November 11, 2024 • 36 mins
When Elton John agrees to do a podcast, you go to wherever he is. So a few weeks ago, I travelled to Elton and David Furnish’s beautiful home in Berkshire. We sat around his wooden dining table, tried to think of songs with lyrics of food (‘Blueberry Hill’, ‘Sugar Sugar’), talked about shelling peas with his grandmother, the first meal he and David shared (at the same table) and much more.
What was meant to be a half hour conversation stretched to an hour. His assistant, who joined us, said in 20 years of interviews, she had never heard many of the stories he told.
That’s what food does for memories - and what our podcast is all about.
Ruthie's Table 4, made in partnership with Me+Em.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
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(00:22):
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Speaker 2 (00:48):
What's the song with food?
Speaker 3 (00:50):
Song with food? Sugar sugar shug? I am a sugar
free my candle girl.
Speaker 4 (01:01):
What about my thrill on Blueberry Hill?
Speaker 2 (01:06):
Or do not, Oh my darling, do not? On this
our wedding day.
Speaker 1 (01:18):
An open kitchen in the River Cafe gives me the
chance to watch people having dinner with their children. David
and Elton uniquely engage with theirs, focused listening laughing, all
for in their own private world. In between texts with
David about plans for getting together, there are photographs Sachari
on a boat with a huge seabassies just caught Elijah
(01:41):
kicking a football, all of them in the South of
France around a table. Recently, sitting next to Elton at
a dinner in the River Cafe, we had no small talk.
We spoke immediately about Elton John Aids Foundation, the polarized
world we seem to be living in and what we
need to do as citizens. David and Elton are activists.
(02:02):
They registered their civil partnership in two thousand and five
on the first day it was legal in the UK,
leading the way for others to follow with confidence and
with pride. Do you remember your first meal you had together?
Did you meet in a restaurant?
Speaker 4 (02:17):
First may our first mill was at this table and
I was sitting there, okay, and.
Speaker 3 (02:28):
I was a date?
Speaker 4 (02:30):
Oh no, it was a lot less imitation with a
group of well. Elton had come back from touring. He
was single and he had his friend staying with him,
and he said, I don't want to sit around the
house like a widow. Let's just have a dinner party
in write some people down because a lot of your friends.
Speaker 3 (02:48):
I was in AA, so I hadn't really met anybody
except a people for three years.
Speaker 4 (02:52):
So his friend rang my friend.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
Is that part of AA that you don't meet? I know,
you can't think. It just was so uncompassed.
Speaker 3 (03:00):
I just I threw myself into getting well as much
as I threw myself into getting unwell. So I did
what I was told, and I had a great time.
But eventually all I knew was a people. I didn't
know any other gay people or I lot of touch
with them or whatever, and it wasn't certainly a sexual thing.
So he rang.
Speaker 4 (03:17):
Elton's friend rang my friend Malcolm, and I was going
to Malcolm's house for dinner that night. He was having
a dinner party, and Elton's friend said, why didn't you
bring your dinner party down to Windsor. So Alton didn't
know me. I had no connection at all. It was
very random. And I was vegetarian then, and I came
through the door and you were having I think spaghetti bolonese.
It was what everybody was eating. And so that's this.
Speaker 2 (03:39):
Is your menu for the first night you laid eyes
on each other.
Speaker 4 (03:42):
I didn't have spaghetti bolonies, so Elton's housekeeper made me
like a pasta bake I think with cheese, which was
which was fine. But to be honest with you, I
was so kind of overwhelmed with meeting Elton John that
I didn't really think very much about the food then
the next night, so he asked for my number that evening,
and then he called me the next morning and said,
(04:02):
I'm coming into London and would you want to come
around and have dinner with me at my house in London?
And I said that would be lovely, and he said
we'll we'll have a Chinese takeaway and I was like, oh,
it sounds like I love Chinese food. So I arrived
at the house and there's four giant cardboard boxes on
the kitchen counter and the table set for two, and
(04:24):
I said, who else is coming? What's all this food for?
And it was for mister Chows And Elton didn't know
what I like, so he ordered the entire menu.
Speaker 2 (04:33):
I'd marry a man like that, I mean, I'd marry you.
Speaker 1 (04:37):
The minute somebody did that, I would say, this is
the man for the rest.
Speaker 2 (04:42):
I think that's nice.
Speaker 4 (04:43):
I've never been to mister Chows. I didn't you know,
I hadn't had high end Chinese food before. We had
great Chinese food in Canada, but it was not mister Choles.
But it was a really delicious meal. And we talked
and talked for hours and hours and hours. We really connected.
Speaker 1 (04:57):
We're here in your beautiful, beautiful hou. Would you were
saying you have lived here for how many years?
Speaker 3 (05:03):
I've lived here for next year, which will be twenty
twenty five, lived here for fifty years?
Speaker 2 (05:07):
Fifty years?
Speaker 1 (05:08):
And you've never been tempted to move? Why would you no?
Speaker 3 (05:12):
I mean this is the hub of all the properties behind.
This is the hub where the children were brought up
and go to school locally, so it's always lovely to
come back. It's the only traditional house we own, but
you couldn't really do anything else to it. And I
love the fact that it is traditional because I love
the garden and in fact everything was decimated in nineteen
eighty nine when I knocked the house down practically for
(05:35):
two years to have it made into a proper home
instead of a pop stars house, and I started.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
The god, what a pup star's house looks like?
Speaker 3 (05:42):
We had a lot of gold records a lot of awards,
and also I collected Gallet lamps, Tiffany lamps, Art Nouveau,
Art Deco, Mazurel furniture, and there was so much of it.
It was just all on the floor and I just
actually run out of room to put anything. As you
can see, I'm not a minimalist.
Speaker 1 (06:05):
But we could get for it what it has. It's
not a minimalists, but it has a quality of real rigor.
It does, so you're not saying you're not a minimalist,
but yeah.
Speaker 3 (06:15):
So I decided, how do I get rid of all
this stuff? So I decided to say all basically apart
from a few four cars, some paintings and a bit
of jewelry. And so I had a souther of his
cell which was at the VNA for a week. I'm
luckily we'd sold everything before the crash in nineteen eighty nine,
or I sold it because I hadn't met David by
that time. And then I converted that after two years,
(06:35):
I rented a house in London, which I subsequently bought,
and then I came back here two years later in
nineteen ninety one.
Speaker 1 (06:42):
But that is full of a collection. You might not
have the deco furniture and the same art. But you
have collected when you collect. We suppose to be talking
about food, but do you do you have a rhythm and.
Speaker 2 (06:55):
A kind of consistency for the kind of what you collect.
Speaker 3 (06:58):
Do you think, well, I've never collected ceramics before I
became a mice and fanatic, and I became Staffordshire fanatic.
I just wanted to put things that seemed right in
that country home. I love silver well. I never come
back from a place without something, and.
Speaker 2 (07:16):
It doesn't have a memory.
Speaker 1 (07:17):
You can look at something and remember, do you, David,
You remember where you were when you bought it?
Speaker 4 (07:22):
Absolutely? But I must have met. I have a hard
time keeping up because Elton is such an enthusiastic collector.
And you know, he grew up and the things in
his room when he was a little boy were his friends.
So he's always had a great love of objects. Objects
he feels have feelings, don't you.
Speaker 3 (07:41):
Well they were the when I grow up. My parents
argued all the time, so my olddicts were kept in
pristine condition and they didn't shout at me. So I
love them and I've suddenly subsequently followed that on through
the rest of my life. I do love objicts and
they comfort me while I'm on the road. My dress
room is full of and stuff like that. It's just
very heartwarming for me to see it.
Speaker 4 (08:03):
All. It's about the curation and the celebration of them
and displaying them lovingly and appreciating them. That brings you
so much joy, and it gives the house of real
sense of order too.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
It does. And also there's a lot of white, isn't there.
I was thinking they give a.
Speaker 1 (08:16):
Lot of lightness these, you know, if you look at
there is a lot of white and happiness. And it's
maybe safety, you know, maybe as you were describing your room,
maybe it's safe to have, you know, something that you
can look at, the standing guard safety in the emotional way.
Speaker 2 (08:34):
Let's talk about food. So we thought we would do this.
Speaker 1 (08:37):
We would have our guests read a recipe and you're
going to read it, David.
Speaker 4 (08:41):
So it's risotto with porcini and giol and this recipe
served six One kilogram of fresh porcini and giole, one
garlic clove, peeled and finely chopped, one teaspoon of fresh time,
one leader of chicken stock, one hundred grams of unsold butter,
a red onion finely chopped, three hundred grams of risotto rice,
(09:06):
two hundred and fifty millilters of extra dry white vermouth,
and two hundred grams of parmesan freshly grated. Want the
instructions as well?
Speaker 2 (09:15):
How are we going to make it otherwise? Okay, all right?
Speaker 4 (09:18):
Clean the mushrooms by brushing them lightly clean the caps
of the porcini. Tear any large mushroom into small pieces.
In a frying pan, heat three tablespoons of extra virgin
olive oil. Add half of the mushrooms, chopped, garlic and
thyme in season. Fry until cooked and the liquid has evaporated.
(09:38):
Heat the chicken stock. Melt the butter with the remaining
olive oil. Add the chopped onion, and cook on a
gentle heat until the onion is soft. Add the rice
and stir. Pour in the vermouth and cook until absorbed.
Stir in the hot stok, ladle by ladle, and cook
until the rice is al dante, usually about twenty minutes.
(10:00):
Add the crooked wild mushrooms, the remaining butter, and the parmesan,
and stir well.
Speaker 3 (10:06):
Let me have some.
Speaker 2 (10:06):
Yeah, let's make it. We got in the kitchen.
Speaker 1 (10:08):
But I heard or I read that you like risotto
so much you actually asked one of your cooks to
go gently to learn how to make a risotto.
Speaker 2 (10:18):
Might that be the actually yesterday?
Speaker 4 (10:20):
That was?
Speaker 2 (10:21):
When was that?
Speaker 3 (10:22):
Well?
Speaker 4 (10:22):
That was in the nineties when Johnny Versaci was a
big part of our lives, and we used to go
to Johnny's house in Milan. He lived above the offices
on Via Jesu, in a beautiful apartment that had been
decorated by Monjardino spectacular, and the meals were theater is
(10:44):
the only way I can describe it, because he had
the white coated butlers with the white gloves, the white jackets,
and you sat down and there was a beautiful piece
of antique porcelain and then wosh, it was cleared away,
and then a plate went down with a starter, and
then we it was cleared away, and then another antiq
porcelain plate came down to be cleared away for the
(11:04):
second course or the premier patty, and then taken away
again for the main course. And the resulto at Johnny's
that was it's like nectar.
Speaker 3 (11:15):
It was, you know, it's just it was just so
luscious and also, as David said, the presentation went a
long way with it because he got me into collecting china,
porcelain and tablecloths. It was his fault. Tablecloths, tablecloths, tablecloth.
We're huge on table cloths, napkin. Johnny introduced us to
(11:40):
the tablecloth in Venice, which was Originallyesum, which is now closed.
It was the most beautiful shop. And then on the
island of we went to Dalla Olga, which is the
most incredible shop which has tablecloths of every size, hand
on lace. So I have to say that we went
(12:04):
there and spent so much money on one weekend on
tape gloves. I couldn't believe it.
Speaker 1 (12:09):
And so you asked one of your cooks to learn
how to make a RESULTO properly?
Speaker 2 (12:12):
Did that work? Did he learnt?
Speaker 3 (12:14):
Yeah? It was it was good. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (12:19):
Have either of you ever worked in a restaurant? Did you?
Speaker 3 (12:21):
Did I have work?
Speaker 4 (12:22):
No?
Speaker 3 (12:22):
I'd mentioned wine merchants, but not a restaurant, did you.
Speaker 4 (12:26):
I waited on tables. I was a last boy, I
was a dishwasher, I was a sooux chef. I worked
in a kitchen of a golf and tennis club, and
I did serve dinners to banquets for five hundred people.
I served breakfast to golfers. Used to do short order
stuff in the kitchen to you know, do the toast
and sometimes the bacon and the eggs for people getting
(12:47):
ready to go play their golf game. I loved that.
Speaker 2 (12:49):
Did that teach you?
Speaker 4 (12:51):
It taught me a lot about the importance of kindness because,
particularly for weight staff, because they are under pressure from
the chef, the under pressure from the management, and then
the under pressure from the people they're serving. They get
it from all directions. And so I always go out
of my way anyone that serves me to make sure
I'm incredibly grateful and reasonable and polite and always leave
(13:16):
a nice tip, because it's really hard work and it
can be unforgiving work at times. I don't know. You
learn so much about human nature because watching the way
people were very particular about their food was quite quite
a learning experience for me when I when I worked.
Speaker 2 (13:32):
In tablet experience.
Speaker 3 (13:34):
And that's why I like the restaurants that I go
to because I like this stuff and I hate people
who are route to serving staff. And I know a
lot of people in my business that are and talk
down to them. I just that's one thing I hate
the most. No, it's the seductiveness is part of it.
It's like Daivo right in Benas, which is the simplest restaurant, and.
Speaker 4 (13:56):
It's it's beautiful because the major d comes to the
table of every meal we've we've never looked at the
physical menu. He comes to the table with this little
chart board.
Speaker 1 (14:06):
Eva is a restaurant inventers that you get to it's
quite hard to find, is there's that little light outside.
It's really the most beautiful way is to arrive by boat,
isn't it? Is that how you get there? Do you
ever go by boat?
Speaker 4 (14:18):
Yes, that's the only way we go anywhere we go.
Come in through the side windows. But they arrive with
the chartboard on the on the beautiful gilded column, and
they give you all of the specials and everything that's
being made for the day, and never the same meal twice.
Speaker 3 (14:36):
And the simplicity of it is so sexy and so
fun that I hate pretentious restaurants. I can't. That's why
the River Cafe is always her door enjoyable because you
come in and it's like the greatest canteen in the world.
Where you mix with a lot of people you know,
and where people just seem to be having the best time.
The service is great, the atmosphere is fantastic, whether you're
(14:57):
inside with you're outside, and there's not an ounce of potential.
Speaker 1 (15:01):
And I would say that you'll go back to a
restaurant if you didn't have a great meal, But if
you were treated as if you weren't good enough to
eat there, then why would you go back? The River
Cafe Cafe are all day space and just steps away
from the restaurant is now open in the morning an
(15:24):
Italian breakfast with cornetti, ciambella and crostada from our pastry kitchen.
In the afternoon, ice creamed coops and River Cafe classic desserts.
We have sharing plates Salumi, misti, mozzarella, brusquetta, red and
yellow peppers, Vitello, tonato and more. Come in the evening
for cocktails with our resident pianist in the bar. No
(15:45):
need to book, see you here.
Speaker 3 (15:55):
I grew up after the war, so.
Speaker 1 (15:56):
Everything about the early life.
Speaker 3 (15:59):
Yeah, I was born in the council house. I lived
with my mother, my grandmother, because my father was away
in the Air Force.
Speaker 2 (16:07):
Was your mother's mother yes.
Speaker 3 (16:08):
My grandmother. She was fantastic.
Speaker 2 (16:10):
What was she like?
Speaker 3 (16:11):
She was wonderful. She could cook anything and make it
taste incredible. I mean, basic ingredients were hard to get,
after all, we were Russiened and bacon was partly a
no no. But she made I never remember a bad
meal or going hungry, and everything that was left over
she made into something else the next day. And what
I loved about her because I have the biggest sweet tooth,
(16:32):
her bread puddings and her apple pies, and her scones
or scones and her victorious sponges. Very simple. The kitchen
was again, the coal cellar was in. The kitchen was
relieve it. The laundry was done on the stove in
a boiler, and we had a mangle to it was
(16:52):
a very basic upbringing. But I can never remember the
smell of cooking was always wonderful, and she could cook anything.
I fell in love with very basic, simple English food
at that point.
Speaker 1 (17:04):
I think that a simple English food. As you talk
about bread pudding and apple pie, those are very They're
not easy to make, you know, And it's to do
with the ingredients and the method and the way you cook.
Speaker 3 (17:16):
Yeah, and things like spotted digging calcid. I walk into
a restaurant, say in Yorkshire or something like that, and
sometimes they have things like that on the menu to go,
oh my God, which for me is just a sheer delight.
I always sometimes think that you go to some john
(17:36):
for instance, they have ecoes cakes, and the echoes cakes
are incredible, and they sell it with the cheese and
it's just like wow, man from heaven. Nowadays, unfortunately I
can't eat it because I'm semi diabetic, but I do
like those English stalwarts a lot too well.
Speaker 1 (17:52):
So growing up, you had a mother and a grandmother
in the house, and your father was where he was.
Speaker 3 (17:56):
He was in a way in the Air Force in Aiden,
and so I didn't really see much of him. So
it was a woman's household. My mom's sister, my aunt,
was always there as well. So I grew up with
a bunch of women who knew how to cook, which
was great.
Speaker 2 (18:10):
And you all sat down to meal every night together.
Speaker 3 (18:13):
Yes, and we toasted our toast by the fire was yours?
Speaker 2 (18:16):
Similar in Toronto.
Speaker 4 (18:18):
I grew up in Canada. In Toronto, I was one
of three boys, and my mom was We were very
lucky she was a stay at home mom. She could
make almost anything happen instantly. She had a deep freeze
in the basement and sometimes we'd come back from school
or a sports match and we'd bring two friends along
(18:39):
and she'd say, no problem, and she'd go downstairs and
she thought out some pastries, she thought some meat, she
thought a tomato sauce or something then prepared in advance.
Suddenly the dinner could just expand or change, you know,
with thirty minutes notice. And meals were important, although given
it was three boys and there was a lot going on,
it was a lot of meals on the hop.
Speaker 2 (18:57):
By what you were the I'm the middle one, the
middle one.
Speaker 4 (19:01):
Yeah, the one thing that mum was important because we
were always coming and going. But Sunday lunch, Sunday dinner
was the one time she wanted the family to be
around the table and have more of a sense of occasion,
and that was a traditional English roast. My grandparents on
my mother's side were from the North and the South
(19:21):
of Ireland, and my grandparents on my father's side were
from England and Wales, so a lot of those traditions
came across to Canada and Sunday roast, Yorkshire pudding, roast potatoes,
roast beef, you know, Brussels sprouts, beans, carrots, a really
good gravy, and then always a baked pie or cake
(19:43):
or sweet for dessert. My British grandmother was an amazing baker.
Speaker 2 (19:48):
So you both had grandmothers that.
Speaker 3 (19:51):
I think grandparents are so important.
Speaker 2 (19:53):
They are, I agree.
Speaker 3 (19:55):
The thing about my grandmother was that because we had
a garden, we grew all our own produce because it
was so much cheaper, and my grandmother had green fingers,
so we always had fresh vegetables. Hardly ever had processed peas.
I mean the great advantage in those days that food
wasn't really you know, instant you did, no instant whips,
no instant there mashed potato. It was all genuinely from
(20:18):
the garden, which was delicious. So I mean, I remember
shelling the peas every Sunday morning. That's that was like David,
Sunday roase was very important for the family gathering. So
shelling the peas was one thing. Peeling the potatoes and
another broad being to another. So we always had good
produce because we couldn't afford to buy them because you know, teams.
(20:39):
Times were hard after the war and the ruts, and
we had a tiny bottle of orange juice which you
diluted and poured the water into. But I never felt
as if we were listening any it denied.
Speaker 2 (20:49):
Yeah, but neither of your mother's work. They didn't have
to combine a career with cooking.
Speaker 4 (20:54):
Your mother.
Speaker 3 (20:55):
My mother worked all the time and worked really really
hard as well. And she in the shop, she worked
in a dairy, she worked at the Air Force. She's
always but she'd always come home and make dinner. Yeah,
she was very hard working woman, but still cooked.
Speaker 4 (21:10):
She raised Dalton as a single mom. And so you
know his ability to you know, study and take lessons
and learn and everything. His mum worked very very hard
providing for the family to allow him to do that.
That's what got him on his path to be who
he is today.
Speaker 2 (21:24):
Did you ever go to restaurants?
Speaker 3 (21:27):
The only time I remember going to a restaurant is
when I went to a Chinese restaurant in Harrow. We
lived in Pinner and Chinese restaurants suddenly became the raide.
Coffee bars were the rage before that, but we went
for a Chinese meal was the first restaurant I can
ever remember going to and it was just wow, we
have bean sprouts and it was just so delicious and
(21:48):
it was so exotic, and I remember I was so
excited to go to this Chinese restaurant. There weren't many
in the area. One in Harrow, there wasn't certainly one
in Pinner, but it was just an incredible occasion. And
that's the first exotic food I ever really had. How
old were you, I don't know, eight nine maybe yeah?
Speaker 4 (22:04):
And did you get to a restaurant It was a
very very special treat. Yeah, because again it was expensive
and it was a big treat. What we never had
was fast food. But my mother was very anti fast food.
She just didn't didn't think it was good for us.
I think she was ahead of her time with that.
There wasn't any falt food when I grew up.
Speaker 2 (22:25):
Fast food was boiling the cabbage ten minutes.
Speaker 3 (22:29):
When I went to school, that suddenly became There was
a Wimpy Bar when I was about fifteen. That's the
first fast food place I can ever remember.
Speaker 1 (22:36):
You but you both what is interesting to talk to
you about is that food was important to you, and
delicious food was important to you, and you grew up
with a sense of that importance in your life.
Speaker 3 (22:48):
You know, well, meals were very social. It's when you
got together. I mean when I went to school, I
had school meals which were vile.
Speaker 2 (22:55):
That was a day school that was justful.
Speaker 3 (22:58):
Just awful, awful. Then you come home at night and
that was the day. That's where you got breakfast was
just on the on the run really to get to school.
But the meal at night was always important, and of
course the weekend, the Sunday lunch was really important.
Speaker 1 (23:12):
And when you're both in different stages of your life,
left this coon of your grandmother's your food, your mother
rustling something up when a friend came for you to
talk when each of you, would you tell me when
when did you leave home? When did you How old
were you when you suddenly were out on your own
and thinking about food in your own way.
Speaker 3 (23:35):
When I was about met Bernie, that was nineteen maybe
or twenty and we shared a flat in Islington.
Speaker 2 (23:47):
And did it have a kitchen?
Speaker 3 (23:49):
But I'm incapable of cooking anything and Bernie is too,
so we just.
Speaker 2 (23:55):
Right out all the time.
Speaker 1 (23:56):
Yeah, And would that be would you seek out restaurants
or would you just have grabbed something stuff like.
Speaker 3 (24:03):
That, keep things because we couldn't afford expensive things. But
never The first real exciting restaurant I went to was
when Dick James took her to a restaurant off of
Tottenham Court Road.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
And who was Dick James.
Speaker 3 (24:15):
Dick James was my publisher and my manager who you know,
published the Beatles, very famous, first person to sign on. Yeah,
And so I went to this restaurant called Maisonette, and
I had a prawn cocktail. I'm never seen anything like.
I didn't know what to do, what's this? So that
was the first posh in in Bertacomma's restaurant that I
(24:36):
ever went to.
Speaker 1 (24:38):
Paul McCartney told me that that same experience, said he
when he went was taken.
Speaker 3 (24:43):
By Brian Epstein, Brian Epstein to.
Speaker 1 (24:47):
Again another Maisonette or Montclair or Bontant, and it was
suddenly an eye opener. He said it was the first
time he'd only had cheap wine with John Mann, and
they really and they couldn't understand the point of wine
because it tasted so terrible because it was so cheap.
And then he went and had a good class of
wine and realized what life could be. Did you have
(25:09):
the same feeling about your Prome cocktail exactly?
Speaker 3 (25:13):
It was like, oh, and the bread was lovely and
it was beautiful bread rolled and crispy, and and you thought, well,
this is a different this is a step up. I mean,
it's not the Aberdeen Steakhouse. This well it's not. This
is a proper restaurant. Yeah, sorry, Aberdeen st But to me,
the Aberdeen Steakhouse was posh.
Speaker 2 (25:34):
That was posh. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (25:35):
I remember once I was in New York and my
parents used to take us as a special treat to this restaurant.
And then I was with a girlfriend who was a
friend of mine, and she said her parents were deciding
where to go out to eat and they mentioned this
restaurant and her parents said, oh, we're not going to
a place like that.
Speaker 2 (25:50):
And I thought that was our special place.
Speaker 3 (25:53):
Yeah, I thought the Aberdeen Steakhouse.
Speaker 2 (25:56):
Yeah yeah, yeah. What about you?
Speaker 4 (25:58):
When I was working in advertising, you know, you were
taking out clients and you were entertaining them. So that
was a little bit like being let off the leash
to to explore and have and have fun. And you know,
you wanted to your clients well and you were able
to take them to nice restaurants. In Toronto, where I
grew up, has a fantastic it's a great restaurant town.
It's very international, so what you get exposed to is
(26:22):
was very very sophisticated and very very worldly. And that
was that was I've never, you know, eaten like that
in my life.
Speaker 3 (26:28):
That was really special.
Speaker 1 (26:30):
And so back to the apartment you lived in Islington,
you ate out, you of grab food and then slowly,
with your success, you were able to go and at
that point to being able to eat food and other restaurants.
Speaker 3 (26:42):
When I became successful, it was a different kettle of fish.
I met people who were more sophisticated than I was,
who knew the London restaurant scene and everything, and I
started going to better places with them. It's just it's
just the journey. I've started to play at the venues,
I was starting to eat at better restaurants. I was
(27:03):
starting to earn more money, I was starting to live
in a better place. As you go, as you do
things like that, step by step, you know, you get
introduced to different things. And it was lovely. It was
a wonderful journey in every respect. I never collected art
until I suddenly became wealthy enough to buy some prints,
and the whole journey just went step hand in hand.
(27:24):
And yes, I loved I loved going to lovely restaurant.
I remember when I first met there was two restaurants
in cavon Garten called the Garden and inego Joantsmaz. I
used to go there all the time.
Speaker 2 (27:36):
That was English food, wasn't it called Yeah? Did you
go to Greek or did you discover chow?
Speaker 3 (27:44):
I never? I never went abroad at all. Hardly. I
went to America, but I never really in France because
I never really went to France or Italy or any
places that came later on. I was introduced to America
in cuisine in inverted commers. I don't really think they
have a cuisine unless you're in the South and chicken
(28:04):
and the food is incredible in the South. Yeah, oh
my god, do you think?
Speaker 2 (28:08):
What do you like in the South?
Speaker 3 (28:10):
I like all sorts of things that aren't good for me,
like fried chicken, fried chicken donuts. If I had a
death row meal, it wouldn't contain anything except sweets because
I can't eat them now, so I'd have ice cream donuts,
apple pie, rubab crumble blah blah blah.
Speaker 2 (28:26):
I get it.
Speaker 1 (28:27):
Yeah, So you don't need any sugar now at all?
Speaker 2 (28:31):
Yeah? And do you crave or miss or of you? Now?
How long has it been since you've eaten sugar for.
Speaker 3 (28:36):
A long time. I can have an apple, I can
eat a bit of melon, but they do not. As
long as you're sensible about it, it doesn't shoot your
blood sugar up. But while I crave is chocolate and
ice cream, I can't have any ice cream sugar, can you?
Speaker 2 (28:50):
Yes, it's hardcore, it's very.
Speaker 3 (28:54):
We've just ordered some from Italy, which he kindly bought
me back from.
Speaker 4 (28:58):
Where was it when I was in? I was in
just outside of Pastana.
Speaker 1 (29:07):
If you like listening to Ruthie's Table four, would you
please make sure to rate and review the podcast on
the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.
Speaker 2 (29:21):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (29:26):
Let's talk about work and eating. So if you know
you're having a concert, would you have a meal before
or do you go out hungry? Or do you tell
me about if.
Speaker 3 (29:37):
My show's usually start at eight? Well they used to
because I'm not doing them anymore. But I would eat
probably at five point thirty something, not too heavy.
Speaker 2 (29:47):
What would it be like?
Speaker 3 (29:48):
What would it would be? Probably a little steak and
some vegetables, not probably yet, just some protein and some
vegetables because you can't go on stage when you'll fall out.
They just know, very unpleasant thought that would be. It
was a ritual, my whole your ritual.
Speaker 2 (30:04):
So your ritual is to eat at five thirty by yourself.
Did you see people before or not?
Speaker 3 (30:09):
Just its just me.
Speaker 1 (30:10):
And yeah, and then you go out and you have water,
presumably water, and then.
Speaker 3 (30:16):
You know it's I get to the venue at three o'clock.
I've got to sleep till five point thirty, and then
I have my lunch, dinner. Then I faff around getting
ready and then let's it. It's just a ritual that
happens all the time. Five thirty is the regular five thirty.
Speaker 2 (30:30):
And what about afterwards? Do you eat afterwards?
Speaker 3 (30:33):
No, I'm on a plane. It's you might have a sandwich,
might have a sandwich, half a sandwich.
Speaker 2 (30:40):
When do you have the opportunity to explore a city?
Speaker 1 (30:43):
Then if you're giving a concert in a city, do
you have a sense of where you are that you
can sort of be where you are or do. It
is purely arriving, sleeping, performing, and then it's.
Speaker 3 (30:56):
All a blur there it is there's no time to
side see and you realize if you're in Powers and
you're in Italy, or you're in Denmark or places that
you feel if you're in Romania and Bulgoa, it's different
because you've never experienced it before. But the places I know,
I'm used to. But to be honest, you it's a routine.
No time to stop and enjoy the scenery. You go,
(31:17):
arrive at the airport, get into the car, go to
the show, relax, eat, do the show, fly off to
another place.
Speaker 2 (31:23):
But you do travel for pleasure.
Speaker 1 (31:25):
So absolutely, you have memories of a restaurant in Florence,
you have memories of a restaurant in Venice. Are there
other cities that you really other than the two Italian
ones in France or in.
Speaker 4 (31:34):
Well, the south, in the south of France. We have
a house in Yes. So we're introduced to a restaurant
in Niice, cod La Petite Maison, And it was Hubert
and Javonci that recommended it to us because he was
someone that welcomed us when we first came down and
gave us a few pointers on places to go and
people to know, and that became a real ritual for us.
(31:55):
Every summer we would go there and be looked after
by Nicole at least once a week, once every two weeks.
Speaker 1 (32:02):
Character Yeah, one time Richard and I were there and
we wanted we won't even lef it and we wanted
to leave, and she wouldn't let us go.
Speaker 2 (32:09):
She said this, and it was going to be the
Gypsy Queens.
Speaker 4 (32:11):
This is like, she's a brilliant restaurant for her, she's
very passionate. She's not everybody's cup of tea, but the
food is worth it, and she's always been listening to
us and the boysilers Again, we never see a menu
when we go there. They literally Nicole just feeds us.
So it's like course after course after corn, a lot
(32:35):
of it's a lot of food, which is why we
don't go too often, because it's quite rich and there's
a lot of butter and a lot of all the
oil you.
Speaker 2 (32:44):
Eat that much of the South answers.
Speaker 4 (32:45):
Mostly, We've had a wonderful chef who's cooked for us
for over twenty years, and I think because Elton spends
so much time traveling on the road, and I travel
a lot for work as well. The gray luxury in
the world is staying in your own home and eating wonderful.
Speaker 3 (33:03):
Food terrorists there, which is just perfect for breakfast, for lunch,
for dinner. It's just you can't drag yourself away from
the table. It's a conversation table, and the viewer is amazing.
So why would you bother to go out?
Speaker 4 (33:16):
And all our friends come to visit us, so that's
the time we catch up with the people we love,
you know, on that beautiful terrorist eating fantastic food, all
the local produce. You know, it's like the food basket
of the world there and you get fantastic produce and
exactly question I.
Speaker 2 (33:33):
Saw that fish.
Speaker 1 (33:33):
I know Sara's going to ask you growing up as
you did with the importance of food, points of the table,
the importance of that kind of sharing of your time
with food.
Speaker 2 (33:43):
What about the boys? How do you do it with them?
Speaker 1 (33:45):
What will they when I'm interviewing them in fifteen years,
what will they tell me about their life?
Speaker 3 (33:50):
As they would say they had the best time. I mean,
they just you know, they love go to the chef
food in the summer, and exactly as I say, goes
out fishing comes back with a hate. We eat it
and it's just like, well, it's such a great feeling,
and I think he loves it, the fact that we're
eating dinner and he called it because the summer. Really
it's not just about it's more about them than us.
(34:11):
It's about we want to give them a great memory
of summer, so that kids have the friends come as
stay with us with their parents. So it's really we
pay more attention to them than we do to ourselves.
Speaker 4 (34:23):
And meals are sacred, so no phones at the table,
no television on in the background. It's all about conversation.
It's all about connection. It's where we catch up because
we all have busy lives and we hear about each
other's days. And during lockdown, where we with the boys
three meals a day, when we just talked all the
(34:44):
time about what was going on in the world and
told funny stories or learned about his history or my history.
And the food is part of that brings you together.
Speaker 1 (34:53):
Food is about sharing time with your children, something that
you want to explore, to tell you about another country.
It's also comfort and I was wondering if my last
question of a very beautiful interview and thank you is
to ask you if you needed comfort from a food,
is there a food that you would go.
Speaker 3 (35:11):
To comfort food? Bacon sandwich, bacon sandwich.
Speaker 4 (35:18):
Probably a really basic pasta, like a simple pasta, like
pasta like reat pasta, which I love with a bit
of cheese, a lot of even, but even simple pasta with.
Speaker 2 (35:38):
Pasta is very very confident.
Speaker 3 (35:40):
Yeah, yeah, that's very comforting to me too. But if
if I'm here and a bacon sandwich is much easier
to prepare, So.
Speaker 2 (35:49):
How do you make a bacon sandwich?
Speaker 3 (35:50):
Elton John on whole wheat bread with butter and proper
English bacon, not Danish, not streaky, but you know Lush's
bacon with the fat cut off and cooked quite well,
so it's quite crackly.
Speaker 2 (36:05):
Okay, I'd like to have one of those. Thank you
so much, thank
Speaker 4 (36:09):
You, it's very love, thank you, thank you,
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Speaker 2 (00:48):
What's the song with food?
Speaker 3 (00:50):
Song with food? Sugar sugar shug? I am a sugar
free my candle girl.
Speaker 4 (01:01):
What about my thrill on Blueberry Hill?
Speaker 2 (01:06):
Or do not, Oh my darling, do not? On this
our wedding day.
Speaker 1 (01:18):
An open kitchen in the River Cafe gives me the
chance to watch people having dinner with their children. David
and Elton uniquely engage with theirs, focused listening laughing, all
for in their own private world. In between texts with
David about plans for getting together, there are photographs Sachari
on a boat with a huge seabassies just caught Elijah
(01:41):
kicking a football, all of them in the South of
France around a table. Recently, sitting next to Elton at
a dinner in the River Cafe, we had no small talk.
We spoke immediately about Elton John Aids Foundation, the polarized
world we seem to be living in and what we
need to do as citizens. David and Elton are activists.
(02:02):
They registered their civil partnership in two thousand and five
on the first day it was legal in the UK,
leading the way for others to follow with confidence and
with pride. Do you remember your first meal you had together?
Did you meet in a restaurant?
Speaker 4 (02:17):
First may our first mill was at this table and
I was sitting there, okay, and.
Speaker 3 (02:28):
I was a date?
Speaker 4 (02:30):
Oh no, it was a lot less imitation with a
group of well. Elton had come back from touring. He
was single and he had his friend staying with him,
and he said, I don't want to sit around the
house like a widow. Let's just have a dinner party
in write some people down because a lot of your friends.
Speaker 3 (02:48):
I was in AA, so I hadn't really met anybody
except a people for three years.
Speaker 4 (02:52):
So his friend rang my friend.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
Is that part of AA that you don't meet? I know,
you can't think. It just was so uncompassed.
Speaker 3 (03:00):
I just I threw myself into getting well as much
as I threw myself into getting unwell. So I did
what I was told, and I had a great time.
But eventually all I knew was a people. I didn't
know any other gay people or I lot of touch
with them or whatever, and it wasn't certainly a sexual thing.
So he rang.
Speaker 4 (03:17):
Elton's friend rang my friend Malcolm, and I was going
to Malcolm's house for dinner that night. He was having
a dinner party, and Elton's friend said, why didn't you
bring your dinner party down to Windsor. So Alton didn't
know me. I had no connection at all. It was
very random. And I was vegetarian then, and I came
through the door and you were having I think spaghetti bolonese.
It was what everybody was eating. And so that's this.
Speaker 2 (03:39):
Is your menu for the first night you laid eyes
on each other.
Speaker 4 (03:42):
I didn't have spaghetti bolonies, so Elton's housekeeper made me
like a pasta bake I think with cheese, which was
which was fine. But to be honest with you, I
was so kind of overwhelmed with meeting Elton John that
I didn't really think very much about the food then
the next night, so he asked for my number that evening,
and then he called me the next morning and said,
(04:02):
I'm coming into London and would you want to come
around and have dinner with me at my house in London?
And I said that would be lovely, and he said
we'll we'll have a Chinese takeaway and I was like, oh,
it sounds like I love Chinese food. So I arrived
at the house and there's four giant cardboard boxes on
the kitchen counter and the table set for two, and
(04:24):
I said, who else is coming? What's all this food for?
And it was for mister Chows And Elton didn't know
what I like, so he ordered the entire menu.
Speaker 2 (04:33):
I'd marry a man like that, I mean, I'd marry you.
Speaker 1 (04:37):
The minute somebody did that, I would say, this is
the man for the rest.
Speaker 2 (04:42):
I think that's nice.
Speaker 4 (04:43):
I've never been to mister Chows. I didn't you know,
I hadn't had high end Chinese food before. We had
great Chinese food in Canada, but it was not mister Choles.
But it was a really delicious meal. And we talked
and talked for hours and hours and hours. We really connected.
Speaker 1 (04:57):
We're here in your beautiful, beautiful hou. Would you were
saying you have lived here for how many years?
Speaker 3 (05:03):
I've lived here for next year, which will be twenty
twenty five, lived here for fifty years?
Speaker 2 (05:07):
Fifty years?
Speaker 1 (05:08):
And you've never been tempted to move? Why would you no?
Speaker 3 (05:12):
I mean this is the hub of all the properties behind.
This is the hub where the children were brought up
and go to school locally, so it's always lovely to
come back. It's the only traditional house we own, but
you couldn't really do anything else to it. And I
love the fact that it is traditional because I love
the garden and in fact everything was decimated in nineteen
eighty nine when I knocked the house down practically for
(05:35):
two years to have it made into a proper home
instead of a pop stars house, and I started.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
The god, what a pup star's house looks like?
Speaker 3 (05:42):
We had a lot of gold records a lot of awards,
and also I collected Gallet lamps, Tiffany lamps, Art Nouveau,
Art Deco, Mazurel furniture, and there was so much of it.
It was just all on the floor and I just
actually run out of room to put anything. As you
can see, I'm not a minimalist.
Speaker 1 (06:05):
But we could get for it what it has. It's
not a minimalists, but it has a quality of real rigor.
It does, so you're not saying you're not a minimalist,
but yeah.
Speaker 3 (06:15):
So I decided, how do I get rid of all
this stuff? So I decided to say all basically apart
from a few four cars, some paintings and a bit
of jewelry. And so I had a souther of his
cell which was at the VNA for a week. I'm
luckily we'd sold everything before the crash in nineteen eighty nine,
or I sold it because I hadn't met David by
that time. And then I converted that after two years,
(06:35):
I rented a house in London, which I subsequently bought,
and then I came back here two years later in
nineteen ninety one.
Speaker 1 (06:42):
But that is full of a collection. You might not
have the deco furniture and the same art. But you
have collected when you collect. We suppose to be talking
about food, but do you do you have a rhythm and.
Speaker 2 (06:55):
A kind of consistency for the kind of what you collect.
Speaker 3 (06:58):
Do you think, well, I've never collected ceramics before I
became a mice and fanatic, and I became Staffordshire fanatic.
I just wanted to put things that seemed right in
that country home. I love silver well. I never come
back from a place without something, and.
Speaker 2 (07:16):
It doesn't have a memory.
Speaker 1 (07:17):
You can look at something and remember, do you, David,
You remember where you were when you bought it?
Speaker 4 (07:22):
Absolutely? But I must have met. I have a hard
time keeping up because Elton is such an enthusiastic collector.
And you know, he grew up and the things in
his room when he was a little boy were his friends.
So he's always had a great love of objects. Objects
he feels have feelings, don't you.
Speaker 3 (07:41):
Well they were the when I grow up. My parents
argued all the time, so my olddicts were kept in
pristine condition and they didn't shout at me. So I
love them and I've suddenly subsequently followed that on through
the rest of my life. I do love objicts and
they comfort me while I'm on the road. My dress
room is full of and stuff like that. It's just
very heartwarming for me to see it.
Speaker 4 (08:03):
All. It's about the curation and the celebration of them
and displaying them lovingly and appreciating them. That brings you
so much joy, and it gives the house of real
sense of order too.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
It does. And also there's a lot of white, isn't there.
I was thinking they give a.
Speaker 1 (08:16):
Lot of lightness these, you know, if you look at
there is a lot of white and happiness. And it's
maybe safety, you know, maybe as you were describing your room,
maybe it's safe to have, you know, something that you
can look at, the standing guard safety in the emotional way.
Speaker 2 (08:34):
Let's talk about food. So we thought we would do this.
Speaker 1 (08:37):
We would have our guests read a recipe and you're
going to read it, David.
Speaker 4 (08:41):
So it's risotto with porcini and giol and this recipe
served six One kilogram of fresh porcini and giole, one
garlic clove, peeled and finely chopped, one teaspoon of fresh time,
one leader of chicken stock, one hundred grams of unsold butter,
a red onion finely chopped, three hundred grams of risotto rice,
(09:06):
two hundred and fifty millilters of extra dry white vermouth,
and two hundred grams of parmesan freshly grated. Want the
instructions as well?
Speaker 2 (09:15):
How are we going to make it otherwise? Okay, all right?
Speaker 4 (09:18):
Clean the mushrooms by brushing them lightly clean the caps
of the porcini. Tear any large mushroom into small pieces.
In a frying pan, heat three tablespoons of extra virgin
olive oil. Add half of the mushrooms, chopped, garlic and
thyme in season. Fry until cooked and the liquid has evaporated.
(09:38):
Heat the chicken stock. Melt the butter with the remaining
olive oil. Add the chopped onion, and cook on a
gentle heat until the onion is soft. Add the rice
and stir. Pour in the vermouth and cook until absorbed.
Stir in the hot stok, ladle by ladle, and cook
until the rice is al dante, usually about twenty minutes.
(10:00):
Add the crooked wild mushrooms, the remaining butter, and the parmesan,
and stir well.
Speaker 3 (10:06):
Let me have some.
Speaker 2 (10:06):
Yeah, let's make it. We got in the kitchen.
Speaker 1 (10:08):
But I heard or I read that you like risotto
so much you actually asked one of your cooks to
go gently to learn how to make a risotto.
Speaker 2 (10:18):
Might that be the actually yesterday?
Speaker 4 (10:20):
That was?
Speaker 2 (10:21):
When was that?
Speaker 3 (10:22):
Well?
Speaker 4 (10:22):
That was in the nineties when Johnny Versaci was a
big part of our lives, and we used to go
to Johnny's house in Milan. He lived above the offices
on Via Jesu, in a beautiful apartment that had been
decorated by Monjardino spectacular, and the meals were theater is
(10:44):
the only way I can describe it, because he had
the white coated butlers with the white gloves, the white jackets,
and you sat down and there was a beautiful piece
of antique porcelain and then wosh, it was cleared away,
and then a plate went down with a starter, and
then we it was cleared away, and then another antiq
porcelain plate came down to be cleared away for the
(11:04):
second course or the premier patty, and then taken away
again for the main course. And the resulto at Johnny's
that was it's like nectar.
Speaker 3 (11:15):
It was, you know, it's just it was just so
luscious and also, as David said, the presentation went a
long way with it because he got me into collecting china,
porcelain and tablecloths. It was his fault. Tablecloths, tablecloths, tablecloth.
We're huge on table cloths, napkin. Johnny introduced us to
(11:40):
the tablecloth in Venice, which was Originallyesum, which is now closed.
It was the most beautiful shop. And then on the
island of we went to Dalla Olga, which is the
most incredible shop which has tablecloths of every size, hand
on lace. So I have to say that we went
(12:04):
there and spent so much money on one weekend on
tape gloves. I couldn't believe it.
Speaker 1 (12:09):
And so you asked one of your cooks to learn
how to make a RESULTO properly?
Speaker 2 (12:12):
Did that work? Did he learnt?
Speaker 3 (12:14):
Yeah? It was it was good. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (12:19):
Have either of you ever worked in a restaurant? Did you?
Speaker 3 (12:21):
Did I have work?
Speaker 4 (12:22):
No?
Speaker 3 (12:22):
I'd mentioned wine merchants, but not a restaurant, did you.
Speaker 4 (12:26):
I waited on tables. I was a last boy, I
was a dishwasher, I was a sooux chef. I worked
in a kitchen of a golf and tennis club, and
I did serve dinners to banquets for five hundred people.
I served breakfast to golfers. Used to do short order
stuff in the kitchen to you know, do the toast
and sometimes the bacon and the eggs for people getting
(12:47):
ready to go play their golf game. I loved that.
Speaker 2 (12:49):
Did that teach you?
Speaker 4 (12:51):
It taught me a lot about the importance of kindness because,
particularly for weight staff, because they are under pressure from
the chef, the under pressure from the management, and then
the under pressure from the people they're serving. They get
it from all directions. And so I always go out
of my way anyone that serves me to make sure
I'm incredibly grateful and reasonable and polite and always leave
(13:16):
a nice tip, because it's really hard work and it
can be unforgiving work at times. I don't know. You
learn so much about human nature because watching the way
people were very particular about their food was quite quite
a learning experience for me when I when I worked.
Speaker 2 (13:32):
In tablet experience.
Speaker 3 (13:34):
And that's why I like the restaurants that I go
to because I like this stuff and I hate people
who are route to serving staff. And I know a
lot of people in my business that are and talk
down to them. I just that's one thing I hate
the most. No, it's the seductiveness is part of it.
It's like Daivo right in Benas, which is the simplest restaurant, and.
Speaker 4 (13:56):
It's it's beautiful because the major d comes to the
table of every meal we've we've never looked at the
physical menu. He comes to the table with this little
chart board.
Speaker 1 (14:06):
Eva is a restaurant inventers that you get to it's
quite hard to find, is there's that little light outside.
It's really the most beautiful way is to arrive by boat,
isn't it? Is that how you get there? Do you
ever go by boat?
Speaker 4 (14:18):
Yes, that's the only way we go anywhere we go.
Come in through the side windows. But they arrive with
the chartboard on the on the beautiful gilded column, and
they give you all of the specials and everything that's
being made for the day, and never the same meal twice.
Speaker 3 (14:36):
And the simplicity of it is so sexy and so
fun that I hate pretentious restaurants. I can't. That's why
the River Cafe is always her door enjoyable because you
come in and it's like the greatest canteen in the world.
Where you mix with a lot of people you know,
and where people just seem to be having the best time.
The service is great, the atmosphere is fantastic, whether you're
(14:57):
inside with you're outside, and there's not an ounce of potential.
Speaker 1 (15:01):
And I would say that you'll go back to a
restaurant if you didn't have a great meal, But if
you were treated as if you weren't good enough to
eat there, then why would you go back? The River
Cafe Cafe are all day space and just steps away
from the restaurant is now open in the morning an
(15:24):
Italian breakfast with cornetti, ciambella and crostada from our pastry kitchen.
In the afternoon, ice creamed coops and River Cafe classic desserts.
We have sharing plates Salumi, misti, mozzarella, brusquetta, red and
yellow peppers, Vitello, tonato and more. Come in the evening
for cocktails with our resident pianist in the bar. No
(15:45):
need to book, see you here.
Speaker 3 (15:55):
I grew up after the war, so.
Speaker 1 (15:56):
Everything about the early life.
Speaker 3 (15:59):
Yeah, I was born in the council house. I lived
with my mother, my grandmother, because my father was away
in the Air Force.
Speaker 2 (16:07):
Was your mother's mother yes.
Speaker 3 (16:08):
My grandmother. She was fantastic.
Speaker 2 (16:10):
What was she like?
Speaker 3 (16:11):
She was wonderful. She could cook anything and make it
taste incredible. I mean, basic ingredients were hard to get,
after all, we were Russiened and bacon was partly a
no no. But she made I never remember a bad
meal or going hungry, and everything that was left over
she made into something else the next day. And what
I loved about her because I have the biggest sweet tooth,
(16:32):
her bread puddings and her apple pies, and her scones
or scones and her victorious sponges. Very simple. The kitchen
was again, the coal cellar was in. The kitchen was
relieve it. The laundry was done on the stove in
a boiler, and we had a mangle to it was
(16:52):
a very basic upbringing. But I can never remember the
smell of cooking was always wonderful, and she could cook anything.
I fell in love with very basic, simple English food
at that point.
Speaker 1 (17:04):
I think that a simple English food. As you talk
about bread pudding and apple pie, those are very They're
not easy to make, you know, And it's to do
with the ingredients and the method and the way you cook.
Speaker 3 (17:16):
Yeah, and things like spotted digging calcid. I walk into
a restaurant, say in Yorkshire or something like that, and
sometimes they have things like that on the menu to go,
oh my God, which for me is just a sheer delight.
I always sometimes think that you go to some john
(17:36):
for instance, they have ecoes cakes, and the echoes cakes
are incredible, and they sell it with the cheese and
it's just like wow, man from heaven. Nowadays, unfortunately I
can't eat it because I'm semi diabetic, but I do
like those English stalwarts a lot too well.
Speaker 1 (17:52):
So growing up, you had a mother and a grandmother
in the house, and your father was where he was.
Speaker 3 (17:56):
He was in a way in the Air Force in Aiden,
and so I didn't really see much of him. So
it was a woman's household. My mom's sister, my aunt,
was always there as well. So I grew up with
a bunch of women who knew how to cook, which
was great.
Speaker 2 (18:10):
And you all sat down to meal every night together.
Speaker 3 (18:13):
Yes, and we toasted our toast by the fire was yours?
Speaker 2 (18:16):
Similar in Toronto.
Speaker 4 (18:18):
I grew up in Canada. In Toronto, I was one
of three boys, and my mom was We were very
lucky she was a stay at home mom. She could
make almost anything happen instantly. She had a deep freeze
in the basement and sometimes we'd come back from school
or a sports match and we'd bring two friends along
(18:39):
and she'd say, no problem, and she'd go downstairs and
she thought out some pastries, she thought some meat, she
thought a tomato sauce or something then prepared in advance.
Suddenly the dinner could just expand or change, you know,
with thirty minutes notice. And meals were important, although given
it was three boys and there was a lot going on,
it was a lot of meals on the hop.
Speaker 2 (18:57):
By what you were the I'm the middle one, the
middle one.
Speaker 4 (19:01):
Yeah, the one thing that mum was important because we
were always coming and going. But Sunday lunch, Sunday dinner
was the one time she wanted the family to be
around the table and have more of a sense of occasion,
and that was a traditional English roast. My grandparents on
my mother's side were from the North and the South
(19:21):
of Ireland, and my grandparents on my father's side were
from England and Wales, so a lot of those traditions
came across to Canada and Sunday roast, Yorkshire pudding, roast potatoes,
roast beef, you know, Brussels sprouts, beans, carrots, a really
good gravy, and then always a baked pie or cake
(19:43):
or sweet for dessert. My British grandmother was an amazing baker.
Speaker 2 (19:48):
So you both had grandmothers that.
Speaker 3 (19:51):
I think grandparents are so important.
Speaker 2 (19:53):
They are, I agree.
Speaker 3 (19:55):
The thing about my grandmother was that because we had
a garden, we grew all our own produce because it
was so much cheaper, and my grandmother had green fingers,
so we always had fresh vegetables. Hardly ever had processed peas.
I mean the great advantage in those days that food
wasn't really you know, instant you did, no instant whips,
no instant there mashed potato. It was all genuinely from
(20:18):
the garden, which was delicious. So I mean, I remember
shelling the peas every Sunday morning. That's that was like David,
Sunday roase was very important for the family gathering. So
shelling the peas was one thing. Peeling the potatoes and
another broad being to another. So we always had good
produce because we couldn't afford to buy them because you know, teams.
(20:39):
Times were hard after the war and the ruts, and
we had a tiny bottle of orange juice which you
diluted and poured the water into. But I never felt
as if we were listening any it denied.
Speaker 2 (20:49):
Yeah, but neither of your mother's work. They didn't have
to combine a career with cooking.
Speaker 4 (20:54):
Your mother.
Speaker 3 (20:55):
My mother worked all the time and worked really really
hard as well. And she in the shop, she worked
in a dairy, she worked at the Air Force. She's
always but she'd always come home and make dinner. Yeah,
she was very hard working woman, but still cooked.
Speaker 4 (21:10):
She raised Dalton as a single mom. And so you
know his ability to you know, study and take lessons
and learn and everything. His mum worked very very hard
providing for the family to allow him to do that.
That's what got him on his path to be who
he is today.
Speaker 2 (21:24):
Did you ever go to restaurants?
Speaker 3 (21:27):
The only time I remember going to a restaurant is
when I went to a Chinese restaurant in Harrow. We
lived in Pinner and Chinese restaurants suddenly became the raide.
Coffee bars were the rage before that, but we went
for a Chinese meal was the first restaurant I can
ever remember going to and it was just wow, we
have bean sprouts and it was just so delicious and
(21:48):
it was so exotic, and I remember I was so
excited to go to this Chinese restaurant. There weren't many
in the area. One in Harrow, there wasn't certainly one
in Pinner, but it was just an incredible occasion. And
that's the first exotic food I ever really had. How
old were you, I don't know, eight nine maybe yeah?
Speaker 4 (22:04):
And did you get to a restaurant It was a
very very special treat. Yeah, because again it was expensive
and it was a big treat. What we never had
was fast food. But my mother was very anti fast food.
She just didn't didn't think it was good for us.
I think she was ahead of her time with that.
There wasn't any falt food when I grew up.
Speaker 2 (22:25):
Fast food was boiling the cabbage ten minutes.
Speaker 3 (22:29):
When I went to school, that suddenly became There was
a Wimpy Bar when I was about fifteen. That's the
first fast food place I can ever remember.
Speaker 1 (22:36):
You but you both what is interesting to talk to
you about is that food was important to you, and
delicious food was important to you, and you grew up
with a sense of that importance in your life.
Speaker 3 (22:48):
You know, well, meals were very social. It's when you
got together. I mean when I went to school, I
had school meals which were vile.
Speaker 2 (22:55):
That was a day school that was justful.
Speaker 3 (22:58):
Just awful, awful. Then you come home at night and
that was the day. That's where you got breakfast was
just on the on the run really to get to school.
But the meal at night was always important, and of
course the weekend, the Sunday lunch was really important.
Speaker 1 (23:12):
And when you're both in different stages of your life,
left this coon of your grandmother's your food, your mother
rustling something up when a friend came for you to
talk when each of you, would you tell me when
when did you leave home? When did you How old
were you when you suddenly were out on your own
and thinking about food in your own way.
Speaker 3 (23:35):
When I was about met Bernie, that was nineteen maybe
or twenty and we shared a flat in Islington.
Speaker 2 (23:47):
And did it have a kitchen?
Speaker 3 (23:49):
But I'm incapable of cooking anything and Bernie is too,
so we just.
Speaker 2 (23:55):
Right out all the time.
Speaker 1 (23:56):
Yeah, And would that be would you seek out restaurants
or would you just have grabbed something stuff like.
Speaker 3 (24:03):
That, keep things because we couldn't afford expensive things. But
never The first real exciting restaurant I went to was
when Dick James took her to a restaurant off of
Tottenham Court Road.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
And who was Dick James.
Speaker 3 (24:15):
Dick James was my publisher and my manager who you know,
published the Beatles, very famous, first person to sign on. Yeah,
And so I went to this restaurant called Maisonette, and
I had a prawn cocktail. I'm never seen anything like.
I didn't know what to do, what's this? So that
was the first posh in in Bertacomma's restaurant that I
(24:36):
ever went to.
Speaker 1 (24:38):
Paul McCartney told me that that same experience, said he
when he went was taken.
Speaker 3 (24:43):
By Brian Epstein, Brian Epstein to.
Speaker 1 (24:47):
Again another Maisonette or Montclair or Bontant, and it was
suddenly an eye opener. He said it was the first
time he'd only had cheap wine with John Mann, and
they really and they couldn't understand the point of wine
because it tasted so terrible because it was so cheap.
And then he went and had a good class of
wine and realized what life could be. Did you have
(25:09):
the same feeling about your Prome cocktail exactly?
Speaker 3 (25:13):
It was like, oh, and the bread was lovely and
it was beautiful bread rolled and crispy, and and you thought, well,
this is a different this is a step up. I mean,
it's not the Aberdeen Steakhouse. This well it's not. This
is a proper restaurant. Yeah, sorry, Aberdeen st But to me,
the Aberdeen Steakhouse was posh.
Speaker 2 (25:34):
That was posh. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (25:35):
I remember once I was in New York and my
parents used to take us as a special treat to this restaurant.
And then I was with a girlfriend who was a
friend of mine, and she said her parents were deciding
where to go out to eat and they mentioned this
restaurant and her parents said, oh, we're not going to
a place like that.
Speaker 2 (25:50):
And I thought that was our special place.
Speaker 3 (25:53):
Yeah, I thought the Aberdeen Steakhouse.
Speaker 2 (25:56):
Yeah yeah, yeah. What about you?
Speaker 4 (25:58):
When I was working in advertising, you know, you were
taking out clients and you were entertaining them. So that
was a little bit like being let off the leash
to to explore and have and have fun. And you know,
you wanted to your clients well and you were able
to take them to nice restaurants. In Toronto, where I
grew up, has a fantastic it's a great restaurant town.
It's very international, so what you get exposed to is
(26:22):
was very very sophisticated and very very worldly. And that
was that was I've never, you know, eaten like that
in my life.
Speaker 3 (26:28):
That was really special.
Speaker 1 (26:30):
And so back to the apartment you lived in Islington,
you ate out, you of grab food and then slowly,
with your success, you were able to go and at
that point to being able to eat food and other restaurants.
Speaker 3 (26:42):
When I became successful, it was a different kettle of fish.
I met people who were more sophisticated than I was,
who knew the London restaurant scene and everything, and I
started going to better places with them. It's just it's
just the journey. I've started to play at the venues,
I was starting to eat at better restaurants. I was
(27:03):
starting to earn more money, I was starting to live
in a better place. As you go, as you do
things like that, step by step, you know, you get
introduced to different things. And it was lovely. It was
a wonderful journey in every respect. I never collected art
until I suddenly became wealthy enough to buy some prints,
and the whole journey just went step hand in hand.
(27:24):
And yes, I loved I loved going to lovely restaurant.
I remember when I first met there was two restaurants
in cavon Garten called the Garden and inego Joantsmaz. I
used to go there all the time.
Speaker 2 (27:36):
That was English food, wasn't it called Yeah? Did you
go to Greek or did you discover chow?
Speaker 3 (27:44):
I never? I never went abroad at all. Hardly. I
went to America, but I never really in France because
I never really went to France or Italy or any
places that came later on. I was introduced to America
in cuisine in inverted commers. I don't really think they
have a cuisine unless you're in the South and chicken
(28:04):
and the food is incredible in the South. Yeah, oh
my god, do you think?
Speaker 2 (28:08):
What do you like in the South?
Speaker 3 (28:10):
I like all sorts of things that aren't good for me,
like fried chicken, fried chicken donuts. If I had a
death row meal, it wouldn't contain anything except sweets because
I can't eat them now, so I'd have ice cream donuts,
apple pie, rubab crumble blah blah blah.
Speaker 2 (28:26):
I get it.
Speaker 1 (28:27):
Yeah, So you don't need any sugar now at all?
Speaker 2 (28:31):
Yeah? And do you crave or miss or of you? Now?
How long has it been since you've eaten sugar for.
Speaker 3 (28:36):
A long time. I can have an apple, I can
eat a bit of melon, but they do not. As
long as you're sensible about it, it doesn't shoot your
blood sugar up. But while I crave is chocolate and
ice cream, I can't have any ice cream sugar, can you?
Speaker 2 (28:50):
Yes, it's hardcore, it's very.
Speaker 3 (28:54):
We've just ordered some from Italy, which he kindly bought
me back from.
Speaker 4 (28:58):
Where was it when I was in? I was in
just outside of Pastana.
Speaker 1 (29:07):
If you like listening to Ruthie's Table four, would you
please make sure to rate and review the podcast on
the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.
Speaker 2 (29:21):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (29:26):
Let's talk about work and eating. So if you know
you're having a concert, would you have a meal before
or do you go out hungry? Or do you tell
me about if.
Speaker 3 (29:37):
My show's usually start at eight? Well they used to
because I'm not doing them anymore. But I would eat
probably at five point thirty something, not too heavy.
Speaker 2 (29:47):
What would it be like?
Speaker 3 (29:48):
What would it would be? Probably a little steak and
some vegetables, not probably yet, just some protein and some
vegetables because you can't go on stage when you'll fall out.
They just know, very unpleasant thought that would be. It
was a ritual, my whole your ritual.
Speaker 2 (30:04):
So your ritual is to eat at five thirty by yourself.
Did you see people before or not?
Speaker 3 (30:09):
Just its just me.
Speaker 1 (30:10):
And yeah, and then you go out and you have water,
presumably water, and then.
Speaker 3 (30:16):
You know it's I get to the venue at three o'clock.
I've got to sleep till five point thirty, and then
I have my lunch, dinner. Then I faff around getting
ready and then let's it. It's just a ritual that
happens all the time. Five thirty is the regular five thirty.
Speaker 2 (30:30):
And what about afterwards? Do you eat afterwards?
Speaker 3 (30:33):
No, I'm on a plane. It's you might have a sandwich,
might have a sandwich, half a sandwich.
Speaker 2 (30:40):
When do you have the opportunity to explore a city?
Speaker 1 (30:43):
Then if you're giving a concert in a city, do
you have a sense of where you are that you
can sort of be where you are or do. It
is purely arriving, sleeping, performing, and then it's.
Speaker 3 (30:56):
All a blur there it is there's no time to
side see and you realize if you're in Powers and
you're in Italy, or you're in Denmark or places that
you feel if you're in Romania and Bulgoa, it's different
because you've never experienced it before. But the places I know,
I'm used to. But to be honest, you it's a routine.
No time to stop and enjoy the scenery. You go,
(31:17):
arrive at the airport, get into the car, go to
the show, relax, eat, do the show, fly off to
another place.
Speaker 2 (31:23):
But you do travel for pleasure.
Speaker 1 (31:25):
So absolutely, you have memories of a restaurant in Florence,
you have memories of a restaurant in Venice. Are there
other cities that you really other than the two Italian
ones in France or in.
Speaker 4 (31:34):
Well, the south, in the south of France. We have
a house in Yes. So we're introduced to a restaurant
in Niice, cod La Petite Maison, And it was Hubert
and Javonci that recommended it to us because he was
someone that welcomed us when we first came down and
gave us a few pointers on places to go and
people to know, and that became a real ritual for us.
(31:55):
Every summer we would go there and be looked after
by Nicole at least once a week, once every two weeks.
Speaker 1 (32:02):
Character Yeah, one time Richard and I were there and
we wanted we won't even lef it and we wanted
to leave, and she wouldn't let us go.
Speaker 2 (32:09):
She said this, and it was going to be the
Gypsy Queens.
Speaker 4 (32:11):
This is like, she's a brilliant restaurant for her, she's
very passionate. She's not everybody's cup of tea, but the
food is worth it, and she's always been listening to
us and the boysilers Again, we never see a menu
when we go there. They literally Nicole just feeds us.
So it's like course after course after corn, a lot
(32:35):
of it's a lot of food, which is why we
don't go too often, because it's quite rich and there's
a lot of butter and a lot of all the
oil you.
Speaker 2 (32:44):
Eat that much of the South answers.
Speaker 4 (32:45):
Mostly, We've had a wonderful chef who's cooked for us
for over twenty years, and I think because Elton spends
so much time traveling on the road, and I travel
a lot for work as well. The gray luxury in
the world is staying in your own home and eating wonderful.
Speaker 3 (33:03):
Food terrorists there, which is just perfect for breakfast, for lunch,
for dinner. It's just you can't drag yourself away from
the table. It's a conversation table, and the viewer is amazing.
So why would you bother to go out?
Speaker 4 (33:16):
And all our friends come to visit us, so that's
the time we catch up with the people we love,
you know, on that beautiful terrorist eating fantastic food, all
the local produce. You know, it's like the food basket
of the world there and you get fantastic produce and
exactly question I.
Speaker 2 (33:33):
Saw that fish.
Speaker 1 (33:33):
I know Sara's going to ask you growing up as
you did with the importance of food, points of the table,
the importance of that kind of sharing of your time
with food.
Speaker 2 (33:43):
What about the boys? How do you do it with them?
Speaker 1 (33:45):
What will they when I'm interviewing them in fifteen years,
what will they tell me about their life?
Speaker 3 (33:50):
As they would say they had the best time. I mean,
they just you know, they love go to the chef
food in the summer, and exactly as I say, goes
out fishing comes back with a hate. We eat it
and it's just like, well, it's such a great feeling,
and I think he loves it, the fact that we're
eating dinner and he called it because the summer. Really
it's not just about it's more about them than us.
(34:11):
It's about we want to give them a great memory
of summer, so that kids have the friends come as
stay with us with their parents. So it's really we
pay more attention to them than we do to ourselves.
Speaker 4 (34:23):
And meals are sacred, so no phones at the table,
no television on in the background. It's all about conversation.
It's all about connection. It's where we catch up because
we all have busy lives and we hear about each
other's days. And during lockdown, where we with the boys
three meals a day, when we just talked all the
(34:44):
time about what was going on in the world and
told funny stories or learned about his history or my history.
And the food is part of that brings you together.
Speaker 1 (34:53):
Food is about sharing time with your children, something that
you want to explore, to tell you about another country.
It's also comfort and I was wondering if my last
question of a very beautiful interview and thank you is
to ask you if you needed comfort from a food,
is there a food that you would go.
Speaker 3 (35:11):
To comfort food? Bacon sandwich, bacon sandwich.
Speaker 4 (35:18):
Probably a really basic pasta, like a simple pasta, like
pasta like reat pasta, which I love with a bit
of cheese, a lot of even, but even simple pasta with.
Speaker 2 (35:38):
Pasta is very very confident.
Speaker 3 (35:40):
Yeah, yeah, that's very comforting to me too. But if
if I'm here and a bacon sandwich is much easier
to prepare, So.
Speaker 2 (35:49):
How do you make a bacon sandwich?
Speaker 3 (35:50):
Elton John on whole wheat bread with butter and proper
English bacon, not Danish, not streaky, but you know Lush's
bacon with the fat cut off and cooked quite well,
so it's quite crackly.
Speaker 2 (36:05):
Okay, I'd like to have one of those. Thank you
so much, thank
Speaker 4 (36:09):
You, it's very love, thank you, thank you,
Host
Ruth Rogers
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