August 1, 2023 • 38 mins
Prenups, divorces, and custody oh my! Larsa's favorite Attorney-at-Law Jason Giller gives good advice on this special episode of Separation Anxiety.
He answers tough questions on everything from DNA drama, business red flags, and when a prenup can be contested.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:09):
And we're back with another episode of Separation and Anxiety.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
I'm your host Marcus Jordan and I'm Larsa Pippen, and today.
Speaker 1 (00:16):
We have a very special episode of Separation Anxiety because
we have our very first.
Speaker 3 (00:19):
Guests we do. It's one of my favorite people on
the whole planet. It's someone that I turned to when
I have questions, concerns, problems. You're kind of like you
my fixer, Jason.
Speaker 4 (00:28):
Yeah, that's what I do exactly.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
So welcome Attorney Jason Gillor. Thank you for joining the podcast. First,
tell our listeners what kind of law you're specialize in.
Speaker 4 (00:36):
So I have a general practice. We pretty much do everything.
It's always about solving problems and guiding clients through different
legal issues, business issues, and generally helping them.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
Awesome, Larca tell.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
Us how so, you guys, it's kind of a crazy story.
I met Jason because we were literally friends for a
long time through a mutual friend Michelle, and then I
had a minor problem, so I moved into this house
when I was newly separated. It was like I woke
up one day and I was like, I can't live
in the same house anymore with my ex I like
rented this house really quickly, and I realized that there
(01:10):
were cameras inside the house that were recording me. Okay,
so I called Jason. I'm like, oh my god, Jason,
the house that I rented has cameras and they are
recording in the house while I'm in the house. Because
the landlord would text me and say, hey, did you
forget to set the alarm? Oh my gosh, and stuff
like that. It was like really creepy stuff. Do you
remember when I called you? Yeah, of course, And I
(01:33):
was just like traumatized. I was like, how do I
get out of the situation? What do we do? And
then what did you end up helping me do?
Speaker 4 (01:37):
No, there was a whole litney of things, like he
would call and complain that Larcia left the air conditioning
at the wrong temperature. He would say, well, if you're
going to leave the house, you should put the AC down,
And you didn't put the AC down. We're like, wait
a minute, how does this guy know what she's doing.
It was like a creeper, and it became pretty apparent
that he was actually it seemed like he was watching
the through the cameras. The house was rented how.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
Long was he before you got you noticed, LARSA.
Speaker 3 (02:02):
I think I was in the house like three weeks, right.
Speaker 4 (02:04):
Yeah it was, it was, yeah, it was. It was
early on in the least.
Speaker 3 (02:06):
Yeah, it was probably two three weeks in. But the
guy was really creepy because when I first met him,
he literally was like, whatever you need, I will be
here whatever you need. And I kind of felt like
he was kind of flirting with me a little bit,
and I was like, Oh, it's so great, so I
can move in whenever I want. I thought I thought
it was a good thing. I was like, oh, he
loves me, right, And then before I knew it, like
I started realizing that, like he's texting me, he knows
(02:28):
when I'm home and when I'm not.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
So what was the strategy, Jason? How did you?
Speaker 4 (02:32):
I mean, it's it's pretty much the same strategy for
every case, Like you have to know who you're playing with, right,
So he did some investigative work on the house on
the guy, and then based off of our research, it
seemed like a good portion of the house was actually
built without permits.
Speaker 3 (02:46):
Oh no, oh my gosh, I remember that. That's great.
Speaker 4 (02:48):
Yeah, it was so again, it was kind of like
one of these scenarios where you know, we needed out
of the least the house wasn't properly permitted. If this
all came to light, you know, he would run the risk.
You know, maybe the house gets condemned, right, I mean
he could have permit issues, there could be leans, et cetera.
And then eventually, you know, there's back and forth and
everyone kind of came to the conclusion like instead of
(03:10):
you know, going to war, everyone should just kind of,
you know, lick their wounds and go their own waysts in.
Speaker 2 (03:18):
Everybody.
Speaker 4 (03:18):
Everybody has them. It's a function of finding it for sure.
And you know, and that's kind of you know, part
of the lesson. When you've been around long enough and
the really good lawyers they realize, you got to you
gotta know who you're playing with. Right. If you know
the players, you understand the field. You know, that's how
you can be the most effective. And a lot of
cases they resolve because of pressures that can exist outside
(03:40):
of the courtroom. Right, It's not just the merits, but
also understanding that, Okay, you could be right on this case,
but if these issues come to light, that might destroy
your business, destroy your personality. And that's and that's why
cases subtle.
Speaker 1 (03:55):
Wow, that's awesome. Well, without further ado is get into
some questions exactly. So Jason, when a couple comes in
and asks to draw up a prenup, can you tell
if they're going to last or not?
Speaker 4 (04:08):
So prenups?
Speaker 3 (04:11):
If you got married, would you have a prenup?
Speaker 4 (04:13):
Uh? Well, I'm definitely not going to answer that question.
Speaker 2 (04:17):
A smart man right there.
Speaker 4 (04:19):
Yeah, I'm going to take the fifth on that one.
Prenups aren't necessarily a bad thing, right, So, for example,
like one of the advantages to prenups is that like
if if if one party has a comes from family
money for example, right, a lot of their wealth and
investments and assets that they have they're tied to other
family members, right, And so if you get married and
(04:41):
you don't have a prenup, those assets and those business
interests could become ingrained in like divorce proceedings or child
support proceedings, and no one really wants to subject their
family to that, right. It's disruptive. It can be that
it can have like created a lot of economic hardship.
So there's something advantages, right, and it also helps both ways, right,
(05:02):
because then everyone says, look, no matter what happens, you know,
perhaps the non bread winning spouse will be guaranteed a
certain amount of support or a certain amount of money.
So there are some advantages, right, Yeah, And it's a contract.
It's like everything else. It's a contract. If you can
be explicit and spell out the rights and other issues
in the document, at least everyone knows, Okay, if A,
(05:25):
if the event A happens, then this is what everyone gets,
event B, event C.
Speaker 1 (05:30):
So Lars and I previously talked about an example of
an outrageous well, we both thought it was outrageous. I
guess agreement in a prenup and so it was a
weight clause essentially, And so one spouse said that if
the other spouse went over one hundred and thirty five pounds,
then they were entitled to five hundred thousand dollars in
damages per pound over one thirty five in the course
(05:53):
of the marriage. So, I mean, have you seen any
you know, cases of crazy stuff like that.
Speaker 4 (05:58):
Personally, haven't seen anything like that. The few agreements that
I've I want to say the few, but the agreements
that I've been involved with generally, they're pretty boilerplate, right,
I mean the most I don't want to say the
most atypical because you don't see this in every prenup,
but the fidelity clauses, right, So if there's if someone
you know cheats, then typically there can be consequences for that.
Speaker 3 (06:20):
I like that one.
Speaker 2 (06:21):
What are examples of like those kinds without giving out
too much?
Speaker 4 (06:24):
So for example, it could be that you know, one
of the spouses, they may they may be entitled to
a reduced amount of support, It could be entitled to
a reduced payout, things of that nature. Or it could
be conversely, right, it could be that if, for you know,
as a hypothetical, if the husband's caught cheating, then he
might be required to give the the non cheating spouse
(06:47):
in this case, the wife more money. Right, So it
depends on really what the parties want to do. I
mean some of these are pretty these agreements. It's like
everything else, right, you can you can make it pretty
scandalous or as aggressive as you want. The vast majority
people aren't going into it thinking worst case scenario, or
they wouldn't be doing it in the first place, right,
Just a matter of kind of protecting certain interest and
(07:10):
then creating an established paradigm in the event that the
marriage doesn't work out.
Speaker 3 (07:15):
So can you tell when someone's entering a partnership for
the wrong reasons?
Speaker 4 (07:18):
So the prenup is probably actually an indication that's a
healthy marriage, because everyone is looking at like the reality
of the world, right, I mean, what happened, what exists
today doesn't mean that that's going to exist tomorrow. Life change,
people change. But yeah, I mean there are obviously signs,
like you know, when things are rushed, when there's a
person who's like rushing something or pressuring someone else, that's
(07:42):
probably a sign it's not a good relationship. And that's
not just for marriage, could be business in general. And
you know, look, you can do things right or you
could do them quick. It's rare that you can do
you can do right and quick.
Speaker 1 (07:54):
So I'm from the old school notion of if you
sign on the dotted line, there are no amendments that
could be made. And so, you know, we've all heard
of the iron clad prenup. Does such a thing exist?
Is any prenup iron class?
Speaker 2 (08:08):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (08:08):
And I mean that exists pretty much for like any
type of document. The general you know, the general premise
is that that particular document's fully integrated, meaning that's the
whole agreement on that particular subject matter. And there's typically
provisions that say there are no amendments unless they're in
writing signed by the parties.
Speaker 3 (08:27):
Okay, so when can you like, when can a prenup
be contested?
Speaker 4 (08:30):
So prenup can be contested on procedural or substantive grounds. So,
for example, if you give someone a prenup the day
before you're about to give birth, or the day before
you're about to get married, things like that or whatever,
there's a presumption that you're underdress, you don't have enough
time to digest it, you don't have independent counsel, things
weren't explained to you.
Speaker 3 (08:51):
What if you get like a twenty care ring and
you're just in just you know, like duress, and then
you sign off and the wedding isn't two months, do
you still well?
Speaker 4 (08:58):
I mean, I mean, it depends. It depends on the
facts and circumstances. But the reality is.
Speaker 3 (09:03):
That most of the time the prenup kind of stands.
Speaker 4 (09:06):
A lot of the time, if it's done correctly, the
prenup will be enforceable. And because you know each you
know the husband and the wife will have independent counsel,
it'll be explained. In many instances, the prenup will be negotiated. Generally,
my recommendation is for people to record these things. Right.
So even now, like in our office, we're using like
(09:28):
a new software. We're basically really important documents. We have
a software that basically records people signing it.
Speaker 2 (09:36):
Right.
Speaker 4 (09:36):
You have to video recording, video recording, you have like
a KBA analysis, you have a ID credentialing analysis. Because
there's so much fraud and then people always come back
if if they sign something later they don't like, oh
I didn't sign that. So and so could have signed that.
That's pretty smart, right, and then this way it kind
of it deters against people taking that position.
Speaker 3 (09:56):
That's actually amazing. Yeah, that's great.
Speaker 1 (09:58):
Stepping out of the family court. So, what is maybe
the dumbest thing that you've seen people fight about in court?
And it doesn't necessarily need to be pertaining to divorce,
but like.
Speaker 3 (10:07):
In general, like, what's the dumbest thing? Because I feel
like you tell me really good story. Jason has great stories,
and I love going to dinner with you where I'm like, Jason,
how is your week? And then you tell me the
craziest stories.
Speaker 4 (10:17):
Because because the truth of the matter is, like in
today's world, you don't have to make things up, right,
they don't have to be scripted. Reality is is pretty entertaining.
So for sure, I got I mean the craziest story.
I mean, I've you know, I had a client who
invested a couple of million dollars in like a dog
food company, not knowing anything about dog food, and there
was no dog food company, and you know, I mean
(10:39):
that was nothing. He basically he bought himself a lawsuit.
I mean, that's that's what he did.
Speaker 3 (10:47):
And that's kind of like another thing, like you really
have to make sure that when you're entering a business,
a marriage, any type of a serious relationship, you definitely
have to do your research and know who the person
is that you're going to be sleepy with.
Speaker 4 (10:58):
You know for sure. And that's that's amazing you say it,
because that's what I tell people all the time that
they want to do like joint ventures, they want to
have partners. When you're in a business relationship, it's the
same as marriage. You're getting into bed because if you
want to get out, you have to dissolve the entity.
It's the same thing as dissolving your marriage. It is
a business divorce, and.
Speaker 3 (11:18):
If they get sued, you potentially can get sued also.
Speaker 4 (11:20):
Well, of course, I mean there's a couple of cases
now where the lawyers that were representing very bad actors
are now being sued because they aided or at least
the allegations are that they aided these.
Speaker 3 (11:31):
Bad actors, right, who are the actors?
Speaker 4 (11:33):
So there was there's a pretty well known case now
called like Hammock Oaks, where there was like these board
of directors that were essentially they were using like fraudulent
accounting practices trying to foreclose their neighbors out buying their
units on the cheap. They had their you know, six
cousins on the payroll, and they owned the landscaping company.
And then basically they were using because they were on
(11:55):
the board, they had the ability to use association funds
to pay for lawyers and to pay for defense and
things like that, and you know, so it can be
kind of dangerous.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
Right, Yeah, sounds money.
Speaker 3 (12:07):
Okay, So that's the strangest ruling you've ever witnessed a
judge make in court. Actually, I've seen some crazy.
Speaker 4 (12:14):
Stuff there's all kinds of like crazy rulings. I mean,
I've had judges that just because they didn't finish reading
the documents, they'll adopt positions that like the Florida Supreme
Court has already rejected because they just misread the document
or they're too Do.
Speaker 3 (12:29):
You ever jump in and you're like, by the way,
you forgot to read page like twenty or do not?
You can't do that?
Speaker 4 (12:34):
Yeah, so you can move for reconsideration. There's a mechanism
to kind of correct these types of.
Speaker 3 (12:39):
Errors like respectfully, right, like, because if you're too aggressive,
they probably.
Speaker 4 (12:43):
Will like, well, I mean it's like everything else, you
have to be respectful. Right, There's there's rules. But sometimes
you know, judges, they're people, right, and sometimes you have
really great judges, sometimes mediocre, some not great ones.
Speaker 1 (12:55):
Have you ever had an instance where a judge was like,
you know, kind of picking on you or coming at
you and you had the diss you right back.
Speaker 4 (13:02):
Well, yeah, and that happens, you know, pretty frequently. Usually
it's it was the better judges that were doing it, yeah,
And it was actually I construed it as kind of
like a sign of respect, right, because they know they're
trying to kind of get me to articulate my position
or provide the authority for sure. And that's really what
it is. It's most judges they respect the lawyers in
(13:24):
front of them, and that's a healthy relationship.
Speaker 2 (13:26):
Right.
Speaker 4 (13:27):
You want to have credibility. The judges want to be
you know, have the confidence that you're giving them the
right case law, the right statutes. And it's healthy and
I love it. I mean some of the judges. No
one likes losing, but some of the judges, you know,
they wouldn't grant like a preliminary motion and it was frustrating.
But what they were communicating is, look, you there was
(13:48):
a procedural issue, or you need to emphasize this point
or take more evidence, and then you come back and
then ultimately we could win the case. So it's it's
like everything in life. Sometimes you need to take the
longer path, but it gets you on to the right conclusion.
Speaker 2 (14:02):
Like that.
Speaker 3 (14:02):
So let me ask you a question. What if you've
got like a family member that doesn't have a whole
lot of money, but really believes in themselves and thinks
they want to have a prenup, they want to get married,
but they can't financially afford a lawyer. Is there a
way you can get a prenup without hiring an expensive lawyer?
Speaker 4 (14:20):
Yeah, of course. I mean there's there's all kinds of
nonprofit you know, options, you know, for people to guide
you through it. And the truth is, I mean, some
of these prenups depending on what the terms are.
Speaker 3 (14:31):
So is it basically like a You could just basically
have a contract and a witness. Is that all you need?
Speaker 2 (14:36):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (14:37):
Basically?
Speaker 3 (14:37):
Oh wow, Okay, that's not interesting. I feel like we've
had friends that keep asking us about the stuff and
they basically said, Hey, I want to have a prenup
just because I know that my company is going to
be valued at a whole lot of money in five years
from now. I don't want to wait and want to
get married sooner, but I can't afford to hire, you know,
a thousand dollar an hour attorney to do this.
Speaker 4 (14:56):
Yeah, but there's lots of great lawyers out there that
are not a thousand of dollars an hour. And the
truth of the matter is, it's like everything else in life,
if it's meaningful for you, anyone with the internet connection,
you can do enough research, you can find the answer,
right so it's literally at your fingertips. But a lot
of people they just for whatever reason, they don't really
(15:16):
want to spend the time to do the research, which
is kind of a shame because a lot of these
things like tools. You know, even ten years ago, fifteen
years ago, if you wanted to do real legal research,
you had to go to a law library. Right like
now you have all these different platforms that the better
ones typically are paid subscriptions, but they're at your fingertips,
(15:39):
and there's a lot of free ones and they have
free trials. So it's again, it's for the If it's
important enough, people find a way to be educated on
the story.
Speaker 3 (15:46):
You have access to information that's like really.
Speaker 1 (15:48):
Really nice, Jason. Historically the legal system has favored mothers
it comes to custody cases. But have you seen the
tide turning on that in recent years.
Speaker 4 (16:05):
Yeah, I've actually I've seen that a lot. I've seen
the tide turning a lot. Right now in Florida, the
law just became effective last year. But basically they the
legislature passed new laws that created a presumption that both
parents are entitled to equal time sharing and equal print
or responsibility. So that's the presumption. That's the starting point, right,
(16:27):
and then of course the court will weigh a variety
of factors to determine. Okay, one parent seems to be
the better decision maker should be given more responsibility, or
just practically one parent. If someone just stay at home
parent or has a more flexible work schedule, maybe they
should get a little bit more than the fifty percent
time schedule.
Speaker 2 (16:47):
Yeah, that's that's cool.
Speaker 3 (16:49):
I feel like more. I feel like in twenty twenty three,
dads are really really more involved. I feel like my
dad's generation, I don't. I feel like dads were not
as involved. Dads were like providers.
Speaker 1 (17:00):
Yea, I feel like, you know, the tide has been
changing and turning over the over recent years.
Speaker 3 (17:04):
Yeah, women work just as hard as money, and.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
It sounds like there's more of a strike based system,
Like if you have more negatives against you than you know,
the court might rule in favor of the other spouse
or something like that.
Speaker 3 (17:15):
So let me ask you another question, Jason, is a
marriage considered legal if the man only mirrored because he
got her pregnant but later found out that child was
not his? Can you have it annulled if you find
out that the child is not yours.
Speaker 2 (17:27):
Yeah, I think that's basically that does.
Speaker 3 (17:28):
Happen sometimes, Yeah, it does kind of happen.
Speaker 4 (17:30):
Yeah, And there's a lot of It's not even just
about like the child, right, it could be any kind
of like material false representation. Really, yeah, because when people
forget and this comes up. There was a really crazy
case I had involving like an engagement ring, and then
it ballooned into you know, someone wanting like implants back.
I mean it was really no, yeah, it was.
Speaker 3 (17:50):
It was only his boobs back that he paid for.
Speaker 2 (17:52):
Yeah, I'm not mad at that.
Speaker 4 (17:55):
So, yeah, it ballooned. I was only in the case
for very.
Speaker 3 (17:59):
Very If they're not going to be together, he should not.
Another man should enjoy the boots.
Speaker 2 (18:03):
I spent that money. You know he's.
Speaker 3 (18:08):
Enjoy the booths long enough.
Speaker 4 (18:10):
Yeah, I'm not.
Speaker 2 (18:10):
I don't.
Speaker 4 (18:10):
I don't think even in my last days, I'll probably
understand like the psychology of what he wanted plants for.
Speaker 2 (18:21):
That's pretty funny.
Speaker 4 (18:22):
Yeah. But but basically marriage and and this comes up
a lot. There's actually a lot of litigation about engagement rings,
but marriage it's it's actually a contract, right, I mean,
you are entering into this binding relationship based on a contract. So,
just like any other contract, if someone lies to you
and that lies material and you rely on it to
(18:42):
your detriment, then there's a basis to resent.
Speaker 3 (18:47):
Feel like a lot of women don't know that.
Speaker 1 (18:49):
I feel like a lot of people don't know that.
You know, good lawyers can argue anything in the court.
Speaker 4 (18:54):
So well, one of the one of the craziest cases
kind of along that. I think it was out of
somewhere out of Asia. But basically there was a man
married this woman, really attractive woman, and they had a child.
The child came out and in his words, was the
ugliest creature he ever saw. So he couldn't understand. He
was like, I don't I'm not that ugly, you know,
She's not that ugly, And so he started like doing
(19:17):
little digging and then he realized that basically she had
plastic surgery from head to toe and for her entire
life was getting these procedures done. And so he sought
to have his marriage and nolled and saw damages from her,
and he wanted and he won, he won, and he won.
And what the chord with this particular my recollection is
(19:38):
what the cord found is that yes, if you can
do all these things, but if you don't disclose it,
then you're basically giving the false impression that you will
probably have beautiful children.
Speaker 2 (19:50):
Wow.
Speaker 3 (19:51):
Wow, ladies, you definitely disclose all your plastic surgery because
you can have all your marriage.
Speaker 2 (19:59):
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (19:59):
I I kind of agree with the judge in that
case because, like, you know, false, I feel like.
Speaker 2 (20:06):
To say exactly, and I feel.
Speaker 1 (20:08):
Like, you know, I was going to ask about an
example of like a fraud let's say, like a Bernie
made off or something like that, and not to necessarily say,
you know, that exact example, but let's say you marry
somebody and the you know, the impression is that they've
got this successful business or you helped build a successful
business that was all based on fraud. You know, could
(20:30):
you then ask for an annoment? And so it sounds
like there's cases out there or examples that maybe you
can argue in your favor.
Speaker 4 (20:37):
Yeah, definitely are.
Speaker 1 (20:39):
Jason, At what point is it too late to get
an annoment? Is there a statute of limitations on something
like that?
Speaker 4 (20:45):
I don't know, I mean, like any cause based on state, right, Yeah,
it would vary by the jurisdiction, and most causes of
action at some point there's what's called the statute limitation, right,
So you couldn't You probably couldn't bring that twenty years later, yeah,
because at that point there would be you know, a
presumption that it's too late, right, I mean, you waited
(21:06):
too long. You should have known earlier. You're stuck like
Chuck in Florida. I think it's stuck ten or twelve years.
Like most causes of action, after ten or twelve years,
you can't bring them anymore because wow. Yeah, And the
courts need to do it, right, I mean they need
to kind of prioritize things that are like relevant, and
I mean think about how you're going to find evidence
(21:27):
from twenty years ago or twenty five years ago. All
the witnesses are, they move, they're dead, they have dementia,
they're rehab somewhere years right, you know, so yeah, a.
Speaker 3 (21:36):
Lot of crazy things happen. So wait, do you have
like extensive knowledge and cases involving fraud and tell us
some of your clients who have lost millions because I
know when I've talked to you before, you were like
really stressed out because you were like, I'm dealing with
all these different cases, and I think there was like
a fraud case that you were working on.
Speaker 4 (21:52):
Yeah, I mean, fraud happens all the time, and it
comes in all shapes and forms, right and unfortunately, I mean,
and most of the better frauds actually seem to be
where the people can juice someone else for five million bucks,
ten million bucks, fifty million bucks. And it's kind of like,
I don't know, there's like some unspoken ability for people like, oh,
(22:14):
if you have the balls to ask me for fifty
million dollars, like you must be legit, right what because
the people the people asking you for five grand or
ten grand, Like the first thing that goes off in
your head is, oh, wait a minute, you know, like
this doesn't make sense, Like you must not be that
successful if you need five grand for me, right right.
But if someone comes to you with like some business idea. Look,
I'm putting in all this money and I need fifty
(22:35):
million to get it off the ground, You're like, oh, well,
this guy must be really asking for fifty million dollars.
Speaker 2 (22:39):
Yeah, I'll bet you.
Speaker 3 (22:40):
It's kind of like it's kind of like that show
do you remember on Netflix inventing Anna.
Speaker 2 (22:46):
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3 (22:47):
I could not believe all the banks and all the
people that she was able to like convince that she
was not who she really is, Like, yeah, it's crazy.
Speaker 2 (22:56):
People are very persuasive.
Speaker 1 (23:04):
The actor strike is happening as we speak, and a
big issue of contention is artificial intelligence. But it's obviously
not just a Hollywood issue. And so tell us why
the average American should be at least concerned or researching.
Speaker 4 (23:17):
Yes, so AI. It's like every other piece of tech, right,
it could be something that can be very helpful, and
it can be something it's very very dangerous. So it's
kind of like that new software that was telling you about,
you know, for example, like when we were doing closings
or material transactions. Historically, what we've always done is we
(23:37):
get notarized wire instructions. We followed with the phone calls.
We want to get as much info as possible, send
an ID. But now if somebody has your voice, right,
so for example, you guys are public people, you've spoken
on different speaking events or online, there's now a technology
where somebody can take enough samples of your voice insane,
(23:58):
and then they can call if they get the right
number and get the right info. They could call your
bank and say, hey, can you send a wire to
blah blah blah. Yeah, it'll and it'll sound like you.
And they can spoof your phone number.
Speaker 3 (24:10):
You need a key phrase like A like so these
so like.
Speaker 4 (24:15):
This AI, like these deep fakes, like the way that
they're programmed and the way they can be deployed can
be really dangerous. But AI has been around for it
wasn't always called like AI, but basically you have these
when you have enough data sets, you can have the
software to run algorithms that will start narrowing it down
and using it and producing things. So we've been using
(24:37):
it for you know a number of years, not ready.
Speaker 1 (24:39):
I've seen you know, different applications popping up almost like
every day now.
Speaker 2 (24:43):
And you know, I saw like.
Speaker 1 (24:46):
AI added to Excel and you can like type in
what the AI is supposed to do or formulas and
it just auto populates it. Or like Photoshop, you can
type in, oh, you could upload a picture and then
type in change the background to a scenic background in
Bali and it just automatically like gives you options for that.
And so obviously those are some of the lower hanging
(25:07):
fruits of AI. But I can only imagine how you
know it can impact the law world.
Speaker 3 (25:13):
Well, I think it also impacts school, Like think about
it when you went to law school or like when
I was studying political science, I feel like it was
like hard to write all these forty page papers, but
now you can have someone else write it for you,
Like it's crazy.
Speaker 4 (25:26):
Yeah, I mean then again, I mean there was a
recent incident where I think it was from New York.
There was a lawyer that had used AI application to
draft motion with the court and then I guess they
didn't prove it and they didn't vet the authorities that
were cited. They filed it with the court and not
only was it wrong, like the authorities they cited wrong
(25:46):
fake oh wow what and yeah, and the lawyer got
sanctioned and it was kind of like.
Speaker 3 (25:51):
A lazy ass lawyer.
Speaker 2 (25:54):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (25:54):
Well there's unfortunately there's a lot of those. But basically
this software because and you got to look at really
going back to kind of like the concern point, you
got to understand like where this came from, right, this
came from like Google, from Facebook, from Instagram, from Twitter,
and it just all these applications which have been you know, free.
(26:15):
They pick up all these data points on you, so
they understand the terminology, what your search terms are, what
you're looking at, what you're saving, what you're downloading, and
then they use all that data and now they can
predict what people do. And so yeah, it's it's it's
pretty crazy. So I mean they you could you could
type in supposedly, uh, you know, write me a letter
(26:37):
on this topic, and I need it to be fifty
pages long, and it'll bang it out and you can
say I want it to be aggressive. I want it
to be I wanted to be soft. I want it
to be right and and and it has the capability
because it's a mass, you know, trillions and trillions of data.
Speaker 2 (26:51):
Points you have used.
Speaker 3 (26:54):
No, I kind of feel like, well, I don't know
it's Instagram a I because I feel like if you
can alter photo, it's like but if you can alter
your photos, is that not like yeah, different, It's.
Speaker 1 (27:02):
More like if you typed into a platform like make
me skinnier or brighten my hair color or no, like.
Speaker 2 (27:10):
No, I know you haven't, but I do feel.
Speaker 3 (27:12):
I do feel like this is I do feel like
I do feel like this this whole process has been
going on for the last like what like ten eight years,
ten years something like that, because think about it, first,
we had like all these different social media platforms where
you're able to alter how you look, alter how you sound.
You can take a photo and like get some kind
of app where it shows that you're on the beach
(27:33):
and you can literally be in prison all this stuff.
Speaker 2 (27:36):
Yeah on the zoom background.
Speaker 3 (27:37):
I'm just saying, everything in today's world is so hocus pocused.
None of this stuff's real. It's crazy because think about it.
Back when we were kids, you used to have to
handwrite your paper, You used to really have to know math.
Like now everything is everything is so easy that it's like,
how are kids going to be challenged? They're not, how
are they going to be challenged?
Speaker 4 (27:56):
Well, I mean it's kind of the byproduct of like
American society becoming amassing the wealth that they have. Right,
everything is convenient, easy, and we have these types of tools,
and then people will kind of use it for the
wrong way. Personally, when I have meetings with people, I
want to meet in person, right if I can, you know,
if I can even talk to someone not necessarily FaceTime,
(28:16):
but like zoom. I prefer that over the phone. There's
a different interaction, and that's kind of the interaction I miss,
like even now with courts, and it's only in rare
circumstances you actually go to court. But for me, that's
like important. You can judge credibility, you can see how's
the other person reacting, and that's kind of what we're
losing there. I mean, what was the movie with Bruce Willis.
It was called like Surrogates or something where basically he
(28:38):
just sat in the house like all day and he
had this like avatar running around doing all this stuff.
I mean, but with the technology that exists today, I mean,
you could you could basically.
Speaker 2 (28:47):
Do that if you want to do that's for sure.
Speaker 3 (28:50):
Think about this. It's also like in dating, like all
these dating apps, I feel like people swipe swipe because
you're looking at someone's photo and someone's bio that like
their friend had had them right up. Yeah, but if
you spent if you literally spent ten minutes on a.
Speaker 1 (29:04):
Dating site, would be like find me like an exact statistics,
So you'd be like looking for a five foot five
women with blonde hair and brown eyes. I'm just saying
with AI is like you can program the algorithm to
do what you want versus just seeing a generic algorithm.
Speaker 3 (29:23):
No, of course I get what you're saying.
Speaker 1 (29:24):
Yeah, and so Jason, is there something that people can
do now to protect themselves from like the harms of AI?
Speaker 4 (29:31):
Yeah, I mean, just you just got to verify, right,
follow up? Talk to people on the phone, if you
can see them in person is better. I mean there's
because again, I mean, you just hear a voice on
the end of the phone. You don't really know, right
if you get a you know, one of the biggest
scams a lot of people get is they get something
that will pop up on their computers saying, oh, you
need your computer's been hacked. We can solve it for you.
(29:55):
Call this number and then take your credit card time
and people fall for that. People do you know, or
they'll get a phone call. They'll say, this is really common,
especially for my foreign clients. They'll get these phone calls
from people saying that they work for the US government
from the IRS and basically, if you don't send X
number of dollars through like a money order by tomorrow,
(30:16):
they're going to be arrested and without fail. I mean
I can tell you ninety percent of my foreign clients
they get these types of messages, they get these phone
calls and they call me frantic. I don't understand there's
nothing that was owed everything, the count and handles everything,
and I'm like, no, that's not how the IRS operates. Right,
they send you a letter, they follow up, and so
(30:36):
one of the ways you could do if you get
a phone call from a bank, from an agency, anything
like that, or any even a phone number from someone
you're doing a deal with, right it could be a
real estate broke or a lawyer accountant. If you don't
recognize the number, you don't know the name, call them back.
Call the number that you're familiar with. That's a great
idea and confirm. And that's one of the ways that
you can sure that like these are real things, because
(30:58):
you're going to see these types of scam going to
be all over the place.
Speaker 3 (31:02):
Yeah, I'm so paranoid. I don't even trust my grandmother. Like,
if my grandmother is calling me asking me for personal
numbers and stuff, I'm like, I'll call you right back.
Speaker 1 (31:09):
Like it's funny because I changed my number a couple
of months back, and it's the first time I changed
my number and like, I don't know a long time,
and I just felt like as I was texting people, Hey,
it's Mark because I got a new number, then they
in turn, we're calling other people that we knew mutually
just to verify, like it's just real, because you know,
it's like I don't know, it's just funny.
Speaker 2 (31:30):
That's what made me. It made me think of that
a little bit.
Speaker 3 (31:32):
Yeah, I mean you definitely have to like do your
research and find.
Speaker 4 (31:35):
You're talking about why did you change your number? Someone
put your number in like Craigslist.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
Not that I know, I wouldn't I wouldn't doubt it,
but not just a new chapter, you know, turning the.
Speaker 3 (31:44):
New changing my numbers. Yeah, I feel like it's good.
It's good to do a lot.
Speaker 2 (31:48):
I had to cut some people off, you know, you know,
it's good for the good to start exactly.
Speaker 3 (31:54):
But I will say that, like, I feel like what
you do is like super fascinating for me. I love
hearing your stories.
Speaker 4 (32:01):
No, no, I love and there's no there's no two
days that are alike. Every day there's something new, and
it's it's generally fun. And I mean I personally couldn't
imagine doing anything else. And again, as the world evolves,
like the practice of law evolves, there's new problems, new solutions.
Speaker 1 (32:17):
What are you seeing most frequently these days in terms
of the cases that you take the court.
Speaker 4 (32:24):
I mean just a lot. So I mean so again,
like right now, we're still at least especially in South floor,
I should say, we're still like in an economic boom.
Right people are still making but money, businesses are good,
real estate values are up. What I suspect will happen
is that when the economy cycles down and businesses don't
survive or you know, business ventures don't they're no longer viable,
(32:48):
that's when people will fight. Right When, when people are
making money, everything's good, no one will look at the contracts,
No one cares what the contracts say. When things go
bad and people start losing money, that's when the fighting
typically happens. So you know, the lesson kind of is,
you know, if you're going to sign something, it's make
sure you're comfortable with what you're signing, and I generally
(33:08):
look at it. Okay, worst case scenario, right, armageddon happens.
Worst case scenario if the agreement, if you can survive
with whatever the outcome is under the agreement, then that's
a good investment. If you can't, don't do it. And
if you don't like the agreement, you're better off having
no agreement than a bad agreement.
Speaker 2 (33:27):
That's true.
Speaker 3 (33:27):
That's true. Okay, So before we let you go, what's
one piece of legal advice that you'd like to leave
our listeners with.
Speaker 4 (33:34):
If I can only give one, it's just if you
have nothing intelligent to say, or you can't be honest
about somebody, say nothing. You know, we have that amendment
bill wrights people never exercise it.
Speaker 3 (33:45):
And everybody's doing that because there's times when I do
interviews and I feel pressured to say something like I
did yesterday when I was doing my interview, and I
feel like I need to be in a place where
I don't have to like answer questions. Sometimes I could
just be like I do I'm not comfortable answering that,
but I just feel like sometimes I don't. I'm like
a little kid sometimes I need to.
Speaker 1 (34:05):
I think you like to be the life of the
party sometimes and that sometimes sways you into making decisions
you normally wouin.
Speaker 4 (34:12):
So I mean it's okay to say no, right, And
I think that's what I think that comes from saying
I agree with that. Yeah, you know, so don't don't
be shy about it. And you know, again, I mean,
I know a lot of people get in a lot
of trouble because they couldn't keep their mouth shut.
Speaker 3 (34:26):
I hear you, that's okay. So the power is saying no,
I'm going to start taking that. Guys to two of
my favorite guys to my left and to my right.
Speaker 2 (34:33):
Yeah, I love that.
Speaker 3 (34:35):
Well, you guys, we had an amazing time. Thank you
so much Jason with us, and I hope today was insightful.
I know a lot of people are going through hard times, divorces, you.
Speaker 2 (34:46):
Have relationshships, Like any conversation with Jason is.
Speaker 3 (34:48):
Always it's always fun. Yeah, it's always fun. And I think,
like I think what I got from today was basically like,
do your research.
Speaker 4 (34:56):
Yeah, oh, the diligence is super important. And again, I
mean paper is easy, right, anyone with a computer can
put it, but you gotta you have to verify it
to do your diligence. If you're gonna make a material
investment or you know, a partnership with someone, do your background,
know who you're getting into.
Speaker 1 (35:12):
And I like what Jason said about, you know, trying
to take meetings in person looking for people like my eyes,
you can kind of get a good feel. I feel
like people have gone away from that, especially through COVID.
Everything's become virtual. But whenever you get the chance, look
somebody and I you can kind of tell what they're about.
Speaker 3 (35:26):
You know, you know what. It also reminds me of
like I feel like my gut instincts are so good.
Speaker 2 (35:32):
You do have it.
Speaker 3 (35:32):
I feel like and if whenever I don't, I don't
listen to it, I always feel like later on I'm
like I knew it, Like Larsa, you knew it. Why
did you listen to yourself? Because I do feel like
when you're sitting across from someone I've been in bad deals,
Like we had a financial guy that literally stole twenty
million dollars from us and I never liked him, and
I remember sitting across from him and I knew he
was not a good.
Speaker 1 (35:53):
I feel like, even on a relationship level, like you're
a good judge of character in terms of like when
your friends try to introduce you to their.
Speaker 2 (36:00):
Way, friends like that you've got good instincts in terms.
Speaker 3 (36:03):
I am but I am. But you know what, I
feel like, it's because like I've been screwed a lot,
you know. I think it comes from a place that
I feel like it comes from a place of like,
you know, like, oh, I should have listened to what
I was thinking and feeling on the inside.
Speaker 4 (36:17):
You know.
Speaker 3 (36:18):
There's so many people that I've met that I've been
like accountants, business people all the time where they dress
really well, they speak, they speak over you, they're speaking
way smarter than you over your head, and you want
to believe everything they say, but like there's something inside
of you that's telling you that you shouldn't trust this person.
They're not looking after your best interests, you know. And
so I feel like a lot of times for me,
like now it's finally like I'm at a place where
(36:40):
I can like speak up as far as like I
don't trust this person, you know, I feel like they
don't give me a good unders.
Speaker 4 (36:45):
Face to face. I mean, yeah, it'll make the good
relationships better, strengthen those, and then the ones that are
kind of shaky people, they won't have time because it's
a lot harder. It's easier for someone to send an
email and make up the ass or even say it
on the phone. It's different when you're shitting, you know,
a couple of inches or foot away from someone, they
look you in the You call somebody a liar, of course.
Speaker 3 (37:05):
I would, yeah, J to be like you're lying, Yeah, of.
Speaker 4 (37:11):
Course I would.
Speaker 2 (37:12):
I think you're good at that too. Bag call liars
out too.
Speaker 3 (37:15):
I do call liars out, but at the same time,
like I don't know how to use my voice for no.
When I do my interviews, you know, it's like, now
you know what I think it is. I think I'm
one of those people that like I was a good student,
and I like to listen to like teachers.
Speaker 1 (37:27):
You'd like to go above and beyond me. You want
to get an A plus and everything that.
Speaker 2 (37:31):
That's probably that's not a bad thing, that's not a
bad thing.
Speaker 3 (37:33):
Yeah, well you guys. We have the best time with
you guys. Thank you and follow.
Speaker 1 (37:39):
Us a separation Underscore Anxiety Underscore podcast and tune in
next week.
Speaker 3 (37:44):
Bye guys, Bye Chasing
And we're back with another episode of Separation and Anxiety.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
I'm your host Marcus Jordan and I'm Larsa Pippen, and today.
Speaker 1 (00:16):
We have a very special episode of Separation Anxiety because
we have our very first.
Speaker 3 (00:19):
Guests we do. It's one of my favorite people on
the whole planet. It's someone that I turned to when
I have questions, concerns, problems. You're kind of like you
my fixer, Jason.
Speaker 4 (00:28):
Yeah, that's what I do exactly.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
So welcome Attorney Jason Gillor. Thank you for joining the podcast. First,
tell our listeners what kind of law you're specialize in.
Speaker 4 (00:36):
So I have a general practice. We pretty much do everything.
It's always about solving problems and guiding clients through different
legal issues, business issues, and generally helping them.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
Awesome, Larca tell.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
Us how so, you guys, it's kind of a crazy story.
I met Jason because we were literally friends for a
long time through a mutual friend Michelle, and then I
had a minor problem, so I moved into this house
when I was newly separated. It was like I woke
up one day and I was like, I can't live
in the same house anymore with my ex I like
rented this house really quickly, and I realized that there
(01:10):
were cameras inside the house that were recording me. Okay,
so I called Jason. I'm like, oh my god, Jason,
the house that I rented has cameras and they are
recording in the house while I'm in the house. Because
the landlord would text me and say, hey, did you
forget to set the alarm? Oh my gosh, and stuff
like that. It was like really creepy stuff. Do you
remember when I called you? Yeah, of course, And I
(01:33):
was just like traumatized. I was like, how do I
get out of the situation? What do we do? And
then what did you end up helping me do?
Speaker 4 (01:37):
No, there was a whole litney of things, like he
would call and complain that Larcia left the air conditioning
at the wrong temperature. He would say, well, if you're
going to leave the house, you should put the AC down,
And you didn't put the AC down. We're like, wait
a minute, how does this guy know what she's doing.
It was like a creeper, and it became pretty apparent
that he was actually it seemed like he was watching
the through the cameras. The house was rented how.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
Long was he before you got you noticed, LARSA.
Speaker 3 (02:02):
I think I was in the house like three weeks, right.
Speaker 4 (02:04):
Yeah it was, it was, yeah, it was. It was
early on in the least.
Speaker 3 (02:06):
Yeah, it was probably two three weeks in. But the
guy was really creepy because when I first met him,
he literally was like, whatever you need, I will be
here whatever you need. And I kind of felt like
he was kind of flirting with me a little bit,
and I was like, Oh, it's so great, so I
can move in whenever I want. I thought I thought
it was a good thing. I was like, oh, he
loves me, right, And then before I knew it, like
I started realizing that, like he's texting me, he knows
(02:28):
when I'm home and when I'm not.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
So what was the strategy, Jason? How did you?
Speaker 4 (02:32):
I mean, it's it's pretty much the same strategy for
every case, Like you have to know who you're playing with, right,
So he did some investigative work on the house on
the guy, and then based off of our research, it
seemed like a good portion of the house was actually
built without permits.
Speaker 3 (02:46):
Oh no, oh my gosh, I remember that. That's great.
Speaker 4 (02:48):
Yeah, it was so again, it was kind of like
one of these scenarios where you know, we needed out
of the least the house wasn't properly permitted. If this
all came to light, you know, he would run the risk.
You know, maybe the house gets condemned, right, I mean
he could have permit issues, there could be leans, et cetera.
And then eventually, you know, there's back and forth and
everyone kind of came to the conclusion like instead of
(03:10):
you know, going to war, everyone should just kind of,
you know, lick their wounds and go their own waysts in.
Speaker 2 (03:18):
Everybody.
Speaker 4 (03:18):
Everybody has them. It's a function of finding it for sure.
And you know, and that's kind of you know, part
of the lesson. When you've been around long enough and
the really good lawyers they realize, you got to you
gotta know who you're playing with. Right. If you know
the players, you understand the field. You know, that's how
you can be the most effective. And a lot of
cases they resolve because of pressures that can exist outside
(03:40):
of the courtroom. Right, It's not just the merits, but
also understanding that, Okay, you could be right on this case,
but if these issues come to light, that might destroy
your business, destroy your personality. And that's and that's why
cases subtle.
Speaker 1 (03:55):
Wow, that's awesome. Well, without further ado is get into
some questions exactly. So Jason, when a couple comes in
and asks to draw up a prenup, can you tell
if they're going to last or not?
Speaker 4 (04:08):
So prenups?
Speaker 3 (04:11):
If you got married, would you have a prenup?
Speaker 4 (04:13):
Uh? Well, I'm definitely not going to answer that question.
Speaker 2 (04:17):
A smart man right there.
Speaker 4 (04:19):
Yeah, I'm going to take the fifth on that one.
Prenups aren't necessarily a bad thing, right, So, for example,
like one of the advantages to prenups is that like
if if if one party has a comes from family
money for example, right, a lot of their wealth and
investments and assets that they have they're tied to other
family members, right, And so if you get married and
(04:41):
you don't have a prenup, those assets and those business
interests could become ingrained in like divorce proceedings or child
support proceedings, and no one really wants to subject their
family to that, right. It's disruptive. It can be that
it can have like created a lot of economic hardship.
So there's something advantages, right, and it also helps both ways, right,
(05:02):
because then everyone says, look, no matter what happens, you know,
perhaps the non bread winning spouse will be guaranteed a
certain amount of support or a certain amount of money.
So there are some advantages, right, Yeah, And it's a contract.
It's like everything else. It's a contract. If you can
be explicit and spell out the rights and other issues
in the document, at least everyone knows, Okay, if A,
(05:25):
if the event A happens, then this is what everyone gets,
event B, event C.
Speaker 1 (05:30):
So Lars and I previously talked about an example of
an outrageous well, we both thought it was outrageous. I
guess agreement in a prenup and so it was a
weight clause essentially, And so one spouse said that if
the other spouse went over one hundred and thirty five pounds,
then they were entitled to five hundred thousand dollars in
damages per pound over one thirty five in the course
(05:53):
of the marriage. So, I mean, have you seen any
you know, cases of crazy stuff like that.
Speaker 4 (05:58):
Personally, haven't seen anything like that. The few agreements that
I've I want to say the few, but the agreements
that I've been involved with generally, they're pretty boilerplate, right,
I mean the most I don't want to say the
most atypical because you don't see this in every prenup,
but the fidelity clauses, right, So if there's if someone
you know cheats, then typically there can be consequences for that.
Speaker 3 (06:20):
I like that one.
Speaker 2 (06:21):
What are examples of like those kinds without giving out
too much?
Speaker 4 (06:24):
So for example, it could be that you know, one
of the spouses, they may they may be entitled to
a reduced amount of support, It could be entitled to
a reduced payout, things of that nature. Or it could
be conversely, right, it could be that if, for you know,
as a hypothetical, if the husband's caught cheating, then he
might be required to give the the non cheating spouse
(06:47):
in this case, the wife more money. Right, So it
depends on really what the parties want to do. I
mean some of these are pretty these agreements. It's like
everything else, right, you can you can make it pretty
scandalous or as aggressive as you want. The vast majority
people aren't going into it thinking worst case scenario, or
they wouldn't be doing it in the first place, right,
Just a matter of kind of protecting certain interest and
(07:10):
then creating an established paradigm in the event that the
marriage doesn't work out.
Speaker 3 (07:15):
So can you tell when someone's entering a partnership for
the wrong reasons?
Speaker 4 (07:18):
So the prenup is probably actually an indication that's a
healthy marriage, because everyone is looking at like the reality
of the world, right, I mean, what happened, what exists
today doesn't mean that that's going to exist tomorrow. Life change,
people change. But yeah, I mean there are obviously signs,
like you know, when things are rushed, when there's a
person who's like rushing something or pressuring someone else, that's
(07:42):
probably a sign it's not a good relationship. And that's
not just for marriage, could be business in general. And
you know, look, you can do things right or you
could do them quick. It's rare that you can do
you can do right and quick.
Speaker 1 (07:54):
So I'm from the old school notion of if you
sign on the dotted line, there are no amendments that
could be made. And so, you know, we've all heard
of the iron clad prenup. Does such a thing exist?
Is any prenup iron class?
Speaker 2 (08:08):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (08:08):
And I mean that exists pretty much for like any
type of document. The general you know, the general premise
is that that particular document's fully integrated, meaning that's the
whole agreement on that particular subject matter. And there's typically
provisions that say there are no amendments unless they're in
writing signed by the parties.
Speaker 3 (08:27):
Okay, so when can you like, when can a prenup
be contested?
Speaker 4 (08:30):
So prenup can be contested on procedural or substantive grounds. So,
for example, if you give someone a prenup the day
before you're about to give birth, or the day before
you're about to get married, things like that or whatever,
there's a presumption that you're underdress, you don't have enough
time to digest it, you don't have independent counsel, things
weren't explained to you.
Speaker 3 (08:51):
What if you get like a twenty care ring and
you're just in just you know, like duress, and then
you sign off and the wedding isn't two months, do
you still well?
Speaker 4 (08:58):
I mean, I mean, it depends. It depends on the
facts and circumstances. But the reality is.
Speaker 3 (09:03):
That most of the time the prenup kind of stands.
Speaker 4 (09:06):
A lot of the time, if it's done correctly, the
prenup will be enforceable. And because you know each you
know the husband and the wife will have independent counsel,
it'll be explained. In many instances, the prenup will be negotiated. Generally,
my recommendation is for people to record these things. Right.
So even now, like in our office, we're using like
(09:28):
a new software. We're basically really important documents. We have
a software that basically records people signing it.
Speaker 2 (09:36):
Right.
Speaker 4 (09:36):
You have to video recording, video recording, you have like
a KBA analysis, you have a ID credentialing analysis. Because
there's so much fraud and then people always come back
if if they sign something later they don't like, oh
I didn't sign that. So and so could have signed that.
That's pretty smart, right, and then this way it kind
of it deters against people taking that position.
Speaker 3 (09:56):
That's actually amazing. Yeah, that's great.
Speaker 1 (09:58):
Stepping out of the family court. So, what is maybe
the dumbest thing that you've seen people fight about in court?
And it doesn't necessarily need to be pertaining to divorce,
but like.
Speaker 3 (10:07):
In general, like, what's the dumbest thing? Because I feel
like you tell me really good story. Jason has great stories,
and I love going to dinner with you where I'm like, Jason,
how is your week? And then you tell me the
craziest stories.
Speaker 4 (10:17):
Because because the truth of the matter is, like in
today's world, you don't have to make things up, right,
they don't have to be scripted. Reality is is pretty entertaining.
So for sure, I got I mean the craziest story.
I mean, I've you know, I had a client who
invested a couple of million dollars in like a dog
food company, not knowing anything about dog food, and there
was no dog food company, and you know, I mean
(10:39):
that was nothing. He basically he bought himself a lawsuit.
I mean, that's that's what he did.
Speaker 3 (10:47):
And that's kind of like another thing, like you really
have to make sure that when you're entering a business,
a marriage, any type of a serious relationship, you definitely
have to do your research and know who the person
is that you're going to be sleepy with.
Speaker 4 (10:58):
You know for sure. And that's that's amazing you say it,
because that's what I tell people all the time that
they want to do like joint ventures, they want to
have partners. When you're in a business relationship, it's the
same as marriage. You're getting into bed because if you
want to get out, you have to dissolve the entity.
It's the same thing as dissolving your marriage. It is
a business divorce, and.
Speaker 3 (11:18):
If they get sued, you potentially can get sued also.
Speaker 4 (11:20):
Well, of course, I mean there's a couple of cases
now where the lawyers that were representing very bad actors
are now being sued because they aided or at least
the allegations are that they aided these.
Speaker 3 (11:31):
Bad actors, right, who are the actors?
Speaker 4 (11:33):
So there was there's a pretty well known case now
called like Hammock Oaks, where there was like these board
of directors that were essentially they were using like fraudulent
accounting practices trying to foreclose their neighbors out buying their
units on the cheap. They had their you know, six
cousins on the payroll, and they owned the landscaping company.
And then basically they were using because they were on
(11:55):
the board, they had the ability to use association funds
to pay for lawyers and to pay for defense and
things like that, and you know, so it can be
kind of dangerous.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
Right, Yeah, sounds money.
Speaker 3 (12:07):
Okay, So that's the strangest ruling you've ever witnessed a
judge make in court. Actually, I've seen some crazy.
Speaker 4 (12:14):
Stuff there's all kinds of like crazy rulings. I mean,
I've had judges that just because they didn't finish reading
the documents, they'll adopt positions that like the Florida Supreme
Court has already rejected because they just misread the document
or they're too Do.
Speaker 3 (12:29):
You ever jump in and you're like, by the way,
you forgot to read page like twenty or do not?
You can't do that?
Speaker 4 (12:34):
Yeah, so you can move for reconsideration. There's a mechanism
to kind of correct these types of.
Speaker 3 (12:39):
Errors like respectfully, right, like, because if you're too aggressive,
they probably.
Speaker 4 (12:43):
Will like, well, I mean it's like everything else, you
have to be respectful. Right, There's there's rules. But sometimes
you know, judges, they're people, right, and sometimes you have
really great judges, sometimes mediocre, some not great ones.
Speaker 1 (12:55):
Have you ever had an instance where a judge was like,
you know, kind of picking on you or coming at
you and you had the diss you right back.
Speaker 4 (13:02):
Well, yeah, and that happens, you know, pretty frequently. Usually
it's it was the better judges that were doing it, yeah,
And it was actually I construed it as kind of
like a sign of respect, right, because they know they're
trying to kind of get me to articulate my position
or provide the authority for sure. And that's really what
it is. It's most judges they respect the lawyers in
(13:24):
front of them, and that's a healthy relationship.
Speaker 2 (13:26):
Right.
Speaker 4 (13:27):
You want to have credibility. The judges want to be
you know, have the confidence that you're giving them the
right case law, the right statutes. And it's healthy and
I love it. I mean some of the judges. No
one likes losing, but some of the judges, you know,
they wouldn't grant like a preliminary motion and it was frustrating.
But what they were communicating is, look, you there was
(13:48):
a procedural issue, or you need to emphasize this point
or take more evidence, and then you come back and
then ultimately we could win the case. So it's it's
like everything in life. Sometimes you need to take the
longer path, but it gets you on to the right conclusion.
Speaker 2 (14:02):
Like that.
Speaker 3 (14:02):
So let me ask you a question. What if you've
got like a family member that doesn't have a whole
lot of money, but really believes in themselves and thinks
they want to have a prenup, they want to get married,
but they can't financially afford a lawyer. Is there a
way you can get a prenup without hiring an expensive lawyer?
Speaker 4 (14:20):
Yeah, of course. I mean there's there's all kinds of
nonprofit you know, options, you know, for people to guide
you through it. And the truth is, I mean, some
of these prenups depending on what the terms are.
Speaker 3 (14:31):
So is it basically like a You could just basically
have a contract and a witness. Is that all you need?
Speaker 2 (14:36):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (14:37):
Basically?
Speaker 3 (14:37):
Oh wow, Okay, that's not interesting. I feel like we've
had friends that keep asking us about the stuff and
they basically said, Hey, I want to have a prenup
just because I know that my company is going to
be valued at a whole lot of money in five years
from now. I don't want to wait and want to
get married sooner, but I can't afford to hire, you know,
a thousand dollar an hour attorney to do this.
Speaker 4 (14:56):
Yeah, but there's lots of great lawyers out there that
are not a thousand of dollars an hour. And the
truth of the matter is, it's like everything else in life,
if it's meaningful for you, anyone with the internet connection,
you can do enough research, you can find the answer,
right so it's literally at your fingertips. But a lot
of people they just for whatever reason, they don't really
(15:16):
want to spend the time to do the research, which
is kind of a shame because a lot of these
things like tools. You know, even ten years ago, fifteen
years ago, if you wanted to do real legal research,
you had to go to a law library. Right like
now you have all these different platforms that the better
ones typically are paid subscriptions, but they're at your fingertips,
(15:39):
and there's a lot of free ones and they have
free trials. So it's again, it's for the If it's
important enough, people find a way to be educated on
the story.
Speaker 3 (15:46):
You have access to information that's like really.
Speaker 1 (15:48):
Really nice, Jason. Historically the legal system has favored mothers
it comes to custody cases. But have you seen the
tide turning on that in recent years.
Speaker 4 (16:05):
Yeah, I've actually I've seen that a lot. I've seen
the tide turning a lot. Right now in Florida, the
law just became effective last year. But basically they the
legislature passed new laws that created a presumption that both
parents are entitled to equal time sharing and equal print
or responsibility. So that's the presumption. That's the starting point, right,
(16:27):
and then of course the court will weigh a variety
of factors to determine. Okay, one parent seems to be
the better decision maker should be given more responsibility, or
just practically one parent. If someone just stay at home
parent or has a more flexible work schedule, maybe they
should get a little bit more than the fifty percent
time schedule.
Speaker 2 (16:47):
Yeah, that's that's cool.
Speaker 3 (16:49):
I feel like more. I feel like in twenty twenty three,
dads are really really more involved. I feel like my
dad's generation, I don't. I feel like dads were not
as involved. Dads were like providers.
Speaker 1 (17:00):
Yea, I feel like, you know, the tide has been
changing and turning over the over recent years.
Speaker 3 (17:04):
Yeah, women work just as hard as money, and.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
It sounds like there's more of a strike based system,
Like if you have more negatives against you than you know,
the court might rule in favor of the other spouse
or something like that.
Speaker 3 (17:15):
So let me ask you another question, Jason, is a
marriage considered legal if the man only mirrored because he
got her pregnant but later found out that child was
not his? Can you have it annulled if you find
out that the child is not yours.
Speaker 2 (17:27):
Yeah, I think that's basically that does.
Speaker 3 (17:28):
Happen sometimes, Yeah, it does kind of happen.
Speaker 4 (17:30):
Yeah, And there's a lot of It's not even just
about like the child, right, it could be any kind
of like material false representation. Really, yeah, because when people
forget and this comes up. There was a really crazy
case I had involving like an engagement ring, and then
it ballooned into you know, someone wanting like implants back.
I mean it was really no, yeah, it was.
Speaker 3 (17:50):
It was only his boobs back that he paid for.
Speaker 2 (17:52):
Yeah, I'm not mad at that.
Speaker 4 (17:55):
So, yeah, it ballooned. I was only in the case
for very.
Speaker 3 (17:59):
Very If they're not going to be together, he should not.
Another man should enjoy the boots.
Speaker 2 (18:03):
I spent that money. You know he's.
Speaker 3 (18:08):
Enjoy the booths long enough.
Speaker 4 (18:10):
Yeah, I'm not.
Speaker 2 (18:10):
I don't.
Speaker 4 (18:10):
I don't think even in my last days, I'll probably
understand like the psychology of what he wanted plants for.
Speaker 2 (18:21):
That's pretty funny.
Speaker 4 (18:22):
Yeah. But but basically marriage and and this comes up
a lot. There's actually a lot of litigation about engagement rings,
but marriage it's it's actually a contract, right, I mean,
you are entering into this binding relationship based on a contract. So,
just like any other contract, if someone lies to you
and that lies material and you rely on it to
(18:42):
your detriment, then there's a basis to resent.
Speaker 3 (18:47):
Feel like a lot of women don't know that.
Speaker 1 (18:49):
I feel like a lot of people don't know that.
You know, good lawyers can argue anything in the court.
Speaker 4 (18:54):
So well, one of the one of the craziest cases
kind of along that. I think it was out of
somewhere out of Asia. But basically there was a man
married this woman, really attractive woman, and they had a child.
The child came out and in his words, was the
ugliest creature he ever saw. So he couldn't understand. He
was like, I don't I'm not that ugly, you know,
She's not that ugly, And so he started like doing
(19:17):
little digging and then he realized that basically she had
plastic surgery from head to toe and for her entire
life was getting these procedures done. And so he sought
to have his marriage and nolled and saw damages from her,
and he wanted and he won, he won, and he won.
And what the chord with this particular my recollection is
(19:38):
what the cord found is that yes, if you can
do all these things, but if you don't disclose it,
then you're basically giving the false impression that you will
probably have beautiful children.
Speaker 2 (19:50):
Wow.
Speaker 3 (19:51):
Wow, ladies, you definitely disclose all your plastic surgery because
you can have all your marriage.
Speaker 2 (19:59):
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (19:59):
I I kind of agree with the judge in that
case because, like, you know, false, I feel like.
Speaker 2 (20:06):
To say exactly, and I feel.
Speaker 1 (20:08):
Like, you know, I was going to ask about an
example of like a fraud let's say, like a Bernie
made off or something like that, and not to necessarily say,
you know, that exact example, but let's say you marry
somebody and the you know, the impression is that they've
got this successful business or you helped build a successful
business that was all based on fraud. You know, could
(20:30):
you then ask for an annoment? And so it sounds
like there's cases out there or examples that maybe you
can argue in your favor.
Speaker 4 (20:37):
Yeah, definitely are.
Speaker 1 (20:39):
Jason, At what point is it too late to get
an annoment? Is there a statute of limitations on something
like that?
Speaker 4 (20:45):
I don't know, I mean, like any cause based on state, right, Yeah,
it would vary by the jurisdiction, and most causes of
action at some point there's what's called the statute limitation, right,
So you couldn't You probably couldn't bring that twenty years later, yeah,
because at that point there would be you know, a
presumption that it's too late, right, I mean, you waited
(21:06):
too long. You should have known earlier. You're stuck like
Chuck in Florida. I think it's stuck ten or twelve years.
Like most causes of action, after ten or twelve years,
you can't bring them anymore because wow. Yeah, And the
courts need to do it, right, I mean they need
to kind of prioritize things that are like relevant, and
I mean think about how you're going to find evidence
(21:27):
from twenty years ago or twenty five years ago. All
the witnesses are, they move, they're dead, they have dementia,
they're rehab somewhere years right, you know, so yeah, a.
Speaker 3 (21:36):
Lot of crazy things happen. So wait, do you have
like extensive knowledge and cases involving fraud and tell us
some of your clients who have lost millions because I
know when I've talked to you before, you were like
really stressed out because you were like, I'm dealing with
all these different cases, and I think there was like
a fraud case that you were working on.
Speaker 4 (21:52):
Yeah, I mean, fraud happens all the time, and it
comes in all shapes and forms, right and unfortunately, I mean,
and most of the better frauds actually seem to be
where the people can juice someone else for five million bucks,
ten million bucks, fifty million bucks. And it's kind of like,
I don't know, there's like some unspoken ability for people like, oh,
(22:14):
if you have the balls to ask me for fifty
million dollars, like you must be legit, right what because
the people the people asking you for five grand or
ten grand, Like the first thing that goes off in
your head is, oh, wait a minute, you know, like
this doesn't make sense, Like you must not be that
successful if you need five grand for me, right right.
But if someone comes to you with like some business idea. Look,
I'm putting in all this money and I need fifty
(22:35):
million to get it off the ground, You're like, oh, well,
this guy must be really asking for fifty million dollars.
Speaker 2 (22:39):
Yeah, I'll bet you.
Speaker 3 (22:40):
It's kind of like it's kind of like that show
do you remember on Netflix inventing Anna.
Speaker 2 (22:46):
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3 (22:47):
I could not believe all the banks and all the
people that she was able to like convince that she
was not who she really is, Like, yeah, it's crazy.
Speaker 2 (22:56):
People are very persuasive.
Speaker 1 (23:04):
The actor strike is happening as we speak, and a
big issue of contention is artificial intelligence. But it's obviously
not just a Hollywood issue. And so tell us why
the average American should be at least concerned or researching.
Speaker 4 (23:17):
Yes, so AI. It's like every other piece of tech, right,
it could be something that can be very helpful, and
it can be something it's very very dangerous. So it's
kind of like that new software that was telling you about,
you know, for example, like when we were doing closings
or material transactions. Historically, what we've always done is we
(23:37):
get notarized wire instructions. We followed with the phone calls.
We want to get as much info as possible, send
an ID. But now if somebody has your voice, right,
so for example, you guys are public people, you've spoken
on different speaking events or online, there's now a technology
where somebody can take enough samples of your voice insane,
(23:58):
and then they can call if they get the right
number and get the right info. They could call your
bank and say, hey, can you send a wire to
blah blah blah. Yeah, it'll and it'll sound like you.
And they can spoof your phone number.
Speaker 3 (24:10):
You need a key phrase like A like so these
so like.
Speaker 4 (24:15):
This AI, like these deep fakes, like the way that
they're programmed and the way they can be deployed can
be really dangerous. But AI has been around for it
wasn't always called like AI, but basically you have these
when you have enough data sets, you can have the
software to run algorithms that will start narrowing it down
and using it and producing things. So we've been using
(24:37):
it for you know a number of years, not ready.
Speaker 1 (24:39):
I've seen you know, different applications popping up almost like
every day now.
Speaker 2 (24:43):
And you know, I saw like.
Speaker 1 (24:46):
AI added to Excel and you can like type in
what the AI is supposed to do or formulas and
it just auto populates it. Or like Photoshop, you can
type in, oh, you could upload a picture and then
type in change the background to a scenic background in
Bali and it just automatically like gives you options for that.
And so obviously those are some of the lower hanging
(25:07):
fruits of AI. But I can only imagine how you
know it can impact the law world.
Speaker 3 (25:13):
Well, I think it also impacts school, Like think about
it when you went to law school or like when
I was studying political science, I feel like it was
like hard to write all these forty page papers, but
now you can have someone else write it for you,
Like it's crazy.
Speaker 4 (25:26):
Yeah, I mean then again, I mean there was a
recent incident where I think it was from New York.
There was a lawyer that had used AI application to
draft motion with the court and then I guess they
didn't prove it and they didn't vet the authorities that
were cited. They filed it with the court and not
only was it wrong, like the authorities they cited wrong
(25:46):
fake oh wow what and yeah, and the lawyer got
sanctioned and it was kind of like.
Speaker 3 (25:51):
A lazy ass lawyer.
Speaker 2 (25:54):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (25:54):
Well there's unfortunately there's a lot of those. But basically
this software because and you got to look at really
going back to kind of like the concern point, you
got to understand like where this came from, right, this
came from like Google, from Facebook, from Instagram, from Twitter,
and it just all these applications which have been you know, free.
(26:15):
They pick up all these data points on you, so
they understand the terminology, what your search terms are, what
you're looking at, what you're saving, what you're downloading, and
then they use all that data and now they can
predict what people do. And so yeah, it's it's it's
pretty crazy. So I mean they you could you could
type in supposedly, uh, you know, write me a letter
(26:37):
on this topic, and I need it to be fifty
pages long, and it'll bang it out and you can
say I want it to be aggressive. I want it
to be I wanted to be soft. I want it
to be right and and and it has the capability
because it's a mass, you know, trillions and trillions of data.
Speaker 2 (26:51):
Points you have used.
Speaker 3 (26:54):
No, I kind of feel like, well, I don't know
it's Instagram a I because I feel like if you
can alter photo, it's like but if you can alter
your photos, is that not like yeah, different, It's.
Speaker 1 (27:02):
More like if you typed into a platform like make
me skinnier or brighten my hair color or no, like.
Speaker 2 (27:10):
No, I know you haven't, but I do feel.
Speaker 3 (27:12):
I do feel like this is I do feel like
I do feel like this this whole process has been
going on for the last like what like ten eight years,
ten years something like that, because think about it, first,
we had like all these different social media platforms where
you're able to alter how you look, alter how you sound.
You can take a photo and like get some kind
of app where it shows that you're on the beach
(27:33):
and you can literally be in prison all this stuff.
Speaker 2 (27:36):
Yeah on the zoom background.
Speaker 3 (27:37):
I'm just saying, everything in today's world is so hocus pocused.
None of this stuff's real. It's crazy because think about it.
Back when we were kids, you used to have to
handwrite your paper, You used to really have to know math.
Like now everything is everything is so easy that it's like,
how are kids going to be challenged? They're not, how
are they going to be challenged?
Speaker 4 (27:56):
Well, I mean it's kind of the byproduct of like
American society becoming amassing the wealth that they have. Right,
everything is convenient, easy, and we have these types of tools,
and then people will kind of use it for the
wrong way. Personally, when I have meetings with people, I
want to meet in person, right if I can, you know,
if I can even talk to someone not necessarily FaceTime,
(28:16):
but like zoom. I prefer that over the phone. There's
a different interaction, and that's kind of the interaction I miss,
like even now with courts, and it's only in rare
circumstances you actually go to court. But for me, that's
like important. You can judge credibility, you can see how's
the other person reacting, and that's kind of what we're
losing there. I mean, what was the movie with Bruce Willis.
It was called like Surrogates or something where basically he
(28:38):
just sat in the house like all day and he
had this like avatar running around doing all this stuff.
I mean, but with the technology that exists today, I mean,
you could you could basically.
Speaker 2 (28:47):
Do that if you want to do that's for sure.
Speaker 3 (28:50):
Think about this. It's also like in dating, like all
these dating apps, I feel like people swipe swipe because
you're looking at someone's photo and someone's bio that like
their friend had had them right up. Yeah, but if
you spent if you literally spent ten minutes on a.
Speaker 1 (29:04):
Dating site, would be like find me like an exact statistics,
So you'd be like looking for a five foot five
women with blonde hair and brown eyes. I'm just saying
with AI is like you can program the algorithm to
do what you want versus just seeing a generic algorithm.
Speaker 3 (29:23):
No, of course I get what you're saying.
Speaker 1 (29:24):
Yeah, and so Jason, is there something that people can
do now to protect themselves from like the harms of AI?
Speaker 4 (29:31):
Yeah, I mean, just you just got to verify, right,
follow up? Talk to people on the phone, if you
can see them in person is better. I mean there's
because again, I mean, you just hear a voice on
the end of the phone. You don't really know, right
if you get a you know, one of the biggest
scams a lot of people get is they get something
that will pop up on their computers saying, oh, you
need your computer's been hacked. We can solve it for you.
(29:55):
Call this number and then take your credit card time
and people fall for that. People do you know, or
they'll get a phone call. They'll say, this is really common,
especially for my foreign clients. They'll get these phone calls
from people saying that they work for the US government
from the IRS and basically, if you don't send X
number of dollars through like a money order by tomorrow,
(30:16):
they're going to be arrested and without fail. I mean
I can tell you ninety percent of my foreign clients
they get these types of messages, they get these phone
calls and they call me frantic. I don't understand there's
nothing that was owed everything, the count and handles everything,
and I'm like, no, that's not how the IRS operates. Right,
they send you a letter, they follow up, and so
(30:36):
one of the ways you could do if you get
a phone call from a bank, from an agency, anything
like that, or any even a phone number from someone
you're doing a deal with, right it could be a
real estate broke or a lawyer accountant. If you don't
recognize the number, you don't know the name, call them back.
Call the number that you're familiar with. That's a great
idea and confirm. And that's one of the ways that
you can sure that like these are real things, because
(30:58):
you're going to see these types of scam going to
be all over the place.
Speaker 3 (31:02):
Yeah, I'm so paranoid. I don't even trust my grandmother. Like,
if my grandmother is calling me asking me for personal
numbers and stuff, I'm like, I'll call you right back.
Speaker 1 (31:09):
Like it's funny because I changed my number a couple
of months back, and it's the first time I changed
my number and like, I don't know a long time,
and I just felt like as I was texting people, Hey,
it's Mark because I got a new number, then they
in turn, we're calling other people that we knew mutually
just to verify, like it's just real, because you know,
it's like I don't know, it's just funny.
Speaker 2 (31:30):
That's what made me. It made me think of that
a little bit.
Speaker 3 (31:32):
Yeah, I mean you definitely have to like do your
research and find.
Speaker 4 (31:35):
You're talking about why did you change your number? Someone
put your number in like Craigslist.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
Not that I know, I wouldn't I wouldn't doubt it,
but not just a new chapter, you know, turning the.
Speaker 3 (31:44):
New changing my numbers. Yeah, I feel like it's good.
It's good to do a lot.
Speaker 2 (31:48):
I had to cut some people off, you know, you know,
it's good for the good to start exactly.
Speaker 3 (31:54):
But I will say that, like, I feel like what
you do is like super fascinating for me. I love
hearing your stories.
Speaker 4 (32:01):
No, no, I love and there's no there's no two
days that are alike. Every day there's something new, and
it's it's generally fun. And I mean I personally couldn't
imagine doing anything else. And again, as the world evolves,
like the practice of law evolves, there's new problems, new solutions.
Speaker 1 (32:17):
What are you seeing most frequently these days in terms
of the cases that you take the court.
Speaker 4 (32:24):
I mean just a lot. So I mean so again,
like right now, we're still at least especially in South floor,
I should say, we're still like in an economic boom.
Right people are still making but money, businesses are good,
real estate values are up. What I suspect will happen
is that when the economy cycles down and businesses don't
survive or you know, business ventures don't they're no longer viable,
(32:48):
that's when people will fight. Right When, when people are
making money, everything's good, no one will look at the contracts,
No one cares what the contracts say. When things go
bad and people start losing money, that's when the fighting
typically happens. So you know, the lesson kind of is,
you know, if you're going to sign something, it's make
sure you're comfortable with what you're signing, and I generally
(33:08):
look at it. Okay, worst case scenario, right, armageddon happens.
Worst case scenario if the agreement, if you can survive
with whatever the outcome is under the agreement, then that's
a good investment. If you can't, don't do it. And
if you don't like the agreement, you're better off having
no agreement than a bad agreement.
Speaker 2 (33:27):
That's true.
Speaker 3 (33:27):
That's true. Okay, So before we let you go, what's
one piece of legal advice that you'd like to leave
our listeners with.
Speaker 4 (33:34):
If I can only give one, it's just if you
have nothing intelligent to say, or you can't be honest
about somebody, say nothing. You know, we have that amendment
bill wrights people never exercise it.
Speaker 3 (33:45):
And everybody's doing that because there's times when I do
interviews and I feel pressured to say something like I
did yesterday when I was doing my interview, and I
feel like I need to be in a place where
I don't have to like answer questions. Sometimes I could
just be like I do I'm not comfortable answering that,
but I just feel like sometimes I don't. I'm like
a little kid sometimes I need to.
Speaker 1 (34:05):
I think you like to be the life of the
party sometimes and that sometimes sways you into making decisions
you normally wouin.
Speaker 4 (34:12):
So I mean it's okay to say no, right, And
I think that's what I think that comes from saying
I agree with that. Yeah, you know, so don't don't
be shy about it. And you know, again, I mean,
I know a lot of people get in a lot
of trouble because they couldn't keep their mouth shut.
Speaker 3 (34:26):
I hear you, that's okay. So the power is saying no,
I'm going to start taking that. Guys to two of
my favorite guys to my left and to my right.
Speaker 2 (34:33):
Yeah, I love that.
Speaker 3 (34:35):
Well, you guys, we had an amazing time. Thank you
so much Jason with us, and I hope today was insightful.
I know a lot of people are going through hard times, divorces, you.
Speaker 2 (34:46):
Have relationshships, Like any conversation with Jason is.
Speaker 3 (34:48):
Always it's always fun. Yeah, it's always fun. And I think,
like I think what I got from today was basically like,
do your research.
Speaker 4 (34:56):
Yeah, oh, the diligence is super important. And again, I
mean paper is easy, right, anyone with a computer can
put it, but you gotta you have to verify it
to do your diligence. If you're gonna make a material
investment or you know, a partnership with someone, do your background,
know who you're getting into.
Speaker 1 (35:12):
And I like what Jason said about, you know, trying
to take meetings in person looking for people like my eyes,
you can kind of get a good feel. I feel
like people have gone away from that, especially through COVID.
Everything's become virtual. But whenever you get the chance, look
somebody and I you can kind of tell what they're about.
Speaker 3 (35:26):
You know, you know what. It also reminds me of
like I feel like my gut instincts are so good.
Speaker 2 (35:32):
You do have it.
Speaker 3 (35:32):
I feel like and if whenever I don't, I don't
listen to it, I always feel like later on I'm
like I knew it, Like Larsa, you knew it. Why
did you listen to yourself? Because I do feel like
when you're sitting across from someone I've been in bad deals,
Like we had a financial guy that literally stole twenty
million dollars from us and I never liked him, and
I remember sitting across from him and I knew he
was not a good.
Speaker 1 (35:53):
I feel like, even on a relationship level, like you're
a good judge of character in terms of like when
your friends try to introduce you to their.
Speaker 2 (36:00):
Way, friends like that you've got good instincts in terms.
Speaker 3 (36:03):
I am but I am. But you know what, I
feel like, it's because like I've been screwed a lot,
you know. I think it comes from a place that
I feel like it comes from a place of like,
you know, like, oh, I should have listened to what
I was thinking and feeling on the inside.
Speaker 4 (36:17):
You know.
Speaker 3 (36:18):
There's so many people that I've met that I've been
like accountants, business people all the time where they dress
really well, they speak, they speak over you, they're speaking
way smarter than you over your head, and you want
to believe everything they say, but like there's something inside
of you that's telling you that you shouldn't trust this person.
They're not looking after your best interests, you know. And
so I feel like a lot of times for me,
like now it's finally like I'm at a place where
(36:40):
I can like speak up as far as like I
don't trust this person, you know, I feel like they
don't give me a good unders.
Speaker 4 (36:45):
Face to face. I mean, yeah, it'll make the good
relationships better, strengthen those, and then the ones that are
kind of shaky people, they won't have time because it's
a lot harder. It's easier for someone to send an
email and make up the ass or even say it
on the phone. It's different when you're shitting, you know,
a couple of inches or foot away from someone, they
look you in the You call somebody a liar, of course.
Speaker 3 (37:05):
I would, yeah, J to be like you're lying, Yeah, of.
Speaker 4 (37:11):
Course I would.
Speaker 2 (37:12):
I think you're good at that too. Bag call liars
out too.
Speaker 3 (37:15):
I do call liars out, but at the same time,
like I don't know how to use my voice for no.
When I do my interviews, you know, it's like, now
you know what I think it is. I think I'm
one of those people that like I was a good student,
and I like to listen to like teachers.
Speaker 1 (37:27):
You'd like to go above and beyond me. You want
to get an A plus and everything that.
Speaker 2 (37:31):
That's probably that's not a bad thing, that's not a
bad thing.
Speaker 3 (37:33):
Yeah, well you guys. We have the best time with
you guys. Thank you and follow.
Speaker 1 (37:39):
Us a separation Underscore Anxiety Underscore podcast and tune in
next week.
Speaker 3 (37:44):
Bye guys, Bye Chasing
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