September 18, 2023 • 50 mins
Let's get right into the controversy!
She received the first perfect score of her season only to be eliminated that same night, leaving the ballroom and the judges in a state of shock.
"Glee" alum Heather Morris joins Cheryl to dissect her time on season 24 of DWTS, including her shocking elimination, dealing with haters, her honest opinions about her two dance partners, and revealing whether she thinks dancing with Maks was the real reason she was voted off!
Plus, the ladies get real about mental health struggles and the price of dealing with fame, and Cheryl opens up about her experiences being body-shamed by viewers and the media on a national stage.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
This is Sex Lies and Spray Tands with me Cheryl
Burke and iHeartRadio podcast. Welcome to Sex Lies and Spray Tans.
This is such a professional, little, little huge studio that
we're in Blue Wires Studios at Win, Las Vegas. Holy crap,
you know, just have this view behind us. This is like,
(00:22):
I mean, I should move here, I think, and start
podcasting with my guest Heather Morris, who's already doing this.
What is this called? We're doing this? I feel like
we're doing this show show it, hide it? What is
it like in it? Show it? Hide it? Show hid it. Yeah,
you can catch us on our new one two women's
(00:44):
show here at the end. Just kidding, Okay, we're going
to stop right there. Well, I'm ahead. I can't believe
I've never met you before.
Speaker 2 (00:51):
It's wild though that I just I walked in here
and we both said we feel like.
Speaker 1 (00:56):
We've known each other that long time. I know, and
I normally hate when people say that because you're like whatever, no,
but like I really have. Seriously, yes, we have. I
mean past life, we were dance partners, and we're hair
twins today, linzies, except mine hair is fake, as we know, Okay,
most of it, I know. But I'm an open book.
Yeah I love that. Okay, so let's just get right
(01:20):
into it, shall we just far away? Though we couldn't.
We're trying. We're trying really soft fingertips. I mean, if
anyone ever wanted to know about Heather mooris feel her fingertips. Fingertips.
So okay, just call me Barbara Walters. But here we go.
(01:41):
You were just obviously with your Glee cast. When was
the last time you guys saw each other. You were
there obviously supporting the writer's strike and the SAG after
a strike as well. Was that an interesting experience? Like,
you know, I'm here on the sidelines, I'm not an actor,
but yes I'm a part of SAG obviously. You know,
I am oh sag Aftra and you know, whatever is
(02:02):
going on is ridiculous. How has your life been affected?
And first of all, the first question was how was
your mini reunion with the cast members?
Speaker 2 (02:12):
The mini reunion is always a blast. Even getting the
text originally from my friends. I mean, they're all my
friends to get together for this, It's like you're trying
to contain your excitement because you want to see your
friends but you're also like, I'm here for a reason, right,
and I got to be really serious about it, and
like wear my shirt and puld my sign, which is
very important and I can't lose sight of that. But
(02:33):
also like, oh my god, I love you so much
you and so that whole thing happened, and but it's
it's pretty casual because we see each.
Speaker 1 (02:41):
Other often anyway. It's not like it's this weird moment. Okay,
So have you ever picketed before, because that must be
an interesting experience, Like I was, I have not, huh,
And I was shocked at the amount of honking, right.
It was jarring, and I it felt as though those
people were getting paid to do that because it was
(03:02):
so excessive. I just couldn't understand how much honking Do
you think they were getting paid? Maybe no, they were not.
Speaker 2 (03:09):
They know they weren't, but it felt crazy because they were.
They just wouldn't stop honking. And it's not like it's
they're just showing their support and they're so proud and
obviously their allies and they know why we're there.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
But still it's just so it's loud, and you want
to talk to us a little bit about your actual
sign that you were holding up is so sweet.
Speaker 2 (03:30):
I know it was a little tribute to Nya, to
miss Nya. I mean, I didn't make the sign. I
was gratefully handed the sign by the the person who
put it together, and so I didn't anticipate it, but
I thought it was such a beautiful little tribute. And
I mean just the sight of that, like.
Speaker 1 (03:49):
Just just just the.
Speaker 2 (03:51):
Symbol of what Santana meant was just so vast for
so many people. And so even just looking at a
sign like that, it's instantly like puddles and tears, you know.
Speaker 1 (04:02):
What I mean. I got chills when I saw the
science said the only straight I am is straight up
a broke. I love it, And that couldn't be more fitting.
I felt Naya in there. I felt it. Yeah, s
raight up barroke. Is that how she would say, like, yeah, okay,
so with you know, obviously so much success came with Glee,
(04:23):
and similar obviously story with Dancing with the Stars in
my story as well, Like I had no idea that
this was going to go on more than two seasons,
right like, and I guess you're never really ready for
the I guess attention from the outside Ruld, but you're
there just to do your art. Sure, how was that
for you when you, you know, all of a sudden,
(04:45):
you know, became one of the main characters I guess,
as well as somebody who was like a public figure
all of a sudden. I mean, I know you had
dance experience. I know you danced for Beyonce and all
of that, but this must have been a different light
for you.
Speaker 2 (04:58):
No, I mean it's so wild, like you have felt
just to go from being an artist, which sounds like
self proclaiming, but just being an artist and somebody who
has danced their entire life. I have danced since I
was one years old and then longer than me thirty
six years almost okay, And you know, like not, I
(05:23):
had wanted to become an actor, Like I had started
taking acting classes and I was preparing myself to do
the work and continue. And then I had gotten the job.
I was assisting as equidly, and so I had gotten
the job through him, and so I was like, yes,
I got my big acting job. And watching the pilot.
I don't know if you ever saw the pilot, but
(05:44):
watching the pilot, it feels it feels very small. You know,
it feels very niche, and it's like this dark comedy
that it just sets itself apart from so many different things.
And so when I watched the pilot, I didn't never
anticipate it would be that big got it? You know,
it felt like, oh, this really cool gig I got
that could feel small. I could work on my craft
(06:04):
and I'll kind of grow into the industry and like
make my way up, if that makes any sense. And
so to be like literally shot into the kin, literally
like you are bigger than the Beatles at this moment.
Speaker 1 (06:18):
That's crazy, crazy and jarring.
Speaker 2 (06:21):
And we were sat down and like kind of prepared
by Ryan Murphy, but like, wait.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
How does one prep for that? Like what does one
say to you? How do you prep for that? You
can't just say so you're going to become famous. Kids,
Please sit down here in my office and we're going
to talk about how famous you're about to be. Like
don't you wish there was a crash course with many
things mental health, I mean, how to clean your clothes?
Speaker 2 (06:47):
Yeah, but I just felt like I dropped the ball
on what this whole thing was, what it spiraled into,
because like.
Speaker 1 (06:53):
I had no idea how to fucking deal with any
of it.
Speaker 2 (06:55):
No, you know, I got a manager and that was
super helpful, but they your job is to push your
career forward, and it was like, well, how do you
help sustain it when I had no idea what I
was doing in the first place.
Speaker 1 (07:08):
Or I mean not in a bad way or you know, yeah,
it's just like no, No, you're right though, because you
use these kids, you have to also think about you know, yes,
live in the moment, be present, be grateful, but you
do have to think about your future because there is
this quick fifteen minute of fame, but you also want
how do you deal with people? Yeah, I mean that
doesn't even matter, right, Like the famous part is the
(07:30):
famous part, but you're doing what you love to do ultimately, Yeah,
but like, how do you handle like I wish there
was a crash course? How how I drink? Okay, Like, actually,
I'm not even trying to be funny, like and that's
why you know, I'm sober today. But I drank the
pain that I was feeling away. But it wasn't pain.
It was also like it was interesting because it was
(07:50):
a beautiful thing. Like I never thought ballroom deal I
was living in Harlem with my ex dance partner one
thirty six then Adam Clayton, to be exact, and I
was like, yeah, I'm going to just do this show
for one season, Okay, make some money. Yeah, and make
some money. Don't you dance with anyone else, sir? Anyway?
But then twenty six seasons later, obviously I never went back,
but like it was really jarring. Ye for me, I'm
(08:15):
introverted right the same. I'm an extroverted performer, yes, but
I'm an introverted like people think that I'm lying when
I say that. Yeah. No. I my very first interview,
I sounded like a mouse, Like ah, name is Cheryl.
I couldn't talk in front of the camera unless I
was drinking. So obviously I dealt with it through something
I don't recommend anyone doing, which is numbing through alcohol.
(08:35):
How did you deal with it?
Speaker 2 (08:37):
I didn't. I didn't know how to deal with it.
And I've been very outspoken about this with my mental
health struggles, but I didn't know how to deal with it.
I basically I went numb. I stopped talking to my castmates,
I stopped wanting to wear makeup. I didn't want to
see anybody, Like it was just this whole dark hole
(08:59):
I went to went into, and it was just for
the time. It wasn't something that was spoken about amongst castmates,
amongst you know, your peers or your family members.
Speaker 1 (09:13):
Or you know.
Speaker 2 (09:13):
It was still it was even though it was what
ten years ago, twelve years ago, it was still taboo ish.
Does that make any sense? Maybe it was just starting
to sprout. But I just felt really alone in that
and so I still just like kept getting like deeper
and deeper into my dark hole. And I'm grateful that
(09:34):
I got the job, but I wish somebody would have
just like pulled me aside and said, like, how can
we help? Yeah, like, how can I, you know, help
you get through this? So it what was a really
beautiful gift during that time was I got pregnant. In
no way, shape or form. Am I saying like, when
you're in a bad place, go get pregnant and have
(09:55):
a child, Like great way to numb. Exactly, great way
to numb. No, I'm not saying. But for me at
the time, I was having difficulties like knowing what my
purpose was and where I just felt like myself and
just I don't know like coming home and then having
a child just felt like really purposeful. Other than I
(10:18):
don't know, celebrityism.
Speaker 1 (10:19):
Is just interesting. We could talk forever about it, but
it's it's just weird. Yeah, So I guess what would
your advice be then for people who are like up
and coming but also like all of these like TikTok
influencers and stars and social media influencers like this is
you know, it's interesting because I'll get stopped not for
the hardcore dancing I trained in, but my like last
(10:41):
real post or something. And it's so it's so interesting, right,
but it's still like your I relate to you when
you say you went into a dark hole, because I
definitely did, and I thought alcohol was my way of
being social, you know, but there was no correlation. There
is no correlation.
Speaker 2 (10:57):
It just numsy a nice again and you're like, oh, okay,
I can function, yes, And then like just as an addiction,
and right, it is, yes.
Speaker 1 (11:06):
And I am an addict, as we know most of
us know, I guess, but I'm very much an open book,
as are you, I know, which I appreciate. How what
advice would you give to these people that want to
get into the entertainment business or that already are but
have no idea how to stay grounded.
Speaker 2 (11:24):
Well, that was a very deep and serious eye And
I don't mean that to say like, don't told you
it scary painful? Yeah, don't run the other way right,
get pregnant? No, not in any way, shape or form.
Speaker 1 (11:41):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (11:42):
I I think like, continue to do your homework the
entire time, and surround yourself with smart people and ask
a lot of questions, like don't be afraid to ask
questions from any of your mentors or your peers or
people that are working for you. That's they're not only
there to like help you rise to fame, but they're
(12:03):
also there to like help you sustain and be successful.
You know, there's there's so many performers that do it
and you're like, holy crap, they're so elegant and they
just seamlessly did it. But like no, they they work
tirelessly and they get help. Like you know, I would
say if you are rising, like hire an assistance. So
(12:24):
you all feel so overwhelmed and there's just so many
people there to help you.
Speaker 1 (12:28):
You're not alone, like exactly, and you're not alone. Yeah,
really seriously that it helps to know that because it
is people. I think back in the day too, it's
really hard for people to talk about mental health in general,
and because people assume that our lives are perfect, it's
far from that, where we are just honestly human beings. Okay,
just to switch it up to a little bit more
(12:50):
of a different subject, I guess about just tragedy and
death and how hard you know. I just lost my
dad a few years ago, and I can't even imagine,
you know, even just being a part of the Dancing
with the Stars family in general. It's just losing someone
is not easy. How did you sorry to hear that
(13:14):
I was passing? Yeah, it's it's something that I guess.
I'm a professional number and so it's been something that
I'm still dealing with, you know, on top of a
bunch of deaths. I guess, like my you know, divorce
is one. My divorce with Dancing with the Stars is
another one that really freaking hard. Is shit still is.
(13:37):
But like with that obviously, you know, I don't know,
the grieving process is different for everybody. How has yours been?
And you know during that time, what was going through
your mind?
Speaker 2 (13:48):
The grieving process, I don't know it comes in waves,
like they always say, like I don't think I have
anything more I would say like spiritual to say about it.
But I constantly try to remind myself of, you know,
the the importance of what Naya, what Corey, what my
(14:10):
dad what? So many people that we've lost mean to us,
and also like live in their presence, like what do
they want? You know, what would they want you to do?
How could you live through their memory? Like I know,
for Nia's birthday each year, her mom goes and draws
blood and donates blood. And I think that's such a
beautiful memory too, to remember such an important person with.
(14:34):
And it's like, how can we celebrate these people and
not feel like it's the worst day in the world,
but like, you know, kind of live their legacy on totally.
Speaker 1 (14:43):
And they would want nothing but for you to be happy. Yes,
and yeah, I hear you. Thanks that actually helped me, yea,
and nice words.
Speaker 2 (14:49):
She'd be like, make that money, like anyway you do,
make the money, don't.
Speaker 1 (14:53):
Be never forget that. Yeah, that's awesome. I love that.
So you know, let's switch it up a little. We're
gonna just talk all things dancing with the stars because
this job. Let's do some givett do some jive kicks. Na,
(15:14):
We're gonna not do that. I hate it jive, but
your jive was great. Mind you Okay, I don't want
to just cut the bullshit. What the hell? You basically
had switch up week because you dance with Max and
Alan who was troop back then you did season? What
was your season? Season twenty four? Twenty four? Right? Yeah?
(15:35):
If I have the.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
Worst memory, you could ask me something that happened two
minutes ago and I'd be like, I.
Speaker 1 (15:41):
Have your long term memory I'm sure is in Yes. Yeah,
that's why I need to do memory games. I need
to be better at. Seriously, yes, same. I mean my
mom actually has early stages of Alzheimer's and it's scary.
It's scaring me because like not to switch it to this,
but just memory is very important. Dance does help though.
Dances help and what I need to teach. So you do,
(16:03):
keep it, keep it, keep it, keep it with it.
Keep I have a trainer, my boxing trainer. I'm like,
give me routines. He goes. But this is not what
we do in boxing. I said, I'm not trying to
fight anyone, Like we're just trying to work the brain here.
I imagine like somebody attacks you and you're like jab
jabs one, five, seven, eight and five. I'm like, wait
what U you throw them off? Yeah? Totally, I knew it.
(16:28):
How was okay? So you got a lot of hate
for your dance experience? I as a seasoned pro twenty
six zones, I mean, dust off my white blazer on
the strip of Las Vegas. Here at Blue Wires Studios,
Nile covers, yes with no no nipple covers today? Going on?
(16:51):
Do you remember the girl that would check your nipple
covers on Dancing on the Stars? Oh? For sure. It
was like uh okay, mm hmmm, yeah, okay, anyways, let's
talk about nip another time. How was like the I
don't know, I wasn't there, but yet I was there
in spirit because I was still I'm still a fan,
will always be a fan. I watched your season and
it must have been challenging to deal with everyone saying
(17:14):
she's got a dance experience when I know that when
you have dance experience, it actually hurts you more than.
Speaker 2 (17:19):
Helps you when you start sitting like with a partner.
Because I'm a I'm a group sport dancer, so it
was like nobody I did lifts, but like I never
was heartnered like that because you have to actually let
somebody lead you, and I had never been led before.
And so those poor partners Max, they're fine, they're fine.
Speaker 1 (17:43):
You know what.
Speaker 2 (17:43):
I actually wish I would have flowed better, like gone
with the flow, you know what I mean with it,
and just like to those haters, been like, listen, yeah,
I'm a dancer, so what like who cares? Everybody's here
doing their best, living life, having fun. And I think
I took the pressure of it and like tried to
take it on and be like, no, it's fine, just
(18:04):
be really professional and like be very you know, just
like do your job and be serious. What an actuality?
Like No, the audience kind of just wants to hear
like who cares? Everything's okay? Jojo Cia as a professional dancer,
and she does she win. No is a professional dancer.
Speaker 1 (18:22):
She won. I mean, look, I was trying to teach
aj MacLean how to freaking chatcha and that was impossible
because he's a professional dancer. So it's like it's not
necessarily everyone's gonna have their own challenges. Yeah, exactly. But
is that how you took it? No, you you were
really upset. Were you upset or you're numbing? You're numbing,
You're Was I.
Speaker 2 (18:40):
Upset when I when I got kicked off at the time,
it was shocking?
Speaker 1 (18:45):
No, No, that's another conversation. Were you upset like initially
when the when you started receiving.
Speaker 2 (18:49):
Like fine, okay, yeah, cool, all right bye, And it
should have just come out. I should have been like, guys,
I'm coming. Yes, yeah, I know.
Speaker 1 (19:02):
I wasn't upset at all. I you know, I just
it didn't mess with your mind because like listen, No,
Dancing with the Stars is physically, yes, demanding, but I
find it to be more mentally challenging, okay, because of
the pressures. Of course, it's like stories that they want
to push, and so you're gonna have to feel the
stories ish ish in your own way and things change
(19:23):
and happen, and then your partner like you're so, let's
get to it. So, Maxim Schmierk Schmerkovsky, Schmerkovsky, I was
a teenager, how was so? Were you a fan of
Dancing with the Stars prior to you joining the cast.
I'm gonna say yes, but I'm gonna shake my no,
(19:44):
we aren't going to have real show. No.
Speaker 2 (19:48):
I had watched a few I knew Amber had been
on Dancing with the Stars, so I'd watched like a
few of her performances.
Speaker 1 (19:56):
It was just like it wasn't my gig, you know
what I mean? I had an auditioned for. So you
think you can dance?
Speaker 2 (20:01):
Yes to Dancing with the Start, And how was that experience?
Is that fucking upset me real hard? So like I
think I just numbed and blocked it out, and I
was like, I don't want to do reality television.
Speaker 1 (20:12):
It's so crazy, and then you will just chotch on
to Dancing with the Stars.
Speaker 2 (20:18):
So that I was like, you know what, I'll give
another shot and I'll have fun and whatever.
Speaker 1 (20:23):
So how what was your I guess conversation or interview
like with Dina Katz, who was the casting director of
Dancing did she was she like, wait, you were on?
So you think you can dance? Like did she even
know that you were on? Or like I think so?
And she like she did her homework, she was and
then she had a job to do. So like I
really chat right, and were you kind of like maybe
this is not going to be fair. I mean, were
(20:44):
you thinking any of this or no.
Speaker 2 (20:45):
Of course, the conversation was always there, and it was
always like pre interviewed, like just so you know it's
going to be controversial, okay, Like the second that that happens,
I'm going, oh my god, are they using this like
to promote the show?
Speaker 1 (20:58):
You know what I mean? Like is the nagad of me?
Speaker 2 (21:01):
Like and so I'm sitting there going like, okay, just
don't let that, don't let that hinder your dancing ability.
Just have fun and be real. So yeah, that was that,
and that was in my mind. But I was like,
just don't give into it, don't do it, like, just
dance and have a great time.
Speaker 1 (21:17):
Control what you can control, which is your rumba walks. Okay,
you remember that, guys, that's just my favorite though, Like
the boy I got it choreographed. That number was so good.
I have to say, Okay, so let's just tells her
about rumba's. First of all, it's always harder to dance
with less choreography than it is just like do a
(21:37):
jive so much harder. Your leg action was beautiful. You know.
I also have a relatable story to mention to you
because I got a sixty at a sixty with my
partner Juan Pablo Depace and we got eliminated. I'm still
not over it, not over it, never will be. People
are like, get over it, and I'm like, you get
(21:59):
over it, thank you. I'm allowed to have feelings, okay, yeah,
like it is insanity. Yeah, any who, do you think
Max was the reason you got eliminated? I think Max
was the reason. God damn it. You gotta blame somebody
but yourself. Oh God, was there that much hate towards no,
this one person? Max? Yeah? No, I'm just asking you, like,
(22:20):
do you think he was the reason? Like because he
had just come back from his injury. Injury he went
from Alan who was so excited to be there because
he had just if you know, he was like graduating
from troop to pro almost like he was right on
the cusp, like this was his time to shine, you
I know, but we talk. He talks a little, you know,
he was he is sweet, though, squeet. He's so excited
(22:42):
to be there and he still is like yeah, oh yeah,
he's so excited, so excited. You can see it through
his body language. And then you have someone like Max
who's the season pro who isn't necessarily the easiest of
like coaches either, am I I get it. This is
how we were trained in when we were professional dancers,
you know, like there is no affirmations, positive affirmations unless
(23:06):
it's deserved, right, I mean.
Speaker 2 (23:09):
I grew up with negative affirmations, like you have to
tell me I'm the worst dancer in the in the room,
and then I will be amazing and I'm great.
Speaker 1 (23:17):
I'm like, what's wrong with me? Wait? How are you
with compliments? I have the same problem, Like when people
generally say beautiful today.
Speaker 2 (23:26):
I have gone to I've gotten them altered compliments. I've
gone to a steamstress, and those compliments now fit my body,
whereas before they would just sag and fall right off.
Speaker 1 (23:36):
So you'll hear all about it.
Speaker 2 (23:38):
Okay, I don't feel all great about them, but if
you tell me, I'll take them and I appreciate it,
and then I'm like, okay, yeah, I think that might
be right.
Speaker 1 (23:47):
That might I love maybe custom made alterations and afmations
like Dancing with the Stars is amazing wardrobe department mind you?
So okay, it was must have been really hard though,
to honestly, to switch from one partner that you had.
You did like a what two week three week training
period prior to the three weeks with Yeah, and then
(24:09):
all of a sudden it You know, I know from experience,
it's different when you dance with Max and with Alan,
completely two different feelings. Right now, I'm not saying one's
better than the other. I'm just saying it is just,
you know, it's different. Who did you prefer to dance with?
You can't ask me to pick favorites. Listen, listen, well,
who's your favorite child? No kidding? Who do I like? No?
(24:35):
Because I okay, I'll tell you right now. I prefer
dancing with Max than Alan because Max made me feel
more feminine, I guess, like and also with my with
my like my body type, and with Max it's just fit.
It just looks aesthetically better.
Speaker 2 (24:49):
So he choreographed, Yeah, definitely is more fitting to the female.
Speaker 1 (24:54):
Like it's was. It feels like real ballroom, different strokes
for different folks. Yes, so you say, you say Max, Yeah.
Speaker 2 (25:01):
I think for the time it was probably like it
felt a little adolescent, you know what I mean to
do those couple of weeks and then going back to
Max was like, this is the adult.
Speaker 1 (25:13):
God b Stars, this is the Godfather, this is dancing
with the Stars. Have to duck.
Speaker 2 (25:16):
They have to duck, And maybe that was hard for
the viewers and the audience. Like I think that's the
only way I could attribute the that performance not doing
well is because like maybe in his new show that
he just put on in nin Napa, right, Like that's
a wonderful dance for that, but like for a TV show,
(25:39):
it might not have been the best. It just felt like.
Speaker 1 (25:43):
Dark, it's so dirty. It was it was easy.
Speaker 2 (25:46):
Oh my god, That's what I'm saying, Like I loved it.
I don't know, am I reaching I'm reaching the wrong
I'm reaching reach. Wait you feel your those sophomore touching.
Speaker 1 (25:58):
Literally come out? Didn't I didn't go from underneath? Okay, good,
I thought, Okay, so listen you were you were on
season twenty four. They love it when it's like dark, dirty,
sexual and sensual and full of chemistry. It was like
a how to performance that rumba and Max is with
the rumba. God yeah and he I. So there's so
(26:20):
many different styles of dance. I think that when you
danced your Disney. I don't think Max could have done that.
For example, Jose So it was in a way you had,
you know, both worlds. Child, you would have changed, Actor,
would have changed your.
Speaker 2 (26:34):
Song, l Actor with a tantrum if that song came on,
he would have been so mad.
Speaker 1 (26:37):
I don't think anyone would want to see backs dance
that dance strictly Ballward over here, I feel I feel
his pain and anyone else's pain. Who watches us people dance? Like,
oh you remember it? So what was your experience so
like with the packages, like was there any tension packages?
What was your package? Pry? I always say this to
(26:58):
my partners. Priority on Dancing with the Stars is number one.
Your package means more than your dance, then your live
interview with the host, whoever your host was back then
and then comes the dance and then the scores. Like honestly,
I do believe that is like that's priority, and I
think it's so important for people to come on a
journey with you. And you know, was it Max? Also?
(27:23):
You know, as we all are very competitive, we want
to win, and with that comes a lot of pressure
we put on ourselves. Did you feel like he was
doing that because people expected you to be perfect right
out at the gate.
Speaker 2 (27:35):
Well, what's interesting about like, first of all me and
then like Max and my? Is that the right grammar
Max and my like dynamic is that like I'm not
a competitive person, oh really in any way shape or
for him, So like I'm not there to go.
Speaker 1 (27:53):
Win at all, and no, I'm not. I'm not.
Speaker 2 (27:58):
And my husband, like, you know, God love him, he
also is like he is competitive and he loved sports
and he's been doing sports his whole life.
Speaker 1 (28:05):
So I tease him.
Speaker 2 (28:07):
I'm always like, you know what, We're just going out
there and we're having the best time we can and
that's the best we can do. Like, that's who I
am in a Nutually, I have to be competitive a
little bit when there's teach no, because I only beat
myself up too much if I am like I I'd
rather be authentically me than like push myself, which might
(28:28):
be super lazy.
Speaker 1 (28:28):
But how did you untrain for myself? How did you
untrain that? Then? Because you said like, because then you
beat yourself up, which means that you had experience of judging.
Speaker 2 (28:36):
But like in the audition rooms for acting, right, not
so much dancing, because dancing for me it when I
became a professional dancer. I yes, I was like competitive,
I wanted to get the job, but it was more
like it was all about the attack and like the
feeling behind it, rather than like the number, I'm going
to be better than you. Because I made friends with
(28:57):
all of my like my friends in audition rooms, we
always were best friends. We would leave, we would go
get lunch. Like that was never what it was. Of
course I wanted the job, So I guess I'm still
trying to figure out, like what that is. I am
competitive competitive, like.
Speaker 1 (29:11):
For example, like for me, I know what I my
potential is, right, so sure like and I have to say,
this is a part of the reason why I retired.
I think was because I wasn't seeing what I expected
to see like I used to.
Speaker 2 (29:24):
Like I well articulated because I feel the same with
my naring. I was just physically torn both both my labrams.
And I also tore my my buttocks last season when
I was teaching. And so now I'm like, you know what,
I think, I'm good Like I don't need to dance
anymore because I can't do it.
Speaker 1 (29:43):
Like I used to. So you are competitive, but I
guess I am you do have you hold yourself up
with like expectations, certain expectations. I think that is natural.
It's stone being in a wheelchair. No, I hear you.
I have arthritis from head to toe from pushing these
athletes around the dance floor.
Speaker 2 (29:58):
Like I bet, like, really, no more texting for you, fox,
Let's move it. Let's move it. No, I can still
do that. It's more like my hips.
Speaker 1 (30:10):
I've got like two golf balls the size of golf
balls of scar tissue and both hip So like, technically
I do need hip replacements. Yeah, but we're not going
to manifest it. I did stem Cell. So what happened?
Speaker 2 (30:22):
Yeah, say more. I at first, it like didn't work
very well. It took like a while for it to work.
But I had my right hip was torn from like
eleven to three. I still had carlage, so that was okay.
Did I say my right that was my right hip?
My left hip was torn bilaterally, So I was torn
(30:44):
this way and so I did stem Cell, and I
wanted to stay awake during it, So I like, that's
too weird.
Speaker 1 (30:52):
WHOA this mic just hit me in the face. I
wanted to like see this thing happened, you know what
I mean? How pain? It was so painful? Like, are
you fucking kidding me? Howther go to sleep? Why would
you want to stay to sleep? Why? Yeah, exactly the
song you should have been listening to.
Speaker 2 (31:11):
But like why I was just interested in you a
chance behind it? Like I just wanted to know what
that what that looked like, what it felt like. The
live cells coming out of the chamber was.
Speaker 1 (31:21):
Like a movie. Like he pulled it.
Speaker 2 (31:24):
Out and it was like, you know, bubbling with ice,
and he was like, there's nine billion cells in here.
And I was like, okay, so where does this come from?
And he's like, it's from.
Speaker 1 (31:34):
A cadever And I was like, oh, you know, you
could next time you do this, you could easily YouTube it,
maybe watch someone else's experience. Most of that, those details,
I still was just interested. We're playing rapid fire questions
(31:57):
starting now. Are you ready? I'm ready? Oh god? Okay?
Do you think Alan or Max brought out the best
in you? Which one? Who brought out the best in you? Alan?
I love that. Who do you prefer as a coach? Max?
How about a friend? Max? Who did you have the
most fun with during rehearsals? Alan. Who did you feel
(32:18):
most comfortable with? Alan? Who did you have the best
chemistry with on and off the dance floor?
Speaker 2 (32:24):
Well, okay, because this can't be because I'm okay, God.
Speaker 1 (32:30):
Alan, Max? Who had the better physique? Max? Who was
the smelliest? Oh I don't remember that was seven years ago?
Your senses, Yeah he does. Who is who smelled the best? Max?
Definitely with his like freaking old spice, I swear. Who
was the most excited to be there? Alan? Who was
(32:51):
the cheesiest Alan? Who did you prefer with no shirt on? Oh? God? Max?
Who is the better dancer? Ooh snap, hurry up and
answer it. In the day and age, let's say Alan,
Max is old, Kiss Mary killed? But this time we're
only playing obviously kiss and kill because there's only two people, okay,
(33:11):
and you're married. Who would you kiss? I kiss you
and I'd kill kill. You know I'm not part of it.
Damn nice?
Speaker 2 (33:21):
Try Oh see, I just sneak un and be nice,
just just quickly, Okay, I would kiss Alan and I
kill Max.
Speaker 1 (33:29):
No, there was no oh yeah, there would yes, Sorry,
said nailed it. We're not marrying anyone. You're married? Are
we married? We're married? Okay, So with Dancing with the
Stars comes a lot of controversy obviously, as any with
any show, people are trying to get into people's business.
Was there any I guess, you know, Max danced with
this celebrity. Her name was Hope Solo. She's still alive.
(33:52):
Her name is Hope Solo, And it really is like
there's a lot of yeah, Hope and I'm Solo, like, yeah,
super independent of you. He Basically there was quotes from
the both of them about how basically Matt Max did
(34:13):
I guess, disrespected her and slapped her on her stomach.
I'm assuming none of this happened in your guys's short
I guess partnership. Were there any I guess with Dancing
with the Stars training? Just for all my listeners, I
guess people don't really understand how intense everything is. Did
you find that the schedule and the bickering because I
(34:35):
bicker with a lot of my partners, or I did?
It was intense as the show, I guess as time
went by.
Speaker 2 (34:43):
Yes, when we got to the group, like we did
a girl's in a guys night like the girls group
and the guys night, and we had to go straight
from the show. So we had filmed all day long
and then we went into an all nighter where we filmed.
Speaker 1 (35:00):
After the day. So we get there way and seven
am and seven howards. Yeah, yes, And.
Speaker 2 (35:11):
Like maybe I was coming into my voice of like,
you know, like you already work hard. You don't need
to work harder than you need to kind of like
think you.
Speaker 1 (35:20):
Know what I mean? Like what?
Speaker 2 (35:21):
Well, Like I just felt like I didn't really have
to like stay and talk about everything with everybody. He's like,
what more do we need to keep sitting here chatting about?
Speaker 1 (35:32):
Right? So you're talking about the team to the team
dances when we are team dances. Yes, so for fans
obviously you guys know what that is. But basically we
this show is live, so we rehearse seven days a week,
don't care what anyone else says. We don't have one
day off. And with that and ganting everybody schedule together,
it is important that we rehearse that same night. When
you've made it this far to Team Dances straight just
(35:52):
about going and heading into week six, right, yeah, then
you have to go straight from uh what from a
six A call time? On set? We dance live, we wrap,
we still have press afterwards, so we're not dent till
seven pm. Then they expect us to go to Dancing
with the Stars rehearsals and a group of individuals correct.
Speaker 2 (36:10):
With our team, and that goes until at least midnight exactly.
And that was me of being like, well, I'm a professional.
I don't have to you know, right, Like I don't
have to stay and do all this. I'm not sixteen anymore.
Like I'm not striving for things. You're not that much
sound like, yes, it could sound terrible. I'm so sorry,
but I was like, I'm tired, man, I want to
go to bed. It's like nine o'clock.
Speaker 1 (36:31):
So you're the angry Heather came out. I was just down, though.
I don't like get mad.
Speaker 2 (36:37):
I just don't talk and that doesn't translate well for TV. No,
I just look like our resting bitch.
Speaker 1 (36:43):
Oh my god, I have the best me and Whitney,
and I think you join the new club here of
the Resting Bitch RBF club. Whitney does have a resting bitch. Yes,
I mean I definitely do too. Yeah, it's just takes
less energy to not smile than smile. Yeah, I mean
I love to be happy. I mean, it doesn't mean
I'm not happy.
Speaker 2 (37:03):
But at like nine pm, I think most humans but
naturally like to go to bed.
Speaker 1 (37:08):
So was Max back then? That was his first rehearsal back.
Oh was he excited to be back? Yeah? So that
must have been good?
Speaker 2 (37:16):
Like how so how how was that experience that was
more exciting for him to like sit with his wife
than it was to like come into rehearsals, you know,
like because Peter was there.
Speaker 1 (37:23):
I mean, he sits with his wife when he was injured.
Speaker 2 (37:26):
So I just had a baby, so it was a
brand new thing. He had just had Shy. He had
just had Shy, and so that whole experience for him
was like brand new and he was excited. And so yeah,
he was excited to be back. And but was it like,
so did the show? Was that moment the moment that
tested you basically is what you're trying to allude to. Yeah,
(37:48):
thanks for putting that the right way, because it was
I was just like, okay, it's also mid season when
they decided like she's got to go, Like you're.
Speaker 1 (37:55):
So dumb, she needs to go to bed. She can't
make anymore. She's old RB A face of hers resting
bitch face, ain't reading Okay, Middle America. They don't love
you now because of the RBS. No, you got to
be on a carton of milk. And look, why do
you think you got eliminated? Why do I think I
got eliminated? I think it's a big tornado of all
(38:18):
those things. It's like, why do you think you do?
Speaker 2 (38:21):
I think I can't say that because I'm a conspiracy
theory so am I let's go. I think it was
for ratings, Okay, I think it was shocking elimination. It
was a shocking elimination at the time. This is going
to be used against me.
Speaker 1 (38:32):
No, it's not.
Speaker 2 (38:34):
It felt like it was for ratings and they wanted
more people to vote, and I was.
Speaker 1 (38:38):
Like, God, I love your honesty. Jesus nice man.
Speaker 2 (38:42):
The initial thought came true, but again, like you never know,
maybe maybe my RBI was too much for everybody. RBF,
My RBF was too much for everybody, And I think
it was the audience didn't rather there, so they said, boo, Heather,
you said, get out of here. You're not giving us
(39:03):
enough listen, not competitive enough.
Speaker 1 (39:05):
I was just like, okay, yes, okay, well we're gonna
cut to commercial. Just kidding, there isn't one here yet. Okay,
you know what, I don't listen. Conspiracy theory, whatever you
want to call it. Of course, that goes through people's minds,
especially when you are also in the same boat, like,
of course, there are moments where I think the same thing,
(39:27):
like what you just said about it's time for some
mid season shocking eliminations. Here we go, goodbye. You're not,
you know, too married to the show. You've had two partners,
for God's sakes, Like you can't be that connected to it.
And so yeah, shit happens any who.
Speaker 2 (39:44):
I mean, I could have remorse for saying that, but
at the same time, like I don't. It's so like
it's a TV showy show, yeah, and they need they
need the ratings. Like I have been a producer now
for almost two years for a podcast called The Bystanders,
and I get it now, Like when I when I
look back at all the things that I was so
defiant about because I am a third child and so
(40:05):
I'm very like I I know what I want and
that's it. And so the things that I've said no
to are like the things that I just don't understand
I'm like, how dare they now? As a producer and
I see like the whole of it, I'm like, you
know what, there's so many different sides to this. Obviously,
we want people to be watching, we want eyes on this. Otherwise,
you know, we don't have a show. So it's the
(40:25):
same for something like this, where like you do essentially
need just like a little quick moment.
Speaker 1 (40:31):
Yeah, was Max pissed? I don't.
Speaker 2 (40:34):
I don't think so. Again, like the way that I
saw him in that time of his life, he was
like happy, he just had a baby. And for sure
I think he was a little you know, down and
out like because he you know, he had had I
think a couple seasons where he like had drama or whatever,
and I think this might have just been a little
bit hard on him.
Speaker 1 (40:54):
But he still just seemed like okay, cool, Like like
where keep going? Yeah, I'm going to go back to
being ad. I'm sure exactly. I'm want to be a
dad and in a business dad. Alan has Alan thanked
you for his career? I mean I've just went drink. Well,
I went on tour. Did you know that I went
on to know a traveling tour? How is that this
(41:14):
is no more hotels, right? Were they putting you up
in hotels yet? No, we were saying on the bus.
Speaker 2 (41:18):
The first two of tours though, that I was a
part of. Yeah, we were like rock stars. I mean, listen,
I toured with Beyonce and we stay at hotels. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (41:27):
Wait, how was that experience? Oh my god? It was incredible.
And this was what year? I was nineteen, so this
was two thousand and seven. How many dancers were there?
Speaker 2 (41:38):
There's ten. There was six girls and four guys. Wow,
And I was amazing.
Speaker 1 (41:44):
We're both like very.
Speaker 2 (41:46):
Babies, babies, the babies of the baby. And she just retired.
She just yeah, she just retired.
Speaker 1 (41:50):
Wow. Wow, wow. Wow. Yeah. The dance community is a
small community. I guess. You know, if I always said this,
if I don't have kids, and you know, with dancing
comes body dysmorphia, did you ever have to deal with that?
I mean, you have like the perfect dancer's body. But
you know, I think with dancing with the stars and me,
(42:10):
I don't know, being curvy and I've always been curvy,
there's nothing I can do about it. There comes a
lot of fat shaming, or there was, and for yourself
or other people other people, like the press and all
of that, Like it was pretty center of attention at
one season. I'll never forget. It was like a couple
of people from the cast pro dancers, you're one of
(42:34):
your partners, and another person basically said that, you know,
along the lines of thinking that it was important as
athletes that we showcase a body that is more like
an athlete's body and you know, with hormones. And I'm
not making any excuses other than like, look, who my
(42:56):
my weight fluctuates, Like that's just way, It doesn't make
any excuse. Correct. When was this? This was a while.
It was like after I based my whole life off seasons.
It was like after season seven I danced with Maurice Green,
the runner Olympian guy, and then it was like that season.
I remember I got off my birth control thinking that
it was going to make me lose weight, but then
I retained fifteen pounds of water weight. Yeah on camera,
(43:20):
So this is all happening on camera. They were saying
this on camera. Oh yeah, no, yeah, shook no no.
So it was like all over the tabloids. It was
like I was being fat shamed in the middle of
a season on Dancing with the Stars and it was
like the it was headline news, Like literally, I'll never
forget turning on my TV in like George Pinacchio from
ABC Channel seven news in LA was like, oh then
(43:40):
Cheryl Burke fat shamed and blah blah, it was it
was insanity.
Speaker 2 (43:45):
I hope that's changed. I hope so because I mean,
like it's been what I don't know, I guess, like
how many years has this?
Speaker 1 (43:52):
It's been a while, but it's been a while.
Speaker 2 (43:54):
Yeah, but still, like, don't you want to see representation
on a show where you know, there are dancers in
different forms of costumes, doing different styles of dancing.
Speaker 1 (44:04):
There's so many people out of types. Yeah, there's so
many people.
Speaker 2 (44:06):
Out there watching that want to feel represented and like,
you know, to keep perpetuating the ideal that we all
have to be this certain way. And of course, like
you and I both as dancers, like we struggle with okay,
I want to continue to maintain that. But for me,
it's more so like I want to continue to maintain
that because I want to be healthy and I don't
(44:27):
want to end up with you know, autoimmune diseases. I
hear you, but more so like I want to see
representation on Dancing.
Speaker 1 (44:34):
With the Stars. No, I hear you.
Speaker 2 (44:35):
I want to see that. I think it would be
beautiful and it would change lives. Yeah, no, I hear you,
and yes, but I can't like to say that. If
I were to say I'm healed and yes, I agree
with you wholeheartedly and that's how I live my life,
it would be a lie. Like I think this has
a lot to do with why I don't have kids,
why I don't even want to freeze my eggs, because
it's trauma, because like, yes, we're you were humiliated, not only.
Speaker 1 (44:57):
But even with and Dancing with the Stars, like just
the dance world in general, right, being like comparing and
being in front of mirrors constantly. So like, I don't know,
have you dealt with anything similar or would you even
have your kids take part in a sport like dance?
I think, so I do.
Speaker 2 (45:16):
I do judge dance competitions often, and so I work
on a convention and I'm judging Friday nights and Saturday nights,
and I see so much representation on that stage and
so many different shapes and sizes of dancers who are
just as well off as athletes as the other ones,
and so I am grateful for that to see that
(45:37):
as well as like you know, non binary people and
and just all different assets of like how we identify
in our lives, and that's very present in these young kids.
Speaker 1 (45:49):
And so I will say I'm hopeful, yeah, that that
is there, like it's accepted. And when you were pregnant,
you didn't have to ever, like you didn't think twice
obviously about I think twice. I have a huge scar.
Speaker 2 (46:02):
I have a huge scar, you know, And like I'm
sure you know, but maybe you don't. I once had
breast in plants when I was like nineteen years old,
and they were so painful. For four years I had
them and I had them taken out. And I'm still
so self conscious because I'm flat chested, like I don't
look like I want to look like I really want
(46:23):
to get my boobs in again. And it's like, you know,
I still sometimes shame myself, and not more so of
like oh right now, like I look fine, it's more
so like I want to look sexy for my husband,
Like I want to be fucking hot when I'm having sex.
Speaker 1 (46:37):
You know what I mean, Like you are hot? I
prefer no boobies. But that's just my preference. Yeah, I do.
I think it's just like it's like in right now,
like we're not trying to get the big boobs, but hey,
to each their own. I love the big boobs. I
love the small boobs.
Speaker 2 (46:54):
I mean I once had my nipples pierce when I
was nineteen years old, and I thought that was cute
for small boobs. But like my kids still walk on
walk in on me sometimes naked, like accidentally, Like I
can't have my nipples peers, I can n the ten
year old.
Speaker 1 (47:07):
Hey, it's just a clip on, you know, one of
those Questons's fun. Before we wrap, where can people find you?
What's new? Let's talk about your podcast? Really quick?
Speaker 2 (47:14):
Yes, So the Bystanders podcast. It's a it's a funny,
dark comedy podcast. It's a new season, new storyline every season.
And uh, this season we have Kathleen Turner, Jolo Trulio,
Beth Dover, Luke Cook who is Hystericylle.
Speaker 1 (47:33):
Have you watched term? Yes? Of course, I mean amazing.
And then the way he attacked the person.
Speaker 2 (47:39):
Is he always yes, like naturally, he is so good
to watch, He's so inspiring. And so this season Uh,
these these Bystanders, Uh, they happen upon like an event
and nobody gets involved with this attack, and one year later,
on the anniversary of that event, they all find them
(47:59):
so waking up, bound and captive by a crazy man
who tries to teach them, you know, how to be
a better person. Essentially. It's so funny. I would say
it's like the White Lotus of podcasts. Like it's so
weird and zany and fun. And these actors that we had,
we had Kristin China with in season one. Jane Lynch
(48:22):
narrated both the first and the second season, and it's
just it's such a great recipe. And not only that,
like the creators, we have an all female creative team
as well as like as well as the executive producers.
So just I don't know the whole feeling behind it.
It just feels so positive and like everybody's so supportive. Yeah,
it's just amazing. Where can people find it? It's called
(48:43):
The Bystanders Podcast. It's now available on all podcast platforms
where you get podcasts.
Speaker 1 (48:48):
Has a right And where can people find you? On
social media?
Speaker 2 (48:51):
You can find me on Instagram at Heather with two Rs.
Elizabeth with two h's at the end. It's a dread
and I want to find the person. I just want
them to raise their hand, like.
Speaker 1 (49:03):
Hey, this is me who stole your name? Seriously?
Speaker 2 (49:06):
You know you can do that? Yeah, but how like
I need a step by step this Isn't you need to.
Speaker 1 (49:10):
Hire someone for that? Oh okay, yeah, so you give
you the number? Oh okay, yeah, but that's rude. It's
really rude. Heather Elizabeth and then my is Twitter cool anymore?
Speaker 2 (49:19):
Now? Threads, Threads, I'm kidding. I refuse right now. I
mean I'll stay there soon, Okay, I'll see you there.
I'm just a little late and I'm taking a nap
and then I'll be there.
Speaker 1 (49:31):
No. I love it because I'm not even taking pictures
for it. We're just just texting with the thumbs, okay.
And then that's it like Twitter, you know, ish, what's
the concept? I mean, it's the same thing as Twitter. Ohkay, yeah,
just thoughts. Yeah. Until thread sponsors this podcast, they'llt's stop
talking about them. I love ya. I love your sister
from another mystic from another world, yes, seriously, from another universe.
(49:52):
We will talk more on our flight back to Los Angeles. Tonight,
but make sure you guys check out at sex Lies
and spray Tands and follow us and us on Instagram.
Make sure you guys follow us at sex Lies and
spray Tands on our Instagram handle, and make sure your
comment let me know who you want me to interview.
What do you all think? Let me know
This is Sex Lies and Spray Tands with me Cheryl
Burke and iHeartRadio podcast. Welcome to Sex Lies and Spray Tans.
This is such a professional, little, little huge studio that
we're in Blue Wires Studios at Win, Las Vegas. Holy crap,
you know, just have this view behind us. This is like,
(00:22):
I mean, I should move here, I think, and start
podcasting with my guest Heather Morris, who's already doing this.
What is this called? We're doing this? I feel like
we're doing this show show it, hide it? What is
it like in it? Show it? Hide it? Show hid it. Yeah,
you can catch us on our new one two women's
(00:44):
show here at the end. Just kidding, Okay, we're going
to stop right there. Well, I'm ahead. I can't believe
I've never met you before.
Speaker 2 (00:51):
It's wild though that I just I walked in here
and we both said we feel like.
Speaker 1 (00:56):
We've known each other that long time. I know, and
I normally hate when people say that because you're like whatever, no,
but like I really have. Seriously, yes, we have. I
mean past life, we were dance partners, and we're hair
twins today, linzies, except mine hair is fake, as we know, Okay,
most of it, I know. But I'm an open book.
Yeah I love that. Okay, so let's just get right
(01:20):
into it, shall we just far away? Though we couldn't.
We're trying. We're trying really soft fingertips. I mean, if
anyone ever wanted to know about Heather mooris feel her fingertips. Fingertips.
So okay, just call me Barbara Walters. But here we go.
(01:41):
You were just obviously with your Glee cast. When was
the last time you guys saw each other. You were
there obviously supporting the writer's strike and the SAG after
a strike as well. Was that an interesting experience? Like,
you know, I'm here on the sidelines, I'm not an actor,
but yes I'm a part of SAG obviously. You know,
I am oh sag Aftra and you know, whatever is
(02:02):
going on is ridiculous. How has your life been affected?
And first of all, the first question was how was
your mini reunion with the cast members?
Speaker 2 (02:12):
The mini reunion is always a blast. Even getting the
text originally from my friends. I mean, they're all my
friends to get together for this, It's like you're trying
to contain your excitement because you want to see your
friends but you're also like, I'm here for a reason, right,
and I got to be really serious about it, and
like wear my shirt and puld my sign, which is
very important and I can't lose sight of that. But
(02:33):
also like, oh my god, I love you so much
you and so that whole thing happened, and but it's
it's pretty casual because we see each.
Speaker 1 (02:41):
Other often anyway. It's not like it's this weird moment. Okay,
So have you ever picketed before, because that must be
an interesting experience, Like I was, I have not, huh,
And I was shocked at the amount of honking, right.
It was jarring, and I it felt as though those
people were getting paid to do that because it was
(03:02):
so excessive. I just couldn't understand how much honking Do
you think they were getting paid? Maybe no, they were not.
Speaker 2 (03:09):
They know they weren't, but it felt crazy because they were.
They just wouldn't stop honking. And it's not like it's
they're just showing their support and they're so proud and
obviously their allies and they know why we're there.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
But still it's just so it's loud, and you want
to talk to us a little bit about your actual
sign that you were holding up is so sweet.
Speaker 2 (03:30):
I know it was a little tribute to Nya, to
miss Nya. I mean, I didn't make the sign. I
was gratefully handed the sign by the the person who
put it together, and so I didn't anticipate it, but
I thought it was such a beautiful little tribute. And
I mean just the sight of that, like.
Speaker 1 (03:49):
Just just just the.
Speaker 2 (03:51):
Symbol of what Santana meant was just so vast for
so many people. And so even just looking at a
sign like that, it's instantly like puddles and tears, you know.
Speaker 1 (04:02):
What I mean. I got chills when I saw the
science said the only straight I am is straight up
a broke. I love it, And that couldn't be more fitting.
I felt Naya in there. I felt it. Yeah, s
raight up barroke. Is that how she would say, like, yeah, okay,
so with you know, obviously so much success came with Glee,
(04:23):
and similar obviously story with Dancing with the Stars in
my story as well, Like I had no idea that
this was going to go on more than two seasons,
right like, and I guess you're never really ready for
the I guess attention from the outside Ruld, but you're
there just to do your art. Sure, how was that
for you when you, you know, all of a sudden,
(04:45):
you know, became one of the main characters I guess,
as well as somebody who was like a public figure
all of a sudden. I mean, I know you had
dance experience. I know you danced for Beyonce and all
of that, but this must have been a different light
for you.
Speaker 2 (04:58):
No, I mean it's so wild, like you have felt
just to go from being an artist, which sounds like
self proclaiming, but just being an artist and somebody who
has danced their entire life. I have danced since I
was one years old and then longer than me thirty
six years almost okay, And you know, like not, I
(05:23):
had wanted to become an actor, Like I had started
taking acting classes and I was preparing myself to do
the work and continue. And then I had gotten the job.
I was assisting as equidly, and so I had gotten
the job through him, and so I was like, yes,
I got my big acting job. And watching the pilot.
I don't know if you ever saw the pilot, but
(05:44):
watching the pilot, it feels it feels very small. You know,
it feels very niche, and it's like this dark comedy
that it just sets itself apart from so many different things.
And so when I watched the pilot, I didn't never
anticipate it would be that big got it? You know,
it felt like, oh, this really cool gig I got
that could feel small. I could work on my craft
(06:04):
and I'll kind of grow into the industry and like
make my way up, if that makes any sense. And
so to be like literally shot into the kin, literally
like you are bigger than the Beatles at this moment.
Speaker 1 (06:18):
That's crazy, crazy and jarring.
Speaker 2 (06:21):
And we were sat down and like kind of prepared
by Ryan Murphy, but like, wait.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
How does one prep for that? Like what does one
say to you? How do you prep for that? You
can't just say so you're going to become famous. Kids,
Please sit down here in my office and we're going
to talk about how famous you're about to be. Like
don't you wish there was a crash course with many
things mental health, I mean, how to clean your clothes?
Speaker 2 (06:47):
Yeah, but I just felt like I dropped the ball
on what this whole thing was, what it spiraled into,
because like.
Speaker 1 (06:53):
I had no idea how to fucking deal with any
of it.
Speaker 2 (06:55):
No, you know, I got a manager and that was
super helpful, but they your job is to push your
career forward, and it was like, well, how do you
help sustain it when I had no idea what I
was doing in the first place.
Speaker 1 (07:08):
Or I mean not in a bad way or you know, yeah,
it's just like no, No, you're right though, because you
use these kids, you have to also think about you know, yes,
live in the moment, be present, be grateful, but you
do have to think about your future because there is
this quick fifteen minute of fame, but you also want
how do you deal with people? Yeah, I mean that
doesn't even matter, right, Like the famous part is the
(07:30):
famous part, but you're doing what you love to do ultimately, Yeah,
but like, how do you handle like I wish there
was a crash course? How how I drink? Okay, Like, actually,
I'm not even trying to be funny, like and that's
why you know, I'm sober today. But I drank the
pain that I was feeling away. But it wasn't pain.
It was also like it was interesting because it was
(07:50):
a beautiful thing. Like I never thought ballroom deal I
was living in Harlem with my ex dance partner one
thirty six then Adam Clayton, to be exact, and I
was like, yeah, I'm going to just do this show
for one season, Okay, make some money. Yeah, and make
some money. Don't you dance with anyone else, sir? Anyway?
But then twenty six seasons later, obviously I never went back,
but like it was really jarring. Ye for me, I'm
(08:15):
introverted right the same. I'm an extroverted performer, yes, but
I'm an introverted like people think that I'm lying when
I say that. Yeah. No. I my very first interview,
I sounded like a mouse, Like ah, name is Cheryl.
I couldn't talk in front of the camera unless I
was drinking. So obviously I dealt with it through something
I don't recommend anyone doing, which is numbing through alcohol.
(08:35):
How did you deal with it?
Speaker 2 (08:37):
I didn't. I didn't know how to deal with it.
And I've been very outspoken about this with my mental
health struggles, but I didn't know how to deal with it.
I basically I went numb. I stopped talking to my castmates,
I stopped wanting to wear makeup. I didn't want to
see anybody, Like it was just this whole dark hole
(08:59):
I went to went into, and it was just for
the time. It wasn't something that was spoken about amongst castmates,
amongst you know, your peers or your family members.
Speaker 1 (09:13):
Or you know.
Speaker 2 (09:13):
It was still it was even though it was what
ten years ago, twelve years ago, it was still taboo ish.
Does that make any sense? Maybe it was just starting
to sprout. But I just felt really alone in that
and so I still just like kept getting like deeper
and deeper into my dark hole. And I'm grateful that
(09:34):
I got the job, but I wish somebody would have
just like pulled me aside and said, like, how can
we help? Yeah, like, how can I, you know, help
you get through this? So it what was a really
beautiful gift during that time was I got pregnant. In
no way, shape or form. Am I saying like, when
you're in a bad place, go get pregnant and have
(09:55):
a child, Like great way to numb. Exactly, great way
to numb. No, I'm not saying. But for me at
the time, I was having difficulties like knowing what my
purpose was and where I just felt like myself and
just I don't know like coming home and then having
a child just felt like really purposeful. Other than I
(10:18):
don't know, celebrityism.
Speaker 1 (10:19):
Is just interesting. We could talk forever about it, but
it's it's just weird. Yeah, So I guess what would
your advice be then for people who are like up
and coming but also like all of these like TikTok
influencers and stars and social media influencers like this is
you know, it's interesting because I'll get stopped not for
the hardcore dancing I trained in, but my like last
(10:41):
real post or something. And it's so it's so interesting, right,
but it's still like your I relate to you when
you say you went into a dark hole, because I
definitely did, and I thought alcohol was my way of
being social, you know, but there was no correlation. There
is no correlation.
Speaker 2 (10:57):
It just numsy a nice again and you're like, oh, okay,
I can function, yes, And then like just as an addiction,
and right, it is, yes.
Speaker 1 (11:06):
And I am an addict, as we know most of
us know, I guess, but I'm very much an open book,
as are you, I know, which I appreciate. How what
advice would you give to these people that want to
get into the entertainment business or that already are but
have no idea how to stay grounded.
Speaker 2 (11:24):
Well, that was a very deep and serious eye And
I don't mean that to say like, don't told you
it scary painful? Yeah, don't run the other way right,
get pregnant? No, not in any way, shape or form.
Speaker 1 (11:41):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (11:42):
I I think like, continue to do your homework the
entire time, and surround yourself with smart people and ask
a lot of questions, like don't be afraid to ask
questions from any of your mentors or your peers or
people that are working for you. That's they're not only
there to like help you rise to fame, but they're
(12:03):
also there to like help you sustain and be successful.
You know, there's there's so many performers that do it
and you're like, holy crap, they're so elegant and they
just seamlessly did it. But like no, they they work
tirelessly and they get help. Like you know, I would
say if you are rising, like hire an assistance. So
(12:24):
you all feel so overwhelmed and there's just so many
people there to help you.
Speaker 1 (12:28):
You're not alone, like exactly, and you're not alone. Yeah,
really seriously that it helps to know that because it
is people. I think back in the day too, it's
really hard for people to talk about mental health in general,
and because people assume that our lives are perfect, it's
far from that, where we are just honestly human beings. Okay,
just to switch it up to a little bit more
(12:50):
of a different subject, I guess about just tragedy and
death and how hard you know. I just lost my
dad a few years ago, and I can't even imagine,
you know, even just being a part of the Dancing
with the Stars family in general. It's just losing someone
is not easy. How did you sorry to hear that
(13:14):
I was passing? Yeah, it's it's something that I guess.
I'm a professional number and so it's been something that
I'm still dealing with, you know, on top of a
bunch of deaths. I guess, like my you know, divorce
is one. My divorce with Dancing with the Stars is
another one that really freaking hard. Is shit still is.
(13:37):
But like with that obviously, you know, I don't know,
the grieving process is different for everybody. How has yours been?
And you know during that time, what was going through
your mind?
Speaker 2 (13:48):
The grieving process, I don't know it comes in waves,
like they always say, like I don't think I have
anything more I would say like spiritual to say about it.
But I constantly try to remind myself of, you know,
the the importance of what Naya, what Corey, what my
(14:10):
dad what? So many people that we've lost mean to us,
and also like live in their presence, like what do
they want? You know, what would they want you to do?
How could you live through their memory? Like I know,
for Nia's birthday each year, her mom goes and draws
blood and donates blood. And I think that's such a
beautiful memory too, to remember such an important person with.
(14:34):
And it's like, how can we celebrate these people and
not feel like it's the worst day in the world,
but like, you know, kind of live their legacy on totally.
Speaker 1 (14:43):
And they would want nothing but for you to be happy. Yes,
and yeah, I hear you. Thanks that actually helped me, yea,
and nice words.
Speaker 2 (14:49):
She'd be like, make that money, like anyway you do,
make the money, don't.
Speaker 1 (14:53):
Be never forget that. Yeah, that's awesome. I love that.
So you know, let's switch it up a little. We're
gonna just talk all things dancing with the stars because
this job. Let's do some givett do some jive kicks. Na,
(15:14):
We're gonna not do that. I hate it jive, but
your jive was great. Mind you Okay, I don't want
to just cut the bullshit. What the hell? You basically
had switch up week because you dance with Max and
Alan who was troop back then you did season? What
was your season? Season twenty four? Twenty four? Right? Yeah?
(15:35):
If I have the.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
Worst memory, you could ask me something that happened two
minutes ago and I'd be like, I.
Speaker 1 (15:41):
Have your long term memory I'm sure is in Yes. Yeah,
that's why I need to do memory games. I need
to be better at. Seriously, yes, same. I mean my
mom actually has early stages of Alzheimer's and it's scary.
It's scaring me because like not to switch it to this,
but just memory is very important. Dance does help though.
Dances help and what I need to teach. So you do,
(16:03):
keep it, keep it, keep it, keep it with it.
Keep I have a trainer, my boxing trainer. I'm like,
give me routines. He goes. But this is not what
we do in boxing. I said, I'm not trying to
fight anyone, Like we're just trying to work the brain here.
I imagine like somebody attacks you and you're like jab
jabs one, five, seven, eight and five. I'm like, wait
what U you throw them off? Yeah? Totally, I knew it.
(16:28):
How was okay? So you got a lot of hate
for your dance experience? I as a seasoned pro twenty
six zones, I mean, dust off my white blazer on
the strip of Las Vegas. Here at Blue Wires Studios,
Nile covers, yes with no no nipple covers today? Going on?
(16:51):
Do you remember the girl that would check your nipple
covers on Dancing on the Stars? Oh? For sure. It
was like uh okay, mm hmmm, yeah, okay, anyways, let's
talk about nip another time. How was like the I
don't know, I wasn't there, but yet I was there
in spirit because I was still I'm still a fan,
will always be a fan. I watched your season and
it must have been challenging to deal with everyone saying
(17:14):
she's got a dance experience when I know that when
you have dance experience, it actually hurts you more than.
Speaker 2 (17:19):
Helps you when you start sitting like with a partner.
Because I'm a I'm a group sport dancer, so it
was like nobody I did lifts, but like I never
was heartnered like that because you have to actually let
somebody lead you, and I had never been led before.
And so those poor partners Max, they're fine, they're fine.
Speaker 1 (17:43):
You know what.
Speaker 2 (17:43):
I actually wish I would have flowed better, like gone
with the flow, you know what I mean with it,
and just like to those haters, been like, listen, yeah,
I'm a dancer, so what like who cares? Everybody's here
doing their best, living life, having fun. And I think
I took the pressure of it and like tried to
take it on and be like, no, it's fine, just
(18:04):
be really professional and like be very you know, just
like do your job and be serious. What an actuality?
Like No, the audience kind of just wants to hear
like who cares? Everything's okay? Jojo Cia as a professional dancer,
and she does she win. No is a professional dancer.
Speaker 1 (18:22):
She won. I mean, look, I was trying to teach
aj MacLean how to freaking chatcha and that was impossible
because he's a professional dancer. So it's like it's not
necessarily everyone's gonna have their own challenges. Yeah, exactly. But
is that how you took it? No, you you were
really upset. Were you upset or you're numbing? You're numbing,
You're Was I.
Speaker 2 (18:40):
Upset when I when I got kicked off at the time,
it was shocking?
Speaker 1 (18:45):
No, No, that's another conversation. Were you upset like initially
when the when you started receiving.
Speaker 2 (18:49):
Like fine, okay, yeah, cool, all right bye, And it
should have just come out. I should have been like, guys,
I'm coming. Yes, yeah, I know.
Speaker 1 (19:02):
I wasn't upset at all. I you know, I just
it didn't mess with your mind because like listen, No,
Dancing with the Stars is physically, yes, demanding, but I
find it to be more mentally challenging, okay, because of
the pressures. Of course, it's like stories that they want
to push, and so you're gonna have to feel the
stories ish ish in your own way and things change
(19:23):
and happen, and then your partner like you're so, let's
get to it. So, Maxim Schmierk Schmerkovsky, Schmerkovsky, I was
a teenager, how was so? Were you a fan of
Dancing with the Stars prior to you joining the cast.
I'm gonna say yes, but I'm gonna shake my no,
(19:44):
we aren't going to have real show. No.
Speaker 2 (19:48):
I had watched a few I knew Amber had been
on Dancing with the Stars, so I'd watched like a
few of her performances.
Speaker 1 (19:56):
It was just like it wasn't my gig, you know
what I mean? I had an auditioned for. So you
think you can dance?
Speaker 2 (20:01):
Yes to Dancing with the Start, And how was that experience?
Is that fucking upset me real hard? So like I
think I just numbed and blocked it out, and I
was like, I don't want to do reality television.
Speaker 1 (20:12):
It's so crazy, and then you will just chotch on
to Dancing with the Stars.
Speaker 2 (20:18):
So that I was like, you know what, I'll give
another shot and I'll have fun and whatever.
Speaker 1 (20:23):
So how what was your I guess conversation or interview
like with Dina Katz, who was the casting director of
Dancing did she was she like, wait, you were on?
So you think you can dance? Like did she even
know that you were on? Or like I think so?
And she like she did her homework, she was and
then she had a job to do. So like I
really chat right, and were you kind of like maybe
this is not going to be fair. I mean, were
(20:44):
you thinking any of this or no.
Speaker 2 (20:45):
Of course, the conversation was always there, and it was
always like pre interviewed, like just so you know it's
going to be controversial, okay, Like the second that that happens,
I'm going, oh my god, are they using this like
to promote the show?
Speaker 1 (20:58):
You know what I mean? Like is the nagad of me?
Speaker 2 (21:01):
Like and so I'm sitting there going like, okay, just
don't let that, don't let that hinder your dancing ability.
Just have fun and be real. So yeah, that was that,
and that was in my mind. But I was like,
just don't give into it, don't do it, like, just
dance and have a great time.
Speaker 1 (21:17):
Control what you can control, which is your rumba walks. Okay,
you remember that, guys, that's just my favorite though, Like
the boy I got it choreographed. That number was so good.
I have to say, Okay, so let's just tells her
about rumba's. First of all, it's always harder to dance
with less choreography than it is just like do a
(21:37):
jive so much harder. Your leg action was beautiful. You know.
I also have a relatable story to mention to you
because I got a sixty at a sixty with my
partner Juan Pablo Depace and we got eliminated. I'm still
not over it, not over it, never will be. People
are like, get over it, and I'm like, you get
(21:59):
over it, thank you. I'm allowed to have feelings, okay, yeah,
like it is insanity. Yeah, any who, do you think
Max was the reason you got eliminated? I think Max
was the reason. God damn it. You gotta blame somebody
but yourself. Oh God, was there that much hate towards no,
this one person? Max? Yeah? No, I'm just asking you, like,
(22:20):
do you think he was the reason? Like because he
had just come back from his injury. Injury he went
from Alan who was so excited to be there because
he had just if you know, he was like graduating
from troop to pro almost like he was right on
the cusp, like this was his time to shine, you
I know, but we talk. He talks a little, you know,
he was he is sweet, though, squeet. He's so excited
(22:42):
to be there and he still is like yeah, oh yeah,
he's so excited, so excited. You can see it through
his body language. And then you have someone like Max
who's the season pro who isn't necessarily the easiest of
like coaches either, am I I get it. This is
how we were trained in when we were professional dancers,
you know, like there is no affirmations, positive affirmations unless
(23:06):
it's deserved, right, I mean.
Speaker 2 (23:09):
I grew up with negative affirmations, like you have to
tell me I'm the worst dancer in the in the room,
and then I will be amazing and I'm great.
Speaker 1 (23:17):
I'm like, what's wrong with me? Wait? How are you
with compliments? I have the same problem, Like when people
generally say beautiful today.
Speaker 2 (23:26):
I have gone to I've gotten them altered compliments. I've
gone to a steamstress, and those compliments now fit my body,
whereas before they would just sag and fall right off.
Speaker 1 (23:36):
So you'll hear all about it.
Speaker 2 (23:38):
Okay, I don't feel all great about them, but if
you tell me, I'll take them and I appreciate it,
and then I'm like, okay, yeah, I think that might
be right.
Speaker 1 (23:47):
That might I love maybe custom made alterations and afmations
like Dancing with the Stars is amazing wardrobe department mind you?
So okay, it was must have been really hard though,
to honestly, to switch from one partner that you had.
You did like a what two week three week training
period prior to the three weeks with Yeah, and then
(24:09):
all of a sudden it You know, I know from experience,
it's different when you dance with Max and with Alan,
completely two different feelings. Right now, I'm not saying one's
better than the other. I'm just saying it is just,
you know, it's different. Who did you prefer to dance with?
You can't ask me to pick favorites. Listen, listen, well,
who's your favorite child? No kidding? Who do I like? No?
(24:35):
Because I okay, I'll tell you right now. I prefer
dancing with Max than Alan because Max made me feel
more feminine, I guess, like and also with my with
my like my body type, and with Max it's just fit.
It just looks aesthetically better.
Speaker 2 (24:49):
So he choreographed, Yeah, definitely is more fitting to the female.
Speaker 1 (24:54):
Like it's was. It feels like real ballroom, different strokes
for different folks. Yes, so you say, you say Max, Yeah.
Speaker 2 (25:01):
I think for the time it was probably like it
felt a little adolescent, you know what I mean to
do those couple of weeks and then going back to
Max was like, this is the adult.
Speaker 1 (25:13):
God b Stars, this is the Godfather, this is dancing
with the Stars. Have to duck.
Speaker 2 (25:16):
They have to duck, And maybe that was hard for
the viewers and the audience. Like I think that's the
only way I could attribute the that performance not doing
well is because like maybe in his new show that
he just put on in nin Napa, right, Like that's
a wonderful dance for that, but like for a TV show,
(25:39):
it might not have been the best. It just felt like.
Speaker 1 (25:43):
Dark, it's so dirty. It was it was easy.
Speaker 2 (25:46):
Oh my god, That's what I'm saying, Like I loved it.
I don't know, am I reaching I'm reaching the wrong
I'm reaching reach. Wait you feel your those sophomore touching.
Speaker 1 (25:58):
Literally come out? Didn't I didn't go from underneath? Okay, good,
I thought, Okay, so listen you were you were on
season twenty four. They love it when it's like dark, dirty,
sexual and sensual and full of chemistry. It was like
a how to performance that rumba and Max is with
the rumba. God yeah and he I. So there's so
(26:20):
many different styles of dance. I think that when you
danced your Disney. I don't think Max could have done that.
For example, Jose So it was in a way you had,
you know, both worlds. Child, you would have changed, Actor,
would have changed your.
Speaker 2 (26:34):
Song, l Actor with a tantrum if that song came on,
he would have been so mad.
Speaker 1 (26:37):
I don't think anyone would want to see backs dance
that dance strictly Ballward over here, I feel I feel
his pain and anyone else's pain. Who watches us people dance? Like,
oh you remember it? So what was your experience so
like with the packages, like was there any tension packages?
What was your package? Pry? I always say this to
(26:58):
my partners. Priority on Dancing with the Stars is number one.
Your package means more than your dance, then your live
interview with the host, whoever your host was back then
and then comes the dance and then the scores. Like honestly,
I do believe that is like that's priority, and I
think it's so important for people to come on a
journey with you. And you know, was it Max? Also?
(27:23):
You know, as we all are very competitive, we want
to win, and with that comes a lot of pressure
we put on ourselves. Did you feel like he was
doing that because people expected you to be perfect right
out at the gate.
Speaker 2 (27:35):
Well, what's interesting about like, first of all me and
then like Max and my? Is that the right grammar
Max and my like dynamic is that like I'm not
a competitive person, oh really in any way shape or
for him, So like I'm not there to go.
Speaker 1 (27:53):
Win at all, and no, I'm not. I'm not.
Speaker 2 (27:58):
And my husband, like, you know, God love him, he
also is like he is competitive and he loved sports
and he's been doing sports his whole life.
Speaker 1 (28:05):
So I tease him.
Speaker 2 (28:07):
I'm always like, you know what, We're just going out
there and we're having the best time we can and
that's the best we can do. Like, that's who I
am in a Nutually, I have to be competitive a
little bit when there's teach no, because I only beat
myself up too much if I am like I I'd
rather be authentically me than like push myself, which might
(28:28):
be super lazy.
Speaker 1 (28:28):
But how did you untrain for myself? How did you
untrain that? Then? Because you said like, because then you
beat yourself up, which means that you had experience of judging.
Speaker 2 (28:36):
But like in the audition rooms for acting, right, not
so much dancing, because dancing for me it when I
became a professional dancer. I yes, I was like competitive,
I wanted to get the job, but it was more
like it was all about the attack and like the
feeling behind it, rather than like the number, I'm going
to be better than you. Because I made friends with
(28:57):
all of my like my friends in audition rooms, we
always were best friends. We would leave, we would go
get lunch. Like that was never what it was. Of
course I wanted the job, So I guess I'm still
trying to figure out, like what that is. I am
competitive competitive, like.
Speaker 1 (29:11):
For example, like for me, I know what I my
potential is, right, so sure like and I have to say,
this is a part of the reason why I retired.
I think was because I wasn't seeing what I expected
to see like I used to.
Speaker 2 (29:24):
Like I well articulated because I feel the same with
my naring. I was just physically torn both both my labrams.
And I also tore my my buttocks last season when
I was teaching. And so now I'm like, you know what,
I think, I'm good Like I don't need to dance
anymore because I can't do it.
Speaker 1 (29:43):
Like I used to. So you are competitive, but I
guess I am you do have you hold yourself up
with like expectations, certain expectations. I think that is natural.
It's stone being in a wheelchair. No, I hear you.
I have arthritis from head to toe from pushing these
athletes around the dance floor.
Speaker 2 (29:58):
Like I bet, like, really, no more texting for you, fox,
Let's move it. Let's move it. No, I can still
do that. It's more like my hips.
Speaker 1 (30:10):
I've got like two golf balls the size of golf
balls of scar tissue and both hip So like, technically
I do need hip replacements. Yeah, but we're not going
to manifest it. I did stem Cell. So what happened?
Speaker 2 (30:22):
Yeah, say more. I at first, it like didn't work
very well. It took like a while for it to work.
But I had my right hip was torn from like
eleven to three. I still had carlage, so that was okay.
Did I say my right that was my right hip?
My left hip was torn bilaterally, So I was torn
(30:44):
this way and so I did stem Cell, and I
wanted to stay awake during it, So I like, that's
too weird.
Speaker 1 (30:52):
WHOA this mic just hit me in the face. I
wanted to like see this thing happened, you know what
I mean? How pain? It was so painful? Like, are
you fucking kidding me? Howther go to sleep? Why would
you want to stay to sleep? Why? Yeah, exactly the
song you should have been listening to.
Speaker 2 (31:11):
But like why I was just interested in you a
chance behind it? Like I just wanted to know what
that what that looked like, what it felt like. The
live cells coming out of the chamber was.
Speaker 1 (31:21):
Like a movie. Like he pulled it.
Speaker 2 (31:24):
Out and it was like, you know, bubbling with ice,
and he was like, there's nine billion cells in here.
And I was like, okay, so where does this come from?
And he's like, it's from.
Speaker 1 (31:34):
A cadever And I was like, oh, you know, you
could next time you do this, you could easily YouTube it,
maybe watch someone else's experience. Most of that, those details,
I still was just interested. We're playing rapid fire questions
(31:57):
starting now. Are you ready? I'm ready? Oh god? Okay?
Do you think Alan or Max brought out the best
in you? Which one? Who brought out the best in you? Alan?
I love that. Who do you prefer as a coach? Max?
How about a friend? Max? Who did you have the
most fun with during rehearsals? Alan. Who did you feel
(32:18):
most comfortable with? Alan? Who did you have the best
chemistry with on and off the dance floor?
Speaker 2 (32:24):
Well, okay, because this can't be because I'm okay, God.
Speaker 1 (32:30):
Alan, Max? Who had the better physique? Max? Who was
the smelliest? Oh I don't remember that was seven years ago?
Your senses, Yeah he does. Who is who smelled the best? Max?
Definitely with his like freaking old spice, I swear. Who
was the most excited to be there? Alan? Who was
(32:51):
the cheesiest Alan? Who did you prefer with no shirt on? Oh? God? Max?
Who is the better dancer? Ooh snap, hurry up and
answer it. In the day and age, let's say Alan,
Max is old, Kiss Mary killed? But this time we're
only playing obviously kiss and kill because there's only two people, okay,
(33:11):
and you're married. Who would you kiss? I kiss you
and I'd kill kill. You know I'm not part of it.
Damn nice?
Speaker 2 (33:21):
Try Oh see, I just sneak un and be nice,
just just quickly, Okay, I would kiss Alan and I
kill Max.
Speaker 1 (33:29):
No, there was no oh yeah, there would yes, Sorry,
said nailed it. We're not marrying anyone. You're married? Are
we married? We're married? Okay, So with Dancing with the
Stars comes a lot of controversy obviously, as any with
any show, people are trying to get into people's business.
Was there any I guess, you know, Max danced with
this celebrity. Her name was Hope Solo. She's still alive.
(33:52):
Her name is Hope Solo, And it really is like
there's a lot of yeah, Hope and I'm Solo, like, yeah,
super independent of you. He Basically there was quotes from
the both of them about how basically Matt Max did
(34:13):
I guess, disrespected her and slapped her on her stomach.
I'm assuming none of this happened in your guys's short
I guess partnership. Were there any I guess with Dancing
with the Stars training? Just for all my listeners, I
guess people don't really understand how intense everything is. Did
you find that the schedule and the bickering because I
(34:35):
bicker with a lot of my partners, or I did?
It was intense as the show, I guess as time
went by.
Speaker 2 (34:43):
Yes, when we got to the group, like we did
a girl's in a guys night like the girls group
and the guys night, and we had to go straight
from the show. So we had filmed all day long
and then we went into an all nighter where we filmed.
Speaker 1 (35:00):
After the day. So we get there way and seven
am and seven howards. Yeah, yes, And.
Speaker 2 (35:11):
Like maybe I was coming into my voice of like,
you know, like you already work hard. You don't need
to work harder than you need to kind of like
think you.
Speaker 1 (35:20):
Know what I mean? Like what?
Speaker 2 (35:21):
Well, Like I just felt like I didn't really have
to like stay and talk about everything with everybody. He's like,
what more do we need to keep sitting here chatting about?
Speaker 1 (35:32):
Right? So you're talking about the team to the team
dances when we are team dances. Yes, so for fans
obviously you guys know what that is. But basically we
this show is live, so we rehearse seven days a week,
don't care what anyone else says. We don't have one
day off. And with that and ganting everybody schedule together,
it is important that we rehearse that same night. When
you've made it this far to Team Dances straight just
(35:52):
about going and heading into week six, right, yeah, then
you have to go straight from uh what from a
six A call time? On set? We dance live, we wrap,
we still have press afterwards, so we're not dent till
seven pm. Then they expect us to go to Dancing
with the Stars rehearsals and a group of individuals correct.
Speaker 2 (36:10):
With our team, and that goes until at least midnight exactly.
And that was me of being like, well, I'm a professional.
I don't have to you know, right, Like I don't
have to stay and do all this. I'm not sixteen anymore.
Like I'm not striving for things. You're not that much
sound like, yes, it could sound terrible. I'm so sorry,
but I was like, I'm tired, man, I want to
go to bed. It's like nine o'clock.
Speaker 1 (36:31):
So you're the angry Heather came out. I was just down, though.
I don't like get mad.
Speaker 2 (36:37):
I just don't talk and that doesn't translate well for TV. No,
I just look like our resting bitch.
Speaker 1 (36:43):
Oh my god, I have the best me and Whitney,
and I think you join the new club here of
the Resting Bitch RBF club. Whitney does have a resting bitch. Yes,
I mean I definitely do too. Yeah, it's just takes
less energy to not smile than smile. Yeah, I mean
I love to be happy. I mean, it doesn't mean
I'm not happy.
Speaker 2 (37:03):
But at like nine pm, I think most humans but
naturally like to go to bed.
Speaker 1 (37:08):
So was Max back then? That was his first rehearsal back.
Oh was he excited to be back? Yeah? So that
must have been good?
Speaker 2 (37:16):
Like how so how how was that experience that was
more exciting for him to like sit with his wife
than it was to like come into rehearsals, you know,
like because Peter was there.
Speaker 1 (37:23):
I mean, he sits with his wife when he was injured.
Speaker 2 (37:26):
So I just had a baby, so it was a
brand new thing. He had just had Shy. He had
just had Shy, and so that whole experience for him
was like brand new and he was excited. And so yeah,
he was excited to be back. And but was it like,
so did the show? Was that moment the moment that
tested you basically is what you're trying to allude to. Yeah,
(37:48):
thanks for putting that the right way, because it was
I was just like, okay, it's also mid season when
they decided like she's got to go, Like you're.
Speaker 1 (37:55):
So dumb, she needs to go to bed. She can't
make anymore. She's old RB A face of hers resting
bitch face, ain't reading Okay, Middle America. They don't love
you now because of the RBS. No, you got to
be on a carton of milk. And look, why do
you think you got eliminated? Why do I think I
got eliminated? I think it's a big tornado of all
(38:18):
those things. It's like, why do you think you do?
Speaker 2 (38:21):
I think I can't say that because I'm a conspiracy
theory so am I let's go. I think it was
for ratings, Okay, I think it was shocking elimination. It
was a shocking elimination at the time. This is going
to be used against me.
Speaker 1 (38:32):
No, it's not.
Speaker 2 (38:34):
It felt like it was for ratings and they wanted
more people to vote, and I was.
Speaker 1 (38:38):
Like, God, I love your honesty. Jesus nice man.
Speaker 2 (38:42):
The initial thought came true, but again, like you never know,
maybe maybe my RBI was too much for everybody. RBF,
My RBF was too much for everybody, And I think
it was the audience didn't rather there, so they said, boo, Heather,
you said, get out of here. You're not giving us
(39:03):
enough listen, not competitive enough.
Speaker 1 (39:05):
I was just like, okay, yes, okay, well we're gonna
cut to commercial. Just kidding, there isn't one here yet. Okay,
you know what, I don't listen. Conspiracy theory, whatever you
want to call it. Of course, that goes through people's minds,
especially when you are also in the same boat, like,
of course, there are moments where I think the same thing,
(39:27):
like what you just said about it's time for some
mid season shocking eliminations. Here we go, goodbye. You're not,
you know, too married to the show. You've had two partners,
for God's sakes, Like you can't be that connected to it.
And so yeah, shit happens any who.
Speaker 2 (39:44):
I mean, I could have remorse for saying that, but
at the same time, like I don't. It's so like
it's a TV showy show, yeah, and they need they
need the ratings. Like I have been a producer now
for almost two years for a podcast called The Bystanders,
and I get it now, Like when I when I
look back at all the things that I was so
defiant about because I am a third child and so
(40:05):
I'm very like I I know what I want and
that's it. And so the things that I've said no
to are like the things that I just don't understand
I'm like, how dare they now? As a producer and
I see like the whole of it, I'm like, you
know what, there's so many different sides to this. Obviously,
we want people to be watching, we want eyes on this. Otherwise,
you know, we don't have a show. So it's the
(40:25):
same for something like this, where like you do essentially
need just like a little quick moment.
Speaker 1 (40:31):
Yeah, was Max pissed? I don't.
Speaker 2 (40:34):
I don't think so. Again, like the way that I
saw him in that time of his life, he was
like happy, he just had a baby. And for sure
I think he was a little you know, down and
out like because he you know, he had had I
think a couple seasons where he like had drama or whatever,
and I think this might have just been a little
bit hard on him.
Speaker 1 (40:54):
But he still just seemed like okay, cool, Like like
where keep going? Yeah, I'm going to go back to
being ad. I'm sure exactly. I'm want to be a
dad and in a business dad. Alan has Alan thanked
you for his career? I mean I've just went drink. Well,
I went on tour. Did you know that I went
on to know a traveling tour? How is that this
(41:14):
is no more hotels, right? Were they putting you up
in hotels yet? No, we were saying on the bus.
Speaker 2 (41:18):
The first two of tours though, that I was a
part of. Yeah, we were like rock stars. I mean, listen,
I toured with Beyonce and we stay at hotels. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (41:27):
Wait, how was that experience? Oh my god? It was incredible.
And this was what year? I was nineteen, so this
was two thousand and seven. How many dancers were there?
Speaker 2 (41:38):
There's ten. There was six girls and four guys. Wow,
And I was amazing.
Speaker 1 (41:44):
We're both like very.
Speaker 2 (41:46):
Babies, babies, the babies of the baby. And she just retired.
She just yeah, she just retired.
Speaker 1 (41:50):
Wow. Wow, wow. Wow. Yeah. The dance community is a
small community. I guess. You know, if I always said this,
if I don't have kids, and you know, with dancing
comes body dysmorphia, did you ever have to deal with that?
I mean, you have like the perfect dancer's body. But
you know, I think with dancing with the stars and me,
(42:10):
I don't know, being curvy and I've always been curvy,
there's nothing I can do about it. There comes a
lot of fat shaming, or there was, and for yourself
or other people other people, like the press and all
of that, Like it was pretty center of attention at
one season. I'll never forget. It was like a couple
of people from the cast pro dancers, you're one of
(42:34):
your partners, and another person basically said that, you know,
along the lines of thinking that it was important as
athletes that we showcase a body that is more like
an athlete's body and you know, with hormones. And I'm
not making any excuses other than like, look, who my
(42:56):
my weight fluctuates, Like that's just way, It doesn't make
any excuse. Correct. When was this? This was a while.
It was like after I based my whole life off seasons.
It was like after season seven I danced with Maurice Green,
the runner Olympian guy, and then it was like that season.
I remember I got off my birth control thinking that
it was going to make me lose weight, but then
I retained fifteen pounds of water weight. Yeah on camera,
(43:20):
So this is all happening on camera. They were saying
this on camera. Oh yeah, no, yeah, shook no no.
So it was like all over the tabloids. It was
like I was being fat shamed in the middle of
a season on Dancing with the Stars and it was
like the it was headline news, Like literally, I'll never
forget turning on my TV in like George Pinacchio from
ABC Channel seven news in LA was like, oh then
(43:40):
Cheryl Burke fat shamed and blah blah, it was it
was insanity.
Speaker 2 (43:45):
I hope that's changed. I hope so because I mean,
like it's been what I don't know, I guess, like
how many years has this?
Speaker 1 (43:52):
It's been a while, but it's been a while.
Speaker 2 (43:54):
Yeah, but still, like, don't you want to see representation
on a show where you know, there are dancers in
different forms of costumes, doing different styles of dancing.
Speaker 1 (44:04):
There's so many people out of types. Yeah, there's so
many people.
Speaker 2 (44:06):
Out there watching that want to feel represented and like,
you know, to keep perpetuating the ideal that we all
have to be this certain way. And of course, like
you and I both as dancers, like we struggle with okay,
I want to continue to maintain that. But for me,
it's more so like I want to continue to maintain
that because I want to be healthy and I don't
(44:27):
want to end up with you know, autoimmune diseases. I
hear you, but more so like I want to see
representation on Dancing.
Speaker 1 (44:34):
With the Stars. No, I hear you.
Speaker 2 (44:35):
I want to see that. I think it would be
beautiful and it would change lives. Yeah, no, I hear you,
and yes, but I can't like to say that. If
I were to say I'm healed and yes, I agree
with you wholeheartedly and that's how I live my life,
it would be a lie. Like I think this has
a lot to do with why I don't have kids,
why I don't even want to freeze my eggs, because
it's trauma, because like, yes, we're you were humiliated, not only.
Speaker 1 (44:57):
But even with and Dancing with the Stars, like just
the dance world in general, right, being like comparing and
being in front of mirrors constantly. So like, I don't know,
have you dealt with anything similar or would you even
have your kids take part in a sport like dance?
I think, so I do.
Speaker 2 (45:16):
I do judge dance competitions often, and so I work
on a convention and I'm judging Friday nights and Saturday nights,
and I see so much representation on that stage and
so many different shapes and sizes of dancers who are
just as well off as athletes as the other ones,
and so I am grateful for that to see that
(45:37):
as well as like you know, non binary people and
and just all different assets of like how we identify
in our lives, and that's very present in these young kids.
Speaker 1 (45:49):
And so I will say I'm hopeful, yeah, that that
is there, like it's accepted. And when you were pregnant,
you didn't have to ever, like you didn't think twice
obviously about I think twice. I have a huge scar.
Speaker 2 (46:02):
I have a huge scar, you know, And like I'm
sure you know, but maybe you don't. I once had
breast in plants when I was like nineteen years old,
and they were so painful. For four years I had
them and I had them taken out. And I'm still
so self conscious because I'm flat chested, like I don't
look like I want to look like I really want
(46:23):
to get my boobs in again. And it's like, you know,
I still sometimes shame myself, and not more so of
like oh right now, like I look fine, it's more
so like I want to look sexy for my husband,
Like I want to be fucking hot when I'm having sex.
Speaker 1 (46:37):
You know what I mean, Like you are hot? I
prefer no boobies. But that's just my preference. Yeah, I do.
I think it's just like it's like in right now,
like we're not trying to get the big boobs, but hey,
to each their own. I love the big boobs. I
love the small boobs.
Speaker 2 (46:54):
I mean I once had my nipples pierce when I
was nineteen years old, and I thought that was cute
for small boobs. But like my kids still walk on
walk in on me sometimes naked, like accidentally, Like I
can't have my nipples peers, I can n the ten
year old.
Speaker 1 (47:07):
Hey, it's just a clip on, you know, one of
those Questons's fun. Before we wrap, where can people find you?
What's new? Let's talk about your podcast? Really quick?
Speaker 2 (47:14):
Yes, So the Bystanders podcast. It's a it's a funny,
dark comedy podcast. It's a new season, new storyline every season.
And uh, this season we have Kathleen Turner, Jolo Trulio,
Beth Dover, Luke Cook who is Hystericylle.
Speaker 1 (47:33):
Have you watched term? Yes? Of course, I mean amazing.
And then the way he attacked the person.
Speaker 2 (47:39):
Is he always yes, like naturally, he is so good
to watch, He's so inspiring. And so this season Uh,
these these Bystanders, Uh, they happen upon like an event
and nobody gets involved with this attack, and one year later,
on the anniversary of that event, they all find them
(47:59):
so waking up, bound and captive by a crazy man
who tries to teach them, you know, how to be
a better person. Essentially. It's so funny. I would say
it's like the White Lotus of podcasts. Like it's so
weird and zany and fun. And these actors that we had,
we had Kristin China with in season one. Jane Lynch
(48:22):
narrated both the first and the second season, and it's
just it's such a great recipe. And not only that,
like the creators, we have an all female creative team
as well as like as well as the executive producers.
So just I don't know the whole feeling behind it.
It just feels so positive and like everybody's so supportive. Yeah,
it's just amazing. Where can people find it? It's called
(48:43):
The Bystanders Podcast. It's now available on all podcast platforms
where you get podcasts.
Speaker 1 (48:48):
Has a right And where can people find you? On
social media?
Speaker 2 (48:51):
You can find me on Instagram at Heather with two Rs.
Elizabeth with two h's at the end. It's a dread
and I want to find the person. I just want
them to raise their hand, like.
Speaker 1 (49:03):
Hey, this is me who stole your name? Seriously?
Speaker 2 (49:06):
You know you can do that? Yeah, but how like
I need a step by step this Isn't you need to.
Speaker 1 (49:10):
Hire someone for that? Oh okay, yeah, so you give
you the number? Oh okay, yeah, but that's rude. It's
really rude. Heather Elizabeth and then my is Twitter cool anymore?
Speaker 2 (49:19):
Now? Threads, Threads, I'm kidding. I refuse right now. I
mean I'll stay there soon, Okay, I'll see you there.
I'm just a little late and I'm taking a nap
and then I'll be there.
Speaker 1 (49:31):
No. I love it because I'm not even taking pictures
for it. We're just just texting with the thumbs, okay.
And then that's it like Twitter, you know, ish, what's
the concept? I mean, it's the same thing as Twitter. Ohkay, yeah,
just thoughts. Yeah. Until thread sponsors this podcast, they'llt's stop
talking about them. I love ya. I love your sister
from another mystic from another world, yes, seriously, from another universe.
(49:52):
We will talk more on our flight back to Los Angeles. Tonight,
but make sure you guys check out at sex Lies
and spray Tands and follow us and us on Instagram.
Make sure you guys follow us at sex Lies and
spray Tands on our Instagram handle, and make sure your
comment let me know who you want me to interview.
What do you all think? Let me know
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