On today’s episode, Jason is joined by St. Bonaventure Men's Basketball General Manager Adrian Wojnarowski for a lengthy conversation. During the interview, Woj discusses how important NIL is to his new gig, the trials and tribulations that come along with trying to build a competitive basketball program, how he's using his ESPN connections to help his players build a basketball career after college, how difficult it is to navigate this new era of college basketball and much more!
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:05):
This is Straight Fire with Jason McIntyre.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
What is up, straight Ram. It's me Jason McIntyre Straight
Fire for Friday, January thirty. First, Oh, we have a
spectacular guest today on the podcast. I know you're here
usually for my hot takes, but I'm just telling you this.
Today's guest, Adrian Wojnarowski, one of the foremost journalists in America,
left for a new job. He is now the GM
(00:33):
of the Saint Bonaventure Bonnies, the basketball team in the
A ten. It is an incredible turn of events for Woj.
He's been there about six months and I've known him
for a good twenty issuyears. So I hit him up.
I was like, bold, I want to go. I think
the audience wants to hear about this. A lot of
people are like, oh, nil is ruining college basketball. It's
(00:54):
also creating a ton of new jobs this GM job
that Woj got. There are now agents representing college athletes
for name, image and likeness, like it is awesome. I
love this interview where we talked Thursday afternoon. It was spectacular.
I think you guys are really gonna like it. Outside
the box stuff. It's illuminating to say the least. I
(01:16):
will just add one other thing. I am in a
weird spot where I'm working at the FS one and
a lot of people write about our show, and some
people write about the future of our show. This is
my favorite part about it. Okay, So I have been
at Fox eight and a half years, almost nine years,
(01:39):
and it is always strange when people write about your
place of employment and some of the stuff you didn't know,
some of the stuff you did. But it's always weird
to read about it from an outsider perspective. And obviously
this week there was big news and I have been
besieged in the last forty eight hours with some texts
(02:02):
but mostly dms online Dude, are you moving to Chicago?
Speaker 1 (02:07):
Is the show moving?
Speaker 2 (02:08):
What's going on? Because people read stuff and then you
know Colin address sub of it on his podcast. And
my favorite part of all this is back when I
was a journalist, when you hear a story about a story,
you reach out to parties involved, Right, Hey, I heard
you might be transferring. Hey I heard you are gonna
(02:32):
sign as a free agent with X team. Like you
would call the agent, the athlete, reach out to the
person involved and try to find out and it is
just hilarious to me that I haven't heard from anyone
in the media, but I hear from people who know me, dude,
are you moving who don't write about the media. They're
just asking me as kind of quasi friends, or they
(02:53):
know they know me and live near me or whatever
it is. And it's just so funny for people to
speculate reach I would never respond to them. If they
did reach out to me, I'd be like, yeah, I'm
not gonna I can't go there. Sorry, Bud, thanks for
reaching out. But that's the thing people are writing about
it is if they know stuff or they're plugged in,
but they're not even reaching out to attempt to find
(03:14):
out the truth. Like I would respect people more if
they were like, Hey, j Mac, I gotta ask you know,
I'm writing about this. Are you going? I sorry, I
can't comment, you know. And that happens sometimes, but on
this one this week, not one person has reached out,
but everybody's writing as if they know. And that's how
you know. People are just chasing algorithms and clicks because
it's in the news. I have no clue what's gonna happen, Okay,
(03:37):
I I don't know. I really like life out here
on the West Coast. If you watch the herd closely.
Colin and I have been joking about this for months.
You gotta read between the tea leaves and listen closely.
But yeah, that's all I'll say about that, and let's
get to the main event. Adrian wol j Darowski GM
(03:59):
of the Saint Bonaventure basketball program.
Speaker 1 (04:02):
Fox Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in
the nation. Catch all of our shows at foxsports Radio
dot com and within the iHeartRadio app. Search FSR to
listen live. You know, Jason likes to think he knows
everything when it comes to sports.
Speaker 2 (04:20):
I know what sports fans want, but for.
Speaker 1 (04:23):
Everything he doesn't. He knows a guy who does.
Speaker 3 (04:26):
Let's just say I know a guy who knows a
guy who knows another guy.
Speaker 2 (04:31):
All right, let's welcome into straight fire. Come on, you
guys know him. He doesn't even need an introduction. I've
known this guy probably close to twenty five years now.
One of my first jobs out of college, we were
working kind of in the same shop, and man, I
learned more from that guy in two years than I
learned in newspapers and five or six. Adrian Wojnarowski, the
GM of Saint Bonaventure Basketball. Woj how are you, man, Jason?
Speaker 4 (04:55):
I'm great? Are Yeah.
Speaker 3 (04:56):
We are a long way from the record hack Andsack,
New Jersey. Our offices on the old offices on River Street,
they're not even I don't believe they're there anymore.
Speaker 4 (05:05):
Jason.
Speaker 2 (05:05):
Wow, Hey, it's been a minute, man, it has been
a while. And congrats, you know, I it's so random.
I saw woje out here in California crossing the street.
Speaker 4 (05:13):
I was like, what are you doing?
Speaker 2 (05:15):
And uh, you know, hey man, you've you've had a
busy six months. Shall we say, how's the job going.
Speaker 4 (05:21):
It's great.
Speaker 3 (05:21):
I really jump out of bed every day looking forward
to the challenge of this.
Speaker 4 (05:27):
Every day is a little bit different.
Speaker 3 (05:29):
You're doing a lot of the you know, same pursuits
of recruiting nil you know, trying to help our players
and their families with things that you know can be
helpful to them, and you know, getting out and telling
the story of Saint Bonaventure basketball, Saint Bonaventure University. We
had some good wins this season, just you know, be
(05:49):
dating at home the other night, be the VCU at
home beat Providence on a neutral court. So you know,
we we We've got some great wins this year and
really great group of players. That's been my favorite part
of this, Jason, is being around our players their families,
you know, and trying to help where I can help.
And it's it's been a lot of fun. It's it's
(06:12):
really been everything I hoped in more.
Speaker 2 (06:15):
I think when the news first broke wog Is leaving
ESPN and being the number one NBA reporter on the
planet to go to Saint bonavent Or, people were dubious, like,
I'll wait a minute, was or scandal because it's a
weird time in college basketball, woage where you've got all
these old great coaches kind of leaving the sport. The
guy at Virginia recently left right before the season, you know,
(06:35):
and here you are running into it. I mean, your
job GM did not exist in college basketball what like
four years ago, maybe even less.
Speaker 3 (06:43):
No, And I think it's you know, what's made these
jobs necessary or certainly really helpful at places both football
and especially especially football and basketball is the portal and
nil because we have perpetual free agency. Everybody can leave
(07:03):
essentially after every year, and we have money that needs
to be raised and essentially salary caps that have to
be managed, and you're working on retention every day and
that's part of you know, to me, our most important
recruiting is our own players and showing them, you know,
all the opportunities and hopefully they're having a great experience here,
(07:26):
but also understanding at the end of each year there
are opportunities too that can be really tempting for guys.
The money is significant, you know, not just across the landscape,
but in the Atlantic ten in our league, and so
you know, that's our.
Speaker 4 (07:42):
Fight every day.
Speaker 3 (07:43):
But certainly, you know, as I dig in on basketball,
I do marvel at football and I watch, you know,
you kind of watch the you know that I try
to read and listen to what's going on at Carolina
with Bill Belichick and Mike Lombardi. And it's fascinating in football,
you know, because you need so many more guys. Obviously
they have stabs and it's different.
Speaker 4 (08:06):
You know, we're.
Speaker 3 (08:07):
Still you know, it's still you put a basketball team together,
you're trying to get five guys and obviously you want
to bench and you need to protect against injuries and
and all the things.
Speaker 4 (08:17):
But it's it's fun. It's like putting a puzzle together.
Speaker 3 (08:21):
And you know, I come into this pretty humble about
I've got a lot to learn and trying to lean
on people a lot smarter than me, whether it's our
coaching staff and understanding with our staff about you know,
what we value in players, and you know, you look
at analytics and certain data about things that we value
(08:43):
that somebody else may not value as much, vice versa.
And so that part of it's been a lot of fun.
And but a lot of it, Jason is I've spent
the last thirty five years talking to players every day,
coaches every day, agents every day, and you're still doing that,
but you're having different conversations.
Speaker 2 (09:04):
Yeah. Yeah, it sounds like you guys, And listen, I
did look up some stuff. It seems like the SEC
spent on average thirteen million dollars in the NIL and
Big ten was about ten mil. I don't know if
these are updated, but it was from chat GBT, which
is obviously never wrong. And you guys have to do
it on a moneyball, like a bit of a shoe
string budget, you know, like if you want Joe Schmo
(09:25):
and Kansas is coming after him, like that's a that's
a tough one for you guys. But I'm curious, like
this moneyball aspect, how much fun is it because it
just seems like that one of the best jobs that
you could imagine.
Speaker 3 (09:36):
Yeah, I think, you know, for us, you've got a
zero win on places that who you are as a school,
who Saint Bonaventure is, and what our identity is. Embrace
it and find people who this appeals to. And it's
not going to be everybody. Yeah, but you know, I
think on a couple of levels right where we might
be your first stop on the way somewhere else, we
(09:59):
might be the place you you have to come to
get the basketball.
Speaker 4 (10:01):
Right.
Speaker 3 (10:02):
We have a Hall of Fame coach and Mark Schremidi
just won his four hundred game as a Division one coach.
He's one of the all time winning his coaches in
Atlantic ten history. You know, he's behind you know, the
likes of John Cheney and you know, legendary figures like that.
And we have a great league in the Atlantic Ten,
playing against the Vcus and the Daytons. You're in the
major media markets, you're on television, you know, you know,
(10:26):
we had a first round pick in our league last
year we've had first round picks at Saint Bonaventure, And
so you find guys and families who value the whole
picture of that. Like Jason, we're not winning bidding wars,
and if it's just about money, I'm going to be
out of it pretty We're going to be out of
it pretty quick and move on. But what I have
found and where, especially with our the group we have here,
(10:48):
you know they value We have families who value the
bigger picture of you know, playing big time basketball. But
at a school that has two thousand students, there's nobody
quite like us in Division one. There's other school that
have two thousand students, but they're not trying to play
basketball and sports in the Atlantic ten. And so certainly
you do the math. We have fewer students, we have
(11:08):
fewer alumni, we have fewer people to draw from to
raise money versus some of the schools I just mentioned,
and so you're gonna have to do more with less.
We've had a coach who's done that over a very
long period of time.
Speaker 4 (11:20):
And my job people here GM, and they.
Speaker 3 (11:24):
Think of pro sports. I think of the NFL, NBA.
The GM is in charge. I'm not in charge of anything.
I'm in charge of bringing to our coaches and our
staff options and saying, hey, here's through my relationships old
and new. You know, here are potential players internationally, potential
porter players, portal, junior college, Division two high school, obviously,
(11:50):
all the different places that you know you would draw from,
and let's dig in on the let's dig in on
tape on them, let's dig in on the data, and
then let's see who we really want to focus in
on in our recruiting. You know, it's not like I
talked to NBA guys and I had a long talk
with a GM today about is I'm trying to Analytics
(12:11):
was a blind spot for me. This is not something
I have a strengthen. But I think I've helped to
surround myself with people who do, who are helping us.
And you know, we're not trying to cover the an
NBA team can draft from any where they want, Like,
if there's a player out there, they can draft them,
they can get them, maybe they can trade for them.
Once he's in the NBA, we have to be able
(12:33):
to recruit them. And so what I'm trying to do
is let's build out a database of people places where
we have great relationships, where there's geographic fits, and where
there's you know, again, like I said, maybe we're the
first stop on the way somewhere else. Maybe you're going
to come and play four years here. Maybe we're the
place where you where you went to the big time program.
(12:55):
You picked geography, you picked weather, you picked nil, they
were all bigger factors. Didn't go great, it didn't go
how you hoped it would. We're the place to come
to fix that, and you see the we play for
a great coach here. Hopefully I can be helpful with
players with NBA opportunities, other professional opportunities, you know, get
(13:20):
guys in the gym with NBA players in the summer,
have NBA guys coming through our campus. Maybe do a
pro day here next year based on what our roster
looks like. So we have a lot to sell and
you've got to you got to drill in and find
the guys who.
Speaker 4 (13:40):
Our story is compelling to.
Speaker 3 (13:42):
It's not going to be for everyone, but the good
news is we just need five of them on the floor.
Speaker 4 (13:47):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
Now, So I'm part of a Mexican soccer team ownership
group with a guy you may know, former NBA agent
Sam Porter. And one of the challenges is, you know,
you got to coach every different two or three years.
He's got a different system he wants to run. You
don't have the players for that system, so then you've
got to go find a couple new guys. But with
you guys having Schmidt there forever, you kind of know
what he wants, what his system is. Is that a
(14:09):
huge advantage when it comes to the portal, Like you
can see a guy popping at Wagner and then hey,
that's a great fit for us, Let's bring him in.
Is it make it a lot easier?
Speaker 4 (14:16):
No, it's a great point, Jason.
Speaker 3 (14:18):
And not only do we know what a Mark Schmidt
player looks like and plays like in the Tangibles and
the Intangibles, people out there who we would be recruiting
with recruiting from they also know. So you'll you'll have
people come to you and say, hey, I got a
Bondi player for you, and we kind of know what
(14:38):
that is. That doesn't mean you know, what's great about
coach Schmid is his ability to adjust and adjust to
the personnel. It's not just hey, you're going to fit
into the system. You're going to adjust to your best players.
But our group typically like we're going to defend, we're
going to rebound, you know. And so you know we've
(15:04):
had we've won in lots of different ways here under
Coach Schmidt, and you know, the hard part is especially
a program like ours, where you know, we had a
run of eight straight years essentially of first team All
Atlantic ten guard play Jalen Adams to Kyle often where
they became starters as freshmen, they were four year starters.
Speaker 4 (15:24):
They got us to the nca tournament.
Speaker 3 (15:25):
We won a lot that it's harder to imagine you're
probably going to have a four year starter at point
guard now, so you're turning it over faster. And so
that's certainly a challenge for the staff, but it's everybody's.
It's everybody's challenge. And you know that's for me, is
I believe in this place. I believe in Saint Bonaventure
(15:46):
that the university was transformational in my life and I
think for a lot of young people it can still
be a transformational place. And our woman's coach, Jim Crowley
said this to me and it stays with me. He said, listen,
you come to our place and you get on campus
and you either feel it or you don't, and if
you feel it, it stays with you the rest of
your life. And I see we're bringing back twenty fifth
(16:09):
anniversary team that went to the NCAAs in two thousand
and took Kentucky to double overtime. You know, the entire
team's coming back, and they're coming from all over the world,
and how much this.
Speaker 4 (16:20):
Place means to them.
Speaker 3 (16:22):
And I really feel like when we're out recruiting, even
in this age of the portal, we're selling a forty
year relationship.
Speaker 4 (16:28):
I want so much for our current.
Speaker 3 (16:30):
Players to see the relationships that this team has from
twenty five years ago, to see them come back to campus,
how close they still are, how they're all still on.
Speaker 4 (16:40):
A text chain.
Speaker 3 (16:41):
We had a team from the late sixties that was
back earlier this season. I mean, these guys are in
their seventies early eighties and they're still really close. And
so for us, it's great for our players at a
time when again they can move around, some have moved,
some may move again, but that they can look and
say maybe say, hey, I'd like to have that twenty
(17:03):
five years from now or fifty years from now. And
I do wonder sometimes in this portal age, if you
go to three schools, do you really have one you
can go back to? Do you really have one that
you can call home? And again, that doesn't have to
be important for everybody, but for some kids it will be.
And we got to find those guys.
Speaker 2 (17:22):
Let me ask you. You mentioned a freshman staying four years.
It's tough for high school kids now, woh, Like, it's like,
why would I take an eighteen or nineteen year old
when I could get a twenty two year old who's
been a starter for three years? You know, like, it's
just it's difficult. How do you guys manage bringing in
young guys who would stay with the program versus hitting
the portal and getting high impact fifteen pointy game guys.
Speaker 4 (17:44):
Yeah, there's no question, Jason.
Speaker 3 (17:45):
And with the junior college with a lawsuit with the
Vanderbilt quarterback that changed the junior college eligibility. Now you know,
players who we thought were out of eligibility after this
year have one.
Speaker 4 (17:57):
They might have two more.
Speaker 3 (17:58):
Years of eligibility based on how your junior college years
are judged. And so you know you're going to have
because of the COVID, we had the twenty four to
twenty five year olds. Now with the j C rule,
you know again, and there's a big difference having a
twenty four year old point guard playing an eighteen year
old point guard. You look at our league, there's young
(18:19):
guys who play, and we have Xander Wedlow, who's a
freshman center from Detroit who's in our rotation and playing
is going to be terrific. Typically it is older players
and you are winning, and the portal is important, and
high schools in many cases a little more of a
developmental route now and you're seeing maybe high school players
(18:40):
who might have come in at the Atlantic ten level,
maybe they're coming into college basketball at what might be
perceived as a level below. But I do think what
you see is if you're a player and you produce
at what's you know, a low major, or you produce
in Division two, there's going to be opportunities.
Speaker 4 (18:57):
To move up.
Speaker 3 (18:57):
I think you look back a lot of like, look
at the Division two upperclassmen now who are out there,
many of whom kind of came through in COVID. And
there probably were some recruiting mistakes made during COVID because
people couldn't get out and evaluate, and so there are
no I mean, look at Drake this season with four
(19:19):
Division two players in their lineup. You better, to me,
you better be really digging in in the Division two,
Division three level for US Canada. You know, Toronto's three
hours away. That's a very important market for US, and
so there's players everywhere. And you're right about though, Jason older.
I think a lot of people probably feel older is better.
Speaker 2 (19:42):
Yeah, let me ask about it. Sounds like you're you
have to divide your time some high school. You got
to monitor high school, you got to monitor JUCO. You've
also got to monitor Division IE potential portal guys. I
don't know, I did see that. You know, the Patriot
League and the IVY League, they're struggling with the idea
of paying kids. Nil Yale lost a bunch of dudes.
(20:02):
How do you handle like just drumming up money and
how to handle and divide it among whether it's a
JUCO a d one high school kid.
Speaker 3 (20:09):
Yeah, that's that's the challenge, and I think I think
everybody's grappling with that of of you know, in the pros,
there's a salary cap and you you have an owner
who even if you're the even if you're the lowest
spending team in the NBA, if you have a great player,
you're going to pay them a max deal to keep them.
Speaker 4 (20:30):
Right like you.
Speaker 3 (20:32):
It's different at this level, right, we don't have a
quote unquote owner. We don't have a billionaire who's funding it.
You're raising it as you go and the generosity of
your alums and donors. And then there's a lot of
business partnerships that I spend you know, a great deal
of time on where you know, where you bring business
to partners you have and you get essentially a commission
(20:54):
back at those I spend a lot of time with
those kind of fundraising efforts where you kind of get
this passive income that you can count on over time.
That's going to be the key of it, the donor model,
especially to smaller school you can't just keep going to
the same people over and over. You've got to find
new revenue streams. You've got to find marketing deals for
(21:17):
your players. And so while we're recruiting players, I'm also
going to companies and you know, national brands and be
able to get potential nil deals that you know, play
a particular player might appeal to that company and calling on.
Speaker 4 (21:35):
Relationships you've had through the year.
Speaker 3 (21:37):
So you're spending your time on all of that, and
you know, if schools are going to opt if schools
are going to opt in, if the house settlement is
going to go through, and the schools in the instant,
the leagues that have forty and fifty million dollar a
year television deals, who can fund fully fund you know
that twenty plus million dollar revenue sharing. I mean, that's
(22:02):
not that's not how it looks at Saint Bonaventure, That's
not how.
Speaker 4 (22:06):
It looks with some of the schools in our league.
But there's no question there are schools in our league that.
Speaker 3 (22:11):
You know, are are going to be really aggressive with
rev with essentially player salaries if we you know, if
that all goes through. So you know, that's where I
spend my days on are trying to close the gaps
on that, and then we've got to be.
Speaker 4 (22:27):
Smart with our money. We've got to make good decisions.
Speaker 3 (22:30):
And again it goes back to having a great, great
coach at Mark Schmid, who's a great equalizer for us.
And I know spending the most money doesn't guarantee.
Speaker 4 (22:42):
You're gonna win. But if you're at the bottom, pretty
good chance you're not. Right.
Speaker 1 (22:48):
Fox Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in
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listen live.
Speaker 2 (23:00):
I wanted to ask those So you used to cover,
You've done a lot of college, and I mean even
when I was covering high school, you knew the lay
of the land. I'm just curious. It used to be
called boosters and now it's like collective. It just sounds
a little more classy and upscale. Is it the same
way you're you know, listen, there were some street agent
kind of guys back in the day. Is it similar
(23:22):
or is it the behind the scenes stuff cleaned up
a little bit?
Speaker 3 (23:26):
Yeah, Like the players can have representatives and and I
like that part of it. I would rather typically deal
with an agent. I'd rather probably prefer to have our collective.
When I worked with our collective, and dealing with a
representative who's negotiated deals, who understands the marketplace, I think
(23:48):
that's I like operating that way.
Speaker 4 (23:51):
And so having had a lot of those relationships through
the years, and then you know, you're building.
Speaker 3 (23:56):
There's a new group of younger like in a lot
of cases, younger agents now who have really been aggressive
and smart in the NIL area with both basketball football
and getting to know them and you know, trying to
get a sense of what a marketplace looks like and
being prepared for when that portal opens that you know who,
(24:17):
be prepared for who may be available, and where the
price points are going to be and where the value
is and if you you know, you spend a little
more at this position, you might have a little less
to spend here. And so those are all the decisions
you're making, and you're moving pretty fast. And so the
goal is to not have dramatic roster.
Speaker 4 (24:35):
Turnover every year. You want to be able to keep
guys you can do a great job.
Speaker 3 (24:42):
You know, the money elsewhere can be massive, And I'm
never going to tell a young kid in a family
that they shouldn't take a life changing opportunity. I'll make
the case for what we have and who we are
and the opportunities that come with being at Saint Bonaventure,
but I I'll readily tell our guys, hey listen, and
there's probably going to be more out there for you.
Somewhere else, but there's also a long play here with us.
Speaker 4 (25:07):
And the opportunities that are here.
Speaker 3 (25:09):
And it's gratifying when guys feel it and they stay
and they want to be a part of it. And
when you have guys who believe in your place and fit,
you just want to do everything you can to keep
them because that's who you win, that's who you win with,
and that's who you feel good about winning with.
Speaker 4 (25:25):
We just have such a great.
Speaker 3 (25:26):
Group of young guys that, you know, for me, I
feel a pressure to do right by them and help them,
not just while they're at Bonaventure, but to be able
to help them, you know, in their careers.
Speaker 2 (25:36):
Yeah, I wonder, like you know, I'm sure there's been
you have an example of a guy coming to you saying, hey, listen, woach,
you guys are paying me a hundred, but I just
cooked this guy both both times in our conference play
and he's getting Look, he's making three hundred fifty thousand.
I need a raise or I'm out. I don't know
how if you've dealt with that, or how do you
deal with guys floating fake numbers, which is what agents
love to do to drive up their value. And their client.
(25:58):
I don't know, like, is that happening yet or can
you talk about that?
Speaker 1 (26:02):
No?
Speaker 3 (26:02):
I you know, I've only been obviously, I've only been
here since September. We haven't gotten through that cycle yet.
But I would tell you what I and again, it's
why I love the group we have is they've been
really focused on you know, playing, going to school, the
job at hand. We'll get to that stuff, and I'm
always talking to them and their families about what it
(26:25):
might look like and you know, making sure that we're
doing everything we can for them to maximize their experience here.
And there's lots of factors that might lead someone to leave.
It's not always money. It might be role or playing time,
or geography or.
Speaker 4 (26:43):
Whatever it is. But I've never I've not had.
Speaker 3 (26:46):
A I've not had a player or a family come
to me and said, hey, I had a good game.
Speaker 4 (26:52):
I'd like to pay raise. I've heard of it.
Speaker 3 (26:54):
Happening somewhere, yes, and I think it other places certainly.
And that's why I've really enjoyed being around our group.
Speaker 4 (27:02):
And we'll do the best we can.
Speaker 3 (27:03):
And I'm going to be you know, we're going to
be aggressive, and we are aggressive and raising that money
in nil and we're going to offer what we can
and hope that playing for a winning program at a
great university in a really good league and a really
fun place to play college basketball. Our place the one
thing I always suspected, and I know it by being
(27:26):
here every day. You know our place is for gym rats.
Speaker 4 (27:30):
Our place.
Speaker 3 (27:31):
The guys we win with and who have success the
same Bonaventure are the guys who want to be in
the gym. They go to class and they do their
work and they want to be.
Speaker 4 (27:40):
In the gym. And I love coming back.
Speaker 3 (27:42):
I'll come back to my office at nine or ten
at night, and I see guys after they had you know,
morning skills session, a practice study hall, and they're back
in the arena, shooting back in our facility late at night.
And you know enough about only in New York to
know there's not a lot of distractions here, Jason, there's
(28:03):
not a lot of nightlife. And so the guys who
are going to do well here are the guys who
want to be in the gym. And if you want
a bunch of other things, we're probably not the place
for you.
Speaker 4 (28:14):
So we have to find those guys and then we got.
Speaker 2 (28:17):
To keep them. I'm sure a lot of people are like,
where the heck is Saint Bonaventure. I looked on a map.
You guys are what like ninety minutes south of Buffalo.
Speaker 4 (28:24):
That's right, Yep, we south right near the Pennsylvania border,
south of Buffalo.
Speaker 2 (28:29):
How the heck did you convince your your family, Hey,
we're moving only in New York? Like, is that a
tough sell?
Speaker 3 (28:35):
Well, the good news is my wife. I met my
wife at Saint Bonaventure. If she had gone to college
anywhere else in the world, this probably would have been
a different probably it was probably would have been a
different conversation. But she's been super supportive with this and
loves the place like I love it.
Speaker 4 (28:53):
And we have a lot of friends here.
Speaker 3 (28:54):
And we're still in Jersey a little bit, you know,
back and forth, and you know, maybe in the summer
when the portals closed and we're just got.
Speaker 2 (29:04):
Yeah, like it's open twenty four to seven.
Speaker 4 (29:06):
Yeah, but this is a twelve month of year job.
It is.
Speaker 3 (29:09):
But you know this is also we're in the middle
of the season right now. We've got recruiting going on,
we're raising money. You know, we got a big game
Saturday against Fordham at home, and so but uh, we've
had a blast. It's it's fun for us to be back.
I'm you know, I'm in a room downstairs at our
Riley Center. You know the student newspaper where I met
(29:30):
my wife was just is just down the hall and
around the corner. So it's it's been a lot of fun.
Speaker 2 (29:36):
Let me ask one more. So you know, listen, you
know I love hoops. I'm in the gym all the time.
You don't care. But we got a men's league game
tonight against Timofay Moscow and we got a great team.
Speaker 4 (29:45):
But do you really I'm really playing Moscow.
Speaker 2 (29:47):
Yeah, we've usually beat him, but uh, he's got a
really good team this year. Point guard from USC Ethan Anderson.
I don't know if you know the name, played at
Wyoming Pepperdine. Young guys. But uh, the interesting thing is
a lot of these college basketball players, let's be real, well,
a lot of them are not going to go to
the NBA. Some will probably go international. But for a
lot of these guys, this is their chance to make
big money or you know, one hundred and fifty thousand
(30:09):
whatever it is before they get a real job at enterprise,
rent a car, or you know whatever an accounting firm is.
And it's like, it's I understand why some of them
would be kind of sort of chasing money if basketball
isn't their future and this could be a bigger payday
than their first job. Have you had any of those
types of discussions with either players or agents.
Speaker 3 (30:29):
No, it's a great point, Jason, And I mean, come on,
do the math.
Speaker 4 (30:33):
Look at the draft. You know how many American college
players are in the draft every year? The number is
probably dwindling, right, is it thirty is a thirty five?
Is it thirty eight?
Speaker 3 (30:43):
But players are coming from all over the world. Some
are coming from college and you're also seeing more European
players or international players because of the nil who might
have stayed and played for a club team in Europe.
They can make more as a frontline player, frontline starter
in college basketball. And so to me, that's a big
part of my responsibility. Our responsibility is I want to educate.
(31:06):
You know, at some point this season, I'll have Bobby
I want to get Bobby Marks in front of our guys,
probably after the season, and explain to guys what's a
what's an Exhibit ten deal. What's a summer league contracts?
Speaker 4 (31:20):
What is a G league? What's a G league contract?
How do you progress?
Speaker 3 (31:24):
I know everybody thinks about the first round or the
second round.
Speaker 4 (31:28):
There's lots of ways.
Speaker 3 (31:30):
Most guys listen, it's a very small number that are
going to be drafted, but there's plenty of ways. And
then the other factor, and I'll bring these guys through
and we talk about this, how do you build a
European career? How do you go about doing that? And
I think there's also going to be a realization for
a lot of guys that the money they're making in
(31:54):
nil at the college level, they're not going to just
start at that number. This For most many guys, it
will be the most they ever make. And are we
preparing them with financial literacy? Are we preparing them to
you have a right to do whatever you want with
the money that you earn. To you have a right
to do whatever you want with it. But I think
(32:14):
we have a responsibility to make sure that we expose
them to.
Speaker 4 (32:21):
Again.
Speaker 3 (32:22):
You know, we'll provide tax services for them so they
understand the tax and implications of earning and same with
their families and make sure everybody. It's a new frontier.
But to sit around and say, I always tell guys,
and we've had NBA players at Bonavento. I had great
relationships with Andrew Nicholson and Jayleen Custins who came through
(32:42):
and went to the NBA. If you're good enough, I
can help you. If you're good enough, I will make
sure people know what they need to know about you
and get you access. But if you're not good enough,
I can't help you. There's no magic dust. I'm gonna sprinkle.
But there are so many But I think we have
to also temper expectations about you can make a great
(33:04):
living playing basketball all over the world. There isn't just
the NBA, and you need to have the mindset and
the understanding and how to choose an agent and make
sure that you know it's somebody who has a track
record and who can show you, Hey, I've had success
with similar players than you. And we sort of have
this new agent space with Nil and it's great. There's
(33:26):
a lot like guys. I think it's great guys have
representation and help. These are significant financial deals. Yeah, I
don't do those things alone. You don't do those things alone.
Jason why should they do those things? But you know,
what you want to make sure is that you help
they find people who have track records, who have credibility,
who can help them maximize the money and then maximize
(33:49):
their career. And so for me at Bonaventure, you know,
those are all things that I try to help our
guys with as much or as little as they and
their families might want, you know, and bring in people
who can help them and expose them to people who
can help them answer those questions.
Speaker 2 (34:08):
And last one, uh, last question, So staff building. I'm
fascinated by this because it sounds like you have an
analytics guy on staff. I'm just curious how you built
out your staff because listen, well, let's be real, kind
of tough to lure people to only in New York,
especially if they're you know, in their late twenties, like
it's a town of two thousand people Like you said.
Speaker 3 (34:26):
Yeah, I've not lured anybody to only in to work
for me. I don't have a budget for that. But
what we do have, and we're sort of getting it
off the ground, is you know an individual who lives
outside of this area, who has a great passion in
this great knowledge great basketball pedigree who's helping me from
afar And then you know, one thing we're starting to
(34:48):
do is you know, integrating our student at Saint BONAMTCH
or the Sports Analytics Club and letting those guys loose
on data and so they've we've got a great professor
or who runs that and so you know, we subscribe
to different services that help us with different data, different databases,
(35:09):
and so that is not my expert area of expertise.
What I think I can be helpful with is using
my relationships to bring potential players into the mix. And
then ultimately, again we've got to make decisions. Again, it's
not pro sports. You don't draft them. You got to
(35:30):
convince them to come. The money's got to work, it's
got to be a fit.
Speaker 4 (35:34):
And so.
Speaker 3 (35:36):
But that's what I'm trying to do or surround myself
with people who know, I know what my blind spots
are in this, and there's a lot of them coming in.
But I do have great enthusiasm. I believe in this
place and I have found in my time in doing this,
there are a lot of people who want to help
Saint Bonaventure basketball. A lot of folks who I've had
relationships with for a very long time. Who who who
(36:00):
you know, know our head coach and know the kind
of program we have and see the value that.
Speaker 4 (36:06):
Players get here.
Speaker 3 (36:07):
You look at our team this year and so many
guys who came in here or developed in our program
we're just have increased their value and their productivity and
their efficiency as players. And then you try to sell
that to the next group.
Speaker 2 (36:21):
Yeah, it's it's very fun and exciting. Adrian Woljerowski, amazing stuff.
What a career. You know, this guy helped me get
my feet wet in Jersey. Help introduce me to my agent.
Like I listen, man, I've known you forever. A great guy.
Congrats on all your success and keep up the good work.
Speaker 1 (36:36):
Man.
Speaker 4 (36:37):
Well proud of you. Jason.
Speaker 3 (36:39):
Still love watching you and it's it was fun to
be on and and and talk through some of the
stuff with you.
This is Straight Fire with Jason McIntyre.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
What is up, straight Ram. It's me Jason McIntyre Straight
Fire for Friday, January thirty. First, Oh, we have a
spectacular guest today on the podcast. I know you're here
usually for my hot takes, but I'm just telling you this.
Today's guest, Adrian Wojnarowski, one of the foremost journalists in America,
left for a new job. He is now the GM
(00:33):
of the Saint Bonaventure Bonnies, the basketball team in the
A ten. It is an incredible turn of events for Woj.
He's been there about six months and I've known him
for a good twenty issuyears. So I hit him up.
I was like, bold, I want to go. I think
the audience wants to hear about this. A lot of
people are like, oh, nil is ruining college basketball. It's
(00:54):
also creating a ton of new jobs this GM job
that Woj got. There are now agents representing college athletes
for name, image and likeness, like it is awesome. I
love this interview where we talked Thursday afternoon. It was spectacular.
I think you guys are really gonna like it. Outside
the box stuff. It's illuminating to say the least. I
(01:16):
will just add one other thing. I am in a
weird spot where I'm working at the FS one and
a lot of people write about our show, and some
people write about the future of our show. This is
my favorite part about it. Okay, So I have been
at Fox eight and a half years, almost nine years,
(01:39):
and it is always strange when people write about your
place of employment and some of the stuff you didn't know,
some of the stuff you did. But it's always weird
to read about it from an outsider perspective. And obviously
this week there was big news and I have been
besieged in the last forty eight hours with some texts
(02:02):
but mostly dms online Dude, are you moving to Chicago?
Speaker 1 (02:07):
Is the show moving?
Speaker 2 (02:08):
What's going on? Because people read stuff and then you
know Colin address sub of it on his podcast. And
my favorite part of all this is back when I
was a journalist, when you hear a story about a story,
you reach out to parties involved, Right, Hey, I heard
you might be transferring. Hey I heard you are gonna
(02:32):
sign as a free agent with X team. Like you
would call the agent, the athlete, reach out to the
person involved and try to find out and it is
just hilarious to me that I haven't heard from anyone
in the media, but I hear from people who know me, dude,
are you moving who don't write about the media. They're
just asking me as kind of quasi friends, or they
(02:53):
know they know me and live near me or whatever
it is. And it's just so funny for people to
speculate reach I would never respond to them. If they
did reach out to me, I'd be like, yeah, I'm
not gonna I can't go there. Sorry, Bud, thanks for
reaching out. But that's the thing people are writing about
it is if they know stuff or they're plugged in,
but they're not even reaching out to attempt to find
(03:14):
out the truth. Like I would respect people more if
they were like, Hey, j Mac, I gotta ask you know,
I'm writing about this. Are you going? I sorry, I
can't comment, you know. And that happens sometimes, but on
this one this week, not one person has reached out,
but everybody's writing as if they know. And that's how
you know. People are just chasing algorithms and clicks because
it's in the news. I have no clue what's gonna happen, Okay,
(03:37):
I I don't know. I really like life out here
on the West Coast. If you watch the herd closely.
Colin and I have been joking about this for months.
You gotta read between the tea leaves and listen closely.
But yeah, that's all I'll say about that, and let's
get to the main event. Adrian wol j Darowski GM
(03:59):
of the Saint Bonaventure basketball program.
Speaker 1 (04:02):
Fox Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in
the nation. Catch all of our shows at foxsports Radio
dot com and within the iHeartRadio app. Search FSR to
listen live. You know, Jason likes to think he knows
everything when it comes to sports.
Speaker 2 (04:20):
I know what sports fans want, but for.
Speaker 1 (04:23):
Everything he doesn't. He knows a guy who does.
Speaker 3 (04:26):
Let's just say I know a guy who knows a
guy who knows another guy.
Speaker 2 (04:31):
All right, let's welcome into straight fire. Come on, you
guys know him. He doesn't even need an introduction. I've
known this guy probably close to twenty five years now.
One of my first jobs out of college, we were
working kind of in the same shop, and man, I
learned more from that guy in two years than I
learned in newspapers and five or six. Adrian Wojnarowski, the
GM of Saint Bonaventure Basketball. Woj how are you, man, Jason?
Speaker 4 (04:55):
I'm great? Are Yeah.
Speaker 3 (04:56):
We are a long way from the record hack Andsack,
New Jersey. Our offices on the old offices on River Street,
they're not even I don't believe they're there anymore.
Speaker 4 (05:05):
Jason.
Speaker 2 (05:05):
Wow, Hey, it's been a minute, man, it has been
a while. And congrats, you know, I it's so random.
I saw woje out here in California crossing the street.
Speaker 4 (05:13):
I was like, what are you doing?
Speaker 2 (05:15):
And uh, you know, hey man, you've you've had a
busy six months. Shall we say, how's the job going.
Speaker 4 (05:21):
It's great.
Speaker 3 (05:21):
I really jump out of bed every day looking forward
to the challenge of this.
Speaker 4 (05:27):
Every day is a little bit different.
Speaker 3 (05:29):
You're doing a lot of the you know, same pursuits
of recruiting nil you know, trying to help our players
and their families with things that you know can be
helpful to them, and you know, getting out and telling
the story of Saint Bonaventure basketball, Saint Bonaventure University. We
had some good wins this season, just you know, be
(05:49):
dating at home the other night, be the VCU at
home beat Providence on a neutral court. So you know,
we we We've got some great wins this year and
really great group of players. That's been my favorite part
of this, Jason, is being around our players their families,
you know, and trying to help where I can help.
And it's it's been a lot of fun. It's it's
(06:12):
really been everything I hoped in more.
Speaker 2 (06:15):
I think when the news first broke wog Is leaving
ESPN and being the number one NBA reporter on the
planet to go to Saint bonavent Or, people were dubious, like,
I'll wait a minute, was or scandal because it's a
weird time in college basketball, woage where you've got all
these old great coaches kind of leaving the sport. The
guy at Virginia recently left right before the season, you know,
(06:35):
and here you are running into it. I mean, your
job GM did not exist in college basketball what like
four years ago, maybe even less.
Speaker 3 (06:43):
No, And I think it's you know, what's made these
jobs necessary or certainly really helpful at places both football
and especially especially football and basketball is the portal and
nil because we have perpetual free agency. Everybody can leave
(07:03):
essentially after every year, and we have money that needs
to be raised and essentially salary caps that have to
be managed, and you're working on retention every day and
that's part of you know, to me, our most important
recruiting is our own players and showing them, you know,
all the opportunities and hopefully they're having a great experience here,
(07:26):
but also understanding at the end of each year there
are opportunities too that can be really tempting for guys.
The money is significant, you know, not just across the landscape,
but in the Atlantic ten in our league, and so
you know, that's our.
Speaker 4 (07:42):
Fight every day.
Speaker 3 (07:43):
But certainly, you know, as I dig in on basketball,
I do marvel at football and I watch, you know,
you kind of watch the you know that I try
to read and listen to what's going on at Carolina
with Bill Belichick and Mike Lombardi. And it's fascinating in football,
you know, because you need so many more guys. Obviously
they have stabs and it's different.
Speaker 4 (08:06):
You know, we're.
Speaker 3 (08:07):
Still you know, it's still you put a basketball team together,
you're trying to get five guys and obviously you want
to bench and you need to protect against injuries and
and all the things.
Speaker 4 (08:17):
But it's it's fun. It's like putting a puzzle together.
Speaker 3 (08:21):
And you know, I come into this pretty humble about
I've got a lot to learn and trying to lean
on people a lot smarter than me, whether it's our
coaching staff and understanding with our staff about you know,
what we value in players, and you know, you look
at analytics and certain data about things that we value
(08:43):
that somebody else may not value as much, vice versa.
And so that part of it's been a lot of fun.
And but a lot of it, Jason is I've spent
the last thirty five years talking to players every day,
coaches every day, agents every day, and you're still doing that,
but you're having different conversations.
Speaker 2 (09:04):
Yeah. Yeah, it sounds like you guys, And listen, I
did look up some stuff. It seems like the SEC
spent on average thirteen million dollars in the NIL and
Big ten was about ten mil. I don't know if
these are updated, but it was from chat GBT, which
is obviously never wrong. And you guys have to do
it on a moneyball, like a bit of a shoe
string budget, you know, like if you want Joe Schmo
(09:25):
and Kansas is coming after him, like that's a that's
a tough one for you guys. But I'm curious, like
this moneyball aspect, how much fun is it because it
just seems like that one of the best jobs that
you could imagine.
Speaker 3 (09:36):
Yeah, I think, you know, for us, you've got a
zero win on places that who you are as a school,
who Saint Bonaventure is, and what our identity is. Embrace
it and find people who this appeals to. And it's
not going to be everybody. Yeah, but you know, I
think on a couple of levels right where we might
be your first stop on the way somewhere else, we
(09:59):
might be the place you you have to come to
get the basketball.
Speaker 4 (10:01):
Right.
Speaker 3 (10:02):
We have a Hall of Fame coach and Mark Schremidi
just won his four hundred game as a Division one coach.
He's one of the all time winning his coaches in
Atlantic ten history. You know, he's behind you know, the
likes of John Cheney and you know, legendary figures like that.
And we have a great league in the Atlantic Ten,
playing against the Vcus and the Daytons. You're in the
major media markets, you're on television, you know, you know,
(10:26):
we had a first round pick in our league last
year we've had first round picks at Saint Bonaventure, And
so you find guys and families who value the whole
picture of that. Like Jason, we're not winning bidding wars,
and if it's just about money, I'm going to be
out of it pretty We're going to be out of
it pretty quick and move on. But what I have
found and where, especially with our the group we have here,
(10:48):
you know they value We have families who value the
bigger picture of you know, playing big time basketball. But
at a school that has two thousand students, there's nobody
quite like us in Division one. There's other school that
have two thousand students, but they're not trying to play
basketball and sports in the Atlantic ten. And so certainly
you do the math. We have fewer students, we have
(11:08):
fewer alumni, we have fewer people to draw from to
raise money versus some of the schools I just mentioned,
and so you're gonna have to do more with less.
We've had a coach who's done that over a very
long period of time.
Speaker 4 (11:20):
And my job people here GM, and they.
Speaker 3 (11:24):
Think of pro sports. I think of the NFL, NBA.
The GM is in charge. I'm not in charge of anything.
I'm in charge of bringing to our coaches and our
staff options and saying, hey, here's through my relationships old
and new. You know, here are potential players internationally, potential
porter players, portal, junior college, Division two high school, obviously,
(11:50):
all the different places that you know you would draw from,
and let's dig in on the let's dig in on
tape on them, let's dig in on the data, and
then let's see who we really want to focus in
on in our recruiting. You know, it's not like I
talked to NBA guys and I had a long talk
with a GM today about is I'm trying to Analytics
(12:11):
was a blind spot for me. This is not something
I have a strengthen. But I think I've helped to
surround myself with people who do, who are helping us.
And you know, we're not trying to cover the an
NBA team can draft from any where they want, Like,
if there's a player out there, they can draft them,
they can get them, maybe they can trade for them.
Once he's in the NBA, we have to be able
(12:33):
to recruit them. And so what I'm trying to do
is let's build out a database of people places where
we have great relationships, where there's geographic fits, and where
there's you know, again, like I said, maybe we're the
first stop on the way somewhere else. Maybe you're going
to come and play four years here. Maybe we're the
place where you where you went to the big time program.
(12:55):
You picked geography, you picked weather, you picked nil, they
were all bigger factors. Didn't go great, it didn't go
how you hoped it would. We're the place to come
to fix that, and you see the we play for
a great coach here. Hopefully I can be helpful with
players with NBA opportunities, other professional opportunities, you know, get
(13:20):
guys in the gym with NBA players in the summer,
have NBA guys coming through our campus. Maybe do a
pro day here next year based on what our roster
looks like. So we have a lot to sell and
you've got to you got to drill in and find
the guys who.
Speaker 4 (13:40):
Our story is compelling to.
Speaker 3 (13:42):
It's not going to be for everyone, but the good
news is we just need five of them on the floor.
Speaker 4 (13:47):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
Now, So I'm part of a Mexican soccer team ownership
group with a guy you may know, former NBA agent
Sam Porter. And one of the challenges is, you know,
you got to coach every different two or three years.
He's got a different system he wants to run. You
don't have the players for that system, so then you've
got to go find a couple new guys. But with
you guys having Schmidt there forever, you kind of know
what he wants, what his system is. Is that a
(14:09):
huge advantage when it comes to the portal, Like you
can see a guy popping at Wagner and then hey,
that's a great fit for us, Let's bring him in.
Is it make it a lot easier?
Speaker 4 (14:16):
No, it's a great point, Jason.
Speaker 3 (14:18):
And not only do we know what a Mark Schmidt
player looks like and plays like in the Tangibles and
the Intangibles, people out there who we would be recruiting
with recruiting from they also know. So you'll you'll have
people come to you and say, hey, I got a
Bondi player for you, and we kind of know what
(14:38):
that is. That doesn't mean you know, what's great about
coach Schmid is his ability to adjust and adjust to
the personnel. It's not just hey, you're going to fit
into the system. You're going to adjust to your best players.
But our group typically like we're going to defend, we're
going to rebound, you know. And so you know we've
(15:04):
had we've won in lots of different ways here under
Coach Schmidt, and you know, the hard part is especially
a program like ours, where you know, we had a
run of eight straight years essentially of first team All
Atlantic ten guard play Jalen Adams to Kyle often where
they became starters as freshmen, they were four year starters.
Speaker 4 (15:24):
They got us to the nca tournament.
Speaker 3 (15:25):
We won a lot that it's harder to imagine you're
probably going to have a four year starter at point
guard now, so you're turning it over faster. And so
that's certainly a challenge for the staff, but it's everybody's.
It's everybody's challenge. And you know that's for me, is
I believe in this place. I believe in Saint Bonaventure
(15:46):
that the university was transformational in my life and I
think for a lot of young people it can still
be a transformational place. And our woman's coach, Jim Crowley
said this to me and it stays with me. He said, listen,
you come to our place and you get on campus
and you either feel it or you don't, and if
you feel it, it stays with you the rest of
your life. And I see we're bringing back twenty fifth
(16:09):
anniversary team that went to the NCAAs in two thousand
and took Kentucky to double overtime. You know, the entire
team's coming back, and they're coming from all over the world,
and how much this.
Speaker 4 (16:20):
Place means to them.
Speaker 3 (16:22):
And I really feel like when we're out recruiting, even
in this age of the portal, we're selling a forty
year relationship.
Speaker 4 (16:28):
I want so much for our current.
Speaker 3 (16:30):
Players to see the relationships that this team has from
twenty five years ago, to see them come back to campus,
how close they still are, how they're all still on.
Speaker 4 (16:40):
A text chain.
Speaker 3 (16:41):
We had a team from the late sixties that was
back earlier this season. I mean, these guys are in
their seventies early eighties and they're still really close. And
so for us, it's great for our players at a
time when again they can move around, some have moved,
some may move again, but that they can look and
say maybe say, hey, I'd like to have that twenty
(17:03):
five years from now or fifty years from now. And
I do wonder sometimes in this portal age, if you
go to three schools, do you really have one you
can go back to? Do you really have one that
you can call home? And again, that doesn't have to
be important for everybody, but for some kids it will be.
And we got to find those guys.
Speaker 2 (17:22):
Let me ask you. You mentioned a freshman staying four years.
It's tough for high school kids now, woh, Like, it's like,
why would I take an eighteen or nineteen year old
when I could get a twenty two year old who's
been a starter for three years? You know, like, it's
just it's difficult. How do you guys manage bringing in
young guys who would stay with the program versus hitting
the portal and getting high impact fifteen pointy game guys.
Speaker 4 (17:44):
Yeah, there's no question, Jason.
Speaker 3 (17:45):
And with the junior college with a lawsuit with the
Vanderbilt quarterback that changed the junior college eligibility. Now you know,
players who we thought were out of eligibility after this
year have one.
Speaker 4 (17:57):
They might have two more.
Speaker 3 (17:58):
Years of eligibility based on how your junior college years
are judged. And so you know you're going to have
because of the COVID, we had the twenty four to
twenty five year olds. Now with the j C rule,
you know again, and there's a big difference having a
twenty four year old point guard playing an eighteen year
old point guard. You look at our league, there's young
(18:19):
guys who play, and we have Xander Wedlow, who's a
freshman center from Detroit who's in our rotation and playing
is going to be terrific. Typically it is older players
and you are winning, and the portal is important, and
high schools in many cases a little more of a
developmental route now and you're seeing maybe high school players
(18:40):
who might have come in at the Atlantic ten level,
maybe they're coming into college basketball at what might be
perceived as a level below. But I do think what
you see is if you're a player and you produce
at what's you know, a low major, or you produce
in Division two, there's going to be opportunities.
Speaker 4 (18:57):
To move up.
Speaker 3 (18:57):
I think you look back a lot of like, look
at the Division two upperclassmen now who are out there,
many of whom kind of came through in COVID. And
there probably were some recruiting mistakes made during COVID because
people couldn't get out and evaluate, and so there are
no I mean, look at Drake this season with four
(19:19):
Division two players in their lineup. You better, to me,
you better be really digging in in the Division two,
Division three level for US Canada. You know, Toronto's three
hours away. That's a very important market for US, and
so there's players everywhere. And you're right about though, Jason older.
I think a lot of people probably feel older is better.
Speaker 2 (19:42):
Yeah, let me ask about it. Sounds like you're you
have to divide your time some high school. You got
to monitor high school, you got to monitor JUCO. You've
also got to monitor Division IE potential portal guys. I
don't know, I did see that. You know, the Patriot
League and the IVY League, they're struggling with the idea
of paying kids. Nil Yale lost a bunch of dudes.
(20:02):
How do you handle like just drumming up money and
how to handle and divide it among whether it's a
JUCO a d one high school kid.
Speaker 3 (20:09):
Yeah, that's that's the challenge, and I think I think
everybody's grappling with that of of you know, in the pros,
there's a salary cap and you you have an owner
who even if you're the even if you're the lowest
spending team in the NBA, if you have a great player,
you're going to pay them a max deal to keep them.
Speaker 4 (20:30):
Right like you.
Speaker 3 (20:32):
It's different at this level, right, we don't have a
quote unquote owner. We don't have a billionaire who's funding it.
You're raising it as you go and the generosity of
your alums and donors. And then there's a lot of
business partnerships that I spend you know, a great deal
of time on where you know, where you bring business
to partners you have and you get essentially a commission
(20:54):
back at those I spend a lot of time with
those kind of fundraising efforts where you kind of get
this passive income that you can count on over time.
That's going to be the key of it, the donor model,
especially to smaller school you can't just keep going to
the same people over and over. You've got to find
new revenue streams. You've got to find marketing deals for
(21:17):
your players. And so while we're recruiting players, I'm also
going to companies and you know, national brands and be
able to get potential nil deals that you know, play
a particular player might appeal to that company and calling on.
Speaker 4 (21:35):
Relationships you've had through the year.
Speaker 3 (21:37):
So you're spending your time on all of that, and
you know, if schools are going to opt if schools
are going to opt in, if the house settlement is
going to go through, and the schools in the instant,
the leagues that have forty and fifty million dollar a
year television deals, who can fund fully fund you know
that twenty plus million dollar revenue sharing. I mean, that's
(22:02):
not that's not how it looks at Saint Bonaventure, That's
not how.
Speaker 4 (22:06):
It looks with some of the schools in our league.
But there's no question there are schools in our league that.
Speaker 3 (22:11):
You know, are are going to be really aggressive with
rev with essentially player salaries if we you know, if
that all goes through. So you know, that's where I
spend my days on are trying to close the gaps
on that, and then we've got to be.
Speaker 4 (22:27):
Smart with our money. We've got to make good decisions.
Speaker 3 (22:30):
And again it goes back to having a great, great
coach at Mark Schmid, who's a great equalizer for us.
And I know spending the most money doesn't guarantee.
Speaker 4 (22:42):
You're gonna win. But if you're at the bottom, pretty
good chance you're not. Right.
Speaker 1 (22:48):
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Speaker 2 (23:00):
I wanted to ask those So you used to cover,
You've done a lot of college, and I mean even
when I was covering high school, you knew the lay
of the land. I'm just curious. It used to be
called boosters and now it's like collective. It just sounds
a little more classy and upscale. Is it the same
way you're you know, listen, there were some street agent
kind of guys back in the day. Is it similar
(23:22):
or is it the behind the scenes stuff cleaned up
a little bit?
Speaker 3 (23:26):
Yeah, Like the players can have representatives and and I
like that part of it. I would rather typically deal
with an agent. I'd rather probably prefer to have our collective.
When I worked with our collective, and dealing with a
representative who's negotiated deals, who understands the marketplace, I think
(23:48):
that's I like operating that way.
Speaker 4 (23:51):
And so having had a lot of those relationships through
the years, and then you know, you're building.
Speaker 3 (23:56):
There's a new group of younger like in a lot
of cases, younger agents now who have really been aggressive
and smart in the NIL area with both basketball football
and getting to know them and you know, trying to
get a sense of what a marketplace looks like and
being prepared for when that portal opens that you know who,
(24:17):
be prepared for who may be available, and where the
price points are going to be and where the value
is and if you you know, you spend a little
more at this position, you might have a little less
to spend here. And so those are all the decisions
you're making, and you're moving pretty fast. And so the
goal is to not have dramatic roster.
Speaker 4 (24:35):
Turnover every year. You want to be able to keep
guys you can do a great job.
Speaker 3 (24:42):
You know, the money elsewhere can be massive, And I'm
never going to tell a young kid in a family
that they shouldn't take a life changing opportunity. I'll make
the case for what we have and who we are
and the opportunities that come with being at Saint Bonaventure,
but I I'll readily tell our guys, hey listen, and
there's probably going to be more out there for you.
Somewhere else, but there's also a long play here with us.
Speaker 4 (25:07):
And the opportunities that are here.
Speaker 3 (25:09):
And it's gratifying when guys feel it and they stay
and they want to be a part of it. And
when you have guys who believe in your place and fit,
you just want to do everything you can to keep
them because that's who you win, that's who you win with,
and that's who you feel good about winning with.
Speaker 4 (25:25):
We just have such a great.
Speaker 3 (25:26):
Group of young guys that, you know, for me, I
feel a pressure to do right by them and help them,
not just while they're at Bonaventure, but to be able
to help them, you know, in their careers.
Speaker 2 (25:36):
Yeah, I wonder, like you know, I'm sure there's been
you have an example of a guy coming to you saying, hey, listen, woach,
you guys are paying me a hundred, but I just
cooked this guy both both times in our conference play
and he's getting Look, he's making three hundred fifty thousand.
I need a raise or I'm out. I don't know
how if you've dealt with that, or how do you
deal with guys floating fake numbers, which is what agents
love to do to drive up their value. And their client.
(25:58):
I don't know, like, is that happening yet or can
you talk about that?
Speaker 1 (26:02):
No?
Speaker 3 (26:02):
I you know, I've only been obviously, I've only been
here since September. We haven't gotten through that cycle yet.
But I would tell you what I and again, it's
why I love the group we have is they've been
really focused on you know, playing, going to school, the
job at hand. We'll get to that stuff, and I'm
always talking to them and their families about what it
(26:25):
might look like and you know, making sure that we're
doing everything we can for them to maximize their experience here.
And there's lots of factors that might lead someone to leave.
It's not always money. It might be role or playing time,
or geography or.
Speaker 4 (26:43):
Whatever it is. But I've never I've not had.
Speaker 3 (26:46):
A I've not had a player or a family come
to me and said, hey, I had a good game.
Speaker 4 (26:52):
I'd like to pay raise. I've heard of it.
Speaker 3 (26:54):
Happening somewhere, yes, and I think it other places certainly.
And that's why I've really enjoyed being around our group.
Speaker 4 (27:02):
And we'll do the best we can.
Speaker 3 (27:03):
And I'm going to be you know, we're going to
be aggressive, and we are aggressive and raising that money
in nil and we're going to offer what we can
and hope that playing for a winning program at a
great university in a really good league and a really
fun place to play college basketball. Our place the one
thing I always suspected, and I know it by being
(27:26):
here every day. You know our place is for gym rats.
Speaker 4 (27:30):
Our place.
Speaker 3 (27:31):
The guys we win with and who have success the
same Bonaventure are the guys who want to be in
the gym. They go to class and they do their
work and they want to be.
Speaker 4 (27:40):
In the gym. And I love coming back.
Speaker 3 (27:42):
I'll come back to my office at nine or ten
at night, and I see guys after they had you know,
morning skills session, a practice study hall, and they're back
in the arena, shooting back in our facility late at night.
And you know enough about only in New York to
know there's not a lot of distractions here, Jason, there's
(28:03):
not a lot of nightlife. And so the guys who
are going to do well here are the guys who
want to be in the gym. And if you want
a bunch of other things, we're probably not the place
for you.
Speaker 4 (28:14):
So we have to find those guys and then we got.
Speaker 2 (28:17):
To keep them. I'm sure a lot of people are like,
where the heck is Saint Bonaventure. I looked on a map.
You guys are what like ninety minutes south of Buffalo.
Speaker 4 (28:24):
That's right, Yep, we south right near the Pennsylvania border,
south of Buffalo.
Speaker 2 (28:29):
How the heck did you convince your your family, Hey,
we're moving only in New York? Like, is that a
tough sell?
Speaker 3 (28:35):
Well, the good news is my wife. I met my
wife at Saint Bonaventure. If she had gone to college
anywhere else in the world, this probably would have been
a different probably it was probably would have been a
different conversation. But she's been super supportive with this and
loves the place like I love it.
Speaker 4 (28:53):
And we have a lot of friends here.
Speaker 3 (28:54):
And we're still in Jersey a little bit, you know,
back and forth, and you know, maybe in the summer
when the portals closed and we're just got.
Speaker 2 (29:04):
Yeah, like it's open twenty four to seven.
Speaker 4 (29:06):
Yeah, but this is a twelve month of year job.
It is.
Speaker 3 (29:09):
But you know this is also we're in the middle
of the season right now. We've got recruiting going on,
we're raising money. You know, we got a big game
Saturday against Fordham at home, and so but uh, we've
had a blast. It's it's fun for us to be back.
I'm you know, I'm in a room downstairs at our
Riley Center. You know the student newspaper where I met
(29:30):
my wife was just is just down the hall and
around the corner. So it's it's been a lot of fun.
Speaker 2 (29:36):
Let me ask one more. So you know, listen, you
know I love hoops. I'm in the gym all the time.
You don't care. But we got a men's league game
tonight against Timofay Moscow and we got a great team.
Speaker 4 (29:45):
But do you really I'm really playing Moscow.
Speaker 2 (29:47):
Yeah, we've usually beat him, but uh, he's got a
really good team this year. Point guard from USC Ethan Anderson.
I don't know if you know the name, played at
Wyoming Pepperdine. Young guys. But uh, the interesting thing is
a lot of these college basketball players, let's be real, well,
a lot of them are not going to go to
the NBA. Some will probably go international. But for a
lot of these guys, this is their chance to make
big money or you know, one hundred and fifty thousand
(30:09):
whatever it is before they get a real job at enterprise,
rent a car, or you know whatever an accounting firm is.
And it's like, it's I understand why some of them
would be kind of sort of chasing money if basketball
isn't their future and this could be a bigger payday
than their first job. Have you had any of those
types of discussions with either players or agents.
Speaker 3 (30:29):
No, it's a great point, Jason, And I mean, come on,
do the math.
Speaker 4 (30:33):
Look at the draft. You know how many American college
players are in the draft every year? The number is
probably dwindling, right, is it thirty is a thirty five?
Is it thirty eight?
Speaker 3 (30:43):
But players are coming from all over the world. Some
are coming from college and you're also seeing more European
players or international players because of the nil who might
have stayed and played for a club team in Europe.
They can make more as a frontline player, frontline starter
in college basketball. And so to me, that's a big
part of my responsibility. Our responsibility is I want to educate.
(31:06):
You know, at some point this season, I'll have Bobby
I want to get Bobby Marks in front of our guys,
probably after the season, and explain to guys what's a
what's an Exhibit ten deal. What's a summer league contracts?
Speaker 4 (31:20):
What is a G league? What's a G league contract?
How do you progress?
Speaker 3 (31:24):
I know everybody thinks about the first round or the
second round.
Speaker 4 (31:28):
There's lots of ways.
Speaker 3 (31:30):
Most guys listen, it's a very small number that are
going to be drafted, but there's plenty of ways. And
then the other factor, and I'll bring these guys through
and we talk about this, how do you build a
European career? How do you go about doing that? And
I think there's also going to be a realization for
a lot of guys that the money they're making in
(31:54):
nil at the college level, they're not going to just
start at that number. This For most many guys, it
will be the most they ever make. And are we
preparing them with financial literacy? Are we preparing them to
you have a right to do whatever you want with
the money that you earn. To you have a right
to do whatever you want with it. But I think
(32:14):
we have a responsibility to make sure that we expose
them to.
Speaker 4 (32:21):
Again.
Speaker 3 (32:22):
You know, we'll provide tax services for them so they
understand the tax and implications of earning and same with
their families and make sure everybody. It's a new frontier.
But to sit around and say, I always tell guys,
and we've had NBA players at Bonavento. I had great
relationships with Andrew Nicholson and Jayleen Custins who came through
(32:42):
and went to the NBA. If you're good enough, I
can help you. If you're good enough, I will make
sure people know what they need to know about you
and get you access. But if you're not good enough,
I can't help you. There's no magic dust. I'm gonna sprinkle.
But there are so many But I think we have
to also temper expectations about you can make a great
(33:04):
living playing basketball all over the world. There isn't just
the NBA, and you need to have the mindset and
the understanding and how to choose an agent and make
sure that you know it's somebody who has a track
record and who can show you, Hey, I've had success
with similar players than you. And we sort of have
this new agent space with Nil and it's great. There's
(33:26):
a lot like guys. I think it's great guys have
representation and help. These are significant financial deals. Yeah, I
don't do those things alone. You don't do those things alone.
Jason why should they do those things? But you know,
what you want to make sure is that you help
they find people who have track records, who have credibility,
who can help them maximize the money and then maximize
(33:49):
their career. And so for me at Bonaventure, you know,
those are all things that I try to help our
guys with as much or as little as they and
their families might want, you know, and bring in people
who can help them and expose them to people who
can help them answer those questions.
Speaker 2 (34:08):
And last one, uh, last question, So staff building. I'm
fascinated by this because it sounds like you have an
analytics guy on staff. I'm just curious how you built
out your staff because listen, well, let's be real, kind
of tough to lure people to only in New York,
especially if they're you know, in their late twenties, like
it's a town of two thousand people Like you said.
Speaker 3 (34:26):
Yeah, I've not lured anybody to only in to work
for me. I don't have a budget for that. But
what we do have, and we're sort of getting it
off the ground, is you know an individual who lives
outside of this area, who has a great passion in
this great knowledge great basketball pedigree who's helping me from
afar And then you know, one thing we're starting to
(34:48):
do is you know, integrating our student at Saint BONAMTCH
or the Sports Analytics Club and letting those guys loose
on data and so they've we've got a great professor
or who runs that and so you know, we subscribe
to different services that help us with different data, different databases,
(35:09):
and so that is not my expert area of expertise.
What I think I can be helpful with is using
my relationships to bring potential players into the mix. And
then ultimately, again we've got to make decisions. Again, it's
not pro sports. You don't draft them. You got to
(35:30):
convince them to come. The money's got to work, it's
got to be a fit.
Speaker 4 (35:34):
And so.
Speaker 3 (35:36):
But that's what I'm trying to do or surround myself
with people who know, I know what my blind spots
are in this, and there's a lot of them coming in.
But I do have great enthusiasm. I believe in this
place and I have found in my time in doing this,
there are a lot of people who want to help
Saint Bonaventure basketball. A lot of folks who I've had
relationships with for a very long time. Who who who
(36:00):
you know, know our head coach and know the kind
of program we have and see the value that.
Speaker 4 (36:06):
Players get here.
Speaker 3 (36:07):
You look at our team this year and so many
guys who came in here or developed in our program
we're just have increased their value and their productivity and
their efficiency as players. And then you try to sell
that to the next group.
Speaker 2 (36:21):
Yeah, it's it's very fun and exciting. Adrian Woljerowski, amazing stuff.
What a career. You know, this guy helped me get
my feet wet in Jersey. Help introduce me to my agent.
Like I listen, man, I've known you forever. A great guy.
Congrats on all your success and keep up the good work.
Speaker 1 (36:36):
Man.
Speaker 4 (36:37):
Well proud of you. Jason.
Speaker 3 (36:39):
Still love watching you and it's it was fun to
be on and and and talk through some of the
stuff with you.
Host
Jason McIntyre
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