March 1, 2023 • 37 mins
The Book of Joe Podcast begins with hosts Tom Verducci and Joe Maddon seeing Spring Training get underway without Joe in a dugout! Newly retired Dexter Fowler joins us to talk about calling it a career and what's up next. Joe has always loved 'Glue Guys' and Dexter tops that list. Dexter reveals how he started switch hitting at the plate and how he got his 'not to great' break into the Major Leagues. We get 'A Reading from the Book of Joe' with Dexter picking page 24...which centers on Joe's relationship with his manager in college.
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Speaker 1 (00:04):
The Book of Joe Podcast is a production of iHeartRadio.
Hey there, welcome back. It's the latest episode of the
Book of Joe podcast, the most interesting podcast about baseball
and life with my good buddy Joe Madden and Joe. First,
(00:26):
I got to check in on you, make sure you're okay,
because spring training is underway and you are not there
for the first time and I don't know how many years,
how are you doing? It's I think when nineteen eighty
one was the first of my last break before that
was nineteen nineteen eighty, I wasn't there, so seventy six, seven, eight, nine,
(00:49):
eighty off and then eighty one to present tense. Yeah,
I'm here to report I'm okay. Honestly, I played again yesterday,
meaning golf, I'm playing again today. I got to go
to Tampa next week. I get an opportunity to play
in the Valspar Pro Am. Then I got another tournament
at Whisper Rock, Then I got another one out here
with Wally Joyner, and then I eventually do it at
(01:11):
Joe Naman So and in between that, we know, we
did the book signing and Savannah, which was outstanding. It
wasn't just cool, it was outstanding. So I'm like, really busy.
I'm really busy in a good way. So yeah, I'm
watching it, and we did. I did actually tweet about
it the pitch clock. I thought I was watching Bob
Gibson pitch for both sides. It was outstanding. It was
(01:32):
so cool, And like I said, I thought about this
too while I was watching it, like the other stuff. Okay,
so you know, people find it interesting the other rules,
but the one rule that really is participated within every
pitch is that one that rules the most used rule,
new rule that's going to be incorporated into the game,
and I think that's the best one. I think that's
(01:53):
the one that if you're going to attract more youthful
fans or more of a viewing audience, or just want
to come to the ballpark and check it out, that's
the one that's going to work. Going to kind of
dig it. It's awesome. I'm with you. I've been telling
people it's the greatest thing to happen to baseball since
they had nachos and a souvenir batting helmets. And I'm
glad to hear you're doing well, Joe, and we can
(02:16):
ask the same question of Dexter Fowler, who is officially
retired as a player from Major League Baseball after an
outstanding fourteen years in the bigs. Dexter, how are you doing.
I'm doing unbelievable. Honestly, I'm more busy. I'm busier than ever.
(02:37):
And you know, like you said, usually you go to
spring training and it's like, ah, like it's time, that time,
It's that time. But now I'm at home with the girls.
I'm a dance dad, and then I'm also doing some
TV stuff, so I'm getting calls all over the place,
along with some business things going on to four meetings
and all that. So I got a lot going on,
(02:59):
including dinner. The other night, we went out to dinner
up at Scottsdale, add myself, Decks, Eddie Vedder, Josh Cleinghoffer,
Bussy was there, Bussy was there, Sam Kennedy was just
such really fun evening. I got to sit next to
Decks and the moment you walk in the room and
Decks was there, I didn't know. I didn't know he's
gonna be there. He snuck up from behind, and god,
(03:20):
it's just it's just typical. I mean, and I was
gonna bring this up and I bring it up now,
decks lights upper room, and he just does when I
first met him, when we first got together. The smile
began then and it never ends. You can see it
right now. And that's a big part of the reason
why he played as long as he did. Such a
wonderful guy within the clubhouse and on the team. The
players really feed off of his energy, and you can
(03:42):
feed off his energy the other night just having dinner
with him. So it was great to see again, my brother,
It really was. I'm so happy for this new episode.
An adventure in your life. I know you're gonna be
great at it, but I just wanted to throw that
out there a bit too. Oh, I appreciate it. We
had we definitely did. We have fun. We have fun.
It was good. I say, get the band back together.
We remembered this one, some good stories about about those
(04:05):
two years. And yeah, and Joe, Joe was and you know, likewise,
Joe was one of my one of my favorite managers
ever to play for. So well, Joe, can I start
with a question for you, sure, because you know we
love to talk on this show about glue guys, right,
what makes a team a team? Obviously, a manager, head
(04:25):
coach and other sports has a lot to do with that,
but there's nothing like having that come within the player ranks.
And when we talk about glue guys, I have to
imagine that you've got to put Dexter near the top
of your lists of big time glue guys. What was
it about Dexter that made him such a glue guy
besides that smile? Yeah, regardless regardless of what was going on,
(04:48):
Like he had a good day, a bad day. I
mean he like he had he had a great run
during that year, but also he went into a little
bit of a slump. But the thing is, you never
know when he showed up at the ballpark. He was
always the same cat every day. So you know what
to expect. You know what you could count on as
a manager, and then as a teammate. I mean, some
guys are walking in the room surly and they don't
want to give. They don't want to they just want
(05:09):
to take all the time. They don't want to give.
But dex is the kind of guy that wants to
give all the time. And he's there like he'll he'll
sense that somebody else isn't doing so well. And in
spite of the fact maybe he's running through a bad moment,
he's still going to give to that guy and to
be that's really probably the best definition I can give
you of a leader is that he recognizes and gives
to everybody else in the room, and he's not always
(05:29):
seeking to be to get things from other people. Dex
is a giver and every player in that room felt it.
I appreciate it. And where does that come from, dex U.
I had to be my parents. They still keep me humble,
They humble me all the time. So I think that's
half of it. And at the end of the day,
like like Joe said, I feed off energy, and I
(05:50):
don't want anybody to have any type of ill energy
because I feel like a lot of people, you know,
in this game, like we're around each other all the time,
and we all need to be on the same page
at all. At the same time, it's crazy. It's crazy
to see a guy come in because I feel like
I've gone through a lot of this, a lot of
these things, and sometimes you get caught up in baseball
(06:12):
and baseball only and you people don't realize that we're
here at the end of the day, right and we're
going to excel. Like the best thing ever was Joe said, Hey,
if you feel good in it, where it? Remember and
that right there, like be comfortable in your own skin,
be able to come in. I think you'll have more
success if you come in and you're comfortable where you're at,
(06:36):
whether whether you're having a good day a bad day.
There's always guys. There should be your brothers there to
pick pick guys up and keep guys, hold guys accountable. Yeah,
there's a if you think you look hot, where it.
I mean, if the big thing for me was about
this is one of my tenants too, is that the
more freedom given, the greater respect and discipline returned. I mean,
I'm speaking to myself too, as as a young player
(06:58):
back in the day where there was football or baseball,
primarily the coaches that really permitted me to be myself
in a sense, and we're there to help when I
absolutely need it to help it. Otherwise, they permitted me
to make mistakes or they permitted me to do something
good without a whole lot of interference, and that's how
you grow, and that's it. I mean, I think as
an athlete, as a world class athlete, which all Music
(07:19):
League baseball players are. The more they are feel they
are able to express themselves and be themselves, then you
will find all of their abilities on the field at
any particular moment. The moment you feel constricted and you're
being controlled in a sense, then you're not going to
see the full impact of that particular player. Talking into baseball,
(07:40):
I think I could talk about the corporate world also,
but this is something I learned way back in the day,
whether it was high school than going to college and
talk about Coach Route in the Book of Joey was
my backfield coach at Lawfiette. This guy taught me how
to accept or teach through communication and non intimidation, And
to me, that's the best way to go about being
a teacher. Yeah, that goes a long way. It does
(08:01):
go a long way, especially you know you are the helm,
but you know as a player, he's spot on. I mean,
you respond better when guys are comfortable in their own skin.
So dexon. We and they will talk for years about
that sixteen team in Chicago. We know about the championships,
we can watch the highlights. What's kind of in your
heart when you think about how you remember that group
(08:24):
of guys that year twenty sixteen. Honestly, we were all
if we land in a city and you look up,
even in Chicago, we were all together at all times.
It was crazy, like I've never been part of a
team that's always been together, and like we'll go out
to dinner together, everybody's always invited. We'll go over somebody's house,
(08:45):
everybody's invited, whether it's a hotel room. Everybody was together
and everybody was willing to come. There was no really
any clicks, which was great. And then even the guys
who came in, like the Chappies and everybody who came,
you know, to help out, like towards the end of
the year, they were welcome with open arms, like and
they felt comfortable enough to come around and be together
(09:08):
as with us as well. Let me just say something there,
and that's a big part of that. I agree. Um,
when you get when you create, you talk about atmosphere
or you create a culture or whatever. Even though we
didn't have a long time together, we kind of created
a culture. So when somebody walks in the room, acquisitionally
say they walk in the room, and the guys that
have been there are basically in charge of the room,
(09:29):
which I love your your veterans need to run the clubhouse.
But when they walk in there, the guys coming in
will be immediately if they if they want to go
straight stray at all, that's not how we do things here.
These guys will be there. This is how we do
things that they're gonna they're going to make sure that
this thing is going to continue to run smoothly like
it had been running to that particular point. I don't
(09:51):
know that people understand that completely. But when you have
a room running properly and it's being run by your veterans,
if somebody wants to go a little bit sideways on you, uh,
those guys will they'll just get the guy off to decide.
Do it in a professional way. Listen, we don't. We
don't do that here. We do it this way, and
to me, that's the best way and the most successful
(10:12):
way to run a clubhouse. And you teach the young
guys too, like it's it's it doesn't just go with
somebody who comes in a clubhouse, even a guy who
just gets called up and doesn't know right right. You
do it, like like Joe said, we do it in
a respectful way, we're all family in there, and that's
and that's part of it. And you're gonna play a
lot harder for the guy next to you if he
knows that's like, this dude really cares about me. And
(10:34):
that's just human behavior. I mean people, well some people
may not understand that. But when you're with everybody with
each other every day, one hundred and sixty two plus
forty some days in spring training and then the postseason,
that's over two hundred games you could possibly be together
for during the course of the year. It's it's it's
a it's a family man, and you're gonna have your
(10:55):
disagreement arguments, and you're gonna have every wonderful times like
Decks talked about, but there's got to be a structure,
and the structure has to be built among the players
and not by the manager of the coaches. Yeah. I
love it when players are really good, but more importantly,
they're really good guys. And when you have that special
bond and you guys had that with the Cubs group
of yeah, talented players, but really good guys. One of
(11:18):
my favorite stories Decks, it was either fifteen or sixteen, right,
it's probably around August because the school year was starting up,
and you and your wife went in there and you
picked up the tab on family's layaway back to school items.
I just you picked up that tab. I know you
weren't looking forward to get any attention, but that has
(11:39):
always stuck with me. Is man, that's such a cool
thing to do, and you really have to be an
empathetic person to even come up with that kind of idea.
So kudos to you. I'm sure you've done and I
know you have done a lot more than that, but that,
to me was special, was unique and good on you. No,
I appreciate it. And how it came about. My mom
was a teacher, right, so going into and it was
(11:59):
an inner city She taught an inner city school, so
you know, I saw a lot of going in. I
used to speak to her classes and just seeing the
kids that were obviously not as privileged as I was.
And I told myself, I always wanted to help kids,
kids that didn't needed help, right, because sometimes it just
to go to school is just to get away from,
you know, what they've been going through. You know, some
(12:21):
kids just go there even to get a meal, right.
So that's how that all came about, you knows. So
you see families in there and you're like, hey, I'm
gonna help this family out. I know they they you know,
they're Penny pension here or there, and I mean you
can kind of see that, so you just jump in
and try to help. We're gonna take a quick break here,
(12:42):
and obviously we're gonna ask Dexter about, of course, Game seven,
but I want to ask him about game one, Game
one of his career. Back in a minute Welcome back
to the Book of Joe podcast. Are asked, is Dexter
(13:05):
Fouler Fourteen years in the major leagues? Not bad for
a guy who was drafted in the fourteenth round. And
I know, Dexter, probably that had a lot to do
with sign ability. You had offers, I believe from Miami,
from Harvard, and you signed on with the Rockies. That first.
Take me back to that time in your life and
(13:27):
making that kind of a decision. Well, I thought I
was gonna go first round. I just won the night
before they draft, I won National Player of the Year
at the All American Game, and everybody's like, oh, you're
gonna be the first pick, you know, from anybody here,
And I remember that day like it was yesterday and
I was sitting in the room and like de Witt
(13:48):
was the first guy to get drafted, and I'm sitting
there and I see my dad walking off on calls
and I'm like, oh, is this it? This? It so
ended up yeah, getting drafted in the fourteenth round. Found
out a few years later there like after I signed,
I signed for first round money, but everybody was like,
that's that's what it took like, and I found out
(14:09):
somebody had messed had got me sign ability wise, and
it was actually one of the coaches that wanted me
to play for their team. So I found that out.
But all in all, it worked out the way it
was supposed to work out. Yeah, I was I was
actually gonna. I signed both sport to play basketball and
(14:29):
baseball in the Major League, so I couldn't go back
and go back to college and play basketball. So at
then I signed, ended up going with Colorado and the
rest is history history. Yeah, I think at the time,
weren't you only a right handed hitter and you wound
up you look at your major league numbers. I've never
(14:49):
heard of this before. Joe natural right handed hitter and
in the Big League. His better side was the left side. Yeah,
I mean it was times. We've talked about that, and
we became at the Syria. When we went at the
Saint Louis. You know, there was a time that this
boy you could not get him out right handed. Man,
I tell you why he was hot with the Cubbies.
He got hot right handed, and I wanted to see
(15:11):
him up their right handed. The left side was a
little bit more movement. The right side. It was more
directed the ball. I think that's when you were on
top of your game right handed. My god, it was
like Bernie Williams good. It was that good from that
side for me. But then he would go through because
you hit left handed most of the time as a
switch hitteror you you hit left handed. Yeah, I didn't exactly. Yeah,
we told we've talked about this at dinner. We actually
(15:33):
talked about this, and I thank Joe because Joe used
to because he knew I wasn't getting so in Saint Louis.
I'm not gonna name any names, but somebody then let
me play against lefties only right handed. I mean only
I was only hitting left hand. So I would hit
left handed for probably like a week and a half
two weeks straight, and I didn't get any right handed
(15:53):
at bats. And Joe we played the Cubs, and Joe
used to flip me every time maybe hit, maybe hit
right hand, and I think it kind of locked and
locking back good. Right. I grew up hitting right handed,
so that like, once I start seeing some pitches, I'm
back like it's like riding a bike. But if I
(16:13):
don't see any pitches, I'm like timing's off. I'm rolling
over stuff. But I used to go up right handed
and tell everybody there's no way that anybody's getting me out.
I'll get myself out right handed, but you cannot get
me out technically. I liked your right handed swinging better.
Like I said, it's more short direct your left hand.
You had that little thing that would flip you a
little before, but when that stucker was timed up right,
(16:35):
when you got hot, left handed, man, nobody can get
you out left handed either. It was. You know, it's
a classic example switching. A young guy like that learns
the other side and then then all of a sudden,
of course left handed being the learned side, he's gonna
face mostly right handed pitchers. So there might be a
couple of flaws in that, but man, I even in
callar out he hit the ball well right handed for
me too. So anyway, this guy get it well from
(16:57):
both sides of the play and that's why he lasted
as long as he did. Did I ever tell you
how that came about? Did you know what? No? So
I'm in the cage and this is instructs my first
year like nobody's ever Like these guys have never seen
me play. So I'm hitting right handed or whatever, and
I don't even think I played a game. I go
in the cage and I'm just like, hey, y'all flip
(17:17):
me some you know, obviously, if you know me, I
goof around a lot, right. So I'm goofing around in
the cage and I just I'm hitting left handed. And
Jimmy Johnson says, hey, he was our roving heating You
ever hit left handed? I go, no, We just played
with my brother and I used to play harmon derby
in our yard because it was smaller. We just hit
left handed. But my feet were every day but everywhere,
but I had a good hand ichornation. The next day,
(17:40):
I get a call and it's like, hey, Bill, guy Vette,
which was our scouting director at the time, wants to
see you in his office and I'm over here thinking
like this is my first I'm like, what the hell
did I do? Right? So I go in the office
and I sit down and I'm like my heart's beating,
and he's like, so we want you to start switch hitting.
He's like no, he goes the reason I could. He
(18:01):
goes the reason I called you to the office today.
And I'm like, all right, let me have it. What
did I do? And he's like, because it's like the
principal's office, He's like, we want you to start switch hitting.
Jimmy saw your your your swing, um, and he said
that we think it will help you, you know, getting
down the first year really fast or whatever. And I said, well,
you guys haven't even seen me hit right. He goes, no,
you still hit right handed, just like you know against
(18:23):
against the right as you hit left handed. I said, okay,
I'll try it when when you want me to start?
And they were like today and I was like today,
Like you really want me to start today? It was
like absolutely, go to bass man, which was our our
our equipment guy and tell him in the minor leagues
and tell him you need some left handed bats. I
was like, okay. So I went in there and I said,
(18:46):
bass man, I need some left hand in the bat.
I need some left handed bats because I'm starting to
switch hit now. And he started laughing. He goes, what
do you want. No, I'm serious, like I'm switch hitting.
Like I asked you for left handed He goes, there's
no left handed bats. All the bats are the same.
He got me. So I was the day I started
I started switching. That's awesome. I you know, I really
(19:08):
m JJ. I know JJ from Arizona JJ, and I
uhould do clinics. Yeah. Yeah. And then Guy Vett was
one of my players in the minor leagues. I just
I just was with him a couple of weeks. So
it's kind of interesting that you have that same kind
of history with those guys too. Yeah. So Dexter's September
of two thousand and eight, you get called up tenth
thinning against the Giants. They send you in there to
(19:29):
pinch run. You got to pick up the story from there. Yeah. So, um,
first of all, let's let's rewind. So I get there
and I see on the day before I get called up,
I see Peter Gammons on baseball tonight, and he said,
notable September call ups. And I'm sitting there at a
(19:51):
team dinner, like our team party for the end of
the year in Northwest Arkansas, and I look up and
I look at school call. I'm like, did I get
called up? I'm in double A. I'm like, did I
get called up? They said, I just got called up?
Like what it like? And he goes, I haven't heard thing.
So I was like, in my playing tomorrow. It was like, yeah,
you're in there. So I end up waking up, couldn't
sleep the whole night, end up waking up playing, got
(20:12):
three hits. After the game, I get called up. They said, hey,
you need to hurry up and get back. So when
we get back, you'll just drive. You'll pick up your
stuff and you can drive to Denver. It's probably from
Tulsa's probably like an eight hour drive. I'm like, okay,
the whole time going home, I get it. I drive there,
(20:33):
can't sleep and they're like, yeah, you need to hurry
up and get there because you might start And I'm
looking it up and I'm like, who's who's pitching? They
were like ten months ago this is what the freak was.
The freak. So I'm over Oh man, you know, I'm
so excited. So I get there on three hours of sleep.
I get there and I'm like, not in the lineup,
(20:54):
and I'm like, oh man, I thought I was starting.
So I'm sitting there in the first big league game.
I'm sitting there, you know, watching the whole game, excited.
Top ten. Jamie Quirk comes down and says, hey, Decks,
if the catcher gets on that, you're gonna pinch runt.
He's leading off the ending. I said, okay, So I'm
down there. I'm I'm I'm amped up. He gets end
(21:15):
up getting on. I get out there and they're like, hey,
we need to we need you to get this bag.
So I'm like all right. So second pitch, I get
the steel sign. I look in. Benji Malina is behind
the plate, and I'm like, I gotta get a really
good jump, right, And so I get the steel sign.
I get a good jump. I look in and the
(21:36):
balls up and a way so it looks like a
pitch out Like when I peek in, he's already up
like this, and I'm like, oh damn. So I take
like I'm three quarters of the way. I stop and
go back to the bag. And this is probably the
only time that Benji Malina threw a ball offline. It's
(21:56):
offline to Emmanuel Birds. He comes across the bag like
this in stride, catches it throws at the first I slide.
Then I'm out. At first, I'm like, everybody's blooming me
like a parent. Everybody. Yeah. I go back and sit down.
I'm sad, and I remember they came up to me.
(22:17):
They're like, hey, look, you're in the books. It's all right,
It's all right. So that was my that was my
big league debut. Who's the manager at that time? Who'd
you have? Your manager? Went Hurdle was okay, hey, Dex.
We talk a lot in this episode and these podcasts
about that moment when you belong You've heard Joe talk
about the five levels of being a professional. For you,
(22:38):
When did that moment come when you knew you belonged?
I can't pinpoint one. I mean almost when I was
third and Rookie of the Year voting second ar yeah,
third and Rookie of the Year voting, like I guess
when I left Colorado. If that's because kind of like
It's kind of like you you grew up, you come
(23:00):
up in Colorado, and they still view you as a kid.
Right when you're eighteen, you come in and you were
I was a kid, and you know, you make it
through the ranks and you play. I played for them
for five years, and I was still viewed as a kid.
And at that point, you're you're grown. You got five
years in the big leagues. I went to Houston, and
(23:21):
as terrible as we were at Houston h BO Porter,
I was I was looked at as the guy, like
the one of the veterans. So like even when Springer
came up, like you live with me, like all two right,
Like they all looked up to me, right, I was
the guy. And I think that's when I realized, like
I belong here, Like this is like this is where
(23:43):
I belong. And then I get I ended up getting
traded to um to and fifteen to the to the Cubs.
So yeah, I mean that's we allays have. We all
have to go through that seminal moment, that moment when um,
you know, that epiphany strikes, um you finally I belong here.
I can do this. Um, I'm as good as everybody else,
if not better, you have to really believe that internally.
(24:05):
We all have to believe that internally in order to
really maximize our talents. I mean, I know even as
a coach, as a manager, as a major league coach,
I had to go through that same process as a
young minor league player. I had to go through that
same process the first time I went to Boulder, Colorado,
and can I play with these other guys from Texas
(24:25):
and Oklahoma, etc. It's weird of it, and I think
everybody and I think it again, it applies in the
business world too. You have to I don't care if
your attorney, doctor, whatever, a teacher, it's got to be
that one moment when you breathe and all of a sudden,
your brain works. It works, it's able to slow things down.
I'm as good as anybody else around here. And then
(24:46):
everybody gets to see the full benefit of what you're
capable of doing, and that it happens to all of us. Man,
And it's a perfect example with you. Once you had
that leadership role kind of it sounds like you're able
to take off from there. Well. I don't want to
overlook Texter's career too, either, Joey talked about his ability
as a glue guy. But again, a fourteen year career,
eighty two triples. If you want to know how many
(25:09):
that is, Nobody who has joined the Major League since
two thousand and five has eighty two triples. The active
leader's actually a tie. Charlie Blackman and Alcie dis Escobar
have only fifty eight. And here's a trivia question for you.
Joe Dexter had one hundred and twenty seven home runs
and eighty two triples. There's only one other switch hitting
(25:33):
outfielder in the history of baseball that has that combination
of home runs and triples, that many homers, that many triples,
Mickey Mantle. Not Mickey Mantle, but it is a Hall
of Famer home runs and triples. Yes, probably the second
greatest leadoff hitter in baseball history, because we have to
(25:55):
go with the Rickey at number one. No offense. Dexter,
come on, I had you got me at Mickey. It's
more even more of an ale guy. Maybe from back then,
back in the eighties, but he was in the other
league back in the eighties when you were in the
al Tim Rain Dexter, Fowler and Tim Rain how about that.
That's crazy, which leads me dexter to this question who
(26:18):
is your guy growing up? Like, who is the guy
you're watching? You're like, man, I like that Ken. I
want to be like him. J K Junior first year,
without a doubt. That's why I war twenty four for Junior.
I remember Don Baylor introduced me to him, and it
was crazy because when that was like, I don't get
(26:39):
star struck meeting people, but like Junior, I was. I was.
I just got called up. So two thousand and nine
and I made the team out of training and grew
Don Baylor walking me over there at the meeting. We
were in Peoria, and funny he knew who I was.
He told me, hey, don't be running down any of
my balls, gave me his number, and Junior has always
(27:01):
been great and that, like I said, that's why I
I was a Marinis fan growing up, even being in Atlanta,
just because Griffy was my guy. So cool, pretty good player, man,
I saw him in rookie ball. Pretty good player. The
one thing decks there's a little phrase he was coming
out of the dugout one time in Chicago. I don't
even know if you're like hurting a little bit or
I recognize something, but he's walking in front of me,
(27:24):
going to the on deck circle, probably going to hit.
And I just called him over and said, remember one thing,
you go, we go. And from that moment on, I
would repeat that to him before every game. You go,
we go. And it was absolutely true. The guy. You
think about fifteen, the home run in Pittsburgh, you think
about sixteen, the leadoff home running Game seven, There's so
many big hits that he had had and just and
(27:47):
then he would just he was an igniter. He's, like
you said, a classical leadoff hitter that everybody's seeking, because
he could handle it mentally too, like when you're not
going well, you have to be able to handle that also.
And he handled the downtime as well too. But you go,
we go. I always remember that about us, but absolutely
And I'm laughing because I remember in fifteen I went
up here often. I was struggling. I feel like every
(28:12):
every had back um to start the game, I was
punching out. You remember, yeah, you said, hey, okay, all right, decks,
we're gonna change your mindset. He said, hey, what are
we gonna do when we start this game? To day,
and I said, probably punch out and they go right
ahead and do it. Man did we go to? It
(28:32):
was like, hey, they go ahead, go ahead, it's punch
out as much as you have to. Yeah, right, But
that's the that's just the type of person, like the
type of relationship Joe and I had. He started laughing
and I started laughing. I was like, well, I haven't
doing it, so I was just keep doing it, but
ended up it ended up turning around so that the
ugo we go. It definitely helped out. But that's just
the confidence he had in me. And like that, Like
(28:54):
I said, dating back, that goes a long way. It
was just true. You did you were the you were
the shrug. Yeah, absolutely, you go we go? He used to.
We used to, we used to dap it up me
a hug, you go we go? And I say, hey,
it's true. Yeah, And Dexter is the same thing Game
seven of the World Series. Right first out of the
game and then you walk up to a hit. That's
(29:17):
that's I forgot all about. That's outstanding. That's beautiful. X.
This has been outstanding. But I've got one more job
for you. We'll be back with that in a minute.
All right, Dexter. Before we let you go, they have
(29:38):
a game to play with you. Okay, we call it
a reading from the Book of Joe. We take our
book and we like to think you can crack this
book open anywhere and you're gonna find something interesting and fun.
And we put that to the test with all of
our guests. So you get to pick a number anywhere
between one and three hundred and sixty eight and we'll
(30:00):
see what's on that page. So your choice, Um, let's
go twenty four. I what a shocker number, twenty four.
Where did you come up with that? I would never
have seen that one coming. Oh man, you're going back
(30:22):
to Joe's right, right right. Growing up with his college coach,
he talked about Norm Geigan. Is that how you say
at Joe gig Right? Yes? Who did play for the
He played for the Chicago Cups? He did? He did?
He played for the Cup. Yeah, So here we go,
page twenty four. Gigan was never as blunt with Madden
(30:45):
as he was one day when he discussed his chances
of playing in the major leagues. You know you're never
gonna play in the big leagues, Gigan told him. The
only chance you have of playing pro ball is as
a backup catcher, but you ain't never playing in the
big leagues, says Madden. I love when coaches were straight
up with me. Gig played in pro ball. He had
(31:08):
a good idea what the standard was. I wasn't close
to being as good as what he understood that standard
to be correct. How about that story, Joe, Yeah, I
could just I mean he was. He's no longer with us.
He was a very self confident man. He was. He
played at the big leagues so briefly with the Cubs,
I think in nineteen sixty eight sixty nine. He was
(31:31):
also the JB basketball coach. Their big athlete. Went to
Colby College in Maine. Tough, but this guy taught me
how to catch, and that was my ticket to to
professional baseball because I converted the catcher my freshman year
at college and this guy was an infielder, but everything
he taught me to catch in that freshman year. I
heard it again when I got to spring training with
(31:53):
the Angels in Holtville. From del Crando, Jack Hyatt, Chris Kenna, Zaro,
Larry Himes, all these dudes that had all this this
pedigree in catching, so I was really fortunate that Gig
was my skipper at that time. But man, the man
had an ego, but it was a lot of fun
to play for him. I love that. What's that line
you have, Joe about delivering truth but with compassion. Yeah, honestly,
(32:15):
without compassion equals cruelty. But I was okay with a
little bit of cruelty. I mean, coming back from where
we came from back in the day. I played for
Adam Seminska, I played for Norm Giggle, and I played
for Richie Rabbits and Jack Sywell. I mean, these guys
that shoot you right between the eyes when you're ten
and eleven years old. They tell you much a stink,
and so you just had to keep coming back and
(32:36):
I kind of liked it, kind of liked it. I
appreciate that too, you know, player, you appreciate you rather
that than guy just blow smoke and man do whatever
he needs to do. I really tell me, be honest
with me, Hey, I really don't like you. I don't
like your game, Okay, cool? Cool. I appreciate that. I
appreciate you telling me that instead of being like, hey,
you know what, You're great. I can't wait till you
and then really hate me like it's spot. I can
(32:58):
fee man, I'm a girl, I'm a big boy. I
can handle it right to give it to me exactly, Dexter,
this has been great, and I'm sure anybody listening to
this understands why you are an ultimate glue guy. Appreciate
your time before we let you go. Give us a
quick idea besides being a dance dad, of of what
you've got ahead of you. I understand you'll do a
(33:19):
little more work for the Marquis Sports Network doing some
Cubbs games. So what's ahead for you. I'm kind of
a free agent right now, so I'm setting through some
some things, um, Marquis set in stone. We're gonna solidify
some stuff here, um hopefully this week or next week
and get going. But you'll definitely see me in my
face on air, um somewhere, whether that's on YouTube via
(33:45):
social media, but I'll be uh, not just one place,
but not everywhere. So are ubiquitous, buddy, right, They're very good.
Love it. Thanks so much, Dexter. It's been great. Well,
thank you guys for having me. For sure. Deck's best wishes, man,
best wishes with everything you know that way in touch.
We got to play some golf. Man, absolutely got to
play some golf. Edited seventy nine, Yesterday seventy nine. I'm
(34:07):
coming after you. I love to see it. I love
to see let's go, let's go. All right, Well, Joe,
no surprise to you. You know Dexter Fowler really well.
But for a lot of our listeners maybe no, obviously
no him as a player. You get a little insight
into the person and you're even more impressed. That was
a real treat. Yeah, that's just that's typical decks right there,
(34:27):
And that's what I was talking about. These on a
daily basis. You know what to expect as the person
who the person is walking in the door. And that's
why he's so influential in the clubhouse. Speaking about there,
he was really really outstanding in sixteen. But of course
you're away was going to go through some bad moments,
but when he did, it was unrecognizable regarding his personality
(34:48):
and how he went about his business with everybody else.
And that that to me is a real leader, and
real leader is a leadoff hitter. I mean, your leadoff
hitter is going to go through some bad moments. You
might give him a day off, but you're not taking
him out of the leadoff spots. So he handled it
so well and we did some good things together, and
it's always wonderful to be in his company. And you
know what, I know, Dexter got every bit out of
his career. But hopefully, as we're watching spring spring training
(35:11):
games this year, Joe, there's going to be more Dexter
fowlers in this game. I think we're going to see
switch hitting comeback. We're going to see obviously a premium
on athleticism, on base stealing, all those qualities that sort
of we're a little bit devalued with the way the
game fell in love with the home run. I think
are coming back in a much more entertaining game. If
(35:32):
first indications of the rule changes in spring training are
any indications, so that's a good thing. That'd be very welcoming. Absolutely,
And just last point, I did the same thing with
a couple of young hitters, made them into switch hitters,
and they'll stay asked when I said today, you just
started up that day because when you're the minor leagues,
you don't want to waste a moment. You're okay with
a couple of bad at batch for a couple outs.
(35:52):
Let's just start it today, get a feel for it,
and then we just move forward from there. It's a
great idea. I just for background. Two thousand and nine,
Dexter's first full year of the Big leagues, there were
twenty five switch hitters who qualified. That's enough plate appearances
to qualify for the batting title. Last year there are thirteen. Well,
(36:13):
so you know, you think about the Hey days, which
hitter is probably the nineteen eighties, and we've kind of
gone downhill since then. Babe, it'll come back some better
athletes than As you said, you need some minor league
coaches to encourage it as well. Yeah, absolutely, Joe, you
got something to take us out here. Yeah. Again, I
went back to mister twin as I was playing with
Kurt Vonnegut a little bit. Vonnegut kind of messed my
head up in nineteen was at seventy something. He was
(36:36):
just kind of but I love him. I love all
of his stuff. Anyway, way back to Mark Twain, and
I love this too because it deals with the imagination.
You can't depend on your eyes when your imagination is
out of focus. That's it's so important to be able
to visually see things in advance and be willing to
(36:58):
try new and different things and to take to take
the lead in those situations. So that's what I get
out of that. If your imagination is in focus, it's
really permit your eyes to see more clearly. The great
Mark Twain, one of my favorites, and the man who
said golf is a good walk spoiled good? How is
(37:19):
he was so good? Wasn't hit him straight? Joe? Thanks
brother nice going. The Book of Joe podcast is a
production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts for my heart Radio,
visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get
(37:41):
your podcasts.
The Book of Joe Podcast is a production of iHeartRadio.
Hey there, welcome back. It's the latest episode of the
Book of Joe podcast, the most interesting podcast about baseball
and life with my good buddy Joe Madden and Joe. First,
(00:26):
I got to check in on you, make sure you're okay,
because spring training is underway and you are not there
for the first time and I don't know how many years,
how are you doing? It's I think when nineteen eighty
one was the first of my last break before that
was nineteen nineteen eighty, I wasn't there, so seventy six, seven, eight, nine,
(00:49):
eighty off and then eighty one to present tense. Yeah,
I'm here to report I'm okay. Honestly, I played again yesterday,
meaning golf, I'm playing again today. I got to go
to Tampa next week. I get an opportunity to play
in the Valspar Pro Am. Then I got another tournament
at Whisper Rock, Then I got another one out here
with Wally Joyner, and then I eventually do it at
(01:11):
Joe Naman So and in between that, we know, we
did the book signing and Savannah, which was outstanding. It
wasn't just cool, it was outstanding. So I'm like, really busy.
I'm really busy in a good way. So yeah, I'm
watching it, and we did. I did actually tweet about
it the pitch clock. I thought I was watching Bob
Gibson pitch for both sides. It was outstanding. It was
(01:32):
so cool, And like I said, I thought about this
too while I was watching it, like the other stuff. Okay,
so you know, people find it interesting the other rules,
but the one rule that really is participated within every
pitch is that one that rules the most used rule,
new rule that's going to be incorporated into the game,
and I think that's the best one. I think that's
(01:53):
the one that if you're going to attract more youthful
fans or more of a viewing audience, or just want
to come to the ballpark and check it out, that's
the one that's going to work. Going to kind of
dig it. It's awesome. I'm with you. I've been telling
people it's the greatest thing to happen to baseball since
they had nachos and a souvenir batting helmets. And I'm
glad to hear you're doing well, Joe, and we can
(02:16):
ask the same question of Dexter Fowler, who is officially
retired as a player from Major League Baseball after an
outstanding fourteen years in the bigs. Dexter, how are you doing.
I'm doing unbelievable. Honestly, I'm more busy. I'm busier than ever.
(02:37):
And you know, like you said, usually you go to
spring training and it's like, ah, like it's time, that time,
It's that time. But now I'm at home with the girls.
I'm a dance dad, and then I'm also doing some
TV stuff, so I'm getting calls all over the place,
along with some business things going on to four meetings
and all that. So I got a lot going on,
(02:59):
including dinner. The other night, we went out to dinner
up at Scottsdale, add myself, Decks, Eddie Vedder, Josh Cleinghoffer,
Bussy was there, Bussy was there, Sam Kennedy was just
such really fun evening. I got to sit next to
Decks and the moment you walk in the room and
Decks was there, I didn't know. I didn't know he's
gonna be there. He snuck up from behind, and god,
(03:20):
it's just it's just typical. I mean, and I was
gonna bring this up and I bring it up now,
decks lights upper room, and he just does when I
first met him, when we first got together. The smile
began then and it never ends. You can see it
right now. And that's a big part of the reason
why he played as long as he did. Such a
wonderful guy within the clubhouse and on the team. The
players really feed off of his energy, and you can
(03:42):
feed off his energy the other night just having dinner
with him. So it was great to see again, my brother,
It really was. I'm so happy for this new episode.
An adventure in your life. I know you're gonna be
great at it, but I just wanted to throw that
out there a bit too. Oh, I appreciate it. We
had we definitely did. We have fun. We have fun.
It was good. I say, get the band back together.
We remembered this one, some good stories about about those
(04:05):
two years. And yeah, and Joe, Joe was and you know, likewise,
Joe was one of my one of my favorite managers
ever to play for. So well, Joe, can I start
with a question for you, sure, because you know we
love to talk on this show about glue guys, right,
what makes a team a team? Obviously, a manager, head
(04:25):
coach and other sports has a lot to do with that,
but there's nothing like having that come within the player ranks.
And when we talk about glue guys, I have to
imagine that you've got to put Dexter near the top
of your lists of big time glue guys. What was
it about Dexter that made him such a glue guy
besides that smile? Yeah, regardless regardless of what was going on,
(04:48):
Like he had a good day, a bad day. I
mean he like he had he had a great run
during that year, but also he went into a little
bit of a slump. But the thing is, you never
know when he showed up at the ballpark. He was
always the same cat every day. So you know what
to expect. You know what you could count on as
a manager, and then as a teammate. I mean, some
guys are walking in the room surly and they don't
want to give. They don't want to they just want
(05:09):
to take all the time. They don't want to give.
But dex is the kind of guy that wants to
give all the time. And he's there like he'll he'll
sense that somebody else isn't doing so well. And in
spite of the fact maybe he's running through a bad moment,
he's still going to give to that guy and to
be that's really probably the best definition I can give
you of a leader is that he recognizes and gives
to everybody else in the room, and he's not always
(05:29):
seeking to be to get things from other people. Dex
is a giver and every player in that room felt it.
I appreciate it. And where does that come from, dex U.
I had to be my parents. They still keep me humble,
They humble me all the time. So I think that's
half of it. And at the end of the day,
like like Joe said, I feed off energy, and I
(05:50):
don't want anybody to have any type of ill energy
because I feel like a lot of people, you know,
in this game, like we're around each other all the time,
and we all need to be on the same page
at all. At the same time, it's crazy. It's crazy
to see a guy come in because I feel like
I've gone through a lot of this, a lot of
these things, and sometimes you get caught up in baseball
(06:12):
and baseball only and you people don't realize that we're
here at the end of the day, right and we're
going to excel. Like the best thing ever was Joe said, Hey,
if you feel good in it, where it? Remember and
that right there, like be comfortable in your own skin,
be able to come in. I think you'll have more
success if you come in and you're comfortable where you're at,
(06:36):
whether whether you're having a good day a bad day.
There's always guys. There should be your brothers there to
pick pick guys up and keep guys, hold guys accountable. Yeah,
there's a if you think you look hot, where it.
I mean, if the big thing for me was about
this is one of my tenants too, is that the
more freedom given, the greater respect and discipline returned. I mean,
I'm speaking to myself too, as as a young player
(06:58):
back in the day where there was football or baseball,
primarily the coaches that really permitted me to be myself
in a sense, and we're there to help when I
absolutely need it to help it. Otherwise, they permitted me
to make mistakes or they permitted me to do something
good without a whole lot of interference, and that's how
you grow, and that's it. I mean, I think as
an athlete, as a world class athlete, which all Music
(07:19):
League baseball players are. The more they are feel they
are able to express themselves and be themselves, then you
will find all of their abilities on the field at
any particular moment. The moment you feel constricted and you're
being controlled in a sense, then you're not going to
see the full impact of that particular player. Talking into baseball,
(07:40):
I think I could talk about the corporate world also,
but this is something I learned way back in the day,
whether it was high school than going to college and
talk about Coach Route in the Book of Joey was
my backfield coach at Lawfiette. This guy taught me how
to accept or teach through communication and non intimidation, And
to me, that's the best way to go about being
a teacher. Yeah, that goes a long way. It does
(08:01):
go a long way, especially you know you are the helm,
but you know as a player, he's spot on. I mean,
you respond better when guys are comfortable in their own skin.
So dexon. We and they will talk for years about
that sixteen team in Chicago. We know about the championships,
we can watch the highlights. What's kind of in your
heart when you think about how you remember that group
(08:24):
of guys that year twenty sixteen. Honestly, we were all
if we land in a city and you look up,
even in Chicago, we were all together at all times.
It was crazy, like I've never been part of a
team that's always been together, and like we'll go out
to dinner together, everybody's always invited. We'll go over somebody's house,
(08:45):
everybody's invited, whether it's a hotel room. Everybody was together
and everybody was willing to come. There was no really
any clicks, which was great. And then even the guys
who came in, like the Chappies and everybody who came,
you know, to help out, like towards the end of
the year, they were welcome with open arms, like and
they felt comfortable enough to come around and be together
(09:08):
as with us as well. Let me just say something there,
and that's a big part of that. I agree. Um,
when you get when you create, you talk about atmosphere
or you create a culture or whatever. Even though we
didn't have a long time together, we kind of created
a culture. So when somebody walks in the room, acquisitionally
say they walk in the room, and the guys that
have been there are basically in charge of the room,
(09:29):
which I love your your veterans need to run the clubhouse.
But when they walk in there, the guys coming in
will be immediately if they if they want to go
straight stray at all, that's not how we do things here.
These guys will be there. This is how we do
things that they're gonna they're going to make sure that
this thing is going to continue to run smoothly like
it had been running to that particular point. I don't
(09:51):
know that people understand that completely. But when you have
a room running properly and it's being run by your veterans,
if somebody wants to go a little bit sideways on you, uh,
those guys will they'll just get the guy off to decide.
Do it in a professional way. Listen, we don't. We
don't do that here. We do it this way, and
to me, that's the best way and the most successful
(10:12):
way to run a clubhouse. And you teach the young
guys too, like it's it's it doesn't just go with
somebody who comes in a clubhouse, even a guy who
just gets called up and doesn't know right right. You
do it, like like Joe said, we do it in
a respectful way, we're all family in there, and that's
and that's part of it. And you're gonna play a
lot harder for the guy next to you if he
knows that's like, this dude really cares about me. And
(10:34):
that's just human behavior. I mean people, well some people
may not understand that. But when you're with everybody with
each other every day, one hundred and sixty two plus
forty some days in spring training and then the postseason,
that's over two hundred games you could possibly be together
for during the course of the year. It's it's it's
a it's a family man, and you're gonna have your
(10:55):
disagreement arguments, and you're gonna have every wonderful times like
Decks talked about, but there's got to be a structure,
and the structure has to be built among the players
and not by the manager of the coaches. Yeah. I
love it when players are really good, but more importantly,
they're really good guys. And when you have that special
bond and you guys had that with the Cubs group
of yeah, talented players, but really good guys. One of
(11:18):
my favorite stories Decks, it was either fifteen or sixteen, right,
it's probably around August because the school year was starting up,
and you and your wife went in there and you
picked up the tab on family's layaway back to school items.
I just you picked up that tab. I know you
weren't looking forward to get any attention, but that has
(11:39):
always stuck with me. Is man, that's such a cool
thing to do, and you really have to be an
empathetic person to even come up with that kind of idea.
So kudos to you. I'm sure you've done and I
know you have done a lot more than that, but that,
to me was special, was unique and good on you. No,
I appreciate it. And how it came about. My mom
was a teacher, right, so going into and it was
(11:59):
an inner city She taught an inner city school, so
you know, I saw a lot of going in. I
used to speak to her classes and just seeing the
kids that were obviously not as privileged as I was.
And I told myself, I always wanted to help kids,
kids that didn't needed help, right, because sometimes it just
to go to school is just to get away from,
you know, what they've been going through. You know, some
(12:21):
kids just go there even to get a meal, right.
So that's how that all came about, you knows. So
you see families in there and you're like, hey, I'm
gonna help this family out. I know they they you know,
they're Penny pension here or there, and I mean you
can kind of see that, so you just jump in
and try to help. We're gonna take a quick break here,
(12:42):
and obviously we're gonna ask Dexter about, of course, Game seven,
but I want to ask him about game one, Game
one of his career. Back in a minute Welcome back
to the Book of Joe podcast. Are asked, is Dexter
(13:05):
Fouler Fourteen years in the major leagues? Not bad for
a guy who was drafted in the fourteenth round. And
I know, Dexter, probably that had a lot to do
with sign ability. You had offers, I believe from Miami,
from Harvard, and you signed on with the Rockies. That first.
Take me back to that time in your life and
(13:27):
making that kind of a decision. Well, I thought I
was gonna go first round. I just won the night
before they draft, I won National Player of the Year
at the All American Game, and everybody's like, oh, you're
gonna be the first pick, you know, from anybody here,
And I remember that day like it was yesterday and
I was sitting in the room and like de Witt
(13:48):
was the first guy to get drafted, and I'm sitting
there and I see my dad walking off on calls
and I'm like, oh, is this it? This? It so
ended up yeah, getting drafted in the fourteenth round. Found
out a few years later there like after I signed,
I signed for first round money, but everybody was like,
that's that's what it took like, and I found out
(14:09):
somebody had messed had got me sign ability wise, and
it was actually one of the coaches that wanted me
to play for their team. So I found that out.
But all in all, it worked out the way it
was supposed to work out. Yeah, I was I was
actually gonna. I signed both sport to play basketball and
(14:29):
baseball in the Major League, so I couldn't go back
and go back to college and play basketball. So at
then I signed, ended up going with Colorado and the
rest is history history. Yeah, I think at the time,
weren't you only a right handed hitter and you wound
up you look at your major league numbers. I've never
(14:49):
heard of this before. Joe natural right handed hitter and
in the Big League. His better side was the left side. Yeah,
I mean it was times. We've talked about that, and
we became at the Syria. When we went at the
Saint Louis. You know, there was a time that this
boy you could not get him out right handed. Man,
I tell you why he was hot with the Cubbies.
He got hot right handed, and I wanted to see
(15:11):
him up their right handed. The left side was a
little bit more movement. The right side. It was more
directed the ball. I think that's when you were on
top of your game right handed. My god, it was
like Bernie Williams good. It was that good from that
side for me. But then he would go through because
you hit left handed most of the time as a
switch hitteror you you hit left handed. Yeah, I didn't exactly. Yeah,
we told we've talked about this at dinner. We actually
(15:33):
talked about this, and I thank Joe because Joe used
to because he knew I wasn't getting so in Saint Louis.
I'm not gonna name any names, but somebody then let
me play against lefties only right handed. I mean only
I was only hitting left hand. So I would hit
left handed for probably like a week and a half
two weeks straight, and I didn't get any right handed
(15:53):
at bats. And Joe we played the Cubs, and Joe
used to flip me every time maybe hit, maybe hit
right hand, and I think it kind of locked and
locking back good. Right. I grew up hitting right handed,
so that like, once I start seeing some pitches, I'm
back like it's like riding a bike. But if I
(16:13):
don't see any pitches, I'm like timing's off. I'm rolling
over stuff. But I used to go up right handed
and tell everybody there's no way that anybody's getting me out.
I'll get myself out right handed, but you cannot get
me out technically. I liked your right handed swinging better.
Like I said, it's more short direct your left hand.
You had that little thing that would flip you a
little before, but when that stucker was timed up right,
(16:35):
when you got hot, left handed, man, nobody can get
you out left handed either. It was. You know, it's
a classic example switching. A young guy like that learns
the other side and then then all of a sudden,
of course left handed being the learned side, he's gonna
face mostly right handed pitchers. So there might be a
couple of flaws in that, but man, I even in
callar out he hit the ball well right handed for
me too. So anyway, this guy get it well from
(16:57):
both sides of the play and that's why he lasted
as long as he did. Did I ever tell you
how that came about? Did you know what? No? So
I'm in the cage and this is instructs my first
year like nobody's ever Like these guys have never seen
me play. So I'm hitting right handed or whatever, and
I don't even think I played a game. I go
in the cage and I'm just like, hey, y'all flip
(17:17):
me some you know, obviously, if you know me, I
goof around a lot, right. So I'm goofing around in
the cage and I just I'm hitting left handed. And
Jimmy Johnson says, hey, he was our roving heating You
ever hit left handed? I go, no, We just played
with my brother and I used to play harmon derby
in our yard because it was smaller. We just hit
left handed. But my feet were every day but everywhere,
but I had a good hand ichornation. The next day,
(17:40):
I get a call and it's like, hey, Bill, guy Vette,
which was our scouting director at the time, wants to
see you in his office and I'm over here thinking
like this is my first I'm like, what the hell
did I do? Right? So I go in the office
and I sit down and I'm like my heart's beating,
and he's like, so we want you to start switch hitting.
He's like no, he goes the reason I could. He
(18:01):
goes the reason I called you to the office today.
And I'm like, all right, let me have it. What
did I do? And he's like, because it's like the
principal's office, He's like, we want you to start switch hitting.
Jimmy saw your your your swing, um, and he said
that we think it will help you, you know, getting
down the first year really fast or whatever. And I said, well,
you guys haven't even seen me hit right. He goes, no,
you still hit right handed, just like you know against
(18:23):
against the right as you hit left handed. I said, okay,
I'll try it when when you want me to start?
And they were like today and I was like today,
Like you really want me to start today? It was
like absolutely, go to bass man, which was our our
our equipment guy and tell him in the minor leagues
and tell him you need some left handed bats. I
was like, okay. So I went in there and I said,
(18:46):
bass man, I need some left hand in the bat.
I need some left handed bats because I'm starting to
switch hit now. And he started laughing. He goes, what
do you want. No, I'm serious, like I'm switch hitting.
Like I asked you for left handed He goes, there's
no left handed bats. All the bats are the same.
He got me. So I was the day I started
I started switching. That's awesome. I you know, I really
(19:08):
m JJ. I know JJ from Arizona JJ, and I
uhould do clinics. Yeah. Yeah. And then Guy Vett was
one of my players in the minor leagues. I just
I just was with him a couple of weeks. So
it's kind of interesting that you have that same kind
of history with those guys too. Yeah. So Dexter's September
of two thousand and eight, you get called up tenth
thinning against the Giants. They send you in there to
(19:29):
pinch run. You got to pick up the story from there. Yeah. So, um,
first of all, let's let's rewind. So I get there
and I see on the day before I get called up,
I see Peter Gammons on baseball tonight, and he said,
notable September call ups. And I'm sitting there at a
(19:51):
team dinner, like our team party for the end of
the year in Northwest Arkansas, and I look up and
I look at school call. I'm like, did I get
called up? I'm in double A. I'm like, did I
get called up? They said, I just got called up?
Like what it like? And he goes, I haven't heard thing.
So I was like, in my playing tomorrow. It was like, yeah,
you're in there. So I end up waking up, couldn't
sleep the whole night, end up waking up playing, got
(20:12):
three hits. After the game, I get called up. They said, hey,
you need to hurry up and get back. So when
we get back, you'll just drive. You'll pick up your
stuff and you can drive to Denver. It's probably from
Tulsa's probably like an eight hour drive. I'm like, okay,
the whole time going home, I get it. I drive there,
(20:33):
can't sleep and they're like, yeah, you need to hurry
up and get there because you might start And I'm
looking it up and I'm like, who's who's pitching? They
were like ten months ago this is what the freak was.
The freak. So I'm over Oh man, you know, I'm
so excited. So I get there on three hours of sleep.
I get there and I'm like, not in the lineup,
(20:54):
and I'm like, oh man, I thought I was starting.
So I'm sitting there in the first big league game.
I'm sitting there, you know, watching the whole game, excited.
Top ten. Jamie Quirk comes down and says, hey, Decks,
if the catcher gets on that, you're gonna pinch runt.
He's leading off the ending. I said, okay, So I'm
down there. I'm I'm I'm amped up. He gets end
(21:15):
up getting on. I get out there and they're like, hey,
we need to we need you to get this bag.
So I'm like all right. So second pitch, I get
the steel sign. I look in. Benji Malina is behind
the plate, and I'm like, I gotta get a really
good jump, right, And so I get the steel sign.
I get a good jump. I look in and the
(21:36):
balls up and a way so it looks like a
pitch out Like when I peek in, he's already up
like this, and I'm like, oh damn. So I take
like I'm three quarters of the way. I stop and
go back to the bag. And this is probably the
only time that Benji Malina threw a ball offline. It's
(21:56):
offline to Emmanuel Birds. He comes across the bag like
this in stride, catches it throws at the first I slide.
Then I'm out. At first, I'm like, everybody's blooming me
like a parent. Everybody. Yeah. I go back and sit down.
I'm sad, and I remember they came up to me.
(22:17):
They're like, hey, look, you're in the books. It's all right,
It's all right. So that was my that was my
big league debut. Who's the manager at that time? Who'd
you have? Your manager? Went Hurdle was okay, hey, Dex.
We talk a lot in this episode and these podcasts
about that moment when you belong You've heard Joe talk
about the five levels of being a professional. For you,
(22:38):
When did that moment come when you knew you belonged?
I can't pinpoint one. I mean almost when I was
third and Rookie of the Year voting second ar yeah,
third and Rookie of the Year voting, like I guess
when I left Colorado. If that's because kind of like
It's kind of like you you grew up, you come
(23:00):
up in Colorado, and they still view you as a kid.
Right when you're eighteen, you come in and you were
I was a kid, and you know, you make it
through the ranks and you play. I played for them
for five years, and I was still viewed as a kid.
And at that point, you're you're grown. You got five
years in the big leagues. I went to Houston, and
(23:21):
as terrible as we were at Houston h BO Porter,
I was I was looked at as the guy, like
the one of the veterans. So like even when Springer
came up, like you live with me, like all two right,
Like they all looked up to me, right, I was
the guy. And I think that's when I realized, like
I belong here, Like this is like this is where
(23:43):
I belong. And then I get I ended up getting
traded to um to and fifteen to the to the Cubs.
So yeah, I mean that's we allays have. We all
have to go through that seminal moment, that moment when um,
you know, that epiphany strikes, um you finally I belong here.
I can do this. Um, I'm as good as everybody else,
if not better, you have to really believe that internally.
(24:05):
We all have to believe that internally in order to
really maximize our talents. I mean, I know even as
a coach, as a manager, as a major league coach,
I had to go through that same process as a
young minor league player. I had to go through that
same process the first time I went to Boulder, Colorado,
and can I play with these other guys from Texas
(24:25):
and Oklahoma, etc. It's weird of it, and I think
everybody and I think it again, it applies in the
business world too. You have to I don't care if
your attorney, doctor, whatever, a teacher, it's got to be
that one moment when you breathe and all of a sudden,
your brain works. It works, it's able to slow things down.
I'm as good as anybody else around here. And then
(24:46):
everybody gets to see the full benefit of what you're
capable of doing, and that it happens to all of us. Man,
And it's a perfect example with you. Once you had
that leadership role kind of it sounds like you're able
to take off from there. Well. I don't want to
overlook Texter's career too, either, Joey talked about his ability
as a glue guy. But again, a fourteen year career,
eighty two triples. If you want to know how many
(25:09):
that is, Nobody who has joined the Major League since
two thousand and five has eighty two triples. The active
leader's actually a tie. Charlie Blackman and Alcie dis Escobar
have only fifty eight. And here's a trivia question for you.
Joe Dexter had one hundred and twenty seven home runs
and eighty two triples. There's only one other switch hitting
(25:33):
outfielder in the history of baseball that has that combination
of home runs and triples, that many homers, that many triples,
Mickey Mantle. Not Mickey Mantle, but it is a Hall
of Famer home runs and triples. Yes, probably the second
greatest leadoff hitter in baseball history, because we have to
(25:55):
go with the Rickey at number one. No offense. Dexter,
come on, I had you got me at Mickey. It's
more even more of an ale guy. Maybe from back then,
back in the eighties, but he was in the other
league back in the eighties when you were in the
al Tim Rain Dexter, Fowler and Tim Rain how about that.
That's crazy, which leads me dexter to this question who
(26:18):
is your guy growing up? Like, who is the guy
you're watching? You're like, man, I like that Ken. I
want to be like him. J K Junior first year,
without a doubt. That's why I war twenty four for Junior.
I remember Don Baylor introduced me to him, and it
was crazy because when that was like, I don't get
(26:39):
star struck meeting people, but like Junior, I was. I was.
I just got called up. So two thousand and nine
and I made the team out of training and grew
Don Baylor walking me over there at the meeting. We
were in Peoria, and funny he knew who I was.
He told me, hey, don't be running down any of
my balls, gave me his number, and Junior has always
(27:01):
been great and that, like I said, that's why I
I was a Marinis fan growing up, even being in Atlanta,
just because Griffy was my guy. So cool, pretty good player, man,
I saw him in rookie ball. Pretty good player. The
one thing decks there's a little phrase he was coming
out of the dugout one time in Chicago. I don't
even know if you're like hurting a little bit or
I recognize something, but he's walking in front of me,
(27:24):
going to the on deck circle, probably going to hit.
And I just called him over and said, remember one thing,
you go, we go. And from that moment on, I
would repeat that to him before every game. You go,
we go. And it was absolutely true. The guy. You
think about fifteen, the home run in Pittsburgh, you think
about sixteen, the leadoff home running Game seven, There's so
many big hits that he had had and just and
(27:47):
then he would just he was an igniter. He's, like
you said, a classical leadoff hitter that everybody's seeking, because
he could handle it mentally too, like when you're not
going well, you have to be able to handle that also.
And he handled the downtime as well too. But you go,
we go. I always remember that about us, but absolutely
And I'm laughing because I remember in fifteen I went
up here often. I was struggling. I feel like every
(28:12):
every had back um to start the game, I was
punching out. You remember, yeah, you said, hey, okay, all right, decks,
we're gonna change your mindset. He said, hey, what are
we gonna do when we start this game? To day,
and I said, probably punch out and they go right
ahead and do it. Man did we go to? It
(28:32):
was like, hey, they go ahead, go ahead, it's punch
out as much as you have to. Yeah, right, But
that's the that's just the type of person, like the
type of relationship Joe and I had. He started laughing
and I started laughing. I was like, well, I haven't
doing it, so I was just keep doing it, but
ended up it ended up turning around so that the
ugo we go. It definitely helped out. But that's just
the confidence he had in me. And like that, Like
(28:54):
I said, dating back, that goes a long way. It
was just true. You did you were the you were
the shrug. Yeah, absolutely, you go we go? He used to.
We used to, we used to dap it up me
a hug, you go we go? And I say, hey,
it's true. Yeah, And Dexter is the same thing Game
seven of the World Series. Right first out of the
game and then you walk up to a hit. That's
(29:17):
that's I forgot all about. That's outstanding. That's beautiful. X.
This has been outstanding. But I've got one more job
for you. We'll be back with that in a minute.
All right, Dexter. Before we let you go, they have
(29:38):
a game to play with you. Okay, we call it
a reading from the Book of Joe. We take our
book and we like to think you can crack this
book open anywhere and you're gonna find something interesting and fun.
And we put that to the test with all of
our guests. So you get to pick a number anywhere
between one and three hundred and sixty eight and we'll
(30:00):
see what's on that page. So your choice, Um, let's
go twenty four. I what a shocker number, twenty four.
Where did you come up with that? I would never
have seen that one coming. Oh man, you're going back
(30:22):
to Joe's right, right right. Growing up with his college coach,
he talked about Norm Geigan. Is that how you say
at Joe gig Right? Yes? Who did play for the
He played for the Chicago Cups? He did? He did?
He played for the Cup. Yeah, So here we go,
page twenty four. Gigan was never as blunt with Madden
(30:45):
as he was one day when he discussed his chances
of playing in the major leagues. You know you're never
gonna play in the big leagues, Gigan told him. The
only chance you have of playing pro ball is as
a backup catcher, but you ain't never playing in the
big leagues, says Madden. I love when coaches were straight
up with me. Gig played in pro ball. He had
(31:08):
a good idea what the standard was. I wasn't close
to being as good as what he understood that standard
to be correct. How about that story, Joe, Yeah, I
could just I mean he was. He's no longer with us.
He was a very self confident man. He was. He
played at the big leagues so briefly with the Cubs,
I think in nineteen sixty eight sixty nine. He was
(31:31):
also the JB basketball coach. Their big athlete. Went to
Colby College in Maine. Tough, but this guy taught me
how to catch, and that was my ticket to to
professional baseball because I converted the catcher my freshman year
at college and this guy was an infielder, but everything
he taught me to catch in that freshman year. I
heard it again when I got to spring training with
(31:53):
the Angels in Holtville. From del Crando, Jack Hyatt, Chris Kenna, Zaro,
Larry Himes, all these dudes that had all this this
pedigree in catching, so I was really fortunate that Gig
was my skipper at that time. But man, the man
had an ego, but it was a lot of fun
to play for him. I love that. What's that line
you have, Joe about delivering truth but with compassion. Yeah, honestly,
(32:15):
without compassion equals cruelty. But I was okay with a
little bit of cruelty. I mean, coming back from where
we came from back in the day. I played for
Adam Seminska, I played for Norm Giggle, and I played
for Richie Rabbits and Jack Sywell. I mean, these guys
that shoot you right between the eyes when you're ten
and eleven years old. They tell you much a stink,
and so you just had to keep coming back and
(32:36):
I kind of liked it, kind of liked it. I
appreciate that too, you know, player, you appreciate you rather
that than guy just blow smoke and man do whatever
he needs to do. I really tell me, be honest
with me, Hey, I really don't like you. I don't
like your game, Okay, cool? Cool. I appreciate that. I
appreciate you telling me that instead of being like, hey,
you know what, You're great. I can't wait till you
and then really hate me like it's spot. I can
(32:58):
fee man, I'm a girl, I'm a big boy. I
can handle it right to give it to me exactly, Dexter,
this has been great, and I'm sure anybody listening to
this understands why you are an ultimate glue guy. Appreciate
your time before we let you go. Give us a
quick idea besides being a dance dad, of of what
you've got ahead of you. I understand you'll do a
(33:19):
little more work for the Marquis Sports Network doing some
Cubbs games. So what's ahead for you. I'm kind of
a free agent right now, so I'm setting through some
some things, um, Marquis set in stone. We're gonna solidify
some stuff here, um hopefully this week or next week
and get going. But you'll definitely see me in my
face on air, um somewhere, whether that's on YouTube via
(33:45):
social media, but I'll be uh, not just one place,
but not everywhere. So are ubiquitous, buddy, right, They're very good.
Love it. Thanks so much, Dexter. It's been great. Well,
thank you guys for having me. For sure. Deck's best wishes, man,
best wishes with everything you know that way in touch.
We got to play some golf. Man, absolutely got to
play some golf. Edited seventy nine, Yesterday seventy nine. I'm
(34:07):
coming after you. I love to see it. I love
to see let's go, let's go. All right, Well, Joe,
no surprise to you. You know Dexter Fowler really well.
But for a lot of our listeners maybe no, obviously
no him as a player. You get a little insight
into the person and you're even more impressed. That was
a real treat. Yeah, that's just that's typical decks right there,
(34:27):
And that's what I was talking about. These on a
daily basis. You know what to expect as the person
who the person is walking in the door. And that's
why he's so influential in the clubhouse. Speaking about there,
he was really really outstanding in sixteen. But of course
you're away was going to go through some bad moments,
but when he did, it was unrecognizable regarding his personality
(34:48):
and how he went about his business with everybody else.
And that that to me is a real leader, and
real leader is a leadoff hitter. I mean, your leadoff
hitter is going to go through some bad moments. You
might give him a day off, but you're not taking
him out of the leadoff spots. So he handled it
so well and we did some good things together, and
it's always wonderful to be in his company. And you
know what, I know, Dexter got every bit out of
his career. But hopefully, as we're watching spring spring training
(35:11):
games this year, Joe, there's going to be more Dexter
fowlers in this game. I think we're going to see
switch hitting comeback. We're going to see obviously a premium
on athleticism, on base stealing, all those qualities that sort
of we're a little bit devalued with the way the
game fell in love with the home run. I think
are coming back in a much more entertaining game. If
(35:32):
first indications of the rule changes in spring training are
any indications, so that's a good thing. That'd be very welcoming. Absolutely,
And just last point, I did the same thing with
a couple of young hitters, made them into switch hitters,
and they'll stay asked when I said today, you just
started up that day because when you're the minor leagues,
you don't want to waste a moment. You're okay with
a couple of bad at batch for a couple outs.
(35:52):
Let's just start it today, get a feel for it,
and then we just move forward from there. It's a
great idea. I just for background. Two thousand and nine,
Dexter's first full year of the Big leagues, there were
twenty five switch hitters who qualified. That's enough plate appearances
to qualify for the batting title. Last year there are thirteen. Well,
(36:13):
so you know, you think about the Hey days, which
hitter is probably the nineteen eighties, and we've kind of
gone downhill since then. Babe, it'll come back some better
athletes than As you said, you need some minor league
coaches to encourage it as well. Yeah, absolutely, Joe, you
got something to take us out here. Yeah. Again, I
went back to mister twin as I was playing with
Kurt Vonnegut a little bit. Vonnegut kind of messed my
head up in nineteen was at seventy something. He was
(36:36):
just kind of but I love him. I love all
of his stuff. Anyway, way back to Mark Twain, and
I love this too because it deals with the imagination.
You can't depend on your eyes when your imagination is
out of focus. That's it's so important to be able
to visually see things in advance and be willing to
(36:58):
try new and different things and to take to take
the lead in those situations. So that's what I get
out of that. If your imagination is in focus, it's
really permit your eyes to see more clearly. The great
Mark Twain, one of my favorites, and the man who
said golf is a good walk spoiled good? How is
(37:19):
he was so good? Wasn't hit him straight? Joe? Thanks
brother nice going. The Book of Joe podcast is a
production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts for my heart Radio,
visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get
(37:41):
your podcasts.
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