September 22, 2025 • 40 mins
This is the season for Emmy-Nominated actor Karen Pittman. She touched hearts this summer with Netflix's Judy Blume remake, Forever, and this fall she's shaking things up in the fourth season of The Morning Show on Apple TV+. After three seasons of watching Karen's character, Mia Jordan, follow the company line even at her own peril, the UBA executive is coming into her own and taking what's hers. It's a thrilling arc for a dynamic character, and one that Karen knows well. Acting was her second-act career, one that she fought for amid the ups and downs of her personal life. After grinding in the business for 20 years, Karen says it's the journey that she appreciates; a journey that has helped her leave imposter syndrome behind and take more risks — in life and her career. The fourth season of The Morning Show is now streaming on Apple TV+.
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Speaker 1 (00:02):
Today on the Right Side, Emmy nominated actor Karen Pittman
is here and we're talking season four of The Morning Show,
her role in the viral Netflix series Forever and the
journey that's led to what she calls her Golden era.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
There is this moment that we have as women where
you have the choice to societally betray everything that you
have been conditioned to learn about what it means to
be a woman. And just like a little you can
see like there's a little veil that starts to lift
a little bit, and you're like, well, what's that? What's
(00:37):
that over there? No, I'm not gonna worry about that,
or I can't look at that. I'm gonna go in
opposite direction.
Speaker 1 (00:42):
I'm simone voice and this is the Right side from
Hello Sunshine.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
Welcome back to the show, y'all. I have the best.
Speaker 1 (00:49):
News to share to kick off today's episode, Season four
of Hello Sunshine's hit drama The Morning Show is live.
Speaker 3 (00:57):
On Apple TV. Y'all.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
Okay, it's been a minute since we've been with our
girls at UBN, so let's do a little recap, shall we.
Spoiler alert If you're not cut up, then just skip ahead. Well,
season three ended with a massive shakeup. So if you remember,
Bradley Jackson played by Reese Witherspoon turns herself into the
FBI after she deleted footage to protect her brother. Meanwhile,
(01:20):
UBA merged with its rival network UBN, with Alex Leevy
played by Jennifer Aniston right at the center of that
power struggle. And now two years later, the women are
running the show and they're pulling at the.
Speaker 3 (01:34):
Threads of trust, truth and power.
Speaker 1 (01:38):
So a lot of you already know that in a
past life, I worked at a place that's not too
different from UBN.
Speaker 3 (01:44):
Hi everyone, I'm simone.
Speaker 1 (01:46):
Boys say good morning, as you mentioned, and just good
morning ladies.
Speaker 3 (01:49):
As women continue to break down, Darry, I mean.
Speaker 1 (01:51):
The larger than life egos, the rush to be first,
the politics both inside and outside the newsroom. I've definitely
been around that energy before. And one character who feels
especially familiar, like someone I've probably worked with, is UBN
executive Mia Jordan, played by my guest today, Karen Pittman.
Speaker 4 (02:14):
I'm the one who has to look at Julia and
Layla and everybody else who's overworked, underappreciated, underpaid on my watch, Yeah, no, no, no,
don't look over there, you know, keep the show lean
and mean, do more with less, get creative sleep in
your office if that's what it takes, because that is
what it takes.
Speaker 3 (02:31):
And this season, let's just say Mia reaches her breaking point.
I know it, I deserve and it's my time now. Ooh,
I love that line.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
Honestly, it's Karen Pittman's time now too, between her Emmy
nomination for The Morning Show, the viral and just utterly
delightful Judy Bluem adaptation Forever on Netflix and her role
as doctor Niah Wallace on and just like that, I mean,
Karen Pittman is on fire, and today you're gonna hear
(03:01):
what it took for her to get to that point.
Speaker 3 (03:04):
I'm gonna be honest with you.
Speaker 1 (03:05):
Karen is truly one of the most inspiring second act
stories I've ever heard, because she started her acting career
at a stage when most people might have given up.
And you'll see what I mean in just a few minutes.
This is your sign to leave imposter syndrome at the
door and show up for your dreams unapologetically. Sis, what
(03:27):
are you waiting for? Let's get into it with Karen Pittman,
Karen Pittman, Welcome to the bright Side.
Speaker 3 (03:39):
Thank you the right Side. I wore my bright side
dressed today.
Speaker 1 (03:45):
I got all gussied up, as you should because you
have had quite the year, ma'am, been so good.
Speaker 3 (03:52):
I mean, it's been great for us as audiences.
Speaker 2 (03:55):
And listen, I'm staying alive in five Oh, you are
doing more than stay.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
You are thriving because we started the summer with you
in Forever, which was just delicious?
Speaker 3 (04:05):
Did you love that show? Delicious? Wasn't it so good?
Speaker 1 (04:08):
It made me think, it made me feel, It made
me hope, I saw myself.
Speaker 3 (04:12):
We needed that. We need a.
Speaker 2 (04:13):
Little delicious morsel at the start, Yes, summer, we needed it.
Speaker 3 (04:17):
Well.
Speaker 1 (04:17):
I can't wait to talk to you more about Don
Edwards because I've got a lot of questions for you
about that. But I want to start with The Morning
Show because now we are heading into fall, Season four
of the Morning Show is premiering. I mean, how would
you describe this era that you're in right now?
Speaker 3 (04:33):
Karen? Oh, how would I describe this era? I'm golden? Ooh,
I love golden.
Speaker 2 (04:41):
Yeah, golden, because it feels like I'm in a light moment.
I'm in a bright moment, and I have been navigating
my own life conversations about what light means. You know,
I love a diamond. Everybody loves a jewel, But in
order to have a really beautiful shine, there should be
a little bit of darkness in that diamond, just a
little bit so that it refract the light. And so
(05:02):
for a while, I've had a little bit more dark
than I've wanted, and so now I have a lot
of light. I balanced it out with a little bit
of you know, shade and sometimes, and now I feel
like I'm in a really good season. So golden is
the word for me.
Speaker 3 (05:15):
I love that. Well.
Speaker 1 (05:16):
I saw you at the premiere last night. I got
to see the first episode of season four, and wow,
it just is like this a pol Yes, we are
being launched into a completely new era for the women
of the Morning Show. And that's what we really see
also in the trailer at UBN, like women are really
stepping up and stepping into their power. And Mia is
(05:39):
no exception because we see you say this line, I
know what I deserve and it's my time now to
Jennifer Andison's character, I mean chills. That is such a
powerful declaration. Yea, what does Mia have up personally? How
when your light that I can't's violent?
Speaker 2 (05:59):
But I think I think me as journey has been
really interesting as a character. I've really had to hold
a lot of what she feels close to the vest.
And even in you know, some of the trailers, you
can see that she's starting to let things off her
chest a little bit, like she's saying it with her chest,
(06:21):
She's speaking up. And I think that's part of what
the journey that people will see me on. How do
you find your voice? How do you become an army
of one? How does that happen? And why it really
does have to be strategic and how do you come
about that strategy? And Mia does that in season four
and I think people are going to love it.
Speaker 1 (06:43):
One of the most impressive aspects of the Morning Show
to me is the way that it responds to world
events in real time. Season four starts with talk of
the Paris Olympics, and we see that the show is
really about the messiness of truth, right, like who gets
to tell the truth, who owns the truth?
Speaker 3 (07:05):
Who gets silenced? And you alluded to that like Mia
being silenced.
Speaker 1 (07:08):
Where do you think Mia sits in that bigger conversation
about truth. You know.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
I think me as really for most of her career
been mission based, whatever the mission of U Ben or
Uba or NBN or whatever they're calling it now on
the show, it's I think now they put those two
together and they're called ub In. She's a real company girl,
like she believes in what the Morning Show and what
the corporation is meant to do in the same way
(07:33):
that Alex has believed in it, and Alex Leevie Jennifer
Anderson's character is supported folks at the Morning Show in
her own way, and grete Lee characters sell A Bak
is supported in her own way. So I think all
of these women are moving in the same direction, but
they're doing it in very very different ways. So I
think Mia is having to deal with the truth of
(07:54):
her own journey right along with all of the simuli
that comes along with dealing with an environment that includes AI,
which is challenging what our sense of truth is, dealing
with the legacy media and how money is influencing what
we tell the news, how we find our news, you know,
dealing with anchors and people at work who had big
(08:17):
egos and they want to see themselves realize and actualized
like Chris Hunter and you know, meeting the bottom line.
Speaker 3 (08:24):
So I think she's dealing with all of those myriad
of issues and challenges.
Speaker 1 (08:29):
You mentioned all the powerhouse women who are on the show,
Reese Weatherspoon, Jennifer Aniston, Greta Lee, Marian Cootier. And even
with all the progress that we've seen to make Hollywood
more equitable, I imagine it's still so rare to step
onto a set like this where there are so many
powerful women both in front of and behind the camera.
(08:50):
What is that energy and that camaraderie? Like, how would
you describe it?
Speaker 3 (08:54):
Well, you know, I think.
Speaker 2 (08:57):
It's very powerful when women come together and you know,
I don't want a sugarcoat and act like it's perfect
all the time. Like we do have our own conflicts.
But the way that women handle conflict, at least on
our show is to air it out to you know,
demand honesty along with integrity. You know, this is what
(09:18):
we say we're about, then what are we what are
we really doing here? There's a Glamour cover that I'm
so blessed to share with all the women on the
Morning show, and you'll see that Recent and I are
leaning into each other, but you also see that I'm
holding onto Nicole Bari's hand, and you know, she's on
the side of the photo on this little bitty great balancing,
(09:39):
but I wanted, I wanted to make sure that in
many ways, me holding onto her hand, it's just, you know,
sort of it was a natural instinct of my part,
and I'm so glad they caught it. But it's also
a reflection of my own personal ethos, my own personal
politic when it comes to any show that I work on,
but especially the Morning Show, it is about, you know,
(09:59):
linking farms with the women and pulling as you climb,
bigging others along with you as you climb, which I think,
you know, quite honestly, Jennifer Anda, san Reese Witherspoon have
done it better than any producers I've ever met. And
I've had a seventeen year career in television, in theater
and film, and they're exemplary. And that they walk the
(10:22):
walk and they talk the talk. You know, you always
know that they're going to do what's best for the
entire production, and that that feels it feels good, like
you know, the greatest good is there is their highest
goal and so we're we're all encouraged by that.
Speaker 1 (10:38):
Well, I'm so glad that you brought up that Glamour
cover story because it was so so compelling to read
and it was so.
Speaker 3 (10:45):
Good doing so much good stuff. You guys were ready
for the support.
Speaker 1 (10:49):
It's going to be so golden, golden, We're in our
golden era, golden era. Well, Reese in that interview have
said that she wishes that reporters would ask her not
just about the roles that she's doing now, but what
it actually takes to get to.
Speaker 3 (11:01):
The level that she's at in her career.
Speaker 1 (11:03):
So I want to throw that framing back on you
because a lot of people probably don't know that you
discovered acting a bit later in life.
Speaker 3 (11:11):
Yeah that's true.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
Yeah, you started out in the music industry as an
opera singer. Tell me what it took for you to
get here? Right?
Speaker 2 (11:19):
Well, first and foremost, like, I kind of had a
plan for my for a where I wanted my life
to go, and a lot of it was about my
inherent obedience to my parents for what I thought, Oh,
this is what a good life is supposed to look.
Speaker 3 (11:31):
Like, this is this is what you're supposed to do.
Speaker 2 (11:33):
This is how you go and marry me mom, mom
and my m and same and you retire. And so
I thought, oh, okay, so that's what. But I was miserable,
very sad in that life.
Speaker 3 (11:46):
You know. Acting came into my life after I had affort.
Speaker 2 (11:50):
Nothing was really working, and I had a midlife crisis
at like twenty eight or twenty nine, and I had
to rethink my whole scenario. You know. By that time,
I was pregnant with my first child, and I auditioned
for grad school to go to acting at NYU, which
at the time was like one of the number one
schools in the country. I had no idea, so it
(12:12):
was really I was rolling the dice, you know what
I mean. I was like, you know, seven eleven, you
know what I mean.
Speaker 1 (12:17):
So you just up and decided I'm going to I'm
just gonna go audition for acting.
Speaker 3 (12:23):
Well, up and decide.
Speaker 1 (12:24):
I was saying, did you have just up and decide,
because that's radical, up and decide.
Speaker 2 (12:31):
I did think to myself, go to some place good, yes,
of course.
Speaker 1 (12:36):
But did you have experience in acting before that? Did
you mean at the opera is theater? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (12:41):
Yeah, yeah, okay, So if you're doing opera, you're doing
a theatrical the most theatrical version. Yes, of singing, right, possibly,
but there is some singing and acting, but there's a
lot of acting in singing, right. And I'd had an
acting coach who actually said I was like, you know,
I love acting. I want to if I could do
this for a career, and he's like, yeah, sure of
(13:01):
course you could do it. And at the time I
was pregnant. I said yeah, but I'm pregnant.
Speaker 3 (13:05):
He was like, so, so what try it?
Speaker 2 (13:08):
And I watch your audition for school and I auditioned
for NYU again, which you know, I mean it was
kind of an up and deside because you do have
to be radical at a certain point. You're backing up
against the wall, kind of when you have your children
in your life and you find out you're going to
be raising other human beings. Your back is up against
(13:29):
the wall. You're like, I've got okay, I you know,
I can't f around and find out, you know what
I mean, Like I need to I need to actually
engage with this life and strategize. And so part of
my strategy was just joy. It's just I want to
have a I want my son to look at me
and think, oh, that's a woman who's happy and she's
(13:49):
happy to have me around, and she's not sacrificing everything
for me and my life, and you know, she's got
a life of her own. And so acting was my stab.
I was my my sore out into the world and
my gesture to say, hey, I want to see myself
out here and.
Speaker 3 (14:06):
Why you brought me in? You know, I think for
many years for me, it.
Speaker 2 (14:10):
Was the grind. It was a hustle and grind. It
was the late nights. It was you know, no sleep.
You know what I mean that no sleep hustle, which
will get you very far, so mo mom will get
you far that I'm going to run this race until
I drop kind of thing, and then I'm gonna rest
and pick myself up and start running again. Like that
literally was me for a very long time. And then
(14:32):
maybe after the second season of The Morning Show I
started and just like that a Sex and the City reboot.
Speaker 3 (14:39):
I started to realize that.
Speaker 2 (14:41):
I needed to create another gesture in the world to
see myself, and it had to start with rest. I
could not be a human being that lived on fumes
my imagination, my life would not flourish, would not thrive
on you know, air.
Speaker 3 (15:00):
I had to be.
Speaker 2 (15:01):
Grounded in the earth, and so I started to develop
ways pockets of rest, which helped to give me opportunity
to think into play, not just with you know, my career,
but with my children, with my friends. It gave me
an opportunity to find and rEFInd people that had been
(15:22):
in my life, including Marl brockerheel what I do forever
with it was the spark of us coming together for
forever was going to Vegas to see Usher and on
that trip, girls trip, hanging out watching you know, Usher,
doing a thing which only Usher can Thank you, Usher
shout out to Usher.
Speaker 3 (15:40):
Well.
Speaker 2 (15:41):
The next morning we woke up with this warm feeling
about our friendship and our relationship and boy, this was
fun and you know, how do we continue it?
Speaker 3 (15:49):
And then Mars said.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
You know, I got this character and this television show,
and I you know, I saw you do.
Speaker 3 (15:56):
This play years ago. This might be good for you,
and you might be a true and we've been friends
for many years.
Speaker 2 (16:03):
But it came out of the strategy of play, rest work,
and I think it has manifested an incredible stream.
Speaker 3 (16:14):
Of opportunity and light.
Speaker 2 (16:17):
You know, a new version of myself in the world
where I just decide to take more risks, a few
more calculations.
Speaker 3 (16:28):
Right, I'm a little bit more calculated.
Speaker 2 (16:29):
But if you have energy, if you have life force,
energy to share, right, then you're able to take risks
and not be so concerned about the outcome because you
learn the process. The journey is the most you're going
to get to a lot of places, you get to mountaintop.
I mean that premiere last night. I wish you guys
(16:51):
had been there. We were at MoMA, we left it
went to Metropolitan Club, which is very on twenty in
New York. I wish you guys would have been there.
It was so incredible. But there's a mountaintop moment. But
if like the journey getting there, yxtraordinary.
Speaker 3 (17:06):
Yeah. Worth it.
Speaker 1 (17:09):
More from Karen Pittman after this quick break, take me
back to that day when you audition. Oh, you're five
months pregnant, five months pregnant. What was going through your
mind that day? Did you go out there without fear?
Did you feel courageous? Was there an affirmation that you
(17:32):
played over and over again?
Speaker 3 (17:33):
No, no, no, no, No, I was panicked. To you,
I was desperate in that moment.
Speaker 2 (17:39):
You know, there is this moment that we have as
women where you have the choice to societally to betray
everything that you have been conditioned to learn about what
it means to be a woman, and you just like
a little you can see, like there's a little veil
(18:01):
that starts to lift.
Speaker 3 (18:02):
A little bit and you turn it. Yep, You're like, well,
what's that? What's that over there?
Speaker 2 (18:07):
No, I'm not gonna worry about that, or I can't
look at that. I'm gonna go in the opposite direction.
But I had had my opportunity to investigate that that
little crack, that little space. I think Roomy says something
about when you're exploring craft, is that little space where
you find yourself? You know that's where you are. And
I thought that I saw a crack of light that
(18:27):
was going to inform my journey.
Speaker 3 (18:29):
And I was right in that moment though I was panicked.
Speaker 2 (18:34):
I wasn't going to turn around, because your girl don't
turn around when she's going in one direction right.
Speaker 3 (18:39):
At any rate. I was freaked out. There's no courage,
it was just adrenaline. But you were there you showed up.
Speaker 1 (18:46):
Yeah, and it sounds like motherhood did for you what
it did for me. It galvanized me. It gave me courage,
It gave me clarity. And I think there's this myth
or misconception that our careers have to end when we
become moms, because it did for a while. But for me,
it gave me the courage to go even further. Well,
now that's the first baby. On the second.
Speaker 3 (19:08):
Baby'd be like, wait.
Speaker 2 (19:11):
That second baby, well, that second child comes along. It
truly is a death. You go from being a daughter,
being a mother, You go from being a wife to
being a capital m Yes.
Speaker 3 (19:20):
Do you know what I mean?
Speaker 1 (19:21):
Yes?
Speaker 3 (19:22):
Is that true for you?
Speaker 1 (19:23):
Or oh my gosh, yeah, Karen, my second kid almost
broke me.
Speaker 3 (19:26):
Yes exactly. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (19:29):
I had mine back to back and I was just like, whoa,
this is way more than I ever bargained for. Yeah,
and now on the other side of it, I'm like
so happy. Of course, of course, those those trenches, those moments,
And I know you experienced that too, because you got
pregnant with your daughter right right after a.
Speaker 2 (19:46):
Year and a half out of grad school. Spend all
that money. My mother said, girl, you spend all that money,
I only end up pregnant. Beginning, What in the hell
are you thinking? What are you going to do? It
was crazy, And that was a pregnancy that I I
had not planned, you know, extraordinary father, but a partner
(20:06):
I ended up having to detach from after my daughter
was born. You know, we literally got back together to
have her because we were apart when I found out
I was pregnant. Girl, I'd messed the whole thing up. Wow,
you know what I mean, Like I had blown my
whole thing up.
Speaker 3 (20:26):
That's what you thought in your mind. I had not.
I had it al slowed down.
Speaker 2 (20:33):
It slowed down to a grinding halt when my second
child was born because I had real responsibilities. I couldn't
just you know, go ahead and drop that kid off
with in laws or you know that time and a
co parent of a bus and so forth, with grandma whatever.
I had two children, had real responsibilities, and I went
through it with my second child. That was an extraordinary
(20:54):
gift to me. Lena was speaking of the bright side.
Her name means a bright light, and she was that
for me. What it really informed me, though, Simone, was
my childhood desire.
Speaker 3 (21:04):
To be seen was not enough to build a career on.
Wait say that again.
Speaker 2 (21:08):
My childhood desires to be seen was not enough to
build a career on.
Speaker 3 (21:16):
And so the desire to be seen was what was
motivating you. I realized that red carpet layer, do you
know what I mean?
Speaker 2 (21:26):
That applause that oh I booked that job?
Speaker 3 (21:31):
That a validation. That was what I really needed and wanted.
Speaker 2 (21:38):
But when you've got two children who have to be
fed and no partner in the house, grow you better.
You better grow up, You better grow up because you
got to feed. And so then I was like, well,
what am I going to do? And my sister, one
of my sisters, my oldest sister, Michelle, she's an attorney,
She said, Karen's time to stop doing homework.
Speaker 3 (21:56):
You got to go out there and get it.
Speaker 2 (21:58):
And then my other sister, Rauquel, my old sister, said
to me, I mean, pooper, get off the pot, babe.
Speaker 3 (22:04):
What are you going to do with this career? Go
out there and get it.
Speaker 2 (22:07):
And it was the motivation of my sisters, you know,
their words of advice, genuine their experience was if anybody's
going to do it, you got to do it. And
that was back in twenty eleven. Now, mind you is
twenty twenty five, right, so it's been a fourteen years.
Or let me see where you are. Let's do this
in fourteen years, baby girl. Let me know where you
are in fourteen years, to sit down and see how
(22:29):
far you've come and all the lessons that you've learned.
That's why people say it's not the mountaintop, it's what
you're seeing as you're going up, because my life is
not that one night at MoMA, or the Glamour magazine
cover or you know, any of the extraordinary fashion campaign,
none of that. It's it's this journey I've had over
the last fourteen years from those moments I have with
(22:50):
my sisters.
Speaker 3 (22:51):
Wow, right, it sounds like that pep talk kind of
changed everything. I mean it did.
Speaker 2 (22:56):
I mean it was the biggest thing that changed me
as a mother was when my mother passed in twenty sixteen.
I joined the Morning Show in twenty eighteen. I joined
in just like that cast. In twenty twenty one. I
booked a bunch of other things in their Yellowstone, but
I came to Mars Show.
Speaker 3 (23:15):
In twenty twenty four.
Speaker 2 (23:17):
So there was something that took fire and that really
you know, ascended once my mother left this earth, and
I think some of it is that life force energy
in her that continues to propel me for that continues
to mother me and nurture me from beyond. But I
also think it was just this sense of Oh, you
(23:37):
got as you girl, and you can do it.
Speaker 3 (23:40):
You gotta do it, though, you gotta do it.
Speaker 1 (23:43):
We talked about validation, and it's such a tricky thing
because I'm not going to lie. I need validation as
an artist, as a creative, I need to know them
on the right track. Yeah, But at the same time,
I can't let it win me over and take over me.
But I think every actor has that project that it
feels like a turning point in their career, that feels like, yeah,
(24:04):
I belong here and I'm bringing something here and.
Speaker 3 (24:07):
I can do this. Which role or experience was that
valid That was.
Speaker 2 (24:12):
In twenty fourteen when I did my first Broadway show,
and it was a play called Disgraced with an extraordinary
playwright named aod okstar who's peeled a surprise winning Tony
nominated all the things, you know. We did the playoff Broadway,
and then it came to Broadway and I was the
only actor that came from the off Broadway cast for
whatever reason. But he said to me, well, this play
(24:36):
doesn't work without you, but I will tell you. I actually,
at some point in the process believed him, and yeah,
it's extraordinary play. It doesn't have to work with anybody.
He work with whoever he wants to. I mean, he's
aod Och star. But I thought, oh, oh, this is
different now, because after that point I knew I would
never not work on Broadway unless I didn't want to,
(24:58):
and Broadway was a real goal of mine. In Nashville,
I was a young girl in Nashville going around singing,
start spreading the news.
Speaker 3 (25:06):
My parents were like, what in the heck she do?
Speaker 5 (25:11):
I'm leaving today. I would go around singing that whenever
I went and They're like, what is she? I was
a young girl with big, big, big feelings.
Speaker 2 (25:22):
You know, you have a child that has big, big,
big emotions, a big feelings.
Speaker 3 (25:26):
I was that kid, and they knew not what to do.
You were manifesting before we even had the language for her.
I was, I was.
Speaker 2 (25:32):
But yeah, that was a big moment for me. And
also twenty eighteen when I booked the Morning Show and.
Speaker 1 (25:38):
Let's talk about your Emmy nomination for me. You've called
that a mountaintop.
Speaker 2 (25:42):
That was oh, for sure, sure, I've had many mountaintop moments.
I mean, I think I was somewhere that day and
I just know I've seen all the other names of
the supporting actresses on the show come up, but I
didn't see mine. And then I saw first time Emmy
nominees on the morning show include you know, Karen, and
I was like, I'm a person nominee.
Speaker 3 (26:05):
Wow, I did it.
Speaker 2 (26:06):
I did it finally, and then my shoulders dropped for
a second and they were to my neck because there's
you know, but it was an interesting it was interesting.
I did feel like a big deal in the moment
here at the top of that mountain. And then you're
like time to go back down because you.
Speaker 3 (26:25):
Know, sewing is work, but reaping is work too.
Speaker 2 (26:31):
You can't just take all your things and because you
got to put away, you got to pack up, you
gotta can, you got to freeze, you gotta whatever it is.
Forgive me for being, you know, to agricultural.
Speaker 3 (26:44):
How par can I take this metaphor?
Speaker 2 (26:47):
But having a career in this industry is very much
like agriculture. You are planning seeds, you are nurturing relationships,
you are sewing, you are reaping, and all.
Speaker 3 (26:57):
Of that is work.
Speaker 1 (26:58):
We're going to take a short break, but before we do,
if you are loving this conversation with Karen Pittman as
much as I am, do me a favor and just
copy that link and share it with a friend right now.
Everyone needs a little Karen Pittman in their lives, right Okay, thanks,
You're the best. Now it is time I want to
talk about Don in Forever. Okay, gosh, the show really
(27:24):
impacted me. What do you think was so unique about
don and the way that you portrayed her to elicit
the kind of viral response that you got from this role.
Speaker 2 (27:34):
Well, you know, I think it's really it really is
in the writing. She just sparked my imagination. She made
me want to fill in all those cracks between the
words because the words were so incredible.
Speaker 3 (27:51):
I mean, every word is like a gospel verse in
many ways.
Speaker 2 (27:56):
When she says to Justin, you know these white folks
out here, they say it takes a village until it
comes to our children.
Speaker 3 (28:05):
I'll say that's a word. Do I say that?
Speaker 2 (28:10):
And fill in all the spaces for what she really
means underneath that and what she means on the other
side of it, and underneath it and above it, and
you know, so really being Dawn was about crafting this
character with a lot of with all the nuances, but
(28:30):
grounding the character and care and love.
Speaker 1 (28:34):
So many women have reached out to you to say
that they see themselves.
Speaker 2 (28:38):
So much and really all of my characters. Yes, yes,
there is a strong sense of representation in the work
that I do via Jordan do you know Doctor Niawa,
Professor Wallace and Nahwallace.
Speaker 3 (28:51):
On Sex and City Reboot and for Dawn and Forever.
Speaker 2 (28:56):
And it's interesting, as daunting, little unrelenting. Sometimes as an
artist it makes you feel like, well, I mean, my
commitment is to the art. It can't be a representation,
can't be to representing. The best look for who these
women are has to be being truthful and authentic to
(29:18):
whatever these writers come up with. There are times where
I have conflict with that, but I have faith that
my writers will give me an opportunity to nuance whatever
comes up that I might have conflict with.
Speaker 1 (29:31):
So knowing that your dedication is to the art and
the writing and the character. I know you're also human too,
and you're a black woman and you're a black mother.
Speaker 3 (29:40):
So what does it mean to you?
Speaker 1 (29:42):
And how does it feel whenever you hold up a
mirror for audiences like that and see that response.
Speaker 2 (29:47):
Well, I think it's for me. It's an active political engagement,
it's a service, it's a vocation, it's a ministry. It's
all those highest, you know, life force efforts that we
do as human beings is what I do it for.
I was raised Catholic, I was raised in scripture. I'm
(30:11):
not practicing Catholic anymore. I do love Jesus's teachings, but
I was raised to believe that you have a light
and you have to let it shine.
Speaker 3 (30:21):
God gives you talents, and what are you going to
do with them? Do you know?
Speaker 2 (30:25):
So it feels like a very sincerely I am responsible.
I'm accountable to my life by being a part of that,
being part of helping to craft conversations that get people
talking not where they feel judged, but where they just
start looking inward.
Speaker 1 (30:44):
One of my favorite definitions of community is people who
see your light and protect it. And it seems like
you have that with Marra Brakakiel. Yeah, what has female
friendship given to you when you think about how it's
impacted you and your career friendship?
Speaker 3 (31:05):
Well, it starts really started.
Speaker 2 (31:06):
At home, you know, started with my siblings, my sisters
really and my mother who taught us to always really
put each other first. Loyalty is very important. And then
it ended, it really ended with this deep understanding that
first and foremost that must be a friend to myself.
You know, I tell my daughter this all the time
(31:27):
because you know, young girls they deal with all these
questions and conflicts around self image. I said, if you
don't love you, there's someone who's going to be able
to love you in return. Do you know love you too?
So please work on loving yourself. Please be a good
friend and a best friend to Lena. And my daughter's
name is Lena, and so really those are the two
(31:48):
sort of my sisters and my own sort of journey,
and we're to be kind and loving to myself has
really helped me to create a safe space for my friends,
certainly for women in my line of work in television
and film industry, there's you know, we go through it
and some days we're fine, sometimes we're sad.
Speaker 3 (32:11):
Some days we're like, why did you get that part?
And then other days we're like you ain't that cute?
Like you know?
Speaker 2 (32:16):
And then other days we're like, oh my god, girl,
I can't believe I said that.
Speaker 3 (32:19):
You know, I love you, and you're like, I know
you love me. I'm so glad you're back. Do you
know what I mean?
Speaker 2 (32:23):
It's like, it's not that petty bullshit, it's not that
grudge holding. It's like, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, you
were going through it. Let's keep going together.
Speaker 4 (32:31):
You know.
Speaker 2 (32:32):
It's forgiveness is love, it's creating safe space where people
can just be themselves.
Speaker 1 (32:36):
I know that we're getting a season two of Forever,
which I'm so excited for it too. Do you have
any hopes for Dawn?
Speaker 2 (32:43):
Well, I know that we started this show in twenty eighteen,
so if we're basing it in some sort of historical truth,
and I know that she's going to encounter all of
the things that I encountered in twenty twenty, the death
of Mammatt Arpery, the death of Breanna Taylor, the death
of George Floyd. And I think what the writers did
(33:05):
give me, what Mara gave me, was this idea of
catastrophic parenting and how that creates anxiety and worry and
concern in her. I know that it's going to get
very heightened for her, but I'm interested in what Maraa
is doing.
Speaker 3 (33:19):
She keeps it very close to the vest, but I
trust her. Trust is a beautiful thing. Yes, I trust her. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (33:26):
Well, I've actually seen you say that you don't have
imposter syndrome. No, I don't anymore. You but you had
it at one time, right, No, for sure, but you've
grown out of it.
Speaker 3 (33:35):
I had to.
Speaker 1 (33:36):
I think it's so refreshing to hear women say I
don't have imposter syndrome, because we hear so many women
say that they do have it. We need to see
the models. We're saying you don't have to have it.
So what did it take for you to grow out
of it? Was there a moment, a breakthrough?
Speaker 2 (33:52):
I think maturity a matter of time, extending grace to myself,
making mistakes, huge swings, and you know, you know, we
have a swing in the bat. I think it does
take seeing other women trying things and failing. You know,
(34:14):
when I was growing up, I was an athlete, big
time athlete. So I think the competition can be a
great tool for self knowledge, and as an athlete, I
loved competing because I could learn so much about myself
in the process. And one of my favorite athletes is
Naomi Osaka. And I think Naomi does this extraordinary gift
(34:36):
of letting us see her emotion, her anxiety, all of
her fears, and she doesn't hide them.
Speaker 3 (34:44):
She can't. She actually can't hide them.
Speaker 2 (34:46):
I mean, you see Naomi on a court and she
is joyful and then she's winning. But if Naomi is losing,
you see it all over her face. And what a
gift she gives us by letting her allowing us to
watch her journey. She has a new documentary on to
be called Second Set, and it is about her experience
(35:08):
as a mother after her journey after having had her
daughter at twenty six years old twenty five, twenty six
years old, she says, people have said that my career
is over, but they don't understand as it's just starting.
And it just so touched me deeply that she figured
that out. I wish I had known it twenty five,
that you know, opening yourself into areas where you don't
(35:32):
know how it's going to turn out. Great risk is
actually going to expand you in ways that you cannot foresee,
you can't imagine, you know, on the other side of
what that process is going to look like. And so
watching other women you know, do it has really helped
me to do it too. What's behind the emotion I'm
seeing in I just think I just think it's a
(35:53):
just special one. I think she's very special. I think
I just you know, I have such a fondness for me.
But also any woman who's like, gone there, I just
you know, it's empathy.
Speaker 3 (36:07):
M h. I'm an actor, got big feelings. I got
such big feelings. Child is exhausting, how many big feelings
I have? Lord free me from these big failings.
Speaker 2 (36:17):
But but yeah, I mean I felt that same way
when I saw Michelle Obama tak you know.
Speaker 3 (36:25):
What she's been through that poor Mega Markle, Oh my god.
And also Ree's been through so much Jennifer, like I
have deep, deep, deep empthy mar, I have deep empathy
for these people who have walked through these storms on
their own, these women who walk through the storms on
their own and come out on the other side. I mean,
(36:45):
Reese is a perfect example. She has set a template.
She really is.
Speaker 2 (36:52):
She set a template for how women get through periods
in their careers where they can't or they're not given
the opportunity work.
Speaker 3 (37:01):
She blazed trail and that's not just you know, you
don't just say that lightly.
Speaker 2 (37:06):
I know this is on Hello Sunshine, this our company,
but I do mean this literally act of trail blazing
is actually a very lonely and daunting pursuit. And she
figured it out and now so many other people, so
many other women will know she went that direction.
Speaker 3 (37:24):
That's the way I go, do you know what I mean?
Speaker 1 (37:26):
Oh?
Speaker 2 (37:27):
So I learned no imposter syndrome because of just you know,
watching other people, but also just you know, failing failing forward.
Speaker 1 (37:35):
You know what, Karen, I'm having a moment right now
because I'm realizing why.
Speaker 3 (37:40):
You are the talent that you are.
Speaker 2 (37:42):
Oh.
Speaker 3 (37:43):
When I watch your work, you're honestly one of my
favorite actors to watch, so good you are.
Speaker 1 (37:47):
I always have a bunch of screens going whenever I'm
watching stuff, because add and the Internet and everything. Whenever
you come on screen, or whenever I find out, oh,
Karen Pittman's in this, Oh, let me put my stuff down.
Speaker 5 (37:58):
Let me lock in, Let me pay everybody be exactly
Karen Pittman is on.
Speaker 1 (38:05):
But what I'm realizing now talking to you, Karen Pittman,
like the woman behind all these characters, and seeing the
deep empathy that you have in the way that you
are just filled with emotion, talking about the women who
inspire you like this is what makes you a truly
(38:26):
generational talent.
Speaker 3 (38:27):
Oh, thank you. Yeah to you, Simon.
Speaker 2 (38:30):
It's us together that that's doing this, that's having this
moment a deep, soulful, spiritual experience.
Speaker 3 (38:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (38:38):
I feel so lucky that we get to witness you
as you're building this body of work.
Speaker 3 (38:43):
No, that's what's happening. You're building a legendary body of work.
Oh clod, I'm so glad you feel like that, because
I hope I am.
Speaker 1 (38:50):
Okay, I need to lighten the mood for a minute.
I want to end on a silly note. Okay, when
I was working in news, I worked in news for
many years and people will often ask me to do
my anchor voice. Ah yah, have you have you ever
just dabbled in a news anchor and.
Speaker 3 (39:05):
Pressures you have to we have to you kidding me?
Can I hear it?
Speaker 1 (39:10):
Hi?
Speaker 3 (39:10):
This is Karen Pitman and you are watching the bride side.
I don't know what that was perfect.
Speaker 1 (39:18):
Karen Pittman, thank you so much for coming on the
bright Side.
Speaker 3 (39:22):
We did, We did.
Speaker 1 (39:27):
Karen Pittman is an Emmy nominated actor and star of
the Morning Show. Season four is available on Apple TV
right now. The bright Side is a production of Hello
Sunshine and iHeart Podcasts and is executive produced by Rhyese,
Witherspoon and me Simone Boyce. Production is by A Cast
Creative Studios. Our producers are Taylor Williamson, Adrian Bain, Abby Delk,
(39:52):
and Darby Masters.
Speaker 3 (39:53):
Our production assistant is.
Speaker 1 (39:54):
Joya putnoy A Casts Executive producers are Jenny Kaplan and
Emily Rudder. Maureen Polo, Andrhyese Witherspoon are the executive producers
for Hello Sunshine. Ali Perry and Lauren Hansen are the
executive producers for iHeart Podcasts. Our theme song is by
Anna Stump and Hamilton Lakehauser.
Today on the Right Side, Emmy nominated actor Karen Pittman
is here and we're talking season four of The Morning Show,
her role in the viral Netflix series Forever and the
journey that's led to what she calls her Golden era.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
There is this moment that we have as women where
you have the choice to societally betray everything that you
have been conditioned to learn about what it means to
be a woman. And just like a little you can
see like there's a little veil that starts to lift
a little bit, and you're like, well, what's that? What's
(00:37):
that over there? No, I'm not gonna worry about that,
or I can't look at that. I'm gonna go in
opposite direction.
Speaker 1 (00:42):
I'm simone voice and this is the Right side from
Hello Sunshine.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
Welcome back to the show, y'all. I have the best.
Speaker 1 (00:49):
News to share to kick off today's episode, Season four
of Hello Sunshine's hit drama The Morning Show is live.
Speaker 3 (00:57):
On Apple TV. Y'all.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
Okay, it's been a minute since we've been with our
girls at UBN, so let's do a little recap, shall we.
Spoiler alert If you're not cut up, then just skip ahead. Well,
season three ended with a massive shakeup. So if you remember,
Bradley Jackson played by Reese Witherspoon turns herself into the
FBI after she deleted footage to protect her brother. Meanwhile,
(01:20):
UBA merged with its rival network UBN, with Alex Leevy
played by Jennifer Aniston right at the center of that
power struggle. And now two years later, the women are
running the show and they're pulling at the.
Speaker 3 (01:34):
Threads of trust, truth and power.
Speaker 1 (01:38):
So a lot of you already know that in a
past life, I worked at a place that's not too
different from UBN.
Speaker 3 (01:44):
Hi everyone, I'm simone.
Speaker 1 (01:46):
Boys say good morning, as you mentioned, and just good
morning ladies.
Speaker 3 (01:49):
As women continue to break down, Darry, I mean.
Speaker 1 (01:51):
The larger than life egos, the rush to be first,
the politics both inside and outside the newsroom. I've definitely
been around that energy before. And one character who feels
especially familiar, like someone I've probably worked with, is UBN
executive Mia Jordan, played by my guest today, Karen Pittman.
Speaker 4 (02:14):
I'm the one who has to look at Julia and
Layla and everybody else who's overworked, underappreciated, underpaid on my watch, Yeah, no, no, no,
don't look over there, you know, keep the show lean
and mean, do more with less, get creative sleep in
your office if that's what it takes, because that is
what it takes.
Speaker 3 (02:31):
And this season, let's just say Mia reaches her breaking point.
I know it, I deserve and it's my time now. Ooh,
I love that line.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
Honestly, it's Karen Pittman's time now too, between her Emmy
nomination for The Morning Show, the viral and just utterly
delightful Judy Bluem adaptation Forever on Netflix and her role
as doctor Niah Wallace on and just like that, I mean,
Karen Pittman is on fire, and today you're gonna hear
(03:01):
what it took for her to get to that point.
Speaker 3 (03:04):
I'm gonna be honest with you.
Speaker 1 (03:05):
Karen is truly one of the most inspiring second act
stories I've ever heard, because she started her acting career
at a stage when most people might have given up.
And you'll see what I mean in just a few minutes.
This is your sign to leave imposter syndrome at the
door and show up for your dreams unapologetically. Sis, what
(03:27):
are you waiting for? Let's get into it with Karen Pittman,
Karen Pittman, Welcome to the bright Side.
Speaker 3 (03:39):
Thank you the right Side. I wore my bright side
dressed today.
Speaker 1 (03:45):
I got all gussied up, as you should because you
have had quite the year, ma'am, been so good.
Speaker 3 (03:52):
I mean, it's been great for us as audiences.
Speaker 2 (03:55):
And listen, I'm staying alive in five Oh, you are
doing more than stay.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
You are thriving because we started the summer with you
in Forever, which was just delicious?
Speaker 3 (04:05):
Did you love that show? Delicious? Wasn't it so good?
Speaker 1 (04:08):
It made me think, it made me feel, It made
me hope, I saw myself.
Speaker 3 (04:12):
We needed that. We need a.
Speaker 2 (04:13):
Little delicious morsel at the start, Yes, summer, we needed it.
Speaker 3 (04:17):
Well.
Speaker 1 (04:17):
I can't wait to talk to you more about Don
Edwards because I've got a lot of questions for you
about that. But I want to start with The Morning
Show because now we are heading into fall, Season four
of the Morning Show is premiering. I mean, how would
you describe this era that you're in right now?
Speaker 3 (04:33):
Karen? Oh, how would I describe this era? I'm golden? Ooh,
I love golden.
Speaker 2 (04:41):
Yeah, golden, because it feels like I'm in a light moment.
I'm in a bright moment, and I have been navigating
my own life conversations about what light means. You know,
I love a diamond. Everybody loves a jewel, But in
order to have a really beautiful shine, there should be
a little bit of darkness in that diamond, just a
little bit so that it refract the light. And so
(05:02):
for a while, I've had a little bit more dark
than I've wanted, and so now I have a lot
of light. I balanced it out with a little bit
of you know, shade and sometimes, and now I feel
like I'm in a really good season. So golden is
the word for me.
Speaker 3 (05:15):
I love that. Well.
Speaker 1 (05:16):
I saw you at the premiere last night. I got
to see the first episode of season four, and wow,
it just is like this a pol Yes, we are
being launched into a completely new era for the women
of the Morning Show. And that's what we really see
also in the trailer at UBN, like women are really
stepping up and stepping into their power. And Mia is
(05:39):
no exception because we see you say this line, I
know what I deserve and it's my time now to
Jennifer Andison's character, I mean chills. That is such a
powerful declaration. Yea, what does Mia have up personally? How
when your light that I can't's violent?
Speaker 2 (05:59):
But I think I think me as journey has been
really interesting as a character. I've really had to hold
a lot of what she feels close to the vest.
And even in you know, some of the trailers, you
can see that she's starting to let things off her
chest a little bit, like she's saying it with her chest,
(06:21):
She's speaking up. And I think that's part of what
the journey that people will see me on. How do
you find your voice? How do you become an army
of one? How does that happen? And why it really
does have to be strategic and how do you come
about that strategy? And Mia does that in season four
and I think people are going to love it.
Speaker 1 (06:43):
One of the most impressive aspects of the Morning Show
to me is the way that it responds to world
events in real time. Season four starts with talk of
the Paris Olympics, and we see that the show is
really about the messiness of truth, right, like who gets
to tell the truth, who owns the truth?
Speaker 3 (07:05):
Who gets silenced? And you alluded to that like Mia
being silenced.
Speaker 1 (07:08):
Where do you think Mia sits in that bigger conversation
about truth. You know.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
I think me as really for most of her career
been mission based, whatever the mission of U Ben or
Uba or NBN or whatever they're calling it now on
the show, it's I think now they put those two
together and they're called ub In. She's a real company girl,
like she believes in what the Morning Show and what
the corporation is meant to do in the same way
(07:33):
that Alex has believed in it, and Alex Leevie Jennifer
Anderson's character is supported folks at the Morning Show in
her own way, and grete Lee characters sell A Bak
is supported in her own way. So I think all
of these women are moving in the same direction, but
they're doing it in very very different ways. So I
think Mia is having to deal with the truth of
(07:54):
her own journey right along with all of the simuli
that comes along with dealing with an environment that includes AI,
which is challenging what our sense of truth is, dealing
with the legacy media and how money is influencing what
we tell the news, how we find our news, you know,
dealing with anchors and people at work who had big
(08:17):
egos and they want to see themselves realize and actualized
like Chris Hunter and you know, meeting the bottom line.
Speaker 3 (08:24):
So I think she's dealing with all of those myriad
of issues and challenges.
Speaker 1 (08:29):
You mentioned all the powerhouse women who are on the show,
Reese Weatherspoon, Jennifer Aniston, Greta Lee, Marian Cootier. And even
with all the progress that we've seen to make Hollywood
more equitable, I imagine it's still so rare to step
onto a set like this where there are so many
powerful women both in front of and behind the camera.
(08:50):
What is that energy and that camaraderie? Like, how would
you describe it?
Speaker 3 (08:54):
Well, you know, I think.
Speaker 2 (08:57):
It's very powerful when women come together and you know,
I don't want a sugarcoat and act like it's perfect
all the time. Like we do have our own conflicts.
But the way that women handle conflict, at least on
our show is to air it out to you know,
demand honesty along with integrity. You know, this is what
(09:18):
we say we're about, then what are we what are
we really doing here? There's a Glamour cover that I'm
so blessed to share with all the women on the
Morning show, and you'll see that Recent and I are
leaning into each other, but you also see that I'm
holding onto Nicole Bari's hand, and you know, she's on
the side of the photo on this little bitty great balancing,
(09:39):
but I wanted, I wanted to make sure that in
many ways, me holding onto her hand, it's just, you know,
sort of it was a natural instinct of my part,
and I'm so glad they caught it. But it's also
a reflection of my own personal ethos, my own personal
politic when it comes to any show that I work on,
but especially the Morning Show, it is about, you know,
(09:59):
linking farms with the women and pulling as you climb,
bigging others along with you as you climb, which I think,
you know, quite honestly, Jennifer Anda, san Reese Witherspoon have
done it better than any producers I've ever met. And
I've had a seventeen year career in television, in theater
and film, and they're exemplary. And that they walk the
(10:22):
walk and they talk the talk. You know, you always
know that they're going to do what's best for the
entire production, and that that feels it feels good, like
you know, the greatest good is there is their highest
goal and so we're we're all encouraged by that.
Speaker 1 (10:38):
Well, I'm so glad that you brought up that Glamour
cover story because it was so so compelling to read
and it was so.
Speaker 3 (10:45):
Good doing so much good stuff. You guys were ready
for the support.
Speaker 1 (10:49):
It's going to be so golden, golden, We're in our
golden era, golden era. Well, Reese in that interview have
said that she wishes that reporters would ask her not
just about the roles that she's doing now, but what
it actually takes to get to.
Speaker 3 (11:01):
The level that she's at in her career.
Speaker 1 (11:03):
So I want to throw that framing back on you
because a lot of people probably don't know that you
discovered acting a bit later in life.
Speaker 3 (11:11):
Yeah that's true.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
Yeah, you started out in the music industry as an
opera singer. Tell me what it took for you to
get here? Right?
Speaker 2 (11:19):
Well, first and foremost, like, I kind of had a
plan for my for a where I wanted my life
to go, and a lot of it was about my
inherent obedience to my parents for what I thought, Oh,
this is what a good life is supposed to look.
Speaker 3 (11:31):
Like, this is this is what you're supposed to do.
Speaker 2 (11:33):
This is how you go and marry me mom, mom
and my m and same and you retire. And so
I thought, oh, okay, so that's what. But I was miserable,
very sad in that life.
Speaker 3 (11:46):
You know. Acting came into my life after I had affort.
Speaker 2 (11:50):
Nothing was really working, and I had a midlife crisis
at like twenty eight or twenty nine, and I had
to rethink my whole scenario. You know. By that time,
I was pregnant with my first child, and I auditioned
for grad school to go to acting at NYU, which
at the time was like one of the number one
schools in the country. I had no idea, so it
(12:12):
was really I was rolling the dice, you know what
I mean. I was like, you know, seven eleven, you
know what I mean.
Speaker 1 (12:17):
So you just up and decided I'm going to I'm
just gonna go audition for acting.
Speaker 3 (12:23):
Well, up and decide.
Speaker 1 (12:24):
I was saying, did you have just up and decide,
because that's radical, up and decide.
Speaker 2 (12:31):
I did think to myself, go to some place good, yes,
of course.
Speaker 1 (12:36):
But did you have experience in acting before that? Did
you mean at the opera is theater? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (12:41):
Yeah, yeah, okay, So if you're doing opera, you're doing
a theatrical the most theatrical version. Yes, of singing, right, possibly,
but there is some singing and acting, but there's a
lot of acting in singing, right. And I'd had an
acting coach who actually said I was like, you know,
I love acting. I want to if I could do
this for a career, and he's like, yeah, sure of
(13:01):
course you could do it. And at the time I
was pregnant. I said yeah, but I'm pregnant.
Speaker 3 (13:05):
He was like, so, so what try it?
Speaker 2 (13:08):
And I watch your audition for school and I auditioned
for NYU again, which you know, I mean it was
kind of an up and deside because you do have
to be radical at a certain point. You're backing up
against the wall, kind of when you have your children
in your life and you find out you're going to
be raising other human beings. Your back is up against
(13:29):
the wall. You're like, I've got okay, I you know,
I can't f around and find out, you know what
I mean, Like I need to I need to actually
engage with this life and strategize. And so part of
my strategy was just joy. It's just I want to
have a I want my son to look at me
and think, oh, that's a woman who's happy and she's
(13:49):
happy to have me around, and she's not sacrificing everything
for me and my life, and you know, she's got
a life of her own. And so acting was my stab.
I was my my sore out into the world and
my gesture to say, hey, I want to see myself
out here and.
Speaker 3 (14:06):
Why you brought me in? You know, I think for
many years for me, it.
Speaker 2 (14:10):
Was the grind. It was a hustle and grind. It
was the late nights. It was you know, no sleep.
You know what I mean that no sleep hustle, which
will get you very far, so mo mom will get
you far that I'm going to run this race until
I drop kind of thing, and then I'm gonna rest
and pick myself up and start running again. Like that
literally was me for a very long time. And then
(14:32):
maybe after the second season of The Morning Show I
started and just like that a Sex and the City reboot.
Speaker 3 (14:39):
I started to realize that.
Speaker 2 (14:41):
I needed to create another gesture in the world to
see myself, and it had to start with rest. I
could not be a human being that lived on fumes
my imagination, my life would not flourish, would not thrive
on you know, air.
Speaker 3 (15:00):
I had to be.
Speaker 2 (15:01):
Grounded in the earth, and so I started to develop
ways pockets of rest, which helped to give me opportunity
to think into play, not just with you know, my career,
but with my children, with my friends. It gave me
an opportunity to find and rEFInd people that had been
(15:22):
in my life, including Marl brockerheel what I do forever
with it was the spark of us coming together for
forever was going to Vegas to see Usher and on
that trip, girls trip, hanging out watching you know, Usher,
doing a thing which only Usher can Thank you, Usher
shout out to Usher.
Speaker 3 (15:40):
Well.
Speaker 2 (15:41):
The next morning we woke up with this warm feeling
about our friendship and our relationship and boy, this was
fun and you know, how do we continue it?
Speaker 3 (15:49):
And then Mars said.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
You know, I got this character and this television show,
and I you know, I saw you do.
Speaker 3 (15:56):
This play years ago. This might be good for you,
and you might be a true and we've been friends
for many years.
Speaker 2 (16:03):
But it came out of the strategy of play, rest work,
and I think it has manifested an incredible stream.
Speaker 3 (16:14):
Of opportunity and light.
Speaker 2 (16:17):
You know, a new version of myself in the world
where I just decide to take more risks, a few
more calculations.
Speaker 3 (16:28):
Right, I'm a little bit more calculated.
Speaker 2 (16:29):
But if you have energy, if you have life force,
energy to share, right, then you're able to take risks
and not be so concerned about the outcome because you
learn the process. The journey is the most you're going
to get to a lot of places, you get to mountaintop.
I mean that premiere last night. I wish you guys
(16:51):
had been there. We were at MoMA, we left it
went to Metropolitan Club, which is very on twenty in
New York. I wish you guys would have been there.
It was so incredible. But there's a mountaintop moment. But
if like the journey getting there, yxtraordinary.
Speaker 3 (17:06):
Yeah. Worth it.
Speaker 1 (17:09):
More from Karen Pittman after this quick break, take me
back to that day when you audition. Oh, you're five
months pregnant, five months pregnant. What was going through your
mind that day? Did you go out there without fear?
Did you feel courageous? Was there an affirmation that you
(17:32):
played over and over again?
Speaker 3 (17:33):
No, no, no, no, No, I was panicked. To you,
I was desperate in that moment.
Speaker 2 (17:39):
You know, there is this moment that we have as
women where you have the choice to societally to betray
everything that you have been conditioned to learn about what
it means to be a woman, and you just like
a little you can see, like there's a little veil
(18:01):
that starts to lift.
Speaker 3 (18:02):
A little bit and you turn it. Yep, You're like, well,
what's that? What's that over there?
Speaker 2 (18:07):
No, I'm not gonna worry about that, or I can't
look at that. I'm gonna go in the opposite direction.
But I had had my opportunity to investigate that that
little crack, that little space. I think Roomy says something
about when you're exploring craft, is that little space where
you find yourself? You know that's where you are. And
I thought that I saw a crack of light that
(18:27):
was going to inform my journey.
Speaker 3 (18:29):
And I was right in that moment though I was panicked.
Speaker 2 (18:34):
I wasn't going to turn around, because your girl don't
turn around when she's going in one direction right.
Speaker 3 (18:39):
At any rate. I was freaked out. There's no courage,
it was just adrenaline. But you were there you showed up.
Speaker 1 (18:46):
Yeah, and it sounds like motherhood did for you what
it did for me. It galvanized me. It gave me courage,
It gave me clarity. And I think there's this myth
or misconception that our careers have to end when we
become moms, because it did for a while. But for me,
it gave me the courage to go even further. Well,
now that's the first baby. On the second.
Speaker 3 (19:08):
Baby'd be like, wait.
Speaker 2 (19:11):
That second baby, well, that second child comes along. It
truly is a death. You go from being a daughter,
being a mother, You go from being a wife to
being a capital m Yes.
Speaker 3 (19:20):
Do you know what I mean?
Speaker 1 (19:21):
Yes?
Speaker 3 (19:22):
Is that true for you?
Speaker 1 (19:23):
Or oh my gosh, yeah, Karen, my second kid almost
broke me.
Speaker 3 (19:26):
Yes exactly. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (19:29):
I had mine back to back and I was just like, whoa,
this is way more than I ever bargained for. Yeah,
and now on the other side of it, I'm like
so happy. Of course, of course, those those trenches, those moments,
And I know you experienced that too, because you got
pregnant with your daughter right right after a.
Speaker 2 (19:46):
Year and a half out of grad school. Spend all
that money. My mother said, girl, you spend all that money,
I only end up pregnant. Beginning, What in the hell
are you thinking? What are you going to do? It
was crazy, And that was a pregnancy that I I
had not planned, you know, extraordinary father, but a partner
(20:06):
I ended up having to detach from after my daughter
was born. You know, we literally got back together to
have her because we were apart when I found out
I was pregnant. Girl, I'd messed the whole thing up. Wow,
you know what I mean, Like I had blown my
whole thing up.
Speaker 3 (20:26):
That's what you thought in your mind. I had not.
I had it al slowed down.
Speaker 2 (20:33):
It slowed down to a grinding halt when my second
child was born because I had real responsibilities. I couldn't
just you know, go ahead and drop that kid off
with in laws or you know that time and a
co parent of a bus and so forth, with grandma whatever.
I had two children, had real responsibilities, and I went
through it with my second child. That was an extraordinary
(20:54):
gift to me. Lena was speaking of the bright side.
Her name means a bright light, and she was that
for me. What it really informed me, though, Simone, was
my childhood desire.
Speaker 3 (21:04):
To be seen was not enough to build a career on.
Wait say that again.
Speaker 2 (21:08):
My childhood desires to be seen was not enough to
build a career on.
Speaker 3 (21:16):
And so the desire to be seen was what was
motivating you. I realized that red carpet layer, do you
know what I mean?
Speaker 2 (21:26):
That applause that oh I booked that job?
Speaker 3 (21:31):
That a validation. That was what I really needed and wanted.
Speaker 2 (21:38):
But when you've got two children who have to be
fed and no partner in the house, grow you better.
You better grow up, You better grow up because you
got to feed. And so then I was like, well,
what am I going to do? And my sister, one
of my sisters, my oldest sister, Michelle, she's an attorney,
She said, Karen's time to stop doing homework.
Speaker 3 (21:56):
You got to go out there and get it.
Speaker 2 (21:58):
And then my other sister, Rauquel, my old sister, said
to me, I mean, pooper, get off the pot, babe.
Speaker 3 (22:04):
What are you going to do with this career? Go
out there and get it.
Speaker 2 (22:07):
And it was the motivation of my sisters, you know,
their words of advice, genuine their experience was if anybody's
going to do it, you got to do it. And
that was back in twenty eleven. Now, mind you is
twenty twenty five, right, so it's been a fourteen years.
Or let me see where you are. Let's do this
in fourteen years, baby girl. Let me know where you
are in fourteen years, to sit down and see how
(22:29):
far you've come and all the lessons that you've learned.
That's why people say it's not the mountaintop, it's what
you're seeing as you're going up, because my life is
not that one night at MoMA, or the Glamour magazine
cover or you know, any of the extraordinary fashion campaign,
none of that. It's it's this journey I've had over
the last fourteen years from those moments I have with
(22:50):
my sisters.
Speaker 3 (22:51):
Wow, right, it sounds like that pep talk kind of
changed everything. I mean it did.
Speaker 2 (22:56):
I mean it was the biggest thing that changed me
as a mother was when my mother passed in twenty sixteen.
I joined the Morning Show in twenty eighteen. I joined
in just like that cast. In twenty twenty one. I
booked a bunch of other things in their Yellowstone, but
I came to Mars Show.
Speaker 3 (23:15):
In twenty twenty four.
Speaker 2 (23:17):
So there was something that took fire and that really
you know, ascended once my mother left this earth, and
I think some of it is that life force energy
in her that continues to propel me for that continues
to mother me and nurture me from beyond. But I
also think it was just this sense of Oh, you
(23:37):
got as you girl, and you can do it.
Speaker 3 (23:40):
You gotta do it, though, you gotta do it.
Speaker 1 (23:43):
We talked about validation, and it's such a tricky thing
because I'm not going to lie. I need validation as
an artist, as a creative, I need to know them
on the right track. Yeah, But at the same time,
I can't let it win me over and take over me.
But I think every actor has that project that it
feels like a turning point in their career, that feels like, yeah,
(24:04):
I belong here and I'm bringing something here and.
Speaker 3 (24:07):
I can do this. Which role or experience was that
valid That was.
Speaker 2 (24:12):
In twenty fourteen when I did my first Broadway show,
and it was a play called Disgraced with an extraordinary
playwright named aod okstar who's peeled a surprise winning Tony
nominated all the things, you know. We did the playoff Broadway,
and then it came to Broadway and I was the
only actor that came from the off Broadway cast for
whatever reason. But he said to me, well, this play
(24:36):
doesn't work without you, but I will tell you. I actually,
at some point in the process believed him, and yeah,
it's extraordinary play. It doesn't have to work with anybody.
He work with whoever he wants to. I mean, he's
aod Och star. But I thought, oh, oh, this is
different now, because after that point I knew I would
never not work on Broadway unless I didn't want to,
(24:58):
and Broadway was a real goal of mine. In Nashville,
I was a young girl in Nashville going around singing,
start spreading the news.
Speaker 3 (25:06):
My parents were like, what in the heck she do?
Speaker 5 (25:11):
I'm leaving today. I would go around singing that whenever
I went and They're like, what is she? I was
a young girl with big, big, big feelings.
Speaker 2 (25:22):
You know, you have a child that has big, big,
big emotions, a big feelings.
Speaker 3 (25:26):
I was that kid, and they knew not what to do.
You were manifesting before we even had the language for her.
I was, I was.
Speaker 2 (25:32):
But yeah, that was a big moment for me. And
also twenty eighteen when I booked the Morning Show and.
Speaker 1 (25:38):
Let's talk about your Emmy nomination for me. You've called
that a mountaintop.
Speaker 2 (25:42):
That was oh, for sure, sure, I've had many mountaintop moments.
I mean, I think I was somewhere that day and
I just know I've seen all the other names of
the supporting actresses on the show come up, but I
didn't see mine. And then I saw first time Emmy
nominees on the morning show include you know, Karen, and
I was like, I'm a person nominee.
Speaker 3 (26:05):
Wow, I did it.
Speaker 2 (26:06):
I did it finally, and then my shoulders dropped for
a second and they were to my neck because there's
you know, but it was an interesting it was interesting.
I did feel like a big deal in the moment
here at the top of that mountain. And then you're
like time to go back down because you.
Speaker 3 (26:25):
Know, sewing is work, but reaping is work too.
Speaker 2 (26:31):
You can't just take all your things and because you
got to put away, you got to pack up, you
gotta can, you got to freeze, you gotta whatever it is.
Forgive me for being, you know, to agricultural.
Speaker 3 (26:44):
How par can I take this metaphor?
Speaker 2 (26:47):
But having a career in this industry is very much
like agriculture. You are planning seeds, you are nurturing relationships,
you are sewing, you are reaping, and all.
Speaker 3 (26:57):
Of that is work.
Speaker 1 (26:58):
We're going to take a short break, but before we do,
if you are loving this conversation with Karen Pittman as
much as I am, do me a favor and just
copy that link and share it with a friend right now.
Everyone needs a little Karen Pittman in their lives, right Okay, thanks,
You're the best. Now it is time I want to
talk about Don in Forever. Okay, gosh, the show really
(27:24):
impacted me. What do you think was so unique about
don and the way that you portrayed her to elicit
the kind of viral response that you got from this role.
Speaker 2 (27:34):
Well, you know, I think it's really it really is
in the writing. She just sparked my imagination. She made
me want to fill in all those cracks between the
words because the words were so incredible.
Speaker 3 (27:51):
I mean, every word is like a gospel verse in
many ways.
Speaker 2 (27:56):
When she says to Justin, you know these white folks
out here, they say it takes a village until it
comes to our children.
Speaker 3 (28:05):
I'll say that's a word. Do I say that?
Speaker 2 (28:10):
And fill in all the spaces for what she really
means underneath that and what she means on the other
side of it, and underneath it and above it, and
you know, so really being Dawn was about crafting this
character with a lot of with all the nuances, but
(28:30):
grounding the character and care and love.
Speaker 1 (28:34):
So many women have reached out to you to say
that they see themselves.
Speaker 2 (28:38):
So much and really all of my characters. Yes, yes,
there is a strong sense of representation in the work
that I do via Jordan do you know Doctor Niawa,
Professor Wallace and Nahwallace.
Speaker 3 (28:51):
On Sex and City Reboot and for Dawn and Forever.
Speaker 2 (28:56):
And it's interesting, as daunting, little unrelenting. Sometimes as an
artist it makes you feel like, well, I mean, my
commitment is to the art. It can't be a representation,
can't be to representing. The best look for who these
women are has to be being truthful and authentic to
(29:18):
whatever these writers come up with. There are times where
I have conflict with that, but I have faith that
my writers will give me an opportunity to nuance whatever
comes up that I might have conflict with.
Speaker 1 (29:31):
So knowing that your dedication is to the art and
the writing and the character. I know you're also human too,
and you're a black woman and you're a black mother.
Speaker 3 (29:40):
So what does it mean to you?
Speaker 1 (29:42):
And how does it feel whenever you hold up a
mirror for audiences like that and see that response.
Speaker 2 (29:47):
Well, I think it's for me. It's an active political engagement,
it's a service, it's a vocation, it's a ministry. It's
all those highest, you know, life force efforts that we
do as human beings is what I do it for.
I was raised Catholic, I was raised in scripture. I'm
(30:11):
not practicing Catholic anymore. I do love Jesus's teachings, but
I was raised to believe that you have a light
and you have to let it shine.
Speaker 3 (30:21):
God gives you talents, and what are you going to
do with them? Do you know?
Speaker 2 (30:25):
So it feels like a very sincerely I am responsible.
I'm accountable to my life by being a part of that,
being part of helping to craft conversations that get people
talking not where they feel judged, but where they just
start looking inward.
Speaker 1 (30:44):
One of my favorite definitions of community is people who
see your light and protect it. And it seems like
you have that with Marra Brakakiel. Yeah, what has female
friendship given to you when you think about how it's
impacted you and your career friendship?
Speaker 3 (31:05):
Well, it starts really started.
Speaker 2 (31:06):
At home, you know, started with my siblings, my sisters
really and my mother who taught us to always really
put each other first. Loyalty is very important. And then
it ended, it really ended with this deep understanding that
first and foremost that must be a friend to myself.
You know, I tell my daughter this all the time
(31:27):
because you know, young girls they deal with all these
questions and conflicts around self image. I said, if you
don't love you, there's someone who's going to be able
to love you in return. Do you know love you too?
So please work on loving yourself. Please be a good
friend and a best friend to Lena. And my daughter's
name is Lena, and so really those are the two
(31:48):
sort of my sisters and my own sort of journey,
and we're to be kind and loving to myself has
really helped me to create a safe space for my friends,
certainly for women in my line of work in television
and film industry, there's you know, we go through it
and some days we're fine, sometimes we're sad.
Speaker 3 (32:11):
Some days we're like, why did you get that part?
And then other days we're like you ain't that cute?
Like you know?
Speaker 2 (32:16):
And then other days we're like, oh my god, girl,
I can't believe I said that.
Speaker 3 (32:19):
You know, I love you, and you're like, I know
you love me. I'm so glad you're back. Do you
know what I mean?
Speaker 2 (32:23):
It's like, it's not that petty bullshit, it's not that
grudge holding. It's like, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, you
were going through it. Let's keep going together.
Speaker 4 (32:31):
You know.
Speaker 2 (32:32):
It's forgiveness is love, it's creating safe space where people
can just be themselves.
Speaker 1 (32:36):
I know that we're getting a season two of Forever,
which I'm so excited for it too. Do you have
any hopes for Dawn?
Speaker 2 (32:43):
Well, I know that we started this show in twenty eighteen,
so if we're basing it in some sort of historical truth,
and I know that she's going to encounter all of
the things that I encountered in twenty twenty, the death
of Mammatt Arpery, the death of Breanna Taylor, the death
of George Floyd. And I think what the writers did
(33:05):
give me, what Mara gave me, was this idea of
catastrophic parenting and how that creates anxiety and worry and
concern in her. I know that it's going to get
very heightened for her, but I'm interested in what Maraa
is doing.
Speaker 3 (33:19):
She keeps it very close to the vest, but I
trust her. Trust is a beautiful thing. Yes, I trust her. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (33:26):
Well, I've actually seen you say that you don't have
imposter syndrome. No, I don't anymore. You but you had
it at one time, right, No, for sure, but you've
grown out of it.
Speaker 3 (33:35):
I had to.
Speaker 1 (33:36):
I think it's so refreshing to hear women say I
don't have imposter syndrome, because we hear so many women
say that they do have it. We need to see
the models. We're saying you don't have to have it.
So what did it take for you to grow out
of it? Was there a moment, a breakthrough?
Speaker 2 (33:52):
I think maturity a matter of time, extending grace to myself,
making mistakes, huge swings, and you know, you know, we
have a swing in the bat. I think it does
take seeing other women trying things and failing. You know,
(34:14):
when I was growing up, I was an athlete, big
time athlete. So I think the competition can be a
great tool for self knowledge, and as an athlete, I
loved competing because I could learn so much about myself
in the process. And one of my favorite athletes is
Naomi Osaka. And I think Naomi does this extraordinary gift
(34:36):
of letting us see her emotion, her anxiety, all of
her fears, and she doesn't hide them.
Speaker 3 (34:44):
She can't. She actually can't hide them.
Speaker 2 (34:46):
I mean, you see Naomi on a court and she
is joyful and then she's winning. But if Naomi is losing,
you see it all over her face. And what a
gift she gives us by letting her allowing us to
watch her journey. She has a new documentary on to
be called Second Set, and it is about her experience
(35:08):
as a mother after her journey after having had her
daughter at twenty six years old twenty five, twenty six
years old, she says, people have said that my career
is over, but they don't understand as it's just starting.
And it just so touched me deeply that she figured
that out. I wish I had known it twenty five,
that you know, opening yourself into areas where you don't
(35:32):
know how it's going to turn out. Great risk is
actually going to expand you in ways that you cannot foresee,
you can't imagine, you know, on the other side of
what that process is going to look like. And so
watching other women you know, do it has really helped
me to do it too. What's behind the emotion I'm
seeing in I just think I just think it's a
(35:53):
just special one. I think she's very special. I think
I just you know, I have such a fondness for me.
But also any woman who's like, gone there, I just
you know, it's empathy.
Speaker 3 (36:07):
M h. I'm an actor, got big feelings. I got
such big feelings. Child is exhausting, how many big feelings
I have? Lord free me from these big failings.
Speaker 2 (36:17):
But but yeah, I mean I felt that same way
when I saw Michelle Obama tak you know.
Speaker 3 (36:25):
What she's been through that poor Mega Markle, Oh my god.
And also Ree's been through so much Jennifer, like I
have deep, deep, deep empthy mar, I have deep empathy
for these people who have walked through these storms on
their own, these women who walk through the storms on
their own and come out on the other side. I mean,
(36:45):
Reese is a perfect example. She has set a template.
She really is.
Speaker 2 (36:52):
She set a template for how women get through periods
in their careers where they can't or they're not given
the opportunity work.
Speaker 3 (37:01):
She blazed trail and that's not just you know, you
don't just say that lightly.
Speaker 2 (37:06):
I know this is on Hello Sunshine, this our company,
but I do mean this literally act of trail blazing
is actually a very lonely and daunting pursuit. And she
figured it out and now so many other people, so
many other women will know she went that direction.
Speaker 3 (37:24):
That's the way I go, do you know what I mean?
Speaker 1 (37:26):
Oh?
Speaker 2 (37:27):
So I learned no imposter syndrome because of just you know,
watching other people, but also just you know, failing failing forward.
Speaker 1 (37:35):
You know what, Karen, I'm having a moment right now
because I'm realizing why.
Speaker 3 (37:40):
You are the talent that you are.
Speaker 2 (37:42):
Oh.
Speaker 3 (37:43):
When I watch your work, you're honestly one of my
favorite actors to watch, so good you are.
Speaker 1 (37:47):
I always have a bunch of screens going whenever I'm
watching stuff, because add and the Internet and everything. Whenever
you come on screen, or whenever I find out, oh,
Karen Pittman's in this, Oh, let me put my stuff down.
Speaker 5 (37:58):
Let me lock in, Let me pay everybody be exactly
Karen Pittman is on.
Speaker 1 (38:05):
But what I'm realizing now talking to you, Karen Pittman,
like the woman behind all these characters, and seeing the
deep empathy that you have in the way that you
are just filled with emotion, talking about the women who
inspire you like this is what makes you a truly
(38:26):
generational talent.
Speaker 3 (38:27):
Oh, thank you. Yeah to you, Simon.
Speaker 2 (38:30):
It's us together that that's doing this, that's having this
moment a deep, soulful, spiritual experience.
Speaker 3 (38:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (38:38):
I feel so lucky that we get to witness you
as you're building this body of work.
Speaker 3 (38:43):
No, that's what's happening. You're building a legendary body of work.
Oh clod, I'm so glad you feel like that, because
I hope I am.
Speaker 1 (38:50):
Okay, I need to lighten the mood for a minute.
I want to end on a silly note. Okay, when
I was working in news, I worked in news for
many years and people will often ask me to do
my anchor voice. Ah yah, have you have you ever
just dabbled in a news anchor and.
Speaker 3 (39:05):
Pressures you have to we have to you kidding me?
Can I hear it?
Speaker 1 (39:10):
Hi?
Speaker 3 (39:10):
This is Karen Pitman and you are watching the bride side.
I don't know what that was perfect.
Speaker 1 (39:18):
Karen Pittman, thank you so much for coming on the
bright Side.
Speaker 3 (39:22):
We did, We did.
Speaker 1 (39:27):
Karen Pittman is an Emmy nominated actor and star of
the Morning Show. Season four is available on Apple TV
right now. The bright Side is a production of Hello
Sunshine and iHeart Podcasts and is executive produced by Rhyese,
Witherspoon and me Simone Boyce. Production is by A Cast
Creative Studios. Our producers are Taylor Williamson, Adrian Bain, Abby Delk,
(39:52):
and Darby Masters.
Speaker 3 (39:53):
Our production assistant is.
Speaker 1 (39:54):
Joya putnoy A Casts Executive producers are Jenny Kaplan and
Emily Rudder. Maureen Polo, Andrhyese Witherspoon are the executive producers
for Hello Sunshine. Ali Perry and Lauren Hansen are the
executive producers for iHeart Podcasts. Our theme song is by
Anna Stump and Hamilton Lakehauser.
Host
Simone Boyce
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