April 17, 2025 • 54 mins
Justin and Carter take a look at the Atlanta Hawks and Miami Heat to preview what a potential matchup would look like against both teams. What can be learned from either series, what challenges the Cavs may face against each team, and how we believe they would perform.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
This crowd rises to its being what Barlow slamming it? Oh,
Carl left wing, free ball, perfect pop.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
The block, the shot at the rim, how with the
left hand and of fowl.
Speaker 3 (00:16):
Welcome to Chase Doown Podcast, part of the CAZ Media family.
I'm your host Justin Rohan. The Chase Doown is presented
by Fubo, the official streaming partner of the Calves. Watch
over three hundred and fifty channels of live sports and TV,
including FanDuel Sports Network without gable, There's no cost and
no commitment. Try for free at FuboTV dot com Slash Calves.
We finally have some clarity about who the Cavs first
(00:37):
round opponent is going to be. We've at least eliminated
to really from the mix h The Chicago Bulls lost
to the Miami Heat just before we started recording this.
Orlando Magic beat the Atlanta Hawks yesterday, so we know
the Caves will be playing one of the Atlanta Hawks
or the Miami Heat. Joining me today to the attempt
(00:57):
to break down this first round is my co host
Carter Rodrigue.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
Carter, how are you doing, buddy?
Speaker 1 (01:01):
Attempt? It sounds like you're not sure we're going to
be able to do it.
Speaker 2 (01:05):
You know.
Speaker 3 (01:05):
It's it's honestly the weirdest preview that we've done, because
going into the playing we knew exactly who we're playing.
Going into the nixt series, we knew who that they
were going to play. We had a full week, you know,
to break that down. We were able to do the
same thing for the Orlando Magic. This is really the
first time that you know, we're going into a series
and you know, we're going to find out two.
Speaker 2 (01:27):
Days before We're going.
Speaker 3 (01:28):
To find out two days before Sunday who the Cavs
are playing. And I'm interested to see what that dynamic
is really like.
Speaker 1 (01:35):
You know, I think you could be guilty of accusing
Adam Silver of too often listening to podcasters and worrying
about what podcasters want. Talk about an inverted situation, you know,
the monkey paw curly. You might be right there for
everyone but podcasters.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
Baby.
Speaker 3 (01:56):
Well, here here's the funny thing, because Richard Jefferson brought
this up on the tonight about how the Miami Heat,
if they do make it through and if they are
able to beat the Atlanta Hawks on Friday, they're basically
going to be on the road eight days coming into
game one of the playoffs. That is quite the disadvantage.
And obviously, you know, if you're going to be the
(02:16):
ten seed in the play in and earn your way
to the playoffs, you should have to climb an uphill
you know, that should be an uphill battle. I'm not
feeling any sympathy for them, but when you talk about
the cows inability to really prepare specifically for one team,
I'm sure now they're going to be in the process
of game planning for both the Hawks and the Heat.
(02:38):
I still think that the lower seed is definitely at
a disadvantage here.
Speaker 1 (02:43):
Yeah, no kidding, It's going to be interesting to see.
I mean, I am now. You know, you never know
exactly how you feel about this stuff till the dust settles.
Sometimes it's like when you're when you're when you're partner
and you are talking about restaurants and you've you've listed
(03:05):
two that you'd be okay with, and then they pick
one and you go, ah, that's not the one I wanted,
you know, and you didn't really realize it wasn't the
one you wanted till someone picked the other one. I
kind of feel that way about the Orlando Magic. The
second they stop being available, I was like, I'm kind
of glad I don't have to deal.
Speaker 2 (03:25):
With that, Okay, So it's basically.
Speaker 3 (03:30):
That's an inverse scenario. I've I recognize that on the
front end as much as I want to, you know, show, Hey,
this is a different situation than it was last year.
Let's be honest, No, Geelan Suggs, that changes the complexion
of the series. I already know that this is a
better cast team than it was last year. And you know,
no more Wagner like if what's the point of beating
(03:51):
the Orlando Magic in five games if you can't rub
it in most face, like, it's not the same when
he's on the bench. So I'm more than half be
to see the Boston Celtics go up against the Orlando Magic.
And even if that series goes four or five games,
physically it's probably going to feel like a six game
series because that that is just what it's like to
play Orlando.
Speaker 1 (04:12):
Yeah, I mean, one can hope that, you know, the
battle of attrition that is the playoffs takes its toll
on the Celtics. Obviously don't want to root for anyone
to get hurt. But you know, it's hard work playing
those Magic It sucks. They hack more than any other
team in the league. It's a key part of their identity.
And for a team that has struggled with the injury bug, like,
(04:36):
it's kind of nice to avoid that.
Speaker 2 (04:39):
Now.
Speaker 1 (04:39):
Atlanta is a pretty physical team too, you know, they
they'll beat you up a little bit. Daniels will get
into the passing lanes. But you know, I do think
there's still a pretty big difference between that in Orlando
at the end of the day, and you know, there's
also just more spots on the Atlanta team to attack,
(05:02):
you know. So overall, definitely happy to see Orlando. I
was pretty indifferent. I didn't think Chicago was getting getting
out of this thing.
Speaker 2 (05:11):
I actually did.
Speaker 3 (05:12):
I thought Chicago had a real chance because when you're
looking at the post All Star Break stretch, they were
almost like March doesn't matter, justin they were seventeen and ten.
They you know, post All Star breaks, number ten offense,
number fourteen defense. You know, they were trending in the
right direction here, and you know, some of it I
(05:32):
think is, hey, the Miami Heat, they are tough to
kill no matter who is available for them. They always
seem to get one game off of a team in
a playoff series. They always seem to find a way
to squeeze a little bit more life out of that
towel and find a way to extend their season. So
I'm not surprised to see them win, But part of
(05:53):
me wondered, hey, you know, there's no Jimmy.
Speaker 2 (05:55):
Butler this time around.
Speaker 3 (05:57):
They've kind of had a tiring, tiring season. Are are
they ready to just kind of check out as the
ten seed going into the play And you know, the
answer that we got tonight is absolutely not. I'm actually
curious to ask you about this because we've talked about
the play in the last couple of years, and I
think we both have generally been fans of it, as
(06:18):
your opinion evolved at all, now that we have more
of a sample size, like I think, coming in, both
of us liked it, and then the Cavs got eliminated
in the play in, and even despite that, I was
still saying, sitting here saying I think this.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
Is a net good for the league. Do you still
feel that way? I do.
Speaker 1 (06:38):
I think this year wasn't maybe the most sterling example
for it just because there was such a difference between
seven through ten and eleven through fifteen in each conference.
Speaker 2 (06:53):
Yeah, you know.
Speaker 1 (06:55):
Where where there wasn't you know, you didn't see Toronto
desperately trying to get into the play in. That's one
of the things I've liked about it is that the middle,
the lower middle class of the league is less likely
to tank if they have a couple of postseason games
of revenue that they might be able to chase.
Speaker 2 (07:19):
So you didn't have that, But.
Speaker 1 (07:21):
What you did have at West is this, you know,
vicious race from the third seed to the eight seed
trying to desperately avoid it and the other. So if
I thought that it did more, I thought it did
more to help with tanking than lottery of reform. And
(07:42):
I also think what it did was it made it
so there's six playoff spots, not not ten. Everyone's complaining
that there's no ten. I'm saying there's only six. You know,
we have a six and a wild card and that,
and and I think that tension was really really good
out West. So even in a year where I don't
think it was perfect for like selling the play in,
(08:04):
I still think it's a net good. It's It's funny
because I think one this being such a great draft
class probably shifted incentives for some of those lower teams.
And I also think in the Eastern Conference, if Orlando
was healthier for the majority of the season, all of
a sudden, you have a seventh team and you're going
to have a little bit of a race to avoid
(08:25):
the play in right like Detroit with their forty four
and thirty eight record, that's the exact same record that
the Cavs had when they were the eight seed and
lost in the play in right like. Normally that gets
pushed down a little bit further. If Philadelphia was healthier,
you would have, you know, another team in that mix.
And honestly, as much as I hate to ever credit
(08:46):
the Toronto Raptors, if that team was healthy and had
their full roster available to them, you know, Emmanuel quickly, RJ.
Barrett Brandon Ingram.
Speaker 2 (08:58):
You're missing the elephant in the room. Philly. I already
said Philly. Oh, you said Philly. Okay, I led with them,
good sir. Oh, actually I led with Orlando.
Speaker 1 (09:06):
Yeah, yeah, I heard Orlando in Toronto. I didn't hear
anything about Philly.
Speaker 2 (09:10):
Nah.
Speaker 3 (09:10):
I'm pretty sure I had them in there. If not,
that's on me, So thank you to hold this man accountable.
Don't hold me accountable if I'm wrong though, No, it's okay,
But you know, having those extra teams in the mix
would have caused more of that race for six.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
And really, the way that.
Speaker 3 (09:24):
I look at it is it's more of a punishment
for seven and eight than it is a reward for
nine and ten. Like, you know, you're really setting up
that you know your season can fall apart in two games,
so you better try like hell to avoid this thing.
And you know it does give Let's say, you know,
EMBIID didn't have to be shut down for the year
(09:47):
and they could kind of stick around in that nine
tenth spot allows it a good team that just had
bad injury luck to have a chance to come in.
Obviously that sucks for whoever sitting there in the one seed,
but it's it's not like we haven't seen those scenarios before.
So I feel like it's a net positive and in
generally enjoy the games, and I feel like there has
been some really good playing games over over the last
(10:09):
couple of years, and there's also been some really good
game maybe two. It's as bad as some of them
March in April. Basketball can be when there it's teams
in that race, particularly when they're playing against one another,
you can get some really really good basketball.
Speaker 1 (10:23):
Yeah, and even like when it's not both teams that
are participating, but you know, Harrison Barnes hits a game
winner against Golden State pushes them into the play in
now they now they have to fight for their lives.
Now they get a very green young Rockets team to
go up against, and it's going to be, you know,
the old age versus beauty type of matchup. And like,
(10:45):
now you get something really interesting based off a game
that in you know, the old days.
Speaker 2 (10:49):
Just would be well whatever.
Speaker 1 (10:51):
You know, Like I do think there is a lot
of net benefit and you know, I think almost you know,
you're really not even seeing the discord us about the
play anymore. I feel like it was just a pretty
universally successful initiative.
Speaker 3 (11:06):
No, no, I've seen like the odd bad faith kind
of argument, But in general, I feel like this is
something that you know, as we get more years of
experience with it, right, as it becomes more and more normalized.
People once something no longer feels new, they stop feeling
the need to pick it apart, and it just gets
(11:28):
accepted as part of the game. And I like that
it's around who do you think?
Speaker 2 (11:33):
You know? But before we dive.
Speaker 3 (11:34):
Into kind of the strengths of both Atlanta as well
as Miami and how they match up against the Calves,
how do you think that game is going to play
out on Friday?
Speaker 1 (11:44):
You know, I'm just going to pick Miami. I think
they're a healthier team. I think they're a more you know,
they've got more guys with playoff scars. You look at Atlanta,
if you look at their normal roster, you definitely pick them.
But you know, Mo Gay is playing for them, Dominic
(12:04):
Barlow is playing for them again like real minutes. You know,
these are the guys you kind of expect to be
playing in March and April as the team is a
little banged up. But then you know, then they clear
out of the way for the tight rotation, and you know,
Quinn Snyder played ten guys against Orlando, uh, And I
(12:27):
just I just don't think they've got the depth. And
I think Miami has a lot of guys to throw
at Tray to make his life hard, you know. Davion
Mitchell is just the perfect Heat culture player.
Speaker 2 (12:42):
Yeah. Uh.
Speaker 1 (12:44):
Hero went absolutely ballistic tonight, you know, and and the
other really good players in the Hawks. I just kind
of feel like the the Heat kind of have good
answers for you know, like me and you love Okongwu,
but he is is he not?
Speaker 2 (13:00):
You know, great value brand?
Speaker 1 (13:02):
Bam out of Byo, Yeah, he's not going to get
to do O Kong Wui stuff against Bam.
Speaker 2 (13:11):
Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (13:13):
I feel like of the players that are available, obviously,
I think this is a different conversation if Jalen Johnson
was available for Atlanta. I think there was an argument
that he was their most impactful player when he was healthy.
Speaker 2 (13:25):
But you have to give the coaching edge to.
Speaker 3 (13:28):
Spolstra because I just think that he is not the
best coach in the league. He's top three, right, like,
I think just from track record what he's been able
to do with that team, I think he's as good
as it gets.
Speaker 2 (13:40):
You know.
Speaker 3 (13:40):
Bam out of Bayo, I think is one of the
best defensive players in the league. He's a top five
defensive player. Tyler Hero was an All Star this year.
He's been terrific. Andrew Wiggins gave them really, really good
minutes against Chicago and he's capable of playing well. So
I definitely am leaning Miami, which is funny because I
really felt like Chicago had a chance to come out
out of this thing. But you know, maybe this is
(14:03):
just you know, the the rock paper scissors of the NBA,
and I'm just learning, Oh my, Miami is still rock.
Speaker 2 (14:10):
They're going to make it through it.
Speaker 3 (14:12):
They beat Chicago, so therefore they get to keep the
belt and they get to advance.
Speaker 1 (14:17):
Yeah, I think it just it also like you have
a little bit of positive momentum on your side.
Speaker 2 (14:23):
I mean, I'll be interested, that's your point.
Speaker 1 (14:25):
Actually, yeah, once the play in, you know, gets fifteen
twenty years of data under its belt, I will be
curious to see how often the nine to ten winner
kind of can sneak in.
Speaker 2 (14:39):
There's no ending.
Speaker 1 (14:39):
They're coming off a win, the other team's coming off
a loss, you know, and there is like I mean,
I remember feeling it in the seven eight game three
years ago, like.
Speaker 2 (14:49):
Oh no, we lost, Now what's going to happen?
Speaker 1 (14:53):
Like yeah, like you know, there's just this different kind
of angst that that creeps in as at least as
a And so I'm gonna pick Miami to win. I
think that's if I'm the Cavs video staff, maybe I'm
putting my best guys on Miami and a sixty forty
split sixty forty attention split PERHBS. But of course that's
(15:15):
not why I don't run a film room, because that's
probably not how that works at all.
Speaker 3 (15:19):
Yeah, you know, basketball's a game of runs. When you're
coming off a win, that gives you that extra little boost.
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Let's take a look at these teams, Carter. The thing
that jumps out to me right away when I'm kind
of looking at the season long stats, and this is
very often the case when you are talking about what
is functionally you know, the the eight seed and the
ten seed right now competing for the eighth spot in
(16:03):
the history books. These are not perfect teams. These are
not teams that have a glaring strength. I would say
Atlanta is seventeenth in offense and eighteenth in defense, below
average in both or about average in both. Miami is
the number twenty one offense, number nine defense, So you
know there's a top ten trade. You at least expect
(16:25):
an Eric Spolster team to play very well defensively, and
I think we've seen that in some of those matchups.
But what's going to be interesting to me is that
the Cavs, on the other hand, have been really, really
good across the board, and when you look at some
of the areas where maybe there's been some slippage, like
their number twenty two defensive rebound rate, neither of these
(16:48):
teams really seem poise to take advantage of that. Atlanta
is eight thirteenth in offensive rebound rate and Miami is
twenty seventh. So if your prediction and my prediction is
true Miami heat advanced through this, that is not a
team that is likely to beat them up on the
offensive glass.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
No, and I mean just up and down. These are
the definition of.
Speaker 2 (17:13):
Teams.
Speaker 1 (17:14):
You know, you look you look at the standings and
you see Miami with a plus point six point differential
in the year in Atlanta with a minus one point one.
I think it's important to say. I mean, anyone who's
listening to this podcast already knows this, but the Cavs
should win their series in four or five games. Yeah,
(17:36):
it would be very surprising just based on the profiles
of the two teams if it went any other way.
You know, teams that outscore their opponent by ten points
a game rarely lose series. Two teams that almost get
outscored on the season or finish their season eight games
under five hundred. So important to say that. I will say,
(18:00):
you know, this is where on the Atlanta side, I
guess I'd like to start. On the Atlanta side, not
having Capella available is hard for them.
Speaker 2 (18:11):
You know.
Speaker 1 (18:12):
They just don't have a lot of size that's impactful.
Okongwu is a very good offensive rebounder, Mogay is okay
at it, but that's.
Speaker 2 (18:22):
Kind of it, you know, and.
Speaker 1 (18:26):
They don't have a lot of just BV big men.
Dominic Barlow I think is you know a little bit
you know of a tweener forward. He's not someone who's
going to beat you up. And then guys who down
their roster. You know, Daniels is a pretty good rebounders
because he's a big guard. Reache is not as good
(18:47):
as his size, but indicate Brett Young is obviously famously hurt, horrific.
And then you look at the bench, it's niang Lavert
like who you know, never were great rebounders for the
Calves and still aren't for Atlanta. And then you guy
like Terence Man, who you know once was a very
hot prospect for the Clippers, only played ten minutes in
(19:10):
that game against Orlando, and you know he was one
of he was a good glass crasher in for the Clippers,
but you know, he's just not important enough for them.
So like, I just think they're not really that well
built to beat us up physically, either on the glass
or just in general.
Speaker 3 (19:30):
No, they really aren't. And when I'm looking at these matchups,
I don't think that these teams should have a chance
in the series. But you never know, if there's one
aspect that at least the Calves can say, hey, this
is a strength of theirs, let's work to take that away.
And when it comes to the Atlanta Hawks, they like
(19:50):
to get out in transition. They're number one in transition frequency,
and for the Calves, transition defense it isn't poor, but
it's not their biggest strength. There are eleventh in transition defense,
and I'd be really interested to see if you do
ultimately end up playing the Atlanta Hawks and they are
getting out and running, maybe that is an opportunity for
(20:10):
the Cavs to work on their transition defense, because if
you end up playing the Indiana Pacers in the second round,
you know that's a team that's going to get out
and run. Boston may try to get out and run,
and even though they're not the highest frequency transition team,
how you defend those transition attempts versus Boston, whether you
are finding the shooters in the corner, whether you're finding
(20:33):
those guys streaking up and down the court, how you
defend those possessions might be the difference in a series
that we believe is going to have very thin margins.
So I still think that there are things that you
can take from these individual matchups, even though you are
at an advantage and you should be the overwhelming favorite
to win that series, because as I said, the Caves
(20:53):
are eleventh in transition defense their fifth and half court defense.
So typically when you have that as an indicator, that
says your defense is going to be better in the postseason.
But I still think that, you know, when I look
at Atlanta, that's the number one thing that I'm looking at.
They are a slightly above average offensive rebounding team. It's
(21:15):
hard to use season averages when they are missing guys
and they are banged up. But the one thing that
we know they're going to do is they're going to
get out and run. And because they know that they're
at a talent deficit and they know that they know
they're the eight seed versus the one seed, I would
expect them to get up threes at a higher rate
because really, three point attempts and three point variants, that's
(21:38):
probably your best chance at a great equalizer. That game
that they won in Cleveland, not the weird Thanksgiving afternoon game,
but the one. The game they won in Cleveland, they
got fewer than their normal average in terms of wide
open three point looks. They just made them at a
really really high clip in a game where the Calves
(21:58):
generated I think it was thirty two wide open three
point attempts and just didn't make any of them. Your
best chance of getting a game off the Calves is
by banking on that kind of variant. So I'd expect
them to get try to get easy baskets and transition
and try to get those three pointers up at a high,
high rate.
Speaker 1 (22:15):
Yeah, and I think the other thing they're going to
try to do is just try to get the Calves
in rotation. I'll be really interested to see what the
Calves decided to do defensively in that series if it
comes to pass. You know, one thing that we really
criticized JB and the game plan for in that play
(22:37):
in game three years ago was that, you know, they
kind of left what they were doing and we're just
and then we're very rigid. You know, they said we're
gonna switch everything. First half, it was going quite well.
Second half, Trey Young figured out that, yeah, I can
score on Lowry Markinen and just it was just a
(22:58):
parade of you know, beating marketing off the dribble, help
having to come against set shooters, and just feeding the corners,
feeding lob threats, feeding. You know, Trey is at his best,
one of the great offensive engines in the league. You know,
when when he when the when the jumper is going
(23:20):
for him. I mean, he is a passing savant. He
led the league and assist this year. And I'll be
really interested to see how different the Calves want to
get with their defensive fundamentals and how they want to
chase him. You know, are they just going to switch everything? Uh,
that's certainly a strategy. Are they going to Are they
(23:41):
going to show him size and put two on the
ball and make him outlet and trust the rotations on
the back end?
Speaker 2 (23:49):
Uh?
Speaker 1 (23:49):
You know, probably don't want to play a ton of
drop on Trey. That's kind of one of the things
he likes to likes to to beat up. But like,
how are you going to both corral him and keep
the keep the uh, you know, corral has passing and
not just let him go ballistic on an army of
(24:09):
floaters like this very well could be a series where
Trey scores forty plus in two or three games. That's
kind of my opinion, kind of their only road to
stealing two or three games in this series.
Speaker 3 (24:21):
Yeah, there's something I want to say, and I don't
want it to be as disrespectful as it's going to sound.
But I'm going to say it anyways, and it's just
going to sound that way, But in a lot of ways,
he's scout teams Tyrese haliburtn Like you know, you get
you get to practice what you're going to have to
do against Tyrese Halliburn VERSU Tray Young, just like you know,
(24:41):
Ben Simmons was the stand in for Jokic for the Clippers,
Like you know, that's obviously Trey Young is much closer
to Tyrese Halliburn, but how you have to defend him
is going to be very similar. Obviously, there's no way
to guarantee that the Indiana Pacers are going to make
it to the next round. But these are the type
(25:01):
of things that you you kind of have to look into,
right Like, you want to challenge yourself. You want to
gain experience of making the adjustments, trying to take away
the strengths. Even if you don't need to make adjustments
to win the series, you still want to get that practice.
So you want to, you know, get that muscle memory
(25:21):
of the execution. And I think that's really what I'm
trying to take away from this first round here, That's
what I really really want to learn because the last
two years first round series has been a dogfight. One
of them they lost, one of them they won, but
it never really felt like they were fully in control
of the series. And now the Calves have the talent,
(25:43):
they have the health, they have everything that they need to,
you know, impose their will on a series. It's about
are they able to do that effectively? Is are they
able to be as dominant as they were in the
regular season. And you know, coming into game one and two, yeah,
you don't know who your opponent is until two days before,
(26:04):
but really like games one and two, you're kind of
coming out with your base plan to some extent, like
you are going to tweak your game plan to what
you think is going to work well against the other team.
But typically game three is where you really see adjustments
in a series. I'm sure the Cavs have a game
plan in mind for the Atlanta Hawks and for the
Miami Heat. They're going to highlight things in the film session,
(26:26):
but you're not really going to deviate from that game
one game plan for the first two games because you're
trying to get an appropriate sample size as well of
a like you know this, we think this work is
going to work, even if it didn't work particularly well
in Game one, and that little chess match. Chess matches
(26:47):
is what I'm looking for here.
Speaker 1 (26:48):
Yeah, I think really like what you're talking about isn't
necessarily about playing perfectly. It's about, you know, imposing your style. Yes,
And like I think as impressive as I thought that
Magic series was for the Cavs, I'm not sure I
would say they imposed their style. They played an Orlando
game and just beat Orlando at Orlando's game, you know,
(27:12):
I would actually argue they played more close to Cavaliers
basketball against the Celtics, uh than.
Speaker 2 (27:22):
Lando.
Speaker 3 (27:23):
The Orlando series was trusting the defense, they got in
a rock fight, and Donovan Mitchell happened to be better
than Palo Bank Carol. Like that's really what it came
down to, Like kind of that lead initiator was the
lead initiator and Mitchell did a better.
Speaker 2 (27:37):
Job of it.
Speaker 1 (27:38):
Yeah, I think like what you want at some point
is Atlanta to be kind of looking around at their
you know, looking around at each other and the huddle
going what we need to change everything? Like that's what
you want them to have to be saying, because like
we're not in control of this series in any meaningful way,
(28:00):
and like that's what I think you really want to see.
But with that said, I do want to ask a
couple of rotation questions before we pivot over to Okay, Miami,
Is this an Isaca Korro series?
Speaker 3 (28:14):
Yes, you're playing Tray Young. I would like to see, Honestly,
I would like to have a Coro in the early
rotation of all of these kind of matchups, no matter
who we're playing, even if it doesn't feel like as
much of an Icycle Coro series on paper, at least
from the defensive standpoint, because I want to get him
those reps offensively, and I want to see if we can,
(28:36):
you know, with the new ways that we're using him,
if he can be an effective part of the rotation
kind of regardless of matchup, we're still talking about someone that's,
you know what, twenty three years old here, Like, getting
good data on Isco Coro is a really important thing
for me. So I obviously against Trey Young, I think
he does as good of a job as anybody in
(28:58):
the league, So it's definitely a yes for me. But
I just wanted to have that qualifier of even if
it's a series where it isn't as important even if
you're playing a Milwaukee Bucks where there isn't a huge
strategic advantage of putting him on a dynamic guard. I
would still like to see Isaac Ocor out there in
the early series rotation.
Speaker 1 (29:19):
Yeah, I would too. I asked the question because I
do think it is. What's going to be important though
for him is making Atlanta pay when they have Trey
sashed on him. Yes, he needs to bully him, He
needs to use his physicality. He needs to be a
great screener for the guards to get Dyson Daniels, who
(29:41):
is there, you know, one of the best point of
attack guard defenders in the NBA. Get him out of
the paint, get him away from from Darius and Donovan
when they have the ball. You know, because I do
imagine a lot of Okuoros Mints will come at the
two in this in this series if he's going to
be a major part of your rotation, So you're not
(30:02):
going to have two of Darius Donovan tie and some
of those lineups.
Speaker 2 (30:07):
Some of them you will, But like you know, just.
Speaker 1 (30:10):
In terms of making because Atlanta has pretty good positional size,
you know, it gets really messy to be like, all right,
tied Jerome, you got Resa Shay who's six' ten playing small,
forward like you're gonna you're gonna have to make some you,
know some interesting lineup decisions with who is guarding who
(30:30):
and the in the minutes Where okoro's at the, three
if you want him going and chasing around the only
small player on the floor For, ATLANTA.
Speaker 2 (30:38):
I agree with.
Speaker 3 (30:39):
You i'm very curious if we're going to be right,
Though Like i'm very curious to see if we change
up the rotation or if we end up seeing you,
know the constant two guard no matter, what and even
some three guard lineups would Sam, Merril i'm, really, really
really curious to see if that ultimately is the, case
(31:00):
because what you're saying makes absolute. SENSE i think this
is a series for the calves to use their. Wings
because you have wings, available you have the option to
play it. Larger we'll see if that ends up coming to.
Fruition that's that's one of those things we may learn
about How Kenny atkinson chooses to approach the playoffs that
(31:20):
you're just not going to learn until you're in the.
Speaker 1 (31:21):
Playoffs, yeah for, sure and THEN i And i'll let
you also do closing thoughts in a final pick if It's.
Atlanta BUT i just think at the end of the,
day they just don't have enough answers for what The
calves have from a roster. Perspective you, know we were
talking on the discord today AND i think you Mentioned
(31:42):
George niang is gonna have to put in shifts On
Evan mobley like.
Speaker 2 (31:46):
You stole my series. Preview i'm, sorry you, know AND
i just.
Speaker 1 (31:52):
Or it's going to Be mogay And Don, barlow and you,
know it's like like WHAT i suspect will happen in
this series if it goes the way we hope it,
goes is one of The hawks role players is going
to be getting, cooked whether It's, niang whether It's, barlow
whether whoever it. Is and someone's gonna say we got
(32:15):
to get them off the, floor and smart fans of
The hawks will say for, who you, know like they
JUST i just think their toolkit isn't quite big. ENOUGH i,
mean you can downshift a, little you, know you can
Do vitkritchi and Parents man and play uber small, ball but,
LIKE i just DON'T i don't think they've got enough guys,
(32:38):
that you, know you really really can.
Speaker 3 (32:40):
Trust, yeah like you might switch like we talk About
icicle korl moving down the you know assignments playing small
four but Guarding Tray young and some of the cross
matching you're doing. There you might have the same thing
on The hawks, side just even, reverse Where reesaha is
playing shooting guard but he's Guarding Evan mobley as the,
four And George niang is like sliding down to Guard
(33:03):
Isaac okoro or something on those, lines, right because that's
not going to be a beneficial. MATCHUP i think that
would look a lot like when he was trying to
Guard palo in last Year's Magic, series which you, know
when you look at how Good Evan mobley has gone
in space and also just how Good Evan mobley is
at finishing over, guys like that's that's the biggest.
Speaker 1 (33:23):
One and they won't give you the bailout Stuff pala gives, you.
Speaker 2 (33:27):
Right and like.
Speaker 3 (33:30):
Okong wu is six eight six,' Nine george nangs six,
Y seven mogay's got some, good length but not a.
Big dude mobley just finishes, Over GUYS and i think
we are Going to we've talked about it for Years
That evan mobley is going to be the one that
(33:50):
dictates how Far the cavs go and. All THAT but
i think we're really going to get a feel for
how Much Better evan mobley is and how his game
is going to translate to the playoffs in game one of.
Round one, Is this both of these matchups should be
Series Where evan mobley plays a very, significant ROLE and
i think getting him going should be goal number one in.
(34:14):
The playoffs we need To Have evan mobley playing, really well,
playing confident and, you know being a two way monster.
OUT there i think that Is the cav's best pathway.
To success and if we can build positive momentum in,
that direction why not start in?
Speaker 1 (34:29):
Round, one bear what's your pick For A atlanta Hawk's cliving?
Cavaliers series CAAs. And four I'm going calves. IN five
I think I think trey is capable of stealing the game.
AGAINST anyone i think they have enough. Shooting variants they
have shooting talent on.
Speaker 2 (34:46):
That, roster Yes and karis can go for, forty one we, know,
That yeah.
Speaker 1 (34:52):
SO like i just think they have enough volatility offensively that,
YOU know i think they've what eighteenth, On OFFENSE but
i think there are nights where they look like the
fifth best offense in, the league, you, Know yep and
there're just other nights where they look like the twenty
fifth and that's how you get. To eighteenth BUT but
(35:13):
i think they're just a more valid old team than
their averages kind of make. Them Look so I'm going calves.
IN five i want To. Talk miami you want to.
Go first here's, The.
Speaker 3 (35:24):
THING miami I think i really want THEM because i
Want the calves to experience some form of a test in.
The PLAYOFFS and i think going Up Against eric spolstra
is going to force them to make the types of
ADJUSTMENTS that i, Was, saying hey that's that's what you
want to, experience with that's what you want to kind
of try out in. The, PLAYOFFS here I think spoe
is going to throw different things. AT them i think
(35:46):
they're going to be forced to do. Problem solving and
if my, primary motivation if my number one area of
interest heading into the first round Is Can evin mobley get?
It Going Can evin mobley show that this, is different
that he is ready to do what's necessary to get
this team a championship. This season going UP against Bam
(36:07):
At a bayo is the perfect matchup to make that
kind of, a statement because bam. Is phenomenal he's someone
that we have compared, mobily to, you know basically since
he entered the league that we wanted to see him
basically be a Bigger Bam. Ata bayo that matchup would,
Be fascinating the coaching matchup would, Be FASCINATING and I
(36:28):
think miami has the ability to really Test, the calves
not in terms of pushing, the SERIES but i think
they'd have to play at a higher level than they
Would against atlanta in order to win the series in
four or.
Speaker 1 (36:41):
Five games it's a weird THING where i don't disagree
with anything you, just SAID but i do have this
weird HEADSPACE where i feel Like the hawks will Test
the calves stylistically, more okay because of the Singularity, of trey,
(37:03):
you know the style and the way he binds and
breaks your brain a little bit when he's, Really ON
whereas i feel Like the calves will play won't have
to make one change to the way they've played all
year To. Beat miami they just will have to execute very.
Speaker 3 (37:21):
Very well let me ask, YOU this i agree that
how you have to Account For. Trey young that's a
different beast Than What tyler herro is going. To DO
like I Trust donovan mitchell To Guard, TYLER hero i
trust guys up and down the roster To Guard.
Speaker 2 (37:37):
Tyler hero are you.
Speaker 3 (37:39):
Trying to learn about the defense or you're trying to
learn about, the OFFENSE because i want to learn about,
the OFFENSE and I think miami is going to Test
the cavs offense, as much if not More than atlanta
would Test the. Cavs DEFENSE and i don't worry About the.
CAVES defense i understand that theoretically that might come up
at some point in, the playoffs but it has not
(38:01):
at any point to. This point AND because i want
to learn about the offense translating in, THE playoffs I
think miami is the more interesting test for.
Speaker 2 (38:09):
That, Reason yeah i'm not even. Saying it lana is.
Speaker 1 (38:12):
More interesting IT'S just i just think it's a style
thing in terms of How the calves might tweak what.
They're doing and part of it's Just because atlana's got more,
weak points then you might that you're more willing to
go out of your way, to attack, you know if that,
makes sense you might so you might just do things
(38:34):
differently on both ends of the ball than what you've done. All,
YEAR like i don't you want to see if we're
going to match, up hunt like if we're just going
to get really all.
Speaker 2 (38:41):
THAT time i don't even KNOW if i want.
Speaker 1 (38:42):
TO see i just kind of think, they might, YOU
know i think they might just behave a, little Differently
whereas miami is just like they play one, drop big
they play one man out, of bio they play a big,
small forward they play a shooty, shooting guard they play
they play, You know burks a little Bit and daveyon for,
(39:02):
ball pressure, you know And Like andrews. Revenge SERIES maybe i,
don't know he's always been GOOD, AGAINST us, i. THINK
uh i, just THINK like i don't, YOU know i
Asked about Isaac, o quoro uh and and if they
should kind of tweak the rotation to give him. More
RUN and i do agree that, you're right they. Probably
(39:23):
won't if they, do tweak it won't be till, mid
series Even. Against atlanta, BUT like i don't think they
could or should tweak their rotation Really. AGAINST miami i
think they should play one how they've played, all year,
you KNOW because i, think defensively they should be able
(39:43):
to do a really really good job On this. Miami,
Team offensively miami gives up more as in the bottom
third of the league and three, pointers allowed so they
should be able to get because they're a team that
you can get into rotation And the cavs.
Speaker 2 (39:57):
Are really really a lot of.
Speaker 1 (39:58):
Them exactly so like all the things that Make, the
cabs that has Made the cabs offense prolific, This year
miami is not that well built. TO stop i think,
IF anything I actually i'm. NOT sure i would Say
that miami inherently is a much greater Test. Than, atlanta
(40:19):
DEFENSIVELY though i do think they are just literally because
OF the, Vam FACTOR but i would actually say they're
much greater Tests For, Evan mobley like we'll learn More About,
evan mobley, actually more but if he goes Off, against
miami then we'll really know we have a, Stew going
whereas if he goes Off, against atlanta will be really
(40:41):
encouraged and that will be new in terms of like
dominating a series start, to finish but like it'll be
different If.
Speaker 3 (40:48):
It's, pam yeah that's part OF why i want to.
SEE it i Believe That kevin mobley is a guy
that can clear, high bars so why not set them.
UP high i don't. NEED them i don't need the
high jump to be a three feet to start, things
off which is what going Up Against george name would
be in COMPARISON to Bamai. To bayo let's set it
(41:09):
high and see what he can. Do there let's see
if he can do a backflip over that high. Jump
bar i'm Here For evan mobley being TESTED because i
think he's going to pass.
Speaker 2 (41:18):
Those tests looking.
Speaker 3 (41:19):
At how miami's, performed defensively they are the number nine
defense IN the nba this season and the number nine half,
court defense so that's. Certainly interesting they're twenty six in,
transition frequency so that one area Where the calves are
less than great in terms of the. Transition defense miami
isn't going to test them in. That area they are
(41:40):
not a particularly good. Transition defense miami is twenty first in,
transition defense While, the calves despite not being a high transition,
frequency team they are number three in. Transition EFFICIENCY so
i would Expect the cast to be able to get
some easy. Buckets there although we do know that postseason
basketball tends to kind of shift towards the half court
(42:04):
more so than getting out.
Speaker 1 (42:05):
And, running yeah but we what we do need to
see them get the buckets that. Are there, you know
if we want to see this offense hold up the
way that we're all kind of desperately hoping, and praying
it does means you got to get the easy ones
when they're available.
Speaker 2 (42:20):
To YOU so i do think.
Speaker 1 (42:21):
THAT'S interesting I think miami's positional size is. Pretty strong,
you know You've got hero at, Six four marks at,
Six five wiggins at six seven, Six eight bam at, six'
nine where is a true seven to one though you know.
He's a rookie if that'll be a good belt Weather
(42:44):
for the cavs offense is how quickly they Can Make, Spogo.
Speaker 2 (42:48):
Kyle, anderson Hey, what hi smith please come.
Speaker 1 (42:51):
Save the defense we can't have this child out here like,
that's you know like that will be a good belt
weather for How well the Haves offenses functioning like where
played twenty minutes in, this he starts but he only
he doesn't play like thirty forty minutes a, game for,
them you know getting chasing him from the floor is
(43:11):
a good belt weather for how well the. Offense is
running but they do have, good positional, size you know
and even. When they downshift And You, know kyle anderson
who you know isn't, a you know, brutish power forward
but has really good length, and you know as a
guy who just always makes, really smart plays you know
(43:34):
he can he can Very Credibly guard evan mobley. In
the post you know that's. Not a Problem heyward high
smith can guard up. Really REALLY well so i think
they they and, THEN you know I just think i,
think that bench the two bench benches against each other
will be a. Really interesting battle like when You, look
at miami you're almost more impressed by the guys coming
(43:55):
off the bench than the. Guys who, Start You know
davion mitchell, as you know fit. Like a glove there
the the, intense ball pressure Which we know. Calves don't
like uh is something that uh that that flips. Games
For them kyle anderson is just such a freaking grown.
Up out there he can he can played twenty three
(44:16):
minutes and not attempt a shot and b plus fifteen like.
He was Tonight, heywood high smith can you know when
that three? Pointer is going especially you know, all that,
athleticism all that all those. Smarts Really Playing then duncan
robinson is kind of this chaos Agent who swings benjamin
it's when when, with his, MOVEMENT you know i Mean
(44:37):
He's basically Sam Merrill if sam merril. Was. Six, eight
yeah uh and that's very a good. Thing TO be,
so i think how The if, the calves, bench you
know Draws dead, With miami's Bench If if, Tye Sam
o'coro hunter wade or Like even, WITH miami's bench i
(45:01):
think we're, winning this. Very Very comfortably if miami's bench
is changing the shape of the game and consistently messing,
up THE vibes then I think the calves might have
a bit more of a fight. On, their, HANDS yeah
yeah i. Agree with that where would you go on A?
Series with miami what are? You picking here i'm also
(45:23):
going to go caves. In FIVE here just i. THINK
the style i think this is a better Matchup.
Speaker 2 (45:29):
For the calves.
Speaker 1 (45:33):
But but like miami, Always gets one miami's always going.
TO get one i think they have the best coach.
IN the league i think if either series was more likely,
TO go along i would pick this one. For that
reason spoe, Is A demon BUT i THINK i think
(45:54):
i Would. RATHER play Miami i. Think i'm there i'd rather.
See the test i'd rather get. Really good data i'd
really like to see how they handle a super well,
coached together team even if the talent level, isn't you
Know even what orlando.
Speaker 2 (46:11):
Was last year and, let's be.
Speaker 3 (46:13):
HONEST we're selfish i think, from you know breaking, down
the series breaking down, GAME by game i think it's
more interesting to talk About what a miami. SERIES would
be i just think that the test there and just
what supposed able to do and even just the top End,
Talent of miami like you could probably Make An argument
(46:34):
Tyler Hero versus tree young this year in terms of
like overall impact and. STUFF like that i Probably, would
lean tray but it's close enough that you could. MAKE
that argument I still think bam is the best player
out of. All that bunch, i'll be honest my brain,
is telling, ME you know cavsn five when It. Comes
TO miami but i really do have a gut Feeling
that the cavs are going to sweep this. FIRST round
(46:55):
series i think they have been less interested in, the
regular season having locked up things for, a WHILE now
and i feel like this is a team that, has
championship goals that is hungry to. Make A statement and
i think what they are. Going to do you know
(47:16):
the experience of recognizing what a long series can, do,
to you right Like they dominated orlando in games, one
and two and then that series went on. For too
long that had an impact on how the Series. WENT
against boston i think you learn. From, that experience yeah
and you know you talk about the bench and can
(47:37):
our bench play them their? Bench, to, draw honestly man
like we got two of the Top three six Man
of the Year candidates In Tijerum. And DeAndre hunter our
starting lineup should be the. Better starting lineup our bench
should be.
Speaker 2 (47:52):
The.
Speaker 3 (47:52):
BETTER bench, spoe i agree best coach, In The league
kenny atkinson was the best. COACH this year i Think.
CAN sweep miami i think that would be a hell
of a. Statement to make and that is my OFFICIAL prediction.
Speaker 1 (48:05):
HERE i asked I Went on Lockdown calves On Monday
with DANNY cunningham and i asked him A question that
i'm gonna, ask you, now which is is there any
Performance that the cavs can have in the first round
that would change how you feel Going into a boston
(48:25):
Series in. The, conference, FINALS no no i think mobily
having a great series is going to HELP solidify.
Speaker 3 (48:35):
How i feel but we talked about this on. THE
last podcast i am starting my expectations at a High
level and.
Speaker 2 (48:43):
I'm just going.
Speaker 3 (48:44):
To maintain those i'm not going, to you know start
leaping up Proportionally if.
Speaker 2 (48:49):
The calves do have.
Speaker 3 (48:50):
A great series i have a very very high level
of Confidence that this calves team can play the way
that we've seen them play when they're playing. At Their
best so i'm just going to, meet matain, that you,
know throughout playoffs my. CONFIDENCE can shrink i don't think
it can GO up because i respect The challenge. THAT
boston is i think that's going to be a rock,
By that series and you know that kind of swaying
(49:13):
variance of me believing, it's you know a forty sixty
chance to a true fifty, to fifty chance, or you
know if both teams, are fully healthy that's probably kind
of like my margin. For error there, But in general
i'm going to, kind of, maintain you. KNOW the SAME
i don't I don't think i can push up my
level of confidence from from where.
Speaker 2 (49:33):
It's.
Speaker 1 (49:33):
Already, AT uh intellectually i completely, agree with you and. You,
ARE right emotionally i think they still can answer some
some vibe check questions for me if they go if
they get through a first round series with a one
eighteen offensive rating and they're putting, up, one, twenty one
(49:53):
five one thirty in some, of These games and i'm going, to,
be like, oh, oh oh, like you know it'll really
like it'll it will be. Kind of one it can
be one of the last pieces on. My confidence journey yeah,
with this, team YOU know because i just haven't. Seen it,
(50:14):
yet so like EVEN though intellectually i see all the
indicators that tell me that this offense should be great,
IN the postseason i still. Haven't seen IT so, ONCE
i do i do think it's going to unlock a
little piece, for me emotionally and my emotions and my
intellect will. Ideally be aligned.
Speaker 3 (50:33):
If we Get To The eastern conference finals in ten
games and we have a one twenty offensive rating, in
The playoffs like i'm going to be sending you those
little messages on the, side, being like dog we, can.
Speaker 2 (50:43):
Do this we.
Speaker 1 (50:44):
Can do this' that was the root, of my QUESTION
is am i going to be? Getting those messages you're.
Speaker 2 (50:50):
Probably going to be. Getting those messages, let's be.
Speaker 3 (50:52):
Real it's me i'm excitable, and, you know yeah that's
what this time of. Years all about, it's about belief it's,
about having fun it's about enjoying this because we are
going to be, entering some high high. Stress scenarios here
the playoffs. Are always stressful every game, matters so much
every possession.
Speaker 2 (51:11):
Matters so much, and you know this is.
Speaker 3 (51:15):
A high pressure environment for. Our guys too like when you,
are this good it, comes with expectations it. Comes With
Pressure can darius garland have a? Great playoff series kenny
have a? Great playoff run we haven't really seen.
Speaker 2 (51:27):
That From, him evan.
Speaker 3 (51:28):
Mobley same question you know he's probably going to BE an,
all nba player which means you're in that. Top fifteen
range when you are anointed newly anointed as a top
fifteen PLAYER, of the nba that's going to come with a.
Lot of pressure that's going to come with a lot
of people looking to. Pick that apart that is part,
of the game that is. Fair Play Man, so evan
(51:51):
mobley there's pressure on him going, Into the playoffs donovan
trying to get out of the second round for the
first time. In His career kenny atkinson trying to get
out of the first round for the first time in
his career. As a, Coach You, KNOW jared allen i
thought he really acquitted Himself. Great, against orlando, UNFORTUNATELY you
know i think people were unfair when it came to that.
(52:12):
Broken rib situation but he has a chance to make
a statement and help shift, perception, to WHERE frankly where
i think it should. Be all along so there's big
time pressure, on, This team man and when you have
big time pressure and you, answer the bell.
Speaker 2 (52:29):
That comes with a.
Speaker 3 (52:30):
Sense of relief as a, fan like that that is
one of the best. Feelings THERE is so i think
it is fair to both acknowledge that pressure and also,
just you know the the excitement that comes when you
achieve and you match and. Exceed lofty, expectations, oh yeah,
brother it's. Time let's go. Let's do this next podcast
(52:50):
will be, after game one very very, before game one thank,
you very much, before game one before game one for.
Sure on YouTube next one up on the feed from,
an audio standpoint is probably going To be Postgame game
one we will be on Site. At in cleveland very.
Excited For that rocket arena is going. To be rocking
it's going to be hard for me to not, say
(53:12):
Romo fijo but i'm still getting. Used to that but
very very excited To. Travel to cleveland we will Have
coverage four Games one, and game two as well as
every game. Throughout the playoffs we will be recording podcasts
whether We are in cleveland or whether we are sitting here.
In these chairs so very very excited to. Break that
down big thanks to everyone that tune in. Live on
YouTube make sure you guys are, like in subscribing clicking
(53:35):
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Next Time jokay sat sutas
This crowd rises to its being what Barlow slamming it? Oh,
Carl left wing, free ball, perfect pop.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
The block, the shot at the rim, how with the
left hand and of fowl.
Speaker 3 (00:16):
Welcome to Chase Doown Podcast, part of the CAZ Media family.
I'm your host Justin Rohan. The Chase Doown is presented
by Fubo, the official streaming partner of the Calves. Watch
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We finally have some clarity about who the Cavs first
(00:37):
round opponent is going to be. We've at least eliminated
to really from the mix h The Chicago Bulls lost
to the Miami Heat just before we started recording this.
Orlando Magic beat the Atlanta Hawks yesterday, so we know
the Caves will be playing one of the Atlanta Hawks
or the Miami Heat. Joining me today to the attempt
(00:57):
to break down this first round is my co host
Carter Rodrigue.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
Carter, how are you doing, buddy?
Speaker 1 (01:01):
Attempt? It sounds like you're not sure we're going to
be able to do it.
Speaker 2 (01:05):
You know.
Speaker 3 (01:05):
It's it's honestly the weirdest preview that we've done, because
going into the playing we knew exactly who we're playing.
Going into the nixt series, we knew who that they
were going to play. We had a full week, you know,
to break that down. We were able to do the
same thing for the Orlando Magic. This is really the
first time that you know, we're going into a series
and you know, we're going to find out two.
Speaker 2 (01:27):
Days before We're going.
Speaker 3 (01:28):
To find out two days before Sunday who the Cavs
are playing. And I'm interested to see what that dynamic
is really like.
Speaker 1 (01:35):
You know, I think you could be guilty of accusing
Adam Silver of too often listening to podcasters and worrying
about what podcasters want. Talk about an inverted situation, you know,
the monkey paw curly. You might be right there for
everyone but podcasters.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
Baby.
Speaker 3 (01:56):
Well, here here's the funny thing, because Richard Jefferson brought
this up on the tonight about how the Miami Heat,
if they do make it through and if they are
able to beat the Atlanta Hawks on Friday, they're basically
going to be on the road eight days coming into
game one of the playoffs. That is quite the disadvantage.
And obviously, you know, if you're going to be the
(02:16):
ten seed in the play in and earn your way
to the playoffs, you should have to climb an uphill
you know, that should be an uphill battle. I'm not
feeling any sympathy for them, but when you talk about
the cows inability to really prepare specifically for one team,
I'm sure now they're going to be in the process
of game planning for both the Hawks and the Heat.
(02:38):
I still think that the lower seed is definitely at
a disadvantage here.
Speaker 1 (02:43):
Yeah, no kidding, It's going to be interesting to see.
I mean, I am now. You know, you never know
exactly how you feel about this stuff till the dust settles.
Sometimes it's like when you're when you're when you're partner
and you are talking about restaurants and you've you've listed
(03:05):
two that you'd be okay with, and then they pick
one and you go, ah, that's not the one I wanted,
you know, and you didn't really realize it wasn't the
one you wanted till someone picked the other one. I
kind of feel that way about the Orlando Magic. The
second they stop being available, I was like, I'm kind
of glad I don't have to deal.
Speaker 2 (03:25):
With that, Okay, So it's basically.
Speaker 3 (03:30):
That's an inverse scenario. I've I recognize that on the
front end as much as I want to, you know, show, Hey,
this is a different situation than it was last year.
Let's be honest, No, Geelan Suggs, that changes the complexion
of the series. I already know that this is a
better cast team than it was last year. And you know,
no more Wagner like if what's the point of beating
(03:51):
the Orlando Magic in five games if you can't rub
it in most face, like, it's not the same when
he's on the bench. So I'm more than half be
to see the Boston Celtics go up against the Orlando Magic.
And even if that series goes four or five games,
physically it's probably going to feel like a six game
series because that that is just what it's like to
play Orlando.
Speaker 1 (04:12):
Yeah, I mean, one can hope that, you know, the
battle of attrition that is the playoffs takes its toll
on the Celtics. Obviously don't want to root for anyone
to get hurt. But you know, it's hard work playing
those Magic It sucks. They hack more than any other
team in the league. It's a key part of their identity.
And for a team that has struggled with the injury bug, like,
(04:36):
it's kind of nice to avoid that.
Speaker 2 (04:39):
Now.
Speaker 1 (04:39):
Atlanta is a pretty physical team too, you know, they
they'll beat you up a little bit. Daniels will get
into the passing lanes. But you know, I do think
there's still a pretty big difference between that in Orlando
at the end of the day, and you know, there's
also just more spots on the Atlanta team to attack,
(05:02):
you know. So overall, definitely happy to see Orlando. I
was pretty indifferent. I didn't think Chicago was getting getting
out of this thing.
Speaker 2 (05:11):
I actually did.
Speaker 3 (05:12):
I thought Chicago had a real chance because when you're
looking at the post All Star Break stretch, they were
almost like March doesn't matter, justin they were seventeen and ten.
They you know, post All Star breaks, number ten offense,
number fourteen defense. You know, they were trending in the
right direction here, and you know, some of it I
(05:32):
think is, hey, the Miami Heat, they are tough to
kill no matter who is available for them. They always
seem to get one game off of a team in
a playoff series. They always seem to find a way
to squeeze a little bit more life out of that
towel and find a way to extend their season. So
I'm not surprised to see them win, But part of
(05:53):
me wondered, hey, you know, there's no Jimmy.
Speaker 2 (05:55):
Butler this time around.
Speaker 3 (05:57):
They've kind of had a tiring, tiring season. Are are
they ready to just kind of check out as the
ten seed going into the play And you know, the
answer that we got tonight is absolutely not. I'm actually
curious to ask you about this because we've talked about
the play in the last couple of years, and I
think we both have generally been fans of it, as
(06:18):
your opinion evolved at all, now that we have more
of a sample size, like I think, coming in, both
of us liked it, and then the Cavs got eliminated
in the play in, and even despite that, I was
still saying, sitting here saying I think this.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
Is a net good for the league. Do you still
feel that way? I do.
Speaker 1 (06:38):
I think this year wasn't maybe the most sterling example
for it just because there was such a difference between
seven through ten and eleven through fifteen in each conference.
Speaker 2 (06:53):
Yeah, you know.
Speaker 1 (06:55):
Where where there wasn't you know, you didn't see Toronto
desperately trying to get into the play in. That's one
of the things I've liked about it is that the middle,
the lower middle class of the league is less likely
to tank if they have a couple of postseason games
of revenue that they might be able to chase.
Speaker 2 (07:19):
So you didn't have that, But.
Speaker 1 (07:21):
What you did have at West is this, you know,
vicious race from the third seed to the eight seed
trying to desperately avoid it and the other. So if
I thought that it did more, I thought it did
more to help with tanking than lottery of reform. And
(07:42):
I also think what it did was it made it
so there's six playoff spots, not not ten. Everyone's complaining
that there's no ten. I'm saying there's only six. You know,
we have a six and a wild card and that,
and and I think that tension was really really good
out West. So even in a year where I don't
think it was perfect for like selling the play in,
(08:04):
I still think it's a net good. It's It's funny
because I think one this being such a great draft
class probably shifted incentives for some of those lower teams.
And I also think in the Eastern Conference, if Orlando
was healthier for the majority of the season, all of
a sudden, you have a seventh team and you're going
to have a little bit of a race to avoid
(08:25):
the play in right like Detroit with their forty four
and thirty eight record, that's the exact same record that
the Cavs had when they were the eight seed and
lost in the play in right like. Normally that gets
pushed down a little bit further. If Philadelphia was healthier,
you would have, you know, another team in that mix.
And honestly, as much as I hate to ever credit
(08:46):
the Toronto Raptors, if that team was healthy and had
their full roster available to them, you know, Emmanuel quickly, RJ.
Barrett Brandon Ingram.
Speaker 2 (08:58):
You're missing the elephant in the room. Philly. I already
said Philly. Oh, you said Philly. Okay, I led with them,
good sir. Oh, actually I led with Orlando.
Speaker 1 (09:06):
Yeah, yeah, I heard Orlando in Toronto. I didn't hear
anything about Philly.
Speaker 2 (09:10):
Nah.
Speaker 3 (09:10):
I'm pretty sure I had them in there. If not,
that's on me, So thank you to hold this man accountable.
Don't hold me accountable if I'm wrong though, No, it's okay,
But you know, having those extra teams in the mix
would have caused more of that race for six.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
And really, the way that.
Speaker 3 (09:24):
I look at it is it's more of a punishment
for seven and eight than it is a reward for
nine and ten. Like, you know, you're really setting up
that you know your season can fall apart in two games,
so you better try like hell to avoid this thing.
And you know it does give Let's say, you know,
EMBIID didn't have to be shut down for the year
(09:47):
and they could kind of stick around in that nine
tenth spot allows it a good team that just had
bad injury luck to have a chance to come in.
Obviously that sucks for whoever sitting there in the one seed,
but it's it's not like we haven't seen those scenarios before.
So I feel like it's a net positive and in
generally enjoy the games, and I feel like there has
been some really good playing games over over the last
(10:09):
couple of years, and there's also been some really good
game maybe two. It's as bad as some of them
March in April. Basketball can be when there it's teams
in that race, particularly when they're playing against one another,
you can get some really really good basketball.
Speaker 1 (10:23):
Yeah, and even like when it's not both teams that
are participating, but you know, Harrison Barnes hits a game
winner against Golden State pushes them into the play in
now they now they have to fight for their lives.
Now they get a very green young Rockets team to
go up against, and it's going to be, you know,
the old age versus beauty type of matchup. And like,
(10:45):
now you get something really interesting based off a game
that in you know, the old days.
Speaker 2 (10:49):
Just would be well whatever.
Speaker 1 (10:51):
You know, Like I do think there is a lot
of net benefit and you know, I think almost you know,
you're really not even seeing the discord us about the
play anymore. I feel like it was just a pretty
universally successful initiative.
Speaker 3 (11:06):
No, no, I've seen like the odd bad faith kind
of argument, But in general, I feel like this is
something that you know, as we get more years of
experience with it, right, as it becomes more and more normalized.
People once something no longer feels new, they stop feeling
the need to pick it apart, and it just gets
(11:28):
accepted as part of the game. And I like that
it's around who do you think?
Speaker 2 (11:33):
You know? But before we dive.
Speaker 3 (11:34):
Into kind of the strengths of both Atlanta as well
as Miami and how they match up against the Calves,
how do you think that game is going to play
out on Friday?
Speaker 1 (11:44):
You know, I'm just going to pick Miami. I think
they're a healthier team. I think they're a more you know,
they've got more guys with playoff scars. You look at Atlanta,
if you look at their normal roster, you definitely pick them.
But you know, Mo Gay is playing for them, Dominic
(12:04):
Barlow is playing for them again like real minutes. You know,
these are the guys you kind of expect to be
playing in March and April as the team is a
little banged up. But then you know, then they clear
out of the way for the tight rotation, and you know,
Quinn Snyder played ten guys against Orlando, uh, And I
(12:27):
just I just don't think they've got the depth. And
I think Miami has a lot of guys to throw
at Tray to make his life hard, you know. Davion
Mitchell is just the perfect Heat culture player.
Speaker 2 (12:42):
Yeah. Uh.
Speaker 1 (12:44):
Hero went absolutely ballistic tonight, you know, and and the
other really good players in the Hawks. I just kind
of feel like the the Heat kind of have good
answers for you know, like me and you love Okongwu,
but he is is he not?
Speaker 2 (13:00):
You know, great value brand?
Speaker 1 (13:02):
Bam out of Byo, Yeah, he's not going to get
to do O Kong Wui stuff against Bam.
Speaker 2 (13:11):
Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (13:13):
I feel like of the players that are available, obviously,
I think this is a different conversation if Jalen Johnson
was available for Atlanta. I think there was an argument
that he was their most impactful player when he was healthy.
Speaker 2 (13:25):
But you have to give the coaching edge to.
Speaker 3 (13:28):
Spolstra because I just think that he is not the
best coach in the league. He's top three, right, like,
I think just from track record what he's been able
to do with that team, I think he's as good
as it gets.
Speaker 2 (13:40):
You know.
Speaker 3 (13:40):
Bam out of Bayo, I think is one of the
best defensive players in the league. He's a top five
defensive player. Tyler Hero was an All Star this year.
He's been terrific. Andrew Wiggins gave them really, really good
minutes against Chicago and he's capable of playing well. So
I definitely am leaning Miami, which is funny because I
really felt like Chicago had a chance to come out
out of this thing. But you know, maybe this is
(14:03):
just you know, the the rock paper scissors of the NBA,
and I'm just learning, Oh my, Miami is still rock.
Speaker 2 (14:10):
They're going to make it through it.
Speaker 3 (14:12):
They beat Chicago, so therefore they get to keep the
belt and they get to advance.
Speaker 1 (14:17):
Yeah, I think it just it also like you have
a little bit of positive momentum on your side.
Speaker 2 (14:23):
I mean, I'll be interested, that's your point.
Speaker 1 (14:25):
Actually, yeah, once the play in, you know, gets fifteen
twenty years of data under its belt, I will be
curious to see how often the nine to ten winner
kind of can sneak in.
Speaker 2 (14:39):
There's no ending.
Speaker 1 (14:39):
They're coming off a win, the other team's coming off
a loss, you know, and there is like I mean,
I remember feeling it in the seven eight game three
years ago, like.
Speaker 2 (14:49):
Oh no, we lost, Now what's going to happen?
Speaker 1 (14:53):
Like yeah, like you know, there's just this different kind
of angst that that creeps in as at least as
a And so I'm gonna pick Miami to win. I
think that's if I'm the Cavs video staff, maybe I'm
putting my best guys on Miami and a sixty forty
split sixty forty attention split PERHBS. But of course that's
(15:15):
not why I don't run a film room, because that's
probably not how that works at all.
Speaker 3 (15:19):
Yeah, you know, basketball's a game of runs. When you're
coming off a win, that gives you that extra little boost.
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Let's take a look at these teams, Carter. The thing
that jumps out to me right away when I'm kind
of looking at the season long stats, and this is
very often the case when you are talking about what
is functionally you know, the the eight seed and the
ten seed right now competing for the eighth spot in
(16:03):
the history books. These are not perfect teams. These are
not teams that have a glaring strength. I would say
Atlanta is seventeenth in offense and eighteenth in defense, below
average in both or about average in both. Miami is
the number twenty one offense, number nine defense, So you
know there's a top ten trade. You at least expect
(16:25):
an Eric Spolster team to play very well defensively, and
I think we've seen that in some of those matchups.
But what's going to be interesting to me is that
the Cavs, on the other hand, have been really, really
good across the board, and when you look at some
of the areas where maybe there's been some slippage, like
their number twenty two defensive rebound rate, neither of these
(16:48):
teams really seem poise to take advantage of that. Atlanta
is eight thirteenth in offensive rebound rate and Miami is
twenty seventh. So if your prediction and my prediction is
true Miami heat advanced through this, that is not a
team that is likely to beat them up on the
offensive glass.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
No, and I mean just up and down. These are
the definition of.
Speaker 2 (17:13):
Teams.
Speaker 1 (17:14):
You know, you look you look at the standings and
you see Miami with a plus point six point differential
in the year in Atlanta with a minus one point one.
I think it's important to say. I mean, anyone who's
listening to this podcast already knows this, but the Cavs
should win their series in four or five games. Yeah,
(17:36):
it would be very surprising just based on the profiles
of the two teams if it went any other way.
You know, teams that outscore their opponent by ten points
a game rarely lose series. Two teams that almost get
outscored on the season or finish their season eight games
under five hundred. So important to say that. I will say,
(18:00):
you know, this is where on the Atlanta side, I
guess I'd like to start. On the Atlanta side, not
having Capella available is hard for them.
Speaker 2 (18:11):
You know.
Speaker 1 (18:12):
They just don't have a lot of size that's impactful.
Okongwu is a very good offensive rebounder, Mogay is okay
at it, but that's.
Speaker 2 (18:22):
Kind of it, you know, and.
Speaker 1 (18:26):
They don't have a lot of just BV big men.
Dominic Barlow I think is you know a little bit
you know of a tweener forward. He's not someone who's
going to beat you up. And then guys who down
their roster. You know, Daniels is a pretty good rebounders
because he's a big guard. Reache is not as good
(18:47):
as his size, but indicate Brett Young is obviously famously hurt, horrific.
And then you look at the bench, it's niang Lavert
like who you know, never were great rebounders for the
Calves and still aren't for Atlanta. And then you guy
like Terence Man, who you know once was a very
hot prospect for the Clippers, only played ten minutes in
(19:10):
that game against Orlando, and you know he was one
of he was a good glass crasher in for the Clippers,
but you know, he's just not important enough for them.
So like, I just think they're not really that well
built to beat us up physically, either on the glass
or just in general.
Speaker 3 (19:30):
No, they really aren't. And when I'm looking at these matchups,
I don't think that these teams should have a chance
in the series. But you never know, if there's one
aspect that at least the Calves can say, hey, this
is a strength of theirs, let's work to take that away.
And when it comes to the Atlanta Hawks, they like
(19:50):
to get out in transition. They're number one in transition frequency,
and for the Calves, transition defense it isn't poor, but
it's not their biggest strength. There are eleventh in transition defense,
and I'd be really interested to see if you do
ultimately end up playing the Atlanta Hawks and they are
getting out and running, maybe that is an opportunity for
(20:10):
the Cavs to work on their transition defense, because if
you end up playing the Indiana Pacers in the second round,
you know that's a team that's going to get out
and run. Boston may try to get out and run,
and even though they're not the highest frequency transition team,
how you defend those transition attempts versus Boston, whether you
are finding the shooters in the corner, whether you're finding
(20:33):
those guys streaking up and down the court, how you
defend those possessions might be the difference in a series
that we believe is going to have very thin margins.
So I still think that there are things that you
can take from these individual matchups, even though you are
at an advantage and you should be the overwhelming favorite
to win that series, because as I said, the Caves
(20:53):
are eleventh in transition defense their fifth and half court defense.
So typically when you have that as an indicator, that
says your defense is going to be better in the postseason.
But I still think that, you know, when I look
at Atlanta, that's the number one thing that I'm looking at.
They are a slightly above average offensive rebounding team. It's
(21:15):
hard to use season averages when they are missing guys
and they are banged up. But the one thing that
we know they're going to do is they're going to
get out and run. And because they know that they're
at a talent deficit and they know that they know
they're the eight seed versus the one seed, I would
expect them to get up threes at a higher rate
because really, three point attempts and three point variants, that's
(21:38):
probably your best chance at a great equalizer. That game
that they won in Cleveland, not the weird Thanksgiving afternoon game,
but the one. The game they won in Cleveland, they
got fewer than their normal average in terms of wide
open three point looks. They just made them at a
really really high clip in a game where the Calves
(21:58):
generated I think it was thirty two wide open three
point attempts and just didn't make any of them. Your
best chance of getting a game off the Calves is
by banking on that kind of variant. So I'd expect
them to get try to get easy baskets and transition
and try to get those three pointers up at a high,
high rate.
Speaker 1 (22:15):
Yeah, and I think the other thing they're going to
try to do is just try to get the Calves
in rotation. I'll be really interested to see what the
Calves decided to do defensively in that series if it
comes to pass. You know, one thing that we really
criticized JB and the game plan for in that play
(22:37):
in game three years ago was that, you know, they
kind of left what they were doing and we're just
and then we're very rigid. You know, they said we're
gonna switch everything. First half, it was going quite well.
Second half, Trey Young figured out that, yeah, I can
score on Lowry Markinen and just it was just a
(22:58):
parade of you know, beating marketing off the dribble, help
having to come against set shooters, and just feeding the corners,
feeding lob threats, feeding. You know, Trey is at his best,
one of the great offensive engines in the league. You know,
when when he when the when the jumper is going
(23:20):
for him. I mean, he is a passing savant. He
led the league and assist this year. And I'll be
really interested to see how different the Calves want to
get with their defensive fundamentals and how they want to
chase him. You know, are they just going to switch everything? Uh,
that's certainly a strategy. Are they going to Are they
(23:41):
going to show him size and put two on the
ball and make him outlet and trust the rotations on
the back end?
Speaker 2 (23:49):
Uh?
Speaker 1 (23:49):
You know, probably don't want to play a ton of
drop on Trey. That's kind of one of the things
he likes to likes to to beat up. But like,
how are you going to both corral him and keep
the keep the uh, you know, corral has passing and
not just let him go ballistic on an army of
(24:09):
floaters like this very well could be a series where
Trey scores forty plus in two or three games. That's
kind of my opinion, kind of their only road to
stealing two or three games in this series.
Speaker 3 (24:21):
Yeah, there's something I want to say, and I don't
want it to be as disrespectful as it's going to sound.
But I'm going to say it anyways, and it's just
going to sound that way, But in a lot of ways,
he's scout teams Tyrese haliburtn Like you know, you get
you get to practice what you're going to have to
do against Tyrese Halliburn VERSU Tray Young, just like you know,
(24:41):
Ben Simmons was the stand in for Jokic for the Clippers,
Like you know, that's obviously Trey Young is much closer
to Tyrese Halliburn, but how you have to defend him
is going to be very similar. Obviously, there's no way
to guarantee that the Indiana Pacers are going to make
it to the next round. But these are the type
(25:01):
of things that you you kind of have to look into,
right Like, you want to challenge yourself. You want to
gain experience of making the adjustments, trying to take away
the strengths. Even if you don't need to make adjustments
to win the series, you still want to get that practice.
So you want to, you know, get that muscle memory
(25:21):
of the execution. And I think that's really what I'm
trying to take away from this first round here, That's
what I really really want to learn because the last
two years first round series has been a dogfight. One
of them they lost, one of them they won, but
it never really felt like they were fully in control
of the series. And now the Calves have the talent,
(25:43):
they have the health, they have everything that they need to,
you know, impose their will on a series. It's about
are they able to do that effectively? Is are they
able to be as dominant as they were in the
regular season. And you know, coming into game one and two, yeah,
you don't know who your opponent is until two days before,
(26:04):
but really like games one and two, you're kind of
coming out with your base plan to some extent, like
you are going to tweak your game plan to what
you think is going to work well against the other team.
But typically game three is where you really see adjustments
in a series. I'm sure the Cavs have a game
plan in mind for the Atlanta Hawks and for the
Miami Heat. They're going to highlight things in the film session,
(26:26):
but you're not really going to deviate from that game
one game plan for the first two games because you're
trying to get an appropriate sample size as well of
a like you know this, we think this work is
going to work, even if it didn't work particularly well
in Game one, and that little chess match. Chess matches
(26:47):
is what I'm looking for here.
Speaker 1 (26:48):
Yeah, I think really like what you're talking about isn't
necessarily about playing perfectly. It's about, you know, imposing your style. Yes,
And like I think as impressive as I thought that
Magic series was for the Cavs, I'm not sure I
would say they imposed their style. They played an Orlando
game and just beat Orlando at Orlando's game, you know,
(27:12):
I would actually argue they played more close to Cavaliers
basketball against the Celtics, uh than.
Speaker 2 (27:22):
Lando.
Speaker 3 (27:23):
The Orlando series was trusting the defense, they got in
a rock fight, and Donovan Mitchell happened to be better
than Palo Bank Carol. Like that's really what it came
down to, Like kind of that lead initiator was the
lead initiator and Mitchell did a better.
Speaker 2 (27:37):
Job of it.
Speaker 1 (27:38):
Yeah, I think like what you want at some point
is Atlanta to be kind of looking around at their
you know, looking around at each other and the huddle
going what we need to change everything? Like that's what
you want them to have to be saying, because like
we're not in control of this series in any meaningful way,
(28:00):
and like that's what I think you really want to see.
But with that said, I do want to ask a
couple of rotation questions before we pivot over to Okay, Miami,
Is this an Isaca Korro series?
Speaker 3 (28:14):
Yes, you're playing Tray Young. I would like to see, Honestly,
I would like to have a Coro in the early
rotation of all of these kind of matchups, no matter
who we're playing, even if it doesn't feel like as
much of an Icycle Coro series on paper, at least
from the defensive standpoint, because I want to get him
those reps offensively, and I want to see if we can,
(28:36):
you know, with the new ways that we're using him,
if he can be an effective part of the rotation
kind of regardless of matchup, we're still talking about someone that's,
you know what, twenty three years old here, Like, getting
good data on Isco Coro is a really important thing
for me. So I obviously against Trey Young, I think
he does as good of a job as anybody in
(28:58):
the league, So it's definitely a yes for me. But
I just wanted to have that qualifier of even if
it's a series where it isn't as important even if
you're playing a Milwaukee Bucks where there isn't a huge
strategic advantage of putting him on a dynamic guard. I
would still like to see Isaac Ocor out there in
the early series rotation.
Speaker 1 (29:19):
Yeah, I would too. I asked the question because I
do think it is. What's going to be important though
for him is making Atlanta pay when they have Trey
sashed on him. Yes, he needs to bully him, He
needs to use his physicality. He needs to be a
great screener for the guards to get Dyson Daniels, who
(29:41):
is there, you know, one of the best point of
attack guard defenders in the NBA. Get him out of
the paint, get him away from from Darius and Donovan
when they have the ball. You know, because I do
imagine a lot of Okuoros Mints will come at the
two in this in this series if he's going to
be a major part of your rotation, So you're not
(30:02):
going to have two of Darius Donovan tie and some
of those lineups.
Speaker 2 (30:07):
Some of them you will, But like you know, just.
Speaker 1 (30:10):
In terms of making because Atlanta has pretty good positional size,
you know, it gets really messy to be like, all right,
tied Jerome, you got Resa Shay who's six' ten playing small,
forward like you're gonna you're gonna have to make some you,
know some interesting lineup decisions with who is guarding who
(30:30):
and the in the minutes Where okoro's at the, three
if you want him going and chasing around the only
small player on the floor For, ATLANTA.
Speaker 2 (30:38):
I agree with.
Speaker 3 (30:39):
You i'm very curious if we're going to be right,
Though Like i'm very curious to see if we change
up the rotation or if we end up seeing you,
know the constant two guard no matter, what and even
some three guard lineups would Sam, Merril i'm, really, really
really curious to see if that ultimately is the, case
(31:00):
because what you're saying makes absolute. SENSE i think this
is a series for the calves to use their. Wings
because you have wings, available you have the option to
play it. Larger we'll see if that ends up coming to.
Fruition that's that's one of those things we may learn
about How Kenny atkinson chooses to approach the playoffs that
(31:20):
you're just not going to learn until you're in the.
Speaker 1 (31:21):
Playoffs, yeah for, sure and THEN i And i'll let
you also do closing thoughts in a final pick if It's.
Atlanta BUT i just think at the end of the,
day they just don't have enough answers for what The
calves have from a roster. Perspective you, know we were
talking on the discord today AND i think you Mentioned
(31:42):
George niang is gonna have to put in shifts On
Evan mobley like.
Speaker 2 (31:46):
You stole my series. Preview i'm, sorry you, know AND
i just.
Speaker 1 (31:52):
Or it's going to Be mogay And Don, barlow and you,
know it's like like WHAT i suspect will happen in
this series if it goes the way we hope it,
goes is one of The hawks role players is going
to be getting, cooked whether It's, niang whether It's, barlow
whether whoever it. Is and someone's gonna say we got
(32:15):
to get them off the, floor and smart fans of
The hawks will say for, who you, know like they
JUST i just think their toolkit isn't quite big. ENOUGH i,
mean you can downshift a, little you, know you can
Do vitkritchi and Parents man and play uber small, ball but,
LIKE i just DON'T i don't think they've got enough guys,
(32:38):
that you, know you really really can.
Speaker 3 (32:40):
Trust, yeah like you might switch like we talk About
icicle korl moving down the you know assignments playing small
four but Guarding Tray young and some of the cross
matching you're doing. There you might have the same thing
on The hawks, side just even, reverse Where reesaha is
playing shooting guard but he's Guarding Evan mobley as the,
four And George niang is like sliding down to Guard
(33:03):
Isaac okoro or something on those, lines, right because that's
not going to be a beneficial. MATCHUP i think that
would look a lot like when he was trying to
Guard palo in last Year's Magic, series which you, know
when you look at how Good Evan mobley has gone
in space and also just how Good Evan mobley is
at finishing over, guys like that's that's the biggest.
Speaker 1 (33:23):
One and they won't give you the bailout Stuff pala gives, you.
Speaker 2 (33:27):
Right and like.
Speaker 3 (33:30):
Okong wu is six eight six,' Nine george nangs six,
Y seven mogay's got some, good length but not a.
Big dude mobley just finishes, Over GUYS and i think
we are Going to we've talked about it for Years
That evan mobley is going to be the one that
(33:50):
dictates how Far the cavs go and. All THAT but
i think we're really going to get a feel for
how Much Better evan mobley is and how his game
is going to translate to the playoffs in game one of.
Round one, Is this both of these matchups should be
Series Where evan mobley plays a very, significant ROLE and
i think getting him going should be goal number one in.
(34:14):
The playoffs we need To Have evan mobley playing, really well,
playing confident and, you know being a two way monster.
OUT there i think that Is the cav's best pathway.
To success and if we can build positive momentum in,
that direction why not start in?
Speaker 1 (34:29):
Round, one bear what's your pick For A atlanta Hawk's cliving?
Cavaliers series CAAs. And four I'm going calves. IN five
I think I think trey is capable of stealing the game.
AGAINST anyone i think they have enough. Shooting variants they
have shooting talent on.
Speaker 2 (34:46):
That, roster Yes and karis can go for, forty one we, know,
That yeah.
Speaker 1 (34:52):
SO like i just think they have enough volatility offensively that,
YOU know i think they've what eighteenth, On OFFENSE but
i think there are nights where they look like the
fifth best offense in, the league, you, Know yep and
there're just other nights where they look like the twenty
fifth and that's how you get. To eighteenth BUT but
(35:13):
i think they're just a more valid old team than
their averages kind of make. Them Look so I'm going calves.
IN five i want To. Talk miami you want to.
Go first here's, The.
Speaker 3 (35:24):
THING miami I think i really want THEM because i
Want the calves to experience some form of a test in.
The PLAYOFFS and i think going Up Against eric spolstra
is going to force them to make the types of
ADJUSTMENTS that i, Was, saying hey that's that's what you
want to, experience with that's what you want to kind
of try out in. The, PLAYOFFS here I think spoe
is going to throw different things. AT them i think
(35:46):
they're going to be forced to do. Problem solving and
if my, primary motivation if my number one area of
interest heading into the first round Is Can evin mobley get?
It Going Can evin mobley show that this, is different
that he is ready to do what's necessary to get
this team a championship. This season going UP against Bam
(36:07):
At a bayo is the perfect matchup to make that
kind of, a statement because bam. Is phenomenal he's someone
that we have compared, mobily to, you know basically since
he entered the league that we wanted to see him
basically be a Bigger Bam. Ata bayo that matchup would,
Be fascinating the coaching matchup would, Be FASCINATING and I
(36:28):
think miami has the ability to really Test, the calves
not in terms of pushing, the SERIES but i think
they'd have to play at a higher level than they
Would against atlanta in order to win the series in
four or.
Speaker 1 (36:41):
Five games it's a weird THING where i don't disagree
with anything you, just SAID but i do have this
weird HEADSPACE where i feel Like the hawks will Test
the calves stylistically, more okay because of the Singularity, of trey,
(37:03):
you know the style and the way he binds and
breaks your brain a little bit when he's, Really ON
whereas i feel Like the calves will play won't have
to make one change to the way they've played all
year To. Beat miami they just will have to execute very.
Speaker 3 (37:21):
Very well let me ask, YOU this i agree that
how you have to Account For. Trey young that's a
different beast Than What tyler herro is going. To DO
like I Trust donovan mitchell To Guard, TYLER hero i
trust guys up and down the roster To Guard.
Speaker 2 (37:37):
Tyler hero are you.
Speaker 3 (37:39):
Trying to learn about the defense or you're trying to
learn about, the OFFENSE because i want to learn about,
the OFFENSE and I think miami is going to Test
the cavs offense, as much if not More than atlanta
would Test the. Cavs DEFENSE and i don't worry About the.
CAVES defense i understand that theoretically that might come up
at some point in, the playoffs but it has not
(38:01):
at any point to. This point AND because i want
to learn about the offense translating in, THE playoffs I
think miami is the more interesting test for.
Speaker 2 (38:09):
That, Reason yeah i'm not even. Saying it lana is.
Speaker 1 (38:12):
More interesting IT'S just i just think it's a style
thing in terms of How the calves might tweak what.
They're doing and part of it's Just because atlana's got more,
weak points then you might that you're more willing to
go out of your way, to attack, you know if that,
makes sense you might so you might just do things
(38:34):
differently on both ends of the ball than what you've done. All,
YEAR like i don't you want to see if we're
going to match, up hunt like if we're just going
to get really all.
Speaker 2 (38:41):
THAT time i don't even KNOW if i want.
Speaker 1 (38:42):
TO see i just kind of think, they might, YOU
know i think they might just behave a, little Differently
whereas miami is just like they play one, drop big
they play one man out, of bio they play a big,
small forward they play a shooty, shooting guard they play
they play, You know burks a little Bit and daveyon for,
(39:02):
ball pressure, you know And Like andrews. Revenge SERIES maybe i,
don't know he's always been GOOD, AGAINST us, i. THINK
uh i, just THINK like i don't, YOU know i
Asked about Isaac, o quoro uh and and if they
should kind of tweak the rotation to give him. More
RUN and i do agree that, you're right they. Probably
(39:23):
won't if they, do tweak it won't be till, mid
series Even. Against atlanta, BUT like i don't think they
could or should tweak their rotation Really. AGAINST miami i
think they should play one how they've played, all year,
you KNOW because i, think defensively they should be able
(39:43):
to do a really really good job On this. Miami,
Team offensively miami gives up more as in the bottom
third of the league and three, pointers allowed so they
should be able to get because they're a team that
you can get into rotation And the cavs.
Speaker 2 (39:57):
Are really really a lot of.
Speaker 1 (39:58):
Them exactly so like all the things that Make, the
cabs that has Made the cabs offense prolific, This year
miami is not that well built. TO stop i think,
IF anything I actually i'm. NOT sure i would Say
that miami inherently is a much greater Test. Than, atlanta
(40:19):
DEFENSIVELY though i do think they are just literally because
OF the, Vam FACTOR but i would actually say they're
much greater Tests For, Evan mobley like we'll learn More About,
evan mobley, actually more but if he goes Off, against
miami then we'll really know we have a, Stew going
whereas if he goes Off, against atlanta will be really
(40:41):
encouraged and that will be new in terms of like
dominating a series start, to finish but like it'll be
different If.
Speaker 3 (40:48):
It's, pam yeah that's part OF why i want to.
SEE it i Believe That kevin mobley is a guy
that can clear, high bars so why not set them.
UP high i don't. NEED them i don't need the
high jump to be a three feet to start, things
off which is what going Up Against george name would
be in COMPARISON to Bamai. To bayo let's set it
(41:09):
high and see what he can. Do there let's see
if he can do a backflip over that high. Jump
bar i'm Here For evan mobley being TESTED because i
think he's going to pass.
Speaker 2 (41:18):
Those tests looking.
Speaker 3 (41:19):
At how miami's, performed defensively they are the number nine
defense IN the nba this season and the number nine half,
court defense so that's. Certainly interesting they're twenty six in,
transition frequency so that one area Where the calves are
less than great in terms of the. Transition defense miami
isn't going to test them in. That area they are
(41:40):
not a particularly good. Transition defense miami is twenty first in,
transition defense While, the calves despite not being a high transition,
frequency team they are number three in. Transition EFFICIENCY so
i would Expect the cast to be able to get
some easy. Buckets there although we do know that postseason
basketball tends to kind of shift towards the half court
(42:04):
more so than getting out.
Speaker 1 (42:05):
And, running yeah but we what we do need to
see them get the buckets that. Are there, you know
if we want to see this offense hold up the
way that we're all kind of desperately hoping, and praying
it does means you got to get the easy ones
when they're available.
Speaker 2 (42:20):
To YOU so i do think.
Speaker 1 (42:21):
THAT'S interesting I think miami's positional size is. Pretty strong,
you know You've got hero at, Six four marks at,
Six five wiggins at six seven, Six eight bam at, six'
nine where is a true seven to one though you know.
He's a rookie if that'll be a good belt Weather
(42:44):
for the cavs offense is how quickly they Can Make, Spogo.
Speaker 2 (42:48):
Kyle, anderson Hey, what hi smith please come.
Speaker 1 (42:51):
Save the defense we can't have this child out here like,
that's you know like that will be a good belt
weather for How well the Haves offenses functioning like where
played twenty minutes in, this he starts but he only
he doesn't play like thirty forty minutes a, game for,
them you know getting chasing him from the floor is
(43:11):
a good belt weather for how well the. Offense is
running but they do have, good positional, size you know
and even. When they downshift And You, know kyle anderson
who you know isn't, a you know, brutish power forward
but has really good length, and you know as a
guy who just always makes, really smart plays you know
(43:34):
he can he can Very Credibly guard evan mobley. In
the post you know that's. Not a Problem heyward high
smith can guard up. Really REALLY well so i think
they they and, THEN you know I just think i,
think that bench the two bench benches against each other
will be a. Really interesting battle like when You, look
at miami you're almost more impressed by the guys coming
(43:55):
off the bench than the. Guys who, Start You know
davion mitchell, as you know fit. Like a glove there
the the, intense ball pressure Which we know. Calves don't
like uh is something that uh that that flips. Games
For them kyle anderson is just such a freaking grown.
Up out there he can he can played twenty three
(44:16):
minutes and not attempt a shot and b plus fifteen like.
He was Tonight, heywood high smith can you know when
that three? Pointer is going especially you know, all that,
athleticism all that all those. Smarts Really Playing then duncan
robinson is kind of this chaos Agent who swings benjamin
it's when when, with his, MOVEMENT you know i Mean
(44:37):
He's basically Sam Merrill if sam merril. Was. Six, eight
yeah uh and that's very a good. Thing TO be,
so i think how The if, the calves, bench you
know Draws dead, With miami's Bench If if, Tye Sam
o'coro hunter wade or Like even, WITH miami's bench i
(45:01):
think we're, winning this. Very Very comfortably if miami's bench
is changing the shape of the game and consistently messing,
up THE vibes then I think the calves might have
a bit more of a fight. On, their, HANDS yeah
yeah i. Agree with that where would you go on A?
Series with miami what are? You picking here i'm also
(45:23):
going to go caves. In FIVE here just i. THINK
the style i think this is a better Matchup.
Speaker 2 (45:29):
For the calves.
Speaker 1 (45:33):
But but like miami, Always gets one miami's always going.
TO get one i think they have the best coach.
IN the league i think if either series was more likely,
TO go along i would pick this one. For that
reason spoe, Is A demon BUT i THINK i think
(45:54):
i Would. RATHER play Miami i. Think i'm there i'd rather.
See the test i'd rather get. Really good data i'd
really like to see how they handle a super well,
coached together team even if the talent level, isn't you
Know even what orlando.
Speaker 2 (46:11):
Was last year and, let's be.
Speaker 3 (46:13):
HONEST we're selfish i think, from you know breaking, down
the series breaking down, GAME by game i think it's
more interesting to talk About what a miami. SERIES would
be i just think that the test there and just
what supposed able to do and even just the top End,
Talent of miami like you could probably Make An argument
(46:34):
Tyler Hero versus tree young this year in terms of
like overall impact and. STUFF like that i Probably, would
lean tray but it's close enough that you could. MAKE
that argument I still think bam is the best player
out of. All that bunch, i'll be honest my brain,
is telling, ME you know cavsn five when It. Comes
TO miami but i really do have a gut Feeling
that the cavs are going to sweep this. FIRST round
(46:55):
series i think they have been less interested in, the
regular season having locked up things for, a WHILE now
and i feel like this is a team that, has
championship goals that is hungry to. Make A statement and
i think what they are. Going to do you know
(47:16):
the experience of recognizing what a long series can, do,
to you right Like they dominated orlando in games, one
and two and then that series went on. For too
long that had an impact on how the Series. WENT
against boston i think you learn. From, that experience yeah
and you know you talk about the bench and can
(47:37):
our bench play them their? Bench, to, draw honestly man
like we got two of the Top three six Man
of the Year candidates In Tijerum. And DeAndre hunter our
starting lineup should be the. Better starting lineup our bench
should be.
Speaker 2 (47:52):
The.
Speaker 3 (47:52):
BETTER bench, spoe i agree best coach, In The league
kenny atkinson was the best. COACH this year i Think.
CAN sweep miami i think that would be a hell
of a. Statement to make and that is my OFFICIAL prediction.
Speaker 1 (48:05):
HERE i asked I Went on Lockdown calves On Monday
with DANNY cunningham and i asked him A question that
i'm gonna, ask you, now which is is there any
Performance that the cavs can have in the first round
that would change how you feel Going into a boston
(48:25):
Series in. The, conference, FINALS no no i think mobily
having a great series is going to HELP solidify.
Speaker 3 (48:35):
How i feel but we talked about this on. THE
last podcast i am starting my expectations at a High
level and.
Speaker 2 (48:43):
I'm just going.
Speaker 3 (48:44):
To maintain those i'm not going, to you know start
leaping up Proportionally if.
Speaker 2 (48:49):
The calves do have.
Speaker 3 (48:50):
A great series i have a very very high level
of Confidence that this calves team can play the way
that we've seen them play when they're playing. At Their
best so i'm just going to, meet matain, that you,
know throughout playoffs my. CONFIDENCE can shrink i don't think
it can GO up because i respect The challenge. THAT
boston is i think that's going to be a rock,
By that series and you know that kind of swaying
(49:13):
variance of me believing, it's you know a forty sixty
chance to a true fifty, to fifty chance, or you
know if both teams, are fully healthy that's probably kind
of like my margin. For error there, But in general
i'm going to, kind of, maintain you. KNOW the SAME
i don't I don't think i can push up my
level of confidence from from where.
Speaker 2 (49:33):
It's.
Speaker 1 (49:33):
Already, AT uh intellectually i completely, agree with you and. You,
ARE right emotionally i think they still can answer some
some vibe check questions for me if they go if
they get through a first round series with a one
eighteen offensive rating and they're putting, up, one, twenty one
(49:53):
five one thirty in some, of These games and i'm going, to,
be like, oh, oh oh, like you know it'll really
like it'll it will be. Kind of one it can
be one of the last pieces on. My confidence journey yeah,
with this, team YOU know because i just haven't. Seen it,
(50:14):
yet so like EVEN though intellectually i see all the
indicators that tell me that this offense should be great,
IN the postseason i still. Haven't seen IT so, ONCE
i do i do think it's going to unlock a
little piece, for me emotionally and my emotions and my
intellect will. Ideally be aligned.
Speaker 3 (50:33):
If we Get To The eastern conference finals in ten
games and we have a one twenty offensive rating, in
The playoffs like i'm going to be sending you those
little messages on the, side, being like dog we, can.
Speaker 2 (50:43):
Do this we.
Speaker 1 (50:44):
Can do this' that was the root, of my QUESTION
is am i going to be? Getting those messages you're.
Speaker 2 (50:50):
Probably going to be. Getting those messages, let's be.
Speaker 3 (50:52):
Real it's me i'm excitable, and, you know yeah that's
what this time of. Years all about, it's about belief it's,
about having fun it's about enjoying this because we are
going to be, entering some high high. Stress scenarios here
the playoffs. Are always stressful every game, matters so much
every possession.
Speaker 2 (51:11):
Matters so much, and you know this is.
Speaker 3 (51:15):
A high pressure environment for. Our guys too like when you,
are this good it, comes with expectations it. Comes With
Pressure can darius garland have a? Great playoff series kenny
have a? Great playoff run we haven't really seen.
Speaker 2 (51:27):
That From, him evan.
Speaker 3 (51:28):
Mobley same question you know he's probably going to BE an,
all nba player which means you're in that. Top fifteen
range when you are anointed newly anointed as a top
fifteen PLAYER, of the nba that's going to come with a.
Lot of pressure that's going to come with a lot
of people looking to. Pick that apart that is part,
of the game that is. Fair Play Man, so evan
(51:51):
mobley there's pressure on him going, Into the playoffs donovan
trying to get out of the second round for the
first time. In His career kenny atkinson trying to get
out of the first round for the first time in
his career. As a, Coach You, KNOW jared allen i
thought he really acquitted Himself. Great, against orlando, UNFORTUNATELY you
know i think people were unfair when it came to that.
(52:12):
Broken rib situation but he has a chance to make
a statement and help shift, perception, to WHERE frankly where
i think it should. Be all along so there's big
time pressure, on, This team man and when you have
big time pressure and you, answer the bell.
Speaker 2 (52:29):
That comes with a.
Speaker 3 (52:30):
Sense of relief as a, fan like that that is
one of the best. Feelings THERE is so i think
it is fair to both acknowledge that pressure and also,
just you know the the excitement that comes when you
achieve and you match and. Exceed lofty, expectations, oh yeah,
brother it's. Time let's go. Let's do this next podcast
(52:50):
will be, after game one very very, before game one thank,
you very much, before game one before game one for.
Sure on YouTube next one up on the feed from,
an audio standpoint is probably going To be Postgame game
one we will be on Site. At in cleveland very.
Excited For that rocket arena is going. To be rocking
it's going to be hard for me to not, say
(53:12):
Romo fijo but i'm still getting. Used to that but
very very excited To. Travel to cleveland we will Have
coverage four Games one, and game two as well as
every game. Throughout the playoffs we will be recording podcasts
whether We are in cleveland or whether we are sitting here.
In these chairs so very very excited to. Break that
down big thanks to everyone that tune in. Live on
YouTube make sure you guys are, like in subscribing clicking
(53:35):
that notification bel so you know when. We're going live
if you're listening via podcast and you, want to support leave,
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Cook those books if you won't Be Part of chase
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appreciate it make sure you guys are staying safe out there. Until,
Next Time jokay sat sutas
Hosts And Creators
Carter Rodriguez
Justin Rowan
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Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com