May 2, 2021 • 28 mins
This is Prime Cuts: Top Ten Takes from the NFL Draft. We count down the best takes on the first three rounds of the draft from The Colin Cowherd Podcast. Colin, former NFL scout John Middlekauff and Action Network Chief Content Officer Chad Millman discuss the picks they love, the picks they hate, who won the draft, who is in for a long season, and the inside scoop on Colin's Trey Lance connection.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
The volume. This is Prime Cuts Top ten takes from
the NFL Draft. It's a countdown to the best takes
from me, my buddy, John Middlecoff, Chad Millman of the
Action Network. After the first three rounds of the draft,
(00:23):
we get into our favorite picks, not so favorite picks.
Who's the biggest reach my inside info on Trey Lance.
It's funny. Enjoy number ten. There's been criticism about New
England that they don't do their homework necessarily. This is
what I've been told by people through the years. And
the more Super Bowls Belichick one, the more power he
(00:43):
has in the organization. And about mid to late January
he tells the scouts, I've got it from here. And
Bill's not thought of as lazy. But I don't think
they always do their homework with their draft. Here's a
prime example. He relies on people he knows herm ed words.
He went and not got Nikil Harry, and story broke.
(01:04):
Albert Brier broke the story that the scouting department did
not want Nikil Harry and Belichick blew him off. So
they go out and draft Christian Barmore, defensive tackle Alabama.
I have two different people who I trust, who took
him off their board because of some personal stuff they'd heard.
(01:25):
I mean, even Nick Saban had to defend him during
the year. That's classic. He was a red flag guy
for just two of the teams two for two I
talked to, So your thoughts, I mean, I just I
think Belichick he has struggled in this draft, and Christian
Barmore Nick Saban had to defend him multiple times this year,
(01:49):
Like I don't like the move. Well, look I can't.
I can't speak to anything about Barmore, but I do
think it's interesting that there is always, in very specific instances,
year after year, Belichick trusting Nick Saban, right, who's the
(02:12):
quarterback that he wanted? Who's the quarterback that he drafted?
And now last night he's being praised for staying in
one spot and getting Mac Jones, And I, like, I
have been suspect of Mac Jones and Zach Wilson this
entire process because I do not understand how quarterbacks and
(02:35):
Trey Lance falls into this too. I do not understand
how quarterbacks who perform for one year with in mac
jones case, obviously they are heading shoulders more talented than everybody,
but Zack Wilson, who is playing against a supreme offensive
line against terrible competition. He does it for one year
and a few games, and all of a sudden, he's
(02:57):
a world beater. And it makes no sense to me.
Why any quarterback. And I'm sort of veered from your question,
but to me, it speaks to a larger issue of
the lack of science in scouting and these coaches, these
scouts who fall in love with what they believe to
be talented. It's like that great scene in Moneyball where
(03:18):
they're all sitting around a table. The ball sounds great.
When he comes off his bat. His girlfriend's ugly. He's
got no confidence. Like they're basing these decisions on things
like just look at the film. Look at the film.
Justin Fields played against top level competition for multiple years
and was consistent throughout his career. Trevor Lawrence, same thing.
(03:42):
Why are you not drafting the guys who prove it
on the field. Don't give me he doesn't weigh enough.
Don't give me his hips aren't good. It's like they
try to outguess themselves so they can be the smartest
guy in the room and make the pick that is
going to make them seem like a genius instead of
grabbing the gold that is right in front of them. Well,
I mean, Jordan Love had one great ear, he gets drafted.
(04:03):
Zach Wilson had one great ear and gets drafted. I mean,
if you go to high school. In college, Justin Fields
was dominant for like a five year stretch. So I
agree with you number nine. My favorite pick of the night.
Part of this is luck because the guy fell. I
give the Bears a lot of credit. So let's talk that.
(04:24):
Because now I was gonna say John, So, Ryan Pace
is in trouble. I mean he's getting bad press. I
think people like Naggie, there's a lot of doubters on
Ryan Pace. You could make the argument that by moving
up to get a quarterback, he's going to get three
to four days of great press. Yeah, and that if
he was a selfish gem, he's like, you know, everybody
(04:47):
loves the quarterback, but I actually like it because my
takeaway is Dalton is Alex Smith. He understands his role.
He can be a mentor. You're not paying him much.
If Justin Fields had to learn from somebody outside of
Alex Smith, you could argue Andy Dalton is about as
(05:07):
good a role model as you could have for a year,
and best case scenario, Fields comes in just beats him
out in training camp. He's just a better player, and
Andy knows his role. He just sits behind him. Here's
the other thing, though, there are not many general managers
that aren't like they're a decade plus to get the
opportunity to take two first round quarterbacks. I would if
me and you would have been in there and we
ran the Bears, I would not have been okay, very
(05:30):
like giving Ryan Pace the power to trade future first
round picks to do much. But the moment Fields start plummeting.
And this can be overrated, But in the Midwest Ohio state,
justin Fields the Bear, that area, that region. Think how
many Ohio State fans just live in the area the Bears.
I'd say, coming into this draft, of all the big
(05:50):
market teams had to have the lowest rating of fan confidence.
I would imagine tonight tomorrow, it's like jubilation. We got
this guy who Colin. I think this guy is getting
underrated as a prospect. He's almost six four, he's got
a big arm, he can run. I know there are
some fundamental flaws. These coaches make eight, ten, eleven million dollars.
(06:11):
Now they're all offensive coaches. Guy up, you don't think it.
Andy Reid as Sean McVay would want to work with
this guy, like ultimately Kyle Shannah and went with Trey
Lance similar, big strong, can run like these are the
type guys these coaches want Sean Payton want to work
with now. And the other thing is he's played a
lot like he should be. I don't want to say
plug and play. It's a hard transition, but he should.
(06:33):
He should have the opportunity to start just an open competition.
And if you're a Bears fan, it just breathed some
life into the franchise. Number eight. First of all, the
Miami Dolphins are having a hell of a draft. See
that is a team that I wholly I mean, by
(06:54):
the way, if you're just they got oh my god,
they got four starters in this draft, Jalen Waddle, Jalen Phillips.
By the way, I watched a lot of Oregon football
because I used to work there. Javon Holland at safety
is a stud. And then they get Notre Dame's left tackle,
Liam Eichenberg, So now they have a left Austin Jackson
(07:17):
last year. So far, to me, the Dolphins are winning
the draft. Four clean, no red flag players, four starters, right.
I really like what they're doing. Let me talk about
the other Bay Area team, formerly the Raiders, now the
Las Vegas Raiders. I thought they were the first team
to reach with Alex Leatherwood. It's funny. I was hearing
(07:40):
a lot of the ESPN analysts say, well, he's got
a lot of potential, there's a great ceiling. And my
takeaway is, when's the last Saban player at Obama that
didn't get close to his potential at Alabama? I mean,
Nick's pretty good at squeezing all that potential out. I
don't think he's terribly strong. I think he's an inside
offensive lineman in the NFL. I haven't loved their picks
(08:02):
in the first round. I think Leatherwood was available in
the second round. I thought it was a reach. I
really and and I don't like saying that because he'll
start in the NFL, but boy, I thought it was
a reach. Yeah. I think sometimes I immediately text an
SEC scout he's like, I like Leatherwood, but I had
(08:23):
multiple offensive linemen on the board that are still on
the board that I would have taken over the guy,
you know, and you look at the division that Denver
didn't overthink it. They just took Patrick certain, a guy
that you know at Alabama, Boom, plug and play, ready
to rock and roll. Look at the Chargers. They end
up with a tackle, boom, plug and play, ready to roll.
The Raiders back to back years, Damon Arnette last year,
(08:47):
it's like, whoa you go in Ohio State. They've one
thing with Mayock and Gruden these last several years. It's
basically Ohio State, BAM or Clemson. That's just the way
they lean, which I got no issue with, but not
every that's not the way the draft works. Sometimes a
guy from Virginia Tech can be better. I think the
risk Colin is that they're comparing it to their recent tackle,
(09:09):
Colton Miller, who was much more of a projection who
then lived up to it. But sometimes, like I don't
want to say they got lucky there, but that was
a pretty big swing and it worked out. And they
keep taking these taking huge kind of stretches and some
of these outliers instead of just don't over outthink the
room here. And what's weird is watching Maynock on TV
(09:31):
for a decade plus, he felt very meat and potatoes,
nuts and bolts like these aren't his type picks. This
does feel a little more Gruden every time it does.
Number six. I thought the Cowboys, how about that? Like
the guys they wanted to go off the board, and
what do they do? They do a deal with a
division rival, but they moved back to spots. They still
(09:51):
get a stud and they gain a third round pick.
Like that's a high level. Jerry's a good GM. Jerry's
problem is this he resigns guys when he probably should
let him walk him. Picking players is not an issue. Hey,
I really, let's talk Dallas. I know they wanted a
corner my intel was, but the minute they couldn't get them,
(10:12):
they're like, all right, let's get the best defensive player. Now.
I don't think they have an urgent need at linebacker.
But the problem is their linebackers have health issues. So
where if you were a scout for the Cowboys, would
you a push for Micah because they have two? You
know they've got linebackers. Well, the way I had this
player described to me is he can play a role
(10:34):
in a four three defense, which they're going to run
with dan Quinn a little a better version of what
Bruce Irvan was back when Seattle got them with dan
Quinn a decade ago. As this stand up sam linebacker
who can also rush the passer and the patriot or
I mean, the Cowboys just need better players up front, right,
guys that can tackle. Vander Esch gets hurt a lot.
(10:56):
So this guy can go sideline the sideline, but he
also brings you pass rush value. And he's just a
blue chip body type. You know. You just get a
guy that's six four sixty five two hundred fifty two
hundred sixty pounds that can run. You need guys like
that in the league. Hybrid players what sometimes we try
to pigeonhole a guy. If he can do multiple things,
if your defensive coordinator is good enough, you're gonna be
(11:17):
in pretty good shape. This guy was dominant at Penn
State two years ago. He sat out this year, but
in that conference when it was really good, A last
State was loaded that year, Wisconsin was really good. Even
harbous team wasn't that bad. In twenty nineteen. You could
argue the Big Ten was arguably the best conference that year.
Was right, up there two years ago, and this guy
was a top two or three player in that conference,
(11:38):
number five. So Tom Talesco is my buddy. He's very
patient in the draft. So he gets Rashawn Slater to
fall to him. They wanted a left tackle in a corner,
and now in the second round he gets a Sante
Samuel Junior to fall to him, arguably the third best corner.
(11:59):
They were just patient. They had two nique because that's
a good roster. By the way, that is a good roster.
They got the two players they wanted. They liked JC
Horn a lot. Once they couldn't get him. Tom was like,
I'm gonna be patient. They got the second best tackle
and probably the third best corner, maybe fourth. Sometimes just
(12:19):
being patient in life pays off. I will tell you
I am I am all in on the Los Angeles Chargers.
I have bought Super Bowl futures on the Chargers. I
like them over nine wins for the year. I felt
like Herbert justin Herbert last year really just did not
He wasn't rookie great. He was thoughtful great. And there's
(12:43):
a big difference. There's a big difference between a rookie
getting on a hot streak and a rookie who looks
like he understands the playbook and is making smart throws
and is taking the chances when he needs to and
is getting the ball into tight windows and making NFL throws.
I thought that's what he did. He suffered greatly from horrible,
horrible decision making and the talent that he has around him.
(13:07):
He's got a level talent. And so also, don't forget
Thrwyn James coming back. You want to talk about a
safety who can make a difference and get a team
over the top, get a team over their season win total.
The Chargers at nine, give me that number four. One
thing stands out to me about this quarterback draft, and
(13:28):
it was awesome, right, fifty five guys went the top fifteen.
The three guys went to perfect spots. I think it's
going to be difficult this season for Zach Wilson to
look better than Trey Lance if he plays justin fields
and Mac Jones and we just you know, it's New York.
You and I a couple of weeks ago, I was
on here the Anger there. All of a sudden, you
(13:49):
were taken. No, obviously, Trevor goes one, but you chose
this guy over these three. Matt could easily look really
good in New England with those guys. If Trey Lance
is playing, he's looking with Kyle and feels maybe he's
just one of those like kind of Herberts where it's
just wow, this the league screwed up on this guy.
He's good and all of a sudden, Zach, their team's
not any good. I mean, we'll see what they do
(14:11):
the next couple of days, but they don't have many weapons,
and even when you draft weapons, it's not every one
of them hits the ground running. Like it could just
be a long season. If someone texts me the other day,
a rookie quarterback in that division against Belichick who's on
a mission and pissed off Flores who's really good, and
Sean McDermott, who's just a high level coach, Like the
division is tough, Colin, it could just be a long
(14:33):
Zach Wilson could go on to have a good career.
This first year. He better be mentally tough because it's
gonna be a mother Yeah, I mean, their team's not good.
They reset, and also what if Sam they got weapons,
Like what if he's just solid? So then you got. Wow,
Sam's gonna look better than Zach more than likely. It could,
just it could be a rough starting spot. And as
(14:54):
we know in the Northeast, how you start sometimes it's
hard to shake that. Darnold never could. Well, No, this
is why I like what Joe Douglas did. I think
he looked at it because in this draft, corners went
earlier than we thought, Corners moved up, tackles kind of
moved back. Panasu was the first good old lineman taken
(15:16):
at seven. So all of a sudden, you're sitting there
because Miami, we thought in Cincinnati could take a tackle,
they didn't. And so all of a sudden, once the
Chargers got Slater, the first thing I thought is they
got back then last year at left tackle. They got
to protect this kid because they know they went and
(15:37):
got you know, they went and paid money for Corey
Davis at wide receiver. And they need a running back later,
which tomorrow, don't be shocked if they don't get North
Carolina's running back at the top of the second round.
But I really think Joe Douglas thought a lot about
what you just said. Darnold's gonna work down in Carolina. Yeah,
he's not whoever that he's not gonna suck and you
(16:01):
can say, and by the way, I think Joe Douglass
likes him, but I really did like the Elijah Vera
Tucker move. He's a clean player because I think they
realize Joe Douglas says, Listen, we never gave Darnald a
chance up front. We never gave I'm not going to
allow that to happen number three. So let's go to Denver.
(16:25):
So I was a little surprised Bridgewater's a band aid.
Drew Locke has lost the confidence of a lot of
people in the organization. Weren't you a little surprised the
Broncos didn't get a dynamic quarterback? I think sometimes their
new general manager comes from Minnesota. Once upon a time
(16:46):
they drafted Teddy. Anyone that's been around with Teddy swears
by him. But we have enough evidence he's just averaged
to below. You could find like why didn't they trade
a second round pick for Sam Darnold. Why didn't they
just take justin fields like count if you met some
other dude that it's scattered in the NFL, that's better
than me, Like go to them, like, why are you
tied to the old You know who cares that you around?
(17:08):
No one cares anymore. We have evidence it's over. Teddy
Bridgewater's never thrown for more than fifteen touchdowns, John Is
a scout, Mahomes, Derek Carr and Herbert in your division,
I mean to me, I mean, I talked to Bill
Poling about this. He goes, listen, man once we got
Peyton manning. The rest of our division, they were drafting
(17:29):
pass rushers. I mean, Brady. If you go remember Mario Williams.
Buffalo paid a ton for Mario Williams. Why to get
Tom Brady. You have to look at your division. I mean,
I just Denver, and I think to your point, Matt
Naggie with Justin Fields, Trey Lance with Shanahan, Urban's got
(17:49):
Trevor Lawrence, mac Jones, the Belichick, there's a strong likelihood
those four kids flourish and Denver looks idiotic in a
year from now. They clearly don't like Drew Locke. They
took him in the second round. You didn't draft him
in the top ten. Who cares like to bring in
to me? Teddy Bridgewater a band aid who we've seen
(18:10):
as a starter. He's just not good enough, like if
he has to start two or three games like he
did the other last year with the Saints or two
years ago when when Breeze hurt his thumb. Yeah, if
your team stacked, well, you have a flawed roster. Now
to me where I could understand it, Do they end
up with Rogers? If they do, then I would understand
pass on? Do you do they think right now that
(18:30):
they have a good chance with Rogers? The hard part though,
I go back to, like if you're the Packers, Okay,
I give you Rogers and you give me three ones
and a player, Your ones are immediately good because you're
gonna win with him, So one a future one when
I give you Rogers. I had a bud in the
league I was talking to before the draft. He said,
people underrate the Broncos. Offensive lines now really good and
(18:53):
they got skill guys everywhere. Their problem is a quarterback,
Drew Lock's a disaster. But if you put Rogers on them,
their offense is big time and fans it was a
great defensive coordinator, they'd be in pretty good shape. So
find the Packers, like I'm gonna trade j Rogers will
just make the playoffs. Then my picks are in the twenties.
What is good? Does that do me? Right? Number two?
So there, I don't think NFL people are rooting for
(19:16):
Urban Meyer. There's a lot of you know, there's a
lot of pettiness Urban Meyers having a very good draft.
So he goes and gets Travis at N and everybody
kind of freaks out. But this whole Bell Cow running
back thing is bullshit. Christian McCaffrey's falling apart and Zeke
every year as yards per carry go down, you need
two running backs. This is not like, this is not
(19:37):
college football. You need to There's a reason Nick Saban
recruits three to four to five star running backs a year.
It's like hard. So he gets Travis at N. They
have two good backs he gets. Then he goes and
gets Tyson Campbell, the better corner for Georgia the Packers
drafted late in the first round, the second best corner
(19:59):
for Joe or he gets the best corner. Then he
goes out and gets it. It's a great story. He
gets Walker Little, a left tackle for Stanford. So Walker
Little had an injury early and opted out, so people
haven't seen much of him. So two years ago I
talked to David Shaw. I think it was off the air.
It may have been on. It was off the air,
and I said, who's your favorite recruit? And he goes,
(20:21):
we got this kid Walker, a little from Houston. He's
gonna start as a freshman at Stanford at left tackle.
And he's like, yeah, yeah, he goes, this guy is
a first round guy. He got injured and then he
opted out. It maybe the steal of the draft. But
he told me at the time when he saw him.
He goes, he's a top ten, top five NFL pick.
(20:44):
He told me. This was like two years ago. He's like,
his kid is so good. So I don't think anybody's
rooting for Urban Meyer, but I'm gonna throw this at you.
Tennessee looks worse. It's a weird division. Houston's a disaster.
We think Carson and Wentz works. If I told you
Jacksonville ends up going like a nine and eight, ten
(21:07):
and six, Chad, this is a weird, funky division. Fourth
becomes first regularly. Tennessee is not as good, Okay, Houston
maybe a bottom three team in the league. How good
are the Colts? They're good. I think Jacksonville's gonna surprise people,
Oh my god, have you already started cocktail hour? That
(21:29):
is I had what it's small? It's tiny that it's
like you are dipping into the solo cups so hard
right now. That is insane. Trevor Lawrence mel Kiper last night.
I love mel Kiper, he is a gem of a guy,
pointed out that the four quarterbacks he has rated is
(21:49):
like generational talents. It was John Elway, it was Peyton Manning,
it was Andrew luck and it was Trevor Lawrence. Brilliant.
Peyton Manning through twenty eight interceptions his rookie year and
was terrible. Okay, Andrew Lucke got beat up so bad
(22:12):
his rookie year that it lingered for the rest of
his career and shortened his career. Trevor Lawrence is not
going to be a winning quarterback in twenty twenty one.
The Colts are likely to be the best team in
that division. Frank Reich is probably the best coach in
that division. I think the Titan that his Tennessee Titans
improved a little bit, but I don't know that they
(22:34):
improved enough in the defensive backfield to really take over
what the Colts can do if Carson Wentz can be
seventy five percent of what he was with Frank Reich.
And let's not be clouded like Jacksonville is rebuilding their defense,
they got to start over from scratch, all new people.
(22:54):
Urban Meyer amazing coach, but he is not a miracle
worker at the NFL level, where allan is so much
closer together, he is not going to be able to
dominate as he did in college football. Give him two years.
I am not seeing them as a winning team. Okay,
what's their record, Milman, Let's see, it's a seventeen game season.
I don't I don't think they have more than five wins. Oh,
(23:18):
come on, Stefanski. Stefanski never been more than a coordinator.
Look what he did in one year. Stefanski's special. Everyone
knows that everyone is special. What very very special talent.
Come on, he's a genius. He's a boy wonder. He
went to a nine number one. So long story short,
(23:41):
I live in La. Trey Lance was working out in
LA about three weeks ago for the draft and ran
into Trey Lance really really impressed with him as a kid,
good size, looks in the eyes, really humble, really thought full,
and after meeting him. It's funny. I sent a text
(24:05):
to a couple of gms that I thought may have
the chance to get him. One of them, John Lynch,
and I said, hey John, And by the way, when
I do this, I know it has no influence on
the general managers. But John Lynch is a buddy of mine,
and so I thought I'll just send him this. I'm
sure he has it. I know it's not going to
influence him, but you know, you take care of your friends.
John was always great to me, is always great to me.
(24:27):
So I text John. I said, hey, I just met
Trey Lance. I don't know what you're doing with the
number three pick, but I'm like, blah blah blah blah blah,
totally impressed, humble, what a great kid. And John's like, thanks, Colin,
I don't hear anything. Then after the third pig tonight,
I get a couple of fists bumps text to do
me by John Lynch. So I know I had no influence,
(24:50):
but nonetheless it made me laugh. John's a great guy,
and I actually think it's the right pick. I just
don't believe in a division with Russell Wilson twice a year.
Man Stafford twice a year, Kyler Murray twice a year.
I'm gonna have Mac Jones b arm c athlete one
year starter in college. I don't buy it. Trey Lance
(25:12):
is the guy for me. Speaking of that, John Mintelkoff
knows the Bay Area well. He knows the Niners and
the Raiders as well as anybody. So this is just
what I heard. Lynch was more Trey Lance, Kyle was
more Mac. The Scouts kind of leaned in John's direction,
and in the end, Trey Lance blew them away in
(25:35):
the pro day. So John, your reaction to what the
Niners did with Trey Lance, Yeah, I mean it would
have been it would have been despised, you know, with
forty nine Ers fans, and you know it didn't make
any sense. But ultimately it's a moot point because they
took the other guy. I think the one thing that
(25:55):
really stands out is you texting with with Lynch. I've
known Adam Peters kind of his right hand guy for
a long time. Clearly we just have a lot of
intel on the type players Kyle likes personality wise. Character
is a big big deal. You know, I wouldn't say
it's quite Belichick. You know where it's very very like
(26:15):
Mac Jones, like perfect off the field, just historically what
the Patriots are into. But I was around Andy Reid
like a little more open minded, you know Andy, the
Al Davis is like, you know, they lean talent. Kyle
was very very rigid. And John Lynch, I mean, I
think he leans that way too. Stanford guy. What stood
(26:37):
out to me about Trey Lances he was a Condon guy,
a CIA guy, and they also have Mac Jones. And historically,
you know, it's the Staffords, it's the Mannings, it's the Breezes,
it's the Alex Smith's. And when when I saw that
they got Trey Lance and I've been trying to get
him on podcasts and you know, talk to this guy,
that that really stood out to me. I went, Wow,
(26:57):
this guy is with the crew that really values care character.
And then the physical attributes he lost to the Homes
in the Super Bowl. Kyle did obviously, Brady got him
the one year when he had Matt Ryan, who was
really good. Brady's just dramatically better. And then this year
on Monday Night Football when their team, you know, the
Niners didn't miss the playoffs this year by seven games,
they missed it by two, and down the stretch they
(27:19):
handled the Rams, beat the breaks off the Cardinals. I
mean they don't need I mean, obviously they would have
loved Aaron Rodgers their quarterback, but they just need solid
quarterback play. But Josh Allen on a Monday night football
game destroyed them. And Kyle had comments after the game
basically like I love this guy coming out and just
when you sit there on the sideline and watch this talent,
like to beat this guy, you have to have a
(27:42):
great player on your side. And they talked on Monday
and they said, ideally, what you would want is Drew
Brees that can move like Lamar Jackson. Now obviously that's
unfair to even think that Trey Lance can ever become that,
But I think the character and the intelligence from what
I've heard of Trey Lance, on top of the physical attributes,
(28:02):
that is a risk. I mean anytime Josh Allen was
a big risk. But I as a as a fan
of the draft and someone who's lived it, I respect
them taking a massive swing for the fence, a calculated risk,
taking a high character guy. But he doesn't He hasn't
played that much Colin and he's not coming from a
big school. I mean he's coming from now. You can
argue they've they've produced three NFL quarterbacks in six years,
(28:25):
Carson Wentz, Cooper Rush, and this guy. That's pretty impressive
or Easton Stick. Excuse me. That's all for this week.
Got a great week coming up. Make sure to subscribe
and follow us at The Volume Sports on Twitter and Instagram.
The volume. This is Prime Cuts Top ten takes from
the NFL Draft. It's a countdown to the best takes
from me, my buddy, John Middlecoff, Chad Millman of the
Action Network. After the first three rounds of the draft,
(00:23):
we get into our favorite picks, not so favorite picks.
Who's the biggest reach my inside info on Trey Lance.
It's funny. Enjoy number ten. There's been criticism about New
England that they don't do their homework necessarily. This is
what I've been told by people through the years. And
the more Super Bowls Belichick one, the more power he
(00:43):
has in the organization. And about mid to late January
he tells the scouts, I've got it from here. And
Bill's not thought of as lazy. But I don't think
they always do their homework with their draft. Here's a
prime example. He relies on people he knows herm ed words.
He went and not got Nikil Harry, and story broke.
(01:04):
Albert Brier broke the story that the scouting department did
not want Nikil Harry and Belichick blew him off. So
they go out and draft Christian Barmore, defensive tackle Alabama.
I have two different people who I trust, who took
him off their board because of some personal stuff they'd heard.
(01:25):
I mean, even Nick Saban had to defend him during
the year. That's classic. He was a red flag guy
for just two of the teams two for two I
talked to, So your thoughts, I mean, I just I
think Belichick he has struggled in this draft, and Christian
Barmore Nick Saban had to defend him multiple times this year,
(01:49):
Like I don't like the move. Well, look I can't.
I can't speak to anything about Barmore, but I do
think it's interesting that there is always, in very specific instances,
year after year, Belichick trusting Nick Saban, right, who's the
(02:12):
quarterback that he wanted? Who's the quarterback that he drafted?
And now last night he's being praised for staying in
one spot and getting Mac Jones, And I, like, I
have been suspect of Mac Jones and Zach Wilson this
entire process because I do not understand how quarterbacks and
(02:35):
Trey Lance falls into this too. I do not understand
how quarterbacks who perform for one year with in mac
jones case, obviously they are heading shoulders more talented than everybody,
but Zack Wilson, who is playing against a supreme offensive
line against terrible competition. He does it for one year
and a few games, and all of a sudden, he's
(02:57):
a world beater. And it makes no sense to me.
Why any quarterback. And I'm sort of veered from your question,
but to me, it speaks to a larger issue of
the lack of science in scouting and these coaches, these
scouts who fall in love with what they believe to
be talented. It's like that great scene in Moneyball where
(03:18):
they're all sitting around a table. The ball sounds great.
When he comes off his bat. His girlfriend's ugly. He's
got no confidence. Like they're basing these decisions on things
like just look at the film. Look at the film.
Justin Fields played against top level competition for multiple years
and was consistent throughout his career. Trevor Lawrence, same thing.
(03:42):
Why are you not drafting the guys who prove it
on the field. Don't give me he doesn't weigh enough.
Don't give me his hips aren't good. It's like they
try to outguess themselves so they can be the smartest
guy in the room and make the pick that is
going to make them seem like a genius instead of
grabbing the gold that is right in front of them. Well,
I mean, Jordan Love had one great ear, he gets drafted.
(04:03):
Zach Wilson had one great ear and gets drafted. I mean,
if you go to high school. In college, Justin Fields
was dominant for like a five year stretch. So I
agree with you number nine. My favorite pick of the night.
Part of this is luck because the guy fell. I
give the Bears a lot of credit. So let's talk that.
(04:24):
Because now I was gonna say John, So, Ryan Pace
is in trouble. I mean he's getting bad press. I
think people like Naggie, there's a lot of doubters on
Ryan Pace. You could make the argument that by moving
up to get a quarterback, he's going to get three
to four days of great press. Yeah, and that if
he was a selfish gem, he's like, you know, everybody
(04:47):
loves the quarterback, but I actually like it because my
takeaway is Dalton is Alex Smith. He understands his role.
He can be a mentor. You're not paying him much.
If Justin Fields had to learn from somebody outside of
Alex Smith, you could argue Andy Dalton is about as
(05:07):
good a role model as you could have for a year,
and best case scenario, Fields comes in just beats him
out in training camp. He's just a better player, and
Andy knows his role. He just sits behind him. Here's
the other thing, though, there are not many general managers
that aren't like they're a decade plus to get the
opportunity to take two first round quarterbacks. I would if
me and you would have been in there and we
ran the Bears, I would not have been okay, very
(05:30):
like giving Ryan Pace the power to trade future first
round picks to do much. But the moment Fields start plummeting.
And this can be overrated, But in the Midwest Ohio state,
justin Fields the Bear, that area, that region. Think how
many Ohio State fans just live in the area the Bears.
I'd say, coming into this draft, of all the big
(05:50):
market teams had to have the lowest rating of fan confidence.
I would imagine tonight tomorrow, it's like jubilation. We got
this guy who Colin. I think this guy is getting
underrated as a prospect. He's almost six four, he's got
a big arm, he can run. I know there are
some fundamental flaws. These coaches make eight, ten, eleven million dollars.
(06:11):
Now they're all offensive coaches. Guy up, you don't think it.
Andy Reid as Sean McVay would want to work with
this guy, like ultimately Kyle Shannah and went with Trey
Lance similar, big strong, can run like these are the
type guys these coaches want Sean Payton want to work
with now. And the other thing is he's played a
lot like he should be. I don't want to say
plug and play. It's a hard transition, but he should.
(06:33):
He should have the opportunity to start just an open competition.
And if you're a Bears fan, it just breathed some
life into the franchise. Number eight. First of all, the
Miami Dolphins are having a hell of a draft. See
that is a team that I wholly I mean, by
(06:54):
the way, if you're just they got oh my god,
they got four starters in this draft, Jalen Waddle, Jalen Phillips.
By the way, I watched a lot of Oregon football
because I used to work there. Javon Holland at safety
is a stud. And then they get Notre Dame's left tackle,
Liam Eichenberg, So now they have a left Austin Jackson
(07:17):
last year. So far, to me, the Dolphins are winning
the draft. Four clean, no red flag players, four starters, right.
I really like what they're doing. Let me talk about
the other Bay Area team, formerly the Raiders, now the
Las Vegas Raiders. I thought they were the first team
to reach with Alex Leatherwood. It's funny. I was hearing
(07:40):
a lot of the ESPN analysts say, well, he's got
a lot of potential, there's a great ceiling. And my
takeaway is, when's the last Saban player at Obama that
didn't get close to his potential at Alabama? I mean,
Nick's pretty good at squeezing all that potential out. I
don't think he's terribly strong. I think he's an inside
offensive lineman in the NFL. I haven't loved their picks
(08:02):
in the first round. I think Leatherwood was available in
the second round. I thought it was a reach. I
really and and I don't like saying that because he'll
start in the NFL, but boy, I thought it was
a reach. Yeah. I think sometimes I immediately text an
SEC scout he's like, I like Leatherwood, but I had
(08:23):
multiple offensive linemen on the board that are still on
the board that I would have taken over the guy,
you know, and you look at the division that Denver
didn't overthink it. They just took Patrick certain, a guy
that you know at Alabama, Boom, plug and play, ready
to rock and roll. Look at the Chargers. They end
up with a tackle, boom, plug and play, ready to roll.
The Raiders back to back years, Damon Arnette last year,
(08:47):
it's like, whoa you go in Ohio State. They've one
thing with Mayock and Gruden these last several years. It's
basically Ohio State, BAM or Clemson. That's just the way
they lean, which I got no issue with, but not
every that's not the way the draft works. Sometimes a
guy from Virginia Tech can be better. I think the
risk Colin is that they're comparing it to their recent tackle,
(09:09):
Colton Miller, who was much more of a projection who
then lived up to it. But sometimes, like I don't
want to say they got lucky there, but that was
a pretty big swing and it worked out. And they
keep taking these taking huge kind of stretches and some
of these outliers instead of just don't over outthink the
room here. And what's weird is watching Maynock on TV
(09:31):
for a decade plus, he felt very meat and potatoes,
nuts and bolts like these aren't his type picks. This
does feel a little more Gruden every time it does.
Number six. I thought the Cowboys, how about that? Like
the guys they wanted to go off the board, and
what do they do? They do a deal with a
division rival, but they moved back to spots. They still
(09:51):
get a stud and they gain a third round pick.
Like that's a high level. Jerry's a good GM. Jerry's
problem is this he resigns guys when he probably should
let him walk him. Picking players is not an issue. Hey,
I really, let's talk Dallas. I know they wanted a
corner my intel was, but the minute they couldn't get them,
(10:12):
they're like, all right, let's get the best defensive player. Now.
I don't think they have an urgent need at linebacker.
But the problem is their linebackers have health issues. So
where if you were a scout for the Cowboys, would
you a push for Micah because they have two? You
know they've got linebackers. Well, the way I had this
player described to me is he can play a role
(10:34):
in a four three defense, which they're going to run
with dan Quinn a little a better version of what
Bruce Irvan was back when Seattle got them with dan
Quinn a decade ago. As this stand up sam linebacker
who can also rush the passer and the patriot or
I mean, the Cowboys just need better players up front, right,
guys that can tackle. Vander Esch gets hurt a lot.
(10:56):
So this guy can go sideline the sideline, but he
also brings you pass rush value. And he's just a
blue chip body type. You know. You just get a
guy that's six four sixty five two hundred fifty two
hundred sixty pounds that can run. You need guys like
that in the league. Hybrid players what sometimes we try
to pigeonhole a guy. If he can do multiple things,
if your defensive coordinator is good enough, you're gonna be
(11:17):
in pretty good shape. This guy was dominant at Penn
State two years ago. He sat out this year, but
in that conference when it was really good, A last
State was loaded that year, Wisconsin was really good. Even
harbous team wasn't that bad. In twenty nineteen. You could
argue the Big Ten was arguably the best conference that year.
Was right, up there two years ago, and this guy
was a top two or three player in that conference,
(11:38):
number five. So Tom Talesco is my buddy. He's very
patient in the draft. So he gets Rashawn Slater to
fall to him. They wanted a left tackle in a corner,
and now in the second round he gets a Sante
Samuel Junior to fall to him, arguably the third best corner.
(11:59):
They were just patient. They had two nique because that's
a good roster. By the way, that is a good roster.
They got the two players they wanted. They liked JC
Horn a lot. Once they couldn't get him. Tom was like,
I'm gonna be patient. They got the second best tackle
and probably the third best corner, maybe fourth. Sometimes just
(12:19):
being patient in life pays off. I will tell you
I am I am all in on the Los Angeles Chargers.
I have bought Super Bowl futures on the Chargers. I
like them over nine wins for the year. I felt
like Herbert justin Herbert last year really just did not
He wasn't rookie great. He was thoughtful great. And there's
(12:43):
a big difference. There's a big difference between a rookie
getting on a hot streak and a rookie who looks
like he understands the playbook and is making smart throws
and is taking the chances when he needs to and
is getting the ball into tight windows and making NFL throws.
I thought that's what he did. He suffered greatly from horrible,
horrible decision making and the talent that he has around him.
(13:07):
He's got a level talent. And so also, don't forget
Thrwyn James coming back. You want to talk about a
safety who can make a difference and get a team
over the top, get a team over their season win total.
The Chargers at nine, give me that number four. One
thing stands out to me about this quarterback draft, and
(13:28):
it was awesome, right, fifty five guys went the top fifteen.
The three guys went to perfect spots. I think it's
going to be difficult this season for Zach Wilson to
look better than Trey Lance if he plays justin fields
and Mac Jones and we just you know, it's New York.
You and I a couple of weeks ago, I was
on here the Anger there. All of a sudden, you
(13:49):
were taken. No, obviously, Trevor goes one, but you chose
this guy over these three. Matt could easily look really
good in New England with those guys. If Trey Lance
is playing, he's looking with Kyle and feels maybe he's
just one of those like kind of Herberts where it's
just wow, this the league screwed up on this guy.
He's good and all of a sudden, Zach, their team's
not any good. I mean, we'll see what they do
(14:11):
the next couple of days, but they don't have many weapons,
and even when you draft weapons, it's not every one
of them hits the ground running. Like it could just
be a long season. If someone texts me the other day,
a rookie quarterback in that division against Belichick who's on
a mission and pissed off Flores who's really good, and
Sean McDermott, who's just a high level coach, Like the
division is tough, Colin, it could just be a long
(14:33):
Zach Wilson could go on to have a good career.
This first year. He better be mentally tough because it's
gonna be a mother Yeah, I mean, their team's not good.
They reset, and also what if Sam they got weapons,
Like what if he's just solid? So then you got. Wow,
Sam's gonna look better than Zach more than likely. It could,
just it could be a rough starting spot. And as
(14:54):
we know in the Northeast, how you start sometimes it's
hard to shake that. Darnold never could. Well, No, this
is why I like what Joe Douglas did. I think
he looked at it because in this draft, corners went
earlier than we thought, Corners moved up, tackles kind of
moved back. Panasu was the first good old lineman taken
(15:16):
at seven. So all of a sudden, you're sitting there
because Miami, we thought in Cincinnati could take a tackle,
they didn't. And so all of a sudden, once the
Chargers got Slater, the first thing I thought is they
got back then last year at left tackle. They got
to protect this kid because they know they went and
(15:37):
got you know, they went and paid money for Corey
Davis at wide receiver. And they need a running back later,
which tomorrow, don't be shocked if they don't get North
Carolina's running back at the top of the second round.
But I really think Joe Douglas thought a lot about
what you just said. Darnold's gonna work down in Carolina. Yeah,
he's not whoever that he's not gonna suck and you
(16:01):
can say, and by the way, I think Joe Douglass
likes him, but I really did like the Elijah Vera
Tucker move. He's a clean player because I think they
realize Joe Douglas says, Listen, we never gave Darnald a
chance up front. We never gave I'm not going to
allow that to happen number three. So let's go to Denver.
(16:25):
So I was a little surprised Bridgewater's a band aid.
Drew Locke has lost the confidence of a lot of
people in the organization. Weren't you a little surprised the
Broncos didn't get a dynamic quarterback? I think sometimes their
new general manager comes from Minnesota. Once upon a time
(16:46):
they drafted Teddy. Anyone that's been around with Teddy swears
by him. But we have enough evidence he's just averaged
to below. You could find like why didn't they trade
a second round pick for Sam Darnold. Why didn't they
just take justin fields like count if you met some
other dude that it's scattered in the NFL, that's better
than me, Like go to them, like, why are you
tied to the old You know who cares that you around?
(17:08):
No one cares anymore. We have evidence it's over. Teddy
Bridgewater's never thrown for more than fifteen touchdowns, John Is
a scout, Mahomes, Derek Carr and Herbert in your division,
I mean to me, I mean, I talked to Bill
Poling about this. He goes, listen, man once we got
Peyton manning. The rest of our division, they were drafting
(17:29):
pass rushers. I mean, Brady. If you go remember Mario Williams.
Buffalo paid a ton for Mario Williams. Why to get
Tom Brady. You have to look at your division. I mean,
I just Denver, and I think to your point, Matt
Naggie with Justin Fields, Trey Lance with Shanahan, Urban's got
(17:49):
Trevor Lawrence, mac Jones, the Belichick, there's a strong likelihood
those four kids flourish and Denver looks idiotic in a
year from now. They clearly don't like Drew Locke. They
took him in the second round. You didn't draft him
in the top ten. Who cares like to bring in
to me? Teddy Bridgewater a band aid who we've seen
(18:10):
as a starter. He's just not good enough, like if
he has to start two or three games like he
did the other last year with the Saints or two
years ago when when Breeze hurt his thumb. Yeah, if
your team stacked, well, you have a flawed roster. Now
to me where I could understand it, Do they end
up with Rogers? If they do, then I would understand
pass on? Do you do they think right now that
(18:30):
they have a good chance with Rogers? The hard part though,
I go back to, like if you're the Packers, Okay,
I give you Rogers and you give me three ones
and a player, Your ones are immediately good because you're
gonna win with him, So one a future one when
I give you Rogers. I had a bud in the
league I was talking to before the draft. He said,
people underrate the Broncos. Offensive lines now really good and
(18:53):
they got skill guys everywhere. Their problem is a quarterback,
Drew Lock's a disaster. But if you put Rogers on them,
their offense is big time and fans it was a
great defensive coordinator, they'd be in pretty good shape. So
find the Packers, like I'm gonna trade j Rogers will
just make the playoffs. Then my picks are in the twenties.
What is good? Does that do me? Right? Number two?
So there, I don't think NFL people are rooting for
(19:16):
Urban Meyer. There's a lot of you know, there's a
lot of pettiness Urban Meyers having a very good draft.
So he goes and gets Travis at N and everybody
kind of freaks out. But this whole Bell Cow running
back thing is bullshit. Christian McCaffrey's falling apart and Zeke
every year as yards per carry go down, you need
two running backs. This is not like, this is not
(19:37):
college football. You need to There's a reason Nick Saban
recruits three to four to five star running backs a year.
It's like hard. So he gets Travis at N. They
have two good backs he gets. Then he goes and
gets Tyson Campbell, the better corner for Georgia the Packers
drafted late in the first round, the second best corner
(19:59):
for Joe or he gets the best corner. Then he
goes out and gets it. It's a great story. He
gets Walker Little, a left tackle for Stanford. So Walker
Little had an injury early and opted out, so people
haven't seen much of him. So two years ago I
talked to David Shaw. I think it was off the air.
It may have been on. It was off the air,
and I said, who's your favorite recruit? And he goes,
(20:21):
we got this kid Walker, a little from Houston. He's
gonna start as a freshman at Stanford at left tackle.
And he's like, yeah, yeah, he goes, this guy is
a first round guy. He got injured and then he
opted out. It maybe the steal of the draft. But
he told me at the time when he saw him.
He goes, he's a top ten, top five NFL pick.
(20:44):
He told me. This was like two years ago. He's like,
his kid is so good. So I don't think anybody's
rooting for Urban Meyer, but I'm gonna throw this at you.
Tennessee looks worse. It's a weird division. Houston's a disaster.
We think Carson and Wentz works. If I told you
Jacksonville ends up going like a nine and eight, ten
(21:07):
and six, Chad, this is a weird, funky division. Fourth
becomes first regularly. Tennessee is not as good, Okay, Houston
maybe a bottom three team in the league. How good
are the Colts? They're good. I think Jacksonville's gonna surprise people,
Oh my god, have you already started cocktail hour? That
(21:29):
is I had what it's small? It's tiny that it's
like you are dipping into the solo cups so hard
right now. That is insane. Trevor Lawrence mel Kiper last night.
I love mel Kiper, he is a gem of a guy,
pointed out that the four quarterbacks he has rated is
(21:49):
like generational talents. It was John Elway, it was Peyton Manning,
it was Andrew luck and it was Trevor Lawrence. Brilliant.
Peyton Manning through twenty eight interceptions his rookie year and
was terrible. Okay, Andrew Lucke got beat up so bad
(22:12):
his rookie year that it lingered for the rest of
his career and shortened his career. Trevor Lawrence is not
going to be a winning quarterback in twenty twenty one.
The Colts are likely to be the best team in
that division. Frank Reich is probably the best coach in
that division. I think the Titan that his Tennessee Titans
improved a little bit, but I don't know that they
(22:34):
improved enough in the defensive backfield to really take over
what the Colts can do if Carson Wentz can be
seventy five percent of what he was with Frank Reich.
And let's not be clouded like Jacksonville is rebuilding their defense,
they got to start over from scratch, all new people.
(22:54):
Urban Meyer amazing coach, but he is not a miracle
worker at the NFL level, where allan is so much
closer together, he is not going to be able to
dominate as he did in college football. Give him two years.
I am not seeing them as a winning team. Okay,
what's their record, Milman, Let's see, it's a seventeen game season.
I don't I don't think they have more than five wins. Oh,
(23:18):
come on, Stefanski. Stefanski never been more than a coordinator.
Look what he did in one year. Stefanski's special. Everyone
knows that everyone is special. What very very special talent.
Come on, he's a genius. He's a boy wonder. He
went to a nine number one. So long story short,
(23:41):
I live in La. Trey Lance was working out in
LA about three weeks ago for the draft and ran
into Trey Lance really really impressed with him as a kid,
good size, looks in the eyes, really humble, really thought full,
and after meeting him. It's funny. I sent a text
(24:05):
to a couple of gms that I thought may have
the chance to get him. One of them, John Lynch,
and I said, hey John, And by the way, when
I do this, I know it has no influence on
the general managers. But John Lynch is a buddy of mine,
and so I thought I'll just send him this. I'm
sure he has it. I know it's not going to
influence him, but you know, you take care of your friends.
John was always great to me, is always great to me.
(24:27):
So I text John. I said, hey, I just met
Trey Lance. I don't know what you're doing with the
number three pick, but I'm like, blah blah blah blah blah,
totally impressed, humble, what a great kid. And John's like, thanks, Colin,
I don't hear anything. Then after the third pig tonight,
I get a couple of fists bumps text to do
me by John Lynch. So I know I had no influence,
(24:50):
but nonetheless it made me laugh. John's a great guy,
and I actually think it's the right pick. I just
don't believe in a division with Russell Wilson twice a year.
Man Stafford twice a year, Kyler Murray twice a year.
I'm gonna have Mac Jones b arm c athlete one
year starter in college. I don't buy it. Trey Lance
(25:12):
is the guy for me. Speaking of that, John Mintelkoff
knows the Bay Area well. He knows the Niners and
the Raiders as well as anybody. So this is just
what I heard. Lynch was more Trey Lance, Kyle was
more Mac. The Scouts kind of leaned in John's direction,
and in the end, Trey Lance blew them away in
(25:35):
the pro day. So John, your reaction to what the
Niners did with Trey Lance, Yeah, I mean it would
have been it would have been despised, you know, with
forty nine Ers fans, and you know it didn't make
any sense. But ultimately it's a moot point because they
took the other guy. I think the one thing that
(25:55):
really stands out is you texting with with Lynch. I've
known Adam Peters kind of his right hand guy for
a long time. Clearly we just have a lot of
intel on the type players Kyle likes personality wise. Character
is a big big deal. You know, I wouldn't say
it's quite Belichick. You know where it's very very like
(26:15):
Mac Jones, like perfect off the field, just historically what
the Patriots are into. But I was around Andy Reid
like a little more open minded, you know Andy, the
Al Davis is like, you know, they lean talent. Kyle
was very very rigid. And John Lynch, I mean, I
think he leans that way too. Stanford guy. What stood
(26:37):
out to me about Trey Lances he was a Condon guy,
a CIA guy, and they also have Mac Jones. And historically,
you know, it's the Staffords, it's the Mannings, it's the Breezes,
it's the Alex Smith's. And when when I saw that
they got Trey Lance and I've been trying to get
him on podcasts and you know, talk to this guy,
that that really stood out to me. I went, Wow,
(26:57):
this guy is with the crew that really values care character.
And then the physical attributes he lost to the Homes
in the Super Bowl. Kyle did obviously, Brady got him
the one year when he had Matt Ryan, who was
really good. Brady's just dramatically better. And then this year
on Monday Night Football when their team, you know, the
Niners didn't miss the playoffs this year by seven games,
they missed it by two, and down the stretch they
(27:19):
handled the Rams, beat the breaks off the Cardinals. I
mean they don't need I mean, obviously they would have
loved Aaron Rodgers their quarterback, but they just need solid
quarterback play. But Josh Allen on a Monday night football
game destroyed them. And Kyle had comments after the game
basically like I love this guy coming out and just
when you sit there on the sideline and watch this talent,
like to beat this guy, you have to have a
(27:42):
great player on your side. And they talked on Monday
and they said, ideally, what you would want is Drew
Brees that can move like Lamar Jackson. Now obviously that's
unfair to even think that Trey Lance can ever become that,
But I think the character and the intelligence from what
I've heard of Trey Lance, on top of the physical attributes,
(28:02):
that is a risk. I mean anytime Josh Allen was
a big risk. But I as a as a fan
of the draft and someone who's lived it, I respect
them taking a massive swing for the fence, a calculated risk,
taking a high character guy. But he doesn't He hasn't
played that much Colin and he's not coming from a
big school. I mean he's coming from now. You can
argue they've they've produced three NFL quarterbacks in six years,
(28:25):
Carson Wentz, Cooper Rush, and this guy. That's pretty impressive
or Easton Stick. Excuse me. That's all for this week.
Got a great week coming up. Make sure to subscribe
and follow us at The Volume Sports on Twitter and Instagram.
Host
Colin Cowherd
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Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.