First, Colin’s top takes of the week, including reacts to the Jets finally completing the trade for Aaron Rodgers with the Packers, and what makes the NFL Draft unique to every other pro sports draft.
Then, longtime NFL writer - and host of the Open Mike podcast - Mike Silver and Colin to react to the Rodgers trade, what to expect in year one with the Jets, how long before the Packers can decide if Jordan Love is their next franchise QB, and how Rodgers will handle the the rabid New York media.
Next, Colin and 3 and Out podcast Host John Middlekauff react to a surprising 1st Round of the NFL Draft, including the Eagles the consensus #1 rated prospect in Georgia DL Jalen Carter, if the Texans should have taken Ohio State QB C.J. Stroud with the 2nd overall pick, why the Seahawks look to be putting together another stellar class, if the Lions should be considered the NFC North favorite, why Will Levis went undrafted
Finally, Hoops Tonight host Jason Timpf joins Colin to discuss if Warriors/ Kings has better than the eventual Western Conference Finals a thriller of a Game 4, if De’Aaron Fox looks is a Top 10 NBA player, what makes Draymond invaluable to the Warriors, if the Lakers are clearly superior to the Grizzlies, where the Knicks have a huge advantage over the Cavs.
Follow Colin and The Volume on Twitter for the latest content and updates, and check out FanDuel for the best wagering and daily fantasy action! #Herd #Volume
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
The volume.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
This is Prime Cuts, the best of the Colin Coward Podcast.
All right, Aaron Rodgers going to the New York Jets
is official. The draft picks were around what most people speculated.
Nobody won the trade. I mean you can argue the
Jets won the trade because they get Aaron Rodgers. I
think my takeaway is that I've always said that once
(00:37):
a rookie quarterback comes in, I will give him a
year and a half year. Two Thanksgiving. You will know
what you have now. It used to be you gave
a rookie quarterback two full years. Bill Pollian would say three.
But with seven on seven summer camps, the personal quarterback coaching,
(00:57):
I'll give you to Thanksgiving your second year in. But
it is different with Jordan Love. Jordan Love has been
in the building for three years. I will give Jordan
Love until Thanksgiving. This year. You'll know. By getting another
second round pick, the Packers can pick up a wide
(01:18):
receiver in the first round, an edge rusher, and a
tight end in the second. It's an incredibly deep edge
rusher and tight end draft. So the Packers should be
able to get three starters in their first three picks.
And that's what they're going to go after in what order.
I have no IDEA wide receiver, tight end, and edge rusher.
It is not a deep wide receiver class. There is
(01:41):
one receiver maybe two in the first round, and the
Packers have the thirteenth pick. So my guess is they
go for the best receiver out of Ohio State. Then
they probably get a tight end in an edge rusher
in round two. Those are all going to be high
rotation or starting players. Then you draft and develop the
rest of the draft. This is a team that is
(02:03):
ready to win football games. Okay, we know Minnesota is
not going eleven to zero in one score games. We
don't know if Chicago's any good and Detroit, though improved,
is Detroit with that gambling scandal. Who knows who's going
to be available in September. But this team is ready
to win or at least be competent. Jordan Love is
(02:24):
inheriting a top ten offensive line, two more than capable
running backs, one a borderline star Christian Watson is an
emerging star at wide receiver, an offensive coach. They need
an edge rusher. They have a Pro Bowl corner, good
interior defensive linemen, excellent young safeties, you can't win nine
(02:45):
or ten games, and we'll know by Thanksgiving in the
weakest the NFC has been in twenty years, then you
got the wrong guy. This is one of my favorite
weeks of the year, as all of you know if
you've listened to me for years. I love the NFL draft,
the architecture of it. I mean, the Jets were a
(03:06):
great example last year where they nailed their first four picks.
The Seahawks nailed their first five, and it literally set
the future up. I mean, if they get Aaron Rodgers,
the Jets will be able to play with anybody. Probably
have to get a left tackle and another receiver and
the Jets will be able to play with anybody. They
got two good receivers, they have a pass rush. They
just need to upgrade at tight end, left tackle, wide receiver.
(03:29):
Joe Douglas will do that in the draft. I mean, Seattle,
we thought was a dying franchise. They hit on two tackles,
a star running back and edge rusher and two corners.
Speaker 1 (03:38):
Boom.
Speaker 2 (03:39):
You know, now they just need another edge rusher. They
got to get a couple of defensive linemen, maybe one
more receiver, and the sky is the limit. So you know,
other drafts are different. Even a great college baseball player,
he's not going to make an impact the following year
in the Major League Baseball playoffs. As great as these
(04:01):
NBA players are, Daron Fox now is just starting to
like turn a franchise around. What is he in year five?
It takes a long time. These guys come out at
nineteen years old. NFL is different for a lot of reasons.
Number one is guys come out at twenty three and
twenty four years old. They're real men. They're physically ready
to play. So if you hit on your first four
(04:22):
or five picks, you know people lament the LA Rams
they have a second and two thirds. If they nail
the right edge rusher, interior offensive lineman, and get a starbacker,
another really high ended receiver in the third round. If
they can get three starters, they turn around the franchise.
They got McVeigh, they have Stafford, they have Aaron Donald.
You're getting grown ups, men physically and emotionally ready to
(04:47):
play and start. So the Jets and the Seahawks last
year are great examples. You nail your verse four or
five draft picks, you can in that moment you bring
in five new starters that you don't have to pay
for four to five years. It changes, shifts the paradigm
of the entire franchise. I mean, look at how bad
the Jets were, the mess Joe Douglas inherits, he even
(05:09):
missed on a quarterback and a left tackle, two of
the three most important positions in football. He missed on both.
And if Aaron Rodgers signs and they hit on a
left tackle and one other receiver, the Jets can play
with anybody in this league, including the Chiefs, they can
play with anybody in this league. So I love this week.
(05:29):
I think the NFL is the League of hope more
than any other league. I remember when Bill Parcells years
ago took over the Miami Dolphins and they were one
in fifteen. The next year they won eleven games, And
I read an article Tony Sperano I think was Bill
Parcell's choice as a coach, kind of a defensive guy.
And I remember reading an article somebody wrote in the
Miami Herald or a Fort Lauderdale paper about what Belichick
(05:53):
really did was he took the middle of the roster
to the end of it. It wasn't the top end
of the roster. He made the locker room better, the
weight room better. He went and got grinders and rotational
players and backups and a handful of low level starters,
and it changed the entire culture of the organization with
like twenty new players, and they weren't stars. Most of
(06:17):
them weren't stars. So no sport allows you to recreate
your roster and your football identity like the NFL. It
takes two to three free agent signings, four home runs
in the draft, seven eight new players to start at energy,
especially draft guys who are cheap, and you turn everything around.
(06:39):
So I can't wait. Somebody is going to do a
Jets or a Seahawks, and I can't wait to watch it.
All right, Mike Silver, a valuable member of the volume.
When breaking news happens, Mike Silver happens, I love that.
That sounds like a billboard.
Speaker 3 (06:58):
Yeah, Colin, I know you remember a year ago, or
a little more than a year ago, we were on
together when the DeVante Adams trade happened to the Raiders
and we were like, whoa, you know, because that was
a little more sudden. But yeah, this is I think
it's an exciting day and I don't want to gloss
(07:18):
over this. For Jets fans, this is awesome. The Jets
are getting one of the best quarterbacks of all time,
possibly with years left. They have a team that was
good enough to almost make the playoffs last year despite
injuries and Zach Wilson being the quarterback for a lot
of it. And Aaron knows this offense intimately because Nathaniel
(07:42):
Hackett's now the coordinators. So people might say, oh, it's
great for the Packers, it's win win that we could
get into all that, but it's not win win.
Speaker 1 (07:50):
The Jets win the day today.
Speaker 2 (07:52):
In my opinion, this isn't perfectly analogous, but I've three
times traveled cross country and took a new job. The
first year, whether you're talented or not, with new environment
is hard, it's choppy. I hope Aaron plays for a
second year. First of all, new defensive coordinators, new conference,
new environment, it's everything, new neighborhood. And if you go
(08:15):
look at Aaron's history, first year starting the league, little bumpy,
first year with Hackett, little bumpy. I think he's going
to do really well. I kind of feel like it's
a ten seven eleven six team. I think it's I
think their schedule is not the easiest. No, But what's
a realistic expectation to you?
Speaker 3 (08:33):
That's a great question because if you look at it
on paper, you say, the AFC is a gauntlet, right,
and the AFC certainly is not going to be easy.
And they are the Jets. They do have some dudes.
I mean both rookies of the year. Brice Hall was
that good before he got hurt. Elijah er Tucker was
hurt last year. You know, they've they've got some dudes,
(08:55):
and I think they will play pretty good defense. You
know you're right about year one because that was the
case in Green Bay, which was year one in the
laflor Hacket offense. And they did go thirteen and three
and reach the NFC Championship Game with a very good team,
but it was not humming offensively the way that you
would expect an Aaron Rodgers team to.
Speaker 1 (09:18):
But I think, you.
Speaker 3 (09:20):
Know, I look at far his first year there, which
everyone revisioned his history thinks sucked, and then he went
to Minnesota and was really good. But Farv had those
Jets eight and three right up in playoff contention. He
was an MVP contention. He suffered an arm injury that essentially,
(09:40):
you know, made him noodle arm the rest of that year,
and it didn't go great. But this is going to
give them a real jolt, and franchise quarterbacks affect teams
in ways that go beyond what most of us see.
It just changes the energy and the vibe of the organization.
It lends a credibility to the the meetings, the practices internally,
(10:03):
and you know, he's going to pull a game or
two out that the Jets aren't used to pulling out,
and that's gonna potentially snowball. So I think playoffs is
a very realistic, you know possibility. I think once you're
in the playoffs with Aaron Rodgers, if you're peaking at
the right time, that.
Speaker 1 (10:21):
Could be really, really exciting.
Speaker 3 (10:25):
And I guess the other thing I want to say,
because it's confusing, right, I would if you told me, hey,
the Packers and Eric Rodgers have decided to come back
for one more year, I wouldn't be as wildly upbeat
about the Packers. And here's why. I just don't think
you'd be getting the same guy in Green Trump. The
(10:46):
guy they had last year I was, is not the
guy that I expect the Jets to be getting today,
and that's not fair necessarily to the Packers, but it
is a reality, and that's why I think Jets fan
should be fired.
Speaker 2 (11:00):
Well yeah, I think all relationships can run their course,
and I think the Green Bay situation there was a
lack of trust on both sides. There was a little
bit of animosity for different reasons. I think you'll get
I think you'll get a highly focused and energized Erran.
I hope it's for two years, and I do think
the Jets will be a viable team year ones are difficult,
(11:24):
as I've said, for a lot of situations. You know,
it's interesting with Jordan Love, I don't know what we have.
Here's the good news. He's been there three years. The
size is not an issue. He's a big kid that
moves well. If he was in I mean, if you
took Jordan Love today, even with what little we've seen
after Bryce Young, he'd be the number two pick in
(11:44):
the draft, right, Like, there's stuff there. I don't know
if he can step to the line of scrimmage and
audible in and out of stuff.
Speaker 1 (11:52):
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (11:54):
Trailing late in the game, third and eleven, how is
he equipped to do that. I have no idea, but
I will say this, it's a good team that needs
another receiver, another tight end, and an edge rusher. And
I talked to two GMS last week that said it's
the best tight end class in years and the best
edge rusher class in years. So I do feel like this, Mike.
(12:17):
I've always believed years ago you gave a quarterback three years,
But now the seven on seven camps. In private coaching,
I always say Thanksgiving of year two, you know what
you have. But Jordan loves been there for three years.
I feel like we'll know by Thanksgiving what kind of
we have eight nine games in there'll be a set
(12:39):
Because the NFC, Mike, it's not a gauntlet. There's a
lot of wus in this conference. Yeah, I think that's realistic.
Speaker 3 (12:48):
You know, I came from a different era where quarterbacks
almost always sat, and when they didn't, they took lumps
as great as they.
Speaker 1 (12:55):
Were Aikman everyone but a Marino essentially.
Speaker 3 (12:58):
But you know that all changed with Matt Ryan and
Joe Flacco and and you know, for a lot of
reasons you stated it's a it's a different landscape. Now,
I'd say the good on Jordan Love is. Yeah, there
is some definite upside. I remember one offensive coach I
really respect telling me before the draft where Jordan Love
was drafted, I would take this guy first overall. So
(13:22):
there is something special about the package. The early reviews
were not good, and you know, he's it's not quite
Trey Lance coming from North Dakota State or Carson Wentz,
but it's a guy coming from a smaller program, more
like Josh Allen right, And you know, early on I
think Packer coaches and players were kind of like, ah, man,
(13:46):
if this guy has to play, you know, we're in
real trouble. And now again the standard is very high.
So that's the good part. Maybe I think he from
what I've heard, he has gotten a lot better. He
has developed, he works at it, he's a good kid.
There some definite upside. I think the hard news is
this delusion that many Packer fans seem to have in
(14:07):
others that well, Aron waited for three years and look
what happened. Like this has happened twice in NFL history
where a first ballot Hall of Fame quarterback was succeeded
immediately by another future first ballot Hall of fame quarterback,
and it was tumultuous both times. Montanaa young the Niners
did not get nearly as many years out of that combined.
(14:28):
The Packers somehow got fifteen to fifteen three decades of
uninterrupted transcendent quarterback play that could cover up all ills
and pull games out of nowhere. And I just, especially
young Packer fans, I'm looking at you, guys, going you
guys like it could work out well. They could be
a well rounded team. Jordan Love could be good. The
(14:48):
odds of having yet another transcendent quarterback just take the
reins and keep it rolling are not good. And you're
not going to notice that necessarily Week three, the third
quarter against the Bears, when you're you know, marching down
the field. But you're going to notice it in December
on third and eighteen against a really good team at
(15:12):
times where Aaron and far before we're able to just
do insanely magical things. I just don't think that's going
to be the case. And that's not a slight on
Jordan Love. I'm just trying to be realistic.
Speaker 2 (15:27):
Yeah, Listen, if he was as good as a Burrow
or a Mahomes, they would not have signed Aaron to
an extension, right because there was drama three years ago.
If he was as bad as Zach Wilson, they know
it and I've kept so my takeaway, he's somewhere between
twelve and twenty. He's probably in that mix, which I.
Speaker 1 (15:45):
Mean it goes well, if it goes well.
Speaker 2 (15:48):
Yeah, he's somewhere between Kirk Cousins and Jimmy Garoppolo or
you know, he's somewhere in. But it's also possible that
he is Zach Wilson. It just hasn't played right. I mean,
I think he's a more mature person and all that,
but like, right, yeah, but I hear you.
Speaker 3 (16:05):
Yeah, Like if it goes the way they are hoping
it will go, and they've got good infrastructure around him,
and Mountain Floor is a really, really good coach, I think.
Speaker 2 (16:13):
He has a chance. You know, Mike, I think they're
going to look like last year. They're going to be
the nine and eight sort of level, but it's going
to be the opposite. So with Aaron, he didn't want
to work with the young receivers. They start slow schedule weekends,
they finished strong. I think because Jordan Love is going
to be totally committed to the young guys, and nobody
(16:34):
has film on him. They're actually be pretty good team
until Thanksgiving. At Thanksgiving the break you get film. People
now have had their buys, and now I think people
take stuff away from Jordan love that he had in
the first eight or nine weeks. I think they're going
to end up the same place. Last year's team did
(16:56):
a pretty a team that would be sub five hundred
and the afcally above five hundred in the NFC. But
it is his first year. The kid hasn't seen live
bullets played from behind Sunday night games. I think a
realistic expectation is Jets ten wins, Packers eight to nine.
Feel about right to you.
Speaker 3 (17:17):
Yeah, And he's going to have to have a tough,
tough makeup because I remember being out on Aaron Rodgers
Island his first year as a starter in two thousand
and eight, when there was a lot of skepticism and
because of my cal ties and the fact that you
know the blind scorel nut theory, I was right on
this one and I had to weather that first year
(17:38):
when he was six and ten. Now, he played really
well a lot. There were a lot of close games.
He couldn't pull out. He had some injury stuff, so
a lot of people were still very very skeptical. After
eight and nine, he was obviously much much better. And
then we had that epic playoff game against the Cardinals
at Curt Order, and you know, I covered that game
(17:59):
and remember like being pretty sure that we were seeing
a guy who was going to ascend.
Speaker 2 (18:06):
So I thought the compensation was reasonable. It was mostly
what we thought, which is, the Packers are either going
to get a couple of two's or a two and
a one if Aaron plays. I don't think there's a
real winner. I guess I guess the winner is the
team that gets Aaron Rodgers. But I didn't think I
didn't think the compensation it was sort of what we thought, right.
Speaker 3 (18:29):
Yeah, I liked it. I thought, you know, it was creative,
there was some compromise. That swap of thirteen and fifteen
was a good creative way to change the value. Both teams,
you know, could have stared down longer, but there was
good motivation to.
Speaker 1 (18:44):
Get it done.
Speaker 3 (18:45):
I thought, if you're the Packers, then you know you're
getting rid of them. I thought Brian Gudacus did a
really nice job. I liked his haul all things considered,
And if you're Joe Douglass or Robert Salla a, you
got to have them because you know you're coaching for
your jobs presum and you know it's all set up
for that. And b I, you know, I know the
(19:07):
Jets just wanted some recognition that if he doesn't play
that second year that they would have given up a lot,
and now they have at least a little bit of
protection that way. So I actually thought both gms did
a really nice job of creatively splitting the difference and
doing it in a timely manner.
Speaker 2 (19:27):
Give me your prediction on the New York media, which
can lean ferocious and left. And Aaron Rodgers, who's now
supporting Robert Kennedy. You know he's the anti vaccine candidate. Like, listen,
say what you want. There's two different ways to write
the same story. Do you think it'll be a rough
(19:49):
first year? What do you think Aaron, who's had some
rabbit ears? You got the Daily News, The Times, the
Outspoken Post. There's sports talk radio in New York can
be brutal, w fa N, wildly entertaining and outspoken. How
do you think it goes your one.
Speaker 1 (20:08):
That's a great question.
Speaker 3 (20:10):
I would I look at it the same way I
look at any coach going into that market or anyone
who's kind of you know, thrown into it. If you win,
it's gonna be awesome. You know, Eric Mangini was on
The Sopranos as Mangenius. What he won early Rex Ryan
(20:31):
was love, you know, through my foot fetish scandal at all,
it was all good and a lot of ways you
could keep living off that. If it goes batterly and
you appear to be defensive or out on a fringe
or you know, combative, then it's a tougher place to
(20:53):
have thin skin about it. I don't know that Aaron
will or whoa Derek has ways to communicate directly. It's
a different era. But you know, I think if it
goes well early he will be getting a lot of
love from those back pages and a lot of the
you know, potential trigger points will be ah, well, you
know he's got a different view on the vaccines. But
(21:15):
you see that pass on third to twelve, you know.
But right if you know, if it's not going so well,
then yeah, sure people are going to be looking for
ways to poking proud and we'll be watching.
Speaker 2 (21:33):
All right, let's bring on John Middlcoff. You know him,
you love him. He's part of the Volume Podcasting digital network.
We love having him. Former NFL scout Okay, let's start.
I thought the first thing that jumped out to me
is good teams and good gms get value. The Belichick
gets Christian Gonzales right middle of the first a very
(21:55):
good corner, and the Eagles got, to me the best
player I watched in college football at the number nine pick.
They moved up a spot. I mean, to me, Philadelphia again,
They've got the culture, they think they have, the coach,
you know, Fletcher cox Age. I thought Philadelphia got the
best player, you know, the organization. Well, what were your
thoughts on that?
Speaker 4 (22:15):
Well, I think, first and foremost, if you remember, several
years ago, they drafted Jalen Rager instead of Justin Jefferson,
and it really kind of bit him in the ass, right,
I mean, Justin Jefferson went on to be one of
the best players in the league and Jalen Rager is
not even on their team. I think, I mean, I
know that they kind of got together as an organization
and said, why are we out thinking the room. Here,
take the best players from the best programs. What have
(22:38):
they done the last couple of years? DeVante Smith Alabama
Heisman Trophy, Jordan Davis starting defensive tackle at Georgia National Championship.
Trade for aj Brown, an SEC blue chip guy who's
dominating Nakobe Dean. They draft, you know, from Georgia in
the second round. They also, I think one thing, Howie
and obviously Jeffrey Lewie they know well from the Andy
(22:59):
year and they've carried it over into their good teams
with Doug Peterson in this last couple of years. As
culture is really big, and when you have these veteran
guys like why do you resign Fletcher Cox and Brandon Graham,
they're done because they bring a lot to the table, yep.
And then when you get a situation like this, what's
this guy going to do? I act like an idiot
around those two guys. I mean, Brandon Graham stripped Tom
Brady to win a Super Bowl. He's been in the
(23:20):
league for twelve thirteen years. Fletcher Cox, you know, is
an all time great Eagle and while he's you know,
on the other side of his career, is just an
SEC guy. The other thing they have now to me
and in football is different than like AAU. Right, if
you meet a kid from LA or New York AAU.
They all play together in basketball, they've all played in football.
(23:41):
If I'm from LA, I don't know the guy from
New York or Seattle or Florida.
Speaker 1 (23:45):
Right.
Speaker 4 (23:45):
Besides in college if I play him, Well, the SEC
guys all know each other, right, and they all kind
of roll together.
Speaker 5 (23:52):
Well.
Speaker 4 (23:52):
Think about their team Colin DeVante Smith Alabama, Nakobe Dean,
Jordan Davis, the new Georgia guys, Fletcher Cox SEC guy,
A J. Brown SEC guy Jalen Hurts. Well, I think
we think Oklahoma three years, Alabama SEC guy. So their core,
they all kind of speak the same language in terms
of that Southern football culture. Obviously they all come from
(24:13):
elite program, especially the BAM and Georgia guys. It's a
risky pick. I mean, this guy, I think scared a
ton of teams as you could see him going to
nine like that's pretty telling. But I think how he
feels very good about their infrastructure now with their coaches,
with their players to kind of operate a lot like
Belichick used to do for years with Tom and some
of their core guys where they as it went on,
(24:34):
they started taking some flyers because they felt really good
about their main guys. You can't act like an idiot
when when the top guys you look up to and
are kind of like, you know, you have a lot
in common with.
Speaker 1 (24:46):
So I think that was I mean, an easy pick
for them obviously.
Speaker 2 (24:49):
Yeah, and by the way, for those of you uninitiated,
John's a former scout. This is the kind of insight
you get, which I've never heard anybody talk about that.
But I think you're right on the money. And the
other thing that jumped out to me is I've said
with CJ. Stroud, he is a first round quarterback. I
don't see a ton of juice. He's accurate. Jared Goff
is a very accurate comp I think he's a little
(25:11):
better runner than Jared. But you know, there was a
lot of speculation. I kind of fell for it that
they would get Jalen Carter or Will Anderson. What did
you make of the Texans getting Stroud? What did it
tell you?
Speaker 4 (25:23):
One thing I was I was stunned in the sense
that they just got a brand new coach who's young
and I'm A big believer in Demiko. When I was
with the Eagles, we traded for him as a player
because of his character and I've you know, lived in
the bear for a long time, went to the practices.
Kyle Shanahan swears by the guy. I think he's going
to be a stud head coach. I mean, he's just
He's been good at everything he's ever done in his
entire life. I don't know why it's going to stop little.
(25:46):
I mean, obviously I understand why the GM in the
front office and the owner and needs to get a quarterback.
You look at there, But if you're Demiko, why rush
into this? You know, I think a lot of people
in the NFL. He throws a beautiful ball. But when
you look at Ohio State these last couple of years,
a lot like Tua when he was Alabama. I mean, Colin,
you're talking about three or four top fifteen wide receivers
(26:07):
on their team, not like a couple guys that play
in the NFL. Right, these are top fifteen picks. Well
technically in JIGBA twenty, but you know what I mean.
I mean this is and the speed difference in the
Big ten relative to even two in the sec that
the advantage Ohio State has. I do think that Georgia
game though, because the Jared gofkomp was definitely something that
(26:28):
kind of kicks stay with it.
Speaker 1 (26:29):
That Georgia game.
Speaker 4 (26:30):
He was run around. He looked like kind of a
different player. Now, I don't know what your take was,
but the take of like when he responded to the test.
I'm not a test taker. I'm a football player. I
did love that quarterbacks get held to a higher standard. Man,
you know, I mean you're not playing slot receiver dB
so I mean Peyton Manning, Tom Brady Lamar He those
(26:52):
guys don't they don't get defensive over stuff like that.
But risky move. I actually thought they're moved trading back
up to get will Anderson, who I liked a lot.
But holy moly, they gave up a lot to go
back from twelve to three. Especially, But I guess when
you're in the court, when you've drafted the quarterback and
they got all these picks coming from Deshaun Watson, maybe
they're they're not thinking about Caleb Williams and Drake May anymore.
Speaker 1 (27:14):
Obviously.
Speaker 4 (27:15):
I mean I thought Seattle, you know, I just think Pete,
you know, a lot of people thought Jalen Carter, he
takes some swings. They did not mess around with that,
which I understand everyone I know. And teams that had
no shot of getting this guy, they loved Witherspoon kind
of a throwback to you know, some of those teams
they had with Russell Wilson, those LOB teams absolute just
(27:37):
m effort stud I mean, big time tackler, can play inside, outside,
you can move them around, can tackle.
Speaker 2 (27:44):
Seattle's got two two's, a three and two fours. So
of their three needs, one was Locket Dk. They needed
another receiver, they needed they wanted another, and they got one.
I mean he's good, he's awesome when healthy, yep. And
then they got a wide receiver and then they get
you know, Jackson Smith Jigba. So they end up getting
(28:08):
two of their three needs. I think they needed guard
now and then a later an edge rusher. But I mean,
if you look at last year's pick on ESPN, they
put up the last six or seven like great young players.
I mean they are. They had a run John where
I think Pete Carroll and Paul Allen passed. They had
a run where Pete had too much control in the draft,
(28:31):
and it feels like they've given it back to John
Snyder and the scouting department. They have not missed on
a pick.
Speaker 4 (28:40):
With tackles. They got Kenneth Walker. I mean, they got
a good young nucleus. I mean they they won nine
games where I'm guilty. I thought they were going to
be terrible and they were really good. And I think
they're going to be even better. I mean because they
got so many young pieces that they're building around.
Speaker 2 (28:54):
Okay, so I think we both agree Seattle did well,
so Jamiir gives the running back, so people are to
bang on Detroit's picks. Now. Gibbs is a very dynamic
and again Alabama big school. You see them run over
guys and run past guys in the SEC. So you know,
my takeaway on Detroit is the last two drafts with
(29:15):
his front office, John, I've really liked him, and so
part of me thinks to myself with Swift and Gibbs
as they're trying to take they love their O line. Okay,
they solve their corner issue a little bit, right, are
they basically saying is we want to take the pressure
off Jared goff Or. I mean I was watching them
(29:39):
high five in the room, like this was not a
pick they had trepidation over. These guys were high five
And what did it say to get a running back
when they have swift because their O line can control
I think can control a lot of the defensive fronts
in that division. Is that what they're saying.
Speaker 4 (29:56):
I think in most most drafts, when you see a
guy that you go, you know, I think it's fair
to say going into the any draft, a guy like
him is like an early second, you know, somewhere in
like thirty two to forty pick. This draft was viewed
as pretty terrible. Like the difference between pick eight and
twenty five. You know, you might not be able to
tell the difference, like Ken Kaid going twenty five to
(30:17):
the Bills might be no different than the six pick.
Speaker 1 (30:19):
You know.
Speaker 4 (30:20):
So it's just time will tell people were not that
comp This was not Jamar Chase and the Waddles and
the Pinasoles and the Michael Parsons. That wasn't this draft.
So when you go, well, they got to a super
Bowl with Jared Goff when he had a great running game,
right with Sean McVay in with La and last year
Jared Goff statistically was excellent. Well, they had another pick
and they got a linebackers. Their defense, I mean, I
(30:41):
think Aiden Hutchinson is going to be a really really
good player. To me, he's got some whiffs of Joey Bosa.
I mean, he's got a chance to be a twelve
fifteen sack guy next year immediately. So if their defense
is just incrementally better, their offense. I mean, the USC
wide receiver they have as a stud, like you said,
their offensive lines of stud. Their coach, while he's an
offensive because he's a tight end, is really wired more
(31:02):
like a defensive tackle. I mean, he wants to be
a tough, physical guy. I'm with you if you love
this guy, and I'm going to give them the benefit
of doubt because I watched them last year and they
were an expressive operation.
Speaker 1 (31:13):
So I think they know the wiring.
Speaker 4 (31:15):
The other thing is Dan Campbell came from Sean Payton,
you know, over that five or six year run when
he got fired from Miami and went there became an
assistant head coach. They had really good drafts during that
time when the Saints were really good at the end
of the two thousand, you know, the teams right the
seventeen eighteen nineteen, So I think he knows the wiring
of the guys. I remember sometimes the Saints, you'd be like, wow,
they did that, and then it would work out right.
(31:35):
So I'm with you. It was a little eye opening
because you see the second running back come off at twelve.
But I'm going to give them the benefit of the
doubt because I know their play style and I know
what they want to do. The other thing is when's
the last time a running back from Alabama beside Trent
Richardson hasn't worked in the NFL. You watch them all
over the league. They were all successful players well. And
(31:57):
Jared Goff's history is when Gurley was he he's been
a really good quarterback. When Jared gets in trouble is
third and long. Okay, so is Detroit saying we love
our oc we just don't want to get in third
and long. You and I know I saw Goff out
Duel Mahomes when they had Gurley and naked run. Jared
was getting you to the super Bowl. It's when the
(32:19):
O line aged and they didn't have a consistent run game.
Now you leene on Jared Goff and it's not pretty right.
So I look at Detroit and I think they love
their OC. They have good young receivers, excellent O line,
Swift got banged up, and maybe they're just saying, listen,
we're just gonna do a one two punch and we're
gonna go. And by the way, in that division, the
D line for the Vikings, the D line for the Packers,
(32:42):
the D line for the Bears, are you gonna pick
them to win the division? You pick Minnesota last year?
To me, obviously, injuries can happen, but Detroit would be
my pick as of recording this today to win the North.
Speaker 2 (32:52):
And again, I think, is Detroit looking at that division
and thinking our O line is significantly better in those
six games against the D lines in our division? Can
we go five and one in that division?
Speaker 1 (33:05):
For sure?
Speaker 4 (33:05):
And in a weird way because they haven't even made
the playoffs, right, But if you assume that they're going
to be in the mix, the three teams that are
at the top of the conference, the Eagles, the Niners,
and Cowboys are all physical teams. So you're getting this
is not a lightweight fight. You're getting in the ring
to fight heavyweights, So you have to be willing to
play like that. And Dan Campbell is now building a
(33:26):
team who they draft their second pick in the first round,
a linebacker from Iowa. Right, I mean, they have a
type of guy that they're looking for to build their team.
And honestly, that should translate to playing the Cowboys the
Eagles and just give them a chance. If not in
twenty three, the next couple of years. Obviously, you know
Jared Goff is going to be the guy we talk
about the most, but he's proven if you can do
(33:47):
it around him and their roster. I liked the lot
with the Lions have going on a lot, so I
mean the Will Levice situation. I talk to people that
I really trust. Their big concern with him was, listen,
the kid is smart. We know his mom went to
an I League school Yale. We know he's a four
(34:07):
point student. Why is his judgment so bad? And what
I heard was Jay Cutler is that Jay Cutler was
arrogant and obstinate, and if Jay had a rope, Jay
had an arm, and if Jay wanted to sling it,
he didn't give a shit what the coach said. And Jay,
(34:29):
I'll argue it forever. Jay had one of the best
arms in the league. When he played, he had an
absolute host, but Jay was stubborn, rigid, difficult, and people
worried Will Levi us with the selfies, the gun show,
look at me the combine. He wore a muscle shirt.
I had a head coach and a GM told me
(34:50):
they hated that. I mean, I listen, Brady Quinn works
at Fox, and I like Brady, but that was one
of the knocks I heard is that an he can't
be jacked as a quarterback. You have to be flu
and you don't see biceps on Aaron Rodgers or Peyton Manning.
Your take on Will levis dropping.
Speaker 1 (35:05):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (35:05):
I mean I think that he was a fascinating player
coming into the season, and then the season was a disaster,
and I had people that really like him. They aren't
necessarily quote unquote decision makers, but are you know, high
in their organization said if coming out his junior season
or whatever two years ago, when Liam Cohen, right, the
Rams guy, was his offensive coordinator, he would have been
(35:27):
a lock top five pick. Then he goes to Rich Skangarello,
who a lot of people are down on disastrous season,
and then, like you said, kind of has a bad offseason,
the lifting things that you're not playing offensive tackle or lineback,
No one cares. It's about pliability. It's about fluidity, and
that's a big knock on his game is fluidity. Touch.
(35:49):
And we've seen so many guys Brady Quinn Kaepernick got
really big. Whether you can throw at one hundred and
twenty miles an hour, If you can't throw a strike,
who cares, You're not going to make the big leagues, right.
Touch is a big issue with him. I also think that,
like Anthony Richardson, who this raw guy was viewed as
very mouldable. One thing I have heard like when he
(36:11):
went and met with people, they were just like, you
know what this guy means?
Speaker 1 (36:13):
Well, like I would love to be around this guy.
Speaker 4 (36:15):
There was a lot of positive vibes around him.
Speaker 2 (36:18):
Very grateful. Like Anthony Richardson wrote a Penda letter, he
was like humble and grateful. And it's like, John, you
look at that and you think, Okay, this kid wants
to learn.
Speaker 4 (36:27):
Yeah, and whether it works out, only time will tell,
and more than the history would show us it probably won't.
But I know that a lot of people were down
on him, and during the process came away the opposite,
like I'm rooting for this guy. I think this guy
not crazy to go in the top five. Is the
ceiling is sky high, and I think will Levis started
(36:47):
getting more negative and negative. Not like you said anything malicious, right,
but the buff stuff to the lifting the pictures on
Instagram within the last month, Like what are we doing?
You know, it's just I mean, he didn't im he tumbled.
I mean, this was a guy that I think after
last season twenty one, when Kentucky had a really good year,
(37:08):
I don't see how he wouldn't have been a top
five pick, not with those measurables, right, But then yeah,
I mean, I clearly the league is very I mean,
this is a quarterback star of the leak. For no
one to touch him, it's crazy.
Speaker 5 (37:25):
Colin, how you doing?
Speaker 4 (37:26):
Man?
Speaker 5 (37:26):
What a game? Harrison Barnes with the shot of his life.
He had a chance to erase all the pain and
suffering from the twenty sixteen finals that he left it long.
Speaker 2 (37:35):
Well, they needed that Draymond block, They needed the twenty
two from Jordan Poole. I feel like I'm watching the
younger Warriors take on the old Warriors. They Stephen Dearin
get baskets, get great looks when they want, you have enforcers.
You know what, I watched this tonight in the second half,
and I'm like, outside of Denver, is this the Western
(37:58):
Conference Final? Now that the Warriors are full strength, are
we watching essentially the Western Conference Final? In round one?
Speaker 5 (38:07):
I remember I had a similar thought after the playing games,
and everyone's like, oh man, the Wolves and the Lakers,
they're both terrible. What an ugly basketball game. And I
have like a completely different feeling about this. I think
all of these teams are awesome. I think the Kings
are awesome. I think the Warriors are awesome. I think
the Lakers are awesome. I think the Suns are awesome.
(38:28):
The Nuggets have been arguably the most impressive team in
the first round here in the Western Conference, And like, again,
like what you're seeing here is that it doesn't it's
a two to seven matchup, and it's a first round matchup.
But these are two teams from an overall talent standpoint
that are typically the types of teams that you'd see
in later playoff rounds. It's they're incredibly evenly matched. I
want to I want to give a special shout out
(38:49):
to Deer and Fox because there's this thing that happens.
And I mean we've even seen the reverse side of
this with Darius Garland on the Calves this year, as
he's really really struggled to just be constantly effective throughout
the series. Every time we see a young player kind
of rise up the echelons of the NBA, there's always
this question like is his game gonna work when they
(39:11):
get to the playoffs, and some guys struggle to get separations,
some guys struggle in the physicality, Like Trey Young had
a really good game in Game three against Boston. That's
the outlier. He's had like six straight playoff stinkers before that.
You know what I mean. Darren Fox, his game translates
so well to this level. And I actually think you'll
find this interesting, Colin, because you've been super critical of
(39:31):
this type of player, right, this ultra athletic point guard
that is this unbelievable downhill force that plays with passion
and energy. That player has failed time and time and
time again in NBA history. And the thing that separates,
in my opinion, Darren Fox from the others is he
legitimately has outrageously good shooting touch from everywhere on the floor,
(39:56):
and so whoever's guarding him like to give a certain
amount of space, just just an attempt to contain the
drives and so and when he and he's deadly on
those shots.
Speaker 4 (40:08):
Well.
Speaker 2 (40:09):
And also Westbrook and Wall especially, they didn't play with
a ton of self awareness in their prime. They were
going a thousand miles an hour. Dearen pays with plays
with really good pacing. He knows when to slow it up.
I mean, you look like you're watching a twelve year
veteran like he knows when to speed it up. Steph
does this? You know when? When do you know he'll
(40:31):
He'll go right through traffic. He's trying to speed the
tempo up, and it's not really to get a shot.
It's just kind of to see if he can find
a little crevice and get to the basket. If he can't,
then he pulls it up and waits for the bigs
to come down. Dearan's got a real understanding of pace
and tempo. He's not playing with his head down everything,
you know. It's like Patrick Mahomes. He sees the field,
(40:54):
he sees the court, he sees everybody. Darren Fox is
really smart. And he plays like a really smart basketball player.
Steph Curry's really smart. Some of this is just guys
Deer and also not that he's not vertical, but he's
kind of uh he's I would I would, you know,
if I was a scout, I'd say smooth, smart, beautiful
(41:18):
offensive game. It's gorgeous. I mean, mid range outside, everything
is pretty. So I don't really put him in that
I you know, and I feel like he's he's a
little bit like Steph. Probably I trust Deer and Moore
in a mid range Steph on a three, but I
think their games are so much about manipulating pace and tempo.
(41:40):
John Wall never did. John was just get me the
ball and I'm gonna race everybody down the floor. And
the wings are like, bro, hold up, I can't keep
up with you. And Westbrook has a little bit of that.
It's a one hundred mile an hour fastball. It's the
quarterback that has a fastball.
Speaker 4 (41:53):
You know.
Speaker 2 (41:54):
He throws it on the deep post, he throws it
on the screen. It's it's a one tempo thrower. And
so I dearon Is, I think he's an all timer.
I think next year he'll be I think, right now
he feels like a top ten player, maybe ten, But
I think if they get past the Warriors, he's going
to be a top ten player, because I feel like
he's just twelve ish. And then you're watching them in
(42:17):
this series, you're like, I mean, if I told you
today John Morant or him, I'd take dearon Fox.
Speaker 5 (42:23):
He's been great in every game. This is an out
every gaming defense in a high stakes playoff series where
he came in as the underdog, and he's been great
in every game like he I mean, look like people
always get a little freaked out when we start to
talk about lists because you feel bad about bumping guys.
But I mean, here's the deal. Like he's he is
performing at this level against this type of defense, at
(42:44):
a higher level than most of the players around the league.
I think that's completely reasonable. I think, you know, it's funny.
Over the course of the series, I've been talking a
lot about how the Kings have no answer for Steph Curry,
and that's a big part of why I have it.
I've been yet to relinquish my stance at the will
win this series, and I still feel that way I
picked them in six. I'm gonna stick with that for
right now. But like the reality is is like the
(43:06):
Kings should feel really good about their chances because the
same thing is in reverse like they I did think
it was interesting that we didn't see as much Gary
Payton today. They spent a lot of time with Draymond
Green on Deer and Fox today, which is a super
interesting adjustment. Yes, oh yeah, so just what a again?
What a what an amazing luxury as a coach to
(43:27):
be able to do that, And they did a similar
thing last year in the finals if you remember when
they moved Draymond Green out onto Jlen Brown because he can.
Just the thing with Draymond is he has these obnoxiously
long alarms. First of all, his defensive performance down the
stretch of this game was so ridiculous, And there was
a lot of talk over the last couple of days, Oh,
the Warriors better without Draymond, which everyone just gets dumber
whenever that happens. They were eleven points better per one
hundred possessions with him than without him in last year's postseason.
(43:49):
They were fourteen points better with him than without him
in this regular season. Like that, that argument is dead
on arrival. I can't believe it ever even gets brought up.
He blew up some plays around the rim. You're thinking
of the block, Oh my god, Bonus, you get another play.
So Bonus is coming down the floor in a short role.
It's a two on one. Harrison Barnes is standing wide
open in the dunker spot ready to go up and
(44:10):
dunk it, and Sa Bonus goes to pass it to
Harrison Barnes and Draymond just pokes it out of Sabonis's hands.
He blew up a two on one that's a basket
ninety five percent of the time in the NBA like
he was. He was unbelievable defensively in this game. But
even with him, he has to give a little bit
of ground to de Aaron Fox to try to contain
this drive in on that final shot, the one that
(44:30):
d'eren made that brought it back to one, like you
got a great contest on it. But that's what great
players do, and Darreon Fox has done that this entire series.
He can adjust his release based on where he is
on the floor and he can knock these shots down well.
Speaker 2 (44:43):
And also Dramon's got really good hands. Klay Thompson's are Okay, Wiggins.
I think I've really noticed it with Wiggins. He doesn't
quite have his wind yet and his hands. Sometimes when
you don't have your wind, you can lose your legs
where you get sloppy. Wiggins today had four or five
that he just couldn't secure. For a guy that's not
(45:03):
a great shooter, Draymond's got strong hands and good hands.
Like he touches it, he gets it his timing. There's
certain players in the league that and because you know
I employed Draymond one of his many employers, by the way,
talented guy, you know people are going to, you know, say, Colin,
(45:26):
you have a bias. First of all, I've said this
a thousand times in my career. Every great team of
my life has them for the heat, Rodman for the Bulls,
Derek Rick Fox for the Lakers, Lambert for the Pistons,
Draymond Green, all great dynasties, Bruce Bowen for the Spurs.
Have a feisty, annoying, tough guy and his job. He's
(45:50):
in the league because he's smart enough to know. I mean,
Bruce Bowen scored, he could score twenty a game in
the league. He's like not I knew on this team.
My way in the league to rings was to play
the way I had to play, do the stuff that
nobody else wanted to do. If you don't get Draymond Green,
like if you don't understand, have you ever noticed out
around outside the arc they bring him up. They want
(46:12):
him to have the ball in his hands, him to
set the screen, him to make the pass. Like that
organization puts him in the crosshairs. You make a mistake
out there, it's a layuper a dunk the other way, like,
this organization has so much trust for Draymon. With the
basketball in his hands, we think of him defensively, but
as you watch him Jason, he's such a catalyst, his passing,
(46:35):
his screening, his hands. If you don't people that don't
get him, you don't get the game. Like anybody know.
Everybody knows that Darren Fox and stuff are great. That
doesn't take you know you're watching Jalen Brunson, He's obviously
it's such a unique fun player. Guys like Draymon like
they just don't. Sometimes I watch Draymond and I think
(46:56):
he should open a clinic on how to make the
NBA as a star in average eight, a game like
he does so many things that you don't think they
like screening, passing, He does so many little things well
that you don't necessarily like, you don't get points in
a box score for screening or those little he'll screen
(47:18):
those little touch passes that don't get the assist, but
they're the pass before the assist, the incubator of it. Like,
he doesn't get a lot of credit for that, but
he was so big late today to your point.
Speaker 5 (47:30):
Yeah, you know, it's funny because a lot of people
have been comparing him in Dylan Brooks, which drives me crazy.
They'll be like, oh, they both make the Oh I've
never seen Draymond Green shove a cameraman just to be
a jerk. Okay, Like there's there's a different there's a
difference between like like just being a jerk and being
a guy who's kind of a physical instigator. There's no
doubt that Draymond's a physical instigator and Dylan Boroks is
(47:51):
that a and Moore And the other thing too, is
like Dylan Brooks is a bad is a limited offensive
player from a skill standpoint that doesn't get it. And
we'll take eleven shots in a quarter and in a
road playoff game in Los Angeles, and you're like, dude,
what the hell are you doing? Like, Raymond has his
offensive limitations, but he understands his role. And I love
(48:11):
how you pointed out all those whole things because it's
you're right. They love to have the ball in his hands.
They've been running a ton of Steph high pick and
roll as this series has progressed, Like there was a
play at the end of this game where Andrew Wiggins
made a floater. Steph runs the high pick and roll,
they trap him, he makes the drop off pass to Draymond.
He's rolling down the basket. Looney and Wiggins kind of
mess up. They both cut, and you never want to
both cut because now you're getting in each other's way.
(48:33):
It's better for one guy to cut, one guy to
stay at the three point line. And Draymond like hangs
in the air and just waits barely for Wiggins to
kind of break open and hits him in stride, and
Wiggins makes the floater, and I'm like, man, that was
kind of an impressive play in traffic in the short role.
They like having the ball in his hands. He can
disrupt guys below the rim. Defensively, he can disrupt guys
above the rim. Defensively. Tap out rebounds is a big one.
(48:54):
There'll be like a ball in the air and he
knows he can't go get it, but he'll just run
up and just tap at it and just keep it alive.
Speaker 2 (49:01):
So I kind of feel like Sacramento almost ended the Dynasty,
and I think they're gonna look at that film on
the way home and they're gonna think, we just gave
one away. We just gave a game away. They outplayed
Golden State early, too many turnovers. They're a tough out man.
They are the Baby Warriors. They are a tough out
(49:22):
and they're really smart. As I said at the start
of this, I just feel like they need another shooter
and they'll probably get that in the draft or you know,
somewhere in free agency.
Speaker 5 (49:32):
I actually think if they upgrade the Sabonus position at
any point, they could be super dangerous because like the
unsung heroes of this series have been well, I say unsung,
the real heroes of this series have been Malik, Bunk
and Deer and Fox and the simple fact that nobody
can played well. Malik's been good in this whole series.
And it's funny because the Lakers couldn't afford to keep him.
But that's the only reason he's not a Laker right now.
(49:52):
He was one of the rare bright spots last year,
just an excellent shot creator that can beat people off
the dribble and knock down threes. He just played so
well that the Lakers were financially incapable of retaining him.
You know, it's funny. I actually think the Warrior are
the Kings deserve to be slight favorites right now. They've
played well enough, and they have two games at home.
(50:13):
It's pretty simple that said. These games are going to
reach a fever pitch of intensity and drama and stakes,
and so I still lean I still lean Warriors just
because they've There's look, if it's Game five and it's
one hundred to one hundred with three minutes left, there's
no doubt that the Warriors will be more comfortable in
that situation, simply because they right in those situations before.
(50:36):
The same goes for a game seven. Again, the Kings
should I bet you they were positive in the locker room.
I bet you they feel good in their film session.
They should feel confident. But I think these games are
going to get even more sweaty palms, even more high drama,
and I just trust the.
Speaker 1 (50:52):
Warriors a little bit more.
Speaker 5 (50:54):
What was your take on that Lakers blowout of the
Grizzlies yesterday. Do you think it's Do you think the
real matchup is more like the first quarter or more
like the last three quarters?
Speaker 2 (51:04):
Well, I think the Lakers. I think we both chose
the Lakers. I think they're better. I always felt there
was two things that were true about Memphis. They were
they're deep, and they're inexperienced. And I'm not saying depth
and experience are everything, but it's they feel like they
(51:24):
need another score. To me, you know, jaw was sensational,
but I just feel like they need another dependable score.
I mean, you really don't want somebody scoring forty five
points in a playoff game. You really don't. I mean
that's just I mean, everybody's in awe of Jamran. It's like,
you know, you can go back to the Kobe stats,
like the Lakers were awful when he scored over thirty
(51:46):
five points, right, and so you know, Jos starts playing well,
he plays downhill and it's fun, it's magical. But I
just I never I mean, listen, they were a two seed,
the Lakers were seven, and I feel it was you know,
I sit on the air, I said, if I say
it on the air, I believe it. I'm like, I
think the Lakers are gonna win the series. They were
(52:06):
a forty three win team, right, one's the left to
a forty three wins seven seed. You take them over
a two seed confident, and Memphis is one of the Yeah,
and Memphis is one of the best home teams in
the league. So I just don't. I don't feel and
we're seeing it with Cleveland, by the way, you know,
you really young have some depth, but Garland and Mitchell.
(52:28):
I mean, the Knicks aren't even getting a good series
from Julius Randall. He's not playing well. And so I
just don't feel like I think Sacramento regardless of I
think Sacramento is really close to being a championship team,
like a player away.
Speaker 1 (52:46):
I don't.
Speaker 2 (52:46):
With Memphis, I don't always love. I feel they're at
a little less mature than Sacramento, a little chippier, a
little less self awareness. Their stars had some problems. The
King Star is like Steph mature. So it's not that
I don't buying a Memphis, but I really never bought
(53:08):
into them as a championship team. I really don't. In fact,
if you told me the two really young teams in
the NBA, I like I would say, it's Sacramento in Cleveland.
Cleveland's been disappointing, like these playoffs, basically, Jason, nothing surprised
us except Cleveland. I mean, that's the only series where
if you'd have told anybody, yeah, Julius Randall, good game one,
doesn't do anything and they lead three to one, that
(53:30):
would be a surprise. I think almost everything we're seeing,
including the Lakers Grizzlies, we all kind of expected. We
trusted Lebron in ad over the last three weeks. They
just won a lot of close games, and they won
a lot of games against for the same reason they're
winning this one.
Speaker 5 (53:47):
I'm glad you said that about Memphis because I actually agree.
I don't think they're close either. A couple things, the
only position I think that they have really the only
spots that I feel really good about, like really good
about our Jared Jackson in jaw Desmond Baine has been
bad in almost every playoff game that he's played, especially
(54:08):
over the last couple of years. He struggles mightily to
create his own shot off the dribble, and guys are
good at chasing him over those screens to lessen the
quality of the shots, and he can't make it. Like
Austin Reeves has soundly outplayed him in this series, you
know what I mean. The Grizzlies have severe limitations in
shot creation and off ball offensive skill. I was talking
(54:28):
with a buddy yesterday about this, Like what scares me
for the Lakers is they can get lazy. And you
saw that, Like I tweeted right after the first quarter yesterday,
I'm like, just get ready for them to do the
bare minimum to try to win this game.
Speaker 1 (54:40):
You know, like the whole game.
Speaker 5 (54:42):
The whole game, it was like, oh, they got back
to eleven, I guess we should start trying again. I
get it up to sixteen, seventeen, and then they'd have
three bad possessions in a row and to be a
ten and we're like, all right, call time out. All right,
let's go get control of this game again. Like I
think the Lakers are so much better than the Grizzlies.
I think that people are. But to your point about
the arrogance, the way Jaw was acting in that fourth quarter, like, Oh,
(55:04):
I've got these guys like I'm like, they're not even
playing anymore. They're jogging back in transition. They're barely guarding you.
In the first quarter, you couldn't even get a clean look.
He shot two for ten on two point shots before
the fourth quarter, like they they have figured out the
job pick and roll because Jared Vanderbilt and Anthony Davis
have taken away his floater and they've shut off the
(55:24):
rig on him. They've they've they've kind of figured that out. Memphis,
to me, so has so far to go. But with
the Lakers in their lapses in execution and effort, what
freaks me out for them? There is Sacramento in Golden
State because Memphis is a young athletic team that loves
to play fast, but they're unskilled, like remarkably unskilled compared
(55:46):
to other NBA teams. Yep, Sacramento and Golden State love
to play fast and they are super skilled like at
every position. So like they will those teams if they
have those same brief lapses in judgment and effort in execute,
the Lakers will get run off the floor by the
Warriors and Kings, so like it's good, it's weird. I
feel so confident that the Lakers are going to beat
(56:07):
the Grizzlies, but I am so hesitant to pick them
as a team that can make a real run because
they just had to. It is part of their identity.
As soon as they start to feel even remotely comfortable,
Lebron and Anthony Davis go, how can I start conserving energy?
And it's going to be something that gets them beat?
I think, yeah.
Speaker 2 (56:24):
I mean, I also think that the question we asked
about Memphis all year because John is not a great shooter.
He's a great athlete. He's got the floater, he finishes
at the rim. If you take the rim away, you
take a chunk of his field goal. I mean, it's
it's the Westbrook. He's a better shooter than Westbrook. But
if you took the rim away from Russell Westbrook, he
can have really bad nights and it gets into his
(56:46):
head really fast. Even great shooters. I mean, Lebron for
a big chunk of his career, like didn't like bigs
around the basket because if he lost confidence in his three,
he could always beat guys off the dribble score and
get back into it. Lebrono was like, liked his bosh
and his Kevin loves you. Stay clear. I didn't get
this point in his career. He shoots threes, makes the misses,
(57:09):
nothing's in his head. He's kind of graduated last couple
of years. But Jaw's not a great natural shooter. So
if he's not hitting the three and the rims closed off,
you're not beating people on floaters and mid range jumpers.
And so I think when I look at this team
all year, my takeaway was, well, if you shut Jaw
down a little bit and make him shoot forty one percent,
(57:31):
who's the second dependable score? There is one, and they
just don't have one. The Volume, make sure to check
(57:54):
out The Draymon Green Show. I brought Draymond Green into
the Volume because one of the more entertaining voices and
sports unique perspective understands behind the rope also chops up
with guests like Gary Payton, Zach Lavine, Tracy McGrady. Make
sure download The Draymond Green Show wherever you get your podcasts,
only on the Volume podcast Network
The volume.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
This is Prime Cuts, the best of the Colin Coward Podcast.
All right, Aaron Rodgers going to the New York Jets
is official. The draft picks were around what most people speculated.
Nobody won the trade. I mean you can argue the
Jets won the trade because they get Aaron Rodgers. I
think my takeaway is that I've always said that once
(00:37):
a rookie quarterback comes in, I will give him a
year and a half year. Two Thanksgiving. You will know
what you have now. It used to be you gave
a rookie quarterback two full years. Bill Pollian would say three.
But with seven on seven summer camps, the personal quarterback coaching,
(00:57):
I'll give you to Thanksgiving your second year in. But
it is different with Jordan Love. Jordan Love has been
in the building for three years. I will give Jordan
Love until Thanksgiving. This year. You'll know. By getting another
second round pick, the Packers can pick up a wide
(01:18):
receiver in the first round, an edge rusher, and a
tight end in the second. It's an incredibly deep edge
rusher and tight end draft. So the Packers should be
able to get three starters in their first three picks.
And that's what they're going to go after in what order.
I have no IDEA wide receiver, tight end, and edge rusher.
It is not a deep wide receiver class. There is
(01:41):
one receiver maybe two in the first round, and the
Packers have the thirteenth pick. So my guess is they
go for the best receiver out of Ohio State. Then
they probably get a tight end in an edge rusher
in round two. Those are all going to be high
rotation or starting players. Then you draft and develop the
rest of the draft. This is a team that is
(02:03):
ready to win football games. Okay, we know Minnesota is
not going eleven to zero in one score games. We
don't know if Chicago's any good and Detroit, though improved,
is Detroit with that gambling scandal. Who knows who's going
to be available in September. But this team is ready
to win or at least be competent. Jordan Love is
(02:24):
inheriting a top ten offensive line, two more than capable
running backs, one a borderline star Christian Watson is an
emerging star at wide receiver, an offensive coach. They need
an edge rusher. They have a Pro Bowl corner, good
interior defensive linemen, excellent young safeties, you can't win nine
(02:45):
or ten games, and we'll know by Thanksgiving in the
weakest the NFC has been in twenty years, then you
got the wrong guy. This is one of my favorite
weeks of the year, as all of you know if
you've listened to me for years. I love the NFL draft,
the architecture of it. I mean, the Jets were a
(03:06):
great example last year where they nailed their first four picks.
The Seahawks nailed their first five, and it literally set
the future up. I mean, if they get Aaron Rodgers,
the Jets will be able to play with anybody. Probably
have to get a left tackle and another receiver and
the Jets will be able to play with anybody. They
got two good receivers, they have a pass rush. They
just need to upgrade at tight end, left tackle, wide receiver.
(03:29):
Joe Douglas will do that in the draft. I mean, Seattle,
we thought was a dying franchise. They hit on two tackles,
a star running back and edge rusher and two corners.
Speaker 1 (03:38):
Boom.
Speaker 2 (03:39):
You know, now they just need another edge rusher. They
got to get a couple of defensive linemen, maybe one
more receiver, and the sky is the limit. So you know,
other drafts are different. Even a great college baseball player,
he's not going to make an impact the following year
in the Major League Baseball playoffs. As great as these
(04:01):
NBA players are, Daron Fox now is just starting to
like turn a franchise around. What is he in year five?
It takes a long time. These guys come out at
nineteen years old. NFL is different for a lot of reasons.
Number one is guys come out at twenty three and
twenty four years old. They're real men. They're physically ready
to play. So if you hit on your first four
(04:22):
or five picks, you know people lament the LA Rams
they have a second and two thirds. If they nail
the right edge rusher, interior offensive lineman, and get a starbacker,
another really high ended receiver in the third round. If
they can get three starters, they turn around the franchise.
They got McVeigh, they have Stafford, they have Aaron Donald.
You're getting grown ups, men physically and emotionally ready to
(04:47):
play and start. So the Jets and the Seahawks last
year are great examples. You nail your verse four or
five draft picks, you can in that moment you bring
in five new starters that you don't have to pay
for four to five years. It changes, shifts the paradigm
of the entire franchise. I mean, look at how bad
the Jets were, the mess Joe Douglas inherits, he even
(05:09):
missed on a quarterback and a left tackle, two of
the three most important positions in football. He missed on both.
And if Aaron Rodgers signs and they hit on a
left tackle and one other receiver, the Jets can play
with anybody in this league, including the Chiefs, they can
play with anybody in this league. So I love this week.
(05:29):
I think the NFL is the League of hope more
than any other league. I remember when Bill Parcells years
ago took over the Miami Dolphins and they were one
in fifteen. The next year they won eleven games, And
I read an article Tony Sperano I think was Bill
Parcell's choice as a coach, kind of a defensive guy.
And I remember reading an article somebody wrote in the
Miami Herald or a Fort Lauderdale paper about what Belichick
(05:53):
really did was he took the middle of the roster
to the end of it. It wasn't the top end
of the roster. He made the locker room better, the
weight room better. He went and got grinders and rotational
players and backups and a handful of low level starters,
and it changed the entire culture of the organization with
like twenty new players, and they weren't stars. Most of
(06:17):
them weren't stars. So no sport allows you to recreate
your roster and your football identity like the NFL. It
takes two to three free agent signings, four home runs
in the draft, seven eight new players to start at energy,
especially draft guys who are cheap, and you turn everything around.
(06:39):
So I can't wait. Somebody is going to do a
Jets or a Seahawks, and I can't wait to watch it.
All right, Mike Silver, a valuable member of the volume.
When breaking news happens, Mike Silver happens, I love that.
That sounds like a billboard.
Speaker 3 (06:58):
Yeah, Colin, I know you remember a year ago, or
a little more than a year ago, we were on
together when the DeVante Adams trade happened to the Raiders
and we were like, whoa, you know, because that was
a little more sudden. But yeah, this is I think
it's an exciting day and I don't want to gloss
(07:18):
over this. For Jets fans, this is awesome. The Jets
are getting one of the best quarterbacks of all time,
possibly with years left. They have a team that was
good enough to almost make the playoffs last year despite
injuries and Zach Wilson being the quarterback for a lot
of it. And Aaron knows this offense intimately because Nathaniel
(07:42):
Hackett's now the coordinators. So people might say, oh, it's
great for the Packers, it's win win that we could
get into all that, but it's not win win.
Speaker 1 (07:50):
The Jets win the day today.
Speaker 2 (07:52):
In my opinion, this isn't perfectly analogous, but I've three
times traveled cross country and took a new job. The
first year, whether you're talented or not, with new environment
is hard, it's choppy. I hope Aaron plays for a
second year. First of all, new defensive coordinators, new conference,
new environment, it's everything, new neighborhood. And if you go
(08:15):
look at Aaron's history, first year starting the league, little bumpy,
first year with Hackett, little bumpy. I think he's going
to do really well. I kind of feel like it's
a ten seven eleven six team. I think it's I
think their schedule is not the easiest. No, But what's
a realistic expectation to you?
Speaker 3 (08:33):
That's a great question because if you look at it
on paper, you say, the AFC is a gauntlet, right,
and the AFC certainly is not going to be easy.
And they are the Jets. They do have some dudes.
I mean both rookies of the year. Brice Hall was
that good before he got hurt. Elijah er Tucker was
hurt last year. You know, they've they've got some dudes,
(08:55):
and I think they will play pretty good defense. You
know you're right about year one because that was the
case in Green Bay, which was year one in the
laflor Hacket offense. And they did go thirteen and three
and reach the NFC Championship Game with a very good team,
but it was not humming offensively the way that you
would expect an Aaron Rodgers team to.
Speaker 1 (09:18):
But I think, you.
Speaker 3 (09:20):
Know, I look at far his first year there, which
everyone revisioned his history thinks sucked, and then he went
to Minnesota and was really good. But Farv had those
Jets eight and three right up in playoff contention. He
was an MVP contention. He suffered an arm injury that essentially,
(09:40):
you know, made him noodle arm the rest of that year,
and it didn't go great. But this is going to
give them a real jolt, and franchise quarterbacks affect teams
in ways that go beyond what most of us see.
It just changes the energy and the vibe of the organization.
It lends a credibility to the the meetings, the practices internally,
(10:03):
and you know, he's going to pull a game or
two out that the Jets aren't used to pulling out,
and that's gonna potentially snowball. So I think playoffs is
a very realistic, you know possibility. I think once you're
in the playoffs with Aaron Rodgers, if you're peaking at
the right time, that.
Speaker 1 (10:21):
Could be really, really exciting.
Speaker 3 (10:25):
And I guess the other thing I want to say,
because it's confusing, right, I would if you told me, hey,
the Packers and Eric Rodgers have decided to come back
for one more year, I wouldn't be as wildly upbeat
about the Packers. And here's why. I just don't think
you'd be getting the same guy in Green Trump. The
(10:46):
guy they had last year I was, is not the
guy that I expect the Jets to be getting today,
and that's not fair necessarily to the Packers, but it
is a reality, and that's why I think Jets fan
should be fired.
Speaker 2 (11:00):
Well yeah, I think all relationships can run their course,
and I think the Green Bay situation there was a
lack of trust on both sides. There was a little
bit of animosity for different reasons. I think you'll get
I think you'll get a highly focused and energized Erran.
I hope it's for two years, and I do think
the Jets will be a viable team year ones are difficult,
(11:24):
as I've said, for a lot of situations. You know,
it's interesting with Jordan Love, I don't know what we have.
Here's the good news. He's been there three years. The
size is not an issue. He's a big kid that
moves well. If he was in I mean, if you
took Jordan Love today, even with what little we've seen
after Bryce Young, he'd be the number two pick in
(11:44):
the draft, right, Like, there's stuff there. I don't know
if he can step to the line of scrimmage and
audible in and out of stuff.
Speaker 1 (11:52):
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (11:54):
Trailing late in the game, third and eleven, how is
he equipped to do that. I have no idea, but
I will say this, it's a good team that needs
another receiver, another tight end, and an edge rusher. And
I talked to two GMS last week that said it's
the best tight end class in years and the best
edge rusher class in years. So I do feel like this, Mike.
(12:17):
I've always believed years ago you gave a quarterback three years,
But now the seven on seven camps. In private coaching,
I always say Thanksgiving of year two, you know what
you have. But Jordan loves been there for three years.
I feel like we'll know by Thanksgiving what kind of
we have eight nine games in there'll be a set
(12:39):
Because the NFC, Mike, it's not a gauntlet. There's a
lot of wus in this conference. Yeah, I think that's realistic.
Speaker 3 (12:48):
You know, I came from a different era where quarterbacks
almost always sat, and when they didn't, they took lumps
as great as they.
Speaker 1 (12:55):
Were Aikman everyone but a Marino essentially.
Speaker 3 (12:58):
But you know that all changed with Matt Ryan and
Joe Flacco and and you know, for a lot of
reasons you stated it's a it's a different landscape. Now,
I'd say the good on Jordan Love is. Yeah, there
is some definite upside. I remember one offensive coach I
really respect telling me before the draft where Jordan Love
was drafted, I would take this guy first overall. So
(13:22):
there is something special about the package. The early reviews
were not good, and you know, he's it's not quite
Trey Lance coming from North Dakota State or Carson Wentz,
but it's a guy coming from a smaller program, more
like Josh Allen right, And you know, early on I
think Packer coaches and players were kind of like, ah, man,
(13:46):
if this guy has to play, you know, we're in
real trouble. And now again the standard is very high.
So that's the good part. Maybe I think he from
what I've heard, he has gotten a lot better. He
has developed, he works at it, he's a good kid.
There some definite upside. I think the hard news is
this delusion that many Packer fans seem to have in
(14:07):
others that well, Aron waited for three years and look
what happened. Like this has happened twice in NFL history
where a first ballot Hall of Fame quarterback was succeeded
immediately by another future first ballot Hall of fame quarterback,
and it was tumultuous both times. Montanaa young the Niners
did not get nearly as many years out of that combined.
(14:28):
The Packers somehow got fifteen to fifteen three decades of
uninterrupted transcendent quarterback play that could cover up all ills
and pull games out of nowhere. And I just, especially
young Packer fans, I'm looking at you, guys, going you
guys like it could work out well. They could be
a well rounded team. Jordan Love could be good. The
(14:48):
odds of having yet another transcendent quarterback just take the
reins and keep it rolling are not good. And you're
not going to notice that necessarily Week three, the third
quarter against the Bears, when you're you know, marching down
the field. But you're going to notice it in December
on third and eighteen against a really good team at
(15:12):
times where Aaron and far before we're able to just
do insanely magical things. I just don't think that's going
to be the case. And that's not a slight on
Jordan Love. I'm just trying to be realistic.
Speaker 2 (15:27):
Yeah, Listen, if he was as good as a Burrow
or a Mahomes, they would not have signed Aaron to
an extension, right because there was drama three years ago.
If he was as bad as Zach Wilson, they know
it and I've kept so my takeaway, he's somewhere between
twelve and twenty. He's probably in that mix, which I.
Speaker 1 (15:45):
Mean it goes well, if it goes well.
Speaker 2 (15:48):
Yeah, he's somewhere between Kirk Cousins and Jimmy Garoppolo or
you know, he's somewhere in. But it's also possible that
he is Zach Wilson. It just hasn't played right. I mean,
I think he's a more mature person and all that,
but like, right, yeah, but I hear you.
Speaker 3 (16:05):
Yeah, Like if it goes the way they are hoping
it will go, and they've got good infrastructure around him,
and Mountain Floor is a really, really good coach, I think.
Speaker 2 (16:13):
He has a chance. You know, Mike, I think they're
going to look like last year. They're going to be
the nine and eight sort of level, but it's going
to be the opposite. So with Aaron, he didn't want
to work with the young receivers. They start slow schedule weekends,
they finished strong. I think because Jordan Love is going
to be totally committed to the young guys, and nobody
(16:34):
has film on him. They're actually be pretty good team
until Thanksgiving. At Thanksgiving the break you get film. People
now have had their buys, and now I think people
take stuff away from Jordan love that he had in
the first eight or nine weeks. I think they're going
to end up the same place. Last year's team did
(16:56):
a pretty a team that would be sub five hundred
and the afcally above five hundred in the NFC. But
it is his first year. The kid hasn't seen live
bullets played from behind Sunday night games. I think a
realistic expectation is Jets ten wins, Packers eight to nine.
Feel about right to you.
Speaker 3 (17:17):
Yeah, And he's going to have to have a tough,
tough makeup because I remember being out on Aaron Rodgers
Island his first year as a starter in two thousand
and eight, when there was a lot of skepticism and
because of my cal ties and the fact that you
know the blind scorel nut theory, I was right on
this one and I had to weather that first year
(17:38):
when he was six and ten. Now, he played really
well a lot. There were a lot of close games.
He couldn't pull out. He had some injury stuff, so
a lot of people were still very very skeptical. After
eight and nine, he was obviously much much better. And
then we had that epic playoff game against the Cardinals
at Curt Order, and you know, I covered that game
(17:59):
and remember like being pretty sure that we were seeing
a guy who was going to ascend.
Speaker 2 (18:06):
So I thought the compensation was reasonable. It was mostly
what we thought, which is, the Packers are either going
to get a couple of two's or a two and
a one if Aaron plays. I don't think there's a
real winner. I guess I guess the winner is the
team that gets Aaron Rodgers. But I didn't think I
didn't think the compensation it was sort of what we thought, right.
Speaker 3 (18:29):
Yeah, I liked it. I thought, you know, it was creative,
there was some compromise. That swap of thirteen and fifteen
was a good creative way to change the value. Both teams,
you know, could have stared down longer, but there was
good motivation to.
Speaker 1 (18:44):
Get it done.
Speaker 3 (18:45):
I thought, if you're the Packers, then you know you're
getting rid of them. I thought Brian Gudacus did a
really nice job. I liked his haul all things considered,
And if you're Joe Douglass or Robert Salla a, you
got to have them because you know you're coaching for
your jobs presum and you know it's all set up
for that. And b I, you know, I know the
(19:07):
Jets just wanted some recognition that if he doesn't play
that second year that they would have given up a lot,
and now they have at least a little bit of
protection that way. So I actually thought both gms did
a really nice job of creatively splitting the difference and
doing it in a timely manner.
Speaker 2 (19:27):
Give me your prediction on the New York media, which
can lean ferocious and left. And Aaron Rodgers, who's now
supporting Robert Kennedy. You know he's the anti vaccine candidate. Like, listen,
say what you want. There's two different ways to write
the same story. Do you think it'll be a rough
(19:49):
first year? What do you think Aaron, who's had some
rabbit ears? You got the Daily News, The Times, the
Outspoken Post. There's sports talk radio in New York can
be brutal, w fa N, wildly entertaining and outspoken. How
do you think it goes your one.
Speaker 1 (20:08):
That's a great question.
Speaker 3 (20:10):
I would I look at it the same way I
look at any coach going into that market or anyone
who's kind of you know, thrown into it. If you win,
it's gonna be awesome. You know, Eric Mangini was on
The Sopranos as Mangenius. What he won early Rex Ryan
(20:31):
was love, you know, through my foot fetish scandal at all,
it was all good and a lot of ways you
could keep living off that. If it goes batterly and
you appear to be defensive or out on a fringe
or you know, combative, then it's a tougher place to
(20:53):
have thin skin about it. I don't know that Aaron
will or whoa Derek has ways to communicate directly. It's
a different era. But you know, I think if it
goes well early he will be getting a lot of
love from those back pages and a lot of the
you know, potential trigger points will be ah, well, you
know he's got a different view on the vaccines. But
(21:15):
you see that pass on third to twelve, you know.
But right if you know, if it's not going so well,
then yeah, sure people are going to be looking for
ways to poking proud and we'll be watching.
Speaker 2 (21:33):
All right, let's bring on John Middlcoff. You know him,
you love him. He's part of the Volume Podcasting digital network.
We love having him. Former NFL scout Okay, let's start.
I thought the first thing that jumped out to me
is good teams and good gms get value. The Belichick
gets Christian Gonzales right middle of the first a very
(21:55):
good corner, and the Eagles got, to me the best
player I watched in college football at the number nine pick.
They moved up a spot. I mean, to me, Philadelphia again,
They've got the culture, they think they have, the coach,
you know, Fletcher cox Age. I thought Philadelphia got the
best player, you know, the organization. Well, what were your
thoughts on that?
Speaker 4 (22:15):
Well, I think, first and foremost, if you remember, several
years ago, they drafted Jalen Rager instead of Justin Jefferson,
and it really kind of bit him in the ass, right,
I mean, Justin Jefferson went on to be one of
the best players in the league and Jalen Rager is
not even on their team. I think, I mean, I
know that they kind of got together as an organization
and said, why are we out thinking the room. Here,
take the best players from the best programs. What have
(22:38):
they done the last couple of years? DeVante Smith Alabama
Heisman Trophy, Jordan Davis starting defensive tackle at Georgia National Championship.
Trade for aj Brown, an SEC blue chip guy who's
dominating Nakobe Dean. They draft, you know, from Georgia in
the second round. They also, I think one thing, Howie
and obviously Jeffrey Lewie they know well from the Andy
(22:59):
year and they've carried it over into their good teams
with Doug Peterson in this last couple of years. As
culture is really big, and when you have these veteran
guys like why do you resign Fletcher Cox and Brandon Graham,
they're done because they bring a lot to the table, yep.
And then when you get a situation like this, what's
this guy going to do? I act like an idiot
around those two guys. I mean, Brandon Graham stripped Tom
Brady to win a Super Bowl. He's been in the
(23:20):
league for twelve thirteen years. Fletcher Cox, you know, is
an all time great Eagle and while he's you know,
on the other side of his career, is just an
SEC guy. The other thing they have now to me
and in football is different than like AAU. Right, if
you meet a kid from LA or New York AAU.
They all play together in basketball, they've all played in football.
(23:41):
If I'm from LA, I don't know the guy from
New York or Seattle or Florida.
Speaker 1 (23:45):
Right.
Speaker 4 (23:45):
Besides in college if I play him, Well, the SEC
guys all know each other, right, and they all kind
of roll together.
Speaker 5 (23:52):
Well.
Speaker 4 (23:52):
Think about their team Colin DeVante Smith Alabama, Nakobe Dean,
Jordan Davis, the new Georgia guys, Fletcher Cox SEC guy,
A J. Brown SEC guy Jalen Hurts. Well, I think
we think Oklahoma three years, Alabama SEC guy. So their core,
they all kind of speak the same language in terms
of that Southern football culture. Obviously they all come from
(24:13):
elite program, especially the BAM and Georgia guys. It's a
risky pick. I mean, this guy, I think scared a
ton of teams as you could see him going to
nine like that's pretty telling. But I think how he
feels very good about their infrastructure now with their coaches,
with their players to kind of operate a lot like
Belichick used to do for years with Tom and some
of their core guys where they as it went on,
(24:34):
they started taking some flyers because they felt really good
about their main guys. You can't act like an idiot
when when the top guys you look up to and
are kind of like, you know, you have a lot
in common with.
Speaker 1 (24:46):
So I think that was I mean, an easy pick
for them obviously.
Speaker 2 (24:49):
Yeah, and by the way, for those of you uninitiated,
John's a former scout. This is the kind of insight
you get, which I've never heard anybody talk about that.
But I think you're right on the money. And the
other thing that jumped out to me is I've said
with CJ. Stroud, he is a first round quarterback. I
don't see a ton of juice. He's accurate. Jared Goff
is a very accurate comp I think he's a little
(25:11):
better runner than Jared. But you know, there was a
lot of speculation. I kind of fell for it that
they would get Jalen Carter or Will Anderson. What did
you make of the Texans getting Stroud? What did it
tell you?
Speaker 4 (25:23):
One thing I was I was stunned in the sense
that they just got a brand new coach who's young
and I'm A big believer in Demiko. When I was
with the Eagles, we traded for him as a player
because of his character and I've you know, lived in
the bear for a long time, went to the practices.
Kyle Shanahan swears by the guy. I think he's going
to be a stud head coach. I mean, he's just
He's been good at everything he's ever done in his
entire life. I don't know why it's going to stop little.
(25:46):
I mean, obviously I understand why the GM in the
front office and the owner and needs to get a quarterback.
You look at there, But if you're Demiko, why rush
into this? You know, I think a lot of people
in the NFL. He throws a beautiful ball. But when
you look at Ohio State these last couple of years,
a lot like Tua when he was Alabama. I mean, Colin,
you're talking about three or four top fifteen wide receivers
(26:07):
on their team, not like a couple guys that play
in the NFL. Right, these are top fifteen picks. Well
technically in JIGBA twenty, but you know what I mean.
I mean this is and the speed difference in the
Big ten relative to even two in the sec that
the advantage Ohio State has. I do think that Georgia
game though, because the Jared gofkomp was definitely something that
(26:28):
kind of kicks stay with it.
Speaker 1 (26:29):
That Georgia game.
Speaker 4 (26:30):
He was run around. He looked like kind of a
different player. Now, I don't know what your take was,
but the take of like when he responded to the test.
I'm not a test taker. I'm a football player. I
did love that quarterbacks get held to a higher standard. Man,
you know, I mean you're not playing slot receiver dB
so I mean Peyton Manning, Tom Brady Lamar He those
(26:52):
guys don't they don't get defensive over stuff like that.
But risky move. I actually thought they're moved trading back
up to get will Anderson, who I liked a lot.
But holy moly, they gave up a lot to go
back from twelve to three. Especially, But I guess when
you're in the court, when you've drafted the quarterback and
they got all these picks coming from Deshaun Watson, maybe
they're they're not thinking about Caleb Williams and Drake May anymore.
Speaker 1 (27:14):
Obviously.
Speaker 4 (27:15):
I mean I thought Seattle, you know, I just think Pete,
you know, a lot of people thought Jalen Carter, he
takes some swings. They did not mess around with that,
which I understand everyone I know. And teams that had
no shot of getting this guy, they loved Witherspoon kind
of a throwback to you know, some of those teams
they had with Russell Wilson, those LOB teams absolute just
(27:37):
m effort stud I mean, big time tackler, can play inside, outside,
you can move them around, can tackle.
Speaker 2 (27:44):
Seattle's got two two's, a three and two fours. So
of their three needs, one was Locket Dk. They needed
another receiver, they needed they wanted another, and they got one.
I mean he's good, he's awesome when healthy, yep. And
then they got a wide receiver and then they get
you know, Jackson Smith Jigba. So they end up getting
(28:08):
two of their three needs. I think they needed guard
now and then a later an edge rusher. But I mean,
if you look at last year's pick on ESPN, they
put up the last six or seven like great young players.
I mean they are. They had a run John where
I think Pete Carroll and Paul Allen passed. They had
a run where Pete had too much control in the draft,
(28:31):
and it feels like they've given it back to John
Snyder and the scouting department. They have not missed on
a pick.
Speaker 4 (28:40):
With tackles. They got Kenneth Walker. I mean, they got
a good young nucleus. I mean they they won nine
games where I'm guilty. I thought they were going to
be terrible and they were really good. And I think
they're going to be even better. I mean because they
got so many young pieces that they're building around.
Speaker 2 (28:54):
Okay, so I think we both agree Seattle did well,
so Jamiir gives the running back, so people are to
bang on Detroit's picks. Now. Gibbs is a very dynamic
and again Alabama big school. You see them run over
guys and run past guys in the SEC. So you know,
my takeaway on Detroit is the last two drafts with
(29:15):
his front office, John, I've really liked him, and so
part of me thinks to myself with Swift and Gibbs
as they're trying to take they love their O line. Okay,
they solve their corner issue a little bit, right, are
they basically saying is we want to take the pressure
off Jared goff Or. I mean I was watching them
(29:39):
high five in the room, like this was not a
pick they had trepidation over. These guys were high five
And what did it say to get a running back
when they have swift because their O line can control
I think can control a lot of the defensive fronts
in that division. Is that what they're saying.
Speaker 4 (29:56):
I think in most most drafts, when you see a
guy that you go, you know, I think it's fair
to say going into the any draft, a guy like
him is like an early second, you know, somewhere in
like thirty two to forty pick. This draft was viewed
as pretty terrible. Like the difference between pick eight and
twenty five. You know, you might not be able to
tell the difference, like Ken Kaid going twenty five to
(30:17):
the Bills might be no different than the six pick.
Speaker 1 (30:19):
You know.
Speaker 4 (30:20):
So it's just time will tell people were not that
comp This was not Jamar Chase and the Waddles and
the Pinasoles and the Michael Parsons. That wasn't this draft.
So when you go, well, they got to a super
Bowl with Jared Goff when he had a great running game,
right with Sean McVay in with La and last year
Jared Goff statistically was excellent. Well, they had another pick
and they got a linebackers. Their defense, I mean, I
(30:41):
think Aiden Hutchinson is going to be a really really
good player. To me, he's got some whiffs of Joey Bosa.
I mean, he's got a chance to be a twelve
fifteen sack guy next year immediately. So if their defense
is just incrementally better, their offense. I mean, the USC
wide receiver they have as a stud, like you said,
their offensive lines of stud. Their coach, while he's an
offensive because he's a tight end, is really wired more
(31:02):
like a defensive tackle. I mean, he wants to be
a tough, physical guy. I'm with you if you love
this guy, and I'm going to give them the benefit
of doubt because I watched them last year and they
were an expressive operation.
Speaker 1 (31:13):
So I think they know the wiring.
Speaker 4 (31:15):
The other thing is Dan Campbell came from Sean Payton,
you know, over that five or six year run when
he got fired from Miami and went there became an
assistant head coach. They had really good drafts during that
time when the Saints were really good at the end
of the two thousand, you know, the teams right the
seventeen eighteen nineteen, So I think he knows the wiring
of the guys. I remember sometimes the Saints, you'd be like, wow,
they did that, and then it would work out right.
(31:35):
So I'm with you. It was a little eye opening
because you see the second running back come off at twelve.
But I'm going to give them the benefit of the
doubt because I know their play style and I know
what they want to do. The other thing is when's
the last time a running back from Alabama beside Trent
Richardson hasn't worked in the NFL. You watch them all
over the league. They were all successful players well. And
(31:57):
Jared Goff's history is when Gurley was he he's been
a really good quarterback. When Jared gets in trouble is
third and long. Okay, so is Detroit saying we love
our oc we just don't want to get in third
and long. You and I know I saw Goff out
Duel Mahomes when they had Gurley and naked run. Jared
was getting you to the super Bowl. It's when the
(32:19):
O line aged and they didn't have a consistent run game.
Now you leene on Jared Goff and it's not pretty right.
So I look at Detroit and I think they love
their OC. They have good young receivers, excellent O line,
Swift got banged up, and maybe they're just saying, listen,
we're just gonna do a one two punch and we're
gonna go. And by the way, in that division, the
D line for the Vikings, the D line for the Packers,
(32:42):
the D line for the Bears, are you gonna pick
them to win the division? You pick Minnesota last year?
To me, obviously, injuries can happen, but Detroit would be
my pick as of recording this today to win the North.
Speaker 2 (32:52):
And again, I think, is Detroit looking at that division
and thinking our O line is significantly better in those
six games against the D lines in our division? Can
we go five and one in that division?
Speaker 1 (33:05):
For sure?
Speaker 4 (33:05):
And in a weird way because they haven't even made
the playoffs, right, But if you assume that they're going
to be in the mix, the three teams that are
at the top of the conference, the Eagles, the Niners,
and Cowboys are all physical teams. So you're getting this
is not a lightweight fight. You're getting in the ring
to fight heavyweights, So you have to be willing to
play like that. And Dan Campbell is now building a
(33:26):
team who they draft their second pick in the first round,
a linebacker from Iowa. Right, I mean, they have a
type of guy that they're looking for to build their team.
And honestly, that should translate to playing the Cowboys the
Eagles and just give them a chance. If not in
twenty three, the next couple of years. Obviously, you know
Jared Goff is going to be the guy we talk
about the most, but he's proven if you can do
(33:47):
it around him and their roster. I liked the lot
with the Lions have going on a lot, so I
mean the Will Levice situation. I talk to people that
I really trust. Their big concern with him was, listen,
the kid is smart. We know his mom went to
an I League school Yale. We know he's a four
(34:07):
point student. Why is his judgment so bad? And what
I heard was Jay Cutler is that Jay Cutler was
arrogant and obstinate, and if Jay had a rope, Jay
had an arm, and if Jay wanted to sling it,
he didn't give a shit what the coach said. And Jay,
(34:29):
I'll argue it forever. Jay had one of the best
arms in the league. When he played, he had an
absolute host, but Jay was stubborn, rigid, difficult, and people
worried Will Levi us with the selfies, the gun show,
look at me the combine. He wore a muscle shirt.
I had a head coach and a GM told me
(34:50):
they hated that. I mean, I listen, Brady Quinn works
at Fox, and I like Brady, but that was one
of the knocks I heard is that an he can't
be jacked as a quarterback. You have to be flu
and you don't see biceps on Aaron Rodgers or Peyton Manning.
Your take on Will levis dropping.
Speaker 1 (35:05):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (35:05):
I mean I think that he was a fascinating player
coming into the season, and then the season was a disaster,
and I had people that really like him. They aren't
necessarily quote unquote decision makers, but are you know, high
in their organization said if coming out his junior season
or whatever two years ago, when Liam Cohen, right, the
Rams guy, was his offensive coordinator, he would have been
(35:27):
a lock top five pick. Then he goes to Rich Skangarello,
who a lot of people are down on disastrous season,
and then, like you said, kind of has a bad offseason,
the lifting things that you're not playing offensive tackle or lineback,
No one cares. It's about pliability. It's about fluidity, and
that's a big knock on his game is fluidity. Touch.
(35:49):
And we've seen so many guys Brady Quinn Kaepernick got
really big. Whether you can throw at one hundred and
twenty miles an hour, If you can't throw a strike,
who cares, You're not going to make the big leagues, right.
Touch is a big issue with him. I also think that,
like Anthony Richardson, who this raw guy was viewed as
very mouldable. One thing I have heard like when he
(36:11):
went and met with people, they were just like, you
know what this guy means?
Speaker 1 (36:13):
Well, like I would love to be around this guy.
Speaker 4 (36:15):
There was a lot of positive vibes around him.
Speaker 2 (36:18):
Very grateful. Like Anthony Richardson wrote a Penda letter, he
was like humble and grateful. And it's like, John, you
look at that and you think, Okay, this kid wants
to learn.
Speaker 4 (36:27):
Yeah, and whether it works out, only time will tell,
and more than the history would show us it probably won't.
But I know that a lot of people were down
on him, and during the process came away the opposite,
like I'm rooting for this guy. I think this guy
not crazy to go in the top five. Is the
ceiling is sky high, and I think will Levis started
(36:47):
getting more negative and negative. Not like you said anything malicious, right,
but the buff stuff to the lifting the pictures on
Instagram within the last month, Like what are we doing?
You know, it's just I mean, he didn't im he tumbled.
I mean, this was a guy that I think after
last season twenty one, when Kentucky had a really good year,
(37:08):
I don't see how he wouldn't have been a top
five pick, not with those measurables, right, But then yeah,
I mean, I clearly the league is very I mean,
this is a quarterback star of the leak. For no
one to touch him, it's crazy.
Speaker 5 (37:25):
Colin, how you doing?
Speaker 4 (37:26):
Man?
Speaker 5 (37:26):
What a game? Harrison Barnes with the shot of his life.
He had a chance to erase all the pain and
suffering from the twenty sixteen finals that he left it long.
Speaker 2 (37:35):
Well, they needed that Draymond block, They needed the twenty
two from Jordan Poole. I feel like I'm watching the
younger Warriors take on the old Warriors. They Stephen Dearin
get baskets, get great looks when they want, you have enforcers.
You know what, I watched this tonight in the second half,
and I'm like, outside of Denver, is this the Western
(37:58):
Conference Final? Now that the Warriors are full strength, are
we watching essentially the Western Conference Final? In round one?
Speaker 5 (38:07):
I remember I had a similar thought after the playing games,
and everyone's like, oh man, the Wolves and the Lakers,
they're both terrible. What an ugly basketball game. And I
have like a completely different feeling about this. I think
all of these teams are awesome. I think the Kings
are awesome. I think the Warriors are awesome. I think
the Lakers are awesome. I think the Suns are awesome.
(38:28):
The Nuggets have been arguably the most impressive team in
the first round here in the Western Conference, And like, again,
like what you're seeing here is that it doesn't it's
a two to seven matchup, and it's a first round matchup.
But these are two teams from an overall talent standpoint
that are typically the types of teams that you'd see
in later playoff rounds. It's they're incredibly evenly matched. I
want to I want to give a special shout out
(38:49):
to Deer and Fox because there's this thing that happens.
And I mean we've even seen the reverse side of
this with Darius Garland on the Calves this year, as
he's really really struggled to just be constantly effective throughout
the series. Every time we see a young player kind
of rise up the echelons of the NBA, there's always
this question like is his game gonna work when they
(39:11):
get to the playoffs, and some guys struggle to get separations,
some guys struggle in the physicality, Like Trey Young had
a really good game in Game three against Boston. That's
the outlier. He's had like six straight playoff stinkers before that.
You know what I mean. Darren Fox, his game translates
so well to this level. And I actually think you'll
find this interesting, Colin, because you've been super critical of
(39:31):
this type of player, right, this ultra athletic point guard
that is this unbelievable downhill force that plays with passion
and energy. That player has failed time and time and
time again in NBA history. And the thing that separates,
in my opinion, Darren Fox from the others is he
legitimately has outrageously good shooting touch from everywhere on the floor,
(39:56):
and so whoever's guarding him like to give a certain
amount of space, just just an attempt to contain the
drives and so and when he and he's deadly on
those shots.
Speaker 4 (40:08):
Well.
Speaker 2 (40:09):
And also Westbrook and Wall especially, they didn't play with
a ton of self awareness in their prime. They were
going a thousand miles an hour. Dearen pays with plays
with really good pacing. He knows when to slow it up.
I mean, you look like you're watching a twelve year
veteran like he knows when to speed it up. Steph
does this? You know when? When do you know he'll
(40:31):
He'll go right through traffic. He's trying to speed the
tempo up, and it's not really to get a shot.
It's just kind of to see if he can find
a little crevice and get to the basket. If he can't,
then he pulls it up and waits for the bigs
to come down. Dearan's got a real understanding of pace
and tempo. He's not playing with his head down everything,
you know. It's like Patrick Mahomes. He sees the field,
(40:54):
he sees the court, he sees everybody. Darren Fox is
really smart. And he plays like a really smart basketball player.
Steph Curry's really smart. Some of this is just guys
Deer and also not that he's not vertical, but he's
kind of uh he's I would I would, you know,
if I was a scout, I'd say smooth, smart, beautiful
(41:18):
offensive game. It's gorgeous. I mean, mid range outside, everything
is pretty. So I don't really put him in that
I you know, and I feel like he's he's a
little bit like Steph. Probably I trust Deer and Moore
in a mid range Steph on a three, but I
think their games are so much about manipulating pace and tempo.
(41:40):
John Wall never did. John was just get me the
ball and I'm gonna race everybody down the floor. And
the wings are like, bro, hold up, I can't keep
up with you. And Westbrook has a little bit of that.
It's a one hundred mile an hour fastball. It's the
quarterback that has a fastball.
Speaker 4 (41:53):
You know.
Speaker 2 (41:54):
He throws it on the deep post, he throws it
on the screen. It's it's a one tempo thrower. And
so I dearon Is, I think he's an all timer.
I think next year he'll be I think, right now
he feels like a top ten player, maybe ten, But
I think if they get past the Warriors, he's going
to be a top ten player, because I feel like
he's just twelve ish. And then you're watching them in
(42:17):
this series, you're like, I mean, if I told you
today John Morant or him, I'd take dearon Fox.
Speaker 5 (42:23):
He's been great in every game. This is an out
every gaming defense in a high stakes playoff series where
he came in as the underdog, and he's been great
in every game like he I mean, look like people
always get a little freaked out when we start to
talk about lists because you feel bad about bumping guys.
But I mean, here's the deal. Like he's he is
performing at this level against this type of defense, at
(42:44):
a higher level than most of the players around the league.
I think that's completely reasonable. I think, you know, it's funny.
Over the course of the series, I've been talking a
lot about how the Kings have no answer for Steph Curry,
and that's a big part of why I have it.
I've been yet to relinquish my stance at the will
win this series, and I still feel that way I
picked them in six. I'm gonna stick with that for
right now. But like the reality is is like the
(43:06):
Kings should feel really good about their chances because the
same thing is in reverse like they I did think
it was interesting that we didn't see as much Gary
Payton today. They spent a lot of time with Draymond
Green on Deer and Fox today, which is a super
interesting adjustment. Yes, oh yeah, so just what a again?
What a what an amazing luxury as a coach to
(43:27):
be able to do that, And they did a similar
thing last year in the finals if you remember when
they moved Draymond Green out onto Jlen Brown because he can.
Just the thing with Draymond is he has these obnoxiously
long alarms. First of all, his defensive performance down the
stretch of this game was so ridiculous, And there was
a lot of talk over the last couple of days, Oh,
the Warriors better without Draymond, which everyone just gets dumber
whenever that happens. They were eleven points better per one
hundred possessions with him than without him in last year's postseason.
(43:49):
They were fourteen points better with him than without him
in this regular season. Like that, that argument is dead
on arrival. I can't believe it ever even gets brought up.
He blew up some plays around the rim. You're thinking
of the block, Oh my god, Bonus, you get another play.
So Bonus is coming down the floor in a short role.
It's a two on one. Harrison Barnes is standing wide
open in the dunker spot ready to go up and
(44:10):
dunk it, and Sa Bonus goes to pass it to
Harrison Barnes and Draymond just pokes it out of Sabonis's hands.
He blew up a two on one that's a basket
ninety five percent of the time in the NBA like
he was. He was unbelievable defensively in this game. But
even with him, he has to give a little bit
of ground to de Aaron Fox to try to contain
this drive in on that final shot, the one that
(44:30):
d'eren made that brought it back to one, like you
got a great contest on it. But that's what great
players do, and Darreon Fox has done that this entire series.
He can adjust his release based on where he is
on the floor and he can knock these shots down well.
Speaker 2 (44:43):
And also Dramon's got really good hands. Klay Thompson's are Okay, Wiggins.
I think I've really noticed it with Wiggins. He doesn't
quite have his wind yet and his hands. Sometimes when
you don't have your wind, you can lose your legs
where you get sloppy. Wiggins today had four or five
that he just couldn't secure. For a guy that's not
(45:03):
a great shooter, Draymond's got strong hands and good hands.
Like he touches it, he gets it his timing. There's
certain players in the league that and because you know
I employed Draymond one of his many employers, by the way,
talented guy, you know people are going to, you know, say, Colin,
(45:26):
you have a bias. First of all, I've said this
a thousand times in my career. Every great team of
my life has them for the heat, Rodman for the Bulls,
Derek Rick Fox for the Lakers, Lambert for the Pistons,
Draymond Green, all great dynasties, Bruce Bowen for the Spurs.
Have a feisty, annoying, tough guy and his job. He's
(45:50):
in the league because he's smart enough to know. I mean,
Bruce Bowen scored, he could score twenty a game in
the league. He's like not I knew on this team.
My way in the league to rings was to play
the way I had to play, do the stuff that
nobody else wanted to do. If you don't get Draymond Green,
like if you don't understand, have you ever noticed out
around outside the arc they bring him up. They want
(46:12):
him to have the ball in his hands, him to
set the screen, him to make the pass. Like that
organization puts him in the crosshairs. You make a mistake
out there, it's a layuper a dunk the other way, like,
this organization has so much trust for Draymon. With the
basketball in his hands, we think of him defensively, but
as you watch him Jason, he's such a catalyst, his passing,
(46:35):
his screening, his hands. If you don't people that don't
get him, you don't get the game. Like anybody know.
Everybody knows that Darren Fox and stuff are great. That
doesn't take you know you're watching Jalen Brunson, He's obviously
it's such a unique fun player. Guys like Draymon like
they just don't. Sometimes I watch Draymond and I think
(46:56):
he should open a clinic on how to make the
NBA as a star in average eight, a game like
he does so many things that you don't think they
like screening, passing, He does so many little things well
that you don't necessarily like, you don't get points in
a box score for screening or those little he'll screen
(47:18):
those little touch passes that don't get the assist, but
they're the pass before the assist, the incubator of it. Like,
he doesn't get a lot of credit for that, but
he was so big late today to your point.
Speaker 5 (47:30):
Yeah, you know, it's funny because a lot of people
have been comparing him in Dylan Brooks, which drives me crazy.
They'll be like, oh, they both make the Oh I've
never seen Draymond Green shove a cameraman just to be
a jerk. Okay, Like there's there's a different there's a
difference between like like just being a jerk and being
a guy who's kind of a physical instigator. There's no
doubt that Draymond's a physical instigator and Dylan Boroks is
(47:51):
that a and Moore And the other thing too, is
like Dylan Brooks is a bad is a limited offensive
player from a skill standpoint that doesn't get it. And
we'll take eleven shots in a quarter and in a
road playoff game in Los Angeles, and you're like, dude,
what the hell are you doing? Like, Raymond has his
offensive limitations, but he understands his role. And I love
(48:11):
how you pointed out all those whole things because it's
you're right. They love to have the ball in his hands.
They've been running a ton of Steph high pick and
roll as this series has progressed, Like there was a
play at the end of this game where Andrew Wiggins
made a floater. Steph runs the high pick and roll,
they trap him, he makes the drop off pass to Draymond.
He's rolling down the basket. Looney and Wiggins kind of
mess up. They both cut, and you never want to
both cut because now you're getting in each other's way.
(48:33):
It's better for one guy to cut, one guy to
stay at the three point line. And Draymond like hangs
in the air and just waits barely for Wiggins to
kind of break open and hits him in stride, and
Wiggins makes the floater, and I'm like, man, that was
kind of an impressive play in traffic in the short role.
They like having the ball in his hands. He can
disrupt guys below the rim. Defensively, he can disrupt guys
above the rim. Defensively. Tap out rebounds is a big one.
(48:54):
There'll be like a ball in the air and he
knows he can't go get it, but he'll just run
up and just tap at it and just keep it alive.
Speaker 2 (49:01):
So I kind of feel like Sacramento almost ended the Dynasty,
and I think they're gonna look at that film on
the way home and they're gonna think, we just gave
one away. We just gave a game away. They outplayed
Golden State early, too many turnovers. They're a tough out man.
They are the Baby Warriors. They are a tough out
(49:22):
and they're really smart. As I said at the start
of this, I just feel like they need another shooter
and they'll probably get that in the draft or you know,
somewhere in free agency.
Speaker 5 (49:32):
I actually think if they upgrade the Sabonus position at
any point, they could be super dangerous because like the
unsung heroes of this series have been well, I say unsung,
the real heroes of this series have been Malik, Bunk
and Deer and Fox and the simple fact that nobody
can played well. Malik's been good in this whole series.
And it's funny because the Lakers couldn't afford to keep him.
But that's the only reason he's not a Laker right now.
(49:52):
He was one of the rare bright spots last year,
just an excellent shot creator that can beat people off
the dribble and knock down threes. He just played so
well that the Lakers were financially incapable of retaining him.
You know, it's funny. I actually think the Warrior are
the Kings deserve to be slight favorites right now. They've
played well enough, and they have two games at home.
(50:13):
It's pretty simple that said. These games are going to
reach a fever pitch of intensity and drama and stakes,
and so I still lean I still lean Warriors just
because they've There's look, if it's Game five and it's
one hundred to one hundred with three minutes left, there's
no doubt that the Warriors will be more comfortable in
that situation, simply because they right in those situations before.
(50:36):
The same goes for a game seven. Again, the Kings
should I bet you they were positive in the locker room.
I bet you they feel good in their film session.
They should feel confident. But I think these games are
going to get even more sweaty palms, even more high drama,
and I just trust the.
Speaker 1 (50:52):
Warriors a little bit more.
Speaker 5 (50:54):
What was your take on that Lakers blowout of the
Grizzlies yesterday. Do you think it's Do you think the
real matchup is more like the first quarter or more
like the last three quarters?
Speaker 2 (51:04):
Well, I think the Lakers. I think we both chose
the Lakers. I think they're better. I always felt there
was two things that were true about Memphis. They were
they're deep, and they're inexperienced. And I'm not saying depth
and experience are everything, but it's they feel like they
(51:24):
need another score. To me, you know, jaw was sensational,
but I just feel like they need another dependable score.
I mean, you really don't want somebody scoring forty five
points in a playoff game. You really don't. I mean
that's just I mean, everybody's in awe of Jamran. It's like,
you know, you can go back to the Kobe stats,
like the Lakers were awful when he scored over thirty
(51:46):
five points, right, and so you know, Jos starts playing well,
he plays downhill and it's fun, it's magical. But I
just I never I mean, listen, they were a two seed,
the Lakers were seven, and I feel it was you know,
I sit on the air, I said, if I say
it on the air, I believe it. I'm like, I
think the Lakers are gonna win the series. They were
(52:06):
a forty three win team, right, one's the left to
a forty three wins seven seed. You take them over
a two seed confident, and Memphis is one of the Yeah,
and Memphis is one of the best home teams in
the league. So I just don't. I don't feel and
we're seeing it with Cleveland, by the way, you know,
you really young have some depth, but Garland and Mitchell.
(52:28):
I mean, the Knicks aren't even getting a good series
from Julius Randall. He's not playing well. And so I
just don't feel like I think Sacramento regardless of I
think Sacramento is really close to being a championship team,
like a player away.
Speaker 1 (52:46):
I don't.
Speaker 2 (52:46):
With Memphis, I don't always love. I feel they're at
a little less mature than Sacramento, a little chippier, a
little less self awareness. Their stars had some problems. The
King Star is like Steph mature. So it's not that
I don't buying a Memphis, but I really never bought
(53:08):
into them as a championship team. I really don't. In fact,
if you told me the two really young teams in
the NBA, I like I would say, it's Sacramento in Cleveland.
Cleveland's been disappointing, like these playoffs, basically, Jason, nothing surprised
us except Cleveland. I mean, that's the only series where
if you'd have told anybody, yeah, Julius Randall, good game one,
doesn't do anything and they lead three to one, that
(53:30):
would be a surprise. I think almost everything we're seeing,
including the Lakers Grizzlies, we all kind of expected. We
trusted Lebron in ad over the last three weeks. They
just won a lot of close games, and they won
a lot of games against for the same reason they're
winning this one.
Speaker 5 (53:47):
I'm glad you said that about Memphis because I actually agree.
I don't think they're close either. A couple things, the
only position I think that they have really the only
spots that I feel really good about, like really good
about our Jared Jackson in jaw Desmond Baine has been
bad in almost every playoff game that he's played, especially
(54:08):
over the last couple of years. He struggles mightily to
create his own shot off the dribble, and guys are
good at chasing him over those screens to lessen the
quality of the shots, and he can't make it. Like
Austin Reeves has soundly outplayed him in this series, you
know what I mean. The Grizzlies have severe limitations in
shot creation and off ball offensive skill. I was talking
(54:28):
with a buddy yesterday about this, Like what scares me
for the Lakers is they can get lazy. And you
saw that, Like I tweeted right after the first quarter yesterday,
I'm like, just get ready for them to do the
bare minimum to try to win this game.
Speaker 1 (54:40):
You know, like the whole game.
Speaker 5 (54:42):
The whole game, it was like, oh, they got back
to eleven, I guess we should start trying again. I
get it up to sixteen, seventeen, and then they'd have
three bad possessions in a row and to be a
ten and we're like, all right, call time out. All right,
let's go get control of this game again. Like I
think the Lakers are so much better than the Grizzlies.
I think that people are. But to your point about
the arrogance, the way Jaw was acting in that fourth quarter, like, Oh,
(55:04):
I've got these guys like I'm like, they're not even
playing anymore. They're jogging back in transition. They're barely guarding you.
In the first quarter, you couldn't even get a clean look.
He shot two for ten on two point shots before
the fourth quarter, like they they have figured out the
job pick and roll because Jared Vanderbilt and Anthony Davis
have taken away his floater and they've shut off the
(55:24):
rig on him. They've they've they've kind of figured that out. Memphis,
to me, so has so far to go. But with
the Lakers in their lapses in execution and effort, what
freaks me out for them? There is Sacramento in Golden
State because Memphis is a young athletic team that loves
to play fast, but they're unskilled, like remarkably unskilled compared
(55:46):
to other NBA teams. Yep, Sacramento and Golden State love
to play fast and they are super skilled like at
every position. So like they will those teams if they
have those same brief lapses in judgment and effort in execute,
the Lakers will get run off the floor by the
Warriors and Kings, so like it's good, it's weird. I
feel so confident that the Lakers are going to beat
(56:07):
the Grizzlies, but I am so hesitant to pick them
as a team that can make a real run because
they just had to. It is part of their identity.
As soon as they start to feel even remotely comfortable,
Lebron and Anthony Davis go, how can I start conserving energy?
And it's going to be something that gets them beat?
I think, yeah.
Speaker 2 (56:24):
I mean, I also think that the question we asked
about Memphis all year because John is not a great shooter.
He's a great athlete. He's got the floater, he finishes
at the rim. If you take the rim away, you
take a chunk of his field goal. I mean, it's
it's the Westbrook. He's a better shooter than Westbrook. But
if you took the rim away from Russell Westbrook, he
can have really bad nights and it gets into his
(56:46):
head really fast. Even great shooters. I mean, Lebron for
a big chunk of his career, like didn't like bigs
around the basket because if he lost confidence in his three,
he could always beat guys off the dribble score and
get back into it. Lebrono was like, liked his bosh
and his Kevin loves you. Stay clear. I didn't get
this point in his career. He shoots threes, makes the misses,
(57:09):
nothing's in his head. He's kind of graduated last couple
of years. But Jaw's not a great natural shooter. So
if he's not hitting the three and the rims closed off,
you're not beating people on floaters and mid range jumpers.
And so I think when I look at this team
all year, my takeaway was, well, if you shut Jaw
down a little bit and make him shoot forty one percent,
(57:31):
who's the second dependable score? There is one, and they
just don't have one. The Volume, make sure to check
(57:54):
out The Draymon Green Show. I brought Draymond Green into
the Volume because one of the more entertaining voices and
sports unique perspective understands behind the rope also chops up
with guests like Gary Payton, Zach Lavine, Tracy McGrady. Make
sure download The Draymond Green Show wherever you get your podcasts,
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