Colin is joined by Jason Timpf, host of “Hoops Tonight” talk NBA playoffs!
They start with the Celtics sweep of the Pacers, why that series NEEDED to be over and why there will be massive pressure on the Celtics to win the title (3:00). They both shovel dirt on the Timberwolves, and Colin explains why he loves the matchup between Dallas and Boston and compares it to the 2000 series between the Blazers and Lakers (11:00).
They remember the life and career of NBA legend Bill Walton, why he was Jokic before Jokic (24:30), and why Walton’s game was 50 years ahead of his time. They dig into the reason behind Kyrie Irving’s renaissance with the Mavs (32:00) and why Dallas could become an attractive free agent destination if they win the title (39:00).
Finally, they debate whether Dallas should re-sign Kyrie to a long-term extension (41:00), Colin predicts a huge swing in free agency by the Warriors (45:00) and they rank the top 10 players in the NBA Finals (58:00)
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
The volume. All right, Jason timp is going to stop
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(00:21):
a valiant effort, come on, a lot of lucky shots,
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The ticket prices go down the closer you get to
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(00:44):
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lowest prices. Garren teed, all right, a lot of stuff
to talk about tonight. Jason timpf hoops tonight, mercifully, the
(01:07):
series is over. Derek White, big corner. Three Pacers don't
get an offensive bucket last three and a half minutes
of the game. Yes, I thought they were throwing up
some crap in the fourth quarter. Yes, I think the
Pacers are a good young team that I'm not sure
would win a playoff series in the West. I'm not
sure if they would. It is what it is. You know,
(01:30):
sports predictions are fun. I've I've been wrong on the
Dallas Mavericks all year. So I'm just I thought okay
See was gonna beat him. I thought Minnesota would beat
him in seven. I mean, you know, once they got
you know, Gafford, PJ. Washington, They're a different team. Kyrie's
playing real defense. But I've been wrong on that. This
is the easiest sports prediction in the last year. Celtics
(01:50):
make the finals, then you throw in the injuries. I
don't know what to make of Indiana. I you know,
TJ McConnell. You know they've got Pascal Siakam I've liked forever,
but I kind of felt like this is one of
those games where I appreciate the effort by Rick Carlisle,
but I wanted the series to end, and I try
not to root.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
I just wanted this series to end.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
Am I a bad guy?
Speaker 3 (02:17):
Though we did not need a Game five of Pacer Celtics,
one of the things that's really fascinating to me about
that particular series is like Boston was capable at any
moment of strangling their offense the way they did over
the final few minutes Indiana and the credit to Rick Carlisle.
They have crazy ball in player movement. They'll get five
interchanges within like ten seconds, and Boston switches a lot,
(02:39):
so like when they're not really engaged, they botch switches
and guys will bank open and someone will just end
up breaking open right underneath the basket. But anytime they
actually communicate and put in the requisite effort, they're actually
I don't know if you remember college, you remember that
twenty twenty two Celtics team, the team that made the finals.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
Yeah, they were like they played hard.
Speaker 3 (02:57):
On defense every single night, and it was scary how
good Jalen Brown, Jason Tatum, Marcus Smart, and Derek White
could be when they were really engaged defensively. And like, honestly,
we talk so much about the offensive end with Boston,
and they certainly have some frustrating things on that end
of the floor, but when they really lock in defensively,
they have four awesome versatile defenders. Derek White and then
(03:21):
they can. Yeah, they can strangle the life out of
teams when they really want to. Now, the question is
do they have the habits tied in tightly enough to
beat a really good team from the West. We're gonna
find out. But yeah, like that that that punch for
them has always been there. They just don't throw it
as often as they need to.
Speaker 1 (03:36):
Yeah, And you know, Jalen Brunson now has a big contract.
Porzingis Holiday Tatum. These are Richard dudes, you know they
they and they also know their big favorites. There is
talk that you can't flip a switch, but when I
think there's a disparity between teams, like I think Boston
will be much more engaged in the in the finals. Also,
(03:57):
I think the last game of the NBA Finals is
scheduled for like, you know, late June. I don't know
what they're gonna do this. I mean, are they gonna
start the final Saturday night? If Dallas closes it out,
I mean, they may just get you. I look tonight,
I'm like, how are they gonna How are they gonna
stretch this out? That's baseball makes that mistake sometimes where
(04:19):
people get into these series and baseball is an everyday game,
and then you get into a playoff series and there's
three days off. Well, it's in the football season, it's October.
You lose me if you you know, if I want
to watch the Braves and the Dodgers in the NLCS,
you can't go three days off, you lose me. So
I don't know what the NBA is gonna do with
their final schedule, but I do think Boston's a team.
This is a team. Now you go Marcus Martin, Drew Holiday,
(04:41):
you know, a little more of a legacy player. Porzingis
has made some big time money, been viewed as a unicorn,
a star. So I think it's hard when these guys
look at Indiana and they're like, they're terrible defensively, they're
awfully young. They probably wouldn't be here without some injuries
to the Knicks. So I think, you know, I was
thinking about this, Jason. The two easiest ways to win
(05:04):
a championship it is to be part of a dynasty.
Those are hard to construct, but once you have it,
you have lots of players, usually a great coach. You know,
dynasties get rolling, play with confidence. So you know, once
you win your first or second with the Bulls. The
third feels like it's easier. The second way is as
an underdog that comes out of nowhere with no pressure.
(05:26):
Dirk and the Mavericks over the heat. The hardest way
to win a championship is when you don't have one yet.
We're expecting one for years and you go in as
a favorite and I look at this Boston team, Dallas,
I'm thinking it, and we just put this thing together.
We just shovel the cards through it on the table.
I think Boston is going to have a lot of
(05:47):
pressure in the finals. What say you.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
There's gonna be a lot of pressure, and they're not
gonna in all likelihood, Luca is the best player going
into that series too, which is another interesting element. You know,
one of the things one of the biggest lessons I've
learned from this Dallas Minnesota series is that we got
to stop looking at the championship picture within the context
of individual teams, but rather look at it through matchups.
(06:11):
Because you go out of the second round and you're like, oh, man, Minnesota,
look at what they did to Denver. They have everyone's number. Clearly,
they're the best team in the league, and it's like, well,
actually they have a very specific weakness, which is rim protection,
because Anthony Edwards loves to get downhill and attack the rim. Right,
you go against Denver who can't protect the rim, and
you go against Phoenix with Usuf Nurkic who can't protect
(06:32):
the rim, and it's just slicing and dice in them
all series long. All of a sudden, Dallas has a
freaky athlete and Derek Jones Junior to put on the
ball in an elite couple of rim protectors, and Derek
Lively and Daniel Gafford, and they look flummoxed. They look
like they don't know what to do when the game
really slows down. And so I have to kind of
take that into the finals as well. And as we
look into the finals, you know, if it ends up
(06:54):
being Dallas Boston, you know Luke is going to be
the best player in the series. One of the biggest
issues for Boston and it's a big part of why
Indiana scored on them as effectively as they did. Boston
has been the worst pick and roll defense in the
playoffs to this point, and a lot of that has
to do with Porzingis being out. But what do we
know that Luca's gonna do. Lucas gonna pick on Al
(07:15):
Horford every single opportunity he gets, just like you're seeing
Indiana do so often over the course of this series,
picking on him whenever they have an opportunity to opportunity
to in ball screens. And so, honestly, like there's a
lot of advantages that Dallas brings to the table. That said,
Boston does just have a ton of talent, and they
have one specific thing that I think is super fascinating.
(07:36):
Jason Tatum is one of the few athletes in the
league who's actually big and strong enough to cause some
issues for Luca, And so I think that's kind of
an interesting matchup piece going into that series. And so like,
don't I don't necessarily think that Boston's talent or Dallas
having survived the West means anything. We got to look
(07:57):
at this in a vacuum, and Boston has a lot
of advantages, Dallas has a lot of advantages. It's going
to be really interesting to get to dig into. But
you're right, Boston is going to go into that series
a substantial favorite. I think we're over I think right
now on DraftKings are already something like minus two to
twenty to win the title. There's a ton of pressure. Again,
if Jason Tatum does get badly outplayed by Luca in
(08:17):
that series, after what happened with Stephan twenty twenty two,
that would be a disaster. So I do think pressure
will play a role. But I think Boston being at
home to start helps, and the big time off helps
a lot too. Because you were talking about the final schedule,
it's set. They're not playing Game one till June sixth,
So if Dallas wins tomorrow is going to six Yeah,
(08:38):
there's going to be eight consecutive days off if dat
Dallas wins tomorrow. A couple of things there. Luca's got
a bad knee, that's really good for his knee. Chris
hops porzingis a little bit extra time to get back
from that calf injury. So we could be seeing very
different versions of both of these teams when we get
to that point. You know, for what could have been
of much more entertaining conference finals, Dallas Boston feels like
a pretty damn good NBA Finals. You excited about that?
Speaker 1 (09:01):
No, I think I said this today on FS one.
I worked today and I said this is as good
as it gets. I have a huge brand in the
Celtics with two stars who have played together for years,
so people know the story. I've got Mark Cuban and
Dirk Novitsky made the Mavericks. They punch above their weight.
That's a real brand. It's not the Lakers rorior Celtics,
(09:23):
but it's a real brand. You have two stars, one
of them controversial Kyrie Irving, you have the Boston Kyrie factor.
You have the pressure on the Celtics to finally come on. Guys,
you've been to a final, so you're going to have
a favorite. This is as good as the NBA can do.
I mean, I love watching Denver play, but I don't
(09:43):
think they break through nationally. I don't think Minnesota does.
I don't think Oh Casey does. I think the Knicks
will if they could get a Paul George or one
more highly effective wing player. But this is really good.
There's I think it's going to be a great final.
I didn't know. I was just sitting here looking to
so you're right, that is right, June.
Speaker 2 (10:02):
Isn't that crazy? That's a long break? I mean, you're
that's a whole playoff series.
Speaker 1 (10:07):
Well, you're lucky that, you know, because baseball's had long
breaks and it's just a killer in October because there's
a college football or pro football. I mean, Fox is
now running college football games on Friday. You just can't
do that in football season. You can do it now.
It's funny. My takeaway, I said this on the air today.
If Porzingis plays, I like Boston barely, but I do
(10:29):
think I'll tell you a series it reminds me of
two thousand Blazers Lakers, the Celtics of the Blazers. Blazers
had our Vetus, Steve Smith and Scottie Pippin and Ponzi
Wells and David Stodameier Rashid Wallace. They had more quality
players than the Lakers did. The Lakers had Kobe and Shack,
(10:49):
and it really experienced coach. Multiple times in that series.
The Blazers gave them fits. Lakers couldn't stop Rashid Wallace.
There were multiple matchup issues for the Lakers, but they
had Shack and Kobe, and I kind of feel like
the league's never been this gifted offensively ever, that's never
(11:09):
looked like this, and increasingly in these series, you know,
it's just like who's going to get the shots. I mean,
Minnesota is the best defensive team in the league. People
were targeting Rudy Gobert. It's like, that's the best defensive player,
go after him. It's a different ballgame when you got
seven footers that have to come and defend the perimeter.
(11:32):
It's a different world. And I could just see this series.
You know, aggressive teams win. They went and got I
mean they first of all, they hired Nico Harrison from Nike,
then they get Kyrie, then the trade deadline. I mean
they took big swings and sports rewards. So there's an
aggressive culture with this team. And don't you feel a
(11:53):
little bit like Dallas, with Kyrie's temperament, feels like we
should take advantage of the opportunity we have this.
Speaker 2 (12:01):
This may not be in the oven long, right, Like
this might be one year.
Speaker 1 (12:05):
Well yeah, I mean, don't you think, Jason, there is
a sense with Dallas like let's get this. This is
the time. You know that Maverick dirt team, it was
a jumbalaya. It was it was a bunch of stuff
thrown together that the tarmac wasn't very long on it.
So I the more I think about this, I'm like, man,
(12:26):
it feels like seven and it feels like Luca's gonna
hit a shot. It really does. Like I just it's
so hard for me. I that Blazer Lakers series, I
felt six games, hell, I felt going into the fourth
quarter the Blazers were the better team in the series.
And then Kobe and Shaq do their thing, and do
you have a strong feeling either way?
Speaker 3 (12:46):
Yeah, So I find the dynamic to be super fascinating
in the sense that Boston is this super talented team.
They have four guys that make over thirty million, and
they all deserve to if they all are free agent tomorrow,
they all make over thirty million. And then Chris excuse me,
Derek White is the one guy who doesn't. He makes
like eighteen and if he was a free agent tomorrow,
(13:09):
he'd make thirty thirty five. He has a huge Yeah,
he's arguably their second or third best player. I'd say
probably their third best player, right, And so like they
have an absurd amount of talent, it's very equal opportunity.
We've joked on the show, it's like vibes. It's like
you take this possession, you take that possession. It's like
when they won Game three. It's like Drew Holliday just
decides to randomly attack Pascal Siakam at the end of
the game.
Speaker 1 (13:29):
Even Al Horford has nights. I mean, Al Horford could
drop twenty three, you'd never be shocked.
Speaker 3 (13:36):
Yeah, they look they almost look like a different version
of themselves every night, Whereas like Dallas, it's like every
single Dallas Mavericks basketball game I've watched since Luca got
drafted has looked more or less the same, you know
what I mean, Where it's like there's a corner three
point shooter, there's a corner three point shooter, there's a
lob threat, and then there's a guy on the opposite wing,
and then there's usually a secondary creator, whether it's Jalen
Brunt center, it's you know, Kyrie Irvinger, it's Spencer Dinwiddie, right,
(13:59):
and so like it's so what I find fascinating about
the build is like this to me, is the maximized
version of the Luca Dallas Mavericks construction. Right, You've got
Luca playing the best basketball he's ever played in his life.
You've got the best number two he's ever played with.
Kyry irving was playing the best basketball he's played in
a long time, right, and he's also defending at a
much higher level than he has in recent seasons. They've
(14:22):
got legitimate wing defenders. Derek Jones Junior was a veteran
minimum contract who's been one of the best perimeter guys
in the league. He's done an awesome job on Anthony
Edwards in this playoff series.
Speaker 2 (14:31):
PJ.
Speaker 3 (14:32):
Washington has been super valuable, valuable for them in all
three rounds. And then they've got two vertical spacers, right
and so in Gafford and Lively, and both of them
have been big time defensive threats for them at various
points during the season.
Speaker 2 (14:44):
And so what I.
Speaker 3 (14:45):
Find fascinating is it's very much like a star driven
construct with guys playing super focused roles. Guard the other
team's best player, hit a corner three, you know, protect
the rim, screen, and roll hard with Luca like they
have super focused roles versus Boston, where it's like everyone's
(15:06):
kind of a Swiss Army knife doing something different on
any given night. Even defensively, they'll have Tatum gard to center,
They'll have Drew Holiday guard to center. They'll put Al
Horford on Pascal Siakam because that's an archetype he has
success with. So it's like, I find it really fascinating
that they're two very very different team constructs. That said, like,
one of the things that I worry about for Dallas
in the series is they have the ability to put
(15:27):
some more size and strength on Luca than Minnesota does.
What I found really interesting in the Thunder series, Lou Dort,
built like a linebacker, caused Lucas some problems. Jaden McDaniels,
a more highly regarded perimeter defender, is getting bullied by
Luca because he's skinny and gangly, and Luca can just
shove him off and get wherever he wants. Tatum's got
(15:48):
some real size and strength. Jaalen Brown is a more
strong and stout lower base than a guy like Jaden McDaniels.
Drew Holliday is a famous like fire truck built like
really low strong kind of base. So they have a
lot of big, strong bodies that throw at Luca. And
then the second piece of it is. One of the
big reasons why Minnesota's offense is struggling so bad in
this series is they're really struggling to get the ball
(16:09):
to the weak side, and Anthony Edwards is struggling to
dissect their defense with their aggressive coverages. Boston is awesome
at getting the ball moving around to shooters and like
they will get you in space. And one of the
things they did until Haliburton got hurt, they literally every
single time down the floor were targeting Haliburton every single time,
whether it was through Tatum and Brown, or Tatum and
(16:31):
Derek White, or whether it was through Jalen Brown and
Drew Holliday, they were attacking him every single time. They
will do the same to Luca and they will try
to wear him down, And so I would say that
I lean towards Boston as well. But I do believe
that this Dallas defense is really good and if they
can play Boston into some poor shooting performances, if a
guy like a PJ. Washington or a Derek Jones Junior
can have a similar effect on Tatum that some other
(16:54):
guys have had in the past, like Andrew Wiggins did
in the twenty twenty two finals, if they have some success,
I think they have a shot. But I would lean
Boston at this point.
Speaker 1 (17:03):
Yeah, I mean, even getting the kid out of Duke Lively,
who was viewed just you don't get many players at
a college basketball that can play not only in the NBA,
can play, but play for a really good team and
get minutes. So it's like they even Dallas even throws
that at you, where they get a college kid. Now,
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (17:19):
How much you know.
Speaker 1 (17:20):
Again, the finals are different, like it. It feels really different.
The finals even feel different than the conference finals. There's
much more at tension. I don't think Boston has played
with even they feel like they're playing about eighty percent.
Like this game was a great example where I'm like, God,
if I have to have another TJ McConnell shot, give
me a break. And I just felt like, okay, this
(17:42):
seven point lead is going to evaporate. And then all
of a sudden, you could just sense it was like, okay,
Boston started getting a couple of really nice defensive sets.
Then they hit Derek White from the corner and you're like, okay,
Boston really picked their spots to be engaged and they
were good enough. I don't think that's what we'll see.
I think they know, oh what they're in for, all right.
(18:04):
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Speaker 1 (19:56):
I was thinking so much today about Bill Walton, the
passing of the Great Bill Walton. So I grew up
in the Pacific Northwest. You know that, so the first
time I watched basketball was seventy two, seventy three. The
Lakers had Weston Goodrich, a very old Wilt. They were
very good back then, So I don't remember the Knicks
winning a championship. That was like seventy one seventy two.
(20:17):
I started watching TV in seventy two. I was like
seven eight years old, so I remember the old west
Goodrich Lakers, the seventy seven Blazers, the seventy six Sonics,
the Warriors in about seventy seven to seventy eight won
a title Washington with Elvin Hayes West Sunfield. But Bill
Walton really was for people your age, you're more of
(20:41):
a basketball encyclopedia, but he was. He was pre Jokic,
That's what he played like that. And I said this
today on Fox Sports that if Walton didn't have injuries,
I think there'd be a debate today he would be
in the debate for the second best center to Kareem
of all time. I feel that strongly he wouldn't have
been the score of Kareem. First of all, he's a
consensus three time player of the Year in college basketball,
(21:06):
not an All American. And remember in the era back then,
it was full of NBA guys. He was the consensus
Player of the Year three straight times, So there's that.
The second thing was that Portland team really was not
terribly talented offensively. It was a lot of Dave towards
it and Henry Steele and Maurice Lucas. So I mean,
(21:26):
to win was very much about Bill Walton. But I
thought one of the interesting things was that we've talked
about this before many it's surprising how often many of
the great players in basketball have such unique games. Now,
Kobe clearly copied a lot of Michael but generally nobody
(21:49):
played like Kareem Nobody played like George Gervin. There was
no pre bird to Bird. Lebron was a Swiss Army knife.
Magic was totally unique. Bill Waller was unique. There was
no Rvidas Sabonis there. He was the first player that
came out and would gladly. I mean, if the Blazers
would have had multiple great offensive players, he would have
(22:10):
been more robust and dynamic as a distributor. But Walton
and I remember watching him, the games weren't national. Remember
you only got like the finals national and that was
on tape delay, so you didn't get the regionalization. And
I lived I lived two hours between Seattle and Portland,
but we got Sonic games. So like, unless I went
to Portland or they were on this Sunday game with
(22:32):
CBS Brett Musberg, you didn't see Walton. So I only
probably saw him six to seven to eight times, most
of it against the Sixers in the finals. And I
just remember thinking the hair, the headband. I'm like, I've
never seen anything like that. Even as a kid, You're like,
what is that? You know he had this he almost
shot it like a guard, the way he had his
(22:53):
hands perven So there are certain things in life as
an old guy I wish young people could have seen.
I've said this before. I wish people in their twenties
understood how great boxing was forty years ago, how great
it was like the Super Bowl and and and when
Bill Walton passed, he touched so many lives. So many
(23:13):
of the feed things on the feedbacks today on the
internet were so touching. I think Bill Walton would have
been he would have worked today. He really is a
today player. There there's my take. He was. He was
forty to fifty years ahead of his time. A lot
of people are eight to ten years ahead of their time.
I honestly, I honestly think Walton was fifty years ahead
(23:35):
of his time. Who do you have a player that
you watched when you were eight nine years old that
literally is imprinted Doctor j and Bill Walton stand out
to me, you know.
Speaker 3 (23:47):
Lebron was always that for me when I was growing up.
And it's it's very interesting because the way you put it,
it's it kind of a piggybacks off what we talked
about last week in the sense that like all of
these all time creates, they're almost all weird.
Speaker 2 (23:57):
There's like a weird element to them.
Speaker 3 (23:59):
And I agree with you that Bill Walton I think
would have done really well in today's NBA because he
was that connective piece and so many NBA teams now
are running five out offense, which I'm not going to
get into it, but the gist of it is it
depends on a big guy that can make decisions, that
can set screens and read the floor. The balls in
the big guy's hands a lot in a lot of
these modern NBA offenses, right, And like you know, it's
(24:22):
funny though for me, Bill Walton, for everything mostly comes
down to what he was as a broadcaster, right, which
is weird. Yeah, yeah, what's so funny is ida buddy.
His name was Matt Quartek. He played at the University
of Arizona and I remember he was he registered there
one year and he played behind those awesome front lines
(24:44):
with like Aaron Gordon and Stanley Johnson and Caleb Tarzuski
and then but I remember he came off the bench
for those guys. He had a big game against Stanford
on the road, and I remember he gotta throw it
down big Man one time from Bill Walton on the call,
and like me and my buddies were ras at him
about that forever, because that's the dream, Like you got
Bill Walton talking about you'd being the big man dunkin
down the lane. Like he just was always iconic as
(25:05):
a broadcaster, and like he always just brought this insane
energy right uh, to to to the to that environment.
Even when you'd go to McHale Center, because I used
to go to a lot of University of Arizona games,
Like you'd sit up there and you'd actually see him
on the on the sideline and he stand out from
the crowd because.
Speaker 2 (25:20):
He's so damn tall.
Speaker 3 (25:21):
And he's like waving his arms and he's getting all active.
Speaker 1 (25:23):
And Jason, he also was ahead of his time. He
was very much against the Vietnam War. He was sit
ins on UCLA's campus like he was. We had some
track and field athletes that were socially conscious conscious. Bill
was one of the first outspoken athletes I can remember.
(25:43):
I there's a there's a great story about him. So
he was close to John Wooden until John Wooden's passing.
John a very humble man, lived in a very Bill Plashky.
The La Times wrote about it today that Walton would
call him a couple of times a week, and he
called him on his nineteen ninetieth birthday and Plashky was
there and John Wooden said, you know, I don't do
(26:05):
much of the talking, but Bill calls regularly, and he goes.
You know, there's no more enjoyable phone call I get
than a couple of times a week from Bill Walton.
But when he got to UCLA, Walton wouldn't cut his hair,
and so he said, coach, very iconic plastic, I'm not
going to cut my hair. And John Wooden said, well,
we'll miss you. So Bill got in his bicycle and
(26:27):
bicycle across campus to a barber, but we lost. I
went and looked at I went to watch YouTube highlights
of Bill Walton. Today, I went back and I do
this when somebody passes. Could be you know Glenn Fry
the Eagles, or you know anybody in sports and Bill
today I sat there before the Celtics game for about
thirty minutes and I went back and watched some college
(26:47):
stuff and then his blazer stuff. And for a kid
from the Northwest, Bill was really special. I want to
talk a little bit about something that makes being an
nbagm very difficult. It's very unique to the culture. So
(27:08):
in football, most of your star players and almost all
players Jason get in line with the coach, the culture,
the system. There's not a lot of pushback. It's very
It's not an independent sport. I mean even Brandon IU
will go erase his social media stuff, but he's a Niner.
He wants to be a Niner. And the NBA is different.
(27:31):
And there were almost no offers for Kyrie Irving out
of Brooklyn. He was talks at it. It was February fifth,
twenty was at twenty three no offers. So I mean Brooklyn,
you had the vaccine situation. But this is why Kawhi
got a big contract, Jimmy Butler, who had bounced around
(27:52):
in Miami. This is why Kyrie is going to get one.
Because if you can get that player that's transcended and
you just get him in the right frame of mind,
you get trophies and it's as great as the basketball
talent is. Man, Jason, there's like eight players in the
(28:13):
planet that are just different. And I'm watching Kyrie and
Traffic and I'm like, I don't there's no comp I
don't even.
Speaker 2 (28:20):
Know what that is.
Speaker 1 (28:21):
He's better than Isaiah offensively, he doesn't shoot like Steph,
but he's better around the rim and traffic, he's better
with his left hand. I mean, like when they made
the move, I said, you got to get Luca somebody,
you know, and nobody wants to give you a great player.
(28:43):
You're gonna have to swing because nobody's gonna say, oh,
they've got Luca, let's give him another great player, or
you're done. What was your initial thought when they got Kyrie?
Speaker 2 (28:53):
I loved the deal.
Speaker 3 (28:55):
I you know. One of the things that really bothers
me about the way that deal has looked back at
as like super risky and like, don't get me wrong,
there was a certain element of risk and I loved you.
I loved your opening. I think it was your open
on the Herd today where you mentioned like pat Riley
getting Jimmy Butler. It's like, yeah, that was a dude
who is mercurial and was like gotten fights with players
at practice and it was obviously like a very weird
(29:16):
type of ego. And he's been amazing in Miami. Lebron
James is a guy like if he did leave the
Lakers this summer, which I don't believe you do, but
there's been he will, but there's been some reports like
the maybe Phoenix is interested, maybe Philadelphia is interested. You
don't think if you signed Lebron James at a veteran minimum,
it's going to come with a lot of additional stuff
like media, like a lot of like a just drama
(29:37):
over the course of the season, just by virtue of
his star power. That's like part of the risk is
just bringing in that type of like real big personality
into a locker room.
Speaker 1 (29:46):
Right.
Speaker 3 (29:47):
The part that bothers me about the way the Kyrie
thing was looked back at is it made so much
sense to me at the time because of why he
was requesting a trade. He wasn't requesting a trade because
he wanted to leave. He wasn't requesting a trade because
he just wanted a change of scenery. He was in
a contract year and Sean Marks wasn't going to give
(30:07):
him a new deal, so he was heavily incentivized to
go into his next situation and bring his a game
both on the court and off the court. It was like,
if there was a time to buy Kyrie, that was
the time to buy Kyrie. It made a ton of
sense and like and honestly, looking back at it, I
remember saying this at the time.
Speaker 2 (30:27):
Loved the deal.
Speaker 3 (30:29):
They just needed to nail some stuff after the fact,
and they did. They went to the summer, they got
the sign and trade for Grant Williams, which ended up
being a vehicle for them to use at this year's
trade deadline. They got Derek Lively, who has been I mean,
we're underselling him on this show. He's he's arguably better
than Gafford's He's a better passer on the role, he's
(30:49):
a better defensive player, like, he's an incredible player. And
then obviously Daniel Gafford in the deal.
Speaker 2 (30:54):
PJ.
Speaker 3 (30:54):
Washington and the deal, we talked about the veteran minimum
signing of Derek Jones Junior. He's probably the best veteran
minimum signing that any team has made in the league
this year. Like they nailed the stuff on the margins
after the fact and tied it all together. And what
it really comes down to is this, and this is
why the risk, why I love the risk when you
have real superstars that can do the really hard stuff
(31:16):
to replicate. Like to your point about TJ McConnell, love
TJ McConnell, played with them, played against him a few
times at Arizona. He legitimately is like like an awesome competitor,
a dude that's really fun to watch, but yeah, he's
not going to be able to get a bucket against
a really locked in Celtics defense, right, Like the really
difficult to replicate stuff Hyrie can do. Right, So then
(31:39):
you can you can by virtue having Luca and having Kyrie.
You can then go get players that are specialists, and
specialists are easier to find at discount and from there
you can build out a roster that where it's like, hey,
I don't need you to, you know, come off of
this dribble handoff and make decisions in the lane the
way that KCP does for the Nuggets. I just need
(32:01):
you to guard Anthony Edwards and go stand in the corner.
And the only way you have the ability to do
that is if you give Luca a legitimate secondary shot creator.
It made a ton of sense that he would. He
obviously got dragged through the mud for good reason. He
got dragged through the mud there for a couple of
years in Brooklyn. Wasn't just the COVID stuff either. He
was like ghosting on Steve Nash without telling him, Like
(32:24):
he just go celebrate his sister's birthday for a week
and like just leave the team. Like he was bad.
He did a really bad job. But he had learned
behind the scenes that he would pay the price by
virtue of him not getting a new deal from Brooklyn.
So that was the best time to buy. I thought
Mark Cuban made the right risk there, and they've nailed
everything since then and the rest is history. I mean,
here they are, They're going to be in the NBA Finals.
Speaker 1 (32:45):
I've wondered for years why Dallas isn't a greater destination
or a more alluring destination for free agents. Never have
a five hour flight. If you play there, you're right
in the middle of the country. I mean, if you're
playing in the Pacific northwest of the West, you got
five six hour flights all the time. It's a winter league.
(33:05):
It's not Phoenix for Miami, but it's you know, it's doable.
Winter weather, forty degrees forty eight to fifty two when
you land, no state tax, beautiful women everywhere. I always
Somebody once suggested that Mark Cuban was such a prominent
star as an owner that he could take some of
(33:28):
the appeal off star players that Europeans didn't mind that,
you know, European Dirk and Luca, they don't want the press.
But sometimes an agent wouldn't send his domestic star to
Dallas because Cuban is such a star. Plus it's a
cowboy town. So people have suggested, you know. But I
sometimes I'll watch pro athletes and they'll you know, like
(33:48):
when Justin Field says I want to play for the Steelers,
and I'm like, you already had a defensive coach. You
don't want another one. You're going to be a backup
to Russell Wilson, that's not where you want to go.
Kirk Cousins goes, I want to go play for Atlanta
because it's got a great line, offensive weapons and a
crappy division. And I look at some of these players
and where they go, and I'm like, why don't more
guys go to Dallas. I do feel like most European
(34:10):
players we've talked about this Jason would rather be loyal,
Like they just rather stay and not. They don't want
to bounce around the league, you know. I mean they
it's almost like they feel like they want that one.
They love their homeland. These guys are on a golf
stream the second the championship parades over seasons and they
(34:31):
and they just want a second home and that's where
they get drafted. They don't they don't want to beat
They've those those guys bounce around Europe. I mean, Europeans
travel because of their training system. They travel more than
we do. Those guys bounce around their country. That's that's
what they know. They come over here. They want to
keep it simple. They want to play in San Antonio, Dallas, uson.
They don't want to bounce around, so I you know,
(34:53):
for Dirk. I felt like there was so much disappointment
until he finally got it. It's if Luke, if Luca
can win a title, boy, Dallas could be really good
for a long time. I think there's a lot of
guys because you know what, sometimes it just takes a catalyst.
(35:15):
I mean, Jokic. Now you look at Denver, this football market,
this hockey mark whatever, it's like, oh no, it's gonna
be for a decade of basketball market and it takes
certain players that you know, whether it's the Georgetown hoyas
with John Thompson. Sometimes in college the coach is the catalyst.
But I mean, would you sign Kyrie if if if
(35:38):
you had to sign Kyrie to way, has he signed
an extension.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
Or I think he has like two years left on
That's what I.
Speaker 1 (35:47):
Think it is. But my takeaway is if you had
to sign him, would you extend him for three and
four years?
Speaker 3 (35:55):
So he he has a player option after next season,
so they have him locked up for additional season, And like,
I mean, here's the thing. It all depends on his
level of play. Like right now, he's thirty two years old,
so it kind of just depends on whether or not
his body holds up over the course of the next season. Now,
my thing is, like you you find out pretty quickly
that the gap between a Kyrie Irving and then like
(36:15):
a league average replacement guard someone like Andrew Nemhard is
like a huge gap, and it's really hard to make
up for that, right, so you know, you know, my
thing is like you want to set yourself up for
you talked about being you said one of the easiest
ways to win is being a dynasty. And one of
the first things I thought when you said that is
like kind of like what Michael Malone was saying after
they lost to Minnesota, which is like you kind of
(36:38):
it's more about getting three and five or four and seven.
And what that means to me is like, sometimes you
catch a bad matchup, sometimes a guy gets hurt, like
Jamal Murray had a calf muscle issue this year, right,
So like sometimes there are just things that break your
way or don't break your way, Like, for instance, Dallas
didn't have to face Denver out of the Western Conference.
It's very possible that if they ran into Denver they
could have lost that a bad matchup, Yeah, exactly, and
(37:02):
so so so Honestly, the way the way I look
at it, like you just want to make sure that
you're in the mix multiple years in a row because
something might break your way, and like if it breaks
your way, all of a sudden, you're in the dance.
Speaker 2 (37:14):
Right.
Speaker 3 (37:14):
So, like, again the way I look at it, I
think they'll obviously retain him, just simply because you could
trade him at that point if you wanted to, Like
if Kyrie, if you sign him for a two plus
one and then he's like, you know, halfway through the
first year, he's either declining a little bit or maybe
Luca gets hurt or something like, you can pivot. It's
(37:35):
in my opinion, it always makes more sense to retain
the star because you can trade the star. Like every
once in a while, someone screws up, Like look at
zach Levine. Zach Lavine makes too much money, He's not
good enough, nobody wants him, right, and it's just it's
and zach Lvine's an interesting player, he just makes so
much money that no team would be willing to sacrifice
what it takes to bring him in, right. But like
(37:57):
every time there's a star that needs to get traded,
just find a way to trade him. And so when
push comes to Shob, I think he'll end up just
re upping and then maybe getting traded to a certain
destination when the timing's right.
Speaker 1 (38:16):
I think it's going to be an interesting off season.
I think Paul George is fascinating to me. I think
he could make Philadelphia really a handful, and I think
he works in New York. I just don't think he
wants it. I think that, you know, Balmer's the richest
or second richest owner in the sport. He's opening his
new arena. He's not letting guys go. And Paul George.
(38:40):
I mean, first of all, you have to be in
alpha to be an NBA player. Largely, even Jason Tatum
or Anthony Davis, they may not be, you know, like
the supreme Alpha, but these guys are driven, competitive as hell.
I if you had to predict one big move, gods,
Paul George is gonna stay. You know. Here's the other thing.
(39:04):
I think Golden State is now kind of understands Joe
Lacob's one of the wealthier owners. I think they sort
of understand like this, we tried to bridge old and new,
and they're not going to bring Chris Paul back. Probably
his name's getting bounced around. I think the Warriors are
going to be a big player somewhere. I think we're
concentrating on Philly and New York, and I understand that
(39:27):
it's just a much easier avenue to get to the
conference finals. In the finals, like, there's no disputing that. God,
how good is the West going to be next year?
But I think Golden State full of smart people. Jason
looks at okay See, looks at Denver, looks at Dallas.
It's like, come on, we're not even close. Like you said,
(39:48):
there's a big gap between a Kyri Paul George and
your average good wing defender. Paul can really dial it up.
So I think teams like Golden State are like, right now,
you know, we're all fucking Klay Thompson, Chris Paul want
to do. I think they're going to take a huge swing.
That's my get. Maybe it's Karl Anthony Towns. What do
you think?
Speaker 2 (40:08):
I think so too.
Speaker 3 (40:09):
I think Dallas is the perfect example of why you
should take a really big swing. I was actually talking
about this with a buddy of mine, sam As Fondirio,
covers the Warriors, and like I was talking about it,
with him this morning, Like Dallas is the perfect example
of why you look at your current situation with Steph
Curry and you go, wait, if we bring him a
second star and we hit like one or two moves
(40:30):
on the margins, we could be right back in this thing.
But Dallas missed the playoffs last year, like they literally
missed a ten team playoff field. And it's the same
two stars. They just made a couple of tweaks with
specific role players. As long as your two stars work.
Now to your point, there's a lot of fun stuff
to talk about this summer, like Paul George potentially going somewhere,
(40:50):
Like I would be lying if I didn't think it'd
be fun, even though I don't think it'll happen. To
see a Lebron James go to Phoenix and play alongside
Kevin Durant, Bradley be Old, Devin Booker, those sorts of things.
I think this is going to be the summer of
the move of the Tier two stars. So like I
think you'll see a Darius Garland move somewhere. I'd love
to see Darius Garland in San Antonio with Webbin Yama.
I think that'd be super fascinating. I think you'll see
(41:11):
a Dejonte Murray get moved. De Jontay Murray's a guy
who I think would make Golden State a really fascinating
team if you gave Steph a real athletic backcourt shot
creator next to him, that would fit I think really
well in their five out attack, the way that they
the way that they go. I think you'll see a
Mikhale Bridges get pulled into a like McHale Bridge is
a guy that you might see with the New York Knicks,
(41:33):
you might see get moved to one of these teams.
And so I think it's going to be the Tier
two guys that move. But again, if you don't think
about them as like real needle movers, think about them
as guys that would offer support to existing Tier one stars.
It's not de Jontey Murray in a vacuum, It's is
Jana Murray next to Steph Curry. It's not you know,
Darius Garland in a vacuum. It's Terius Garland next to
(41:53):
Victor Webbin Yama. It's those are the types of moves
that I think could have sizeable impact. Kyrie is a
big name, and Kyrie has a lot of like star
power behind him. But like, Kyrie's not a guy that's
regarded as a top fifteen player in the league. He's
just in the perfect role for him right now, secondary
shot creator on a team where they have somebody that
(42:14):
can guard. He doesn't have to guard the other team's
best guard. He doesn't even have to be the guy
that runs the offense for the majority of the game.
He can play off of Luca. And how often have
we seen Kyrie in this playoff run like chill for
three quarters and then come in to start the fourth
quarter and be like, all right, let's go, I'm going
to attack this game. So like again, I think that
those kinds of moves they can there's a tendency to
(42:34):
always be like does that really move the needle? Does
that really move the needle? I see that so differently.
Like to me, basketball is more art than science. It's
not about nolating talent points. It's not about accumulating talent
points and like, oh, we hit the magic score of
we have enough talent on the roster. It's like, no,
you have responsibilities your team needs to fulfill on the court.
And if you bring in a really good player, that
(42:55):
can take a bunch of those responsibilities. It even takes
your other role players and makes them play better because
now they don't need to do as much. You know,
like it to me, to me like that, that sort
of thing. A lot of people overthink that. It's like,
that's why I'm a big believer. And you're in the
thing that.
Speaker 2 (43:10):
You always preach, which is like, take those risks. If
you're close, take the risk.
Speaker 3 (43:14):
Dallas put it all on the line this year, yep,
by trading that first round draft pick at the deadline.
They have all of their eggs in this basket. And
you know what, it might have failed. Maybe PJ. Washington
doesn't get that foul call on the corner three. Maybe
you head back to Oklahoma City for Game seven and
you lose in Okay, see advances, and then everyone calls
you idiots, right, but no, that's not what happened. And
(43:36):
here they're going to go to the NBA Finals, And
so I love it. I wish more teams would do
that sort of thing.
Speaker 1 (43:40):
Yeah, I think it's I think it's hard sometimes where
you know, taking big swings. First of all, you have
to be built for it. You have to be like
Miami can do it because of their history and their legacy,
you know, for the Mavericks to do it. Mark Cuban,
(44:03):
you know, is moves out, so you have new ownership,
you have a relatively new front office. Luca's kind of
a new star. Dallas deserves a lot of credit to
just say we're just we're gonna take some big swings here.
But I also think there is an advantage because when
you're in a market with the Dallas Cowboys, even the
Texas Rangers and Sark and the Texas Longhorns, you know,
(44:26):
Dallas stars now are good. I do think there's something
to be said about competitive markets. I think over the
course of my life, I've watched New York teams sometimes
be too aggressive to keep up with the Yankees of
the Giants, right, like too aggressive. And I think Dallas
the advantage to being the Mavericks is when we make
little mistakes, people don't pay attention to them. They pay
(44:48):
attention to the cowboys.
Speaker 2 (44:50):
Right.
Speaker 1 (44:50):
That's a cowboy town. So you're allowed to be a
little bit under the radar in terms of national scope
and even local scope because you're in a cowboy It's
like being in Philadelphia. I mean, the Phillies are huge,
the Sixers are gigantic, the Eagles are big, right, Like
you're all sharing that, and I think I think Dallas,
(45:11):
you know, they had the Dirk title, Cuban made them
incredibly relevant. And not that it's easier to take swings,
but they you know, they weren't the Warriors, they weren't
the heat They they weren't the Lakers of the Celtics brand.
And so I think that they were really smart swings,
(45:32):
really smart thoughtful swings. And I think we all went
on that stuff. You know, I say this even in football.
The advantage in football if you take a big swing
and miss, like Russell Wilson, is the draft provides you
so many good players. I mean, like the story now
is Bonix is just crushing it for Denver. Okay, you
got the quarterbacks all one, one class, whereas you know
(45:54):
the NBA draft can give you lively to the Mavericks.
But you know he and he's been terrific. I went
and read his draft preview tonight as I'm watching the
game the other night, as I'm flying, I'm reading it
and I'm like, oh, it was gonna be a good
they said, good backup player. Nice little passer. I mean,
they really marginalized him to like a six minute a
game guy. And he comes in and he's a factor.
(46:16):
But it's harder to take sometimes chances in the NBA
because you don't get bailed out by the draft.
Speaker 2 (46:22):
You just don't.
Speaker 1 (46:23):
And so the guys deserve when you take these big swings,
These gms deserve credit. There is no safety net, you know,
Russell Wilson. It's a year later, we got one more
year a dead cap. We're done, all right, We're done.
And so I what Dallas did. Take some cajonas and
I think it and they've been rewarded. I just I
(46:45):
think swings for me create content and.
Speaker 2 (46:49):
I'm oh, for sure, so you love them?
Speaker 1 (46:52):
Yeah, so I just want swings. Any final thoughts, Let's
circle back to the Celtics Mavericks and that's what it'll
I'll say this again. The most fascinating part of it
is Tatum will sign a bigness. So Jalen Brown got
his money, Porzingis has his, Derek White has some, but
(47:12):
Jason Tatum's gonna sign his MAX when the season's over.
So you'll be fine if they don't want it this year.
For one more year's run. But if you lost to
Dallas this year, last year, next year would be so
pressurized for Boston, like this is it, Fellas, So I
(47:32):
kind of feel like you want to get it now,
not later, because once Tatum signs, it's like, Okay, guys,
this is it. We got no bench. You can forget
your bench. It's over, Connie, I'll circle back again. I
think that's the one thing about Boston. I could see
him getting really tight, really tight in this series.
Speaker 3 (47:53):
Well, and to your point, the as you get into
the future, there's also the second Apron rules that come
into effect too, where Boston could be very handicapped in
terms of what they're or handcuffed, I should say, in
terms of what they're allowed to do to do things
to supplement the roster, Like you can't even use the
taxpayer mid level exception when you're in the second Apron,
(48:14):
Like you can't even sign anybody unless it's a veteran
minimum contract over the summer. Like, there's a lot of
restrictions that come into play when you have that type
of salary on your roster.
Speaker 2 (48:24):
I think like the big key to watch.
Speaker 3 (48:26):
Is Jason Tatum, Like if they lose and it's a
competitive six to seven game series and you feel like
Tatum goes toe to toe with Luca, Yeah, you're fine.
But the one, the one thing that I think would
actually be real crisis for Boston is what if they
go in and they lose in games in the NBA
Finals in Tatum's bad because if that happens, it's like, oh, wait,
(48:50):
this whole construct is flawed because our best guy can't
go toe to toe with the other best guys. That
would be that would be the catastrophe. And because at
this point, it's like, man, we are two whole years
removed from that Steph Curry incident in twenty twenty two
when he was amazing for three rounds and then just
completely fell apart in the NBA Finals, right, And so like,
(49:12):
I think that's the one thing that would that would
cause me to like really press the panic button if
I was Boston. But even if they lost, if Tatum
can looks like he kind of met the level and
kind of met the moment, then it's like, man, next year,
we're definitely going to get it done. Like that, that's
where you start to feel really confident. And by the way,
you know Tatum has been frustrating offensively in this playoff run,
(49:32):
but we do not talk nearly enough about what an
impactful defensive athlete he is.
Speaker 2 (49:38):
He's big, he's strong, he's master the most of the guys.
Speaker 3 (49:41):
He's long, he can he can guard centers, he could,
Like it's so funny watching how like anytime anybody tries
to isolate or do something against Tatum on an island,
it's just hopeless, Like he just swallows him up because
he's And I'm really really excited. That's one of the
biggest things I'm looking forward to in the next series
is like how many times are they going to watch
Luca you know, Bully Drew Holliday, Bully Derek White, Bully
(50:02):
Jalen Brown before you know. Joe Mizoula goes like, all right,
Jason Tatum, you're guarding you, and I really want to
see that specific matchup. But like, yeah, I'm I'm more
on the patient route with Boston because they are still
so much younger than people think. Like Tatum is, what
is he twenty six now, He's barely getting He's barely
entering in the phase where we expect great players to win.
Speaker 2 (50:23):
He's barely there.
Speaker 1 (50:24):
Think about let's just rank the top ten players in
this final mab Celtics. So Luca one, Tatum two.
Speaker 2 (50:32):
Yes, I'd probably go Jalen Brown, Right, what about you?
Speaker 1 (50:37):
I think just a sturdier athlete, a little bit more consistent.
I would probably go Kyrie four.
Speaker 2 (50:44):
Mm hmm.
Speaker 1 (50:45):
I mean because of Porzingis's health, God, do I go
Derek White?
Speaker 2 (50:51):
Jesus Derek. I'd go Derek White five.
Speaker 1 (50:54):
Okay, Derek White five. If Porzingis is healthy, I'd go Porzingis.
Speaker 2 (50:58):
Six, Drewe Holliday's probably seven.
Speaker 1 (51:02):
Seven. Then I go PJ Washington.
Speaker 2 (51:06):
Yeah, yeah, probably probably PJ Washington.
Speaker 1 (51:09):
Okay, so that's eight.
Speaker 3 (51:11):
Gaff I go Lively Probably, I think Lively. I think
Lively is a better defensive player and a better passer
than Gafford. Gafford's really good and he gets slandered, but
I think Lively is a little better than him.
Speaker 1 (51:21):
Okay, And who's our tenth best player?
Speaker 3 (51:25):
You probably go? Like you probably go I Horford's got
to be somewhere in there. Like Horford hits six or
seven threes.
Speaker 2 (51:34):
The other night.
Speaker 1 (51:35):
If you give him that corner, three, dude, he finds himself.
Like you can say what you want about Al Horford,
He's had a more than redeemable career, really good veteran,
hits open shots, tends to play above his weight in
big spots, like never an anxiety player, like he's always
ready to play. Sometimes with say Akham, he's just not
(51:56):
quick enough, like you can get eaten up with him sometimes.
But that's a lot of talent we had to get
to like eight or nine, So I mean it's it's
I mean one of the things Dallas doesn't deal with
is getting all. They don't have a lot of bad
half court offensive possessions like Minnesota does, Like they're just
awful looking. Indiana's got some clunky ones, Boston doesn't, and
(52:19):
Dallas doesn't. It will be aesthetically a really attractive series.
It will be like fun, good ball movement great. I
mean the degree of difficulty with Luca's insane. I mean
he hit shot because you know he's not a big jumper,
he's not twitchy fast, so almost everything he's dealing with
a hand in his face. He is the great tough
(52:41):
always said Phil Mickelson was the great tough shot maker
in golf. Lucas the great tough shot maker. He makes
more things. He even turns to the sometimes the wrong side,
and he'll shoot a following and I'm like, God, why
did you make that so hard? It's a fourteen footer.
I think it's going to be aesthetically a lot like
the Warrior Celtics series, where you can't take your eyes
(53:03):
off it. It's just really good.
Speaker 3 (53:04):
Oh yeah, yeah, you know Luca, Luca's I did a
film session on him this morning because the end of
that game I thought was super fascinating.
Speaker 2 (53:13):
How like it was one o four, one oh four, and.
Speaker 3 (53:16):
I don't think anybody thought Minnesota was going to win
that game, you know, And it starts with a big
mistake Anthony Edwards leadst PJ Washington wide open in the corner.
It's a three. It's one oh seven to one to four.
But from there, down the stretch of the game, Luca
and Kyrie made three tough, contested pull up jump shots.
Minnesota didn't get a bucket until Anthony Edwards had this
like this like garbage time layup. But I want to
(53:39):
just zero in really quickly on the Lucas shot over
Jada McDaniels. It was the last shot he hit because
he had a fade away over Nasried and then he
hit one over Jade McDaniels and Jada McDaniels. By the way,
I think he's the best perimeter defender in the league.
He doesn't match up well with Luca because he's not
very strong, but in terms of all the little things
that make a perimeter defender great, I think he's got
the full package, and he Luca hits this, like you said,
(54:01):
a funky kind of release. He hit a shot in
the first half against Nikile Alexander Walker where he did
awkward kind of reverse footwork where he took like a
leaning forward kind of floating jump shot in the lane.
He faked that shot against Jaden on that final possession,
and Jayden left his feet and got out a position,
and then Luca immediately spun out of it over his
(54:23):
right shoulder into a fade away and barely got.
Speaker 2 (54:26):
It off and hit it.
Speaker 3 (54:27):
And I was literally sitting there thinking like he's going
against the best defender in the world, the best perimeter
defender in my opinion, and he literally has to get
a shot off in this situation, and he actually gets
him to leave his feet and it's just enough to
barely get the shot. It's like literally a game of inches,
and it was based on a fake. I went through
my film session today and I showed the shot that
(54:47):
he takes, and then I showed the fake, and then
I went into the shot that he took, and I
was like, this guy is He is the most improvisational
shot maker I've ever seen. He can tweak the angle.
He hit a step back three over Karl Anthony in
the right corner in the fourth quarter where he jab
stepped and went a step back. Carl Towns almost blocked it.
So he just shot it way up in the air,
(55:08):
just shot a moon ball and it just went way
up in the air and it came down And I
was like, so he just tweaked his whole release and
changed the geometry of his shot to get this shot.
Speaker 2 (55:17):
Off and it went in. Like he is the most
creative and audacious.
Speaker 3 (55:21):
Basketball player I can't remember watching like Like, I don't
love everything about Luca. He can complain sometimes I hate
the way he talks to the refs all the time. Like,
there are some things with Luca that drive me crazy.
But as a basketball fan, the shot making is it's
like art. It's like art with Luca it's so much
fun to watch.
Speaker 1 (55:37):
Yeah, I always felt Kobe didn't have as many stock
moves as Michael and Kobe went down and the canvas
was pretty bare sometimes, and you know, you spill a
lot of paint. There were some bad Kobe stretches, whereas
Michael always went back to two or three like standard
mid range moves, which he just owned. And Kobe is
willing to be a little bit more of an artist.
He had spots on the floor he like, but and
(55:57):
so does Luca. All great basketball players have bots and
comfort levels. But Jesus, there's just nothing like him in
the planet. There's just nothing like Luca. All right, Jason
timp hoops tonight. Can't wait. I think we're gonna have Sorry, Minnesota,
we're already counting you out, but I think it's gonna
be I think it's gonna be one of the most dramatic,
pressurized finals and one of the most beautiful offensive finals
(56:21):
we've seen in a long time. Good stuff.
Speaker 2 (56:24):
Totally agree, can't wait. It's gonna be fun.
Speaker 1 (56:26):
See you man the volume. Thanks so much for listening.
If you've enjoyed the podcast, take a moment rate and
review
The volume. All right, Jason timp is going to stop
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to talk about tonight. Jason timpf hoops tonight, mercifully, the
(01:07):
series is over. Derek White, big corner. Three Pacers don't
get an offensive bucket last three and a half minutes
of the game. Yes, I thought they were throwing up
some crap in the fourth quarter. Yes, I think the
Pacers are a good young team that I'm not sure
would win a playoff series in the West. I'm not
sure if they would. It is what it is. You know,
(01:30):
sports predictions are fun. I've I've been wrong on the
Dallas Mavericks all year. So I'm just I thought okay
See was gonna beat him. I thought Minnesota would beat
him in seven. I mean, you know, once they got
you know, Gafford, PJ. Washington, They're a different team. Kyrie's
playing real defense. But I've been wrong on that. This
is the easiest sports prediction in the last year. Celtics
(01:50):
make the finals, then you throw in the injuries. I
don't know what to make of Indiana. I you know,
TJ McConnell. You know they've got Pascal Siakam I've liked forever,
but I kind of felt like this is one of
those games where I appreciate the effort by Rick Carlisle,
but I wanted the series to end, and I try
not to root.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
I just wanted this series to end.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
Am I a bad guy?
Speaker 3 (02:17):
Though we did not need a Game five of Pacer Celtics,
one of the things that's really fascinating to me about
that particular series is like Boston was capable at any
moment of strangling their offense the way they did over
the final few minutes Indiana and the credit to Rick Carlisle.
They have crazy ball in player movement. They'll get five
interchanges within like ten seconds, and Boston switches a lot,
(02:39):
so like when they're not really engaged, they botch switches
and guys will bank open and someone will just end
up breaking open right underneath the basket. But anytime they
actually communicate and put in the requisite effort, they're actually
I don't know if you remember college, you remember that
twenty twenty two Celtics team, the team that made the finals.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
Yeah, they were like they played hard.
Speaker 3 (02:57):
On defense every single night, and it was scary how
good Jalen Brown, Jason Tatum, Marcus Smart, and Derek White
could be when they were really engaged defensively. And like, honestly,
we talk so much about the offensive end with Boston,
and they certainly have some frustrating things on that end
of the floor, but when they really lock in defensively,
they have four awesome versatile defenders. Derek White and then
(03:21):
they can. Yeah, they can strangle the life out of
teams when they really want to. Now, the question is
do they have the habits tied in tightly enough to
beat a really good team from the West. We're gonna
find out. But yeah, like that that that punch for
them has always been there. They just don't throw it
as often as they need to.
Speaker 1 (03:36):
Yeah, And you know, Jalen Brunson now has a big contract.
Porzingis Holiday Tatum. These are Richard dudes, you know they
they and they also know their big favorites. There is
talk that you can't flip a switch, but when I
think there's a disparity between teams, like I think Boston
will be much more engaged in the in the finals. Also,
(03:57):
I think the last game of the NBA Finals is
scheduled for like, you know, late June. I don't know
what they're gonna do this. I mean, are they gonna
start the final Saturday night? If Dallas closes it out,
I mean, they may just get you. I look tonight,
I'm like, how are they gonna How are they gonna
stretch this out? That's baseball makes that mistake sometimes where
(04:19):
people get into these series and baseball is an everyday game,
and then you get into a playoff series and there's
three days off. Well, it's in the football season, it's October.
You lose me if you you know, if I want
to watch the Braves and the Dodgers in the NLCS,
you can't go three days off, you lose me. So
I don't know what the NBA is gonna do with
their final schedule, but I do think Boston's a team.
This is a team. Now you go Marcus Martin, Drew Holiday,
(04:41):
you know, a little more of a legacy player. Porzingis
has made some big time money, been viewed as a unicorn,
a star. So I think it's hard when these guys
look at Indiana and they're like, they're terrible defensively, they're
awfully young. They probably wouldn't be here without some injuries
to the Knicks. So I think, you know, I was
thinking about this, Jason. The two easiest ways to win
(05:04):
a championship it is to be part of a dynasty.
Those are hard to construct, but once you have it,
you have lots of players, usually a great coach. You know,
dynasties get rolling, play with confidence. So you know, once
you win your first or second with the Bulls. The
third feels like it's easier. The second way is as
an underdog that comes out of nowhere with no pressure.
(05:26):
Dirk and the Mavericks over the heat. The hardest way
to win a championship is when you don't have one yet.
We're expecting one for years and you go in as
a favorite and I look at this Boston team, Dallas,
I'm thinking it, and we just put this thing together.
We just shovel the cards through it on the table.
I think Boston is going to have a lot of
(05:47):
pressure in the finals. What say you.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
There's gonna be a lot of pressure, and they're not
gonna in all likelihood, Luca is the best player going
into that series too, which is another interesting element. You know,
one of the things one of the biggest lessons I've
learned from this Dallas Minnesota series is that we got
to stop looking at the championship picture within the context
of individual teams, but rather look at it through matchups.
(06:11):
Because you go out of the second round and you're like, oh, man, Minnesota,
look at what they did to Denver. They have everyone's number. Clearly,
they're the best team in the league, and it's like, well,
actually they have a very specific weakness, which is rim protection,
because Anthony Edwards loves to get downhill and attack the rim. Right,
you go against Denver who can't protect the rim, and
you go against Phoenix with Usuf Nurkic who can't protect
(06:32):
the rim, and it's just slicing and dice in them
all series long. All of a sudden, Dallas has a
freaky athlete and Derek Jones Junior to put on the
ball in an elite couple of rim protectors, and Derek
Lively and Daniel Gafford, and they look flummoxed. They look
like they don't know what to do when the game
really slows down. And so I have to kind of
take that into the finals as well. And as we
look into the finals, you know, if it ends up
(06:54):
being Dallas Boston, you know Luke is going to be
the best player in the series. One of the biggest
issues for Boston and it's a big part of why
Indiana scored on them as effectively as they did. Boston
has been the worst pick and roll defense in the
playoffs to this point, and a lot of that has
to do with Porzingis being out. But what do we
know that Luca's gonna do. Lucas gonna pick on Al
(07:15):
Horford every single opportunity he gets, just like you're seeing
Indiana do so often over the course of this series,
picking on him whenever they have an opportunity to opportunity
to in ball screens. And so, honestly, like there's a
lot of advantages that Dallas brings to the table. That said,
Boston does just have a ton of talent, and they
have one specific thing that I think is super fascinating.
(07:36):
Jason Tatum is one of the few athletes in the
league who's actually big and strong enough to cause some
issues for Luca, And so I think that's kind of
an interesting matchup piece going into that series. And so like,
don't I don't necessarily think that Boston's talent or Dallas
having survived the West means anything. We got to look
(07:57):
at this in a vacuum, and Boston has a lot
of advantages, Dallas has a lot of advantages. It's going
to be really interesting to get to dig into. But
you're right, Boston is going to go into that series
a substantial favorite. I think we're over I think right
now on DraftKings are already something like minus two to
twenty to win the title. There's a ton of pressure. Again,
if Jason Tatum does get badly outplayed by Luca in
(08:17):
that series, after what happened with Stephan twenty twenty two,
that would be a disaster. So I do think pressure
will play a role. But I think Boston being at
home to start helps, and the big time off helps
a lot too. Because you were talking about the final schedule,
it's set. They're not playing Game one till June sixth,
So if Dallas wins tomorrow is going to six Yeah,
(08:38):
there's going to be eight consecutive days off if dat
Dallas wins tomorrow. A couple of things there. Luca's got
a bad knee, that's really good for his knee. Chris
hops porzingis a little bit extra time to get back
from that calf injury. So we could be seeing very
different versions of both of these teams when we get
to that point. You know, for what could have been
of much more entertaining conference finals, Dallas Boston feels like
a pretty damn good NBA Finals. You excited about that?
Speaker 1 (09:01):
No, I think I said this today on FS one.
I worked today and I said this is as good
as it gets. I have a huge brand in the
Celtics with two stars who have played together for years,
so people know the story. I've got Mark Cuban and
Dirk Novitsky made the Mavericks. They punch above their weight.
That's a real brand. It's not the Lakers rorior Celtics,
(09:23):
but it's a real brand. You have two stars, one
of them controversial Kyrie Irving, you have the Boston Kyrie factor.
You have the pressure on the Celtics to finally come on. Guys,
you've been to a final, so you're going to have
a favorite. This is as good as the NBA can do.
I mean, I love watching Denver play, but I don't
(09:43):
think they break through nationally. I don't think Minnesota does.
I don't think Oh Casey does. I think the Knicks
will if they could get a Paul George or one
more highly effective wing player. But this is really good.
There's I think it's going to be a great final.
I didn't know. I was just sitting here looking to
so you're right, that is right, June.
Speaker 2 (10:02):
Isn't that crazy? That's a long break? I mean, you're
that's a whole playoff series.
Speaker 1 (10:07):
Well, you're lucky that, you know, because baseball's had long
breaks and it's just a killer in October because there's
a college football or pro football. I mean, Fox is
now running college football games on Friday. You just can't
do that in football season. You can do it now.
It's funny. My takeaway, I said this on the air today.
If Porzingis plays, I like Boston barely, but I do
(10:29):
think I'll tell you a series it reminds me of
two thousand Blazers Lakers, the Celtics of the Blazers. Blazers
had our Vetus, Steve Smith and Scottie Pippin and Ponzi
Wells and David Stodameier Rashid Wallace. They had more quality
players than the Lakers did. The Lakers had Kobe and Shack,
(10:49):
and it really experienced coach. Multiple times in that series.
The Blazers gave them fits. Lakers couldn't stop Rashid Wallace.
There were multiple matchup issues for the Lakers, but they
had Shack and Kobe, and I kind of feel like
the league's never been this gifted offensively ever, that's never
(11:09):
looked like this, and increasingly in these series, you know,
it's just like who's going to get the shots. I mean,
Minnesota is the best defensive team in the league. People
were targeting Rudy Gobert. It's like, that's the best defensive player,
go after him. It's a different ballgame when you got
seven footers that have to come and defend the perimeter.
(11:32):
It's a different world. And I could just see this series.
You know, aggressive teams win. They went and got I
mean they first of all, they hired Nico Harrison from Nike,
then they get Kyrie, then the trade deadline. I mean
they took big swings and sports rewards. So there's an
aggressive culture with this team. And don't you feel a
(11:53):
little bit like Dallas, with Kyrie's temperament, feels like we
should take advantage of the opportunity we have this.
Speaker 2 (12:01):
This may not be in the oven long, right, Like
this might be one year.
Speaker 1 (12:05):
Well yeah, I mean, don't you think, Jason, there is
a sense with Dallas like let's get this. This is
the time. You know that Maverick dirt team, it was
a jumbalaya. It was it was a bunch of stuff
thrown together that the tarmac wasn't very long on it.
So I the more I think about this, I'm like, man,
(12:26):
it feels like seven and it feels like Luca's gonna
hit a shot. It really does. Like I just it's
so hard for me. I that Blazer Lakers series, I
felt six games, hell, I felt going into the fourth
quarter the Blazers were the better team in the series.
And then Kobe and Shaq do their thing, and do
you have a strong feeling either way?
Speaker 3 (12:46):
Yeah, So I find the dynamic to be super fascinating
in the sense that Boston is this super talented team.
They have four guys that make over thirty million, and
they all deserve to if they all are free agent tomorrow,
they all make over thirty million. And then Chris excuse me,
Derek White is the one guy who doesn't. He makes
like eighteen and if he was a free agent tomorrow,
(13:09):
he'd make thirty thirty five. He has a huge Yeah,
he's arguably their second or third best player. I'd say
probably their third best player, right, And so like they
have an absurd amount of talent, it's very equal opportunity.
We've joked on the show, it's like vibes. It's like
you take this possession, you take that possession. It's like
when they won Game three. It's like Drew Holliday just
decides to randomly attack Pascal Siakam at the end of
the game.
Speaker 1 (13:29):
Even Al Horford has nights. I mean, Al Horford could
drop twenty three, you'd never be shocked.
Speaker 3 (13:36):
Yeah, they look they almost look like a different version
of themselves every night, Whereas like Dallas, it's like every
single Dallas Mavericks basketball game I've watched since Luca got
drafted has looked more or less the same, you know
what I mean, Where it's like there's a corner three
point shooter, there's a corner three point shooter, there's a
lob threat, and then there's a guy on the opposite wing,
and then there's usually a secondary creator, whether it's Jalen
Brunt center, it's you know, Kyrie Irvinger, it's Spencer Dinwiddie, right,
(13:59):
and so like it's so what I find fascinating about
the build is like this to me, is the maximized
version of the Luca Dallas Mavericks construction. Right, You've got
Luca playing the best basketball he's ever played in his life.
You've got the best number two he's ever played with.
Kyry irving was playing the best basketball he's played in
a long time, right, and he's also defending at a
much higher level than he has in recent seasons. They've
(14:22):
got legitimate wing defenders. Derek Jones Junior was a veteran
minimum contract who's been one of the best perimeter guys
in the league. He's done an awesome job on Anthony
Edwards in this playoff series.
Speaker 2 (14:31):
PJ.
Speaker 3 (14:32):
Washington has been super valuable, valuable for them in all
three rounds. And then they've got two vertical spacers, right
and so in Gafford and Lively, and both of them
have been big time defensive threats for them at various
points during the season.
Speaker 2 (14:44):
And so what I.
Speaker 3 (14:45):
Find fascinating is it's very much like a star driven
construct with guys playing super focused roles. Guard the other
team's best player, hit a corner three, you know, protect
the rim, screen, and roll hard with Luca like they
have super focused roles versus Boston, where it's like everyone's
(15:06):
kind of a Swiss Army knife doing something different on
any given night. Even defensively, they'll have Tatum gard to center,
They'll have Drew Holiday guard to center. They'll put Al
Horford on Pascal Siakam because that's an archetype he has
success with. So it's like, I find it really fascinating
that they're two very very different team constructs. That said, like,
one of the things that I worry about for Dallas
in the series is they have the ability to put
(15:27):
some more size and strength on Luca than Minnesota does.
What I found really interesting in the Thunder series, Lou Dort,
built like a linebacker, caused Lucas some problems. Jaden McDaniels,
a more highly regarded perimeter defender, is getting bullied by
Luca because he's skinny and gangly, and Luca can just
shove him off and get wherever he wants. Tatum's got
(15:48):
some real size and strength. Jaalen Brown is a more
strong and stout lower base than a guy like Jaden McDaniels.
Drew Holliday is a famous like fire truck built like
really low strong kind of base. So they have a
lot of big, strong bodies that throw at Luca. And
then the second piece of it is. One of the
big reasons why Minnesota's offense is struggling so bad in
this series is they're really struggling to get the ball
(16:09):
to the weak side, and Anthony Edwards is struggling to
dissect their defense with their aggressive coverages. Boston is awesome
at getting the ball moving around to shooters and like
they will get you in space. And one of the
things they did until Haliburton got hurt, they literally every
single time down the floor were targeting Haliburton every single time,
whether it was through Tatum and Brown, or Tatum and
(16:31):
Derek White, or whether it was through Jalen Brown and
Drew Holliday, they were attacking him every single time. They
will do the same to Luca and they will try
to wear him down, And so I would say that
I lean towards Boston as well. But I do believe
that this Dallas defense is really good and if they
can play Boston into some poor shooting performances, if a
guy like a PJ. Washington or a Derek Jones Junior
can have a similar effect on Tatum that some other
(16:54):
guys have had in the past, like Andrew Wiggins did
in the twenty twenty two finals, if they have some success,
I think they have a shot. But I would lean
Boston at this point.
Speaker 1 (17:03):
Yeah, I mean, even getting the kid out of Duke Lively,
who was viewed just you don't get many players at
a college basketball that can play not only in the NBA,
can play, but play for a really good team and
get minutes. So it's like they even Dallas even throws
that at you, where they get a college kid. Now,
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (17:19):
How much you know.
Speaker 1 (17:20):
Again, the finals are different, like it. It feels really different.
The finals even feel different than the conference finals. There's
much more at tension. I don't think Boston has played
with even they feel like they're playing about eighty percent.
Like this game was a great example where I'm like, God,
if I have to have another TJ McConnell shot, give
me a break. And I just felt like, okay, this
(17:42):
seven point lead is going to evaporate. And then all
of a sudden, you could just sense it was like, okay,
Boston started getting a couple of really nice defensive sets.
Then they hit Derek White from the corner and you're like, okay,
Boston really picked their spots to be engaged and they
were good enough. I don't think that's what we'll see.
I think they know, oh what they're in for, all right.
(18:04):
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Speaker 1 (19:56):
I was thinking so much today about Bill Walton, the
passing of the Great Bill Walton. So I grew up
in the Pacific Northwest. You know that, so the first
time I watched basketball was seventy two, seventy three. The
Lakers had Weston Goodrich, a very old Wilt. They were
very good back then, So I don't remember the Knicks
winning a championship. That was like seventy one seventy two.
(20:17):
I started watching TV in seventy two. I was like
seven eight years old, so I remember the old west
Goodrich Lakers, the seventy seven Blazers, the seventy six Sonics,
the Warriors in about seventy seven to seventy eight won
a title Washington with Elvin Hayes West Sunfield. But Bill
Walton really was for people your age, you're more of
(20:41):
a basketball encyclopedia, but he was. He was pre Jokic,
That's what he played like that. And I said this
today on Fox Sports that if Walton didn't have injuries,
I think there'd be a debate today he would be
in the debate for the second best center to Kareem
of all time. I feel that strongly he wouldn't have
been the score of Kareem. First of all, he's a
consensus three time player of the Year in college basketball,
(21:06):
not an All American. And remember in the era back then,
it was full of NBA guys. He was the consensus
Player of the Year three straight times, So there's that.
The second thing was that Portland team really was not
terribly talented offensively. It was a lot of Dave towards
it and Henry Steele and Maurice Lucas. So I mean,
(21:26):
to win was very much about Bill Walton. But I
thought one of the interesting things was that we've talked
about this before many it's surprising how often many of
the great players in basketball have such unique games. Now,
Kobe clearly copied a lot of Michael but generally nobody
(21:49):
played like Kareem Nobody played like George Gervin. There was
no pre bird to Bird. Lebron was a Swiss Army knife.
Magic was totally unique. Bill Waller was unique. There was
no Rvidas Sabonis there. He was the first player that
came out and would gladly. I mean, if the Blazers
would have had multiple great offensive players, he would have
(22:10):
been more robust and dynamic as a distributor. But Walton
and I remember watching him, the games weren't national. Remember
you only got like the finals national and that was
on tape delay, so you didn't get the regionalization. And
I lived I lived two hours between Seattle and Portland,
but we got Sonic games. So like, unless I went
to Portland or they were on this Sunday game with
(22:32):
CBS Brett Musberg, you didn't see Walton. So I only
probably saw him six to seven to eight times, most
of it against the Sixers in the finals. And I
just remember thinking the hair, the headband. I'm like, I've
never seen anything like that. Even as a kid, You're like,
what is that? You know he had this he almost
shot it like a guard, the way he had his
(22:53):
hands perven So there are certain things in life as
an old guy I wish young people could have seen.
I've said this before. I wish people in their twenties
understood how great boxing was forty years ago, how great
it was like the Super Bowl and and and when
Bill Walton passed, he touched so many lives. So many
(23:13):
of the feed things on the feedbacks today on the
internet were so touching. I think Bill Walton would have
been he would have worked today. He really is a
today player. There there's my take. He was. He was
forty to fifty years ahead of his time. A lot
of people are eight to ten years ahead of their time.
I honestly, I honestly think Walton was fifty years ahead
(23:35):
of his time. Who do you have a player that
you watched when you were eight nine years old that
literally is imprinted Doctor j and Bill Walton stand out
to me, you know.
Speaker 3 (23:47):
Lebron was always that for me when I was growing up.
And it's it's very interesting because the way you put it,
it's it kind of a piggybacks off what we talked
about last week in the sense that like all of
these all time creates, they're almost all weird.
Speaker 2 (23:57):
There's like a weird element to them.
Speaker 3 (23:59):
And I agree with you that Bill Walton I think
would have done really well in today's NBA because he
was that connective piece and so many NBA teams now
are running five out offense, which I'm not going to
get into it, but the gist of it is it
depends on a big guy that can make decisions, that
can set screens and read the floor. The balls in
the big guy's hands a lot in a lot of
these modern NBA offenses, right, And like you know, it's
(24:22):
funny though for me, Bill Walton, for everything mostly comes
down to what he was as a broadcaster, right, which
is weird. Yeah, yeah, what's so funny is ida buddy.
His name was Matt Quartek. He played at the University
of Arizona and I remember he was he registered there
one year and he played behind those awesome front lines
(24:44):
with like Aaron Gordon and Stanley Johnson and Caleb Tarzuski
and then but I remember he came off the bench
for those guys. He had a big game against Stanford
on the road, and I remember he gotta throw it
down big Man one time from Bill Walton on the call,
and like me and my buddies were ras at him
about that forever, because that's the dream, Like you got
Bill Walton talking about you'd being the big man dunkin
down the lane. Like he just was always iconic as
(25:05):
a broadcaster, and like he always just brought this insane
energy right uh, to to to the to that environment.
Even when you'd go to McHale Center, because I used
to go to a lot of University of Arizona games,
Like you'd sit up there and you'd actually see him
on the on the sideline and he stand out from
the crowd because.
Speaker 2 (25:20):
He's so damn tall.
Speaker 3 (25:21):
And he's like waving his arms and he's getting all active.
Speaker 1 (25:23):
And Jason, he also was ahead of his time. He
was very much against the Vietnam War. He was sit
ins on UCLA's campus like he was. We had some
track and field athletes that were socially conscious conscious. Bill
was one of the first outspoken athletes I can remember.
(25:43):
I there's a there's a great story about him. So
he was close to John Wooden until John Wooden's passing.
John a very humble man, lived in a very Bill Plashky.
The La Times wrote about it today that Walton would
call him a couple of times a week, and he
called him on his nineteen ninetieth birthday and Plashky was
there and John Wooden said, you know, I don't do
(26:05):
much of the talking, but Bill calls regularly, and he goes.
You know, there's no more enjoyable phone call I get
than a couple of times a week from Bill Walton.
But when he got to UCLA, Walton wouldn't cut his hair,
and so he said, coach, very iconic plastic, I'm not
going to cut my hair. And John Wooden said, well,
we'll miss you. So Bill got in his bicycle and
(26:27):
bicycle across campus to a barber, but we lost. I
went and looked at I went to watch YouTube highlights
of Bill Walton. Today, I went back and I do
this when somebody passes. Could be you know Glenn Fry
the Eagles, or you know anybody in sports and Bill
today I sat there before the Celtics game for about
thirty minutes and I went back and watched some college
(26:47):
stuff and then his blazer stuff. And for a kid
from the Northwest, Bill was really special. I want to
talk a little bit about something that makes being an
nbagm very difficult. It's very unique to the culture. So
(27:08):
in football, most of your star players and almost all
players Jason get in line with the coach, the culture,
the system. There's not a lot of pushback. It's very
It's not an independent sport. I mean even Brandon IU
will go erase his social media stuff, but he's a Niner.
He wants to be a Niner. And the NBA is different.
(27:31):
And there were almost no offers for Kyrie Irving out
of Brooklyn. He was talks at it. It was February fifth,
twenty was at twenty three no offers. So I mean Brooklyn,
you had the vaccine situation. But this is why Kawhi
got a big contract, Jimmy Butler, who had bounced around
(27:52):
in Miami. This is why Kyrie is going to get one.
Because if you can get that player that's transcended and
you just get him in the right frame of mind,
you get trophies and it's as great as the basketball
talent is. Man, Jason, there's like eight players in the
(28:13):
planet that are just different. And I'm watching Kyrie and
Traffic and I'm like, I don't there's no comp I
don't even.
Speaker 2 (28:20):
Know what that is.
Speaker 1 (28:21):
He's better than Isaiah offensively, he doesn't shoot like Steph,
but he's better around the rim and traffic, he's better
with his left hand. I mean, like when they made
the move, I said, you got to get Luca somebody,
you know, and nobody wants to give you a great player.
(28:43):
You're gonna have to swing because nobody's gonna say, oh,
they've got Luca, let's give him another great player, or
you're done. What was your initial thought when they got Kyrie?
Speaker 2 (28:53):
I loved the deal.
Speaker 3 (28:55):
I you know. One of the things that really bothers
me about the way that deal has looked back at
as like super risky and like, don't get me wrong,
there was a certain element of risk and I loved you.
I loved your opening. I think it was your open
on the Herd today where you mentioned like pat Riley
getting Jimmy Butler. It's like, yeah, that was a dude
who is mercurial and was like gotten fights with players
at practice and it was obviously like a very weird
(29:16):
type of ego. And he's been amazing in Miami. Lebron
James is a guy like if he did leave the
Lakers this summer, which I don't believe you do, but
there's been he will, but there's been some reports like
the maybe Phoenix is interested, maybe Philadelphia is interested. You
don't think if you signed Lebron James at a veteran minimum,
it's going to come with a lot of additional stuff
like media, like a lot of like a just drama
(29:37):
over the course of the season, just by virtue of
his star power. That's like part of the risk is
just bringing in that type of like real big personality
into a locker room.
Speaker 1 (29:46):
Right.
Speaker 3 (29:47):
The part that bothers me about the way the Kyrie
thing was looked back at is it made so much
sense to me at the time because of why he
was requesting a trade. He wasn't requesting a trade because
he wanted to leave. He wasn't requesting a trade because
he just wanted a change of scenery. He was in
a contract year and Sean Marks wasn't going to give
(30:07):
him a new deal, so he was heavily incentivized to
go into his next situation and bring his a game
both on the court and off the court. It was like,
if there was a time to buy Kyrie, that was
the time to buy Kyrie. It made a ton of
sense and like and honestly, looking back at it, I
remember saying this at the time.
Speaker 2 (30:27):
Loved the deal.
Speaker 3 (30:29):
They just needed to nail some stuff after the fact,
and they did. They went to the summer, they got
the sign and trade for Grant Williams, which ended up
being a vehicle for them to use at this year's
trade deadline. They got Derek Lively, who has been I mean,
we're underselling him on this show. He's he's arguably better
than Gafford's He's a better passer on the role, he's
(30:49):
a better defensive player, like, he's an incredible player. And
then obviously Daniel Gafford in the deal.
Speaker 2 (30:54):
PJ.
Speaker 3 (30:54):
Washington and the deal, we talked about the veteran minimum
signing of Derek Jones Junior. He's probably the best veteran
minimum signing that any team has made in the league
this year. Like they nailed the stuff on the margins
after the fact and tied it all together. And what
it really comes down to is this, and this is
why the risk, why I love the risk when you
have real superstars that can do the really hard stuff
(31:16):
to replicate. Like to your point about TJ McConnell, love
TJ McConnell, played with them, played against him a few
times at Arizona. He legitimately is like like an awesome competitor,
a dude that's really fun to watch, but yeah, he's
not going to be able to get a bucket against
a really locked in Celtics defense, right, Like the really
difficult to replicate stuff Hyrie can do. Right, So then
(31:39):
you can you can by virtue having Luca and having Kyrie.
You can then go get players that are specialists, and
specialists are easier to find at discount and from there
you can build out a roster that where it's like, hey,
I don't need you to, you know, come off of
this dribble handoff and make decisions in the lane the
way that KCP does for the Nuggets. I just need
(32:01):
you to guard Anthony Edwards and go stand in the corner.
And the only way you have the ability to do
that is if you give Luca a legitimate secondary shot creator.
It made a ton of sense that he would. He
obviously got dragged through the mud for good reason. He
got dragged through the mud there for a couple of
years in Brooklyn. Wasn't just the COVID stuff either. He
was like ghosting on Steve Nash without telling him, Like
(32:24):
he just go celebrate his sister's birthday for a week
and like just leave the team. Like he was bad.
He did a really bad job. But he had learned
behind the scenes that he would pay the price by
virtue of him not getting a new deal from Brooklyn.
So that was the best time to buy. I thought
Mark Cuban made the right risk there, and they've nailed
everything since then and the rest is history. I mean,
here they are, They're going to be in the NBA Finals.
Speaker 1 (32:45):
I've wondered for years why Dallas isn't a greater destination
or a more alluring destination for free agents. Never have
a five hour flight. If you play there, you're right
in the middle of the country. I mean, if you're
playing in the Pacific northwest of the West, you got
five six hour flights all the time. It's a winter league.
(33:05):
It's not Phoenix for Miami, but it's you know, it's doable.
Winter weather, forty degrees forty eight to fifty two when
you land, no state tax, beautiful women everywhere. I always
Somebody once suggested that Mark Cuban was such a prominent
star as an owner that he could take some of
(33:28):
the appeal off star players that Europeans didn't mind that,
you know, European Dirk and Luca, they don't want the press.
But sometimes an agent wouldn't send his domestic star to
Dallas because Cuban is such a star. Plus it's a
cowboy town. So people have suggested, you know. But I
sometimes I'll watch pro athletes and they'll you know, like
(33:48):
when Justin Field says I want to play for the Steelers,
and I'm like, you already had a defensive coach. You
don't want another one. You're going to be a backup
to Russell Wilson, that's not where you want to go.
Kirk Cousins goes, I want to go play for Atlanta
because it's got a great line, offensive weapons and a
crappy division. And I look at some of these players
and where they go, and I'm like, why don't more
guys go to Dallas. I do feel like most European
(34:10):
players we've talked about this Jason would rather be loyal,
Like they just rather stay and not. They don't want
to bounce around the league, you know. I mean they
it's almost like they feel like they want that one.
They love their homeland. These guys are on a golf
stream the second the championship parades over seasons and they
(34:31):
and they just want a second home and that's where
they get drafted. They don't they don't want to beat
They've those those guys bounce around Europe. I mean, Europeans
travel because of their training system. They travel more than
we do. Those guys bounce around their country. That's that's
what they know. They come over here. They want to
keep it simple. They want to play in San Antonio, Dallas, uson.
They don't want to bounce around, so I you know,
(34:53):
for Dirk. I felt like there was so much disappointment
until he finally got it. It's if Luke, if Luca
can win a title, boy, Dallas could be really good
for a long time. I think there's a lot of
guys because you know what, sometimes it just takes a catalyst.
(35:15):
I mean, Jokic. Now you look at Denver, this football market,
this hockey mark whatever, it's like, oh no, it's gonna
be for a decade of basketball market and it takes
certain players that you know, whether it's the Georgetown hoyas
with John Thompson. Sometimes in college the coach is the catalyst.
But I mean, would you sign Kyrie if if if
(35:38):
you had to sign Kyrie to way, has he signed
an extension.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
Or I think he has like two years left on
That's what I.
Speaker 1 (35:47):
Think it is. But my takeaway is if you had
to sign him, would you extend him for three and
four years?
Speaker 3 (35:55):
So he he has a player option after next season,
so they have him locked up for additional season, And like,
I mean, here's the thing. It all depends on his
level of play. Like right now, he's thirty two years old,
so it kind of just depends on whether or not
his body holds up over the course of the next season. Now,
my thing is, like you you find out pretty quickly
that the gap between a Kyrie Irving and then like
(36:15):
a league average replacement guard someone like Andrew Nemhard is
like a huge gap, and it's really hard to make
up for that, right, so you know, you know, my
thing is like you want to set yourself up for
you talked about being you said one of the easiest
ways to win is being a dynasty. And one of
the first things I thought when you said that is
like kind of like what Michael Malone was saying after
they lost to Minnesota, which is like you kind of
(36:38):
it's more about getting three and five or four and seven.
And what that means to me is like, sometimes you
catch a bad matchup, sometimes a guy gets hurt, like
Jamal Murray had a calf muscle issue this year, right,
So like sometimes there are just things that break your
way or don't break your way, Like, for instance, Dallas
didn't have to face Denver out of the Western Conference.
It's very possible that if they ran into Denver they
could have lost that a bad matchup, Yeah, exactly, and
(37:02):
so so so Honestly, the way the way I look
at it, like you just want to make sure that
you're in the mix multiple years in a row because
something might break your way, and like if it breaks
your way, all of a sudden, you're in the dance.
Speaker 2 (37:14):
Right.
Speaker 3 (37:14):
So, like, again the way I look at it, I
think they'll obviously retain him, just simply because you could
trade him at that point if you wanted to, Like
if Kyrie, if you sign him for a two plus
one and then he's like, you know, halfway through the
first year, he's either declining a little bit or maybe
Luca gets hurt or something like, you can pivot. It's
(37:35):
in my opinion, it always makes more sense to retain
the star because you can trade the star. Like every
once in a while, someone screws up, Like look at
zach Levine. Zach Lavine makes too much money, He's not
good enough, nobody wants him, right, and it's just it's
and zach Lvine's an interesting player, he just makes so
much money that no team would be willing to sacrifice
what it takes to bring him in, right. But like
(37:57):
every time there's a star that needs to get traded,
just find a way to trade him. And so when
push comes to Shob, I think he'll end up just
re upping and then maybe getting traded to a certain
destination when the timing's right.
Speaker 1 (38:16):
I think it's going to be an interesting off season.
I think Paul George is fascinating to me. I think
he could make Philadelphia really a handful, and I think
he works in New York. I just don't think he
wants it. I think that, you know, Balmer's the richest
or second richest owner in the sport. He's opening his
new arena. He's not letting guys go. And Paul George.
(38:40):
I mean, first of all, you have to be in
alpha to be an NBA player. Largely, even Jason Tatum
or Anthony Davis, they may not be, you know, like
the supreme Alpha, but these guys are driven, competitive as hell.
I if you had to predict one big move, gods,
Paul George is gonna stay. You know. Here's the other thing.
(39:04):
I think Golden State is now kind of understands Joe
Lacob's one of the wealthier owners. I think they sort
of understand like this, we tried to bridge old and new,
and they're not going to bring Chris Paul back. Probably
his name's getting bounced around. I think the Warriors are
going to be a big player somewhere. I think we're
concentrating on Philly and New York, and I understand that
(39:27):
it's just a much easier avenue to get to the
conference finals. In the finals, like, there's no disputing that. God,
how good is the West going to be next year?
But I think Golden State full of smart people. Jason
looks at okay See, looks at Denver, looks at Dallas.
It's like, come on, we're not even close. Like you said,
(39:48):
there's a big gap between a Kyri Paul George and
your average good wing defender. Paul can really dial it up.
So I think teams like Golden State are like, right now,
you know, we're all fucking Klay Thompson, Chris Paul want
to do. I think they're going to take a huge swing.
That's my get. Maybe it's Karl Anthony Towns. What do
you think?
Speaker 2 (40:08):
I think so too.
Speaker 3 (40:09):
I think Dallas is the perfect example of why you
should take a really big swing. I was actually talking
about this with a buddy of mine, sam As Fondirio,
covers the Warriors, and like I was talking about it,
with him this morning, Like Dallas is the perfect example
of why you look at your current situation with Steph
Curry and you go, wait, if we bring him a
second star and we hit like one or two moves
(40:30):
on the margins, we could be right back in this thing.
But Dallas missed the playoffs last year, like they literally
missed a ten team playoff field. And it's the same
two stars. They just made a couple of tweaks with
specific role players. As long as your two stars work.
Now to your point, there's a lot of fun stuff
to talk about this summer, like Paul George potentially going somewhere,
(40:50):
Like I would be lying if I didn't think it'd
be fun, even though I don't think it'll happen. To
see a Lebron James go to Phoenix and play alongside
Kevin Durant, Bradley be Old, Devin Booker, those sorts of things.
I think this is going to be the summer of
the move of the Tier two stars. So like I
think you'll see a Darius Garland move somewhere. I'd love
to see Darius Garland in San Antonio with Webbin Yama.
I think that'd be super fascinating. I think you'll see
(41:11):
a Dejonte Murray get moved. De Jontay Murray's a guy
who I think would make Golden State a really fascinating
team if you gave Steph a real athletic backcourt shot
creator next to him, that would fit I think really
well in their five out attack, the way that they
the way that they go. I think you'll see a
Mikhale Bridges get pulled into a like McHale Bridge is
a guy that you might see with the New York Knicks,
(41:33):
you might see get moved to one of these teams.
And so I think it's going to be the Tier
two guys that move. But again, if you don't think
about them as like real needle movers, think about them
as guys that would offer support to existing Tier one stars.
It's not de Jontey Murray in a vacuum, It's is
Jana Murray next to Steph Curry. It's not you know,
Darius Garland in a vacuum. It's Terius Garland next to
(41:53):
Victor Webbin Yama. It's those are the types of moves
that I think could have sizeable impact. Kyrie is a
big name, and Kyrie has a lot of like star
power behind him. But like, Kyrie's not a guy that's
regarded as a top fifteen player in the league. He's
just in the perfect role for him right now, secondary
shot creator on a team where they have somebody that
(42:14):
can guard. He doesn't have to guard the other team's
best guard. He doesn't even have to be the guy
that runs the offense for the majority of the game.
He can play off of Luca. And how often have
we seen Kyrie in this playoff run like chill for
three quarters and then come in to start the fourth
quarter and be like, all right, let's go, I'm going
to attack this game. So like again, I think that
those kinds of moves they can there's a tendency to
(42:34):
always be like does that really move the needle? Does
that really move the needle? I see that so differently.
Like to me, basketball is more art than science. It's
not about nolating talent points. It's not about accumulating talent
points and like, oh, we hit the magic score of
we have enough talent on the roster. It's like, no,
you have responsibilities your team needs to fulfill on the court.
And if you bring in a really good player, that
(42:55):
can take a bunch of those responsibilities. It even takes
your other role players and makes them play better because
now they don't need to do as much. You know,
like it to me, to me like that, that sort
of thing. A lot of people overthink that. It's like,
that's why I'm a big believer. And you're in the
thing that.
Speaker 2 (43:10):
You always preach, which is like, take those risks. If
you're close, take the risk.
Speaker 3 (43:14):
Dallas put it all on the line this year, yep,
by trading that first round draft pick at the deadline.
They have all of their eggs in this basket. And
you know what, it might have failed. Maybe PJ. Washington
doesn't get that foul call on the corner three. Maybe
you head back to Oklahoma City for Game seven and
you lose in Okay, see advances, and then everyone calls
you idiots, right, but no, that's not what happened. And
(43:36):
here they're going to go to the NBA Finals, And
so I love it. I wish more teams would do
that sort of thing.
Speaker 1 (43:40):
Yeah, I think it's I think it's hard sometimes where
you know, taking big swings. First of all, you have
to be built for it. You have to be like
Miami can do it because of their history and their legacy,
you know, for the Mavericks to do it. Mark Cuban,
(44:03):
you know, is moves out, so you have new ownership,
you have a relatively new front office. Luca's kind of
a new star. Dallas deserves a lot of credit to
just say we're just we're gonna take some big swings here.
But I also think there is an advantage because when
you're in a market with the Dallas Cowboys, even the
Texas Rangers and Sark and the Texas Longhorns, you know,
(44:26):
Dallas stars now are good. I do think there's something
to be said about competitive markets. I think over the
course of my life, I've watched New York teams sometimes
be too aggressive to keep up with the Yankees of
the Giants, right, like too aggressive. And I think Dallas
the advantage to being the Mavericks is when we make
little mistakes, people don't pay attention to them. They pay
(44:48):
attention to the cowboys.
Speaker 2 (44:50):
Right.
Speaker 1 (44:50):
That's a cowboy town. So you're allowed to be a
little bit under the radar in terms of national scope
and even local scope because you're in a cowboy It's
like being in Philadelphia. I mean, the Phillies are huge,
the Sixers are gigantic, the Eagles are big, right, Like
you're all sharing that, and I think I think Dallas,
(45:11):
you know, they had the Dirk title, Cuban made them
incredibly relevant. And not that it's easier to take swings,
but they you know, they weren't the Warriors, they weren't
the heat They they weren't the Lakers of the Celtics brand.
And so I think that they were really smart swings,
(45:32):
really smart thoughtful swings. And I think we all went
on that stuff. You know, I say this even in football.
The advantage in football if you take a big swing
and miss, like Russell Wilson, is the draft provides you
so many good players. I mean, like the story now
is Bonix is just crushing it for Denver. Okay, you
got the quarterbacks all one, one class, whereas you know
(45:54):
the NBA draft can give you lively to the Mavericks.
But you know he and he's been terrific. I went
and read his draft preview tonight as I'm watching the
game the other night, as I'm flying, I'm reading it
and I'm like, oh, it was gonna be a good
they said, good backup player. Nice little passer. I mean,
they really marginalized him to like a six minute a
game guy. And he comes in and he's a factor.
(46:16):
But it's harder to take sometimes chances in the NBA
because you don't get bailed out by the draft.
Speaker 2 (46:22):
You just don't.
Speaker 1 (46:23):
And so the guys deserve when you take these big swings,
These gms deserve credit. There is no safety net, you know,
Russell Wilson. It's a year later, we got one more
year a dead cap. We're done, all right, We're done.
And so I what Dallas did. Take some cajonas and
I think it and they've been rewarded. I just I
(46:45):
think swings for me create content and.
Speaker 2 (46:49):
I'm oh, for sure, so you love them?
Speaker 1 (46:52):
Yeah, so I just want swings. Any final thoughts, Let's
circle back to the Celtics Mavericks and that's what it'll
I'll say this again. The most fascinating part of it
is Tatum will sign a bigness. So Jalen Brown got
his money, Porzingis has his, Derek White has some, but
(47:12):
Jason Tatum's gonna sign his MAX when the season's over.
So you'll be fine if they don't want it this year.
For one more year's run. But if you lost to
Dallas this year, last year, next year would be so
pressurized for Boston, like this is it, Fellas, So I
(47:32):
kind of feel like you want to get it now,
not later, because once Tatum signs, it's like, Okay, guys,
this is it. We got no bench. You can forget
your bench. It's over, Connie, I'll circle back again. I
think that's the one thing about Boston. I could see
him getting really tight, really tight in this series.
Speaker 3 (47:53):
Well, and to your point, the as you get into
the future, there's also the second Apron rules that come
into effect too, where Boston could be very handicapped in
terms of what they're or handcuffed, I should say, in
terms of what they're allowed to do to do things
to supplement the roster, Like you can't even use the
taxpayer mid level exception when you're in the second Apron,
(48:14):
Like you can't even sign anybody unless it's a veteran
minimum contract over the summer. Like, there's a lot of
restrictions that come into play when you have that type
of salary on your roster.
Speaker 2 (48:24):
I think like the big key to watch.
Speaker 3 (48:26):
Is Jason Tatum, Like if they lose and it's a
competitive six to seven game series and you feel like
Tatum goes toe to toe with Luca, Yeah, you're fine.
But the one, the one thing that I think would
actually be real crisis for Boston is what if they
go in and they lose in games in the NBA
Finals in Tatum's bad because if that happens, it's like, oh, wait,
(48:50):
this whole construct is flawed because our best guy can't
go toe to toe with the other best guys. That
would be that would be the catastrophe. And because at
this point, it's like, man, we are two whole years
removed from that Steph Curry incident in twenty twenty two
when he was amazing for three rounds and then just
completely fell apart in the NBA Finals, right, And so like,
(49:12):
I think that's the one thing that would that would
cause me to like really press the panic button if
I was Boston. But even if they lost, if Tatum
can looks like he kind of met the level and
kind of met the moment, then it's like, man, next year,
we're definitely going to get it done. Like that, that's
where you start to feel really confident. And by the way,
you know Tatum has been frustrating offensively in this playoff run,
(49:32):
but we do not talk nearly enough about what an
impactful defensive athlete he is.
Speaker 2 (49:38):
He's big, he's strong, he's master the most of the guys.
Speaker 3 (49:41):
He's long, he can he can guard centers, he could,
Like it's so funny watching how like anytime anybody tries
to isolate or do something against Tatum on an island,
it's just hopeless, Like he just swallows him up because
he's And I'm really really excited. That's one of the
biggest things I'm looking forward to in the next series
is like how many times are they going to watch
Luca you know, Bully Drew Holliday, Bully Derek White, Bully
(50:02):
Jalen Brown before you know. Joe Mizoula goes like, all right,
Jason Tatum, you're guarding you, and I really want to
see that specific matchup. But like, yeah, I'm I'm more
on the patient route with Boston because they are still
so much younger than people think. Like Tatum is, what
is he twenty six now, He's barely getting He's barely
entering in the phase where we expect great players to win.
Speaker 2 (50:23):
He's barely there.
Speaker 1 (50:24):
Think about let's just rank the top ten players in
this final mab Celtics. So Luca one, Tatum two.
Speaker 2 (50:32):
Yes, I'd probably go Jalen Brown, Right, what about you?
Speaker 1 (50:37):
I think just a sturdier athlete, a little bit more consistent.
I would probably go Kyrie four.
Speaker 2 (50:44):
Mm hmm.
Speaker 1 (50:45):
I mean because of Porzingis's health, God, do I go
Derek White?
Speaker 2 (50:51):
Jesus Derek. I'd go Derek White five.
Speaker 1 (50:54):
Okay, Derek White five. If Porzingis is healthy, I'd go Porzingis.
Speaker 2 (50:58):
Six, Drewe Holliday's probably seven.
Speaker 1 (51:02):
Seven. Then I go PJ Washington.
Speaker 2 (51:06):
Yeah, yeah, probably probably PJ Washington.
Speaker 1 (51:09):
Okay, so that's eight.
Speaker 3 (51:11):
Gaff I go Lively Probably, I think Lively. I think
Lively is a better defensive player and a better passer
than Gafford. Gafford's really good and he gets slandered, but
I think Lively is a little better than him.
Speaker 1 (51:21):
Okay, And who's our tenth best player?
Speaker 3 (51:25):
You probably go? Like you probably go I Horford's got
to be somewhere in there. Like Horford hits six or
seven threes.
Speaker 2 (51:34):
The other night.
Speaker 1 (51:35):
If you give him that corner, three, dude, he finds himself.
Like you can say what you want about Al Horford,
He's had a more than redeemable career, really good veteran,
hits open shots, tends to play above his weight in
big spots, like never an anxiety player, like he's always
ready to play. Sometimes with say Akham, he's just not
(51:56):
quick enough, like you can get eaten up with him sometimes.
But that's a lot of talent we had to get
to like eight or nine, So I mean it's it's
I mean one of the things Dallas doesn't deal with
is getting all. They don't have a lot of bad
half court offensive possessions like Minnesota does, Like they're just
awful looking. Indiana's got some clunky ones, Boston doesn't, and
(52:19):
Dallas doesn't. It will be aesthetically a really attractive series.
It will be like fun, good ball movement great. I
mean the degree of difficulty with Luca's insane. I mean
he hit shot because you know he's not a big jumper,
he's not twitchy fast, so almost everything he's dealing with
a hand in his face. He is the great tough
(52:41):
always said Phil Mickelson was the great tough shot maker
in golf. Lucas the great tough shot maker. He makes
more things. He even turns to the sometimes the wrong side,
and he'll shoot a following and I'm like, God, why
did you make that so hard? It's a fourteen footer.
I think it's going to be aesthetically a lot like
the Warrior Celtics series, where you can't take your eyes
(53:03):
off it. It's just really good.
Speaker 3 (53:04):
Oh yeah, yeah, you know Luca, Luca's I did a
film session on him this morning because the end of
that game I thought was super fascinating.
Speaker 2 (53:13):
How like it was one o four, one oh four, and.
Speaker 3 (53:16):
I don't think anybody thought Minnesota was going to win
that game, you know, And it starts with a big
mistake Anthony Edwards leadst PJ Washington wide open in the corner.
It's a three. It's one oh seven to one to four.
But from there, down the stretch of the game, Luca
and Kyrie made three tough, contested pull up jump shots.
Minnesota didn't get a bucket until Anthony Edwards had this
like this like garbage time layup. But I want to
(53:39):
just zero in really quickly on the Lucas shot over
Jada McDaniels. It was the last shot he hit because
he had a fade away over Nasried and then he
hit one over Jade McDaniels and Jada McDaniels. By the way,
I think he's the best perimeter defender in the league.
He doesn't match up well with Luca because he's not
very strong, but in terms of all the little things
that make a perimeter defender great, I think he's got
the full package, and he Luca hits this, like you said,
(54:01):
a funky kind of release. He hit a shot in
the first half against Nikile Alexander Walker where he did
awkward kind of reverse footwork where he took like a
leaning forward kind of floating jump shot in the lane.
He faked that shot against Jaden on that final possession,
and Jayden left his feet and got out a position,
and then Luca immediately spun out of it over his
(54:23):
right shoulder into a fade away and barely got.
Speaker 2 (54:26):
It off and hit it.
Speaker 3 (54:27):
And I was literally sitting there thinking like he's going
against the best defender in the world, the best perimeter
defender in my opinion, and he literally has to get
a shot off in this situation, and he actually gets
him to leave his feet and it's just enough to
barely get the shot. It's like literally a game of inches,
and it was based on a fake. I went through
my film session today and I showed the shot that
(54:47):
he takes, and then I showed the fake, and then
I went into the shot that he took, and I
was like, this guy is He is the most improvisational
shot maker I've ever seen. He can tweak the angle.
He hit a step back three over Karl Anthony in
the right corner in the fourth quarter where he jab
stepped and went a step back. Carl Towns almost blocked it.
So he just shot it way up in the air,
(55:08):
just shot a moon ball and it just went way
up in the air and it came down And I
was like, so he just tweaked his whole release and
changed the geometry of his shot to get this shot.
Speaker 2 (55:17):
Off and it went in. Like he is the most
creative and audacious.
Speaker 3 (55:21):
Basketball player I can't remember watching like Like, I don't
love everything about Luca. He can complain sometimes I hate
the way he talks to the refs all the time. Like,
there are some things with Luca that drive me crazy.
But as a basketball fan, the shot making is it's
like art. It's like art with Luca it's so much
fun to watch.
Speaker 1 (55:37):
Yeah, I always felt Kobe didn't have as many stock
moves as Michael and Kobe went down and the canvas
was pretty bare sometimes, and you know, you spill a
lot of paint. There were some bad Kobe stretches, whereas
Michael always went back to two or three like standard
mid range moves, which he just owned. And Kobe is
willing to be a little bit more of an artist.
He had spots on the floor he like, but and
(55:57):
so does Luca. All great basketball players have bots and
comfort levels. But Jesus, there's just nothing like him in
the planet. There's just nothing like Luca. All right, Jason
timp hoops tonight. Can't wait. I think we're gonna have Sorry, Minnesota,
we're already counting you out, but I think it's gonna
be I think it's gonna be one of the most dramatic,
pressurized finals and one of the most beautiful offensive finals
(56:21):
we've seen in a long time. Good stuff.
Speaker 2 (56:24):
Totally agree, can't wait. It's gonna be fun.
Speaker 1 (56:26):
See you man the volume. Thanks so much for listening.
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Colin Cowherd
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