Colin Cowherd is joined by '3 & Out' host John Middlekauff to discuss the latest in the NFL. They start off discussing who should start at QB for the Pittsburgh Steelers: Russell Wilson or Justin Fields and if this could be Mike Tomlin's last season as Steelers Head Coach. Caleb Williams continues to shine in the preseason but will he be the best QB from the 2024 NFL Draft Class? Do the Giants regret keeping Daniel Jones and could Aaron Rodgers be the weakness of the Jets? Bo Nix is shining in Denver with Broncos HC Sean Payton. Will Andy Reid pass Bill Belichick as the GOAT Head Coach. Lastly they talk about how well of a job Lane Kiffin has been doing at Ole Miss.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
The volume. All right, we are almost ready for the
one hour Sunday hit from this point foward. We're gonna
miss one maybe next week, but we're getting the ramped
up here in August with John Middelkoff. Before we do that,
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(01:11):
lowest prices guaranteed. John Middlecoff joining me as he will
do probably twenty of the next twenty four weeks. I'm
going to take a couple of Sundays and be off here.
Next Sunday, I'm off. Following Sunday, I'm going to England
with my wife. She's never been there. Got to take
(01:31):
her on that last August trip because then I got
six and a half months of no time off. So sometimes, John,
the league has changed so much, and we've seen defensive
coaches Belichick, Pete Carroll really look outdated. The Pittsburgh Steelers.
Now we have to have this conversation about Mike Tomlin.
(01:51):
Pretty early this year, Russell Wilson had five series one
first down. They can't get the snap right with justin feet.
This offensive line still a mess, doesn't get a great push. Now,
we can keep blaming Russell Wilson, but if you go
back to last year, let's be fair. Once Hacket left
and Peyton took over, Russell wasn't the primary issue last year.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
Limited.
Speaker 1 (02:15):
Yes, the defense was egregiously bad. Is I look at
Pittsburgh right now and they have too many good players
to be pathetic offensively? And I mean, Russell Wilson's been
in this league a long time.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
He can't pick up.
Speaker 1 (02:30):
First downs, first downs? When does the Mike Tomlin. I mean,
everybody likes it. It's like Pete Carroll. Pete Carroll's got
super Bowls too, Mike's gone him. But when I watched
that team, I'm like, they just feel like tone deaf offensively.
Speaker 3 (02:48):
Yeah, to me, I thought it was a time for
a divorce. Last year, you know, Andy Reid and the
Philadelphia Eagles got a divorce. How'd that work out for
both Super Bowl? For the Eagles, Andy's won three, everyone benefited. Yeah,
it doesn't feel like anyone's ever on the hot seat
in Pittsburgh. I'm out. I'm out this year. I think
this is the year that it finally kind of comes
to roost and they don't go over five hundred. That
(03:10):
the offense, the offensive line was getting smoked.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
Smoked.
Speaker 3 (03:13):
Russell's a shell of what he used to be, you know,
a guy that's lost his confidence. Fields kind of is
what he is. I mean, it's just it's carbon copy
of what we saw last year. They the moment Big
Ben started falling off a cliff and listen, they got
Lucky's the wrong word because they drafted him and he
became a star, and physically at the end, it was
(03:33):
ugly and he was not the same guy. Obviously threw
out his arm. They drafted Kenny Pickett in the first round.
That's that's embarrassing. Like to me, this isn't embarrassing what
they're doing. They got Russell for a million dollars and
traded nothing for Justin Fields. It's kind of desperate. It's cheap.
The Kenny Pickett in the first round. I don't know
if you had a chance. I don't blame you if
you did not watch any of that Eagles Patriot preseason
(03:56):
game Thursday night. I watch Kenny Pickett's not He's not
very good. Yeah, and even if he is a quote
unquote NFL player, he's the type guy you draft historically
in like the fourth fifth round. Yeah, same building. You
always talk about this Pittsburgh. They feel some loyalty there.
It kind of gets weird. He wasn't even remotely close
to a first round talent in the history of the league. Obviously,
we've got a little quarterback inflation, but they've had a
(04:19):
quarterback issue for the last four or five years, and
this year I think it's gonna be worse than last year,
even though these guys are more talented, because how polarizing
are these two individuals. I mean, Russell's one of the
biggest stars in the last fifteen years. He's become a
lightning rod and Fields has this like cult like following
and listen, I'm the one saying you should throw him
in because at least he can run around, and he
(04:41):
did that yesterday. But you can't depend I mean, how
many games last year did they win because like TJ.
Watt got a sack fumble touchdown or you know, the
weird shit happens. They play a ton of close games.
I think this is the year that it just doesn't work.
Now for them, that's not three or four wins, but
seven eight wins in Pittsburgh feels like disaster does not.
Speaker 1 (05:01):
Yeah, well, Tomlin signed an extension. I'm just saying that
if Andy Reid, Bill Belichick and Pete Carroll can be
let go, and I don't think Pittsburgh will, But we've
got to be honest about this. There is some I've
been on this for like four years. If you go
to the best offensive lines in football and the worst
the bottom is overwhelmingly defensive coaches. Now, the Giants is
(05:21):
a drafting issue, So Dave all gets pass there, but
it's there is something about offensive coaches and the ability
to remake, reboot and develop offensive lines. When's the last
bad Packer offensive line they've had offensive coaches? I mean
New England right now, atrocious offensive line.
Speaker 2 (05:38):
See.
Speaker 1 (05:38):
I think one of the reasons Pete Carroll got asked
is they just felt he the talent was better than
the production. But I watch Pittsburgh right now, and there
are things I've always said. Tomlin reminds me a little
of Pete Carroll. He's a pro, he's got trophy. He'd
get a job. And you know, if Pete was fifteen
years younger, he'd get another job.
Speaker 3 (06:00):
You can hire last cycle.
Speaker 2 (06:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:02):
Also, Tomlin is the greatest lock to be a great broadcaster.
I think Fox would not hire him a fifteen minutes
Fox would hire He'd get a lot.
Speaker 3 (06:11):
Of money in the open market as a coach. Someone
are paying fifteen million dollars the Eagles. If they had,
you know, he would get he'd be interviewing for the
top jobs.
Speaker 1 (06:18):
But I do think the culture in Pittsburgh to me,
feels outdated. All their money is on the defensive side.
They can't develop an offensive line. They still draft and
develop a wide receiver, pass rusher, defensive line, linebacker at
a very elite level free agency. They're not biggest spenders,
but they'll go out and make a deal. I kind
(06:39):
of just feel like when I watched Pittsburgh, I'm like,
this just feels broken.
Speaker 3 (06:43):
It's not they they don't know quarterbacks. They don't know quarterbacks.
Speaker 1 (06:46):
Well, New England is not only broken. They have a
talent scarcity. Pittsburgh's got players. I'll argue that all day long.
They've got player.
Speaker 3 (06:55):
I mean, they had one of the best players in
the league, MIKEA. Fitzpatrick's a stud. They got a quarterback
problem and they don't know how to identify it. Mason
Rudolph can he Pickett? I mean they were playing games
with Duck Hodges three or four years ago. I mean
he's dating a country star selling real estate. Now, these
two guys, this has got debacle written all over it.
And listen to me, Tomlin, sometimes you just need a
(07:17):
fresh start. He's also being let down by like, you know,
the front office is drafting these players too, and they
just had a front office turnover. Kevin Colbert, who is
a scout. Scout I would say is pretty good at
his job, and they kind of pivoted to kind of
this modern day the cap guy. You know, I don't know,
I'm just this is not going to work now. One
(07:38):
thing they got going for him, Burrow's health is a
major concern. He struggles to practice four straight days. I
mean he has to take the fourth day. The Cleveland Browns,
while their roster is excellent and Kevin Stefanski is a
good offensive coach, their quarterback situation could be a debacle
as well. Right, Deshaun Watson has not been good and
the Ravens just are they going to be as good
(07:59):
as they last year? You lose Mike McDonald, do you
lose them players in free agency? But they're still good,
But you just factor in the other two teams. They
have pretty big question marks at quarterback, one being health
and one being Deshaun Watson might be the most overpaid
player in the history league.
Speaker 1 (08:14):
So you know, Jim Nagy runs the Senior Bowl and
I follow him and he had said multiple times that
this is going to be a really great draft. This
just draft that was just completed in April, especially in
the first five rounds, gets a little wonky mid six.
That could be a cultural issue. Fewer moms want their
sons playing football.
Speaker 3 (08:35):
We could dieel guys go back.
Speaker 1 (08:37):
Absolutely, So it's I mean, listen, we used to have
seven rounds in the NBA draft. I mean when I
was growing up, that's what you had. Now you got
two and you're sort of out of players by the
thirteenth pick. There could be a time we have only six.
You know, we just have six rounds in the NFL draft.
Within ten years, I do think there are fewer kids
playing it. If you look at the numbers across the country.
There are exceptions. There's your Texas's and your Alabama's, but
(09:00):
you know a lot of these states, sometimes the more
liberal areas, their moms aren't letting their kids play. Just
the reality of it. So one of my takeaways. You know,
I'm watching Caleb and Romadnze for Chicago. Now they drafted
a punter. They feel kind of like they got a
lot of their problems solved in free agency and last
year's draft, so they're just adding some pieces. They needed
(09:22):
another receiver, a little bit of an edge rusher, and
a quarterback. But I got to tell you, and it
is there are This was a good draft.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
This weekend.
Speaker 1 (09:33):
I'm watching guys Kansas City players, and I'm like, these
guys are good. These guys aren't even mediocre starters. They're
like some guys that are walking into this league and
going to be productive. When you were scouting for the Eagles,
and it was a different time. In fact, two drafts
ago was considered a very weak draft. I was told
that by Tom to le Us go with a Chargers.
He's like, this is not a great draft. You better
(09:54):
get your guys in your first three and a half rounds.
Middle of the fourth it gets a little thin. I
think we're gonna, I really do. In the NBA, we
know this, John. You go from great draft to terrible draft.
This year was a week draft. Previous draft was a
good draft. Do you think there'll be a time, because
of fewer high school football players that we will start.
Speaker 2 (10:16):
Having good draft? Bad draft? Good draft?
Speaker 1 (10:19):
This one felt exceptional, two years ago felt weak.
Speaker 3 (10:23):
I think the sport has just transitioned so much more
to perimeter oriented game that I think the receivers are
going to keep flowing in space, and I think it's
such a sexy position and gets paid so much. Some
of the guys that previously might have played defensive back
corner all want to play wide receiver. I mean, hell,
we see it with Travis Hunter. He his top five corner,
(10:44):
but he loves playing wide receiver because it's a little
more fun. God only puts so many guys that can
play offensive and defensive line on this planet. Yeah, there
are only so many body types like that. So it
feels like that's been pretty consistent with the body types.
I mean, every yearence has been the way you play
and the way that you develop. I mean, when you
(11:05):
were grown up, every team was running the wing tee
hally when I was a kid, it was kind of transitioning.
But the best team in the country Nebraska in the
mid nineties, they ran a verer option offense and then
it as Mike Leach was like, what's this guy doing? Now?
The majority of the league play, or in college play
a version of that, And I think these NFL coaches
have been saying forever we can only get what they're
(11:27):
giving us. Right, this is not a minor league system
in the sense we have nothing to do with it.
So as the offense has changed, it really works its
way up. So it's harder to find one thing you
have seen, though is there have been a lot of
really good defensive tackle pass rushers, where when I was
in the league in twenty ten, eleven, twelve, thirteen, it
was hard to find those guys, and there's a lot more,
(11:47):
but it's harder to find now good guards and centers
coming out of college. So I don't think big picture
at least for the foreseeable future. But I've said forever,
like football is not going to stay on top four.
It has a wide margin in terms of its lead
right now, and it feels pretty unflappable I would say
at least a decade moving forward. But baseball was huge
(12:09):
when I was a kid MJ with the the NBA
in the nineties, like things EBB and flow, and to me,
you never know. Obviously the concussion lawsuit they kind of
phased off. I do think what you said, this draft
was pretty good. Yeah, I mean speaking at guards, like
the forty nine ers found a guy from Kansas who's
gonna be their starting right guard Cuty. So you look
at the rams they find these, you know, it's like
(12:30):
there are guys you just have to to me, it's
the A lot of guys in a draft have the
physical characteristics, size, speed, whatever, it's about your mentality, and
I truly believe that's what separates guys. There are certain
like quarterback, I think like Trey Lance or justin fields,
I do think they're trying. That's a position where it's
so fucking hard that if if you don't have like
(12:51):
the specific it can just weed you out. It doesn't
not lack effort. All the other positions if you have
the physical characteristics, like you're gonna be a pretty good
guard defensive tack if you try hard, work hard, take
care of your body. Right, Quarterback's kind of the one
individual a little more skill based specific skill or the
others you can make up for with effort and studying
and just playing hard, especially the line of scrimmage. So
(13:14):
I think when you find the right guys at those positions,
which doesn't really feel like it's slowing down, it's just
you have to the pressure on the staff, I would
say to coach them up pretty immediately. Caleb, you know,
listen everyone, and I'm not gonna poo poo this because
he is a really fun player player to watch. His
comp has been mahomes and watching him yesterday morning, and like, no,
(13:36):
his comp's actually prime Seattle Russell Wilson right now, the
scramble ability, that's where he's making his sweetest places. And
there are gonna be a lot of negative nancies, like
he can't play from within the pocket. Well right now,
that's not his strength. But if I'm the mccaskey's or
I'm the GM's, like, well, I'm paying the quarterback coach
eight hundred and fifty k, I'm paying the OC two
and a half million. We just need to work on that.
(13:57):
But at twenty one years old, what he's bringing to
the like is a lot. Yeah, but for him to
be a true true star, he's gonna cause they're gonna
be in big games this year. Yeah, and the difference
of winning eight nine games and eleven games are a
couple third nines. The fields has no chance to make
this guy does. He just has to. You know, one
thing the Seattle and Pete used to push back on
(14:20):
is like let Russ cook. It's like nuts, he can't
really Now I think this guy is better or that's unfair.
Russell was really good, has a chance to be better.
But for him to be a super superstar, like clearly
he can do this outrageous stuff. We knew that, so
I'm not shocked. I'm sure you're not. When he makes
the plate to Rome, I understand the excitement. But for
(14:41):
them to be like Super Bowl contender in the next
three or four years, got to dominate from within the pocket.
But he's twenty one years old. It's a second preseason game,
like what Lebron wasn't perfect, you know, two months into
his career, like welcome to sports.
Speaker 2 (14:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (14:55):
One of the things I like about football is that
we don't romanticize it. That the game changes, the rules change,
the kickoff changes, and that's I absolutely love.
Speaker 2 (15:07):
That about football.
Speaker 1 (15:08):
Is that, you know, if you listen to sports talk
radio in America, if there's baseball talk, somebody brings up Mantle,
you know, somebody brings up you Know, you know somebody
that pitched Cofax. It's just a sport that's rich in
history and lore. We all collected baseball cards and football
is not like that. Is that in football you move
(15:29):
off stuff really quickly. And I think in quarterback we've
always had these rules three years full then we go
what about Eli Manning and what about Peyton man You know,
Peyton in year four had a ton of interceptions, but
there is something about the current seven on seven. The
high school college coaching is better offensively that guys come
(15:53):
into this league quarterbacks. I'm going to give them. I've
said this, I'll give you Thanksgiving a year two. But
I kind of know seriously by week two C J. Stroud,
Kyler Murrie, A. Matt Ryan, Like, I'm watching and going, well,
(16:16):
that works.
Speaker 2 (16:17):
Team's not good. That works.
Speaker 1 (16:20):
Like everybody in that New York Giants building knows Daniel
Jones can't play. Like I'm watching the other night. Those
turnovers are the exact same turnovers four years ago. And
this is what I think fans don't understand. Davile didn't
want it. The GM tried to move up. They are
(16:41):
completely completely trapped by their owner, John Morris. Want to
make Daniel Jones work, but I'm watching him with two picks,
bad throws from his end zone and I'm thinking, I
don't need to see anything else. I want the kid
to see seed. But it's it's like Sam Darnold. I
(17:03):
love Sam, but he will throw an atrocious pick in
every game he's ever played, and I mean the optics
of it are one of those jaw droppingly the f
was that Sam yeah, you know, I've talked about this.
Brady through two hundred plus interceptions, very few are memorably
awful in his entire career. Sam gives you one every
(17:25):
Sunday minimum. The Giant situation, are they in the running?
Do you think for the number one pick? Because Beck's
getting picked the Georgia quarterbacks getting picked number one?
Speaker 3 (17:40):
I would think there would be a worse team than them,
because I do think their defense could be pretty solid,
and we've seen day Ball just field competitive teams. I
mean even last year with Devido, they had some moments
like are they likely to finish finish fifth than one?
To be one? Overall? I think the Patriots have that
written all over them. Yes, I mean written all.
Speaker 2 (17:58):
I think the Raiders are up there.
Speaker 3 (18:00):
I mean anytime you named Gardner Minshew your starting quarterback.
I have some concerns. I think the Giants got a
couple one. Is it crazy? And I understand it was
only year one for these guys, but if they truly
didn't want Daniel Jones or just pay in the contract
for Joe Shane and Brian day Ball to be like
you either fire us or you let us do this,
(18:22):
or is that just like I understand these jobs are
hard to get, but they had just made the playoffs.
If they if he does fire him, that he can't.
So they had to be on board a little bit,
you know. And even if you watch that Hard Knocks,
he keeps going, I want to see what we got.
I want to see what we got. We know what
you have. You have an Alex Smith who wants to
play like he's Patrick Mahomes. Yeah, you know. And that's
(18:44):
the thing with Darnold the pick he throws down the sideline,
you know, Daniel Jones does. Stingley's gonna become the best
corner in the league. I know everyone loves Sauce Gardner
because of his name, and he's a good player. Stingley's
more talented, and it's to me would be the guy
that every GM in the league picks. If you got
to choose between the two of them, that's no shot
at saws. That's the Stingley Guy's got a chance to
(19:05):
be very very special. You have to miss that deep.
But he doesn't have a huge arm. And this is
where the team building thing. Who do they draft? Will
they draft like this explosive Jamar Chase, Justin Jefferson player
who doesn't even fit with them with the number seven
overall pick. So you're just the team building's out of whack,
(19:25):
the quarterback sisitions out of whack. And this is what
the Giants have been since they fired Tom Coughlin and
he stormed off that podium. You know when John Marr,
remember how awkward it was when he gave his goodbye
and it was and listen, it was the right thing
to do. But they have been a disaster since they've
run through the Joe Judges, the Pat Shermers, David Gettleman
like it's they're not gonna be any good this year.
(19:47):
And I thought, you know, maybe they'll be better in Washington.
You watch Daniel Jones. I mean, they can lose to
anyone at any moment, by any margin because he just
can't implode and Saquan ain't there to save the day anymore.
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Speaker 2 (21:31):
You know, I was thinking about this.
Speaker 1 (21:32):
I had a discussion with a buddy last night and
I said, just forget all the opinions on Aaron Rodgers.
He's taken four snaps in like five hundred days. But
I and I started naming quarterbacks to my friend and
I said, and I want you to consider everything work, ethic, focus, health, mobility,
(21:57):
everything is Aaron Rodgers. Because I'm gonna give you a
take care. Is Aaron Rodgers as good as mahomes Alan
and Lamar He's not. No, I don't think he'll be
as good this year as Burrow or Herbert with Harbaugh.
I don't think he moves as well or as his
healthy as C. J. Stroud Stafford. And I'll make this
(22:19):
argument all day. If Aaron has a clunker this year
and Stafford gets to a super Bowl, You're going to
start looking at those two careers differently. Stafford was a
hell of a lot better in high school, college, and
the first four years in the pros, and he's going
to be better late. If he crushes the next two years,
you start going down quarterback and.
Speaker 2 (22:37):
Say who's better.
Speaker 1 (22:39):
Aaron doesn't, isn't quite as committed. He has a below
average offensive coordinator in Matt Hackett. That's been established the
offensive lines in flux fingers crossed, but it's not elite.
He has a defensive coach Aaron has become over the
course of the last half dozen years. He'll lead the
NFL in like throwaways, Like if he does like the
(23:00):
play call, Aaron's not taking the arrows, He'll throw it
out of bounce. He did that, as you know with
McCarthy the last two years. You know with lafleur he
may live out of the play. He wasn't disgusted with it.
He was with the McCarthy. He will be with Matt Hackett.
And so I was just saying to somebody, I said,
in the NFC, I viewed him differently. I said, I
(23:21):
look in the AFC right now, I don't think he's
a top I don't think he's a top six quarterback
in the AFC.
Speaker 2 (23:28):
And my take.
Speaker 1 (23:29):
Is, is it possible that the weakness of the Jets.
If Garrett Wilson and Breese Hall stay upright, they're both
the elite. They're both really special. We may look in
week twelve and think Aaron's not as good as Jordan
Love or now Trevor Lawrence or josh or Lamar or
(23:52):
Burrow or and we say he's like the eleventh best
quarterback in the league, and the defense is great. Wilson
and Breesehall are crushing. Smith gives you twelve starts, the
rookie from Penn States better than we think, and we
look up hot take and go, shit, Aaron's closer to
Dak than Mahomes.
Speaker 3 (24:11):
Well, he's forty years old. One thing I've noticed on
the NFL network, and it's hard because he doesn't play
any of these preseason games. I think he's moving slow,
you know, so why every clip I see it's like
he looks like the forty five year old guy if
you just went to the gym you see kind of
jogging around shooting hoops. That's what he looks like. And
that's a little concerning because that's never how he's played. Now.
(24:34):
If he just morphs his game into playing like Peyton
he had or Brady he has the arm to function
like that. Then it gets to the question mark, well,
he's never had to play like that. If his offensive
line they get a couple injuries, all of a sudden,
he's kind of moving for his life. But he can't
run around. What's the problem with Russell Wilson that not
quite as fast? Still thinks he can scramble? Well can't.
It's much easier for Caleb. Why he's way younger and
(24:55):
he's still fast. So you watch these guys kind of
scramble around. Some guys can't, some guys can. I just
think he's such a polarizing individual. It's gonna get weird fast.
You got Monday night against the Niners. What if you
go in there, you get your teeth kicked in all
of a sudden, it's like, oh, here we go again.
I don't like I mean, listen, Robert Saala is a
nice guy. He's been completely over his head. Yeah, you know,
(25:16):
of just being able to handle a star told me something.
Aaron's like, what the hell is what's he talking about?
That's just that's stuff that like Mike McCarthy doesn't you
you know, just knows how to handle Yeah. I mean,
I just think that if his mobility is gone and
not gone where he can't move at all, like Tom
Brady at forty five. But he used to be you know,
(25:36):
seven and a half eight out of ten and now
it's more like five ish, and he's less hesitant to
do it once he realizes I'm not as quick. That
changes the player dramatically. Yes, And you're looking at, like
you said, the influx of new young quarterbacks. You know,
let's use brock Purty as an example. One thing he
can do is scramble around. He moves well, and that
(25:58):
is the modern day football. You have to be able
to move. Because we talked about the the talent coming
in the league. Well, there hasn't been a lot of
Trent Williams come in the league and Larry Allen's over
the last five ten years, but there has been a
lot of defensive lines. So you're at a disadvantage most
games where they got more good defensive linemen than you
do offensive lineman. That's why these quarterbacks being able to
scramble around can save you. Well, if that's gone for him,
(26:20):
with the lack of offensive ingenuity that's in that building.
From a coaching standpoint, what is it argue they could
be screwed relative to the expectation that he's back and
going to save the day.
Speaker 1 (26:31):
Also, I remember as a kid, I got into a
motorcycle accident, ripped up. I still have a scar from it. Huh,
Honda one fifty or something. You know, it was pretty ugly,
and I can remember it took me two years before
somebody finally said, dude, you got to get on that.
A neighborhood dad said, you gotta get on that bike. Kid,
(26:52):
You just got to get You gotta crash again. And
that always sticks in my head that if if you
get hurt doing something, just you got to get back
in there. Brady acknowledges the first year back from his injury,
he didn't want to get he didn't want anybody near
his knees. He got prickly. He would bark at officials.
Are we not acknowledging Aaron is going to be affected
(27:14):
by that? Like Aaron probably deep down feels like he
disappointed the city taking four snaps though it wasn't his fault.
So you've got an aging player, a player that is
going to be hyper sensitive to that, an offensive coordinator
you can't trust. I just I think we look at
the Jets and think Aaron will save us. In my
take is no, Actually I trust their defense. I think
(27:38):
Garrett Wilson is really good. Breese Hall, I think the
on line will kind of figure it out. I'm just saying,
I think we're going to look up at Thanksgiving and
like Aaron sometimes is a weakness.
Speaker 3 (27:51):
I haven't had a chance to read the book or
blisten to the audiobook yet. Obviously there's a lot coming
out about that family moment at the Tahoe golf tournament
where he saw his dad, And obviously there's two sides
to every story. You know, who knows maybe if the
parents are whack jobs and it's not as much on Aaron,
which it kind of feels like that might be, is
not as crazy as on Aaron side. But regardless, isn't
(28:12):
it a pretty consistent theme over the last however many years,
the quarterback and the family relationship. You look at Peyton
and Tom, obviously their families are very very close. Caleb's
tight with his you know, Russell and his family. You
just go around the league, Patrick Mahomes and his family,
Lamar's moms, his agent. Yeah, I mean, it's that's strained,
like I saw some craziness when I was a kid
(28:34):
with some you know, extended family. That's hard on any
human I don't care who it is. It wears on you.
Even if you're right or they're right, it doesn't even
matter after a while. It's just that lack of you
only have so many people in your life that when
you grow up and that relationship with your brothers and
sisters and your parents, you remove that. I can't even imagine.
(28:59):
I can't relate to that because I the relationship i'd
had with my dad's past now, but my dad, my mom,
my brother, that seems like hard to overcome in certain
moments of just to gain some levity in life, just
a game like hey, I need to talk to somebody,
not even about something serious. That's that's an underrated part.
(29:19):
And I think a lot of people sarcastically mock and
stuff I'm talking about as a human being, you know.
And I wonder if that situation, I mean, he sees
his dad at that tournament and goes up to him.
I mean, that's what a fucking awkward thing they got
going on.
Speaker 2 (29:32):
Yeah, okay, so.
Speaker 1 (29:36):
I want the Errand thing was a mild take because
I do think most people realize these young quarterbacks are sensational,
They move better than Aaron, better health, many have offensive coaches.
If I had a take, and I know you know
I've used this example before, John, and you, as a
scout probably know this better than anybody I've talked about before.
(29:59):
Seahawk Camp was in Cheenie, Washington, where I went to college,
and I've talked about before. Seeing Eugene Robinson from Colgate
his first practice with the Seahawks and literally knowing, I mean,
I had people around me and I could name them.
I went to college with him, saying, holy shit, he
is lighting up Steve Largent, who is that colegate who?
(30:24):
At that time, I don't even know if I'd ever
seen an IVY League game on TV. You know this
is back in like nineteen eighty two. It doesn't take
long to see certain things. Right. Here's here's a take.
Bon Nicks has got a better arm than I think
(30:44):
people think. I think he's more cut and athletic than
people think. I noticed this when I saw him live
on the field against Utah. That game everything went Oregon's way.
And I know it's preseason, John, but I've watched bon
Nicks and I'm like, oh shit, Caleb defensive coach, Drake Made,
(31:04):
defensive coach Jaden, defensive coach JJ McCarthy, Hurt Pennix may
not play hot take bow Knicks is the best quarterback
this year out of the crop.
Speaker 3 (31:17):
I think Caleb will be better because of what he's
dealing with. But I think bo Nicks is going to
shut a lot of people up really fast. I mean,
it's already inevitable. He's started for week one, He's got
a coach. I would say, who a well established, very
rich guy who's already won a Super Bowl, who kind
of has this like back against the wall chip on
his shoulder right now? Yeah, because that year last year
(31:40):
was probably not fun and is anything good? I would
say nothing has a chance to age better faster than
boot and Russell out for eighty million dollars in selecting
this guy. And let's face it, leading up to the draft,
before he inevitably picked him, everyone was going, Oh, Sean
Payton wants the bow Knicks. That's tarot, that's awful. You
can't drap this guy that high. This is crazy, this
(32:01):
is stupid, and it's like, now, I mean, this guy
has a pretty good idea. He was one of the
rare guys that was all in on mahomes. He like
Drew Brees once upon a time when not everyone was
lining at the door, you know. So I would say
that you have an offensive coach is just a huge
advantage and a guy that can develop quarterbacks and a
guy who can call the place. To me, my biggest
(32:21):
thing is not offensive and defensive coaches. It's do you
call the place? Do you dictate fifty percent of the game.
And obviously, as an offensive coach, not only are you
calling the place, you're controlling the quarterback then essentially and
the pace of the game. You know, defense is much
more physicality, there's stuff out of your control. Even great
defense gets speed sometime. But as an offensive play caller,
(32:42):
you can completely control the game. And beside that couple
of year stretch which was bad when they I think
Rob Ryan was their defensive coordinator in New Orleans and
they were going seven to nine even though their offense
was setting records. When they've had good defenses, they dominated.
You know, they were consistent ten to twelve win team
in the NFL. That's what Sean Payton's record. It is
when the defense is solid. So their defense a solid,
which it was the second half of last year. And
(33:04):
clearly I think removing Russell Wilson and this is why
I'm out on the Steelers. That thing that you take
in is more than just that miss third down throw.
It's all this other stuff, which, in fairness, I don't
know how much Russell brings it. It's just there now,
it's just part of the deal. And you remove that,
(33:27):
you get this young hungry guy, you get this chip
on the shoulder coach the Raiders naming Gardner Minshew that
they're not going to be any good. The Chargers just
gonna have some injury problems and their depth is going
to be very questionable. Is it crazy to think Denver
could finish second in this division? No, he clearly likes
this team. They like their rookie class. They got some
good wide receivers. Watching them play, I mean, I don't
think it's inconceivable they go nine to eight.
Speaker 1 (33:49):
Boon Nicks played with Troy Franklin. Troy average one hundred
and five yards per game, fourteen touchdowns. Shit, they played
together in college. Like, think about this, He's twenty four,
Drake May's twenty one offensive coach I think between Mims, Cortland,
Sutton and Troy Franklin, they have a good tight end,
two capable backs. I'm like, that's that's at least averaged
(34:09):
the slightly above average. I mean, look at Dallas Cowboys.
They're completely dependent on Ceedee lambstaying healthy or they're screwed.
So to me, I look at Denver and I'm like,
every single year it was Houston. Last year, there's a
pop team and I'm watching bow Nicks and I've had
a couple of texts with Sean Payton. It's not lost
on me that a former NFL quarterback that I was
(34:32):
talking to in the building at Fox several months ago
said just remember Drake, Caleb and Jaden have defensive coaches.
He goes, I don't care how talented they are. And
this guy came into the league years ago and had
a defensive coach. He said, it matters like you're nervous,
you don't you you know he said a defensive coach.
(34:55):
I mean, Mark Sanchez told me years and years ago,
it's like, you know, the reality is an offense of coach.
You talk at night, you text, you know, your texting.
Defensive coaches think differently. Their buddies are defensive coaches. Their
favorite players are Belichick's favorite player is Lawrence Taylor. It's
not Tom Brady. So I think I just think Denver
(35:15):
is better. PFF has their personnel near the bottom of
the league, and I'm like, ah, I don't.
Speaker 3 (35:21):
Know wide Peyton Manning love Adam Gase because he could
text him at one o'clock in the morning and he
texts him right back, maybe talking football. These offensive guys
I saw with Andy Reid sleeps like three hours a night.
He's just in the whiteboard. Just these guys. It's like
a creative The mentality is it's night and day. Different.
Now some of the defensive guys are just such natural leaders.
(35:41):
The aggressiveness kind of it's a different personality. But yeah,
I mean, I think the offensive play caller is the
number one guy you'd ever want running, especially in this
modern day football. But who are the options for pop teams? Right?
It have to be a team an on an AFC
West team, right, not the Chiefs, So it'd be the Raiders,
(36:04):
the Chargers of the Broncos. I think most people are
out on the Raiders when you watch their quarterback situation.
Listen I'm a Jim Harbad die hard, but they just
got a ton of injuries. They got a guys that
have always injured. That makes me nervous. Their quarterback just
got out of a boot. The Jets, who we talked about,
I would say, are pretty uh, are walking a very
(36:27):
very tight line. They could shatter in front of our
eyes immediately. The Steelers I got coming back to Earth.
They were already a playoff team. The same with the
same with the Cleveland Browns because their quarterback situation just
scares the crap out of me. I think it's wide
open for a team like the Broncos to kind of
sneak up on.
Speaker 2 (36:46):
People, for sure.
Speaker 1 (36:48):
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Speaker 1 (37:58):
So as we go into the season, you know, I
thought about this if the Chiefs three p. Belichick didn't
do it. And we talk a lot about the Chiefs.
We talk about Mahomes and Brady, right, Brady's going to
be more productive, but Mahomes is more talented and increasing
(38:18):
in production. But I want to talk about Andy Reid
and Belichick. Andy Reid wins a third straight Super Bowl.
Belichick never did it. Andy Reid two teams to a
Super Bowl. Belichick didn't do it. Andy Reid had to
face for the first fifteen to twenty years of his
(38:40):
coaching career, a league that allowed Belichick's favorite rules to exist,
Yet Andy still flourished five NFC championship. The minute the
league pivoted to offense and Brady left, Belichick is it's Jurassic.
He is completely tone deaf. And my take is we've
(39:01):
always felt there's Belichick and Shula. Andy wins at third straight.
Andy's Super Bowl Philadelphia, Kansas City. Andy's won with terrible quarterbacks.
Andy's one with everybody. Andy's assistants are better. Andy's the
one coach that gave Belichick real problems. Go look at
their record. I think that Andy Reid Belichick gap gets
(39:27):
really thin, really thin. And if we're going to be fair,
the league pivoted offense seven years ago, about seven eight,
You're like, I mean everything now, it's go look at
Belichick's last seven drafts, last four seasons. I again, I'm
(39:48):
not confusing it. I think Belichick is a better coach
than Shula, and Shula has more wins. It's not all
just on record. Andy Reid is good with everybody at quarterback.
I think the gap closes. I think it gets really
close if he knocks down three straight super Bowl why.
Speaker 3 (40:08):
I'd say it's been closing dramatically fast over the last
two years, as he's knocked these last two off. Right,
I'm torn on this because I'm an Andy Reid guy,
but I am a Belichick defender of Like, we know
what we watched. We watched him out coach everyone for
eighteen years and then clues Andy beat him in a
Super Bowl. Now he had Brady, he had McNab. That's
(40:28):
the gap there's pretty wide. And he did beat him
Mahomes first year on the road in that AFC championship
game that went overtime. That was one of the better
games the Patriots ever played in. But you could argue
if to me, if Andy wins won more, the ability
to coach every type quarterback, absolutely, and like you said,
and win pretty big. I mean, he was consistently going
(40:49):
to the playoffs with Alex Smith, no problem, right, winning
with Donovan McNabb, who had some serious flaws. Belichick could
not only coach or have success with one guy. That
guy was wired like a defensive guy. You could just
dog cuss them, you could scream at him. That's not
really the way most quarterbacks handle. And you put anyone
else in that place it gets a little weird really fast,
(41:12):
where I think Andy's personality is much more tailored to quarterbacks,
which have always been the name of the game. Right,
So Bill just got pretty lucky. He just got this
rare bird that was wired more like Mike Vrabel or
Teddy Bruski could just take it. Most quarterbacks were not
taking that type of abuse. So why every article that
was ever written about any backup quarterback that sat next
(41:33):
to Tom said, this is the craziest thing I've ever seen.
The way that he takes this. It's like it terrified
everyone else because if mahomes ainc again, it doesn't mean
you can't coach a guy hard or push a guy.
But they treated everyone as equals when they're not equals.
Joe Montana, John Elway, Peyton Manning, they weren't equals in
the room and the room knows it. But Belichick's thing,
(41:54):
to me could have only worked with Tom. It's why
they were the perfect marriage, one of the great sports
marriages of all time. Yeah, Andy can date anybody. If
you gave Andy any of the top let's just say,
fifteen quarterbacks in the NFL. I'm not saying the Chiefs
win the super Bowl. You gave him like Josh Allen,
they'd win the Super Bowl. Joe Burrow Lamar would be fun.
(42:15):
I think he could just take like Dak, you random
guys and they would have eleven to twelve wins. Now,
they may lose in a playoff game because that guy's
not good enough, but he would be a lock for
the playoffs. And I don't think you could say that
about Bill as the years went on rotating just take
give me, give him Dak Prescott, He's a lock to win.
I don't feel that way. So that's Andy's trump card
(42:35):
in this modern day football. It ain't even close right,
his ability to do offense and quarterback Bill couldn't. That's
why I think a lot of people were off Bill. Now,
it'll be very fascinating to watch how this offseason or
this season goes with Bill playing this new role. I
would say Bill is very dependent on one individual over
the last fifteen years, and that was Josh McDaniels. When
(42:58):
he had Josh and Josh available, you're getting a package deal.
And once you hire Bill and Josh, well, no one's
ever hiring Josh to be a head coach ever. Again,
right in the NFL maybe in college, but so maybe
Bill has that going for him. But yeah, I mean this,
I don't even think it's remotely close. And I think
Mahome is a good example of like, the guy that
(43:19):
we see now is so much different than the guy
we saw early on the way they've coached him, the
way he's changed. And just if you can't coach the quarterbacks,
I mean he put now Andy put Wan Castillo's defensive
coordinator when I was there. Everyone makes mistakes, yeah, but
to put Matt Patricia as your offensive coordinator really the
(43:41):
second year coach is one of the most insane things
ever and first great as Belichick's resume is, that's like
an all time stain. Yea. To me, that's a bigger
stay than like the Flate gate or any of that
other crap.
Speaker 2 (43:50):
You know.
Speaker 1 (43:50):
I mean, there are these there are these moments. I mean,
every great actor Brando had six bombs.
Speaker 3 (43:58):
Danira, they all do right, But there.
Speaker 1 (44:00):
Are moves over the last three to four years with
Belichick that I can't unsee, and the Matt Patricia thing
and the five six straight. I mean, there are drafts
where they don't have a single good player. It stains
how I look at Bill and how the beginning, and
any great movie starts great and finishes strong. Bill's ending
(44:24):
is a catastrophe.
Speaker 3 (44:26):
Think about this too. I do think it's a little
weird that this Bill was like this ultimate dictator. You
don't get it wrong, Like you're in the building with Andy,
like he's the boss, but he interacts clearly a little
different because look at his resume of like Doug Peterson
was the right hand guy won a Super Bowl. Matt
Naggie they claim was a disaster, took the Bears in
the playoffs. Ron Rivera took the Paranthers to the Super Bowl.
(44:51):
Andy guy John Harbaugh turned out to be pretty good.
Like why do Andy's guys just function pretty well? And
Bill's guys football coaching is a hard and every guy's
gonna lose, have a bad season, maybe get You're gonna
get fired eventually, his guys get run out of the
building in record speed. Yeah, I mean Joe Judge immediately
like the same organ. Josh McDaniels couldn't even make it
(45:12):
through the second year after like ten years to a
step back, Patricia, whatever the hell happened in Detroit? I mean,
at all times, couldn't get along with Stafford, Oh my god. Yeah.
So and these are his core guys. Like when you
think Bill of the last fifteen years, Pat Brian Flores
couldn't get along with a soul on offense, hate his
(45:33):
interactions with the quarterback because that's what they saw. Think
about that, that's what those guys saw. So defensive guys
scream at the quarterback. You're like, this ain't gonna work.
That ain't Tom Brady.
Speaker 2 (45:43):
Success or failure.
Speaker 1 (45:45):
All of Andy Reid's guys are guys you'd love to
have a beer with. They're good dudes, well liked. Go
to Bill's Charlie Wise, Joe Judge, he just ran on
He just ran on Twitter about getting fired from Serious saying,
I was like, Charlie, what's going on here? Almost all
of Bill's guys, Eric Mangini's an exception, Almost all of
(46:06):
them there are a lot of work. Like if they
were in the building, you'd avoid them. They're harsh, they're intense,
they're arrogant. Bill is attracted to that quality, that sort
of pseudo confidence, arrogance. Andy's guys, Matt n Aggie used
to call me, Hey, thanks for saying nice stuff. You know,
my kids listened this morning going to work, like Doug
(46:28):
Peterson's a great guy. They're all nice guys, and Andy
is looking for people that Andy barks, So I think
he looks for people psychologically that can comfort players when
he barks. Bill barks and doubles down on the barking.
(46:49):
And that's why that's why the minute Brady leaves, free
agents don't want to go there. Brandon Ayuk's like not
remotely interested in that culture Bill created.
Speaker 3 (47:01):
Yeah, to me, it was his culture was all dependent
on Tom. Once Tom established himself and go back to Walsh,
like they could have pivoted way earlier to young and
been fine, Like it wasn't dependent on one individual. I
just think that's an all time outlier situation what we
saw because the way the quarterback could take it, none
of these other quarterbacks take it. It's why every single guy,
(47:23):
to a man, the backup quarterbacks that all rotate around
the league were like, this is the craziest thing I've
ever seen. And it's not like obviously there were a
small percentage of teams that just are really buttoned up,
do it the right way. The Ravens, the Chiefs, the Patriots,
like the gap of how they get ready isn't it.
But the way that they treated the quarterback in front
of the entire team didn't happen anywhere else because that's
(47:45):
not normal and you're never gonna see that away. And
I understand why the Patriot guys defend it, Like if
I was Edelman, I would defend it too, because they
won a lot, but it wasn't sustainable. Once you remove
the keycog, it you crumbled down. And I'm telling you
it's gonna get really ugly there. It's gonna get really
ugly there. That team rolling out Jacoby. I mean, Drake's
(48:06):
a major project. People are gonna be mad at Craft
because everything he did to Bill, even obviously didn't end
well with Bill on the field, but you respect a
guy that brought you so much. It's I think it's
gonna be really bad. And you talk to like I
text around people in the league, they're like, buckle up, Phillis,
(48:26):
it's gonna be ugly. And it's not like they're playing
in a division. I mean, the Bill's got a lot
of moving parts. Obviously they are the king of the division.
The Dolphins aren't great. The Jets could implode if you
told me they didn't win a divisional game, I'd believe you.
Speaker 2 (48:41):
All right.
Speaker 1 (48:43):
So Chris Peterson's gone, Nick Saban's gone, Jim Harbaugh's gone,
Dabo Sweeney is struggling with a transfer portal, and an
il Ryan Day is struggling defining what Ohio State is.
Take Kirby smart out. He's considered the best coach in
college football. I think Kaylin de Boor's really close. And
(49:05):
you'll the rest of the country will see that what
Husky fans know. It's really interesting. And this is why
you can't give up on people. I could make an
argument the third best coach in college football is Lane Kiffen,
and this sport bailed on him. Old miss has no
business being as good as they are. I mean, let's
be honest. The state produces, I mean, how many players.
(49:29):
They can't get many, and Georgia gets the best in Georgia,
Bama gets the best in Bama.
Speaker 2 (49:34):
Florida. It's rated by everybody. He is.
Speaker 1 (49:38):
That state's only got three and a half like million people.
Speaker 2 (49:40):
It's Oregon.
Speaker 1 (49:41):
It's got more players than Oregon. But generally speaking, most
of these teams in the top ten come from highly
populated states, fertile recruiting grounds. Is that people bail The
Raiders bailed on him, you know, college football bailed on him.
And you start looking around and I'm like, and by
the way, Sark somewhere in the top ten. He may
(50:02):
not have the trophy yet, but recruiting, culture, building, quarterback development,
Sark knows what he's doing. He's won a lot of games.
Washington was zero to twelve when he took it over.
He had what they were seven wins second year, and
he handed Chris Peterson some dudes, some NFL bodies. But
I was thinking about that today. Take Kirby out and
Kaitlin to Bore.
Speaker 2 (50:22):
We know it.
Speaker 1 (50:23):
You know, Urban's gone, Harbaugh's gone, Savan's gone, Chris Peterson's gone.
All these guys. Dabbo is struggling with nil on the
transfer portal. He's struggling with it.
Speaker 3 (50:31):
Well, he won't do it. He won't do it.
Speaker 2 (50:32):
He won't do.
Speaker 1 (50:33):
Jesus and Ryan Day hired Chip Kelly, which I think
is brilliant because the hole in his game, which he acknowledges,
is the run game. Ryan admits that, so he can't
put him as a top five coach now because he's
beating Perdue. It's you know, Lane Kiffin can coach his
ass off, That's my take.
Speaker 3 (50:49):
You know, one of the best stats I remember here
in last year was Ole Miss has never had back
to back double digit seasons win seasons in the history
of the program. Lane did it twenty two and twenty three,
and last year when he beat LSU. You're watching him going.
The talent gap on these two rosters can't be as
close as what it looks like on the field. Obviously
(51:10):
he scares people, but to me, he's got one of
the blue blood's, whether it's Florida, if they make a
change whoever. You know, there were rumors that I had
heard Oregon when Dan Lanning got it, he was really interested.
People just wouldn't touch him. You get to a point, though,
I think, especially in college sports in the NFL, you
win enough, who cares, like, what are we even talking about?
(51:33):
And a lot of people think they're going to be
a top ten team. He crushed the transfer portal. Oh yeah,
good quarterback.
Speaker 2 (51:39):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (51:40):
I do think there's a lot of pressure though. It's
one of those where even if he wins eight or
nine games and misses the playoffs, it's still a remarkable accomplishment.
You win ten eleven and then nine you're at ol Miss,
not Ohio State, right, Like, I'm with you on Kalen Newbor.
He's a star. And don't be shocked when they're back
in the final fourth Alabama right away, Right, but you
(52:02):
should win at Alabama even if some guys leave, you're
still inheriting. Every single guy in that roster is someone
that Nick had recruited. Right, you should win Ohio State.
You obviously should win at USC, even Sark. It is
to me much more impressive that they have an unlimited
checkbook to sign whoever they want, whenever they want.
Speaker 1 (52:19):
Now.
Speaker 3 (52:19):
Sark had a good year last year, though kind of
a little softened in the playoff game against Washington. It's
way easier to win at Texas than it is at
Old Miss. Like Lane went to what Fai or Fui
or whatever that school was in Florida that no one
could even get, right if I pulled random people that
follow sports, and then to Old Miss, who usually runs
through coaches every three or four years, and now he's
(52:40):
kicking everyone's ass. He's beaten LSU. Yeah, I mean, I
just think that it's it's easy to hire. I think
part of what's worked against Lane. It's easy for USC
to give one hundred million do to Lincoln like everyone's
on board. It's easy when LSU gives ninety plus to
Brian Kelly, like we see. I think it is controversial
in some of these ads and whatever to hire Lane
(53:03):
at this point in time. You're crazy if you do not.
They're hiring these billion napiers and all these other guys.
Lanes werenning circles around them all. So, I mean, what
he's doing at ole Miss now here's the thing. He's
getting paid nine ten million dollars there and they clearly
had a pretty good But does he need to leave?
Speaker 1 (53:19):
Well, yeah, I mean I think some of its lifestyle.
He likes the South. He's told me that he likes
the style. He loves fishing. He's an intense guy. He
likes it's he gets some space. People are nice, you know.
Lane's little cocky, unique personality. But I also think he's
got a great heart and I think he's really I
(53:39):
think he's really a good coach. I think sometimes when
dad's a coach, or dad's a broadcaster, or dad's a
bank president, the Sun gets placed into a position he's
not quite ready for. And if it wasn't for Monnie Kiffin,
Lane probably doesn't get the raider job.
Speaker 2 (53:56):
We don't know.
Speaker 1 (53:56):
He's just another young assistant McVeigh, you know, like grandpa
or somebody was a general manager. That's different.
Speaker 2 (54:03):
It wasn't high profile.
Speaker 1 (54:05):
But I think one of the vagaries of having a famous,
successful dad and if you go into the same industry
is you tend to get inserted into places that eventually
you are ahead of people and you will be successful.
But Lane was like kid coach, like thirty two years old,
and it's and I can't remember when he went to USC.
He just wasn't he And I was rooting for him,
(54:27):
but he was a little loose with his private personal life.
He just didn't quite know how to be a head
coach at USC. Wasn't the play calling. But I think
there is an advantage when dad or grandpa or somebody
ran the bank and you get into finance, there's an advantage.
But I look around college football now and in a
(54:48):
big game, I'm gonna tell you this, I would not
want to face Lang Kiffin. I think he's clever. He
by the way, playing with house money at all. Miss
He's he's like he has the talent of most the
top six, but none of the pressure that an Ohio
State does if they met in the playoff.
Speaker 3 (55:05):
I think one thing that is dramatically different about him
is at USC he almost had like this angry, edgy
anti media being fun, and he's the complete opposite. Now
he's just much more looser, especially in front of a camera.
He feels much more natural. Maybe he just embraced it. Listen,
Jimmy Sexton and Nick Saban changed his life. He says
(55:28):
it as much right when he goes to Nick, and
I wonder if he saw Nick like, you can be
this hard driving, kind of a hole coach on the
field and kind of handle when the lights are on
with the media. Because you're in that business as an
NFL coach. Your roster's your roster. You're not recruiting anyone
out there in college football. It's a little different. It's
why Nick, when the camera's on, kind of turns into
(55:49):
a different guy. He has all these different kind of
like characters he can play where I think Lane struggle
with it now you watch him. I saw this clip
on the internet the other day about he was on
with the SEC the network guys, and they were asking
about his dad and he's like, starts. You just got
this emotional side of Lane. You have to remember Lane
was a quarterback at Fresno State in the late nineties
(56:10):
who when Pat Hill recruited Billy Vollock and David Carr,
they said, Lane, you're never gonna play her. Immediately just
transitioned into being a coach with Jeff Tedford, who was
the offensive coordinator. This guy transitioned at like twenty years
old to being a coach. And like you said, to me,
it is an advantage if you do like you're mentally
or I would say mature enough to handle it. Like
(56:32):
Kyle Shanahan. This guy went right into it. And to me,
Kyle's much more serious in the sense of you're not
screwing around as much. Lane has some interests, I would
say outside the football building. I wonder if he just
has corralled it all and got the right people around him.
But his personality in front of the quote unquote media
or when he's doing things with a camera on, to me,
(56:53):
is dramatically different than the guy that we saw at USC,
which I thought was part of his undoing. He wasn't
that likable? Isn't that a huge part of life? Like,
if you're kind of likable, people root for you. Like
the Sam Pittman guy at Arkansas. I think he's not
very good, but everyone loves the guy.
Speaker 1 (57:08):
Yeah, he's like everybody's really friendly. Stepdad be hard to fire,
you know. It's like the Freakonomics top To talked about that.
I think it was Freakonomics was the book they talked
about that the doctors that get sued aren't the bad doctors.
The doctors that get sued are often the most educated
and the most successful doctors. They don't have good bedside manner.
(57:29):
It's impossible to sue even the incompetent doctor you love, right,
It's hard to fire somebody you really have great affection for.
It's easy to sue the asshole surgeon that's screwed up
during the surgery. Right. Like. So, I think as you
become more likable, and let's be honest about this, my
dad used to say this, you your employment will be
(57:50):
based in rooms that you're not in. People will raise
their hand, a boss will say, you know, raise your hand.
Colin stays or goes.
Speaker 2 (57:57):
There's nine, you need five.
Speaker 3 (57:58):
You have rid of middle cough, the room goes silent.
Speaker 2 (58:01):
Me and Logan have those meetings almost every other week.
Speaker 1 (58:05):
There's a lot to be said with Lane is that
when you're a little snarky and you go in a
three game losing streak, or it's just much easier to
get rid of guys that are.
Speaker 3 (58:12):
Pain Well, I'll give you a guy because in the
NFL that only goes so far. If you're winning six
to seven games, no matter how much they like you,
they run you out of town. Arthur Smith, I remember
when they fired or Arthur Smith was fired by Arthur
Blank and Arthur Blanks I love the guy. I didn't
want to do it, but he just wasn't good enough.
I'm watching I was slipping around channels and watching Big
ten Network. They had on Matt Ruhle. I'm like, ah,
(58:34):
this guy's I see why this guy a good college coach.
He's just kind of got a personality, can own the
room when the camera's on, and you're like, I get it.
And I've heard he's not easy to play for. Yes,
it can be really difficult. And they're the classic team
of like they bring in this young hot shot quarterback,
and the expectations are high and it's usually hard to
(58:56):
live up to those. All of a sudden, you win
seven eight games, people are maybe like we sneak into
the playoffs. Week two is Nebraska hosting Colorado. I mean,
I don't know if you saw the clip. I think
it was yesterday or two days ago. Even Dion was like, hey, CBS,
whoever hear from CB, I'm sorry, We're all good now.
I would imagine someone in Colorado like, we can't be
(59:16):
doing all this, Like we gotta be a little careful.
Pick your battles. You're not you're not the player. And
that's where I think Dion kind of carries himself like
you're the coach, but you got all these other guys
and beside your couple sons in Travis Hunter, some of
these guys aren't gonna be all back up all your words, right.
We don't have Alabama. Who've gotta be careful that game
because last year, remember Nebraska's quarterback looked like me. I mean,
(59:39):
it was a joke.
Speaker 2 (59:40):
It was awful.
Speaker 3 (59:41):
It's gonna be a little more interesting this time around.
That's one of those there's a lot of like you know,
USC LSU and all these That's a game that I
have this season circled like I want to. I'll be
will not be moving off the couch for that one.
Speaker 1 (59:55):
John Middlecoff, former NFL Scout three and out as always,
Buddy Gray stuff see con the volume. Thanks so much
for listening. If you've enjoyed the podcast, take a moment,
rate and review
The volume. All right, we are almost ready for the
one hour Sunday hit from this point foward. We're gonna
miss one maybe next week, but we're getting the ramped
up here in August with John Middelkoff. Before we do that,
download the game Time app. You know, the drill takes
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(00:48):
going to a game two weeks in advance. A lot
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it up that day or that afternoon. Take the guess
work out of buying major league tickets with a game
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(01:11):
lowest prices guaranteed. John Middlecoff joining me as he will
do probably twenty of the next twenty four weeks. I'm
going to take a couple of Sundays and be off here.
Next Sunday, I'm off. Following Sunday, I'm going to England
with my wife. She's never been there. Got to take
(01:31):
her on that last August trip because then I got
six and a half months of no time off. So sometimes, John,
the league has changed so much, and we've seen defensive
coaches Belichick, Pete Carroll really look outdated. The Pittsburgh Steelers.
Now we have to have this conversation about Mike Tomlin.
(01:51):
Pretty early this year, Russell Wilson had five series one
first down. They can't get the snap right with justin feet.
This offensive line still a mess, doesn't get a great push. Now,
we can keep blaming Russell Wilson, but if you go
back to last year, let's be fair. Once Hacket left
and Peyton took over, Russell wasn't the primary issue last year.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
Limited.
Speaker 1 (02:15):
Yes, the defense was egregiously bad. Is I look at
Pittsburgh right now and they have too many good players
to be pathetic offensively? And I mean, Russell Wilson's been
in this league a long time.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
He can't pick up.
Speaker 1 (02:30):
First downs, first downs? When does the Mike Tomlin. I mean,
everybody likes it. It's like Pete Carroll. Pete Carroll's got
super Bowls too, Mike's gone him. But when I watched
that team, I'm like, they just feel like tone deaf offensively.
Speaker 3 (02:48):
Yeah, to me, I thought it was a time for
a divorce. Last year, you know, Andy Reid and the
Philadelphia Eagles got a divorce. How'd that work out for
both Super Bowl? For the Eagles, Andy's won three, everyone benefited. Yeah,
it doesn't feel like anyone's ever on the hot seat
in Pittsburgh. I'm out. I'm out this year. I think
this is the year that it finally kind of comes
to roost and they don't go over five hundred. That
(03:10):
the offense, the offensive line was getting smoked.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
Smoked.
Speaker 3 (03:13):
Russell's a shell of what he used to be, you know,
a guy that's lost his confidence. Fields kind of is
what he is. I mean, it's just it's carbon copy
of what we saw last year. They the moment Big
Ben started falling off a cliff and listen, they got
Lucky's the wrong word because they drafted him and he
became a star, and physically at the end, it was
(03:33):
ugly and he was not the same guy. Obviously threw
out his arm. They drafted Kenny Pickett in the first round.
That's that's embarrassing. Like to me, this isn't embarrassing what
they're doing. They got Russell for a million dollars and
traded nothing for Justin Fields. It's kind of desperate. It's cheap.
The Kenny Pickett in the first round. I don't know
if you had a chance. I don't blame you if
you did not watch any of that Eagles Patriot preseason
(03:56):
game Thursday night. I watch Kenny Pickett's not He's not
very good. Yeah, and even if he is a quote
unquote NFL player, he's the type guy you draft historically
in like the fourth fifth round. Yeah, same building. You
always talk about this Pittsburgh. They feel some loyalty there.
It kind of gets weird. He wasn't even remotely close
to a first round talent in the history of the league. Obviously,
we've got a little quarterback inflation, but they've had a
(04:19):
quarterback issue for the last four or five years, and
this year I think it's gonna be worse than last year,
even though these guys are more talented, because how polarizing
are these two individuals. I mean, Russell's one of the
biggest stars in the last fifteen years. He's become a
lightning rod and Fields has this like cult like following
and listen, I'm the one saying you should throw him
in because at least he can run around, and he
(04:41):
did that yesterday. But you can't depend I mean, how
many games last year did they win because like TJ.
Watt got a sack fumble touchdown or you know, the
weird shit happens. They play a ton of close games.
I think this is the year that it just doesn't work.
Now for them, that's not three or four wins, but
seven eight wins in Pittsburgh feels like disaster does not.
Speaker 1 (05:01):
Yeah, well, Tomlin signed an extension. I'm just saying that
if Andy Reid, Bill Belichick and Pete Carroll can be
let go, and I don't think Pittsburgh will, But we've
got to be honest about this. There is some I've
been on this for like four years. If you go
to the best offensive lines in football and the worst
the bottom is overwhelmingly defensive coaches. Now, the Giants is
(05:21):
a drafting issue, So Dave all gets pass there, but
it's there is something about offensive coaches and the ability
to remake, reboot and develop offensive lines. When's the last
bad Packer offensive line they've had offensive coaches? I mean
New England right now, atrocious offensive line.
Speaker 2 (05:38):
See.
Speaker 1 (05:38):
I think one of the reasons Pete Carroll got asked
is they just felt he the talent was better than
the production. But I watch Pittsburgh right now, and there
are things I've always said. Tomlin reminds me a little
of Pete Carroll. He's a pro, he's got trophy. He'd
get a job. And you know, if Pete was fifteen
years younger, he'd get another job.
Speaker 3 (06:00):
You can hire last cycle.
Speaker 2 (06:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:02):
Also, Tomlin is the greatest lock to be a great broadcaster.
I think Fox would not hire him a fifteen minutes
Fox would hire He'd get a lot.
Speaker 3 (06:11):
Of money in the open market as a coach. Someone
are paying fifteen million dollars the Eagles. If they had,
you know, he would get he'd be interviewing for the
top jobs.
Speaker 1 (06:18):
But I do think the culture in Pittsburgh to me,
feels outdated. All their money is on the defensive side.
They can't develop an offensive line. They still draft and
develop a wide receiver, pass rusher, defensive line, linebacker at
a very elite level free agency. They're not biggest spenders,
but they'll go out and make a deal. I kind
(06:39):
of just feel like when I watched Pittsburgh, I'm like,
this just feels broken.
Speaker 3 (06:43):
It's not they they don't know quarterbacks. They don't know quarterbacks.
Speaker 1 (06:46):
Well, New England is not only broken. They have a
talent scarcity. Pittsburgh's got players. I'll argue that all day long.
They've got player.
Speaker 3 (06:55):
I mean, they had one of the best players in
the league, MIKEA. Fitzpatrick's a stud. They got a quarterback
problem and they don't know how to identify it. Mason
Rudolph can he Pickett? I mean they were playing games
with Duck Hodges three or four years ago. I mean
he's dating a country star selling real estate. Now, these
two guys, this has got debacle written all over it.
And listen to me, Tomlin, sometimes you just need a
(07:17):
fresh start. He's also being let down by like, you know,
the front office is drafting these players too, and they
just had a front office turnover. Kevin Colbert, who is
a scout. Scout I would say is pretty good at
his job, and they kind of pivoted to kind of
this modern day the cap guy. You know, I don't know,
I'm just this is not going to work now. One
(07:38):
thing they got going for him, Burrow's health is a
major concern. He struggles to practice four straight days. I
mean he has to take the fourth day. The Cleveland Browns,
while their roster is excellent and Kevin Stefanski is a
good offensive coach, their quarterback situation could be a debacle
as well. Right, Deshaun Watson has not been good and
the Ravens just are they going to be as good
(07:59):
as they last year? You lose Mike McDonald, do you
lose them players in free agency? But they're still good,
But you just factor in the other two teams. They
have pretty big question marks at quarterback, one being health
and one being Deshaun Watson might be the most overpaid
player in the history league.
Speaker 1 (08:14):
So you know, Jim Nagy runs the Senior Bowl and
I follow him and he had said multiple times that
this is going to be a really great draft. This
just draft that was just completed in April, especially in
the first five rounds, gets a little wonky mid six.
That could be a cultural issue. Fewer moms want their
sons playing football.
Speaker 3 (08:35):
We could dieel guys go back.
Speaker 1 (08:37):
Absolutely, So it's I mean, listen, we used to have
seven rounds in the NBA draft. I mean when I
was growing up, that's what you had. Now you got
two and you're sort of out of players by the
thirteenth pick. There could be a time we have only six.
You know, we just have six rounds in the NFL draft.
Within ten years, I do think there are fewer kids
playing it. If you look at the numbers across the country.
There are exceptions. There's your Texas's and your Alabama's, but
(09:00):
you know a lot of these states, sometimes the more
liberal areas, their moms aren't letting their kids play. Just
the reality of it. So one of my takeaways. You know,
I'm watching Caleb and Romadnze for Chicago. Now they drafted
a punter. They feel kind of like they got a
lot of their problems solved in free agency and last
year's draft, so they're just adding some pieces. They needed
(09:22):
another receiver, a little bit of an edge rusher, and
a quarterback. But I got to tell you, and it
is there are This was a good draft.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
This weekend.
Speaker 1 (09:33):
I'm watching guys Kansas City players, and I'm like, these
guys are good. These guys aren't even mediocre starters. They're
like some guys that are walking into this league and
going to be productive. When you were scouting for the Eagles,
and it was a different time. In fact, two drafts
ago was considered a very weak draft. I was told
that by Tom to le Us go with a Chargers.
He's like, this is not a great draft. You better
(09:54):
get your guys in your first three and a half rounds.
Middle of the fourth it gets a little thin. I
think we're gonna, I really do. In the NBA, we
know this, John. You go from great draft to terrible draft.
This year was a week draft. Previous draft was a
good draft. Do you think there'll be a time, because
of fewer high school football players that we will start.
Speaker 2 (10:16):
Having good draft? Bad draft? Good draft?
Speaker 1 (10:19):
This one felt exceptional, two years ago felt weak.
Speaker 3 (10:23):
I think the sport has just transitioned so much more
to perimeter oriented game that I think the receivers are
going to keep flowing in space, and I think it's
such a sexy position and gets paid so much. Some
of the guys that previously might have played defensive back
corner all want to play wide receiver. I mean, hell,
we see it with Travis Hunter. He his top five corner,
(10:44):
but he loves playing wide receiver because it's a little
more fun. God only puts so many guys that can
play offensive and defensive line on this planet. Yeah, there
are only so many body types like that. So it
feels like that's been pretty consistent with the body types.
I mean, every yearence has been the way you play
and the way that you develop. I mean, when you
(11:05):
were grown up, every team was running the wing tee
hally when I was a kid, it was kind of transitioning.
But the best team in the country Nebraska in the
mid nineties, they ran a verer option offense and then
it as Mike Leach was like, what's this guy doing? Now?
The majority of the league play, or in college play
a version of that, And I think these NFL coaches
have been saying forever we can only get what they're
(11:27):
giving us. Right, this is not a minor league system
in the sense we have nothing to do with it.
So as the offense has changed, it really works its
way up. So it's harder to find one thing you
have seen, though is there have been a lot of
really good defensive tackle pass rushers, where when I was
in the league in twenty ten, eleven, twelve, thirteen, it
was hard to find those guys, and there's a lot more,
(11:47):
but it's harder to find now good guards and centers
coming out of college. So I don't think big picture
at least for the foreseeable future. But I've said forever,
like football is not going to stay on top four.
It has a wide margin in terms of its lead
right now, and it feels pretty unflappable I would say
at least a decade moving forward. But baseball was huge
(12:09):
when I was a kid MJ with the the NBA
in the nineties, like things EBB and flow, and to me,
you never know. Obviously the concussion lawsuit they kind of
phased off. I do think what you said, this draft
was pretty good. Yeah, I mean speaking at guards, like
the forty nine ers found a guy from Kansas who's
gonna be their starting right guard Cuty. So you look
at the rams they find these, you know, it's like
(12:30):
there are guys you just have to to me, it's
the A lot of guys in a draft have the
physical characteristics, size, speed, whatever, it's about your mentality, and
I truly believe that's what separates guys. There are certain
like quarterback, I think like Trey Lance or justin fields,
I do think they're trying. That's a position where it's
so fucking hard that if if you don't have like
(12:51):
the specific it can just weed you out. It doesn't
not lack effort. All the other positions if you have
the physical characteristics, like you're gonna be a pretty good
guard defensive tack if you try hard, work hard, take
care of your body. Right, Quarterback's kind of the one
individual a little more skill based specific skill or the
others you can make up for with effort and studying
and just playing hard, especially the line of scrimmage. So
(13:14):
I think when you find the right guys at those positions,
which doesn't really feel like it's slowing down, it's just
you have to the pressure on the staff, I would
say to coach them up pretty immediately. Caleb, you know,
listen everyone, and I'm not gonna poo poo this because
he is a really fun player player to watch. His
comp has been mahomes and watching him yesterday morning, and like, no,
(13:36):
his comp's actually prime Seattle Russell Wilson right now, the
scramble ability, that's where he's making his sweetest places. And
there are gonna be a lot of negative nancies, like
he can't play from within the pocket. Well right now,
that's not his strength. But if I'm the mccaskey's or
I'm the GM's, like, well, I'm paying the quarterback coach
eight hundred and fifty k, I'm paying the OC two
and a half million. We just need to work on that.
(13:57):
But at twenty one years old, what he's bringing to
the like is a lot. Yeah, but for him to
be a true true star, he's gonna cause they're gonna
be in big games this year. Yeah, and the difference
of winning eight nine games and eleven games are a
couple third nines. The fields has no chance to make
this guy does. He just has to. You know, one
thing the Seattle and Pete used to push back on
(14:20):
is like let Russ cook. It's like nuts, he can't
really Now I think this guy is better or that's unfair.
Russell was really good, has a chance to be better.
But for him to be a super superstar, like clearly
he can do this outrageous stuff. We knew that, so
I'm not shocked. I'm sure you're not. When he makes
the plate to Rome, I understand the excitement. But for
(14:41):
them to be like Super Bowl contender in the next
three or four years, got to dominate from within the pocket.
But he's twenty one years old. It's a second preseason game,
like what Lebron wasn't perfect, you know, two months into
his career, like welcome to sports.
Speaker 2 (14:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (14:55):
One of the things I like about football is that
we don't romanticize it. That the game changes, the rules change,
the kickoff changes, and that's I absolutely love.
Speaker 2 (15:07):
That about football.
Speaker 1 (15:08):
Is that, you know, if you listen to sports talk
radio in America, if there's baseball talk, somebody brings up Mantle,
you know, somebody brings up you Know, you know somebody
that pitched Cofax. It's just a sport that's rich in
history and lore. We all collected baseball cards and football
is not like that. Is that in football you move
(15:29):
off stuff really quickly. And I think in quarterback we've
always had these rules three years full then we go
what about Eli Manning and what about Peyton man You know,
Peyton in year four had a ton of interceptions, but
there is something about the current seven on seven. The
high school college coaching is better offensively that guys come
(15:53):
into this league quarterbacks. I'm going to give them. I've
said this, I'll give you Thanksgiving a year two. But
I kind of know seriously by week two C J. Stroud,
Kyler Murrie, A. Matt Ryan, Like, I'm watching and going, well,
(16:16):
that works.
Speaker 2 (16:17):
Team's not good. That works.
Speaker 1 (16:20):
Like everybody in that New York Giants building knows Daniel
Jones can't play. Like I'm watching the other night. Those
turnovers are the exact same turnovers four years ago. And
this is what I think fans don't understand. Davile didn't
want it. The GM tried to move up. They are
(16:41):
completely completely trapped by their owner, John Morris. Want to
make Daniel Jones work, but I'm watching him with two picks,
bad throws from his end zone and I'm thinking, I
don't need to see anything else. I want the kid
to see seed. But it's it's like Sam Darnold. I
(17:03):
love Sam, but he will throw an atrocious pick in
every game he's ever played, and I mean the optics
of it are one of those jaw droppingly the f
was that Sam yeah, you know, I've talked about this.
Brady through two hundred plus interceptions, very few are memorably
awful in his entire career. Sam gives you one every
(17:25):
Sunday minimum. The Giant situation, are they in the running?
Do you think for the number one pick? Because Beck's
getting picked the Georgia quarterbacks getting picked number one?
Speaker 3 (17:40):
I would think there would be a worse team than them,
because I do think their defense could be pretty solid,
and we've seen day Ball just field competitive teams. I
mean even last year with Devido, they had some moments
like are they likely to finish finish fifth than one?
To be one? Overall? I think the Patriots have that
written all over them. Yes, I mean written all.
Speaker 2 (17:58):
I think the Raiders are up there.
Speaker 3 (18:00):
I mean anytime you named Gardner Minshew your starting quarterback.
I have some concerns. I think the Giants got a
couple one. Is it crazy? And I understand it was
only year one for these guys, but if they truly
didn't want Daniel Jones or just pay in the contract
for Joe Shane and Brian day Ball to be like
you either fire us or you let us do this,
(18:22):
or is that just like I understand these jobs are
hard to get, but they had just made the playoffs.
If they if he does fire him, that he can't.
So they had to be on board a little bit,
you know. And even if you watch that Hard Knocks,
he keeps going, I want to see what we got.
I want to see what we got. We know what
you have. You have an Alex Smith who wants to
play like he's Patrick Mahomes. Yeah, you know. And that's
(18:44):
the thing with Darnold the pick he throws down the sideline,
you know, Daniel Jones does. Stingley's gonna become the best
corner in the league. I know everyone loves Sauce Gardner
because of his name, and he's a good player. Stingley's
more talented, and it's to me would be the guy
that every GM in the league picks. If you got
to choose between the two of them, that's no shot
at saws. That's the Stingley Guy's got a chance to
(19:05):
be very very special. You have to miss that deep.
But he doesn't have a huge arm. And this is
where the team building thing. Who do they draft? Will
they draft like this explosive Jamar Chase, Justin Jefferson player
who doesn't even fit with them with the number seven
overall pick. So you're just the team building's out of whack,
(19:25):
the quarterback sisitions out of whack. And this is what
the Giants have been since they fired Tom Coughlin and
he stormed off that podium. You know when John Marr,
remember how awkward it was when he gave his goodbye
and it was and listen, it was the right thing
to do. But they have been a disaster since they've
run through the Joe Judges, the Pat Shermers, David Gettleman
like it's they're not gonna be any good this year.
(19:47):
And I thought, you know, maybe they'll be better in Washington.
You watch Daniel Jones. I mean, they can lose to
anyone at any moment, by any margin because he just
can't implode and Saquan ain't there to save the day anymore.
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Speaker 2 (21:31):
You know, I was thinking about this.
Speaker 1 (21:32):
I had a discussion with a buddy last night and
I said, just forget all the opinions on Aaron Rodgers.
He's taken four snaps in like five hundred days. But
I and I started naming quarterbacks to my friend and
I said, and I want you to consider everything work, ethic, focus, health, mobility,
(21:57):
everything is Aaron Rodgers. Because I'm gonna give you a
take care. Is Aaron Rodgers as good as mahomes Alan
and Lamar He's not. No, I don't think he'll be
as good this year as Burrow or Herbert with Harbaugh.
I don't think he moves as well or as his
healthy as C. J. Stroud Stafford. And I'll make this
(22:19):
argument all day. If Aaron has a clunker this year
and Stafford gets to a super Bowl, You're going to
start looking at those two careers differently. Stafford was a
hell of a lot better in high school, college, and
the first four years in the pros, and he's going
to be better late. If he crushes the next two years,
you start going down quarterback and.
Speaker 2 (22:37):
Say who's better.
Speaker 1 (22:39):
Aaron doesn't, isn't quite as committed. He has a below
average offensive coordinator in Matt Hackett. That's been established the
offensive lines in flux fingers crossed, but it's not elite.
He has a defensive coach Aaron has become over the
course of the last half dozen years. He'll lead the
NFL in like throwaways, Like if he does like the
(23:00):
play call, Aaron's not taking the arrows, He'll throw it
out of bounce. He did that, as you know with
McCarthy the last two years. You know with lafleur he
may live out of the play. He wasn't disgusted with it.
He was with the McCarthy. He will be with Matt Hackett.
And so I was just saying to somebody, I said,
in the NFC, I viewed him differently. I said, I
(23:21):
look in the AFC right now, I don't think he's
a top I don't think he's a top six quarterback
in the AFC.
Speaker 2 (23:28):
And my take.
Speaker 1 (23:29):
Is, is it possible that the weakness of the Jets.
If Garrett Wilson and Breese Hall stay upright, they're both
the elite. They're both really special. We may look in
week twelve and think Aaron's not as good as Jordan
Love or now Trevor Lawrence or josh or Lamar or
(23:52):
Burrow or and we say he's like the eleventh best
quarterback in the league, and the defense is great. Wilson
and Breesehall are crushing. Smith gives you twelve starts, the
rookie from Penn States better than we think, and we
look up hot take and go, shit, Aaron's closer to
Dak than Mahomes.
Speaker 3 (24:11):
Well, he's forty years old. One thing I've noticed on
the NFL network, and it's hard because he doesn't play
any of these preseason games. I think he's moving slow,
you know, so why every clip I see it's like
he looks like the forty five year old guy if
you just went to the gym you see kind of
jogging around shooting hoops. That's what he looks like. And
that's a little concerning because that's never how he's played. Now.
(24:34):
If he just morphs his game into playing like Peyton
he had or Brady he has the arm to function
like that. Then it gets to the question mark, well,
he's never had to play like that. If his offensive
line they get a couple injuries, all of a sudden,
he's kind of moving for his life. But he can't
run around. What's the problem with Russell Wilson that not
quite as fast? Still thinks he can scramble? Well can't.
It's much easier for Caleb. Why he's way younger and
(24:55):
he's still fast. So you watch these guys kind of
scramble around. Some guys can't, some guys can. I just
think he's such a polarizing individual. It's gonna get weird fast.
You got Monday night against the Niners. What if you
go in there, you get your teeth kicked in all
of a sudden, it's like, oh, here we go again.
I don't like I mean, listen, Robert Saala is a
nice guy. He's been completely over his head. Yeah, you know,
(25:16):
of just being able to handle a star told me something.
Aaron's like, what the hell is what's he talking about?
That's just that's stuff that like Mike McCarthy doesn't you
you know, just knows how to handle Yeah. I mean,
I just think that if his mobility is gone and
not gone where he can't move at all, like Tom
Brady at forty five. But he used to be you know,
(25:36):
seven and a half eight out of ten and now
it's more like five ish, and he's less hesitant to
do it once he realizes I'm not as quick. That
changes the player dramatically. Yes, And you're looking at, like
you said, the influx of new young quarterbacks. You know,
let's use brock Purty as an example. One thing he
can do is scramble around. He moves well, and that
(25:58):
is the modern day football. You have to be able
to move. Because we talked about the the talent coming
in the league. Well, there hasn't been a lot of
Trent Williams come in the league and Larry Allen's over
the last five ten years, but there has been a
lot of defensive lines. So you're at a disadvantage most
games where they got more good defensive linemen than you
do offensive lineman. That's why these quarterbacks being able to
scramble around can save you. Well, if that's gone for him,
(26:20):
with the lack of offensive ingenuity that's in that building.
From a coaching standpoint, what is it argue they could
be screwed relative to the expectation that he's back and
going to save the day.
Speaker 1 (26:31):
Also, I remember as a kid, I got into a
motorcycle accident, ripped up. I still have a scar from it. Huh,
Honda one fifty or something. You know, it was pretty ugly,
and I can remember it took me two years before
somebody finally said, dude, you got to get on that.
A neighborhood dad said, you gotta get on that bike. Kid,
(26:52):
You just got to get You gotta crash again. And
that always sticks in my head that if if you
get hurt doing something, just you got to get back
in there. Brady acknowledges the first year back from his injury,
he didn't want to get he didn't want anybody near
his knees. He got prickly. He would bark at officials.
Are we not acknowledging Aaron is going to be affected
(27:14):
by that? Like Aaron probably deep down feels like he
disappointed the city taking four snaps though it wasn't his fault.
So you've got an aging player, a player that is
going to be hyper sensitive to that, an offensive coordinator
you can't trust. I just I think we look at
the Jets and think Aaron will save us. In my
take is no, Actually I trust their defense. I think
(27:38):
Garrett Wilson is really good. Breese Hall, I think the
on line will kind of figure it out. I'm just saying,
I think we're going to look up at Thanksgiving and
like Aaron sometimes is a weakness.
Speaker 3 (27:51):
I haven't had a chance to read the book or
blisten to the audiobook yet. Obviously there's a lot coming
out about that family moment at the Tahoe golf tournament
where he saw his dad, And obviously there's two sides
to every story. You know, who knows maybe if the
parents are whack jobs and it's not as much on Aaron,
which it kind of feels like that might be, is
not as crazy as on Aaron side. But regardless, isn't
(28:12):
it a pretty consistent theme over the last however many years,
the quarterback and the family relationship. You look at Peyton
and Tom, obviously their families are very very close. Caleb's
tight with his you know, Russell and his family. You
just go around the league, Patrick Mahomes and his family,
Lamar's moms, his agent. Yeah, I mean, it's that's strained,
like I saw some craziness when I was a kid
(28:34):
with some you know, extended family. That's hard on any
human I don't care who it is. It wears on you.
Even if you're right or they're right, it doesn't even
matter after a while. It's just that lack of you
only have so many people in your life that when
you grow up and that relationship with your brothers and
sisters and your parents, you remove that. I can't even imagine.
(28:59):
I can't relate to that because I the relationship i'd
had with my dad's past now, but my dad, my mom,
my brother, that seems like hard to overcome in certain
moments of just to gain some levity in life, just
a game like hey, I need to talk to somebody,
not even about something serious. That's that's an underrated part.
(29:19):
And I think a lot of people sarcastically mock and
stuff I'm talking about as a human being, you know.
And I wonder if that situation, I mean, he sees
his dad at that tournament and goes up to him.
I mean, that's what a fucking awkward thing they got
going on.
Speaker 2 (29:32):
Yeah, okay, so.
Speaker 1 (29:36):
I want the Errand thing was a mild take because
I do think most people realize these young quarterbacks are sensational,
They move better than Aaron, better health, many have offensive coaches.
If I had a take, and I know you know
I've used this example before, John, and you, as a
scout probably know this better than anybody I've talked about before.
(29:59):
Seahawk Camp was in Cheenie, Washington, where I went to college,
and I've talked about before. Seeing Eugene Robinson from Colgate
his first practice with the Seahawks and literally knowing, I mean,
I had people around me and I could name them.
I went to college with him, saying, holy shit, he
is lighting up Steve Largent, who is that colegate who?
(30:24):
At that time, I don't even know if I'd ever
seen an IVY League game on TV. You know this
is back in like nineteen eighty two. It doesn't take
long to see certain things. Right. Here's here's a take.
Bon Nicks has got a better arm than I think
(30:44):
people think. I think he's more cut and athletic than
people think. I noticed this when I saw him live
on the field against Utah. That game everything went Oregon's way.
And I know it's preseason, John, but I've watched bon
Nicks and I'm like, oh shit, Caleb defensive coach, Drake Made,
(31:04):
defensive coach Jaden, defensive coach JJ McCarthy, Hurt Pennix may
not play hot take bow Knicks is the best quarterback
this year out of the crop.
Speaker 3 (31:17):
I think Caleb will be better because of what he's
dealing with. But I think bo Nicks is going to
shut a lot of people up really fast. I mean,
it's already inevitable. He's started for week one, He's got
a coach. I would say, who a well established, very
rich guy who's already won a Super Bowl, who kind
of has this like back against the wall chip on
his shoulder right now? Yeah, because that year last year
(31:40):
was probably not fun and is anything good? I would
say nothing has a chance to age better faster than
boot and Russell out for eighty million dollars in selecting
this guy. And let's face it, leading up to the draft,
before he inevitably picked him, everyone was going, Oh, Sean
Payton wants the bow Knicks. That's tarot, that's awful. You
can't drap this guy that high. This is crazy, this
(32:01):
is stupid, and it's like, now, I mean, this guy
has a pretty good idea. He was one of the
rare guys that was all in on mahomes. He like
Drew Brees once upon a time when not everyone was
lining at the door, you know. So I would say
that you have an offensive coach is just a huge
advantage and a guy that can develop quarterbacks and a
guy who can call the place. To me, my biggest
(32:21):
thing is not offensive and defensive coaches. It's do you
call the place? Do you dictate fifty percent of the game.
And obviously, as an offensive coach, not only are you
calling the place, you're controlling the quarterback then essentially and
the pace of the game. You know, defense is much
more physicality, there's stuff out of your control. Even great
defense gets speed sometime. But as an offensive play caller,
(32:42):
you can completely control the game. And beside that couple
of year stretch which was bad when they I think
Rob Ryan was their defensive coordinator in New Orleans and
they were going seven to nine even though their offense
was setting records. When they've had good defenses, they dominated.
You know, they were consistent ten to twelve win team
in the NFL. That's what Sean Payton's record. It is
when the defense is solid. So their defense a solid,
which it was the second half of last year. And
(33:04):
clearly I think removing Russell Wilson and this is why
I'm out on the Steelers. That thing that you take
in is more than just that miss third down throw.
It's all this other stuff, which, in fairness, I don't
know how much Russell brings it. It's just there now,
it's just part of the deal. And you remove that,
(33:27):
you get this young hungry guy, you get this chip
on the shoulder coach the Raiders naming Gardner Minshew that
they're not going to be any good. The Chargers just
gonna have some injury problems and their depth is going
to be very questionable. Is it crazy to think Denver
could finish second in this division? No, he clearly likes
this team. They like their rookie class. They got some
good wide receivers. Watching them play, I mean, I don't
think it's inconceivable they go nine to eight.
Speaker 1 (33:49):
Boon Nicks played with Troy Franklin. Troy average one hundred
and five yards per game, fourteen touchdowns. Shit, they played
together in college. Like, think about this, He's twenty four,
Drake May's twenty one offensive coach I think between Mims, Cortland,
Sutton and Troy Franklin, they have a good tight end,
two capable backs. I'm like, that's that's at least averaged
(34:09):
the slightly above average. I mean, look at Dallas Cowboys.
They're completely dependent on Ceedee lambstaying healthy or they're screwed.
So to me, I look at Denver and I'm like,
every single year it was Houston. Last year, there's a
pop team and I'm watching bow Nicks and I've had
a couple of texts with Sean Payton. It's not lost
on me that a former NFL quarterback that I was
(34:32):
talking to in the building at Fox several months ago
said just remember Drake, Caleb and Jaden have defensive coaches.
He goes, I don't care how talented they are. And
this guy came into the league years ago and had
a defensive coach. He said, it matters like you're nervous,
you don't you you know he said a defensive coach.
(34:55):
I mean, Mark Sanchez told me years and years ago,
it's like, you know, the reality is an offense of coach.
You talk at night, you text, you know, your texting.
Defensive coaches think differently. Their buddies are defensive coaches. Their
favorite players are Belichick's favorite player is Lawrence Taylor. It's
not Tom Brady. So I think I just think Denver
(35:15):
is better. PFF has their personnel near the bottom of
the league, and I'm like, ah, I don't.
Speaker 3 (35:21):
Know wide Peyton Manning love Adam Gase because he could
text him at one o'clock in the morning and he
texts him right back, maybe talking football. These offensive guys
I saw with Andy Reid sleeps like three hours a night.
He's just in the whiteboard. Just these guys. It's like
a creative The mentality is it's night and day. Different.
Now some of the defensive guys are just such natural leaders.
(35:41):
The aggressiveness kind of it's a different personality. But yeah,
I mean, I think the offensive play caller is the
number one guy you'd ever want running, especially in this
modern day football. But who are the options for pop teams? Right?
It have to be a team an on an AFC
West team, right, not the Chiefs, So it'd be the Raiders,
(36:04):
the Chargers of the Broncos. I think most people are
out on the Raiders when you watch their quarterback situation.
Listen I'm a Jim Harbad die hard, but they just
got a ton of injuries. They got a guys that
have always injured. That makes me nervous. Their quarterback just
got out of a boot. The Jets, who we talked about,
I would say, are pretty uh, are walking a very
(36:27):
very tight line. They could shatter in front of our
eyes immediately. The Steelers I got coming back to Earth.
They were already a playoff team. The same with the
same with the Cleveland Browns because their quarterback situation just
scares the crap out of me. I think it's wide
open for a team like the Broncos to kind of
sneak up on.
Speaker 2 (36:46):
People, for sure.
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Speaker 1 (37:58):
So as we go into the season, you know, I
thought about this if the Chiefs three p. Belichick didn't
do it. And we talk a lot about the Chiefs.
We talk about Mahomes and Brady, right, Brady's going to
be more productive, but Mahomes is more talented and increasing
(38:18):
in production. But I want to talk about Andy Reid
and Belichick. Andy Reid wins a third straight Super Bowl.
Belichick never did it. Andy Reid two teams to a
Super Bowl. Belichick didn't do it. Andy Reid had to
face for the first fifteen to twenty years of his
(38:40):
coaching career, a league that allowed Belichick's favorite rules to exist,
Yet Andy still flourished five NFC championship. The minute the
league pivoted to offense and Brady left, Belichick is it's Jurassic.
He is completely tone deaf. And my take is we've
(39:01):
always felt there's Belichick and Shula. Andy wins at third straight.
Andy's Super Bowl Philadelphia, Kansas City. Andy's won with terrible quarterbacks.
Andy's one with everybody. Andy's assistants are better. Andy's the
one coach that gave Belichick real problems. Go look at
their record. I think that Andy Reid Belichick gap gets
(39:27):
really thin, really thin. And if we're going to be fair,
the league pivoted offense seven years ago, about seven eight,
You're like, I mean everything now, it's go look at
Belichick's last seven drafts, last four seasons. I again, I'm
(39:48):
not confusing it. I think Belichick is a better coach
than Shula, and Shula has more wins. It's not all
just on record. Andy Reid is good with everybody at quarterback.
I think the gap closes. I think it gets really
close if he knocks down three straight super Bowl why.
Speaker 3 (40:08):
I'd say it's been closing dramatically fast over the last
two years, as he's knocked these last two off. Right,
I'm torn on this because I'm an Andy Reid guy,
but I am a Belichick defender of Like, we know
what we watched. We watched him out coach everyone for
eighteen years and then clues Andy beat him in a
Super Bowl. Now he had Brady, he had McNab. That's
(40:28):
the gap there's pretty wide. And he did beat him
Mahomes first year on the road in that AFC championship
game that went overtime. That was one of the better
games the Patriots ever played in. But you could argue
if to me, if Andy wins won more, the ability
to coach every type quarterback, absolutely, and like you said,
and win pretty big. I mean, he was consistently going
(40:49):
to the playoffs with Alex Smith, no problem, right, winning
with Donovan McNabb, who had some serious flaws. Belichick could
not only coach or have success with one guy. That
guy was wired like a defensive guy. You could just
dog cuss them, you could scream at him. That's not
really the way most quarterbacks handle. And you put anyone
else in that place it gets a little weird really fast,
(41:12):
where I think Andy's personality is much more tailored to quarterbacks,
which have always been the name of the game. Right,
So Bill just got pretty lucky. He just got this
rare bird that was wired more like Mike Vrabel or
Teddy Bruski could just take it. Most quarterbacks were not
taking that type of abuse. So why every article that
was ever written about any backup quarterback that sat next
(41:33):
to Tom said, this is the craziest thing I've ever seen.
The way that he takes this. It's like it terrified
everyone else because if mahomes ainc again, it doesn't mean
you can't coach a guy hard or push a guy.
But they treated everyone as equals when they're not equals.
Joe Montana, John Elway, Peyton Manning, they weren't equals in
the room and the room knows it. But Belichick's thing,
(41:54):
to me could have only worked with Tom. It's why
they were the perfect marriage, one of the great sports
marriages of all time. Yeah, Andy can date anybody. If
you gave Andy any of the top let's just say,
fifteen quarterbacks in the NFL. I'm not saying the Chiefs
win the super Bowl. You gave him like Josh Allen,
they'd win the Super Bowl. Joe Burrow Lamar would be fun.
(42:15):
I think he could just take like Dak, you random
guys and they would have eleven to twelve wins. Now,
they may lose in a playoff game because that guy's
not good enough, but he would be a lock for
the playoffs. And I don't think you could say that
about Bill as the years went on rotating just take
give me, give him Dak Prescott, He's a lock to win.
I don't feel that way. So that's Andy's trump card
(42:35):
in this modern day football. It ain't even close right,
his ability to do offense and quarterback Bill couldn't. That's
why I think a lot of people were off Bill. Now,
it'll be very fascinating to watch how this offseason or
this season goes with Bill playing this new role. I
would say Bill is very dependent on one individual over
the last fifteen years, and that was Josh McDaniels. When
(42:58):
he had Josh and Josh available, you're getting a package deal.
And once you hire Bill and Josh, well, no one's
ever hiring Josh to be a head coach ever. Again,
right in the NFL maybe in college, but so maybe
Bill has that going for him. But yeah, I mean this,
I don't even think it's remotely close. And I think
Mahome is a good example of like, the guy that
(43:19):
we see now is so much different than the guy
we saw early on the way they've coached him, the
way he's changed. And just if you can't coach the quarterbacks,
I mean he put now Andy put Wan Castillo's defensive
coordinator when I was there. Everyone makes mistakes, yeah, but
to put Matt Patricia as your offensive coordinator really the
(43:41):
second year coach is one of the most insane things
ever and first great as Belichick's resume is, that's like
an all time stain. Yea. To me, that's a bigger
stay than like the Flate gate or any of that
other crap.
Speaker 2 (43:50):
You know.
Speaker 1 (43:50):
I mean, there are these there are these moments. I mean,
every great actor Brando had six bombs.
Speaker 3 (43:58):
Danira, they all do right, But there.
Speaker 1 (44:00):
Are moves over the last three to four years with
Belichick that I can't unsee, and the Matt Patricia thing
and the five six straight. I mean, there are drafts
where they don't have a single good player. It stains
how I look at Bill and how the beginning, and
any great movie starts great and finishes strong. Bill's ending
(44:24):
is a catastrophe.
Speaker 3 (44:26):
Think about this too. I do think it's a little
weird that this Bill was like this ultimate dictator. You
don't get it wrong, Like you're in the building with Andy,
like he's the boss, but he interacts clearly a little
different because look at his resume of like Doug Peterson
was the right hand guy won a Super Bowl. Matt
Naggie they claim was a disaster, took the Bears in
the playoffs. Ron Rivera took the Paranthers to the Super Bowl.
(44:51):
Andy guy John Harbaugh turned out to be pretty good.
Like why do Andy's guys just function pretty well? And
Bill's guys football coaching is a hard and every guy's
gonna lose, have a bad season, maybe get You're gonna
get fired eventually, his guys get run out of the
building in record speed. Yeah, I mean Joe Judge immediately
like the same organ. Josh McDaniels couldn't even make it
(45:12):
through the second year after like ten years to a
step back, Patricia, whatever the hell happened in Detroit? I mean,
at all times, couldn't get along with Stafford, Oh my god. Yeah.
So and these are his core guys. Like when you
think Bill of the last fifteen years, Pat Brian Flores
couldn't get along with a soul on offense, hate his
(45:33):
interactions with the quarterback because that's what they saw. Think
about that, that's what those guys saw. So defensive guys
scream at the quarterback. You're like, this ain't gonna work.
That ain't Tom Brady.
Speaker 2 (45:43):
Success or failure.
Speaker 1 (45:45):
All of Andy Reid's guys are guys you'd love to
have a beer with. They're good dudes, well liked. Go
to Bill's Charlie Wise, Joe Judge, he just ran on
He just ran on Twitter about getting fired from Serious saying,
I was like, Charlie, what's going on here? Almost all
of Bill's guys, Eric Mangini's an exception, Almost all of
(46:06):
them there are a lot of work. Like if they
were in the building, you'd avoid them. They're harsh, they're intense,
they're arrogant. Bill is attracted to that quality, that sort
of pseudo confidence, arrogance. Andy's guys, Matt n Aggie used
to call me, Hey, thanks for saying nice stuff. You know,
my kids listened this morning going to work, like Doug
(46:28):
Peterson's a great guy. They're all nice guys, and Andy
is looking for people that Andy barks, So I think
he looks for people psychologically that can comfort players when
he barks. Bill barks and doubles down on the barking.
(46:49):
And that's why that's why the minute Brady leaves, free
agents don't want to go there. Brandon Ayuk's like not
remotely interested in that culture Bill created.
Speaker 3 (47:01):
Yeah, to me, it was his culture was all dependent
on Tom. Once Tom established himself and go back to Walsh,
like they could have pivoted way earlier to young and
been fine, Like it wasn't dependent on one individual. I
just think that's an all time outlier situation what we
saw because the way the quarterback could take it, none
of these other quarterbacks take it. It's why every single guy,
(47:23):
to a man, the backup quarterbacks that all rotate around
the league were like, this is the craziest thing I've
ever seen. And it's not like obviously there were a
small percentage of teams that just are really buttoned up,
do it the right way. The Ravens, the Chiefs, the Patriots,
like the gap of how they get ready isn't it.
But the way that they treated the quarterback in front
of the entire team didn't happen anywhere else because that's
(47:45):
not normal and you're never gonna see that away. And
I understand why the Patriot guys defend it, Like if
I was Edelman, I would defend it too, because they
won a lot, but it wasn't sustainable. Once you remove
the keycog, it you crumbled down. And I'm telling you
it's gonna get really ugly there. It's gonna get really
ugly there. That team rolling out Jacoby. I mean, Drake's
(48:06):
a major project. People are gonna be mad at Craft
because everything he did to Bill, even obviously didn't end
well with Bill on the field, but you respect a
guy that brought you so much. It's I think it's
gonna be really bad. And you talk to like I
text around people in the league, they're like, buckle up, Phillis,
(48:26):
it's gonna be ugly. And it's not like they're playing
in a division. I mean, the Bill's got a lot
of moving parts. Obviously they are the king of the division.
The Dolphins aren't great. The Jets could implode if you
told me they didn't win a divisional game, I'd believe you.
Speaker 2 (48:41):
All right.
Speaker 1 (48:43):
So Chris Peterson's gone, Nick Saban's gone, Jim Harbaugh's gone,
Dabo Sweeney is struggling with a transfer portal, and an
il Ryan Day is struggling defining what Ohio State is.
Take Kirby smart out. He's considered the best coach in
college football. I think Kaylin de Boor's really close. And
(49:05):
you'll the rest of the country will see that what
Husky fans know. It's really interesting. And this is why
you can't give up on people. I could make an
argument the third best coach in college football is Lane Kiffen,
and this sport bailed on him. Old miss has no
business being as good as they are. I mean, let's
be honest. The state produces, I mean, how many players.
(49:29):
They can't get many, and Georgia gets the best in Georgia,
Bama gets the best in Bama.
Speaker 2 (49:34):
Florida. It's rated by everybody. He is.
Speaker 1 (49:38):
That state's only got three and a half like million people.
Speaker 2 (49:40):
It's Oregon.
Speaker 1 (49:41):
It's got more players than Oregon. But generally speaking, most
of these teams in the top ten come from highly
populated states, fertile recruiting grounds. Is that people bail The
Raiders bailed on him, you know, college football bailed on him.
And you start looking around and I'm like, and by
the way, Sark somewhere in the top ten. He may
(50:02):
not have the trophy yet, but recruiting, culture, building, quarterback development,
Sark knows what he's doing. He's won a lot of games.
Washington was zero to twelve when he took it over.
He had what they were seven wins second year, and
he handed Chris Peterson some dudes, some NFL bodies. But
I was thinking about that today. Take Kirby out and
Kaitlin to Bore.
Speaker 2 (50:22):
We know it.
Speaker 1 (50:23):
You know, Urban's gone, Harbaugh's gone, Savan's gone, Chris Peterson's gone.
All these guys. Dabbo is struggling with nil on the
transfer portal. He's struggling with it.
Speaker 3 (50:31):
Well, he won't do it. He won't do it.
Speaker 2 (50:32):
He won't do.
Speaker 1 (50:33):
Jesus and Ryan Day hired Chip Kelly, which I think
is brilliant because the hole in his game, which he acknowledges,
is the run game. Ryan admits that, so he can't
put him as a top five coach now because he's
beating Perdue. It's you know, Lane Kiffin can coach his
ass off, That's my take.
Speaker 3 (50:49):
You know, one of the best stats I remember here
in last year was Ole Miss has never had back
to back double digit seasons win seasons in the history
of the program. Lane did it twenty two and twenty three,
and last year when he beat LSU. You're watching him going.
The talent gap on these two rosters can't be as
close as what it looks like on the field. Obviously
(51:10):
he scares people, but to me, he's got one of
the blue blood's, whether it's Florida, if they make a
change whoever. You know, there were rumors that I had
heard Oregon when Dan Lanning got it, he was really interested.
People just wouldn't touch him. You get to a point, though,
I think, especially in college sports in the NFL, you
win enough, who cares, like, what are we even talking about?
(51:33):
And a lot of people think they're going to be
a top ten team. He crushed the transfer portal. Oh yeah,
good quarterback.
Speaker 2 (51:39):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (51:40):
I do think there's a lot of pressure though. It's
one of those where even if he wins eight or
nine games and misses the playoffs, it's still a remarkable accomplishment.
You win ten eleven and then nine you're at ol Miss,
not Ohio State, right, Like, I'm with you on Kalen Newbor.
He's a star. And don't be shocked when they're back
in the final fourth Alabama right away, Right, but you
(52:02):
should win at Alabama even if some guys leave, you're
still inheriting. Every single guy in that roster is someone
that Nick had recruited. Right, you should win Ohio State.
You obviously should win at USC, even Sark. It is
to me much more impressive that they have an unlimited
checkbook to sign whoever they want, whenever they want.
Speaker 1 (52:19):
Now.
Speaker 3 (52:19):
Sark had a good year last year, though kind of
a little softened in the playoff game against Washington. It's
way easier to win at Texas than it is at
Old Miss. Like Lane went to what Fai or Fui
or whatever that school was in Florida that no one
could even get, right if I pulled random people that
follow sports, and then to Old Miss, who usually runs
through coaches every three or four years, and now he's
(52:40):
kicking everyone's ass. He's beaten LSU. Yeah, I mean, I
just think that it's it's easy to hire. I think
part of what's worked against Lane. It's easy for USC
to give one hundred million do to Lincoln like everyone's
on board. It's easy when LSU gives ninety plus to
Brian Kelly, like we see. I think it is controversial
in some of these ads and whatever to hire Lane
(53:03):
at this point in time. You're crazy if you do not.
They're hiring these billion napiers and all these other guys.
Lanes werenning circles around them all. So, I mean, what
he's doing at ole Miss now here's the thing. He's
getting paid nine ten million dollars there and they clearly
had a pretty good But does he need to leave?
Speaker 1 (53:19):
Well, yeah, I mean I think some of its lifestyle.
He likes the South. He's told me that he likes
the style. He loves fishing. He's an intense guy. He
likes it's he gets some space. People are nice, you know.
Lane's little cocky, unique personality. But I also think he's
got a great heart and I think he's really I
(53:39):
think he's really a good coach. I think sometimes when
dad's a coach, or dad's a broadcaster, or dad's a
bank president, the Sun gets placed into a position he's
not quite ready for. And if it wasn't for Monnie Kiffin,
Lane probably doesn't get the raider job.
Speaker 2 (53:56):
We don't know.
Speaker 1 (53:56):
He's just another young assistant McVeigh, you know, like grandpa
or somebody was a general manager. That's different.
Speaker 2 (54:03):
It wasn't high profile.
Speaker 1 (54:05):
But I think one of the vagaries of having a famous,
successful dad and if you go into the same industry
is you tend to get inserted into places that eventually
you are ahead of people and you will be successful.
But Lane was like kid coach, like thirty two years old,
and it's and I can't remember when he went to USC.
He just wasn't he And I was rooting for him,
(54:27):
but he was a little loose with his private personal life.
He just didn't quite know how to be a head
coach at USC. Wasn't the play calling. But I think
there is an advantage when dad or grandpa or somebody
ran the bank and you get into finance, there's an advantage.
But I look around college football now and in a
(54:48):
big game, I'm gonna tell you this, I would not
want to face Lang Kiffin. I think he's clever. He
by the way, playing with house money at all. Miss
He's he's like he has the talent of most the
top six, but none of the pressure that an Ohio
State does if they met in the playoff.
Speaker 3 (55:05):
I think one thing that is dramatically different about him
is at USC he almost had like this angry, edgy
anti media being fun, and he's the complete opposite. Now
he's just much more looser, especially in front of a camera.
He feels much more natural. Maybe he just embraced it. Listen,
Jimmy Sexton and Nick Saban changed his life. He says
(55:28):
it as much right when he goes to Nick, and
I wonder if he saw Nick like, you can be
this hard driving, kind of a hole coach on the
field and kind of handle when the lights are on
with the media. Because you're in that business as an
NFL coach. Your roster's your roster. You're not recruiting anyone
out there in college football. It's a little different. It's
why Nick, when the camera's on, kind of turns into
(55:49):
a different guy. He has all these different kind of
like characters he can play where I think Lane struggle
with it now you watch him. I saw this clip
on the internet the other day about he was on
with the SEC the network guys, and they were asking
about his dad and he's like, starts. You just got
this emotional side of Lane. You have to remember Lane
was a quarterback at Fresno State in the late nineties
(56:10):
who when Pat Hill recruited Billy Vollock and David Carr,
they said, Lane, you're never gonna play her. Immediately just
transitioned into being a coach with Jeff Tedford, who was
the offensive coordinator. This guy transitioned at like twenty years
old to being a coach. And like you said, to me,
it is an advantage if you do like you're mentally
or I would say mature enough to handle it. Like
(56:32):
Kyle Shanahan. This guy went right into it. And to me,
Kyle's much more serious in the sense of you're not
screwing around as much. Lane has some interests, I would
say outside the football building. I wonder if he just
has corralled it all and got the right people around him.
But his personality in front of the quote unquote media
or when he's doing things with a camera on, to me,
(56:53):
is dramatically different than the guy that we saw at USC,
which I thought was part of his undoing. He wasn't
that likable? Isn't that a huge part of life? Like,
if you're kind of likable, people root for you. Like
the Sam Pittman guy at Arkansas. I think he's not
very good, but everyone loves the guy.
Speaker 1 (57:08):
Yeah, he's like everybody's really friendly. Stepdad be hard to fire,
you know. It's like the Freakonomics top To talked about that.
I think it was Freakonomics was the book they talked
about that the doctors that get sued aren't the bad doctors.
The doctors that get sued are often the most educated
and the most successful doctors. They don't have good bedside manner.
(57:29):
It's impossible to sue even the incompetent doctor you love, right,
It's hard to fire somebody you really have great affection for.
It's easy to sue the asshole surgeon that's screwed up
during the surgery. Right. Like. So, I think as you
become more likable, and let's be honest about this, my
dad used to say this, you your employment will be
(57:50):
based in rooms that you're not in. People will raise
their hand, a boss will say, you know, raise your hand.
Colin stays or goes.
Speaker 2 (57:57):
There's nine, you need five.
Speaker 3 (57:58):
You have rid of middle cough, the room goes silent.
Speaker 2 (58:01):
Me and Logan have those meetings almost every other week.
Speaker 1 (58:05):
There's a lot to be said with Lane is that
when you're a little snarky and you go in a
three game losing streak, or it's just much easier to
get rid of guys that are.
Speaker 3 (58:12):
Pain Well, I'll give you a guy because in the
NFL that only goes so far. If you're winning six
to seven games, no matter how much they like you,
they run you out of town. Arthur Smith, I remember
when they fired or Arthur Smith was fired by Arthur
Blank and Arthur Blanks I love the guy. I didn't
want to do it, but he just wasn't good enough.
I'm watching I was slipping around channels and watching Big
ten Network. They had on Matt Ruhle. I'm like, ah,
(58:34):
this guy's I see why this guy a good college coach.
He's just kind of got a personality, can own the
room when the camera's on, and you're like, I get it.
And I've heard he's not easy to play for. Yes,
it can be really difficult. And they're the classic team
of like they bring in this young hot shot quarterback,
and the expectations are high and it's usually hard to
(58:56):
live up to those. All of a sudden, you win
seven eight games, people are maybe like we sneak into
the playoffs. Week two is Nebraska hosting Colorado. I mean,
I don't know if you saw the clip. I think
it was yesterday or two days ago. Even Dion was like, hey, CBS,
whoever hear from CB, I'm sorry, We're all good now.
I would imagine someone in Colorado like, we can't be
(59:16):
doing all this, Like we gotta be a little careful.
Pick your battles. You're not you're not the player. And
that's where I think Dion kind of carries himself like
you're the coach, but you got all these other guys
and beside your couple sons in Travis Hunter, some of
these guys aren't gonna be all back up all your words, right.
We don't have Alabama. Who've gotta be careful that game
because last year, remember Nebraska's quarterback looked like me. I mean,
(59:39):
it was a joke.
Speaker 2 (59:40):
It was awful.
Speaker 3 (59:41):
It's gonna be a little more interesting this time around.
That's one of those there's a lot of like you know,
USC LSU and all these That's a game that I
have this season circled like I want to. I'll be
will not be moving off the couch for that one.
Speaker 1 (59:55):
John Middlecoff, former NFL Scout three and out as always,
Buddy Gray stuff see con the volume. Thanks so much
for listening. If you've enjoyed the podcast, take a moment,
rate and review
Host
Colin Cowherd
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