April 1, 2022 • 35 mins
Thomas leaves Tampa and heads to the French Quarter to sit down with iconic New Orleans Saints GM, Mickey Loomis. Mickey and Thomas discuss longevity in the NFL, the remarkable career of Drew Brees, and Mickey shares his philosophy on servant leadership, and resilience and strength of the city of New Orleans.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
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Forward slash donate. Welcome to the GM journey with Thomas Demtrov.
(00:53):
All right, welcome back. I mean look, traveling from Tampa Bay,
from the newly meanted GM Jason Light, straight across the
highway and across the state to New Orleans to meet
with Mickey Loomis, one of the Godfathers of GMS in
the League right now. I mean, what a great trip
this was. You guys will listen into some great conversation here.
(01:16):
I mean here's a guy who has proven himself at
so many different levels. He is, he truly is, the
guy that most times the league, though they may not
always like his answers, because he's a direct, straightforward guy.
They will go to him for information and go to
him for opinions about really, really important things. We were
(01:36):
on the General Manager's advisory and committee together. I have
nothing but great respect for him. Most people think that
we should have been massive nemesis, but we never were
that we were. We were really, really close, and people
usually laugh at that because they expect it to be
the other way around. Take a listen. A lot of
(01:58):
really good soul for conversation. Isn't well and we're in
the middle of the French quarter. We walked around, had
a couple of cocktails, talked about in life as well,
and then, after this great interview that you listened to,
we went and had some great dinner. Anyway, really really
cool stuff. Listen Up. I've been thinking lately, and you
(02:19):
may take offense to this, but you have now become
the godfather of football executives in the world. How does
that feel? Well, look, I hate the terminology because God
friend of means two things to me, old and mean
and nasty. And Look, I don't think I mean in nasty.
(02:40):
I'll go with the older. But when I think of
the Godfather of g MS, I think of Gil Brandt
and Bill Polian and guys that are still with US
still have a lot to offer. Um. Look, there's guys
in our league that as experienced as I am. You
Know Kevin Colbert and Rix Bielman, yourself, guys that that
have been around for a good period of time and
(03:00):
been successful. So I Goshal, I hope everybody thinks of
me that way. Well, you have such a presence and
we'll get into that a little bit. Interestingly enough, I
look at this often. I think people think that you
and I should be adversaries because you know the crazy
heated relationship between and uh sort of competitiveness between your team,
(03:22):
the New Orleans Saints, and my former team, the falcons,
that built over years, and people think, well, of course
you're not friends, you're not gonna deal with Mickey. The
crazy thing is our opportunity to work together in the
General Manager's Advisory Committee. That was a big thing for
me and in my formative years as a GM and
you became one of my most trusted and closest confidence
in the business and I appreciate that. Appreciate that. Beyond
(03:45):
your my personality and your personalities are different. We have
different approaches. I probably are. Am a little bit more
of an open book as far as my approach to things. You,
respectfully have more of a guarded, uh, an appropriate, respectfully
guarded side. Um, so your approach is that? Is that personal?
(04:08):
Is that your personal approach? Yeah, well, yeah, it's a
good question. First of all, I do hate the Falcons.
I just don't hate the people that worked for the
Atlanta fols. I have a lot of respect for the
coaches that you've had their the you know, the owner,
all the people involved in your building. That doesn't I
can separate the people from the rivalry and I think
(04:30):
you can as well, and we've been able to do that.
We've had a lot of great conversations. Listen, you've helped
me lots of times with with UH perspective and advice
and things like that, and hopefully I've done that for you. Um, look,
I I've I grew up in the business and I've been,
you know, part of the NFL for thirty eight years
(04:52):
here now, and Mike McCormick was the general manager that
hired me, and he was he came from a perspective
of servant leadership up and came from a perspective. Now,
Mike McCormick was a hall of fame player as well
as a coach before he became a GM, and he
was always of the elk that, man, the face of
(05:12):
your franchise is your player, your best players, and your coach.
And as a GM, you know you're taking a back
seat and you're taking a role behind the scene, servant leadership,
and so that's been my perspective and so I don't like,
I don't believe in the GM being the outfront guy
most of the time. Now, when there's adversity and accountability,
(05:37):
you need to stand up and take that, but when
things are going well, man, let's let's let the let's
let your players and coach, you know, be the face
of your franchise. It's a great point and I went
back and forth, you know, with that whole idea as
a general manager, what is expected of me and what
what wasn't over the years. Okay, I'm gonna Bring in
another analogy here and you're not gonna like this one.
(05:58):
I mean inside the NFL and outside the NFL. Mickey
loomis has a little bit of a wizard of Oz
element to him. I don't know this is highly intelligent,
highly powerful, highly intuitive, but behind the scenes interesting perspective.
But I mean there are a lot of people in
my role, as we were growing up through and became
(06:18):
general managers, who still have this like really uh sort
of deep, uh seated interest in trying to tap into
your brain and what you know and how you put
together a team, how you lead. Again, back to what
you just explained, working with Sean Payton, who is a
really strong minded and wilful and productive and talented man
(06:41):
and football coach. Can you talk to us a little
bit about that relationship and how two people with a
lot of intelligence and a lot of presence coexists, because
it's not easy. We know how important that is. Yeah, well,
it's a good question and I feel like in our
business the most important relationship is head coach GM. I
(07:04):
think that's a really important relationship in order to have
sustained success. And UH, man, there's egos involved and and look,
I think me and a head coach in the NFL
is the toughest job in store. I really do. You've
got full players, so many coaches to manage, so much
time management, Um, all the things that are involved in
(07:27):
being a greed head coach is. It's so difficult and look,
I'm here to relieve as much of that stress as
I can. I'm not here to add stress to our
head coach. Look, I I believe the head coaches is
uh should be one of the faces, if not the
(07:47):
face and the voice of your franchise. I don't have
uh any notion otherwise about that. Now, that doesn't mean
I'm not I'm not trying to lead our group and
lead our team and lead our organization, but I recognize
how difficult his job is and I'm gonna have to
take a back seat in terms of ego and and
(08:09):
I'm gonna have to uh compromise and some things that
I don't necessarily want to compromise it at times, but
I think for the good the organization, is good the team.
That's what we should be doing. Well, I love the
fact over the years, we've talked about it, the respect
that you have for Sean and his job as a
head coach, as you just alluded to, and his respect
for you is what makes you guys a very special
(08:29):
organization and I'm while I've always been widely interested in
some of the intricacies of that with uh, you know
where you guys are in a relationship and it's so important.
We saw a pack back in the day. I remember
when I first got this job, or even before, I
looked at some of the people out there, like Marty
Shott and I'm in a J Smith, two incredibly um
talented football men different parts of the organization. One was
(08:51):
a GM and one was a head coach. And it's
splintered and and I feel like I can talk about
it because it was very public. You guys just have
a really cool grasp about you and it's everyone admires
it from a far, whether they share it with you
or not, or whether we're supposed to share it or not.
As a former Atlanta people, it is a really, really
impressive deal. So well, let me just say that it's
not all roses and butterflies. You know. We've had our times,
(09:15):
you know, and you've got to work through that. And Look,
if you committed and you and and winning is the
most important thing, then you know, you find ways to
to compromise and and and, uh yeah, we've been able
to do that and that's as much a credit to
him as it is to me. This and this is
this is a two way street. It's not a one
way street, not a one ray street. Well, so, then
I started thinking about you've been involved at so many levels,
(09:38):
not only the general manager's advisory committee, excuse me, but
a number of other highly influential committees in this in
this league. Um, you've done a lot of the league.
Everyone appreciates it, whether they come and shake your hand
about it or whether they're talking about it behind your back.
It's really appreciated. It comes back to my analogy of
you being the Godfather which you you've battled. I get it.
(10:00):
Do you ever, with all of that you've given back
to the to the organization and the League, the portrayal
of them, the portrayal of where the saints are, Um,
of being, you know, pushing the limits, which I respect
a great deal, do you ever get to a spot
where you think, well, that's not necessarily case, or are
(10:20):
you proud of where you are, your aggressiveness and your approach? Yeah, look,
that's a good question. Uh, and I would say, look,
if I had to go back in time where there's
some things that you know, we might do differently, probably, yes,
but look, we're we're pushing. We push the limits without
without training to cross the line Um and, you know,
(10:42):
different people have different perspectives about that. I get that,
but listen, we're trying to win, we're trying to do
it the right way, we're trying to have sustained success
and and uh, look, I believe in the way we operate,
I do. And I also believe in in the league.
I believe in the you know, for the good of
the League. I think we have the best in professional sports.
You know, I believe in the integrity of our game.
(11:05):
I believe that that that's what makes our game great
is is that in any given year we're on a
level playing field. You know, every franchise has an opportunity
to be successful. There we're not constrained by, you know,
one group having so many, much more resources than another.
We have an opportunity to be successful on our you know,
(11:27):
based upon the merits of our abilities. And so I
love our league, I do. I love football of the game.
I'm passionate about the game, passionate about the people, not
just with other teams and our team, but with the
League office too. I am I don't always agree with
with what someone else does or what the League does, but,
you know, I try to I try to I try
(11:49):
to be empathetic about where their position is. So you
to that point and I love that response. there. Outside
of your organization there's always been an element of us
against the world, saints, which, again, we can all throw
darts at it. People that aren't involved probably more Atlanta
Falcons than everyone because again there's that crazy uh sort
(12:11):
of competitiveness, that US against the world element. Is that
a function of Sean Payton's leadership? Is it a function
of your fan base, who is incredible here, who are
so passionate about you guys along with you dealing with
all of these natural disasters and and different things that
have come across? Where does that US against the world
come from? Well, I think it's all that. Um, I
(12:34):
think it's all of it. I look, I think if
you look back in history at all the great coaches,
I think almost all of them try to create that
it's us against the world culture within their building. Right, hey,
we we can only rely on each other. We can't
rely on anyone else. So I think that's that's, you know,
(12:55):
natural in professional sports and in in any sport really.
I also think that, look, we have a little bit
of that in our city not a little bit. We
have a lot of that in our city. We've had
to overcome Katrina, we've had to overcome the oil spills,
we had to overcome some things that. You know, we're
trying to prove we're a big league city here and
and then and that we are one of the best
(13:16):
cities in the world. And so I think, I think
it's all of that together creates this man it's ut
against the world and we can lye on each other.
Our Fan base is so, you know, uh, passionate and strong.
That that I think it gets amplified what it would
actually exists in with every team. Well, great, great, uh,
(13:39):
just the idea of your organization being able to pull
that off from where they are again, from the leadership side.
But it seems very, very authentic on the outside, and
that's why it's interesting, because a lot of people can't
bottle that up and they continue to look at New
Orleans again as a team and as a fan base
and quietly marvel. UH, because there's Jealou, he's there. Let's
(14:00):
call the way it is. My my my my fan base,
my my former fan base in Atlanta may not like
to hear that because there's a sort of hate to
love the New Orleans Element. But I mean again, I can't,
I can't be positive enough about what you guys have
done that way. I mean, okay, so you're you're in
a situation where, Um, drew brees retires. You're a general manager, UH,
(14:22):
and in charge of many, many things within this organization. Um,
very lofty position, and you know that your first ostensible,
first ballot hall of Famer Leaves This Organization. How do
you approach that? How, in a nutshell, how do you
approach that? What is your North Star after drew brees?
That's you question. Well, you know, first of all. First
(14:46):
of all, you appreciate the fact that we've had fifteen
years of this guy as a free agent and not
in our wildest dreams, not in your wildest dream as
a GM or mine, would you ever expect to sign
someone and get fifteen years of elite performance and with
all of fame performance. So I'm not particularly sad about it.
(15:09):
I'm just appreciative of how blessed we've been to have
this guy as our leader on the field, his elite
performance and his leadership in the community, just the way
he was represented an organization. I mean I I just
I don't I don't know how you could ask for
more than what he has done, and you you appreciate that.
(15:30):
First of all, you start thinking about you get a
little panic attack, like you know, what the hell are
we gonna do now? And yet I have such great
confidence we have. We have a a great football coach
in Sean Payton, and and a great staff we have.
We have a great personnel staff. I we're gonna be
just fine, Um, and so you have confidence in in
(15:53):
what our organization can do. That's what gives you confidence
about the future, as opposed to, Oh no, we've just
lost this great quarterback. So good about about where we're
at and where we're going. Well, parallel that to New
England losing Tom Brady, having a complicated season this past
season and Tampa Bay thriving. Another team you don't like
(16:16):
to thrive about her a lot, of course. Um, I've
often wondered when you're in that spot, and I haven't
been in that spot as a GM because Matt Ryan
was there the whole time. And I know you're gonna
answer this question the way I assume you're gonna answer it,
because you just did. There's there's sometimes that, when you're
looking at it, the feeling of Man, are we on
borrow time now because we don't have the stud that
(16:37):
is you have so many other people on that team
that are really good football players. That's how you answer
that question to people around the organization who worry. Correct well,
you do. And yet, listen, I've been in the situation.
I was in Seattle for fifteen years and there was
a good period of time there where we struggled to find,
you know, the quarterback. You struggled to find who, who's
going to lead us to the next level. You know,
(17:00):
we we had a great quarterback in Dave Craig. You
know when I when I first got there, and we
had a lot of wins and a lot of success. Um,
not a super bowl, but we had success. And then look,
we we went through a number of years where we
were struggling to find that next guy and never really
could do it in the time that I was there.
So I understand how that works and there's no guarantee
about that. Right, a lot of this is your luck.
(17:23):
A lot of it's luck. I'd like to say it's
all skill. It's not a lot of its luck. It's
it's getting the right guy. It's getting the Right UH
coaching staff in place to develop them. It's putting the
right pieces around them. There's a lot of variables that
exist and I can't guarantee that we're gonna find that
Guy Um and then it's all gonna work. I can't
guarantee that, but I know I know what it looks like.
(17:44):
We know what it looks like as an organization and again,
I have confidence in our coaches, in our head coach,
that if we can find the right people, that they'll
develop and we'll have success. We'll have success. You have
an ultimate an incredible amount of wisdom inside and outside
(18:04):
of football, your background and business and being around this
league for as long as you have. What is your
biggest fear about the future of the NFL? When I
first got the league, I remember going to league meetings
and in the bulk of the League meetings we're talking
about the game. You know the game and how can
we improve the game? How can we improve, Um, the
(18:26):
integrity of the competition? In any given year Atlanta can
win a super bowl, New Orleans can win a super bowl,
cleveland can win a super you know any of these teams.
It's not just the teams that have the most resources that,
you know, in the biggest markets. And so I worry
sometimes that we spend too much time talking about the
(18:47):
marketing and the business, the business of the game, which
is important, by the way, and not enough time spent
on the game itself. And and and uh, look, this
is a game built on players and coaches. That's that's
what it's built on. It's what I believe and we
and we have a fantastic, great game that that people
want to watch and and they get really invested in
(19:10):
our fans here in Atlanta and every city in our
in in uh that it has an NFL team. Those
fans are invested and I think we owe it to
them to put the best product on the field and
in the best and the best uh competition that has integrity. Well,
I mean, I mean, I thought you articulated that very
(19:31):
well and I started thinking about sort of next steps
in all this, Mickey, where we are in the evolution
of the league per diversity issues. Right, we're we're in
a really interesting spot societally, of course, and I think
the league is making some strides. Of course, Um, it
may not be fast enough for certain people, what's your
(19:52):
assessment at this point of where we are with diversity, diversity, highers, etcetera, etcetera,
within the League? Yeah, look, I like that we're paying
attention and to it. I don't have the answers. I'm
not smart enough to have all the answers. Um. I
feel like a lot of our business, Um, is really
blind to color. And yet I know it's not. And so, Um,
(20:15):
I think. I I think more than anything else, having
discussion and having the topic and understanding where Um, the
people in our league that feel like they haven't been
given affair shake. We need to we need to listen
and pay attention and take steps, and we're gonna take
some missteps. I think we have taken this steps and
(20:37):
I think sometimes those have been with good intentions, Um,
and I just think we need to keep on this
path of paying attention to it, Um, taking steps that
are necessary and understanding when we when we're taking this step.
We gotta correct that. Gotta correct. It's a it's a
it's a really it's a valid point that I remember
(20:57):
before I left Atlanta, it was about communication and making
sure that I communicated as well as I could with
everyone within the organization and we had some amazing meetings
during that time which we're quite emotional to hear everyone,
not not only you know, it didn't matter where they were,
across the organization and to hear some of the people
of color within the organization speak to it and some
(21:18):
of some of the underrepresented people with an organization share
their feelings. Are Heartfelt feelings and everyone sharing. I mean
it brought tears to a lot of people's eyes just
because they know we're heading in the right direction. There's
a long way to go. Personally, and I would say
to this to you. Two years ago, when I was
at the owner's meetings and we took our GM photograph
and we see one person of color within the whole
(21:42):
general manager group and that was Chris Greer, and now
I think the League has seven or six, I believe.
I love where we're going. We still have a ways
to go, of course, and we still have a ways
to go on the on the head coaching side. In
the end, I love how people are coming together and
understanding the importance of this and it's a big issue.
Of course. We'll be right back with more from the
(22:07):
GM journey. Let's let's jump to another tangent here for
a minute. So the League continues to pay the general
managers and the head coach as well, and we've seen
recently the general manager salaries are going up, up significantly,
but there's still at large chasm. Do you think it's
(22:30):
still justifiable in this league that there's such a large
chasm between the head coach of the GM salaries? Yeah, look,
you know I said this before, I think the head
coaches have the toughest job in ear league. Um Man,
they're responsible for so much. It's such a emotional Um.
You know, taxing, it's it's it's time, taxing, it's, you know,
(22:55):
just everything about it is so difficult. You've got so
many of the people that you're responsible for and I
think your job is tougher than ours, honestly. So I
don't I don't have any problem with with what they make.
It's it's, you know, they're part of the talent right.
Talent Um in our league should get paid and they
get paid well, and they should get paid well because
(23:16):
they're creating this this business for us, the players and
the coaches, and so I don't have any issue where
it look, you know, I didn't get into this. I
know you didn't get into this because we thought we
were gonna make a great living. We got into it
because we love sport, we love competition. We never being
part of a team and I don't, I don't really
think a lot about about how much I make or
(23:36):
how much, uh, you know, I should make. I just
it doesn't ever cross my mind. And yet I'm grateful
for what I do, what we do make, and I'm
grateful for the ownership and recognizing that we have valuable jobs. Um. Yeah,
so it's a good question and yet I don't spend
a lot of the the time thinking about well, they're they're
they're two incredible positions, meaning there's a lot on your plate.
(23:58):
There's a lot on Sean pay this place, uh plate. Um,
I think we all recognize that for sure. So let's
let's go to that for a minute. You did an
amazing job and your hiring of of your head coach
and since I've done a great job organizationally putting together
the coaching staffs Um coordinators are wildly important. I have
a really strong opinion about that as well, are the
(24:21):
position coaches. They have elements within their job duties that
are really, really important. Do you where is your uh
function and how do you function now? What is your
relationship to helping the coach Put together the coaching staff? Yeah, well,
I think part of that depends upon who your head coaches.
Is the first time head coach or is the experience
(24:43):
I've I've always believed that the head coach should be
able to hire his staff. I think that's important that
they understand that they're they are reporting to him and that,
you know, everything should flow through the head coach. So
our head coaches all always had the ability to hire
his staff. And Look, we have a great relationship and
(25:04):
I think he values my opinion. He'll ask me my
opinion and I'll offer it, you know, when asked. But
it's his responsibility. He's done a fantastic job over the
years of of hiring coaches and and recognizing that. Look,
chemistry amongst the staff is as important as ability. You
have to have ability, but you also have to have chemistry.
(25:26):
You have to have guys that are teachers, Um, guys
that can motivate and and uh and recognize that. Look
in amongst your staff you may have guys with different
strengths and I think he does a great job of that.
But I would say that, you know, the quality of
our staff is directly related to the quality of our
head coach and his ability to identify what he wants
(25:50):
and and find it. Well, he's done a great job
and identifying, of course. And and what I've always been
really impressed with with Sean is his approach to be
very real with his coach is, and no, this is
probably from bill parcels right. He's not worried about being
liked within the building. At least that's my impression. I've
really been impressed making sure that he gets his points
across because ultimately he is the head coach and that's
(26:12):
his his call. Correct well, I think he's great at
setting expectations and and, uh, maintaining accountability, which is what
you're talking about, maintaining accountability. All right, so in the
last few years as a general manager, Um, what leadership
lesson do you think has been something that has come
across your desk that has been sort of adjusting and
(26:36):
altering for your approach as a leader? Yeah, man, I
don't know if it's been in the last few years.
I I just know over time I've, you know, I've
recognized my own strengths and weaknesses. And you know, I've
settled into this servant leadership model. It's and look, there's
lots of different ways to lead right, there's lots of
(26:57):
different ways and I know that that fit. It's me
is uh, I like behind the scenes, you know, I like, uh,
making sure that people have opportunities and then they have
the right environment to be successful. And so that's the
that's the leadership style that I've settled into and uh,
I think it works for us. And and and look,
(27:17):
you have to have people that are complementary to you.
You can't have a bunch of people that are exactly
the same. You need people that will disagree, they will
have a different perspective and uh, you know, I'm so
I'm not afraid of that and I believe that we
have that in our building. And, look, I value it. Well,
you definitely seem like you have it in your building. Again,
from afar. I keep saying that because everyone's eyes are
(27:39):
on you, whether you win the Super Bowl or not
in a certain year, everyone is looking at how things
are run within the states organization across the League. So
to that point, rising sort of mid management level individuals,
what salient point would you share with them if you
have one point to share. Um, look, I've always believe this.
(28:00):
I think setting goals and having dreams and aspirations are great.
I really do, Um, and you get and I have gotten.
You know, young people come in, I want your job,
I want to be a general manager. I want to
be a general manager. And Look, my message is always, man,
you're you're you're looking so far out into the future
(28:21):
you can lose sight of what's right in front of you. Um,
there's thirty two jobs in the NFL that are gentle
manager jobs right, and thousands of people that want them. You,
it would be. It would be. You'd be doing yourself
a disservice if you set yourself up for I'm gonna
be a failure if I don't get one of those
(28:42):
thirty two jobs. So my message is always to our guys,
whoever they are. Man, just focus on the job you have.
If you're an intern, be the best intern you can
ever be. If you're the area Scout, be the best
area scout you can be. If you're the best kept guy,
be the best kept guy you can be, because if
you're the best at what you do, then you'll get
(29:02):
an opportunity to get the job you want. So focus
on the job you have and if you do well,
the job you want will come along. And so I'm
more of look, look at what's right in front of you,
not what's two blocks in front of you. I mean
great wisdom for for anyone around the league or executives
who are climbing through businesses right. I mean too often
(29:23):
there's there's this idea that they want to be it.
Now I used to think I wanted to be the
best college scouting director in the history of the League.
You had different approaches then. We we ask around the
table now, a whole scouting group and you say how
many want to be a GM and it's not just
one hand, it's two hands up in the air. All right.
Last two questions. One the Tim Ferris question. I don't
(29:44):
know if you know Tim Ferris is. He's one of
the most reputable podcasters, lifestyle podcasters, out there. He often
asked in the last few years, Um, what is a
new belief, behavior or approach personally, not professionally as much personally,
that has changed their life? Oh Wow, good question. Um,
I think look, one of the things that happens when
(30:06):
you get older, particularly when you're older like I am
and you have young children. Is Hey, how can I
not just live longer, but how can I have a
quality life for a longer period of time? So, look,
I think the biggest factor in quality life is stress.
You know, how can I eliminate stress from my life
(30:28):
and yet still do a magnificent job in not just
my work life but my family life? So I'm I'm
looking for ways to dial back the stress level. And Look,
I'm fortunate because because I have a great staff, I
have a great organization, we have great culture. It takes
(30:48):
a lot of uh. I have to pay attention to
that garden. We all do. Everyone in our building has
to pay attention to the garden. I've got to a
coach that talks about this all the time. Is that
we can't just assume that we're gonna have Um, you know,
a great locker room, a great culture. We have to
Um tended, and I think the same thing exists in
your home life and your personal life. Is that you
(31:10):
have to you have to tend that and I probably
don't do enough of it, and yet I'm trying to
do better at it. I'm trying to tend to my
personal life. Eliminate stress, eliminate the stress of, you know,
my wife and my children and and uh, I don't
have an answer as to exactly what those things are,
but every day we can find something that, okay, I can,
(31:32):
I can relieve some of the stress off you and
or my children or whatever. So I'm trying to do that.
I'm trying to do a better job at that, tending
the garden. I love that idea. I think about different
things all the time and now that I have more
time to think about it, making I'm not worried about
a draft or worrying about an organization's morale, which you are.
I'm trying to take it all in. I'm trying to
live a certain way, I'm trying to live with purpose.
(31:54):
Of course, travel around the country, trying to be introspective
as much as I can. It's not easy, but there's
a lot more time to do so. I appreciate it.
The very last question here and if you didn't hear
that last one, this is another one. Very last question
is what was the question that you feared that I
was going to ask you the most about you and
the New Orleans Saints? I probably fear that you were
(32:16):
gonna ask me about Bounty Gate, because I'm just tired
of it. I've had ten years of it and I'm
I'm sick of it. I don't like talking about it,
you know. Look, I've got feelings about it, about how
that was a handle all that business, but I'm beg
you didn't ask me about it. Well, let me just
say this. Interestingly enough, and I thought through this very,
very closely, we all, as a general manager, want a
(32:40):
gate in our life, as odd as that sounds, and somehow,
leaving after thirteen years, this sounds weird. I was blessed
with sound gate. That's my bond with you for the
rest of the life. You had bounty gate, what you
don't want to talk about, and I had sound gate,
although I pushed mine off on someone else because evidently
someone who was controlling the UH, the stadium at that
(33:01):
time was pumping music through there or whatever the hell
it was. But in the end, I really really appreciate
you taking the time. This was fantastic, incredibly insightful and uh,
you just get killed it. Thank you. Well, look, thanks, Thomas.
I've appreciated your friendship for a long, long time. I
know we were arrivals. I wanted to beat you every
weekend that we played and yet, man, you have been
a big help to me. Is is hopefully, I've been
(33:24):
to you and I'm looking forward to, uh, you know,
a relationship going on for the rest of our lives.
Thank you so much, Mickey blessed. Thank you. Thank you.
All right. Hey, look, I hope you guys enjoyed that again,
what a ride. That was just amazing to see how
(33:47):
much established presence that Mickey has in the city of
New Orleans, you know, sitting there getting everything, you know,
taken care of by the police officers in New Orleans.
To be able to park where we parked in this
interview in the middle of the market, in the middle
of the French quarter, was huge. Again, I can't stress
enough how much respect I have for Mickey Loomis, not
(34:09):
only as a professional, which I have a great deal
of respect, but also as a person, very very loyal,
soulfil person. You guys should be proud down there in
New Orleans to have him asure your guide because obviously
has done some great things there. I hope you enjoyed
it again. Nothing but massive respect for for Mickey Loomis
as we moved from Mickey. WE'RE gonna be heading up
to a different part of the country in the next
(34:29):
up next pot that we have here, all the way
up to Baltimore, spending some great time leading in with
a really, really impressive, intelligent, insightful, fairly young gun when
you compare him to Mickey Loomis, and that's Eric to Costa.
I know all the people up there have a great
deal of respect for him. Definitely make sure you listen
up to that one. You guys, have a great one.
(34:51):
You have been listening to the GM journey with Thomas Tomtrough.
Continue to follow Thomas as he interviews GMS from your
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(35:14):
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Forward slash donate. Welcome to the GM journey with Thomas Demtrov.
(00:53):
All right, welcome back. I mean look, traveling from Tampa Bay,
from the newly meanted GM Jason Light, straight across the
highway and across the state to New Orleans to meet
with Mickey Loomis, one of the Godfathers of GMS in
the League right now. I mean, what a great trip
this was. You guys will listen into some great conversation here.
(01:16):
I mean here's a guy who has proven himself at
so many different levels. He is, he truly is, the
guy that most times the league, though they may not
always like his answers, because he's a direct, straightforward guy.
They will go to him for information and go to
him for opinions about really, really important things. We were
(01:36):
on the General Manager's advisory and committee together. I have
nothing but great respect for him. Most people think that
we should have been massive nemesis, but we never were
that we were. We were really, really close, and people
usually laugh at that because they expect it to be
the other way around. Take a listen. A lot of
(01:58):
really good soul for conversation. Isn't well and we're in
the middle of the French quarter. We walked around, had
a couple of cocktails, talked about in life as well,
and then, after this great interview that you listened to,
we went and had some great dinner. Anyway, really really
cool stuff. Listen Up. I've been thinking lately, and you
(02:19):
may take offense to this, but you have now become
the godfather of football executives in the world. How does
that feel? Well, look, I hate the terminology because God
friend of means two things to me, old and mean
and nasty. And Look, I don't think I mean in nasty.
(02:40):
I'll go with the older. But when I think of
the Godfather of g MS, I think of Gil Brandt
and Bill Polian and guys that are still with US
still have a lot to offer. Um. Look, there's guys
in our league that as experienced as I am. You
Know Kevin Colbert and Rix Bielman, yourself, guys that that
have been around for a good period of time and
(03:00):
been successful. So I Goshal, I hope everybody thinks of
me that way. Well, you have such a presence and
we'll get into that a little bit. Interestingly enough, I
look at this often. I think people think that you
and I should be adversaries because you know the crazy
heated relationship between and uh sort of competitiveness between your team,
(03:22):
the New Orleans Saints, and my former team, the falcons,
that built over years, and people think, well, of course
you're not friends, you're not gonna deal with Mickey. The
crazy thing is our opportunity to work together in the
General Manager's Advisory Committee. That was a big thing for
me and in my formative years as a GM and
you became one of my most trusted and closest confidence
in the business and I appreciate that. Appreciate that. Beyond
(03:45):
your my personality and your personalities are different. We have
different approaches. I probably are. Am a little bit more
of an open book as far as my approach to things. You,
respectfully have more of a guarded, uh, an appropriate, respectfully
guarded side. Um, so your approach is that? Is that personal?
(04:08):
Is that your personal approach? Yeah, well, yeah, it's a
good question. First of all, I do hate the Falcons.
I just don't hate the people that worked for the
Atlanta fols. I have a lot of respect for the
coaches that you've had their the you know, the owner,
all the people involved in your building. That doesn't I
can separate the people from the rivalry and I think
(04:30):
you can as well, and we've been able to do that.
We've had a lot of great conversations. Listen, you've helped
me lots of times with with UH perspective and advice
and things like that, and hopefully I've done that for you. Um, look,
I I've I grew up in the business and I've been,
you know, part of the NFL for thirty eight years
(04:52):
here now, and Mike McCormick was the general manager that
hired me, and he was he came from a perspective
of servant leadership up and came from a perspective. Now,
Mike McCormick was a hall of fame player as well
as a coach before he became a GM, and he
was always of the elk that, man, the face of
(05:12):
your franchise is your player, your best players, and your coach.
And as a GM, you know you're taking a back
seat and you're taking a role behind the scene, servant leadership,
and so that's been my perspective and so I don't like,
I don't believe in the GM being the outfront guy
most of the time. Now, when there's adversity and accountability,
(05:37):
you need to stand up and take that, but when
things are going well, man, let's let's let the let's
let your players and coach, you know, be the face
of your franchise. It's a great point and I went
back and forth, you know, with that whole idea as
a general manager, what is expected of me and what
what wasn't over the years. Okay, I'm gonna Bring in
another analogy here and you're not gonna like this one.
(05:58):
I mean inside the NFL and outside the NFL. Mickey
loomis has a little bit of a wizard of Oz
element to him. I don't know this is highly intelligent,
highly powerful, highly intuitive, but behind the scenes interesting perspective.
But I mean there are a lot of people in
my role, as we were growing up through and became
(06:18):
general managers, who still have this like really uh sort
of deep, uh seated interest in trying to tap into
your brain and what you know and how you put
together a team, how you lead. Again, back to what
you just explained, working with Sean Payton, who is a
really strong minded and wilful and productive and talented man
(06:41):
and football coach. Can you talk to us a little
bit about that relationship and how two people with a
lot of intelligence and a lot of presence coexists, because
it's not easy. We know how important that is. Yeah, well,
it's a good question and I feel like in our
business the most important relationship is head coach GM. I
(07:04):
think that's a really important relationship in order to have
sustained success. And UH, man, there's egos involved and and look,
I think me and a head coach in the NFL
is the toughest job in store. I really do. You've
got full players, so many coaches to manage, so much
time management, Um, all the things that are involved in
(07:27):
being a greed head coach is. It's so difficult and look,
I'm here to relieve as much of that stress as
I can. I'm not here to add stress to our
head coach. Look, I I believe the head coaches is
uh should be one of the faces, if not the
(07:47):
face and the voice of your franchise. I don't have
uh any notion otherwise about that. Now, that doesn't mean
I'm not I'm not trying to lead our group and
lead our team and lead our organization, but I recognize
how difficult his job is and I'm gonna have to
take a back seat in terms of ego and and
(08:09):
I'm gonna have to uh compromise and some things that
I don't necessarily want to compromise it at times, but
I think for the good the organization, is good the team.
That's what we should be doing. Well, I love the
fact over the years, we've talked about it, the respect
that you have for Sean and his job as a
head coach, as you just alluded to, and his respect
for you is what makes you guys a very special
(08:29):
organization and I'm while I've always been widely interested in
some of the intricacies of that with uh, you know
where you guys are in a relationship and it's so important.
We saw a pack back in the day. I remember
when I first got this job, or even before, I
looked at some of the people out there, like Marty
Shott and I'm in a J Smith, two incredibly um
talented football men different parts of the organization. One was
(08:51):
a GM and one was a head coach. And it's
splintered and and I feel like I can talk about
it because it was very public. You guys just have
a really cool grasp about you and it's everyone admires
it from a far, whether they share it with you
or not, or whether we're supposed to share it or not.
As a former Atlanta people, it is a really, really
impressive deal. So well, let me just say that it's
not all roses and butterflies. You know. We've had our times,
(09:15):
you know, and you've got to work through that. And Look,
if you committed and you and and winning is the
most important thing, then you know, you find ways to
to compromise and and and, uh yeah, we've been able
to do that and that's as much a credit to
him as it is to me. This and this is
this is a two way street. It's not a one
way street, not a one ray street. Well, so, then
I started thinking about you've been involved at so many levels,
(09:38):
not only the general manager's advisory committee, excuse me, but
a number of other highly influential committees in this in
this league. Um, you've done a lot of the league.
Everyone appreciates it, whether they come and shake your hand
about it or whether they're talking about it behind your back.
It's really appreciated. It comes back to my analogy of
you being the Godfather which you you've battled. I get it.
(10:00):
Do you ever, with all of that you've given back
to the to the organization and the League, the portrayal
of them, the portrayal of where the saints are, Um,
of being, you know, pushing the limits, which I respect
a great deal, do you ever get to a spot
where you think, well, that's not necessarily case, or are
(10:20):
you proud of where you are, your aggressiveness and your approach? Yeah, look,
that's a good question. Uh, and I would say, look,
if I had to go back in time where there's
some things that you know, we might do differently, probably, yes,
but look, we're we're pushing. We push the limits without
without training to cross the line Um and, you know,
(10:42):
different people have different perspectives about that. I get that,
but listen, we're trying to win, we're trying to do
it the right way, we're trying to have sustained success
and and uh, look, I believe in the way we operate,
I do. And I also believe in in the league.
I believe in the you know, for the good of
the League. I think we have the best in professional sports.
You know, I believe in the integrity of our game.
(11:05):
I believe that that that's what makes our game great
is is that in any given year we're on a
level playing field. You know, every franchise has an opportunity
to be successful. There we're not constrained by, you know,
one group having so many, much more resources than another.
We have an opportunity to be successful on our you know,
(11:27):
based upon the merits of our abilities. And so I
love our league, I do. I love football of the game.
I'm passionate about the game, passionate about the people, not
just with other teams and our team, but with the
League office too. I am I don't always agree with
with what someone else does or what the League does, but,
you know, I try to I try to I try
(11:49):
to be empathetic about where their position is. So you
to that point and I love that response. there. Outside
of your organization there's always been an element of us
against the world, saints, which, again, we can all throw
darts at it. People that aren't involved probably more Atlanta
Falcons than everyone because again there's that crazy uh sort
(12:11):
of competitiveness, that US against the world element. Is that
a function of Sean Payton's leadership? Is it a function
of your fan base, who is incredible here, who are
so passionate about you guys along with you dealing with
all of these natural disasters and and different things that
have come across? Where does that US against the world
come from? Well, I think it's all that. Um, I
(12:34):
think it's all of it. I look, I think if
you look back in history at all the great coaches,
I think almost all of them try to create that
it's us against the world culture within their building. Right, hey,
we we can only rely on each other. We can't
rely on anyone else. So I think that's that's, you know,
(12:55):
natural in professional sports and in in any sport really.
I also think that, look, we have a little bit
of that in our city not a little bit. We
have a lot of that in our city. We've had
to overcome Katrina, we've had to overcome the oil spills,
we had to overcome some things that. You know, we're
trying to prove we're a big league city here and
and then and that we are one of the best
(13:16):
cities in the world. And so I think, I think
it's all of that together creates this man it's ut
against the world and we can lye on each other.
Our Fan base is so, you know, uh, passionate and strong.
That that I think it gets amplified what it would
actually exists in with every team. Well, great, great, uh,
(13:39):
just the idea of your organization being able to pull
that off from where they are again, from the leadership side.
But it seems very, very authentic on the outside, and
that's why it's interesting, because a lot of people can't
bottle that up and they continue to look at New
Orleans again as a team and as a fan base
and quietly marvel. UH, because there's Jealou, he's there. Let's
(14:00):
call the way it is. My my my my fan base,
my my former fan base in Atlanta may not like
to hear that because there's a sort of hate to
love the New Orleans Element. But I mean again, I can't,
I can't be positive enough about what you guys have
done that way. I mean, okay, so you're you're in
a situation where, Um, drew brees retires. You're a general manager, UH,
(14:22):
and in charge of many, many things within this organization. Um,
very lofty position, and you know that your first ostensible,
first ballot hall of Famer Leaves This Organization. How do
you approach that? How, in a nutshell, how do you
approach that? What is your North Star after drew brees?
That's you question. Well, you know, first of all. First
(14:46):
of all, you appreciate the fact that we've had fifteen
years of this guy as a free agent and not
in our wildest dreams, not in your wildest dream as
a GM or mine, would you ever expect to sign
someone and get fifteen years of elite performance and with
all of fame performance. So I'm not particularly sad about it.
(15:09):
I'm just appreciative of how blessed we've been to have
this guy as our leader on the field, his elite
performance and his leadership in the community, just the way
he was represented an organization. I mean I I just
I don't I don't know how you could ask for
more than what he has done, and you you appreciate that.
(15:30):
First of all, you start thinking about you get a
little panic attack, like you know, what the hell are
we gonna do now? And yet I have such great
confidence we have. We have a a great football coach
in Sean Payton, and and a great staff we have.
We have a great personnel staff. I we're gonna be
just fine, Um, and so you have confidence in in
(15:53):
what our organization can do. That's what gives you confidence
about the future, as opposed to, Oh no, we've just
lost this great quarterback. So good about about where we're
at and where we're going. Well, parallel that to New
England losing Tom Brady, having a complicated season this past
season and Tampa Bay thriving. Another team you don't like
(16:16):
to thrive about her a lot, of course. Um, I've
often wondered when you're in that spot, and I haven't
been in that spot as a GM because Matt Ryan
was there the whole time. And I know you're gonna
answer this question the way I assume you're gonna answer it,
because you just did. There's there's sometimes that, when you're
looking at it, the feeling of Man, are we on
borrow time now because we don't have the stud that
(16:37):
is you have so many other people on that team
that are really good football players. That's how you answer
that question to people around the organization who worry. Correct well,
you do. And yet, listen, I've been in the situation.
I was in Seattle for fifteen years and there was
a good period of time there where we struggled to find,
you know, the quarterback. You struggled to find who, who's
going to lead us to the next level. You know,
(17:00):
we we had a great quarterback in Dave Craig. You
know when I when I first got there, and we
had a lot of wins and a lot of success. Um,
not a super bowl, but we had success. And then look,
we we went through a number of years where we
were struggling to find that next guy and never really
could do it in the time that I was there.
So I understand how that works and there's no guarantee
about that. Right, a lot of this is your luck.
(17:23):
A lot of it's luck. I'd like to say it's
all skill. It's not a lot of its luck. It's
it's getting the right guy. It's getting the Right UH
coaching staff in place to develop them. It's putting the
right pieces around them. There's a lot of variables that
exist and I can't guarantee that we're gonna find that
Guy Um and then it's all gonna work. I can't
guarantee that, but I know I know what it looks like.
(17:44):
We know what it looks like as an organization and again,
I have confidence in our coaches, in our head coach,
that if we can find the right people, that they'll
develop and we'll have success. We'll have success. You have
an ultimate an incredible amount of wisdom inside and outside
(18:04):
of football, your background and business and being around this
league for as long as you have. What is your
biggest fear about the future of the NFL? When I
first got the league, I remember going to league meetings
and in the bulk of the League meetings we're talking
about the game. You know the game and how can
we improve the game? How can we improve, Um, the
(18:26):
integrity of the competition? In any given year Atlanta can
win a super bowl, New Orleans can win a super bowl,
cleveland can win a super you know any of these teams.
It's not just the teams that have the most resources that,
you know, in the biggest markets. And so I worry
sometimes that we spend too much time talking about the
(18:47):
marketing and the business, the business of the game, which
is important, by the way, and not enough time spent
on the game itself. And and and uh, look, this
is a game built on players and coaches. That's that's
what it's built on. It's what I believe and we
and we have a fantastic, great game that that people
want to watch and and they get really invested in
(19:10):
our fans here in Atlanta and every city in our
in in uh that it has an NFL team. Those
fans are invested and I think we owe it to
them to put the best product on the field and
in the best and the best uh competition that has integrity. Well,
I mean, I mean, I thought you articulated that very
(19:31):
well and I started thinking about sort of next steps
in all this, Mickey, where we are in the evolution
of the league per diversity issues. Right, we're we're in
a really interesting spot societally, of course, and I think
the league is making some strides. Of course, Um, it
may not be fast enough for certain people, what's your
(19:52):
assessment at this point of where we are with diversity, diversity, highers, etcetera, etcetera,
within the League? Yeah, look, I like that we're paying
attention and to it. I don't have the answers. I'm
not smart enough to have all the answers. Um. I
feel like a lot of our business, Um, is really
blind to color. And yet I know it's not. And so, Um,
(20:15):
I think. I I think more than anything else, having
discussion and having the topic and understanding where Um, the
people in our league that feel like they haven't been
given affair shake. We need to we need to listen
and pay attention and take steps, and we're gonna take
some missteps. I think we have taken this steps and
(20:37):
I think sometimes those have been with good intentions, Um,
and I just think we need to keep on this
path of paying attention to it, Um, taking steps that
are necessary and understanding when we when we're taking this step.
We gotta correct that. Gotta correct. It's a it's a
it's a really it's a valid point that I remember
(20:57):
before I left Atlanta, it was about communication and making
sure that I communicated as well as I could with
everyone within the organization and we had some amazing meetings
during that time which we're quite emotional to hear everyone,
not not only you know, it didn't matter where they were,
across the organization and to hear some of the people
of color within the organization speak to it and some
(21:18):
of some of the underrepresented people with an organization share
their feelings. Are Heartfelt feelings and everyone sharing. I mean
it brought tears to a lot of people's eyes just
because they know we're heading in the right direction. There's
a long way to go. Personally, and I would say
to this to you. Two years ago, when I was
at the owner's meetings and we took our GM photograph
and we see one person of color within the whole
(21:42):
general manager group and that was Chris Greer, and now
I think the League has seven or six, I believe.
I love where we're going. We still have a ways
to go, of course, and we still have a ways
to go on the on the head coaching side. In
the end, I love how people are coming together and
understanding the importance of this and it's a big issue.
Of course. We'll be right back with more from the
(22:07):
GM journey. Let's let's jump to another tangent here for
a minute. So the League continues to pay the general
managers and the head coach as well, and we've seen
recently the general manager salaries are going up, up significantly,
but there's still at large chasm. Do you think it's
(22:30):
still justifiable in this league that there's such a large
chasm between the head coach of the GM salaries? Yeah, look,
you know I said this before, I think the head
coaches have the toughest job in ear league. Um Man,
they're responsible for so much. It's such a emotional Um.
You know, taxing, it's it's it's time, taxing, it's, you know,
(22:55):
just everything about it is so difficult. You've got so
many of the people that you're responsible for and I
think your job is tougher than ours, honestly. So I
don't I don't have any problem with with what they make.
It's it's, you know, they're part of the talent right.
Talent Um in our league should get paid and they
get paid well, and they should get paid well because
(23:16):
they're creating this this business for us, the players and
the coaches, and so I don't have any issue where
it look, you know, I didn't get into this. I
know you didn't get into this because we thought we
were gonna make a great living. We got into it
because we love sport, we love competition. We never being
part of a team and I don't, I don't really
think a lot about about how much I make or
(23:36):
how much, uh, you know, I should make. I just
it doesn't ever cross my mind. And yet I'm grateful
for what I do, what we do make, and I'm
grateful for the ownership and recognizing that we have valuable jobs. Um. Yeah,
so it's a good question and yet I don't spend
a lot of the the time thinking about well, they're they're
they're two incredible positions, meaning there's a lot on your plate.
(23:58):
There's a lot on Sean pay this place, uh plate. Um,
I think we all recognize that for sure. So let's
let's go to that for a minute. You did an
amazing job and your hiring of of your head coach
and since I've done a great job organizationally putting together
the coaching staffs Um coordinators are wildly important. I have
a really strong opinion about that as well, are the
(24:21):
position coaches. They have elements within their job duties that
are really, really important. Do you where is your uh
function and how do you function now? What is your
relationship to helping the coach Put together the coaching staff? Yeah, well,
I think part of that depends upon who your head coaches.
Is the first time head coach or is the experience
(24:43):
I've I've always believed that the head coach should be
able to hire his staff. I think that's important that
they understand that they're they are reporting to him and that,
you know, everything should flow through the head coach. So
our head coaches all always had the ability to hire
his staff. And Look, we have a great relationship and
(25:04):
I think he values my opinion. He'll ask me my
opinion and I'll offer it, you know, when asked. But
it's his responsibility. He's done a fantastic job over the
years of of hiring coaches and and recognizing that. Look,
chemistry amongst the staff is as important as ability. You
have to have ability, but you also have to have chemistry.
(25:26):
You have to have guys that are teachers, Um, guys
that can motivate and and uh and recognize that. Look
in amongst your staff you may have guys with different
strengths and I think he does a great job of that.
But I would say that, you know, the quality of
our staff is directly related to the quality of our
head coach and his ability to identify what he wants
(25:50):
and and find it. Well, he's done a great job
and identifying, of course. And and what I've always been
really impressed with with Sean is his approach to be
very real with his coach is, and no, this is
probably from bill parcels right. He's not worried about being
liked within the building. At least that's my impression. I've
really been impressed making sure that he gets his points
across because ultimately he is the head coach and that's
(26:12):
his his call. Correct well, I think he's great at
setting expectations and and, uh, maintaining accountability, which is what
you're talking about, maintaining accountability. All right, so in the
last few years as a general manager, Um, what leadership
lesson do you think has been something that has come
across your desk that has been sort of adjusting and
(26:36):
altering for your approach as a leader? Yeah, man, I
don't know if it's been in the last few years.
I I just know over time I've, you know, I've
recognized my own strengths and weaknesses. And you know, I've
settled into this servant leadership model. It's and look, there's
lots of different ways to lead right, there's lots of
(26:57):
different ways and I know that that fit. It's me
is uh, I like behind the scenes, you know, I like, uh,
making sure that people have opportunities and then they have
the right environment to be successful. And so that's the
that's the leadership style that I've settled into and uh,
I think it works for us. And and and look,
(27:17):
you have to have people that are complementary to you.
You can't have a bunch of people that are exactly
the same. You need people that will disagree, they will
have a different perspective and uh, you know, I'm so
I'm not afraid of that and I believe that we
have that in our building. And, look, I value it. Well,
you definitely seem like you have it in your building. Again,
from afar. I keep saying that because everyone's eyes are
(27:39):
on you, whether you win the Super Bowl or not
in a certain year, everyone is looking at how things
are run within the states organization across the League. So
to that point, rising sort of mid management level individuals,
what salient point would you share with them if you
have one point to share. Um, look, I've always believe this.
(28:00):
I think setting goals and having dreams and aspirations are great.
I really do, Um, and you get and I have gotten.
You know, young people come in, I want your job,
I want to be a general manager. I want to
be a general manager. And Look, my message is always, man,
you're you're you're looking so far out into the future
(28:21):
you can lose sight of what's right in front of you. Um,
there's thirty two jobs in the NFL that are gentle
manager jobs right, and thousands of people that want them. You,
it would be. It would be. You'd be doing yourself
a disservice if you set yourself up for I'm gonna
be a failure if I don't get one of those
(28:42):
thirty two jobs. So my message is always to our guys,
whoever they are. Man, just focus on the job you have.
If you're an intern, be the best intern you can
ever be. If you're the area Scout, be the best
area scout you can be. If you're the best kept guy,
be the best kept guy you can be, because if
you're the best at what you do, then you'll get
(29:02):
an opportunity to get the job you want. So focus
on the job you have and if you do well,
the job you want will come along. And so I'm
more of look, look at what's right in front of you,
not what's two blocks in front of you. I mean
great wisdom for for anyone around the league or executives
who are climbing through businesses right. I mean too often
(29:23):
there's there's this idea that they want to be it.
Now I used to think I wanted to be the
best college scouting director in the history of the League.
You had different approaches then. We we ask around the
table now, a whole scouting group and you say how
many want to be a GM and it's not just
one hand, it's two hands up in the air. All right.
Last two questions. One the Tim Ferris question. I don't
(29:44):
know if you know Tim Ferris is. He's one of
the most reputable podcasters, lifestyle podcasters, out there. He often
asked in the last few years, Um, what is a
new belief, behavior or approach personally, not professionally as much personally,
that has changed their life? Oh Wow, good question. Um,
I think look, one of the things that happens when
(30:06):
you get older, particularly when you're older like I am
and you have young children. Is Hey, how can I
not just live longer, but how can I have a
quality life for a longer period of time? So, look,
I think the biggest factor in quality life is stress.
You know, how can I eliminate stress from my life
(30:28):
and yet still do a magnificent job in not just
my work life but my family life? So I'm I'm
looking for ways to dial back the stress level. And Look,
I'm fortunate because because I have a great staff, I
have a great organization, we have great culture. It takes
(30:48):
a lot of uh. I have to pay attention to
that garden. We all do. Everyone in our building has
to pay attention to the garden. I've got to a
coach that talks about this all the time. Is that
we can't just assume that we're gonna have Um, you know,
a great locker room, a great culture. We have to
Um tended, and I think the same thing exists in
your home life and your personal life. Is that you
(31:10):
have to you have to tend that and I probably
don't do enough of it, and yet I'm trying to
do better at it. I'm trying to tend to my
personal life. Eliminate stress, eliminate the stress of, you know,
my wife and my children and and uh, I don't
have an answer as to exactly what those things are,
but every day we can find something that, okay, I can,
(31:32):
I can relieve some of the stress off you and
or my children or whatever. So I'm trying to do that.
I'm trying to do a better job at that, tending
the garden. I love that idea. I think about different
things all the time and now that I have more
time to think about it, making I'm not worried about
a draft or worrying about an organization's morale, which you are.
I'm trying to take it all in. I'm trying to
live a certain way, I'm trying to live with purpose.
(31:54):
Of course, travel around the country, trying to be introspective
as much as I can. It's not easy, but there's
a lot more time to do so. I appreciate it.
The very last question here and if you didn't hear
that last one, this is another one. Very last question
is what was the question that you feared that I
was going to ask you the most about you and
the New Orleans Saints? I probably fear that you were
(32:16):
gonna ask me about Bounty Gate, because I'm just tired
of it. I've had ten years of it and I'm
I'm sick of it. I don't like talking about it,
you know. Look, I've got feelings about it, about how
that was a handle all that business, but I'm beg
you didn't ask me about it. Well, let me just
say this. Interestingly enough, and I thought through this very,
very closely, we all, as a general manager, want a
(32:40):
gate in our life, as odd as that sounds, and somehow,
leaving after thirteen years, this sounds weird. I was blessed
with sound gate. That's my bond with you for the
rest of the life. You had bounty gate, what you
don't want to talk about, and I had sound gate,
although I pushed mine off on someone else because evidently
someone who was controlling the UH, the stadium at that
(33:01):
time was pumping music through there or whatever the hell
it was. But in the end, I really really appreciate
you taking the time. This was fantastic, incredibly insightful and uh,
you just get killed it. Thank you. Well, look, thanks, Thomas.
I've appreciated your friendship for a long, long time. I
know we were arrivals. I wanted to beat you every
weekend that we played and yet, man, you have been
a big help to me. Is is hopefully, I've been
(33:24):
to you and I'm looking forward to, uh, you know,
a relationship going on for the rest of our lives.
Thank you so much, Mickey blessed. Thank you. Thank you.
All right. Hey, look, I hope you guys enjoyed that again,
what a ride. That was just amazing to see how
(33:47):
much established presence that Mickey has in the city of
New Orleans, you know, sitting there getting everything, you know,
taken care of by the police officers in New Orleans.
To be able to park where we parked in this
interview in the middle of the market, in the middle
of the French quarter, was huge. Again, I can't stress
enough how much respect I have for Mickey Loomis, not
(34:09):
only as a professional, which I have a great deal
of respect, but also as a person, very very loyal,
soulfil person. You guys should be proud down there in
New Orleans to have him asure your guide because obviously
has done some great things there. I hope you enjoyed
it again. Nothing but massive respect for for Mickey Loomis
as we moved from Mickey. WE'RE gonna be heading up
to a different part of the country in the next
(34:29):
up next pot that we have here, all the way
up to Baltimore, spending some great time leading in with
a really, really impressive, intelligent, insightful, fairly young gun when
you compare him to Mickey Loomis, and that's Eric to Costa.
I know all the people up there have a great
deal of respect for him. Definitely make sure you listen
up to that one. You guys, have a great one.
(34:51):
You have been listening to the GM journey with Thomas Tomtrough.
Continue to follow Thomas as he interviews GMS from your
favorite NFL t the GM journey has been produced by
Alan Castenbaum, Thomas Dimitrov and Octagon Entertainment. Don't forget to
download and subscribe on Apple Podcasts, spotify or wherever you
(35:14):
get your podcast from. The GM journey is distributed by
the eight side network.
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