October 17, 2023 • 39 mins
Cappy Thompson was a creator at an early age and her thirst for knowledge only grew as she became a world-renowned professional glass artist. She sits down with Jacob & Ashley to recall her deep loves, losses and spirituality.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:09):
Welcome to the Good Stuff.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
I'm Jacob Schick and I am joined by my co
host and wife, Ashley shik Jake is.
Speaker 3 (00:15):
A third generation combat Marine and I'm a gold Star granddaughter.
We work together to serve military veterans, first responders, frontline
healthcare workers, and their families with mental and emotional wellness
through traditional and non traditional therapy. At One Tribe Foundation,
we believe.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
Everyone has a story to tell, not only about the peaks,
but also the valleys they've been through to get them to.
Speaker 1 (00:36):
Where they are today.
Speaker 3 (00:37):
Each week, we invite a guest to tell us their story,
to share with us the lessons they've learned that shaped
who they are and what they're doing to pay it
forward and give back.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
Are mission with this show is to dig deep into
our guest journeys so that we can celebrate the hope
and inspiration or story has to offer.
Speaker 3 (00:52):
We're thrilled you're joining us again.
Speaker 1 (00:55):
Welcome to the Good Stuff. Our guest today.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
Is Thompson, an internationally recognized glass artist based in Seattle, Washington.
Speaker 3 (01:06):
Kapi's work deals with the biggest themes we as humans
try to come to terms with faith, religion, myth, folklore,
the cosmos and the afterlife.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
Not only has Kapi built a life long, celebrated career
as a fine artist, she is equally devoted to her
creative community as a teacher and mentor.
Speaker 3 (01:24):
She's here today to tell us about her life as
an artist and being a devoted student to religious philosophies
and spirituality. Kappy's story is also about the life and
sudden death of her beloved husband, Charlie Williams. Charlie was
the great love of Kapi's life and a partner in
her exploration of the spiritual realm. His passing opened Kappy's
(01:44):
heart to an even greater sense of love, heartbreak, and
the unknown.
Speaker 2 (01:50):
This episode is about living, dying, and the beauty found
and grieving. This was a particularly moving conversation and we
are blessed to be able to.
Speaker 1 (01:58):
Share it with you.
Speaker 3 (02:02):
Miss Kathy Thompson, Thank you so much for joining us
here on the Good Stuff. We are so thrilled that
you're here joining us today.
Speaker 4 (02:09):
Thank you.
Speaker 3 (02:09):
Your story is about some of our greatest mysteries of life.
It's art, love, the meaning of life, and the meaning
of death. Your life has been so full of creation
and spiritual inquiry, and so to get us started tell
us about what it was like growing up in your
household and how you even became interested in art.
Speaker 4 (02:28):
My mom was a painter, and she actually didn't have
a career, but she was primarily a homemaker. She had
four children with my dad, but she had a lifelong
practice of painting, and there was an art supplies in
the house. We went to museums, we went to gallery.
So I had an early awareness that art was something
(02:50):
that was a value. And I'm wired kind of the
way my mom is, so it was a pretty natural
thing to be interested in it as a kid. And
I started feeling like I was in a zone with
it probably when I was a teenager, so it was
kind of natural to head that direction.
Speaker 2 (03:09):
Kevin, do you have any brothers or sisters and did
you guys go to church.
Speaker 4 (03:14):
I have two sisters. I'm the middle girl or two
years apart, and a younger brother who's four years younger
than Mollie, six years younger than me. So my mom's
was from Iowa. Just a wonderful sort of common sense
person with a good sense of humor, and she met
my dad in college. It was after the war. My
(03:36):
dad was going to school on the GI Bill at
the University of Washington. My mom was coming to get
a teaching certificate, so that's how they met. We moved
a bit because my dad took him a little while
to settle down into a job that ended up being
a long term career. The family unit was pretty tight
(03:56):
and pretty important because we moved not infrequently, but you know,
every few years. One thing that was formative was when
I was a teenager. My dad, by then I was
a Boeing engineer, and that was one of the recessions
where everybody was leaving. Boeing was laying off people, and
he basically was transferred to the South. Boeing had facilities
(04:21):
in Huntsville, Alabama, and so my dad was transferred there.
So we moved to the Deep South during the Civil
Rights movement. My mom's father had passed away when she
was young, and my mom was in her twenties when
her father died, and when I was twelve and her sister,
Dory was in her thirties, Dori died of cancer, and
(04:44):
so that was about the time we moved to Alabama.
My mom had sought a church. At that point. I
started to attend the Episcopal Church. My family did, and
so that was kind of my first religious grounding. But
when I was about thirty teen, like a lot of
people do, I kind of decided that the Nicean crete
(05:06):
didn't make any sense to me that Jesus would be
the only begotten son of God. I mean, I had
a naive understanding of it, and I was just like, no,
I couldn't understand why all religions weren't acceptable or anyway.
Stopped kind of going to church. And then when I
was in college, I got attracted to, of course, all
the religions. I got curious about them, so I looked
(05:30):
at Buddhism, and Sufi's stories were really interesting to me,
So I you know, I sort of started getting interested
in the esoteric areas of most of the of religious cultures.
Speaker 3 (05:43):
I think that's so fascinating that at such a young
age you started to not necessarily question, but you started
to just really think on a broader scope about religion.
Then about okay, does this make sense.
Speaker 4 (05:56):
My family was pretty probably left leaning, I guess I
would say we had gone from the far North to
the deep South. My parents had taken on well, they
definitely were an anti racist mindset, and I think that
there were a lot you know, there was a lot
of philosophical and sort of like value oriented discussion in
(06:21):
my family. So that's probably why it. You know, it
was okay for me to basically say no, I disagree,
you know, I don't think this is what I want
to do.
Speaker 2 (06:31):
And I think that's extremely important in family units to
have openness, be able to talk with vulnerability, because we're
all eat our own person And I think it's a
beautiful thing that you were able to go educate yourself
stemming from curiosity, which was often Disguis's courage to look
in these other into these other religions and to educate
(06:52):
yourself about what does it all mean? Are they connected?
Do they have to be separated? And it seems as
though because of industry and monetary gain, a lot.
Speaker 1 (07:04):
Of it is.
Speaker 2 (07:06):
Separated, and then the hyper focus is implemented in being
able to okay, this is going to be monetized, Therefore.
Speaker 1 (07:17):
It's going to be protected because we can't lose that.
Speaker 2 (07:21):
I'm with you completely on that, But were you the
only one that kind of picked up on the art
out of your siblings?
Speaker 4 (07:30):
Ah, that's interesting. My sister Sarah was bookworm She's the eldest,
and she was just so smart. She's basically was academically
really brilliant, and she buried herself in books, and I
sort of went another direction. So I was like into
visual art, and my younger sister, Mollie basically went into theater,
(07:52):
and my brother Peter was good at math and science.
The eldest and the youngest actually were pretty academically oriented,
and then Mollie and I were more in the creative side.
Everybody kind of carved out a different kind of lane,
I guess.
Speaker 3 (08:08):
So when did you decide to make art your life's path.
Speaker 4 (08:13):
It was in my early twenties when I went to
school in Bellingham at an alternative school, but there was
no opportunity to do art. It was connected with a
college that had art, but you couldn't get into classes
as a first year student. There's no way you could
do art, and so I wasn't particularly happy, and I
after one year, I went back home and there was
(08:34):
a small art school in Seattle, wasn't really accredited even
but it was really a fantastic place. It's called the
Factory of Visual Art, and the classes were great, and
I basically went to school there with my mom. We
both took classes and I had never been happier. And
then the next year the whole family had gotten into therapy.
(08:56):
My mom had found a therapist and it was sort
of transactual ANALYSI since we were like a hippie family
diving deep into So when I went back to school
a year later, it was like, are you going to
do psychology or do I want to do art? And
it was a pretty easy decision because I thought, yeah,
if I do art, I'll never come to the bottom
(09:17):
of it. You won't ever come to the end of it.
So and that's true. I made a really good decision and.
Speaker 3 (09:23):
Never thought about that.
Speaker 1 (09:25):
But it's such a profound.
Speaker 3 (09:26):
It's never ending to say you can always create more, and.
Speaker 2 (09:30):
To be honest with a lot of the people we know,
human psychology feels.
Speaker 1 (09:36):
A lot like well, just you'll never see the end
of it.
Speaker 3 (09:40):
But it's you know, it's it's such a gift to
be able to create. And artists have always fascinated me.
Like I said, I'm not an artist. I try to
draw a dog and it looks like I love to
paint the hell out of walls. Yes, I do love that.
Speaker 4 (09:54):
I love painting because that's good too.
Speaker 1 (09:56):
It's therapeutic.
Speaker 3 (09:57):
And you brought up therapy, and how forward thinking of
your parents to have the entire family back then in therapy,
because you know.
Speaker 4 (10:04):
Yeah right, it was kind of amazing.
Speaker 3 (10:06):
Actually somewhat taboo. But to me, painting walls is therapy.
Speaker 1 (10:11):
Yeah, I mean, it's proof we can find therapy in
anything we do.
Speaker 3 (10:14):
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (10:14):
You know, you have to be.
Speaker 2 (10:15):
First centered with yourself, and I believe that what you're
able to create with your own hands is awe inspiring.
Because as Ash and I were looking at some of
this art, I was like, there's no way in hell
I wouldn't break that accidentally, Like I wouldn't mean to, yeah,
but I would take.
Speaker 1 (10:31):
A very marine approach to it.
Speaker 3 (10:33):
You'd be too careful and then I'd break it. Your
work is absolutely stunning. We hadn't seen it before, and
we went and really dug in, and your work is
absolutely stunning. So you decided to go to college and
pursue this as your life's path.
Speaker 4 (10:47):
Yeah, So I had done mostly I started doing painting
and printmaking, and then I went to a school that
had an independent study program so I could do research
and I had a summer job and stay Glass Studio,
and the fellows there suggested that I researched glass painting,
which I did. I basically paint on glass, and that's
(11:08):
how I the language that I kind of developed my
work in because I started doing it in my early
twenties and I'm a painter and I'm a narrative painter,
and I'm self taught, so I developed kind of a
focusesthetic and storytelling aspect.
Speaker 3 (11:27):
Your painting is not just painting like with a paintbrush
on top of glass, and then it's all.
Speaker 2 (11:34):
I was just about to say, you make it sound
so simple. Yeah, and it's not simple. I understand the explanation.
Not anybody can do it like you have no idea
how hard I tried to figure it out. I was like,
that's incredible, because it is. It's something that imagine that
you're painting a picture with words to the people listening,
(11:54):
that they can put themselves in your brain just for
a moment.
Speaker 4 (11:58):
Well, when I first started working with glass, I was
working in stained glass, and it is a very brilliant
material and it's not inexpensive either, So I think it's
interesting that I actually considered an audience when I started
working in glass because it's doesn't feel like particularly private medium.
(12:20):
The technique that I use is from early stained glass,
and it's called grisaille, and it's gray tonal painting, so
the colors are in the stained glass, and then the
drawing is done with a paint that's made out of
a glass frit and metal oxides, and so it gets
melted on, it's fired on, and it's fired on in
(12:40):
several layers, so a line work and then a second
layer which is applied as in a thin wash, and
then worked back subtractively with bristle brushes. It looks a
bit like an etching at that point, and then it
gets fired. Anyway, you can have a nuanced image with
painting and the colors of stained glass. That kind of
(13:00):
informed the whole development of my work, that style of
drawing of painting.
Speaker 3 (13:06):
What were your initial inspirations.
Speaker 4 (13:09):
I guess I've been inspired by early works from many cultures,
and this goes back to kind of an interest in
myth and religious cultures around the world. So when the
first pieces I did were sort of just straightforward narrative,
I was like figuring out my voice by making drawings
of Aesop's fables and to try to integrate the drawing
(13:32):
into the lead lines. And eventually I worked in stained
glass for about ten years, and actually at the very
beginning pieces I made a reproduction of Persian miniatures to
try to figure out how to work with the paints.
So I sort of was like changing the scale and
changing the well. Anyway, we can't talk about all the.
Speaker 2 (13:57):
It's a beautiful thing here is that Just from that
brief explanation, I think, especially for our younger audience or
even older audience that is listening, has to understand that
you can't wake up and be excellent at something.
Speaker 4 (14:13):
Yeah, it takes years, right, right.
Speaker 2 (14:15):
You have to embrace patients and you have to embrace
the grace that comes with said patients, mostly for yourself
and your process. And that's a great explanation what you
just gave of the fact that you have to be
very patient and very methodical and very self forgiving in
the process. And I think that's one of the reasons
(14:36):
that your outcomes are second to none. And so I
commend you on finding you and finding your path and
the fact that it's endless. In your words, you know,
you never find the bottom I think is exhilarating.
Speaker 1 (14:52):
I think that's got to be very exciting.
Speaker 4 (14:54):
Yeah, if there have been like these ten year periods
in my life as an artist where I do an exploration.
So the first ten years I did these sort of
narrative fables in stained glass, and then I bumped into
the studio glass movement, which is actually in full blast
here in the Seattle area. So I actually was very
(15:17):
lucky to be working in glass at this period when
there was a lot of interests being sparked by it.
For Dale Jihouli is a very well known artist now
internationally globally because he's just gotten very very famous, and
he started a school north of Seattle, Pilchat Glass School,
and so there was a community of people coalescing around
(15:40):
working with glass as an artistic medium. So I've sort
of been buoyed and carried along by that. You don't
get to do very much in isolation, but when there's
synergy behind a group of people kind of working in
the same direction, the universe is like giving you a push.
So I was lucky in that respect too. I was
a to actually find my way as an artist in
(16:03):
this material that was finding its voice at this particular
time and an audience who would buy it.
Speaker 3 (16:09):
So beautiful to have a mentor because you think art
is such a personal thing, but then to think, no,
there's actually a large community around and so that's that
is beautiful. Thank you for painting that picture. Let's switch
gears over to your love life. When was your heart
fulfilled and love?
Speaker 4 (16:28):
Yeah, so that'll take us back to my husband, Charlie.
That's the love of my life. I feel like that's
my karmic relationship person I was supposed to be with.
And we met when we were thirteen, so that goes
back to way back to junior high. Yeah, yep, Charlie
and I went to ASA Mercer Junior High and we
were friends through high school too. I met him just
(16:49):
prior to moving to Alabama, so I met him for
like a month in seventh grade. Then we moved, and
then we returned to Seattle two years later. So I
met him for just a short period when I was
thirteen and then came back when I was fifteen. We
were good friends in high school as well. We both
married other people, and we were sort of this brat
(17:12):
pack of kids who thought we were the clique, who
thought we weren't a click.
Speaker 1 (17:18):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (17:19):
And then Charlie and I bumped into each other again
at a point when I was about to get a
divorce and he already had one. We met at a
kind of an esoteric dance performance and had a long
conversation with each other. And then within the year my
(17:39):
marriage had come to an end and I was having
a show and I invited all my friends to come,
including Charlie, and I had a gathering at my studio
afterwards to celebrate. He came and I had all these
prints that I had a lithograph that to copies of
(18:00):
that I was giving to friends, and I gave one
to Charlie, and I remember he was leaving and I
gave him a kiss, and he thinks that I gave
him quite the kiss. Oh, I just thought I was
giving him a peck. But anyway, we started going out
after that, and I must have been a yes, Well,
it wasn't really much of a kiss. Actually, he told
(18:23):
everybody for the rest of his life that I was
really coming on to him.
Speaker 3 (18:30):
Hilarious. What was he like? What was it that drew
you to him?
Speaker 4 (18:34):
He was super smart and a serious guy, but also
he had a good sense of humor. We grew up
in the same place. You know, we knew the same people,
we had, grew up with the same music in the
same times. We couldn't have had a relationship if we'd
started earlyer. We both needed to grow up. He had
a complicated relationship with his dad. His dad was ex
(18:56):
military and just didn't live at home until Charlie was
about five or six. He's a biracial family, so his
mom's Japanese and his dad was Texas middleweight boxing oh wow,
from when he was young before the military. But his
(19:16):
dad was a disciplinarian, so Charlie had some hard stuff
in his family. He stayed with us when we were
My parents had left us for summer jobs and they
had a beach place. This was like in the like
nineteen seventy. Charlie lived with us just before he went
to college. He was selling encyclopedias and we were, you know,
(19:40):
had whatever summer jobs we had, and he came to
live with us because he'd gotten kicked out. He'd had
a fight, finally, a fight with his dad and that
was the end of that. So anyway, he went to
University of Chicago for a couple of years, and we
talked every so often on the phone. We were good friends,
but we weren't a love interest until much later.
Speaker 3 (20:00):
That's beautiful how your paths crossed right when they were
supposed to.
Speaker 4 (20:04):
And then it was wonderful to be married to him,
and we had the esoteric interest in common too. He
was intellectually curious period. Charlie read really broadly, and he
had a good, solid kind of basic education from Chicago,
so he had read a lot of Greek philosophy, and
then he continued to study his whole life. And anyway,
(20:27):
but when we were both interested, had friends who were
doing Gurdjief Gerjeef was an esoteric teacher in the twenties.
But we were reading books and had a little study group,
and then after we were married, we were just looking
at enlightenment. What's that you start getting interested in your
(20:47):
you know, what is a human being? And if you
start meditating, what you know? What is your mind? What
is stillness? You know? Where do you go when you
go to sleep? These things, I think everybody kind of
comes up against them or ponders them. But Charlie and
I both had a deep curiosity about these things, and
so we were in a school called the Ridwan School
(21:10):
for nine years where we worked with a teacher and
went on retreats and basically it was an inquiry into
presence basically and into the aspects of being, and the
head of the school was Hamid Ali, but there were
a lot of teachers in the program. So anyway, there
was an aspect of psychology in it too, so kind
(21:31):
of a spiritual psychology of going into the things that
separate you from presence, which usually are our family of
origin issues. But you got really a sense of what
being present and being quiet and if you can connect
with that. But in the end then Charlie was too
expensive to stay in so Charlie was ready to He
(21:53):
ran for a judicial office, and so we needed our
money to actually put into a political campaign, which was
a wonderful ego reduction exercise. Basically, anyway, the things you
do that you work for that are hard, and then
(22:13):
you lose, and then you pick yourself up the next day.
It's amazing you lose and then you grow and then
you go, oh wow, that was awful. Well, it wasn't
all awful. Anyway. We also got interested in basically the
wisdom traditions and theosophy, you know. Anyway, so Charlie and
(22:37):
I just it was wonderful to study with him. Charlie
got sick. I don't know if it was just a
segue for that, but we were married for twenty two
and a half years, and five years ago he had
got sick quickly and we didn't even know he was ill.
He wasn't feeling well and then for a couple weeks
(23:00):
and then I said, you just get to get into
the doctors, and you just have to go in. And
what happened was he went for some imaging and they
thought he might have leukemia, but then it turned out
to be something much more virulent. So in the end,
a week after the initial imaging, he was in pain
(23:22):
and we went back to the doctors for the follow
up and they put him in the hospital and then
he died four days later. So it was really fast. Yeah,
So the thing about death, well it's a shock. I mean,
it's terrible to not be prepared for. It is hard.
So you're in a state of shock for a while.
(23:43):
I mean, it's like but what helped was he had
been actually he didn't think he was going to live
long anyway. He talked about that frequently. His father died
at like age sixty two, and Charlie had some underlying
health issues. He had Type two diabetes and had a stint,
(24:04):
so he contemplated when he would die. And he had
been studying also the work of Rudel Steiner, who founded anthroposophy,
which is another of these sort of esoteric branches. It's
an esoteric Christian philosophy. But there's a lot of writing
that Steiner did about reincarnation. And he was a clairvoyant,
(24:29):
so he basically could see into the spiritual world, and
he did a lot of lecturing. The lectures were all written,
so there's a ton of material, and he spoke a
lot about the period between death and rebirth. And Charlie
had been reading about this for a long time and studying,
and I had been as well, but he had gone
(24:52):
much more deeply into it. So actually, right now we're
in Charlie's office and I'm just finally now going through
some through the books he has, like there's like five
thousand volumes in here, wow, on esoteric traditions of everything
from Tibetan Buddhism to Avida Vedanta to the Greeks to
(25:12):
theosophy and anthroposophy and Alice Bailey and you know, anyway,
it's like Gurgieff and all the people who basically secondary
students of all these movements. It was a defense attorney,
so if he wasn't actually defending somebody who had been
accused of there's a lot of dui work mostly and
(25:34):
some other more serious stuff. He was a wonderful lawyer,
but he was a lifelong learner. So I was comforted
by the fact that Charlie had he had studied how
you know, death, and so when he actually died, he
died quite easily, you know, when we found out that
he was on a ventilator, and when it turned out
that he was really was going, I said, no, then
(25:56):
we'd just let him go. And I think he just
relaxed into it dying. What it does it reveals to you.
To me anyway, my experience was that I could see
how much I loved him. Everything that was bullshit was
just disappeared and what didn't even exist. So I saw
(26:20):
how much I loved him, and that really carried me
for quite a while. It also pushed me into presence
the shock of the death. Like I was like in
the silence of it, and it was so true. Those
aspects of it were so profound, the depth and the
(26:41):
truth of it, and then how much I loved him,
and all these things that like they're they're very profound.
It was kind of ecstatic, almost strangely, because I was
also in love with myself because I could see how
much I loved him, and I was like, oh, y,
(27:02):
that was like proof of it, because you never know
because you get mad at people and you're like, oh
my god, are you kidding, why did you do that?
Or you've got your sticking points, you know. But I
appreciated so much about him too. Charlie wouldn't pull his punches.
He would tell the truth, and he told me the
truth when he thought I was out of line or whatever,
(27:22):
and it doesn't and that's not fun. But on the
other hand, I came to really appreciate who actually has
the courage to tell you what they see, even if
it's not what you want to hear.
Speaker 1 (27:36):
Very few butswer.
Speaker 4 (27:38):
But he made me a better person and I probably
made him a better person. But anyway, so the death
that was hard, and then eventually I got some grief counseling,
some therapy that helped. But you know, after the first year,
you realize, oh, this isn't going away, You're just in it,
(28:03):
and then you think, oh, you're going to get through it.
And then eventually you realize, oh, this is now part
of who you are. This grief, this loss, this person
is still part of who you are. And now the
fact that you lost them, that's part of who you are.
Also just trying to stay connected because I'm now seventy one.
(28:25):
Charlie died five years ago, five plus, and some people
want to partner up again and I don't. I had my.
Speaker 1 (28:35):
Person actually emotional, so I'll jump in like that.
Speaker 2 (28:44):
I probably don't look at like it, but I'm a
very deep human being, and.
Speaker 4 (28:50):
I think everybody is, really but you're more aware of
it than most people.
Speaker 2 (28:55):
You said it, not me, and your description like that
should be unsigned. It was such a beautiful and eloquently
put description that I feel like just the explanation alone
would help people start to heal. And I learned a
long time ago that I don't believe, I truly believe
(29:19):
that we don't ever get over traumatic experiences or things
that have made a big impression on our mind in
our soul. But I believe we learn to deal with
them in a healthier manner that in turn makes us
better human beings, not worse human beings. That's the way
I view those things. And it's clear to me by
(29:42):
your emotion that I feel, I truly feel it. I
hope we have.
Speaker 1 (29:49):
What they had, is all I'm gonna say. I.
Speaker 2 (29:52):
And I said that to Ashley for the listeners, like
that to me is ultimate relationship goal. And it's beautiful,
like your description and your emotion is absolutely raw and beautiful.
Speaker 1 (30:06):
And I just wanted to take a minute to acknowledge that.
Speaker 3 (30:09):
Thank you for sharing it with us, because your love
is now being spread to others because we can feel
it just to you talking about it, And so thank
you for sharing that. And I think back to when
you told us about the two of you really digging
in and what is presence and what is humanality and
what are all of these things? How much deeper was
(30:30):
your relationship because you took the time, you took the energy,
you took the effort to go study all of these things.
Speaker 1 (30:36):
Think that is such a great point.
Speaker 2 (30:39):
Think about how instant gratification obsessed we are in this country.
It's everything we want, need, is that our fingertips or
you know, on a keyboard, and the fact that you
guys took time and dug in it's not common especially now.
Speaker 4 (30:57):
Just want to say one thing about doing that work together.
You're doing that work together, but a part for sure,
because like Charlie's issues were really different from my issues,
and so it isn't like you go into this thing
and you're sharing the beauty of all that. No, your
each of you is in your your shit and then
(31:17):
you're you're working it out, you're you're Yeah, there was
just one piece of it. I wanted to like not
make it too romantic, the part of like doing the
inner work of like looking at your stuff. It's very
individual and it's when you know that.
Speaker 3 (31:32):
Everybody knows that there's absolutely nothing romantic about that part
at all. But to have two people that are in
a union together, that have committed their lives to each other.
Speaker 4 (31:44):
I was really lucky to have a partner who was
interested in that the same.
Speaker 2 (31:48):
As me, and he it was really lucky to have
you too, because it takes two. You absolutely exude love
and greece An acceptance, capy. I mean, I feel it
hardcore off of you You're a beautiful person, and so.
Speaker 1 (32:08):
This has been an amazing thank you revolution.
Speaker 3 (32:11):
How are you doing now?
Speaker 4 (32:13):
You mean, in my life in general or in this minute.
Speaker 3 (32:17):
In your life in general? How are you doing now?
Speaker 1 (32:20):
Oh?
Speaker 4 (32:20):
Yeah, So now I'm actually I'm struggling. I started up
to talk to my grief therapist again. My mom died recently.
My mom died in January. The last few years, the
pandemic's been tough. But my mom that's different. She was
ninety nine and a half and I had a wonderful
time she was still in her home. We were caregivers.
(32:42):
I was one of like five caregivers for the last
four years with my mom, and so that's a different thing.
But I miss her. Death is a subject for me.
Death is a you know, right now, it's a big subject.
I'm contemplating tidying up. It's weird. I want to live.
So I'm actually I'm trying to figure out how to
(33:07):
live with the loss and with the ongoing relationship that
you have with your loved ones who are gone. So
how am I doing now? I have a show that
I am preparing for that's next winter, and I so
I'm my art practice, which is I know that's always
been the bottom line. It was after Charlie died, because
(33:28):
the question is what do I do now? It's a
huge question, what do I want to do now? But
I fortunately I've always been able to answer it, which
goes back to the first thing I said was that
art is a deep study and you never come to
the bottom of it. Because really, I have become a
subject of my work in the narrative I did, probably
thirty years ago, start to pop in as a character
(33:50):
in the work. And now it's not necessarily that I'm
drawing myself in the work, although sometimes I am. It's
how I understand unconscious material comes up through art, and
so it's how I read myself. It's how I see
how I am, And so I can tell you I'm
good and I'm struggling.
Speaker 1 (34:13):
And that's all okay, Yeah, that's all okay.
Speaker 4 (34:16):
Exactly.
Speaker 3 (34:17):
I can't wait to see your next pieces that you produce.
I truly can't. We have a question that we've asked
all of our guests, and I just cannot wait to
hear your answer to this. But what feeds your soul?
Speaker 4 (34:29):
Oh, the study that I'm doing, the esoteric study, it
feeds my soul and my friends do, my relationships with
friends do, and art does. I actually realizing recently that
I'm hungry for good art. So, I mean, there's an
incredible show up at the Fry cast from Bradford. There's
(34:51):
a wonderful art museum in Seattle that has an incredible
show of Brooklyn, a New York painter, casts from Bradford.
Incredible sh she's eighty and it's a retrospective and it's
just incredible. Those are the things that are feeding my
soul right now.
Speaker 3 (35:07):
And where can people find your art?
Speaker 4 (35:11):
Oh, I have a website Kathie Thompson dot com, c
A P Y T h O N ps O N
dot com.
Speaker 3 (35:17):
Truly beautiful works of art.
Speaker 1 (35:21):
How do you find yourself recharging?
Speaker 4 (35:24):
Walking is extremely important practice, And actually I learned that
after Charlie died, because really nothing was I mean, I
was just in a state of numbness in a way,
but walking I could feel my legs, just the feeling
of feeling my legs, and I was like, oh, this
feels good. So actually I still now I need to
(35:47):
be in nature. I don't have to be forest bathing
because that's pretty hard to do, but just to be
seeing some trees and the sky and hear the birds.
And so there's a park not too are from me
that just has a good walking loop. So anyway, so
that I walk, yeah, and I need to see friends,
and I need a good night's sleep. Those are my
(36:09):
go to recharging.
Speaker 1 (36:12):
Kathy Thompson.
Speaker 3 (36:13):
Kathy Thompson, thank you so much. Thank you for your
vulnerability and telling us your story. I mean, we could
do five hours with you, Katy.
Speaker 2 (36:23):
Like I said, this is not the last time we've
talked so much. Right now, I just want to hug you.
I just want to do right.
Speaker 3 (36:29):
Now doing a zoom hug. Oh. Thank you so much.
We truly appreciate your insight and your vulnerability and you
speaking your truth. It's your love of art, your love
of Charlie, your love of your mom, Virginia, and and
all things in this life. It's true that you see
the beauty in life, but you're also a forever student
(36:51):
and want to know more. We have so much to
gain from you, and we truly appreciate you being on
the good stuff much like.
Speaker 1 (36:57):
You exude.
Speaker 2 (37:00):
Everything that I aspire to be and I mean in
the emotional sense as a human being, and so.
Speaker 1 (37:08):
Thank you for being you and giving us.
Speaker 2 (37:10):
Your time and enlightening not only myself but everyone that
took the time to listen to this.
Speaker 1 (37:16):
We were indebted to you.
Speaker 4 (37:18):
Thank you so much.
Speaker 1 (37:21):
That is the purest.
Speaker 3 (37:25):
Soul, so beautiful, and not only the work that she's done,
not only the art that she's created in her story,
but she's was so raw and authentic and telling her
story and you can tell she's ever searching for more.
That fascinates me. So many of us get stuck and
(37:45):
just what we know and then we move forward. She
wants to know more and that's beautiful to me.
Speaker 1 (37:51):
Yeah, listen, I'm asked a lot, Jake, how do we
stop war? Now? I have an even more simple answer.
Be more like Kappy Thompson.
Speaker 3 (38:02):
She is an incredible woman. To me, this episode was
a gift because there was so much enlightenment coming across
from her microphone to us. Right, Yeah, we get to
share it with others.
Speaker 2 (38:14):
Beautiful soul, beautiful human, the most genuine version of herself
every day seemingly and it's just you know, I've never
wanted to hug someone so much and like just immediately
feel uber protective of this amazing human being. That brings
(38:35):
so much light in so many different ways and just
commands the grit to be better tomorrow than we were today.
Speaker 3 (38:43):
That's what it is.
Speaker 1 (38:44):
She's light.
Speaker 3 (38:45):
She is light.
Speaker 1 (38:46):
In fact, it's beautiful.
Speaker 3 (38:49):
Thank you so much for listening. If this episode touched
you today, please share it and be part of making
someone else's day better.
Speaker 1 (38:55):
Put on your bad ass case and go be great today.
Speaker 2 (38:57):
And remember you can't do epic stuff without epic people.
Speaker 1 (39:01):
Thank you for listening to the good Stuff.
Speaker 2 (39:06):
The Good Stuff is executive produced by Ashley Schick, Jacob Schick,
Leah Pictures and.
Speaker 1 (39:11):
Q Code Media.
Speaker 2 (39:13):
Hosted by Ashley Shick and Jacob Shick, Produced by Nick
Cassolini and Ryan Counts. House post production supervisor Will Tindi.
Music editing by Will heywood Smith, Edited by Mike Robinson.
Welcome to the Good Stuff.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
I'm Jacob Schick and I am joined by my co
host and wife, Ashley shik Jake is.
Speaker 3 (00:15):
A third generation combat Marine and I'm a gold Star granddaughter.
We work together to serve military veterans, first responders, frontline
healthcare workers, and their families with mental and emotional wellness
through traditional and non traditional therapy. At One Tribe Foundation,
we believe.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
Everyone has a story to tell, not only about the peaks,
but also the valleys they've been through to get them to.
Speaker 1 (00:36):
Where they are today.
Speaker 3 (00:37):
Each week, we invite a guest to tell us their story,
to share with us the lessons they've learned that shaped
who they are and what they're doing to pay it
forward and give back.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
Are mission with this show is to dig deep into
our guest journeys so that we can celebrate the hope
and inspiration or story has to offer.
Speaker 3 (00:52):
We're thrilled you're joining us again.
Speaker 1 (00:55):
Welcome to the Good Stuff. Our guest today.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
Is Thompson, an internationally recognized glass artist based in Seattle, Washington.
Speaker 3 (01:06):
Kapi's work deals with the biggest themes we as humans
try to come to terms with faith, religion, myth, folklore,
the cosmos and the afterlife.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
Not only has Kapi built a life long, celebrated career
as a fine artist, she is equally devoted to her
creative community as a teacher and mentor.
Speaker 3 (01:24):
She's here today to tell us about her life as
an artist and being a devoted student to religious philosophies
and spirituality. Kappy's story is also about the life and
sudden death of her beloved husband, Charlie Williams. Charlie was
the great love of Kapi's life and a partner in
her exploration of the spiritual realm. His passing opened Kappy's
(01:44):
heart to an even greater sense of love, heartbreak, and
the unknown.
Speaker 2 (01:50):
This episode is about living, dying, and the beauty found
and grieving. This was a particularly moving conversation and we
are blessed to be able to.
Speaker 1 (01:58):
Share it with you.
Speaker 3 (02:02):
Miss Kathy Thompson, Thank you so much for joining us
here on the Good Stuff. We are so thrilled that
you're here joining us today.
Speaker 4 (02:09):
Thank you.
Speaker 3 (02:09):
Your story is about some of our greatest mysteries of life.
It's art, love, the meaning of life, and the meaning
of death. Your life has been so full of creation
and spiritual inquiry, and so to get us started tell
us about what it was like growing up in your
household and how you even became interested in art.
Speaker 4 (02:28):
My mom was a painter, and she actually didn't have
a career, but she was primarily a homemaker. She had
four children with my dad, but she had a lifelong
practice of painting, and there was an art supplies in
the house. We went to museums, we went to gallery.
So I had an early awareness that art was something
(02:50):
that was a value. And I'm wired kind of the
way my mom is, so it was a pretty natural
thing to be interested in it as a kid. And
I started feeling like I was in a zone with
it probably when I was a teenager, so it was
kind of natural to head that direction.
Speaker 2 (03:09):
Kevin, do you have any brothers or sisters and did
you guys go to church.
Speaker 4 (03:14):
I have two sisters. I'm the middle girl or two
years apart, and a younger brother who's four years younger
than Mollie, six years younger than me. So my mom's
was from Iowa. Just a wonderful sort of common sense
person with a good sense of humor, and she met
my dad in college. It was after the war. My
(03:36):
dad was going to school on the GI Bill at
the University of Washington. My mom was coming to get
a teaching certificate, so that's how they met. We moved
a bit because my dad took him a little while
to settle down into a job that ended up being
a long term career. The family unit was pretty tight
(03:56):
and pretty important because we moved not infrequently, but you know,
every few years. One thing that was formative was when
I was a teenager. My dad, by then I was
a Boeing engineer, and that was one of the recessions
where everybody was leaving. Boeing was laying off people, and
he basically was transferred to the South. Boeing had facilities
(04:21):
in Huntsville, Alabama, and so my dad was transferred there.
So we moved to the Deep South during the Civil
Rights movement. My mom's father had passed away when she
was young, and my mom was in her twenties when
her father died, and when I was twelve and her sister,
Dory was in her thirties, Dori died of cancer, and
(04:44):
so that was about the time we moved to Alabama.
My mom had sought a church. At that point. I
started to attend the Episcopal Church. My family did, and
so that was kind of my first religious grounding. But
when I was about thirty teen, like a lot of
people do, I kind of decided that the Nicean crete
(05:06):
didn't make any sense to me that Jesus would be
the only begotten son of God. I mean, I had
a naive understanding of it, and I was just like, no,
I couldn't understand why all religions weren't acceptable or anyway.
Stopped kind of going to church. And then when I
was in college, I got attracted to, of course, all
the religions. I got curious about them, so I looked
(05:30):
at Buddhism, and Sufi's stories were really interesting to me,
So I you know, I sort of started getting interested
in the esoteric areas of most of the of religious cultures.
Speaker 3 (05:43):
I think that's so fascinating that at such a young
age you started to not necessarily question, but you started
to just really think on a broader scope about religion.
Then about okay, does this make sense.
Speaker 4 (05:56):
My family was pretty probably left leaning, I guess I
would say we had gone from the far North to
the deep South. My parents had taken on well, they
definitely were an anti racist mindset, and I think that
there were a lot you know, there was a lot
of philosophical and sort of like value oriented discussion in
(06:21):
my family. So that's probably why it. You know, it
was okay for me to basically say no, I disagree,
you know, I don't think this is what I want
to do.
Speaker 2 (06:31):
And I think that's extremely important in family units to
have openness, be able to talk with vulnerability, because we're
all eat our own person And I think it's a
beautiful thing that you were able to go educate yourself
stemming from curiosity, which was often Disguis's courage to look
in these other into these other religions and to educate
(06:52):
yourself about what does it all mean? Are they connected?
Do they have to be separated? And it seems as
though because of industry and monetary gain, a lot.
Speaker 1 (07:04):
Of it is.
Speaker 2 (07:06):
Separated, and then the hyper focus is implemented in being
able to okay, this is going to be monetized, Therefore.
Speaker 1 (07:17):
It's going to be protected because we can't lose that.
Speaker 2 (07:21):
I'm with you completely on that, But were you the
only one that kind of picked up on the art
out of your siblings?
Speaker 4 (07:30):
Ah, that's interesting. My sister Sarah was bookworm She's the eldest,
and she was just so smart. She's basically was academically
really brilliant, and she buried herself in books, and I
sort of went another direction. So I was like into
visual art, and my younger sister, Mollie basically went into theater,
(07:52):
and my brother Peter was good at math and science.
The eldest and the youngest actually were pretty academically oriented,
and then Mollie and I were more in the creative side.
Everybody kind of carved out a different kind of lane,
I guess.
Speaker 3 (08:08):
So when did you decide to make art your life's path.
Speaker 4 (08:13):
It was in my early twenties when I went to
school in Bellingham at an alternative school, but there was
no opportunity to do art. It was connected with a
college that had art, but you couldn't get into classes
as a first year student. There's no way you could
do art, and so I wasn't particularly happy, and I
after one year, I went back home and there was
(08:34):
a small art school in Seattle, wasn't really accredited even
but it was really a fantastic place. It's called the
Factory of Visual Art, and the classes were great, and
I basically went to school there with my mom. We
both took classes and I had never been happier. And
then the next year the whole family had gotten into therapy.
(08:56):
My mom had found a therapist and it was sort
of transactual ANALYSI since we were like a hippie family
diving deep into So when I went back to school
a year later, it was like, are you going to
do psychology or do I want to do art? And
it was a pretty easy decision because I thought, yeah,
if I do art, I'll never come to the bottom
(09:17):
of it. You won't ever come to the end of it.
So and that's true. I made a really good decision and.
Speaker 3 (09:23):
Never thought about that.
Speaker 1 (09:25):
But it's such a profound.
Speaker 3 (09:26):
It's never ending to say you can always create more, and.
Speaker 2 (09:30):
To be honest with a lot of the people we know,
human psychology feels.
Speaker 1 (09:36):
A lot like well, just you'll never see the end
of it.
Speaker 3 (09:40):
But it's you know, it's it's such a gift to
be able to create. And artists have always fascinated me.
Like I said, I'm not an artist. I try to
draw a dog and it looks like I love to
paint the hell out of walls. Yes, I do love that.
Speaker 4 (09:54):
I love painting because that's good too.
Speaker 1 (09:56):
It's therapeutic.
Speaker 3 (09:57):
And you brought up therapy, and how forward thinking of
your parents to have the entire family back then in therapy,
because you know.
Speaker 4 (10:04):
Yeah right, it was kind of amazing.
Speaker 3 (10:06):
Actually somewhat taboo. But to me, painting walls is therapy.
Speaker 1 (10:11):
Yeah, I mean, it's proof we can find therapy in
anything we do.
Speaker 3 (10:14):
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (10:14):
You know, you have to be.
Speaker 2 (10:15):
First centered with yourself, and I believe that what you're
able to create with your own hands is awe inspiring.
Because as Ash and I were looking at some of
this art, I was like, there's no way in hell
I wouldn't break that accidentally, Like I wouldn't mean to, yeah,
but I would take.
Speaker 1 (10:31):
A very marine approach to it.
Speaker 3 (10:33):
You'd be too careful and then I'd break it. Your
work is absolutely stunning. We hadn't seen it before, and
we went and really dug in, and your work is
absolutely stunning. So you decided to go to college and
pursue this as your life's path.
Speaker 4 (10:47):
Yeah, So I had done mostly I started doing painting
and printmaking, and then I went to a school that
had an independent study program so I could do research
and I had a summer job and stay Glass Studio,
and the fellows there suggested that I researched glass painting,
which I did. I basically paint on glass, and that's
(11:08):
how I the language that I kind of developed my
work in because I started doing it in my early
twenties and I'm a painter and I'm a narrative painter,
and I'm self taught, so I developed kind of a
focusesthetic and storytelling aspect.
Speaker 3 (11:27):
Your painting is not just painting like with a paintbrush
on top of glass, and then it's all.
Speaker 2 (11:34):
I was just about to say, you make it sound
so simple. Yeah, and it's not simple. I understand the explanation.
Not anybody can do it like you have no idea
how hard I tried to figure it out. I was like,
that's incredible, because it is. It's something that imagine that
you're painting a picture with words to the people listening,
(11:54):
that they can put themselves in your brain just for
a moment.
Speaker 4 (11:58):
Well, when I first started working with glass, I was
working in stained glass, and it is a very brilliant
material and it's not inexpensive either, So I think it's
interesting that I actually considered an audience when I started
working in glass because it's doesn't feel like particularly private medium.
(12:20):
The technique that I use is from early stained glass,
and it's called grisaille, and it's gray tonal painting, so
the colors are in the stained glass, and then the
drawing is done with a paint that's made out of
a glass frit and metal oxides, and so it gets
melted on, it's fired on, and it's fired on in
(12:40):
several layers, so a line work and then a second
layer which is applied as in a thin wash, and
then worked back subtractively with bristle brushes. It looks a
bit like an etching at that point, and then it
gets fired. Anyway, you can have a nuanced image with
painting and the colors of stained glass. That kind of
(13:00):
informed the whole development of my work, that style of
drawing of painting.
Speaker 3 (13:06):
What were your initial inspirations.
Speaker 4 (13:09):
I guess I've been inspired by early works from many cultures,
and this goes back to kind of an interest in
myth and religious cultures around the world. So when the
first pieces I did were sort of just straightforward narrative,
I was like figuring out my voice by making drawings
of Aesop's fables and to try to integrate the drawing
(13:32):
into the lead lines. And eventually I worked in stained
glass for about ten years, and actually at the very
beginning pieces I made a reproduction of Persian miniatures to
try to figure out how to work with the paints.
So I sort of was like changing the scale and
changing the well. Anyway, we can't talk about all the.
Speaker 2 (13:57):
It's a beautiful thing here is that Just from that
brief explanation, I think, especially for our younger audience or
even older audience that is listening, has to understand that
you can't wake up and be excellent at something.
Speaker 4 (14:13):
Yeah, it takes years, right, right.
Speaker 2 (14:15):
You have to embrace patients and you have to embrace
the grace that comes with said patients, mostly for yourself
and your process. And that's a great explanation what you
just gave of the fact that you have to be
very patient and very methodical and very self forgiving in
the process. And I think that's one of the reasons
(14:36):
that your outcomes are second to none. And so I
commend you on finding you and finding your path and
the fact that it's endless. In your words, you know,
you never find the bottom I think is exhilarating.
Speaker 1 (14:52):
I think that's got to be very exciting.
Speaker 4 (14:54):
Yeah, if there have been like these ten year periods
in my life as an artist where I do an exploration.
So the first ten years I did these sort of
narrative fables in stained glass, and then I bumped into
the studio glass movement, which is actually in full blast
here in the Seattle area. So I actually was very
(15:17):
lucky to be working in glass at this period when
there was a lot of interests being sparked by it.
For Dale Jihouli is a very well known artist now
internationally globally because he's just gotten very very famous, and
he started a school north of Seattle, Pilchat Glass School,
and so there was a community of people coalescing around
(15:40):
working with glass as an artistic medium. So I've sort
of been buoyed and carried along by that. You don't
get to do very much in isolation, but when there's
synergy behind a group of people kind of working in
the same direction, the universe is like giving you a push.
So I was lucky in that respect too. I was
a to actually find my way as an artist in
(16:03):
this material that was finding its voice at this particular
time and an audience who would buy it.
Speaker 3 (16:09):
So beautiful to have a mentor because you think art
is such a personal thing, but then to think, no,
there's actually a large community around and so that's that
is beautiful. Thank you for painting that picture. Let's switch
gears over to your love life. When was your heart
fulfilled and love?
Speaker 4 (16:28):
Yeah, so that'll take us back to my husband, Charlie.
That's the love of my life. I feel like that's
my karmic relationship person I was supposed to be with.
And we met when we were thirteen, so that goes
back to way back to junior high. Yeah, yep, Charlie
and I went to ASA Mercer Junior High and we
were friends through high school too. I met him just
(16:49):
prior to moving to Alabama, so I met him for
like a month in seventh grade. Then we moved, and
then we returned to Seattle two years later. So I
met him for just a short period when I was
thirteen and then came back when I was fifteen. We
were good friends in high school as well. We both
married other people, and we were sort of this brat
(17:12):
pack of kids who thought we were the clique, who
thought we weren't a click.
Speaker 1 (17:18):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (17:19):
And then Charlie and I bumped into each other again
at a point when I was about to get a
divorce and he already had one. We met at a
kind of an esoteric dance performance and had a long
conversation with each other. And then within the year my
(17:39):
marriage had come to an end and I was having
a show and I invited all my friends to come,
including Charlie, and I had a gathering at my studio
afterwards to celebrate. He came and I had all these
prints that I had a lithograph that to copies of
(18:00):
that I was giving to friends, and I gave one
to Charlie, and I remember he was leaving and I
gave him a kiss, and he thinks that I gave
him quite the kiss. Oh, I just thought I was
giving him a peck. But anyway, we started going out
after that, and I must have been a yes, Well,
it wasn't really much of a kiss. Actually, he told
(18:23):
everybody for the rest of his life that I was
really coming on to him.
Speaker 3 (18:30):
Hilarious. What was he like? What was it that drew
you to him?
Speaker 4 (18:34):
He was super smart and a serious guy, but also
he had a good sense of humor. We grew up
in the same place. You know, we knew the same people,
we had, grew up with the same music in the
same times. We couldn't have had a relationship if we'd
started earlyer. We both needed to grow up. He had
a complicated relationship with his dad. His dad was ex
(18:56):
military and just didn't live at home until Charlie was
about five or six. He's a biracial family, so his
mom's Japanese and his dad was Texas middleweight boxing oh wow,
from when he was young before the military. But his
(19:16):
dad was a disciplinarian, so Charlie had some hard stuff
in his family. He stayed with us when we were
My parents had left us for summer jobs and they
had a beach place. This was like in the like
nineteen seventy. Charlie lived with us just before he went
to college. He was selling encyclopedias and we were, you know,
(19:40):
had whatever summer jobs we had, and he came to
live with us because he'd gotten kicked out. He'd had
a fight, finally, a fight with his dad and that
was the end of that. So anyway, he went to
University of Chicago for a couple of years, and we
talked every so often on the phone. We were good friends,
but we weren't a love interest until much later.
Speaker 3 (20:00):
That's beautiful how your paths crossed right when they were
supposed to.
Speaker 4 (20:04):
And then it was wonderful to be married to him,
and we had the esoteric interest in common too. He
was intellectually curious period. Charlie read really broadly, and he
had a good, solid kind of basic education from Chicago,
so he had read a lot of Greek philosophy, and
then he continued to study his whole life. And anyway,
(20:27):
but when we were both interested, had friends who were
doing Gurdjief Gerjeef was an esoteric teacher in the twenties.
But we were reading books and had a little study group,
and then after we were married, we were just looking
at enlightenment. What's that you start getting interested in your
(20:47):
you know, what is a human being? And if you
start meditating, what you know? What is your mind? What
is stillness? You know? Where do you go when you
go to sleep? These things, I think everybody kind of
comes up against them or ponders them. But Charlie and
I both had a deep curiosity about these things, and
so we were in a school called the Ridwan School
(21:10):
for nine years where we worked with a teacher and
went on retreats and basically it was an inquiry into
presence basically and into the aspects of being, and the
head of the school was Hamid Ali, but there were
a lot of teachers in the program. So anyway, there
was an aspect of psychology in it too, so kind
(21:31):
of a spiritual psychology of going into the things that
separate you from presence, which usually are our family of
origin issues. But you got really a sense of what
being present and being quiet and if you can connect
with that. But in the end then Charlie was too
expensive to stay in so Charlie was ready to He
(21:53):
ran for a judicial office, and so we needed our
money to actually put into a political campaign, which was
a wonderful ego reduction exercise. Basically, anyway, the things you
do that you work for that are hard, and then
(22:13):
you lose, and then you pick yourself up the next day.
It's amazing you lose and then you grow and then
you go, oh wow, that was awful. Well, it wasn't
all awful. Anyway. We also got interested in basically the
wisdom traditions and theosophy, you know. Anyway, so Charlie and
(22:37):
I just it was wonderful to study with him. Charlie
got sick. I don't know if it was just a
segue for that, but we were married for twenty two
and a half years, and five years ago he had
got sick quickly and we didn't even know he was ill.
He wasn't feeling well and then for a couple weeks
(23:00):
and then I said, you just get to get into
the doctors, and you just have to go in. And
what happened was he went for some imaging and they
thought he might have leukemia, but then it turned out
to be something much more virulent. So in the end,
a week after the initial imaging, he was in pain
(23:22):
and we went back to the doctors for the follow
up and they put him in the hospital and then
he died four days later. So it was really fast. Yeah,
So the thing about death, well it's a shock. I mean,
it's terrible to not be prepared for. It is hard.
So you're in a state of shock for a while.
(23:43):
I mean, it's like but what helped was he had
been actually he didn't think he was going to live
long anyway. He talked about that frequently. His father died
at like age sixty two, and Charlie had some underlying
health issues. He had Type two diabetes and had a stint,
(24:04):
so he contemplated when he would die. And he had
been studying also the work of Rudel Steiner, who founded anthroposophy,
which is another of these sort of esoteric branches. It's
an esoteric Christian philosophy. But there's a lot of writing
that Steiner did about reincarnation. And he was a clairvoyant,
(24:29):
so he basically could see into the spiritual world, and
he did a lot of lecturing. The lectures were all written,
so there's a ton of material, and he spoke a
lot about the period between death and rebirth. And Charlie
had been reading about this for a long time and studying,
and I had been as well, but he had gone
(24:52):
much more deeply into it. So actually, right now we're
in Charlie's office and I'm just finally now going through
some through the books he has, like there's like five
thousand volumes in here, wow, on esoteric traditions of everything
from Tibetan Buddhism to Avida Vedanta to the Greeks to
(25:12):
theosophy and anthroposophy and Alice Bailey and you know, anyway,
it's like Gurgieff and all the people who basically secondary
students of all these movements. It was a defense attorney,
so if he wasn't actually defending somebody who had been
accused of there's a lot of dui work mostly and
(25:34):
some other more serious stuff. He was a wonderful lawyer,
but he was a lifelong learner. So I was comforted
by the fact that Charlie had he had studied how
you know, death, and so when he actually died, he
died quite easily, you know, when we found out that
he was on a ventilator, and when it turned out
that he was really was going, I said, no, then
(25:56):
we'd just let him go. And I think he just
relaxed into it dying. What it does it reveals to you.
To me anyway, my experience was that I could see
how much I loved him. Everything that was bullshit was
just disappeared and what didn't even exist. So I saw
(26:20):
how much I loved him, and that really carried me
for quite a while. It also pushed me into presence
the shock of the death. Like I was like in
the silence of it, and it was so true. Those
aspects of it were so profound, the depth and the
(26:41):
truth of it, and then how much I loved him,
and all these things that like they're they're very profound.
It was kind of ecstatic, almost strangely, because I was
also in love with myself because I could see how
much I loved him, and I was like, oh, y,
(27:02):
that was like proof of it, because you never know
because you get mad at people and you're like, oh
my god, are you kidding, why did you do that?
Or you've got your sticking points, you know. But I
appreciated so much about him too. Charlie wouldn't pull his punches.
He would tell the truth, and he told me the
truth when he thought I was out of line or whatever,
(27:22):
and it doesn't and that's not fun. But on the
other hand, I came to really appreciate who actually has
the courage to tell you what they see, even if
it's not what you want to hear.
Speaker 1 (27:36):
Very few butswer.
Speaker 4 (27:38):
But he made me a better person and I probably
made him a better person. But anyway, so the death
that was hard, and then eventually I got some grief counseling,
some therapy that helped. But you know, after the first year,
you realize, oh, this isn't going away, You're just in it,
(28:03):
and then you think, oh, you're going to get through it.
And then eventually you realize, oh, this is now part
of who you are. This grief, this loss, this person
is still part of who you are. And now the
fact that you lost them, that's part of who you are.
Also just trying to stay connected because I'm now seventy one.
(28:25):
Charlie died five years ago, five plus, and some people
want to partner up again and I don't. I had my.
Speaker 1 (28:35):
Person actually emotional, so I'll jump in like that.
Speaker 2 (28:44):
I probably don't look at like it, but I'm a
very deep human being, and.
Speaker 4 (28:50):
I think everybody is, really but you're more aware of
it than most people.
Speaker 2 (28:55):
You said it, not me, and your description like that
should be unsigned. It was such a beautiful and eloquently
put description that I feel like just the explanation alone
would help people start to heal. And I learned a
long time ago that I don't believe, I truly believe
(29:19):
that we don't ever get over traumatic experiences or things
that have made a big impression on our mind in
our soul. But I believe we learn to deal with
them in a healthier manner that in turn makes us
better human beings, not worse human beings. That's the way
I view those things. And it's clear to me by
(29:42):
your emotion that I feel, I truly feel it. I
hope we have.
Speaker 1 (29:49):
What they had, is all I'm gonna say. I.
Speaker 2 (29:52):
And I said that to Ashley for the listeners, like
that to me is ultimate relationship goal. And it's beautiful,
like your description and your emotion is absolutely raw and beautiful.
Speaker 1 (30:06):
And I just wanted to take a minute to acknowledge that.
Speaker 3 (30:09):
Thank you for sharing it with us, because your love
is now being spread to others because we can feel
it just to you talking about it, And so thank
you for sharing that. And I think back to when
you told us about the two of you really digging
in and what is presence and what is humanality and
what are all of these things? How much deeper was
(30:30):
your relationship because you took the time, you took the energy,
you took the effort to go study all of these things.
Speaker 1 (30:36):
Think that is such a great point.
Speaker 2 (30:39):
Think about how instant gratification obsessed we are in this country.
It's everything we want, need, is that our fingertips or
you know, on a keyboard, and the fact that you
guys took time and dug in it's not common especially now.
Speaker 4 (30:57):
Just want to say one thing about doing that work together.
You're doing that work together, but a part for sure,
because like Charlie's issues were really different from my issues,
and so it isn't like you go into this thing
and you're sharing the beauty of all that. No, your
each of you is in your your shit and then
(31:17):
you're you're working it out, you're you're Yeah, there was
just one piece of it. I wanted to like not
make it too romantic, the part of like doing the
inner work of like looking at your stuff. It's very
individual and it's when you know that.
Speaker 3 (31:32):
Everybody knows that there's absolutely nothing romantic about that part
at all. But to have two people that are in
a union together, that have committed their lives to each other.
Speaker 4 (31:44):
I was really lucky to have a partner who was
interested in that the same.
Speaker 2 (31:48):
As me, and he it was really lucky to have
you too, because it takes two. You absolutely exude love
and greece An acceptance, capy. I mean, I feel it
hardcore off of you You're a beautiful person, and so.
Speaker 1 (32:08):
This has been an amazing thank you revolution.
Speaker 3 (32:11):
How are you doing now?
Speaker 4 (32:13):
You mean, in my life in general or in this minute.
Speaker 3 (32:17):
In your life in general? How are you doing now?
Speaker 1 (32:20):
Oh?
Speaker 4 (32:20):
Yeah, So now I'm actually I'm struggling. I started up
to talk to my grief therapist again. My mom died recently.
My mom died in January. The last few years, the
pandemic's been tough. But my mom that's different. She was
ninety nine and a half and I had a wonderful
time she was still in her home. We were caregivers.
(32:42):
I was one of like five caregivers for the last
four years with my mom, and so that's a different thing.
But I miss her. Death is a subject for me.
Death is a you know, right now, it's a big subject.
I'm contemplating tidying up. It's weird. I want to live.
So I'm actually I'm trying to figure out how to
(33:07):
live with the loss and with the ongoing relationship that
you have with your loved ones who are gone. So
how am I doing now? I have a show that
I am preparing for that's next winter, and I so
I'm my art practice, which is I know that's always
been the bottom line. It was after Charlie died, because
(33:28):
the question is what do I do now? It's a
huge question, what do I want to do now? But
I fortunately I've always been able to answer it, which
goes back to the first thing I said was that
art is a deep study and you never come to
the bottom of it. Because really, I have become a
subject of my work in the narrative I did, probably
thirty years ago, start to pop in as a character
(33:50):
in the work. And now it's not necessarily that I'm
drawing myself in the work, although sometimes I am. It's
how I understand unconscious material comes up through art, and
so it's how I read myself. It's how I see
how I am, And so I can tell you I'm
good and I'm struggling.
Speaker 1 (34:13):
And that's all okay, Yeah, that's all okay.
Speaker 4 (34:16):
Exactly.
Speaker 3 (34:17):
I can't wait to see your next pieces that you produce.
I truly can't. We have a question that we've asked
all of our guests, and I just cannot wait to
hear your answer to this. But what feeds your soul?
Speaker 4 (34:29):
Oh, the study that I'm doing, the esoteric study, it
feeds my soul and my friends do, my relationships with
friends do, and art does. I actually realizing recently that
I'm hungry for good art. So, I mean, there's an
incredible show up at the Fry cast from Bradford. There's
(34:51):
a wonderful art museum in Seattle that has an incredible
show of Brooklyn, a New York painter, casts from Bradford.
Incredible sh she's eighty and it's a retrospective and it's
just incredible. Those are the things that are feeding my
soul right now.
Speaker 3 (35:07):
And where can people find your art?
Speaker 4 (35:11):
Oh, I have a website Kathie Thompson dot com, c
A P Y T h O N ps O N
dot com.
Speaker 3 (35:17):
Truly beautiful works of art.
Speaker 1 (35:21):
How do you find yourself recharging?
Speaker 4 (35:24):
Walking is extremely important practice, And actually I learned that
after Charlie died, because really nothing was I mean, I
was just in a state of numbness in a way,
but walking I could feel my legs, just the feeling
of feeling my legs, and I was like, oh, this
feels good. So actually I still now I need to
(35:47):
be in nature. I don't have to be forest bathing
because that's pretty hard to do, but just to be
seeing some trees and the sky and hear the birds.
And so there's a park not too are from me
that just has a good walking loop. So anyway, so
that I walk, yeah, and I need to see friends,
and I need a good night's sleep. Those are my
(36:09):
go to recharging.
Speaker 1 (36:12):
Kathy Thompson.
Speaker 3 (36:13):
Kathy Thompson, thank you so much. Thank you for your
vulnerability and telling us your story. I mean, we could
do five hours with you, Katy.
Speaker 2 (36:23):
Like I said, this is not the last time we've
talked so much. Right now, I just want to hug you.
I just want to do right.
Speaker 3 (36:29):
Now doing a zoom hug. Oh. Thank you so much.
We truly appreciate your insight and your vulnerability and you
speaking your truth. It's your love of art, your love
of Charlie, your love of your mom, Virginia, and and
all things in this life. It's true that you see
the beauty in life, but you're also a forever student
(36:51):
and want to know more. We have so much to
gain from you, and we truly appreciate you being on
the good stuff much like.
Speaker 1 (36:57):
You exude.
Speaker 2 (37:00):
Everything that I aspire to be and I mean in
the emotional sense as a human being, and so.
Speaker 1 (37:08):
Thank you for being you and giving us.
Speaker 2 (37:10):
Your time and enlightening not only myself but everyone that
took the time to listen to this.
Speaker 1 (37:16):
We were indebted to you.
Speaker 4 (37:18):
Thank you so much.
Speaker 1 (37:21):
That is the purest.
Speaker 3 (37:25):
Soul, so beautiful, and not only the work that she's done,
not only the art that she's created in her story,
but she's was so raw and authentic and telling her
story and you can tell she's ever searching for more.
That fascinates me. So many of us get stuck and
(37:45):
just what we know and then we move forward. She
wants to know more and that's beautiful to me.
Speaker 1 (37:51):
Yeah, listen, I'm asked a lot, Jake, how do we
stop war? Now? I have an even more simple answer.
Be more like Kappy Thompson.
Speaker 3 (38:02):
She is an incredible woman. To me, this episode was
a gift because there was so much enlightenment coming across
from her microphone to us. Right, Yeah, we get to
share it with others.
Speaker 2 (38:14):
Beautiful soul, beautiful human, the most genuine version of herself
every day seemingly and it's just you know, I've never
wanted to hug someone so much and like just immediately
feel uber protective of this amazing human being. That brings
(38:35):
so much light in so many different ways and just
commands the grit to be better tomorrow than we were today.
Speaker 3 (38:43):
That's what it is.
Speaker 1 (38:44):
She's light.
Speaker 3 (38:45):
She is light.
Speaker 1 (38:46):
In fact, it's beautiful.
Speaker 3 (38:49):
Thank you so much for listening. If this episode touched
you today, please share it and be part of making
someone else's day better.
Speaker 1 (38:55):
Put on your bad ass case and go be great today.
Speaker 2 (38:57):
And remember you can't do epic stuff without epic people.
Speaker 1 (39:01):
Thank you for listening to the good Stuff.
Speaker 2 (39:06):
The Good Stuff is executive produced by Ashley Schick, Jacob Schick,
Leah Pictures and.
Speaker 1 (39:11):
Q Code Media.
Speaker 2 (39:13):
Hosted by Ashley Shick and Jacob Shick, Produced by Nick
Cassolini and Ryan Counts. House post production supervisor Will Tindi.
Music editing by Will heywood Smith, Edited by Mike Robinson.
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