September 24, 2025 • 27 mins
Bryan Kohberger has begun serving his sentence at the Idaho Maximum Security Institution, a prison known for its unforgiving conditions. Hear an inside look at his daily life at IMSI, the challenges he faces, and what his future behind bars may hold.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:04):
To be sent to MZ, you have to commit the
worst of the worst crimes in Idaho.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
He's holding on that anchor and as things got more chaotic,
what do you do?
Speaker 3 (00:14):
You go back to your anchor more He does have
a target on his back. One hundred percent.
Speaker 4 (00:25):
This is the Idaho Massacre. A production of KAT Studios
and iHeartRadio, Season three, Episode six, Behind Bars. I'm Courtney Armstrong,
a producer at KAT Studios, with Stephanie Leideger, Gabriel Castillo,
and Alison Bankston. On July twenty third, twenty twenty five,
(00:48):
Brian Coberger officially became inmate number one six three two
one four at the Idaho Maximum Security Institution in Kuna, Idaho.
It's a notorious facility that lands it on Security Journal
America's twenty twenty four list of the worst prisons in
(01:09):
the United States. It's built to contain the state's most
violent and unpredictable offenders. This prison has a reputation for
relentless conditions, solitary confinement, overcrowding, and frequent lockdowns inside. Inmates
have few opportunities for social interaction, education, or rehabilitation. The
(01:32):
facility has also been criticized as an environment that often
breeds severe behavioral issues for harsh treatment and lack of
adequate mental health care. Reports of inmate on inmate violence
are common, and allegations of excessive force by correctional officers
continue to hang over the institution's legacy. It's a place
(01:54):
where survival is a daily struggle. To help us understand
what life behind these walls will really be like for
Brian Kobecker, we turn to bail bondsman Kevin Corson, a
man who knows the inner workings of this infamous facility.
He's joined by a KT Studios producer, Alison Bankston.
Speaker 5 (02:15):
If you can tell me about your background, what you
do with your bail company, how you related to the prison.
Speaker 1 (02:22):
I've been doing this for about ten years and I
love it. And we have a lot of people that
get sent to prison. Obviously, the clients that we work
with and we hear back from them. You know a
lot about the conditions and stuff like that that we
hear about, and you know just kind of what it's
like there.
Speaker 5 (02:43):
Well, can you tell me about the Idaho Maximum Security
Institution for someone who's never been there, can you paint
kind of a very detailed picture of it, walk me
through it.
Speaker 1 (02:53):
So it was constructed in nineteen eighty nine. It is
currently set up to house roughly five hundred and thirty prisoners.
So when you pull up to the South Boise Prison
Complex where IMSI, the Maximum Security Institution is housed, it's
(03:13):
seven different buildings that you're you're kind of pulling up
to there, and it ranges from alternative placement to work release,
to a women's prison, to a general prison, to community
and reintroducement facilities. And the Maximum Security Institution is one
(03:34):
of seven of those buildings out there, and it is
the one with double fencing around it. It's got razor wire,
it has electronic monitoring on the outside. It has twenty
four hour guards on the outside that are armed fully
watching the perimeter at any given time. To be sent
to MZ, you have to either commit murder or a rape,
(03:59):
or you know, several different things stacking up really extreme
cases of drug trafficking and stuff like that. Definitely the
worst of the worst crimes in Idaho, not just not
just a theft or beating somebody up and stuff like that,
or aggravated assault, or it's gonna be somebody that they
(04:21):
see as a high risk for reoffense, or they have
an entire lifetime a rap sheet of this and there's
just no turning this person around. So everybody in IMSI
is under very strict housing, but not everybody has the
twenty three hour a day rule. There are some inmates
(04:42):
that are like in close custody, that are able to
have more freedom within the facility and be housed with
each other, eat their meals somewhat normally, not in their
cell for the rest of their life.
Speaker 5 (04:57):
And how about Brian Coberger? Where is he housed? What
is his custody situation?
Speaker 1 (05:01):
Like Coberger's now housed on J Block. J Block is
as secure as it gets.
Speaker 3 (05:07):
It's very bare bones.
Speaker 1 (05:09):
There's only the stuff you need. It's not a comfy bed,
it's not a comfy toilet to sit on. It's a
dirty sink and a slot for your food to come
through for every meal.
Speaker 3 (05:20):
That you're gonna eat.
Speaker 1 (05:21):
J Block is where the death row inmates are housed,
as well as the max of the max.
Speaker 3 (05:27):
Prisoners are kept.
Speaker 1 (05:28):
So there's a section for death row and there's also
a section for people that are up there with that
security level but not on death row, and they eat
in their cells every meal or however long they're there.
Speaker 5 (05:45):
What is life like in these cells? What do these
inmates do for entertainment?
Speaker 3 (05:50):
You don't have access to a TV in the cell.
Speaker 1 (05:53):
You can get an iPad and you can come out
into the open area outside of the cell.
Speaker 3 (06:00):
You're one hour a day that you're allowed out.
Speaker 1 (06:02):
You can either go exercise, you can buy a tablet
and have access to visit people on that. Limited access
to the internet, limited access to TV shows, but you're
only allowed an hour out a day. So you better
choose wisely what you want to do. When you're watching
this iPad, you're going to be in a cage in
the middle of this room, and so you can't just
(06:24):
walk around with it.
Speaker 3 (06:25):
You can't bring it back to your cell.
Speaker 5 (06:27):
I'm intrigued what you said about the tablets. So I
think a lot of people so they can't bring the
tablets into their cells. No, because I think when I
first read that he had a tablet and maybe get
a TV, I'm thinking, Oh, he's just gonna watch movies
all day in his cell and be entertained. But so
I think that's a good distinction, is that they're only
allowed one hour and they can play with their tablet.
Speaker 1 (06:48):
Then essentially yep, one hour a day tablet visitation, exercise,
watching a show on the tablet, watching you know, limited
internet and books. But other than that, that other twenty
three hours a day you're staring at a wall.
Speaker 5 (07:09):
Do you know what kind of like TV shows they
have access to and what websites they can go on.
Speaker 1 (07:13):
So the websites are mainly going to be informational. If
an inmate wants to appeal their case, they have access
to stuff like that, Like I said, just purely informational.
Speaker 3 (07:25):
No Facebook.
Speaker 1 (07:27):
As far as the TV shows, it's going to be
nothing of violence, nothing that kind of pertains to why
they're there, Nothing that they can sort of enjoy.
Speaker 3 (07:38):
Right, he gets to shower every other day. It's kind
of odd to think about, but that sucks.
Speaker 1 (07:45):
But that's where you are, and it's pretty much the
same for the rest of the inmates.
Speaker 5 (07:50):
One thing that really stood out to me is, you know,
there's been this document dump and we're kind of learning
some things about what his life was like at the
Leita County Jail. I guess he was known for taking
like our showers and he would just sit in there
and you know, wash his hands aggressively all the time.
That's not something he could do at IMSI. It sounds like, so.
Speaker 1 (08:10):
He does have access to a sink, but you know,
it sounds like he's kind of a germophobe and needing
to wash the hands all the time, and he's kind
of maybe a little bit ocd about stuff. And he's
gonna probably not have a lot of soap that they're
gonna be providing him all the time. That's kind of
(08:31):
a luxury as far as he's doing it. But yeah,
he does have access to a sink and the shower
thing probably really bugs him every other day.
Speaker 5 (08:42):
Do you know anything about the food in there, like
the fact that he's, you know, a very strict vegan.
What could he be seen, how could he how could
the rest of his life look from from that standpoint?
Speaker 1 (08:53):
The dietary requirements for an individual, whether they be vegan vegetarian,
the prison does accommodate that, and they do have certain
menus that they are able to give the inmates if
you get too picky, though it's clearly says on the
website we're not going to jump through hoops for you,
but they do provide what they're required to as far
(09:14):
as dietary restrictions. And yeah, I actually have a menu
right here for mzy.
Speaker 5 (09:22):
I'm so curious. Yes, please share.
Speaker 3 (09:24):
I mean it's not a bad menu.
Speaker 1 (09:25):
Biscuits and gravy for breakfast, peanut butter pancakes another day,
French toast, coffee cake, pumpkin bread.
Speaker 3 (09:34):
And this is stuff that not only the.
Speaker 1 (09:37):
Close custody people are getting, but also on J Block
death row. And you know, the worst of the worst there,
all the way down to lower level. Day two of
the month, you're gonna get mac and cheese, you know,
day six, pizza, barbecue, chicken, chili, beef, tacos, meat loaf.
Speaker 3 (09:55):
So it doesn't sound very bad.
Speaker 1 (09:57):
You know, there's visitation there, in person visitation, but it's
very limited. It's very strict as far as who can go.
There's a whole application process for somebody.
Speaker 3 (10:11):
Coming to visit an inmate there, and.
Speaker 1 (10:13):
Coberger's days will be Thursday, Friday, Saturday and Sunday that
he's limited to.
Speaker 5 (10:19):
Oh wow, so yeah, actually has quite a few days
for visitors to show.
Speaker 1 (10:23):
Up, correct, But it all has to be approved and
it's not you know, the prison system, they're.
Speaker 3 (10:30):
Liable for these people's safety. They have to provide food, water, shelter.
Speaker 1 (10:34):
And beyond that, a limited amount of exercise. If the
prisoner is, you know, behaving well, they can do that.
As far as visiting, they can easily deny people coming
or even video.
Speaker 5 (10:51):
Some of the people that you work with, they come
back to you and they tell you what IMSI is like.
What are some of the stories they've shared with you
about their experiences there.
Speaker 1 (11:00):
The status of the living situation there has been kind
of a contentious issue with the Department of Correction here.
There's been many complaints about the living conditions, the excessive
use of wars, the excessive use of solitary confinement for
(11:20):
inmates that you know. The stories are they did nothing
wrong and it's been investigated and there's been a couple
of lawsuits about it against the Department of Correction here.
And it's not a nice place. It's not clean. Coburger
is going to hate that. The vents, We've all heard
about PCs being shoved into the vents and the event
(11:41):
system goes around to the entire place. I have heard
about people communicating through vents from clients and inmates urinating
on the floor. And it's just kind of a constant
game of cleanup there. And these people have nothing left
to lose, you know, they're already being put in solitary
and stuff like that.
Speaker 3 (12:00):
Wor can you do? And it's a very very dark place.
Speaker 4 (12:08):
Let's stop here for a break. We'll be back in
a moment. On July twenty third, twenty twenty five, Brian
Coberger began the rest of his existence inside the Idaho
Maximum Security Institution after being sentenced to four consecutive life
(12:30):
terms for the brutal murders of Madison Mogen, Kaylie Gonsalvez,
Xana Kernodle, and Ethan Shapin. Known as IMSI, this facility
is reserved for Idaho's most violent and dangerous inmates. It's
a place that has garnered a reputation for its harsh,
hell like conditions, overcrowding, extended lockdowns, and criticism over the
(12:52):
poor treatment of inmates. For many, life at IMSI is isolating, grueling,
and relentless. Now that's the world Brian Coberger is facing
every single day, and it seems he's struggling to adapt.
Reports indicate he's been firing off complaint after complaint to
prison staff, detailing his discontent with his new reality. Here's
(13:16):
Stephanie Laideker with crime analyst Body Movin breaking down Coberger's
latest prison quarrels and what they might reveal about him.
Speaker 6 (13:26):
This is why I'm calling him Brian Karenberger. His handwriting
is literally the worst thing ever. But I'm going to
read them to you. You're going to get so crazy.
Just by the way, trigger alert. This is going to
make everybody nuts. I feel so enraged right now, and
that's a rare feeling for me. I'm not really the
enraged one. But you really know, you're very level headed.
This was dated on July twenty seventh, and he was
(13:48):
still in medical on the twenty seventh. Okay, so we
need to keep all that in mind. Okay, So this
is written on the twenty seventh, and he says, I
need access to the JPay system to act access and
complete an order created on I think it's or crafted
on a full commissary menu.
Speaker 4 (14:07):
Commis hungry.
Speaker 6 (14:08):
When attempting to access JP, I am given an error
that I am not set up in the system at
the Sea Block. Again, he's in medical at this time. Okay,
at the Sea Block, Kiosk may I temporarily moved in
the system to do so. Thank you for your assistance.
Speaker 7 (14:27):
So that's all.
Speaker 6 (14:28):
That's one complaint, Okay. The next one is, okay, I
did not receive my lunch on seven thirty, twenty twenty
five despite inquiring. Although I understand that the something became hectic,
it was never communicated to me that I would be
unable to receive a new bag. The next shift was
not aware of this either. I wish to access this
(14:51):
as I have a right to this meal. Thank you.
And then it says I have tried to solve this
problem informally by and then he's says speaking with staff
several times. And then the next thing, it says, I
suggest the following solution for the problem. And he says,
in the future, I wish to receive my lunch without exception.
This could be accomplished by sending for the replacement as
(15:13):
rapidly as possible.
Speaker 7 (15:14):
What a great solution. That's the whole Thank god you're
here right. Well, listen, I would suggest you don't murder
four people. I would tend go to prison and expect
your vegan meal. The end exclamation point. That story is over.
Speaker 6 (15:27):
Right, And he had said something like, you know, if
I don't receive everything on my tray, you're not meeting
the nutritial requirements as documented by your own policy. And immediately,
immediately I was like, what I wonder if you know
the children or the young adults that you murdered, you know,
wonder about you violating their policy for you know, the
right to live and the people that you arrassed to
(15:49):
wsu the policy of violating Title line media.
Speaker 7 (15:52):
How about being a total creeper and making everybody super uncomfortable.
And then you're taking the lives of four extraordinary human beings,
wrecking GEDI generations of lives for all of their families,
all of those who knew them and loved them. The
ripple effect of that will go on for generations and
generations and generations. And this clown feels it's appropriate to
be upset about his meals, right, Yeah, I gotta tell
(16:15):
you the nerve. It feels to me like it's not
sinking in entirely to Brian Coburger, that he's not getting
the fact that he was spared his life and he
took a coward's way out by not sharing any of
the details or any of the information for reasons we'll
never know, and now he just wants to be treated
per the law for prison conduct. Give me a break.
Speaker 6 (16:39):
So in addition to the meal complaints, which I think,
you know, I mean, listen, I do think that we
need to feed these people, but he's also complaining about
being taunted in prison by the other inmates. He's saying
he's being sexually harassed. Coburger accused one inmate of saying
I'll but f you, and another stating that the only
ass we're going to be eating is He requested a
(17:01):
transfer out of the J block, got moved up one
floor to J two, which is the second level. He
filed a complaint saying that he was being subjected to
minute by minute threats and harassment. His cell was flooded.
He told the committee that he wants to eventually be
allowed to work and be productive in prison and have
shared recreation, just like any other high profile resident on
(17:23):
J two does. And you know, listen, in ten years,
people probably will have forgotten about Brian Coberger and he
might get that privilege. But for right now, he's exactly
where he belongs by himself in a cell only allowed
out one hour day in shackles and only allowed to
shower every other day.
Speaker 4 (17:45):
And Coburger's entitled behavior didn't start at the Idaho Maximum
Security Institution. Documents released by the Moscow Police Department and
the Idaho State Police show that even in county jail,
he was a constant nuisance, pushing boundaries and acting entitled.
To break down what these reports reveal about him, here's
crime Analyzed body move in. Along with Kat's Studio's producer
(18:09):
Alison Bankston, we.
Speaker 6 (18:13):
Learned the documents tell us that Brian Koberger was annoying
in Leaytal County jail. The people that were in jail
with him found him incredibly annoying. He would pace his cell,
he would wash his hands constantly.
Speaker 5 (18:27):
And I guess when he first was admitted into Leyta
County he just walked into the pod and saw himself
on TV and was like, Wow, I'm on every channel.
What a bizarre thing to say for your grand entrance.
And this is before he even pled. You know, he's
presumed innocent. He's acting all proud that he's on TV.
Odd behavior. And you know the weird thing too in
this particular report is that you know this inmate is saying,
(18:50):
Brian loved watching the news when it was just him
on it. You know, news stores just surrended his case.
But he would have immediately changed the channel if his
family would mentioned, like, immediately he'd turn it off. And
these fellow inmates are also saying, you know that he'd
spent hours and hours on the phone with his mom.
Speaker 6 (19:09):
Right And in one instance, one of the inmates was
watching TV like kind of in like their day room,
I'm imagining, and Brian Coberger was on the phone with
his mother and you know, he's watching sports on TV
and he's yelling at the TV shut up or you know,
something along those lines. And Brian Coberger kind of rushed
over and put his you know, head between the bars
(19:30):
and said, what did you say?
Speaker 4 (19:31):
Are you taking?
Speaker 6 (19:32):
You know, kind of implying that the inmate was talking
about Brian Coberger's mom and Brian got incessant about it.
That's pretty scary, listen. I'm not a psychologist, so I
don't know the answer. Is there something weird there with
his mom? Does he have some sort of reverence for
his mom and maybe women don't live up to his
mom's you know image, like is he modonifying his mom
(19:55):
in some way, I don't know.
Speaker 4 (19:58):
We brought in Robin Drea, a retired FBI special agent
and former head of the bureau's counter Intelligence Behavioral Analysis program,
to offer his perspective on Brian Coberger's complicated and potentially
strange relationship with his mother.
Speaker 5 (20:15):
His relationship with his mom is really interesting, you know,
and we see these with other serial killers too, Like
Brian Coberger's mom seems like a normal person. What is
it about someone's relationship with their mom and this idolization
of their mom that would make like a hatred for
women or a want to kill? What is it with
serial killers and mothers?
Speaker 3 (20:35):
They're all different, you know?
Speaker 2 (20:36):
The only sense I get again, no data points on
this because the mother's not sharing anything, but from what
we see from the family dynamic and limited data points,
you know, So it's all conjecture. I don't get the
sense of a Norman Bates kind of thing here with
a domineering mother. To me, this is in one I've
seen other A few psychologists online say it's not necessarily
mother fixation. I just think this is his only sense
(20:58):
of emotional anchoring, he gets, his only sense of anchoring
he has because life in his brain is just chaos,
I think, and he can't and that's why he's OCD.
That's why he fixates on things is try to try
to control that. And the only thing that's that's been
stable that doesn't bring chaos to his brain. My estimation
is his mother, because what a mother does, or just
(21:20):
any any compassionate, empathetic individual will do is not judge.
And when you're not being judged, that becomes an anchor
for you that no matter what happens, I can go
back to my ancher, no matter what happens, to go
back to my anchor. And so I my estimation, my
conjecture is she is just that anchor that was there
no matter what he did, no matter what kind of
(21:42):
day he's having. You know, Dad's the one that's gonna
help me by taking action, by turning me into the
police when I steal my sister's cell phone and take
actions to drive across the country with me, because he's
a carrying dad. But dad's a dad in this case,
looks like a problem solver. Mom just looks like the anchor.
And so he's holding on that anchor. And as things
got more chaotic, what do you do you go back
(22:02):
to your anchor more. That's why I think he called
her more and more and more in prison.
Speaker 5 (22:06):
Yeah, that makes total sense. Thank you. You know, I
honestly really feel for his mom. That has to be
such a tough situation to be in. No mothers are
supposed to love their sons. She can't just ignore his
phone calls. I'm sure this is heartbreaking and devastating for her.
I honestly don't know what I would do. I also
wanted to ask you another question about Brian Colberger's prison
life from a behavioral standpoint, Just something I was wondering about.
(22:29):
You know, he seems like such a cocky person. You know,
we read earlier reports that he was bragg you know,
a being on TV to his fellow inmates. A lot
of people who knew him said he always had to
be the smartest person in the room. Going into prison,
do you think that he thought, I'm going to be
the most popular person there, I'm going to be notorious.
I did the worst thing. What do you think was
going through his mind before he decided to plead guilty
(22:51):
and say, you know, I'm going to spend the rest
of my life in prison.
Speaker 2 (22:55):
So one of things that I believe are a motivation
for the behavior he had is and he said it
earlier in life, he wasn't stimulated by anything. So you're
constantly going for some sort of emotional stimulation. That's why
he experimented and got into drugs. It's why we do
everything in life, kickboxing and will give you, you know, stimulation.
So I think he was always seeking some sort of stimulation.
So I think when he resolved to finally admit guilt,
(23:18):
he was looking forward to being stimulated by being notorious
in prison. So his mind started shifting. It's like I
will be this famous person. But because he thinks in
a stovepipe, he wasn't really fully appreciating the fact of
how prisons generally run about. And if you kill women
or children.
Speaker 4 (23:40):
Let's stop here for a break. We'll be back in
a moment. Brian Coberger may have believed his name would
carry weight behind bars, but prison life doesn't work that way.
To explain why we back bail bondsman Kevin Corson, he
(24:02):
spent years around inmates and understands the reality of surviving inside.
Speaker 1 (24:10):
He goes to this facility and there's you know, there's
people in there. This is their home, and when you're
in these places, you're you're the biggest and baddest person
in there, and that's that's how you survive.
Speaker 3 (24:22):
And he's the new guy there. Yeah, he probably does have.
Speaker 1 (24:25):
That thinking, I'm gonna have notoriety when I get there,
and I'm gonna be this guy that did this, and
all these other bad people are gonna look up to me.
That's not the case. You're coming into their house where
they live, and you know, you better play by the rules.
And that's the number one reason why they have to
keep him away from other people, because it's not notoriety
(24:48):
that he has there. It's these people that are the
biggest and the baddest that would love to hurt him.
Stick him with a fork, stick him, you know, with
a shaved down blade, to make a name for themselves
because this is their home and it has been for
a while. So you get so institutionalized with the way
you deal with stuff, and it's technically a you know,
(25:11):
a disrespect.
Speaker 3 (25:12):
You're coming into my home and we're going to make
sure you play by our rules.
Speaker 1 (25:17):
Otherwise, if we have the chance to get you, we will.
And he does have a target on his back one
hundred percent.
Speaker 4 (25:27):
And it's a target he will likely carry for the
rest of his life. There is very little chance that
Brian Coberger will ever see the general prison population again.
His future is one of permanent solitary confinement, a world
of cement walls, endless lockdowns, and hours that bleed together
into gray, monotonous days. No redemption, no freedom, no escape,
(25:54):
just the consequences of his own choices haunting him every
single day. What's the existence he created? This is the
life he will endure, and this is the legacy he
leaves behind. Next time, on the Idaho Massacre, we're joined
by sociologist doctor Michael Kimmel, a leading expert on men's
(26:15):
studies and masculinities. Some have speculated that Brian Colberger could
have been part of the in cell movement, But is
that really true or is it just another label being
placed on him? Next week we'll explore the evidence and
the uncertainty surrounding this theory. More on that next time.
(26:37):
For more information on the case and relevant photos, follow
us on Instagram at Kat Underscore Studios. The Idaho Massacre
is produced by Stephanie Leideker, Alison Bankston, Gabriel Castillo and
me Courtney Armstrong. Editing and sound design by Jeff Toois,
music by Jared Aston. The Idaho Masacer is a production
(26:59):
of Kat Student Dios and iHeartRadio. For more podcasts like this,
visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen
to your favorite shows.
To be sent to MZ, you have to commit the
worst of the worst crimes in Idaho.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
He's holding on that anchor and as things got more chaotic,
what do you do?
Speaker 3 (00:14):
You go back to your anchor more He does have
a target on his back. One hundred percent.
Speaker 4 (00:25):
This is the Idaho Massacre. A production of KAT Studios
and iHeartRadio, Season three, Episode six, Behind Bars. I'm Courtney Armstrong,
a producer at KAT Studios, with Stephanie Leideger, Gabriel Castillo,
and Alison Bankston. On July twenty third, twenty twenty five,
(00:48):
Brian Coberger officially became inmate number one six three two
one four at the Idaho Maximum Security Institution in Kuna, Idaho.
It's a notorious facility that lands it on Security Journal
America's twenty twenty four list of the worst prisons in
(01:09):
the United States. It's built to contain the state's most
violent and unpredictable offenders. This prison has a reputation for
relentless conditions, solitary confinement, overcrowding, and frequent lockdowns inside. Inmates
have few opportunities for social interaction, education, or rehabilitation. The
(01:32):
facility has also been criticized as an environment that often
breeds severe behavioral issues for harsh treatment and lack of
adequate mental health care. Reports of inmate on inmate violence
are common, and allegations of excessive force by correctional officers
continue to hang over the institution's legacy. It's a place
(01:54):
where survival is a daily struggle. To help us understand
what life behind these walls will really be like for
Brian Kobecker, we turn to bail bondsman Kevin Corson, a
man who knows the inner workings of this infamous facility.
He's joined by a KT Studios producer, Alison Bankston.
Speaker 5 (02:15):
If you can tell me about your background, what you
do with your bail company, how you related to the prison.
Speaker 1 (02:22):
I've been doing this for about ten years and I
love it. And we have a lot of people that
get sent to prison. Obviously, the clients that we work
with and we hear back from them. You know a
lot about the conditions and stuff like that that we
hear about, and you know just kind of what it's
like there.
Speaker 5 (02:43):
Well, can you tell me about the Idaho Maximum Security
Institution for someone who's never been there, can you paint
kind of a very detailed picture of it, walk me
through it.
Speaker 1 (02:53):
So it was constructed in nineteen eighty nine. It is
currently set up to house roughly five hundred and thirty prisoners.
So when you pull up to the South Boise Prison
Complex where IMSI, the Maximum Security Institution is housed, it's
(03:13):
seven different buildings that you're you're kind of pulling up
to there, and it ranges from alternative placement to work release,
to a women's prison, to a general prison, to community
and reintroducement facilities. And the Maximum Security Institution is one
(03:34):
of seven of those buildings out there, and it is
the one with double fencing around it. It's got razor wire,
it has electronic monitoring on the outside. It has twenty
four hour guards on the outside that are armed fully
watching the perimeter at any given time. To be sent
to MZ, you have to either commit murder or a rape,
(03:59):
or you know, several different things stacking up really extreme
cases of drug trafficking and stuff like that. Definitely the
worst of the worst crimes in Idaho, not just not
just a theft or beating somebody up and stuff like that,
or aggravated assault, or it's gonna be somebody that they
(04:21):
see as a high risk for reoffense, or they have
an entire lifetime a rap sheet of this and there's
just no turning this person around. So everybody in IMSI
is under very strict housing, but not everybody has the
twenty three hour a day rule. There are some inmates
(04:42):
that are like in close custody, that are able to
have more freedom within the facility and be housed with
each other, eat their meals somewhat normally, not in their
cell for the rest of their life.
Speaker 5 (04:57):
And how about Brian Coberger? Where is he housed? What
is his custody situation?
Speaker 1 (05:01):
Like Coberger's now housed on J Block. J Block is
as secure as it gets.
Speaker 3 (05:07):
It's very bare bones.
Speaker 1 (05:09):
There's only the stuff you need. It's not a comfy bed,
it's not a comfy toilet to sit on. It's a
dirty sink and a slot for your food to come
through for every meal.
Speaker 3 (05:20):
That you're gonna eat.
Speaker 1 (05:21):
J Block is where the death row inmates are housed,
as well as the max of the max.
Speaker 3 (05:27):
Prisoners are kept.
Speaker 1 (05:28):
So there's a section for death row and there's also
a section for people that are up there with that
security level but not on death row, and they eat
in their cells every meal or however long they're there.
Speaker 5 (05:45):
What is life like in these cells? What do these
inmates do for entertainment?
Speaker 3 (05:50):
You don't have access to a TV in the cell.
Speaker 1 (05:53):
You can get an iPad and you can come out
into the open area outside of the cell.
Speaker 3 (06:00):
You're one hour a day that you're allowed out.
Speaker 1 (06:02):
You can either go exercise, you can buy a tablet
and have access to visit people on that. Limited access
to the internet, limited access to TV shows, but you're
only allowed an hour out a day. So you better
choose wisely what you want to do. When you're watching
this iPad, you're going to be in a cage in
the middle of this room, and so you can't just
(06:24):
walk around with it.
Speaker 3 (06:25):
You can't bring it back to your cell.
Speaker 5 (06:27):
I'm intrigued what you said about the tablets. So I
think a lot of people so they can't bring the
tablets into their cells. No, because I think when I
first read that he had a tablet and maybe get
a TV, I'm thinking, Oh, he's just gonna watch movies
all day in his cell and be entertained. But so
I think that's a good distinction, is that they're only
allowed one hour and they can play with their tablet.
Speaker 1 (06:48):
Then essentially yep, one hour a day tablet visitation, exercise,
watching a show on the tablet, watching you know, limited
internet and books. But other than that, that other twenty
three hours a day you're staring at a wall.
Speaker 5 (07:09):
Do you know what kind of like TV shows they
have access to and what websites they can go on.
Speaker 1 (07:13):
So the websites are mainly going to be informational. If
an inmate wants to appeal their case, they have access
to stuff like that, Like I said, just purely informational.
Speaker 3 (07:25):
No Facebook.
Speaker 1 (07:27):
As far as the TV shows, it's going to be
nothing of violence, nothing that kind of pertains to why
they're there, Nothing that they can sort of enjoy.
Speaker 3 (07:38):
Right, he gets to shower every other day. It's kind
of odd to think about, but that sucks.
Speaker 1 (07:45):
But that's where you are, and it's pretty much the
same for the rest of the inmates.
Speaker 5 (07:50):
One thing that really stood out to me is, you know,
there's been this document dump and we're kind of learning
some things about what his life was like at the
Leita County Jail. I guess he was known for taking
like our showers and he would just sit in there
and you know, wash his hands aggressively all the time.
That's not something he could do at IMSI. It sounds like, so.
Speaker 1 (08:10):
He does have access to a sink, but you know,
it sounds like he's kind of a germophobe and needing
to wash the hands all the time, and he's kind
of maybe a little bit ocd about stuff. And he's
gonna probably not have a lot of soap that they're
gonna be providing him all the time. That's kind of
(08:31):
a luxury as far as he's doing it. But yeah,
he does have access to a sink and the shower
thing probably really bugs him every other day.
Speaker 5 (08:42):
Do you know anything about the food in there, like
the fact that he's, you know, a very strict vegan.
What could he be seen, how could he how could
the rest of his life look from from that standpoint?
Speaker 1 (08:53):
The dietary requirements for an individual, whether they be vegan vegetarian,
the prison does accommodate that, and they do have certain
menus that they are able to give the inmates if
you get too picky, though it's clearly says on the
website we're not going to jump through hoops for you,
but they do provide what they're required to as far
(09:14):
as dietary restrictions. And yeah, I actually have a menu
right here for mzy.
Speaker 5 (09:22):
I'm so curious. Yes, please share.
Speaker 3 (09:24):
I mean it's not a bad menu.
Speaker 1 (09:25):
Biscuits and gravy for breakfast, peanut butter pancakes another day,
French toast, coffee cake, pumpkin bread.
Speaker 3 (09:34):
And this is stuff that not only the.
Speaker 1 (09:37):
Close custody people are getting, but also on J Block
death row. And you know, the worst of the worst there,
all the way down to lower level. Day two of
the month, you're gonna get mac and cheese, you know,
day six, pizza, barbecue, chicken, chili, beef, tacos, meat loaf.
Speaker 3 (09:55):
So it doesn't sound very bad.
Speaker 1 (09:57):
You know, there's visitation there, in person visitation, but it's
very limited. It's very strict as far as who can go.
There's a whole application process for somebody.
Speaker 3 (10:11):
Coming to visit an inmate there, and.
Speaker 1 (10:13):
Coberger's days will be Thursday, Friday, Saturday and Sunday that
he's limited to.
Speaker 5 (10:19):
Oh wow, so yeah, actually has quite a few days
for visitors to show.
Speaker 1 (10:23):
Up, correct, But it all has to be approved and
it's not you know, the prison system, they're.
Speaker 3 (10:30):
Liable for these people's safety. They have to provide food, water, shelter.
Speaker 1 (10:34):
And beyond that, a limited amount of exercise. If the
prisoner is, you know, behaving well, they can do that.
As far as visiting, they can easily deny people coming
or even video.
Speaker 5 (10:51):
Some of the people that you work with, they come
back to you and they tell you what IMSI is like.
What are some of the stories they've shared with you
about their experiences there.
Speaker 1 (11:00):
The status of the living situation there has been kind
of a contentious issue with the Department of Correction here.
There's been many complaints about the living conditions, the excessive
use of wars, the excessive use of solitary confinement for
(11:20):
inmates that you know. The stories are they did nothing
wrong and it's been investigated and there's been a couple
of lawsuits about it against the Department of Correction here.
And it's not a nice place. It's not clean. Coburger
is going to hate that. The vents, We've all heard
about PCs being shoved into the vents and the event
(11:41):
system goes around to the entire place. I have heard
about people communicating through vents from clients and inmates urinating
on the floor. And it's just kind of a constant
game of cleanup there. And these people have nothing left
to lose, you know, they're already being put in solitary
and stuff like that.
Speaker 3 (12:00):
Wor can you do? And it's a very very dark place.
Speaker 4 (12:08):
Let's stop here for a break. We'll be back in
a moment. On July twenty third, twenty twenty five, Brian
Coberger began the rest of his existence inside the Idaho
Maximum Security Institution after being sentenced to four consecutive life
(12:30):
terms for the brutal murders of Madison Mogen, Kaylie Gonsalvez,
Xana Kernodle, and Ethan Shapin. Known as IMSI, this facility
is reserved for Idaho's most violent and dangerous inmates. It's
a place that has garnered a reputation for its harsh,
hell like conditions, overcrowding, extended lockdowns, and criticism over the
(12:52):
poor treatment of inmates. For many, life at IMSI is isolating, grueling,
and relentless. Now that's the world Brian Coberger is facing
every single day, and it seems he's struggling to adapt.
Reports indicate he's been firing off complaint after complaint to
prison staff, detailing his discontent with his new reality. Here's
(13:16):
Stephanie Laideker with crime analyst Body Movin breaking down Coberger's
latest prison quarrels and what they might reveal about him.
Speaker 6 (13:26):
This is why I'm calling him Brian Karenberger. His handwriting
is literally the worst thing ever. But I'm going to
read them to you. You're going to get so crazy.
Just by the way, trigger alert. This is going to
make everybody nuts. I feel so enraged right now, and
that's a rare feeling for me. I'm not really the
enraged one. But you really know, you're very level headed.
This was dated on July twenty seventh, and he was
(13:48):
still in medical on the twenty seventh. Okay, so we
need to keep all that in mind. Okay, So this
is written on the twenty seventh, and he says, I
need access to the JPay system to act access and
complete an order created on I think it's or crafted
on a full commissary menu.
Speaker 4 (14:07):
Commis hungry.
Speaker 6 (14:08):
When attempting to access JP, I am given an error
that I am not set up in the system at
the Sea Block. Again, he's in medical at this time. Okay,
at the Sea Block, Kiosk may I temporarily moved in
the system to do so. Thank you for your assistance.
Speaker 7 (14:27):
So that's all.
Speaker 6 (14:28):
That's one complaint, Okay. The next one is, okay, I
did not receive my lunch on seven thirty, twenty twenty
five despite inquiring. Although I understand that the something became hectic,
it was never communicated to me that I would be
unable to receive a new bag. The next shift was
not aware of this either. I wish to access this
(14:51):
as I have a right to this meal. Thank you.
And then it says I have tried to solve this
problem informally by and then he's says speaking with staff
several times. And then the next thing, it says, I
suggest the following solution for the problem. And he says,
in the future, I wish to receive my lunch without exception.
This could be accomplished by sending for the replacement as
(15:13):
rapidly as possible.
Speaker 7 (15:14):
What a great solution. That's the whole Thank god you're
here right. Well, listen, I would suggest you don't murder
four people. I would tend go to prison and expect
your vegan meal. The end exclamation point. That story is over.
Speaker 6 (15:27):
Right, And he had said something like, you know, if
I don't receive everything on my tray, you're not meeting
the nutritial requirements as documented by your own policy. And immediately,
immediately I was like, what I wonder if you know
the children or the young adults that you murdered, you know,
wonder about you violating their policy for you know, the
right to live and the people that you arrassed to
(15:49):
wsu the policy of violating Title line media.
Speaker 7 (15:52):
How about being a total creeper and making everybody super uncomfortable.
And then you're taking the lives of four extraordinary human beings,
wrecking GEDI generations of lives for all of their families,
all of those who knew them and loved them. The
ripple effect of that will go on for generations and
generations and generations. And this clown feels it's appropriate to
be upset about his meals, right, Yeah, I gotta tell
(16:15):
you the nerve. It feels to me like it's not
sinking in entirely to Brian Coburger, that he's not getting
the fact that he was spared his life and he
took a coward's way out by not sharing any of
the details or any of the information for reasons we'll
never know, and now he just wants to be treated
per the law for prison conduct. Give me a break.
Speaker 6 (16:39):
So in addition to the meal complaints, which I think,
you know, I mean, listen, I do think that we
need to feed these people, but he's also complaining about
being taunted in prison by the other inmates. He's saying
he's being sexually harassed. Coburger accused one inmate of saying
I'll but f you, and another stating that the only
ass we're going to be eating is He requested a
(17:01):
transfer out of the J block, got moved up one
floor to J two, which is the second level. He
filed a complaint saying that he was being subjected to
minute by minute threats and harassment. His cell was flooded.
He told the committee that he wants to eventually be
allowed to work and be productive in prison and have
shared recreation, just like any other high profile resident on
(17:23):
J two does. And you know, listen, in ten years,
people probably will have forgotten about Brian Coberger and he
might get that privilege. But for right now, he's exactly
where he belongs by himself in a cell only allowed
out one hour day in shackles and only allowed to
shower every other day.
Speaker 4 (17:45):
And Coburger's entitled behavior didn't start at the Idaho Maximum
Security Institution. Documents released by the Moscow Police Department and
the Idaho State Police show that even in county jail,
he was a constant nuisance, pushing boundaries and acting entitled.
To break down what these reports reveal about him, here's
crime Analyzed body move in. Along with Kat's Studio's producer
(18:09):
Alison Bankston, we.
Speaker 6 (18:13):
Learned the documents tell us that Brian Koberger was annoying
in Leaytal County jail. The people that were in jail
with him found him incredibly annoying. He would pace his cell,
he would wash his hands constantly.
Speaker 5 (18:27):
And I guess when he first was admitted into Leyta
County he just walked into the pod and saw himself
on TV and was like, Wow, I'm on every channel.
What a bizarre thing to say for your grand entrance.
And this is before he even pled. You know, he's
presumed innocent. He's acting all proud that he's on TV.
Odd behavior. And you know the weird thing too in
this particular report is that you know this inmate is saying,
(18:50):
Brian loved watching the news when it was just him
on it. You know, news stores just surrended his case.
But he would have immediately changed the channel if his
family would mentioned, like, immediately he'd turn it off. And
these fellow inmates are also saying, you know that he'd
spent hours and hours on the phone with his mom.
Speaker 6 (19:09):
Right And in one instance, one of the inmates was
watching TV like kind of in like their day room,
I'm imagining, and Brian Coberger was on the phone with
his mother and you know, he's watching sports on TV
and he's yelling at the TV shut up or you know,
something along those lines. And Brian Coberger kind of rushed
over and put his you know, head between the bars
(19:30):
and said, what did you say?
Speaker 4 (19:31):
Are you taking?
Speaker 6 (19:32):
You know, kind of implying that the inmate was talking
about Brian Coberger's mom and Brian got incessant about it.
That's pretty scary, listen. I'm not a psychologist, so I
don't know the answer. Is there something weird there with
his mom? Does he have some sort of reverence for
his mom and maybe women don't live up to his
mom's you know image, like is he modonifying his mom
(19:55):
in some way, I don't know.
Speaker 4 (19:58):
We brought in Robin Drea, a retired FBI special agent
and former head of the bureau's counter Intelligence Behavioral Analysis program,
to offer his perspective on Brian Coberger's complicated and potentially
strange relationship with his mother.
Speaker 5 (20:15):
His relationship with his mom is really interesting, you know,
and we see these with other serial killers too, Like
Brian Coberger's mom seems like a normal person. What is
it about someone's relationship with their mom and this idolization
of their mom that would make like a hatred for
women or a want to kill? What is it with
serial killers and mothers?
Speaker 3 (20:35):
They're all different, you know?
Speaker 2 (20:36):
The only sense I get again, no data points on
this because the mother's not sharing anything, but from what
we see from the family dynamic and limited data points,
you know, So it's all conjecture. I don't get the
sense of a Norman Bates kind of thing here with
a domineering mother. To me, this is in one I've
seen other A few psychologists online say it's not necessarily
mother fixation. I just think this is his only sense
(20:58):
of emotional anchoring, he gets, his only sense of anchoring
he has because life in his brain is just chaos,
I think, and he can't and that's why he's OCD.
That's why he fixates on things is try to try
to control that. And the only thing that's that's been
stable that doesn't bring chaos to his brain. My estimation
is his mother, because what a mother does, or just
(21:20):
any any compassionate, empathetic individual will do is not judge.
And when you're not being judged, that becomes an anchor
for you that no matter what happens, I can go
back to my ancher, no matter what happens, to go
back to my anchor. And so I my estimation, my
conjecture is she is just that anchor that was there
no matter what he did, no matter what kind of
(21:42):
day he's having. You know, Dad's the one that's gonna
help me by taking action, by turning me into the
police when I steal my sister's cell phone and take
actions to drive across the country with me, because he's
a carrying dad. But dad's a dad in this case,
looks like a problem solver. Mom just looks like the anchor.
And so he's holding on that anchor. And as things
got more chaotic, what do you do you go back
(22:02):
to your anchor more. That's why I think he called
her more and more and more in prison.
Speaker 5 (22:06):
Yeah, that makes total sense. Thank you. You know, I
honestly really feel for his mom. That has to be
such a tough situation to be in. No mothers are
supposed to love their sons. She can't just ignore his
phone calls. I'm sure this is heartbreaking and devastating for her.
I honestly don't know what I would do. I also
wanted to ask you another question about Brian Colberger's prison
life from a behavioral standpoint, Just something I was wondering about.
(22:29):
You know, he seems like such a cocky person. You know,
we read earlier reports that he was bragg you know,
a being on TV to his fellow inmates. A lot
of people who knew him said he always had to
be the smartest person in the room. Going into prison,
do you think that he thought, I'm going to be
the most popular person there, I'm going to be notorious.
I did the worst thing. What do you think was
going through his mind before he decided to plead guilty
(22:51):
and say, you know, I'm going to spend the rest
of my life in prison.
Speaker 2 (22:55):
So one of things that I believe are a motivation
for the behavior he had is and he said it
earlier in life, he wasn't stimulated by anything. So you're
constantly going for some sort of emotional stimulation. That's why
he experimented and got into drugs. It's why we do
everything in life, kickboxing and will give you, you know, stimulation.
So I think he was always seeking some sort of stimulation.
So I think when he resolved to finally admit guilt,
(23:18):
he was looking forward to being stimulated by being notorious
in prison. So his mind started shifting. It's like I
will be this famous person. But because he thinks in
a stovepipe, he wasn't really fully appreciating the fact of
how prisons generally run about. And if you kill women
or children.
Speaker 4 (23:40):
Let's stop here for a break. We'll be back in
a moment. Brian Coberger may have believed his name would
carry weight behind bars, but prison life doesn't work that way.
To explain why we back bail bondsman Kevin Corson, he
(24:02):
spent years around inmates and understands the reality of surviving inside.
Speaker 1 (24:10):
He goes to this facility and there's you know, there's
people in there. This is their home, and when you're
in these places, you're you're the biggest and baddest person
in there, and that's that's how you survive.
Speaker 3 (24:22):
And he's the new guy there. Yeah, he probably does have.
Speaker 1 (24:25):
That thinking, I'm gonna have notoriety when I get there,
and I'm gonna be this guy that did this, and
all these other bad people are gonna look up to me.
That's not the case. You're coming into their house where
they live, and you know, you better play by the rules.
And that's the number one reason why they have to
keep him away from other people, because it's not notoriety
(24:48):
that he has there. It's these people that are the
biggest and the baddest that would love to hurt him.
Stick him with a fork, stick him, you know, with
a shaved down blade, to make a name for themselves
because this is their home and it has been for
a while. So you get so institutionalized with the way
you deal with stuff, and it's technically a you know,
(25:11):
a disrespect.
Speaker 3 (25:12):
You're coming into my home and we're going to make
sure you play by our rules.
Speaker 1 (25:17):
Otherwise, if we have the chance to get you, we will.
And he does have a target on his back one
hundred percent.
Speaker 4 (25:27):
And it's a target he will likely carry for the
rest of his life. There is very little chance that
Brian Coberger will ever see the general prison population again.
His future is one of permanent solitary confinement, a world
of cement walls, endless lockdowns, and hours that bleed together
into gray, monotonous days. No redemption, no freedom, no escape,
(25:54):
just the consequences of his own choices haunting him every
single day. What's the existence he created? This is the
life he will endure, and this is the legacy he
leaves behind. Next time, on the Idaho Massacre, we're joined
by sociologist doctor Michael Kimmel, a leading expert on men's
(26:15):
studies and masculinities. Some have speculated that Brian Colberger could
have been part of the in cell movement, But is
that really true or is it just another label being
placed on him? Next week we'll explore the evidence and
the uncertainty surrounding this theory. More on that next time.
(26:37):
For more information on the case and relevant photos, follow
us on Instagram at Kat Underscore Studios. The Idaho Massacre
is produced by Stephanie Leideker, Alison Bankston, Gabriel Castillo and
me Courtney Armstrong. Editing and sound design by Jeff Toois,
music by Jared Aston. The Idaho Masacer is a production
(26:59):
of Kat Student Dios and iHeartRadio. For more podcasts like this,
visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen
to your favorite shows.
Hosts And Creators
Stephanie Lydecker
Courtney Armstrong
Jeff Shane
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