April 21, 2025 • 18 mins
Hello, Puzzlers! Puzzling with us today: podcaster and author Gretchen Rubin!
Join host A.J. Jacobs and his guests as they puzzle–and laugh–their way through new spins on old favorites, like anagrams and palindromes, as well as quirky originals such as “Ask AI” and audio rebuses.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Hello, puzzlers. Let's start with a quick puzzle. Take the
first name of the singer of Strangers in the Night
and add the first name of the writer of the
Broadway show In the Heights. Put those together, and you
get the last name of an historical figure. Again, take
the first name of the singer of Strangers the Night.
Add to that the name of the writer of In
(00:22):
the Heights. First name Strangers in the Night plus In
the Heights equals the last name of a famous eighteenth
century American. The answer and more puzzling goodness after the break.
Hello puzzlers, Welcome back to the Puzzler. The final three up,
(00:45):
three down, Inning in your puzzle, no hitter. I am
your host, AJ Jacobs. Before the break, we asked, what
do you get when you take the first name of
the Strangers in the Night singer and add the first
name of the In the Heights writer, You get a
famous historical figure. And the answer is Frank as in
Frank Sinatra saying Stranger's Night, Lynn as in Linn Manuel
(01:07):
Miranda wrote or co wrote the In the Heights. Put
them together, you get Franklin as in Benjamin Franklin. And
I bring that up because a. Ben Franklin. I just
love him and b he's one of the great aphorists
of all time, an aforist, someone who writes aphorisms. He wrote,
or at least wrote down or allegedly wrote lots of
(01:29):
great sayings, maxims, adages, whatever you want to call him,
a penny saved as a penny earned, for instance. And
this is appropriate because our guest is another great aforist,
Gretchen Rubin, my longtime friend, host of the podcast Happier
with Gretchen Rubin, author of so many books, including The
(01:50):
Happiness Project, Life in Five Senses, and the new one,
Secrets of Adulthood, which contains those said aphorisms.
Speaker 2 (01:57):
Welcome, Gretchen, Hello, Agy, I am so happy to be
talking to you today.
Speaker 1 (02:02):
There you go. They are very on brand.
Speaker 2 (02:04):
But I I.
Speaker 1 (02:08):
Well, your book, your new book, I love it. It's
filled with a whole bunch of wise aphorisms that you
came up with, like Ben uh, And we're going to
talk about that, but first we have a puzzle, appropriately
enough about aphorisms. Bring it on, all right, So what
I did is I took some famous aphorisms and gave
(02:29):
them a little modern update, a little refurbishing. So Ben
Franklin's a penny saved as a penny earned might become
a bitcoin saved is a bitcoin.
Speaker 2 (02:41):
So for this.
Speaker 1 (02:42):
Puzzle, I'm going to give you the updated aphorisms, and
you can tell me the original. Okay, and if you
know who wrote the original, that's a bonus. Sometimes there's
no one. It's just folk wisdom. Yeah, folks, that's the word.
Oh and by the way, this is off the record.
If you want to comment on the wisdom of any
(03:02):
of these aphorisms, agree with them, disagree with them, please
do so. All right, are you ready, Gretchen, I'm ready. Okay.
Genius is one percent inspiration and ninety nine percent chant.
GBT prompts perspiration, perspiration, yes, right?
Speaker 3 (03:24):
Was that Tom?
Speaker 2 (03:26):
No?
Speaker 1 (03:27):
He always they started it right, Tom started?
Speaker 2 (03:29):
I was saying Thomas Edison or is it a car?
Speaker 3 (03:35):
Wasn't Thomas Edison?
Speaker 1 (03:36):
It was Tom Well Allegedly he said something like it,
said something enough like it. Yeah, it's good, all right,
it was. It was sort of like a I feel
it was a Malcolm gladwellish, if you work hard enough,
you can do it right, right, all right? How about
a watched sue Ve'd pouch never boils. A watched soue
(03:57):
vide pounch never boils.
Speaker 2 (03:59):
I believe that a watched pot never boils exactly. And that,
I would say, is a proverb. That's folk wisdom. That's
like the old England's kind of proverb.
Speaker 1 (04:08):
Right, our man Ben Franklin did mention it in one
of his many books, but or letters. But all right,
how about tweet softly and carry a big troll army.
Speaker 3 (04:23):
I think that is speak softly and carry a big.
Speaker 1 (04:26):
Stick exactly, and that is associated with do you remember
now it is a president a little earlier, a little earlier.
Oh you said it, yes, exactly, This is a big stick?
Speaker 3 (04:48):
Was the giveaway?
Speaker 2 (04:48):
There?
Speaker 1 (04:49):
There you go. He seems like a man with a
big stick. He and he didn't originate it, but he
did make it famous. Okay, okay, all right, how about
the only thing we have to be generally anxious about
is generalized anxiety disorder itself.
Speaker 2 (05:08):
The only thing we have to fear is fear itself.
And I believe I believe that was Franklin Roseen.
Speaker 1 (05:17):
Yes too, I just realized two roosevelts in a row.
I didn't mean to do that.
Speaker 3 (05:21):
That's interesting.
Speaker 2 (05:22):
I feel like there's like a puzzle up, like you
could have puzzled on that.
Speaker 1 (05:26):
I know I missed an opportunity and think people think
Franklin was a.
Speaker 3 (05:30):
President even though he wasn't.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
Oh he's like a pseudo president, right exactly, I'm Franklin
Roosevelt was president. Franklin was.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
I feel like this is how your puzzle mind works,
like you're making all these connections.
Speaker 1 (05:43):
Yes, yeah, it's a problem. Annow whatever I'm reading, I'm like, oh,
was there a puzzle?
Speaker 3 (05:49):
Occupational hazard?
Speaker 1 (05:51):
It's an occupational hazard. Life is short, your digital footprint.
Speaker 3 (05:56):
Is long, life is short, art is long.
Speaker 1 (06:00):
Yes, that's right, and it seemed unsure, but you were
absolutely correct.
Speaker 3 (06:05):
Well I think that might be a lot in proverb.
Speaker 1 (06:08):
Yes, and it's all.
Speaker 2 (06:10):
Also, isn't that what flash used to flash on the
screen before, like MGM movies or something. Didn't they didn't
they think there was some kind of movie. Yeah, I think,
or maybe I don't know.
Speaker 1 (06:21):
But yeah, I like that. I like that. I didn't know.
I did rate on the internet, which is never wrong
that the roar of the MGM lion is a tiger.
So if people can fact check that, I would be
let me know, send that in.
Speaker 2 (06:35):
I seem to believe that it may be a trademark sound,
which is very unusual.
Speaker 3 (06:39):
There's much to learn, I think.
Speaker 1 (06:41):
All right, yeah, I love it. And by the way,
some people say Hippocrates popularize that. But you know, okay,
how about nothing is certain except for offshore taxhavens and
plasma exchange longevity treatments. Nothing is sure that death and
(07:03):
taxes exactly, and that I have no idea who said that.
I think it's one of your folk wisdom ones. Okay, okay,
people do say Ben Franklin or Mark Twain.
Speaker 3 (07:16):
That sounds like something attributed to Mark Twain.
Speaker 1 (07:18):
Proud, there's a lot of attributes Daniel Defoe or something similar.
Speaker 2 (07:22):
Yogi Berra apparently said I didn't say a lot of
the things.
Speaker 3 (07:25):
That I said.
Speaker 1 (07:26):
Ah, that's a good meta one. Or did he say
that he did?
Speaker 2 (07:29):
I think he did say that about right exactly.
Speaker 1 (07:36):
What doesn't kill us makes our insurance premiums go up?
Thank you for enjoying these, well, am, I am.
Speaker 2 (07:45):
What doesn't kill kill us makes us stronger, that's right,
which I don't agree with that one particularly, Yes, controversial, Yeah,
your mileage may vary on that one.
Speaker 3 (07:58):
I have.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
I it sounds like something that perhaps is attributed to
an actual person, but I do not know who originated.
Speaker 1 (08:05):
Right, it is attributed to Frederick and Meeta, and I
mean sometimes I agree You're right, it depends. Sometimes challenges
I think do make us better and stronger. But it's
like you know, if you if you have a horrible
disease and then you have symptoms for the rest of
your life, that's not stronger.
Speaker 2 (08:26):
Well. One of my aphorisms is the opposite of a
profound truth is also true.
Speaker 1 (08:32):
I love that.
Speaker 3 (08:33):
Yeah, so maybe that's a good example, all right.
Speaker 1 (08:37):
One man's spam is another man's important email folder.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
One man's meat is another man's poison, or is it
One man's poison is another man's meat.
Speaker 3 (08:48):
Oh, that's one man's one man's I can't remember. Wait,
what is well, what is the actual saying?
Speaker 1 (08:54):
If yours is not real, then it should be because
I think it's great, but yes it is.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (09:00):
One man's trash is another man's treasure is one way?
I like it though, I like it, okay, and I
agree with it, and you actually one of yours is
similar to that way.
Speaker 3 (09:16):
I'm right, good memory, Yes, it's uh.
Speaker 1 (09:19):
That what is fun for other people may not be
fun for you, right and vice versa, which I love
and it is so true. Well, what is something fun
that you find fun that other people would be surprised by?
Speaker 2 (09:32):
I find it very relaxing to clutter clear, like mild
clutter clearing, which a lot of people find very sort
of irksome. But on the other hand, like in age,
I mean, we're so different in this way. I don't
really like most games. I like booring games, or like
I don't like the Olympics because I don't like to
see people lose, and so it just kind of it
(09:54):
hurts my heart to see all these people losing after
they've tried so hard.
Speaker 1 (09:58):
So I think that's that's one thing that well I love. Wait,
let me just dig in on both of those. Because
I love your Olympics, I love your compassion. What about
so are you in pain right now doing puzzles? Is this?
Speaker 2 (10:11):
Uh? Well you made this fun, aj but I have
to say, and I like this kind of game, but
I would I don't like something like poker, or I
don't like something like I just find them kind of boring.
The only game I really truly like is Uno, which
you give this sense of like my level of complexity.
Speaker 3 (10:30):
Yeah, I like who know that? I will play, you know,
but that's just about the only game I really like.
Speaker 1 (10:35):
All Right, all right, we got just a couple more. Uh.
When your only tool is a bedazzler, every problem looks
like a jean jacket. This one's a little harder.
Speaker 2 (10:54):
When your only tool is a hammer, every problem looks
like it needs a nail.
Speaker 1 (10:59):
Exactly. That is it. And I actually didn't know who
said it until I researched it.
Speaker 3 (11:03):
Oh did you do?
Speaker 2 (11:04):
No?
Speaker 3 (11:04):
Did? I thought it was just folk wisdom? Did somebody
actually say that?
Speaker 1 (11:07):
Well, according to the ever always accurate Internet, Abraham Maslow,
the psychologist. Interesting, it's called Maslow's hammer. And I do
like that. I do like people use the tools they have,
which is why it's important to have a toolbox. Yes,
I don't know what do you think you are the expert?
Speaker 2 (11:27):
No, I think that's absolutely true that if you have one,
if you have one way of going about something, you
just try to use that instead of thinking like, well,
maybe there's a whole different way to tackle it.
Speaker 3 (11:39):
That's I think.
Speaker 2 (11:39):
Another proverb is it's easier to slice than to untie.
Speaker 3 (11:44):
That's kind of related to.
Speaker 1 (11:45):
A tool too, like if you have the right tool. Okay,
I like that, Yeah, all right. Last one, the filter
is always brighter on someone else's Instagram.
Speaker 3 (11:57):
I think this is the grass is always greener in
some on the other side of the fence.
Speaker 1 (12:03):
That's it exactly.
Speaker 3 (12:04):
Okay, here's something interesting about that.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
That's literally true because if you look down at grass
that's at your feet, you see all the browns and
the dirt and all of the you know, all the
other colors. But if you look farther away at someone
else's lawn, you just see the grass, the green grass
growing you know, higher. And so it is literally true
that if you're looking at someone else's lawn it will
(12:26):
look greener than if you look down at your feet.
Speaker 1 (12:28):
I love that. I did not know literally and metaphorically true,
and Meda totally metaphorically true. So tell me why did
you decide I love aphorisms, and I love I am
assuming you do too. Why did you decide to write
this book Secrets of Adulthood?
Speaker 3 (12:46):
Well, there's sort of two things came together.
Speaker 2 (12:48):
One is, you know, with time and experience, we learn
lessons from life the hard way, and I wanted to
gather sort of these secrets of adulthood that I'd learned,
partly to give them to my two daughters, but also
just to give them to myself, because I don't know
about you, but I feel like I am relearning the
same lesson over and over and over, and like working
(13:09):
is one of the most dangerous forms of procrastination.
Speaker 3 (13:11):
I probably remind myself of that, you know, once a week.
Speaker 2 (13:14):
So I wanted to gather these just sort of to
help capture what I'd learned. And then I really pushed
myself to write them as aphorisms, because I really it
is an ancient literary form, is like your examples have shown,
and when we push ourselves to say something really succinctly,
you really forces polis. That forced me to really get
(13:38):
clear on what I thought and what I believed and
to try to express it in the most powerful way.
And as a writer, I just found that to be
a very kind of creative and energizing undertaking to try
to really distill a big idea into maybe one sentence.
And so I wrote hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of
these but in this collection, and I just picked the
(14:00):
best ones and I just fixed the ones that kind
of Our Secrets of Adulthood, where it's kind of news
you could use as you're trying to make a decision
or stop procrastinating or deal with a difficult relationship. Because
I have some aphorisms that are just observations, like the
periodic table of the elements is an ingredient list of
the universe, which is kind of true. It's not totally true,
(14:22):
but it's kind of true, and it's kind of interesting.
But it's just an observation.
Speaker 3 (14:25):
It's not useful.
Speaker 1 (14:27):
Well, what I One of the things I love about
the book is that it's a relatively short book, and
yet yet it can take a long time to read
because if you read the aphorisms, you have to think about,
how does this apply to my life? Yes, well you
know what does this mean? Give me some exam and
so that's that's why I like, you know, you can
(14:48):
read just a few a night. Let me go over
just a couple of ones that resonated with me. Oh yeah,
I want to hear. Well, this one will allow me
to plug my son Lucas's high school play. Whenever we
choose one path, we must forego other paths, So any
choice may bring unavoidable regret. I think that's true. I
(15:10):
think it's profound. And also, my son was just in
into the woods and there's a wonderful song in there
about and and or do you remember that?
Speaker 3 (15:21):
Yes? I do, Yeah, you do.
Speaker 1 (15:22):
Your very needs to be very cultured.
Speaker 3 (15:24):
Oh well, I I it's a big show.
Speaker 2 (15:27):
I'm explained for people, like, why that's wrong, that's that's
a really I had not thought of that as a
good example.
Speaker 1 (15:32):
But yeah, well, all right, spoilers, I know for those
who haven't seen the show, but the Baker's wife has
an affair, and she's saying she's going to go back
to the Baker because she can't have both. In life,
you can't always have and you have to make some
more choices and you have to be okay with that.
(15:55):
And it's true, like, you know, my my life could
have gone a thousand different ways, and maybe I made
some very bad choices, but I'm gonna I have to
be at peace with the with the ore well.
Speaker 2 (16:08):
And I think it's helpful to remember that. I think
sometimes people want to make a decision that will mean
that they will not experience regret, Like, oh, if I
make the right decision, I won't regret it. But sometimes
it's like you will regret what you didn't have, because
it's like if you live in California, you don't live
in Vermont, and so it's like I missed the seasons.
It's like you can't you can't avoid regret. And I
think that's where people get stuck. Sometimes it's thinking like, well,
(16:31):
if I just really make the perfect decision or think
about it enough, then I won't regret what I don't have,
where it's really that's not really possible.
Speaker 3 (16:39):
You have to decide.
Speaker 1 (16:41):
Yeah, yeah, I'm glad that one resonated with you.
Speaker 3 (16:43):
That's interesting.
Speaker 2 (16:44):
Yes, Now that the book is going out, I'm so
curious to know which ones strike a chord with other people, because.
Speaker 1 (16:49):
It's not always going to be the same. No, yeah,
well let me do one more that resonated. It's more
fun to change the wallpaper than to fix the roof,
but it's less important. And I like that because you
know that is you have a lot about sort of
the the idea of delayed gratification. I like the phrase
(17:14):
that you've probably heard eat the frog, which means when
you get up, and I use that every morning when
I get up I'm like, I really want to well,
for instance, I really want to write puzzles, which is
I find so joyous, but I know I have to
do whatever. I have to do some stuff that will
take a lot of mental energy, so I better do
(17:36):
that stuff first.
Speaker 3 (17:37):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:38):
Well, and it's also like it's and this is sort
of related to working as one of the most dangerous
forms of procrastination because you feel like, oh, I'm fixing
up my house, but it's like, okay, but you're doing
the fun part and not the part that is actually
going to make the biggest difference in your experience of
your house.
Speaker 1 (17:54):
Exactly exactly. I like that working can be the greatest
form of procrastination. Well, luckily we have you for one
other episode, we get an ad instead of just an
or yay. And before we wrap up, as always, I
do have one for the folks at home. To air
(18:14):
is human to have existentially threatening misaligned objectives? Is ai?
To air is human to have existentially threatening misaligned objectives?
Is AI? What is the real one? And if you
can recall who might have said it? Thank you Gretchen,
and thank you listeners. If you like the show, check
(18:35):
out our Instagram. We have at Hello Puzzlers, Hello puzzlers.
We post original puzzles, other fun stuff, and we'll meet
here tomorrow for more puzzling puzzles that will puzzle you
puzzlingly
Hello, puzzlers. Let's start with a quick puzzle. Take the
first name of the singer of Strangers in the Night
and add the first name of the writer of the
Broadway show In the Heights. Put those together, and you
get the last name of an historical figure. Again, take
the first name of the singer of Strangers the Night.
Add to that the name of the writer of In
(00:22):
the Heights. First name Strangers in the Night plus In
the Heights equals the last name of a famous eighteenth
century American. The answer and more puzzling goodness after the break.
Hello puzzlers, Welcome back to the Puzzler. The final three up,
(00:45):
three down, Inning in your puzzle, no hitter. I am
your host, AJ Jacobs. Before the break, we asked, what
do you get when you take the first name of
the Strangers in the Night singer and add the first
name of the In the Heights writer, You get a
famous historical figure. And the answer is Frank as in
Frank Sinatra saying Stranger's Night, Lynn as in Linn Manuel
(01:07):
Miranda wrote or co wrote the In the Heights. Put
them together, you get Franklin as in Benjamin Franklin. And
I bring that up because a. Ben Franklin. I just
love him and b he's one of the great aphorists
of all time, an aforist, someone who writes aphorisms. He wrote,
or at least wrote down or allegedly wrote lots of
(01:29):
great sayings, maxims, adages, whatever you want to call him,
a penny saved as a penny earned, for instance. And
this is appropriate because our guest is another great aforist,
Gretchen Rubin, my longtime friend, host of the podcast Happier
with Gretchen Rubin, author of so many books, including The
(01:50):
Happiness Project, Life in Five Senses, and the new one,
Secrets of Adulthood, which contains those said aphorisms.
Speaker 2 (01:57):
Welcome, Gretchen, Hello, Agy, I am so happy to be
talking to you today.
Speaker 1 (02:02):
There you go. They are very on brand.
Speaker 2 (02:04):
But I I.
Speaker 1 (02:08):
Well, your book, your new book, I love it. It's
filled with a whole bunch of wise aphorisms that you
came up with, like Ben uh, And we're going to
talk about that, but first we have a puzzle, appropriately
enough about aphorisms. Bring it on, all right, So what
I did is I took some famous aphorisms and gave
(02:29):
them a little modern update, a little refurbishing. So Ben
Franklin's a penny saved as a penny earned might become
a bitcoin saved is a bitcoin.
Speaker 2 (02:41):
So for this.
Speaker 1 (02:42):
Puzzle, I'm going to give you the updated aphorisms, and
you can tell me the original. Okay, and if you
know who wrote the original, that's a bonus. Sometimes there's
no one. It's just folk wisdom. Yeah, folks, that's the word.
Oh and by the way, this is off the record.
If you want to comment on the wisdom of any
(03:02):
of these aphorisms, agree with them, disagree with them, please
do so. All right, are you ready, Gretchen, I'm ready. Okay.
Genius is one percent inspiration and ninety nine percent chant.
GBT prompts perspiration, perspiration, yes, right?
Speaker 3 (03:24):
Was that Tom?
Speaker 2 (03:26):
No?
Speaker 1 (03:27):
He always they started it right, Tom started?
Speaker 2 (03:29):
I was saying Thomas Edison or is it a car?
Speaker 3 (03:35):
Wasn't Thomas Edison?
Speaker 1 (03:36):
It was Tom Well Allegedly he said something like it,
said something enough like it. Yeah, it's good, all right,
it was. It was sort of like a I feel
it was a Malcolm gladwellish, if you work hard enough,
you can do it right, right, all right? How about
a watched sue Ve'd pouch never boils. A watched soue
(03:57):
vide pounch never boils.
Speaker 2 (03:59):
I believe that a watched pot never boils exactly. And that,
I would say, is a proverb. That's folk wisdom. That's
like the old England's kind of proverb.
Speaker 1 (04:08):
Right, our man Ben Franklin did mention it in one
of his many books, but or letters. But all right,
how about tweet softly and carry a big troll army.
Speaker 3 (04:23):
I think that is speak softly and carry a big.
Speaker 1 (04:26):
Stick exactly, and that is associated with do you remember
now it is a president a little earlier, a little earlier.
Oh you said it, yes, exactly, This is a big stick?
Speaker 3 (04:48):
Was the giveaway?
Speaker 2 (04:48):
There?
Speaker 1 (04:49):
There you go. He seems like a man with a
big stick. He and he didn't originate it, but he
did make it famous. Okay, okay, all right, how about
the only thing we have to be generally anxious about
is generalized anxiety disorder itself.
Speaker 2 (05:08):
The only thing we have to fear is fear itself.
And I believe I believe that was Franklin Roseen.
Speaker 1 (05:17):
Yes too, I just realized two roosevelts in a row.
I didn't mean to do that.
Speaker 3 (05:21):
That's interesting.
Speaker 2 (05:22):
I feel like there's like a puzzle up, like you
could have puzzled on that.
Speaker 1 (05:26):
I know I missed an opportunity and think people think
Franklin was a.
Speaker 3 (05:30):
President even though he wasn't.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
Oh he's like a pseudo president, right exactly, I'm Franklin
Roosevelt was president. Franklin was.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
I feel like this is how your puzzle mind works,
like you're making all these connections.
Speaker 1 (05:43):
Yes, yeah, it's a problem. Annow whatever I'm reading, I'm like, oh,
was there a puzzle?
Speaker 3 (05:49):
Occupational hazard?
Speaker 1 (05:51):
It's an occupational hazard. Life is short, your digital footprint.
Speaker 3 (05:56):
Is long, life is short, art is long.
Speaker 1 (06:00):
Yes, that's right, and it seemed unsure, but you were
absolutely correct.
Speaker 3 (06:05):
Well I think that might be a lot in proverb.
Speaker 1 (06:08):
Yes, and it's all.
Speaker 2 (06:10):
Also, isn't that what flash used to flash on the
screen before, like MGM movies or something. Didn't they didn't
they think there was some kind of movie. Yeah, I think,
or maybe I don't know.
Speaker 1 (06:21):
But yeah, I like that. I like that. I didn't know.
I did rate on the internet, which is never wrong
that the roar of the MGM lion is a tiger.
So if people can fact check that, I would be
let me know, send that in.
Speaker 2 (06:35):
I seem to believe that it may be a trademark sound,
which is very unusual.
Speaker 3 (06:39):
There's much to learn, I think.
Speaker 1 (06:41):
All right, yeah, I love it. And by the way,
some people say Hippocrates popularize that. But you know, okay,
how about nothing is certain except for offshore taxhavens and
plasma exchange longevity treatments. Nothing is sure that death and
(07:03):
taxes exactly, and that I have no idea who said that.
I think it's one of your folk wisdom ones. Okay, okay,
people do say Ben Franklin or Mark Twain.
Speaker 3 (07:16):
That sounds like something attributed to Mark Twain.
Speaker 1 (07:18):
Proud, there's a lot of attributes Daniel Defoe or something similar.
Speaker 2 (07:22):
Yogi Berra apparently said I didn't say a lot of
the things.
Speaker 3 (07:25):
That I said.
Speaker 1 (07:26):
Ah, that's a good meta one. Or did he say
that he did?
Speaker 2 (07:29):
I think he did say that about right exactly.
Speaker 1 (07:36):
What doesn't kill us makes our insurance premiums go up?
Thank you for enjoying these, well, am, I am.
Speaker 2 (07:45):
What doesn't kill kill us makes us stronger, that's right,
which I don't agree with that one particularly, Yes, controversial, Yeah,
your mileage may vary on that one.
Speaker 3 (07:58):
I have.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
I it sounds like something that perhaps is attributed to
an actual person, but I do not know who originated.
Speaker 1 (08:05):
Right, it is attributed to Frederick and Meeta, and I
mean sometimes I agree You're right, it depends. Sometimes challenges
I think do make us better and stronger. But it's
like you know, if you if you have a horrible
disease and then you have symptoms for the rest of
your life, that's not stronger.
Speaker 2 (08:26):
Well. One of my aphorisms is the opposite of a
profound truth is also true.
Speaker 1 (08:32):
I love that.
Speaker 3 (08:33):
Yeah, so maybe that's a good example, all right.
Speaker 1 (08:37):
One man's spam is another man's important email folder.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
One man's meat is another man's poison, or is it
One man's poison is another man's meat.
Speaker 3 (08:48):
Oh, that's one man's one man's I can't remember. Wait,
what is well, what is the actual saying?
Speaker 1 (08:54):
If yours is not real, then it should be because
I think it's great, but yes it is.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (09:00):
One man's trash is another man's treasure is one way?
I like it though, I like it, okay, and I
agree with it, and you actually one of yours is
similar to that way.
Speaker 3 (09:16):
I'm right, good memory, Yes, it's uh.
Speaker 1 (09:19):
That what is fun for other people may not be
fun for you, right and vice versa, which I love
and it is so true. Well, what is something fun
that you find fun that other people would be surprised by?
Speaker 2 (09:32):
I find it very relaxing to clutter clear, like mild
clutter clearing, which a lot of people find very sort
of irksome. But on the other hand, like in age,
I mean, we're so different in this way. I don't
really like most games. I like booring games, or like
I don't like the Olympics because I don't like to
see people lose, and so it just kind of it
(09:54):
hurts my heart to see all these people losing after
they've tried so hard.
Speaker 1 (09:58):
So I think that's that's one thing that well I love. Wait,
let me just dig in on both of those. Because
I love your Olympics, I love your compassion. What about
so are you in pain right now doing puzzles? Is this?
Speaker 2 (10:11):
Uh? Well you made this fun, aj but I have
to say, and I like this kind of game, but
I would I don't like something like poker, or I
don't like something like I just find them kind of boring.
The only game I really truly like is Uno, which
you give this sense of like my level of complexity.
Speaker 3 (10:30):
Yeah, I like who know that? I will play, you know,
but that's just about the only game I really like.
Speaker 1 (10:35):
All Right, all right, we got just a couple more. Uh.
When your only tool is a bedazzler, every problem looks
like a jean jacket. This one's a little harder.
Speaker 2 (10:54):
When your only tool is a hammer, every problem looks
like it needs a nail.
Speaker 1 (10:59):
Exactly. That is it. And I actually didn't know who
said it until I researched it.
Speaker 3 (11:03):
Oh did you do?
Speaker 2 (11:04):
No?
Speaker 3 (11:04):
Did? I thought it was just folk wisdom? Did somebody
actually say that?
Speaker 1 (11:07):
Well, according to the ever always accurate Internet, Abraham Maslow,
the psychologist. Interesting, it's called Maslow's hammer. And I do
like that. I do like people use the tools they have,
which is why it's important to have a toolbox. Yes,
I don't know what do you think you are the expert?
Speaker 2 (11:27):
No, I think that's absolutely true that if you have one,
if you have one way of going about something, you
just try to use that instead of thinking like, well,
maybe there's a whole different way to tackle it.
Speaker 3 (11:39):
That's I think.
Speaker 2 (11:39):
Another proverb is it's easier to slice than to untie.
Speaker 3 (11:44):
That's kind of related to.
Speaker 1 (11:45):
A tool too, like if you have the right tool. Okay,
I like that, Yeah, all right. Last one, the filter
is always brighter on someone else's Instagram.
Speaker 3 (11:57):
I think this is the grass is always greener in
some on the other side of the fence.
Speaker 1 (12:03):
That's it exactly.
Speaker 3 (12:04):
Okay, here's something interesting about that.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
That's literally true because if you look down at grass
that's at your feet, you see all the browns and
the dirt and all of the you know, all the
other colors. But if you look farther away at someone
else's lawn, you just see the grass, the green grass
growing you know, higher. And so it is literally true
that if you're looking at someone else's lawn it will
(12:26):
look greener than if you look down at your feet.
Speaker 1 (12:28):
I love that. I did not know literally and metaphorically true,
and Meda totally metaphorically true. So tell me why did
you decide I love aphorisms, and I love I am
assuming you do too. Why did you decide to write
this book Secrets of Adulthood?
Speaker 3 (12:46):
Well, there's sort of two things came together.
Speaker 2 (12:48):
One is, you know, with time and experience, we learn
lessons from life the hard way, and I wanted to
gather sort of these secrets of adulthood that I'd learned,
partly to give them to my two daughters, but also
just to give them to myself, because I don't know
about you, but I feel like I am relearning the
same lesson over and over and over, and like working
(13:09):
is one of the most dangerous forms of procrastination.
Speaker 3 (13:11):
I probably remind myself of that, you know, once a week.
Speaker 2 (13:14):
So I wanted to gather these just sort of to
help capture what I'd learned. And then I really pushed
myself to write them as aphorisms, because I really it
is an ancient literary form, is like your examples have shown,
and when we push ourselves to say something really succinctly,
you really forces polis. That forced me to really get
(13:38):
clear on what I thought and what I believed and
to try to express it in the most powerful way.
And as a writer, I just found that to be
a very kind of creative and energizing undertaking to try
to really distill a big idea into maybe one sentence.
And so I wrote hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of
these but in this collection, and I just picked the
(14:00):
best ones and I just fixed the ones that kind
of Our Secrets of Adulthood, where it's kind of news
you could use as you're trying to make a decision
or stop procrastinating or deal with a difficult relationship. Because
I have some aphorisms that are just observations, like the
periodic table of the elements is an ingredient list of
the universe, which is kind of true. It's not totally true,
(14:22):
but it's kind of true, and it's kind of interesting.
But it's just an observation.
Speaker 3 (14:25):
It's not useful.
Speaker 1 (14:27):
Well, what I One of the things I love about
the book is that it's a relatively short book, and
yet yet it can take a long time to read
because if you read the aphorisms, you have to think about,
how does this apply to my life? Yes, well you
know what does this mean? Give me some exam and
so that's that's why I like, you know, you can
(14:48):
read just a few a night. Let me go over
just a couple of ones that resonated with me. Oh yeah,
I want to hear. Well, this one will allow me
to plug my son Lucas's high school play. Whenever we
choose one path, we must forego other paths, So any
choice may bring unavoidable regret. I think that's true. I
(15:10):
think it's profound. And also, my son was just in
into the woods and there's a wonderful song in there
about and and or do you remember that?
Speaker 3 (15:21):
Yes? I do, Yeah, you do.
Speaker 1 (15:22):
Your very needs to be very cultured.
Speaker 3 (15:24):
Oh well, I I it's a big show.
Speaker 2 (15:27):
I'm explained for people, like, why that's wrong, that's that's
a really I had not thought of that as a
good example.
Speaker 1 (15:32):
But yeah, well, all right, spoilers, I know for those
who haven't seen the show, but the Baker's wife has
an affair, and she's saying she's going to go back
to the Baker because she can't have both. In life,
you can't always have and you have to make some
more choices and you have to be okay with that.
(15:55):
And it's true, like, you know, my my life could
have gone a thousand different ways, and maybe I made
some very bad choices, but I'm gonna I have to
be at peace with the with the ore well.
Speaker 2 (16:08):
And I think it's helpful to remember that. I think
sometimes people want to make a decision that will mean
that they will not experience regret, Like, oh, if I
make the right decision, I won't regret it. But sometimes
it's like you will regret what you didn't have, because
it's like if you live in California, you don't live
in Vermont, and so it's like I missed the seasons.
It's like you can't you can't avoid regret. And I
think that's where people get stuck. Sometimes it's thinking like, well,
(16:31):
if I just really make the perfect decision or think
about it enough, then I won't regret what I don't have,
where it's really that's not really possible.
Speaker 3 (16:39):
You have to decide.
Speaker 1 (16:41):
Yeah, yeah, I'm glad that one resonated with you.
Speaker 3 (16:43):
That's interesting.
Speaker 2 (16:44):
Yes, Now that the book is going out, I'm so
curious to know which ones strike a chord with other people, because.
Speaker 1 (16:49):
It's not always going to be the same. No, yeah,
well let me do one more that resonated. It's more
fun to change the wallpaper than to fix the roof,
but it's less important. And I like that because you
know that is you have a lot about sort of
the the idea of delayed gratification. I like the phrase
(17:14):
that you've probably heard eat the frog, which means when
you get up, and I use that every morning when
I get up I'm like, I really want to well,
for instance, I really want to write puzzles, which is
I find so joyous, but I know I have to
do whatever. I have to do some stuff that will
take a lot of mental energy, so I better do
(17:36):
that stuff first.
Speaker 3 (17:37):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:38):
Well, and it's also like it's and this is sort
of related to working as one of the most dangerous
forms of procrastination because you feel like, oh, I'm fixing
up my house, but it's like, okay, but you're doing
the fun part and not the part that is actually
going to make the biggest difference in your experience of
your house.
Speaker 1 (17:54):
Exactly exactly. I like that working can be the greatest
form of procrastination. Well, luckily we have you for one
other episode, we get an ad instead of just an
or yay. And before we wrap up, as always, I
do have one for the folks at home. To air
(18:14):
is human to have existentially threatening misaligned objectives? Is ai?
To air is human to have existentially threatening misaligned objectives?
Is AI? What is the real one? And if you
can recall who might have said it? Thank you Gretchen,
and thank you listeners. If you like the show, check
(18:35):
out our Instagram. We have at Hello Puzzlers, Hello puzzlers.
We post original puzzles, other fun stuff, and we'll meet
here tomorrow for more puzzling puzzles that will puzzle you
puzzlingly
Hosts And Creators
Greg Pliska
A.J. Jacobs
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