March 13, 2024 • 41 mins
Two callers are ready to learn to co-parent with their exes, but Iyanla suspects there are deeper issues at play. The first caller is deep in a custody battle when she plans to take her daughter to another country and the second caller realizes she’s never even had a real relationship with the father of her child, a whoopsie-pregnancy after a one night stand.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
I am Yamla, your host for this journey. I was
a hopeless love aholic, but just could not get my
love to work. Then, after a series of heartbreaks and
deep heartache, I finally got clear about what love is
and what it is not. I want to share some
(00:22):
of what I've learned about love a holism. Welcome to
the r Spot, a production of shondaland Audio in partnership
with iHeartRadio. Great day, and welcome to the art Spot,
(00:48):
the place we come to talk about all kinds of
relationships and the issues that grow through our relationships. In
our relationships sometime the issues that tear down our relationships.
I am a Yamla, your host, your guide, your support system,
here to offer you a different perspective, perhaps a different approach,
(01:13):
to support you by offering tools and skills and information
that will help you make all of your relationships loving, fulfilling,
and hopefully peaceful. Yeah. Today we're talking about a very
important topic, co parenting, or what happens when the relationship
(01:37):
between the parents breaks down and there are children involved.
I have seen time and time again, and I'm sure
you have seen and you probably know about children who
become collateral damage in the fighting between parents, and what
happens when the initial relationship isn't really solid and a
(02:02):
child comes through that relationship. When the parents don't have
a good, solid relationships, perhaps it was just the thing
or a fling, and we weren't careful and conscious, so
we created a child that we're now trying to raise.
But the parents are fighting or disconnected, or perhaps they
(02:24):
don't really know each other well, the children become collateral damage.
Or what happens when there's the ending of a long
term relationship or a committed relationship where they were children,
and now, in addition to the house and the car
and the bank accounts and material possessions, the parents are
(02:47):
fighting among themselves and the children get caught up in
the middle. What happens when the holidays rolled around, or
if there's a funeral, or if there's a wedding, who
gets to bring the children? Who gets to speak to
the children. What happens when partners separate and one partner
(03:07):
has a new partner and the other partner doesn't want
the children exposed. I mean, there are so many issues
that go on when we're trying to co parent and
we haven't cleaned up the original relationship. We're going to
talk about that today and I hope to be able
(03:30):
to give you some insights, some information about how to
separate the husband, wife, boyfriend, girlfriend, father, mother from the
same people who are actually the parents of the children.
Let me say that again. I hope to give you
some insight, some information, a different perspective and approach so
(03:55):
that you can separate, make a distinction between who you
are as ex spouses or ex partners and who you
are as parents, because although you are one and the same,
your responsibilities, your approach, your perspective as parents who no
(04:17):
longer live together must be different. I've got some callers
on the line and we are going to talk to
them today and hopefully, hopefully we will get some new
ideas about how to co parent when the initial loving
relationship has fallen apart or broken down. Greetings beloved, and
(04:42):
welcome to the R Spot. We are talking today about
co parenting when the relationship between the parents isn't good
and they're trying to raise children together. Thank you for
joining us, and what is the issue you're bringing to
the table today?
Speaker 2 (04:59):
Hello calling Because I was married for seventeen years and
the context of that marriage, we had four children, so
they're twenty two, twenty one, fourteen, and twelve. We've been
divorced for sixty year, or I call it happily unmarried
and delightfully divorced. I've been delightfully but divorced for six years.
And initially when we were still living in the same state,
(05:19):
the co parenting was kind of going okay, but we
now live in different states. So for two years they
were with me during the school year and then with
him during agreed upon breaks. And then that two year period,
he was frequently not showing up for visits and things
like that, which put me in a position to have
to explain to the kids, you know that he wasn't
showing up, and try to overcompensate for him not showing
(05:39):
up during the day, say he'd agreed to show up
during mediation. Since June, we've kind of switched that, so
there the younger two kids are now with him. They
were with him with us during the summer, there with
him during the school year, and I find that he's
micro managing my visits and so even though he wasn't
showing up for his visits, I'm showing up for my
agreed upon visits and trying to get ex additional visits.
(06:01):
So two things that have come up more recently. For
the winter break, according to our mediated agreement, I'm supposed
to be with them or they're supposed to be with
me from December twenty sixth to the thirty first, and
so I reached out to him to see if I
could get some extra time with them because they'll be
out of school longer than that. So I reached out
to him about this about seven weeks ago. And then
I also reached out to him because I recently quit
(06:24):
flash retired from being a philosophy professor, so I'm taking
kind of a personal sabbatical now. But I was offered
a research fellowship in Germany from January until June. And
so my youngest, the twelve year old, wants to come
with me to Germany. So I reached out to him
about seven weeks ago to say, you know, I'd like
to extend the winter break time with the kids and
Kalia would like to come with me to Germany. You know,
(06:44):
can we schedule a conversation about that. So after repeatedly
reaching out to him into the mediator's office over several weeks,
I was just able to get him to agree to
the conversation about the winter break next week, and then
he pushed out the mediation session all the way to
December twentieth of this year, even though I'm heading to
Germany like January fifteenth. So it's just been challenging to
(07:07):
negotiate the kind of micromanaging what feels like petty control
and pushing out decisions to the last possible moment over
something that I would have hoped that we could just
have conversations about sooner rather than later.
Speaker 1 (07:19):
I just want to take a moment, Mama and just
acknowledge you, because so very often when the marriage or
the relationship between the parents break down, the mother kind
of claims possession of the children and would never would
(07:41):
never do you, hear me, I have seen it time
and time again, never allow her children and believe it
or not, particularly her son to go live with his father.
My goodness, Good for you, Good for.
Speaker 2 (07:56):
You, thank you. I appreciate. I mean, it was definitely
a challenging decision, but I feel like, you know, it's
important for them to have a healthy relationship with both parents.
They have influences from both parents, and you know, with
him not showing up for his visits when they were
with me. I'm like, well, if they're with him, he
like he may not be able to show up emotionally,
but like they're you know, they get an opportunity to
(08:18):
kind of experience him for his hand and decide what
that relationship is going to be with him, because I
constantly have stressed to them my relationship with my husband
is not the same as their relationship with their father,
and so I try to differentiate those things.
Speaker 1 (08:30):
Wow, wow, do you know how many people don't get that?
How many people don't get my relationship with my ex
is different than my children's relationship with their father. Two
different people all in the same body. One for you,
So you are like light years ahead of the game,
(08:52):
believe it or not.
Speaker 2 (08:54):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (08:56):
Let's talk about this micro managing. Think what your experience
of that has been? What is that?
Speaker 2 (09:04):
Well it has been you know, like I said specifically
with regard to trying to have conversations around the winter
break and trying to have conversations around the Germany trip,
like constantly avoiding and pushing that out instead of just
like sitting down and having that conversation, or like initially
the mediator said, well, you guys should probably have a
phone call check in at least once a month, like
(09:24):
at the beginning of the month. So we said we
would do that, but I'm constantly having to reach out
to him in order to set that out up. So
like the last conversation that we've actually had by phone
was like in August, because we haven't done these monthly
check ins. And then he is also remarried now, so
he wants to filter that through his wife as well,
(09:47):
and so so it's just it's interesting.
Speaker 1 (09:49):
You've got to know that that could impact his ability
or willingness to be in communication with you. Do you know, oh,
his new wife, do you know her?
Speaker 2 (10:02):
I don't know her personally, right, So they actually like
when he first started dating her, he told me that
he was, you know, dating somebody, and then and then
I found out through the kids that he was getting married,
and so I never even met her, like the during
the time that they were dating, during the time that
they were engaged, or even before they got married. The
first time I met her was actually I was I
(10:22):
wouldn't say by accident. Maybe it was serendissity. They were
in town to pick up the kids last summer when
the younger two kids were going to go with them
for the summer and we were going to the store
to pick something up for the youngest teacher, and she
happened to be in the store, and so they were like, oh,
this is you know, so and so and so. I
was like, oh, well, it's nice to finally actually meet
you in person. And she seemed really pleasant. We exchanged
(10:44):
numbers and she was saying, like, you know, Will I
tried to, you know, get him to introduce us, but
he kept avoiding it, and I didn't want to nag.
And she was like, you know, you probably don't believe me,
and I'm like, oh, I believe you right, Like I
have no reason not to believe you, know, your account
of those events. She So, she seemed really pleasant at
the time. And then the next time we had a
conversation was with We did a family counseling session with him,
(11:07):
his wife, and myself. We did one with the adults
first and then with the kids, and then there she
seems definitely like, you know, co signing his position, which
I understand, you know, they're married, they're doing the United
Front thing. But then when several issues were raised about
what the kids' experiences had been with them last summer.
Then there was more of like a defensiveness from both
(11:28):
of them around you know they're doing you know, they're
saying their way, which I get, But I was trying
to explain to them, like, this is a major transition.
This was ahead of them, the kids going with them
this year, and so I'm like, it's a major transition
for the kids. They've only ever lived with me, you know,
give them some grace, give them some patience. And there
seemed to be just not a lot of grades and
patients and consideration for how they could transition. It was
(11:49):
for the younger two kids to go from having lived
with me their whole life and being with their older
two siblings to going solo to live with them, away
from me and away from their siblings.
Speaker 1 (12:00):
Are the kids adjusting to that? Is that what they
want or is that what you two decide it should happen.
Speaker 2 (12:08):
So we decided to give it a try for a year.
So right now, the mediation is there with him for
this year, and then we will revisit the arrangement next summer.
At the end of this year, our son, I think
is satisfied with that arrangement as long as he can
continue to see me. Our youngest is not satisfied with
that arrangement. So again, the youngest would like to come
(12:30):
with me to Germany, but I need you know, he
would have to agree to that, because we already have
an agreement in place. But if not, then the youngest,
you know, would have to wait out this year and
then you know, we can make new a new agreement
next summer.
Speaker 1 (12:46):
Wow, So what do we do now? We'll talk about
that right after the spring. Welcome back to the r spot.
Let's pick up where we left done. Okay, is he
angry with you?
Speaker 2 (13:03):
Yes?
Speaker 1 (13:04):
Have you and him talked about it or brought that
to any level of resolution?
Speaker 2 (13:09):
There was a point at which we did, and then
there were more things. So, like I tried to be
really intentional, so because I'm the person who wanted the
divorce right, like, I had this moment of like just
intuitive insight of like I really and it wasn't about
him being a terrible person. It was just like I
do not want to be married anymore. It's time for
me to like get out of this relationship. And then
I found out at that time that he'd been having
(13:30):
an affair with the attack of he member in his apartment.
He'd been having an affair with a graduate student of his department.
Right like, all of this stuff came out, so ultimately
we separated. He I asked him to move out of
the house, and I think that's when the anger cap in,
right like that he had to move out. That he
then had to you know, be on his own financially
and do all the adult things that I had basically
(13:52):
been doing throughout the marriage. And then he said since then, like, oh, well,
you always get your way. Everything's always about your preference.
But I think there's anger and a feeling that I
have kind of dictated things and now he wants to
kind of reclaim a control.
Speaker 1 (14:06):
At this point, well, have you have you dictated things?
No heat, no judgment. Were you the maximizer in the relationship?
Did you get things hand or taken care of? Yeah,
kind of thing.
Speaker 2 (14:18):
Of course, maximize itself like better language than dictator. Right,
But so I would have said I dictated things, but
I would say yeah, in that sense, I was a MAXI.
So I've always been a person who I'm a high achiever.
I'm a planner, you know, I make a plan I
worked a plan.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
You know, there's an old saying that all children leave
home angry. It's easier for them to leave home angry
and be upset with their parents and go out on
their own and do their thing and be mad with
their parents than it is for them to come to
agreement and say, you know, it's time, I'm going to go.
When you have a situation where the woman was the
(14:56):
maximizer or the let's say the director, I don't want
to say the controller or the manager. I'll say the director.
When that relationship breaks down, very often the male partner
is it treats the his ex as though she were
his mother, and he has to be mad at her
(15:21):
to go out and get away. He doesn't look at
the fact that he didn't pick up his socks, he
didn't put the food away, he peed on the toilet seat.
You know, because I really see here, just as you
so wisely assessed, that he's angry and he's gonna now control.
It's directed at you, But the children are caught up
(15:44):
in the middle.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
That's my concern, is a kid because for me, as
an adult who already you know, experienced seventeen years of
marriage with him and you know, against six years happily unmarried,
delightfully divorced. Like I know how to I can negotiate
that adult to adult. I think it's harder for the
kids to negotiate with their dad and feel caught up
in it.
Speaker 1 (16:02):
So I'm just wondering here if there is an opportunity
for you to do this woman to woman, to kind
of snuggle up to your sister woman, his wife, to
see if you and her can come to come to
an agreement, to involve her, you know, so that she
(16:26):
knows because she's probably getting it all from his side
at the table, if you and her are not communicating,
if you and her are not speaking, I'm just wondering
if you can do this woman to woman, not to
override him, not to bypass him, but to just let
her know first of all, that you appreciate her, that
(16:47):
she's there, that she's providing care. I'm just wondering if
you and her can build a bond that will support
you in getting him to move a little quicker, because
it sounds like he's just acting out, rebelling. He's mad
at you, he's mad at the director, the mommy. He's
gonna have you ever considered that, do you think that's
(17:10):
a possibility.
Speaker 2 (17:11):
I did consider it, and I was hopeful that that
would be a possibility until we sat down most recently
with the three of us, where she kind of was
definitely taking on his line of it, you know what
I mean. And so, you know, initially I thought, okay, well,
maybe I can communicate more directly with her with regard
to the kids. But then she got into a place
of defensiveness around like, well, these kids need to, you know,
(17:33):
respect me, and I'm not going to be disrespected, and like,
so she's caught up in her own stuff with regard
to her relationship to him and her relationship with the kids.
Speaker 1 (17:41):
You know, do you play chess?
Speaker 2 (17:44):
No, my son, my kids do, but I don't. But yeah,
being strategic, right, you know.
Speaker 1 (17:50):
And so it may be a woman to woman phone
call where you say listen. I can only imagine, as
the stepmom or the blended mom into this family, that
the kids are going to have a little rebellion against you.
I understand that, and I want you to know that
I'm not supporting it. I'm not supporting it. They're in
(18:13):
your home. I want you to sup them to respect you.
I want you to know I heard what you said,
and I also want to know how I can do that?
What do? What would you ask of me? And what
I would ask of you is if you and I
can you know, communicate because it seems that Booboo whatever
(18:34):
his name is, is a little slow on responding to
some things that I want to be able to plan for.
And I don't want to be disrespectful. I don't want
to overstep. You know, you get a strategy where you
and her can line up as women, you know, because
I'm telling you, he's just rebelling against you. He's angry
(18:57):
and he's rebelling. And she's the stepmoms, so you know,
she's bringing kids into her house. I don't know if
she has children. She probably wants your children to act
the way her children do, but she's not their birth
mother and they're in relationship with you. It's hard. It's
hard for the little pooka new news. The little pooka
(19:17):
new news. You know, they probably feel they're being disloyal
to you even liking her, And that twelve year old
at that age is a challenged to like her because
she's gonna feel disloyal to you because she's different and
(19:38):
b she's twelve. You know, she's in a really a critical,
critical place. But I still think it would be worthwhile
for you to just attempt, I don't know, if you know,
how to get in touch with her, attempt to create
this union between her. Now, we got to move a
(19:58):
little quickly because you got this thing coming up for Germany.
It sounds to me, you know, and of course I
don't know all of the intricate details, but it sounds
to me like you you know, you're approaching this from
a very mature perspective, which is why I say, try
(20:19):
to create an alliance, so that when he doesn't respond,
you could say, have you and Boo boo talked about this?
You know, not meddling, just want to know, you know,
so I can make the right choices here. I think
that's your that's the way to go. Okay, woman to
woman and she's gonna go with you to Germany.
Speaker 2 (20:41):
Oh, thank you so much.
Speaker 1 (20:42):
I'm going to decree that for you. Because she's had
a critical time. This is critical, critical, critical, and if
you got to whip out some psychological documentation, put that
on the mediation table. Don't be afraid to do that,
you know, like I said at twelve thirteen, identity versus
(21:04):
identity confusion. She's looking at who am I following? Who
am I modeling my womanness after? And if she doesn't
like her stepmother, or if they're not getting along and
she doesn't have access to you because you're in Germany,
that is going to be a problem. And here's another thing, Mama,
(21:27):
I want you to hear me. Okay, First of all,
I want you to know you haven't done anything wrong,
but I also sense you doing all of this from
your head. I want you to drop down into your heart.
You are a planner, and you are in many ways strategic,
(21:47):
and you are an achiever, but you're doing it from
best thought and I want you to drop down and
start doing this with a mother's heart. Take a breath
from me, take a breath for me, and in your heart,
(22:11):
I want you to see your baby girl with you.
I want you to see yourself over in Germany together.
I want you to see you, know yourself, laughing, playing
with her, just being with her. Not from your head
because you want her to go, but from your heart
(22:33):
because you're a mama bear and your cub needs you
right now. Yeah, just see that and feel that. Get
that into your body, take him out of it. He
doesn't have anything to do with this. This is you
a mama bear protecting her cub. You can't do that
from your head and what needs to be done in
(22:54):
this meeting and that meeting, in the schedule and body
plane tickets, and you can't do it like that. Yeah,
I want you a little more in your heart. Does
that make sense to you?
Speaker 3 (23:05):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (23:05):
It does. I definitely and very cerebral. So even though
on the cancer sunshine, so I'm in my feelings all
the time that I hear you saying, move from the
space of the heart and out the head.
Speaker 1 (23:16):
Yeah. So before you and your baby girl leaf for Germany,
just shoot me an email at a yamladiyama dot com
just say thank you. I'm on my way.
Speaker 3 (23:27):
Oh my goodness, I definitely will.
Speaker 2 (23:30):
Thank you so much for that encouragement and affirmation.
Speaker 3 (23:32):
I receive it.
Speaker 1 (23:34):
Okay, all right, my love, thank you for calling.
Speaker 2 (23:36):
Thank you for having me.
Speaker 1 (23:41):
Sometimes as mothers, we get so caught up in what
needs to be done and the best way to do it,
at what's going on and what they're doing and what
we're not doing, that we move into a very cerebral place,
and we start dealing from our head. We also deal
(24:02):
from our past experiences. Very often when we're co parenting,
we have to do it from the heart space, creating oneness,
creating unity, being compassionate, empathetic, not sympathetic, not pushing to
(24:25):
get our way, but trying to get on the same
side of the table as the other parent, considering their perspective,
not getting caught up in it, not judging it, not
excusing it, but just see it from their perspective, and
then get clear about what it is that it's best
(24:48):
for the child from a mother's heart, not a mother's head,
because in the head are all the experiences that we
had with a partner or ex partner as a partner,
and now that that union is no longer operating, we
(25:09):
got to create a new normal. Get out of your head, mothers,
get into your heart and deal with your ex from
your heart space, filled with compassion, empathy, and being clear
about what it is you desire for the child. Be
(25:31):
willing to compromise and yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I know.
Sometimes the other party is not willing to do that
and they'll put their foot down. Stay in your heart,
stay in your heart. Make your request clear for the
good of the child, not in opposition or againstness to
(25:55):
the other parent. And if you're a mom and the
ex has another woman in his life, consider how you
and her can become sister women an alliance for the
good of the child. Now, I know that doesn't work
all the time, but at least it's a possibility. Stay tuned,
(26:19):
we'll be right back. Greetings, and welcome to the R Spot.
We are talking today about co parenting when your husband
or your used to be wife is involved and you
(26:40):
are in breakdown and you are trying to raise children.
So what is the dilemma that you're bringing to the
table today.
Speaker 3 (26:47):
The dilemma that I'm bringing to the table today is
the fact that my youngest friend's father is what I
like to call a convenience store dad, if that makes sense. Yeah, yeah,
And so you know, he likes to be a dad
when it's convenient for him. Just recently this past holiday
(27:09):
per se, his mom got involved, and she's been involved
from the beginning, but it's just splitting the times between
two families, and she wanted the entire time to be
with her and the rest of their family, Whereas here
I am like, hey, well, look he has two families,
not just one. Your family ain't the only family here,
(27:31):
and it cost a huge ripple and the tide, so
to speak, because you want to send time with your
friend when you had ample opportunity prior to just this
great Thanksgiving to do so. And I feel like she
feels like I'm using my son as a pawn or
wedge between the two families to say, well, you know,
(27:52):
for Christmas, you can't see him, see him, and that's
not the case. My day is the time outside of
the holidays you don't do nothing with. So now you
want me to be, you know, make the sacrifice and
be convenient and try my hardest to you know, please
you and y'all during the holiday season when it's still
(28:13):
three hundred and sixty two days of a year where
y'all could see him and you don't. So that's where
my co parentee issues come here at holidays.
Speaker 1 (28:25):
How old is your son, mam?
Speaker 3 (28:26):
He is four, and he is a very observant, vocal,
energetic for your old little boy.
Speaker 1 (28:34):
So he really doesn't give two diadley snits about Thanksgiving.
He really don't.
Speaker 3 (28:42):
No, he doesn't.
Speaker 1 (28:43):
What is the arrangement that you now. What is the
arrangement that you now? What's the arrangement?
Speaker 3 (28:49):
Well, the way that the arrangement started once his father
found out that he was a father prior of like
the last two years.
Speaker 1 (28:57):
Wait a minute, hold up, hold up, hold up, hold up,
you just trying to zip past that. What does that mean?
Once the father found out he was a father, What
does that mean?
Speaker 3 (29:08):
Well, I didn't know that I was pregnant until I
had my kids, and I had my I had my
youngest son in the middle of my parents' living room
on March the first of twenty nineteen.
Speaker 1 (29:23):
Oh my goodness. Yeah, how you didn't know you was pregnant?
What happened?
Speaker 3 (29:28):
To be honest his eldest brother, I found out two
weeks prior before having him that I was pregnant. So
it's just, I would say, just the distant stresses of
life and just you know, just going with emotions of
things and not really listening and honing into my body.
(29:49):
I was just going with the flow. I know, I know,
I know, So.
Speaker 1 (29:57):
You know what, that would be a whole show in
and of itself. I'm going to just stay with the fact.
Here's the question. What was the nature of your relationship
with your four year old son's father? What was the
nature of that relationship?
Speaker 3 (30:12):
Honestly, it was just a you scratch my echtch each
type of deal. And we should never you know, when
we could just see each other and passing. But now
that itch scratching committed for how long?
Speaker 1 (30:28):
For how long? For how for? How long did you
do that?
Speaker 3 (30:32):
I should honestly say it was one time. It was
supposed to be a one and done type of deal,
and then thee don turned into a whole lifetime commitment.
Speaker 1 (30:41):
Okay, so you do not have a relationship with him, correct,
So his convenience store, he's still scratching an itch, and
since you know that it ain't really there, he hasn't.
It doesn't seem to me that he's yet translated the
distinction or made the distinction between scratching your itch and
(31:06):
fathering his son. Because he didn't have a choice, he
wasn't involved, he didn't participate. So he's just transferred his
relationship with you onto his relationship with his son.
Speaker 3 (31:21):
Yeah, and I'm taken.
Speaker 1 (31:23):
Does that make sense to John?
Speaker 3 (31:24):
I'm taking your full responsibility of my actions, and you know,
the things that have happened, But I'm like, Okay, at
the other day, we still have an all kid that
we have to raise together, but separate.
Speaker 1 (31:37):
You know, you do have a child that you want
to raise. What is the conversation between you and his
father regarding his participation in raising his son? What has
your conversation been with him?
Speaker 3 (31:53):
There? Hass like talking to a brick wall.
Speaker 1 (31:56):
Okay, well I would I would.
Speaker 3 (31:59):
You know, open up the line of communication. You know,
what's abod? I try to call him so we can
have conversations. I hay, when's you know, when's the time
for you to see him? What is your weekend looking like?
And get I get no response. His mother is more
evolved than he is.
Speaker 1 (32:22):
So then I say, line up, woman to woman with
his mother, line up. How old is this gentleman?
Speaker 3 (32:29):
He's thirty five.
Speaker 1 (32:32):
Does he have other children?
Speaker 2 (32:34):
No?
Speaker 3 (32:34):
As as well as far as I know, my friend
is his fus.
Speaker 2 (32:40):
And his only so.
Speaker 1 (32:43):
But here, mom, I want you to hear me. I'm
not I don't have no heat, no judgment on this,
but I really want you to hear me. I want
you to take this in. That's not his son, that's
the scratching of an itch. That's a scratching of an itch.
(33:04):
That's not his son. He's not there, gotcha. So if
your intention is to be sure that your son has
access to is involved with his father's side of the family,
then your doorway, your ticket to that is his grandmother. Okay,
(33:27):
and perhaps she is the one you know. And I'm
really torn in that because it's hard for me to
say that knowing he may be around his father and
his father just sees him as an itch or not
as a you know, a responsibility. But the other thing
I'm gonna encourage you to do, and I don't know
how you don't have any agreement with this man in
(33:50):
terms of cope parenting. I don't know what kind of
request that you've made, because when are you going to
spend time with him? Is not a request, that's an inquiry,
that's a question. Got to You've got to make it clear.
I want to know or my request is that you
have care of your son, of our son at least
(34:13):
one weekend a month, and when he's with your mom,
that's between me and your mom. You've got to set
up a relationship with her that's separate and apart from
the relationship you have with the father because she sees
this as her grandson. He sees this as an itch.
Speaker 3 (34:29):
Yes, and he's kind of mention.
Speaker 1 (34:31):
Of the nature of your I.
Speaker 3 (34:34):
Would saying, well, he's currently as of recently, we have
started the family court process her his request for visitational purposes,
So we're going to see.
Speaker 1 (34:46):
How oh good he requested it.
Speaker 3 (34:48):
Yeah, he did. And to be honest, I guess for
me it was a thing. I'm like, okay, but you're
asking for visitation when all you have to do is
your feakle to fault and say, hey man.
Speaker 1 (35:02):
Your business manya business manya business. If that's how he
wants to do it, it may be a fear that
you're gonna ask him too much or again he he
don't know you. You you had a role in the
hay with this guy. True, So he's trying to protect hisself.
He's trying to protect hisself because in his mile, she's
(35:22):
gonna come after me. She's gonna come after me for money.
She's gonna do this, that and the other thing. But
when you get into court, you can definitely ask for money. Yeah,
that is separate and apart from your relationship with his mom. Yes, ma'am,
this is her grandson. She sees him as her grandson
(35:43):
and she wants to be in relationship with her him.
So you have to set that up with her, whether
he is involved or not. Get into alignment and agreement
with grandma. Grandma. If you're in alignment with her, she'll
make it happen.
Speaker 3 (36:04):
Yes, ma'am. Does that make sense?
Speaker 1 (36:08):
So you know when I was co parenting my granddaughter
with her father, and he was just a wonderful child
of God, cleverly disguised as an idiot. I had to
really make agreements and request and it wasn't always what
(36:30):
I wanted. So we agreed one Thanksgiving he's with you,
and that year she's with me for Christmas. One the
next year she's with me for Thanksgiving, she's with you
for Christmas. And even if you set it up, they
have him Christmas Day and you get him the day
after Christmas. Kids don't they don't care, They don't you know,
(36:51):
he don't know. He's four, He don't know what day
Christmas is in his mind. He could have a Christmas,
two Christmases, two thanks Giving and someone you're gonna have
to relinquish your attachment to. I got to have him
for major house. One Mother's Day, he's with her, One
Mother's Day he's with you. Father's Day he can have him,
(37:14):
you know, a groundhog's day. All of those things, right,
But get into alignment with Grandma. Get into alignment with her,
and it may mean that you have to I don't
know what better words. I'll say sacrifice, sacrifice until he's
old enough to say I don't want to go, or
(37:36):
I want to stay with you, which you'll probably be
around ten or eleven. Yes, line up with Line up
with grandma, and deal with daddy, who has absolutely no
connection to this child at all, unfortunately because you was
giving up the goodies.
Speaker 3 (37:54):
Yeah, I can't. Yes, where am I wan? Yes, William,
thank you so much. I appreciate.
Speaker 1 (38:03):
Okay, line up with grandma.
Speaker 2 (38:04):
Okay, I'm a line up with grandma.
Speaker 1 (38:06):
All right. Thank you for love it, thank you for calling,
and good luck to you. Thank you alrighty. So many
co parents do not understand that the nature of their
relationship together impacts the nature of the way the children
(38:28):
are parenting. If you had a you know one and
done fly by go by night, you can't come in
the back door now expecting the other parent to be
you know, all in, heads in, feet in because they
weren't involved to that degree. And it's not to beat
ourselves up, it's not to make ourselves feel bad. But
(38:52):
if you have a child with someone and their intention
was not to have a child, then maybe some things
that you have to give up. You can't force somebody.
You cannot force somebody to step into their responsibility. You
would hope that they would, but if they didn't have
(39:12):
a vote and a choice upfront, if you ended up
pregnant or just got pregnant and that wasn't the plan,
you know, the fact that the other party doesn't want
to be a parent, doesn't live up to their responsibilities,
that ain't your business. They're gonna have to answer to
God for that, not you. Your business is how do you
(39:36):
communicate that to the child. But insisting that someone step
into their parenthood when they're resistant to doing that, fighting
with them is not it's not It's not gonna turn
out well for you. Okay, So we've got to be
mindful when we are co parenting to understand the name
(40:00):
nature of the relationship that produced the child. You got
to take that into consideration and don't assume that just
because you add the child or are having the child
that the other person is happy about. Okay, Now, if
this is a planned child, if you were in a
(40:20):
committed relationship and the child is born, then you may
have a little bit to work with. But you still
have to look at the nature of the relationship and
the nature of the person you were in relationship with.
If they are irresponsible in their relationship, negligent in their relationship, dishonest,
(40:41):
out of integrity, lacking ownership, accountability in their relationship with
another adult, what in the blazon of Jesus thinks that
they are going to be responsible, integrists and accountable to
a child? Okay, So some of the demands and the
requires and a quest that you may be making are
(41:03):
going to fall on deaf ears, and yes, the child
or the children become collateral damage. What you want to
figure out is how best to deal with the situation
you are in for the good of the child and
maintain the peace in the process. I hope that you
(41:23):
know something now that you didn't know when you tuned in,
And until we meet again, stay in peace and not pieces.
The R Spot is a production of shondaland Audio in
partnership with iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from Shondaland Audio, visit
(41:46):
the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to
your favorite shows.
I am Yamla, your host for this journey. I was
a hopeless love aholic, but just could not get my
love to work. Then, after a series of heartbreaks and
deep heartache, I finally got clear about what love is
and what it is not. I want to share some
(00:22):
of what I've learned about love a holism. Welcome to
the r Spot, a production of shondaland Audio in partnership
with iHeartRadio. Great day, and welcome to the art Spot,
(00:48):
the place we come to talk about all kinds of
relationships and the issues that grow through our relationships. In
our relationships sometime the issues that tear down our relationships.
I am a Yamla, your host, your guide, your support system,
here to offer you a different perspective, perhaps a different approach,
(01:13):
to support you by offering tools and skills and information
that will help you make all of your relationships loving, fulfilling,
and hopefully peaceful. Yeah. Today we're talking about a very
important topic, co parenting, or what happens when the relationship
(01:37):
between the parents breaks down and there are children involved.
I have seen time and time again, and I'm sure
you have seen and you probably know about children who
become collateral damage in the fighting between parents, and what
happens when the initial relationship isn't really solid and a
(02:02):
child comes through that relationship. When the parents don't have
a good, solid relationships, perhaps it was just the thing
or a fling, and we weren't careful and conscious, so
we created a child that we're now trying to raise.
But the parents are fighting or disconnected, or perhaps they
(02:24):
don't really know each other well, the children become collateral damage.
Or what happens when there's the ending of a long
term relationship or a committed relationship where they were children,
and now, in addition to the house and the car
and the bank accounts and material possessions, the parents are
(02:47):
fighting among themselves and the children get caught up in
the middle. What happens when the holidays rolled around, or
if there's a funeral, or if there's a wedding, who
gets to bring the children? Who gets to speak to
the children. What happens when partners separate and one partner
(03:07):
has a new partner and the other partner doesn't want
the children exposed. I mean, there are so many issues
that go on when we're trying to co parent and
we haven't cleaned up the original relationship. We're going to
talk about that today and I hope to be able
(03:30):
to give you some insights, some information about how to
separate the husband, wife, boyfriend, girlfriend, father, mother from the
same people who are actually the parents of the children.
Let me say that again. I hope to give you
some insight, some information, a different perspective and approach so
(03:55):
that you can separate, make a distinction between who you
are as ex spouses or ex partners and who you
are as parents, because although you are one and the same,
your responsibilities, your approach, your perspective as parents who no
(04:17):
longer live together must be different. I've got some callers
on the line and we are going to talk to
them today and hopefully, hopefully we will get some new
ideas about how to co parent when the initial loving
relationship has fallen apart or broken down. Greetings beloved, and
(04:42):
welcome to the R Spot. We are talking today about
co parenting when the relationship between the parents isn't good
and they're trying to raise children together. Thank you for
joining us, and what is the issue you're bringing to
the table today?
Speaker 2 (04:59):
Hello calling Because I was married for seventeen years and
the context of that marriage, we had four children, so
they're twenty two, twenty one, fourteen, and twelve. We've been
divorced for sixty year, or I call it happily unmarried
and delightfully divorced. I've been delightfully but divorced for six years.
And initially when we were still living in the same state,
(05:19):
the co parenting was kind of going okay, but we
now live in different states. So for two years they
were with me during the school year and then with
him during agreed upon breaks. And then that two year period,
he was frequently not showing up for visits and things
like that, which put me in a position to have
to explain to the kids, you know that he wasn't
showing up, and try to overcompensate for him not showing
(05:39):
up during the day, say he'd agreed to show up
during mediation. Since June, we've kind of switched that, so
there the younger two kids are now with him. They
were with him with us during the summer, there with
him during the school year, and I find that he's
micro managing my visits and so even though he wasn't
showing up for his visits, I'm showing up for my
agreed upon visits and trying to get ex additional visits.
(06:01):
So two things that have come up more recently. For
the winter break, according to our mediated agreement, I'm supposed
to be with them or they're supposed to be with
me from December twenty sixth to the thirty first, and
so I reached out to him to see if I
could get some extra time with them because they'll be
out of school longer than that. So I reached out
to him about this about seven weeks ago. And then
I also reached out to him because I recently quit
(06:24):
flash retired from being a philosophy professor, so I'm taking
kind of a personal sabbatical now. But I was offered
a research fellowship in Germany from January until June. And
so my youngest, the twelve year old, wants to come
with me to Germany. So I reached out to him
about seven weeks ago to say, you know, I'd like
to extend the winter break time with the kids and
Kalia would like to come with me to Germany. You know,
(06:44):
can we schedule a conversation about that. So after repeatedly
reaching out to him into the mediator's office over several weeks,
I was just able to get him to agree to
the conversation about the winter break next week, and then
he pushed out the mediation session all the way to
December twentieth of this year, even though I'm heading to
Germany like January fifteenth. So it's just been challenging to
(07:07):
negotiate the kind of micromanaging what feels like petty control
and pushing out decisions to the last possible moment over
something that I would have hoped that we could just
have conversations about sooner rather than later.
Speaker 1 (07:19):
I just want to take a moment, Mama and just
acknowledge you, because so very often when the marriage or
the relationship between the parents break down, the mother kind
of claims possession of the children and would never would
(07:41):
never do you, hear me, I have seen it time
and time again, never allow her children and believe it
or not, particularly her son to go live with his father.
My goodness, Good for you, Good for.
Speaker 2 (07:56):
You, thank you. I appreciate. I mean, it was definitely
a challenging decision, but I feel like, you know, it's
important for them to have a healthy relationship with both parents.
They have influences from both parents, and you know, with
him not showing up for his visits when they were
with me. I'm like, well, if they're with him, he
like he may not be able to show up emotionally,
but like they're you know, they get an opportunity to
(08:18):
kind of experience him for his hand and decide what
that relationship is going to be with him, because I
constantly have stressed to them my relationship with my husband
is not the same as their relationship with their father,
and so I try to differentiate those things.
Speaker 1 (08:30):
Wow, wow, do you know how many people don't get that?
How many people don't get my relationship with my ex
is different than my children's relationship with their father. Two
different people all in the same body. One for you,
So you are like light years ahead of the game,
(08:52):
believe it or not.
Speaker 2 (08:54):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (08:56):
Let's talk about this micro managing. Think what your experience
of that has been? What is that?
Speaker 2 (09:04):
Well it has been you know, like I said specifically
with regard to trying to have conversations around the winter
break and trying to have conversations around the Germany trip,
like constantly avoiding and pushing that out instead of just
like sitting down and having that conversation, or like initially
the mediator said, well, you guys should probably have a
phone call check in at least once a month, like
(09:24):
at the beginning of the month. So we said we
would do that, but I'm constantly having to reach out
to him in order to set that out up. So
like the last conversation that we've actually had by phone
was like in August, because we haven't done these monthly
check ins. And then he is also remarried now, so
he wants to filter that through his wife as well,
(09:47):
and so so it's just it's interesting.
Speaker 1 (09:49):
You've got to know that that could impact his ability
or willingness to be in communication with you. Do you know, oh,
his new wife, do you know her?
Speaker 2 (10:02):
I don't know her personally, right, So they actually like
when he first started dating her, he told me that
he was, you know, dating somebody, and then and then
I found out through the kids that he was getting married,
and so I never even met her, like the during
the time that they were dating, during the time that
they were engaged, or even before they got married. The
first time I met her was actually I was I
(10:22):
wouldn't say by accident. Maybe it was serendissity. They were
in town to pick up the kids last summer when
the younger two kids were going to go with them
for the summer and we were going to the store
to pick something up for the youngest teacher, and she
happened to be in the store, and so they were like, oh,
this is you know, so and so and so. I
was like, oh, well, it's nice to finally actually meet
you in person. And she seemed really pleasant. We exchanged
(10:44):
numbers and she was saying, like, you know, Will I
tried to, you know, get him to introduce us, but
he kept avoiding it, and I didn't want to nag.
And she was like, you know, you probably don't believe me,
and I'm like, oh, I believe you right, Like I
have no reason not to believe you, know, your account
of those events. She So, she seemed really pleasant at
the time. And then the next time we had a
conversation was with We did a family counseling session with him,
(11:07):
his wife, and myself. We did one with the adults
first and then with the kids, and then there she
seems definitely like, you know, co signing his position, which
I understand, you know, they're married, they're doing the United
Front thing. But then when several issues were raised about
what the kids' experiences had been with them last summer.
Then there was more of like a defensiveness from both
(11:28):
of them around you know they're doing you know, they're
saying their way, which I get, But I was trying
to explain to them, like, this is a major transition.
This was ahead of them, the kids going with them
this year, and so I'm like, it's a major transition
for the kids. They've only ever lived with me, you know,
give them some grace, give them some patience. And there
seemed to be just not a lot of grades and
patients and consideration for how they could transition. It was
(11:49):
for the younger two kids to go from having lived
with me their whole life and being with their older
two siblings to going solo to live with them, away
from me and away from their siblings.
Speaker 1 (12:00):
Are the kids adjusting to that? Is that what they
want or is that what you two decide it should happen.
Speaker 2 (12:08):
So we decided to give it a try for a year.
So right now, the mediation is there with him for
this year, and then we will revisit the arrangement next summer.
At the end of this year, our son, I think
is satisfied with that arrangement as long as he can
continue to see me. Our youngest is not satisfied with
that arrangement. So again, the youngest would like to come
(12:30):
with me to Germany, but I need you know, he
would have to agree to that, because we already have
an agreement in place. But if not, then the youngest,
you know, would have to wait out this year and
then you know, we can make new a new agreement
next summer.
Speaker 1 (12:46):
Wow, So what do we do now? We'll talk about
that right after the spring. Welcome back to the r spot.
Let's pick up where we left done. Okay, is he
angry with you?
Speaker 2 (13:03):
Yes?
Speaker 1 (13:04):
Have you and him talked about it or brought that
to any level of resolution?
Speaker 2 (13:09):
There was a point at which we did, and then
there were more things. So, like I tried to be
really intentional, so because I'm the person who wanted the
divorce right, like, I had this moment of like just
intuitive insight of like I really and it wasn't about
him being a terrible person. It was just like I
do not want to be married anymore. It's time for
me to like get out of this relationship. And then
I found out at that time that he'd been having
(13:30):
an affair with the attack of he member in his apartment.
He'd been having an affair with a graduate student of his department.
Right like, all of this stuff came out, so ultimately
we separated. He I asked him to move out of
the house, and I think that's when the anger cap in,
right like that he had to move out. That he
then had to you know, be on his own financially
and do all the adult things that I had basically
(13:52):
been doing throughout the marriage. And then he said since then, like, oh, well,
you always get your way. Everything's always about your preference.
But I think there's anger and a feeling that I
have kind of dictated things and now he wants to
kind of reclaim a control.
Speaker 1 (14:06):
At this point, well, have you have you dictated things?
No heat, no judgment. Were you the maximizer in the relationship?
Did you get things hand or taken care of? Yeah,
kind of thing.
Speaker 2 (14:18):
Of course, maximize itself like better language than dictator. Right,
But so I would have said I dictated things, but
I would say yeah, in that sense, I was a MAXI.
So I've always been a person who I'm a high achiever.
I'm a planner, you know, I make a plan I
worked a plan.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
You know, there's an old saying that all children leave
home angry. It's easier for them to leave home angry
and be upset with their parents and go out on
their own and do their thing and be mad with
their parents than it is for them to come to
agreement and say, you know, it's time, I'm going to go.
When you have a situation where the woman was the
(14:56):
maximizer or the let's say the director, I don't want
to say the controller or the manager. I'll say the director.
When that relationship breaks down, very often the male partner
is it treats the his ex as though she were
his mother, and he has to be mad at her
(15:21):
to go out and get away. He doesn't look at
the fact that he didn't pick up his socks, he
didn't put the food away, he peed on the toilet seat.
You know, because I really see here, just as you
so wisely assessed, that he's angry and he's gonna now control.
It's directed at you, But the children are caught up
(15:44):
in the middle.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
That's my concern, is a kid because for me, as
an adult who already you know, experienced seventeen years of
marriage with him and you know, against six years happily unmarried,
delightfully divorced. Like I know how to I can negotiate
that adult to adult. I think it's harder for the
kids to negotiate with their dad and feel caught up
in it.
Speaker 1 (16:02):
So I'm just wondering here if there is an opportunity
for you to do this woman to woman, to kind
of snuggle up to your sister woman, his wife, to
see if you and her can come to come to
an agreement, to involve her, you know, so that she
(16:26):
knows because she's probably getting it all from his side
at the table, if you and her are not communicating,
if you and her are not speaking, I'm just wondering
if you can do this woman to woman, not to
override him, not to bypass him, but to just let
her know first of all, that you appreciate her, that
(16:47):
she's there, that she's providing care. I'm just wondering if
you and her can build a bond that will support
you in getting him to move a little quicker, because
it sounds like he's just acting out, rebelling. He's mad
at you, he's mad at the director, the mommy. He's
gonna have you ever considered that, do you think that's
(17:10):
a possibility.
Speaker 2 (17:11):
I did consider it, and I was hopeful that that
would be a possibility until we sat down most recently
with the three of us, where she kind of was
definitely taking on his line of it, you know what
I mean. And so, you know, initially I thought, okay, well,
maybe I can communicate more directly with her with regard
to the kids. But then she got into a place
of defensiveness around like, well, these kids need to, you know,
(17:33):
respect me, and I'm not going to be disrespected, and like,
so she's caught up in her own stuff with regard
to her relationship to him and her relationship with the kids.
Speaker 1 (17:41):
You know, do you play chess?
Speaker 2 (17:44):
No, my son, my kids do, but I don't. But yeah,
being strategic, right, you know.
Speaker 1 (17:50):
And so it may be a woman to woman phone
call where you say listen. I can only imagine, as
the stepmom or the blended mom into this family, that
the kids are going to have a little rebellion against you.
I understand that, and I want you to know that
I'm not supporting it. I'm not supporting it. They're in
(18:13):
your home. I want you to sup them to respect you.
I want you to know I heard what you said,
and I also want to know how I can do that?
What do? What would you ask of me? And what
I would ask of you is if you and I
can you know, communicate because it seems that Booboo whatever
(18:34):
his name is, is a little slow on responding to
some things that I want to be able to plan for.
And I don't want to be disrespectful. I don't want
to overstep. You know, you get a strategy where you
and her can line up as women, you know, because
I'm telling you, he's just rebelling against you. He's angry
(18:57):
and he's rebelling. And she's the stepmoms, so you know,
she's bringing kids into her house. I don't know if
she has children. She probably wants your children to act
the way her children do, but she's not their birth
mother and they're in relationship with you. It's hard. It's
hard for the little pooka new news. The little pooka
(19:17):
new news. You know, they probably feel they're being disloyal
to you even liking her, And that twelve year old
at that age is a challenged to like her because
she's gonna feel disloyal to you because she's different and
(19:38):
b she's twelve. You know, she's in a really a critical,
critical place. But I still think it would be worthwhile
for you to just attempt, I don't know, if you know,
how to get in touch with her, attempt to create
this union between her. Now, we got to move a
(19:58):
little quickly because you got this thing coming up for Germany.
It sounds to me, you know, and of course I
don't know all of the intricate details, but it sounds
to me like you you know, you're approaching this from
a very mature perspective, which is why I say, try
(20:19):
to create an alliance, so that when he doesn't respond,
you could say, have you and Boo boo talked about this?
You know, not meddling, just want to know, you know,
so I can make the right choices here. I think
that's your that's the way to go. Okay, woman to
woman and she's gonna go with you to Germany.
Speaker 2 (20:41):
Oh, thank you so much.
Speaker 1 (20:42):
I'm going to decree that for you. Because she's had
a critical time. This is critical, critical, critical, and if
you got to whip out some psychological documentation, put that
on the mediation table. Don't be afraid to do that,
you know, like I said at twelve thirteen, identity versus
(21:04):
identity confusion. She's looking at who am I following? Who
am I modeling my womanness after? And if she doesn't
like her stepmother, or if they're not getting along and
she doesn't have access to you because you're in Germany,
that is going to be a problem. And here's another thing, Mama,
(21:27):
I want you to hear me. Okay, First of all,
I want you to know you haven't done anything wrong,
but I also sense you doing all of this from
your head. I want you to drop down into your heart.
You are a planner, and you are in many ways strategic,
(21:47):
and you are an achiever, but you're doing it from
best thought and I want you to drop down and
start doing this with a mother's heart. Take a breath
from me, take a breath for me, and in your heart,
(22:11):
I want you to see your baby girl with you.
I want you to see yourself over in Germany together.
I want you to see you, know yourself, laughing, playing
with her, just being with her. Not from your head
because you want her to go, but from your heart
(22:33):
because you're a mama bear and your cub needs you
right now. Yeah, just see that and feel that. Get
that into your body, take him out of it. He
doesn't have anything to do with this. This is you
a mama bear protecting her cub. You can't do that
from your head and what needs to be done in
(22:54):
this meeting and that meeting, in the schedule and body
plane tickets, and you can't do it like that. Yeah,
I want you a little more in your heart. Does
that make sense to you?
Speaker 3 (23:05):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (23:05):
It does. I definitely and very cerebral. So even though
on the cancer sunshine, so I'm in my feelings all
the time that I hear you saying, move from the
space of the heart and out the head.
Speaker 1 (23:16):
Yeah. So before you and your baby girl leaf for Germany,
just shoot me an email at a yamladiyama dot com
just say thank you. I'm on my way.
Speaker 3 (23:27):
Oh my goodness, I definitely will.
Speaker 2 (23:30):
Thank you so much for that encouragement and affirmation.
Speaker 3 (23:32):
I receive it.
Speaker 1 (23:34):
Okay, all right, my love, thank you for calling.
Speaker 2 (23:36):
Thank you for having me.
Speaker 1 (23:41):
Sometimes as mothers, we get so caught up in what
needs to be done and the best way to do it,
at what's going on and what they're doing and what
we're not doing, that we move into a very cerebral place,
and we start dealing from our head. We also deal
(24:02):
from our past experiences. Very often when we're co parenting,
we have to do it from the heart space, creating oneness,
creating unity, being compassionate, empathetic, not sympathetic, not pushing to
(24:25):
get our way, but trying to get on the same
side of the table as the other parent, considering their perspective,
not getting caught up in it, not judging it, not
excusing it, but just see it from their perspective, and
then get clear about what it is that it's best
(24:48):
for the child from a mother's heart, not a mother's head,
because in the head are all the experiences that we
had with a partner or ex partner as a partner,
and now that that union is no longer operating, we
(25:09):
got to create a new normal. Get out of your head, mothers,
get into your heart and deal with your ex from
your heart space, filled with compassion, empathy, and being clear
about what it is you desire for the child. Be
(25:31):
willing to compromise and yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I know.
Sometimes the other party is not willing to do that
and they'll put their foot down. Stay in your heart,
stay in your heart. Make your request clear for the
good of the child, not in opposition or againstness to
(25:55):
the other parent. And if you're a mom and the
ex has another woman in his life, consider how you
and her can become sister women an alliance for the
good of the child. Now, I know that doesn't work
all the time, but at least it's a possibility. Stay tuned,
(26:19):
we'll be right back. Greetings, and welcome to the R Spot.
We are talking today about co parenting when your husband
or your used to be wife is involved and you
(26:40):
are in breakdown and you are trying to raise children.
So what is the dilemma that you're bringing to the
table today.
Speaker 3 (26:47):
The dilemma that I'm bringing to the table today is
the fact that my youngest friend's father is what I
like to call a convenience store dad, if that makes sense. Yeah, yeah,
And so you know, he likes to be a dad
when it's convenient for him. Just recently this past holiday
(27:09):
per se, his mom got involved, and she's been involved
from the beginning, but it's just splitting the times between
two families, and she wanted the entire time to be
with her and the rest of their family, Whereas here
I am like, hey, well, look he has two families,
not just one. Your family ain't the only family here,
(27:31):
and it cost a huge ripple and the tide, so
to speak, because you want to send time with your
friend when you had ample opportunity prior to just this
great Thanksgiving to do so. And I feel like she
feels like I'm using my son as a pawn or
wedge between the two families to say, well, you know,
(27:52):
for Christmas, you can't see him, see him, and that's
not the case. My day is the time outside of
the holidays you don't do nothing with. So now you
want me to be, you know, make the sacrifice and
be convenient and try my hardest to you know, please
you and y'all during the holiday season when it's still
(28:13):
three hundred and sixty two days of a year where
y'all could see him and you don't. So that's where
my co parentee issues come here at holidays.
Speaker 1 (28:25):
How old is your son, mam?
Speaker 3 (28:26):
He is four, and he is a very observant, vocal,
energetic for your old little boy.
Speaker 1 (28:34):
So he really doesn't give two diadley snits about Thanksgiving.
He really don't.
Speaker 3 (28:42):
No, he doesn't.
Speaker 1 (28:43):
What is the arrangement that you now. What is the
arrangement that you now? What's the arrangement?
Speaker 3 (28:49):
Well, the way that the arrangement started once his father
found out that he was a father prior of like
the last two years.
Speaker 1 (28:57):
Wait a minute, hold up, hold up, hold up, hold up,
you just trying to zip past that. What does that mean?
Once the father found out he was a father, What
does that mean?
Speaker 3 (29:08):
Well, I didn't know that I was pregnant until I
had my kids, and I had my I had my
youngest son in the middle of my parents' living room
on March the first of twenty nineteen.
Speaker 1 (29:23):
Oh my goodness. Yeah, how you didn't know you was pregnant?
What happened?
Speaker 3 (29:28):
To be honest his eldest brother, I found out two
weeks prior before having him that I was pregnant. So
it's just, I would say, just the distant stresses of
life and just you know, just going with emotions of
things and not really listening and honing into my body.
(29:49):
I was just going with the flow. I know, I know,
I know, So.
Speaker 1 (29:57):
You know what, that would be a whole show in
and of itself. I'm going to just stay with the fact.
Here's the question. What was the nature of your relationship
with your four year old son's father? What was the
nature of that relationship?
Speaker 3 (30:12):
Honestly, it was just a you scratch my echtch each
type of deal. And we should never you know, when
we could just see each other and passing. But now
that itch scratching committed for how long?
Speaker 1 (30:28):
For how long? For how for? How long did you
do that?
Speaker 3 (30:32):
I should honestly say it was one time. It was
supposed to be a one and done type of deal,
and then thee don turned into a whole lifetime commitment.
Speaker 1 (30:41):
Okay, so you do not have a relationship with him, correct,
So his convenience store, he's still scratching an itch, and
since you know that it ain't really there, he hasn't.
It doesn't seem to me that he's yet translated the
distinction or made the distinction between scratching your itch and
(31:06):
fathering his son. Because he didn't have a choice, he
wasn't involved, he didn't participate. So he's just transferred his
relationship with you onto his relationship with his son.
Speaker 3 (31:21):
Yeah, and I'm taken.
Speaker 1 (31:23):
Does that make sense to John?
Speaker 3 (31:24):
I'm taking your full responsibility of my actions, and you know,
the things that have happened, But I'm like, Okay, at
the other day, we still have an all kid that
we have to raise together, but separate.
Speaker 1 (31:37):
You know, you do have a child that you want
to raise. What is the conversation between you and his
father regarding his participation in raising his son? What has
your conversation been with him?
Speaker 3 (31:53):
There? Hass like talking to a brick wall.
Speaker 1 (31:56):
Okay, well I would I would.
Speaker 3 (31:59):
You know, open up the line of communication. You know,
what's abod? I try to call him so we can
have conversations. I hay, when's you know, when's the time
for you to see him? What is your weekend looking like?
And get I get no response. His mother is more
evolved than he is.
Speaker 1 (32:22):
So then I say, line up, woman to woman with
his mother, line up. How old is this gentleman?
Speaker 3 (32:29):
He's thirty five.
Speaker 1 (32:32):
Does he have other children?
Speaker 2 (32:34):
No?
Speaker 3 (32:34):
As as well as far as I know, my friend
is his fus.
Speaker 2 (32:40):
And his only so.
Speaker 1 (32:43):
But here, mom, I want you to hear me. I'm
not I don't have no heat, no judgment on this,
but I really want you to hear me. I want
you to take this in. That's not his son, that's
the scratching of an itch. That's a scratching of an itch.
(33:04):
That's not his son. He's not there, gotcha. So if
your intention is to be sure that your son has
access to is involved with his father's side of the family,
then your doorway, your ticket to that is his grandmother. Okay,
(33:27):
and perhaps she is the one you know. And I'm
really torn in that because it's hard for me to
say that knowing he may be around his father and
his father just sees him as an itch or not
as a you know, a responsibility. But the other thing
I'm gonna encourage you to do, and I don't know
how you don't have any agreement with this man in
(33:50):
terms of cope parenting. I don't know what kind of
request that you've made, because when are you going to
spend time with him? Is not a request, that's an inquiry,
that's a question. Got to You've got to make it clear.
I want to know or my request is that you
have care of your son, of our son at least
(34:13):
one weekend a month, and when he's with your mom,
that's between me and your mom. You've got to set
up a relationship with her that's separate and apart from
the relationship you have with the father because she sees
this as her grandson. He sees this as an itch.
Speaker 3 (34:29):
Yes, and he's kind of mention.
Speaker 1 (34:31):
Of the nature of your I.
Speaker 3 (34:34):
Would saying, well, he's currently as of recently, we have
started the family court process her his request for visitational purposes,
So we're going to see.
Speaker 1 (34:46):
How oh good he requested it.
Speaker 3 (34:48):
Yeah, he did. And to be honest, I guess for
me it was a thing. I'm like, okay, but you're
asking for visitation when all you have to do is
your feakle to fault and say, hey man.
Speaker 1 (35:02):
Your business manya business manya business. If that's how he
wants to do it, it may be a fear that
you're gonna ask him too much or again he he
don't know you. You you had a role in the
hay with this guy. True, So he's trying to protect hisself.
He's trying to protect hisself because in his mile, she's
(35:22):
gonna come after me. She's gonna come after me for money.
She's gonna do this, that and the other thing. But
when you get into court, you can definitely ask for money. Yeah,
that is separate and apart from your relationship with his mom. Yes, ma'am,
this is her grandson. She sees him as her grandson
(35:43):
and she wants to be in relationship with her him.
So you have to set that up with her, whether
he is involved or not. Get into alignment and agreement
with grandma. Grandma. If you're in alignment with her, she'll
make it happen.
Speaker 3 (36:04):
Yes, ma'am. Does that make sense?
Speaker 1 (36:08):
So you know when I was co parenting my granddaughter
with her father, and he was just a wonderful child
of God, cleverly disguised as an idiot. I had to
really make agreements and request and it wasn't always what
(36:30):
I wanted. So we agreed one Thanksgiving he's with you,
and that year she's with me for Christmas. One the
next year she's with me for Thanksgiving, she's with you
for Christmas. And even if you set it up, they
have him Christmas Day and you get him the day
after Christmas. Kids don't they don't care, They don't you know,
(36:51):
he don't know. He's four, He don't know what day
Christmas is in his mind. He could have a Christmas,
two Christmases, two thanks Giving and someone you're gonna have
to relinquish your attachment to. I got to have him
for major house. One Mother's Day, he's with her, One
Mother's Day he's with you. Father's Day he can have him,
(37:14):
you know, a groundhog's day. All of those things, right,
But get into alignment with Grandma. Get into alignment with her,
and it may mean that you have to I don't
know what better words. I'll say sacrifice, sacrifice until he's
old enough to say I don't want to go, or
(37:36):
I want to stay with you, which you'll probably be
around ten or eleven. Yes, line up with Line up
with grandma, and deal with daddy, who has absolutely no
connection to this child at all, unfortunately because you was
giving up the goodies.
Speaker 3 (37:54):
Yeah, I can't. Yes, where am I wan? Yes, William,
thank you so much. I appreciate.
Speaker 1 (38:03):
Okay, line up with grandma.
Speaker 2 (38:04):
Okay, I'm a line up with grandma.
Speaker 1 (38:06):
All right. Thank you for love it, thank you for calling,
and good luck to you. Thank you alrighty. So many
co parents do not understand that the nature of their
relationship together impacts the nature of the way the children
(38:28):
are parenting. If you had a you know one and
done fly by go by night, you can't come in
the back door now expecting the other parent to be
you know, all in, heads in, feet in because they
weren't involved to that degree. And it's not to beat
ourselves up, it's not to make ourselves feel bad. But
(38:52):
if you have a child with someone and their intention
was not to have a child, then maybe some things
that you have to give up. You can't force somebody.
You cannot force somebody to step into their responsibility. You
would hope that they would, but if they didn't have
(39:12):
a vote and a choice upfront, if you ended up
pregnant or just got pregnant and that wasn't the plan,
you know, the fact that the other party doesn't want
to be a parent, doesn't live up to their responsibilities,
that ain't your business. They're gonna have to answer to
God for that, not you. Your business is how do you
(39:36):
communicate that to the child. But insisting that someone step
into their parenthood when they're resistant to doing that, fighting
with them is not it's not It's not gonna turn
out well for you. Okay, So we've got to be
mindful when we are co parenting to understand the name
(40:00):
nature of the relationship that produced the child. You got
to take that into consideration and don't assume that just
because you add the child or are having the child
that the other person is happy about. Okay, Now, if
this is a planned child, if you were in a
(40:20):
committed relationship and the child is born, then you may
have a little bit to work with. But you still
have to look at the nature of the relationship and
the nature of the person you were in relationship with.
If they are irresponsible in their relationship, negligent in their relationship, dishonest,
(40:41):
out of integrity, lacking ownership, accountability in their relationship with
another adult, what in the blazon of Jesus thinks that
they are going to be responsible, integrists and accountable to
a child? Okay, So some of the demands and the
requires and a quest that you may be making are
(41:03):
going to fall on deaf ears, and yes, the child
or the children become collateral damage. What you want to
figure out is how best to deal with the situation
you are in for the good of the child and
maintain the peace in the process. I hope that you
(41:23):
know something now that you didn't know when you tuned in,
And until we meet again, stay in peace and not pieces.
The R Spot is a production of shondaland Audio in
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(41:46):
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