August 5, 2025 • 51 mins
Rennae sits down with one half of the Giggly Squad, former D1 tennis player, comedian and cat trafficker Hannah Berner to talk about everything from Netflix specials to Coco Gauff’s (relatable) serve woes and off-court serves. Bonus appearance from Boots the cat.t
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Speaker 1 (00:14):
I'm fastering a cat and your boots. She's beautiful, perfect,
also obsessed with podcast strings. So if everything goes black,
it's because of boots.
Speaker 2 (00:25):
I think I have a feeling that there's some some
somehow you might be keeping that cat.
Speaker 1 (00:32):
I'm getting my producer to keep her so she stays
in the family.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
Oh, I love this. I love this for all what
I do, that's what I do.
Speaker 1 (00:39):
So I'm a cat trafficker. I'm a rescue cat trafficker.
That's what I do this summer because I have nothing
else to do.
Speaker 2 (00:45):
Well, Hannah, first of all, you know, welcome to the
Renee Substowns podcast. I finally, finally, it's only taken like
I don't know since I've known you, which is like
three and a half years or something.
Speaker 1 (00:57):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
But but before we get going, people are probably like,
who the fuck who's Hannah Berner talking to you on
a tennis podcast? So let me just let people know,
all right, first of all, with some respect on my name,
I'm going to put some respect on your names, like
why am I listening to this person?
Speaker 1 (01:16):
But where's Couco Gough?
Speaker 2 (01:18):
Before we get to your tennis accolades? Okay, I just
need to let everybody know you're not only killing it.
You're killing it, Hannah, You're killing it. You had a
Netflix special called We Ride It, look At Me, Looking
at Looking at All Your shit on Uh, You've got
to killer podcast that everybody should listen to if they
(01:41):
don't know you. They've been living under a rock with
Giggly Squad with Paige Desorbo. You were just on Jimmy
Fallon Okay together the two of you. You have another podcast,
I'm still going. You've got another podcast with your husband
Dez called Bernafone, which also is hilarious because he's also cute.
(02:01):
I mean, both of them have one hundred million downloads.
You had a sold out Giggly Squad tour with page
Like just a couple of months ago, which was unbelievable,
and you had a number two. I'm a little disappointed
that you didn't get from one because number two New
York Times bestseller with how to Giggle, a guide of
(02:22):
taking life less seriously and if anyone knows you, that
is like apropos if I've ever heard it. Of course,
Hanne on the Street YouTube that shit. It's over three
hundred million views. It's insane. The thing that I love
about you, Hannah is that on your bio page, on
your actual page, it says lives in Brooklyn with cats,
but not with your husband with your cat.
Speaker 1 (02:45):
I was like, I don't live in Brooklyn anymore.
Speaker 2 (02:47):
I know. It's classic.
Speaker 1 (02:49):
My mom was like, hey, you should say you're with
your husband, and I was like, we're decentering, man, that's
not important. No one cares. That's the least interesting about
me that I've lived with my husband. Obviously I live
with my husband.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
It's more about living with your cat. Okay, that's what
That's what I died. Second of all, I think that's
the most proud person that you're on this podcast is
not only me, but of course your dad Dan.
Speaker 1 (03:10):
Okay, let shout out to Dan. Shout out to Dan,
who's definitely listening, my tennis coach, my father, and the
muddy waters in between. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
Now, now for those of you that are going, okay, great,
she's a comedian and she's funny. Why the fuck is
she on this podcast? Well, you were a d One
Hannas player at the University of Wisconsin, Wisconsin. What is
that a badger? Are you a badger? Cool?
Speaker 1 (03:33):
Beagers?
Speaker 2 (03:34):
Yeah? There you go Go Badgers. And not only I
looked it up, Hannah, you were the team MVP in
twenty thirteen. You're all academic, hey, way to go.
Speaker 1 (03:43):
You actually school.
Speaker 2 (03:45):
It's a very rare thing for a college athlete. And
you played number one. You were just some like you know,
walk on at number six or seven.
Speaker 1 (03:54):
You would one.
Speaker 2 (03:56):
And to top this off, now I'm going to be finished,
you were number one in girls in high school. Okay,
and you played on the boys high school team as well,
and you were undefeated in doubles. Is that right?
Speaker 1 (04:08):
Yes? Yes, wait, this is amazing. I've never had a
real journalist cover me. This is amazing you who keep
going the whole part well.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
The fact that you get a real journalists is even
hilarious to me. But the thing that I'm most proud
about for you, Hannah, in all of that is that
you got the Sportsmanship Award in two thousand and five.
Speaker 1 (04:27):
And that's probably because I won a tournament and I
was in a good mood. Let's be honest. The people
who never get the Sportsenship award, they're breaking the rackets.
Speaker 2 (04:36):
So you know, I watch a lot of tennis, obviously,
but I think you watch more tennis than anybody I know.
It's like psychotic. You're lying with your cats that you
house and you're watching tennis more than anyone I know.
It's the photo of you on Instagram is either your feet,
your cat and tennis in the background. So that's why everyone,
(04:57):
Hannah fucking Burner, it's on my pod cast talking tennis.
Speaker 1 (05:01):
Oh my god. I'm so honored to be here as
just like a huge Rene Stubs fan. But also all
I do is watch the tennis channel ESPN, and all
I wait for is to hear your little Aussie voice
in the background so that I could text you during
the match to be like I totally agree about her backhand,
or like what's the strategy here, what's going on? And
I feel like I'm in the Illuminati because I can
(05:23):
like text the journalist while she's watching the match. So anyway,
You've brought so much joy to me in this like
tennis comeback of my life ten years post college, not
to age myself, and all I want to do is
talk tennis with you. But also I give so much
credit to tennis for where I am now in my career.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
Yeah, I mean, I think that's what people need to
sort of know. I mean you're not like an overnight sensation, right,
You've had to work your ass off to get to
where you're at. I mean you're in your early thirties,
like you know, having having I think you're having a
sports background for any especially especially women, I think is
so important for people because you learn wins and losses,
how do you get better? How do you improve? And
(06:03):
the only way for you to be successful is to
work your ass off and that's what you've done. Like
in your entertainment career now is like transform into this
unbelievably well known comedian now, and tennis is so much
about wins and losses.
Speaker 1 (06:17):
And also with tennis, it's so similar to stand up comedy.
And I know it sounds random, but it's true. It's
you out there alone, battling your demons, performing in front
of people. And then it's also a boys club. Like
stand up comedy, you go into a club and you're
just making jokes in front of guys. And there's a
lot of really funny women that walk into a club
(06:38):
with a bunch of drunk dudes at eleven PM in
the Bronx and they're like, maybe this isn't for me.
So I think my tennis experience of obviously training with
a lot of guys playing on the boys team, I
walked into the stand up and I'm like, we're just
making like pussy jokes. I could do this, Yeah, Like
I could do this. So tennis also helps with my
self esteem so much to know that I could over adversity,
(07:00):
because let's be honest, tennis is just about overcoming adversity
every point your mindset, battling yourself. So to this day,
I think tennis is the most difficult thing I've ever done,
and that's why I think stand Up I approached it
with like a very fun creative mentality because I'm like,
nothing's as hard as second serve against Duke three, y'all,
(07:21):
and I'm the final match and I'm gonna hold like
a cheap beach chair.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
It's funny because if I've spoken about this. De Lisa
Raymond right, who played college tennis for a couple of
years as well and had such an amazing tennis career,
we would play. We played this one tournament in Madrid
where like literally people were screaming at us to like
one time, one guy told me go home, and I'm like,
go home, I'm like playing a tennis tournament. I'm like,
this is my job, you know. I mean he said
(07:48):
it with a Spanish accent, right, He's like, go on,
you know. And I remember Lisa was never flustered by anybody, right,
he was never flustered by the crowd or people saying
shit or you know, players be in douchebags down the
other end. And she would say to me, Renee, I
played a Texas Like, you have no idea, right, She's like,
(08:08):
college hands thrown at me.
Speaker 1 (08:10):
College tennis is unruly, but there's a there's a fun
to it because I would get into it. I'm a
New Yorker, I'm loud. My problem was I would be like,
I'd get focused on a match next to me because
you've become like your friends cheerleader. So your teammate like
wins a point and she yells, come on, you yell
come on. Everyone's yelling come on. It was this incredible energy.
(08:31):
But it also for the first time I had like
other people's results and pressure on my back too, like
when I lost, everyone lost, So it was it was
definitely unique thing that I never had to deal with before.
Speaker 2 (08:44):
Yeah, it's not nice to be at the end of
the day and be like loser, and for us waiting.
Speaker 1 (08:49):
I'd be like, hey, guys, sorry my bad, I lost
my singles and sorry I brought nothing to the day.
I brought nothing at one job.
Speaker 2 (08:57):
Well, it's interesting because like, okay, so let's transition a
little bit into like all the players that you watch
and all the matches that you watch and stuff, and
I want your take then on because a lot of
people get shit. Let's talk about two players that came
out of college centers that we had that sort of
ra ra mentality and they kind of get a bit
of shit for it. Let's talk about daniel Collins, right,
she has that like you know that shit, and she
(09:19):
did four years of college, came out, kind of started
a bit slow, has had a tremendous career since their
top ten finals of a Slam, retired twice. Is she
ever going to go away? I mean, look, she announced
her retirement at least Venus didn't. And she just came
back for the medical insurance, which, by the way, is
(09:40):
a true story. I just want everybody to know we
actually talked about that. Just hilarious. But on Danielle like her,
like rah rah, that's sort of the mentality in college
and that's why it's hard to like let it go
when you go pro. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (09:52):
First of all, A huge fan of d Animal. I'm
obsessed with her University of Virginia. I had friends who
played with her. Shout out Julia Barba. The thing is
when you're playing college tennis, I was so vocal after
every point because if I yell come on, it would
rev my team to know, like, oh, we're getting momentum,
Like you can change momentum of your friends match. It's
(10:13):
also professional is so much more like robotic, and you're
just like calm and you don't react. And I think
I like that she's brought personality. Also, it is a
case of like men and women, like she does things
that people be like, oh she is she being kind
of a bitch right now, where I think that like
(10:35):
some other men might just.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
Be being tough. Yeah, oh look at that. Lea are into it.
Although Ben Shelton a lot and.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
Shelton gets a lot of hate. Well did you see
his drama recently with the Italian which actually, as of
half Italian person, was the funniest thing ever. This Italian
person trying to explain what they were feeling and the
hand movements and the words were just not coming together.
And I was like, we don't have all days, let's go,
let's go.
Speaker 2 (11:01):
He said the same thing like five times, and Ben
kept saying, so it's it is with me, and he's like, no,
with you. And I don't know if you saw my Twitter.
I put out a little Twitter thing about it because
I knew what was going on. I couldn't believe the
freaking commentators didn't see it. Now we've all done this
right where your opponent hits a shot and you're like,
that was so out of their ass, and he's tired.
(11:23):
It's like three hours and and you know, Ben hits
this inside out forehand. He got one love in the
tiebreak in the third set, and if you watch his reaction,
he's like, come on, and then he looks down the
other end and he sees his friends curse they're friends, yes,
gesture like he closed his eyes and hit it right,
And so Ben was like, what the fuck, dude, Like
what And so if you look at at two love, okay,
(11:47):
now it's too love in the tiebreak and Ben hits
a screaming forehand and he looked down the other ends like,
oh was that into? It was that out? You know,
So it's kind of like this back and forth. We've
all done it, We've all done this. There was so
out of your ass meybes.
Speaker 1 (12:02):
And also, let's be honest, Ben Shelton's push every shot
he hits is insane, Like it's not like he that's
the first crazy winner he hit all match, Like he
hit serves that bounce into the crowd. I think it's
two guys who like care about each other. But it's
so funny men's tennis and women's tennis. The men care
about each other being cool with each other. Girls have
(12:24):
never cared about being cool with each other, Like, I
look at what you think about me. I just hope
the press isn't like turning on me kind of thing.
But I think the men the girls can learn from
the men in a way where it's like they'll have
a battle and then they'll get a beer. Where the girls,
you know, will have a battle and be like, I'll
never make eye contact with you in the locker room again.
Speaker 2 (12:43):
So yeah, I mean it's interesting how the personalities do
sort of like I mean, women to just they just
take it so much more personally.
Speaker 1 (12:52):
Yes, which I do. What I love about Danielle is
she is kind of just like this is me. I'll
yell at someone in the crowd. She's consistent and I
appreciate that from her. She doesn't treat different people differently.
She's one tone she.
Speaker 2 (13:08):
And it's funny because Danielle also kind of lets it
go but kind of always remembers. She's like, you know,
an elephant that way. She's like, I always remember, but
you know, I don't know. I mean when you understand
her and you're gonna get her personality. And she's a
great person off the court, like she does a lot
of charity work and she's all but on the court.
I love when she tries to keep her shit together.
Speaker 1 (13:29):
Yeah, like you could tell that she so badly wants
to break her racket or say something. I also, I
find it some players instead of taking it out on
the crowd or the other opponent, they take it out
on their team. So it's so interesting. Everyone lets out
this insane stress and pressure they're dealing with, but they
put it in different places. I've definitely I've definitely yelled
(13:50):
at my coach. I've definitely yelled at myself once I
remember I was like sitting on the bench just talking
loud about the girl next to me, like you would
become a different Like when would I ever do that
in my life? But I was saying, like this, girls,
she's cheated last point, she cheated this point, like you,
I don't know who that person is I've become. So
I guess I watched these tennis players with such pressure
(14:13):
and I'm like, I would have been thrown out four
times already in this match for breaking my racket. So
I'm just impressed that they pull themselves together with such class.
Have you ever seen a doubles match in just like
your local tennis courts? Yeah, people are crazy.
Speaker 2 (14:28):
I told the story. I think I told the story
on my podcast one time where I was walking behind
a lady's midwek doubles match and it had the screens
up as well, but you could sort of see someone
walking behind and i'mking, I just hit three hours in
practice with my coach. Were walking behind the court and
these four midweek ladies that were maybe two point five
maybe three stopped and waited for us to get past
(14:52):
the court, and I was like, no, that did not
just happen. So yeah, there's seriousness. So from then on
and every time we walk by a court, we walked
as slow as we could. The ladies trust me, I
get it. I do.
Speaker 1 (15:07):
I do have to say that going back on like
the men versus women stuff, I do think that there
is a lot of villains of the men's game too
that people like to turn on, whether it's meditative Djokovic, Shelton,
Cissy Pass, curios. But I do think with the girls
they're breaking the rackets, people get more upset about were
When a man breaks it, it's like kind of hot.
(15:29):
When a man breaks it, you're like, Okay, I didn't
know you had that in you. Where when a girl
does it, you're like, okay, we need to go to therapy.
Speaker 2 (15:35):
Yeah, you're a little aggressive, A little aggressive. That's dangerous.
Speaker 1 (15:41):
And especially with these girls, they have a lot of
sponsorships writing on them. Like I think about Coco, like,
you know, after a double fault, she wants to take
her racket and throw it out of the stadium, but
she has to hold it together, and like it's it's
really impressive. It's really impressive.
Speaker 2 (15:56):
One thing I'm gonna get to Coco, would you. But
one of the things that I also wanted to talk
about is thinking of breaking rackets or whatever. I saw
Medvedev lose his motherfucking mind last week in Washington. He lost.
I think it's probably one of the greatest match points
I've ever watched as far as how unbelievable every shot
(16:16):
was okay when he lost to Devidkina. And I can
never say that guy's name anyway.
Speaker 1 (16:26):
A lot of culture, it's different cultures, such a.
Speaker 2 (16:29):
Mental luck with his name. He's such a great guy.
But he lost his mind in this match. Oh no,
it wasn't to him. It was to uh mute, who's
also nuts. He threw his racket to his his seat
after the match, like but from the middle of the
cord hander, I was like, no, don't do don't do
it into the crowd like he would be suspended for
(16:50):
like you.
Speaker 1 (16:50):
Could guillotine somebody.
Speaker 2 (16:52):
Seriously, he could tell you. It was like I got
to keep it low, mad process. But the smashed every
water bottle. I can'st it was it was it was.
Speaker 1 (17:04):
But this is the thing. I like, I'm surprised they
don't do it more often because of the pressure and
the money involved and everything. But Medvedev also is the
hardcore king and he just hasn't been able to do
it recently, so I can't imagine how frustrating that is.
Speaker 2 (17:20):
But what he said last week this week, yeah, he
left his rackets on the court and walked off. I
that he was probably like, if I go over there,
I'm gonna break every one of my rackets again. I'm
gonna break the water bottles again, I'm gonna embarrass myself again.
So I'm just exit stage.
Speaker 1 (17:42):
And that's called self control, not to Actually, Koboli was
really cute. He when he walked off, he just gave
his racket to talk it away. Who was who was
cheering for? That's so cute. I have to say not
to get to my own inner turmoil, but my dad
was always very strict about sportsmanship, never throwing your racket,
and during junior tenant, I was so well behaved. And
(18:02):
there was something about me in college where you get
very burned out and you get your schedule and you
see every single day of the year where you have
to be what you have to do one day off,
which is Mondays where you have classes and stuff starts
to heat up, and there was something about being away
from my parents, like living my rebellious stage. I got
a racket that these new rackets, and they kind of
(18:24):
were like the bottom was like breaking, kind of like
there's something wrong with this racket. And I was getting
really frustrated because the grip at the bottom was like
kind of off, and I lose a tie break and
I took the racket. I said, this racket's broken. I
threw it in the trash and my coach comes over
and defaults me no, and my parents had traveled from
(18:46):
New York to Wisconsin, and like it was just craziness,
like debauchery. And then yeah, I love a good cracked racket,
but I would do it in the locker room normally.
Once I broke, Honestly, I swear I am not an
angry person. Once I split sets with someone in Dartmouth
(19:10):
and I went into the bathroom and I slammed the
bathroom stall and it broke broke, and I look over
and my teammates just sitting in the locker room and
I'm like, I'm so sorry, I didn't know you were there,
and she's like, it's okay, I get it, And I'm like,
I have no idea how I lost that last set.
But sometimes a little mental breakdown in the bathroom. Normally
it's me just crying, looking in the mirror. Come back
whin the next set, and that's and that's life. That's
(19:33):
just got to take the hit and go next thing?
Speaker 2 (19:36):
Is she on Tegway, like Luis said, off the court,
have a chat with herself back on the court. Although
I don't really love that, I'm kind of over these players.
You know how many times I went to the bathroom
I played twenty two years on professional on the phone, Yeah, twice.
One time because I had my period at Wimbledon, so
as you can imagine, had to go off the court
and twatt. The second time was in the warm up
(19:58):
of the US Open and I looked at Lisa Raymond
and I said, I got to go to the toilet. Yeah,
do you know what? And I'm back and I ran
back on the court. She's like, was it okay? And
I was like, thank god I went to the toilet
because if I had just tried to fart, it would
have been disasting.
Speaker 1 (20:13):
You'd never be invited back to wimblede is nice?
Speaker 2 (20:16):
Okay? I do think girls to go off the court.
It drives me crazy.
Speaker 1 (20:19):
So renight it's kind of a thing in American tennis,
where like if you split sets, you go to the bathroom.
It was very like I would lose the first set
six one, and it's like and we go to the bathroom,
we cried it out, come back, and then win the
next set six one. It was very like normal. But
I remember playing matches where I was up like three
love and the third girl goes to the bathroom, takes
(20:42):
her like twenty minutes because we're like off on a
side court nowhere near a bathroom. Comes back, I lose
the set, and you're just that's kind of just what
happened with it. But it's interesting how professional tennis it's.
It's looked down upon, and I think sometimes the girls
don't know kind of what's right and wrong. I was
pro diarrhea right before the match.
Speaker 2 (21:03):
Well that was me and the warm up at the
US Open.
Speaker 1 (21:05):
Yes, Also, if you're in your period, if you're on
your period, you should be starting every game of fifty love.
Speaker 2 (21:12):
Yeah, I agree. I mean if many people I saw that,
Andy Rottick sord have talked about that on his podcast
because the week before and everyone's like Andy Rotic doesn't
need to be talking about this. I'm like, he's married
to a woman, like get over it. Like also, yes,
Andy Roddicks should be talking about it. I love that
he's like I brought it up and saying how difficult
it is for women and all the things about having
(21:33):
to deal with that. I mean, I didn't play an
Olympics doubles one year, my first ever Olympics, because of
my period was so bad. I was on the first
time it happened to me, and then after that, I subsequently,
you know, I knew how to deal with it. I
couldn't get up. I was in so much pain that.
Speaker 1 (21:48):
Would you would you ever take pills to like skip
that week?
Speaker 2 (21:52):
Oh yeah, I went on the pill immediately, and clearly,
as everybody knows, I didn't worry about getting pregnant. So
I was like, that's how I had to deal with
my professional career.
Speaker 1 (22:01):
But no one talks about it. I had no idea
about it. And there's this thing about sports betting that
apparently they're trying to track women's periods to know fs.
I know, well they're doing it with a w B A.
And then I started doing stand up jokes about it,
being like the w B A if you're in your period.
There should be more points, you know, you should have
(22:22):
he heat heated pads on the benches for all the girls.
Speaker 2 (22:27):
I said, do you know you see them put it
on their back right they sat down, they had it
on their stomach.
Speaker 1 (22:34):
Yeah, put it right in your stomach. Also, I feel
like you should be able to to foul out. You
can't fill out if you're pms like unlimited fouls.
Speaker 2 (22:41):
Should have at least two extra fouls.
Speaker 1 (22:43):
You're like, she's having a day, like, let her go.
Speaker 2 (22:47):
I just know, and then you see your talk to
her buddy us, I'm sorry, man, just like a little
bit out there. Wanted so, I wanted so, I wanted
to bring up cocoa. Like it's been a struggle, right,
she wins the French open. Everyone's like, yes, like this
is it. But but I you know, and I've talked
about it on the podcast a lot. Clay helps her
(23:07):
so much. Right, it gives a timer a forehand. She
can hit kind of a shitty second serve and get
away with it by using her athleticism around the court
to get the balls back in the court and frustrate
her opponents. And on Clay, as you know, and as
I know, it's a patient game. You can't just go
for winners. You can't smash a serve and get a
free point. So why Serena only won a couple of
French opens, like her serve was nullified a little.
Speaker 1 (23:30):
Bit on I know, only a couple of French opens.
Speaker 2 (23:32):
Like that's terrible, terrible, But you're right.
Speaker 1 (23:37):
People can't hit a winner on Coco when it's clay
and she can do have time with her forehand to
kind of guide it gets away with way more on clay.
But my thing with Coco the complete champion mindset. But
it must be exhausting every I joke, oh it's another
cocoa match, But every single match she's pulling out by
(23:58):
the skin of her teeth because you know, she's battling
a lot of stuff within herself, which is the most
relatable thing ever. But it's exhausting.
Speaker 2 (24:36):
Yeah, yeah, I mean listen when I watch her. I mean,
and obviously I know her pretty well, and she's a
great kid. Works so hard, like put in the hours,
does the work off the court.
Speaker 1 (24:49):
She's a very special person.
Speaker 2 (24:50):
Yeah, this great kid, like great kid. You know, it's
always even well before she was like super famous, she
would look me in the eye having a conversation, and
like people go big deal. I'm like, you have no idea,
like for a fifteen year old to stand there and
talk to you and look at you in the eye
and take in what you're saying. And she's just always
been like that. She stands up for the right things
on social media all this stuff, But my god, like perserve,
(25:16):
I don't understand why now she has literally two coaches,
nothing has changed on her serf like Hannah, like the
ball toss is so far ahead of her on the
second serve. I don't understand. There's a couple of basic things.
I tweeted it out the other day. I think she
gets too forward on her serve too early, right, so
she's already sort of leaning into the court. So if
(25:38):
you're leaning into the court, you're going to fall into
the court, which she does. And then she're going to
always hit down on the.
Speaker 1 (25:44):
Ball, and you have to hit up.
Speaker 2 (25:45):
You have to hit up, and you have to stay
up and you have to hit And I call it
seven pm on a ball, right, if you think about
a ball o'clock, she hits at like one pm. She
needs to hit at seven pm right on the under
the ball to get the k She needs a better
kicksurf and I don't understand how they haven't worked on that.
(26:06):
I mean her grip is messed up as well. It's
way too far around, So it must be. It must
be so stressful because I used to have a little
bit of a yip on my toss for a little while. Yeah,
to have literally before the Wimbledon final, on my first one,
I was having a like I was literally having an
anxiety attack about my bald toss on record at Wimbledon.
(26:28):
In the fire, I managed to deal with it, but like,
I just got a I got a feeling just now,
like oh, like not a Chelsea Handler feeling, but like
a feeling of like Pannick. Yes, because she's on. Every
match is on cenecor, every match is on Tennis Channel,
every match on ESPN. It's like, what a fucking nightmare
(26:51):
for anxiety to deal with.
Speaker 1 (26:52):
That, and having me on as a non professional, I
can speak on someone who had a lot of mental
stuff on the court. I was the queen of yips
and I actually feel very connected to Coco, not because
I won any Grand Slams, but because I had an
extreme forehand grip and I was ranked like top fifteen
(27:13):
in the nation at fourteen, and then I went to
a tennis academy and changed my grip and I never
felt comfortable swinging through, which is why I became incredible
at fourhand slicing, which is for a whole other podcast does.
Speaker 2 (27:26):
And she's throwing a slice, so I'm like, what.
Speaker 1 (27:28):
The fuck was it's and it's not a shot. It's
a shot that she could easily set up. But I'm
the one. I'm hitting my forehand on the back foot,
I'm decelerating. And I would argue, based on what she's
saying where she said I'm practicing so well, I think
she's probably hitting crazy great kick serves in practice, but
her yip is kind of like leaning forward and trying
(27:49):
to push it down in and then with the forehand
you just start slowing. It's it's so fucking mental. Excuse
my French, oh, I swear all the time, but with
her yet we're Aussies. But for her, it's like she
has so many brand deals and she's on social media,
which I hope, I hope her team is just letting
(28:11):
her post but not consuming it, because I would argue
Osaka is one of them. There's a lot of people
who I think are on social media too much and
it's affecting right before they serve. They're listening to tweets
in their head of people talking shit, which tennis players
never had to deal with in the past. Just I mean,
they'd have the press, but you could just don't read
(28:32):
the newspaper. Nowadays you're getting notifications every second every day.
So I'm also Coco, she's busy. I just got, you know,
some emails. She's doing a dinner, she's doing whatever. She
has all these brand deals. Other girls aren't doing this,
but she's creating, you know, generational wealth. But she has
a lot on her plate. And but you're right with
(28:53):
the serve. Other people they'll even if they're the best
serve ever, they change it every year, like Alcrez changing
you know, little tweaks all the time. So I agree
with everything you're saying.
Speaker 2 (29:05):
Yeah, I mean, my suggestion to her would be after
the US Open, no Asia, just shut it down like Serena.
She didn't play Asia, she didn't even play the WTA
finals like Because you also have to look at the
surface right now, if at the end of the year
was on Clay go for it, play right, but it's
on fast, hard courts in China and in Asia or
(29:28):
in Europe indoors, which none of them are going to
be great for her surf. So I think you you
either decide that you're going to break it down like
big time and change it and check everything about it,
the grip, the ball toss, everything. Now, if she like
as you said, if she's hitting it great in practice
and never misses it, I still believe and I will
(29:49):
believe this till the day I die, and Billy Jean
King ossis bad technique breaks down under pressure. So I
don't care if she's hitting it. If a coach is
saying but she's hits it great in practice, I'm like, Okay,
that's fine, but her technique is not good. Her elbow
is down, her grip is wrong, she's hitting on the
wrong side of the ball, the ball toss is in
(30:10):
the wrong position, all those things, and with no pressure,
it's going to go in in practice. But in a match,
if you have bad technique, it is going to break
down a.
Speaker 1 (30:20):
Well, look what Sabalinka did. Yeah, she had she had
a good enough serve until she got the yips with it.
And she changed the entire kind of technique behind it,
and now it's it's been solid. The thing with Cocoa two,
which is something I dealt with at a low, much
lower level, was that I was winning a lot. So
(30:41):
like when you're winning your matches, getting way, I'm getting
away with it. So and I'm playing one. I don't
want to go down to floor. So I'm like, I
don't want to restructure, and like, she's number two in
the world right.
Speaker 2 (30:53):
Now, She's just want a slam.
Speaker 1 (30:55):
She's in major contention everywhere she goes, so it's difficult.
But I do you think her maybe not doing the
Asian swing and making some subtle changes and sticking to
it could be really good base.
Speaker 2 (31:08):
Yeah, I mean that's that would be my advice for her.
You know, look, if she goes and Whin's the US Open,
I'm like, fuck, who am I?
Speaker 1 (31:13):
Right?
Speaker 2 (31:14):
But I mean the bottom line is on the problem
is these players, like you know the Towsons and you
know the Mumbaco we're going to get to oh yes,
like these are tall, tall girls. Go after the return.
You know this? She on Texas Sabalancas, the rebarking all
these players are beat Cocoa on a fast cord was
(31:35):
a nightmare matchup on grass for us. Any chick that
goes after the return big time is going to always
threaten Coco on a fast cord.
Speaker 1 (31:45):
Well, that's the thing. We're not questioning how incredible Coco is.
It's that she wants to be bigger than Serenda Williams.
So if you want to do that and you're dealing
with this must much stress in a first round at
a one thousand three after three setter after three setter.
I don't think it's sustainable. Emotionally, it's not so like.
(32:06):
But I also I don't know if her fourhand will
ever be you know, solid, But I think if she
could get that served down, it'll make her life so
much easier one hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (32:16):
I think if she serves better and more consistently and
has that feeling of like, oh I'm okay, his first
service massive, it's over one hundred and twenty miles an hour.
It's ridiculous. I mean I had a decent serve and
if I got up one sixteen, I was pretty happy.
You know, I'm five Hans, Coco is about my height.
I'm like, it's big. But if you're not hitting that
in panic stations.
Speaker 1 (32:38):
Yeah, I think Coco can beete everyone, but it's about
can you do it every day? Like her ability is there,
but like how Sabalanca could just blow people off the court.
Every match with Coco, I get a stomach ache. I
get so stressed, and I can't imagine how her team
and her are feeling. And I just want her to
have a long, happy career.
Speaker 2 (33:00):
We all trust me. We all do because I can
tell you from a TV standpoint as well, there's about
three players that bring really good numbers and it's Novak
and Alcarez and Coco. Wow, that in and of itself,
we need her in the game and we need to
do to work. And on top of it, she's a
great kid. So I just want her to, as you said,
not go on the court feeling so anxious all the time. Mumbaco, Well,
(33:24):
let's just chat about that. I mean, as a player,
I do see some some things on her serve as
well that it's working now and it's massive. The first
over the second serves a little predictable elbows, lots of
things I pick on the little She has.
Speaker 1 (33:38):
Quite unique kind of head movement on her grounds jokes.
Have you noticed she kind of she jerks her head,
but I guess it helps her with acceleration and she
hits a flatcome to the WTA, there's it just flies.
(33:59):
I love her her maturity on the court.
Speaker 2 (34:02):
Yeah, and I love her. Yeah, she's chill.
Speaker 1 (34:06):
You're right, she's like laughing with her coaches after missing beforehand.
I really like her. She's also she's a child. Yes,
she's a child, but she's I think she's here to stay.
Speaker 2 (34:17):
Yeah, and I think she can get way better. Like
I think technique why she's going to get better and better.
I think, as I said, the surf I think can
get better and if it does, look out because to
keep can playing. She moves well for her height, like
she's she's certainly wont to watch. She'll be pushed today
against the Rabacchino. We'll see where she stands up in
that situation. I want to chat about Naomi Osaka. When
(34:40):
if your matches in Montreal, New coach on board with
Thomas Witchgrousie got rid of your Pemo.
Speaker 1 (34:47):
You know Osaka. I watched her in the beginning of
this tournament and she still had this kind of like
depression over her like she still seemed frustrated, but she
pulled out the matches, and I think enough matches, she's
gonna wake up one day and just be like back
in it. I would argue. It's funny though, I when
they cut to like her previous matches, like winning slams
(35:08):
in like twenty nineteen, her footwork was different.
Speaker 2 (35:12):
Oh it was better.
Speaker 1 (35:13):
Have you noticed that she was She had a very
diligent footwork, and then it cuts back to the current
match and she's still slappy on the footwork a bit.
Speaker 2 (35:21):
Yeah. Yeah, I think that's the one thing. And I
watched to lose to Emma Ratikano last week in DC,
and the one thing I noticed about her because she
looks great, Like she looks fit. She's like out of
shape or anything like that. She's in shape. For her
footwork and her just it's not good and she's missing
shots that she wouldn't have. Maybe working now with Thomas Witchgroowski,
(35:43):
because he's like he's a task master man. I mean
he's tough, and he's got a personality of like my pen.
Speaker 1 (35:50):
Right, I mean he's not messing around.
Speaker 2 (35:53):
He's not a rah rah guy, right, And clearly going
from working with egostrion Tech and Radvanska who she was.
He was working probably, I mean two great feet footwork. Yeah,
worked hard, we're quick around the court. Like he's probably
gonna get that in order because you're so right, Hannah,
Like that's the area that she's just not good at anywhere.
Speaker 1 (36:14):
And if you're a super aggressive player, your footwork has
to be even better because you're going for bigger shots
and you can't go for the big shots if your
footwork isn't there. So it's really critical. I feel like
Coco could get away with, you know, slap your footwork
because she's hands, she's she's just getting stuff back sometimes.
But Naomi needs to get her footwork right to dominate
like she did before. I also, can I bring up
(36:36):
my American girls?
Speaker 2 (36:37):
I have some I was literally about to say before.
I can't let you go without talking about Maddie Keys,
just like suffering through some matches. But also before we
get to the good stuff. Yes, Piccola, what's going on
your buddy?
Speaker 1 (36:49):
I know. Just also my claim to fame as I
played doubles with Jesse Pegoula when we were like fifteen sixteen.
We lost the match definitely because of me, and I
bring it up all the time. I honestly like she's
been so consistent for so long. I just I think
it's okay that you know she's having some losses, take
the loss and try to get in your groove again,
(37:13):
get in your mojo again. Did you tell her this,
I'm gonna I'm going to DM her?
Speaker 2 (37:18):
Yeah, I think. I mean, I listen, what do you
think that it's link?
Speaker 1 (37:21):
Okay?
Speaker 2 (37:23):
I mean listen, I think that. Look, Jesse's whole game
is is talk about hitting the ball flat, and you know,
she has to be she has to be really confident
because that ball, she hits it deep, she hits it
very close to the net. There's not a lot of
room for her to be playing badly. She's not. She's
not going to start rolling it in. She's not going
to start hitting more top spin. That's just not how
(37:44):
So she has to be confident in her game. And
she's lost some tough ones. I mean, the Layla Fernandez
class in Washington was probably that was that was the
tough loss. And I got to give kudos because I
didn't do a pod last week. Laila Fernandez was awesome
last week. I mean, she had some unbelieva. Was so
nice to see her win a couple of matches.
Speaker 1 (38:00):
It was a la the US Open energy.
Speaker 2 (38:03):
We almost had the US Open final like each other
since that final, so it was kind of bummed to
Emma loss at semi, but she had a good web
in Naomi. But yeah, it's nice to see them back
when I do.
Speaker 1 (38:14):
Think with Jesse, I haven't been like tracking all her results,
but it comes a point where you know, Coco is
winning some Grand Slams and I feel like she wants
to have a breakthrough in the Grand Slam. And I
don't know how mentally every week they show up when
they have some like frustrations, like Jesse wants to win
the Slam. She saw Maddie do it like she's ready,
(38:35):
and it could kind of weigh on you maybe, but
I think she has it in her. She just needs
a pop of a tournament, like she needs to remind
these girls who she is.
Speaker 2 (38:44):
Well US So I mean obviously Cincinnati, she'll do well
the other courts and Court's really good for her. Shout
out to Cincinnati. Oh my god, the new grounds look
unbelievable and everybody said to me, there's like it feels
like a grand slam, Amnavaras. Yes, it's put a lot
of money with the Cincinnati. It's Mason. Okay, it's not,
but it's Mason the Cincinnati, and you know, they put
(39:07):
a lot of money into it, and apparently it looks unbelievable.
So maybe Jess has her breakout week they're going into
the US Open, because she's defending finals points at the
US Open. Well.
Speaker 1 (39:16):
Also also Emma, she's in her like sophomore year, some
would say, and people know her game now, but I
think she's due also for a heart result.
Speaker 2 (39:28):
Do you think that it's coming in the next couple
of weeks.
Speaker 1 (39:32):
I don't know. I just know that she's so good
coming in as the underdog and just like being like,
you guys don't even know how good I am. And
then now that she's seated, it's a whole different mentality,
and I think she's getting comfortable with that.
Speaker 2 (39:47):
Yeah, And I think that that's what people don't really understand.
It's like she came into you know, out of college,
you know, a good college player, very good, very good
college player, into the pros and it's like it's a
different world. It's profecttionals, it's people that are literally it's
their job to be on a tennis court two three
four hours a day in the gym two hours a day,
like it's a job. And Emma, bloody hell, she came
(40:10):
in like as president. She came in like I'm gonna
be a pro her.
Speaker 1 (40:15):
She wasn't intimidated by anyone.
Speaker 2 (40:17):
No, no, and she has that such cool swagger and
she's such a funny kid. That's so funny. Yes, she
looks very chill on the court, and everyone's like, does
she have a personality on? Like, trust me off the court.
Speaker 1 (40:27):
So I heard the de grape Vine that she listens
to Giggle Squad, which is my podcast to calm down.
So I'm gonna need to make her lap. Yeah, I know,
I'm freaking out. So she'll every now and then message
me that she's a giggler, which is really really really cool.
I'm you know what I'm saying. I'm getting into the WTA.
I recently was dming Jennifer Brady, who also is hilarious.
(40:52):
I said, Babe, you gotta get that big ice forehand
back on tour. Let's get it together. So I'm I'm
doing some mental rehab with her. Also, can I just say,
Peyton Steren's struggling, though, man, when she do you remember
if she had like a ton of really close losses
in the beginning, when she was like really confident, it
(41:14):
really took a toll on her. I feel like and
hurt her confidence when I want her to get back
to I feel like if she had won one of
those three setters, she could have been like popping off.
Speaker 2 (41:25):
But I tell you, Hannah, her issue is her serf.
It is not good. Like her first service, okay, her
second serve against Venus. I say, Everyone's like, do you
think Venus has a chance to even come close in
this match? And I was like, in this match, she
actually can win. And I said, and the reason is
(41:46):
if she serves well, if Venus serves well enough, which
she served great in that match, like was still popping
down one eighteen miles an hour, Like, okay, she hit
the first time that Peyton hit a second serf, which
was the first point of her service game, Venus hit
one hundred and fifty mile an hour, fourhand down the
line winner, And I went, that's why she can win
(42:07):
this match because Peyton's second serve is not good.
Speaker 1 (42:10):
A coach once told me You're only as good as
your second serve, which is why I'm sitting here today
as a podcaster. But it is valid and that's what
breaks down shut out to Venus, I was texting you
throughout that whole match. I'm so excited to see her
out there. And I mean, her footwork was great, her
the sound of the ball coming off her racket couldn't
(42:32):
have been crisper. How happy are you about this?
Speaker 2 (42:35):
Oh? Yeah, I mean it was great. I mean just
to see her, like with that smile on her face
after she won, because she's always been proud of me.
You know, she's always sort of given that like I'm
too cool, Like I'm not going to get too excited
about stuff. You know, even in the postmatch interview, she
wouldn't give you that much. I mean, the joy on
her face when she won that match was like she'd
won a Grand Slam. It was. It was so nice
to see someone who'd been putting in the work clearly
(42:58):
to get that win. Like, even if it's the last
one she ever wins, at least she got a win.
Speaker 1 (43:03):
And I also think she's such a Hall of Famer
and like everything for the sport. But she happened to
have a sister who was freaking everything. So sometimes I
feel like she, like people not forgot about Venus, but
sometimes she was, you know, behind the scenes with the
Serena stuff. But now her being able to at this
(43:24):
age accomplish this, I think is such a beautiful moment
for her and what she represents for the sport.
Speaker 2 (43:29):
I just hope, you know, playing at the US Open
she has like a decent week and or a match
or two or whatever, and that she gives the crowd
what the crowd got with Serena a couple of years ago.
But more importantly for her, she's got her WTA health
insurance for at least another year.
Speaker 1 (43:45):
Thank goodness.
Speaker 2 (43:47):
This is America as a self employed person, as probably
you are, yes, getting insurance. Health insurance is some bullshit
or you get it, and it's horrible.
Speaker 1 (43:56):
Venus needs to get her teeth cleaned too.
Speaker 2 (43:59):
Yeah, exactly, all right. Last thing that I want to
talk to you about, because I tweeted this out the
other day about the frustration level I have with producers
show the crowd every single goddamn point, and on top
(44:19):
of it, they don't show the handshakes or they don't
show player's reaction when they win matches. It drives me crazy.
Why do you think this is I don't they're trying
to be like cinematographers.
Speaker 1 (44:32):
No, My biggest grape with golf is like after someone
hits a bad shot, they always they always leave it,
and I'm like, show me the guy being frustrated, show
me him cursing on his caddy, Like this is the
drama I want. The tennis reactions is so important. I
love when they show player, then they show the other player.
That's what I want to see.
Speaker 2 (44:52):
We miss that Koboli Ben Shelton thing because we went
from showing Ben sort of going oh what the book,
and then we never showed Coboli's reaction and that was
the whole They showed the crowd. I'm like, no, Caboli's reaction.
If you're on it, that's what you would have shown.
Speaker 1 (45:08):
Do you think it's like golf where they're trying to
like keep it as classy as possible and like god
forbid someone curses or something.
Speaker 2 (45:16):
Oh, I think they would. No one was looking at
Ben Shelton going The commentators were like, well, we don't.
We can't really work out why he's getting frustrated. I
was listening to the World feed on that one. I
don't know what the Tennis channel guys said, but I
was just like, what what do you mean. He's obviously
gestured something's pissed him off with Koboli. Yeah, never showed
(45:36):
Coboli's reaction. So towards the end they're like, oh, I
don't know what's going.
Speaker 1 (45:40):
On, and they were all confused, and then it's like,
go find a replay of what they're referring to. I
want to be in the drama, and you know it's
gonna have tons of articles about it, so you might
as well at the facts. So we all have opinions.
Speaker 2 (45:53):
I would go as far as I say, like it
and you know, night to my own horn, But like
an ESPN, we would say to the produce because sometimes
our producers are on it right. They would have seen
it as well, and they would have had their cameras
on and they would ah his reaction boom, and they
would have got that up right. Sometimes or a lot
of times, it's also on us as commentators to be like,
get hey, hey, get get Cabaldi's reaction. We'll talk back
(46:14):
to the producer Andy, get that and that'll tell the
story and oh, this is why here it is. And
so when they're shaking hands and they're having that moment,
it's like, oh, this is why.
Speaker 1 (46:23):
I also dislike when for some reason the mic doesn't
capture like a full conversation to the ref and like
no one knows what the person's mad at. I'm like,
I want to get the te can. I also have
one hot take too about filming. I'm obsessed with when
they have the camera kind of more behind the players, yes,
and you get to feel like you're playing oh.
Speaker 2 (46:45):
Yeah with the lower camera.
Speaker 1 (46:46):
Whenever they do that, for like return a serve like awesome.
I love it, like to feel what it's like to
return like Opelka serve like I. Whenever it's in that position,
I love it. So if any your producers are listening,
put a couple more behind the player. Yeah, I agree.
Speaker 2 (47:01):
It's amazing how many people write to me about that
as well. And it was just like, hey, that that
camera position is amazing, Like can we see it again?
Speaker 1 (47:10):
What do you think about the make being on the coaches.
Speaker 2 (47:16):
Well as a as a coach, from time to time,
you got to watch what the f you're saying because again,
the producers have the ability to put that up or
down right, and so if you're saying this and f
and that, they'll probably lower it because I don't want
that on there on their TV. But but yeah, I
think I think it's great. I think it's great when
(47:37):
you hear like Ben Shelton's dad saying stout stuff to him,
or like the other day he said on match point,
he goes, if you go down the two, it'll be
an ace. I'm thinking, mate, if he hits it anywhere
on the court, it's gonna be And you know what
he did, He went out wide and hit it because
his dad, you should have dead boy turned around, was like,
(47:57):
But I thought that was kind of hilarious. But anyway, Hannah,
I mean, I could keep you here all day, all day.
I just want everybody to know the last time I
hit tennis balls, Hannah. And this is a true story because,
as you know, I went to Wimbledon to play in
the in the legends, but oh, there's my soup. He's
dropping something off. But I didn't get to play because
(48:19):
I had to go home for my mom's funeral and stuff.
So it was a bit of a disaster. So the
last time I hit tennis balls was with you, Hannah
Burner in New York.
Speaker 1 (48:27):
Can we do it again?
Speaker 2 (48:28):
Please?
Speaker 1 (48:29):
I would love to. I had so much fun. You
were helping me with my back in Vali, and we
got into quite a groove, like we had some really
good rallies.
Speaker 2 (48:38):
Yeah. I hadn't hit for like five months, and I
was like, oh I still got it.
Speaker 1 (48:40):
I'm okay, thank god, but I had so much fun.
Speaker 2 (48:44):
Let's do it.
Speaker 1 (48:44):
Definitely do it again. Let's actually, should we get a
wildcard to the US Open?
Speaker 2 (48:49):
Oh yeah, let's start pleading now, like Alex d. Minor
is pleading to get a wild card with his soon
to be wife.
Speaker 1 (48:58):
I didn't.
Speaker 2 (48:59):
Oh yeah, he he is, like he is, like if
he could write a resume, he would. It's a classic
what he's trying to do right now. But anyway, I
hate given props, and he deserves one, because that guy
is unbelievable. Yes, Hannah, you have your None of Your
Business tour. Oh yes, starting in two days, and if
(49:22):
you want to go to it in the first five shows,
bad fucking luck because it's sold out.
Speaker 1 (49:28):
Go at Hanniburn dot com. I'm probably coming to your
state in the in the fall. Check it out and yeah,
I'm so I'm so happy to be on this part
and I have to come back. Maybe you is open,
we'll talk.
Speaker 2 (49:38):
Yeah, let's do something that us open, because you know,
you know your tennis. You watch your tennis. I love that.
Yourself so into it. It's my favorite thing. And if
you follow Hannah on Instagram Hannah Burner, all she posts
are her fucking videos hitting tennis balls. It's so you
play more tennis than anybody I know, other than maybe
my other podcast partner Caitlyn Thompson, who plays.
Speaker 1 (50:00):
Oh look, we love the game. It's a game for life.
Speaker 2 (50:04):
You frustrated, D one and college.
Speaker 1 (50:08):
That's of my biography.
Speaker 2 (50:10):
We cannot let go of the dream. Oh well, Michael
Kosta wrote a book as you and I know Michael
quite well, and I have his book here because he
sent it to me called Lucky Loser. I read it. Yeah,
So anyway, I just love the fact that the two
of you are killing it so much in comedy and
tennis is such a great way to not only stay
fit and healthy, but also I don't know, you just
(50:31):
you understand the ups and downs and getting out there
in front of a crowd and just doing what you're doing.
It's it's amazing. So August seventh, the tour starts. So
proud of you. Hit some tennis balls and I was
a little surprised that you had the start of the
tour before the US Open, thinking that you might start
it after.
Speaker 1 (50:50):
But you're a pro, you know. I took that week
off for the US Open.
Speaker 2 (50:57):
There you go. That's when you know's I would have
to see you there again, desk, That's that's my goal.
Speaker 1 (51:03):
Oh my god, I would pee myself and.
Speaker 2 (51:06):
Make sure Dan is there, Santa in the studio.
Speaker 1 (51:09):
Shout out to Dan, Shout out to Dan.
Speaker 2 (51:12):
Hannah, I love you so much that I.
Speaker 1 (51:13):
Love you dude, Thank you, Renee.
Speaker 2 (51:16):
I'd have a good rest of your day. And by
what's the cat's name, oh boos has been spooting around
you the whole time. Ye
I'm fastering a cat and your boots. She's beautiful, perfect,
also obsessed with podcast strings. So if everything goes black,
it's because of boots.
Speaker 2 (00:25):
I think I have a feeling that there's some some
somehow you might be keeping that cat.
Speaker 1 (00:32):
I'm getting my producer to keep her so she stays
in the family.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
Oh, I love this. I love this for all what
I do, that's what I do.
Speaker 1 (00:39):
So I'm a cat trafficker. I'm a rescue cat trafficker.
That's what I do this summer because I have nothing
else to do.
Speaker 2 (00:45):
Well, Hannah, first of all, you know, welcome to the
Renee Substowns podcast. I finally, finally, it's only taken like
I don't know since I've known you, which is like
three and a half years or something.
Speaker 1 (00:57):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
But but before we get going, people are probably like,
who the fuck who's Hannah Berner talking to you on
a tennis podcast? So let me just let people know,
all right, first of all, with some respect on my name,
I'm going to put some respect on your names, like
why am I listening to this person?
Speaker 1 (01:16):
But where's Couco Gough?
Speaker 2 (01:18):
Before we get to your tennis accolades? Okay, I just
need to let everybody know you're not only killing it.
You're killing it, Hannah, You're killing it. You had a
Netflix special called We Ride It, look At Me, Looking
at Looking at All Your shit on Uh, You've got
to killer podcast that everybody should listen to if they
(01:41):
don't know you. They've been living under a rock with
Giggly Squad with Paige Desorbo. You were just on Jimmy
Fallon Okay together the two of you. You have another podcast,
I'm still going. You've got another podcast with your husband
Dez called Bernafone, which also is hilarious because he's also cute.
(02:01):
I mean, both of them have one hundred million downloads.
You had a sold out Giggly Squad tour with page
Like just a couple of months ago, which was unbelievable,
and you had a number two. I'm a little disappointed
that you didn't get from one because number two New
York Times bestseller with how to Giggle, a guide of
(02:22):
taking life less seriously and if anyone knows you, that
is like apropos if I've ever heard it. Of course,
Hanne on the Street YouTube that shit. It's over three
hundred million views. It's insane. The thing that I love
about you, Hannah is that on your bio page, on
your actual page, it says lives in Brooklyn with cats,
but not with your husband with your cat.
Speaker 1 (02:45):
I was like, I don't live in Brooklyn anymore.
Speaker 2 (02:47):
I know. It's classic.
Speaker 1 (02:49):
My mom was like, hey, you should say you're with
your husband, and I was like, we're decentering, man, that's
not important. No one cares. That's the least interesting about
me that I've lived with my husband. Obviously I live
with my husband.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
It's more about living with your cat. Okay, that's what
That's what I died. Second of all, I think that's
the most proud person that you're on this podcast is
not only me, but of course your dad Dan.
Speaker 1 (03:10):
Okay, let shout out to Dan. Shout out to Dan,
who's definitely listening, my tennis coach, my father, and the
muddy waters in between. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
Now, now for those of you that are going, okay, great,
she's a comedian and she's funny. Why the fuck is
she on this podcast? Well, you were a d One
Hannas player at the University of Wisconsin, Wisconsin. What is
that a badger? Are you a badger? Cool?
Speaker 1 (03:33):
Beagers?
Speaker 2 (03:34):
Yeah? There you go Go Badgers. And not only I
looked it up, Hannah, you were the team MVP in
twenty thirteen. You're all academic, hey, way to go.
Speaker 1 (03:43):
You actually school.
Speaker 2 (03:45):
It's a very rare thing for a college athlete. And
you played number one. You were just some like you know,
walk on at number six or seven.
Speaker 1 (03:54):
You would one.
Speaker 2 (03:56):
And to top this off, now I'm going to be finished,
you were number one in girls in high school. Okay,
and you played on the boys high school team as well,
and you were undefeated in doubles. Is that right?
Speaker 1 (04:08):
Yes? Yes, wait, this is amazing. I've never had a
real journalist cover me. This is amazing you who keep
going the whole part well.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
The fact that you get a real journalists is even
hilarious to me. But the thing that I'm most proud
about for you, Hannah, in all of that is that
you got the Sportsmanship Award in two thousand and five.
Speaker 1 (04:27):
And that's probably because I won a tournament and I
was in a good mood. Let's be honest. The people
who never get the Sportsenship award, they're breaking the rackets.
Speaker 2 (04:36):
So you know, I watch a lot of tennis, obviously,
but I think you watch more tennis than anybody I know.
It's like psychotic. You're lying with your cats that you
house and you're watching tennis more than anyone I know.
It's the photo of you on Instagram is either your feet,
your cat and tennis in the background. So that's why everyone,
(04:57):
Hannah fucking Burner, it's on my pod cast talking tennis.
Speaker 1 (05:01):
Oh my god. I'm so honored to be here as
just like a huge Rene Stubs fan. But also all
I do is watch the tennis channel ESPN, and all
I wait for is to hear your little Aussie voice
in the background so that I could text you during
the match to be like I totally agree about her backhand,
or like what's the strategy here, what's going on? And
I feel like I'm in the Illuminati because I can
(05:23):
like text the journalist while she's watching the match. So anyway,
You've brought so much joy to me in this like
tennis comeback of my life ten years post college, not
to age myself, and all I want to do is
talk tennis with you. But also I give so much
credit to tennis for where I am now in my career.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
Yeah, I mean, I think that's what people need to
sort of know. I mean you're not like an overnight sensation, right,
You've had to work your ass off to get to
where you're at. I mean you're in your early thirties,
like you know, having having I think you're having a
sports background for any especially especially women, I think is
so important for people because you learn wins and losses,
how do you get better? How do you improve? And
(06:03):
the only way for you to be successful is to
work your ass off and that's what you've done. Like
in your entertainment career now is like transform into this
unbelievably well known comedian now, and tennis is so much
about wins and losses.
Speaker 1 (06:17):
And also with tennis, it's so similar to stand up comedy.
And I know it sounds random, but it's true. It's
you out there alone, battling your demons, performing in front
of people. And then it's also a boys club. Like
stand up comedy, you go into a club and you're
just making jokes in front of guys. And there's a
lot of really funny women that walk into a club
(06:38):
with a bunch of drunk dudes at eleven PM in
the Bronx and they're like, maybe this isn't for me.
So I think my tennis experience of obviously training with
a lot of guys playing on the boys team, I
walked into the stand up and I'm like, we're just
making like pussy jokes. I could do this, Yeah, Like
I could do this. So tennis also helps with my
self esteem so much to know that I could over adversity,
(07:00):
because let's be honest, tennis is just about overcoming adversity
every point your mindset, battling yourself. So to this day,
I think tennis is the most difficult thing I've ever done,
and that's why I think stand Up I approached it
with like a very fun creative mentality because I'm like,
nothing's as hard as second serve against Duke three, y'all,
(07:21):
and I'm the final match and I'm gonna hold like
a cheap beach chair.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
It's funny because if I've spoken about this. De Lisa
Raymond right, who played college tennis for a couple of
years as well and had such an amazing tennis career,
we would play. We played this one tournament in Madrid
where like literally people were screaming at us to like
one time, one guy told me go home, and I'm like,
go home, I'm like playing a tennis tournament. I'm like,
this is my job, you know. I mean he said
(07:48):
it with a Spanish accent, right, He's like, go on,
you know. And I remember Lisa was never flustered by anybody, right,
he was never flustered by the crowd or people saying
shit or you know, players be in douchebags down the
other end. And she would say to me, Renee, I
played a Texas Like, you have no idea, right, She's like,
(08:08):
college hands thrown at me.
Speaker 1 (08:10):
College tennis is unruly, but there's a there's a fun
to it because I would get into it. I'm a
New Yorker, I'm loud. My problem was I would be like,
I'd get focused on a match next to me because
you've become like your friends cheerleader. So your teammate like
wins a point and she yells, come on, you yell
come on. Everyone's yelling come on. It was this incredible energy.
(08:31):
But it also for the first time I had like
other people's results and pressure on my back too, like
when I lost, everyone lost, So it was it was
definitely unique thing that I never had to deal with before.
Speaker 2 (08:44):
Yeah, it's not nice to be at the end of
the day and be like loser, and for us waiting.
Speaker 1 (08:49):
I'd be like, hey, guys, sorry my bad, I lost
my singles and sorry I brought nothing to the day.
I brought nothing at one job.
Speaker 2 (08:57):
Well, it's interesting because like, okay, so let's transition a
little bit into like all the players that you watch
and all the matches that you watch and stuff, and
I want your take then on because a lot of
people get shit. Let's talk about two players that came
out of college centers that we had that sort of
ra ra mentality and they kind of get a bit
of shit for it. Let's talk about daniel Collins, right,
she has that like you know that shit, and she
(09:19):
did four years of college, came out, kind of started
a bit slow, has had a tremendous career since their
top ten finals of a Slam, retired twice. Is she
ever going to go away? I mean, look, she announced
her retirement at least Venus didn't. And she just came
back for the medical insurance, which, by the way, is
(09:40):
a true story. I just want everybody to know we
actually talked about that. Just hilarious. But on Danielle like her,
like rah rah, that's sort of the mentality in college
and that's why it's hard to like let it go
when you go pro. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (09:52):
First of all, A huge fan of d Animal. I'm
obsessed with her University of Virginia. I had friends who
played with her. Shout out Julia Barba. The thing is
when you're playing college tennis, I was so vocal after
every point because if I yell come on, it would
rev my team to know, like, oh, we're getting momentum,
Like you can change momentum of your friends match. It's
(10:13):
also professional is so much more like robotic, and you're
just like calm and you don't react. And I think
I like that she's brought personality. Also, it is a
case of like men and women, like she does things
that people be like, oh she is she being kind
of a bitch right now, where I think that like
(10:35):
some other men might just.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
Be being tough. Yeah, oh look at that. Lea are into it.
Although Ben Shelton a lot and.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
Shelton gets a lot of hate. Well did you see
his drama recently with the Italian which actually, as of
half Italian person, was the funniest thing ever. This Italian
person trying to explain what they were feeling and the
hand movements and the words were just not coming together.
And I was like, we don't have all days, let's go,
let's go.
Speaker 2 (11:01):
He said the same thing like five times, and Ben
kept saying, so it's it is with me, and he's like, no,
with you. And I don't know if you saw my Twitter.
I put out a little Twitter thing about it because
I knew what was going on. I couldn't believe the
freaking commentators didn't see it. Now we've all done this
right where your opponent hits a shot and you're like,
that was so out of their ass, and he's tired.
(11:23):
It's like three hours and and you know, Ben hits
this inside out forehand. He got one love in the
tiebreak in the third set, and if you watch his reaction,
he's like, come on, and then he looks down the
other end and he sees his friends curse they're friends, yes,
gesture like he closed his eyes and hit it right,
And so Ben was like, what the fuck, dude, Like
what And so if you look at at two love, okay,
(11:47):
now it's too love in the tiebreak and Ben hits
a screaming forehand and he looked down the other ends like,
oh was that into? It was that out? You know,
So it's kind of like this back and forth. We've
all done it, We've all done this. There was so
out of your ass meybes.
Speaker 1 (12:02):
And also, let's be honest, Ben Shelton's push every shot
he hits is insane, Like it's not like he that's
the first crazy winner he hit all match, Like he
hit serves that bounce into the crowd. I think it's
two guys who like care about each other. But it's
so funny men's tennis and women's tennis. The men care
about each other being cool with each other. Girls have
(12:24):
never cared about being cool with each other, Like, I
look at what you think about me. I just hope
the press isn't like turning on me kind of thing.
But I think the men the girls can learn from
the men in a way where it's like they'll have
a battle and then they'll get a beer. Where the girls,
you know, will have a battle and be like, I'll
never make eye contact with you in the locker room again.
Speaker 2 (12:43):
So yeah, I mean it's interesting how the personalities do
sort of like I mean, women to just they just
take it so much more personally.
Speaker 1 (12:52):
Yes, which I do. What I love about Danielle is
she is kind of just like this is me. I'll
yell at someone in the crowd. She's consistent and I
appreciate that from her. She doesn't treat different people differently.
She's one tone she.
Speaker 2 (13:08):
And it's funny because Danielle also kind of lets it
go but kind of always remembers. She's like, you know,
an elephant that way. She's like, I always remember, but
you know, I don't know. I mean when you understand
her and you're gonna get her personality. And she's a
great person off the court, like she does a lot
of charity work and she's all but on the court.
I love when she tries to keep her shit together.
Speaker 1 (13:29):
Yeah, like you could tell that she so badly wants
to break her racket or say something. I also, I
find it some players instead of taking it out on
the crowd or the other opponent, they take it out
on their team. So it's so interesting. Everyone lets out
this insane stress and pressure they're dealing with, but they
put it in different places. I've definitely I've definitely yelled
(13:50):
at my coach. I've definitely yelled at myself once I
remember I was like sitting on the bench just talking
loud about the girl next to me, like you would
become a different Like when would I ever do that
in my life? But I was saying, like this, girls,
she's cheated last point, she cheated this point, like you,
I don't know who that person is I've become. So
I guess I watched these tennis players with such pressure
(14:13):
and I'm like, I would have been thrown out four
times already in this match for breaking my racket. So
I'm just impressed that they pull themselves together with such class.
Have you ever seen a doubles match in just like
your local tennis courts? Yeah, people are crazy.
Speaker 2 (14:28):
I told the story. I think I told the story
on my podcast one time where I was walking behind
a lady's midwek doubles match and it had the screens
up as well, but you could sort of see someone
walking behind and i'mking, I just hit three hours in
practice with my coach. Were walking behind the court and
these four midweek ladies that were maybe two point five
maybe three stopped and waited for us to get past
(14:52):
the court, and I was like, no, that did not
just happen. So yeah, there's seriousness. So from then on
and every time we walk by a court, we walked
as slow as we could. The ladies trust me, I
get it. I do.
Speaker 1 (15:07):
I do have to say that going back on like
the men versus women stuff, I do think that there
is a lot of villains of the men's game too
that people like to turn on, whether it's meditative Djokovic, Shelton,
Cissy Pass, curios. But I do think with the girls
they're breaking the rackets, people get more upset about were
When a man breaks it, it's like kind of hot.
(15:29):
When a man breaks it, you're like, Okay, I didn't
know you had that in you. Where when a girl
does it, you're like, okay, we need to go to therapy.
Speaker 2 (15:35):
Yeah, you're a little aggressive, A little aggressive. That's dangerous.
Speaker 1 (15:41):
And especially with these girls, they have a lot of
sponsorships writing on them. Like I think about Coco, like,
you know, after a double fault, she wants to take
her racket and throw it out of the stadium, but
she has to hold it together, and like it's it's
really impressive. It's really impressive.
Speaker 2 (15:56):
One thing I'm gonna get to Coco, would you. But
one of the things that I also wanted to talk
about is thinking of breaking rackets or whatever. I saw
Medvedev lose his motherfucking mind last week in Washington. He lost.
I think it's probably one of the greatest match points
I've ever watched as far as how unbelievable every shot
(16:16):
was okay when he lost to Devidkina. And I can
never say that guy's name anyway.
Speaker 1 (16:26):
A lot of culture, it's different cultures, such a.
Speaker 2 (16:29):
Mental luck with his name. He's such a great guy.
But he lost his mind in this match. Oh no,
it wasn't to him. It was to uh mute, who's
also nuts. He threw his racket to his his seat
after the match, like but from the middle of the
cord hander, I was like, no, don't do don't do
it into the crowd like he would be suspended for
(16:50):
like you.
Speaker 1 (16:50):
Could guillotine somebody.
Speaker 2 (16:52):
Seriously, he could tell you. It was like I got
to keep it low, mad process. But the smashed every
water bottle. I can'st it was it was it was.
Speaker 1 (17:04):
But this is the thing. I like, I'm surprised they
don't do it more often because of the pressure and
the money involved and everything. But Medvedev also is the
hardcore king and he just hasn't been able to do
it recently, so I can't imagine how frustrating that is.
Speaker 2 (17:20):
But what he said last week this week, yeah, he
left his rackets on the court and walked off. I
that he was probably like, if I go over there,
I'm gonna break every one of my rackets again. I'm
gonna break the water bottles again, I'm gonna embarrass myself again.
So I'm just exit stage.
Speaker 1 (17:42):
And that's called self control, not to Actually, Koboli was
really cute. He when he walked off, he just gave
his racket to talk it away. Who was who was
cheering for? That's so cute. I have to say not
to get to my own inner turmoil, but my dad
was always very strict about sportsmanship, never throwing your racket,
and during junior tenant, I was so well behaved. And
(18:02):
there was something about me in college where you get
very burned out and you get your schedule and you
see every single day of the year where you have
to be what you have to do one day off,
which is Mondays where you have classes and stuff starts
to heat up, and there was something about being away
from my parents, like living my rebellious stage. I got
a racket that these new rackets, and they kind of
(18:24):
were like the bottom was like breaking, kind of like
there's something wrong with this racket. And I was getting
really frustrated because the grip at the bottom was like
kind of off, and I lose a tie break and
I took the racket. I said, this racket's broken. I
threw it in the trash and my coach comes over
and defaults me no, and my parents had traveled from
(18:46):
New York to Wisconsin, and like it was just craziness,
like debauchery. And then yeah, I love a good cracked racket,
but I would do it in the locker room normally.
Once I broke, Honestly, I swear I am not an
angry person. Once I split sets with someone in Dartmouth
(19:10):
and I went into the bathroom and I slammed the
bathroom stall and it broke broke, and I look over
and my teammates just sitting in the locker room and
I'm like, I'm so sorry, I didn't know you were there,
and she's like, it's okay, I get it, And I'm like,
I have no idea how I lost that last set.
But sometimes a little mental breakdown in the bathroom. Normally
it's me just crying, looking in the mirror. Come back
whin the next set, and that's and that's life. That's
(19:33):
just got to take the hit and go next thing?
Speaker 2 (19:36):
Is she on Tegway, like Luis said, off the court,
have a chat with herself back on the court. Although
I don't really love that, I'm kind of over these players.
You know how many times I went to the bathroom
I played twenty two years on professional on the phone, Yeah, twice.
One time because I had my period at Wimbledon, so
as you can imagine, had to go off the court
and twatt. The second time was in the warm up
(19:58):
of the US Open and I looked at Lisa Raymond
and I said, I got to go to the toilet. Yeah,
do you know what? And I'm back and I ran
back on the court. She's like, was it okay? And
I was like, thank god I went to the toilet
because if I had just tried to fart, it would
have been disasting.
Speaker 1 (20:13):
You'd never be invited back to wimblede is nice?
Speaker 2 (20:16):
Okay? I do think girls to go off the court.
It drives me crazy.
Speaker 1 (20:19):
So renight it's kind of a thing in American tennis,
where like if you split sets, you go to the bathroom.
It was very like I would lose the first set
six one, and it's like and we go to the bathroom,
we cried it out, come back, and then win the
next set six one. It was very like normal. But
I remember playing matches where I was up like three
love and the third girl goes to the bathroom, takes
(20:42):
her like twenty minutes because we're like off on a
side court nowhere near a bathroom. Comes back, I lose
the set, and you're just that's kind of just what
happened with it. But it's interesting how professional tennis it's.
It's looked down upon, and I think sometimes the girls
don't know kind of what's right and wrong. I was
pro diarrhea right before the match.
Speaker 2 (21:03):
Well that was me and the warm up at the
US Open.
Speaker 1 (21:05):
Yes, Also, if you're in your period, if you're on
your period, you should be starting every game of fifty love.
Speaker 2 (21:12):
Yeah, I agree. I mean if many people I saw that,
Andy Rottick sord have talked about that on his podcast
because the week before and everyone's like Andy Rotic doesn't
need to be talking about this. I'm like, he's married
to a woman, like get over it. Like also, yes,
Andy Roddicks should be talking about it. I love that
he's like I brought it up and saying how difficult
it is for women and all the things about having
(21:33):
to deal with that. I mean, I didn't play an
Olympics doubles one year, my first ever Olympics, because of
my period was so bad. I was on the first
time it happened to me, and then after that, I subsequently,
you know, I knew how to deal with it. I
couldn't get up. I was in so much pain that.
Speaker 1 (21:48):
Would you would you ever take pills to like skip
that week?
Speaker 2 (21:52):
Oh yeah, I went on the pill immediately, and clearly,
as everybody knows, I didn't worry about getting pregnant. So
I was like, that's how I had to deal with
my professional career.
Speaker 1 (22:01):
But no one talks about it. I had no idea
about it. And there's this thing about sports betting that
apparently they're trying to track women's periods to know fs.
I know, well they're doing it with a w B A.
And then I started doing stand up jokes about it,
being like the w B A if you're in your period.
There should be more points, you know, you should have
(22:22):
he heat heated pads on the benches for all the girls.
Speaker 2 (22:27):
I said, do you know you see them put it
on their back right they sat down, they had it
on their stomach.
Speaker 1 (22:34):
Yeah, put it right in your stomach. Also, I feel
like you should be able to to foul out. You
can't fill out if you're pms like unlimited fouls.
Speaker 2 (22:41):
Should have at least two extra fouls.
Speaker 1 (22:43):
You're like, she's having a day, like, let her go.
Speaker 2 (22:47):
I just know, and then you see your talk to
her buddy us, I'm sorry, man, just like a little
bit out there. Wanted so, I wanted so, I wanted
to bring up cocoa. Like it's been a struggle, right,
she wins the French open. Everyone's like, yes, like this
is it. But but I you know, and I've talked
about it on the podcast a lot. Clay helps her
(23:07):
so much. Right, it gives a timer a forehand. She
can hit kind of a shitty second serve and get
away with it by using her athleticism around the court
to get the balls back in the court and frustrate
her opponents. And on Clay, as you know, and as
I know, it's a patient game. You can't just go
for winners. You can't smash a serve and get a
free point. So why Serena only won a couple of
French opens, like her serve was nullified a little.
Speaker 1 (23:30):
Bit on I know, only a couple of French opens.
Speaker 2 (23:32):
Like that's terrible, terrible, But you're right.
Speaker 1 (23:37):
People can't hit a winner on Coco when it's clay
and she can do have time with her forehand to
kind of guide it gets away with way more on clay.
But my thing with Coco the complete champion mindset. But
it must be exhausting every I joke, oh it's another
cocoa match, But every single match she's pulling out by
(23:58):
the skin of her teeth because you know, she's battling
a lot of stuff within herself, which is the most
relatable thing ever. But it's exhausting.
Speaker 2 (24:36):
Yeah, yeah, I mean listen when I watch her. I mean,
and obviously I know her pretty well, and she's a
great kid. Works so hard, like put in the hours,
does the work off the court.
Speaker 1 (24:49):
She's a very special person.
Speaker 2 (24:50):
Yeah, this great kid, like great kid. You know, it's
always even well before she was like super famous, she
would look me in the eye having a conversation, and
like people go big deal. I'm like, you have no idea,
like for a fifteen year old to stand there and
talk to you and look at you in the eye
and take in what you're saying. And she's just always
been like that. She stands up for the right things
on social media all this stuff, But my god, like perserve,
(25:16):
I don't understand why now she has literally two coaches,
nothing has changed on her serf like Hannah, like the
ball toss is so far ahead of her on the
second serve. I don't understand. There's a couple of basic things.
I tweeted it out the other day. I think she
gets too forward on her serve too early, right, so
she's already sort of leaning into the court. So if
(25:38):
you're leaning into the court, you're going to fall into
the court, which she does. And then she're going to
always hit down on the.
Speaker 1 (25:44):
Ball, and you have to hit up.
Speaker 2 (25:45):
You have to hit up, and you have to stay
up and you have to hit And I call it
seven pm on a ball, right, if you think about
a ball o'clock, she hits at like one pm. She
needs to hit at seven pm right on the under
the ball to get the k She needs a better
kicksurf and I don't understand how they haven't worked on that.
(26:06):
I mean her grip is messed up as well. It's
way too far around, So it must be. It must
be so stressful because I used to have a little
bit of a yip on my toss for a little while. Yeah,
to have literally before the Wimbledon final, on my first one,
I was having a like I was literally having an
anxiety attack about my bald toss on record at Wimbledon.
(26:28):
In the fire, I managed to deal with it, but like,
I just got a I got a feeling just now,
like oh, like not a Chelsea Handler feeling, but like
a feeling of like Pannick. Yes, because she's on. Every
match is on cenecor, every match is on Tennis Channel,
every match on ESPN. It's like, what a fucking nightmare
(26:51):
for anxiety to deal with.
Speaker 1 (26:52):
That, and having me on as a non professional, I
can speak on someone who had a lot of mental
stuff on the court. I was the queen of yips
and I actually feel very connected to Coco, not because
I won any Grand Slams, but because I had an
extreme forehand grip and I was ranked like top fifteen
(27:13):
in the nation at fourteen, and then I went to
a tennis academy and changed my grip and I never
felt comfortable swinging through, which is why I became incredible
at fourhand slicing, which is for a whole other podcast does.
Speaker 2 (27:26):
And she's throwing a slice, so I'm like, what.
Speaker 1 (27:28):
The fuck was it's and it's not a shot. It's
a shot that she could easily set up. But I'm
the one. I'm hitting my forehand on the back foot,
I'm decelerating. And I would argue, based on what she's
saying where she said I'm practicing so well, I think
she's probably hitting crazy great kick serves in practice, but
her yip is kind of like leaning forward and trying
(27:49):
to push it down in and then with the forehand
you just start slowing. It's it's so fucking mental. Excuse
my French, oh, I swear all the time, but with
her yet we're Aussies. But for her, it's like she
has so many brand deals and she's on social media,
which I hope, I hope her team is just letting
(28:11):
her post but not consuming it, because I would argue
Osaka is one of them. There's a lot of people
who I think are on social media too much and
it's affecting right before they serve. They're listening to tweets
in their head of people talking shit, which tennis players
never had to deal with in the past. Just I mean,
they'd have the press, but you could just don't read
(28:32):
the newspaper. Nowadays you're getting notifications every second every day.
So I'm also Coco, she's busy. I just got, you know,
some emails. She's doing a dinner, she's doing whatever. She
has all these brand deals. Other girls aren't doing this,
but she's creating, you know, generational wealth. But she has
a lot on her plate. And but you're right with
(28:53):
the serve. Other people they'll even if they're the best
serve ever, they change it every year, like Alcrez changing
you know, little tweaks all the time. So I agree
with everything you're saying.
Speaker 2 (29:05):
Yeah, I mean, my suggestion to her would be after
the US Open, no Asia, just shut it down like Serena.
She didn't play Asia, she didn't even play the WTA
finals like Because you also have to look at the
surface right now, if at the end of the year
was on Clay go for it, play right, but it's
on fast, hard courts in China and in Asia or
(29:28):
in Europe indoors, which none of them are going to
be great for her surf. So I think you you
either decide that you're going to break it down like
big time and change it and check everything about it,
the grip, the ball toss, everything. Now, if she like
as you said, if she's hitting it great in practice
and never misses it, I still believe and I will
(29:49):
believe this till the day I die, and Billy Jean
King ossis bad technique breaks down under pressure. So I
don't care if she's hitting it. If a coach is
saying but she's hits it great in practice, I'm like, Okay,
that's fine, but her technique is not good. Her elbow
is down, her grip is wrong, she's hitting on the
wrong side of the ball, the ball toss is in
(30:10):
the wrong position, all those things, and with no pressure,
it's going to go in in practice. But in a match,
if you have bad technique, it is going to break
down a.
Speaker 1 (30:20):
Well, look what Sabalinka did. Yeah, she had she had
a good enough serve until she got the yips with it.
And she changed the entire kind of technique behind it,
and now it's it's been solid. The thing with Cocoa two,
which is something I dealt with at a low, much
lower level, was that I was winning a lot. So
(30:41):
like when you're winning your matches, getting way, I'm getting
away with it. So and I'm playing one. I don't
want to go down to floor. So I'm like, I
don't want to restructure, and like, she's number two in
the world right.
Speaker 2 (30:53):
Now, She's just want a slam.
Speaker 1 (30:55):
She's in major contention everywhere she goes, so it's difficult.
But I do you think her maybe not doing the
Asian swing and making some subtle changes and sticking to
it could be really good base.
Speaker 2 (31:08):
Yeah, I mean that's that would be my advice for her.
You know, look, if she goes and Whin's the US Open,
I'm like, fuck, who am I?
Speaker 1 (31:13):
Right?
Speaker 2 (31:14):
But I mean the bottom line is on the problem
is these players, like you know the Towsons and you
know the Mumbaco we're going to get to oh yes,
like these are tall, tall girls. Go after the return.
You know this? She on Texas Sabalancas, the rebarking all
these players are beat Cocoa on a fast cord was
(31:35):
a nightmare matchup on grass for us. Any chick that
goes after the return big time is going to always
threaten Coco on a fast cord.
Speaker 1 (31:45):
Well, that's the thing. We're not questioning how incredible Coco is.
It's that she wants to be bigger than Serenda Williams.
So if you want to do that and you're dealing
with this must much stress in a first round at
a one thousand three after three setter after three setter.
I don't think it's sustainable. Emotionally, it's not so like.
(32:06):
But I also I don't know if her fourhand will
ever be you know, solid, But I think if she
could get that served down, it'll make her life so
much easier one hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (32:16):
I think if she serves better and more consistently and
has that feeling of like, oh I'm okay, his first
service massive, it's over one hundred and twenty miles an hour.
It's ridiculous. I mean I had a decent serve and
if I got up one sixteen, I was pretty happy.
You know, I'm five Hans, Coco is about my height.
I'm like, it's big. But if you're not hitting that
in panic stations.
Speaker 1 (32:38):
Yeah, I think Coco can beete everyone, but it's about
can you do it every day? Like her ability is there,
but like how Sabalanca could just blow people off the court.
Every match with Coco, I get a stomach ache. I
get so stressed, and I can't imagine how her team
and her are feeling. And I just want her to
have a long, happy career.
Speaker 2 (33:00):
We all trust me. We all do because I can
tell you from a TV standpoint as well, there's about
three players that bring really good numbers and it's Novak
and Alcarez and Coco. Wow, that in and of itself,
we need her in the game and we need to
do to work. And on top of it, she's a
great kid. So I just want her to, as you said,
not go on the court feeling so anxious all the time. Mumbaco, Well,
(33:24):
let's just chat about that. I mean, as a player,
I do see some some things on her serve as
well that it's working now and it's massive. The first
over the second serves a little predictable elbows, lots of
things I pick on the little She has.
Speaker 1 (33:38):
Quite unique kind of head movement on her grounds jokes.
Have you noticed she kind of she jerks her head,
but I guess it helps her with acceleration and she
hits a flatcome to the WTA, there's it just flies.
(33:59):
I love her her maturity on the court.
Speaker 2 (34:02):
Yeah, and I love her. Yeah, she's chill.
Speaker 1 (34:06):
You're right, she's like laughing with her coaches after missing beforehand.
I really like her. She's also she's a child. Yes,
she's a child, but she's I think she's here to stay.
Speaker 2 (34:17):
Yeah, and I think she can get way better. Like
I think technique why she's going to get better and better.
I think, as I said, the surf I think can
get better and if it does, look out because to
keep can playing. She moves well for her height, like
she's she's certainly wont to watch. She'll be pushed today
against the Rabacchino. We'll see where she stands up in
that situation. I want to chat about Naomi Osaka. When
(34:40):
if your matches in Montreal, New coach on board with
Thomas Witchgrousie got rid of your Pemo.
Speaker 1 (34:47):
You know Osaka. I watched her in the beginning of
this tournament and she still had this kind of like
depression over her like she still seemed frustrated, but she
pulled out the matches, and I think enough matches, she's
gonna wake up one day and just be like back
in it. I would argue. It's funny though, I when
they cut to like her previous matches, like winning slams
(35:08):
in like twenty nineteen, her footwork was different.
Speaker 2 (35:12):
Oh it was better.
Speaker 1 (35:13):
Have you noticed that she was She had a very
diligent footwork, and then it cuts back to the current
match and she's still slappy on the footwork a bit.
Speaker 2 (35:21):
Yeah. Yeah, I think that's the one thing. And I
watched to lose to Emma Ratikano last week in DC,
and the one thing I noticed about her because she
looks great, Like she looks fit. She's like out of
shape or anything like that. She's in shape. For her
footwork and her just it's not good and she's missing
shots that she wouldn't have. Maybe working now with Thomas Witchgroowski,
(35:43):
because he's like he's a task master man. I mean
he's tough, and he's got a personality of like my pen.
Speaker 1 (35:50):
Right, I mean he's not messing around.
Speaker 2 (35:53):
He's not a rah rah guy, right, And clearly going
from working with egostrion Tech and Radvanska who she was.
He was working probably, I mean two great feet footwork. Yeah,
worked hard, we're quick around the court. Like he's probably
gonna get that in order because you're so right, Hannah,
Like that's the area that she's just not good at anywhere.
Speaker 1 (36:14):
And if you're a super aggressive player, your footwork has
to be even better because you're going for bigger shots
and you can't go for the big shots if your
footwork isn't there. So it's really critical. I feel like
Coco could get away with, you know, slap your footwork
because she's hands, she's she's just getting stuff back sometimes.
But Naomi needs to get her footwork right to dominate
like she did before. I also, can I bring up
(36:36):
my American girls?
Speaker 2 (36:37):
I have some I was literally about to say before.
I can't let you go without talking about Maddie Keys,
just like suffering through some matches. But also before we
get to the good stuff. Yes, Piccola, what's going on
your buddy?
Speaker 1 (36:49):
I know. Just also my claim to fame as I
played doubles with Jesse Pegoula when we were like fifteen sixteen.
We lost the match definitely because of me, and I
bring it up all the time. I honestly like she's
been so consistent for so long. I just I think
it's okay that you know she's having some losses, take
the loss and try to get in your groove again,
(37:13):
get in your mojo again. Did you tell her this,
I'm gonna I'm going to DM her?
Speaker 2 (37:18):
Yeah, I think. I mean, I listen, what do you
think that it's link?
Speaker 1 (37:21):
Okay?
Speaker 2 (37:23):
I mean listen, I think that. Look, Jesse's whole game
is is talk about hitting the ball flat, and you know,
she has to be she has to be really confident
because that ball, she hits it deep, she hits it
very close to the net. There's not a lot of
room for her to be playing badly. She's not. She's
not going to start rolling it in. She's not going
to start hitting more top spin. That's just not how
(37:44):
So she has to be confident in her game. And
she's lost some tough ones. I mean, the Layla Fernandez
class in Washington was probably that was that was the
tough loss. And I got to give kudos because I
didn't do a pod last week. Laila Fernandez was awesome
last week. I mean, she had some unbelieva. Was so
nice to see her win a couple of matches.
Speaker 1 (38:00):
It was a la the US Open energy.
Speaker 2 (38:03):
We almost had the US Open final like each other
since that final, so it was kind of bummed to
Emma loss at semi, but she had a good web
in Naomi. But yeah, it's nice to see them back
when I do.
Speaker 1 (38:14):
Think with Jesse, I haven't been like tracking all her results,
but it comes a point where you know, Coco is
winning some Grand Slams and I feel like she wants
to have a breakthrough in the Grand Slam. And I
don't know how mentally every week they show up when
they have some like frustrations, like Jesse wants to win
the Slam. She saw Maddie do it like she's ready,
(38:35):
and it could kind of weigh on you maybe, but
I think she has it in her. She just needs
a pop of a tournament, like she needs to remind
these girls who she is.
Speaker 2 (38:44):
Well US So I mean obviously Cincinnati, she'll do well
the other courts and Court's really good for her. Shout
out to Cincinnati. Oh my god, the new grounds look
unbelievable and everybody said to me, there's like it feels
like a grand slam, Amnavaras. Yes, it's put a lot
of money with the Cincinnati. It's Mason. Okay, it's not,
but it's Mason the Cincinnati, and you know, they put
(39:07):
a lot of money into it, and apparently it looks unbelievable.
So maybe Jess has her breakout week they're going into
the US Open, because she's defending finals points at the
US Open. Well.
Speaker 1 (39:16):
Also also Emma, she's in her like sophomore year, some
would say, and people know her game now, but I
think she's due also for a heart result.
Speaker 2 (39:28):
Do you think that it's coming in the next couple
of weeks.
Speaker 1 (39:32):
I don't know. I just know that she's so good
coming in as the underdog and just like being like,
you guys don't even know how good I am. And
then now that she's seated, it's a whole different mentality,
and I think she's getting comfortable with that.
Speaker 2 (39:47):
Yeah, And I think that that's what people don't really understand.
It's like she came into you know, out of college,
you know, a good college player, very good, very good
college player, into the pros and it's like it's a
different world. It's profecttionals, it's people that are literally it's
their job to be on a tennis court two three
four hours a day in the gym two hours a day,
like it's a job. And Emma, bloody hell, she came
(40:10):
in like as president. She came in like I'm gonna
be a pro her.
Speaker 1 (40:15):
She wasn't intimidated by anyone.
Speaker 2 (40:17):
No, no, and she has that such cool swagger and
she's such a funny kid. That's so funny. Yes, she
looks very chill on the court, and everyone's like, does
she have a personality on? Like, trust me off the court.
Speaker 1 (40:27):
So I heard the de grape Vine that she listens
to Giggle Squad, which is my podcast to calm down.
So I'm gonna need to make her lap. Yeah, I know,
I'm freaking out. So she'll every now and then message
me that she's a giggler, which is really really really cool.
I'm you know what I'm saying. I'm getting into the WTA.
I recently was dming Jennifer Brady, who also is hilarious.
(40:52):
I said, Babe, you gotta get that big ice forehand
back on tour. Let's get it together. So I'm I'm
doing some mental rehab with her. Also, can I just say,
Peyton Steren's struggling, though, man, when she do you remember
if she had like a ton of really close losses
in the beginning, when she was like really confident, it
(41:14):
really took a toll on her. I feel like and
hurt her confidence when I want her to get back
to I feel like if she had won one of
those three setters, she could have been like popping off.
Speaker 2 (41:25):
But I tell you, Hannah, her issue is her serf.
It is not good. Like her first service, okay, her
second serve against Venus. I say, Everyone's like, do you
think Venus has a chance to even come close in
this match? And I was like, in this match, she
actually can win. And I said, and the reason is
(41:46):
if she serves well, if Venus serves well enough, which
she served great in that match, like was still popping
down one eighteen miles an hour, Like, okay, she hit
the first time that Peyton hit a second serf, which
was the first point of her service game, Venus hit
one hundred and fifty mile an hour, fourhand down the
line winner, And I went, that's why she can win
(42:07):
this match because Peyton's second serve is not good.
Speaker 1 (42:10):
A coach once told me You're only as good as
your second serve, which is why I'm sitting here today
as a podcaster. But it is valid and that's what
breaks down shut out to Venus, I was texting you
throughout that whole match. I'm so excited to see her
out there. And I mean, her footwork was great, her
the sound of the ball coming off her racket couldn't
(42:32):
have been crisper. How happy are you about this?
Speaker 2 (42:35):
Oh? Yeah, I mean it was great. I mean just
to see her, like with that smile on her face
after she won, because she's always been proud of me.
You know, she's always sort of given that like I'm
too cool, Like I'm not going to get too excited
about stuff. You know, even in the postmatch interview, she
wouldn't give you that much. I mean, the joy on
her face when she won that match was like she'd
won a Grand Slam. It was. It was so nice
to see someone who'd been putting in the work clearly
(42:58):
to get that win. Like, even if it's the last
one she ever wins, at least she got a win.
Speaker 1 (43:03):
And I also think she's such a Hall of Famer
and like everything for the sport. But she happened to
have a sister who was freaking everything. So sometimes I
feel like she, like people not forgot about Venus, but
sometimes she was, you know, behind the scenes with the
Serena stuff. But now her being able to at this
(43:24):
age accomplish this, I think is such a beautiful moment
for her and what she represents for the sport.
Speaker 2 (43:29):
I just hope, you know, playing at the US Open
she has like a decent week and or a match
or two or whatever, and that she gives the crowd
what the crowd got with Serena a couple of years ago.
But more importantly for her, she's got her WTA health
insurance for at least another year.
Speaker 1 (43:45):
Thank goodness.
Speaker 2 (43:47):
This is America as a self employed person, as probably
you are, yes, getting insurance. Health insurance is some bullshit
or you get it, and it's horrible.
Speaker 1 (43:56):
Venus needs to get her teeth cleaned too.
Speaker 2 (43:59):
Yeah, exactly, all right. Last thing that I want to
talk to you about, because I tweeted this out the
other day about the frustration level I have with producers
show the crowd every single goddamn point, and on top
(44:19):
of it, they don't show the handshakes or they don't
show player's reaction when they win matches. It drives me crazy.
Why do you think this is I don't they're trying
to be like cinematographers.
Speaker 1 (44:32):
No, My biggest grape with golf is like after someone
hits a bad shot, they always they always leave it,
and I'm like, show me the guy being frustrated, show
me him cursing on his caddy, Like this is the
drama I want. The tennis reactions is so important. I
love when they show player, then they show the other player.
That's what I want to see.
Speaker 2 (44:52):
We miss that Koboli Ben Shelton thing because we went
from showing Ben sort of going oh what the book,
and then we never showed Coboli's reaction and that was
the whole They showed the crowd. I'm like, no, Caboli's reaction.
If you're on it, that's what you would have shown.
Speaker 1 (45:08):
Do you think it's like golf where they're trying to
like keep it as classy as possible and like god
forbid someone curses or something.
Speaker 2 (45:16):
Oh, I think they would. No one was looking at
Ben Shelton going The commentators were like, well, we don't.
We can't really work out why he's getting frustrated. I
was listening to the World feed on that one. I
don't know what the Tennis channel guys said, but I
was just like, what what do you mean. He's obviously
gestured something's pissed him off with Koboli. Yeah, never showed
(45:36):
Coboli's reaction. So towards the end they're like, oh, I
don't know what's going.
Speaker 1 (45:40):
On, and they were all confused, and then it's like,
go find a replay of what they're referring to. I
want to be in the drama, and you know it's
gonna have tons of articles about it, so you might
as well at the facts. So we all have opinions.
Speaker 2 (45:53):
I would go as far as I say, like it
and you know, night to my own horn, But like
an ESPN, we would say to the produce because sometimes
our producers are on it right. They would have seen
it as well, and they would have had their cameras
on and they would ah his reaction boom, and they
would have got that up right. Sometimes or a lot
of times, it's also on us as commentators to be like,
get hey, hey, get get Cabaldi's reaction. We'll talk back
(46:14):
to the producer Andy, get that and that'll tell the
story and oh, this is why here it is. And
so when they're shaking hands and they're having that moment,
it's like, oh, this is why.
Speaker 1 (46:23):
I also dislike when for some reason the mic doesn't
capture like a full conversation to the ref and like
no one knows what the person's mad at. I'm like,
I want to get the te can. I also have
one hot take too about filming. I'm obsessed with when
they have the camera kind of more behind the players, yes,
and you get to feel like you're playing oh.
Speaker 2 (46:45):
Yeah with the lower camera.
Speaker 1 (46:46):
Whenever they do that, for like return a serve like awesome.
I love it, like to feel what it's like to
return like Opelka serve like I. Whenever it's in that position,
I love it. So if any your producers are listening,
put a couple more behind the player. Yeah, I agree.
Speaker 2 (47:01):
It's amazing how many people write to me about that
as well. And it was just like, hey, that that
camera position is amazing, Like can we see it again?
Speaker 1 (47:10):
What do you think about the make being on the coaches.
Speaker 2 (47:16):
Well as a as a coach, from time to time,
you got to watch what the f you're saying because again,
the producers have the ability to put that up or
down right, and so if you're saying this and f
and that, they'll probably lower it because I don't want
that on there on their TV. But but yeah, I
think I think it's great. I think it's great when
(47:37):
you hear like Ben Shelton's dad saying stout stuff to him,
or like the other day he said on match point,
he goes, if you go down the two, it'll be
an ace. I'm thinking, mate, if he hits it anywhere
on the court, it's gonna be And you know what
he did, He went out wide and hit it because
his dad, you should have dead boy turned around, was like,
(47:57):
But I thought that was kind of hilarious. But anyway, Hannah,
I mean, I could keep you here all day, all day.
I just want everybody to know the last time I
hit tennis balls, Hannah. And this is a true story because,
as you know, I went to Wimbledon to play in
the in the legends, but oh, there's my soup. He's
dropping something off. But I didn't get to play because
(48:19):
I had to go home for my mom's funeral and stuff.
So it was a bit of a disaster. So the
last time I hit tennis balls was with you, Hannah
Burner in New York.
Speaker 1 (48:27):
Can we do it again?
Speaker 2 (48:28):
Please?
Speaker 1 (48:29):
I would love to. I had so much fun. You
were helping me with my back in Vali, and we
got into quite a groove, like we had some really
good rallies.
Speaker 2 (48:38):
Yeah. I hadn't hit for like five months, and I
was like, oh I still got it.
Speaker 1 (48:40):
I'm okay, thank god, but I had so much fun.
Speaker 2 (48:44):
Let's do it.
Speaker 1 (48:44):
Definitely do it again. Let's actually, should we get a
wildcard to the US Open?
Speaker 2 (48:49):
Oh yeah, let's start pleading now, like Alex d. Minor
is pleading to get a wild card with his soon
to be wife.
Speaker 1 (48:58):
I didn't.
Speaker 2 (48:59):
Oh yeah, he he is, like he is, like if
he could write a resume, he would. It's a classic
what he's trying to do right now. But anyway, I
hate given props, and he deserves one, because that guy
is unbelievable. Yes, Hannah, you have your None of Your
Business tour. Oh yes, starting in two days, and if
(49:22):
you want to go to it in the first five shows,
bad fucking luck because it's sold out.
Speaker 1 (49:28):
Go at Hanniburn dot com. I'm probably coming to your
state in the in the fall. Check it out and yeah,
I'm so I'm so happy to be on this part
and I have to come back. Maybe you is open,
we'll talk.
Speaker 2 (49:38):
Yeah, let's do something that us open, because you know,
you know your tennis. You watch your tennis. I love that.
Yourself so into it. It's my favorite thing. And if
you follow Hannah on Instagram Hannah Burner, all she posts
are her fucking videos hitting tennis balls. It's so you
play more tennis than anybody I know, other than maybe
my other podcast partner Caitlyn Thompson, who plays.
Speaker 1 (50:00):
Oh look, we love the game. It's a game for life.
Speaker 2 (50:04):
You frustrated, D one and college.
Speaker 1 (50:08):
That's of my biography.
Speaker 2 (50:10):
We cannot let go of the dream. Oh well, Michael
Kosta wrote a book as you and I know Michael
quite well, and I have his book here because he
sent it to me called Lucky Loser. I read it. Yeah,
So anyway, I just love the fact that the two
of you are killing it so much in comedy and
tennis is such a great way to not only stay
fit and healthy, but also I don't know, you just
(50:31):
you understand the ups and downs and getting out there
in front of a crowd and just doing what you're doing.
It's it's amazing. So August seventh, the tour starts. So
proud of you. Hit some tennis balls and I was
a little surprised that you had the start of the
tour before the US Open, thinking that you might start
it after.
Speaker 1 (50:50):
But you're a pro, you know. I took that week
off for the US Open.
Speaker 2 (50:57):
There you go. That's when you know's I would have
to see you there again, desk, That's that's my goal.
Speaker 1 (51:03):
Oh my god, I would pee myself and.
Speaker 2 (51:06):
Make sure Dan is there, Santa in the studio.
Speaker 1 (51:09):
Shout out to Dan, Shout out to Dan.
Speaker 2 (51:12):
Hannah, I love you so much that I.
Speaker 1 (51:13):
Love you dude, Thank you, Renee.
Speaker 2 (51:16):
I'd have a good rest of your day. And by
what's the cat's name, oh boos has been spooting around
you the whole time. Ye
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