June 18, 2025 • 34 mins
Into the middle of grass season—the uber specific, tiny portion of the calendar—the USTA has dropped the event of the year, the all-star Mixed Doubles extravaganza featuring heroes, villains, the inept and the cuties. We break out of our regularly scheduled week off to bring you this important power ranking of PPM (pegs per match), face cards, and sub/dom dynamics that will leave you agog.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:14):
Hi everybody, and welcome to the Renee Stubs Tennis podcast.
I am Renee Stubs and we are not together. Caitlyn
is in New York and I am in Kahn. I
am in Khan for can Lyon. I'm doing a bunch
of stuff over here for my couple of different companies.
And I am hot, Caitlin, and I don't mean yes,
I'm hot, I mean it is hot over here, dude.
(00:37):
So we are fully set in the summer of our
lives and also tennis because the French Open is over.
We're on the grass now. We're all excited, but we
are really going to talk a little bit about We're
going to fast forward because I've been texted and tweeted
at and black mixed doubles. There's excitement, there's WTF is
(00:58):
going on? Your first initial thoughts Kaitlin on the partners
spakes that are happening. It's crazy.
Speaker 2 (01:03):
This player's list, this lineup goes unbelievably hard. It goes
hard and it doesn't quit. Okay, let me just read
you some of the highlights and then we'll get into it.
The pairings are unhinged, unhinged, Okay, Chinwin Jung Jack Draper,
Yannick Sinner, Emma Navarro. We got two Italians Yasmin Paulini,
Lorenzo Mussetti, Americans Tommy Paul Jpeg, Jessica Pegula, Rushians together,
(01:29):
Mir and.
Speaker 3 (01:30):
Reva, Danielle Medvedev.
Speaker 2 (01:31):
Then it gets funky, ready for this Taylor Fritz, Elena Rebakna,
Sure why not, Arina Sblanka, Grigor Dimitrov, two Serbs, Olga Danilovich,
who's a very good.
Speaker 3 (01:42):
Young big ball striker, and Novak Djokovic.
Speaker 2 (01:45):
That'll be fun all American Francis Tiafo, Madison Keys. That
one got a lot of shine. A lot of people
are very excited about that. Igish Fiantek Caspar Rude boyfriend
girlfriend Tzipas Bodosa. No surprise there the one that everyone
seems to be the most excited about, even though it's
not my top pick, even though they are very cute
and awesome. Am Aratakanu Carlos Alcoraz. This sort of like
(02:06):
mirrors the stan narrative that's going on the Internet, where
people are convinced that Carlos Alvarez has a crush on
a marat Kanu.
Speaker 3 (02:12):
Maybe that's true, maybe it's not.
Speaker 2 (02:14):
I'm skipping over my favorite pair to highlight name Osaka
and Nick Kirios, which we can get into. There is
the reigning champions, uh Sarah Irani and Vasivori from Finland.
I think I'm leaving somebody off, but the one I'm
most excited about, and frankly the ones I think are
going to win the tournament, Ben Shelton and Taylor Townsend.
(02:35):
What a murderer's row of lineups. Everybody's doing it?
Speaker 1 (02:40):
Yes, nuts, Yeah, I think that. I think that Ben
Shelton Taylor Townsend stands out just because you know Lefty's big,
you know, big serving Ben. But look, who do I
think is gonna win and all of that? Maybe those
guys I don't just don't think that Irani and Vavasori
can be questioned and thought about not winning because they're
(03:01):
doubles players as well. Sarah Ronnie Serve will be questionable.
But then again, when isn't it When when isn't it?
So I don't know. Part of me is so excited
about this. Then there's the flip side of it of
it feels a little exhibition y, right, So I can't.
Speaker 2 (03:23):
Talk about the format because I think that is one
of the main critiques of this feeling a little exhibition
y right, because it is not a full length match.
Speaker 1 (03:33):
Yes, it is a first to four I believe games
three sets. Is that correct?
Speaker 3 (03:38):
I understanding it was first of three, but first of four.
Speaker 1 (03:42):
Yeah, which is basically everyone's serving once, and it feels
like a little bit Team Tennessee, which, by the way,
Team Tennis was first of five. In the end it
was six and then it was five, mainly because you
were playing five sets of singles, doubles and mixed in
World Team Tennis. So it did go quick and it
was no ad. I mean, these matches are going to
go real fast. So I'm not quite sure how I
(04:03):
feel about that. Actually, I know how I feel about that.
That's shit. It's terrible. I think it should be to six.
I think we should play exactly how they played the
system before they already went to the bit of the
chuck raffle. And anybody's listening to our podcast in the path,
you know what the chuck raffle is. It's what Todd
Woodbridge and I called it in two thousand and one
when we won the mixed doubles and we would get
into the ten point tiebreak, and he's kind of anybody's game.
(04:25):
I don't like the first of four. I think that
they should do a regular set. I think they should
play best of two sets and then a ten point
match tie break. Those matches only usually go for like
an hour and twenty minutes. Anyway, that's not taxing on anyone,
and I feel like it does make it very much
an exhibition type style. Now you have to think about Caitlin, like,
there's a history behind the mixed doubles, and there used
(04:48):
to be great singles players that always played the mix,
always played doubles, and it has become taxing on their bodies.
And it also there's so much money now in tennis,
so they don't need to play mixed doubles or doubles
to make money, right. But I don't like that the
fact that they're not playing a regular scoring system. I
think that to tracks from it. And if you're worried
(05:09):
about not getting top plays because it's going to be
too taxing on them, I don't agree with that. I
think you would still get them playing. It's a knockout system.
It's not like they're all going to be playing the
whole tournament. So I don't like that format. I also
think there should be a little onus on if you're
top ten in the world in doubles, you should be
(05:30):
allowed to be in that discussion of being in the
tournament because you know, Okay, before I go on another
tangent on you know, singles players versus doubles players, all
that sort of thud, what are your thoughts.
Speaker 3 (05:42):
On I think people are going to watch it.
Speaker 1 (05:45):
I don't disagree with that, Caitlin.
Speaker 2 (05:47):
I think, at the end of the day, totally valid
and I want to hear your tangent about top ten
doubles players because I think at the most elite end
of the spectrum, mixed doubles is awesome. It's one of
my favorite events, and the history of it is just
like absolutely amazing because.
Speaker 3 (06:05):
It is the only sport in the world where.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
Men and women compete at the same time on the
same field of play at their you know, at their
absolute limit. We saw skiing and other sports attempt to
bring in mixed team events just based on the popularity
of having dual gender The dual gender tournaments get the
most shine, the most money, the most audious. Swimming has
(06:30):
done relays. Yeah, but like skiing, swimming is a relay
system which is about as good as you can get.
This is everybody's playing at the same time, and it's
the most fun. I'll never forget my mother in law,
who cares nothing about tennis, texting me saying, how can
I watch Roger Federer play against Serena Williams. And this
is several years ago, and she was speaking, although she
(06:51):
did not know it, about the Hopman Cup in Australia
over the winter break, and that kind of level of
excitement where the tennis transcends fan nationality, time zone kind
of only happens when you have some nuclear power combinations. Attention,
I'm thinking back, as was Lou Suer, the outgoing CEO
of the USTA, who allegedly came up with this about
(07:13):
the Andy Murray Serena Williams pairing at Wimbledon a couple
of years ago. I was in the stands for that.
I was brought to tears by how enthused, how packed,
how exciting and how awesome it was. And they ended
up winning the match that I watched. And just this
idea that we can create a new fanship for a
legendary product that only our sport can provide is awesome,
and I'm glad to have their revived attention. Most importantly,
(07:35):
I'm really glad that people care about it and we'll
watch it, and maybe this year is the sort of
tester to see if people will come early, because it
is the week before the main draw of single starts,
so it's what we call fan week, and we'll see
based on the amount of caliber and excitement and you know,
names that are attached to this, if we can get
(07:55):
some following and fanship for mixed as a concept, and
maybe next year it's a full size But yeah, I think,
like tragically, nobody watches the current euation of it except
maybe you and me, and that sucks.
Speaker 3 (08:07):
And this is.
Speaker 2 (08:07):
Something that people will watch, and I think you know,
it doesn't It's not terribly more complicated than that for me.
Speaker 1 (08:14):
Yeah, listen, I don't disagree with anything you've just said.
I think that you know, watching it is important, it's exciting,
it's fun, like mixed doubles is great to watch. Doubles
is great to watch, you know, and when people do
watch it, and the tennis enthusiasts love doubles because most
tennis enthusiasts that play play doubles. At a certain age,
it's too tough to run around playing singles all the time,
(08:36):
and unless you're in incredible shape and you've been playing
it in, playing doubles is a lot more fun. It's
one of the reasons why pickleball, which we hate, you know,
they're like, well, we get to hang out with our friends,
and in doubles, yeah, there's four people in the court.
You get to hang out a little bit more. And
I think a lot of the older generation play doubles
and want to watch doubles. So in that regard, I
(08:56):
think it's fantastic. There's a positive and negative to things
I'm going to say, and it might be a little
bit controversy controversial, yeah, but it wouldn't be uske without
a little controversy. And I'm just being honest, right, So
a couple of things. One is back in the day,
and I hate to say that, but a lot of
great singles players played mixed doubles. You think about the
(09:19):
John McEnroe's that played. I'll never forget him playing with
Steffi Graff. He still hasn't forgiven Stepfie about pulling out
of the quarterfinals to Wimbland in his last Wimblin. But
you know, you had great singles players and very good
singles plays playing in the mixed doubles event, and it
slowly started to dwindle and they soldly started to leave
and it became really doubles only sort of tournament. Then,
(09:43):
of course, in doubles we still have and in the
women's game, we have more women playing top players playing
doubles than you do having playing singles. There was a
lot more really good singles players playing doubles. And I
have spoken about it many times, you know, during my
years of playing Kim Kleister's, Lindsey Davenport, a Rancho Sanchez Vicario.
(10:07):
The list is long, very very long. Anybody can look
it up. Who was ranked number one in singles in
the world and number one doubles in the world and
sometimes at the same time. That will never happen anymore.
So that's a shame because the quality of doubles was
so good back twenty years ago. And I don't that's
(10:28):
gonna sound like a slight to players that are playing
doubles now, but it's just a fact. I cannot stress
how that's just the fact. And if any doubles only
player wants to have a go at me about it,
go for it. Because I played ten years of singles
on tour, and I've played predominantly ten years of just
(10:49):
doubles on tour. So I played the lost thirteen singles
and then I played from thirty to forty doubles only right,
I was playing against the players in finals of Grand Slams,
like the Williamson, like the Kim Kleisters, Natalie Tourzia. I mean,
these are players I played in the finals who were
all top ten or number one in the world in singles.
That's what I was playing against to win singles and
(11:10):
doubles Grand Slams. And that has dropped off, and the quality,
in my opinion, has dropped off significantly. We're not seeing
players play great singles and doubles, playing great at the net,
you know, combining those things. And frankly, I think one
of the reasons why, and this might be a little
bit of a controversial stand, I think one of the
reasons why Coco GoF has played well over the last
(11:32):
months as well is that she started playing a little
bit of doubles again and it helps your game, There's
no doubt about it. Andre Eva is a great example.
She's playing singles and doubles every single week. Paolini's playing
singles and doubles every single week. And these are the
players that are getting later parts of singles tournaments. So
I think that this might spur a couple of top
players to play a little bit more doubles or mixed doubles.
(11:53):
And it brings back, as you said, the attention to
the game. And I don't want to be that person's like, oh, Renee,
you know, you'd have to talk about like your day
and age. But it's just a fact. I played when
I won the US Open doubles in two thousand and
or and Lisa Raymon, who was a perennial top ten
singles player. By the way, we beat in the quarterfinals
Martina Hingis and Jennifer Caapriarti in doubles. They were the
(12:14):
number one and the number two players in singles that year, okay,
and we beat them in the quarterfinals. Great doubles players
can beat great singles players. And by the way, both
Jennifer and Martina and I would argue that Martina Hingis
was a better doubles player than singles player, and he
was a great singles player. Yeah, great doubles teams will
(12:37):
not always, but often beat great singles players that play together, right,
And we're talking great doubles teams like you know the
Gigi Fernandez and Vereveras of the world. You know the
Martina navrolovat Pamswiper, who were both very good singles players, clearly,
but you know myself and Lisa Raymond when we were
at our peak, we were beating singles top singles players,
and I think that has dropped off, and I think
(12:57):
the quality of doubles has dropped off, frankly, And you
see four girls on the baseline at the French Open
playing doubles against each other, like what in the actual
f Like that is quality of doubles that I'm sorry
has dropped off. So I think that there's a conversation
that needs to have about how do we make doubles
or mixed doubles more viable, more entertaining, and getting singles
(13:19):
players to play will make it more valuable and it
will give it more gravitas. Again, because some of the
teams and that are winning these doubles and mixed doubles,
they would not compete sometimes with the great singles players
that played more doubles. So I like this. I just
don't like the scoring system. I don't like the exhibition
feel of that.
Speaker 2 (13:39):
Great, I think we're in total agreement, and I think
what I'm particularly interested in is, well, you know, my
if I'm become commissioner of tennis, I'm making I'm stripping
back the tours and the tournaments that matter to like
ten to fifteen, and everybody has to play all events.
(14:00):
If you got to play singles, you gott play doubles,
and you gotta play mixed you get fewer stops on
the tour. But you really got to commit and like
give people a couple of different products. That's how you know,
you know, John McEnroe and Mary Carillo want to mix slam.
Speaker 3 (14:14):
Together like things.
Speaker 2 (14:16):
Fun things happen when I think you put some interesting
combinations together, and that is certainly what we have in
this draw, which is why I think it's really interesting
that we have this like player lineup that is personalities
that you kind of think are like, Okay, who is
going to record the most pegs in a single match.
It's definitely going to be Ben Shelton and Taylor Townsend
(14:37):
if they don't have I want to like special counter
that's like pegs per match. How many people are they
hitting with balls?
Speaker 3 (14:44):
I had to see like at least four.
Speaker 1 (15:00):
M Arena and Dimitrov. I think Arena Sabalanka might be
(15:29):
don't think that Madison Keyes might be pegging people with
their groundstrokes either.
Speaker 3 (15:32):
Great, this is what I'm talking about.
Speaker 2 (15:34):
This is what I want. There's a pretty hilarious rooky
diamond on Twitter has created the US Open Mixed Doubles
power rankings based on the number of words that teammates
have ever spoken to each other, and at the bottom
of the list is Elena Rebakna and Taylor Fritz.
Speaker 3 (15:49):
Have they ever had a conversation?
Speaker 1 (15:51):
Well, I think the reason I had to play together. No,
But didn't they win the Indian World Exhibition Tournament.
Speaker 3 (15:58):
Yes, good point.
Speaker 1 (15:59):
That's why, Kate lens they've already had interaction. And let
me tell you something. They're not gonna bet. They're gonna
be hard to beat, for sure, Big serves Taylor's a
little bit afraid of anything at the net, so that
will be questionable. But he doesn't have to worry about
it because his player is hitting a second and he's
serving huge. The person I'm concerned about is Bava. Sorry,
(16:20):
if they get drawn up against the Madison Keys, who's
gonna take her serve and put a bullet through him?
Speaker 2 (16:29):
I mean some would argue Vasivori is a little bit
of ack for punishment. Well, you know again respectfully, and
I think this speaks to your point before you know,
he and Sarah Ronnie won it last year, but they
are the only team basically in here that is not
composed of singles superstars. So yeah, like what happens when
(16:54):
he's got to defend serves from to the Fritz or
a forehand Madison Keys, you know, like a Rittasa Blaker, Like,
I don't know, I think it's gonna be. I think
he's gonna get kind of brutalized up there.
Speaker 1 (17:07):
I guess what we will we will find out. I'll
be the doubles, the mixed doubles champions of last year,
how they proved themselves up against the lineup like this
of incredible singles players that hit the ball really well.
All right, now, again it's not a flight because look,
I wasn't a great returner. You know, I won two
(17:28):
mixed doubles tournaments and I beat a rancho Sanchez, Curry
on Todd Woodbridge, who's argued one of the greatest doubles
players of all time, you know, and I played with
at the time Jared Palmer, who was a great doubles player,
and you know, and then in another final that I played,
played Lisa Raymond and Leander Pays, and Leander Pay is
one of the greatest. I would put Leander Pays and
(17:48):
Lisa Raymond up against any of these teams, you know,
any of these singles players, but at least obviously it's
an incredible singles player. And Leander and his own right,
was a pretty decent singles player. But we gonna find
out the level of a defending champion against quality singles
players the ball as well as all of these players do.
Speaker 3 (18:08):
For sure.
Speaker 2 (18:09):
And I also think, uh, you know, some of the players,
like you said, like Amira Andreva, uh you know, don't
forget Arina Sablinka has a couple of doubles Grand Slam titles.
Like some of these folks are really accomplished doubles players.
We just don't see them doing it that much, maybe
because they've prioritized, you know, other things. But yeah, like
you said, at Coco has played doubles. She most famously
(18:30):
played a lot with Jessica Pagoula, who pairs with Tim
and Paul, who like, I love that pair up. I
think that's really interesting. A lot has been made about
Naomi Osaka and nik Kirius. A lot of folks have
sort of sent me that as a line like, oh,
they're super disappointed to see a lot of people kind
of feel a certain way about Nick, you know, which
fair enough, like you don't I think you don't get
(18:50):
to repost, you know, Andrew Tait quotes on Twitter without
getting some feedback. But the thing that most people need
to know is Naomi Osaka and Nikias share an agent.
So a lot of these are marriages of convenience. And
I'm not sure that they are, you know, the best
of friends or not. But keep in mind, like that's
that's how Nick curious gets into this thing, because otherwise
he doesn't work the tennis.
Speaker 1 (19:10):
I mean, listen, controversial take that's the one team that
I am questioning because Nick hasn't played at all and
is he playing or not? And then there's probably a
team that probably could have taken that spot. Now having
said that, will they get bums in seats absolute, ad
lutely completely, and that's the issue, and that's what Nick
says on you know, I sell out and people come
and watch me play, and all of that is true.
(19:31):
But at the same time you have to also say, yeah,
but are you are you a player? Are you playing
on tour? You know, every single person in this draw
when it comes to the men, are all great singles
players playing on tour every single day. So you know,
that's probably the one team that you know, if I
saw the alternate, I'd like to know the alternates, you know,
(19:52):
the team that I don't.
Speaker 2 (19:53):
Who didn't who didn't get yeah right.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
Yeah, who requested to play and who didn't get in.
I would like to know that, And I think they
should post that. I think they should post the ten
alternate teams because I guarantee you there'll be one of
these teams that don't play.
Speaker 3 (20:07):
For sure, for sure.
Speaker 1 (20:08):
I mean it's a her side, they're a little bit injured,
or you know, something's going on and they don't want
to they don't want to threaten there playing the following
week in singles.
Speaker 2 (20:18):
Yeah, or if your Nick and you have like some
brand obligations, then you kind of take a spot from
a wild card and then decide not to play, which
is I think what has happened now in wimbled and
in some other places because you don't want to not
do the commercial side of things. From the cutey petuity angle,
Carlos Alcoraz and Emarata Kanu, come on, what are we
(20:40):
doing so cute?
Speaker 3 (20:41):
And then some other folks have mentioned.
Speaker 1 (20:43):
I would argue that they are and this is nothing
against any of them. I would argue just talking from
a perspective of doubles, everybody, so don't lose your mind,
because you all know how I feel like out both
of them. I've talked about them both very glowing over
the last couple of years. That's the weakest pair that
(21:03):
and maybe Eager and Casper the only reason there's it's
more there's a there's a little bit of a weakness
in the doubles aspect. Eager's the great returner, could serve
a Casper. I'm not sure how great he is in
the doubles perspective. Emma Carlos, I saw him play doubles
with a Rapi. He was kind of like a little
(21:25):
lost puppy out there, didn't know where to hit the
ball half the time, or where to stand on the court,
And I was like, oh, it's great. A player is
his ears and of course he's argua the best player
in the world right now. I don't know how his
doubles acumen.
Speaker 3 (21:36):
Is pretty poor.
Speaker 2 (21:38):
But again, this is the qt ptuity power rankings and.
Speaker 1 (21:41):
The going on that. Okay, if you're just going on.
Speaker 3 (21:43):
That, they're at the top for me.
Speaker 1 (21:45):
I mean, and Emma is interesting because I mean, when
was the last time Emma Davarra played doubles. I mean probably,
I'm guessing doubles is such a different game to singles, Okay,
and everyone out there that doesn't understand that, which is
why back sorry to say this again, but back in
you know, the nineties and two thousands, these singles players
(22:06):
that were number one in the world in doubles and
singles were great doubles plays because they were playing doubles
all the time. They weren't just stepping on the court
and hitting a tennis ball. Really well, doubles is a
different game. It's not the same as singles. You hit
the ball the same, but you have to know where
to stand, you have to know angles, you have to
know you know where to stand at the net. You
have to be able to bolly you're at the net,
(22:29):
and teams at the net that are good at the
net are always going to win doubles matches. I don't
care who you are. And the reason why Paolini and
you know Irani do well is because the Rani's great
at the net. She's got great hands. She knows when
where to hit the volley, how to hit the volley,
and where to stand even though her serf is so bad,
(22:49):
they just stand back Paolini. Remember we talked about this.
Everyone hits the ball then to Paolini and a RUnni
runs into that. I'm like, if you're smart, you hit
the ball to a Rani and then you keep hitting
the ball to a running on the bay and you
cannot lose.
Speaker 2 (23:03):
Then well listen, I really hope you are going to
commentate this because it seems like we had a thorough
technical maybe live from our footprint in New York.
Speaker 3 (23:11):
Stay tuned for more details about that.
Speaker 2 (23:14):
The other cutey p Tuity power ranking couple that I
want to call out is Chinwin Jung and Jack Draper.
I mean, face Card meets face Card, whoa like that
is giving Vogue editorial.
Speaker 1 (23:26):
That is giving Vogue editorial. I see major. I wonder
if they have the same agents, but having very likely
that is an interesting pairing. That is an interesting pairing.
Speaker 2 (23:37):
I just somebody was like, oh, chin Win's a nerd
and he's sort of soft boy, and I was like,
chin Win would eat him for breakfast. Don't make no mistake,
chin Win is going to be the boss of that team.
Speaker 1 (23:54):
Which what we should do is have a power ranking
of who is going to be the captain of every
tame good point.
Speaker 3 (24:00):
Okay, so Madison, Francis, Tiafa.
Speaker 1 (24:03):
Okay, I'm gonna go through those because they got in
front of me. Navarro Finner, I think that is an
equal captaincy Agree, Okay. Neither of them are super outgoing.
Speaker 3 (24:12):
Or loud, two introverts, very chill, yep.
Speaker 1 (24:17):
Draper chin Win We've already discussed definitely going to be
chin Win, Pagoula, Tommy Paul, very similar personalities. I would
say a little bit of this and a little bit
of that on the team. I think Jess will be
a little bit of guiding light and Tommy will be
the fun, you know. And it was kind of like
a bit of back and forth and they'll both be
I'll tell you what they'll be doing. They'll be doing
(24:38):
a lot of smiling, a lot of laughing.
Speaker 3 (24:40):
I think that's actually the team to watch. That's my
peck to win it.
Speaker 1 (24:42):
They're like passively aggressively funny, so they will be perfect together.
Speaker 2 (24:46):
I think them and Ben Shelton Taylor turns End are
my two faves for Okay, anyway, please go on, please
keep going.
Speaker 1 (24:53):
Paulini and Rssetti, I would say Pawelini is going to
be the boss of that team. She's like, dude, look
I've won a few double titles over the last few years.
Let me to be the boss, and you just look
pretty and I'm gonna tell you what to do. Revakina
Taylor Fritz, I think that's a combined captain c because
(25:14):
both as neither of them exactly type Ah Andreva Medvedev.
I think that's going to be all about Mira Andreva.
She's gonna draw that, She's gonna run that ship. I
think Danil is just going to be along for the ride,
and you're going to see him smiling a lot on
the tennis court because he's not winning a lot of
singles matches right now. And this might be his chance
to get some confidence back. Madison Keys Tiafo. That is
(25:36):
just going to be I think that's a combined Maddie
will probably be the one telling Francis to calm down
and to concentrate. Dimitrov and Sablenka. There's no question we
know the boss team IgA Kaspar. I think that's going
to be a combined captain. C Podosa sits the pass.
(25:57):
We know the Podoza is definitely going to be wearing
the pants in that situation and telling exactly what to
do for Stefan, stephan Us, Radikanu and al KaAZ. I
don't even know what to say. I think that's just
gonna be.
Speaker 3 (26:12):
You think that's the blind leading the blind.
Speaker 1 (26:14):
I think that is going to be just the cutest
situation to see them look at each other and go,
I don't know, I don't know. What do you think
Benchicch and Zverev definitely Benschic she's the mother now, She's
gonna definitely tell Zverev what to do. Danelovich and Djokovic.
I think Danilovich is going to be the captain of
that team because she is like serious attitude and I
(26:35):
think it's actually that combination is going to be kind
of funny. Actually, I think Novak's gonna just be like,
I'm playing tennis for fun and this feels great.
Speaker 2 (26:43):
I'm really excited, just on a note for this to
see the Novak of old, who's like goofy and silly
and like truly having a good time on the court
in a way that doesn't really cast any meaning onto
his quest.
Speaker 3 (26:59):
For a slam or his quest for gold. You know
all these things.
Speaker 1 (27:01):
They played the Olympics, they played them. I think he
pulled out because he was hurt.
Speaker 3 (27:05):
I think they did, but he didn't play. He didn't
end up playing.
Speaker 1 (27:08):
He played. He pulled out against the Australian team of
Peers and Ash Barty for the bronze medal and because
he was hurt. So so they played together the ball
and they're really good friends. And Novak's been a like
literally a mentor to Danilovich. So that'll be fun to watch.
This is like dad playing with his daughter out there.
Funny Taylor and Ben Taylor. Taylor's going to be telling
(27:29):
Ben and then Irani Barvasori. We already know the answer
to that. We saw the final last year at the
US Open and Sarahronie was the best player on court,
and she was like looking at Baba's story and be like, look,
calm down, I got you. Just just follow my lead.
Osaka and Curios. I didn't even know if they're going
to play. Yeah, let's that's my guess.
Speaker 2 (27:51):
We can come back to that if they actually show up.
There's another team that we're leaving off that. I feel
like it's very it's very of adventures. We didn't talk
about them in the sort of power rankings beforehand, and
you know, I think for me, the benchic dynamic that
you describe is the right one.
Speaker 3 (28:07):
Well, I think no matter.
Speaker 2 (28:08):
What I am, titilated, people are talking about this, people
are excited. I think they will have absolute attention. Kudos
Solution the outgoing US Taco for innovating a new product
that's not something we've said that much about the USTA
in years past, and totally hats off because I think
centering mixed doubles in this way is just super smart
(28:29):
and it leans into one of the many things that
tennis has going for it, which is that there's all
these different products like wheelchair tennis, Legends, Tennis, Junior tennis,
men's tennis, women's tennis, mixed tennis, like yes, is the
answer to all of it. And I think for me,
just the idea that tennis takes all these different forms,
and I was getting a little bit of shine. I
would love, as you suggest, for this to be a
(28:50):
real match with real scores and real formatting. And so
maybe the idea here is if this gets a ton
of attention, a ton of press as it already has,
and a ton of you know, revenue and enthusiasm from
the players, then maybe this is something that they continue,
because I'd certainly love to see it.
Speaker 1 (29:07):
Yeah, listen, I think this is a you know, this
is the start of a sort of I don't know,
the wall falling in mixed doubles. I think, yeah, the
Grand Slams are going to see what happens to this,
and they're going to decide how they're going to do it.
I cannot imagine Craig Tyley doing this in this format,
but I would imagine. I know, Wimbledon won't change it,
and I hope they don't because I just I don't
(29:29):
know Wimbledon is. It's different, Caitlin. People go and watch
mixed doubles and doubles at Wimbledon. They do. They love tennis,
they get it, grounds pass and they just want to
go and watch tennis. So I don't see them really
doing it. We'll see, and I might be wrong, but
we'll see. But it's definitely exciting this came out, and
it's a buzz on the Internet and tennis Twitter and
(29:49):
all the other socials are like losing their minds over
the potential of all of this stuff, and it will
be an incredible week. ESPN wallabys to be showing it
and loving it. Before we sign off, because this is
going to be a quick one today because this was
the talk we wanted to talk about. And we're late
getting our podcasts out this week, but I've been sleeping
very rarely hear and can but can we just touch
on really quickly last week first time we had a
(30:11):
women's event at Queen's Love and tut Tiana Maria slicing
her forehand to a victory on the grass at Wimbledon,
and it just blows my mind that people and coaches
cannot get their players to play a certain game to
(30:34):
beat this player on grass who cannot literally hit a
passing shot, and it just proves to you. If you're
going to teach your player how to win in tennis,
please teach them how to hit volleys, because she showed
you why playing on grass is a whole different animal.
(30:56):
If you keep the ball below the net and you
are afraid to going to the net, you're going to
get literally no pun intended chopped on grass. And that's
what happened.
Speaker 3 (31:06):
I loved it.
Speaker 2 (31:06):
I watched so many of Tatiana Maria's matches, including the
final against Nissimova. The amount of bafflement that her opponents
seemed to generate with her slice on both sides was
quite upsetting because it's like, hey, guys, adjust, make do
something different, like please, even though this is coming, come
into the net, it's gonna float. Interestingly, the best match
(31:30):
from the tournament and the one that was the closest,
was Mukhova Tauchiana Maria. Not surprisingly, both of them hitting
one handed backhands because Mukhova, who has a beautiful slice
and a beautiful net games, you know, had a left
wrist injury, so she was actually both hitting slice on
the one handed backhand and hitting over the one handed backhand,
so it was like it looked like tennis that I play.
(31:51):
I was so thrilled. I was like, everyone is slicing
and hitting one handers and coming into the net and
utilizing the dimensions of the court. It was such classic
throwback tennis.
Speaker 3 (32:00):
Made me so happy.
Speaker 2 (32:01):
And what a fantastic story that touchdown to Maria h
Age thirty nine with two kids wins, you know, wins
the first women's event at Queen's Club in forever certainly forever,
how long? Like what a great outcome. But yes, please,
what the lesson is here is teach slaves and teach volleys.
Speaker 1 (32:23):
The lesson here is too better as coaches, Like, seriously,
as a coach, how do you not have your player
just say listen. I know you're not comfortable than that.
But and I love Tatiana and what she did is incredible,
but she doesn't have a puzzling shot. Really, she has
to love you. And it's like, how do you not
teach your player to come in on her ball and
(32:47):
be patient and hit the volley away. So it's just like,
it's just incredible to me. And if you play a
player like that, you have to come and interview, don't.
She's gonna literally make your life a nightmare, and that's
what happened. And she beat big hitters because they were
refused to come in to beat Madison Keith and then
heath him over back to back because their refusal to
be comfortable inside the service line is just beyond me.
(33:10):
And it's classic. Anyway. I was so happy to see
it because I'm like, good for you, kiddo, good for you.
That's unbelievable. And and she is the nicest person.
Speaker 3 (33:20):
She's a lovely person.
Speaker 1 (33:21):
Her husband, who is the coach, is the nicest guy.
It was just really great to see.
Speaker 2 (33:25):
He loved it, and also shout out to Taylor Fritz
who took Shue Coat on grass beating alex.
Speaker 3 (33:31):
Verev on his again turf of Germany. Again.
Speaker 1 (33:36):
That what we call Caitlin. When you beat someone like that,
they become your pigeon, and he is. Taylor Fritz looks
at Verep and says, you are my pigeon. No argument here,
no argument here. Happy to see it.
Speaker 2 (33:52):
Anyway, France, I see, we will be in I will
be in Maymi in a few hours doing some puddle
events and tennis because sports playing, I say together. And
then I'll be in London on Monday with an event
to come, so stay tuned.
Speaker 1 (34:06):
Great all right, Kaylin, I'll see you in London until then.
As they say in France, I won't say Adam because
I won't see you tomorrow, but i'll see you next week. Wait. Okay, everybody,
thanks for joining you today. All right, beat out everyone. Bye,
Hi everybody, and welcome to the Renee Stubs Tennis podcast.
I am Renee Stubs and we are not together. Caitlyn
is in New York and I am in Kahn. I
am in Khan for can Lyon. I'm doing a bunch
of stuff over here for my couple of different companies.
And I am hot, Caitlin, and I don't mean yes,
I'm hot, I mean it is hot over here, dude.
(00:37):
So we are fully set in the summer of our
lives and also tennis because the French Open is over.
We're on the grass now. We're all excited, but we
are really going to talk a little bit about We're
going to fast forward because I've been texted and tweeted
at and black mixed doubles. There's excitement, there's WTF is
(00:58):
going on? Your first initial thoughts Kaitlin on the partners
spakes that are happening. It's crazy.
Speaker 2 (01:03):
This player's list, this lineup goes unbelievably hard. It goes
hard and it doesn't quit. Okay, let me just read
you some of the highlights and then we'll get into it.
The pairings are unhinged, unhinged, Okay, Chinwin Jung Jack Draper,
Yannick Sinner, Emma Navarro. We got two Italians Yasmin Paulini,
Lorenzo Mussetti, Americans Tommy Paul Jpeg, Jessica Pegula, Rushians together,
(01:29):
Mir and.
Speaker 3 (01:30):
Reva, Danielle Medvedev.
Speaker 2 (01:31):
Then it gets funky, ready for this Taylor Fritz, Elena Rebakna,
Sure why not, Arina Sblanka, Grigor Dimitrov, two Serbs, Olga Danilovich,
who's a very good.
Speaker 3 (01:42):
Young big ball striker, and Novak Djokovic.
Speaker 2 (01:45):
That'll be fun all American Francis Tiafo, Madison Keys. That
one got a lot of shine. A lot of people
are very excited about that. Igish Fiantek Caspar Rude boyfriend
girlfriend Tzipas Bodosa. No surprise there the one that everyone
seems to be the most excited about, even though it's
not my top pick, even though they are very cute
and awesome. Am Aratakanu Carlos Alcoraz. This sort of like
(02:06):
mirrors the stan narrative that's going on the Internet, where
people are convinced that Carlos Alvarez has a crush on
a marat Kanu.
Speaker 3 (02:12):
Maybe that's true, maybe it's not.
Speaker 2 (02:14):
I'm skipping over my favorite pair to highlight name Osaka
and Nick Kirios, which we can get into. There is
the reigning champions, uh Sarah Irani and Vasivori from Finland.
I think I'm leaving somebody off, but the one I'm
most excited about, and frankly the ones I think are
going to win the tournament, Ben Shelton and Taylor Townsend.
(02:35):
What a murderer's row of lineups. Everybody's doing it?
Speaker 1 (02:40):
Yes, nuts, Yeah, I think that. I think that Ben
Shelton Taylor Townsend stands out just because you know Lefty's big,
you know, big serving Ben. But look, who do I
think is gonna win and all of that? Maybe those
guys I don't just don't think that Irani and Vavasori
can be questioned and thought about not winning because they're
(03:01):
doubles players as well. Sarah Ronnie Serve will be questionable.
But then again, when isn't it When when isn't it?
So I don't know. Part of me is so excited
about this. Then there's the flip side of it of
it feels a little exhibition y, right, So I can't.
Speaker 2 (03:23):
Talk about the format because I think that is one
of the main critiques of this feeling a little exhibition
y right, because it is not a full length match.
Speaker 1 (03:33):
Yes, it is a first to four I believe games
three sets. Is that correct?
Speaker 3 (03:38):
I understanding it was first of three, but first of four.
Speaker 1 (03:42):
Yeah, which is basically everyone's serving once, and it feels
like a little bit Team Tennessee, which, by the way,
Team Tennis was first of five. In the end it
was six and then it was five, mainly because you
were playing five sets of singles, doubles and mixed in
World Team Tennis. So it did go quick and it
was no ad. I mean, these matches are going to
go real fast. So I'm not quite sure how I
(04:03):
feel about that. Actually, I know how I feel about that.
That's shit. It's terrible. I think it should be to six.
I think we should play exactly how they played the
system before they already went to the bit of the
chuck raffle. And anybody's listening to our podcast in the path,
you know what the chuck raffle is. It's what Todd
Woodbridge and I called it in two thousand and one
when we won the mixed doubles and we would get
into the ten point tiebreak, and he's kind of anybody's game.
(04:25):
I don't like the first of four. I think that
they should do a regular set. I think they should
play best of two sets and then a ten point
match tie break. Those matches only usually go for like
an hour and twenty minutes. Anyway, that's not taxing on anyone,
and I feel like it does make it very much
an exhibition type style. Now you have to think about Caitlin, like,
there's a history behind the mixed doubles, and there used
(04:48):
to be great singles players that always played the mix,
always played doubles, and it has become taxing on their bodies.
And it also there's so much money now in tennis,
so they don't need to play mixed doubles or doubles
to make money, right. But I don't like that the
fact that they're not playing a regular scoring system. I
think that to tracks from it. And if you're worried
(05:09):
about not getting top plays because it's going to be
too taxing on them, I don't agree with that. I
think you would still get them playing. It's a knockout system.
It's not like they're all going to be playing the
whole tournament. So I don't like that format. I also
think there should be a little onus on if you're
top ten in the world in doubles, you should be
(05:30):
allowed to be in that discussion of being in the
tournament because you know, Okay, before I go on another
tangent on you know, singles players versus doubles players, all
that sort of thud, what are your thoughts.
Speaker 3 (05:42):
On I think people are going to watch it.
Speaker 1 (05:45):
I don't disagree with that, Caitlin.
Speaker 2 (05:47):
I think, at the end of the day, totally valid
and I want to hear your tangent about top ten
doubles players because I think at the most elite end
of the spectrum, mixed doubles is awesome. It's one of
my favorite events, and the history of it is just
like absolutely amazing because.
Speaker 3 (06:05):
It is the only sport in the world where.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
Men and women compete at the same time on the
same field of play at their you know, at their
absolute limit. We saw skiing and other sports attempt to
bring in mixed team events just based on the popularity
of having dual gender The dual gender tournaments get the
most shine, the most money, the most audious. Swimming has
(06:30):
done relays. Yeah, but like skiing, swimming is a relay
system which is about as good as you can get.
This is everybody's playing at the same time, and it's
the most fun. I'll never forget my mother in law,
who cares nothing about tennis, texting me saying, how can
I watch Roger Federer play against Serena Williams. And this
is several years ago, and she was speaking, although she
(06:51):
did not know it, about the Hopman Cup in Australia
over the winter break, and that kind of level of
excitement where the tennis transcends fan nationality, time zone kind
of only happens when you have some nuclear power combinations. Attention,
I'm thinking back, as was Lou Suer, the outgoing CEO
of the USTA, who allegedly came up with this about
(07:13):
the Andy Murray Serena Williams pairing at Wimbledon a couple
of years ago. I was in the stands for that.
I was brought to tears by how enthused, how packed,
how exciting and how awesome it was. And they ended
up winning the match that I watched. And just this
idea that we can create a new fanship for a
legendary product that only our sport can provide is awesome,
and I'm glad to have their revived attention. Most importantly,
(07:35):
I'm really glad that people care about it and we'll
watch it, and maybe this year is the sort of
tester to see if people will come early, because it
is the week before the main draw of single starts,
so it's what we call fan week, and we'll see
based on the amount of caliber and excitement and you know,
names that are attached to this, if we can get
(07:55):
some following and fanship for mixed as a concept, and
maybe next year it's a full size But yeah, I think,
like tragically, nobody watches the current euation of it except
maybe you and me, and that sucks.
Speaker 3 (08:07):
And this is.
Speaker 2 (08:07):
Something that people will watch, and I think you know,
it doesn't It's not terribly more complicated than that for me.
Speaker 1 (08:14):
Yeah, listen, I don't disagree with anything you've just said.
I think that you know, watching it is important, it's exciting,
it's fun, like mixed doubles is great to watch. Doubles
is great to watch, you know, and when people do
watch it, and the tennis enthusiasts love doubles because most
tennis enthusiasts that play play doubles. At a certain age,
it's too tough to run around playing singles all the time,
(08:36):
and unless you're in incredible shape and you've been playing
it in, playing doubles is a lot more fun. It's
one of the reasons why pickleball, which we hate, you know,
they're like, well, we get to hang out with our friends,
and in doubles, yeah, there's four people in the court.
You get to hang out a little bit more. And
I think a lot of the older generation play doubles
and want to watch doubles. So in that regard, I
(08:56):
think it's fantastic. There's a positive and negative to things
I'm going to say, and it might be a little
bit controversy controversial, yeah, but it wouldn't be uske without
a little controversy. And I'm just being honest, right, So
a couple of things. One is back in the day,
and I hate to say that, but a lot of
great singles players played mixed doubles. You think about the
(09:19):
John McEnroe's that played. I'll never forget him playing with
Steffi Graff. He still hasn't forgiven Stepfie about pulling out
of the quarterfinals to Wimbland in his last Wimblin. But
you know, you had great singles players and very good
singles plays playing in the mixed doubles event, and it
slowly started to dwindle and they soldly started to leave
and it became really doubles only sort of tournament. Then,
(09:43):
of course, in doubles we still have and in the
women's game, we have more women playing top players playing
doubles than you do having playing singles. There was a
lot more really good singles players playing doubles. And I
have spoken about it many times, you know, during my
years of playing Kim Kleister's, Lindsey Davenport, a Rancho Sanchez Vicario.
(10:07):
The list is long, very very long. Anybody can look
it up. Who was ranked number one in singles in
the world and number one doubles in the world and
sometimes at the same time. That will never happen anymore.
So that's a shame because the quality of doubles was
so good back twenty years ago. And I don't that's
(10:28):
gonna sound like a slight to players that are playing
doubles now, but it's just a fact. I cannot stress
how that's just the fact. And if any doubles only
player wants to have a go at me about it,
go for it. Because I played ten years of singles
on tour, and I've played predominantly ten years of just
(10:49):
doubles on tour. So I played the lost thirteen singles
and then I played from thirty to forty doubles only right,
I was playing against the players in finals of Grand Slams,
like the Williamson, like the Kim Kleisters, Natalie Tourzia. I mean,
these are players I played in the finals who were
all top ten or number one in the world in singles.
That's what I was playing against to win singles and
(11:10):
doubles Grand Slams. And that has dropped off, and the quality,
in my opinion, has dropped off significantly. We're not seeing
players play great singles and doubles, playing great at the net,
you know, combining those things. And frankly, I think one
of the reasons why, and this might be a little
bit of a controversial stand, I think one of the
reasons why Coco GoF has played well over the last
(11:32):
months as well is that she started playing a little
bit of doubles again and it helps your game, There's
no doubt about it. Andre Eva is a great example.
She's playing singles and doubles every single week. Paolini's playing
singles and doubles every single week. And these are the
players that are getting later parts of singles tournaments. So
I think that this might spur a couple of top
players to play a little bit more doubles or mixed doubles.
(11:53):
And it brings back, as you said, the attention to
the game. And I don't want to be that person's like, oh, Renee,
you know, you'd have to talk about like your day
and age. But it's just a fact. I played when
I won the US Open doubles in two thousand and
or and Lisa Raymon, who was a perennial top ten
singles player. By the way, we beat in the quarterfinals
Martina Hingis and Jennifer Caapriarti in doubles. They were the
(12:14):
number one and the number two players in singles that year, okay,
and we beat them in the quarterfinals. Great doubles players
can beat great singles players. And by the way, both
Jennifer and Martina and I would argue that Martina Hingis
was a better doubles player than singles player, and he
was a great singles player. Yeah, great doubles teams will
(12:37):
not always, but often beat great singles players that play together, right,
And we're talking great doubles teams like you know the
Gigi Fernandez and Vereveras of the world. You know the
Martina navrolovat Pamswiper, who were both very good singles players, clearly,
but you know myself and Lisa Raymond when we were
at our peak, we were beating singles top singles players,
and I think that has dropped off, and I think
(12:57):
the quality of doubles has dropped off, frankly, And you
see four girls on the baseline at the French Open
playing doubles against each other, like what in the actual
f Like that is quality of doubles that I'm sorry
has dropped off. So I think that there's a conversation
that needs to have about how do we make doubles
or mixed doubles more viable, more entertaining, and getting singles
(13:19):
players to play will make it more valuable and it
will give it more gravitas. Again, because some of the
teams and that are winning these doubles and mixed doubles,
they would not compete sometimes with the great singles players
that played more doubles. So I like this. I just
don't like the scoring system. I don't like the exhibition
feel of that.
Speaker 2 (13:39):
Great, I think we're in total agreement, and I think
what I'm particularly interested in is, well, you know, my
if I'm become commissioner of tennis, I'm making I'm stripping
back the tours and the tournaments that matter to like
ten to fifteen, and everybody has to play all events.
(14:00):
If you got to play singles, you gott play doubles,
and you gotta play mixed you get fewer stops on
the tour. But you really got to commit and like
give people a couple of different products. That's how you know,
you know, John McEnroe and Mary Carillo want to mix slam.
Speaker 3 (14:14):
Together like things.
Speaker 2 (14:16):
Fun things happen when I think you put some interesting
combinations together, and that is certainly what we have in
this draw, which is why I think it's really interesting
that we have this like player lineup that is personalities
that you kind of think are like, Okay, who is
going to record the most pegs in a single match.
It's definitely going to be Ben Shelton and Taylor Townsend
(14:37):
if they don't have I want to like special counter
that's like pegs per match. How many people are they
hitting with balls?
Speaker 3 (14:44):
I had to see like at least four.
Speaker 1 (15:00):
M Arena and Dimitrov. I think Arena Sabalanka might be
(15:29):
don't think that Madison Keyes might be pegging people with
their groundstrokes either.
Speaker 3 (15:32):
Great, this is what I'm talking about.
Speaker 2 (15:34):
This is what I want. There's a pretty hilarious rooky
diamond on Twitter has created the US Open Mixed Doubles
power rankings based on the number of words that teammates
have ever spoken to each other, and at the bottom
of the list is Elena Rebakna and Taylor Fritz.
Speaker 3 (15:49):
Have they ever had a conversation?
Speaker 1 (15:51):
Well, I think the reason I had to play together. No,
But didn't they win the Indian World Exhibition Tournament.
Speaker 3 (15:58):
Yes, good point.
Speaker 1 (15:59):
That's why, Kate lens they've already had interaction. And let
me tell you something. They're not gonna bet. They're gonna
be hard to beat, for sure, Big serves Taylor's a
little bit afraid of anything at the net, so that
will be questionable. But he doesn't have to worry about
it because his player is hitting a second and he's
serving huge. The person I'm concerned about is Bava. Sorry,
(16:20):
if they get drawn up against the Madison Keys, who's
gonna take her serve and put a bullet through him?
Speaker 2 (16:29):
I mean some would argue Vasivori is a little bit
of ack for punishment. Well, you know again respectfully, and
I think this speaks to your point before you know,
he and Sarah Ronnie won it last year, but they
are the only team basically in here that is not
composed of singles superstars. So yeah, like what happens when
(16:54):
he's got to defend serves from to the Fritz or
a forehand Madison Keys, you know, like a Rittasa Blaker, Like,
I don't know, I think it's gonna be. I think
he's gonna get kind of brutalized up there.
Speaker 1 (17:07):
I guess what we will we will find out. I'll
be the doubles, the mixed doubles champions of last year,
how they proved themselves up against the lineup like this
of incredible singles players that hit the ball really well.
All right, now, again it's not a flight because look,
I wasn't a great returner. You know, I won two
(17:28):
mixed doubles tournaments and I beat a rancho Sanchez, Curry
on Todd Woodbridge, who's argued one of the greatest doubles
players of all time, you know, and I played with
at the time Jared Palmer, who was a great doubles player,
and you know, and then in another final that I played,
played Lisa Raymond and Leander Pays, and Leander Pay is
one of the greatest. I would put Leander Pays and
(17:48):
Lisa Raymond up against any of these teams, you know,
any of these singles players, but at least obviously it's
an incredible singles player. And Leander and his own right,
was a pretty decent singles player. But we gonna find
out the level of a defending champion against quality singles
players the ball as well as all of these players do.
Speaker 3 (18:08):
For sure.
Speaker 2 (18:09):
And I also think, uh, you know, some of the players,
like you said, like Amira Andreva, uh you know, don't
forget Arina Sablinka has a couple of doubles Grand Slam titles.
Like some of these folks are really accomplished doubles players.
We just don't see them doing it that much, maybe
because they've prioritized, you know, other things. But yeah, like
you said, at Coco has played doubles. She most famously
(18:30):
played a lot with Jessica Pagoula, who pairs with Tim
and Paul, who like, I love that pair up. I
think that's really interesting. A lot has been made about
Naomi Osaka and nik Kirius. A lot of folks have
sort of sent me that as a line like, oh,
they're super disappointed to see a lot of people kind
of feel a certain way about Nick, you know, which
fair enough, like you don't I think you don't get
(18:50):
to repost, you know, Andrew Tait quotes on Twitter without
getting some feedback. But the thing that most people need
to know is Naomi Osaka and Nikias share an agent.
So a lot of these are marriages of convenience. And
I'm not sure that they are, you know, the best
of friends or not. But keep in mind, like that's
that's how Nick curious gets into this thing, because otherwise
he doesn't work the tennis.
Speaker 1 (19:10):
I mean, listen, controversial take that's the one team that
I am questioning because Nick hasn't played at all and
is he playing or not? And then there's probably a
team that probably could have taken that spot. Now having
said that, will they get bums in seats absolute, ad
lutely completely, and that's the issue, and that's what Nick
says on you know, I sell out and people come
and watch me play, and all of that is true.
(19:31):
But at the same time you have to also say, yeah,
but are you are you a player? Are you playing
on tour? You know, every single person in this draw
when it comes to the men, are all great singles
players playing on tour every single day. So you know,
that's probably the one team that you know, if I
saw the alternate, I'd like to know the alternates, you know,
(19:52):
the team that I don't.
Speaker 2 (19:53):
Who didn't who didn't get yeah right.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
Yeah, who requested to play and who didn't get in.
I would like to know that, And I think they
should post that. I think they should post the ten
alternate teams because I guarantee you there'll be one of
these teams that don't play.
Speaker 3 (20:07):
For sure, for sure.
Speaker 1 (20:08):
I mean it's a her side, they're a little bit injured,
or you know, something's going on and they don't want
to they don't want to threaten there playing the following
week in singles.
Speaker 2 (20:18):
Yeah, or if your Nick and you have like some
brand obligations, then you kind of take a spot from
a wild card and then decide not to play, which
is I think what has happened now in wimbled and
in some other places because you don't want to not
do the commercial side of things. From the cutey petuity angle,
Carlos Alcoraz and Emarata Kanu, come on, what are we
(20:40):
doing so cute?
Speaker 3 (20:41):
And then some other folks have mentioned.
Speaker 1 (20:43):
I would argue that they are and this is nothing
against any of them. I would argue just talking from
a perspective of doubles, everybody, so don't lose your mind,
because you all know how I feel like out both
of them. I've talked about them both very glowing over
the last couple of years. That's the weakest pair that
(21:03):
and maybe Eager and Casper the only reason there's it's
more there's a there's a little bit of a weakness
in the doubles aspect. Eager's the great returner, could serve
a Casper. I'm not sure how great he is in
the doubles perspective. Emma Carlos, I saw him play doubles
with a Rapi. He was kind of like a little
(21:25):
lost puppy out there, didn't know where to hit the
ball half the time, or where to stand on the court,
And I was like, oh, it's great. A player is
his ears and of course he's argua the best player
in the world right now. I don't know how his
doubles acumen.
Speaker 3 (21:36):
Is pretty poor.
Speaker 2 (21:38):
But again, this is the qt ptuity power rankings and.
Speaker 1 (21:41):
The going on that. Okay, if you're just going on.
Speaker 3 (21:43):
That, they're at the top for me.
Speaker 1 (21:45):
I mean, and Emma is interesting because I mean, when
was the last time Emma Davarra played doubles. I mean probably,
I'm guessing doubles is such a different game to singles, Okay,
and everyone out there that doesn't understand that, which is
why back sorry to say this again, but back in
you know, the nineties and two thousands, these singles players
(22:06):
that were number one in the world in doubles and
singles were great doubles plays because they were playing doubles
all the time. They weren't just stepping on the court
and hitting a tennis ball. Really well, doubles is a
different game. It's not the same as singles. You hit
the ball the same, but you have to know where
to stand, you have to know angles, you have to
know you know where to stand at the net. You
have to be able to bolly you're at the net,
(22:29):
and teams at the net that are good at the
net are always going to win doubles matches. I don't
care who you are. And the reason why Paolini and
you know Irani do well is because the Rani's great
at the net. She's got great hands. She knows when
where to hit the volley, how to hit the volley,
and where to stand even though her serf is so bad,
(22:49):
they just stand back Paolini. Remember we talked about this.
Everyone hits the ball then to Paolini and a RUnni
runs into that. I'm like, if you're smart, you hit
the ball to a Rani and then you keep hitting
the ball to a running on the bay and you
cannot lose.
Speaker 2 (23:03):
Then well listen, I really hope you are going to
commentate this because it seems like we had a thorough
technical maybe live from our footprint in New York.
Speaker 3 (23:11):
Stay tuned for more details about that.
Speaker 2 (23:14):
The other cutey p Tuity power ranking couple that I
want to call out is Chinwin Jung and Jack Draper.
I mean, face Card meets face Card, whoa like that
is giving Vogue editorial.
Speaker 1 (23:26):
That is giving Vogue editorial. I see major. I wonder
if they have the same agents, but having very likely
that is an interesting pairing. That is an interesting pairing.
Speaker 2 (23:37):
I just somebody was like, oh, chin Win's a nerd
and he's sort of soft boy, and I was like,
chin Win would eat him for breakfast. Don't make no mistake,
chin Win is going to be the boss of that team.
Speaker 1 (23:54):
Which what we should do is have a power ranking
of who is going to be the captain of every
tame good point.
Speaker 3 (24:00):
Okay, so Madison, Francis, Tiafa.
Speaker 1 (24:03):
Okay, I'm gonna go through those because they got in
front of me. Navarro Finner, I think that is an
equal captaincy Agree, Okay. Neither of them are super outgoing.
Speaker 3 (24:12):
Or loud, two introverts, very chill, yep.
Speaker 1 (24:17):
Draper chin Win We've already discussed definitely going to be
chin Win, Pagoula, Tommy Paul, very similar personalities. I would
say a little bit of this and a little bit
of that on the team. I think Jess will be
a little bit of guiding light and Tommy will be
the fun, you know. And it was kind of like
a bit of back and forth and they'll both be
I'll tell you what they'll be doing. They'll be doing
(24:38):
a lot of smiling, a lot of laughing.
Speaker 3 (24:40):
I think that's actually the team to watch. That's my
peck to win it.
Speaker 1 (24:42):
They're like passively aggressively funny, so they will be perfect together.
Speaker 2 (24:46):
I think them and Ben Shelton Taylor turns End are
my two faves for Okay, anyway, please go on, please
keep going.
Speaker 1 (24:53):
Paulini and Rssetti, I would say Pawelini is going to
be the boss of that team. She's like, dude, look
I've won a few double titles over the last few years.
Let me to be the boss, and you just look
pretty and I'm gonna tell you what to do. Revakina
Taylor Fritz, I think that's a combined captain c because
(25:14):
both as neither of them exactly type Ah Andreva Medvedev.
I think that's going to be all about Mira Andreva.
She's gonna draw that, She's gonna run that ship. I
think Danil is just going to be along for the ride,
and you're going to see him smiling a lot on
the tennis court because he's not winning a lot of
singles matches right now. And this might be his chance
to get some confidence back. Madison Keys Tiafo. That is
(25:36):
just going to be I think that's a combined Maddie
will probably be the one telling Francis to calm down
and to concentrate. Dimitrov and Sablenka. There's no question we
know the boss team IgA Kaspar. I think that's going
to be a combined captain. C Podosa sits the pass.
(25:57):
We know the Podoza is definitely going to be wearing
the pants in that situation and telling exactly what to
do for Stefan, stephan Us, Radikanu and al KaAZ. I
don't even know what to say. I think that's just
gonna be.
Speaker 3 (26:12):
You think that's the blind leading the blind.
Speaker 1 (26:14):
I think that is going to be just the cutest
situation to see them look at each other and go,
I don't know, I don't know. What do you think
Benchicch and Zverev definitely Benschic she's the mother now, She's
gonna definitely tell Zverev what to do. Danelovich and Djokovic.
I think Danilovich is going to be the captain of
that team because she is like serious attitude and I
(26:35):
think it's actually that combination is going to be kind
of funny. Actually, I think Novak's gonna just be like,
I'm playing tennis for fun and this feels great.
Speaker 2 (26:43):
I'm really excited, just on a note for this to
see the Novak of old, who's like goofy and silly
and like truly having a good time on the court
in a way that doesn't really cast any meaning onto
his quest.
Speaker 3 (26:59):
For a slam or his quest for gold. You know
all these things.
Speaker 1 (27:01):
They played the Olympics, they played them. I think he
pulled out because he was hurt.
Speaker 3 (27:05):
I think they did, but he didn't play. He didn't
end up playing.
Speaker 1 (27:08):
He played. He pulled out against the Australian team of
Peers and Ash Barty for the bronze medal and because
he was hurt. So so they played together the ball
and they're really good friends. And Novak's been a like
literally a mentor to Danilovich. So that'll be fun to watch.
This is like dad playing with his daughter out there.
Funny Taylor and Ben Taylor. Taylor's going to be telling
(27:29):
Ben and then Irani Barvasori. We already know the answer
to that. We saw the final last year at the
US Open and Sarahronie was the best player on court,
and she was like looking at Baba's story and be like, look,
calm down, I got you. Just just follow my lead.
Osaka and Curios. I didn't even know if they're going
to play. Yeah, let's that's my guess.
Speaker 2 (27:51):
We can come back to that if they actually show up.
There's another team that we're leaving off that. I feel
like it's very it's very of adventures. We didn't talk
about them in the sort of power rankings beforehand, and
you know, I think for me, the benchic dynamic that
you describe is the right one.
Speaker 3 (28:07):
Well, I think no matter.
Speaker 2 (28:08):
What I am, titilated, people are talking about this, people
are excited. I think they will have absolute attention. Kudos
Solution the outgoing US Taco for innovating a new product
that's not something we've said that much about the USTA
in years past, and totally hats off because I think
centering mixed doubles in this way is just super smart
(28:29):
and it leans into one of the many things that
tennis has going for it, which is that there's all
these different products like wheelchair tennis, Legends, Tennis, Junior tennis,
men's tennis, women's tennis, mixed tennis, like yes, is the
answer to all of it. And I think for me,
just the idea that tennis takes all these different forms,
and I was getting a little bit of shine. I
would love, as you suggest, for this to be a
(28:50):
real match with real scores and real formatting. And so
maybe the idea here is if this gets a ton
of attention, a ton of press as it already has,
and a ton of you know, revenue and enthusiasm from
the players, then maybe this is something that they continue,
because I'd certainly love to see it.
Speaker 1 (29:07):
Yeah, listen, I think this is a you know, this
is the start of a sort of I don't know,
the wall falling in mixed doubles. I think, yeah, the
Grand Slams are going to see what happens to this,
and they're going to decide how they're going to do it.
I cannot imagine Craig Tyley doing this in this format,
but I would imagine. I know, Wimbledon won't change it,
and I hope they don't because I just I don't
(29:29):
know Wimbledon is. It's different, Caitlin. People go and watch
mixed doubles and doubles at Wimbledon. They do. They love tennis,
they get it, grounds pass and they just want to
go and watch tennis. So I don't see them really
doing it. We'll see, and I might be wrong, but
we'll see. But it's definitely exciting this came out, and
it's a buzz on the Internet and tennis Twitter and
(29:49):
all the other socials are like losing their minds over
the potential of all of this stuff, and it will
be an incredible week. ESPN wallabys to be showing it
and loving it. Before we sign off, because this is
going to be a quick one today because this was
the talk we wanted to talk about. And we're late
getting our podcasts out this week, but I've been sleeping
very rarely hear and can but can we just touch
on really quickly last week first time we had a
(30:11):
women's event at Queen's Love and tut Tiana Maria slicing
her forehand to a victory on the grass at Wimbledon,
and it just blows my mind that people and coaches
cannot get their players to play a certain game to
(30:34):
beat this player on grass who cannot literally hit a
passing shot, and it just proves to you. If you're
going to teach your player how to win in tennis,
please teach them how to hit volleys, because she showed
you why playing on grass is a whole different animal.
(30:56):
If you keep the ball below the net and you
are afraid to going to the net, you're going to
get literally no pun intended chopped on grass. And that's
what happened.
Speaker 3 (31:06):
I loved it.
Speaker 2 (31:06):
I watched so many of Tatiana Maria's matches, including the
final against Nissimova. The amount of bafflement that her opponents
seemed to generate with her slice on both sides was
quite upsetting because it's like, hey, guys, adjust, make do
something different, like please, even though this is coming, come
into the net, it's gonna float. Interestingly, the best match
(31:30):
from the tournament and the one that was the closest,
was Mukhova Tauchiana Maria. Not surprisingly, both of them hitting
one handed backhands because Mukhova, who has a beautiful slice
and a beautiful net games, you know, had a left
wrist injury, so she was actually both hitting slice on
the one handed backhand and hitting over the one handed backhand,
so it was like it looked like tennis that I play.
(31:51):
I was so thrilled. I was like, everyone is slicing
and hitting one handers and coming into the net and
utilizing the dimensions of the court. It was such classic
throwback tennis.
Speaker 3 (32:00):
Made me so happy.
Speaker 2 (32:01):
And what a fantastic story that touchdown to Maria h
Age thirty nine with two kids wins, you know, wins
the first women's event at Queen's Club in forever certainly forever,
how long? Like what a great outcome. But yes, please,
what the lesson is here is teach slaves and teach volleys.
Speaker 1 (32:23):
The lesson here is too better as coaches, Like, seriously,
as a coach, how do you not have your player
just say listen. I know you're not comfortable than that.
But and I love Tatiana and what she did is incredible,
but she doesn't have a puzzling shot. Really, she has
to love you. And it's like, how do you not
teach your player to come in on her ball and
(32:47):
be patient and hit the volley away. So it's just like,
it's just incredible to me. And if you play a
player like that, you have to come and interview, don't.
She's gonna literally make your life a nightmare, and that's
what happened. And she beat big hitters because they were
refused to come in to beat Madison Keith and then
heath him over back to back because their refusal to
be comfortable inside the service line is just beyond me.
(33:10):
And it's classic. Anyway. I was so happy to see
it because I'm like, good for you, kiddo, good for you.
That's unbelievable. And and she is the nicest person.
Speaker 3 (33:20):
She's a lovely person.
Speaker 1 (33:21):
Her husband, who is the coach, is the nicest guy.
It was just really great to see.
Speaker 2 (33:25):
He loved it, and also shout out to Taylor Fritz
who took Shue Coat on grass beating alex.
Speaker 3 (33:31):
Verev on his again turf of Germany. Again.
Speaker 1 (33:36):
That what we call Caitlin. When you beat someone like that,
they become your pigeon, and he is. Taylor Fritz looks
at Verep and says, you are my pigeon. No argument here,
no argument here. Happy to see it.
Speaker 2 (33:52):
Anyway, France, I see, we will be in I will
be in Maymi in a few hours doing some puddle
events and tennis because sports playing, I say together. And
then I'll be in London on Monday with an event
to come, so stay tuned.
Speaker 1 (34:06):
Great all right, Kaylin, I'll see you in London until then.
As they say in France, I won't say Adam because
I won't see you tomorrow, but i'll see you next week. Wait. Okay, everybody,
thanks for joining you today. All right, beat out everyone. Bye,
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