TINA GUO is The Ultimate Rebel and Boss Lady. Why did she stop touring with Hans Zimmer?

TINA GUO is The Ultimate Rebel and Boss Lady. Why did she stop touring with Hans Zimmer? Grammy-nominated cellist Tina Guo stops by to talk about her humble beginnings, how YouTube helped fuel he career's explosive growth and what's coming next now that she's stopped touring with legendary composer Hans Zimmer.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hello everyone, I am here with the stunning and talented.
I could go down the list Tina Guo, who is
an entrepreneur, phenomenal cellist.

Speaker 2 (00:12):
You are a woman.

Speaker 3 (00:13):
Who holds many cards.

Speaker 1 (00:16):
Many would wish that they could balance your lifestyle, Tina.
But for those of you who don't know Tina, she
has performed with some incredible artists, from the Foo Fighters
at the Grammys, Carrie Underwood at the AMAS Starts to
so Leat, and of course Hans Zimmer. The list pretty

(00:37):
much goes on.

Speaker 3 (00:38):
Tina.

Speaker 1 (00:38):
I think I might be here for a long time
because you have done so many fun collaborations and so
many fun projects in your lifetime. But I want to
get into how you started from the beginning on this
music journey.

Speaker 2 (00:55):
Sure, it's very nice to be here. Thank you for
having me.

Speaker 4 (00:59):
I was for into the family trade. That's the honest
truth of how I started music.

Speaker 2 (01:05):
It was actually not my choice. I don't know what
I would have gone.

Speaker 4 (01:08):
Into, maybe like food tasting or food decorating or something else.

Speaker 2 (01:13):
But both of my.

Speaker 4 (01:14):
Parents are classical music teachers and they, I mean literally
just forced me to practice every day from the time
I started cello at age seven. For eight hours a day,
and I always say, I think if anyone does anything
for eight hours a day, you naturally.

Speaker 2 (01:34):
Get good at it.

Speaker 4 (01:35):
And so you know, people ask me this, and I
think they're always surprised because they expect me to say, like, oh,
you know something that I was really passionate about. I
saw it on TV and I wanted to play. It
was actually the opposite. So like my journey with the cello,
I think all of these years, I'm almost almost forty now, right,
so it's taken like three decades, thank you. I feel

(02:03):
like I get more and more immature as I age,
so that's perfect, But it's taken me like thirty years
really to find the joy in music, to find kind
of find my own voice, because it started off as
something I didn't have a choice in, right, And so
you know, I studied classical cello. I was very lucky
in that because I had four daily lessons. I think

(02:26):
my progress was a bit faster than I guess normal
kids who had maybe lessons once a week, not like
twice a day. And you know, I started soloing and
performing professionally from I think I was eleven years old.
For the first time I played a concerto with orchestral.

Speaker 1 (02:46):
I think I was just doing girl scouts, Tina. That
was about That was about it.

Speaker 4 (02:53):
You know, I wish, but no, I mean, I looking back,
I am of course grateful, you know, for that training,
because it does make it possible. When you have those
ten thousand hours of you know, repetitive training and whatever
it is that you do, it is very important and
I wouldn't Honestly, I wouldn't have done it, you know,
So I guess I am grateful for that. And then

(03:15):
I went to college for classical cello because that's what
I was offered a scholarship in, and my parents couldn't
afford to like pay for my college, and so that
was like, okay, I guess I'll be a cellist.

Speaker 2 (03:27):
So that's how I stand.

Speaker 1 (03:29):
I was a volleyball I played volleyball in college because
my parents told me, listen, like, we don't have a
savings fun for you, like figure it out, right, so
you got to do what you gotta do school.

Speaker 2 (03:39):
Yeah, yeah, exactly.

Speaker 4 (03:40):
And that's awesome that you had a volleyball scholarship. So
mine's not as cool. It's much more dorky that I
had a cellis scholarship. But I do have to say
that was two thousand and four, and it was when
YouTube it was very early days of YouTube, and that
was the first I was actually allowed access to the

(04:01):
Internet because like the Internet of course was like invented
when I was a little younger, but my parents were
so strict, so I wasn't allowed to see anything, to
listen to anything.

Speaker 2 (04:11):
Like that wasn't classical.

Speaker 4 (04:12):
I was raised in such a conservative like like choke hold, you.

Speaker 2 (04:16):
Know, confining.

Speaker 4 (04:20):
Situation that just made me want to like, ah, you know,
burst out and coming, you know, going to college, leaving home. Uh.
I started actually watching YouTube videos of like heavy metal
guitar players and industrial metal, and I you know, I
really resonate and I still do. I just love like
heavy dark music. If you want to cycle analyze it

(04:43):
or I mean, I'm obviously not a train you know, therapist,
but I would say that obviously it's a reflection of
how I felt as a kid, you know, just so
much like yeah, well, I mean it was more of
the rebellion.

Speaker 2 (04:56):
I would say.

Speaker 4 (04:56):
It was like, I mean, I'm I this sounds dramatic,
but I would say it's like rage, you know, like rage, anger.

Speaker 1 (05:03):
I come from the grunge area of Seattle, so you know,
I was you're Vana, you know, super deep indeed kind
of girl growing up.

Speaker 3 (05:11):
That was kind of my astatic music taste.

Speaker 2 (05:14):
I love it, love.

Speaker 4 (05:15):
It and and so like I I mean, just aside
from like their personal stuff as people or whatever they
may have done or not done and whatnot, but just
purely on a musical perspective, like my favorite bands, Marl
I love Marilyn Manson, I love a Ramstein. It's like
a German industrial band. So it's just like dark and heavy.

(05:37):
The darker the better, right.

Speaker 1 (05:39):
I never would have taken you me from Marilyn Manson,
you know, I just remember as a kid, I thought
it was so crazy because I remember they were like,
oh he took one of his ribs out.

Speaker 3 (05:48):
I was like, whoa, Maryland's crazy, that's insane. But yeah,
I love that. That's one of your influences.

Speaker 4 (05:56):
Yes, Like again, it's just like the energy, like everything
I mean you is energy, right, sound waves, and so
for me, I think the more dramatic, like dark stuff,
I just kind of resonate with more or really romantic
and beautiful just anything like dramatic, right, And so that's
when I kind of started experimenting. I was able to,

(06:17):
through some student credit cards from USC purchase my first
electric cello because I was like, oh god, I wish
I played the guitar. I wish I was cool like that.
Not that cello's not cool, no offense to any stream players,
very cool, but back in those days, I just wanted to, like,
you know, I was playing classical music and doing that
and practicing eight hours a day or whatever, doing all

(06:38):
of that stuff.

Speaker 2 (06:39):
But I was like, how do I break free?

Speaker 4 (06:41):
How do I do what I know how to do,
which is play the cello and be able to break
free into like just something else, something that I feel
that expresses myself. And that's when kind of the experimental
experimental phase started. But as you know, as everyone knows,
it's never it's not like an overnight thing where suddenly

(07:02):
something happens. Like I really was like confused and felt
very lost and trying to figure out what on earth
I was doing with this electric cello for years, So
I think it took me about I would say, six
or seven years before I didn't sound like absolute.

Speaker 2 (07:18):
Dog poop.

Speaker 4 (07:21):
Because I was learning about, like, you know, guitar effects
I use, like you know, effects pedals before an amps
now effects processors, but none of that you learn about
from a traditional classical background.

Speaker 2 (07:34):
I mean, it was such a completely.

Speaker 4 (07:36):
Different universe and it was fun, frustrating, fun to play
around with. So that's kind of like, I know, it's
a very broad picture of like how that process started.

Speaker 1 (07:48):
Well especially, I mean it wasn't necessarily like you could
click on a YouTube search page and say listen, like
these are my interests, show me somebody who can the
electric cello this way in this format.

Speaker 3 (08:03):
And I feel like that world also must have.

Speaker 1 (08:06):
A lot of standards where it's kind of like you
need to play the cello like this, and if you
do exist, then you won't be as accepted in the communities.
So were there some barriers as well that you had
to deal with when you were kind of creating this
new path for yourself.

Speaker 2 (08:22):
Oh my gosh, of course, like people thought I was crazy.

Speaker 4 (08:25):
I mean the amount of I have to say hate
comments and negativity from actually from like my fellow students
at USC just because they were all very traditional classical,
you know, classical people who like definitely also did not
appreciate Also, I remember I was taking like selfies before

(08:48):
the selfie was a word not to be like ooh,
look at me, but just I was like posting videos
of myself, experimenting with playing and pictures, and it was
just something I did naturally because I thought, well, there's
this thing called Facebook, which at the time was just
a way to connect with your fellow students, like USC
was one of the.

Speaker 3 (09:04):
Best collegey you remember, yeah.

Speaker 2 (09:08):
Like super early on.

Speaker 4 (09:10):
But I thought, oh cool, this is a great a
great way to like connect with people. And remember people
all saying like why are you adding me?

Speaker 2 (09:15):
Like who are you?

Speaker 4 (09:16):
I'm like, oh, I thought this was like the purpose
of but there, especially when I started experimenting. I think
also not just sonically but visually, because I I love
like the visual of performance, right, I.

Speaker 2 (09:30):
Guess it's kind of like cause playe.

Speaker 4 (09:32):
And again going back to childhood, like I never had
any Halloween costumes.

Speaker 2 (09:36):
I basically wasn't allowed to do anything.

Speaker 4 (09:37):
And so I remember like at school on Halloween every year,
I would see the other kids and they have such
cool like I'm like, oh God, I wish I could
like dress up and you know, live in this like
fantasy world.

Speaker 2 (09:47):
And I think, as you.

Speaker 4 (09:49):
Know, I was in college and I started I was like, Okay,
well maybe I can like dress up when I play.

Speaker 2 (09:54):
And especially like you mentioned that, there's it's a very
strict Again, it's beautiful.

Speaker 4 (10:00):
It's a beautiful art form, but it's a very very
like within these parameters and if you go out of them,
it's like like what is that? And that's the thing
that I loved about the electric cello because at the
time there were some there were a few electric cello
players that have been doing stuff, but I would say
not like a not anything super mainstream apocalyptica of course,

(10:23):
and they're my friends now. They play on acoustic cellos
but amplified and with pedals, like they're the godfathers of
cello metal. And it's actually not announced yet, but I'm
going to be a guest with them at this metal festival.
That's like one of the appearances I make. You were
just super.

Speaker 2 (10:39):
Circle moment, Yeah, full circle. I'm so excited.

Speaker 4 (10:43):
But other than them, like as far as the actual
electric cello, oh, I can't really see it. This behind
me there there really wasn't anyone else doing it, which
there was a lot of electric violin players. But as
far as the electric cello, and that was a good
thing because when there is no paved road, you can
do whatever you want. And I think that's what gave

(11:04):
me also like the impetus maybe right to experiment and whatnot,
because no one could say it was bad, because what
is bad what is good? And I think for me
it was also like luck. You know, hard work and
all of that is important, but it was also lucky
for me the timing that I just happened to explore
this moved to LA at this time, YouTube had just

(11:25):
come out.

Speaker 2 (11:26):
It was very early days.

Speaker 4 (11:27):
No one else was really doing like heavy metal, electric
cello or whatever.

Speaker 1 (11:32):
So you were probably doing cat videos while you were
doing something like that.

Speaker 3 (11:35):
Yeah, you know.

Speaker 1 (11:36):
It's like I was probably making cat videos in my
dorm room and you're over here just killing it.

Speaker 3 (11:41):
No.

Speaker 4 (11:41):
No, oh my gosh, no no. And like I think
it was so it was partially like wanting to just
break free, whatever that means, but also I was also
trying to like get jigs of course, you know, because
I had a scholarship for the tuition, but it didn't
cover living expenses, and so a part of like what
actually helped me develop I think learning to play other

(12:04):
genres of music too, and that kind of parlays into
my day job, as I call it, And again, very
lucky that I get to use the same skill, the
same instrument for that, But like working in soundtracks for TV,
video games, movies, playing with other artists, like it's really
important that you're able to play basically at any genre
like instantaneously. Right, sounds a little like scary, but that's

(12:28):
that's kind of like the culture of the studio, culture
of being a professional studio musician, which I always say,
that's my day job aside from like my own artist stuff.
It like funds my own creative things, you know. And
I was like, how am I going to make money?
Like I can't, you know, I got to pay for food,
I have to pay for my dorm.

Speaker 1 (12:46):
So onnly a full scholarship, Tina. You think it's a
full scholarship till you get your first check and then
you realize it barely pays for all the essentials in the.

Speaker 4 (12:59):
Way.

Speaker 3 (13:00):
How is it that I need more money?

Speaker 2 (13:02):
Yeah?

Speaker 4 (13:02):
I know, or even I remember the first semester, like
the shock of the books, like how much a books
cost was almost nine one hundred dollars and at the time,
I was like, what the like, how am I?

Speaker 2 (13:13):
Yeah? So it's like panic, right, like media panic.

Speaker 4 (13:17):
And so I started putting up ads on Craigslist three
times a day, like I'm very at OCD with everything
three times a day, like offering cello service is available.
I started playing a lot of sadly, a lot of
funerals because like you know, cello's maybe a lens of
self well to.

Speaker 2 (13:32):
Like it said the most music.

Speaker 4 (13:34):
Yeah, And so I played funerals, weddings, bar mitzvahs, bombits
like anything could possibly anything you can imagine. I was
teaching piano students like just random you know, random hustle.

Speaker 3 (13:48):
And now I know why you're so successful. I mean
you realize that.

Speaker 1 (13:51):
I always say, you know, you really truly need to
set yourself up for success. And sometimes when you go
through these experiences or hardships, like yourself, you preparing yourself
for later in life.

Speaker 4 (14:02):
And you know, I can't take credit like I wasn't
because of me.

Speaker 2 (14:06):
It was just because I was broke.

Speaker 1 (14:10):
Yeah, you know, as much as you can look back
and you're like, man, that was hard because I even
look back at my life and like how many jobs
I have? But now I'm like it prepared me to
balance and juggle all these different things. Of course, I
would have loved to have woken up every day like, oh,
I'm not worry about you know, my day to day
bills like paying for gas.

Speaker 4 (14:29):
Right right, But no, but dev I do think it
makes us stronger, obviously, right, and like great, it's wonderful
when people are like born into circumstances that are comfortable.

Speaker 2 (14:41):
But you know, we we just get the cars that
were deal it to make the best of it.

Speaker 4 (14:44):
And the way I look at it, which is, you know,
always finding the bright the bright side, even like oh
there's water in the glass, even if there's like one drop, right, like,
oh there's there, and and like part of the Craigslist
thing right to all kinds of weird stuff and then
oh Craig.

Speaker 1 (15:03):
I don't even know some kids these days know what
Craigslist does. But listen that that was that was the
go to stop for a lot of things, finding a
place to live, you know, getting furnished.

Speaker 2 (15:13):
A dating section.

Speaker 4 (15:14):
I mean there's everything right, like job listings. And I
did start playing with a lot of different like indie
artists right on the Hollywood Sunset Strip before some of
the clubs closed down, and like I was for like
fifty dollars a night right, which barely covered gas parking.
But and I would like play with whoever whoever like

(15:35):
offered to hire me.

Speaker 2 (15:37):
Yeah, and so I.

Speaker 1 (15:38):
Were like before collaborations happened, Tina, you were like yeah,
like so pre which is kind of crazy to think about,
Like you were collaborating so early on.

Speaker 4 (15:49):
I guess I didn't think of it think of it
that way, but I guess, and like you know everything,
like what what's her again? Like you know her, which
is randomly up with like country artists, like with a rapper,
like with a rock band, with like and I think
I played with a lot of like great bands, a lot.

Speaker 2 (16:09):
Of terrible bands. Obviously it's so long ago I can
say that.

Speaker 4 (16:13):
But it was good training for me to like have
no ego, right to go into stuff to figure out
how to play you know, with different uh, different musicians
and different genres of music. And that actually unbeknownst to me,
you know, really, I think prepared me well for just
being able to be a little bit of a chameleon
like musically, which helps again like the day job or whatnot,

(16:37):
of being able to provide cello services in any style instantaneously.
So yeah, and it was like a way for me
to just grow and hear other kinds of music because again,
like I had only heard classical and opera basically like
until I was eighteen, because I wasn't allowed to listen
to anything else except for stuff I accidentally heard on

(16:59):
the radio or you know, little things here and there.

Speaker 1 (17:01):
Yeah, it's just this little kind of bubble that you
finally got to burst it a little bit as soon
as you went to college.

Speaker 3 (17:07):
And I mean, the music industry Teina.

Speaker 1 (17:10):
Is just so competitive, so I'd love to just kind
of know how you navigated through the competitiveness of you know,
the music world and being able to just be found.

Speaker 4 (17:24):
Right right, So I like, okay, now that I'm a
little not old at all, but like older because I've
been grinding for I guess well since I started maybe
like thirty years, but let's say twenty years, you know,
since I came to LA. But I would say first
that I, you know, work life balance in the beginning,

(17:45):
I don't. I think that's like a myth if you
really want to grind hard enough. And so I, like
I mentioned, I was in school full time at the time,
practicing eight hours a day, right, and then spending like
two hours a day like playing along with random YouTube
videos of like with by Joe Satrianni, like different guitar
players to try to figure out like what are they playing,
like how what is the stylistically? And even after after college,

(18:09):
so I was working like seven days a week and
if I wasn't hired to do something, I was still practicing,
and I think just saying yes to everything, And honestly,
it really was like outworking you know, outworking people, like, yeah,
I was exhausted, But I think again that drive also
came partially from just the necessity of having to make money, right,

(18:31):
So it really I think, I'm I'm very grateful to
have had that little fire under my butt because if
I was comfortable, like why on earth would anyone do that?
And so I think like coming from that and also
from a childhood where I basically was raised in a
boot camp, I'm not going to paint it over to
pretend everything was like great.

Speaker 2 (18:50):
It was terrible.

Speaker 4 (18:50):
You know, it was really terrible. I was miserable.

Speaker 1 (18:53):
But you grow up extremely fast at such an early
agey like.

Speaker 4 (18:58):
Yeah, yeah, And I think to be raised in that environment.
When you come out into the real world in a way,
it actually seems easier where it's like you know where
some people be like, oh god, it's so hard. I'm like,
what you have? You have no idea and and you
know not not to be unempathetic or anything like that,

(19:20):
but like as far as like you said, it's so competitive, right,
So the number one thing I always tell people because
you know, yeah, okay, now's like I post stuff or whatnot.
But posting and social media and like marketing is just
it's the wrapping. Right. When when you get hired to,
for example, be a session musician, people ask me how
to get into that business. I'm like, are you a

(19:41):
good player? Do you play in tune? Can you site
read immediately? Are you technically proficient? Can you play like
fat Like it's not about playing fast, but if needed,
can you play.

Speaker 2 (19:51):
Faster and cleaner than anyone else?

Speaker 4 (19:53):
Like? And they're like, oh, oh god, that's so much.
But yeah, So I think the number one thing is
like the core skill to be there, and that requires
just hours you know, of practice. It's like and I
still do it, like you know, I'm here, Like when
I'm preparing for stuff like right now, this week and
next week, Like I want to go out and like
it's beautiful outside, I want to go hang out or

(20:15):
go to the mall or I know what people do,
but like I have to I have to practice, you know,
And so that is a really important thing. And then
as far as like branding or networking, I I for
a while I stopped doing it because like scheduling, like
I have too much on my plate. But I was
doing even brand consultations for a while with like clients

(20:35):
with you know, creative professionals, mostly composers and musicians, on
how to grow their brand, like in the industry. That
kind of became, you know, accidentally, my specialty. And I
told them it's like everyone's different. Like I know a
lot of people like network and whatever, you know, they
go to events and what not and it works for them.
But I only know what works for me, which was

(20:57):
I didn't have like time or resources to go to events, right,
So for me, I call it the dangle the carrot method.
So imagine I have a little carrot here, and like
it's like a it's a psychological energetic thing, right. So
I feel like if if like say people. You know,
consumers are the the bunnies or the rabbits right, their

(21:18):
little ears waiting if you take your carrot and everyone
else has a carrot too, and you're just shoving it
and please eat my carrot. Oh my god, hire me.
Like it's like it's almost like dating when someone's too
like desperate, like really like I don't know about you,
but it's like.

Speaker 2 (21:33):
Off putting a little, a little, you know. And so
again like for me, I was always.

Speaker 4 (21:40):
Focusing on like myself, so turning the energy internally. So
I'm like, how can I get better what?

Speaker 2 (21:46):
Okay?

Speaker 4 (21:46):
I wrote, you know, I recorded this song, Like how
can I how can I present it to people? Because
I remember before I made my first music video and
posted on YouTube, which was a really big turning point
and how Hans found me and a bunch of other composers.
I would tell people like, oh, yeah, I played the
I played the electric cello and I play heavy metal, right,
and people would it was like proverbia like oh that's cute,

(22:09):
that's nice.

Speaker 1 (22:09):
Okay, whatever their heads a little bit like wait a second,
yeah or no?

Speaker 4 (22:15):
Or also like just because so many people talk and
there's no part, there's no product or whatever.

Speaker 2 (22:21):
Right, So I was just one of those people.

Speaker 4 (22:23):
Yeah, And I realized I was one of those people,
even though I had every intention of doing it. So
I think again, focusing internally, and then it took me.
So the very first music video that I uploaded onto
YouTube was called Queen Bee. It was like two thousand
and nine, right, oh gosh, so long ago, and it's
a heavy metal version of the Flight of the Bumblebee.

Speaker 2 (22:45):
I spent my.

Speaker 4 (22:46):
Last two thousand dollars that I had in my bank account,
didn't I didn't have money for rent the next month,
and actually it had been you know, I had been
in LA for a little while and things were not
going well even though I was doing like the Craigslist
gigs or whatever. Like I mentioned, fifty dollars like for
a night is not like that's not enough to even

(23:06):
for like a quarter of a dorm room. And so
I thought, all right, after all these years, like maybe
maybe my parents are right. I was like, just at
that you know, breaking point, maybe I should audition for
an orchestra job because there was an opening in the
San Diego Symphony. I grew up in San Diego and
it's a very respectable job, there's health insurance, all of

(23:26):
that stuff. And I was living in a garage at
the time. I've been living literally in a garage with
no no heat, no finishing. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (23:33):
Yeah, it was real. I mean the struggle was real, right,
and and it was fine. I'm like, you have to
do what you have to do.

Speaker 4 (23:42):
But after living there for two years, I'm like, Okay,
am I delusional?

Speaker 2 (23:46):
Am I crazy?

Speaker 4 (23:47):
Like? Maybe this is all this is going to be?
And I should just you know, come back down to earth.
Maybe other people were right that they told me, like,
what are you doing. You're like wasting your your talent
on the class cal cello. You could be blah blah blah.
So am I all right? I started preparing for the
audition like a good cello girl, preparing all the material,
and I thought, before I just give up, you know,

(24:08):
on my dream, I have to like have something to
show for it, even if it's just to show my
grandkids one day or I don't know, just to have
for myself when I'm eighty years old and be like,
ha ha, look at me when I was and.

Speaker 3 (24:19):
You're eight, when you look like you're thirty cell.

Speaker 5 (24:21):
So it's and I thought, Okay, and so it was
also very much thanks to some friends that I had
met who contributed like a lot of their like filming
it for I don't know if it was for free,
but at a highly discounted rate, you know, finding locations

(24:42):
for free, like so many people that I'm still super
grateful for it to this day, right because I think
like relationships, like, of course that's super important.

Speaker 4 (24:49):
So I say I did it network and I didn't,
But it was more of just I think naturally, like
people when you're doing things from an authentic place and
you're a good person, you do everything openly and honestly,
I think just naturally, you know, like similar energy kind
of gravitates together.

Speaker 2 (25:05):
And so it took me about six months.

Speaker 4 (25:07):
To figure this out because to try to do a
music video with such a small budget and I had
a very big.

Speaker 2 (25:13):
Vision, delusional vision.

Speaker 4 (25:14):
It didn't end up being as I had a hundred extras.

Speaker 3 (25:17):
They were like, okay, that's when you got to ask
all your friends. Seen at that point you're just like,
what's everybody doing tonight? You want to come hang out?

Speaker 4 (25:25):
Well, I mean, okay, this is this is gonna sound
kind of like like maybe even narcissistic and it's not
I want to be very clear, it's not about narcissism.
It's about being scientifically accurate. So queen Bee, right, there's
one Queen Bee in a five, And so I wanted
one hundred male extras naked covered in gold body paint. Wow.

Speaker 3 (25:47):
See that this is a lot to ask for here.

Speaker 4 (25:50):
And of course I think I've hand like two. And
also because there are men and for them to be.

Speaker 2 (25:55):
Naked, probably for each other.

Speaker 4 (25:56):
Most straight guys, like even friends, were like, uh, I
don't know.

Speaker 2 (26:00):
Oh, I'm gonna sit this one out.

Speaker 4 (26:01):
So we skipped that part. We skipped it right. It
didn't make a really like life size not life size
human size like paper mache uh bee hive thing that
I came out of. But what I mean, it was fun.

Speaker 2 (26:13):
So it was.

Speaker 4 (26:15):
Something that you know, we we did together as a team.
Everyone who worked on it, uh. And then you know
everyone who worked on it did it just for the
passion too, like, Okay, this is a really weird, you know,
dark experimental thing.

Speaker 2 (26:27):
Let's just do it.

Speaker 4 (26:27):
And again, for me, it was my last hurrah before
I pick up my electric or sorry acoustic cello and
hope that I get a position in orchestra, so I
can you know, buy groceries. And after after the video
came out, it was like a week later, Oh oh,
there was a small hope in the back of my mind.
I thought like, Okay, maybe there's a small chance that

(26:50):
like marily Manton or Metallica, a rum sign or any
like heavy music band or artists, maybe yeah, anyone please,
like like maybe they would see it and be like, oh, okay,
maybe we should incorporate cello into our band or some
I don't know, some kind of thing, you know, that
I was hoping for, and that did not happen back then, right,
it didn't happen. But within the first week that the

(27:12):
video came out, uh, I mentioned Han like Hans so
Hans Zimmer and John Debney. He was working on Ironman two,
Brian Tyler.

Speaker 2 (27:19):
I don't. I think it was Fast in the Fear.
I don't remember what what movie.

Speaker 4 (27:22):
It was so long ago, but they all reached out
and said, oh, can you like play on my soundtrack?
Like that's really like it's different what you're doing because
it's like heavy and it sounds like a guitar, but
it's a cello, right, And I was like yay work.

Speaker 3 (27:39):
Yes, the bee worked. I didn't need a hot naked
man and gold. I just needed me.

Speaker 4 (27:49):
And like I think it was like it was great
and like I had done a little bit of session
work before, but in the orchestras you know, and like
the cello session, which was great, and I was grateful
to get whatever work I could get doing that, but
not as like me, not as like Tina doing my
whatever weirdo crazy thing that I do. And again it
was like unintentional branding, right, I wasn't thinking of it,

(28:11):
Like I wasn't like, oh, I'm going to brand myself
as this, and I was just like, okay.

Speaker 2 (28:16):
I'm going to give up.

Speaker 4 (28:16):
And before I do that, I just need to like
do this for myself, right, or at least to show
people that I'm not a.

Speaker 3 (28:23):
Very essentially for you too.

Speaker 1 (28:25):
Yeah, I mean you put everything, all of your last
funds into this and within me, which is incredible. That's
when you started getting feedback and people reaching out to you.

Speaker 4 (28:36):
Yeah. Yeah, like after and again it's timing and luck
in that I was it was so early on that
there there honestly wasn't any competition orly very little, right,
so it was easier to.

Speaker 2 (28:47):
Have like a monopoly on the market.

Speaker 4 (28:50):
And like now I do have to say I do
feel like people who play electric strang ingeruments especially not
it's not every anything as possible. Everything is possible, but
it is a little hard because now there's like so
many tens.

Speaker 2 (29:02):
Of thousands, right.

Speaker 4 (29:04):
But I think just for me, it was the timing
and that it was something that hadn't been explored. And
then you know, I did that and I didn't think
about how people would judge me. Like my parents they
were so mad that they didn't talk to me for
two years. I mean, we didn't talk much anyway, but
I didn't because a video was so like it's rated

(29:25):
eighteen and over. So I decided on YouTube it's not
it's not like pornographic or anything, but it's artistic, right.

Speaker 1 (29:30):
I mean, listen, if I'm in a bathing suit, my
dad's over here, like take it down, you know.

Speaker 4 (29:35):
Yah, yeah, come on yeah yeah. And I remember they
were like, oh my gosh, like we're gonna lose all
of our students, like it's so shameful what you've done,
and blah blah blah, and like it was that and
I did get like obviously some negative feedback A lot, Okay,
a lot. I'm just being nice here, A lot of
negative feedback from other people like colleagues or I guess

(29:56):
you would call it. And it is what it is,
right like, so I it's just like, okay, whatever, Like I.

Speaker 1 (30:01):
Already seems so great, though, Tina, is that like you
literally are so headstrong and fearless, and when you want
to do something and you just jump right in, you're
not thinking about the perception and thought process of what's
going on opinion wise from everyone else around you. It's
what basically resembles who you are as a person, in
your interest and how you want to frame things artistically,

(30:25):
which is what makes you so unique of so many people.
And you can't that's something you can't teach. I mean,
there's just you know, it's really something that's unique to you.
And it sounds like you've always just been ten steps
ahead of everyone with you know, collaborations to just being
on social media taking selfies, and I mean it's like

(30:45):
it's crazy.

Speaker 3 (30:46):
It's like you knew the future before the future happened.

Speaker 2 (30:50):
I didn't, the girl.

Speaker 4 (30:51):
I did not know anything else what I was doing.
If people are like I'm like, I don't think anyone
knows what they're doing. We're just like moving forward and
trying to do stuff. Then when it works, people are like, wow,
like how did.

Speaker 1 (31:02):
You you were like flying it back back to the
future over here? You know, did you like span far
ahead into the future and then come back to us And.

Speaker 3 (31:09):
You're like, you know what this is?

Speaker 2 (31:12):
I woke up every day going huh my doing? But
but I think the big.

Speaker 4 (31:17):
Thing is you just you act right, don't don't overthink,
don't overplan. So many musicians, like when I talk to
friends who maybe they they're session musicians, but they want
to also be like an artist, so they release their
own music, do their own thing, and they're like, oh,
but like this is not good enough, or you redo
the mix like ten times.

Speaker 2 (31:34):
It's never going to be perfect, right, so it's better.

Speaker 4 (31:36):
I mean, if you listen to some of my early releases,
please don't guys, if you're watching this, you know, like
I love that.

Speaker 1 (31:43):
You have those because even like my older videos, I
love going back because you can see how far you've
come and you're like, wow, this is kind of like
the roadmap of my life.

Speaker 4 (31:52):
It is it is, and you see how how you
grow and like you have to start from that. So
I feel like a lot of people, because of fear
of like you know, judgment or negative comments, are like,
oh it's not good enough. Of course it's not going
to be good enough. Like why would it be good
enough when you start?

Speaker 2 (32:06):
That's like bad? Do you not want to grow?

Speaker 4 (32:09):
Right? So I think sometimes like the shittier it is
the better because then you have like more of a
you know, a runway to move up. And I think
maybe that is like the biggest like personality trait where
I just like do stuff and I okay, sometimes I
probably should think about things a little bit more, and
I'm as I'm mat trate, you know. Now I think
I'm a little bit more measured. But before I'm just

(32:30):
like boom done. I want to do this. I do
it like people are like planning how to do it.
I'm already doing it. I have no clue what I'm doing,
but I'm doing it right. So I think that's really
really important. So it's kind of like efficiency and speed
of like how you execute things, you know.

Speaker 1 (32:44):
Yeah, I mean it's it's incredible what you've been able
to accomplish. Definitely have to jump into the whole start
to Han's connecting with you and how he came a
part of his team.

Speaker 4 (32:58):
Yeah, yeah, absolutely so with Hans, I think we had
been working together for now what sixteen fifteen, sixteen years
because of.

Speaker 3 (33:06):
The honey Bee queen Bee.

Speaker 1 (33:09):
Yeah, because yeah, I'm forever going to think if he
was a Honeybee now.

Speaker 4 (33:16):
And yeah, like he's And at that time, of course
I knew about the scory industry, but I actually didn't
know who he was because I just wasn't Like my
goal was not to work in soundtracks.

Speaker 2 (33:26):
I wanted to play heavy metal, like that was my dream.

Speaker 4 (33:28):
That was my goal, and so you know, I remember
his assistant reached out and asked if I was like
available to come into his studio, and I remember like, well,
I think I was like shopping I was doing, and
I said, not to be rude, but I'm like, who
is this? How did you get my phone number? And
he's like, oh, I'm calling from like Hans zimmers Uff.
I'm like who, Like what?

Speaker 3 (33:48):
I got a Google?

Speaker 2 (33:49):
Yeah I did.

Speaker 4 (33:52):
I didn't even bother googling. I didn't know what was
going on. But I did go to the studio and
I remember the first time I met him, they were
having lunch in like the back building.

Speaker 2 (34:02):
Uh and Guy Ritchie was there.

Speaker 4 (34:04):
Now Guy Ritchie I recognized, right, And I'm like, oh, okay,
maybe this is like a like a bigger thing, right,
like a little a little step above my Craigslist game,
just a.

Speaker 3 (34:15):
Little bit, just you know.

Speaker 1 (34:17):
I don't know if I've never imagine saying Hans on Craigslist,
but hey, you know, that'd be a great story.

Speaker 4 (34:24):
And uh, actually I did get a gig once with
Courtney Love that she found me on craigslist.

Speaker 2 (34:29):
I want.

Speaker 4 (34:30):
Yeah, yeah, she was like Craigslist like you never know,
I mean, you never know. Yeah, that was before Hans,
so that was the way before. But so I yeah,
I went in and then he said, we're working on
Charlock Holmes. So that was an electric cello that was
on the acoustic cello, and that's kind of that's how
it started. So we did Charlotte Holmes Inception, like a

(34:52):
bunch of other movies and you know these Sorry I
didn't mean to say it, like I was just getting projects.

Speaker 3 (34:59):
Very various projects, just iconic.

Speaker 2 (35:05):
And then I did.

Speaker 4 (35:06):
I did take a couple of years away from that
because I joined a Circus La because they also saw
that video in some of my because I started doing
more videos in different styles, like also classical, and so
they offered me a like a solo position in Michael
Jackson The Immortal World Tour, which was like an arena tour,

(35:26):
and I never performed in arenas before, and I think
it was it was such a great experience for training
and how to project. And I remember I loved it
because in the classical world, like the way that I play, Honestly,
I don't think it's inappropriate, Like I just maybe I'm
just emotional in the way I play. It's not like
anything crazy.

Speaker 1 (35:45):
It's almost like a possession has taken over your body.

Speaker 3 (35:49):
It's like you have this alter.

Speaker 1 (35:50):
Ego and it's so mesmerizing to watch you perform on stage.

Speaker 2 (35:56):
Oh thank you, I do. I do feel like it's
I'm like channeling write something.

Speaker 4 (36:00):
Yeah, that sound too free through but it's it's it's
a spiritual process, right and and like with the classical cello,
it's it's kind of like that.

Speaker 2 (36:07):
I don't feel as free.

Speaker 4 (36:08):
With the classical cello, just because if I think all
the associations around that in myself internally and that's something
I've worked on now and it feels better. But but
even back then, like the way that I played like
certain pieces of music. You know, people like again like
teachers and other classical musicians like, oh, you're too like dramatic,
you play too emotionally. I'm like, I'm sorry, I don't

(36:29):
want to just sit here and just play like a robot.
Not not that they played like robots, but or for
everyone to play the same way. It's very much like
you have to play you have to play it this way.

Speaker 2 (36:39):
I'm like, what's the point.

Speaker 4 (36:40):
There's like a thousand people graduating just this year and
they all play the same Like that's really uh, that's
really kind of like boring, right.

Speaker 1 (36:49):
It's any solo artists that you would take and PLoP
on the stage by themselves, that they were just a
robot in a massive theater, like people would be bored
out of their minds. But when you bring life your
body even though you're playing the instrument, I mean, it's
just it's an outworldly kind of experience that we're feeling
with you again something Yeah.

Speaker 4 (37:12):
Yeah, I mean, honestly, I'm like actually naturally very introverted
and like very I I had like major stage fright,
like like panic more of right, like it's major anxiety.

Speaker 2 (37:22):
And I think like it.

Speaker 4 (37:24):
Was it was kind of forced out of me just
because my parents like forced me. Also in addition to practicing,
to performing and doing competitions and again these old videos
of me, literally I will walk on stage with like
my head down, so I so like panic to look
at people, and like I couldn't speak in public.

Speaker 2 (37:39):
It was really But having gone.

Speaker 4 (37:41):
Through that, I'm like, you know, human beings are anyone
is capable honestly of anything with enough like repetition.

Speaker 2 (37:48):
And like just but it's hard, you know.

Speaker 4 (37:50):
And I think if I didn't have anyone to force me,
I probably wouldn't have done it.

Speaker 2 (37:54):
But all of that is.

Speaker 4 (37:55):
To say, so I came from this environment where I'm
like everything, you know, you're too much, you're too much, ridiculous,
you're weird, you're you know. And then I joined the circus. Yeah.
Then when I joined the Cirts, and I remember like
in the creation period where we're putting the show together
and it's like in a huge arena, it was the opposite.
I mean, I'm around these incredible like acrobats and dancers
and literally clowns and you know, airless and they're like

(38:18):
more more, that's not enough. I'm like, really, wow, I'm
not crib. Yeah, And I think like being you know,
meeting all these professional performers, not just like not again.
It's a totally separate thing to be a studio musician.
Like when you're recording, you shouldn't move around too much
because a microphone is sedentary and if you're just going.

Speaker 2 (38:40):
You know, it's crazy, right.

Speaker 4 (38:42):
So it's a totally different art form. But when you're
performing a performer is very different. It's a different thing.
And I think, uh, those two years from twenty eleven
to twenty thirteen that I spent with the Circus traveling
around that was really formative for me, Like, uh, I
think with performance, right, and then you know, then I
came back to LA and blah blah blah blah blah.

(39:02):
You know, all of the stuff happened playing with different people,
working with Hans and so that's kind of how how
it started.

Speaker 1 (39:09):
But I guess the scene balance your life as well
with performing with O that's a full time gig, but
you're also managing and doing other things on top of that.

Speaker 4 (39:22):
Yeah, it actually so I The last tour that I
did with Hans was earlier this year, twenty twenty five. Uh,
and the but the very the previous one, so like
the recent one they just did, I actually did not
go on and so after fifteen sixteen years, and also
because I'm turning forty in October, so in a couple
of months.

Speaker 1 (39:41):
It was so crazy that you're turning for I'm just like,
are you sure we need to get a different birth certificate?

Speaker 3 (39:46):
I think you read it wrong.

Speaker 2 (39:50):
No, And like, I mean, I love it. I feel
like forty is in you.

Speaker 1 (39:53):
Okay, thirty and it's what everybody's saying. Yeah, it's just
like a new livelihood. But you give such a young,
fresh energy.

Speaker 2 (40:03):
Oh thank you.

Speaker 4 (40:05):
I think I was like an old lady when I
was younger, as a total granny.

Speaker 1 (40:08):
So I went backwards, right when you're ten years old, right,
gotta be by this time. I can't stay out too
late to watch eating too much candy.

Speaker 4 (40:16):
Yeah, and you know, I it's like, I, yes, you're right.
Touring with Funds and with other artists that I've toured with,
it takes a lot of it takes a lot of energy.
I mean it's wonderful, right, but what happens when you
allocate all of your life energy you don't have time
for your own stuff, right, And so I had been

(40:37):
like I was sewn to uh soon I was signed,
not son I was signed to Sony.

Speaker 2 (40:42):
Would be really weird.

Speaker 3 (40:44):
I can never leave.

Speaker 2 (40:47):
I mean, I guess it away, like I think you have.

Speaker 3 (40:49):
To unstitch you. It's okay.

Speaker 4 (40:52):
I was signed to them, sorry from twenty sixteen until
twenty twenty two, I think was when I left. And
at that time, you know, I did my Game on album,
which is all video game music, a bunch of other stuff.
It was a great relationship. But now this is really
going to go full circle all the way back to
like you know, Tina with the Wow having metal right,

(41:12):
that kind of thing. And so I'm like, oh my gosh,
like I've been okay, wonderful.

Speaker 2 (41:16):
I'm signed to Sony.

Speaker 4 (41:17):
I never thought I'd be signed to, like a major
label that wasn't even on my radar right to do this,
or to tour with Hans or be in the circus
or any of this stuff. But I realized, like I
didn't choose any of this, right, I didn't even choose Chellow.
And I thought, what is it because I said there
were moments like of course it gets overwhelming. I think
would like burnout is a real thing that like I

(41:38):
think more people should talk about and that leading to
depression and just like because when you like work so
hard all the time, NonStop, like everything else in life
kind of goes by the wayside. And that's like a
whole separate conversation.

Speaker 2 (41:50):
But I just thought, all.

Speaker 4 (41:52):
Right, I feel like there's there's definitely something off and
off balance, and also like artistically and creatively as as
wonderful as like, you know, doing that Circh show after
three hundred sixty shows in a row, like I was like,
I can't.

Speaker 2 (42:06):
I am going to throw up if I like.

Speaker 1 (42:09):
Crazy three it was one hundred and sixty shows in
a row.

Speaker 2 (42:13):
Shows maybe sixty two, but three sixties you know, nice
even number.

Speaker 1 (42:17):
I mean that's one essentially a day on average. That's insane.

Speaker 2 (42:21):
Yeah, over the course of two years, two years.

Speaker 3 (42:24):
Allowed to get that right, You're like, you cannot get that.

Speaker 4 (42:27):
I didn't I miss I didn't miss any shows except
for at the very end. I actually had some neck issues,
probably just from headbanging too much and playing too hard.
But for like for for two years I didn't miss
any shows and then also touring with Hans Like as
much I do love the music, I love the people,
but you know it's it's a lot to years, yeah,

(42:48):
on my body, but also like creatively, so I thought,
like I what was my original plan? And of course,
like I also have to mention, I think aside from
the musical stuff, like for me, like financial freedom has
always been a really big focus. So I joke that
I'm you know, half robot, half you know, entrepreneur, you know,
very very financially focused, and the other half is like

(43:10):
an artist. But during all of that, you know, I
was very careful with my savings. I mean, living in
a garage was not I guess since I started there,
like I was able to even having a tiny studio
apartment in a really bad neighborhood to me was not
a big deal because I'm like, I'm saving for the future,
I'm taking that money, I'm investing in stocks, right, and
so I invested started doing that as soon as I

(43:32):
started making a little bit of money that I.

Speaker 2 (43:34):
Had extra, you know for the circus.

Speaker 4 (43:38):
And I think I reached a point like only in
the last few years where I realized, like I actually don't,
not that I never have to work, I mean, but
like I mean, like I looked at my financials. Yeah,
I looked at my financials, and I'm like, Okay, I
actually have the freedom and I have like maybe a
little bit of a feelia of safety, right. And when
you're so used to operating in like desperation mode, just

(43:59):
because that's where I came from, it's always like, oh god,
I have to you know, like oh what's my next thing?
Or like just constantly in this panic and then and
when you're in that mode, I think you can't fully
be in touch with yourself as an artist or whatnot.
And I realized, I'm like, I have to do my
own thing. Like it's I'm turning forty this year, you know,

(44:19):
this year. It's like if not now, when, like when
am I going to tour with my own band?

Speaker 2 (44:24):
When am I gonna?

Speaker 4 (44:25):
You know?

Speaker 2 (44:25):
And so that's so now I've stopped training with Hans
and I brought a friend in.

Speaker 4 (44:30):
She actually replaced me when I left Circus Lay as well,
so like we've known each other for many many years
and like she's wonderful and she's very happy to do it.
And for me, I'm very happy that now I have
the time and the energy and then like the mental
capacity right to do my own music. And I'm super excited,
you know. I finally was able to start my tribal

(44:53):
music project, which is it's kind of like Viking music,
but Asian version.

Speaker 3 (44:58):
So it's my I've gotten were the Vikings. So that's
that's right.

Speaker 4 (45:03):
Oh.

Speaker 2 (45:05):
I love Viking culture.

Speaker 4 (45:06):
I love like a Viking music, and but I thought like,
all right, I don't want to like culturally appropriate appropriate
like backwards like white.

Speaker 2 (45:13):
People or Vikings.

Speaker 4 (45:14):
Right, But I thought like, oh, you know, like I
like in the East Asian region, and so this is
totally fantasy. But I'm like, okay, this is music from
one point seven million years ago. This is pre Homo sapien,
pre Neanderthal, and it's uh, the oldest fossil humanoid, you know,
pre human fossil that was found in modern day China

(45:35):
was dated to be one point seven million years old.
And I thought, oh, that's really interesting. I wonder what
music back then sounded like?

Speaker 2 (45:41):
Right, I want to do this.

Speaker 4 (45:43):
I want to get a custom instrument made out of
a sabertoothed tiger school out of a dinosaur skull out
of all of these like weird ideas and like I'm like,
oh my god, I can do whatever I want.

Speaker 2 (45:53):
Like it's like and I think I just was like.

Speaker 4 (45:56):
I didn't realize that until literally like two years ago,
because I got to a point where like I was
doing all these things, but honestly, inside I was I
was unhappy. I was really like, Okay, I've been doing
the same thing over and over and over and I'm
grateful for it, you know, like again not.

Speaker 2 (46:10):
To not be to be ungrateful, but why do I
feel dead inside? Like seriously, why do I think.

Speaker 1 (46:16):
A pinnacle of growth? And it was like you grow anymore,
so you've got to move on and do something different.

Speaker 3 (46:22):
Yeah, yeah, really, well that's totally fine.

Speaker 1 (46:25):
You know, they hit a point where they're comfortable, they're sad,
they don't have to worry about anything, and they can
just kind of routinely keep continuing with their basis.

Speaker 3 (46:33):
I'm very similar to you though, where I'll work a
job and it's.

Speaker 1 (46:37):
Kind of like, Okay, this is the highest position I
can be at, and now what I need to leave
now because I can't grow anymore.

Speaker 3 (46:45):
Yeah, and a challenge to yourself.

Speaker 4 (46:47):
Yeah, and it's really scary because for like, I started
feeling it like some years ago, but I'm like, oh,
you know, it's like again, it's too scary. It's like
safety and all of that stuff and like being attached
to like a certain title or associate that people have
with you. But I do have to say now that
I've been only in the last year. So this new
music video Earth, which is like the first not the

(47:10):
technically the second, but the first music video of this
tribal project, is called the Water Phoenix, which is like
my spirit animal doesn't make any sense, Like why is
there a phoenix? Me?

Speaker 3 (47:22):
Yeah, that little gray you know action in there.

Speaker 4 (47:25):
Yes, yeah, And I'm seeing in this it's like a
totally different playing the saving.

Speaker 2 (47:32):
I'm seeing like a cave woman.

Speaker 3 (47:35):
Oh, I love this.

Speaker 4 (47:37):
We shot the video in a prehistoric dripstone cave in
the middle of Germany, like underground, like with where they
actually had fossils and stuff, and so I think it's
like an artistic exploration time for me. And it hasn't
been announced yet, some of the days have been announced,
but I'm doing like a month and a half tour
this fall, a solo tour with my own band, so

(47:57):
like doing the electric cello stuff, but all so the
Water Phoenix project so kind of like blended together. So
it's like a tribal music and metal right, metal cinematic,
a little bit of gaming music a Skyrim or whatnot.
But all of the covers that I do from soundtracks
are done in like a heavy style, so that's kind
of like kind of blends all the world together.

Speaker 2 (48:19):
And I'm playing four.

Speaker 4 (48:21):
Shows in Europe on the Full Metal Cruises and then
in China doing like a twenty one date tour and
that hasn't been announced yet. It's been announced in China.
I mean, I guess what's the point of announcing in
the US. But it will be soon and coming to see.
That's how I hope, I hope, so like let's see.
It's like I feel like in America though, like the

(48:41):
audience for metal and like especially tribal music or Viking music,
not that it doesn't exist, but it is honestly microscopic,
like compared to Europe and compared to but still so
I think starting there and then building from there.

Speaker 2 (48:55):
I mean, I don't know what the future.

Speaker 3 (48:56):
Holds, but I will just let me know. Oh, everyone.

Speaker 4 (49:02):
Thank you, And I think I just I feel like, yes,
it is stressful because when you're doing everything like yourself right,
like and all the like logistical things, productions, permits, visus flight.

Speaker 2 (49:14):
I mean, it's just so much.

Speaker 4 (49:15):
But I do have to say it feels good and
I'm grateful that, like I made this decision right I
left Sony because like they were like, I was like, oh,
I want to do tribal cave people music, and they
said what now?

Speaker 3 (49:28):
What said? Sorry again? Translation okay if.

Speaker 4 (49:34):
Yeah, if I okay, If I don't do that, can
I do like heavy metal industrial metal? Like no, Tina,
like you're signed to Sony Masterworks, like we like I
understand from a business perspective why they're like that is
way too experimental. There is no audience for it because
it hasn't been done, right Yeah, And I think it
kind of I'm like back to where I started. I'm like,
I know it hasn't been done, but like that's the
whole point. It's like I want to I want to

(49:57):
do it and see what it can be, and like
I have no expectations. If it doesn't work, great, you know,
at least I did it. But it's kind of it
came from like the same kind of genuine Yeah, it
came from the same genuine place as Queen Bee. I
think that's what is like completely full circle where I
just I don't know, I just have this like this
like urge to do it. And so I'm very excited for.

Speaker 3 (50:20):
Again, Tina. I think you will.

Speaker 1 (50:22):
We'll be talking from now about this whole interview and
I'm just gonna laugh and be like I told you
you can foretell the future.

Speaker 4 (50:31):
Yeah, I mean I hope so, right, we could will it?
But yeah, so that's kind of like where I am currently.

Speaker 1 (50:38):
Oh, I know, the welcome to living in New York City, right,
It's just it's not a city without.

Speaker 3 (50:44):
Some sound around us. You're also doing a lot in
the gaming world.

Speaker 1 (50:48):
I wanted to kind of jump into that because I
had no clue all of the stuff you've done from
the gaming side of things.

Speaker 4 (50:56):
Right right, Yeah, Actually last week I was in Saudi
Arabia playing the opening ceremony for the Sports World Cup,
which was super cool, and so I played the main theme, uh,
and then I also played on the remix that Alessa
did and it was my first time collaborating with a
DJ actually and not just any DJ.

Speaker 2 (51:15):
I mean it was amazing that.

Speaker 4 (51:18):
Yeah, yeah, and so nice, such a nice person, and
so that was really surreal. It was such an incredible
like high level production, you know, of course because it
was funded by the Royal Family of Saudi Arabia and
so yeah, yeah, with a lot of incredible and that
was like, that was great. And I've I've been very
lucky also to work on, like you mentioned, some of

(51:40):
these other game soundtracks. One of the games that I
worked on recently is one of the tournament games.

Speaker 2 (51:46):
It's still going on now. It's I think it's like
two months long or something, but it's.

Speaker 1 (51:52):
It is, it is.

Speaker 2 (51:55):
Yeah, it's amazing.

Speaker 4 (51:57):
And so Call of Duty Black Ops six was one
of the games. So I recorded on that and then actually,
don't can I even say this a lot? I'm just
gonna say it, like, you know, oops.

Speaker 2 (52:07):
So next Tuesday, on Tuesday, next week, I'm recording for
Black Ops seven, which I'm and I love like Jack
and the composer Jack Ball. I love working with him
on these on these titles specifically because everything's heavy. It's
like heavy music, right, it's like battle music, and so
I get to go full on, like shred delicious.

Speaker 1 (52:28):
So I got to get ourselves in game mode over here,
you know, ready to make our kills.

Speaker 2 (52:34):
Yeah, yeah, definitely, and yeah and just all the other
games that I've been able to work on.

Speaker 4 (52:39):
Uh, it's yeah, it's it's just been really really really fun.
And like I mentioned before about playing in different genres
and doing different styles, I think as far as like
as a day job as it can go, Like I
really am grateful and excited about it, because every time
it's something completely different, right, like genre wise, music wise,

(53:00):
and I like that little bit of like I don't
want to say fear, but like when you sit down
as a session musician, you're expected to play the music
perfectly from the first take right to be able to
sight read. And of course that's high pressure, Like oh god,
if I suck, like that's it's over right, It's.

Speaker 3 (53:16):
Kind of crazy.

Speaker 1 (53:17):
I'm always like, do you just not wear lotion on
your fingers? Like what if your fingers slipped? Like I
always think about them, like the pressure must be so intense.

Speaker 4 (53:25):
Yeah, or if you're like sweaty or whatever. But I
do think after a while, like you acclimate to it.
But I mean on occasion, if the music is like
really hard where it's impossible to be able to play
it by sight reading, like composers or clients will send
it to me ahead of time. But for the most part,
like it's really exciting to actually pull up a piece
of music something you've never heard before, or like okay,

(53:47):
go and then you just record. And I think that
is why I haven't grown like tired of like being
a mean you call it, I like that collaborator, collaborator
or like a hired session musician, because it's always different.
So I do like when things are not sedentary, when
they're not just the same thing over and over and over.

Speaker 1 (54:08):
Right, stuff, You're so around it. I mean, you've gone
in so many different directions. It almost feels limitless where
I can see you just tapping musically into so many
different places in the world, you know, and.

Speaker 2 (54:21):
Sometimes it's a problem.

Speaker 4 (54:23):
Sometimes that's a problem, But I say, there's only one
of you, right, Yeah, I'm like, okay, I really have
to like because I'm genuinely like passionate and excited about stuff.

Speaker 2 (54:34):
So when people out yes, yes, yes, yes, oh my god,
I'm like, oh, I'm so overwhelped.

Speaker 4 (54:41):
But yeah, like I just released last week, oh my
gosh or earlier this week, I released an album with
Ricky Kesh and an incredible noble piece Lauria, and it's
also it's in the world music, uh like style and
so like I am doing like a lot of different
projects at the same time. But that's that's a process
as I'm doing right now, like like on a personal

(55:02):
level of really like you know, like I said, I
stopped touring with Hans. I was a major, major like
energy and time thing, which was it was incredible. But
now I have more energy to allocate to my own stuff.
But then I realize even my own stuff, like I think,
I think it's a little too much, like it's not
I have to say, it's not good if you wake
up every morning and you're like like to do list

(55:24):
yeah and so, and that's not healthy because also in
the end, like whatever we do for work or for
you know, like we're still humans, right, and I do
think it's important to to also live as like a person.

Speaker 1 (55:36):
So I have a little vaca time, you know, go
to the beach once in a while to touch grass,
as they say.

Speaker 2 (55:44):
I mean, I like I love touching grass.

Speaker 4 (55:47):
I mean, I know, like you know, it's a saying,
but like just the feeling of like my hands on
my feet, like in grass I don't even know the
last time I did that. I'm gonna go do that,
do to go grown right, and so yeah, just fighting
the balance. But yeah, sometimes it is a little tricky
when you're kind of like when of they say jack
of all trades, you know, like kind of master of
some right, and it's.

Speaker 2 (56:08):
But it becomes it becomes a lot when you try
to do too much. So I'm learning to delegate.

Speaker 4 (56:12):
I finally got an assistant, like because I was doing
like literally everything myself, and I still mostly do everything myself.
I started working with like a management company to not
they're co managing me with myself. I know, I know
I have control issues, but just like gradually.

Speaker 3 (56:28):
It's so crazy that you do like everything behind the
scenes for yourself. It's like insane.

Speaker 1 (56:33):
I always thought you had like a team of fifty
or something just doing everything behind the scenes for you.

Speaker 4 (56:38):
You know. I felt like when I when I went
to Saudi last week for this, uh for the esports thing,
and uh post Malone was there.

Speaker 2 (56:47):
Of course he I don't even know how big his
entourage was, but he's he's him the huge huge and
then like the other most of the.

Speaker 4 (56:55):
Other artists, I would say, except for one other artist,
they all brought like management team. I didn't ask, but
probably family or partners. And I went by myself. I
mean I had a couple of friends with me who
are producers who worked on it, so I wasn't like
alone per.

Speaker 2 (57:08):
Se, but I went by myself. And I did feel
I was like, that's kind of not not even like
weird and like a bad way, but you know, just honestly,
I justly felt bad ass.

Speaker 3 (57:21):
No no, I mean, okay, thank you, but you're a
strong woman.

Speaker 2 (57:26):
Oh thank you.

Speaker 4 (57:27):
But you know this is gonna sound weird. It's like
I I, you know, people tell me that, but like
I kind of don't want to be a strong woman
like I am, but I but I don't want to
like have to be that. And actually seem like it
was like it wasn't like bad or anything. It was good.
Everyone was super friendly at a great time, but it
actually made me feel like kind of lonely, you know,
and I'm like, oh my gosh, like for my whole life,

(57:48):
Like I think because I started having to do everything
myself just because I had no one wanted to help
or I couldn't afford, and it just became like kind
of my go to and that's just how I operate,
Like I have to do everything myself.

Speaker 2 (58:00):
I have to and it's exhausting, right and.

Speaker 1 (58:03):
Like probably hardly ask for help as well when you know, yeah,
like for me growing up, that was my biggest lesson
I had to learn, is no one to ask for help.
It's okay coming from a team sport though, I think
I got that understanding of you know, working as yes, exactly,
more people can kind of help and where your weaknesses are,

(58:23):
you give those projects.

Speaker 3 (58:24):
To people who can do it better, and you know
it makes you a better person.

Speaker 2 (58:30):
Yeah yeah, and like building a team or whatnot.

Speaker 4 (58:32):
And so after that experience, just like a few days ago,
over last week, I am currently like negotiating myself but
with another I'll just say a corporate event, client person
thing and not a person. It's a big company for
something in December, and I thought, you know what, like
I should so I asked, I said, Okay, I'm going
to need at least three flights, so I'm going to

(58:53):
bring a tech where I shouldn't be schlepping all my
own gear myself, but I can really barely carry it.
And then an assistant or travel companion and I sent
the email to them and they email me back yesterday.

Speaker 2 (59:04):
It's like, oh yeah, no problem. I'm like asking you
shall receive.

Speaker 4 (59:08):
I just never asked for it. I'm like, I have
to do everything alone, and yeah, that's not healthy. I
think that's that's my biggest I'm still learning a lot
of lessons. I'm like basically learning how to be a
human now, because I said the last like that, you know,
all my life like just working, working, working, working, and
now I'm like, okay, how do I like take care
of me? Right?

Speaker 1 (59:28):
Also, so yeah, I always say you don't get we
don't ask for too. So in life that's kind of like,
can I have a many entourage And they're like, of course.
And then you see other people too, They're like, so
I need fifty people if you can do fifty flights
and we're gonna needs.

Speaker 4 (59:45):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (59:46):
And I have heard from certain artists so for you,
you were like the lowest maintenance for them, a breath
of fresh air. They're like, oh my gosh, thank god,
it's Tina. This is gonna be so much easier, you know, yeah.

Speaker 4 (59:59):
Yeah, So like I still like a streamline efficiency, but
I think it's it's good to have like a couple
of or a few you talked to me in like
a year, I'm like, I have.

Speaker 2 (01:00:08):
A thirty person to rush. No, no, but I think
I think it's uh, it's good.

Speaker 4 (01:00:12):
And you know, again with like trying to balance everything,
as you mentioned earlier, like that that is difficult, you know,
and that's something that I'm working on.

Speaker 2 (01:00:20):
I was married once in my late twenties. Oops. It
was I mean, it was fine, it was nothing bad happened,
but he proposed after three weeks. I did not know
the guy. We loved each other, it was fat, it
was well yeah, k yeah. But but like you remember
what I said about like don't think, just act. Yeah,

(01:00:41):
that was one of those principal Yeah, it was one
of those moments.

Speaker 4 (01:00:44):
But I learned that like the way that I approached
business and career doesn't work so well when it comes
to personal life.

Speaker 2 (01:00:52):
So that and whatnot.

Speaker 4 (01:00:52):
But I think now again like trying to carve out
more time for myself even to just like be here
at home, you know, which I before I was like
sometimes gone for seven or eight months out of the year,
Like that's not I mean, that's great, but.

Speaker 3 (01:01:05):
It's pizza too. How is pizza without you?

Speaker 1 (01:01:09):
Oh, she's asleep behind me right now.

Speaker 4 (01:01:14):
She So Luckily, I have an amazing babysitter and it
was actually the breeder that I got her from. She's
a golden Doodle and they have like I think seven
or eight dogs of their own that are pets, and.

Speaker 2 (01:01:26):
They're like like Burna Doodles, Golden doodles, and she loves
it there.

Speaker 4 (01:01:29):
So that, like that makes me feel better like previously
when I had like I'm currently single, but previously, when
I've been in relationships, like luckily, I was with like
you know, a very very nice person for the last
few years that was able to babysit her, and so yeah,
I mean it's I think that's also the reason I
haven't had like a child, right, which I'm not sure

(01:01:50):
if I'm not sure if I want that, Like I
think it depends if this right situation.

Speaker 2 (01:01:56):
But I think again now.

Speaker 4 (01:01:57):
It's like it is like a I've been having like
a epiphany moments, like moment after a moment, just trying
to like again, like I had to pick my life,
if that makes sense, like to choose because I feel like, again,
so much of everything hasn't been from what do I
want because I didn't have the luxury of that, right,
So I just kind of go along with it, and
you have to keep going.

Speaker 2 (01:02:17):
You have to make more money, you have to.

Speaker 4 (01:02:19):
Do more shows, you have to say yes to everything,
and it doesn't it doesn't leave much room for like Tina,
But I'm like, who who's Stata.

Speaker 3 (01:02:28):
And what's your freedom for once?

Speaker 4 (01:02:32):
You know? And yeah, I'm yeah, I'm learning to do
that and like yeah, like I'm like, I have so
much music, like right now to learn for uh Vadkan,
the world's biggest metal festival, which I'm very excited about.
So I'm playing like five different things there. I'm not
with my band but just by myself and as a
guest with a few bands, and so it's a lot
of material to learn.

Speaker 2 (01:02:53):
But my best friend, her name is also Tina. We've
been best friends since we.

Speaker 4 (01:02:56):
Were like twelve, and we don't see each other that
often because she listens to Diego.

Speaker 2 (01:03:01):
She has two kids.

Speaker 4 (01:03:01):
You know, she's busy, she's you know, working, and we
have planned like a spa weekend, so we're gonna go
meet at a spa half of Saturday and on Sunday,
and the old me like really like the old me
would have been like, I can't sorry, I have to.
Like It's like for years, I really like I I
don't want to say I feel bad about it, and
she's understanding. But like for years I didn't even see

(01:03:22):
her because like or anyone, because I was just so
obsessed with my and maybe in the building phase again. Yeah,
but like now I was like, you know what, it's fine.
I'm gonna figure it out, like things, you always figure
things out. Yeah, even if I'm like like air challowe
on the airplane all the way to Germany and like
trying to learn this stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:03:40):
So I'm like, what is that.

Speaker 3 (01:03:41):
Crazy girl doing on the plane.

Speaker 4 (01:03:44):
I'm gonna meet my best friend and we're going to
go to this spot. I'm not gonna think about work
and we're just gonna have fun.

Speaker 2 (01:03:49):
It's gonna be fine, right and yeah, and like just
like carving time out for stuff. So that's like my
current you know, my current situation current me.

Speaker 3 (01:04:01):
Tina.

Speaker 1 (01:04:01):
Wow, you are such a true inspiration. I mean the
first time I saw you perform with Hans and seeing
you perform wonder woman. I mean, I was just like,
this is one of the coolest human beings that I'm
so fortunate to just be able to experience and see firsthand.
But to find out all these different layers about you
just makes you such an incredible person inside and.

Speaker 3 (01:04:23):
Out, I mean.

Speaker 1 (01:04:24):
And to hear all of the future aspirations that you've
got going on, I mean again just truly inspiring, and
everything that you do it just turns into a success story,
which you know, not many can say that.

Speaker 3 (01:04:39):
And what I love about you is not.

Speaker 6 (01:04:41):
Everything, not everything, not everything, well, not everything necessarily, but
a lot of a lot of components of your life
have been these amazing success stories, and you know, and
those failures too and between are kind of what make
us stronger as well.

Speaker 3 (01:04:56):
And also just the fact that you're taking on these differ.

Speaker 1 (01:05:00):
Diferent paths where people are like, you can't do this,
and you're just like, I'm gonna do it anyways.

Speaker 3 (01:05:04):
It's cool you don't like this. I'm just going to
do me, you know.

Speaker 1 (01:05:08):
And it's honestly it's very rare to me individuals who
are fearless in that sense of like I'm just going
to do what's right. For me in this moment in time,
and I'm really excited to see this new journey that
you're on, Tina. This is really cool, and I hope
that you come to the US and we can give
our audience a shout out about a tour, hopefully with

(01:05:31):
your band out here, and we're going to bring the
tribal Viking music.

Speaker 3 (01:05:35):
Maybe you can perform in a yurro. That would be
so cool.

Speaker 2 (01:05:38):
Actually, that would be super cool and.

Speaker 3 (01:05:41):
Your performance would be epic.

Speaker 4 (01:05:43):
Yeah, yeah, a cave a year like experiential type of
stuff would be amazing.

Speaker 1 (01:05:48):
Yes, that would be so cool. I feel like we're
coming up with some business concepts already here. I'm like,
how can you fail you? It's like, instead of a hive,
we're going to convert it into a really cool year.

Speaker 3 (01:06:00):
Second chapter we won't have we can. I mean, now
you can have naked men, you know, and just paint
them something like an only fur you.

Speaker 4 (01:06:08):
Know now that well, actually the two guys in the
video they're not naked, they're wearing fur. Actually, our costumes
were made by this incredible Petro. She's incredible and she
worked on the Game of Thrones and so she actually
created like our cave people costumes like handstitched like animal skin.

Speaker 2 (01:06:27):
From already dead animals. We did not kill any of
those for this, but I yeah, I mean, I guess
they're kind of naked because they're just wearing like butt
flaps and stuff.

Speaker 4 (01:06:35):
So there you go.

Speaker 1 (01:06:36):
There's there's still still doing the same kind of themes
in different ways. I love it you're saying true to yourself.
Oh gosh, well, Tina, thank you so much again for
this amazing conversation. You are such an incredible human and
again I just wish you the best in this new
path in your life and I can't wait to see
all the successes in your future.

Speaker 2 (01:06:58):
Thank you so much.

Speaker 4 (01:06:59):
I really pre sated.