Ant-Man vs Luka, Best NBA Duo, Caitlin Clark's Rough Start

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
It's the VC Show. It's the VC Show. It's the
VC Show.

Speaker 2 (00:08):
It's the due Let's TV.

Speaker 1 (00:12):
Show, Season two. Yeah, we back again, got the world
coone in there for show. So though with tell of friends,
my heart got me on the for us Slam Dunstan
whistle blow on. Then kick your feet up so you
can listen to gee. It's the VC Show. It's the
VC Show. It's the VC Show. It's the v CZT.

Speaker 2 (00:36):
Welcome to the VC Show. I'm your host, Vince Carter,
and we have a lot of great basketball to talk
about today. Two great game sevens Eastern and Western Conference Finals.
I'm gonna talk some W n B A and much
much more. And oh yeah, I have some special guests
coming through. So kick your feet up. The VC Show
starts now.

Speaker 3 (00:57):
Hold on.

Speaker 2 (01:00):
You got what they wanted, all right, guys, I have
some special special guests, really close friends. You know when
you talk about you know, we all have a group chat.
Everybody has a group chat and it's all your friends
or maybe you have your work your your your work
chat or whatnot. And I wanted to bring a couple

(01:24):
of the guys from the chat. The other guys couldn't
make it. So we're gonna we'll reconvene, We'll have the
big group on and and really have basketball talk this
way because I feel like outside of always hearing me
and and some some other NBA athletes, it's always cool
to bring in guys who have played the game, uh,
who are around it, talk it and give their opinions

(01:46):
along with mine. And I think it kind of makes
for good conversation because everybody can relate on different levels
and and you know, and enlightened because it's always like
I know how I see the game, and I know
Joe and and Ao because we've all had these conversations before,
and I value their opinions, whether sometimes their right or
dead wrong, but it makes a good conversation, so enjoy.

(02:11):
So I'm gonna start here. My first guest one of
my best friends. We've been friends since childhood. He's now
the head coach at our album Model Mainland High School
back to back state playoff appearances as a coach twenty
three and twenty four, back to back Coach of the
Year in Belusha County, that's where we're from. In Daytona

(02:33):
Beach twenty three and twenty four back to back five
star Coach of the Year also twenty three and twenty four,
So the last two years has been pretty darn good
for him. And as a player, he also went what
back to back state championships we won in the ninety
five and once I left he wanted again as a

(02:53):
senior in ninety six. Played college football and basketball at BCU.
That would be Bethune Cookman University, Hell Wildcats, played in
the CFL for the Toronto Argonauts, played in the played
arena football for the Toronto phantom And he's also Mainland
High School's own Joe Giddings. What's up, Joe? How you

(03:15):
doing everything? Well? You know, Steve Harvey gives his introductions,
but you know, I try to do my best.

Speaker 4 (03:20):
I appreciate it, man.

Speaker 2 (03:21):
All right, all right, and my next guest, all right,
what did we start? Okay? Here my next guest. Grammy
Award winner in twenty eighteen for Best Rap Album for
Cardi B's Invasion of Privacy. Hold On six time Grammy
nominated producer hold On fifteen Billboard number one awards, three

(03:42):
billion streams, seventeen million records soul. He has worked with
artists like you Know Lil Wayne on the song John a. Marion,
Let's talk Beyonce, bout Allen, Chris Brown, Bryson Tiller, Eric Belager,
Trey Songs, Doja, Cat, Cardi B and Mex Stallion on
wh I know you guys listen to that? You know
it plays everywhere? Yes that here's the guy who did

(04:05):
that right here, Ao himself, just to name a few people.
His first placement, it was in two thousand and nine
working with Soldier Boy. If you guys think back Soldier
Boy in two thousand and nine. Yeah, you know the rest.
His first Grammy nomination two years later, in twenty eleven,
he collabed with The Orlando Magic to refresh their theme song,

(04:27):
which is so fire and if you haven't listened to it,
go to their go to their page and check it out.
This is who did it right here. Shout out to
Ao Lake Brentley's own Austin Owens aka a Yo the producer.
Thank you guys. Yeah man, thank you guys for showing up. Man.
I appreciate this. I feel like we're gonna have a

(04:48):
good time. So we're gonna get get started, to get moving.
I'm gonna start with Joe first, and Joe, I think
back to you know our years obviously growing up and
Ao obviously you could chime in. I know you've heard
these stories. But I think back to that and I
think about losing in the state playoffs in ninety four,
which was my junior year. What do you briefly, what

(05:10):
do you remember about that?

Speaker 4 (05:13):
First thing? I remember that we all went ball, couldn't hear?

Speaker 2 (05:17):
Yeah, I kept it that way.

Speaker 4 (05:19):
Yeah, we all went could I hair? Like we could
I hair? That's the first thing. But I know another
thing that I remember is that pain. Man, It was
pain to lose, even though you know it was it
was a stage for us, the big stage for us
from coming from a little from all time being on
that stage, but that was that was a hurt feeling.

Speaker 2 (05:41):
And do you happen to remember in the locker room afterwards,
remember what I said, we'll be back. Yeah, So we
were sitting in there and everybody, I mean, we're all
mad and pissed off, and you know, blah blah blah,
crying the whole nine. And I just I looked around
the locker room. I like, man, sad, Now we'll be back.

(06:03):
And in nineteen ninety five we were able to come back.
And obviously fulfill our dream h if. I mean, it's
tough enough to get the joke and speak on that
for sure, But it's tough enough to get there one time,
but to do it back to back years. And that
was a goal of mine, particularly my senior year. I
didn't want to go out when I felt like we
were good enough the year before. But I think we
learned a valuable lesson on sticking to sticking to the script.

(06:27):
I'm not saying we played out of our character, but
I mean, you know, we went ball. The whole team
went ball. I mean, everybody made a sacrifice for the
good of the team though. So it was we were together.
It's just it just didn't work out. And then the
next year we got there. I vowed, you know, to
I was going to do my part, and it was
a team collabed effort. I told you go ahead.

Speaker 4 (06:49):
A lot of people don't know that. There's something. My
sophomore year, your junior year, the year that we lost
you was ash damn the twenty seven points a game,
points a game, man, And then you was like, we
told he was gonna be back. The next year, you
you average.

Speaker 2 (07:06):
Less, average less points. Yeah, that's points more rebounds and assists.

Speaker 4 (07:09):
More rebounds asision, we have aged more and then we
want a championship. You made a sacrifice for us. It
was like, hey, I'm I'm gonna do this right here.
I'm a rebob and more you got more assistant. Then
we took our game to another level, and hey, we
want a championship.

Speaker 2 (07:24):
And he you played basketball too for a brief second, right,
a very broch you don't want to talk about.

Speaker 5 (07:30):
Literally a brief second.

Speaker 2 (07:31):
But yeah, yeah, okay, Well, well Joe, what was uh
what's a memorable moment for you in your high school career?

Speaker 4 (07:40):
Mm hmm, I'll tell you this. Uh your senior year.
My junior year, we played against Launch Park. Ah, god,
I had twenty eight points and twelve. I had twenty
eight twelve that game. I had a fast, great dunk.

Speaker 2 (07:53):
Yeah I remember that.

Speaker 4 (07:55):
And besides that, and then Ocean Center when I.

Speaker 2 (07:59):
Have dunk and our right against our rivals.

Speaker 4 (08:02):
Yeah yeah, the people there, you know those about two
of my moments.

Speaker 2 (08:07):
Man, I'm gonna I'm going to ask you this because
I know your your memory is pretty good. This kind
of ties into this guy over here. What do you
remember about our game against l Branley, God.

Speaker 4 (08:23):
To which one, Like that's that gave we have like seventeen.

Speaker 2 (08:26):
The birthday the birthday, yeah, that was the birthday one.

Speaker 4 (08:28):
Yeah, like twenty seven, seventeen, seventeen or seventeen. About seventeen blocks.

Speaker 2 (08:36):
Was well sins like, yeah.

Speaker 4 (08:39):
I know, yeah, I seventeen blocked. You just sometimes use
his blocking shots even with you know.

Speaker 2 (08:44):
They go, you know, going, yeah, that's what coach. You
got mad at me?

Speaker 4 (08:48):
You went crazy back, man, I was crazy.

Speaker 2 (08:52):
My bad? You know, yeah, you you weren't there, so
you know, you know, I'm sure you heard about. We're
gonna keep it moving up. Hey Joe, you know, I
know you've coached for for how how many years now? Where?

Speaker 4 (09:08):
Twenty years?

Speaker 2 (09:09):
Twenty years? So can you name some of the talented
players that you've coached against? Uh that is that are
recognizable names male or female? Because for those who don't know,
he also coached women the women's team as well back
in the day. Can you name a few that you've
coached against that you were like, he has some.

Speaker 4 (09:29):
The most recent one was sinceketball from Orlando he played.
He's at Utah right now.

Speaker 2 (09:36):
Man.

Speaker 4 (09:37):
Then he gave us like thirty five forty and our
gym he was that's the most recent one.

Speaker 2 (09:46):
Eat or what's up? You didn't pay against the big
fella from he was in the final four? Oh no,
he's a im.

Speaker 4 (09:54):
Didn't play him?

Speaker 2 (09:54):
Yeah, you didn't pay him that year?

Speaker 5 (09:56):
Okay?

Speaker 4 (09:56):
Yeah, So sincekeball is the most one I like I said,
I have, I have few guys that go play, but
not I make no noise yet, but become.

Speaker 2 (10:07):
Paul, thank you?

Speaker 1 (10:11):
You know.

Speaker 2 (10:11):
And lastly, I want to say you've done a great
job of developing players over the years, not just to
be the best version of themselves basketball wise, but also
off the court. You know, I think I know the
answer to this, but where did that come from? What
did you? Where did you develop that passion to help

(10:33):
these young men become student athletes not just athletes?

Speaker 4 (10:36):
Well think about it. You know our parents, our parents
education first, you know, everything else to take care of self.
So to me, if I can build a better young
man basketball the ball in South Bounson at one time,
so what's next? So if I can leave guys to
be better husbands, better fathers, better role model flock you

(10:59):
know wrote my community. I done my job. The wins,
the wins come, the losses come, but there's nothing like
you know, having that that young man go out of
the community and then call me twenty years later, Hey, coach,
I remember DTLT do a little things. Shout out yes,
talk about talk about stuff like that that they have learned.

(11:19):
So everything that we was was taught as a as
a player minded up doing the same thing.

Speaker 2 (11:26):
Shout out to coach. Bring our high school coach. He
kind of taught us that and kind of got us
in that same mode. And this kind of ties into you,
al because you're kind of the same thing in your profession.
As far as giving opportunity. I know you've uh spoke,
you spoke, you spoke at symposiums and and different groups.
Uh full sale. I don't know if it was you

(11:47):
just speak or did you teach a class, But nevertheless,
the point that you were kind of dropping gyms and
giving knowledge to young up and coming producers and artists
on how go about their business? Where did that come
from for you?

Speaker 5 (11:59):
I'm I mean, first and foremost, like you said, parents,
but I think secondly surrounding myself with men like y'all.
Like I learned a lot from you. You know, music
is what I do not who I am, and I
think that's sort of how you look at basketball is
what you did very well. But I think the man

(12:21):
that you are off the floor was much more and
just the businessman. I remember one time specifically, you were like, Hey,
do you know how to run motorcycles? And I was like, yeah,
I'm thinking, we're going, you know, ten to fifteen minutes away,
and I'm like, where we're going?

Speaker 2 (12:36):
There were taking that hour?

Speaker 5 (12:38):
We going to my restaurant, you know, And I'm like, man,
just planting those seeds. Man really taught me to think
a different way. And for me, you know, I think
it's selfish when you're able to receive wisdom like that
and keep it to yourself. So I always try to
just pay it forward and share it and hopefully the
people we share it with go and do the same thing.

Speaker 2 (13:01):
Right. And the cool thing about AO is that we
met obviously through a mutual friend many many many years ago.
It's been a very long time through music. Shout out
to Rod, shout out to KP also or other buddies,
a lot of people as far as involved in music,
and we all got linked together and it's kind of

(13:22):
like it was a natural thing, and I know at
that time you were going through something, some issues in
the business. Obviously, everyone who's in the music business, as
you know, goes through something. And it was funny. I
remember us sitting pretty much right over here, and the

(13:44):
one thing I said to you, you know, like, well
let's let's talk about let's talk through it. And like
I said, we barely knew each other like that, But
you know, I value the opinions of everyone else who
brought you in. They felt like you were apart. It
wasn't just work, you know, it was kind of a
friendship along with work. And I remember you coming in

(14:04):
and I was just like, man and just trying to
give you, like real advice as a friend more so
than anything else, trying to oh if you got the
old man, I helped him get to it. It wasn't it
was zero, nothing about that. It was more so just
lending helping him, you know what I'm saying. So that's
just kind of who I've always been. But you know,

(14:25):
I just remember that situation and just kind of just
trying to shoot it to your for real.

Speaker 5 (14:29):
It's so crazy. I tell the story often. You said,
and you helped me in it. You said, I can
help you, but I'm not. And I'm like, man, like,
what does that even me?

Speaker 4 (14:41):
You know?

Speaker 5 (14:41):
Like, but I knew just out of the respect that
I had for you that it was real purpose to it.
And you were like, look, you know you can learn
now with one hundred thousand, or you can learn down
the road with you know, a million, ten million, and
that alone, man like man right there right there. So yeah, thank.

Speaker 2 (15:05):
You nah for sure for you man going through the business.
And we've enjoyed your music obviously on this side outside
of what the world has has has seen and and
for even those who don't know much about you, but
what what has been most gratifying for you in the business?

(15:30):
I mean you, like I said, like for those once
again he he I remember that you you texting the
group chat about why and how fast it became what
it's become, like literally overnight.

Speaker 1 (15:42):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (15:43):
Now, and I'm gonna ask you this before we even
go there. I know a lot of artists say they
don't like They say, oh, man, I did this record
and I didn't even like it, but everybody else said
put it out anyway? Is that a Is that a
beat that you created that you liked it? Like this
can be something or was it one of I was like, yeah, whatever,
it's cool.

Speaker 5 (16:01):
But man, man, it's so crazy. And I don't know
if I told the story or not, but I made
a lot at home on my couch, just one of
those things like you know, just keep the repetition, just
keep working. And I didn't think it would be what
it was, but you know, thankfully, thankfully it is, you know.

(16:24):
But I think far as like gratification, man, I'm just
I'm thankful to do what I love and really help
the people that I love most, and just the memories
that I've been able to create, you know, you know
for my family and now for my kids, Like that's
just been so amazing. And I think the other side,

(16:46):
which is sort of why we all bonded over music,
is just the therapeutic side of it, you know what
I'm saying, Like we sort of just we closed that
door right there, and you know, we we have fun
and you know, get these emotions and put it down
on paper and get it out, and man, it's just

(17:06):
been such a bonding and experience and you know, just
being able to create that over and over, like it's
a blessing.

Speaker 2 (17:13):
And for you think about this. Did did things seem
bleak like the door was closing once? You know your
issue early with the music, you know, with that that
one record. I don't know if you choose to talk
about it now, is it a thing in the past.
I don't know. I leave that up to you. But
did things look bleak like? Man? I don't know if

(17:36):
things will look up from there. Obviously you get that
opportunity to work with Beyonce and do record them, and
obviously things pop off with Chris Brown and that laundry
list of people, But how was that feeling at that time?

Speaker 5 (17:47):
So you got to think at that time, Remember, I
was Grammy nominated in the nineteen ninety two Honda and
I probably had, you know, one hundred dollars in my
bank account, and one thing that stuck out. Everybody, each
and every one of you treated me as if it

(18:08):
was the exact opposite. You know, it was nothing but love,
And you know, I knew that I would figure it
out in the process, and man, I don't know, it's
so surreal, but it's just one of them things that
I'm glad it happened. And if I could do it
over again, I would go through it again just just
because of the lessons that happened. But I think what

(18:30):
it really made me do is.

Speaker 2 (18:32):
Bro, you were stressed though, Oh, like I remember you're
taking calls in between the sessions, you and Ron, and yeah,
you were stressed. But like I say, I mean, I
guess I guess, like what you're saying makes sense though,
because it's like, yeah, you were stressed, you were going
through it, but it's always comforting and joke. I know
you've been through some things that We've had plenty of
conversations about tough times, and I think when you're going

(18:56):
through it, you go through it. It sucks, but at
the same time, you can look at your show, older
your shoulder and know that you got support. You know
what I'm saying. So I guess what you're saying kind
of kind of makes sense because it's like, yeah, I
go through it again because I know the support that
I had and I knew that I was never alone.
It just I just need to take that opportunity to

(19:18):
speak out to get it out sometimes probably you know,
whatever the case may be. And I get so, I hear.

Speaker 5 (19:23):
You, I hear for sure.

Speaker 2 (19:43):
Well then they man, we've got to lower everybody. So
let's get into some basketball, man like, I know you guys. Well,
first of all, Ao, I know you're a Magic fan,
and what were your thoughts about the Magic And I
say that because I remember leading into the playoffs or
or well, yeah, leading to the playoffs, being local, listening

(20:06):
to some of the fans, how nervous they were, And
the one thing I said about that Magic team, I said,
regardless of how this turns out, this is invaluable experience
for this team for next year, which makes them dangerous
because now they know what to expect. Now they know
what the playoffs look like. Now they it's not unfamiliar territory,

(20:32):
particularly for your star players who are going through it.
They've seen a little bit. So the nerves, You're always
gonna have nerves, obviously, And let me stop right there
real quick, Joe. For you, as a coach, do you
still get or have nerves before you go out to
coach a game? Yes?

Speaker 4 (20:50):
I think when I stopped having nerves, I think, well
that's one I'm gonna stop coaching.

Speaker 2 (20:53):
And same thing for you. Go ahead, and the same
thing for you. Do you still have nerves maybe working
with an artist or right before that that record's about
to drop. Do you still have that? Man? I hope
they like it, or you just like, hey, man, I
know I did some good stuff and not everybody's gonna
like it. How do you still have those nerves?

Speaker 5 (21:14):
Absolutely?

Speaker 2 (21:16):
Yeah? Thousands? All right? Yeah, so and I say that.
So I just think next year for the Magic, it's
gonna be extremely helpful that not only did they just
go through a series, but they went through a game seven.
So more than anything, they got to go through a
game seven, which is the hardest game to go through

(21:38):
because closing out a team, whether you're up or well,
whether I mean officer it's tied, but whether you're up
and you allowed it to come back or whether you
fought back in closing out a series is one of
the hardest things to do. I don't care if it's
the first round or the finals. It's one of the
hardest things to do. So how'd you feel about your Magic?
I know you were at a couple of playoff games.

Speaker 5 (21:57):
Sure, yeah, I think it's one of those things now,
like you said, super excited to see next season. It's
like the dogs, once they taste blood, you know it's
time to eat. So but I just think this this
season and the other song has you know, helped create
this culture, uh, you know with the team and the players.

Speaker 2 (22:19):
How does that make you feel? Man? It's like, I
know you when you did it, you're like, oh, I
think I got one, And it's always cool to think
that you got one, and you know it's gonna pop off.
But yeah, it's next level, right right. It's I read
the comments that I sent you a couple of text
mess like, yo, you should be proud.

Speaker 5 (22:34):
Yeah, I definitely am proud. It's one of those things,
like you said, you never know just how people are
gonna accept it. So those nerves were there and this
one that's just far beyond expectation and I think, you know,
just being a part of that, it just helps, you know,
bring us together. Man. I think that's what it's all about,

(22:55):
you know. It's it's something for players to connect with
fans and fans to connect with players. And even though
it was you know, like the commons say, they're like,
I'm a New York Knicks fan, but play the song,
you know, it's a something special.

Speaker 2 (23:09):
And they were winning and you got to hear it
three times, like it's like it was I'm sure some magic.
Fans felt maybe they get swept, maybe they win one.
Now they pushed it to the break where they actually
had a chance in Game seven, fell short. But it's okay, man,
like this is this is signs of looking up. I'll
say that there were two Game sevens just passed and

(23:31):
they were fantastic. They lived up to the billing. In
my opinion, I thought it kept people on the edge
of the seats. Well, I'll start with the Knicks Pacers.
It ended up a blowout, but at the same time, man,
it was competitive from start to finish. The Knicks the Knicks, man, regardless.

(23:54):
It's funny you hear you hear fans. You know, that's
what we do. We hear fans talk about all we
didn't have all our guys and all that stuff. But
they still had a legitimate shot in winning. Obviously it
was a blowout, but they still had a legitimate shot
with what they had And that says a lot about
the character and the culture in New York. And on

(24:15):
the other side, I think what Rick Carlile has done.
I played for Rick Carlile in Dallas, you guys remember that,
And to see him now buy into the new age,
the new style, the new culture, the new way of
coaching and everything. Man, it says a lot about him
as a coach and having a point guard like Tyrus
Halliburton was fantastic. And my thing was, like at home

(24:42):
he was killing, he was putting up big numbers, uber aggressive,
and on the road in New York he just wasn't aggressive.
And it frustrated me because obviously it's a different vibe.
You gotta find your own and find and create your
own energy on the road all of these things. But
he was a different monster. Game seven, this dude was aggressive,

(25:07):
like aggressive. Twenty six point six assists, ten for seventeen
from the field six or twelve from three point line night,
that was Those numbers are what he did at home,
and he brought that same energy on the road. What
say you guys, what did you see? What were your
thoughts about got Game seven? Hey, yo, you go ahead
be hell goo, Yeah, I.

Speaker 5 (25:27):
Look at it.

Speaker 4 (25:28):
Uh.

Speaker 5 (25:29):
One thing I pride you on is, uh, you know,
just staying healthy is so important, man, taking care.

Speaker 2 (25:36):
Of that body and uh, you know, and those guys
for the you know, next played a lot of minutes,
I mean, but they had to. They were down bodies.
And I'll say this real quick. And Joe, you're a coach,
and you guys heard me just say this not too
long ago. The thing that bothers me about you, coaches,
Joe you, I said, just this, the thing that bothered
me about you coaches, man, And I hope as a coach,

(25:57):
I don't do this. But when you're up and you
have blowout wins and stuff, you got to give you
a bench a chance to play because they need to
gain that invaluable experience for situations like what the Knicks
had gone through. Meaning Randall goes down, Robinson goes down,
Og goes down, then all of a sudden, Jalen Brunson

(26:21):
goes down and you look down that bench and you're like,
oh man, you don't have the confidence to play that guy.
You know for whatever reason, or you feel like he
doesn't mess or feel comfortable confident, Well, you haven't given
him that opportunity in situations. Yeah, sample sizes, but more
sample sizes he gets, the more comfortable he is. Also,

(26:43):
so you know, I just wanted this to add that
to what he was saying. For sure, for sure, go ahead, Joe.

Speaker 5 (26:51):
I agree.

Speaker 4 (26:51):
I think that the Knicks run out of gas. I
think those guys of the minutes they play, I think
Burke came off the bitch and twenty six points.

Speaker 2 (26:59):
He who hadn't played right right, So.

Speaker 4 (27:02):
Imagine if he hadn't played during the season, like you
said earlier in the series, No, he could have been
give him a spark where those guys could have got
some breathing hen there. Yeah, to me, I think game
game six in game seven, I'm like, I think tournament
was big for those guys, specially yeah six for the
Pacers coming out big man shooting threes, and he kept

(27:24):
him in the game in game six.

Speaker 2 (27:25):
So I'm gonna throw another name at you, Pascal Siakam.
I thought Game six in Game seven were well showed
the value uh he had in that trade right there.
He didn't play great early in the series, in my opinion,
I don't have his numbers, but Game six look a

(27:48):
lot more aggressive, uh, more confident at the free throw line.
And then game seven he was comfortable because he'd been
there before. He has a championship, so he knew how
to lead and just go out there and kind of
set the tone and break the ice. I thought he
was another one. And then that other that other dog, TJ. McConnell. Yes,

(28:09):
here's another guy who's been there, you know. And as
a coach, every every coach loves, wants and needs a
t J. McConnell. Would you agree.

Speaker 4 (28:21):
I agree every team need a dog with a team,
and that person's gonna go out there and do little
things that other people want to do and be aggressive
with it. So I think he was big.

Speaker 2 (28:32):
And also, I'm gonna say de Vincenzo, I thought he
was fantastic. I didn't see him to be this prolific
of a score. And it's not disrespect I just didn't
see it. I mean, obviously he was playing within his
role he played in Golden State. I think he learned
how to be a great body mover meaning just moving

(28:52):
off the ball, and obviously a great catching shoot or
catching off the move. He learned a lot playing with
the Golden State Warriors.

Speaker 4 (28:58):
So yeah, man, I could you imagine playing NBA with
your college teammates like no, playing.

Speaker 2 (29:09):
With Antoine and Jeff McGinnis, and yeah, those guys.

Speaker 4 (29:15):
Man Chico, like the Knicks, Man, they had guys and
all three guys that wanted to do no that played together.
So they played well together. They played well together. That
that was a big reason why they was able to
accomplish a lot of stuff and fight through some stuff
because they've been to the practice, they've been playing together
for a long time. And most of those guys I
think went to college for four years. M hmmm, so

(29:38):
they're for a little bit more mature.

Speaker 2 (29:40):
So yeah, they they they they hurt the hurt bitar heels.
We had the series one and uh yeah, they got us.
They got us. But we ain't gonn talk about that.
We're talking about NBA basketball and the other game seven
Denver Nuggets versus the Minnesota Timberwolves. That was wow. I

(30:02):
mean the build up, it's like you went from a
great game. Oh man, it was unfortunate. Obviously we didn't
mention Jalen Brunson obviously breaking his hand on on the
on the strip down and I thought he was unbelievable
all all series, I mean all serious shoot, all playoffs,
and you know, it was just unfortunate. So I want
to give him his love and shout out. I played

(30:23):
with his dad Rick in Toronto briefly, so man, I
was obviously rooted for him to continue to play well.
But it was that that great series, great Game seven
which led to even better Game seven with the Nuggets
and Minnesota? Uh, what are your thoughts? First on what
you saw and then I'll get into what I my thoughts.

Speaker 5 (30:48):
Man, I think, Uh, again, the fatigue played its role.
I've seen something where they were talking about you know,
obviously they had a very long season last year, and
you know that down time that they usually would have had.

Speaker 4 (31:02):
Uh, they did it and then usually series many Yeah,
and then I didn't like that trying to I didn't
like that. What what were your thoughts on trying to
just secure that that second place spot and not being
able to wrest their guys as well?

Speaker 2 (31:14):
You know, And well, let me jump in real fast though,
because I gotta say this. I didn't I didn't like
how that, how that came off because I look at
the Bulls who went three p I look at all
former champions prior to I mean they they all had

(31:36):
a long season flowing into the next year and get
it done. Look at Golden State, look at Lebron and
his teams. Who who were who went five years in
a row? But I mean at least to the conference finals.
So I just I understand what he I hear what
he's saying, but at the same time, I just I'm

(31:57):
just like, yeah, the reason you you those minutes is
because you wanted to win and get the best possible seed.
He didn't feel comfortable going back to our last conversation
about using other guys to savor some of those minutes.
You see what I'm saying, And and and he lost
Bruce Brown, he lost Jeff Green. Shut up to the uncle, Jeff.

(32:20):
Those guys were huge off the bench for him. Where
he can he can buy some minutes, and he didn't
feel comfortable. In my opinion, I'm on the outside looking in,
but I just felt like he didn't feel comfortable. You
used DeAndre Jordan in a few more minutes. You can
kind of sit Joker down a little more to have
him fresh forward. But it's kind of a sacrifice you
have to make to get what you want to get.

(32:42):
They were trying to get the number one seed, period,
you know what I'm saying. So that's that's kind of
what comes with it. So that's that's the only thing.
And Mike Malone is fantastic. He's a great coach. You know.
I just I just I didn't agree with them on
that that's just what it is. Go ahead, Joe to me.

Speaker 4 (32:57):
With Gordon Porter Junior in kse CP he combined for
sixteen points at home in game seven. There's no way
your other three starters who have been playing well here
and they're combined for sixteen points in the game seven
and the close out game and at home to me,
Minnesota was the aggressive in the second half. They made

(33:18):
adjustments by putting Red in the game. Who's a knockdown
shoots Now now Joker, Joker had to go out and guard.
He had to go out and defend those guys who
can shoot with kat Reid, and now he got stretched
forward and Joker played forty seven minutes. He played forty
seven minutes in that game. Late in the game when
when the game was kind of closed, he had fatigued

(33:39):
where he couldn't get rebounds and couldn't get stuff out
there late.

Speaker 2 (33:42):
I think and see, I'll say this as as a coach,
you got to decide, and it's a it's a decision
you have to make on the spot. So will he
look at it like maybe I should have set him
down when they were up twenty at some point in
the game. Maybe he should he could have uh step
with his normal rotation or minute rotation. At that point

(34:04):
you have a lead. Obviously, when you're losing your lead
a little bit, you could throw him back in the
game instead of just sitting them down. I mean, just
leave him on the court. I guess I'll say this.
There's another thing about there's a big thing about what
Chuck said on T and T because I was on
that night about sitting Gobart, and it's a couple of

(34:25):
guys has come out and said that they thought so.
And I kind of understood what they were saying because
they were trying they needed to play faster to get
back in the game, and like you said, Joe, make
Yo Kic guard and they wanted to kind of attack.
I think Kat was doing a very good job of
guarding him until he got fouled. The one thing that
bothers me with Rudy, and I said it on air

(34:46):
and I'll say it again, he was playing too straight up.
So if you're seven whatever you are, and you got
a bigger guy like that, you can't guard him straight
up like that because when he hit you, you're gonna
fall all over the place. He just needed a better base,
a lower base and a little more and active hands

(35:08):
to kind of get him thinking a little bit, show
him different looks and stuff like that, which he didn't do.
I just felt like that's when Joker was able to
take advantage of him. And you see when Kat was
playing them, he was kind of giving them different looks
and just playing them. Sometime he pushed them, sometime he
tried to out quit them, just to get him thinking
a little bit, and that's what wore him down. So

(35:31):
that's why I understood what Chuck was saying. And I
didn't like the reporter that asked Gobert, and I'm assuming
I'm gonna assume that he didn't ask, he didn't tell
him or say give him the whole backstore in context
to why he said that. He just I think the
question was, what are your thoughts on why Chuck Charles

(35:54):
Barkley wanting you off the floor? Blah blah blah. Well,
the reason they were saying they needed play faster. The
coach said at halftime they needed to play faster, So
you know, I just it was just it's just kind
of funny how how things work in the edit that
comes out into the world all the time. But I
just felt like when you talk about Heo, you mentioned

(36:15):
this earlier about a team sticking together, having each other's back.
That's what we saw from Minnesota as far as their
superstar was being double teams and he every time he
was in a situation, they'd wait, wait, wait, go double,
make him get off the ball. So shout out to
it for having the confidence and trust and belief in

(36:38):
his guys, because if he didn't believe him and took
bad shots and forced the issue turnovers, everybody kind of
against the poutain mopen and kind of like, man, what's
wrong with buddy? You know, you know type thing. So
I just I want I gotta give him as propsy
And I asked him that question, like he had confidence

(36:58):
in his guys. You could tell that they're very tight
knit group. And having Mike Conley is huge because he
had a guy where when he got doubled, now you
have a point guard in a four on three situation
to make to make decisions or score himself. When Mike

(37:19):
was out, you saw they double and they struggled. So
I just I just like how that team, how close
knit they are, And then Aunt saying, oh, I'm gonna
step it up. They've got me, They've gotten me to
this point. Now I'm gonna do what I need to
do for them. And in the fourth quarter his defense
stepped up. He got the big steel and then he

(37:40):
hit the big three and obviously shout out to nas
Reed like you guys said, no, it was fantastic. Kat
goes with five fouls, so now you gotta leave Gobert
in and nas Reed takes over like it was just
a total true team effort something like you mentioned.

Speaker 5 (37:56):
I have a question for y'all. Do you think in
that situation being the Nuggets, is it easy to get
comfortable to have time in that locker room?

Speaker 2 (38:05):
Absolutely? Absolutely, because you think a younger team, a younger
team that doesn't have the same experience that you have,
they they're gonna the first five minutes, you know they're
gonna try to make a run to get back in it.
But Denver made the first run. They go up from

(38:27):
fifteen to twenty, so now we're kind of like, oh, yeah,
they ready to lay down, and that wasn't the case.
And yes, I agree they were for Tegue Joker had
thirty four nineteen and seven, and you can see on
his three point shot he ended up making. If I'm
not mistaken, let me see he made he made two
of them, but at one point he was zero for seven,

(38:48):
one for nine, ended up two for ten or for
one for eight and then two to ten. How many
he shot ten?

Speaker 4 (38:55):
Three? She was two for ten.

Speaker 2 (38:56):
Yeah, two for ten. So that's what I'm saying. So
it's just and the other thing, like you guys said
they have five bench points, yes, five.

Speaker 4 (39:06):
Yes, sixteenth sixteen total.

Speaker 2 (39:10):
So yeah, and only two guys in double figures. That's
not gonna get it done. So I do think they
ran out of gas and you just play sometimes, Like
it's easy to say they don't. I mean, I just
said it, but it's easy to be a team that
doesn't have the experience. But sometimes you go out there

(39:31):
and just play hard. And if I don't know better,
that's sometimes okay too. Like they don't know better, like
they don't understand maybe they didn't even realize how big
the moment is, and just just play the games, play
hard sometimes that and that's what we saw, Like they
got punched in the mouth, stagger, stagger, But we could
still play hard. We're still the number one defensive team
in the NBA. We could do that. We could still

(39:53):
give the effort and defense gave them life offensively.

Speaker 4 (39:58):
I got a question for you NBA today, it's a
lot of challenge calls, challenge files.

Speaker 2 (40:08):
Quick to do one of these.

Speaker 5 (40:11):
Anywhere.

Speaker 4 (40:12):
What's like when you played back, when you first begin
to start playing. How do you think that would have
affected the game then as it is now?

Speaker 2 (40:22):
That's hard to say. I mean, obviously, you always you're
gonna I mean, you're gonna lean into the rules whenever
you can't or how have you Whatever advantage you think
you can get, you're gonna you're gonna try to take
advantage of it. So it definitely will be utilized. Uh,
it's just it's just tough sometimes because as a coach

(40:44):
you have to obviously rely on your that that video
guy and assistant coaches to make that quick decision like
yes or no, And sometimes the player feels so adamant
about yes man, challenge this, I know I did or
did not do whatever it is, and sometimes it goes
goes left and as a coach, you lose your time out.
You don't have that challenge late in the game when

(41:05):
you probably need it more than anything. So it's a
it's a tough situation for but I know I think players, coaches,
teams adapt to whatever the situations are and if that's
the thing, they're gonna use it and it will get abused.
That's just that's just how it goes.

Speaker 5 (41:24):
You made a comment early and you said, uh, and
hopefully when I'm coaching. What did you mean by that?

Speaker 2 (41:33):
I don't know. I don't know why I said that.
You said it, I'll just put it out there. Yeah,
I know, And now that I think about it, I
did say that. I guess. I guess I did it.
I didn't mean to. I didn't one percent didn't mean that.
I have not been thinking about it. I think I
think I think I was gonna say. I mean, I

(41:55):
think I was gonna say. I think I was saying
if I were coaching. Okay, that's what That's kind of
just the things I would say. What I have no news,
no news before we get into the Eastern Conference finals

(42:32):
and stuff like that. I want to ask you a question,
in your opinion, what's one of the best deals in
the NBA? Do we still do? I think Joker and
and Murray or one of what are one of the
best I also say Kyrie and Luca the way they

(42:53):
are playing right now, yes, Am and Brown you, I
mean they're still They're still up there. Maybe not the
top two or three, I don't know, but there there
they did. They definitely deserve to be mentioned. Cat and

(43:13):
and and like right now. I mean, yeah, Jalen Brunson
and Devincenzo maybe like yes, a man like what Devincenzo
was doing, like they were getting it done. They were
getting it done. So that's duo. That's that's I don't know,

(43:36):
regardless of how it played out in Denver, but but
out of a sixty nine points, sixty nine points, I
don't mean to cut you off, nineteen rebounds and a
bunch of assists, like they've been tough all year, they
just didn't have any help go ahead.

Speaker 5 (43:54):
Out of the final four, who really has the true
duos there?

Speaker 2 (44:01):
So the best due out of the final four? I'm
mhm m is it?

Speaker 5 (44:10):
Is it a new game being played? In your opinion?

Speaker 2 (44:14):
The game is different now, it's different. It's different for
a lot of reasons. And I think we we rely
on trying to draw the file instead of getting the buckets. Now.
I say we, meaning the players now. I mean, obviously
there's more three point shots. It's funny how you shoot
all the threes and then in the playoffs back in

(44:37):
the day. Now you're trying to get into paint, utilize
your post up more. Now you you're obviously trying to
use the three point shot to your advantage. Spread the floor,
open the floor up. So it's it is a different game.
It's a faster game. You look at the the scoring
numbers now as opposed to when I first got in

(44:57):
the league, it's not even close. You didn't have that
if not one or two teams scoring one hundred points,
and they were probably on the West coast. He definitely
went on the East coast and they definitely wasn't on
my side. Uh So it is definitely a different game.
But with the answer the question the best dual, I'm
gonna say it's Luca and Kyrie. I think m hm uh.

(45:20):
And I got to give Kyrie some props the way
he has matured and what he's done, how he's bought in,
and I'm giving props to Luca for allowing Kyrie to
be the the ultimate dynamic score that he is, as
well allowing the other superstar in his team to flourish
and do what they do to make the game easier

(45:42):
for him, Like he doesn't have the four shots now,
you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 4 (45:45):
I got a question. Boughton and Luca a lot different
than Kyrie. Luca.

Speaker 2 (45:55):
I don't know they he didn't get he didn't get
a chance to be. I mean, it's I think now
we can say, man, that would have in something. Now
I think Brunson. You could see the potential in Brunson
that last year he was there, you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 4 (46:09):
But it is Boston the too. That's a good question,
is Boston too? Because you know Boston he.

Speaker 2 (46:16):
Was he was at that time. He was the two
because Luca had the ball in his hands all the time.
And I think Luca would have been dangerous if he
allowed Brunson to be the point guard with his ability
to pass and score. And now Luca catching the ball
with a live dribble, Yes, he could the ball with

(46:39):
a lot of dribble, so he could either catch it
and go right to his post move call a pick
and roll over or catching shoot. He didn't have to
always have the ball go through a bunch of pick
and rolls, set back up. Now, now get to his
step back. He didn't have he didn't have to work
that hard because of a guy like that. And I
think he's kind of seeing the benefits of that now
with Kyrie, he's seeing the benefits of that now having PJ.

(47:01):
Washington guys who can spread the floor. He's also seen
the benefits because he's having two live wires and I
mean live threats and Lively and Gafford guys who are
very active. Like So, now I come up to pick
a row, I can just wait and just throw it
up there because you got a decision, you know what
I'm saying. So yeah, all right, So since we're getting

(47:23):
into tough questions, I'm gonna ask you this out of okay,
who would you start a franchise with right now? Anthony
Edwards or Luca Dutchess.

Speaker 3 (47:39):
I'm gonna go an, I'm gonna go and just he's
twenty two, yeah, that and he's on he's ascending.

Speaker 2 (47:49):
Yeah, And look and Luca is still right there as well.
I mean he's still ascending. It's just it's just what
is what's your tea? Really? I think that's that to
answer that question, what's your cup of tea. What do
you what style do you like because they play different
style of basketball they do.

Speaker 4 (48:08):
I think I think it's more of he's on the
rise and played offense. Team he played both ends to mean,
Luca has been playing pretty good defense.

Speaker 2 (48:16):
And he has he has bought in. Shout out to
j Kibbs, former teammate. He is a man.

Speaker 4 (48:22):
He's been challenging. He's been he's been a set challenging
to me. I think they possibly have a chance to
come out to West.

Speaker 5 (48:29):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (48:30):
Is there a face of the franchise? Is there one
guy right now who would be is the future face
of the franchise or is there a few of them?

Speaker 5 (48:41):
In your opinions? A few?

Speaker 4 (48:44):
I think it's a few.

Speaker 2 (48:46):
Remember John Moran didn't play, Zion had a good year,
didn't finish Wimby Yes, I mean s G A.

Speaker 1 (49:02):
H.

Speaker 2 (49:04):
I mean you still have I mean Jason Tatum is
is on the custom of that next group as well.

Speaker 4 (49:11):
So you forgetting some guy you think the older guys
that's you know, starting that is by the time for
them let the younger guys take over.

Speaker 2 (49:19):
It just depends on on if they're ready or not.
Because I mean, you can give you can give keys
to a fool. Yeah, and and and they'll they'll take
over your franchise or they'll take over your car, But
that don't mean they're gonna bring it back in one piece.
You see what I'm saying. So it's just I feel
like you, I feel like giving the keys to a
player has you have to value that. It has to

(49:41):
be sacred. I mean, you would like to see your
car come back in one piece, that that nice Maybach
or Bentley or whatever it is that you're gonna let
them drive. This is this is this is your everything.
So I feel like we have to nurture those young
guys in the manner that what we want them to
be when you give them keys, because it's easy to
give a draft pick the keys coming right in and

(50:05):
you know, once they knowing. Just imagine if you're eighteen nineteen,
all right, this is say even twenty one, you're making
all these millions, and now you're the franchise player for
the Orlando Magic AO or whoever. Like, imagine you at
twenty one, yeah, Joe, imagine you at twenty one like
that and you got the like just think about that.
So I just think we have to kind of look

(50:26):
at when I'm giving you these keys, I need to
think can you handle the responsibility that comes with this
being that franchise player. I think a lot of these
guys who are getting that opportunity. I covered the Brooklyn
Nets and Michael Bridges. We had a couple of a

(50:46):
lot of conversations with him about the responsibility and now
the difference because when you're a role player, you're the
third guy, second guy whatever in Phoenix becoming the number
one guy on the Scott Report when they start talking
about what teams do. Guess what they talk about first, you, sir,
And so you don't have time to really be in

(51:07):
your feelings or you got to find a way and
still got to be a team guy. You have a
responsibility for yourself and other other players to get them involved,
even if you're not the point guard in my opinion,
because you can still be the vocal leader and you
have to uplift guys as well as the as a
go to guy. You know, so do you have to
have a voice in the locker room and on the court.

Speaker 4 (51:26):
So back then, I think when when you were when
you were the rookie, you had veterans that was able.

Speaker 2 (51:33):
To it was two young guys and ten ten to
twelve fits. So yes, it was different.

Speaker 4 (51:38):
To help you. You know what I'm saying, help you guys,
you lead, just like now. I told some about the
day I said, eventures go to games. He would a suit.

Speaker 2 (51:47):
No, it's just different for the playoffs. Yeah, and when
we sat on the bench it was required. I mean
that was like I said, it's just a change of
the time, you know. I mean, I think, particularly in
the playoffs, the playoffs is about business, like I'm going
to handle business like so the whole thing about looking good,

(52:11):
feel good, play good, and so and so forth. I
just feel like that's like you're going for business. So
I mean, it's it's different. And some people's like what
what what do you why? Why does what you what
you wear matter? I get it. But at the same time,
persons say you're coming in and watching business, you become
a threat. You know who we have? You know what

(52:33):
I'm saying.

Speaker 5 (52:34):
I haven't talked about like that. And you know, maybe
I'm biased because I'm a Magic fan, but don't care.
On man, I think you.

Speaker 2 (52:42):
Know, I think he's another guy. Yes, he's another guy
on the right. I still this is my opinion, I
feel like he's in the next tier under that those superstars,
like he's a star. He's on the rise of being
a superstar, and I think I think next year will
be the next step for him because of the experience

(53:04):
he got this year. I thought he took a huge
jump this year because of playing in the with the
that Olympic team and seeing how to be a pro,
seeing how to lead your team, seeing how to kind
of adjust to both the responsibility of being the star player.
I thought his growth was fantastic this year. So I

(53:28):
got another question for you, So who you got MAVs Timberwolves.

Speaker 4 (53:41):
Me personally, I think that it's gonna be a great matchup.
I think it's gonna go to seven h Dallas have
size Mavers half size. I think it's gonna and Kyrie
is the match up. Let's talk about the matchups.

Speaker 2 (53:57):
And has already said he he's got kin m so
he said it to me on Turner on post game,
said my matchup gonna be Kyrie. So I'm gonna see
what I'm gonna do. Period. I love it. He's taking
a challenge and he understands that he has to go
and see I think I think this series, the stars

(54:23):
are gonna be stars, gonna put up numbers. I feel
like Kat's gonna pull up some good numbers and Luca Kyrie.
This is gonna come down to my opinion, it's gonna
be an X factor game more so than Stars because
I feel like they're gonna somewhat cancel each other out.

(54:44):
But it's gonna be the X factor. So it's gonna
be that third score. It's gonna be the PJ. Yes,
it's gonna be like PJ. Washington or or McDaniels. Mc daniels,
I feel like he played, He played extremely well where
he nas Red is gonna play and I think go
Beart will have a huge uh. I feel like you'll

(55:07):
see a better version of him because he doesn't have
to guard Nicola Jokic every time down with that type
of size. Now he's dealing with athletes. Though, yes, Bouncy
gonna catch lives like if you're a second late, yeah

(55:28):
you know what's gonna look like. But Go Bear is
a guy that doesn't really care about that, Like he's
gonna still go for the block, go make the right place.
So I feel like for them, Dallas, dare I say
they have to play fast. I don't think. I think.
I say this, Luca can't hold onto the ball. That

(55:48):
ball is gonna have to move to create open shots
because of Minnesota's defense. Yes, they're gonna channel. They're gonna
channel right to go Beert, you have to put Gobert
in multiple picking rolls. It has to be like if
you're Gafford or something. The first screen can't be for
a lot because he's gonna sit back anyway, because Gafford,
I mean yet Luca and and Kyrie come off. He

(56:10):
has to be up. But if you you put him
in multiple screens, so it's a pin down to a
or its a high screen roll to a pin down
or something like that, then you slip to the lot.
That's tough. That's a tough action for for him to guard,
you know what I'm saying. So you have to put
go Bear multiple actions to have success. You said you

(56:31):
think it's gonna go seven, All right, Well does the
other Does the Pacers Celtics go seven?

Speaker 5 (56:39):
No?

Speaker 4 (56:39):
I don't think so. I think that. I think the
Boston's gonna win that in five?

Speaker 3 (56:45):
Wow, Okay, where does.

Speaker 2 (56:52):
What do you think?

Speaker 5 (56:52):
First of all, am I think Boston will take it,
but I'm giving him at least six.

Speaker 2 (56:58):
Okay, Joe, if it's sent five. Where does Indiana win
their one game? When they do they win in Boston
a game or they're gonna win it one at home.

Speaker 4 (57:08):
They don't win one at home.

Speaker 2 (57:10):
They aren't good at home.

Speaker 4 (57:12):
They do look good at home, they don't look that
that great on the road. But I think, you know, Boston,
Boston guys that not their stars, but the X factors.
I think it's gonna be good. Jared white Man, he
didn't even he wasn't even a five star, no start
in high school. When Juco like, look look at it now,
and I think they're gonna get there. They get their

(57:33):
center back too.

Speaker 2 (57:34):
So let me ask you this. That's why I was
gonna be asking the question. So, Chuck, Charles Barkley seems
to think Boston can't get it done if there's no
Presingers and he's projected not to play the first two games.
Do you agree with that? Because we just talked about
all of the X factors, and I think I think

(58:01):
what's the big fellaw uh Horford. I think if he's
able to somewhat guard uh Miles Turner they'll be okay
without presingers. He still has the ability to shoot the three.
He can post up. He's tough and he and he

(58:25):
does a pretty decent job and pick and roll. Now,
when they sub and bring in Luke Cornett, there's a question. Now,
I'm sure they'll have schemes and whatever to protect him
or whatnot. And maybe you don't put up Cornet plays
when Jackson plays, but he's he's an active body for
the Pacers. Well, they're back up big small ball. I

(58:51):
think small ball can can work. I mean, you're you're
talking about Tatum or Brown possibly have in the guard
miles and when he's aggressive on the glass, you're risking
wearing them down and getting them foul trouble.

Speaker 4 (59:06):
Yeah, that's true.

Speaker 5 (59:07):
That's true.

Speaker 2 (59:09):
So that's that's kind of that's my concern when you
do that. So uh, I mean, I think Boston. I
think Boston gets it done seven games. I don't know.
I just feel like they're gonna make Halliburton guard. I

(59:31):
think there was some of the you know, I know
he's up there and steals, and I know Pacer fans
and some people like, oh he's up there steels, Yes,
But I watched the Knicks game, and there were situations
where they made Halliburton have to actually guard and they're
gonna put him in picking rolls and they're gonna hunt
him out and you're gonna avoid the switch. Okay, cool,

(59:53):
But guess what Drew Holliday post up, will post up, Tatum,
you know, will post up, Jaalen Brown will post up up,
even Derek White wild post up. So now he has
to wait until Pritchard comes in the game. Maybe. Oh,
Pritchard versus t J McConnell's gonna be my c TV
Tell You, Tell You two little guys scrappy. I even

(01:00:19):
like would like to see Drew Holliday and t J
McConnell kind of go after it. I mean, obviously, Jewe
Holladay is a bigger guard. Yeah, and he could post up.
So I just think that's that's kind of the key
and rebounding. And here here's my true feeling about Boston,

(01:00:40):
particularly Tatum. He's the star. I don't think it falls
on Jaylen Brown more so than Tatum. Here's why we've
seen in times when when Tatum's not aggressive, well, guess
who picks up the slack? That guy who makes three
hundred million, Jayalen Brown, Right, So I think I honestly

(01:01:03):
feel that Pacers would have a hard time if Tatum
is in attack mode like he was in the close
out game last series, when he's going attacking and he's
not settling for the contested jump shot from three or
like a long to like, if he's in attack mode, man,

(01:01:27):
it won't matter when they play Okay, your turn, my turn.
That's when Boston's kind of not at their best. I
agree they play, but if they play like if they
play like within the Florida offense, and it's kind of like,
all right, I'm going I'm going boom my kid downhill
to give you the ball and keep it. I'm playing
off your penetration. Now, it's kind of set up that way,

(01:01:49):
Boston's gonna be hard to guard.

Speaker 4 (01:01:51):
Out of the last four teams left, which coach do
you give a nod to? Wh who's to have a team?

Speaker 2 (01:01:57):
All right, let me let me think whom Boston, Indiana Wolves.
We yes, what coach has been there? Missoula has been
there before. M hm, Carlile has been there before. Okay, uh,

(01:02:19):
as coaches Wolves have not. All right, So now with
within those coaches I'm talking about Mossoula. Missoula has the
same amount of the same group of guys that has
been there. Carlile has been there, but not with this
group of guys who are younger, who's never been this

(01:02:40):
far in this situation outside of Pascal Siaka. So uh.
But but there again, what what Carlile has done, He's
got these guys to buy in. So it's it's gonna
be interesting to see. Like sometimes I just feel like
was what some of the calls that Missoula calls, like
their calls for they're two superstars, not to be aggressive,

(01:03:03):
and that's yeah, more so than I'm running to play
for you to get what I need you to get
instead of like sometimes you don't you you know, Joe,
you've been there. I'm not. I'm not letting the point guard.
I'm calling display where I know I'm gonna get a
particular shot that I want, you know. So that's what
I think needs to happen. It's situational basketball. Of course,

(01:03:24):
who goes to the finals?

Speaker 5 (01:03:28):
Timberwol Celtics.

Speaker 2 (01:03:32):
I ain't mad at it. I ain't at at it.

Speaker 5 (01:03:35):
That's my take.

Speaker 4 (01:03:36):
I think the Celtics is gonna go and it's either I.

Speaker 2 (01:03:40):
Just know that I ain't know either. It's either it's
either Timberwolves or Maths.

Speaker 4 (01:03:46):
But I know that once with Celtics, but Timberwolves and
the Maths is gonna come down to the last second
shot game seven. Yeah, I think Kyrie is gonna hit it.

Speaker 2 (01:04:00):
Saying Okay, so you're saying MAVs.

Speaker 4 (01:04:04):
I just think I feel like a king and king guard.

Speaker 2 (01:04:10):
But keep going who wins it?

Speaker 5 (01:04:14):
Man?

Speaker 2 (01:04:15):
What an can guard?

Speaker 4 (01:04:16):
But what knud Kyrie? For seven games?

Speaker 2 (01:04:19):
He's going I mean he took the challenge with Murray Kyrie.
I was about to say that I agree a little different. Uh,
I don't know, Smoke, You're right, I'm saying a little different.
So I so, so who was Boston Dallas? And you're

(01:04:40):
saying Boston, Minnesota? Who wins it all?

Speaker 5 (01:04:43):
Minnesota?

Speaker 4 (01:04:47):
I'm going with I'm going with the West.

Speaker 2 (01:04:49):
In Dallas Dallas. So either at the end of the day,
it's gonna be a West Geez Louise.

Speaker 4 (01:04:58):
Who who's going within it all?

Speaker 2 (01:05:00):
I'm I'm I'm the Boston Wolves. Yes, yeah, yeah, there
you Boston Wolves. This week? I would say Minnesota, Minnesula

(01:05:27):
this week? Jah, I am I mean, it's like it's
a whole lot of ifs, ifs, If Presingers is healthy,
that's a different team, and it's a it's a different
guard for go bet.

Speaker 4 (01:05:44):
Yeah, he got the guard.

Speaker 2 (01:05:47):
That dude out there on the perimeter because thats where
he's gonna be. He's not going into the post. Now,
it's no sitting there's no sitting back. It's no sitting back.
But he has to be up. So that's that's that's
I think that's what that's what will do it for me.

Speaker 4 (01:06:05):
Defensive team, yeah, right now, they had.

Speaker 2 (01:06:08):
The best team all year. Yes, and they showed that, like,
hands down, they showed yes.

Speaker 4 (01:06:16):
Even after winning, he's losing three and the rod they
came back into seven game seven, it was different defense.

Speaker 5 (01:06:23):
Second h.

Speaker 2 (01:06:40):
All right, well let's move on.

Speaker 4 (01:06:42):
Let's go.

Speaker 2 (01:06:42):
Let's go on to the w n B. A. Have
you guys been watching much. I know we've all heard
everybody's on social media, so we've all heard about the
hype of Caitlyn Clark, angel rees, even Cameron brink with
the with the l A spark. How impressed or what

(01:07:03):
are your thoughts on Caitlyn Clark so far?

Speaker 4 (01:07:06):
Well, I'll take you this when Kate and Clark was
in high school with her, Iowa a tack team played
in the a turnment at Mainland that was given by Essence.
So I got a chance to see her play at
Maine High School.

Speaker 2 (01:07:20):
Okay, how was she as a player in high school?
Is she pretty much like we know her to be
right now?

Speaker 4 (01:07:26):
It was? It was good TV, man, I'm talking about
every game that she played. Me and this guy, Coach Martin,
shot at Coach Martin. We watched and what you see
now she was doing, shooting, passing. She was the leader,
she always has always been that way. And her team,
most of the girls I was on her, our attack team,
went to college with her, and she was good. It

(01:07:46):
was good TV in high school. And she shot the
deep deep ball, shot at deep. But now she didn't
shoot at DP. She shooting now, but she was. She
shot three balls well, yeah, shot fall very well.

Speaker 2 (01:07:59):
So I got a yeah, yeah, what's your thoughts to me?

Speaker 5 (01:08:03):
It almost reminds me of the winby Hype, you know,
he came in. I think it was a lot of
pressure and the performance that was expected early wasn't there.
But I think, you know, being somebody who didn't play,
I observe it as a fan, and I love the

(01:08:24):
eyes of what it's doing for the overall lead versus
a specific.

Speaker 2 (01:08:29):
Player, and let's talk. Let's talk about that real fast.
I think as much as you and I've said this
on previous on the previous part, as much as you
may love or hate Caitlyn Clark, she's brought more eyes
and I'm gonna and before everybody jumped like what about,

(01:08:52):
what about I'm getting there. But she was the number
one pick. She has that winby hype, like you said,
and that brought from from her fan base alone, brought
more eyeballs to the WNBA to where now you're you're
finding bigger venues for to house a fever game. But

(01:09:14):
the same is with Angel Reese, and I felt like
Angel Reese, Caitlyn Clark would struggle because of the hype.
And she has to now go against these girls who
they say, this is not college. Now you're taking the
best from college and putting them in the pro. It's
another level. These girls are stronger, the nastier they moved

(01:09:36):
their feet, so on and so forth. So I feel
like I felt like the beginning was gonna be a
adjustment period for understanding the speed and strength of these girls,
and midway through her WNBA first season, we'll see improvement,
just like we saw with Wimby Angel Reese. On the

(01:09:57):
other hand, I felt that she would actually do okay
early because you don't have to run a play for
her for her to be dominant. She's a dog and
has a motor and she just play hard like she
trying to just punk you and just outwork you and
then tell you about it like that. Don't require you

(01:10:20):
to run a play for her. Shoot it, just shoot it.
I'll take care of the rest. And that's what we're
seeing her do more than anything. Yes, she's getting some
she's being featured a little bit, but more than anything,
I felt like she would have, particularly in the beginning,
she'd have be a front brother for probably one of
the I mean for a Rookie of the Year because
of that, and then once Caitlyn and some of these

(01:10:42):
other girls kind of settle in, you'll have an interesting race,
if not a favorite or a clear cut winner. Now,
I don't know if you guys got the chance to
see Cameron Brink for the LA Sparks. She's not afraid either,
Yes at all.

Speaker 4 (01:11:02):
Yes, she's tough.

Speaker 2 (01:11:04):
She's tough, she's a shot blocker, she's fearless. I watched
her play against the Las Vegas Vegas Aces, and she
wasn't afraid of the moment, and she wasn't afraid of
her matchup when she guarded. When she was guarding Asia Wilson,
it was like, Okay, that's cool, and that's it's great
to see. I mean, I feel like she's gonna have

(01:11:24):
her struggles, but defensively is where she she's gonna make
her mark. And then offensively, she shoots the ball. She
she has a nice stroke to be six foot everything
because she she she tall, but she she can shoot
the ball. She worked with Stephanie a lot, and I
think there he's he's the god brother, something father, something

(01:11:44):
to to her family. If I can't remember what it was,
so forgive me everyone, but I like her, her her demeanor,
her approach, and then once she kind of gets her
feet under her. As far as how this game is
played offensively, she'll she'll pick up a Defensively, she fits
right in. Have you guys gotten a chance to see

(01:12:05):
the New York Liberty, Yeah, let me tell you something.
They are good and they were in the They were
in the the w NBA finals last year they lost
to the Aces. But it's pretty much the same team
and watching them, I watched them against the the Fever.

(01:12:28):
They're good. They put it this way. We have a
chance to see repeat finals in my opinion, Liberty versus
the Aces, because my other question was the Las Vegas Aces.
If you guys seen them, probably not. They are good
as well. They are loaded, and they picked up one

(01:12:49):
of Caitlyn's Clark Caitland Clark's teammates. I can't think of
her name right now. It's it's I was trying to
think of her name. That young lady is not afraid
of the moment either, and get to her to her
credit because of her playing with Caitlyn in college, always
on the big stage, always having eyeballs, Like, it's not

(01:13:11):
really that big of an adjustment for her because the
acests get a lot of attention, you know what I'm saying,
Like they get a lot of attention, and it's like
outside of like, man, I'm in the w NBA playing
with these girls. She was out there getting it done,
making big plays, and she shoots the ball. She's defense,
she's fearless, like, man, I love it. Man.

Speaker 4 (01:13:30):
So you think like Caitlyn and Lembe, those two type players.
Do you think when they get at the league, like
when they being in the league, do you think players
go at them.

Speaker 2 (01:13:42):
Yeah, they're going at them because of all the hype.
They want to see if the hype is real. And
I thought I thought Wemby handled handle himself very well.
And and I think he had the advantage of having
Greg Popovich as his coach, who kind of holwe him
down just you know, hey, I don't care what they're saying,

(01:14:05):
trust me on this. We're gonna be good. You're gonna
be a star. Like he just he had to buy
into it. And it seemed to me Winby was like,
all right, coach, you the godfather. I'm listening, sir. And
look at the back end of his first season, Winby
started going crazy. So they upped his minutes. They he

(01:14:26):
gained more confidence, he started doing like some people felt
like because of his numbers he should have won Rookie
Year and Defensive Player the year. His numbers were better
than Rudy Gobert this year. His numbers were also better
than Anthony Davis this year.

Speaker 5 (01:14:45):
So question because I feel like you've been there before.
Do you think that players played against him with a
different type of chip on their shoulder because of the
hype that he had, maybe like your rookie year coming
into you know.

Speaker 2 (01:15:01):
I feel like some rookies, I mean, yeah, I guess so.
I mean because I feel like if you're a defensive
guy and you can shut Winby down, that that kind
of help boost your stock. And then offensively, if you
can go after him and particularly as a big and
have your way, that kind of helps boost your stock.
So yeah, they want to shut him down, make their

(01:15:21):
name off of him because you can see, but he's
seventy five man, and he's athletic, Like he's a seven
foot five small four. Yeah, yeah, honestly, offensively and defensively
he that same seven five small four. But the center
that can that can jump, that is athletic. So like

(01:15:41):
that's exactly that is a that is a that's that's
a creative player, right like you you you when you
create that player, you try to see, oh, seven five,
let me go all the way up ninety nine way Yeah, Like, yeah,
I'm gonna make sure he can jump high, he got
a handle, he can shoot, Like that's he's he's that
type of player. So if you can and have a

(01:16:02):
career night or a good night against them, yeah, or
if you could be that guy who he ain't getting
nothing off against me type thing like, that's an easy
way to make it. And I feel like that's kind
of how it was for Caitlyn. Diane Torazi was in
that same position as the Stars, and she let it
be known like this ain't easy coming up here. He's

(01:16:23):
grown women, and this is something you gotta deal with,
you know what I'm so. And it's it's not like
it's not like it's funny because the first thing we
throw out is all she's hating on her. It's not.
It's more so just like, let's slow down and allow
Caitlyn to and all of these rookies with the hype,

(01:16:44):
angel Rees Cameron break all of them. Let's allow these
ladies to adjust, go through their bumps and bruises early,
and let's reconvene middle of the season and see what
we have then. Because just like every w NBA player,
I mean, okay, the outlier in all of this is

(01:17:05):
Candice Parker. She doesn't count. She doesn't count. She came
in as a rookie one, Rookie of the Year and
MVP her Rookie Year she didn't got. But every player
goes through their hard times. I'm not gonna even dare say,
rookie wall. Fine, that's a real thing. I hear people
saying or play. I even hear players like n rookie
that that's a real thing. You just might not know

(01:17:27):
that you're in you're you're you're in the rookie wall
right now, but it's a real thing. Uh. But let
them get their feet said, start seeing these teams a second,
third time around. Then we'll see what they're made of,
because like, yeah, yeah, of course she is the face
like whether we want to admit it or not. And

(01:17:49):
I'm gonna say Caitlon mostly, but I'm still gonna say
Angel Reese as well. The TV revenue, the viewership as
he sales. These girls are flying private now finally, finally,
these they're still professional players, man, they are professional players.

(01:18:11):
Where rather regardless I'll say, regardless of if some people,
however you feel about the w n b A, they're
they're professional players and they are idolized by someone, particularly

(01:18:31):
their home base, and they have to go through the
airport and they had to do it years back in
the in the NBA. I mean this, the whole charter
thing hasn't been around that that long. I mean I
guess it has. I mean it's been I mean, obviously
we've flew charter, but like not too much. Before I

(01:18:52):
got in the league, they were there were all teams
had all teams didn't have a plane, not that long
before I got into the lead. So now that this
is happening, I just feel like we have to just say, hey, man,
I mean, I'm going after but I appreciate her popularity
bringing opportunity to this league because at the end of

(01:19:15):
the day, more money is being generated into the w NBA.
That means your salary is gonna co up. Because if
you can get that TV money, that means your salary
is gonna go up. It's gonna be more money in
your pocket. And yesterday's price won't be today's price because
of the TV money. Because the thing so yes like
you want to play your best against the create a rivalry,

(01:19:38):
well it's must see TV and all of these things.
That's why we're gonna see Caitlin Clark. I think I
saw a think that she maybe had all but one
game not on TV this year.

Speaker 5 (01:19:48):
Wow, all of one game.

Speaker 2 (01:19:51):
You feel me so like she is generating. Whether, however
people feel about her, Yeah, she's doing what she's doing.
The same goes for injuries. However you feel about her.
One thing you can say if you watch it, she
still play hard. She's still the same person. She loves it,

(01:20:12):
loves her lifestyle, lives her lifestyle. But she still come
to work. I can see if she did all the
stuff off the court and didn't produce, didn't play hard,
didn't have a motor, because it's like, oh she doesn't
do this. Yeah, okay, but one thing we do know
that she's gonna do is play hard. She gonna outwork
somebody out there. And regardless of all the outside stuff
that she does, she come to work and she's still throwing.

(01:20:33):
She throwing these girls around still man like crazy.

Speaker 4 (01:20:38):
I got a question for you. If you was in
the NBA around this time, Okay, how many points would
your average? But when you play, you know it was
hand chack, It was it was physical. Yeah, when you
first came to lead, it was handshake. You was averaging

(01:21:00):
thirty game. So, because I had this conversation with someone and.

Speaker 2 (01:21:06):
I think about this outside. Even with all of that
going away, the game is faster. So I played we
we weren't averaging one hundred points a game, right, that's true.
We were in the in the mid nineties, maybe even
the low nineties doing that. So now the game's faster

(01:21:28):
with more three point shooting, which I shot the three
games faster. So I got out and I'll get out
and run and catching lives and fast breaking to go
with it. So yeah, I think I would average more
off of that alone. But I will still want my
post ups. I love a post ups. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,

(01:21:52):
And it's funny. It's funny for me, Like I think
I played in the era when we came in where
you took the mid range jump shot. I made a
living off of that early. I still shot the three,
but I was getting I was getting one, two to
the mid range and getting getting what I wanted, fadeaways
and everything in between or all the way to the basket,

(01:22:13):
and they taken it away. So I think that would
be one thing. Kind of like a DeMar DeRozan who
look even even KD or book guys like that who
like to play in the mid post like I would
I would still enjoy that part of it. So all right, guys, Man,
I appreciate you. Guys wrapping it up once again, Ao,

(01:22:36):
I appreciate you. And Hey, before we move into further,
do you have any anything, any projects, anything coming out
you want to kind of promote. Man, let I feel
like we need to do that for you. Man, what
you got, Man.

Speaker 5 (01:22:49):
I appreciate it. I've been in mogile mode. So right
now I'm focused on the redevelopment downtown thirty five thousand
square feet. It'll be a two performance venues, course, a
recording studio five thousand square feet, education space, uh, coworking space,
a food hall. And then right now I'm about three

(01:23:14):
to four weeks out from finishing my first it's really headquarters,
but it'll be an additional two recording studios there, photography studio,
podcast space, things like that, and then of course you know,
still producing. Uh when I.

Speaker 2 (01:23:32):
Have two new music for any new projects, Uh.

Speaker 5 (01:23:36):
I can't talk about Dang, Yes.

Speaker 2 (01:23:40):
You can't talk about you can't talk about on the way.

Speaker 5 (01:23:43):
That's other way. It's a lot of the way.

Speaker 2 (01:23:44):
I love it. I love it. I love it on
the way, Joe, anything for.

Speaker 4 (01:23:47):
You, nice new Man, just.

Speaker 2 (01:23:50):
Just doing what you do. Man. Yeah, well yeah, Man,
Well I'll say, Joe, I appreciate you know who you are,
what you do for for now on the community, but
to our to the young kids and how you coach
those kids. And obviously you have some success stories in
college right now, making ways one of your players top

(01:24:12):
five in scoring now at LSU. Just doing great things.
So keep up the good work. And Ao, same thing
with you, I know the development, Like I mean you
just said it right there. You're creating spaces and opportunities
for other people, not just yourself, to really give them
a chance to get on. Because that's one thing I've

(01:24:34):
always been comfortable with in my skin is I know
who I am and I know what I bring to
the table into the game, but I was always willing
to help other people if I can give them or
drop some knowledge or share some things on approach that
may take them to another level or start that process.
So you're kind of kind of doing that right now,

(01:24:56):
and Joe you've been doing that. So thank you again
man for what you guys. Dude Man shout out to
the cool everybody, Chef KP Roddaz all you guys. Man
thank you guys for listening. Man, these are my boys.
This is what we do. This is what we're talking
about the VC show. We out. Let's go all right,

(01:25:37):
here's the Upper Room Playoff dunk of the week, and
it goes to mister nas Reed, who had a big fourth,
well third and fourth quarter for the Timberwolves to put
them in the Western Conference Final. His putback dunk over
Yokic goes a little something like this. The interesting thing

(01:26:12):
about this dunk, if you look at it, nas Is
gonna take off with one foot, makes the adjustment quickly
and goes to two feet and catches it. And yes,
he uses Yolkis for a little lift. But at the
same time that is a big athletic movie. You see.

(01:26:33):
They're taking off no adjust too, catches it off the
one hand. And he had two putbacks and this was
one of two. He caught one from the baseline. But
I was impressed by this dunk for the simple fact
of as he goes down, he had it in his
mind he was taking off with one, but he needed
to re adjust a little bit. Made for a pretty

(01:26:55):
good dunk, pretty good highlight, and obviously a great win.
So I get my Upper Room Playoff Dunk of the
Week to nasried. Congratulations. So my next one is who
did I run into this week? Well, I know before
I said yes, I ran into the TNT crew getting

(01:27:16):
the opportunity to work with the crew. But this week
was a little different. I got to participate in the
Black Masters for the second time, finished second or third
and twenty nineteen, and this year I was coming to
win the thing and then mister Charles Barkley shout out

(01:27:40):
to Chuck. He gave me some extra motivation. They didn't
show the part where he basically was just saying there
was nobody there that had a chance, and he guaranteed
them to win. You know how that goes. When he
guaranteed there, he is guaranteeing again. And I have to

(01:28:00):
say I had a great time. Shout out to Underdog,
who was a Volusia count of boy, which is obviously
right outside of Dayton in my area. I think he's
from Barbarville. So yes, the two Volusia kind of boys,
Volucia County boys linked up and had a memorable, great round.

(01:28:23):
I think we shot a seventy four as a team
and chucking those shot at eighty, which that you know
they gave us our proximate. They didn't, but they chose
not to tell the score. But I'm here to tell you,
and we had two big moments. Underdog wasn't great off
the team, but I'll tell you what. He hit two

(01:28:45):
huge putts. One was for Eagle. If you see right here,
this putt right here was for Eagle. I hit it
up on the up on the green. In two and
he hit a twenty five thirty footer. I'm talking about nothing.
But they were pissed because right here in that video

(01:29:05):
they're showing Underdog putting into the into the saale last year.
I was like, hey, it was this teammate. I think
his Chuck. Chuck was his teammate last year, and he
didn't you know, he ain't coach this guy. He just
let him go out there and suffer. And this year
we got it together. We had a game plan, we
executed our game plan got to eighteen, which, by the way, folks,

(01:29:26):
we had it in hand. And you see right there
throwing on the black Master's jacket with a pretty darn
interesting logo of Chuck and his old swing. But I
wanted Underdog to enjoy that moment as well, because I
tell you what his eagle. We were even through nine holes,

(01:29:47):
we eagled ten and we took off from there to
win by six shots. We hit our stride getting to
put that jacket on. It was a pretty good feeling
because Chuck had to give a speech and at eighteen
I went for the bomb just so I can say
it's over, ladies and gentlemen, it's over. And for that

(01:30:12):
it is over, I get to be a champ and
the Black Masters shout out to Ernie, Chuck Keith, Underdog, Eric,
Ernie's son. We had a good time and that there
is who I ran into this week becoming the Black
Masters champion. And my last one for the day is

(01:30:38):
my shoutout. First, I'm gonna give a shout out to
Trevor Emmerlman, who I also ran into, and he was
on the call for this historic, great moment for Xander Shoffley,
who my shoutout goes to winning his first major at
Valhalla and it was a amazing particularly his second shot.

(01:31:03):
If you guys remember, he hits it little left. See here,
drive goes a little left in that first in that
rough right there he has two feet in the sand,
hits the ball right in front of the green for
a great chip or bumping run, whatever he chose. He

(01:31:26):
goes to kind of a bumping run, got it to stop,
I mean, and for a tour player, that's an easy one.
But at the same time you're talking about winning your
first major. You see it goes left and he almost
had the toilet bowl. If he doesn't make that, he
goes obviously into extra holes against Bryson d. Chambeau, who

(01:31:48):
was warming up seemed like he was hitting bombs ready
to go. I mean, it's amazing to see the tour
players and we expect them to kind of do what
they do, and when we're in these situations, we look
and we're like, there's no way. Just imagine look at
all those people in the background having to deal with

(01:32:09):
that hone your emotions and knock down this putt. Amazing.
I did get the chance to see and watch, while
I say, watch Xander win the gold medal at the
Olympics as well. So he's accomplished some great things in
his career. Obviously had a rough finish. He ran into

(01:32:29):
a bus saw with Rory McElroy the week before in Charlotte,
and for him to really bounce back and just kind
of get it done against the naysayers saying can he finish?
Says a lot about him and his character and is

(01:32:50):
able His ability to rise up and get it done
in a big moment, particularly after what has happened to
him before. So shout out to Xander Shoftley for his
first major And those were my clips of the week.
I hope you once again enjoyed this episode. In every
episode we put out, hope you learned a lot. Enjoyed it.

(01:33:11):
Carrying this conversation onto your barbershop, to your couch, around
the neighborhood, talk about it, enjoy it. Kick your feet
up once again. Man the VC Show, We're out, will
see you next week. Let's go

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