Colin reads Fake Questions, Real Answers and names the NFL head coach who has the toughest job this season (1:00). Then Rams GM Les Snead joins Colin to discuss whether he's as aggressive in other areas of his life as he is in free agency (7:00), why he's so willing to give up 1st round picks (9:00), how his NFC West rivals affect his decision-making (12:00), how the NFL's offense-friendly rules have had a surprising consequence (14:00), why the Rams always have one of the league's youngest rosters (20:00), what separates SEC players from all other college players (23:00), why the NFL Draft is more art than science (27:00), how he handles players with big personalities (29:00), the moment he knew he'd trade Jared Goff for Matthew Stafford (34:00), how the Rams are planning to replace injured RB Cam Akers (39:00), and the NFL legend who may have sealed the Sean McVay hiring (42:00).
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
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Podcast brought to you by Fan Duel. It's never been
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(01:47):
every fan Fan Duel more ways to win. Hi, everybody
and welcome to the Friday Morning podcast. Less sne GM
of the Rams. Super sharp Dude gives up first round picks.
(02:09):
That's the culture of the Rams. Does Lebron coming to
l A have anything to do with it? But? First,
fake questions, real answers. These are a bunch of questions
I want to answer. I don't want to wait for
you to ask him, so I asked them to myself.
Dear Colin, if there's one NFL head coach whose job
you wouldn't want this year, who's would it be? Well?
(02:31):
I don't like being forced into things. So I think
he's actually a good coach, but I wouldn't want to
be Bears head coach Matt Naggy. He has a lot
of has twos. He has to win. He really has
to play justin fields. The fans will demand it, and
he's better than Andy Dalton. He has to overcome and
compensate for a GM. I just don't trust. He's had
(02:54):
three seasons with two playoff appearances, so if he gets
to a playoff, he probably ofly has to win a game.
This is a guy who got Mitch Trobinsky to the playoffs?
Does everybody understand he got Mitch Trobinsky to the playoffs?
I like him, but I wouldn't want to be him.
(03:15):
Dear Colin, you see Calvin Johnson didn't thank the Lions
at his Hall of Fame ceremony. Brings up a great
question which NFL player was most let down by his organization?
Barry Sanders Again, I mean think about Barry Sanders led
the NFL and rushing four times in a seven year
stretch when it was a running league. The only other
(03:38):
player to lead the league in rushing during that span
was Emmett Smith. Who had four rushing titles, an he
won three Super Bowls. I mean the way I look
at it as an organization. If you can't get your
ship together, I don't owe you anything. I have worked
overwhelmingly in my career for great companies and excellent bosses.
(03:59):
But when I get inducted to the awesome Sports Radio
Guy Hall of Fame, I'm not mentioning Tampa. It was
poorly run. I don't resent them, but they're not going
to get any credit. I'm ghosting Tampa, not Portland's, not Vegas,
not ESPN, not Fox Sports. I'm ghosting Tampa bad management.
(04:23):
Dear Colin, you see that George Carl, former NBA coaches,
getting blowback because he said Mellow was a ball hog
and a poor defender with the Nuggets. Haven't you been
saying the same thing for decades. Yes, and they're just
certain truths that people don't want to hear, like parents
don't want to hear their kids. Friends are going to
have more influence on their kids than they will. They
(04:44):
did a study back in that found that young teenagers
twelve to fourteen will listen to their peers more than
their parents. The kids were asked to rate dangerous activities
like bungee jumping or biking without a helmet. Then they
were told how adults rated those activit of these and
how their peers rated that activity. Then they were asked
to rate those activities again, and their scores were swayed
(05:07):
more by their peers than they're adults. Here's another truth.
Mellow's got no self awareness. He's a Hall of Fame
guy for one thing, shooting two pointers. Mellow lacked so
much willingness to be a good teammate that is one
of the great mid range forward shooters of all time.
He wouldn't take an extra step back and make it
(05:29):
a three. He wouldn't defend Jeremy Lynn, wouldn't play with them.
He just didn't get it. He will make the Basketball
Hall of Fame for one thing. Shooting two's totally selfish,
absolute ballhog, never in great shape. Close your eyes right
now and imagine Mellow playing basketball odds already shooting along
(05:51):
to probably from the right side of the court. It's
burned into your memory. It's mostly all he did. Dear Colin,
if you could pick one college team right now and
move them to another conference. With everybody moving these days,
who are you picking and where are they going? You
know I've said this before. I take Texas and move
them into the pack twelve, not the SEC. I always
think fit in life matters, all right, Texas feels like
(06:14):
a pack twelve school. Texas is in Austin, it's more progressive.
The pack twelve is in cooler cities. Palo Alto, Los Angeles, Seattle, Tempe, Boulder.
These are great fun cities. Starksville, honestly, Tuscaloosa, Auburn. I
(06:37):
just always thought, from the academics to their politics. U
c l A is not defined by sports. Texas is
not defined by sports. Gotta be honest with you. Most
of the SEC is defined by football. Doesn't feel like
Texas to me. Dear Colin, what's the stat in the
NFL that people obsess over that means absolutely nothing to you?
(07:01):
That's an easy one. Total passing yards? First of all,
I talked about it on TV this week. Never in
the history of the NFL, or at least the Super
Bowl era, has the passing yards leader won the Super Bowl.
Last year, Deshaun Watson led the league Texans four and twelve.
The year before Jamis Winston five thousand yards season listen.
Throwing for over four thousand yards in the offensive leaning
(07:23):
league is not that impressive. Matt shob did it three times,
Andy Dalton twice, Kirk Cousins five times, Jamis Winston three times.
You have to be incompetent not to throw for thirty
two yards. These are just not that impressive. It's like
a car. I'm no longer impressed that your car can
(07:43):
go zero to sixty in four or five seconds. We
have drones that can go zero to sixty and one
point seven seconds. If a drone can do that, why
should I be impressed that a car takes basically three
times longer to do that. The car's got like a
hundred year head start. It can't be half as fast
(08:05):
as a drone. So let's bring in less sneed rams.
GM now for nine years, made the playoffs three of
the last four years, with a Super Bowl appearance. He
was a Falcons Director of player Personnel. Falcon Scout jag
Scout New York Daily News called him football's most interesting.
GM certainly qualifies as that, So let's start with this um.
(08:28):
Are you as aggressive in other areas of your life
as you are as a GM when you play golf.
Do you UH never lay up? Is that your personality
or is it just work as a football GM because
you're scene is very aggressive. Excellent question, So let's take golf.
(08:49):
I'll answer it this way. Golf. I might be why
not if I get a chance to play Augusta, why
not go for the green? And two I have nothing
to lose. Maybe you're one shot plan Augusta. Right, let's
take real life. I'm not going to go skydiving. I
have no interest in bungee jumping off a high bridge
(09:11):
or what have you. So, you know, let's take it investing.
If I'm not an expert, I'll probably be conservative and
maybe listen to some advisors and things like that. So
I think that, to sum it up is is UH
in our business. I do think it's a very competitive business.
If Peter phil what said, you know, competition is for losers.
(09:34):
You don't want to get in the NFL. So at
what point do you right have to make an aggressive move,
take a risk to UH with the bed of maybe
gaining an edge on the thirty one other competitors in
this sleep and you're on pace to go seven years
without a first round pick. And I've always had it's
(09:55):
sort of a Malcolm Gladwell take. But I thought I
mentioned there's about five years ago, is that all these
players are of high risk. And the feeling is there's
always about fifteen guys in the first round who are,
if not can't miss. They're physically different. They're just special players.
They're receivers that separate their Chase Young. They're Trevor Lawrence,
(10:17):
you know, unless barring an injury, it's hard to see
him missing after that. From about the sixteenth or sevent
pick in the first round, you know, to late second
I feel like there's not a huge gap with players.
It's more about if the system is good and they're
and they're coachable, they're gonna be good players. So my
theory has always been I would always try to first
round pick for Jalen Ramsey or Jamal Adams. I don't
(10:39):
have a problem with it. Is that kind of your
theory the Malcolm Gladwell that for the money you're you're
really better off starting in the second round and having
two seconds over one first and that's where the value
is very similar tour and you mentioned there's I mean,
I don't know if there's fifteen him and I don't
think you meant that, right, So they're easy even to
(11:00):
cut off after after Chase Young. But yes, when and
and it's the formulas this if we if we think
we're in this phase of contending, of having winning seasons,
your your your probability of picking uh, let's call it
top ten is low, barring any catastrophe. And you can
(11:23):
use two first round picks to maybe go get a
top five pick, like a Jalen Ramsey, who's who has
already lived up to top five potential. Well, there's now
the guess work is out of the projections out of it,
the developments out of it. And if that, if that
player can help our team, we'll probably do it a lot.
And we'll try to make up for the rest, right uh,
(11:45):
in the back of the draft, whether it's trading back
to acquire more picks in the second, third, four, fifth
round and and and using the uh, you know, the
acquisition mechanisms as creative as possible. I wonder if, like
I always think culturally, I've made moves in my career
based on cultural changes. I'll give you two things for you.
(12:06):
You're in the NFC West, Well, it's just a better division.
So everybody else in the divisions aggressive that could change
the way you you know, uh, I mean when Peyton
Manning was in his division, you better have a pass
rusher because you're canna be facing him for ten years.
When Brady's in the division. There's a reason Buffalo went
out and spent money on Mario Williams. You know, the
Jets kept you know, drafting defensive lineman. So that's that's all.
(12:31):
That's kind of a cultural thing. Do you think about
your division when you're building your football team and and
moving pieces, you think about yourselves first? And I think
there isn't definitely need to be aware, uh what window
you're in right even before you can chase your division
and and be realistic h with that window and a
(12:54):
lot of times I've break down that window. Are are you?
Are you? Are you still building? Are you uh close
to breaking through? Or are you contending? So I think
you know, when you're when you're building, maybe you're gonna
take a little more telescopic approach. But if you've proven
you broken through, uh, and you think you're contending for
(13:15):
that division, you can you can scale back and take
a little bit more of a microscopic approach. And yes
know that. Okay, step number one's winning division. That's the
that's probably the easiest path to right guaranteeing you a
spot in the tournament and guaranteeing uh you a home
game or two. So you definitely want to be aware
of them. But you build your team based on right,
(13:39):
your own specific philosophy and and definitely when you do
go play those because you're gonna play that, you're gonna
play six games a year against those guys, that your
philosophy better definitely uh match up with that. You know,
those three teams. When you made the decision, you interviewed
Jeff Fisher had been around deef ensive minded coach and
(14:01):
and I had theorized, I said, when you go to
Los Angeles, it does matter how you win. Every Laker
team has been exciting. In Detroit, a physical, tough city,
automotive industry, you can sell tough guys. Los Angeles is
movie stars, finesse, our weather is perfect. People here like stars,
(14:21):
Dodger players. They've always they've had star power. USC has
always had great quarterbacks. It's not the sec you can
just I feel like in in Los Angeles. When you
made the move to Sean McVeigh. Part of it was
we're boring, We've got to get more interesting. Now. That
seems very simplistic, But do you ever I mean, Sean
(14:41):
McVeigh came out of nowhere, he was young. Did you
was any part of you thinking it'd be nice to
throw the ball down the field and kind of speed
things up? You were building a new stadium, there's a
lot of money involved, You've got an owner who's all
over sports and events. Did any of that come into play?
But I think it does come into play. But uh,
(15:04):
and that's part of it, and you're releve aware of
your market and and and the fans and what they
won't But I do think at the core the fan
right is pulling for right the Los Angeles Rams more
than just a star and winning is important. So it
would be interesting if if if it was one of
(15:25):
those teams, the Pittsburgh Steelers, of one of those just
defensive teams in the ground out, Uh, let's call it
close wins. Does that take in l a maybe? I
do think I think that would take over star players
and losing. But a bigger picture philosophy is this the
rules of this game, probably because of fans, uh, right.
(15:46):
They benefit offenses fans like scoring UH. If possible, if
the best head coach available is is an offensive minded coach,
one thing can happen. If you hit on that coach,
you build a w winning program. A lot of times
that means you also have a trigger poller or a
quarterback who can win games. And then if you're winning UH,
(16:08):
and your coaches defensive mind UH instead of offensive minded,
A lot of times what happens is the offensive coordinator
then gets the head coaching job, right because other teams
will come coach your better coaches, and now one of
your more important players, the quarterback, is having to probably
(16:29):
learn a different offense, maybe not a totally different one,
but some derivative of an offense UH, every two to
three years because maybe your offensive coordinator UH is getting
those head jobs. And Matt Ryan, I think about my
old place we just talked about, Atlanta has gone through
that right when we drafted Matt Ryan and had Mike
(16:50):
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Mike Malarkey got a head job, Cutter got a head job,
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(20:54):
supply you. We went and looked at your last at
the rosters in your career. Your rosters last year it
was the third youngest. And because you have veteran players
that are noteworthy Aaron Donald Andrew Whitworth, my perception is
(21:15):
less like veterans. And then I started looking and we
started looking at all your rosters and the average age
of your rosters hovers around twenty five other teams. Seven
do you do? Is this a theory? Is it? Is
it a belief or is it? You know, young players
generally recover quicker from injuries but less need. If you
(21:37):
go look at your career, your teams are always one
of the three or four youngest in the league. Why
I appreciate you know, is you can now we can
be that nuance. Right. It's different than television. You know,
you might not get that deep into the weeds, but yes,
it's intentional, but there was all The intent is not
(22:01):
a let's be the young one of the younger teams.
The result is that you mentioned it right, we have
a core group of players that we really rely on,
that our veterans that are in the prime of their career.
But by by building it that way, paying those players
what they deserve, what they've earned, you're definitely gonna have
(22:22):
to turn it around. Even though we haven't had a
uh first round draft pick, like you said, and I
don't know how many years and may go seven years,
right since Sean has been here, we've had the fifth
most draft picks. So the philosophy is, Okay, we've got
this core group of veteran players in their prompt we're
gonna we're gonna really ride their coattails, but we're also
(22:44):
to turn around on the back end draft well and
uh developed well and actually have the courage our coaching staff.
I think the underrated thing is having the courage when
you do have, let's go to perceived veteran team to
also fill in with younger players that maybe our only
(23:04):
lacking experience and they have to get their experience on
our clock and not someone else's. You know it's funny.
I love the draft. We've had conversations. I'm a total
you know, recruiting dork. I admitted there are things every
sportscaster loves that he can't spend a ton of time
talking about on television because the ratings won't be good
(23:27):
and I gotta stay on the big stuff, right the headlines.
But it's it's interesting. I was talking to a college
football coach recently and we were talking about left tackles,
and I said, you know, you don't have a great
left tackle. It was a Pack twelve coach. I said,
but it won't matter until you face Oregon because the
(23:47):
Kievan Thibada. I said, then you're in trouble. But I said,
I looked at your schedule and there's not an NFL
rush end on your really on your schedule until then.
Utah has a really good job usually with NFL D lineman.
When when you look, I see you know, I see
Andrew Whitworth, SEC, Matt Stafford, SEC, I do see you
(24:08):
know your your Jalen Ramsey's uh Florida State. I've said
this before. I think if I was a GM less,
I would struggle not to draft SEC players because I
know they played against NFL players. You know, Pat twelve.
You may face one defensive rush end all year. That's
(24:30):
an NFL guy, you know, Pena Seul I like, but god,
he's a monster compared to ninety percent of the guys
he faces. I have to go back to like Auburn
film or something, you know, a couple of years ago.
So you tell me, do you ever feel like, if
it's close, you just go with a Southern player in
the draft? Well, I think is it? I think you
(24:51):
hit the nail on the head and you explained it, well, right,
it might not right, just be because he was born
in the South, and and I it's just circling all
the w by. My oldest kid played with Cavan Thibodeaux
at Oaks Christian High School out here in California. So
I got to see that kid probably as a sophomore, junior,
and senior, and I know he was I know ed
(25:12):
Orgeron right, who's got some l A ties is down
in Louisiana. Now was really really you know recruiting Caban
talk so point being and you mentioned it is if
it's a tie, uh and you need something to break it,
there is a good chance you're gonna see that SEC
tackle or what have you played more games against more
(25:34):
NFL players than the Pact twelve tackle? So and what
is that? What is that just naturally going to lead to?
Is an we're gonna be more sure about that player,
right because we saw that player do it more times
against NFL competition than uh and I and I bet
everyone that had a chance to draft pas and and
(25:56):
we certainly didn't trade and are one away, but I
bet you if you were in that top ten range
and we're projecting that he won't fall, may fall. Everyone
went back to that Alban Dame. I can tek you
that every every I can't guarantee it hadn't talked to
anyone with I guarantee every evaluator went back to that
that Alburn game. Yeah, I mean that's what That's the
(26:19):
one I wanted to see, Like, I just like, let
me go to the SEC. How do you deal with
Auburn's rush end? Another thing I think about when you draft,
because I've said before, if I wasn't a sportscaster, my
dream job would be GM in the NFL, Like if
I would have spent thirty years doing something, but I
didn't already know the route, right, I didn't play the game,
so whereas a sportscaster, the route was easy. Right, you're
starting a single a baseball team, you go to a
(26:41):
local market, blah blah blah. So I also think about this.
There are certain coaches in college that are so good
that they squeeze every ounce of talent out of the player.
Nick Saban, so I know the player I see is
the player I get. There was a college coach I
won't call him out, but he coached the SEC years ago.
He's a great recruiter, wasn't known as a great player developer,
(27:04):
and so his players often went to the NFL and
you got another gear. But Saban and Tom Osborne, the
Nebraska coach, I always felt like you just got that
you had seen the top end. With a Saban guy
and a tom Osborne guy, there's there's you're not gonna
get extra juice. Have you ever thought about that in drafting,
that this coach is a recruiter, not as good a
(27:27):
player developer and this kid's got more in the tank. Uh, definitely.
And before I get to that question, another and since
we're on the podcast, I can do this one thing.
Also on let's call it the Southern competition of the
sec UH. If Cavan Thibodeau, as an example, would have
gone to l you would have gone to Alabama, got
a good feeling, he would have still panned out and
(27:48):
been one of the best let's call it Russier's and
or what it would have done. But what would have
happened during that If you'd have gone to one of
those environments, of those situations, there would have been a
lot more competition from the start. So you do get
players who are The NFL is full of competition. So
(28:09):
when you get one of those players and they earned
playing time at Alabama, l s U comes in, what
have you? You know, they also beat out some players
that are gonna probably play in the NFL as well.
And those players may have to transfer to actually get
enough tape to do it, and they do it and
if it works out, but the competition is easy. But
I do think you have to look at right coaches, schools,
(28:31):
even systems, and and really be nuanced and okay, and
to put it simply right, what is you know, mom, dad,
God given type traits that you're probably not improving And
if you do, it's it's minutes amounts, but also look
at systems and techniques, things that actually can be developed, right,
and now you have to project, right, can you development
(28:54):
player right? Not? Not every player is. That's call it
a Tiger Woods mentality that says, Okay, i will change
my golf swing even though I'm one of the best,
to be better. Right. So it's you have to really
it's hard for player to come to our league and
I'm gonna change technique because during that process of changing technique,
(29:16):
they're gonna get embarrassed on the practice field a little bit.
So you really got to dig into that mentality and
try to uh, you know the cipher that and that's
what probably makes the draft fund and a little bit
artistic and not just you know, black and white, you
know success, no success, things like that. You've gone with
(29:36):
some big personalities in your career. Uh Marcus Peters and
Dominican Sue um a keep to leave. You've never been
shy about that. Um Marcus Peters was interesting. Chris Peterson
at Washington said it's not working. Andy Reid said it's
not working. And at some point you guys said, hey,
we're moving on. But you're not shy about taking guys,
(29:59):
Jaylen Ramsey, he's got opinions and he's gonna let you
know those opinions. What is it? Or you you can
talk about it specifically or vaguely abstract lye with Marcus,
a bunch of coaches, Andy Reid, who again has taken
big personalities, Chris Peterson McVeigh or less. Need you guys
decided with Peters? You know what? The fit doesn't work?
(30:21):
What is when you are looking at a personality and
it's always receivers and corners for some reason, they're out
in an island. They got they got big personalities. What
is the thing where you go less, Yeah, that's not
gonna work. Like it's it's not that that's over a
lined that's not gonna work. Where where is that space
for you on personalities? Well? I think I'll first take
it right, Okay, what is it that is going to work?
(30:45):
About it? Right? And all of those players you mentioned
one thing that they had in common, like all of
them across the board, with intelligence and applying that intelligence
to football, right, they could they could they could learn
process to citeer apply uh football complexity on the football field.
(31:06):
And that's and that's what made that that helped make
them great. Uh, there's an element of a lot of players, right,
depending on when you get them in the career. Hey
are they Are they in that phase where, you know what,
only get one shot at this, not a lot of
years to do it. I need to earn as much
money as possible. Then there's times when okay, I've got
(31:28):
I've got that taken care of. Now I actually want
to win, right, So and then we look at our
team and go, what do we need? Like I always say,
we can't have everyone that does one of those let's
call it milk advertisements, you know in sports salitory where
where you're you're you're you know you're gonna drink your
whole milk and said yes. Or there's a time on
the football field where there's edge that is needed right there,
(31:51):
Hey there we needed you know, somebody needs to ignite
this place. Right we we went against an enemy and
they've backed us up against the wall. Who's going to
ignit us to get us? You know? Uh, you know
you get us out of that hole? And then and
then there's moments when uh, in all of those cases,
and interesting in Marcus's case, right here in Wade scheme,
(32:12):
he he uh he probably he he fits probably a
vision defense in Wade scheme at time a lot more
man So there is sometimes schematic issues that aren't personality.
But I do think at the end of the day,
when the personality or the individual behind the personality, UH
somewhat probably uh becomes bigger than the team, not necessarily bigger,
(32:36):
but he's putting himself and and everyone should put themselves right.
It's it's a business. It's it's how you earn money.
But I'll use this example. If you're a wide receiver, right, yes,
you should do your best to earn as much money
as possible. While doing that, right, you can help a
football team, if it was us the Rams win games.
(32:59):
We can that symbiotically simultaneously. But if for one reason
you decide, you know what, I'll help you in the
past game, but not necessarily go be hans Ward and
help us in the run game, maybe at that point
you know it is the time to move on in
terms of just personality or or or that intangible Okay,
(33:20):
So I got so I speculated throughout the year, I said,
um I had said on the air, I said McVeigh
has lost trust and golf I just sense it, and um,
it was a San Francisco game, I think it was
up there, and I said, this isn't gonna work. Guys,
there's there's a problem now. Um, and you're an aggressive GM.
(33:42):
Shawn's an aggressive coach. And this is not a shot
at at Jared, but between Russell Wilson twice a year
and Kyle Shanahan twice a year, you can't stand pat everything.
You guys have to be moving. And so at some point,
you know, you guys decide, you know the go fit,
we're gonna make a move. Do you remember the conversation,
(34:05):
the epiphany, the moment when you just sat down and said, Okay,
this kid got to the super Bowl two years earlier.
This is gonna make news. We're gonna have to give
up some picks. Take me to that place for you.
Less that moment when you just said it's a big swing,
I'm going for it. Well, I think it was probably
(34:27):
uh some time after, but the opportunity presented itself right
where we had a chance to acquire a quarterback with
elite skills and Jared has some elite QB skills, uh,
but also a quarterback right that has unique experience and
and and the unique part of it would be I
(34:48):
hate throwing that word around, but in Matt's case, Uh,
take the skill out, take the production out right Frome
for a lot of touchdowns in all the yards, a
lot of comebacks, all of those things. The unique part
of the experience was, Okay, Matts. Matt's been running a
pro style offense probably since he and he did it
in junior high high school. He did it at Georgia
(35:10):
on the under Mark Ricky. So it was that moment
where while there's an opportunity where there's an elite QB
with this experience that now messages with with Sean and
let's go messages where where we were at in the
window where a lot of our skill are in their prime,
a lot of our defenders in their prime. Uh, this
(35:33):
might be an opportunity we can't patch. And the thing
and now there's a human involved, Jared Galtz a great
human being, and he might can get to where Matt's at.
That's just gonna take uh time that Matt had and
he didn't. Uh, And it's a it's a it's a
(35:55):
very very uh tough decision when you do that. But
the thing that I can say is because of Jared
and because of what he did for us and helped
us get to this point. It enabled someone like uh,
Matt to say, you know what, I'd like to be
a part of the Rings. Right if we didn't have
(36:15):
Jared Calton, he didn't help us have the success we had.
Matt could have easily said to Detroit because he had
options and they and Detroit had options, and we all
wanted Matt, but hey, I would rather go to the
Rams because they're more ready to win than maybe Team
BC or D and Jared had a lot to do
with them, which is uh, I guess ironic And what
(36:39):
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Welcome out in machine. I don't think it's a coincidence
that Lane Kiffin was able to get a hundred percent
vaccination in one of the lowest vaccination states, Mississippi. He's
a salesman. He can sell his offense, he can sell
(38:30):
his vision. I think Sean McVeigh similarly is great at
selling his vision. And you guys have one of the
highest vaccination rates in the league. And I look at
Kiffen and I look at Sean, and I think, well,
of course they're really good. Half of football coaching is Hey,
I'm going to sell you my philosophy. I'm gonna sell
you my culture. This is my belief system. Are you
(38:52):
on board? Lane Kiffin? Doing that is really remarkable because
Mississippi has struggled getting people vaccine, and in fact, the
fact that Alma's football is is helping the state's rate.
How when in terms of you, it was a GM
can bring in operations people for the RAMS, can bring
in speakers and epidemiologists, but it was this one of
(39:16):
these did you guys lean on Sean to spread it?
And how did you get to that high a vaccination? Right? Like?
What did you do? It? Did take? It was definitely
a collaborative effort. Sean is a huge part of it,
and I give Lane credit because there there might have
been I would say this, I know for a fact
that there's more incentive right for players in the NFL
to get the vaccination then there is in college football.
(39:39):
That helped us a lot, uh and and for many reasons,
but a very collaborative effort. But I do think going
back to Sean and what he's brilliant at is, yes,
he people buy into his vision, his philosophy, but right
whether he was coaching football or anything else, what he
(40:01):
is at the court and someone who when it gets
down to write important decisions, would would prefer sitting and
sitting down individually with you and and authentically communicating, authentically
having a discussion, and and authentically caring about right all
sides of the viewpoints. And I think that that's what
(40:24):
our players feel and know and and see every day,
and that definitely definitely helps. When Cam Akers got hurt,
I was like, oh, because your power back is now
with the Dolphins, And I thought, all right, don't overreact
to it. Whatever you did, I think, whatever you just did,
(40:46):
we all did that. I just was like, because you know,
and I loved your power back, um, and I just thought, Okay,
don't overreact. There are running backs on the market, There
is talent available on the market. So where are you
at with that? Because a lot of Sean's offense is
(41:07):
dictated um on a not reliant but it's often dictated
on some on running success. I mean, we know when
Todd Gurley, you know PREMIEE issues, it was a juggernaut.
It was hard Kyle Shanahan, by the way. Similarly, you
know everybody looks at Matt Ryan's MVP year, but his
it's a power running game to a large degree. So
(41:29):
what do you do now with Cam Akers in the
toughest division in football, where do you find that running
back talent? Now, give me the options? What are you
looking at? I think the reason we probably had the reaction,
uh that you just demonstrated is realistically, we know that
we will not replace Cam because Cam had the right
(41:51):
the mom dag God give an ability to take a
let's call then eight yard twelve yard hole and turn
it into sixty eight yard rung touchdown. So, uh, that's
probably unrealistic to to go grab right, No one's those
players aren't available, and if they are, it's at a
steep price, and it's just unrealistic. So I think because
(42:12):
of when the injury happened, we do have time on
our sides throughout this preseason, uh to try to figure
it out. And the old yes, there is an element
of next man out Darryl Henderson things like that. I
think in this case it's gonna be next minute, not
just man. And we're gonna to do it a little
bit by committee. And and maybe we're gonna have to
(42:32):
settle right where. Okay, if we uh Shaun's offense and
they do a really really nice job based on cause
we really focus on marrying the running pass game, there's
some space there. But this year, without camp, we may
have to live with that four yard run instead of nine,
that eight yard run instead of twenty five, or that
(42:53):
fourteen yard run instead of thirty or longer, and and
and go from there. And then I think we we
have to really look at our young players without experience
and go, Okay, this is what we can expect from them,
and then monitor who's available on other teams and maybe
the veterans that are out there and determine, hey, could
(43:14):
they be right expected to right add more value and
if so, by how much more so? Uh, We're gonna
We're gonna let our youth have a shot at it
first and then use these use this preseason in these
next three or four weeks too, you know, try to
you know, let's call it solve that puzzle. By the way,
(43:35):
when you hired McVeigh was very young, and now you know,
you look at it in hindsight and you think, of course,
you hire Sean McVeigh, I mean, Brian Flores, Joe Judge,
a bunch of young guys. When Lane Kiffin got a
head coaching job in the NFL, people were, you know,
their jaw dropped. He's like a kid. But now you know,
the sport is more collegiate, it's more progressive, it's offensive minded.
But there was a little risk when you hired McVeigh.
(43:55):
People were like, whoa, what was the case? So you
you do the review thing and there's probably a moment
you call your life for you maybe it's staying crockey
or something you're thinking. I mean, you didn't have a
lot of time because he was going to interview at
other places. Like you know, they say less that it
takes a woman eight minutes to figure out if she'll
(44:16):
date you, if she's gonna fall in love. They need
eight minutes. How many minutes was Sean McVeigh did you say,
all right, I'm into this room, this is gonna work
for me. How many minutes that take in our interview?
And in that first interview it was myself, Kevin dem
Off Tony Pastors was the VP of football administration, probably
took somewhere in that six state minute range and say, okay,
(44:39):
he's the guy. Now from that like Sean's gonna win. An,
that's man, he's got an actual gift. But the reason
we have gotten you know, the reason it probably only
took sixt eight minutes is when you did go back
and let's call it study, study what he did at
Washington with a third round quarterback, and you get really nuanced. Hey,
(45:02):
his offense, for whatever reading reason, created more space than
other offenses. Right, there were times when his receivers were
wide open, they didn't have to use their mom that
God given ability to win on one on one match,
and you were able to see that consistently. And there's
(45:23):
a lot of analytics now that can even measure that
to an extent. So that's one thing that's one of
the reasons why we said, hey, wait, a minute. This
this young man, uh is he's doing things schematically while
that that other people are. I mean, that's a top
five offense and a lot of categories with a QB
(45:45):
that is a third rounder. So he's doing it not necessarily. Hey,
we gotta go out and get a first round QB.
And he was a part of maybe developing Kirk some
you know young so we had two young QB. The
the other part of it, right, I say, a huge
part of who's the most important people in the building.
And we have one of the players on our team
now to Sean Jack. But you know, we did our
(46:06):
research and chatted with with these players and I always
go not just the you know, the quarterbacks, but you know,
through through different channels Kate to Sean, what what do
you think about Sean McVeigh, And it's like, hey, hw
are that guy immediately best teacher of football I've ever had? Hey,
he owns the room. We're all a two. Right, it's
(46:27):
and they had some good players on that team, whether
it was him, that D'Angelo Hall, some some of those
type players that we could do our research with and
and they give the thumbs up. And the the other
part of the story, which is interesting right at that
point in time, Let's take myself. It wasn't like, okay,
it's Colin Calherd gonna bus stock in in less sneed, right,
(46:49):
I was. We hadn't had a winning season under the yet.
So one of the things we did decide to do,
especially with Stand when we brought Seawan to a stand,
is he's a fan of Marshall Fault from the St.
Louis Asi And if you know Marshall Marshall, brilliant football mind,
not just the gifted running back, but he loves he
(47:12):
loves past protection, he loves route combinations, he loves he's
nuanced again he you know, it's it's it's stuff right
television viewer wouldn't wouldn't pay attention to her. Uh uh
you know, stay glued to with our A d h
D generation. But we were able to put Marshall at
the table. And when you just listen to two brilliant
(47:34):
football minds talk football, that the picture becomes clear right
there versus just hey asking let's call it standard interview questions.
So there were many, many, many uh phases to uh
Shawn's interview. But you know when you gathered all of that,
and it was right there in front of you, and
then you meet him, you're probably right six state minutes in, going, yep,
(47:57):
he's what he's what the research says he is. And
from that moment, like he's a thirty year old. Going
back to his press conference, I'm like, he could have
easily been nervous and still been a successful football coach, right, Right,
we all look at that opening press conference and you're
gonna you're gonna have some But we're an entertainment business, right,
You're gonna have some version of how that opening press
(48:19):
conference went. He could have been really, really nervous, right
and still been a successful football coach. But I can
remember texting my wife going and and she was once
in the media business, and she was like, wow, I
never seen one nailing like that. Like from every moment
he took a step after being hired, it's like he's exceeded,
you know, high expectations, which is a tribute to him,
(48:43):
for sure, Less Snead, great stuff. We don't want to
take any more of your time. You got listen. You
just keep looking at that waiver wire for running backs
and some big name's gonna pop up there. You never know. Right,
you never know, You never know. But I it's interesting
in Seawan and I've talked a lot, there has been
a lot of let's call it guys names that you
(49:05):
really didn't know about right playing. Let's call it a
Mike Shanahan born zone type scheme, derivative of zone sites,
whether it was starting with Terrell Davis, whether it was C. J. Anderson,
whether it's tech Motsart up in San Francisco. Now, so
there's been a lot of guys who right had success
(49:26):
in these schemes that maybe you didn't know before they
had the success in these schemes. So, uh, it's definitely
a scheme that benefits running backs. And you know, we're
gonna try to do our best to make sure we
have the best four or five on our roster, even
though we're probably not replacing Cam Akers this year. Yeah,
it made me a sick to my stomach. Hey, thanks
(49:47):
for spending time with the smart stuff. I appreciate it.
Com Thank you. I love talking ball. God. I want
to be at GM someday. Too bad. I'm old twice
about that? A good thing right now? Thanks least all
right at the Volume Sports, Twitter and Instagram rate review
(50:09):
subscribe also our YouTube page at the Volume Sports check out.
It's growing. We put a lot of our podcasting stuff
on our YouTube page if you want to watch it.
It's really fun. We got a couple of big announcements coming,
so I'm really excited for one that's gonna come very
very quickly. In fact, you may learn about it today.
(50:32):
Very very interesting. I've been looking for a young, aggressive
podcast personality in the SEC. I think we may have
found him. Talk soon. Yeah, the Volume. Get right to
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(01:05):
Meet Anna Delvey. You may think she's an audacious entrepreneur
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every fan Fan Duel more ways to win. Hi, everybody
and welcome to the Friday Morning podcast. Less sne GM
of the Rams. Super sharp Dude gives up first round picks.
(02:09):
That's the culture of the Rams. Does Lebron coming to
l A have anything to do with it? But? First,
fake questions, real answers. These are a bunch of questions
I want to answer. I don't want to wait for
you to ask him, so I asked them to myself.
Dear Colin, if there's one NFL head coach whose job
you wouldn't want this year, who's would it be? Well?
(02:31):
I don't like being forced into things. So I think
he's actually a good coach, but I wouldn't want to
be Bears head coach Matt Naggy. He has a lot
of has twos. He has to win. He really has
to play justin fields. The fans will demand it, and
he's better than Andy Dalton. He has to overcome and
compensate for a GM. I just don't trust. He's had
(02:54):
three seasons with two playoff appearances, so if he gets
to a playoff, he probably ofly has to win a game.
This is a guy who got Mitch Trobinsky to the playoffs?
Does everybody understand he got Mitch Trobinsky to the playoffs?
I like him, but I wouldn't want to be him.
(03:15):
Dear Colin, you see Calvin Johnson didn't thank the Lions
at his Hall of Fame ceremony. Brings up a great
question which NFL player was most let down by his organization?
Barry Sanders Again, I mean think about Barry Sanders led
the NFL and rushing four times in a seven year
stretch when it was a running league. The only other
(03:38):
player to lead the league in rushing during that span
was Emmett Smith. Who had four rushing titles, an he
won three Super Bowls. I mean the way I look
at it as an organization. If you can't get your
ship together, I don't owe you anything. I have worked
overwhelmingly in my career for great companies and excellent bosses.
(03:59):
But when I get inducted to the awesome Sports Radio
Guy Hall of Fame, I'm not mentioning Tampa. It was
poorly run. I don't resent them, but they're not going
to get any credit. I'm ghosting Tampa, not Portland's, not Vegas,
not ESPN, not Fox Sports. I'm ghosting Tampa bad management.
(04:23):
Dear Colin, you see that George Carl, former NBA coaches,
getting blowback because he said Mellow was a ball hog
and a poor defender with the Nuggets. Haven't you been
saying the same thing for decades. Yes, and they're just
certain truths that people don't want to hear, like parents
don't want to hear their kids. Friends are going to
have more influence on their kids than they will. They
(04:44):
did a study back in that found that young teenagers
twelve to fourteen will listen to their peers more than
their parents. The kids were asked to rate dangerous activities
like bungee jumping or biking without a helmet. Then they
were told how adults rated those activit of these and
how their peers rated that activity. Then they were asked
to rate those activities again, and their scores were swayed
(05:07):
more by their peers than they're adults. Here's another truth.
Mellow's got no self awareness. He's a Hall of Fame
guy for one thing, shooting two pointers. Mellow lacked so
much willingness to be a good teammate that is one
of the great mid range forward shooters of all time.
He wouldn't take an extra step back and make it
(05:29):
a three. He wouldn't defend Jeremy Lynn, wouldn't play with them.
He just didn't get it. He will make the Basketball
Hall of Fame for one thing. Shooting two's totally selfish,
absolute ballhog, never in great shape. Close your eyes right
now and imagine Mellow playing basketball odds already shooting along
(05:51):
to probably from the right side of the court. It's
burned into your memory. It's mostly all he did. Dear Colin,
if you could pick one college team right now and
move them to another conference. With everybody moving these days,
who are you picking and where are they going? You
know I've said this before. I take Texas and move
them into the pack twelve, not the SEC. I always
think fit in life matters, all right, Texas feels like
(06:14):
a pack twelve school. Texas is in Austin, it's more progressive.
The pack twelve is in cooler cities. Palo Alto, Los Angeles, Seattle, Tempe, Boulder.
These are great fun cities. Starksville, honestly, Tuscaloosa, Auburn. I
(06:37):
just always thought, from the academics to their politics. U
c l A is not defined by sports. Texas is
not defined by sports. Gotta be honest with you. Most
of the SEC is defined by football. Doesn't feel like
Texas to me. Dear Colin, what's the stat in the
NFL that people obsess over that means absolutely nothing to you?
(07:01):
That's an easy one. Total passing yards? First of all,
I talked about it on TV this week. Never in
the history of the NFL, or at least the Super
Bowl era, has the passing yards leader won the Super Bowl.
Last year, Deshaun Watson led the league Texans four and twelve.
The year before Jamis Winston five thousand yards season listen.
Throwing for over four thousand yards in the offensive leaning
(07:23):
league is not that impressive. Matt shob did it three times,
Andy Dalton twice, Kirk Cousins five times, Jamis Winston three times.
You have to be incompetent not to throw for thirty
two yards. These are just not that impressive. It's like
a car. I'm no longer impressed that your car can
(07:43):
go zero to sixty in four or five seconds. We
have drones that can go zero to sixty and one
point seven seconds. If a drone can do that, why
should I be impressed that a car takes basically three
times longer to do that. The car's got like a
hundred year head start. It can't be half as fast
(08:05):
as a drone. So let's bring in less sneed rams.
GM now for nine years, made the playoffs three of
the last four years, with a Super Bowl appearance. He
was a Falcons Director of player Personnel. Falcon Scout jag
Scout New York Daily News called him football's most interesting.
GM certainly qualifies as that, So let's start with this um.
(08:28):
Are you as aggressive in other areas of your life
as you are as a GM when you play golf.
Do you UH never lay up? Is that your personality
or is it just work as a football GM because
you're scene is very aggressive. Excellent question, So let's take golf.
(08:49):
I'll answer it this way. Golf. I might be why
not if I get a chance to play Augusta, why
not go for the green? And two I have nothing
to lose. Maybe you're one shot plan Augusta. Right, let's
take real life. I'm not going to go skydiving. I
have no interest in bungee jumping off a high bridge
(09:11):
or what have you. So, you know, let's take it investing.
If I'm not an expert, I'll probably be conservative and
maybe listen to some advisors and things like that. So
I think that, to sum it up is is UH
in our business. I do think it's a very competitive business.
If Peter phil what said, you know, competition is for losers.
(09:34):
You don't want to get in the NFL. So at
what point do you right have to make an aggressive move,
take a risk to UH with the bed of maybe
gaining an edge on the thirty one other competitors in
this sleep and you're on pace to go seven years
without a first round pick. And I've always had it's
(09:55):
sort of a Malcolm Gladwell take. But I thought I
mentioned there's about five years ago, is that all these
players are of high risk. And the feeling is there's
always about fifteen guys in the first round who are,
if not can't miss. They're physically different. They're just special players.
They're receivers that separate their Chase Young. They're Trevor Lawrence,
(10:17):
you know, unless barring an injury, it's hard to see
him missing after that. From about the sixteenth or sevent
pick in the first round, you know, to late second
I feel like there's not a huge gap with players.
It's more about if the system is good and they're
and they're coachable, they're gonna be good players. So my
theory has always been I would always try to first
round pick for Jalen Ramsey or Jamal Adams. I don't
(10:39):
have a problem with it. Is that kind of your
theory the Malcolm Gladwell that for the money you're you're
really better off starting in the second round and having
two seconds over one first and that's where the value
is very similar tour and you mentioned there's I mean,
I don't know if there's fifteen him and I don't
think you meant that, right, So they're easy even to
(11:00):
cut off after after Chase Young. But yes, when and
and it's the formulas this if we if we think
we're in this phase of contending, of having winning seasons,
your your your probability of picking uh, let's call it
top ten is low, barring any catastrophe. And you can
(11:23):
use two first round picks to maybe go get a
top five pick, like a Jalen Ramsey, who's who has
already lived up to top five potential. Well, there's now
the guess work is out of the projections out of it,
the developments out of it. And if that, if that
player can help our team, we'll probably do it a lot.
And we'll try to make up for the rest, right uh,
(11:45):
in the back of the draft, whether it's trading back
to acquire more picks in the second, third, four, fifth
round and and and using the uh, you know, the
acquisition mechanisms as creative as possible. I wonder if, like
I always think culturally, I've made moves in my career
based on cultural changes. I'll give you two things for you.
(12:06):
You're in the NFC West, Well, it's just a better division.
So everybody else in the divisions aggressive that could change
the way you you know, uh, I mean when Peyton
Manning was in his division, you better have a pass
rusher because you're canna be facing him for ten years.
When Brady's in the division. There's a reason Buffalo went
out and spent money on Mario Williams. You know, the
Jets kept you know, drafting defensive lineman. So that's that's all.
(12:31):
That's kind of a cultural thing. Do you think about
your division when you're building your football team and and
moving pieces, you think about yourselves first? And I think
there isn't definitely need to be aware, uh what window
you're in right even before you can chase your division
and and be realistic h with that window and a
(12:54):
lot of times I've break down that window. Are are you?
Are you? Are you still building? Are you uh close
to breaking through? Or are you contending? So I think
you know, when you're when you're building, maybe you're gonna
take a little more telescopic approach. But if you've proven
you broken through, uh, and you think you're contending for
(13:15):
that division, you can you can scale back and take
a little bit more of a microscopic approach. And yes
know that. Okay, step number one's winning division. That's the
that's probably the easiest path to right guaranteeing you a
spot in the tournament and guaranteeing uh you a home
game or two. So you definitely want to be aware
of them. But you build your team based on right,
(13:39):
your own specific philosophy and and definitely when you do
go play those because you're gonna play that, you're gonna
play six games a year against those guys, that your
philosophy better definitely uh match up with that. You know,
those three teams. When you made the decision, you interviewed
Jeff Fisher had been around deef ensive minded coach and
(14:01):
and I had theorized, I said, when you go to
Los Angeles, it does matter how you win. Every Laker
team has been exciting. In Detroit, a physical, tough city,
automotive industry, you can sell tough guys. Los Angeles is
movie stars, finesse, our weather is perfect. People here like stars,
(14:21):
Dodger players. They've always they've had star power. USC has
always had great quarterbacks. It's not the sec you can
just I feel like in in Los Angeles. When you
made the move to Sean McVeigh. Part of it was
we're boring, We've got to get more interesting. Now. That
seems very simplistic, But do you ever I mean, Sean
(14:41):
McVeigh came out of nowhere, he was young. Did you
was any part of you thinking it'd be nice to
throw the ball down the field and kind of speed
things up? You were building a new stadium, there's a
lot of money involved, You've got an owner who's all
over sports and events. Did any of that come into play?
But I think it does come into play. But uh,
(15:04):
and that's part of it, and you're releve aware of
your market and and and the fans and what they
won't But I do think at the core the fan
right is pulling for right the Los Angeles Rams more
than just a star and winning is important. So it
would be interesting if if if it was one of
(15:25):
those teams, the Pittsburgh Steelers, of one of those just
defensive teams in the ground out, Uh, let's call it
close wins. Does that take in l a maybe? I
do think I think that would take over star players
and losing. But a bigger picture philosophy is this the
rules of this game, probably because of fans, uh, right.
(15:46):
They benefit offenses fans like scoring UH. If possible, if
the best head coach available is is an offensive minded coach,
one thing can happen. If you hit on that coach,
you build a w winning program. A lot of times
that means you also have a trigger poller or a
quarterback who can win games. And then if you're winning UH,
(16:08):
and your coaches defensive mind UH instead of offensive minded,
A lot of times what happens is the offensive coordinator
then gets the head coaching job, right because other teams
will come coach your better coaches, and now one of
your more important players, the quarterback, is having to probably
(16:29):
learn a different offense, maybe not a totally different one,
but some derivative of an offense UH, every two to
three years because maybe your offensive coordinator UH is getting
those head jobs. And Matt Ryan, I think about my
old place we just talked about, Atlanta has gone through
that right when we drafted Matt Ryan and had Mike
(16:50):
Smith defensive minded coach like one of his offense Poolnators,
Mike Malarkey got a head job, Cutter got a head job,
Kyle Shanahan got a head job. So there's a lot
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(20:54):
supply you. We went and looked at your last at
the rosters in your career. Your rosters last year it
was the third youngest. And because you have veteran players
that are noteworthy Aaron Donald Andrew Whitworth, my perception is
(21:15):
less like veterans. And then I started looking and we
started looking at all your rosters and the average age
of your rosters hovers around twenty five other teams. Seven
do you do? Is this a theory? Is it? Is
it a belief or is it? You know, young players
generally recover quicker from injuries but less need. If you
(21:37):
go look at your career, your teams are always one
of the three or four youngest in the league. Why
I appreciate you know, is you can now we can
be that nuance. Right. It's different than television. You know,
you might not get that deep into the weeds, but yes,
it's intentional, but there was all The intent is not
(22:01):
a let's be the young one of the younger teams.
The result is that you mentioned it right, we have
a core group of players that we really rely on,
that our veterans that are in the prime of their career.
But by by building it that way, paying those players
what they deserve, what they've earned, you're definitely gonna have
(22:22):
to turn it around. Even though we haven't had a
uh first round draft pick, like you said, and I
don't know how many years and may go seven years,
right since Sean has been here, we've had the fifth
most draft picks. So the philosophy is, Okay, we've got
this core group of veteran players in their prompt we're
gonna we're gonna really ride their coattails, but we're also
(22:44):
to turn around on the back end draft well and
uh developed well and actually have the courage our coaching staff.
I think the underrated thing is having the courage when
you do have, let's go to perceived veteran team to
also fill in with younger players that maybe our only
(23:04):
lacking experience and they have to get their experience on
our clock and not someone else's. You know it's funny.
I love the draft. We've had conversations. I'm a total
you know, recruiting dork. I admitted there are things every
sportscaster loves that he can't spend a ton of time
talking about on television because the ratings won't be good
(23:27):
and I gotta stay on the big stuff, right the headlines.
But it's it's interesting. I was talking to a college
football coach recently and we were talking about left tackles,
and I said, you know, you don't have a great
left tackle. It was a Pack twelve coach. I said,
but it won't matter until you face Oregon because the
(23:47):
Kievan Thibada. I said, then you're in trouble. But I said,
I looked at your schedule and there's not an NFL
rush end on your really on your schedule until then.
Utah has a really good job usually with NFL D lineman.
When when you look, I see you know, I see
Andrew Whitworth, SEC, Matt Stafford, SEC, I do see you
(24:08):
know your your Jalen Ramsey's uh Florida State. I've said
this before. I think if I was a GM less,
I would struggle not to draft SEC players because I
know they played against NFL players. You know, Pat twelve.
You may face one defensive rush end all year. That's
(24:30):
an NFL guy, you know, Pena Seul I like, but god,
he's a monster compared to ninety percent of the guys
he faces. I have to go back to like Auburn
film or something, you know, a couple of years ago.
So you tell me, do you ever feel like, if
it's close, you just go with a Southern player in
the draft? Well, I think is it? I think you
(24:51):
hit the nail on the head and you explained it, well, right,
it might not right, just be because he was born
in the South, and and I it's just circling all
the w by. My oldest kid played with Cavan Thibodeaux
at Oaks Christian High School out here in California. So
I got to see that kid probably as a sophomore, junior,
and senior, and I know he was I know ed
(25:12):
Orgeron right, who's got some l A ties is down
in Louisiana. Now was really really you know recruiting Caban
talk so point being and you mentioned it is if
it's a tie, uh and you need something to break it,
there is a good chance you're gonna see that SEC
tackle or what have you played more games against more
(25:34):
NFL players than the Pact twelve tackle? So and what
is that? What is that just naturally going to lead to?
Is an we're gonna be more sure about that player,
right because we saw that player do it more times
against NFL competition than uh and I and I bet
everyone that had a chance to draft pas and and
(25:56):
we certainly didn't trade and are one away, but I
bet you if you were in that top ten range
and we're projecting that he won't fall, may fall. Everyone
went back to that Alban Dame. I can tek you
that every every I can't guarantee it hadn't talked to
anyone with I guarantee every evaluator went back to that
that Alburn game. Yeah, I mean that's what That's the
(26:19):
one I wanted to see, Like, I just like, let
me go to the SEC. How do you deal with
Auburn's rush end? Another thing I think about when you draft,
because I've said before, if I wasn't a sportscaster, my
dream job would be GM in the NFL, Like if
I would have spent thirty years doing something, but I
didn't already know the route, right, I didn't play the game,
so whereas a sportscaster, the route was easy. Right, you're
starting a single a baseball team, you go to a
(26:41):
local market, blah blah blah. So I also think about this.
There are certain coaches in college that are so good
that they squeeze every ounce of talent out of the player.
Nick Saban, so I know the player I see is
the player I get. There was a college coach I
won't call him out, but he coached the SEC years ago.
He's a great recruiter, wasn't known as a great player developer,
(27:04):
and so his players often went to the NFL and
you got another gear. But Saban and Tom Osborne, the
Nebraska coach, I always felt like you just got that
you had seen the top end. With a Saban guy
and a tom Osborne guy, there's there's you're not gonna
get extra juice. Have you ever thought about that in drafting,
that this coach is a recruiter, not as good a
(27:27):
player developer and this kid's got more in the tank. Uh, definitely.
And before I get to that question, another and since
we're on the podcast, I can do this one thing.
Also on let's call it the Southern competition of the
sec UH. If Cavan Thibodeau, as an example, would have
gone to l you would have gone to Alabama, got
a good feeling, he would have still panned out and
(27:48):
been one of the best let's call it Russier's and
or what it would have done. But what would have
happened during that If you'd have gone to one of
those environments, of those situations, there would have been a
lot more competition from the start. So you do get
players who are The NFL is full of competition. So
(28:09):
when you get one of those players and they earned
playing time at Alabama, l s U comes in, what
have you? You know, they also beat out some players
that are gonna probably play in the NFL as well.
And those players may have to transfer to actually get
enough tape to do it, and they do it and
if it works out, but the competition is easy. But
I do think you have to look at right coaches, schools,
(28:31):
even systems, and and really be nuanced and okay, and
to put it simply right, what is you know, mom, dad,
God given type traits that you're probably not improving And
if you do, it's it's minutes amounts, but also look
at systems and techniques, things that actually can be developed, right,
and now you have to project, right, can you development
(28:54):
player right? Not? Not every player is. That's call it
a Tiger Woods mentality that says, Okay, i will change
my golf swing even though I'm one of the best,
to be better. Right. So it's you have to really
it's hard for player to come to our league and
I'm gonna change technique because during that process of changing technique,
(29:16):
they're gonna get embarrassed on the practice field a little bit.
So you really got to dig into that mentality and
try to uh, you know the cipher that and that's
what probably makes the draft fund and a little bit
artistic and not just you know, black and white, you
know success, no success, things like that. You've gone with
(29:36):
some big personalities in your career. Uh Marcus Peters and
Dominican Sue um a keep to leave. You've never been
shy about that. Um Marcus Peters was interesting. Chris Peterson
at Washington said it's not working. Andy Reid said it's
not working. And at some point you guys said, hey,
we're moving on. But you're not shy about taking guys,
(29:59):
Jaylen Ramsey, he's got opinions and he's gonna let you
know those opinions. What is it? Or you you can
talk about it specifically or vaguely abstract lye with Marcus,
a bunch of coaches, Andy Reid, who again has taken
big personalities, Chris Peterson McVeigh or less. Need you guys
decided with Peters? You know what? The fit doesn't work?
(30:21):
What is when you are looking at a personality and
it's always receivers and corners for some reason, they're out
in an island. They got they got big personalities. What
is the thing where you go less, Yeah, that's not
gonna work. Like it's it's not that that's over a
lined that's not gonna work. Where where is that space
for you on personalities? Well? I think I'll first take
it right, Okay, what is it that is going to work?
(30:45):
About it? Right? And all of those players you mentioned
one thing that they had in common, like all of
them across the board, with intelligence and applying that intelligence
to football, right, they could they could they could learn
process to citeer apply uh football complexity on the football field.
(31:06):
And that's and that's what made that that helped make
them great. Uh, there's an element of a lot of players, right,
depending on when you get them in the career. Hey
are they Are they in that phase where, you know what,
only get one shot at this, not a lot of
years to do it. I need to earn as much
money as possible. Then there's times when okay, I've got
(31:28):
I've got that taken care of. Now I actually want
to win, right, So and then we look at our
team and go, what do we need? Like I always say,
we can't have everyone that does one of those let's
call it milk advertisements, you know in sports salitory where
where you're you're you're you know you're gonna drink your
whole milk and said yes. Or there's a time on
the football field where there's edge that is needed right there,
(31:51):
Hey there we needed you know, somebody needs to ignite
this place. Right we we went against an enemy and
they've backed us up against the wall. Who's going to
ignit us to get us? You know? Uh, you know
you get us out of that hole? And then and
then there's moments when uh, in all of those cases,
and interesting in Marcus's case, right here in Wade scheme,
(32:12):
he he uh he probably he he fits probably a
vision defense in Wade scheme at time a lot more
man So there is sometimes schematic issues that aren't personality.
But I do think at the end of the day,
when the personality or the individual behind the personality, UH
somewhat probably uh becomes bigger than the team, not necessarily bigger,
(32:36):
but he's putting himself and and everyone should put themselves right.
It's it's a business. It's it's how you earn money.
But I'll use this example. If you're a wide receiver, right, yes,
you should do your best to earn as much money
as possible. While doing that, right, you can help a
football team, if it was us the Rams win games.
(32:59):
We can that symbiotically simultaneously. But if for one reason
you decide, you know what, I'll help you in the
past game, but not necessarily go be hans Ward and
help us in the run game, maybe at that point
you know it is the time to move on in
terms of just personality or or or that intangible Okay,
(33:20):
So I got so I speculated throughout the year, I said,
um I had said on the air, I said McVeigh
has lost trust and golf I just sense it, and um,
it was a San Francisco game, I think it was
up there, and I said, this isn't gonna work. Guys,
there's there's a problem now. Um, and you're an aggressive GM.
(33:42):
Shawn's an aggressive coach. And this is not a shot
at at Jared, but between Russell Wilson twice a year
and Kyle Shanahan twice a year, you can't stand pat everything.
You guys have to be moving. And so at some point,
you know, you guys decide, you know the go fit,
we're gonna make a move. Do you remember the conversation,
(34:05):
the epiphany, the moment when you just sat down and said, Okay,
this kid got to the super Bowl two years earlier.
This is gonna make news. We're gonna have to give
up some picks. Take me to that place for you.
Less that moment when you just said it's a big swing,
I'm going for it. Well, I think it was probably
(34:27):
uh some time after, but the opportunity presented itself right
where we had a chance to acquire a quarterback with
elite skills and Jared has some elite QB skills, uh,
but also a quarterback right that has unique experience and
and and the unique part of it would be I
(34:48):
hate throwing that word around, but in Matt's case, Uh,
take the skill out, take the production out right Frome
for a lot of touchdowns in all the yards, a
lot of comebacks, all of those things. The unique part
of the experience was, Okay, Matts. Matt's been running a
pro style offense probably since he and he did it
in junior high high school. He did it at Georgia
(35:10):
on the under Mark Ricky. So it was that moment
where while there's an opportunity where there's an elite QB
with this experience that now messages with with Sean and
let's go messages where where we were at in the
window where a lot of our skill are in their prime,
a lot of our defenders in their prime. Uh, this
(35:33):
might be an opportunity we can't patch. And the thing
and now there's a human involved, Jared Galtz a great
human being, and he might can get to where Matt's at.
That's just gonna take uh time that Matt had and
he didn't. Uh, And it's a it's a it's a
(35:55):
very very uh tough decision when you do that. But
the thing that I can say is because of Jared
and because of what he did for us and helped
us get to this point. It enabled someone like uh,
Matt to say, you know what, I'd like to be
a part of the Rings. Right if we didn't have
(36:15):
Jared Calton, he didn't help us have the success we had.
Matt could have easily said to Detroit because he had
options and they and Detroit had options, and we all
wanted Matt, but hey, I would rather go to the
Rams because they're more ready to win than maybe Team
BC or D and Jared had a lot to do
with them, which is uh, I guess ironic And what
(36:39):
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us dot org brought to you by the ACT Council.
Welcome out in machine. I don't think it's a coincidence
that Lane Kiffin was able to get a hundred percent
vaccination in one of the lowest vaccination states, Mississippi. He's
a salesman. He can sell his offense, he can sell
(38:30):
his vision. I think Sean McVeigh similarly is great at
selling his vision. And you guys have one of the
highest vaccination rates in the league. And I look at
Kiffen and I look at Sean, and I think, well,
of course they're really good. Half of football coaching is Hey,
I'm going to sell you my philosophy. I'm gonna sell
you my culture. This is my belief system. Are you
(38:52):
on board? Lane Kiffin? Doing that is really remarkable because
Mississippi has struggled getting people vaccine, and in fact, the
fact that Alma's football is is helping the state's rate.
How when in terms of you, it was a GM
can bring in operations people for the RAMS, can bring
in speakers and epidemiologists, but it was this one of
(39:16):
these did you guys lean on Sean to spread it?
And how did you get to that high a vaccination? Right? Like?
What did you do? It? Did take? It was definitely
a collaborative effort. Sean is a huge part of it,
and I give Lane credit because there there might have
been I would say this, I know for a fact
that there's more incentive right for players in the NFL
to get the vaccination then there is in college football.
(39:39):
That helped us a lot, uh and and for many reasons,
but a very collaborative effort. But I do think going
back to Sean and what he's brilliant at is, yes,
he people buy into his vision, his philosophy, but right
whether he was coaching football or anything else, what he
(40:01):
is at the court and someone who when it gets
down to write important decisions, would would prefer sitting and
sitting down individually with you and and authentically communicating, authentically
having a discussion, and and authentically caring about right all
sides of the viewpoints. And I think that that's what
(40:24):
our players feel and know and and see every day,
and that definitely definitely helps. When Cam Akers got hurt,
I was like, oh, because your power back is now
with the Dolphins, And I thought, all right, don't overreact
to it. Whatever you did, I think, whatever you just did,
(40:46):
we all did that. I just was like, because you know,
and I loved your power back, um, and I just thought, Okay,
don't overreact. There are running backs on the market, There
is talent available on the market. So where are you
at with that? Because a lot of Sean's offense is
(41:07):
dictated um on a not reliant but it's often dictated
on some on running success. I mean, we know when
Todd Gurley, you know PREMIEE issues, it was a juggernaut.
It was hard Kyle Shanahan, by the way. Similarly, you
know everybody looks at Matt Ryan's MVP year, but his
it's a power running game to a large degree. So
(41:29):
what do you do now with Cam Akers in the
toughest division in football, where do you find that running
back talent? Now, give me the options? What are you
looking at? I think the reason we probably had the reaction,
uh that you just demonstrated is realistically, we know that
we will not replace Cam because Cam had the right
(41:51):
the mom dag God give an ability to take a
let's call then eight yard twelve yard hole and turn
it into sixty eight yard rung touchdown. So, uh, that's
probably unrealistic to to go grab right, No one's those
players aren't available, and if they are, it's at a
steep price, and it's just unrealistic. So I think because
(42:12):
of when the injury happened, we do have time on
our sides throughout this preseason, uh to try to figure
it out. And the old yes, there is an element
of next man out Darryl Henderson things like that. I
think in this case it's gonna be next minute, not
just man. And we're gonna to do it a little
bit by committee. And and maybe we're gonna have to
(42:32):
settle right where. Okay, if we uh Shaun's offense and
they do a really really nice job based on cause
we really focus on marrying the running pass game, there's
some space there. But this year, without camp, we may
have to live with that four yard run instead of nine,
that eight yard run instead of twenty five, or that
(42:53):
fourteen yard run instead of thirty or longer, and and
and go from there. And then I think we we
have to really look at our young players without experience
and go, Okay, this is what we can expect from them,
and then monitor who's available on other teams and maybe
the veterans that are out there and determine, hey, could
(43:14):
they be right expected to right add more value and
if so, by how much more so? Uh, We're gonna
We're gonna let our youth have a shot at it
first and then use these use this preseason in these
next three or four weeks too, you know, try to
you know, let's call it solve that puzzle. By the way,
(43:35):
when you hired McVeigh was very young, and now you know,
you look at it in hindsight and you think, of course,
you hire Sean McVeigh, I mean, Brian Flores, Joe Judge,
a bunch of young guys. When Lane Kiffin got a
head coaching job in the NFL, people were, you know,
their jaw dropped. He's like a kid. But now you know,
the sport is more collegiate, it's more progressive, it's offensive minded.
But there was a little risk when you hired McVeigh.
(43:55):
People were like, whoa, what was the case? So you
you do the review thing and there's probably a moment
you call your life for you maybe it's staying crockey
or something you're thinking. I mean, you didn't have a
lot of time because he was going to interview at
other places. Like you know, they say less that it
takes a woman eight minutes to figure out if she'll
(44:16):
date you, if she's gonna fall in love. They need
eight minutes. How many minutes was Sean McVeigh did you say,
all right, I'm into this room, this is gonna work
for me. How many minutes that take in our interview?
And in that first interview it was myself, Kevin dem
Off Tony Pastors was the VP of football administration, probably
took somewhere in that six state minute range and say, okay,
(44:39):
he's the guy. Now from that like Sean's gonna win. An,
that's man, he's got an actual gift. But the reason
we have gotten you know, the reason it probably only
took sixt eight minutes is when you did go back
and let's call it study, study what he did at
Washington with a third round quarterback, and you get really nuanced. Hey,
(45:02):
his offense, for whatever reading reason, created more space than
other offenses. Right, there were times when his receivers were
wide open, they didn't have to use their mom that
God given ability to win on one on one match,
and you were able to see that consistently. And there's
(45:23):
a lot of analytics now that can even measure that
to an extent. So that's one thing that's one of
the reasons why we said, hey, wait, a minute. This
this young man, uh is he's doing things schematically while
that that other people are. I mean, that's a top
five offense and a lot of categories with a QB
(45:45):
that is a third rounder. So he's doing it not necessarily. Hey,
we gotta go out and get a first round QB.
And he was a part of maybe developing Kirk some
you know young so we had two young QB. The
the other part of it, right, I say, a huge
part of who's the most important people in the building.
And we have one of the players on our team
now to Sean Jack. But you know, we did our
(46:06):
research and chatted with with these players and I always
go not just the you know, the quarterbacks, but you know,
through through different channels Kate to Sean, what what do
you think about Sean McVeigh, And it's like, hey, hw
are that guy immediately best teacher of football I've ever had? Hey,
he owns the room. We're all a two. Right, it's
(46:27):
and they had some good players on that team, whether
it was him, that D'Angelo Hall, some some of those
type players that we could do our research with and
and they give the thumbs up. And the the other
part of the story, which is interesting right at that
point in time, Let's take myself. It wasn't like, okay,
it's Colin Calherd gonna bus stock in in less sneed, right,
(46:49):
I was. We hadn't had a winning season under the yet.
So one of the things we did decide to do,
especially with Stand when we brought Seawan to a stand,
is he's a fan of Marshall Fault from the St.
Louis Asi And if you know Marshall Marshall, brilliant football mind,
not just the gifted running back, but he loves he
(47:12):
loves past protection, he loves route combinations, he loves he's
nuanced again he you know, it's it's it's stuff right
television viewer wouldn't wouldn't pay attention to her. Uh uh
you know, stay glued to with our A d h
D generation. But we were able to put Marshall at
the table. And when you just listen to two brilliant
(47:34):
football minds talk football, that the picture becomes clear right
there versus just hey asking let's call it standard interview questions.
So there were many, many, many uh phases to uh
Shawn's interview. But you know when you gathered all of that,
and it was right there in front of you, and
then you meet him, you're probably right six state minutes in, going, yep,
(47:57):
he's what he's what the research says he is. And
from that moment, like he's a thirty year old. Going
back to his press conference, I'm like, he could have
easily been nervous and still been a successful football coach, right, Right,
we all look at that opening press conference and you're
gonna you're gonna have some But we're an entertainment business, right,
You're gonna have some version of how that opening press
(48:19):
conference went. He could have been really, really nervous, right
and still been a successful football coach. But I can
remember texting my wife going and and she was once
in the media business, and she was like, wow, I
never seen one nailing like that. Like from every moment
he took a step after being hired, it's like he's exceeded,
you know, high expectations, which is a tribute to him,
(48:43):
for sure, Less Snead, great stuff. We don't want to
take any more of your time. You got listen. You
just keep looking at that waiver wire for running backs
and some big name's gonna pop up there. You never know. Right,
you never know, You never know. But I it's interesting
in Seawan and I've talked a lot, there has been
a lot of let's call it guys names that you
(49:05):
really didn't know about right playing. Let's call it a
Mike Shanahan born zone type scheme, derivative of zone sites,
whether it was starting with Terrell Davis, whether it was C. J. Anderson,
whether it's tech Motsart up in San Francisco. Now, so
there's been a lot of guys who right had success
(49:26):
in these schemes that maybe you didn't know before they
had the success in these schemes. So, uh, it's definitely
a scheme that benefits running backs. And you know, we're
gonna try to do our best to make sure we
have the best four or five on our roster, even
though we're probably not replacing Cam Akers this year. Yeah,
it made me a sick to my stomach. Hey, thanks
(49:47):
for spending time with the smart stuff. I appreciate it.
Com Thank you. I love talking ball. God. I want
to be at GM someday. Too bad. I'm old twice
about that? A good thing right now? Thanks least all
right at the Volume Sports, Twitter and Instagram rate review
(50:09):
subscribe also our YouTube page at the Volume Sports check out.
It's growing. We put a lot of our podcasting stuff
on our YouTube page if you want to watch it.
It's really fun. We got a couple of big announcements coming,
so I'm really excited for one that's gonna come very
very quickly. In fact, you may learn about it today.
(50:32):
Very very interesting. I've been looking for a young, aggressive
podcast personality in the SEC. I think we may have
found him. Talk soon. Yeah, the Volume. Get right to
(51:25):
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