Harris vs Trump: Can we trust the polls?

Reverend Mark Thompson joins us to discuss polling accuracy, which can be affected by various factors, including sampling methods, timing, and public sentiment. We discuss the methodologies around polls and caution the public to carefully draw conclusions about trustworthiness. Ultimately, we all must VOTE!

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
I'm Tamika D.

Speaker 2 (00:01):
Mallory and it's your boy.

Speaker 1 (00:02):
My son is generally we are your host of TMI.

Speaker 3 (00:05):
Tamika and my Son's Information, Truth, Motivation and inspiration name
New Energy.

Speaker 1 (00:14):
What's good, my son, Lennon.

Speaker 2 (00:16):
How you doing today, Tamika D. Mallory.

Speaker 1 (00:18):
I'm doing well, doing well.

Speaker 4 (00:20):
Still out here crisscrossing this country, meeting people, trying to
deal with misinformation and also just you know, really checking
the temperature of our people. I think that, uh, you know,
folks are getting to that point that you know, we
always see happen as it gets closer to the election.

(00:43):
A lot of those who were saying we're sitting this
one out or ain't got time to hear this. We're
working on trying to pay for the bread, the eggs,
the cheese, the milk, the gas, and pay the rent
and election is not that important to us. We're starting
to see folks getting more engaged and kind of you know,
coming to the table. So I think that's good. Also

(01:06):
today we saw an article that was that came out
talking about black political operatives, vendors, funders who you know,
want to see more support from the campaign and you know,
and the Democratic party to help us all of us

(01:30):
do the work on the ground. And I just thought
it was quite funny that for some people who will
write in your comments and mind that we are being
paid by the Democrats, and then you see an article
like that come out that really kind of shows that
many people, many of people, as they say, are waiting

(01:51):
for resources to come down. I don't think waiting in
terms of the fact that we're not doing the work,
because there are certainly other sources of funds to help
do electoral work. But I'm glad to see that people
are standing up to say to these old you know,

(02:12):
old school political party politics and people who are in
charge to open up the pocketbooks and make sure that
folks have the ability to you know, to do the
work that has to happen in the next forty days.

Speaker 3 (02:31):
Yeah, it's very vital, you know. I say this all
the time. People expect people to work for free, you know,
and a lot of us we are passionate because we
understand what's at at stake, So we're doing the work,
you know, naturally because it's something that we actually believe in.

(02:51):
But in order to have a real impact, you know,
you have to be able to have resources. You have
to be able to be able to fund certain things.
Understand that, you know, the opposition is making sure that
they they fund misinformation, right, they are funded misinformation. They're
doing everything that they possibly can to fund misinformation. And

(03:15):
this is actually having a told. So if we're not
we're not going to well not we If the Democratic
Party doesn't seem fit to fund combat and misinformation, then
I don't I don't know how they expect to actually
win a selection, you know, and and they should they

(03:38):
have if they have all the resources necessary. So we
talk about, you know, black people not being funded and
not having the resources to do the work necessary to
actually win the campaign is disheartening. But you know, I'm
one of those people that want to be optimistic and
in these next forty forty one how many days forty

(04:02):
one forty two days too, forty two days, you know,
hopefully they hit the ground running and they understand the
seriousness of what we're dealing with. So that's all we
can do, you know, and just hope for the best.

Speaker 4 (04:17):
Yeah, I think I think that the resources are starting
to open up. I mean, one thing I would say
is that you know, this is a campaign that turned
quickly in the last two months really hasn't even been
enough time. Usually, you know, when you have a presidential candidate,
they're running for a solid year or so even more,

(04:41):
and that wasn't the case here. So there is some
of that, but there's also just political operatives who are
in these campaigns.

Speaker 1 (04:51):
You know, a lot of people.

Speaker 4 (04:52):
Think that that campaigns work just like your regular job,
where the boss is sitting there and kind of knows
about the ins and outs of things that's happening. But
you know, when you're looking at politicians and even in
some corporations and some organizations, there are people that go
out of their way to keep the candidate or the

(05:15):
principle from knowing all of the details.

Speaker 1 (05:18):
They might give a directive.

Speaker 4 (05:21):
I want to meet with so and so, or I
want to see such and such thing, and a few
weeks later, maybe even a few months later, and especially
when things blow up in their faces, they're like, well,
what happened and some person made a decision somewhere along
the line that those people we shouldn't have met with,
or we shouldn't be meeting with, or this group shouldn't

(05:44):
be hired, or these people shouldn't be contacted, and sometimes
it is sabotaged, quite frankly. Sometimes it's incompetence. Other times
it's it's racism. And there are times when you know,
it's all about personal friendships, and you know, and and
and at best it can also be that, you know,

(06:06):
some of these staffers and others are overwhelmed. But whichever
of those things it may be, none of it is acceptable.
And so you know, I know that, you know, I've
seen many of the black folks connected to well, I
can't even say that because I saw some black folks
in the news the article that came out say some
really dumb stuff, but I you know, I know black

(06:30):
other black people who are very connected to the campaign
who have said that.

Speaker 1 (06:35):
Uh.

Speaker 4 (06:35):
And Mignon Moore is one of those who was quoted
in the story, who was just recently the convention chair,
saying that she knows for sure that Kamala Harris has
directed the campaign to do more to make sure that
black grassroots organizations and others have the resources needed to

(06:56):
get out there, knock on doors and organize.

Speaker 1 (06:58):
And I really kind of think I want to put.

Speaker 4 (07:00):
Out and I literally want to release to the public
a budget for what it costs to move around the
country to do the type of work that we do,
because I think that people don't understand. And I'm not
talking about folks in the campaign, because clearly they know
they've done this work. Many of them started at the

(07:21):
grassroots level, and so they know. Some of them may
not have started grassroots, but certainly they have had to
have some relationship with people on the ground, and they
know they have received, you know, a number of budgets
and proposals, so they understand it. But just the average

(07:43):
person who may read an article and say, well, why
would they be want wanting money? It's like, you know,
it's crazy, because you know, some people really have no
clue about what it takes. If you're living in New
York or you're living in Texas, California, or some where,
and now you have the responsibility that either you've taken

(08:04):
on or you've been hired to do, or something you
want to do to go to another state and be
there long enough to have to have an impact. You
need to be able to get there, which costs money.
You need to be able to stay there, which costs money,
and you need to be able to eat while you're there,
and to move around. To travel around, you need a

(08:25):
first aid kit with you. You know, it might be cold,
it might be raining cats and dogs one day, and
you got to go out and be able to buy
ponchos so you can continue to walk your routes. You
might need umbrellas, you might need you know, if somebody
might feel sick and need talent or like, should you
be going in your pocket to pay for expenses related

(08:48):
to work that you have to do in order to
help all of us?

Speaker 3 (08:53):
Ye, especially especially when these campaigns are raising so much
money and that's what is supposed to be allocated too.
So you know, it's like you said, there's a lot,
and I second the notion that you should actually break
that down so people can have some you know, civics
one O one. A lot of people just don't know,

(09:15):
so I don't fault them for not knowing. So that's
what that's what we're here for. As we learn, we
need to.

Speaker 4 (09:22):
Teach, absolutely absolutely that's our responsibility. Well, you know, today,
speaking of learning and teaching, we have invited Reverend Mark
Thompson to be with us.

Speaker 1 (09:34):
I appreciate that.

Speaker 4 (09:37):
You know, as I'm talking to Mark every day, I
get the pleasure and you do as well. For all
of our group chats, but beyond group chats, I speak
to Mark at least three or four times in each day,
and I feel, you know, every time I talk to him,
either I learned something or I debate with him.

Speaker 1 (09:57):
We spa in conversations.

Speaker 4 (09:59):
We go back and forth because I you know, I
like to say that I learned so much from everybody else,
but I teach sometimes sometimes I.

Speaker 1 (10:07):
Teach and so uh.

Speaker 4 (10:09):
But but I certainly know that when I'm finished talking
to Mark each day, I have different thoughts about what
we have, the information we've got to get out to
our people, and so uh. You know, he's going to
be joining us today. I know folks are wondering when
are we coming back visually. We're coming back soon. We'll
be back in the studio. The lot of things are

(10:29):
changing about you know, how we will return with our visuals.
We are going going for an upgrade. We're going for
something a different type of experience, and we're excited about
what's happening in too and with tam I stick with us,
you know today, please listen, listen closely to the information

(10:51):
that you're about to get from Reverend Mark Thompson as
we bring him up, Reverend Mark Thompson from making it plain.

Speaker 1 (11:00):
Our brother.

Speaker 3 (11:02):
Yeah, it's our brother, man. So we're no further ado.
We're going to bring our brother to the chef.

Speaker 4 (11:08):
Well, you know, our friends are back on with us
today as we continue to talk about this election and
really look at all that is happening across the country.
Is so important that we defeat the misinformation and the
disinformation that's online, the disinformation that's being shared by even

(11:33):
people who we consider to be icons. And you know,
I think that, you know, one of the huge points
of contention has been this issue around polling and whether
or not you know. Every time you turn around, you
see different individuals talking about, you know how or different

(11:57):
different people who claim to know based upon polls, where
black people stand, where different communities stand. And I'll tell
you I have never I may have been pulled one time.
I think I picked up the phone in my house
one day and someone was polling me about, you know,
some issue in New York City. But other than that,

(12:18):
I've never been polled. I don't know if you've been pulled,
my son.

Speaker 3 (12:22):
I don't think i've ever. I don't even know what
it looks like to be polled. So I don't think
those those entities come to the communities that we actually inhabit,
So those polls don't really get the full scope, especially
in our communities, of what's going on. So and I've

(12:43):
seen those polls fail, you know what I'm saying. I
watch I literally watched those polls completely fail. And I know,
I think for me, right, just being in this, being
in politics and just studying for the last decade, I
understand that there's a there's a feeling and there's a

(13:05):
vibe inside of communities, especially that we inhabit, that tells
you different than a lot of these polls, do you know,
And and when you try to explain that, you know,
I remember, I remember Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton, and
the polls are saying this, and the pose are saying that,
and the streets wasn't saying that.

Speaker 2 (13:26):
And I kept and I kept reiterating it, and and
then you know, and we actually seeing the outcome of that.
So you know, to your question, I haven't been polled.
I don't even understand if those polls actually work.

Speaker 4 (13:44):
So, so our brother Mark Thompson reberend Mark Thompson of
Naked Plane, His Zone show that you know, really covers
all of these political issues and more. I always say
that Mark Thompson certainly one of the most brilliant not
just members of the clergy, but strategists of our time,

(14:10):
and we're very blessed to have him as a part
of the think tank and until Freedom and Tonight he
is joining us to talk through what we learned from polls,
what we learn from the information that's out there online,
and how we can be more accurate in terms of
and I don't know, maybe there's not a way to

(14:31):
be more accurate. Maybe there's always going to be these
margins that are off, but I mean it seems to
be really off because to your point about Hillary Clinton,
I mean, she lost, and I'm sure Mark, you have
plenty to say about how that happens. So thank you
for joining tam Maya're not a stranger to the show.
We appreciate you for making yourself available.

Speaker 5 (14:53):
Well, good to be with you all. As always, there's
a lot going on, a lot to talk about.

Speaker 4 (14:59):
Yeah, absolutely so, Mark, we're talking about polls. I've only
been polled one time, my son saying he's never been pulled.
That's because he refuses to keep a house phone. So
I don't know what are some of the other ways
that polls happen.

Speaker 5 (15:16):
Well, this actually may be one of the first political
cycles where people are getting dialed by on their cell phones,
and so that does make a difference because normally that
doesn't happen. And when we're talking about younger people, people
of color, you know, people don't have home phones anymore,

(15:40):
So that does make a difference. So this one may
be slightly more accurate. These polls now may be more
accurate in that regard some polls.

Speaker 6 (15:50):
And you have different types of polls.

Speaker 5 (15:51):
Some polls are slanted right, some are slanting more centrist,
some are slanting more liberal.

Speaker 6 (16:00):
That's why the rule of thumb.

Speaker 5 (16:03):
And while the news media will make stories and headlines
every day about this poll and that poll, that keeps
an interested That helps the news media, you get people engaged.
But the best way to look at polls is to
look at aggregate polls, to look at all the polls
that are out there and start doing averages, and then

(16:24):
you may come up with something that's a little more accurate.
Now they they add another wrinkle. We just don't know
sometimes how honest some people are being when it comes
to polling, and I think that's one of the things
happened that happened in twenty sixteen with Hillary Clinton. But
I will say this, we also know Hillary Clinton actually won.

(16:47):
See the problem is when we look at polls, we
never consider the electoral college until after election day. And
so Hillary Clinton won the majority of the votes in
this country. She won that election in terms of actual
millions in popular vote.

Speaker 6 (17:04):
She just did not.

Speaker 5 (17:05):
Win the states that she needed to win, and between
one hundred thousand, just a little over one hundred thousand
votes spread out amongst three states, she lost the election.
So we can look at polls until we're blue in
the face. What happens in the individual states, What happens
when it comes to electoral college is the answer. Now,

(17:28):
maybe we should not assume or presume that everybody has
a full understanding of the electoral college. So I don't
Maybe we need to go over that how that works,
and that being folks in America, you have to win states.
States have electors. Each state has a number of electors.

(17:51):
Those are the people whose votes are sent to the
capitol like they were on January sixth, the day Donald
Trump and his ilk had the insurrection. Each state has
a different number of electors, and the reason for that

(18:13):
is because during the period of enslavement, you had some
states with more people who look like to Meeke a
mice and myself than white folk. But no one, of course,
wanted people who looked like us, wanted enslaved people to vote,

(18:35):
and so you have to make up for that. You
have to compensate for that so that those states still
have an equal or proportionate amount of weight to other states.
And so you did that with the electoral college. You
made sure that certain states had a certain number of
electors to make them relevant, to make them important. Not

(18:57):
one time, up until this era of Republican presidents being
elected without a majority of the popular vote with electors,
people used to make the same argument, Well, some states
of what you call fly over states, they don't matter,
They're not important for Iowa, Montana, flyover states. Nobody campaigns

(19:22):
in those states because they're so rural they don't matter.
But because they have electoral votes that can tip an election,
then the electoral college matters, and so that makes them relevant.
But now more and more, as we see a number
of presidents have been elected to the White House without

(19:46):
a popular vote. There's a more popular call, a more
popular cry, for the electoral college to be done away with. If,
for example, the Democrats get enough votes in the Senate,
they must they may just be able to do that
to get rid of the electoral college. But I've said

(20:08):
a lot a pause there. I'm sure you have some
follow up questions. But that's the way it works. They're posed.
There's the electoral college. It's not meant it, frankly, to
be the most simple or most understandable process, because once again,
this America, this country was built on the back of

(20:30):
our enslaved ancestors, and that is why we have the
electoral system that we have.

Speaker 4 (20:35):
So I'm hearing what you're saying, and you're right, it's
a lot to consume, right, And I wonder with the
electoral college.

Speaker 1 (20:43):
I kind of go back and forth.

Speaker 4 (20:44):
Sometimes I understand the cries and demands to do away
with it, but then I also understand that a state
like or states like California and New York, because of
the amount of people we have, we could pretty much
set the election or decide the elections.

Speaker 1 (21:08):
All the time. Is that accurate? And do you think.

Speaker 4 (21:12):
That's fair, like what would be what's your position on that?

Speaker 5 (21:18):
At one time I did have concerns about that. Those
are not illegitimate concerns because the other thing about that
is is I mentioned some of the other states that
are considered flyover states, like even a state like Pennsylvania.
Who would spend money campaigning in Pennsylvania or Iowa or

(21:39):
in other states if we simply relied on a popular vote,
you can spend most of your time campaigning in big
states like New York and California and Texas and make
a difference, So that that is not an illegitimate concern.
But we got to come up with something better because

(22:00):
you've got a couple of states where a handful of people,
you can't go from one extreme another. You can't have
a over popular or states with large populations exclusively deciding
an election. And then what we have now states were
very small populations and an election being decided by just

(22:24):
a handful of people. Like I said, Jill Stein, peeling
off one hundred and fourteen thousand votes within three states
made Donald Trump the president in twenty sixteen. That's just
bizarre and crazy. Jill Stein will never be elected president
yet her being able to steal those handful of votes

(22:45):
made Donald Trump president and look where that has left us.
So there has to be a better system. And frankly,
we're the only country left in the world that doesn't
do it based upon popular vote.

Speaker 4 (23:00):
So, Mark, you said that somewhere I'm not sure, but
I saw people pushing back saying, no, Hillary lost because
she didn't campaign well in certain states and she did
not make she didn't meet the electoral college number, you know,
in certain places. So can you speak more to that,

(23:22):
because there certainly was some pushback on that point when
I posted no, No, it wasn't you. It was Joyanne
Reid who spoke about Jill Stein and the Third Party
or Green Party and their you know, their efforts being
a reason why Hillary didn't win, and people were pretty

(23:47):
upset about that. So could you maybe speak more to that.

Speaker 6 (23:50):
Well, there were.

Speaker 5 (23:54):
Several states Jill Stein was in was on the ballot
in a number of states, and when you look at it,
I don't necessarily.

Speaker 6 (24:07):
Agree that it was about campaigning.

Speaker 5 (24:12):
There was an alternative, and there were voters spread across.

Speaker 6 (24:18):
Pennsylvania, Michigan, and Wisconsin.

Speaker 5 (24:24):
Now, there was an argument made that perhaps Hillary Clinton
should have gone to Wisconsin a bit more. That is
an argument some have made. Objectively, we've heard that, but
the margin was so slim, like I'm saying, this was

(24:46):
barely one hundred thousand US think about one hundred and
fifteen thousand votes spread across these three states.

Speaker 6 (24:53):
The likelihood that Hillary.

Speaker 5 (24:57):
Clinton campaigning more in those three states would have changed
those one hundred thousand votes is not clear. People had
an alternative. They voted for Jill Side, and because that
alternative was there, those are the numbers. That is the

(25:18):
margin of victory or the margin of defeat for Hillary Clinton.
I mean, that's pretty objective. That math doesn't lie. One
can only hypothesize that those voters would not have gone to.

Speaker 6 (25:42):
Donald Trump.

Speaker 5 (25:43):
And usually when you have a situation like that, you
have three candidates and one is far to the right,
one is center left, as Hillary Clinton was, then you
one must hope or hypothesize that those voters might have
gone to Hillary Clinton. That would have made the difference.

(26:08):
But that's what we know. That's what we know happened
in those in those three states, and with that number
being so small, I don't know that we can say
has he gone to those three states more that one
hundred thousand more votes. We've not seen that that evidence
to those hard numbers that one hundred thousand more people

(26:29):
would have turned out for her.

Speaker 3 (26:31):
So so based on what you're saying, and I and
I and I and I kind of understand, like I'm not,
I don't, I'm not as genius as you are. But
when I listen to it, it just seems like we
haven't really established a viable third party. So pretty much
what it seems to me like and I don't want
to say it in this way, but it just seems

(26:53):
like the third party pretty much is like can be
the monkey wrench, right, It's like we we we have
two viable candidates and a third party. Although and I'm
and I'm a firm believer that we really need to
establish this third party. I believe that there has to
be more alternatives than just two people and two parties

(27:14):
that were just stuck in right, And I don't but
I don't know what the mechanism is. But every time
I hear about this third party, it seems as if
and it's only a monkey rich for the Democrats because
the third party has a lot of a lot of
liberal views right, and they just wait, they just a little.

Speaker 2 (27:33):
More to the left than the Democratic Party.

Speaker 3 (27:37):
So there's what happens is if I'm if I'm strategizing,
if I'm a Republican, I'm strategizing, what I want to
do is is create some level of doubt or some
level of energy to the third party to help them,
you know, so they can help me. And and so

(28:01):
I'm kind of like I'm a lot torn between this because,
like I said, I believe that we need to have
something that's different than a two party system and a
lot of things that to third party says and does
we actually feel like it needs to be done? But

(28:22):
I just understand if the viability is not really there,
then how does it really benefit us? Is it actually
even possible for us to create a third party that
is viable?

Speaker 1 (28:35):
Yeah, it sounds like the RFK.

Speaker 4 (28:38):
Situation mark where you know, who was who did RFK
benefit more? Is it prompt with who he ended up
siding with after getting out of the race.

Speaker 1 (28:51):
Or would it have been that he would have helped
I don't know.

Speaker 4 (28:56):
I mean, I think he became an alternative to the Democrats, right.

Speaker 5 (29:02):
Well, RFK was cutting into Trump's vote, that is why
RFK has been trying to get his name removed from
the ballots. He's an ally of Trump. If his name
is on the ballot, he steals votes from Donald Trump,
the same way Jill Stein steals votes.

Speaker 6 (29:24):
From the left.

Speaker 5 (29:26):
Now, to be clear, just to go back a little bit, Mice,
this has been the case with third party runs. Ross
Parrot stole votes from Daddy Bush in ninety two that
helped Bill Clinton win. That was considered a little bit
different because a lot of people saw Ross Preau as

(29:47):
a very legitimate candidate.

Speaker 6 (29:49):
He was not just a spoiler.

Speaker 5 (29:52):
People considered him somebody even more excuse me, real to
vote for. And he wasn't considered well and he wasn't
running under a party either, really, he was running as
an independent. John Anderson did the same thing in nineteen

(30:14):
eighty that helped Ronald Reagan defeat Jimmy Carter for re election.
So that is the problem with the third party. You
can cause an upset, and in many of those cases

(30:35):
the upset just so happened has not favored the Democrats.
It has hurt the Democrats. To your point, and I'm
someone who tried to establish a third party. In fact,
the most recent black political party as a third party
to obtain any ballot status anywhere in this country. Founder

(31:00):
the Emosia Party, but it has its challenges. The Green Party,
for example, which has been running races most consistently.

Speaker 6 (31:11):
Again, another example.

Speaker 5 (31:12):
Ralph Nader in two thousand cost Al Gore the race
in Florida, giving a Bush Junior, little Bush Baby Bush
the presidency over Al Gore, and you know everything went
to court, Supreme Court, Bush v.

Speaker 6 (31:28):
Gore and all of that. If Ralph Nader.

Speaker 5 (31:32):
Does not give Gore voters that alternative in Florida, then
Gore wins the presidency and we don't have we don't
have Bush.

Speaker 6 (31:43):
The problem is, you're right, Mice.

Speaker 5 (31:46):
All any of these parties right now can be in
running for the presidency is to be a spoiler. But
the way to build a third party, you know, it
is really not the answer to it is not to
be a spoiler and a presidential race, but to build
a party beginning on the local level, to elect members

(32:09):
of Congress, to elect.

Speaker 6 (32:12):
Senators under that party.

Speaker 5 (32:14):
And I think once you do that, it's a more
legitimate party, and then people would have to start paying
closer attention if and when that party chose to run
in presidential races. But as long as we have an
electoral college and as long as we have a winner
take all system in the presidency, a third party unless

(32:34):
it is really viable, unless it is really competitive and
on par with Democrats and Republicans and can raise a
comparable amount of money, at best, it can be a
spoiler for one party or another. So we would have
had a lot going on in this way. We would
have had RFK taking votes from Trump. Now would we

(32:58):
have potentially are the Green Party and possibly Cornell West
taking votes away from the Democrats More than likely. There's
a paradox here though, as those parties is those individuals
take votes away from Democrats to some extent, they're helping Trump.

(33:22):
In fact, some of the lawyers keeping Stein and Cornell
West on the ballot are the same ones trying to
take RFK off the ballot. You know, if you look
at all of that, there's a hand of Republicanism, a
hand of conservatism in each one of those third party
beds RFK, Stein, and West. We see the fingerprints of

(33:46):
Republicans in each of those races.

Speaker 4 (33:50):
That's interesting because you know, and I know this is
you know, very difficult to consume for some people because
we want to see a viable option that is outside
of the realms of the Democrats and Republicans.

Speaker 1 (34:06):
It needs to be.

Speaker 4 (34:07):
And you've already said for those people who can't wait
to get on in the comments and talk about how
you know, you just basically paid by the Democrats and
we over here hosting on our show somebody that just
is a democratic chill, as they say, But you are,
you're you're talking about how you are one who has

(34:29):
tried to establish a third party. And I certainly see
the need for us to have a viable option. But
I and and and and I guess this is something
that I'm asking you that maybe more of a I
don't know, spiritual question or you know, you got so
many bags you can draw from. What do you do

(34:54):
when you realize that you are up against you know,
you're dealing with a two party system. But you have
someone like Jill Stein who has a platform that addresses
some of the important issues that you care about. So
we know that Israel, Palestine, this is something that is

(35:16):
very very important to many of us. We want to
see a cease fire, and you have a person like
Jill Stein who is you know, obviously she's got her
ears to the streets, understands that this is an issue
that we care about. And you know, she said something

(35:37):
the other day, I guess she was on the breakfast
Club about the fact that like, at some point we
have to build political will. Now I heard you say
that has to be done from a local level all
the way up. But I think people are tired of
feeling like every time there's a fire alarm and therefore

(35:58):
they have to vote a certain way just to be
able to quote unquote save democracy. And yet there is
no democracy in what America is participating in in terms
of the the the killing of the Palestinian people. So
I just wonder if you have some thoughts on that,
you know, and and how you would and how are

(36:20):
you speaking to people in your circle who are uh,
you know, feeling uh uh you know this disheartened in
this moment.

Speaker 5 (36:30):
Well, first of all, I don't I don't know anyone
to deal with this specific issue. No one in my
circle is seeing jill Stein as an answer to the
crisis in Gaza, no one legitimately. In fact, it should
be known that the jill Stein tried to pick a

(36:52):
running mate reviewed several people that are prominent in the
ceasefire and in the Palestinian movement, and everyone to a
person turned her down because Jill Stein is seen as
an opportunity. We don't hear from Jill Stein, and we
always say politicians show up in our neighborhoods when they

(37:14):
need to vote well. Jill Stein is no different. That's
what she does, and she will seize upon any issue
that is prominent at the time. There's that, Plus there's
also significant evidence to show jill Stein's relationship with Russia.

(37:36):
Now you mentioned somebody being a Democratic shill, let me
just say this full disclosure. Not only was I the
co founder of the last ballot status political party in
this country in the nineties, in twenty sixteen, because of
my commitment to building third parties, Jill Stein was was

(38:01):
a regular guest at that time on my show Make
It Plain. Before I was informed about what she was doing.
I was duped and I was being fair. I was
giving her equal time. I had Hillary Clinton on my show,
I had your stand on my show. Never had Donald

(38:21):
Trump on the show. That wasn't even consideration, and that
wasn't something he wanted to do. I learned late that
the Green Party is actually an international movement. There are
Greens in Europe. We don't get the European press in
this country, we don't. That's why we don't get. All

(38:44):
of us are involved in the God's movement, but no
one knows what's going on in the Sudan on Congo
because in America we are kept from news pretty much.
This non domestic, just what they want us to see.
So we hear a little bit about Ukraine, we hear
about what's going on in Israel from an Israeli perspective.

(39:04):
Had no idea that Greens for quite some time in
Europe have denounced Jill Stein and see her as a
full ally of Vladimir Putin in Russia that comes from
within the Green Party movement itself. When I saw that,

(39:24):
I asked Jill Stein about that.

Speaker 6 (39:29):
I asked her about her.

Speaker 5 (39:30):
Visit to Russia for the anniversary of RT Russian Television
where she sat at a table next to Vladimir Putin,
his intelligence officials in his cabinet, and the one who

(39:51):
would ultimately be the National security advisor for Donald Trump,
the very one that when Donald Trump met with Barack
Obama after winning the election, he was advised by both
Barack Obama and the US FBI and the State Department

(40:12):
that this guy was going to be a problem. I'm
blanking on his name right now. It'll it'll come to
me in the moment. They're all in this photograph together.
So there there are it's it's it's not.

Speaker 6 (40:28):
It's not just.

Speaker 5 (40:30):
That Jill stein Is is running altruistically or that she's
representing ideology. There are problems with this individual that even
Greens have a problem with. So it's not as simple
as her now. Well, now she once an end to

(40:54):
the ceasefry wild Okay, Jill, But there's still some questions
that have to be answered.

Speaker 6 (40:58):
What is your role in this? Just like any other candidate.

Speaker 5 (41:02):
If we're going to scrutinize a Democratic nominee or Republican nominee,
why would we not scrutinize any other candidate running for
president when there are so many unanswered questions and alliances
that are questionable. So I hope people understand it's not

(41:23):
just about supporting a Democrat. Now to your point of democracy, well,
we've really only talked about democracy the past three cycles
in a row because it just so happens. The candidate
that the Republicans continue to nominate is someone who's made
it very clear he no longer wants to uphold whatever

(41:45):
semblance of a democracy. We've never had perfect democracy as
black people, as African Americans in these countries, people of
African ancestry in this country. But we have someone who
wants to threaten that even further. And everything is on
the shopping block, the number of rights that African Americans

(42:05):
have lost, that women have lost, and that other members
of many constituency groups will probably lose if Donald Trump
is reelected again. This is someone who's decided he does
not care even with the elect the expansive and complicated

(42:26):
electoral college system that has held this country in what
it is. He said, we know, I'm just gonna override
that even if someone else wins the electoral college farre
and square, I, Donald Trump and my insurrectionists are not
going to abide by that.

Speaker 6 (42:39):
We're going to nullify the votes.

Speaker 5 (42:42):
We had black voters in Georgia whose votes he specifically
asked the Georgia Board of Elections to nullify, as he
is trying to do now.

Speaker 6 (42:55):
So we have black voters in other swing states.

Speaker 5 (43:00):
Who are being purged and knocked off the ballot by
Republican forces working in boards of elections in those states.
Our votes are being targeted by Republicans in those states
now by Greens, not by Democrats, but by Republicans.

Speaker 6 (43:21):
That is an objective fact.

Speaker 5 (43:23):
So anybody wants to say, well, what's the difference, that
is the difference.

Speaker 6 (43:28):
There is no other political.

Speaker 5 (43:30):
Interests that is targeting and suppressing African American voters other
than those who are aligned with the Republican Party.

Speaker 6 (43:44):
That's just the fact.

Speaker 5 (43:45):
So we can't say that that's both sides are doing that.
Both sides are not doing that. The Democrats cannot win
without Black voters, so they have no need to do that.

Speaker 6 (43:58):
That is a fact.

Speaker 5 (43:59):
The majority of African Americans, every day, all year round,
vote in the majority four Democrats, seventy eighty ninety percent
in some situations. So it's not just about being a
hill and that's not going to change no matter what
anybody says on social media. As we speak, Kamala Harris
is at about eighty percent at least of the Black vote.

Speaker 6 (44:24):
That number is not as as.

Speaker 5 (44:25):
It should be because of the effect on social media,
because of the targeted effect to discourage African Americans from
voting for whom it could be the first woman, or
the first African American woman, or the first woman of color.
Whatever box she checks off, she checks off about six boxes.
There is discouragement for that to happen.

Speaker 6 (44:46):
Why is that?

Speaker 5 (44:47):
Why would there be such discouragement because they know that
if the black votes does what it normally does and
turns out, then we will have the first woman, the
first African American woman, the first South Asian woman, the
first Caribbean woman elected president of the United States.

Speaker 6 (45:11):
We have a two party system.

Speaker 5 (45:13):
Unfortunately, other countries around the world have a multi party democracy.
Until we can figure out how to build that in
this country, then we're going to continue to have a
conversation about the lesser of two evils, which I think
in this case is an accurate description. There are we

(45:36):
may even be talking about the lester of three, or
we could have been talking about the lesser of five
Trump the Democrats RFK jill Stein, Cornell West And because
we do not have proportional representation, so in a proportional
parliamentary system, let me just give people an alternative.

Speaker 6 (45:57):
Let's look at South Africa all parties get.

Speaker 5 (46:02):
Votes multiper many parties over ten even each party gets
a seat in parliament or their legislators. What it's called
is parliament based upon the percentage of votes their party
even received. So if there's an Until Freedom party and

(46:23):
the Until Freedom party gets ten percent of the vote,
Until Freedom gets ten percent of the seats in that parliament,
and that's the way most parliamentary democracies work, then that
parliament in South Africa elects the president from within parliament

(46:44):
in those percentages. So Until Freedom has ten percent of
the vote, another party has whatever percentage it has. Now
that's you know, nothing is ideal, but those are other
approaches to democracy. Here, we have a winner take all democracy,
so whoever gets the most vote is the winner in
the Senate, in the House, and in the presidency. If

(47:05):
we had a multi party democracy, then you would have
different percentages getting seats based upon the percentage of representation
they have.

Speaker 6 (47:16):
That's an experiment that's being.

Speaker 5 (47:18):
Tried in some locales when it comes to city council races,
and they have to start somewhere, so they started city
council level. People can make a difference in their locales
by changing the percentage of representation they have in those locales.

(47:38):
Everything is locally all from police to school boards to
election systems, and not to mention, every state has different
rules for third parties getting on the ballot.

Speaker 4 (47:48):
Two, Well, let me just say this market and you please,
you know, I don't want to hold you more. I
could listen to you on and on and on because
you just have such so much knowledge all this. You've
been doing this work for so long. But what are
the polls saying?

Speaker 6 (48:05):
Now you know?

Speaker 4 (48:07):
And what do you think about the direction that we're
traveling in?

Speaker 1 (48:11):
And then we let you go.

Speaker 5 (48:13):
The polls right now, many of them have Kamala Harris
with a slight lead over Donald Trump's. If you get
to four or five percent, you're out of the margin
of error. And the margin of era is when you
have four percent a race, whether it's four percent or
less separating the candidates, a margin of area is built

(48:37):
in because poles know sometimes they can be wrong your
point mice, and many times they are. So you have
poles where a candidate is only two or three or
maybe even four points ahead, that's considered a pretty much
a dead even race. When you get into five percent ahead,
then you can say, ah, this person might really be

(48:57):
able to pull this off. And so everyone should look
at the polls for the individual state. You can google
them and where you see a candidate anywhere from four
percent less. It's a tight race. Your vote vote can
make a difference five percent. Of course, your vote can
still make a difference, but that candidate is beginning to
move into a more comfortable lead. Just in the past

(49:20):
twenty of hours, we've seen a couple of poles, times
Siena Pole, which pretty much is still saying a dead
heat in general, but an NBC News poll that has
Kamala Harris forty nine percent to Trump's forty four percent,
So it's still a very, very very close race. There

(49:41):
are aggregate polls, though, if we're going to get a
look at these battlegrounds and these states with electors, there
are polls that are saying she's at about five percent
up in Michigan. That's good for her for Kamala Harris
because Michigan is going to be a competitive state. There

(50:01):
were uncommitted votes in Michigan. The uncommitted movement is not
endorsing her, but they're not endorsing her either, So for
her to be at five percent up in Michigan is formidable,
considering there's that uncommitted vote there. That's a big number.

Speaker 6 (50:21):
Wisconsin she's around four percent, so it's still tight.

Speaker 5 (50:28):
If she has a lead or a hold in Michigan
and Wisconsin, she's in pretty good shape. North Carolina looks
better every day as long as crazy Mark Robinson stays
in the race, because the down ballots are going to
affect the up ballots in the same way the presidential

(50:50):
race affects the races for governor and House and Senate
and local electeds. It works the other way as well.
So North Carolina, Georgia. We look at North Carolina and Georgia.
Who votes in North Carolina. That's a whole lot of
black voters and a lot of black women, and a
lot of divine nine. So we can't write North Carolina

(51:12):
and Georgia off. And Georgia the Trump forces. No, Georgia
is a problem. It was in the past, and that's.

Speaker 1 (51:18):
Why they're doing all this stuff.

Speaker 6 (51:19):
To have the vote right exactly.

Speaker 5 (51:22):
They want to do hand counts now to try to
thwart that. But if we do the mass, if she
has Michigan and Wisconsin, if for the sake of this argument,
that we say she has those states, she would sit
now at two hundred and fifty one electoral votes to
Trump's two hundred nineteen. If we count of all the
red states that we know we're gonna go red, that

(51:43):
means that she would need to win. If she won Pennsylvania,
it'd be over. It'd be absolutely over at two fifty
one plus nineteen eagles two seventy. But if she didn't
win Pennsylvania and she won a combination of two of them,
these states North Carolina, Georgia, Nevada, and Arizona, then that's

(52:08):
her path to win to the presidency. If we do
this math, though, and he's stuck it to nineteen, there
is no way and she has and she actually has
Michigan winiscon in Wisconsin. If she has those states, there
is no way Donald Trump wins the presidency without Pennsylvania.

(52:28):
Pennsylvania is a toss up right now as we speak.
There's mobilization on the ground in Pennsylvania to get out
the black vote, especially in all forty wards in Philadelphia,
that work has not really gone into effect. Like I was,
I was involved in the conversation that I wasn't supposed

(52:49):
to be in but I ended up in it because
if folks started had a conversation in front of me
and I said should I leave? And all stay brother,
We want you to hear this about about mobilizing Pennsylvan
and making that difference in mobilizing Philly. Now, let me
give you one other little heaviat which is really very
interesting and people should hear this. Trump ain't the smartest

(53:12):
person in the room. Folks need to understand that that
Ohio is a problem for Democrats. Florida is a problem
for Democrats. But what is Trump doing. He's targeting Iowa.
He's targeting Haitians. That is mobilizing people against him in Ohio.
But even more so, it's mobilizing almost four hundred thousand

(53:36):
Haitians who vote in Florida. Florida was never in play.
He's got Florida in the pocket. But for the senatorial
race in Florida where Rick Scott is running for re elections.
Rick Scott, that's the dude who looks like he was
on Harry Potter because they wanted Harry Potter villains former
governor now senator who's never won to raise either for

(53:57):
governor or senator by more than ten thousand votes. Trump
is mobilizing four hundred thousand Haitians in Florida to vote.

Speaker 6 (54:04):
Or vote on their own without being mobilized.

Speaker 5 (54:08):
They show up seventy percent in most average elections. The
brother who is investigating the alleged, alleged alleged assassination attempt in.

Speaker 6 (54:20):
The Marlago golf course is a Haitian. What does that
tell you? That's not just a coincidence. The likelihood of
that is because there's so many Haitians in Florida.

Speaker 5 (54:31):
Ations elevate to these, you're going to get Haitian prosecutors
because there's so many Haitians living in Florida for generations.
That's the closest stop on the vote coming in from Haiti.
So he's actually hurting his chances in Florida by attacking Haitians.

Speaker 6 (54:52):
Is dumb?

Speaker 5 (54:53):
Rick Scott is saying, shut up. We've already got abortion
on the bound in Florid like it is in Arizona.
And we've got marijuana legalization in Florida. And that's the
last thing. Abortions on the ballot in Arizona. In Florida,
this will be the first time that Donald Trump will
be on the ballot at the same time as abortion

(55:14):
Keep in mind, Republican women in Republican states have voted
to restore abortion rights in every state where it's been
on the ballot. So here's the question before us. Will
these same women who are Republicans. We know what Democratic
women are going to do. We know young women are
going to turn out more than ever young Democratic women

(55:37):
at eighteen years old. They're eight million new eighteen year
old voters in November. Believing that who will be turning
eighteen by November fifth? Taylor Swift is gonna She's already
mobilized them. What are Republican women are gonna do? Are
they're going to vote to restore abortion in these two
states and vote for Donald Trump?

Speaker 6 (55:58):
Just think if fifty percent of them don't do that.

Speaker 5 (56:01):
Or leave that part of the ballot blank while they
vote to restoring a abortion rights.

Speaker 6 (56:08):
Trump's in trouble.

Speaker 5 (56:09):
So all of the math U looks good for her
if people follow and are honest about what they're saying
in the polls. If people say I want to restore
abortion rights and say it doesn't make sense for me
to vote to restore abortion rights, and then vote for
the man who took away abortion rights in the first place.

(56:32):
If all those things hold, Kamala Harris's pad to the
President's pretty good. If we could, if the eighty percent
of African American continues to rise, and we don't have
people literally spreading the life, we can google her father
right now, there are people saying to our faces, her
father is white.

Speaker 2 (56:54):
Well, that's what I'm These are the things that you have.

Speaker 3 (56:58):
You have all of these eloquent you have all of
the numbers, you know how to do all the things
I'm talking about. Just in the streets right what I'm
faced with is I'm seeing I'm seeing outrageous numbers of
just black males who just and it's not I don't

(57:19):
know if it's just common, it's just the Democratic Party
that they just they're not feeling at this time. Right then,
we have things such as Janet's statement about her father
being white, Like, are these things Janet Jackson, Janet Jackson,
I want to say Janet Jackson, not just Janet Jackson,
so we're clear, But are these things legitimate things that

(57:42):
we should really worry about? Because I think, to me,
like I'm worried, like I'm really worried and I don't
and I don't know if.

Speaker 2 (57:49):
The campaign is paying attention to.

Speaker 3 (57:52):
These things that we already like, we already understand the uncommitted.
We understand that guys is a big thing in you know,
in this election. So that's one thing against just the
med disadministration period and just this feeling that black men
are having right now and I'm in the barbershops and

(58:13):
we have in these conversations, and then when we look
at that and we couple it with just the misinformation
and the intentional because I don't think it's just you
know that it's just people don't know. I think people
are intentionally misinforming people because they want to be you know,
anti you know, the Democratic Party.

Speaker 2 (58:35):
Like, what should we be doing? Is this is really valuable?

Speaker 6 (58:38):
Well, first of all, Mice, you're exactly right.

Speaker 5 (58:42):
But think about it, folks, This didn't just begin. This
has been at least an eight year process. We had
handfuls of black men in twenty sixteen who were feeling
Trump he was always allied with certain entertainers in our community.

(59:03):
And if we really think about it, since twenty sixteen,
it's gradually building, gradually building, gradually building, so it's gotten
to this point now where it may be at a
critical mass. So if you keep putting that stuff out
there gradually, gradually on social media and spreading it, you've
planted a seed of of misinformation that now has become believable.

Speaker 6 (59:29):
And So what I say to people when they say.

Speaker 5 (59:32):
Well, we're hearing this stuff about Kamala and she locked
up black man, which isn't true.

Speaker 6 (59:37):
Her father is really white. So here's the thing.

Speaker 5 (59:41):
I said this to someone today, and I mean, I mean,
it's really it speaks to a larger question. You know,
one of the things doctor King would do. He would
never just deal with the crisis in the moment. He
would deal with the universal issue. Is this just about
November fifth? Or do we have a series is problem
in our community where African Americans are are more targeted

(01:00:05):
for disinformation and more susceptible to believing that disinformation. And
I think that's where we are in the latter. It
goes beyond November fifth. Can anybody say anything and make
us believe it because of our inordinate dependency on social media?

(01:00:26):
So I say to people, look, if Barack Obama burst
on the scene today first time we ever saw Barack Obama,
he would be maligned and decimated because his mother actually
is white. Think about that now, that couldn't happen in
two thousand and eight, because social media didn't have the
power in two thousand and eight.

Speaker 6 (01:00:47):
That it has sixteen years later.

Speaker 5 (01:00:51):
It doesn't have the power that it had eight years
ago in twenty sixteen, and so it gets stronger in
each cycle.

Speaker 6 (01:00:59):
And that's something thing we have to address.

Speaker 5 (01:01:01):
And it is bigger than this, because I'm telling yall
some we really got to understand that it's going to
require some prayer, some understanding, and really drilling into how
is it. I mean a lot of things that are
fake that a lot of things we can disprove every day.
But you cannot google someone's father and have his actual

(01:01:21):
picture come up in every it as a black person
and still say convinced that can't be him, he must
be a white man.

Speaker 6 (01:01:31):
Well, then where is the picture of the actual white father.

Speaker 5 (01:01:34):
Nobody can produce it, but you have a critical mass
of people who believe it. That speaks to something else
more bizarre and nefarious than just being an election. We
gotta figure out what is going on to make people
believe something that actually cannot be proved. It's not even

(01:01:57):
like there's another picture out here is really the secret Father?

Speaker 6 (01:02:01):
You know that that doesn't even exist, you.

Speaker 1 (01:02:04):
Know talking about right there is literally just made up.

Speaker 5 (01:02:10):
And listen to me, because there are pictures of the
Lockness Monster, and people still don't really believe there's a
Lochnans their pictures a Bigfoot, and there's still people still
fit they're really Bigfoot. There are pictures allegedly of the
abominable Snowman. There is no picture of an alleged white
father of Kamala Harris. And I was just in my

(01:02:31):
neighborhood and a grown black man, a middle aged black man,
my age, screaming in the streets.

Speaker 6 (01:02:36):
The father's white. I know he's white. He's white.

Speaker 5 (01:02:39):
He's I mean, just literally blood curdling screaming, and I
just had to walk away. Wow, this is that that
speaks to another pathology. Now, let's be fair.

Speaker 6 (01:02:50):
To mecas a woman on this call. Let's not let's
not dismiss what we also know.

Speaker 5 (01:02:56):
We live in a society that is in innately misogynist
as hell, absolutely and particularly misogynoir. If Tamikas was running
for president, Today's well as we know who her parents are.

Speaker 6 (01:03:10):
Somebody would say, well, her parents are white and we
might be in the same situation.

Speaker 7 (01:03:14):
Are all crazy or they would at least say that
I slept my way to the top all of that,
and you know, I mean, they have so many different theories.

Speaker 4 (01:03:29):
But listen, you know, Mark, I think that we could talk.
There's so many directions to traveling. And you know that
the last few weeks and we've been sort of live
on the road. We are going to be back on
camera soon where you know, folks will be.

Speaker 1 (01:03:47):
Able to see us talking and we have to have
you back for a part.

Speaker 4 (01:03:50):
Too, just to you know, look at I think every
week and it's really every day, this whole thing shifts.
There are changes, there's new conversations, there's new things for
us to look out for if you will, you know,
And I think that's the main thing. Like for me,

(01:04:12):
today I posted on my page. It was a tweet
from Cassim Rashid, the attorney, and he talked about how
in Texas they've purged about five hundred thousand eligible voters.
In Oklahoma they've purged about one hundred and ninety three

(01:04:34):
thousand eligible voters. Nebraska is potentially changing its electoral count
to win or take all so they can go red.
Georgia wants to five to six million votes to be
counted by hand, and other red states have closed more
than one hundred thousand Poland locations in black and Latino neighborhoods.

(01:04:58):
And so I think we just got a really pay
pay attention. We've got to be focused. Every week from
now until the election. This show will be focused on
the you know, electoral politics and what's happening in this country.
I don't think there's anything that's more important than us
covering our work on the grassroots level and how it

(01:05:22):
directly is impacted by what will happen.

Speaker 1 (01:05:26):
In this election.

Speaker 4 (01:05:27):
And so we definitely need to have you back on
camera real soon so that we can talk about and
update as to where we are, look at the polling
numbers again, and also talk about whatever kind of effyree
they got going on. Because I know you love Janna Jackson,
but that was some weird old vibes that she gave

(01:05:48):
out that I don't think happened, you know, just me personally, and.

Speaker 5 (01:05:54):
I had hoped for us, you know, rekindling relationship we once.

Speaker 6 (01:05:58):
Had, but I don't know anymore. I mean, it's it is.
It is bizarre.

Speaker 5 (01:06:04):
Like I said, we can find pictures of everything else
and we can't find that, and I agree. Lastly, just
let me say that, you know, Mice, we we must.

Speaker 6 (01:06:14):
Next year will be the.

Speaker 5 (01:06:15):
Thirtieth anniversion a millionaire in March, and we took a
pledge to defend our communities, particularly our women. And I
want all the brothers to think about that. I want
all the brothers to heal what Mice has been saying.
Can we do that at the same time as we

(01:06:35):
are attacking as sister and allowing people to attack someone
who's a member of a black sorority, who attended an HBCU.

Speaker 6 (01:06:47):
All of those things.

Speaker 5 (01:06:49):
I think that's the real challenge we and the real
question we have to ask ourselves as as black men,
and in all cases we should defend black women who
are working somehow, one way or another to make a
difference in the lives of our people. So I mean,
I would just leave it there. I think we have

(01:07:10):
to fight the missag Noir. You're right, this we could
go There's so many directions for this to go into,
but this is the hour we're in and we're being
put to the test. Let's get through the next forty
some odd days, and then let's talk about what to
do beyond that to really change this country, to hold
whoever is an office accountable. Remember now, the last president

(01:07:34):
who made decisions based upon what the movement dictated was
Lyndon Johnson. And he said that he woke up every
morning he said, go and watch the movie LBJ All
the Way on HBO, HBO movie about him starring Brian Cranston,
Breaking Bad. He played LBJ Lyndon Johnson. And this first

(01:07:54):
scene in the movie opens up when he asked his staff,
what did Doctor King and Dick Gregory say about me
last night?

Speaker 6 (01:08:01):
That's how he started his day. And he responded to.

Speaker 5 (01:08:04):
That it is our problem that we've not rebuilt our
movement after it was terrorized, after our leaders were assassinated,
after all the violence perpetrated against us, we did not
still pick up and rebuild our movement so that whomever
is in office, didn't matter who is a Democrat or Republican,

(01:08:25):
they have to respond to us. That is what we
must rebuild in this country, the beloved community, the unapologetic movement,
power movement that doctor King gave his life, building and absolute.

Speaker 3 (01:08:42):
Everything you're saying is one mark. And like Tamika said,
we can sit here and go over. We definitely need
to have you back on this podcast because your brilliance,
it gives me, it settles me just a little a
little more. But I'm just very, very just concerned about
just politics in general has given me anxiety, like like

(01:09:07):
it's just it's just.

Speaker 2 (01:09:08):
All together anxiety.

Speaker 3 (01:09:09):
It's just like when you start to really just understand
the dynamics and people just put out simple things and
you understand that do we have political.

Speaker 2 (01:09:20):
Theater when we talk about the border?

Speaker 3 (01:09:22):
Right, were talking about the border, and we understand that
Trump has has told Republicans to turn down deals that
could have shut the border down, right right, you realize
that Trump has been running on the same exact border
with the same scared tactics. First of the Haitians is
the Mexicans is everybody of color is coming to kill
white people. So we got to make sure that we

(01:09:43):
seal this board, like understanding these same things over and overseeing,
and then you know, and then you see misinformation and
people are Oh, the Democrats voted against the bill that
to to make sure that the rapists and things or
you know, or or sit back to their country and
it's like, well, that happens anyway. You know, if an

(01:10:04):
immigrant rapes or kills somebody or does something they deported
out here is why we need a new law. Understanding
they making a new law so they can try to
highlight it and use it as something that to catapult
the same. So when you start understanding these things, it
becomes like, how does everybody understand what's going on? So

(01:10:27):
I've been getting anxiety dealing with you know, there's some
election and dealing with the politics of everything, and you
just seem to have a down pack. So thank you
for settling my nerves a little bit and just giving
me somebody who who knows how to articulate it and
break it down.

Speaker 2 (01:10:46):
But we definitely need to have you back on.

Speaker 6 (01:10:48):
Well, I'm just saying, I'm just saying you I have anxietyude.
Don't get me wrong. The thing is it's designed.

Speaker 5 (01:10:58):
A lot of what we're looking at now is designed
to cause a great deal of confusion.

Speaker 6 (01:11:08):
So I mean, mice, you you were you were og
like me.

Speaker 5 (01:11:11):
We we we know stuff about the world, We've been
in places we and then we talked to people right
in front of our faces. You all know, you around
people and you start thinking you crazy. Maybe I'm losing
my mind. I mean, there was a guy screaming in
the street to me yesterday trying to convince me that
Kamla Harris's father is white.

Speaker 6 (01:11:31):
Am I losing my mind?

Speaker 5 (01:11:33):
So so is you? You are not alone in that,
and that's why I'm saying there's a larger problem. But
it's also bringing out the best in others people.

Speaker 6 (01:11:41):
Y'all. We watched wonder Woman as a kid. Linda Carter
got on TV today and for the first time said
her mother was Mexican. She's old mother was an immigrant.

Speaker 5 (01:11:49):
I didn't know Linda Carter, the original white Wonder Woman
was Mexican's.

Speaker 6 (01:11:54):
A Mexican woman. She is a dreamer, She is one
of those people. Her mother immigrant here.

Speaker 5 (01:12:00):
You couldn't you couldn't say that out loud, probably back then.
You know what I'm saying, respect for her. I never
knew this wonder Woman. Okay, I'll u was watching wonder Woman.
This kid were watching wonder Woman. You know that made
the right wingmail down. Wonder Woman is a Mexican, So
you know, for every setback. We have something else that
comes forward that says, you know, a lot of people

(01:12:23):
in this country, many people are people of color and
just and I we keep saying the last thing. One
of the things when we look at the Kamala Harris's
and the Linda Carters, the three of us here, we
regular every day black folk.

Speaker 6 (01:12:36):
The world is changing.

Speaker 5 (01:12:39):
The majority of people being born in the world today
are of all kind of cultural mixtures. I was in
a restaurant the other day right here in New York
in uh near Times Square, and the young lady who
was seating us at the table, it was a delay,

(01:13:01):
so we struck up a conversation and I asked her
where she was from. She said, her father is Haitian.
Now her mother is Haitian, but her father is from Bangladesh.

Speaker 6 (01:13:14):
Now. Thirty foty years ago, you neveruld heard something like that.

Speaker 5 (01:13:17):
That just didn't happen, primarily because people weren't in places
to meet up like that.

Speaker 6 (01:13:23):
But as the world becomes more diverse, Hey, y'all, different
folks from different parts of the.

Speaker 5 (01:13:27):
World go hook up and it's not planned, it never is,
and they don't feel the same restrictions that our parents
and grandparents had to only be in one space with
one kind of person exactly like you.

Speaker 6 (01:13:43):
So you're gonna get people who were jamaking an Indian.

Speaker 5 (01:13:45):
And black all mixed together, and like Haitian and Bangladesh
and Asian and black and pretty soon all of this conversation.
And that is what people fear. That is what people
who are starting this stuff fear. They fear the blurring
of the line. And the more you blur those lines,
the more you have. With doctor Wells and doctor Francis
crest Wellsing taught us, is that sooner or later we're

(01:14:07):
going to have a world of people that will defeat
white supremacy purely via our DNA. This will be a word.
It really already is. The majority of people in the
world are people of color.

Speaker 6 (01:14:17):
But when you start.

Speaker 5 (01:14:19):
Mixing all of these different cultures together, that's not a
bad thing. It's really okay, and it leads to greater
understanding and less oppression. Why do you think there's more
empathy for the people of Palestine than there ever was.

Speaker 6 (01:14:34):
Before we had to people.

Speaker 5 (01:14:36):
Humanity had to evolve to see the Palestinians looked like me.

Speaker 6 (01:14:41):
Jesus was actually.

Speaker 5 (01:14:43):
A dark skinned African Hebrew Palestinian. We didn't understand that
twenty and thirty years ago.

Speaker 6 (01:14:50):
So the more we evolve, every round goes higher and higher.

Speaker 5 (01:14:55):
And these people see that their arguments are becoming obsolete,
and they're trying to hold onto it as long as
they hand as they can while it slips from their hands.

Speaker 1 (01:15:07):
Wow, thank you, Mark.

Speaker 4 (01:15:09):
We appreciate you so much.

Speaker 6 (01:15:12):
We in this together. We wouldn't make it without each other. Lord,
have mercy.

Speaker 3 (01:15:15):
Lord man, I'm barely making it with us, So we
should actually do it.

Speaker 5 (01:15:20):
We should do a reality show just off our phone
calls and text that would get some ratings.

Speaker 6 (01:15:25):
Stuff, y'all.

Speaker 5 (01:15:26):
Y'all they're talking about how I want to hit the audience.
They always talking about I'm brilliant. No, I'm not, because
I called them every day and also I had my owns.
I say, we're not gonna make it.

Speaker 6 (01:15:35):
They're not telling you that part.

Speaker 2 (01:15:36):
Yeah, we're not gonna tell you that far.

Speaker 1 (01:15:39):
But we we will make it. We will take no choice.

Speaker 2 (01:15:44):
Man.

Speaker 3 (01:15:44):
We we're the most resilient people on this planet Earth,
and we figure out how to survive and how to
thrive all the time.

Speaker 2 (01:15:53):
So we're gonna figure it out. But it's tough, it's rough, but.

Speaker 1 (01:15:58):
Thank you Mark, you much.

Speaker 4 (01:16:04):
So much information, I mean, just packed with the what's happening,
with the numbers, packed with you know, understanding of the
political landscape. I mean, Mark is just he he has
a lot of information.

Speaker 1 (01:16:22):
I'll tell you.

Speaker 4 (01:16:23):
I feel like the wrong people work within these campaign offices,
like these campaigns like they got the I don't know.
I won't say the wrong people, because there's some good people,
but folks like Mark Thompson.

Speaker 1 (01:16:39):
Uh and others. You know.

Speaker 4 (01:16:41):
I was just having a conversation with Brittany Packnet the
other night, and some of the things that she was saying,
I was like, yeah, they that's how they need to message,
That's what they should be saying. Like you're someone who
knows what to say, Like why do why don't you
work over there?

Speaker 1 (01:16:57):
You know?

Speaker 4 (01:16:58):
And I think, you know, Marcus one of those people
that has the type of information and the insight that
is needed because he can discuss what's happening on the streets,
he can go to the suites, he can talk about
the highest levels of government, and all of that is
so necessary in these times because a lot of our

(01:17:19):
people just really don't know that.

Speaker 2 (01:17:22):
They really don't know.

Speaker 3 (01:17:23):
So we have a jewel and Mark Thompson and you know,
it's just it's just amazing just listening to the misinformation
and just listening to people.

Speaker 2 (01:17:37):
It's frustrating.

Speaker 3 (01:17:39):
It's just really frustrating. They say you shouldn't discuss politics
and religion, and I'm really I'm starting to believe that
they are one hundred percent right. You know, you can
have people that you love and they start discussing politics
and it's just it just triggers something to you, right,

(01:17:59):
Like I literally watch it because I think that it's
so you know, important to our lives. We like they say,
if you don't do politics, politicis to do you. And
a lot of people I don't think they take it
that serious, right, I think they just they see politics

(01:18:20):
as something that's trendy.

Speaker 6 (01:18:21):
Right.

Speaker 2 (01:18:22):
If there's a politician or somebody.

Speaker 3 (01:18:26):
That people just say, hey, we're with this person because
they're cool, or you know, do we think they're cool.
Something about social media has, you know, made them look
like something that we should be following. People just go
and go along with it. Who was I having a
conversation with somebody told me that a four year old

(01:18:49):
in school was saying that I'm gonna vote for Trump
black person. They say, well, well you can't vote well,
or my parents are gonna boy, And I was just like,
where did this even come from?

Speaker 4 (01:19:02):
Right, Well, there's some kids that have a lot to
say about kam La Harrison, positive things to say about her,
Like I was one of those kids, you know, I
was a kid who was very much so in tune
with politics and civil rights and all that because my parents,

(01:19:22):
it was so much going on in my household. I
don't know if I was four, but certainly by the
time I was seven or eight, I could talk to
you about politics, I could talk to you about community stuff,
like I knew a lot.

Speaker 2 (01:19:39):
No, I get that, And I'm not saying that that's
not a thing. I'm just saying.

Speaker 3 (01:19:45):
Because you knew a lot and you were typically engaged, right,
and you were and you were taught actual things that
made a lot of sense. I don't understand where somebody
would say that we just fooling for Trump, right a kid,
I don't understand what information they're being fed. So like,
and then they'll probably say the same thing about on

(01:20:07):
the other side. So that's what I'm trying to say.
In politics is just it's such a very touchy subject,
you know, but it's very imperative that we.

Speaker 2 (01:20:19):
Focus on it. It's just it's a lot.

Speaker 3 (01:20:21):
I'm telling you, I've been having damnar headaches just thinking
about this election because what I'm very intuitive and just understanding,
like we say this all the time, voter die, and
you know what's on the line. We don't have like
and I just see it more and more coming to

(01:20:42):
fruition that this election is it's very much imperative that
we are focused on it. It's so much on these ballots,
it's so much on the line, and I think people
are not taking it as serious as they should, and
they're just thinking it's just just another right election.

Speaker 2 (01:21:01):
Oh, nothing's gonna affect me. I don't. I think this
one is just different to me.

Speaker 6 (01:21:06):
No.

Speaker 4 (01:21:07):
I think they all are important, you know, And that's
something that I'm beginning to realize. We used to say
this particular election is the most important of your life,
but I think all of them are important. And that's
something that we have to understand. People are governing our
communities and we need to make sure that they are.

Speaker 1 (01:21:25):
Accountable to us.

Speaker 4 (01:21:26):
Now, how we can how we do that better, how
we do a better job of holding them accountable. It's
something that I'm here for every day, all day. So
it's a great show.

Speaker 1 (01:21:36):
You know.

Speaker 4 (01:21:37):
That's that's a lot of information, and I hope that
people will really take the time to sit and listen.

Speaker 1 (01:21:44):
Word for word. It's almost it's almost in this particular situation.

Speaker 4 (01:21:48):
I mean, you know, I'm ready to to get off
the road, to get back home and to get in
the studio to film as soon as we can. But
I will say that listening to Mark today, I kind
of felt almost like you It was like talk radio,
like he has that voice and also that information, that

(01:22:12):
Joe Madison information, you know, Rest in Peace to the Eagle,
where you could literally sit it's like ten ten wins
and just listen.

Speaker 3 (01:22:24):
Yeah, we didn't like an encyclopedia. Man, we deal on
one of the last encyclopedia. Someone who is civically engaged,
who studied, who's been in the rooms, who understands all
the aspects. You know, he's a Jew, real Jew Thompson.

(01:22:44):
And that brings us to the end of another episode
of TMI. We appreciate all of our fans who have
been sticking with us. We know, we haven't had a
couple of visuals, but like Tabika said, we would definitely
be back in that studio.

Speaker 2 (01:22:57):
But we still need you to pay attention because information
that you're getting is vital.

Speaker 3 (01:23:03):
You know, we're bringing you people that we trust, that
we know have information that you need to hear. So
this episode, please make sure you share it with your
friends and continue to make us the number one podcasts
in the world because that's where we are. You know,
TMI and we love y'all. If you have some questions,

(01:23:24):
you know, if something that you don't understand, make sure
that you DM us at the tm MY Podcast.

Speaker 2 (01:23:30):
We'll get back to you.

Speaker 4 (01:23:32):
I don't know why I always have to tell you
it's T ANDM my Underscore Show.

Speaker 3 (01:23:36):
Okay, well tm MY Underscore Show because you know we
still we just finished transitioning from you know, our old
name to this, but tm MY Underscore Show. Make sure
that you hit us up. Let us know what you
need to know, what you don't understand. Even if you
want to have discourse, you know, I might engage you know,

(01:23:57):
because I know how important this selection is.

Speaker 2 (01:24:00):
So we appreciate your all.

Speaker 3 (01:24:02):
I'm not gonna always be right to make it the
marriages and I can always be wrong, but we will
both always and I mean always, be authentic peace,