May 18, 2023 • 48 mins
Devin and Carolina excitedly jump into some excellent listener submitted topics such as jealousy in relationships, friendship breakups, being taken for granted, deserving certainty, boundaries (do they exist?) and of course and above all else VANDERPUMP RULES!
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Oh, hello, and welcome to True Romance. This is Carolina
Barlow and this is Devin Leary. You guys sent in
(00:22):
some topics, which really, every time someone sends in a topic,
it makes me happy.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
It brings a smile to my face.
Speaker 1 (00:28):
I get so excited the fact that anyone wants to
hear us talk about anything is truly a surprise and
a privilege. Because my new mantra is, you don't have
to speak. I'm in a professional environment where I can
speak sometimes and I don't have to. Silence is an option.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
Silence is always an option. But silence is also violence
and a lot of it. That is also true.
Speaker 3 (00:49):
So first of all, we got recommendations talk about Milf Manner,
talk about maths, merrit at First Sight season ten. The
thing about Milf Manner is I couldn't handle that and
I was too disturbed.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
Some things are too violent that emotionally.
Speaker 3 (01:05):
On my TV right now in the background is ninety
Day Fiance Before the ninety Day is season five, which
I've already seen and I'm rewatching.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
Yeah, if Milk Manner is too much for Devn, that
says a lot because if I know Devin, I know
that she has a high tolerance.
Speaker 3 (01:22):
So Married at First Sight season ten. I'm sorry, but
I'm on season fourteen. I'm like the only person alive
who watches Married at First Site in real time. Like
I watch the current season and everyone else is like
still the amount of time. Someone's like, oh yeah, I'm
watching the most current season and I'm like, what season,
and they're like twelve because that's the most recent one
on Netflix.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
It's like, sorry, keep up.
Speaker 3 (01:43):
So then we have someone wrote in and said Taylor
Swift and Marty Healy, which was a pat total power
move to call him Marty, but of.
Speaker 1 (01:54):
Course they're referencing Matt Healy. He is the lead singer
of the nineteen seventy five a band Win which I
do not know one lyric, one song. All I know
is that the lead singer is really hot and makes
out with his fans sometimes.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
I almost hide away. Oh well, you're on You're wrong.
Speaker 3 (02:12):
No.
Speaker 1 (02:12):
I think he's like Timmy Shallamy hot where I'm like,
we wouldn't fit physically with each other because I'm about
approximately four feet taller than him and about i would
say one hundred pounds heavier than him.
Speaker 2 (02:23):
But he is someone is tall too.
Speaker 1 (02:25):
Taylor is tall too, but she's modeled like build and
I think that I think that this is a rebound.
I think we can all safely say that.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
It's a getaway car. And I also think.
Speaker 1 (02:37):
That I'm a little bit relieved swifties, don't come after me, don't.
Speaker 2 (02:42):
Dox me that her and Joe are over.
Speaker 1 (02:44):
Joe was about as interesting as a piece of ham
that was left out on the curb for a while
and turned white.
Speaker 2 (02:52):
He just looked asleep, like dead behind the eyes. I
think there's more to the story with Joe that we
don't know.
Speaker 3 (02:58):
I agree. Friend of the podjast Seekenevski had a really
interesting take on this, which is that we all want
to believe in the Kaylor and the Galer theories because
we want.
Speaker 2 (03:10):
Her to be Taylor. That's what I'm gonna name my
first child.
Speaker 3 (03:15):
We want her to be more Kaylor, Gaylor Barlow Galor Barlow.
Speaker 2 (03:22):
You say with an Italian accent.
Speaker 3 (03:32):
No, but like we want her to be more interesting,
and in reality, she's just a girl like me, Devin
Hunter Leary. She like gets into these relationships with these
semi toxic men and like completely changes her personality for them,
and then.
Speaker 1 (03:43):
Yes, yes, yes, yes, her her zip code we no
one forgets the house she bought in Rhode Island to
be close to the Kennedy teenager.
Speaker 2 (03:50):
Yes. And then she, like.
Speaker 3 (03:54):
Jesse was saying, like, she starts dating Joe. She moves
to the lakes and she starts reading Keats And I'm like, yeah, wow,
I start dating someone and start doing learning about dungeons
and dragons and like dressing and cosplay. Then I start
dating someone else, and well, I'm trying to think, Oh, well,
(04:15):
when I dated Zach, I signed up for two half marathons.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
Did I Did I attend either of them?
Speaker 3 (04:20):
No?
Speaker 1 (04:20):
But you know, I'm you know that costs some money too.
I completely identify with this clearly.
Speaker 3 (04:26):
I I yeah, so she she and she jumps too
quickly into these things, which I also do. And hold on,
I'm getting a phone call, not to brag. She jumps
really quickly into these things and then they fall apart,
which this is what I'll say, though, this is what
(04:47):
I'll say. And thinking about this, I go on Twitter
the other day I see an article about the Jonas
brothers new album is a love letter to their wives.
Speaker 2 (04:58):
So was the last one?
Speaker 3 (05:00):
First of all, Second of all, so nobody wants that.
I don't want to hear someone's love letter to their
wife at all. I can attend my parents' anniversary celebration
if I want that, and I don't want that. Okay,
I want turmoil, I want drama, I want getaway car,
I want folklore. I want this is me trying. I
want all too well. So when I watched Taylor get
(05:24):
out of something so quickly with Joe and into something
so quickly with Maddy Healy, who has proven himself to
be toxic a few years ago, why oh, because.
Speaker 2 (05:33):
So he did an interview.
Speaker 3 (05:35):
So okay, so they met when they were twenty five,
and people say Cardigan is about him, and like he
there was like rumors that she went to his show,
she wore a nineteen seventy five after that, Yeah, and
then he in an interview said that he would never
date Taylor Swift because that would be emasculating because she's
like so successful. God, and then people were like, oh,
(06:00):
like you're misogynistic. And then he kind of like took
it back and was like, oh, I didn't mean that,
but whatever, Like I can just tell he's he doesn't
it track Like you're like, oh, you think you're like
better than her. By the way, didn't she learn from
your indie record that's much cooler than mine?
Speaker 2 (06:17):
But that being said, did I ever learn No? Do
have we ever learned anything based off experience with men?
Absolutely not.
Speaker 1 (06:23):
I this is okay, this is waking me up to
a few things. A. I think she's attracted to men
who have an air of aloofness. She is like the
only guy she's dated who, by the way, I have
heard rumors that he was ready to marry her, and
who matched her energy level? Was I'm sorry to say,
(06:44):
Tom Hidleston.
Speaker 2 (06:45):
Oh, I thought you were gonna say Calvin Harris.
Speaker 1 (06:48):
Sure him as well, but Tom Hidleston I heard, like
thought he was going to marry her.
Speaker 2 (06:52):
And he was like a door. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:56):
And Taylor is like what we love about her, she's
so since and she's even said it in her NYU
commencement speech.
Speaker 2 (07:03):
She said, like, embrace the cringe, totally embrace the cringe.
Speaker 1 (07:07):
And so she is dating people who do not do
that though, and Matt, really I don't like yes, And
then she has to act cool and it says if
in her relationships she is doing the thing that she's
had to do with the public, which is like court
the public into knowing that she is cool and relevant,
et cetera, because we're just famously so hard on women,
(07:28):
which if you want to know more about, you can
watch Miss Americana on Netflix streaming now. So I don't
like that he is known for his celebrity rather than
his music, and I think that he loves that. I
think he loves attention. I mean, like, you know, hot
take rockstar loves attention. But him making out with his
(07:50):
fans a I would kill to do that. Like, yeah,
he looks like at the very least a good kisser,
but b I'm like, you are not being really known
for your music, so you're going for stunts and that
also I mean talk about cringe.
Speaker 2 (08:03):
That's kind of cringe.
Speaker 3 (08:04):
And also like, are you receiving and spreading the herpes virus?
Speaker 2 (08:09):
I don't know the herpes virus. I think this is
bound to burn.
Speaker 3 (08:17):
And I'm kind of into that he's been attending her shows.
But what I love, What I love is how fiercely
the Swift the Swifty community like hates him for her,
Like at the amount of tiktoks I've seen that are
like disgusted by him, and they're like he's not good enough.
Speaker 2 (08:34):
And people are like I don't understand.
Speaker 3 (08:35):
Like someone who wrote into was like I don't understand,
Like why is Gigi Hadid and Phoebe Bridger is nice
to him?
Speaker 2 (08:41):
Like he's awful, he doesn't deserve it?
Speaker 3 (08:42):
So funny, and I think we can all relate to
that as friends.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
I don't know you know that I can relate to yeah,
Like have you ever disapproved of anyone I've dated? Name one,
name one or six? It is so okay.
Speaker 1 (08:57):
This is what I'll say, though, Why are swifties so
obsessed with Joe? Like like when I get it, I
don't get it to send it to you. Someone made
a meme of an old woman in a cage and said,
I'm not letting my grandmother out until Joe and Taylor
get back.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
I don't get it. No, I don't understand at all.
Speaker 3 (09:13):
There's been no information, and I want her to, like,
I want her to bring to light which songs are
really about him, because I've always thought that. I'm like,
there's so many songs that are about him we don't
know about. She needs to be honest about that now
because I want to know, Like did he cheat on
her to chea cheat on him?
Speaker 2 (09:30):
Who was ellisit a Ferris who was secret? We need
an Oprah interview, We need an Oprah interview.
Speaker 3 (09:35):
The ways that he's toxic could potentially at least make
him more interesting like Jake Jill and hallme like, of
course he's awful for her, But in some ways, I'm like, wait,
I'm kind of like into the back and forth, like
I knew you were trouble, Like, oh my god, that's
hot in a way, like.
Speaker 1 (09:48):
I thought that was it. That's about Harry. But continue,
she read a book sometimes and do your research.
Speaker 2 (09:52):
Baby.
Speaker 3 (09:54):
Well, the thing is, the thing is, I don't know
what the thing is, but I'll.
Speaker 1 (10:01):
Say this, Taylor and Pete next, can you imagine I
don't think she would do that. I don't think she
would touch it with a ten football.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
But no, I think like I'm kind of over Pete. Honestly,
I know I am too.
Speaker 1 (10:13):
I hope you just I hope he just stays with
this girl so we can we can. I don't need
any more headlines.
Speaker 2 (10:18):
You know.
Speaker 1 (10:19):
It was like when I was done with Don't Worry
Darling Drama, I'm like, I'm done.
Speaker 2 (10:22):
I think I'm done.
Speaker 3 (10:24):
And also I saw him do an interview where he's like, Okay,
I'm in my twenties, like I date a lot, like
it's actually not weird, And I'm like, no, I have
been you where I like date a million people, Like
I said, really fast, and like what and people think
it's weird, Like even though I'm not famous, people are like,
that's weird.
Speaker 2 (10:40):
Why are you in so many relationships?
Speaker 1 (10:43):
And why do you get a tattoo for every single
relationship and virtually get married to this person?
Speaker 2 (10:47):
That is the weird part.
Speaker 1 (10:48):
That is what you can't get four tattoos for Kim Kardashian,
including all of her children's initials. I remember when I
told you that, Yeah, Like why do people have to
be this way? Like you don't have to. It's like
the silence is an option. Not getting a tattoo that
says Jasmine and Aladdin is an option. Not branding your
name with the word branding your body with the name
Kim is an option.
Speaker 2 (11:08):
I know. Imagine.
Speaker 3 (11:10):
I'm like, I know, lift up my arm and I
have all of Kim's kids tattooed on.
Speaker 2 (11:14):
You're like, I know, I wish I knew that that
was an.
Speaker 3 (11:16):
Option Chicago anyway.
Speaker 1 (11:20):
So that's what we think about Taylor and Maddie and I,
and we hope for more clarity, like the fact that
Blake Lively and Ryan Reynolds unfollowed Joe. I need more
information on that, actually, and so we need more clues.
Speaker 2 (11:34):
I look.
Speaker 1 (11:35):
I look forward to future Easter eggs that are so obvious.
I look forward to more music videos. I love the
fact that she is not like I know, Taylor is
not gonna let us down, like she she can only
tolerate so much privacy on her personal life. And I
don't think she liked that about him too, Like you know,
if she did, if they did in fact get married,
(11:55):
you know that she wanted a Vogue spread, like you
know that she wanted all of that and he took
that away from her, which is, as Ramona said to Bethany,
not supporting other women.
Speaker 2 (12:04):
It's also like, again I relate to her.
Speaker 3 (12:06):
She has that song paper Rings, where it's like I
would marry you with paper rings, I don't care. It's
like I've done that in relationships where I'm like, I
don't even care, like when I was.
Speaker 1 (12:15):
Dating my Well, we'll always forget, I mean, well, that
we'll always forget. We'll always forget when you wanted to
get married in Vegas, like very badly, to the point
of being in a bad mood.
Speaker 2 (12:23):
I know.
Speaker 3 (12:24):
And also with that same person that he was like
wanted a small wedding or something, and I was like same,
like I could get married at city Hall. We all
know that I want a big wedding. I want attention.
I want people watching me walk down the aisle. I
want people crying for me. I want toasts like husband
and crying husband ha personal vowls. I this is making
(12:46):
me so angry. It's like even because my most recent
relationship he said that he wouldn't do vows for me,
like if we got married.
Speaker 2 (12:56):
So I d like, I'm sorry, but I a minimum.
Speaker 3 (13:00):
Every single person I've been with, I could write the most.
Speaker 2 (13:04):
I know.
Speaker 3 (13:04):
I could write the most beautiful, poetic things because I
did for every birthday, anniversary, whatever, these cards that are
like so.
Speaker 2 (13:11):
Heartfelt, and I'm like, I know that.
Speaker 3 (13:16):
Those things can be written about me, like the fact
that no one this is honestly I.
Speaker 2 (13:20):
Could write your vows.
Speaker 1 (13:21):
I could write I could literally write you the most
beautiful vows, and that should be of the friend vows.
I mean, so I could argue that, like, sometimes we
love our friends just as much as our esos, but
your husband should that that's the bare minimum. If Tom
Schwartz can write Katie Maloney vows that make him cry
and he's the same person who truly likes pouring drinks
(13:44):
on women, then yes, your boyfriend can write you vows
again bare minimum.
Speaker 3 (13:49):
But also I'm like, it's me, like, there's so much
to be said about me, but they're like so much
to be said.
Speaker 2 (13:56):
And also I'm like small ways, perfect hits. I don't know,
but this was.
Speaker 3 (14:01):
The thing too, is like I'm like the the fact
that I have been told by a significant other that
it's crazy for me to think that someone should be
certain about marrying me.
Speaker 1 (14:13):
Well, since that was literally the precipitated my last breakup,
those words exactly that were said to you. Well, when
I said to my ex, I deserve someone who's certain
about me and he said, you're right, Yeah, that was equivalent.
Speaker 2 (14:31):
This is sickening, This is sickening, This is.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
Sickening, and that were yeah, bad vows. I would not
want those to be my vows at my wedding. I
think that we deserve people who live where are they?
Speaker 2 (14:45):
Can these people show themselves?
Speaker 1 (14:47):
I don't know, I really don't, but I also think that,
like if I'm really honest with myself and you do
not have to feel the same way, I'm speaking purely
for myself. I'm not ready for that person yet to
get very vulnerable and I like could cry talking about this.
I feel like it sounds so intense, but I feel
like my heart is like so closed since my life.
Speaker 2 (15:09):
I love you, and I.
Speaker 1 (15:11):
Just feel like I'm like repulsed by like the idea
of like opening it again right now.
Speaker 3 (15:17):
I just feel like I am so terrified of being
hurt again.
Speaker 2 (15:27):
Hot. Yeah, I know what you mean.
Speaker 3 (15:30):
I don't have any advice for this because I don't
know what the right way is to be. But I'm
just really sorry that you feel that way because it's
it sounds so painful, and I think you have such
a beautiful heart that I think should be shared with
as many people as possible.
Speaker 1 (15:45):
I think it's just time, Like I think I apologize
to our listeners who can't handle women crying, and if
there are listeners and no listeners like that they love it,
I think it's time. I mean meaning that I think
time is the answer and is the only answer. Unfortunately,
I think I'm on right and I'm on hinge, and
(16:08):
I'm not obsessing about either. I'm just existing on them
and not taking them down, which is like a huge
step for me. And I think I'm trying to just
constantly remind myself of what I deserve, yes, which is
hard when you're not actively getting it, because you feel like,
am I delusional? Like don't I deserve this even though it's.
Speaker 2 (16:27):
Not from me?
Speaker 1 (16:29):
Yes, I don't even know how I got to this
place in this episode and like what brought me here?
But yeah, basically wanting someone, not feeling ready for someone,
wouldn't know what to do if I liked someone, Like
I met someone recently who I like was kind of like, oh,
this could be something, and he was so earnestly nice
(16:50):
and funny and fun but like eager and not playing
cool at all, which, like I know, is both of
our pet peeves when anyone is like trying to play cool,
Like he was just like yeah, hey, and like so
eager and so nice and the kind of person again
who the highest compliment I can pay a guy, or
rather a great barometer I feel like to suss out
a guy's character is whether or not you would be
(17:11):
excited to introduce him to your friends. Yes, if you're
like he's fine and like I really like him, Like,
that's one thing. And I also don't think that you should.
It shouldn't be if my friends don't like him, I
have to break up with him, because I've done that too.
And I don't think that like is necessarily a good
thing or like how you should make a decision. But
(17:32):
I do think you should want to include him in
your friend group because that means, like you're comfortable with him.
You know, you guys share probably some of the same values.
I mean the best example of this is Sex in
the City and when she dates who's the Russian artist
and he is like so weird to all of her
friends and like doesn't mesh well with them because they're
(17:53):
like Samantha's like joking about vibrators and he can't handle it.
Speaker 2 (17:56):
Yeah, you don't want that.
Speaker 1 (17:58):
You don't want that, but even no, that like, oh wow,
there's a guy like this that exists, and he's like
successful and smart and also like kind and humble and funny.
I was like, I'm not going to put any energy
into making this happen, mainly because like I met him
through work and that felt unprofessional, but also because I'm like,
I'm not ready for that in my life right now.
Speaker 2 (18:18):
But will you ever be? I don't know, I don't know,
like I don't know.
Speaker 1 (18:23):
I feel like, yes I will, but it feels like
I have a few obstacles that feel currently insurmountable. But
I'm choosing to be hopeful and focus on things that
I am ready for right now.
Speaker 2 (18:38):
Does that make sense? That makes sense? But I'll keep
you guys posted. I don't want to be sad.
Speaker 1 (18:44):
One of the reasons I love this podcast is because
it's not about like being like depressed. It's about like
how to to me at least, and I hope this
is what it is to our listeners. It's how it's
about how do I become happy with a love life?
Because I want to be happy with a love life.
Speaker 2 (18:57):
I thought it was about reality TV. No, don't kidding, No,
I listen.
Speaker 3 (19:06):
I think it's also about like we don't know anything
about anything, and true, I think that's the most authentic
way to be is just to be like we're figuring
it out.
Speaker 1 (19:17):
I agree, Oh, Okay, to move on. Someone requested, please
get your charts read by Ali and report back.
Speaker 2 (19:34):
I have contacted her. I was gonna contact her yesterday. Okay.
Speaker 1 (19:38):
Well, I'm so glad we made contact. We'll talk to
our producer as well about seeing to if she would
be interested in getting on the pod.
Speaker 2 (19:45):
We're huge Alley fans.
Speaker 1 (19:47):
She is an example of listening to that little voice
inside of you that says, maybe it's weird. If you
see a man and his girlfriend's friend dancing at the
abbey at two am, maybe that's weird.
Speaker 2 (19:56):
Maybe that's something to flag. That's something to flag big time.
So we really love Ali and all sixty pounds of her.
She's a part of history. Should we talk friend breakups briefly? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (20:08):
I don't really have any wise words to say about this,
Like this is something I'm struggling with as an adult,
is like growing out of friendships. And the thing is,
I'm reading this book step Bound. It's not about me, really,
this is something that's really hard for me in adulthood.
Speaker 2 (20:27):
Is like that one.
Speaker 3 (20:29):
Away from a podcast you feel like you have nothing
in common with them anymore, and it's just no. But
this book set boundaries find piece by Nedric Glover tuab.
Speaker 1 (20:42):
I wish that we could get in an airplane and
throw copies out onto the United States, across across this
great nation.
Speaker 3 (20:49):
But the thing is, like she talks about with friend
separation or like family separation specifically, like setting a clear
boundary versus ghosting, and she's like, letting something fade out
is actually like passive, and I'm like, okay. That being said,
I kind of think I would rather someone just like
clearly distance themselves from me than to be like, hey.
Speaker 2 (21:09):
Devin, like I don't really want to be your friend anymore. Yeah,
I'm okay.
Speaker 3 (21:13):
I don't need someone to tell me why they don't
want to be my friend anymore. They can just like
calmly be on their way.
Speaker 2 (21:17):
I have.
Speaker 1 (21:19):
I've gone through a version of this that was really
interesting because it was a time when I was really young,
and I encourage growth at all ages. But you know,
when I stopped partying, I mean, I still like going out,
but when I stopped blacking out, I should say there
were friendships that I realized didn't have a lot of
(21:39):
substance besides going out, getting wasted and trying to have sex.
And so I really do need to share values with someone,
and I need to feel safe with someone, and I
need to trust someone for me to share my life
with them in any capacity, not just romantically. And so
I have realized that time i'ms you know, for instance,
(22:01):
I was super, I was with the I was with
a girl who I used to party with, and I was,
you know, not doing that anymore. But she wanted to
hang out and I was staying in my mom's apartment
at the time. My mom's apartment had a pool and
we were to go lounge by the pool together. We
went to a grocery store beforehand, a small grocery store.
Speaker 3 (22:17):
We're not talking bonds, we're not talking whole food. It's
like a neighborhood grocery store. And she stole something as
we were leaving, and I was.
Speaker 1 (22:25):
Like, I'm not don't get me wrong, I'm not like
one of those people who's like, obey the law and
respect fellow officers. No, but I'm like, you're stealing from
a small business. That is not something I'm okay with. Yeah,
And I don't understand you, and I don't trust you now,
and I don't want you around. If you were like
stealing from Target, I might be like, that's honestly weird,
(22:46):
since I know you have money to afford that, and
I think that's like a little sketchy, but I stealing
from a small business is like especially egregious. Yeah, And
it's just one of those reminders of like, oh, we
live differently. We live very differently, and I don't trust
you as much as I used to. And Devin and
I talked, you know, today about feeling safe to share
(23:09):
a lot about our lives with someone and we need
to trust that they will reciprocate that. So I'm grateful
that I have friends that I can go back. I
have it back and forth with, but I'm cautious not
to get close to people, and I feel like that's
not a possibility. I can totally have shallow friendships. And
I don't even mean shallow in a bad way. I
mean like work friendships. Shout out to my coworkers listen
(23:30):
to the podcast. No, I mean they actually know what
just as much due to the fact that I took
oxycotton because of a surgery. I did send them all
pictures in my hand. But I mean acquaintances through work relationships,
Like it's okay, I don't need to get very close
to everyone. They can be a level of friendship. But
friends who I'm suddenly like I don't agree with the
(23:50):
way that you go through the world and I don't
have to force things based on prior connection.
Speaker 3 (23:58):
Well, I am gonna just turn this into a podcast
where we quote Nedra Glover toab but she on her
Instagram she posted this thing called six types of friends
to stay close to and I really liked it.
Speaker 2 (24:10):
Oh my god, I saw that and I loved it
so much.
Speaker 3 (24:13):
Stay close to friends who don't require constant contact and
embrace you with open arms when you connect. Life is busy.
Being connected to someone who understands that matters. Stay close
to friends who allow you to be authentic without challenging
you to be anything other than what you are. This
has been really big for me this year, like the
feeling of can I be truly authentic with what I'm
(24:35):
going through with this person right now? Or am I
scared of judgment or control. It's special to have a
relationship with someone who gets you when there are differences
between you and them. Stay close to friends who have
healthy boundaries. Seeing someone place boundaries is inspirational. Strong agree,
but also like do I know anyone with healthy boundaries?
I'm not sure, and can encourage you to build healthier boundaries.
(24:57):
Stay close to friends who don't shut down when you
bring up top topics. That's actually true, especially right before
this podcast, when I brought up to Carolina that the
company Wayfair is sex trafficking missing children through dressers and
naming the dressers after those missing children. And it's a
tough topic, and I brought it up in Carolina completely
(25:18):
shut it down.
Speaker 2 (25:19):
I said, next, stay close to friends.
Speaker 3 (25:21):
Who delicately hold you accountable. Having people who want the
best for you is life changing. Okay, So this is
an interesting one because I actually had a friend be
honest with me that I was being annoying recently. Who
oh I in no world would I say, who.
Speaker 2 (25:40):
This bothers me? I'm keep me up at night.
Speaker 3 (25:42):
I'm like, I'm like, oh this person WHI on the podcast?
Speaker 2 (25:47):
No, just a couple of friends. I actually asked. I
was like, am I being annoying about my breakup?
Speaker 3 (25:51):
Like?
Speaker 2 (25:51):
Am I talking about it too much? Am I like.
Speaker 3 (25:53):
Being like obsessive about it? And they were like it's
a lot. And I was like okay, And then I've
really thought about that since then, and I I've thought
like is it necessary, because this is something I really
struggle with, like oversharing, because I don't have a strong
enough sense of self to like regulate my own problems
on my own. I need like everyone's opinion. So I've
been trying to think, like do I need to share
this or am I just like filling space or am
(26:15):
I just like afraid? So I want people to validate
what I'm doing. And it was really helpful to me
that being said, I have friends who there's stuff that
I want to be honest with them about because I'm
like right, and I'm.
Speaker 1 (26:28):
Like could I actually like it causes like a cold
rift between people when someone doesn't feel safe to open up.
And I think that, like I've appreciated that more this
year as well.
Speaker 2 (26:39):
But I think that is something in you and I's friendship.
Speaker 3 (26:42):
I've always been able to be completely honest with you
when I have a problem with you. That's true, And
I'm gonna say right now, I have a huge problem
with you. No I'm kidding, but like you always have
been receptive and I feel like you've been able to
communicate with me and I haven't bet I'm like, and
I haven't really been receptive, but I've worked through it
(27:02):
in my own way and whatever. We've always been able
to grow because we like communicate with each other. But
I have some friendships where I'm like, could I be
honest with that person about what bothers me? Like, I'm
not sure, and that prevents closeness.
Speaker 1 (27:14):
That prevents closeness, And it's also what I imagine a marriage
to be like, where it's like I have to get
vulnerable and grow with you or else we're in trouble,
do you know what I mean? And I think I've
been in relationships where that wasn't really an option or
or there was not a willingness on and I'll include
myself in it on either side to change. And that's
that's a problem I think that I have.
Speaker 2 (27:36):
And I'm sure you'll understand this.
Speaker 1 (27:38):
I in that last post, I think I've wanted better
for people in a way that's almost bullish, because I
don't want I As I've said multiple times on this pod,
there's no man that I think is good enough for
my friends. And I don't mean that being like girls
are queens, Like, I don't mean it that way. I
just really truly believe I have some of the funny, brightest, kindest,
(28:01):
most interesting like people who have champion darkness and like
gotten through it and like really had to look at
themselves in ways that are like both beautiful and transformational.
I am so proud of my friends and like think
that they're some of the most amazing people I've ever met.
Speaker 2 (28:17):
I really do. And they're mostly female. It's hard for.
Speaker 1 (28:21):
Me to accept them dating anyone who is treating them differently.
It makes me insane, and that is like a self
centered way to look at it.
Speaker 2 (28:29):
I should just be like, that's a you problem. Yeah,
I should just.
Speaker 1 (28:33):
Be like, they're dating someone, period, and like, I wonder
how that's going. I don't have to set anyone's life up,
and I, as I've said earlier on the spot, I'm
struggling to even set my own romantic life up. So
it's very easy from that place when you're not dating anyone,
to be like and they shouldn't date this guy because
he's an asshole. Like it's easy to be like that
(28:54):
instead of like, meeting someone is really hard and true
love is hard to find, and if you feel like
you found a connect, like it, it doesn't make it
easier for someone to be like, well he sucks. It's like, yeah,
well you have no idea like the loneliness I've been
living with, So yeah, I definitely understand. I think it's
good to want the best for your friends, and I
also think that it's with caution, like in terms of
(29:17):
like thinking you know what the best is?
Speaker 3 (29:20):
The last slide in Nedra's thing is stay close to
friends who show up to support you. Taking the time
to be present is loving. And I think like I've
also struggled with like and I've like directly affected friendships
by like giving honest opinions about relationships when they're not.
Speaker 2 (29:35):
Asking for I think that's the thing.
Speaker 3 (29:36):
It's like my most recent example of being like, am
I being annoying about my breakup? It's like I was asking,
and sometimes I'm asking without really wanting an answer. But
like when I've had the experience of like sharing what
I'm going through and then receiving like an opinion about
like what I should do, it feels like the person's
not being present or like receiving like a judgment or like,
I don't know, it just feels like wait, are you
listening or are you like thinking that I need to
(29:58):
like change my life, and I think it's a struggle.
But like for me, most of the time, I just
want someone to like listen and be like I love
you anyway.
Speaker 2 (30:07):
Right, And also like every relationship is different.
Speaker 3 (30:10):
And I've also like I've I've been really surprised by
friends relationships that in the beginning I was like, wait what,
And now I'm like, wow, I really admire what you
guys have gotten through together and like that's really cool.
And also like the things I want are clearly different
than like what other people want, Like I have no
idea what works for people, and I don't even know
(30:30):
what works for me. But I've definitely fallen into that
before where I'm like he's not good enough, like it,
I'm scared, you know, But it's all just like fear.
Speaker 2 (30:38):
It's fear.
Speaker 1 (30:39):
And it's also like not jealousy, but the kind of
thing of like you don't deserve to be close to
this person I love. It's a level of protectiveness that
is boundaryless. And I think that listening is a really
profound thing to do that I struggle with. And I
think that you have been really good about listening to
me rant and just nodding and true listening, and that
(31:00):
alone is healing.
Speaker 2 (31:01):
And I don't think we know, like I don't.
Speaker 1 (31:03):
I can't tell you why, but I think that it
is really helpful for someone to fully absorb what you're
going through. I think that's helpful for you to process that.
I think you can grow out of friendships and that
doesn't mean the experience was less valuable. There's friendships that
sometimes I'm like, maybe I should reconnect with this person
and it's sort of like why I know, And that's okay,
(31:24):
Like we had fun. Our lifestyles don't suit each other anymore,
and that's okay. You know, I kind of can han.
I can do friendships and relationships like I used to
be able to, like drink where I want to just
like absorb someone or I really like someone and get
obsessed with them, and that's just not like really necessarily
a way to live. You can have like a few
close friends, which I do, and appreciate someone so much
(31:46):
and they don't have to be everything to you. Let's
move on to one of my favorite topics, jealousy and
female friendships. Your significant other has yep, so I want
to say something about jealousy that has is very helpful
(32:08):
to me. I expressed my therapist I was jealous of
this girl. And my therapist said, look at dogs, and
I said, okay, I do all the time. But she said,
have you seen how they play? Jealousy is a part
of primal animal fabric. Like my dog will hold a
bone and let my other dog bark at it and
clearly gets a rise out of it, and that's fun
(32:30):
for her. And jealousy is clear and it's a game,
but it's also real, and looking at it that way
really helps me be less judgmental and less urgent about myself,
and I can be more like, oh, there it is,
there's my jealousy again. Jealousy is popping up. Okay, this
person has financial success. I want Oh this person just
had an article in deadline. I want to be in deadline.
(32:51):
And instead of judging that or feeling bad about myself
or feeling that way, I'll just let it happen. Yeah,
I'm competitive, Yeah I'm jealous. I don't have to watch myself.
Speaker 2 (33:02):
I don't.
Speaker 3 (33:02):
That doesn't have to lead to obsession anymore. That can
just exist and I can trust that time will take
that away too. I've been jealous of people that I
don't think about.
Speaker 1 (33:11):
Anymore that I used to think about all the time, Like,
can I trust that time happens and that I will,
you know, eventually get over that.
Speaker 3 (33:17):
Well, I think it's hard in relationships to not act
or for me, like, to not act on it.
Speaker 2 (33:22):
Relationships are a different thing.
Speaker 1 (33:23):
I'm talking about being single right now, But in terms
of relationships and a girl being around that you're jealous
of I have, I'll say, for me personally, it usually
speaks to the health of the relationship in what sense,
In the sense that I have been in relationships where girls,
and I'll say this objectively who are hotter than me
have been mad at me because they have a crush
(33:45):
on my boyfriend. I felt no fear, anger, resentment towards
these people. I was kind of like, oh weird, But
I was so trusting of my boyfriend's feelings of me.
I did not feel like I need a monitor this.
I didn't feel like, God, he wants to be to
be skinny like them, he wants me to tan or
(34:05):
blonde like them. I didn't feel any of that because
I just trusted that this person really cared about me.
I have also been in relationships where, for instance, I've
heard like, oh, by the way, your boyfriend was flirting
with this girl at a bar, and I've known that
to be true. I feel like I was evolved enough
at that point to hate her. I mean, sorry, I
absolutely despise her, but at the same time, like understand
(34:26):
that that feeling was misplaced and that who I was
really angry at was him, and that like I needed
to talk to him about whether I could trust him
or not. I think that the most important thing if
you are feeling jealous of a female significant other is
estimating whether you trust your partner or not. And if
you do, and if you're like, Okay, I actually really
trust him. I trust that he loves me, I trust
(34:48):
that he cares about me, then I would say, like,
you can maybe let yourself be jealous or but try
to rest in that knowledge. If you feel like this
is someone who picks at me, who starts fight out
it nowhere, who complains because he says I don't buy
batteries for the house, I of course I'm talking about
Tom Sandoval then, and he has a female best friend,
(35:09):
then I would be okay with saying something's not right,
and I'd say, the worst thing that can happen in
these situations is your partner gaslighting you, like honestly, And
I'm speaking of course of someone who in their Instagram
bio says a feminist who loves men. Some people women
male otherwise can be awful. They can like try to
hook up with someone's boyfriend. They can try to have
(35:30):
emotional affairs with someone's boyfriend. People have the capacity to
be unkind, to be wildly unkind, unempathetic, not consider others.
But it really is about if your partner is seeing
that and acknowledging that pain to you or not.
Speaker 2 (35:46):
Yeah, this is a tough one.
Speaker 3 (35:48):
I have had the direct experience of like someone hitting
on my boyfriend and expressing feelings for them and like trying,
like you said, to start something with them when I
was dating them. And then I have also had the
experience of, like, I think I have the capacity to,
no matter what's going on in the relationship, like choose
(36:09):
something like this to fixate on, because whether I'm like
trying to avoid looking at other aspects of the relationship,
or I'm just like I'm afraid to lose this person,
so I'm just gonna choose this thing and like it's
like in reality and some of these situations, I know
that the person I was with like had no intention
of doing anything inappropriate, but I like chose to be like, well,
this is disrespectful and it shouldn't be happening NonStop, and
(36:31):
it was kind of like a waste of time. And
I also had this weird obsession with like this is
disrespectful and like I if I ever meet this girl,
like I'm not going to be.
Speaker 2 (36:41):
Nice to her.
Speaker 3 (36:42):
And I had a conversation with a friend about that
once and my friend was like why, like why would
you ever not want to be nice to someone?
Speaker 2 (36:48):
And I was like that's so true.
Speaker 3 (36:49):
Like it's actually like way more like aspirational to just
like be nice to everyone and like have an open
mind because you're gonna get proven. Like as Kelly Clarkson
once said, if someone doesn't love you and is like
gonna cheat on you, like you will find out you
don't have to like investigate, like you will find out
that that person doesn't feel the way you do. And
I did always find that out, and it didn't matter
(37:11):
how much time I spent looking for like, oh, he
doesn't care enough about me, because like it's actually kind
of funny in retrospect, in these situations, it's like, yeah,
I found out this person didn't feel the same way
I did and wasn't as like devoted to me as
I was to them, And it was completely regardless of
these little situations that I ass over control. It's like, yeah,
like that was just a waste of time.
Speaker 1 (37:32):
It's it's in regards to the health of your relationship,
it really is, and and also in regards to how
your partner handles Itcause if someone loves the attention despite
how that makes you feel, that is a red flag
to make that big red flag, because it's saying if
a guy was flirting with me and I could tell
it hurt my ex's feelings. Like a lot of people,
(37:53):
myself included, are human enough to like our our partners
feeling jealous or like kind of like excited by the
fact that, like, oh my god, you really like me.
Speaker 2 (38:02):
You don't want any other guy to be with me,
Like that's cool.
Speaker 1 (38:04):
I like that that that estimates how much you care
about me. I would never want someone I love to
feel bad, and if I am looking for that, then
I need to again look at the relationship and like
acknowledge that, like maybe I need validation so much that
I'm willing for someone else to suffer for that, and
that's not okay.
Speaker 3 (38:23):
Right, And also like it's like, yeah, it should be
as simple as like, oh, this makes me uncomfortable. Okay,
got it? You know, like it should be that simple. Yes,
it makes me uncomfortable. And I'm actually and I can
speak for you too. I'm pretty low maintenance.
Speaker 1 (38:35):
So if I'm asking for one thing and it has
to do with respect, as again, to go to VPR.
If I'm asking you not to make out with someone
in our friend group out of respect to me, you
can do that.
Speaker 3 (38:47):
I know. All right, let's just go to VPR because
it's clearly way it is.
Speaker 1 (38:51):
I mean, it's staring us right in the eye. It's
the last episode was the most egregious episode of television
I've ever seen. Viously, Raquel asks, first of all, Laala
for president. I'm sorry, I really, I really do love
her so much. I think she's the voice of reason.
Tom Sandival going after women to the point that his
(39:15):
girlfriend cries, you really see that she knows something is
going on. And she is also doing a very interesting
thing where when her friends bring up like, so, what
happened when Tom, Like basically when you found out he
lied about him not going to see you when your
grandmother died so we could be at a Labor Day party.
She was very much almost shitting on Lala, like, yeah,
I don't know why people need to feel like you
(39:35):
to like ask me all these questions. And I completely
understood where she was coming from, which was basically like,
leave my relationship alone.
Speaker 2 (39:43):
I'm protective of it, and also I don't really want
to look at it or think.
Speaker 1 (39:46):
About it exactly exactly, and I don't want to acknowledge
like that I'm with someone who I can't trust. Tom
Sandival picks a fight of like dude, why are you
always off me? And basically trying to slowly work with
Tom Schwarz to justify the fact that he's gonna leave
Arianna for Raquel. It is absurd, it's embarrassing, it's mean.
(40:07):
And you watch Ariana in these scenes and you can
tell she didn't know that they were going to do
a fight in front of camera because she's really confused.
Speaker 2 (40:15):
And again, it's.
Speaker 1 (40:15):
Sort of like just breaking up with someone rather than
cheating on them with their best friend is possible, so
much easy.
Speaker 3 (40:23):
It's the easier, softer way. When you watch a thing
like this, you're like, oh, that could have been so simple.
Also though, it's so funny because he's trying to make
this case and it like couldn't be. Like she's saying,
I would love if you spent time with me, and
he's like, the things you want to do to spend
time are not stimulating enough for me.
Speaker 2 (40:40):
I need to go to the club and be stimulating.
Speaker 3 (40:42):
He's basically like, if you don't want to do coke
with me, then we're not gonna spend quality time. But
I don't want to have sex, and she's like, I
don't really want to have sex unless we, like, could
her together quality time and she gives him, I swear
the easiest things of man for she doesn't even ask
for a date night. She's like, I would like to
go on a walk around the neighborhood together.
Speaker 2 (40:59):
Yeah, and then I'll have sex with you.
Speaker 3 (41:01):
And he's like, sorry, not stimulating enough, Like you're okay,
you are so unsupportive of me because you want to
go on a walk.
Speaker 1 (41:07):
Like he's a forty year old man who says quality
time to him is hand gliding hand gliding and doing
shrooms and staying up to watch the sunrise horrifying, Like
it's just so horrifying.
Speaker 2 (41:17):
And he has like white nail polish.
Speaker 3 (41:19):
Like I just white nail polish of silk blouse and
a mustache. You your boyfriend won't spend time with you
enough to go for a walk around the neighborhood. But
he's getting manicurious. I'm sorry not to be like gender normative,
but like.
Speaker 1 (41:32):
No, no, no bitch, no stand of all. And I
honestly not when it's anyone, because you need to be
able to cook dinner with me, to have sex with me,
and not use me as like a masturbatory device.
Speaker 2 (41:46):
I would love that sex right now. So I'm like,
I mean, that doesn't sound too bad, but can you
use me? You can? I mean, if you it's complicated.
It's complicated, Listen.
Speaker 3 (41:54):
Life is complicated, but it's not complicated when someone is
this disgusting. And fuck shorts for just like being an
accomplice to it and for hiding in the plants like
Lisa and Wedling. By the way, Lisa vander Pump I
came away from this episode, I was like, vander Pump.
Speaker 2 (42:09):
Is the mother.
Speaker 3 (42:11):
What's the thing of like voice of God, like deis
Mackina or whatever.
Speaker 2 (42:15):
It's like. She is literally like standing up and being.
Speaker 3 (42:18):
Like, listen, I want all of you to love each other,
and I believe in you all.
Speaker 2 (42:24):
And I'm like, okay, first of all, you shouldn't believe
in the Toms.
Speaker 3 (42:26):
But she was like, why the fuck is Tom Shorts
standing in the plants hiding.
Speaker 1 (42:31):
Get in the fight, especially when your ex wife is
getting yelled at by a man that's your friend. And
when Harry her mom I heard they cut out him
telling Terry to shut up.
Speaker 2 (42:43):
That is so fucking horrifory.
Speaker 1 (42:45):
Yes, and he said, I think it's a little tacky
to have your mom entering fights for you. It's like, really, bitch,
I think it's a little tacky for you to take
your mom's retirement fund to start a restaurant that you
don't work out because you're too fucking lazy.
Speaker 2 (42:57):
You know what else I think is tacky? What a whore?
Whoa a total hua?
Speaker 3 (43:04):
Telling Katie a girl who made out with Katie's ex
husband recent ex husband, telling her that she needs to
calm down about the dogs and like telling telling her
how to handle her divorce and trying this is okay.
Speaker 2 (43:22):
It was I Laala.
Speaker 1 (43:23):
I was like I was in Lalla's head when she
was just looking at it, and she could barely speak
because it was so insane, And Katie goes, what are
you doing right now? Get away from me. She's repeatedly
talk about boundaries. Neger would never be able to handle this.
She is repeatedly telling her to leave her alone and
saying even at one point, don't touch me, and Raquel
is following her around. It's so compulsive and scary to
(43:48):
be honest. And then this is what I found most upsetting.
Schwartz tells Katie to be nice to Raquel, and it's like,
you haven't stood up for this woman your entire marriage,
but you are standing up for Raquel to your ex wife.
Speaker 3 (44:00):
Because men are just like at the bottom line, men
are uncomfortable with women voicing anything that's not like support
of them. That's what I felt in that moment, Like
all the times like friendship, post breakup, no, because it's
like I have post breakup been told you need.
Speaker 2 (44:16):
To like be okay with like behavior, and it's like,
wait a second, no, I don't anymore.
Speaker 3 (44:19):
I don't like I'm not agreeing to this whole fucking
weird shit anymore, first of all, and second of all,
think about this.
Speaker 2 (44:26):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (44:26):
So I've had so many moments of being like, wait,
do I actually feel bad for Raquel? And I know
that sounds crazy, but it's like, I'm like, Okay, I
struggle with like wanting validation from men. I struggle with
like getting a nose job too, like she seems to
have alcoholism, Like I don't know.
Speaker 2 (44:40):
Like there's been moments where I'm like, is she okay?
Speaker 3 (44:43):
But then this is the timeline of events. She goes
to a after party of she's not invited to the
original thing. She goes to the after party anyway because
the two men she's learning with who are both one's
in a relationship and one's recently divorced from two people
she's friends with, she just wants attention from them.
Speaker 2 (45:00):
That's why she goes. She shows up.
Speaker 3 (45:02):
Her first move is to talk to the girlfriend of
the man she's having currently an affair with and try
to talk her into breaking up with him. She's like,
don't you think you're not attracted to him? Don't you
think it's weird? You guys, don't have sex because I
actually felt less attracted to James and then we broke up,
so maybe you should consider that.
Speaker 2 (45:17):
Basically trying to convince her to she.
Speaker 1 (45:20):
You want to be in this relationship and she's and
Aria goes yeah, and I mean I was like, I'm
so sorry, you are so stupid.
Speaker 2 (45:26):
We'requel going okay.
Speaker 3 (45:27):
Okay, yeakay, okay, got it to herself, got it, got
it okay, and then she.
Speaker 2 (45:32):
Moves on to the other That's the thing too.
Speaker 3 (45:35):
It's like people are like, oh, was the Tom was
the schwartz 'quel thing like a front?
Speaker 2 (45:39):
No, I think she would have gone with whichever one
gave her.
Speaker 3 (45:42):
Attention, And so she's like, Okay, I guess like, uh,
Sandoval and Ari aren't gonna break up, so let me
move back to Schwartz and Katie. And then she's like, Katie,
you need to like be cooler, like whatever. And that's
the thing too. She's the cool girl. She's the guy
that the guys are like, oh, we're friends with Raquel.
She doesn't care about anything. She'll do cope with us
in the hot tubs, she'll watch sports with us. Yeah,
(46:02):
it's because she has no fucking sense of self or self.
Speaker 1 (46:04):
Esteem and you're heading for a breakdown. Your value comes
from like men, and.
Speaker 3 (46:10):
By the way, you'll deserve that breakdown and everything it
comes with.
Speaker 2 (46:13):
And oh, I feel bad. I feel like she's like,
I think she's in danger.
Speaker 3 (46:18):
Okay, I've been in danger too, and I've had breakdowns too,
and I deserved that. I deserved that, and I was
fabled by it, and I changed and grew.
Speaker 2 (46:25):
And she that's her choice if she does that. I
think that Katie.
Speaker 1 (46:29):
I watched her watch what Katie went on watch What
Happens Live after that episode and pointed out a really
interesting narrative which I think is true, which is that
when Schwartz and Raquel made out, she thinks Raquel did
it to like play games with Tom because he was
obviously in a relationship, and to do it in front
of him and stuff. And she said, and that's why
she thinks Tom Standerbal told Tom Schwartz afterwards that they
(46:53):
were together to basically like get him a trull.
Speaker 3 (46:57):
Okay, See, this is the stuff we have to keep
track of. It's into like succession, like the business deals.
Speaker 1 (47:02):
Like I'm like, wait, this is like I don'kay, yeah,
I need more I need more time to really absorb it.
I mean again, just like Succession, I'm gonna watch this
all over again, probably multiple times, because it is so
intricate and such a wicked web we weave. We are
so excited for the finale. We're so excited for the reunion.
The reunion trailer is gorgeous.
Speaker 3 (47:24):
I have watched it so many times.
Speaker 1 (47:27):
Really, James Kennedy deserves a raise. He really does. He's
been giving us a lot. He's been holding this show
up in a lot of ways. Him throwing a drink
on Schwartz was really valuable to me. And and he
just doesn't get scared, and a part of that is alcoholism.
But the only thing he's scared of is Lisa vander Pump,
which I also think is very charming. I literally saw
a comment that he dig did under a picture of
(47:48):
Lisa with someone.
Speaker 2 (47:49):
He's like, Lisa looks amazing here. Love you Lisa.
Speaker 1 (47:52):
Oh my god, such a teenage boy. But he will
keep you guys posted. Thank you for listening to me
cry today. I can only hope that we can all
grow together. And I really mean that from the bottom
of my heart, because I think growth is the only
option and I want to make choices that open up
my heart rather than keeping it locked.
Speaker 2 (48:13):
And I'm grateful for you. Devin. I love you. I
love you, carolvnted. I want your tu it's so romantic.
(48:39):
Love me, baby, don't leave me, haggin. I want truth
Oh, hello, and welcome to True Romance. This is Carolina
Barlow and this is Devin Leary. You guys sent in
(00:22):
some topics, which really, every time someone sends in a topic,
it makes me happy.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
It brings a smile to my face.
Speaker 1 (00:28):
I get so excited the fact that anyone wants to
hear us talk about anything is truly a surprise and
a privilege. Because my new mantra is, you don't have
to speak. I'm in a professional environment where I can
speak sometimes and I don't have to. Silence is an option.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
Silence is always an option. But silence is also violence
and a lot of it. That is also true.
Speaker 3 (00:49):
So first of all, we got recommendations talk about Milf Manner,
talk about maths, merrit at First Sight season ten. The
thing about Milf Manner is I couldn't handle that and
I was too disturbed.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
Some things are too violent that emotionally.
Speaker 3 (01:05):
On my TV right now in the background is ninety
Day Fiance Before the ninety Day is season five, which
I've already seen and I'm rewatching.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
Yeah, if Milk Manner is too much for Devn, that
says a lot because if I know Devin, I know
that she has a high tolerance.
Speaker 3 (01:22):
So Married at First Sight season ten. I'm sorry, but
I'm on season fourteen. I'm like the only person alive
who watches Married at First Site in real time. Like
I watch the current season and everyone else is like
still the amount of time. Someone's like, oh yeah, I'm
watching the most current season and I'm like, what season,
and they're like twelve because that's the most recent one
on Netflix.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
It's like, sorry, keep up.
Speaker 3 (01:43):
So then we have someone wrote in and said Taylor
Swift and Marty Healy, which was a pat total power
move to call him Marty, but of.
Speaker 1 (01:54):
Course they're referencing Matt Healy. He is the lead singer
of the nineteen seventy five a band Win which I
do not know one lyric, one song. All I know
is that the lead singer is really hot and makes
out with his fans sometimes.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
I almost hide away. Oh well, you're on You're wrong.
Speaker 3 (02:12):
No.
Speaker 1 (02:12):
I think he's like Timmy Shallamy hot where I'm like,
we wouldn't fit physically with each other because I'm about
approximately four feet taller than him and about i would
say one hundred pounds heavier than him.
Speaker 2 (02:23):
But he is someone is tall too.
Speaker 1 (02:25):
Taylor is tall too, but she's modeled like build and
I think that I think that this is a rebound.
I think we can all safely say that.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
It's a getaway car. And I also think.
Speaker 1 (02:37):
That I'm a little bit relieved swifties, don't come after me, don't.
Speaker 2 (02:42):
Dox me that her and Joe are over.
Speaker 1 (02:44):
Joe was about as interesting as a piece of ham
that was left out on the curb for a while
and turned white.
Speaker 2 (02:52):
He just looked asleep, like dead behind the eyes. I
think there's more to the story with Joe that we
don't know.
Speaker 3 (02:58):
I agree. Friend of the podjast Seekenevski had a really
interesting take on this, which is that we all want
to believe in the Kaylor and the Galer theories because
we want.
Speaker 2 (03:10):
Her to be Taylor. That's what I'm gonna name my
first child.
Speaker 3 (03:15):
We want her to be more Kaylor, Gaylor Barlow Galor Barlow.
Speaker 2 (03:22):
You say with an Italian accent.
Speaker 3 (03:32):
No, but like we want her to be more interesting,
and in reality, she's just a girl like me, Devin
Hunter Leary. She like gets into these relationships with these
semi toxic men and like completely changes her personality for them,
and then.
Speaker 1 (03:43):
Yes, yes, yes, yes, her her zip code we no
one forgets the house she bought in Rhode Island to
be close to the Kennedy teenager.
Speaker 2 (03:50):
Yes. And then she, like.
Speaker 3 (03:54):
Jesse was saying, like, she starts dating Joe. She moves
to the lakes and she starts reading Keats And I'm like, yeah, wow,
I start dating someone and start doing learning about dungeons
and dragons and like dressing and cosplay. Then I start
dating someone else, and well, I'm trying to think, Oh, well,
(04:15):
when I dated Zach, I signed up for two half marathons.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
Did I Did I attend either of them?
Speaker 3 (04:20):
No?
Speaker 1 (04:20):
But you know, I'm you know that costs some money too.
I completely identify with this clearly.
Speaker 3 (04:26):
I I yeah, so she she and she jumps too
quickly into these things, which I also do. And hold on,
I'm getting a phone call, not to brag. She jumps
really quickly into these things and then they fall apart,
which this is what I'll say, though, this is what
(04:47):
I'll say. And thinking about this, I go on Twitter
the other day I see an article about the Jonas
brothers new album is a love letter to their wives.
Speaker 2 (04:58):
So was the last one?
Speaker 3 (05:00):
First of all, Second of all, so nobody wants that.
I don't want to hear someone's love letter to their
wife at all. I can attend my parents' anniversary celebration
if I want that, and I don't want that. Okay,
I want turmoil, I want drama, I want getaway car,
I want folklore. I want this is me trying. I
want all too well. So when I watched Taylor get
(05:24):
out of something so quickly with Joe and into something
so quickly with Maddy Healy, who has proven himself to
be toxic a few years ago, why oh, because.
Speaker 2 (05:33):
So he did an interview.
Speaker 3 (05:35):
So okay, so they met when they were twenty five,
and people say Cardigan is about him, and like he
there was like rumors that she went to his show,
she wore a nineteen seventy five after that, Yeah, and
then he in an interview said that he would never
date Taylor Swift because that would be emasculating because she's
like so successful. God, and then people were like, oh,
(06:00):
like you're misogynistic. And then he kind of like took
it back and was like, oh, I didn't mean that,
but whatever, Like I can just tell he's he doesn't
it track Like you're like, oh, you think you're like
better than her. By the way, didn't she learn from
your indie record that's much cooler than mine?
Speaker 2 (06:17):
But that being said, did I ever learn No? Do
have we ever learned anything based off experience with men?
Absolutely not.
Speaker 1 (06:23):
I this is okay, this is waking me up to
a few things. A. I think she's attracted to men
who have an air of aloofness. She is like the
only guy she's dated who, by the way, I have
heard rumors that he was ready to marry her, and
who matched her energy level? Was I'm sorry to say,
(06:44):
Tom Hidleston.
Speaker 2 (06:45):
Oh, I thought you were gonna say Calvin Harris.
Speaker 1 (06:48):
Sure him as well, but Tom Hidleston I heard, like
thought he was going to marry her.
Speaker 2 (06:52):
And he was like a door. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:56):
And Taylor is like what we love about her, she's
so since and she's even said it in her NYU
commencement speech.
Speaker 2 (07:03):
She said, like, embrace the cringe, totally embrace the cringe.
Speaker 1 (07:07):
And so she is dating people who do not do
that though, and Matt, really I don't like yes, And
then she has to act cool and it says if
in her relationships she is doing the thing that she's
had to do with the public, which is like court
the public into knowing that she is cool and relevant,
et cetera, because we're just famously so hard on women,
(07:28):
which if you want to know more about, you can
watch Miss Americana on Netflix streaming now. So I don't
like that he is known for his celebrity rather than
his music, and I think that he loves that. I
think he loves attention. I mean, like, you know, hot
take rockstar loves attention. But him making out with his
(07:50):
fans a I would kill to do that. Like, yeah,
he looks like at the very least a good kisser,
but b I'm like, you are not being really known
for your music, so you're going for stunts and that
also I mean talk about cringe.
Speaker 2 (08:03):
That's kind of cringe.
Speaker 3 (08:04):
And also like, are you receiving and spreading the herpes virus?
Speaker 2 (08:09):
I don't know the herpes virus. I think this is
bound to burn.
Speaker 3 (08:17):
And I'm kind of into that he's been attending her shows.
But what I love, What I love is how fiercely
the Swift the Swifty community like hates him for her,
Like at the amount of tiktoks I've seen that are
like disgusted by him, and they're like he's not good enough.
Speaker 2 (08:34):
And people are like I don't understand.
Speaker 3 (08:35):
Like someone who wrote into was like I don't understand,
Like why is Gigi Hadid and Phoebe Bridger is nice
to him?
Speaker 2 (08:41):
Like he's awful, he doesn't deserve it?
Speaker 3 (08:42):
So funny, and I think we can all relate to
that as friends.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
I don't know you know that I can relate to yeah,
Like have you ever disapproved of anyone I've dated? Name one,
name one or six? It is so okay.
Speaker 1 (08:57):
This is what I'll say, though, Why are swifties so
obsessed with Joe? Like like when I get it, I
don't get it to send it to you. Someone made
a meme of an old woman in a cage and said,
I'm not letting my grandmother out until Joe and Taylor
get back.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
I don't get it. No, I don't understand at all.
Speaker 3 (09:13):
There's been no information, and I want her to, like,
I want her to bring to light which songs are
really about him, because I've always thought that. I'm like,
there's so many songs that are about him we don't
know about. She needs to be honest about that now
because I want to know, Like did he cheat on
her to chea cheat on him?
Speaker 2 (09:30):
Who was ellisit a Ferris who was secret? We need
an Oprah interview, We need an Oprah interview.
Speaker 3 (09:35):
The ways that he's toxic could potentially at least make
him more interesting like Jake Jill and hallme like, of
course he's awful for her, But in some ways, I'm like, wait,
I'm kind of like into the back and forth, like
I knew you were trouble, Like, oh my god, that's
hot in a way, like.
Speaker 1 (09:48):
I thought that was it. That's about Harry. But continue,
she read a book sometimes and do your research.
Speaker 2 (09:52):
Baby.
Speaker 3 (09:54):
Well, the thing is, the thing is, I don't know
what the thing is, but I'll.
Speaker 1 (10:01):
Say this, Taylor and Pete next, can you imagine I
don't think she would do that. I don't think she
would touch it with a ten football.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
But no, I think like I'm kind of over Pete. Honestly,
I know I am too.
Speaker 1 (10:13):
I hope you just I hope he just stays with
this girl so we can we can. I don't need
any more headlines.
Speaker 2 (10:18):
You know.
Speaker 1 (10:19):
It was like when I was done with Don't Worry
Darling Drama, I'm like, I'm done.
Speaker 2 (10:22):
I think I'm done.
Speaker 3 (10:24):
And also I saw him do an interview where he's like, Okay,
I'm in my twenties, like I date a lot, like
it's actually not weird, And I'm like, no, I have
been you where I like date a million people, Like
I said, really fast, and like what and people think
it's weird, Like even though I'm not famous, people are like,
that's weird.
Speaker 2 (10:40):
Why are you in so many relationships?
Speaker 1 (10:43):
And why do you get a tattoo for every single
relationship and virtually get married to this person?
Speaker 2 (10:47):
That is the weird part.
Speaker 1 (10:48):
That is what you can't get four tattoos for Kim Kardashian,
including all of her children's initials. I remember when I
told you that, Yeah, Like why do people have to
be this way? Like you don't have to. It's like
the silence is an option. Not getting a tattoo that
says Jasmine and Aladdin is an option. Not branding your
name with the word branding your body with the name
Kim is an option.
Speaker 2 (11:08):
I know. Imagine.
Speaker 3 (11:10):
I'm like, I know, lift up my arm and I
have all of Kim's kids tattooed on.
Speaker 2 (11:14):
You're like, I know, I wish I knew that that
was an.
Speaker 3 (11:16):
Option Chicago anyway.
Speaker 1 (11:20):
So that's what we think about Taylor and Maddie and I,
and we hope for more clarity, like the fact that
Blake Lively and Ryan Reynolds unfollowed Joe. I need more
information on that, actually, and so we need more clues.
Speaker 2 (11:34):
I look.
Speaker 1 (11:35):
I look forward to future Easter eggs that are so obvious.
I look forward to more music videos. I love the
fact that she is not like I know, Taylor is
not gonna let us down, like she she can only
tolerate so much privacy on her personal life. And I
don't think she liked that about him too, Like you know,
if she did, if they did in fact get married,
(11:55):
you know that she wanted a Vogue spread, like you
know that she wanted all of that and he took
that away from her, which is, as Ramona said to Bethany,
not supporting other women.
Speaker 2 (12:04):
It's also like, again I relate to her.
Speaker 3 (12:06):
She has that song paper Rings, where it's like I
would marry you with paper rings, I don't care. It's
like I've done that in relationships where I'm like, I
don't even care, like when I was.
Speaker 1 (12:15):
Dating my Well, we'll always forget, I mean, well, that
we'll always forget. We'll always forget when you wanted to
get married in Vegas, like very badly, to the point
of being in a bad mood.
Speaker 2 (12:23):
I know.
Speaker 3 (12:24):
And also with that same person that he was like
wanted a small wedding or something, and I was like same,
like I could get married at city Hall. We all
know that I want a big wedding. I want attention.
I want people watching me walk down the aisle. I
want people crying for me. I want toasts like husband
and crying husband ha personal vowls. I this is making
(12:46):
me so angry. It's like even because my most recent
relationship he said that he wouldn't do vows for me,
like if we got married.
Speaker 2 (12:56):
So I d like, I'm sorry, but I a minimum.
Speaker 3 (13:00):
Every single person I've been with, I could write the most.
Speaker 2 (13:04):
I know.
Speaker 3 (13:04):
I could write the most beautiful, poetic things because I
did for every birthday, anniversary, whatever, these cards that are
like so.
Speaker 2 (13:11):
Heartfelt, and I'm like, I know that.
Speaker 3 (13:16):
Those things can be written about me, like the fact
that no one this is honestly I.
Speaker 2 (13:20):
Could write your vows.
Speaker 1 (13:21):
I could write I could literally write you the most
beautiful vows, and that should be of the friend vows.
I mean, so I could argue that, like, sometimes we
love our friends just as much as our esos, but
your husband should that that's the bare minimum. If Tom
Schwartz can write Katie Maloney vows that make him cry
and he's the same person who truly likes pouring drinks
(13:44):
on women, then yes, your boyfriend can write you vows
again bare minimum.
Speaker 3 (13:49):
But also I'm like, it's me, like, there's so much
to be said about me, but they're like so much
to be said.
Speaker 2 (13:56):
And also I'm like small ways, perfect hits. I don't know,
but this was.
Speaker 3 (14:01):
The thing too, is like I'm like the the fact
that I have been told by a significant other that
it's crazy for me to think that someone should be
certain about marrying me.
Speaker 1 (14:13):
Well, since that was literally the precipitated my last breakup,
those words exactly that were said to you. Well, when
I said to my ex, I deserve someone who's certain
about me and he said, you're right, Yeah, that was equivalent.
Speaker 2 (14:31):
This is sickening, This is sickening, This is.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
Sickening, and that were yeah, bad vows. I would not
want those to be my vows at my wedding. I
think that we deserve people who live where are they?
Speaker 2 (14:45):
Can these people show themselves?
Speaker 1 (14:47):
I don't know, I really don't, but I also think that,
like if I'm really honest with myself and you do
not have to feel the same way, I'm speaking purely
for myself. I'm not ready for that person yet to
get very vulnerable and I like could cry talking about this.
I feel like it sounds so intense, but I feel
like my heart is like so closed since my life.
Speaker 2 (15:09):
I love you, and I.
Speaker 1 (15:11):
Just feel like I'm like repulsed by like the idea
of like opening it again right now.
Speaker 3 (15:17):
I just feel like I am so terrified of being
hurt again.
Speaker 2 (15:27):
Hot. Yeah, I know what you mean.
Speaker 3 (15:30):
I don't have any advice for this because I don't
know what the right way is to be. But I'm
just really sorry that you feel that way because it's
it sounds so painful, and I think you have such
a beautiful heart that I think should be shared with
as many people as possible.
Speaker 1 (15:45):
I think it's just time, Like I think I apologize
to our listeners who can't handle women crying, and if
there are listeners and no listeners like that they love it,
I think it's time. I mean meaning that I think
time is the answer and is the only answer. Unfortunately,
I think I'm on right and I'm on hinge, and
(16:08):
I'm not obsessing about either. I'm just existing on them
and not taking them down, which is like a huge
step for me. And I think I'm trying to just
constantly remind myself of what I deserve, yes, which is
hard when you're not actively getting it, because you feel like,
am I delusional? Like don't I deserve this even though it's.
Speaker 2 (16:27):
Not from me?
Speaker 1 (16:29):
Yes, I don't even know how I got to this
place in this episode and like what brought me here?
But yeah, basically wanting someone, not feeling ready for someone,
wouldn't know what to do if I liked someone, Like
I met someone recently who I like was kind of like, oh,
this could be something, and he was so earnestly nice
(16:50):
and funny and fun but like eager and not playing
cool at all, which, like I know, is both of
our pet peeves when anyone is like trying to play cool,
Like he was just like yeah, hey, and like so
eager and so nice and the kind of person again
who the highest compliment I can pay a guy, or
rather a great barometer I feel like to suss out
a guy's character is whether or not you would be
(17:11):
excited to introduce him to your friends. Yes, if you're
like he's fine and like I really like him, Like,
that's one thing. And I also don't think that you should.
It shouldn't be if my friends don't like him, I
have to break up with him, because I've done that too.
And I don't think that like is necessarily a good
thing or like how you should make a decision. But
(17:32):
I do think you should want to include him in
your friend group because that means, like you're comfortable with him.
You know, you guys share probably some of the same values.
I mean the best example of this is Sex in
the City and when she dates who's the Russian artist
and he is like so weird to all of her
friends and like doesn't mesh well with them because they're
(17:53):
like Samantha's like joking about vibrators and he can't handle it.
Speaker 2 (17:56):
Yeah, you don't want that.
Speaker 1 (17:58):
You don't want that, but even no, that like, oh wow,
there's a guy like this that exists, and he's like
successful and smart and also like kind and humble and funny.
I was like, I'm not going to put any energy
into making this happen, mainly because like I met him
through work and that felt unprofessional, but also because I'm like,
I'm not ready for that in my life right now.
Speaker 2 (18:18):
But will you ever be? I don't know, I don't know,
like I don't know.
Speaker 1 (18:23):
I feel like, yes I will, but it feels like
I have a few obstacles that feel currently insurmountable. But
I'm choosing to be hopeful and focus on things that
I am ready for right now.
Speaker 2 (18:38):
Does that make sense? That makes sense? But I'll keep
you guys posted. I don't want to be sad.
Speaker 1 (18:44):
One of the reasons I love this podcast is because
it's not about like being like depressed. It's about like
how to to me at least, and I hope this
is what it is to our listeners. It's how it's
about how do I become happy with a love life?
Because I want to be happy with a love life.
Speaker 2 (18:57):
I thought it was about reality TV. No, don't kidding, No,
I listen.
Speaker 3 (19:06):
I think it's also about like we don't know anything
about anything, and true, I think that's the most authentic
way to be is just to be like we're figuring
it out.
Speaker 1 (19:17):
I agree, Oh, Okay, to move on. Someone requested, please
get your charts read by Ali and report back.
Speaker 2 (19:34):
I have contacted her. I was gonna contact her yesterday. Okay.
Speaker 1 (19:38):
Well, I'm so glad we made contact. We'll talk to
our producer as well about seeing to if she would
be interested in getting on the pod.
Speaker 2 (19:45):
We're huge Alley fans.
Speaker 1 (19:47):
She is an example of listening to that little voice
inside of you that says, maybe it's weird. If you
see a man and his girlfriend's friend dancing at the
abbey at two am, maybe that's weird.
Speaker 2 (19:56):
Maybe that's something to flag. That's something to flag big time.
So we really love Ali and all sixty pounds of her.
She's a part of history. Should we talk friend breakups briefly? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (20:08):
I don't really have any wise words to say about this,
Like this is something I'm struggling with as an adult,
is like growing out of friendships. And the thing is,
I'm reading this book step Bound. It's not about me, really,
this is something that's really hard for me in adulthood.
Speaker 2 (20:27):
Is like that one.
Speaker 3 (20:29):
Away from a podcast you feel like you have nothing
in common with them anymore, and it's just no. But
this book set boundaries find piece by Nedric Glover tuab.
Speaker 1 (20:42):
I wish that we could get in an airplane and
throw copies out onto the United States, across across this
great nation.
Speaker 3 (20:49):
But the thing is, like she talks about with friend
separation or like family separation specifically, like setting a clear
boundary versus ghosting, and she's like, letting something fade out
is actually like passive, and I'm like, okay. That being said,
I kind of think I would rather someone just like
clearly distance themselves from me than to be like, hey.
Speaker 2 (21:09):
Devin, like I don't really want to be your friend anymore. Yeah,
I'm okay.
Speaker 3 (21:13):
I don't need someone to tell me why they don't
want to be my friend anymore. They can just like
calmly be on their way.
Speaker 2 (21:17):
I have.
Speaker 1 (21:19):
I've gone through a version of this that was really
interesting because it was a time when I was really young,
and I encourage growth at all ages. But you know,
when I stopped partying, I mean, I still like going out,
but when I stopped blacking out, I should say there
were friendships that I realized didn't have a lot of
(21:39):
substance besides going out, getting wasted and trying to have sex.
And so I really do need to share values with someone,
and I need to feel safe with someone, and I
need to trust someone for me to share my life
with them in any capacity, not just romantically. And so
I have realized that time i'ms you know, for instance,
(22:01):
I was super, I was with the I was with
a girl who I used to party with, and I was,
you know, not doing that anymore. But she wanted to
hang out and I was staying in my mom's apartment
at the time. My mom's apartment had a pool and
we were to go lounge by the pool together. We
went to a grocery store beforehand, a small grocery store.
Speaker 3 (22:17):
We're not talking bonds, we're not talking whole food. It's
like a neighborhood grocery store. And she stole something as
we were leaving, and I was.
Speaker 1 (22:25):
Like, I'm not don't get me wrong, I'm not like
one of those people who's like, obey the law and
respect fellow officers. No, but I'm like, you're stealing from
a small business. That is not something I'm okay with. Yeah,
And I don't understand you, and I don't trust you now,
and I don't want you around. If you were like
stealing from Target, I might be like, that's honestly weird,
(22:46):
since I know you have money to afford that, and
I think that's like a little sketchy, but I stealing
from a small business is like especially egregious. Yeah, And
it's just one of those reminders of like, oh, we
live differently. We live very differently, and I don't trust
you as much as I used to. And Devin and
I talked, you know, today about feeling safe to share
(23:09):
a lot about our lives with someone and we need
to trust that they will reciprocate that. So I'm grateful
that I have friends that I can go back. I
have it back and forth with, but I'm cautious not
to get close to people, and I feel like that's
not a possibility. I can totally have shallow friendships. And
I don't even mean shallow in a bad way. I
mean like work friendships. Shout out to my coworkers listen
(23:30):
to the podcast. No, I mean they actually know what
just as much due to the fact that I took
oxycotton because of a surgery. I did send them all
pictures in my hand. But I mean acquaintances through work relationships,
Like it's okay, I don't need to get very close
to everyone. They can be a level of friendship. But
friends who I'm suddenly like I don't agree with the
(23:50):
way that you go through the world and I don't
have to force things based on prior connection.
Speaker 3 (23:58):
Well, I am gonna just turn this into a podcast
where we quote Nedra Glover toab but she on her
Instagram she posted this thing called six types of friends
to stay close to and I really liked it.
Speaker 2 (24:10):
Oh my god, I saw that and I loved it
so much.
Speaker 3 (24:13):
Stay close to friends who don't require constant contact and
embrace you with open arms when you connect. Life is busy.
Being connected to someone who understands that matters. Stay close
to friends who allow you to be authentic without challenging
you to be anything other than what you are. This
has been really big for me this year, like the
feeling of can I be truly authentic with what I'm
(24:35):
going through with this person right now? Or am I
scared of judgment or control. It's special to have a
relationship with someone who gets you when there are differences
between you and them. Stay close to friends who have
healthy boundaries. Seeing someone place boundaries is inspirational. Strong agree,
but also like do I know anyone with healthy boundaries?
I'm not sure, and can encourage you to build healthier boundaries.
(24:57):
Stay close to friends who don't shut down when you
bring up top topics. That's actually true, especially right before
this podcast, when I brought up to Carolina that the
company Wayfair is sex trafficking missing children through dressers and
naming the dressers after those missing children. And it's a
tough topic, and I brought it up in Carolina completely
(25:18):
shut it down.
Speaker 2 (25:19):
I said, next, stay close to friends.
Speaker 3 (25:21):
Who delicately hold you accountable. Having people who want the
best for you is life changing. Okay, So this is
an interesting one because I actually had a friend be
honest with me that I was being annoying recently. Who
oh I in no world would I say, who.
Speaker 2 (25:40):
This bothers me? I'm keep me up at night.
Speaker 3 (25:42):
I'm like, I'm like, oh this person WHI on the podcast?
Speaker 2 (25:47):
No, just a couple of friends. I actually asked. I
was like, am I being annoying about my breakup?
Speaker 3 (25:51):
Like?
Speaker 2 (25:51):
Am I talking about it too much? Am I like.
Speaker 3 (25:53):
Being like obsessive about it? And they were like it's
a lot. And I was like okay, And then I've
really thought about that since then, and I I've thought
like is it necessary, because this is something I really
struggle with, like oversharing, because I don't have a strong
enough sense of self to like regulate my own problems
on my own. I need like everyone's opinion. So I've
been trying to think, like do I need to share
this or am I just like filling space or am
(26:15):
I just like afraid? So I want people to validate
what I'm doing. And it was really helpful to me
that being said, I have friends who there's stuff that
I want to be honest with them about because I'm
like right, and I'm.
Speaker 1 (26:28):
Like could I actually like it causes like a cold
rift between people when someone doesn't feel safe to open up.
And I think that, like I've appreciated that more this
year as well.
Speaker 2 (26:39):
But I think that is something in you and I's friendship.
Speaker 3 (26:42):
I've always been able to be completely honest with you
when I have a problem with you. That's true, And
I'm gonna say right now, I have a huge problem
with you. No I'm kidding, but like you always have
been receptive and I feel like you've been able to
communicate with me and I haven't bet I'm like, and
I haven't really been receptive, but I've worked through it
(27:02):
in my own way and whatever. We've always been able
to grow because we like communicate with each other. But
I have some friendships where I'm like, could I be
honest with that person about what bothers me? Like, I'm
not sure, and that prevents closeness.
Speaker 1 (27:14):
That prevents closeness, And it's also what I imagine a marriage
to be like, where it's like I have to get
vulnerable and grow with you or else we're in trouble,
do you know what I mean? And I think I've
been in relationships where that wasn't really an option or
or there was not a willingness on and I'll include
myself in it on either side to change. And that's
that's a problem I think that I have.
Speaker 2 (27:36):
And I'm sure you'll understand this.
Speaker 1 (27:38):
I in that last post, I think I've wanted better
for people in a way that's almost bullish, because I
don't want I As I've said multiple times on this pod,
there's no man that I think is good enough for
my friends. And I don't mean that being like girls
are queens, Like, I don't mean it that way. I
just really truly believe I have some of the funny, brightest, kindest,
(28:01):
most interesting like people who have champion darkness and like
gotten through it and like really had to look at
themselves in ways that are like both beautiful and transformational.
I am so proud of my friends and like think
that they're some of the most amazing people I've ever met.
Speaker 2 (28:17):
I really do. And they're mostly female. It's hard for.
Speaker 1 (28:21):
Me to accept them dating anyone who is treating them differently.
It makes me insane, and that is like a self
centered way to look at it.
Speaker 2 (28:29):
I should just be like, that's a you problem. Yeah,
I should just.
Speaker 1 (28:33):
Be like, they're dating someone, period, and like, I wonder
how that's going. I don't have to set anyone's life up,
and I, as I've said earlier on the spot, I'm
struggling to even set my own romantic life up. So
it's very easy from that place when you're not dating anyone,
to be like and they shouldn't date this guy because
he's an asshole. Like it's easy to be like that
(28:54):
instead of like, meeting someone is really hard and true
love is hard to find, and if you feel like
you found a connect, like it, it doesn't make it
easier for someone to be like, well he sucks. It's like, yeah,
well you have no idea like the loneliness I've been
living with, So yeah, I definitely understand. I think it's
good to want the best for your friends, and I
also think that it's with caution, like in terms of
(29:17):
like thinking you know what the best is?
Speaker 3 (29:20):
The last slide in Nedra's thing is stay close to
friends who show up to support you. Taking the time
to be present is loving. And I think like I've
also struggled with like and I've like directly affected friendships
by like giving honest opinions about relationships when they're not.
Speaker 2 (29:35):
Asking for I think that's the thing.
Speaker 3 (29:36):
It's like my most recent example of being like, am
I being annoying about my breakup? It's like I was asking,
and sometimes I'm asking without really wanting an answer. But
like when I've had the experience of like sharing what
I'm going through and then receiving like an opinion about
like what I should do, it feels like the person's
not being present or like receiving like a judgment or like,
I don't know, it just feels like wait, are you
listening or are you like thinking that I need to
(29:58):
like change my life, and I think it's a struggle.
But like for me, most of the time, I just
want someone to like listen and be like I love
you anyway.
Speaker 2 (30:07):
Right, And also like every relationship is different.
Speaker 3 (30:10):
And I've also like I've I've been really surprised by
friends relationships that in the beginning I was like, wait what,
And now I'm like, wow, I really admire what you
guys have gotten through together and like that's really cool.
And also like the things I want are clearly different
than like what other people want, Like I have no
idea what works for people, and I don't even know
(30:30):
what works for me. But I've definitely fallen into that
before where I'm like he's not good enough, like it,
I'm scared, you know, But it's all just like fear.
Speaker 2 (30:38):
It's fear.
Speaker 1 (30:39):
And it's also like not jealousy, but the kind of
thing of like you don't deserve to be close to
this person I love. It's a level of protectiveness that
is boundaryless. And I think that listening is a really
profound thing to do that I struggle with. And I
think that you have been really good about listening to
me rant and just nodding and true listening, and that
(31:00):
alone is healing.
Speaker 2 (31:01):
And I don't think we know, like I don't.
Speaker 1 (31:03):
I can't tell you why, but I think that it
is really helpful for someone to fully absorb what you're
going through. I think that's helpful for you to process that.
I think you can grow out of friendships and that
doesn't mean the experience was less valuable. There's friendships that
sometimes I'm like, maybe I should reconnect with this person
and it's sort of like why I know, And that's okay,
(31:24):
Like we had fun. Our lifestyles don't suit each other anymore,
and that's okay. You know, I kind of can han.
I can do friendships and relationships like I used to
be able to, like drink where I want to just
like absorb someone or I really like someone and get
obsessed with them, and that's just not like really necessarily
a way to live. You can have like a few
close friends, which I do, and appreciate someone so much
(31:46):
and they don't have to be everything to you. Let's
move on to one of my favorite topics, jealousy and
female friendships. Your significant other has yep, so I want
to say something about jealousy that has is very helpful
(32:08):
to me. I expressed my therapist I was jealous of
this girl. And my therapist said, look at dogs, and
I said, okay, I do all the time. But she said,
have you seen how they play? Jealousy is a part
of primal animal fabric. Like my dog will hold a
bone and let my other dog bark at it and
clearly gets a rise out of it, and that's fun
(32:30):
for her. And jealousy is clear and it's a game,
but it's also real, and looking at it that way
really helps me be less judgmental and less urgent about myself,
and I can be more like, oh, there it is,
there's my jealousy again. Jealousy is popping up. Okay, this
person has financial success. I want Oh this person just
had an article in deadline. I want to be in deadline.
(32:51):
And instead of judging that or feeling bad about myself
or feeling that way, I'll just let it happen. Yeah,
I'm competitive, Yeah I'm jealous. I don't have to watch myself.
Speaker 2 (33:02):
I don't.
Speaker 3 (33:02):
That doesn't have to lead to obsession anymore. That can
just exist and I can trust that time will take
that away too. I've been jealous of people that I
don't think about.
Speaker 1 (33:11):
Anymore that I used to think about all the time, Like,
can I trust that time happens and that I will,
you know, eventually get over that.
Speaker 3 (33:17):
Well, I think it's hard in relationships to not act
or for me, like, to not act on it.
Speaker 2 (33:22):
Relationships are a different thing.
Speaker 1 (33:23):
I'm talking about being single right now, But in terms
of relationships and a girl being around that you're jealous
of I have, I'll say, for me personally, it usually
speaks to the health of the relationship in what sense,
In the sense that I have been in relationships where girls,
and I'll say this objectively who are hotter than me
have been mad at me because they have a crush
(33:45):
on my boyfriend. I felt no fear, anger, resentment towards
these people. I was kind of like, oh weird, But
I was so trusting of my boyfriend's feelings of me.
I did not feel like I need a monitor this.
I didn't feel like, God, he wants to be to
be skinny like them, he wants me to tan or
(34:05):
blonde like them. I didn't feel any of that because
I just trusted that this person really cared about me.
I have also been in relationships where, for instance, I've
heard like, oh, by the way, your boyfriend was flirting
with this girl at a bar, and I've known that
to be true. I feel like I was evolved enough
at that point to hate her. I mean, sorry, I
absolutely despise her, but at the same time, like understand
(34:26):
that that feeling was misplaced and that who I was
really angry at was him, and that like I needed
to talk to him about whether I could trust him
or not. I think that the most important thing if
you are feeling jealous of a female significant other is
estimating whether you trust your partner or not. And if
you do, and if you're like, Okay, I actually really
trust him. I trust that he loves me, I trust
(34:48):
that he cares about me, then I would say, like,
you can maybe let yourself be jealous or but try
to rest in that knowledge. If you feel like this
is someone who picks at me, who starts fight out
it nowhere, who complains because he says I don't buy
batteries for the house, I of course I'm talking about
Tom Sandoval then, and he has a female best friend,
(35:09):
then I would be okay with saying something's not right,
and I'd say, the worst thing that can happen in
these situations is your partner gaslighting you, like honestly, And
I'm speaking of course of someone who in their Instagram
bio says a feminist who loves men. Some people women
male otherwise can be awful. They can like try to
hook up with someone's boyfriend. They can try to have
(35:30):
emotional affairs with someone's boyfriend. People have the capacity to
be unkind, to be wildly unkind, unempathetic, not consider others.
But it really is about if your partner is seeing
that and acknowledging that pain to you or not.
Speaker 2 (35:46):
Yeah, this is a tough one.
Speaker 3 (35:48):
I have had the direct experience of like someone hitting
on my boyfriend and expressing feelings for them and like trying,
like you said, to start something with them when I
was dating them. And then I have also had the
experience of, like, I think I have the capacity to,
no matter what's going on in the relationship, like choose
(36:09):
something like this to fixate on, because whether I'm like
trying to avoid looking at other aspects of the relationship,
or I'm just like I'm afraid to lose this person,
so I'm just gonna choose this thing and like it's
like in reality and some of these situations, I know
that the person I was with like had no intention
of doing anything inappropriate, but I like chose to be like, well,
this is disrespectful and it shouldn't be happening NonStop, and
(36:31):
it was kind of like a waste of time. And
I also had this weird obsession with like this is
disrespectful and like I if I ever meet this girl,
like I'm not going to be.
Speaker 2 (36:41):
Nice to her.
Speaker 3 (36:42):
And I had a conversation with a friend about that
once and my friend was like why, like why would
you ever not want to be nice to someone?
Speaker 2 (36:48):
And I was like that's so true.
Speaker 3 (36:49):
Like it's actually like way more like aspirational to just
like be nice to everyone and like have an open
mind because you're gonna get proven. Like as Kelly Clarkson
once said, if someone doesn't love you and is like
gonna cheat on you, like you will find out you
don't have to like investigate, like you will find out
that that person doesn't feel the way you do. And
I did always find that out, and it didn't matter
(37:11):
how much time I spent looking for like, oh, he
doesn't care enough about me, because like it's actually kind
of funny in retrospect, in these situations, it's like, yeah,
I found out this person didn't feel the same way
I did and wasn't as like devoted to me as
I was to them, And it was completely regardless of
these little situations that I ass over control. It's like, yeah,
like that was just a waste of time.
Speaker 1 (37:32):
It's it's in regards to the health of your relationship,
it really is, and and also in regards to how
your partner handles Itcause if someone loves the attention despite
how that makes you feel, that is a red flag
to make that big red flag, because it's saying if
a guy was flirting with me and I could tell
it hurt my ex's feelings. Like a lot of people,
(37:53):
myself included, are human enough to like our our partners
feeling jealous or like kind of like excited by the
fact that, like, oh my god, you really like me.
Speaker 2 (38:02):
You don't want any other guy to be with me,
Like that's cool.
Speaker 1 (38:04):
I like that that that estimates how much you care
about me. I would never want someone I love to
feel bad, and if I am looking for that, then
I need to again look at the relationship and like
acknowledge that, like maybe I need validation so much that
I'm willing for someone else to suffer for that, and
that's not okay.
Speaker 3 (38:23):
Right, And also like it's like, yeah, it should be
as simple as like, oh, this makes me uncomfortable. Okay,
got it? You know, like it should be that simple. Yes,
it makes me uncomfortable. And I'm actually and I can
speak for you too. I'm pretty low maintenance.
Speaker 1 (38:35):
So if I'm asking for one thing and it has
to do with respect, as again, to go to VPR.
If I'm asking you not to make out with someone
in our friend group out of respect to me, you
can do that.
Speaker 3 (38:47):
I know. All right, let's just go to VPR because
it's clearly way it is.
Speaker 1 (38:51):
I mean, it's staring us right in the eye. It's
the last episode was the most egregious episode of television
I've ever seen. Viously, Raquel asks, first of all, Laala
for president. I'm sorry, I really, I really do love
her so much. I think she's the voice of reason.
Tom Sandival going after women to the point that his
(39:15):
girlfriend cries, you really see that she knows something is
going on. And she is also doing a very interesting
thing where when her friends bring up like, so, what
happened when Tom, Like basically when you found out he
lied about him not going to see you when your
grandmother died so we could be at a Labor Day party.
She was very much almost shitting on Lala, like, yeah,
I don't know why people need to feel like you
(39:35):
to like ask me all these questions. And I completely
understood where she was coming from, which was basically like,
leave my relationship alone.
Speaker 2 (39:43):
I'm protective of it, and also I don't really want
to look at it or think.
Speaker 1 (39:46):
About it exactly exactly, and I don't want to acknowledge
like that I'm with someone who I can't trust. Tom
Sandival picks a fight of like dude, why are you
always off me? And basically trying to slowly work with
Tom Schwarz to justify the fact that he's gonna leave
Arianna for Raquel. It is absurd, it's embarrassing, it's mean.
(40:07):
And you watch Ariana in these scenes and you can
tell she didn't know that they were going to do
a fight in front of camera because she's really confused.
Speaker 2 (40:15):
And again, it's.
Speaker 1 (40:15):
Sort of like just breaking up with someone rather than
cheating on them with their best friend is possible, so
much easy.
Speaker 3 (40:23):
It's the easier, softer way. When you watch a thing
like this, you're like, oh, that could have been so simple.
Also though, it's so funny because he's trying to make
this case and it like couldn't be. Like she's saying,
I would love if you spent time with me, and
he's like, the things you want to do to spend
time are not stimulating enough for me.
Speaker 2 (40:40):
I need to go to the club and be stimulating.
Speaker 3 (40:42):
He's basically like, if you don't want to do coke
with me, then we're not gonna spend quality time. But
I don't want to have sex, and she's like, I
don't really want to have sex unless we, like, could
her together quality time and she gives him, I swear
the easiest things of man for she doesn't even ask
for a date night. She's like, I would like to
go on a walk around the neighborhood together.
Speaker 2 (40:59):
Yeah, and then I'll have sex with you.
Speaker 3 (41:01):
And he's like, sorry, not stimulating enough, Like you're okay,
you are so unsupportive of me because you want to
go on a walk.
Speaker 1 (41:07):
Like he's a forty year old man who says quality
time to him is hand gliding hand gliding and doing
shrooms and staying up to watch the sunrise horrifying, Like
it's just so horrifying.
Speaker 2 (41:17):
And he has like white nail polish.
Speaker 3 (41:19):
Like I just white nail polish of silk blouse and
a mustache. You your boyfriend won't spend time with you
enough to go for a walk around the neighborhood. But
he's getting manicurious. I'm sorry not to be like gender normative,
but like.
Speaker 1 (41:32):
No, no, no bitch, no stand of all. And I
honestly not when it's anyone, because you need to be
able to cook dinner with me, to have sex with me,
and not use me as like a masturbatory device.
Speaker 2 (41:46):
I would love that sex right now. So I'm like,
I mean, that doesn't sound too bad, but can you
use me? You can? I mean, if you it's complicated.
It's complicated, Listen.
Speaker 3 (41:54):
Life is complicated, but it's not complicated when someone is
this disgusting. And fuck shorts for just like being an
accomplice to it and for hiding in the plants like
Lisa and Wedling. By the way, Lisa vander Pump I
came away from this episode, I was like, vander Pump.
Speaker 2 (42:09):
Is the mother.
Speaker 3 (42:11):
What's the thing of like voice of God, like deis
Mackina or whatever.
Speaker 2 (42:15):
It's like. She is literally like standing up and being.
Speaker 3 (42:18):
Like, listen, I want all of you to love each other,
and I believe in you all.
Speaker 2 (42:24):
And I'm like, okay, first of all, you shouldn't believe
in the Toms.
Speaker 3 (42:26):
But she was like, why the fuck is Tom Shorts
standing in the plants hiding.
Speaker 1 (42:31):
Get in the fight, especially when your ex wife is
getting yelled at by a man that's your friend. And
when Harry her mom I heard they cut out him
telling Terry to shut up.
Speaker 2 (42:43):
That is so fucking horrifory.
Speaker 1 (42:45):
Yes, and he said, I think it's a little tacky
to have your mom entering fights for you. It's like, really, bitch,
I think it's a little tacky for you to take
your mom's retirement fund to start a restaurant that you
don't work out because you're too fucking lazy.
Speaker 2 (42:57):
You know what else I think is tacky? What a whore?
Whoa a total hua?
Speaker 3 (43:04):
Telling Katie a girl who made out with Katie's ex
husband recent ex husband, telling her that she needs to
calm down about the dogs and like telling telling her
how to handle her divorce and trying this is okay.
Speaker 2 (43:22):
It was I Laala.
Speaker 1 (43:23):
I was like I was in Lalla's head when she
was just looking at it, and she could barely speak
because it was so insane, And Katie goes, what are
you doing right now? Get away from me. She's repeatedly
talk about boundaries. Neger would never be able to handle this.
She is repeatedly telling her to leave her alone and
saying even at one point, don't touch me, and Raquel
is following her around. It's so compulsive and scary to
(43:48):
be honest. And then this is what I found most upsetting.
Schwartz tells Katie to be nice to Raquel, and it's like,
you haven't stood up for this woman your entire marriage,
but you are standing up for Raquel to your ex wife.
Speaker 3 (44:00):
Because men are just like at the bottom line, men
are uncomfortable with women voicing anything that's not like support
of them. That's what I felt in that moment, Like
all the times like friendship, post breakup, no, because it's
like I have post breakup been told you need.
Speaker 2 (44:16):
To like be okay with like behavior, and it's like,
wait a second, no, I don't anymore.
Speaker 3 (44:19):
I don't like I'm not agreeing to this whole fucking
weird shit anymore, first of all, and second of all,
think about this.
Speaker 2 (44:26):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (44:26):
So I've had so many moments of being like, wait,
do I actually feel bad for Raquel? And I know
that sounds crazy, but it's like, I'm like, Okay, I
struggle with like wanting validation from men. I struggle with
like getting a nose job too, like she seems to
have alcoholism, Like I don't know.
Speaker 2 (44:40):
Like there's been moments where I'm like, is she okay?
Speaker 3 (44:43):
But then this is the timeline of events. She goes
to a after party of she's not invited to the
original thing. She goes to the after party anyway because
the two men she's learning with who are both one's
in a relationship and one's recently divorced from two people
she's friends with, she just wants attention from them.
Speaker 2 (45:00):
That's why she goes. She shows up.
Speaker 3 (45:02):
Her first move is to talk to the girlfriend of
the man she's having currently an affair with and try
to talk her into breaking up with him. She's like,
don't you think you're not attracted to him? Don't you
think it's weird? You guys, don't have sex because I
actually felt less attracted to James and then we broke up,
so maybe you should consider that.
Speaker 2 (45:17):
Basically trying to convince her to she.
Speaker 1 (45:20):
You want to be in this relationship and she's and
Aria goes yeah, and I mean I was like, I'm
so sorry, you are so stupid.
Speaker 2 (45:26):
We'requel going okay.
Speaker 3 (45:27):
Okay, yeakay, okay, got it to herself, got it, got
it okay, and then she.
Speaker 2 (45:32):
Moves on to the other That's the thing too.
Speaker 3 (45:35):
It's like people are like, oh, was the Tom was
the schwartz 'quel thing like a front?
Speaker 2 (45:39):
No, I think she would have gone with whichever one
gave her.
Speaker 3 (45:42):
Attention, And so she's like, Okay, I guess like, uh,
Sandoval and Ari aren't gonna break up, so let me
move back to Schwartz and Katie. And then she's like, Katie,
you need to like be cooler, like whatever. And that's
the thing too. She's the cool girl. She's the guy
that the guys are like, oh, we're friends with Raquel.
She doesn't care about anything. She'll do cope with us
in the hot tubs, she'll watch sports with us. Yeah,
(46:02):
it's because she has no fucking sense of self or self.
Speaker 1 (46:04):
Esteem and you're heading for a breakdown. Your value comes
from like men, and.
Speaker 3 (46:10):
By the way, you'll deserve that breakdown and everything it
comes with.
Speaker 2 (46:13):
And oh, I feel bad. I feel like she's like,
I think she's in danger.
Speaker 3 (46:18):
Okay, I've been in danger too, and I've had breakdowns too,
and I deserved that. I deserved that, and I was
fabled by it, and I changed and grew.
Speaker 2 (46:25):
And she that's her choice if she does that. I
think that Katie.
Speaker 1 (46:29):
I watched her watch what Katie went on watch What
Happens Live after that episode and pointed out a really
interesting narrative which I think is true, which is that
when Schwartz and Raquel made out, she thinks Raquel did
it to like play games with Tom because he was
obviously in a relationship, and to do it in front
of him and stuff. And she said, and that's why
she thinks Tom Standerbal told Tom Schwartz afterwards that they
(46:53):
were together to basically like get him a trull.
Speaker 3 (46:57):
Okay, See, this is the stuff we have to keep
track of. It's into like succession, like the business deals.
Speaker 1 (47:02):
Like I'm like, wait, this is like I don'kay, yeah,
I need more I need more time to really absorb it.
I mean again, just like Succession, I'm gonna watch this
all over again, probably multiple times, because it is so
intricate and such a wicked web we weave. We are
so excited for the finale. We're so excited for the reunion.
The reunion trailer is gorgeous.
Speaker 3 (47:24):
I have watched it so many times.
Speaker 1 (47:27):
Really, James Kennedy deserves a raise. He really does. He's
been giving us a lot. He's been holding this show
up in a lot of ways. Him throwing a drink
on Schwartz was really valuable to me. And and he
just doesn't get scared, and a part of that is alcoholism.
But the only thing he's scared of is Lisa vander Pump,
which I also think is very charming. I literally saw
a comment that he dig did under a picture of
(47:48):
Lisa with someone.
Speaker 2 (47:49):
He's like, Lisa looks amazing here. Love you Lisa.
Speaker 1 (47:52):
Oh my god, such a teenage boy. But he will
keep you guys posted. Thank you for listening to me
cry today. I can only hope that we can all
grow together. And I really mean that from the bottom
of my heart, because I think growth is the only
option and I want to make choices that open up
my heart rather than keeping it locked.
Speaker 2 (48:13):
And I'm grateful for you. Devin. I love you. I
love you, carolvnted. I want your tu it's so romantic.
(48:39):
Love me, baby, don't leave me, haggin. I want truth
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