October 30, 2024 • 53 mins
Welcome to Unbreakable! A mental wealth podcast hosted by Fox NFL Insider Jay Glazer. On today’s episode, Jay goes inside the cage with Brazilian Jujitsu legend and former Bellator Middleweight Champion, Rafael Lovato Jr. Lovato opens up about his rare brain disease that ultimately forced him to relinquish his belt and walk away from the one thing he loved. His story will absolutely blow you away and inspire you through the highs and lows and through it all learn his UNBREAKABLE spirit!
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
This is Unbreakable with Jay Glacier, a Mental Wealth podcast
Build you from the inside out.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Now here's Jay Glacier.
Speaker 3 (00:14):
Welcome in to Unbreakable, a Mental Wealth podcast with Jay Glazer.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
I'm Jay Glazer and Mike Yesterday.
Speaker 3 (00:20):
Matt is one of the most remarkable people you'll ever
be around your life because he is.
Speaker 2 (00:25):
He is a legit world champion. He's a world champion
in a couple different sports.
Speaker 3 (00:29):
The last time I saw this man, I was actually
calling his fight where he won the middleweight Championship of
the World for Belator, and then suddenly it all got
taken from him and he has since then turned it
all back around. He is an incredible human being, an
(00:50):
incredible champion, but an incredible comeback story.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
The one and only Raphael Levado Junior.
Speaker 1 (00:54):
How you doing, brother, I'm doing amazing. Thank you so
much for the kind words. Jay. It's great to do here.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
Man. Oh no, dude, man, and you're listen man.
Speaker 3 (01:01):
I mean the way you fight too is something that
we always kind of try and teach all our football
players that we trained and our fighters.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
Also just relent. Let's relent. Let's relent because a lot
of people sign up for sport. They don't sign up for.
Speaker 3 (01:13):
A fight, right, and you get to fight when you
just constantly pressure people.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
And I use it for business too.
Speaker 3 (01:19):
Constantly pressure people, most people just tend to tap the
fuck out, right.
Speaker 2 (01:24):
So I love the way you approach it all.
Speaker 3 (01:25):
And you know, I'm kind of I'm going to kind
of just give you the floor here and instead of
just you know, back going to the hall.
Speaker 2 (01:31):
You know, how'd you get invited to start and fighting
all that stuff?
Speaker 3 (01:34):
Tell the story about your ascending to the title and
then what happened?
Speaker 2 (01:39):
Will you how to give it up?
Speaker 4 (01:41):
Okay, it's a long story, but uh I got you
it short and sweet.
Speaker 2 (01:45):
Oh tell it?
Speaker 1 (01:45):
Tell it kind of bullet points. First thing, my father
is a lifetime martial artist. So I've been doing martial
arts since I was a kid. I'm an only child,
and it was basically my way to connect and bond
with my father. We would always his train. He was
my first teacher, my first coach, everything, and and so
I grew up doing martial arts under my dad. He
(02:06):
was a jee Kundo instructor and that was the main
thing that we did as I was growing up.
Speaker 4 (02:11):
And then in the mid nineties, real.
Speaker 2 (02:14):
Quick for people don't know what Chacundo's.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
It was Bruce Lee style that he created, yes, right,
and really was the first style that also integrated ground
fighting also into you know, your kung fu and stand
up and ever they got.
Speaker 1 (02:26):
Yeah, it was the first mixed martial arts before mixed
martial arts. Bruce Lee was way ahead of his time,
and so we were always on the cutting edge of
what was going on in the martial arts world. And
then in the early to mid nineties, my father discovered
Brazilian through Gikundo and so I loved martial arts, but
I really loved my dad. I loved just being with
(02:49):
my dad and feeling like I was one of the guys.
But when jiu jitsu came into our lives, then I
really found my passion. You know, I was still a kid,
so I was and you know, I was a big
kid though of course I'm a big guy, and I
was already around the same size as my dad when
I was a teenager, and you know, he's a smaller guy.
(03:11):
And jiu jitsu was just a way for us to
you know, really connect because he was traveling to learn
jiu jitsu. We were living here in Oklahoma, he was
going all the way to California to learn jiu jitsu,
and then you know, once or twice a year, and
then he would come home and he would show it
all to me, everything that he learned, and then we
would work through it together. And so we were like
(03:32):
each other's best training partners. And I was learning very quickly,
and being that most of our students were adult students,
you know, when I was doing like the stand up
arts and stuff like that, sparring with the big grown
ups when I'm a kid wasn't fun. But then when
we started really diving into the technique of the grappling,
I mean, I was holding my own right away, even
(03:54):
like beating a lot of the adults at you know,
thirteen years old. And so that's when I like, oh man,
I really love this, you know, And so I fell
in love with jiu jitsu and basically kind of went
away not too far away. I always practiced muy Thai,
and we had an MMA fight team back in those days,
and I was training with them, helping them, but my
(04:17):
main priority was to compete it in as much jiu
jitsu competition as I could, learn as much as I could.
That was what I really loved and I started going
to Brazil in nineteen ninety nine. I was sixteen years old,
had just turned sixteen. My parents flew me to Brazil
with like a team of Americans that were going there
to compete in the World Championships. And that was really
(04:38):
life changing for me because then I experienced jiu jitsu
and it's you know, mother Mother Earth, you know what
I mean where it all started.
Speaker 4 (04:46):
Yeah, yeah, and the Motherland.
Speaker 1 (04:47):
And just the pure raw like energy and everything about
it was just so captivating. And you know, I'm from
Oklahoma and now I'm in a third world country in Brazil.
The cold shock, all of it put together just really
changed my life. And then I was like, Okay, I
want to be an American who can win in Brazil.
(05:09):
That became like my first goal. And then the next
year I saw BJ Penn win the World Championships in
two thousand and I really set my sights just like,
I want to be the next guy to do that.
Speaker 4 (05:21):
And so I devoted my whole life to jiu jitsu.
Speaker 1 (05:24):
Basically all of my twenties, you know, was dedicated in
the competition space towards Brazilian jiu jitsu and my father
and I we became the first American son jiu jitsu
black belt. I ended up making a lot of history
as a non Brazilian in the sport of jiu jitsu,
winning many titles that hadn't been won by one before,
(05:45):
by anyone that wasn't.
Speaker 4 (05:46):
Brazilian, Like what tell people like what? Well?
Speaker 1 (05:49):
I became the first person to grand slam, the first
person not just you know, Brazilian or not good matters,
the first person which means winning the four major ib
JJF events in the same year, which is the European Championships,
the Pan American Championships, the Brazilian National Championships, and the
World Championships. So I did that in one year, and
(06:14):
with that, I also became the first American to win
all of those tournaments except the worlds BJ Pennat already
won the World So you know, I kind of just
broke a lot of records all in one shot.
Speaker 2 (06:29):
Class.
Speaker 1 (06:29):
It was my weight class, which was what my weight
class back then. I competed mostly at two twenty. Yeah,
I kind of floated around a little bit, but it was, uh,
you weigh in the day for jiu jitsu, like right
before your first match so you don't really cut too
much weight. And my training partner at the time, he
was in the two hundred pound weight class, so I
just kind of went up to not be in the
(06:50):
same division as him. But so I made a lot
of history and I won things repeatedly, and then I
became a NOG World Champion, ADCCS, all that kind of stuff,
and basically my whole twenties I dedicated to trying to
win as much as I could in jiu jitsu, and
you know, there were still a couple of things that
I felt like I didn't achieve that I was hoping
(07:11):
I would achieve. But for the most part, I became
very content and I started to lose the fire a
little bit. For jiu jitsu competition, I competed against so
many generations, all the best guys, fighting them multiple times.
You know. It was the same tournaments, the same people
over and over, and there was some growth in the sport,
but nothing like what's happened in the last five to
(07:32):
ten years, and so I kind of felt a little stagnant,
and I knew that at some point I was going
to enter in the mixed martial arts arena as a
martial artist. Growing up as a martial artist first and
then doing jiu jitsu second. I knew that at some
point I had to put it all together and put
myself in the ultimate challenge, which is, you know, getting
(07:56):
locked in the cage. And so when I got to
be thirty and I was like, I'm just I'm not
feeling the inspiration the way that I used to. Now
is the time to switch over. So I had my
first fight in twenty fourteen. I actually just celebrated ten
year anniversary. It was in September of twenty fourteen and
I was thirty one years old. So I started late.
Speaker 3 (08:18):
I just started my I just celebrated my twenty second
adversary of my first fight.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
I'm oh, yeah, fuck, that was back in the days
two thousand and three, baby, nice, nice, go ahead. Yeah,
you know there I was doing my first fight, and
you know, it felt like the right time, even though
you know, older for mma age. I knew that I
had done everything. You know in jiu jitsu. There's not
(08:44):
going to be any regrets. It was time to go
to the next stage. And I had good people around me,
and I was mature enough to you know, really understand
how to prepare and just what I was out there
to do, like what my purpose was, Well, my why
was the people that I need around me, and we
went all in, you know. From twenty fourteen was my
(09:05):
first fight and I became the Legacy champion and then
got signed to Bellatore and it was within five years
that I was fighting for that world title there in
London with you as the commentator, and you know, it
was just kind of a whole whirlwind.
Speaker 2 (09:20):
Fighting a legend. Yeah, and gig Or Masasi.
Speaker 3 (09:23):
Were like, I don't know what the odds were for
that fight, but they just always it was like five
to one.
Speaker 1 (09:28):
Yeah, underdog. I had been an underdog several times throughout
my career. I was always fighting guys with a lot
more fights, a lot more experience, you know, from from
from the get go, and uh my debut, I was
an underdog.
Speaker 4 (09:42):
You know, everyone had had good records. I never thought
it underdog.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
Your debut when you swept through everything in jiu jitsu.
Speaker 1 (09:50):
But everyone thought I was just a jiu jitsu guy. Jay.
They didn't know that I had the j E D background,
the upbringing in the striking arts. You know that everyone
just thought I was jiu jitsu guy, and I was
fighting with good records, you know, guys that were undefeated
or my first opponent was like five to one and
he had just had a couple of knockouts in a row,
so I was used to it. But definitely the Massosse fight,
(10:13):
you know, I was a huge underdog. It was on
his turf in Europe. You know, he was a legend,
considered one of the all time best, arguably in two
different way classes one eighty five and two five, and
he was like on a six year undefeated streak, beating
a multiple champions of UFC and Belltour, right, and so
it was like, you know, a lot of how to say,
(10:38):
there's a lot of pressure already, you know, just a lot. Okay,
this is the big one.
Speaker 4 (10:41):
You work so.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
Hard to get to this stage, to get to this point,
it's a lifetime of work, you know, and then everything
else happened on top of it. You know, it's like
you don't need to throw in more stress and more pressure.
But you know, basically, London, the title fight was in London,
and that was the first place that required me to
(11:03):
get a brain scan done as part of my pre
fight requirements and medicals and whatnot, and so oh, that's
my first time you had to get one. That was
the first time.
Speaker 2 (11:14):
Yeah, God yeah.
Speaker 4 (11:15):
Every other place here in the US, it's just one.
Speaker 3 (11:18):
Yeah, in Jersey and we were a lot of fucking
head but I still got to cat one. But wow,
I'm surprised that was the first one.
Speaker 1 (11:26):
That's yeah, that'sb I just never fought in a state
that required it.
Speaker 2 (11:29):
Wow.
Speaker 4 (11:30):
And so it just worked out that way.
Speaker 1 (11:32):
And I never had any concussions, never had any issues,
and so I never had reason to just go and
get one done on my own. And so you know,
all right, it's part of the requirements. And so I
go to get one done six weeks before the fight,
plenty of time. And actually like two days later from
(11:53):
the time that I was going to get the scan done,
I was flying to Brazil because my MMA team where
I do like my heart stint of sparring and just
intense training there in the south of Brazil in a
place called Kudi, Chiba where shoe Box is from, legendary place. Yeah,
(12:15):
And actually Vanderla was part of the team that I
trained with, and I've been training with him a few
years already at this point. But that's where I go
to get my like really hard part of that Rocky style,
just get away, full focus, you know. And so I
had that, like I was flying there Saturday to get
their Sunday and I got scanned on like Thursday, and
(12:39):
so I get my scan done here in Oklahoma, and uh,
I'll never forget it. Man. It was just like, you know,
I'm like, okay, just get it done. Have my paper
this thing that they're supposed to fill out for me afterwards.
And of course it's just the radiologist, you know, it's
not like a doctor doctor, just the person running the machine.
And he does, we do the procedure, and the machine stops,
(13:01):
and he's like taking forever to say okay, come on
get out, and you know, like come on out, doesn't
he doesn't leave the place where he sees the screen
and he's looking at my brain and he takes his time.
Finally he comes in and he pulls me out and
he's like, look, I don't know what's going on here,
but you need to see this. And he shows me
my skin and I see all these like blobs of
(13:23):
discoloration and basically just like white spots, and he's like,
I'm not one hundred percent sure what this is. But
you're not healthy, like you're not normal. There's something here.
And I'm like, uh okay, I mean I feel fine,
Like are you gonna sign my paper? You know what
I mean? And he's like no, and he's like, I
want to do a little research, look at this a
(13:45):
little more. Come back tomorrow and I'll give you your disc.
And so I go back the next day and he
gives me the disc. He refuses to sign the paper
and he's like, look, I think you have this and
it's called cavernoma. And he's like, I'm not sure, but
you need to really see some doctors, see some specialists.
And I got to say that there's no way, you know,
(14:07):
I can have you, I can recommend you to fight.
And so I'm just like completely shocked, just like and wait,
what is chavronova? So cabronoma now they call it. Yeah,
it's like they change the name a little bit. It's
like cavernous malformations. It has a longer name, but the
long story, or the abbreviated version of it is cavernoma.
(14:31):
And basically it's where your brain develops these extra blood
vessels and they grow like vines and they tend to
like wrap up and over time they have the you know,
the the risk of bleed and they can ooze blood
very very slowly, but of course it can build and
(14:54):
accumulate and there's a risk of hemorrhaging and a lot
of different things. You know, people have seizure, there's loss
of vision, paralysis, you know, comas and worst worst case,
worst case is death.
Speaker 4 (15:07):
But it's more common than you think. I think in
the US it's.
Speaker 1 (15:11):
Like one in four hundred people have it, maybe one
in five something like that. But most people don't know
that they have it, and it's usually a hereditary thing.
A lot of Hispanics have it, and I'm pretty sure
that's how I got it in my blood. I did
do the DNA test later on, and I was born
(15:33):
with it, So I do have the genetic deficiency. I've
had it my whole life. It's been there, but I
just didn't know. And most people don't know because they
don't have symptoms. And you know, you don't really get
symptoms usually until you're much older, you know, and in
the extreme cases, when you're younger, you know, you'll have
some issues and then they find it. Right, So then
(15:54):
you know you have it, but who knows. There may
be so many more people out there that have it
that don't know.
Speaker 2 (16:00):
But if you get punched in the head for a
living to speed up the process.
Speaker 1 (16:03):
It's not ideal. It's not ideal. You know. Now we'll
go to the next phase of the story. So I
found this out and it's Friday. I'm leaving Saturday for Brazil.
Speaker 2 (16:12):
I end up.
Speaker 1 (16:13):
I had a dinner plan with my wife that night,
she was my girlfriend. Then it was like, you know,
a goodbye dinner before I leave the next day. And
I'm like, I have nothing to say. I'm just like.
Speaker 4 (16:24):
Dead quiet the whole night.
Speaker 1 (16:25):
I'm just trying to process this and I'm just like
I don't know what I'm going to do. And so anyways,
I get to Brazil and my coach is there. They're
like legends. They grew up in Kudichiba. They know everybody
there were world renowned fighters, and so they have connections
all over and down there. Fighting is like, you know,
(16:47):
it's very well respected and so you know, they know
like big up people, right, and so they're pulling out
all the all the stops, just trying to get me
in everywhere and anywhere possible, and so I get another
scan done in Brazil because they want to see a
scan that's done in Brazil. So I get another scan done,
(17:08):
and I start seeing every doctor possible and act like neurology.
Speaker 2 (17:13):
At this point, are you trying to find that information?
Speaker 3 (17:17):
Are you just trying to get a doctor to clearly
clear you because you want to fly for that title.
Speaker 1 (17:21):
I'm all over the place at this point, Jay, You know,
I'm like extremely emotional feeling like okay, you know, you
know when you can tell that you're hurt, you know
what I mean, Like you feel it and you're like,
I'm not I'm not good.
Speaker 2 (17:37):
You know.
Speaker 1 (17:39):
I have that kind of feeling. But it's weird because
I feel the same I don't, you know. So I
have this feeling like man, I'm not okay, but I
can't see it or I don't really feel pain. And
then I'm worried, like am I putting myself at risk?
You know?
Speaker 4 (17:57):
Is this something that could cause serious damage?
Speaker 1 (18:00):
You know? I kept thinking about Muhammad Ali and you know,
Parkinson's and just stuff like that, and like I want
to have a family one day, and all these things
were going through my mind. I just really did not
know how to process it. And then at the same time,
I'm like, you know, if you're about like you're climbing
this mountain, right that is your life's career, your life's work.
(18:24):
I'm like right there about to hit the peak, you know,
and I'm like, man, is it? Am I really not
even going to be able to fight? You know? I
have no idea? And then I'm trying to train at
the same time to prepare just in case it is
going to happen, and I'm not sleeping and I'm super emotional.
I'm like crying every day. And then I so obviously
(18:46):
my training is going terrible, and every time I take
a good hit in the head, I'm just like, dude,
what am I doing? What am I doing? You know?
And so it was like terrible, terrible, terrible energy to
have in a World Championship camp, you know what I mean.
And so we're starting to do the rounds to the doctors,
(19:08):
and you know, the first couple of doctors we sit
down and talk to and they're just like they're shutting
it down quick, and you know, they're really pleading with
me not to fight and not to spar not to
like to live another life, basically, to do something else.
(19:30):
And one doctor, it got so bad we stopped even
going to the doctors. We just sent them the scans
and just say hey, just tell us over the phone
yes or no. You know, like we're trying to get
through all of them and just speed up the process.
And it's no, no, no, no, no, over and over
again for a whole week. This is week two, my
(19:51):
second week in Brazil, Like we went through the whole
freaking Rolodex. And one doctor even says, you shouldn't even
do jiu jitsu because choking and the loss of blood
to my brain could be dangerous, and you know, like
just a combination of all those effects could be bad.
(20:12):
And then, you know, when I heard that news, all
its just like.
Speaker 2 (20:15):
Yeah, take away your purpose?
Speaker 1 (20:17):
Yeah, like what now? And then of course, literally that
same day, I'm sparring and then I tear my ham
strength and sparring it pops really bad, like just in
a takedown sequence. It stretched, it pops, and it just
makes sense. You know. Of course I'm stressed and you know,
just not in a good frame of mind, and I
(20:38):
brought that interergy to my training, and of course that's
when you get hurt. And I had to get carried
out of the academy that day, and I'm just bawling,
just crying, and then I tell my coach, I'm like,
I give up.
Speaker 4 (20:49):
It's not happening. That's it, you know, it's not happening.
Speaker 1 (20:52):
And at this point, we are four weeks out from
the fight, and that was like Thursday, and so that
that whole weekend, Friday through Sunday, I just stay home.
I can't train. I'm trying to do whatever I can
to heal my leg. I set up, I'm putting like
creams on it and doing all that stuff, trying to
stretch it, and I'm just like whatever. And we had
(21:13):
one more doctor to see on Monday. And this doctor
happened to be like the professor. He was like the
most experienced, you know, most senior neurologist of that area
of Brazil, and he was the professor for many of
the other doctors I had already seen. He was a ner,
not only just a neurologist, but a neurosurgeon as well,
(21:37):
so he actually has hands on experience operating on the brain.
And so we see him Monday night and I'm just like, okay,
that final one right, literally the last guy prepared for
him to say no. We sit down with him and
he was the first one to ask me, tell me
how you feel. And so I feel good, Like I've
(21:59):
never had any I don't even really get headaches. There's
never been anything in my life to make me think
that I had some sort of problem, you know. Upstairs,
and he's like okay, and he does a series of
tests with me, just keeps talking with me, and he
was like, look, it's not a perfect world that you're
doing what you're doing, but listen, your condition.
Speaker 4 (22:20):
It has the ability to change at any given time
without any signs, any symptoms, any nothing like.
Speaker 1 (22:28):
It's something that can just take the term for the
worst at any point in your life. And we have
no way of predicting. And and he pulls out he's
got his computer there, and he starts typing. He's like,
I'm gonna look to see if there's some sort of
journals or studies or research papers or anything that says
that head trauma can can make it worse, you know.
(22:50):
And he was like, I guarantee I'm not going to
find anything. He starts typing, da, da da, No, there's nothing.
There's nothing. There's nothing here that says clearly that me
get in the head, hitting the head is gonna make
it worse or speed it up. And so I'm like, okay,
so what are you saying. He was like, I don't
think it's a problem for you to fight. You keep
doing what you're doing. And now that we know, we
(23:13):
can really keep our eyes on this and if there's
a change, then I'm gonna tell you not to fight anymore.
But for now we're gonna I want you to get
another scan done we get closer to the fight and
get scans in after fight, and he's like, basically, you're
gonna need to get scans done pretty routinely, you know,
for the rest of your life, and just keep tabs
on it. And if we see a change, then we're
(23:35):
gonna have to, you know, change something with your lifestyle.
And I'm like, okay, so are you going to sign
my letter? You know, are you going to sign the paper?
He's like, yes, I have no problem with that.
Speaker 2 (23:46):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (23:47):
So he signs the paper and makes another letter giving
all of his credentials and why he thinks what he thinks,
Da da da stamps it the whole thing. And as
soon as I walked out of that office, man, I
just started balley and I hugged my coach. He was
there with me. And it's not just my coach, he's
my brother. We had been on this journey at this
point for ten years together. He's my black belt in
(24:10):
jiu jitsu and I'm his black belt in Muay tie.
So we have this beautiful teacher student relationship. And you know,
it just started crying. I'm like, okay, we're gonna fight.
We're gonna fight. And now it's less than a month out,
but I got a freaking torn hamstring backed Yeah, so
not ideal. And basically I work around the hamstring for
(24:32):
the next couple of weeks. I send everything into Bellotour.
They have to send it all into the commission in London.
And we didn't get the news that they were going
to allow me to fight until two weeks before the fight.
So two weeks before the fight that I finally know
for sure the fight was gonna happen. Wow, And I
(24:52):
didn't have like all of these things.
Speaker 2 (24:54):
What's It's hard to train like that too, because you
gotta have no right.
Speaker 3 (25:00):
It's man, it's horrible horrible to take a beat and
when you don't know if you have something because even.
Speaker 4 (25:06):
Gonna happen, Yeah, it's gonna happen.
Speaker 1 (25:08):
Yeah, And and trying to stay positive, like you're confident.
You need confidence, you know. And it was the worst
camp I've ever done in my life, one hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (25:17):
It's got to be like, I'm not doing Shark when
I'm on fight. I'm not fucking going against five guys
in fucking five minutes. This, I'm not doing this. I'm
not Yeah, I don't. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (25:27):
The internal conversation was all over the place, stuff like that,
just all of it.
Speaker 4 (25:32):
But inside of that couple of weeks from.
Speaker 1 (25:35):
Finding out to that seeing that doctor there, I did
a lot of walks, I did a lot of meditation,
and I knew that I had to do that fight.
I knew if there was any way I could do it,
I had to do it because it meant everything, you know.
It was like my legacy, you know, my my name,
for my father being his son and and him raising
(26:00):
me as a martial artist and everything that we had
been through in our journey and my team and just
all of it. I was like, if there's no other fight,
I can have I have to do this one.
Speaker 2 (26:11):
I have so you being a lot to go on
year terms instead of having it.
Speaker 1 (26:15):
Taken from you right right, And so I really honed in, deep,
deep to my sense of purpose and what that fight
meant to me. More than just being a world champion.
It was so much deeper than that. And you know,
so basically the whole team gets out there. I'm dealing
with my leg all the way until the very end.
(26:35):
But you know, I'll never forget when we were in
the warm up area backstage's getting ready to go. I
talked about this on Joe's podcast, Joe Rogan Show. When
I when I came out with all of this information.
You know, I had this book with me that I
took to all of my fights. It's a Think and
Grow Rich by Napoleon Hill. So many great pieces in
(26:57):
that book that just really changed my life when I
was younger and just keeps me focused. And I didn't
open it up the whole time during camp, even out
there in London, but I always pack it in my bag.
I just take it with me and backstage I open
it up to read a little bit before I'm really
starting to you know, get get the Blood flowing and
(27:20):
that the flap was saved in a spot of in
the book. And so where I opened the book, the
first thing I see is a highlighted section that I
had marked, and it reads, every adversity carries with it
the seed of an equivalent advantage. And right then and
there it hit me. And I was like, I remember
(27:41):
smiling and kind of getting a little little teary eye,
and I looked at my dad, I looked at my coaches,
my you know, my team, my family, and I'm just like,
I'm gonna win this fucking fight, you know. And and
I kind of smiled at them, and I was just like,
this is our night, you know. And I mean, I'm
getting good goosebumps right now. And that was it, man,
You know of the fight.
Speaker 3 (28:00):
That at that point, the fight becomes the easy part
compared to the struggle.
Speaker 1 (28:03):
You're just one hundred percent right. And my opponent had
been very vocal about how he was fighting for money
and just you know, not price, not purpose, not purpose,
and uh, and I knew right there I want this
more than he does one hundred percent. There's I wouldn't
be here, I wouldn't have made it there if I
(28:24):
didn't want it with every inch, every ounce of my being,
you know.
Speaker 4 (28:29):
So that was it, man, And sure enough the fight
went the way it did.
Speaker 2 (28:33):
Well.
Speaker 3 (28:33):
You you again, you fought that night too, like you
were relentless. You fought that night like, hey man, someone's
trying to take this from me, and I am going
to brutalize this person in front of me and make
sure there is no way I don't come out here
with my hand raised. It was clear you absolutely just
(28:53):
impose your will in every way.
Speaker 2 (28:55):
From the time the bell.
Speaker 4 (28:56):
Rang, well, I mean it had. It was a back
and forth fight.
Speaker 1 (29:00):
He had his moments, for sure, and my whole thing was,
I'm leaving everything out here, you know, I'm not every
possible amount of effort I can put. I'm gonna put
into this, into this fight in this cage. And you know,
I'd only had nine fights. He had like fifty, you know,
he had only lost like five fights. For I think
it was even less at that point. You know, I'm
(29:21):
a huge underdog. I'd never done championship rounds, you know,
going to the fourth and fifth round, you know, and
like after the second round ended, and I was like
holding him so much and using the grappling and the
wrestling my arms like the lactic acid was pumping, and
I was like, dude, I'm kind of a little tired already.
(29:42):
And we still got three more rounds, you know, And
I was winning the third round until the last couple
of minutes. I was on his back and I had
this half a second of like, I can tell I'm
starting to fall off his back, ye, and I needed
to put more energy climb back on his back and
stay on his back and hold him.
Speaker 4 (30:03):
But I was like, ah, I'm.
Speaker 1 (30:04):
A little tired, and say I have a good guard,
It's okay if I land on bottom. And that was
terrible and I accepted bottom position, and you know, he
is well well known for having incredible ground and pound,
and I kind of took him lightly in that moment.
I was like, I'm so much better on the ground.
I'll do guard. I'll be fine. And I gave him
that a little bit of life when he finally got
(30:27):
me off and he just unleashed and I got cut
and you know, definitely lost that around, got beat up.
And then in the fourth round, I couldn't see because
I'm bleeding in my eye, and so I'm like trying
to fight with one eye, and then he he poked
me in the other eye, in my good eye, and so.
Speaker 4 (30:46):
Then I'm like totally like I can't see.
Speaker 1 (30:47):
I didn't complain the ref or anything, and I'm like
this and then boom, he sticks an uppercut right in
the middle. I had no idea where it came from,
and I fell. It wasn't like it rocked me so bad,
but I just didn't know where they were coming from,
and so I just I fell it, and you know,
so then he scored a knockdown and so he won
that round. So now we're too too going into the
fifth round, and my corner is just like calmly but intensely,
(31:12):
you know, one more round.
Speaker 4 (31:15):
Everything you got, you know, this is your destiny.
Speaker 1 (31:18):
Go out there. All you need to do is get
one more takedown. And I had this surge of energy.
It was like everything that I went through in the
camp just hit me. And it was like here we are,
last five minutes, Like how bad do you want it?
Speaker 4 (31:29):
Let's go, Let's go.
Speaker 1 (31:31):
And I remember getting up and just being like.
Speaker 4 (31:34):
Like, okay, here we are.
Speaker 1 (31:37):
And I told myself I had this saying I'm wearing
it on my shirt. Right now. I've been saying it
like for a long time. I can't even I mean
even before I started MMA. Every time I'm in a
camp and I'm you know, preparing for something big. When
I do my last round of sparring training or a
conditioning circuit, whatever it is, when it comes down to
(31:59):
that last round, I used to tell myself the last
round is my best round. Last round is my best round.
I always try to finish strong, always try to finish strong.
And I was telling that to myself walking out for
that fifth and final round, and it just energized me.
And the referee brings us to the middle to shake
hands for the final round, and I remember looking right
(32:21):
into Sassy's eyes and smiling and I'm.
Speaker 4 (32:24):
Just like, you know, just ready, like okay, here we go.
Speaker 1 (32:27):
And it turned out to be my best round, My
best round of the whole fight was the last round.
Speaker 2 (32:31):
Were talking about you imposing your will.
Speaker 4 (32:33):
Yes, he didn't even touch me that round.
Speaker 1 (32:35):
I immediately pressured him, put him against the cage, took
him down, did a lot of damage that round and
completely controlled it. And that won me the fight. And
so that was I said, I was going to keep
it short and sweet. That was a long great I
love it you kid.
Speaker 4 (32:50):
That was it so again.
Speaker 3 (32:51):
Now so now here's the second part though. Okay, so
you win this title fight.
Speaker 2 (32:56):
You were again, you were you were man. You were
all world in that.
Speaker 3 (33:00):
That fight because you did go through adversity. Her round
was kind of you dominated for the first four minutes.
They sent along those lines and then got caught right,
you know, sloppy there. But that fifth round, man, it
was just like, man, every once in a while, like
only a couple of times in your life, you get
to find out who the fuck you are. A you
did for that fifth round, yes, sir, and we're like, man,
what he just did to Massasse?
Speaker 2 (33:20):
No one's beating his cat for a while. And then
after that, now I want you to take you there
because that was your last fight.
Speaker 1 (33:28):
So I came out of it and in my head
I just kind of like turned off all that stuff
I went through. And up to this point in time,
nobody knew except my coaches that were in Brazil with
me and my girlfriend is now my wife, you know,
they were the only ones that knew even about the
(33:49):
medical issue, and I just I didn't want to tell anybody,
you know, I didn't want to worry like my parents.
Speaker 4 (33:54):
My dad was in my corner.
Speaker 1 (33:55):
I didn't even tell my dad. I didn't want to really, yeah,
I didn't want him to to, you know, to pull
me back or to not you know, be confident in me.
Speaker 2 (34:05):
And it's also a celebration time. You're the middleweight champ
in the world.
Speaker 1 (34:08):
Yeah, and so you know, definitely super happy, you know,
feel very fulfilled and moving forward, you know, belt who
gives me a little break? Da da da, And they're like, okay,
we want to do the rematch. And I said, great,
let's do it. And in my head, I'm like, after that,
(34:29):
you know, if I get a good camp and the
evolution that came in my training after that fight, going
five rounds and knowing, you know, you find yourself. I mean,
it takes time. I was just then hitting my black
belt level of MMA. I felt like I graduated to
a black belt in MMA at that point, like Okay,
(34:50):
now I really am getting this.
Speaker 4 (34:52):
And so we signed a rematch.
Speaker 1 (34:54):
The fight was in the very end of June, and
then we signed the rematch to happen in Janeuary in
LA and so, you know, by the fall October November
I'm starting to get into camp again, and uh and
I'm just on fire. I'm feeling so good. I'm so
confident and there's no way he's going to make it
out five rounds this time. I'm going to finish him
(35:15):
this time. And we signed everything. I renegotiated my contract
and my life is about to get really really good
because I'm the you know, I'm the champion. Now I
can headline big cards. I want to fight, you know,
it's gonna fight at the form. I had a dream
of fighting in Madison Square Garden and Bellatore was going
there and I had all this like, man, my name
is going to be up there. I'm going to headline.
(35:36):
I'm gonna be the champ, and we're going to finally
make some money and I'm going to set up my my,
my whole life, you know, with this. This is going
to be career, retirement, everything. And so life is looking good. Well,
I'm in the in the camp for the rematch and
I get a call super random and it's a it's
(35:59):
a neurology just from Ireland and he tells me that
after the fight, they decided to make a whole board
to study my case. Look at my scans and come
up with some sort of precedent for what if this
(36:21):
happens again in the future. Because it was such a
unique situation, no one really knew what to do and
how to how to approach it. And he's like, look,
we made this board, we talked about your case, we
looked at your scans, and we all voted, and you
will not be allowed to fight here in Europe ever again.
And I'm telling you right now you need to stop fighting.
(36:43):
And I'm like, oh, okay, here we are again, you know.
And I'm in another camp already and I already had
everything set up and it's still it's like November and
some still a couple.
Speaker 4 (36:56):
Months out, so I have some time, but not that
much time.
Speaker 1 (36:59):
And so I call it Rich and I'm like, Rich,
I just got this call from with Rich show with
the BELLI right, yeah, yeah, our guy guy exactly, great guy.
Here's my my contact for everything. Him and Mike Cogan,
another great guy. And I call it Bridge and I'm like, dude,
this doctor, he just hit me with a big one.
And I'm really concerned to what California is gonna say.
(37:21):
So let's let's start the process now, because I'm not
doing a whole camp and waiting till two weeks before
the fight to know if I'm going to fight again,
And so they give me set up at UCLA.
Speaker 4 (37:32):
We book a trip.
Speaker 1 (37:33):
Immediately, I go to California, go to UCLA and and.
Speaker 4 (37:40):
See a specialist there.
Speaker 1 (37:42):
Keep in mind, the fight had already been signed and everything,
but they hadn't announced it yet. And behind the scenes,
I'm like telling people, Oh, yeah, we're gonna fight. We're
gonna fight, that the news is coming, news is coming,
news is coming, and nothing's going out because we're all
concerned about California. And I'm getting like, message, what are
you going to defend your bell? You're scared of Messa
see all this stuff. I'm like, dude, I've already signed,
(38:04):
I'm ready to go, you know. I'm I'm dealing with
all of this, trying to keep it quiet. So I
go to UCLA, see a specialist, get more scans again. Uh,
nothing had got nothing changed. There's not like anything had
grown or nothing had gotten worse. And that was after
the fight. I mean, really, my whole career, I didn't
really ever get hit in a fight until that fight,
(38:25):
and uh, you know, nothing changed. So good signs. Everything
look good. Talk to UCLA, tell them the whole thing.
They say the same thing. Man, there's no there's no
evidence and there's nothing that supports this is going to
make it worse. The extra risk is very very very
very small. We're okay with it as long as you're
(38:47):
okay with it. And we keep getting scans. We see
you again, Da da dad, And I'm like, yes, yes, yes,
they ride out of thing. We get it all to
Belletour and they sent it to the California Athletic Commission.
Now it's all up to them. Wait wait, wait, wait,
wait comes back. No. I got a call from Rich
not going to happen. He was like, look now that
(39:08):
it's official. California says no. Europe says no, we don't
know what to do. You're our champ and we don't
want to put you in freaking you know, Kansas or
Idaho or whatever. We need you to fight on big shows.
But these are going to be in states and places
that you know I mean. And even if they tried
(39:29):
to undercover slide me in somewhere else, that commission could
talk to them and say, hey, you guys, know what's
going on. You know, and so it was this whole
thing and they're like, we don't know what we're going
to do with you. And I'm in limbo for a
few weeks, and then finally I had this opportunity to
get on Joe's Show, and I'm just like, man, guys,
let me just get my story out there, because I
(39:50):
need to get off my chest. Still to this point.
All the way until like a week before I went
to do Joe Show, I hadn't told anybody. I hadn't
told even my family. And finally I tell them and
I say, hey, I'm just going to let it all
out on Joe's show so everyone can hear it all
at once and get the record straight, know what's going on.
And so basically no one was going to approve me.
(40:14):
And that was that, and so I had to relinquish
my belt. I told the whole story and got it
out there, huge weight off my shoulders. I felt so
much better, so much lighter after that, and it was
one of the toughest things I'd ever been through, ever
did in that moment.
Speaker 4 (40:31):
You know, just letting it all out on Joe's show
is very emotional for me.
Speaker 1 (40:35):
Yeah, that was that. It was just like you get
to the top of the mountain, you're so happy and
you know, and then it's over. You know. But as
hard as all that was, I'll tell you what I've
been through since, just so grateful, you know. I realized
that that was this part of my destiny, part of
my story, and I really like honed in on a
(40:57):
new purpose. I came back to to got to save
my goodbye to jujitsu and grappling, and been able to
do some big things on this side of the sport,
my other love, you.
Speaker 4 (41:07):
Know, gee and no gee, and have you won several
more world titles?
Speaker 1 (41:12):
Right?
Speaker 4 (41:13):
Not world titles.
Speaker 1 (41:14):
I did win some of the titles and won some
big matches, and I did ABCC and I was just
recently the silver medallist and the nine to nine kilogram
division and that's like our Olympics. Yeah, I was the
oldest guy to ever make it to the finals of
that division. So you know, good stuff, you know, definitely
no complaints of course that happened.
Speaker 2 (41:36):
You know.
Speaker 1 (41:37):
The fight was in nineteen and I did Joe Show
in January of twenty twenty, and then I had the
grand opening for my academy, my new academy huge, beautiful,
ten thousand square foot space. I used all my earnings
from my fights to invest in this place, and I
had to take on a pretty substantial commercial loan, you know.
(41:59):
So I went into to make this place possible. And
I did that thinking, Oh, all the money I'm gonna
make from my fights, now, I'm gonna pay this off
in less than a year, like it's gonna be no problem.
And you know, I had all these plans, but then
fighting stopped, and then I'm like, well, that's okay. Business
is going to do great. You know, the beautiful new school.
Speaker 4 (42:18):
I'm I'm world champion, mm a, you know, great everything.
Speaker 1 (42:21):
Dad. Pandemic hits two weeks after our grand opening, had
to close the doors for three months. Not near as
bad here in Oklahoma as where it was everyone. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
terrible out there, terrible, So I can't imagine that. But
it was just a whirlwind of all these things hitting
(42:42):
me like, you know, down, little up, down and even
harder again, you know, and it's just like, dude, what's
going on? But it got me to where I am today,
and my girlfriend became my wife. We have kids now.
I have two year old twins and at the end
(43:02):
of twenty two, Japan's borders opened back up and they
started having international fighters come in for fighting events there,
and I got the opportunity to come back and fight
one more time three and a half years after that
title fight, and the fact that I stayed active in
(43:24):
jiu jitsu and I didn't just stop. You know, I
could have said, Okay, good career, did my thing. Gee
noge jiu jitsu, MMA world champion, good career, I'm gonna
call it. But instead I just like, let me keep pushing,
let me go back to jiu jitsu, fight all the
new young guys I hadn't competed against yet, do all
these competitions again. Just keep pushing, keep pushing. And that
(43:47):
kept me in shape, and it kept me, It kept
me sharp. And so when Japan called and I had
the opportunity to do a fight in Japan, I was like,
I was ready and I had my MMA guys, my team.
I was still helping them. So I had still been sparring,
still been moving, and I got to fight in Japan.
That's a picture of me in the ring right after
(44:08):
it happened with our twin babies in Japan, just five
months after they were born, and I got to do
my goodbye, my go out on my terms, you know,
because the commission told me I couldn't fight anymore. Good
thing about Japan, they don't care about anything, right. I
was like, you guys need a letter something, and they're like, nah,
(44:31):
I know.
Speaker 2 (44:33):
It was great. Yeah, people, it's great. Oh yeah, it's great. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 4 (44:37):
They're like, no, you're fine, You're good. I'm like, okay, cool.
So I got to fight there.
Speaker 1 (44:43):
I thought an undefeated kid, he's like twenty five years
old eight and O.
Speaker 4 (44:47):
Submit him in the first round and that was that.
Speaker 1 (44:50):
Still retired undefeated, but didn't go the way I planned it,
but still a beautiful story nonetheless, and I still got
to make my last round the best round.
Speaker 2 (44:58):
Here's a couple of things I'll try with one I want.
Speaker 3 (45:01):
You to always remember, right, And I just went through
this with Mark Kerr, the smashing machine, right, legend of legends.
He went through a hard time and he and I
were training in Arizona and he's like, you know, I'm
really fucking struggling like I used to be Mark Kerr.
I'm like, no, motherfucker, You're always Mark Kerr. You'll never
not be if you won a title, you got suddenly
(45:23):
like people won world titles and they lose, doesn't take
away you were a world champion.
Speaker 2 (45:28):
You were one and one at one point. So for
the rest of your life, you take that.
Speaker 3 (45:31):
By the way, the funny part was is as he
said that, the kid behind the desk wherever were said,
I'm sorry, are you Mark Kerr? I'm like you say
it like man, right there, it's like godlike step like
stepped in, like I'm gonna remind you.
Speaker 2 (45:46):
Just for you to always remind yourself, okay, no matter what.
Speaker 3 (45:49):
You fucking climbed the top of the mountain. That's it, right.
And you know the other great thing about the sport.
I try and teach my guys like, fuck the winner
of the lost, don't worry about it.
Speaker 2 (46:00):
It's, man, the fight, the honor of the fight.
Speaker 3 (46:02):
If you take that ego part out of it, it
makes you a lot more dangerous than everybody who's trying
to fucking not lose, er trying only when you know,
put on that pressure.
Speaker 2 (46:10):
It's the fight itself. But the fight itself comes from
this fucking community. And you're such a big part of
this fucking community. It's the most special beautiful.
Speaker 3 (46:18):
Like my life is great because I have football and
fighting and the two best locker rooms on the planet.
You put a bunch of football players and fighters together,
you'll solve all the world's problems, you know, And you
have that, and you're such an integral part of that.
I hope you've been able to love yourself up for
this and go, oh no, I fucking was at the
pinnacle and I've reached every dream every other fighter wished
(46:39):
she could have done. And use that as your equity
for the rest of your life. That suddainly doesn't leave
when the uniform comes off, when the helmet comes off,
or when your gloves come off.
Speaker 1 (46:48):
Yeah, one hundred percent, Jay, You know the journey, The
journey is beautiful, man, And I've been so fortunate to
have this incredible martial arts journey, you know, from going
to zil as a kid, and you know, experiencing jiu
jitsu in the roots before it's become this big, you know,
(47:08):
global sport now and having the opportunity to represent myself
in the cage and express myself as a true martial artist.
You know, I've had so many losses in jiu jitsu
on those mats and so you know, I know what
it's like to have to pick yourself back up again
and stay positive.
Speaker 4 (47:27):
You know, I was never a world champion at the
lower belts.
Speaker 1 (47:30):
You know, nowadays these kids that are winning black belt
world titles, ninety nine percent of them, like they've been
world champion at blue, purple, brown, like over and over again.
There they've been phenoms. Like people expect all of this
of them. You know, I was a kid from Oklahoma
who never had a black belt. You know, it's just
me and my dad on her own. We were studying
on VHS tapes. We're having to fly all over the
(47:52):
world just to learn, just to be able to go
somewhere to ask someone our question. You know, hey, can
you answer a question? You know, and all these things
like I wasn't supposed to get to where I got
by any means, and you know, it was that unbreakable
spirit and just never stopped believing and under and how
to like you turn your adversity into the advantage like
(48:14):
gift exactly exactly, and it makes you appreciate it so
much more and then you have so much more to
offer as well, because at the end of the day,
the fighting I mean in jiu jitsu. Don't get me wrong,
there's old guye divisions, you know, until until you're you know,
until you're doster. Yeah, Master seven eight. I don't know
(48:35):
how far it goes, but I'll be in there, I
promise you, because I love it. I love it and
it's who I am. But you know, the glory days
come to an end. But then it's like what you learned,
who you became, all the lessons and the experience that
you get to share with everyone else, you know, with
those around you. You know, that.
Speaker 4 (48:57):
Becomes the new mission.
Speaker 1 (49:00):
Right It's like, okay, let me pass this on, let
me help the next generation, let me try to make
a positive impact on everybody else. That's what Last Round,
Best Round is all about for me. That's why I
put it out there to help everybody else, you know,
stay positive and never give up and learn how to
you know, just appreciate the journey and you know, take
(49:21):
all those those obstacles and just say, okay, this is
going to make my story even better and just make
you stronger, and you.
Speaker 2 (49:29):
Got to celebrate yourself forever. You know.
Speaker 3 (49:31):
I have friends like Lindsey Vonn who just keeps your
metals away. I'm like, no, put them up there because
that was my past life.
Speaker 2 (49:36):
No, it's not.
Speaker 3 (49:37):
What's behind your ribcage got you to be that, So
celebrate it forever. For you, your title belt means more
than everybody else's. So I hope you have it up
there prominently somewhere forever because it says a different story
from every other champion who's ever fought.
Speaker 2 (49:55):
I hope you can always celebrate yourself for that.
Speaker 1 (49:57):
Thank you, Jay, It means a lot to me.
Speaker 2 (49:59):
Absolutely, yeah, brother, I love you, man. I appreciate you
joining me. I was gonna ask you what your unbreakable
moment is, but you fucking you answered it.
Speaker 4 (50:06):
So I had a lot, man, I have a lot.
Speaker 1 (50:08):
Like I said, all the times I failed in jiu
jitsu and wondering if it was going to happen, and
you know, it just kept going. You know, That's what
it's all about. And uh, what I've grown to learn
is it just gets better and better. Like you know,
the best is always yet to come, right, as long
as you keep going, the best is always yet to come. People, Okay,
(50:29):
I'm not you know, fighting on a world stage at
Wimbley Arena in London, right now. But there's new meaning,
new purpose, and you know, I have my kids like
that right there, you know, with with my twins in
the cage in Japan on a come like on a
fight that shouldn't have happened. But you know, that was
something that was even sweeter even though it wasn't a
(50:50):
world title, even sweeter than winning the world title because
that is going to live in their lives forever, that moment,
like you know, their dad didn't give up and I
got that opportunity and three and a half years after
it all went down, you know, at like forty years old,
I went in that cage or in that ring and
I won, and I brought them in there, and having
(51:13):
them in my life is a big reason why I
did it, you know, because it's like I got to
show them anything is possible when you don't give up. So,
you know, like I said, it just the journey just
gets sweeter. You appreciate it more. The relationships to people
that you have around you, if you keep going, those
grow stronger.
Speaker 4 (51:33):
You appreciate those people more. Like just you know, it's beautiful.
Speaker 1 (51:37):
Man. I've had such a blessed life and I'm very
very grateful and you know, getting to talk to you
about it, like, hey, this is awesome.
Speaker 2 (51:43):
You know what I mean. Bless you came on to brother.
I really appreciate it, man.
Speaker 3 (51:46):
Yeah, I've always had a lot of love for you
to dude, and just man, I've admired your you know,
your decision always to be like.
Speaker 2 (51:53):
I'm just going to keep fucking going, and it's just
it's huge.
Speaker 3 (51:56):
A lot of people sit back and go, oh, man,
life me a shitty hand. So as a result, I'm
gonna just sit down here and sulk about my shitty hand.
Speaker 2 (52:04):
And you never did, and I'm sure you know there's
a lot of shitty moments.
Speaker 3 (52:08):
He just kept moving forward, man, And that well, like
I said, the unbreakable part is things that could have
broken us and didn't. As a result, we came through
the other side of that tunnel stronger. And that is
our fucking equity forever in life.
Speaker 2 (52:20):
Yes, that's our superpower. So I'm proud of you, brother.
I appreciate you joining me.
Speaker 1 (52:24):
Man.
Speaker 2 (52:24):
I love the dude. When you come out to l A,
We're definitely fucking breaking bread.
Speaker 1 (52:28):
Yeah, for sure, for sure, I'm looking forward to it.
And if I can put it out there, Last Round,
Best Round dot Com. There's a whole documentary that Will
Harris did about that Japan fight. He went to Japan
with us, Will Harris Anatomy of a Fighter. A beautiful,
beautiful job he did. And and stay tuned because you're
gonna hear a lot more about Last Round, Best Round
(52:49):
in the future. And and that's it. So thank you
so much.
Speaker 2 (52:53):
God can do to help promote brother. I got you,
I got right back, all right.
Speaker 1 (52:56):
I appreciate that.
Speaker 2 (52:58):
Thank you, Thank you my brother, love you body.
Speaker 1 (53:02):
Thank you.
This is Unbreakable with Jay Glacier, a Mental Wealth podcast
Build you from the inside out.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Now here's Jay Glacier.
Speaker 3 (00:14):
Welcome in to Unbreakable, a Mental Wealth podcast with Jay Glazer.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
I'm Jay Glazer and Mike Yesterday.
Speaker 3 (00:20):
Matt is one of the most remarkable people you'll ever
be around your life because he is.
Speaker 2 (00:25):
He is a legit world champion. He's a world champion
in a couple different sports.
Speaker 3 (00:29):
The last time I saw this man, I was actually
calling his fight where he won the middleweight Championship of
the World for Belator, and then suddenly it all got
taken from him and he has since then turned it
all back around. He is an incredible human being, an
(00:50):
incredible champion, but an incredible comeback story.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
The one and only Raphael Levado Junior.
Speaker 1 (00:54):
How you doing, brother, I'm doing amazing. Thank you so
much for the kind words. Jay. It's great to do here.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
Man. Oh no, dude, man, and you're listen man.
Speaker 3 (01:01):
I mean the way you fight too is something that
we always kind of try and teach all our football
players that we trained and our fighters.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
Also just relent. Let's relent. Let's relent because a lot
of people sign up for sport. They don't sign up for.
Speaker 3 (01:13):
A fight, right, and you get to fight when you
just constantly pressure people.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
And I use it for business too.
Speaker 3 (01:19):
Constantly pressure people, most people just tend to tap the
fuck out, right.
Speaker 2 (01:24):
So I love the way you approach it all.
Speaker 3 (01:25):
And you know, I'm kind of I'm going to kind
of just give you the floor here and instead of
just you know, back going to the hall.
Speaker 2 (01:31):
You know, how'd you get invited to start and fighting
all that stuff?
Speaker 3 (01:34):
Tell the story about your ascending to the title and
then what happened?
Speaker 2 (01:39):
Will you how to give it up?
Speaker 4 (01:41):
Okay, it's a long story, but uh I got you
it short and sweet.
Speaker 2 (01:45):
Oh tell it?
Speaker 1 (01:45):
Tell it kind of bullet points. First thing, my father
is a lifetime martial artist. So I've been doing martial
arts since I was a kid. I'm an only child,
and it was basically my way to connect and bond
with my father. We would always his train. He was
my first teacher, my first coach, everything, and and so
I grew up doing martial arts under my dad. He
(02:06):
was a jee Kundo instructor and that was the main
thing that we did as I was growing up.
Speaker 4 (02:11):
And then in the mid nineties, real.
Speaker 2 (02:14):
Quick for people don't know what Chacundo's.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
It was Bruce Lee style that he created, yes, right,
and really was the first style that also integrated ground
fighting also into you know, your kung fu and stand
up and ever they got.
Speaker 1 (02:26):
Yeah, it was the first mixed martial arts before mixed
martial arts. Bruce Lee was way ahead of his time,
and so we were always on the cutting edge of
what was going on in the martial arts world. And
then in the early to mid nineties, my father discovered
Brazilian through Gikundo and so I loved martial arts, but
I really loved my dad. I loved just being with
(02:49):
my dad and feeling like I was one of the guys.
But when jiu jitsu came into our lives, then I
really found my passion. You know, I was still a kid,
so I was and you know, I was a big
kid though of course I'm a big guy, and I
was already around the same size as my dad when
I was a teenager, and you know, he's a smaller guy.
(03:11):
And jiu jitsu was just a way for us to
you know, really connect because he was traveling to learn
jiu jitsu. We were living here in Oklahoma, he was
going all the way to California to learn jiu jitsu,
and then you know, once or twice a year, and
then he would come home and he would show it
all to me, everything that he learned, and then we
would work through it together. And so we were like
(03:32):
each other's best training partners. And I was learning very quickly,
and being that most of our students were adult students,
you know, when I was doing like the stand up
arts and stuff like that, sparring with the big grown
ups when I'm a kid wasn't fun. But then when
we started really diving into the technique of the grappling,
I mean, I was holding my own right away, even
(03:54):
like beating a lot of the adults at you know,
thirteen years old. And so that's when I like, oh man,
I really love this, you know, And so I fell
in love with jiu jitsu and basically kind of went
away not too far away. I always practiced muy Thai,
and we had an MMA fight team back in those days,
and I was training with them, helping them, but my
(04:17):
main priority was to compete it in as much jiu
jitsu competition as I could, learn as much as I could.
That was what I really loved and I started going
to Brazil in nineteen ninety nine. I was sixteen years old,
had just turned sixteen. My parents flew me to Brazil
with like a team of Americans that were going there
to compete in the World Championships. And that was really
(04:38):
life changing for me because then I experienced jiu jitsu
and it's you know, mother Mother Earth, you know what
I mean where it all started.
Speaker 4 (04:46):
Yeah, yeah, and the Motherland.
Speaker 1 (04:47):
And just the pure raw like energy and everything about
it was just so captivating. And you know, I'm from
Oklahoma and now I'm in a third world country in Brazil.
The cold shock, all of it put together just really
changed my life. And then I was like, Okay, I
want to be an American who can win in Brazil.
(05:09):
That became like my first goal. And then the next
year I saw BJ Penn win the World Championships in
two thousand and I really set my sights just like,
I want to be the next guy to do that.
Speaker 4 (05:21):
And so I devoted my whole life to jiu jitsu.
Speaker 1 (05:24):
Basically all of my twenties, you know, was dedicated in
the competition space towards Brazilian jiu jitsu and my father
and I we became the first American son jiu jitsu
black belt. I ended up making a lot of history
as a non Brazilian in the sport of jiu jitsu,
winning many titles that hadn't been won by one before,
(05:45):
by anyone that wasn't.
Speaker 4 (05:46):
Brazilian, Like what tell people like what? Well?
Speaker 1 (05:49):
I became the first person to grand slam, the first
person not just you know, Brazilian or not good matters,
the first person which means winning the four major ib
JJF events in the same year, which is the European Championships,
the Pan American Championships, the Brazilian National Championships, and the
World Championships. So I did that in one year, and
(06:14):
with that, I also became the first American to win
all of those tournaments except the worlds BJ Pennat already
won the World So you know, I kind of just
broke a lot of records all in one shot.
Speaker 2 (06:29):
Class.
Speaker 1 (06:29):
It was my weight class, which was what my weight
class back then. I competed mostly at two twenty. Yeah,
I kind of floated around a little bit, but it was, uh,
you weigh in the day for jiu jitsu, like right
before your first match so you don't really cut too
much weight. And my training partner at the time, he
was in the two hundred pound weight class, so I
just kind of went up to not be in the
(06:50):
same division as him. But so I made a lot
of history and I won things repeatedly, and then I
became a NOG World Champion, ADCCS, all that kind of stuff,
and basically my whole twenties I dedicated to trying to
win as much as I could in jiu jitsu, and
you know, there were still a couple of things that
I felt like I didn't achieve that I was hoping
(07:11):
I would achieve. But for the most part, I became
very content and I started to lose the fire a
little bit. For jiu jitsu competition, I competed against so
many generations, all the best guys, fighting them multiple times.
You know. It was the same tournaments, the same people
over and over, and there was some growth in the sport,
but nothing like what's happened in the last five to
(07:32):
ten years, and so I kind of felt a little stagnant,
and I knew that at some point I was going
to enter in the mixed martial arts arena as a
martial artist. Growing up as a martial artist first and
then doing jiu jitsu second. I knew that at some
point I had to put it all together and put
myself in the ultimate challenge, which is, you know, getting
(07:56):
locked in the cage. And so when I got to
be thirty and I was like, I'm just I'm not
feeling the inspiration the way that I used to. Now
is the time to switch over. So I had my
first fight in twenty fourteen. I actually just celebrated ten
year anniversary. It was in September of twenty fourteen and
I was thirty one years old. So I started late.
Speaker 3 (08:18):
I just started my I just celebrated my twenty second
adversary of my first fight.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
I'm oh, yeah, fuck, that was back in the days
two thousand and three, baby, nice, nice, go ahead. Yeah,
you know there I was doing my first fight, and
you know, it felt like the right time, even though
you know, older for mma age. I knew that I
had done everything. You know in jiu jitsu. There's not
(08:44):
going to be any regrets. It was time to go
to the next stage. And I had good people around me,
and I was mature enough to you know, really understand
how to prepare and just what I was out there
to do, like what my purpose was, Well, my why
was the people that I need around me, and we
went all in, you know. From twenty fourteen was my
(09:05):
first fight and I became the Legacy champion and then
got signed to Bellatore and it was within five years
that I was fighting for that world title there in
London with you as the commentator, and you know, it
was just kind of a whole whirlwind.
Speaker 2 (09:20):
Fighting a legend. Yeah, and gig Or Masasi.
Speaker 3 (09:23):
Were like, I don't know what the odds were for
that fight, but they just always it was like five
to one.
Speaker 1 (09:28):
Yeah, underdog. I had been an underdog several times throughout
my career. I was always fighting guys with a lot
more fights, a lot more experience, you know, from from
from the get go, and uh my debut, I was
an underdog.
Speaker 4 (09:42):
You know, everyone had had good records. I never thought
it underdog.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
Your debut when you swept through everything in jiu jitsu.
Speaker 1 (09:50):
But everyone thought I was just a jiu jitsu guy. Jay.
They didn't know that I had the j E D background,
the upbringing in the striking arts. You know that everyone
just thought I was jiu jitsu guy, and I was
fighting with good records, you know, guys that were undefeated
or my first opponent was like five to one and
he had just had a couple of knockouts in a row,
so I was used to it. But definitely the Massosse fight,
(10:13):
you know, I was a huge underdog. It was on
his turf in Europe. You know, he was a legend,
considered one of the all time best, arguably in two
different way classes one eighty five and two five, and
he was like on a six year undefeated streak, beating
a multiple champions of UFC and Belltour, right, and so
it was like, you know, a lot of how to say,
(10:38):
there's a lot of pressure already, you know, just a lot. Okay,
this is the big one.
Speaker 4 (10:41):
You work so.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
Hard to get to this stage, to get to this point,
it's a lifetime of work, you know, and then everything
else happened on top of it. You know, it's like
you don't need to throw in more stress and more pressure.
But you know, basically, London, the title fight was in London,
and that was the first place that required me to
(11:03):
get a brain scan done as part of my pre
fight requirements and medicals and whatnot, and so oh, that's
my first time you had to get one. That was
the first time.
Speaker 2 (11:14):
Yeah, God yeah.
Speaker 4 (11:15):
Every other place here in the US, it's just one.
Speaker 3 (11:18):
Yeah, in Jersey and we were a lot of fucking
head but I still got to cat one. But wow,
I'm surprised that was the first one.
Speaker 1 (11:26):
That's yeah, that'sb I just never fought in a state
that required it.
Speaker 2 (11:29):
Wow.
Speaker 4 (11:30):
And so it just worked out that way.
Speaker 1 (11:32):
And I never had any concussions, never had any issues,
and so I never had reason to just go and
get one done on my own. And so you know,
all right, it's part of the requirements. And so I
go to get one done six weeks before the fight,
plenty of time. And actually like two days later from
(11:53):
the time that I was going to get the scan done,
I was flying to Brazil because my MMA team where
I do like my heart stint of sparring and just
intense training there in the south of Brazil in a
place called Kudi, Chiba where shoe Box is from, legendary place. Yeah,
(12:15):
And actually Vanderla was part of the team that I
trained with, and I've been training with him a few
years already at this point. But that's where I go
to get my like really hard part of that Rocky style,
just get away, full focus, you know. And so I
had that, like I was flying there Saturday to get
their Sunday and I got scanned on like Thursday, and
(12:39):
so I get my scan done here in Oklahoma, and uh,
I'll never forget it. Man. It was just like, you know,
I'm like, okay, just get it done. Have my paper
this thing that they're supposed to fill out for me afterwards.
And of course it's just the radiologist, you know, it's
not like a doctor doctor, just the person running the machine.
And he does, we do the procedure, and the machine stops,
(13:01):
and he's like taking forever to say okay, come on
get out, and you know, like come on out, doesn't
he doesn't leave the place where he sees the screen
and he's looking at my brain and he takes his time.
Finally he comes in and he pulls me out and
he's like, look, I don't know what's going on here,
but you need to see this. And he shows me
my skin and I see all these like blobs of
(13:23):
discoloration and basically just like white spots, and he's like,
I'm not one hundred percent sure what this is. But
you're not healthy, like you're not normal. There's something here.
And I'm like, uh okay, I mean I feel fine,
Like are you gonna sign my paper? You know what
I mean? And he's like no, and he's like, I
want to do a little research, look at this a
(13:45):
little more. Come back tomorrow and I'll give you your disc.
And so I go back the next day and he
gives me the disc. He refuses to sign the paper
and he's like, look, I think you have this and
it's called cavernoma. And he's like, I'm not sure, but
you need to really see some doctors, see some specialists.
And I got to say that there's no way, you know,
(14:07):
I can have you, I can recommend you to fight.
And so I'm just like completely shocked, just like and wait,
what is chavronova? So cabronoma now they call it. Yeah,
it's like they change the name a little bit. It's
like cavernous malformations. It has a longer name, but the
long story, or the abbreviated version of it is cavernoma.
(14:31):
And basically it's where your brain develops these extra blood
vessels and they grow like vines and they tend to
like wrap up and over time they have the you know,
the the risk of bleed and they can ooze blood
very very slowly, but of course it can build and
(14:54):
accumulate and there's a risk of hemorrhaging and a lot
of different things. You know, people have seizure, there's loss
of vision, paralysis, you know, comas and worst worst case,
worst case is death.
Speaker 4 (15:07):
But it's more common than you think. I think in
the US it's.
Speaker 1 (15:11):
Like one in four hundred people have it, maybe one
in five something like that. But most people don't know
that they have it, and it's usually a hereditary thing.
A lot of Hispanics have it, and I'm pretty sure
that's how I got it in my blood. I did
do the DNA test later on, and I was born
(15:33):
with it, So I do have the genetic deficiency. I've
had it my whole life. It's been there, but I
just didn't know. And most people don't know because they
don't have symptoms. And you know, you don't really get
symptoms usually until you're much older, you know, and in
the extreme cases, when you're younger, you know, you'll have
some issues and then they find it. Right, So then
(15:54):
you know you have it, but who knows. There may
be so many more people out there that have it
that don't know.
Speaker 2 (16:00):
But if you get punched in the head for a
living to speed up the process.
Speaker 1 (16:03):
It's not ideal. It's not ideal. You know. Now we'll
go to the next phase of the story. So I
found this out and it's Friday. I'm leaving Saturday for Brazil.
Speaker 2 (16:12):
I end up.
Speaker 1 (16:13):
I had a dinner plan with my wife that night,
she was my girlfriend. Then it was like, you know,
a goodbye dinner before I leave the next day. And
I'm like, I have nothing to say. I'm just like.
Speaker 4 (16:24):
Dead quiet the whole night.
Speaker 1 (16:25):
I'm just trying to process this and I'm just like
I don't know what I'm going to do. And so anyways,
I get to Brazil and my coach is there. They're
like legends. They grew up in Kudichiba. They know everybody
there were world renowned fighters, and so they have connections
all over and down there. Fighting is like, you know,
(16:47):
it's very well respected and so you know, they know
like big up people, right, and so they're pulling out
all the all the stops, just trying to get me
in everywhere and anywhere possible, and so I get another
scan done in Brazil because they want to see a
scan that's done in Brazil. So I get another scan done,
(17:08):
and I start seeing every doctor possible and act like neurology.
Speaker 2 (17:13):
At this point, are you trying to find that information?
Speaker 3 (17:17):
Are you just trying to get a doctor to clearly
clear you because you want to fly for that title.
Speaker 1 (17:21):
I'm all over the place at this point, Jay, You know,
I'm like extremely emotional feeling like okay, you know, you
know when you can tell that you're hurt, you know
what I mean, Like you feel it and you're like,
I'm not I'm not good.
Speaker 2 (17:37):
You know.
Speaker 1 (17:39):
I have that kind of feeling. But it's weird because
I feel the same I don't, you know. So I
have this feeling like man, I'm not okay, but I
can't see it or I don't really feel pain. And
then I'm worried, like am I putting myself at risk?
You know?
Speaker 4 (17:57):
Is this something that could cause serious damage?
Speaker 1 (18:00):
You know? I kept thinking about Muhammad Ali and you know,
Parkinson's and just stuff like that, and like I want
to have a family one day, and all these things
were going through my mind. I just really did not
know how to process it. And then at the same time,
I'm like, you know, if you're about like you're climbing
this mountain, right that is your life's career, your life's work.
(18:24):
I'm like right there about to hit the peak, you know,
and I'm like, man, is it? Am I really not
even going to be able to fight? You know? I
have no idea? And then I'm trying to train at
the same time to prepare just in case it is
going to happen, and I'm not sleeping and I'm super emotional.
I'm like crying every day. And then I so obviously
(18:46):
my training is going terrible, and every time I take
a good hit in the head, I'm just like, dude,
what am I doing? What am I doing? You know?
And so it was like terrible, terrible, terrible energy to
have in a World Championship camp, you know what I mean.
And so we're starting to do the rounds to the doctors,
(19:08):
and you know, the first couple of doctors we sit
down and talk to and they're just like they're shutting
it down quick, and you know, they're really pleading with
me not to fight and not to spar not to
like to live another life, basically, to do something else.
(19:30):
And one doctor, it got so bad we stopped even
going to the doctors. We just sent them the scans
and just say hey, just tell us over the phone
yes or no. You know, like we're trying to get
through all of them and just speed up the process.
And it's no, no, no, no, no, over and over
again for a whole week. This is week two, my
(19:51):
second week in Brazil, Like we went through the whole
freaking Rolodex. And one doctor even says, you shouldn't even
do jiu jitsu because choking and the loss of blood
to my brain could be dangerous, and you know, like
just a combination of all those effects could be bad.
(20:12):
And then, you know, when I heard that news, all
its just like.
Speaker 2 (20:15):
Yeah, take away your purpose?
Speaker 1 (20:17):
Yeah, like what now? And then of course, literally that
same day, I'm sparring and then I tear my ham
strength and sparring it pops really bad, like just in
a takedown sequence. It stretched, it pops, and it just
makes sense. You know. Of course I'm stressed and you know,
just not in a good frame of mind, and I
(20:38):
brought that interergy to my training, and of course that's
when you get hurt. And I had to get carried
out of the academy that day, and I'm just bawling,
just crying, and then I tell my coach, I'm like,
I give up.
Speaker 4 (20:49):
It's not happening. That's it, you know, it's not happening.
Speaker 1 (20:52):
And at this point, we are four weeks out from
the fight, and that was like Thursday, and so that
that whole weekend, Friday through Sunday, I just stay home.
I can't train. I'm trying to do whatever I can
to heal my leg. I set up, I'm putting like
creams on it and doing all that stuff, trying to
stretch it, and I'm just like whatever. And we had
(21:13):
one more doctor to see on Monday. And this doctor
happened to be like the professor. He was like the
most experienced, you know, most senior neurologist of that area
of Brazil, and he was the professor for many of
the other doctors I had already seen. He was a ner,
not only just a neurologist, but a neurosurgeon as well,
(21:37):
so he actually has hands on experience operating on the brain.
And so we see him Monday night and I'm just like, okay,
that final one right, literally the last guy prepared for
him to say no. We sit down with him and
he was the first one to ask me, tell me
how you feel. And so I feel good, Like I've
(21:59):
never had any I don't even really get headaches. There's
never been anything in my life to make me think
that I had some sort of problem, you know. Upstairs,
and he's like okay, and he does a series of
tests with me, just keeps talking with me, and he
was like, look, it's not a perfect world that you're
doing what you're doing, but listen, your condition.
Speaker 4 (22:20):
It has the ability to change at any given time
without any signs, any symptoms, any nothing like.
Speaker 1 (22:28):
It's something that can just take the term for the
worst at any point in your life. And we have
no way of predicting. And and he pulls out he's
got his computer there, and he starts typing. He's like,
I'm gonna look to see if there's some sort of
journals or studies or research papers or anything that says
that head trauma can can make it worse, you know.
(22:50):
And he was like, I guarantee I'm not going to
find anything. He starts typing, da, da da, No, there's nothing.
There's nothing. There's nothing here that says clearly that me
get in the head, hitting the head is gonna make
it worse or speed it up. And so I'm like, okay,
so what are you saying. He was like, I don't
think it's a problem for you to fight. You keep
doing what you're doing. And now that we know, we
(23:13):
can really keep our eyes on this and if there's
a change, then I'm gonna tell you not to fight anymore.
But for now we're gonna I want you to get
another scan done we get closer to the fight and
get scans in after fight, and he's like, basically, you're
gonna need to get scans done pretty routinely, you know,
for the rest of your life, and just keep tabs
on it. And if we see a change, then we're
(23:35):
gonna have to, you know, change something with your lifestyle.
And I'm like, okay, so are you going to sign
my letter? You know, are you going to sign the paper?
He's like, yes, I have no problem with that.
Speaker 2 (23:46):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (23:47):
So he signs the paper and makes another letter giving
all of his credentials and why he thinks what he thinks,
Da da da stamps it the whole thing. And as
soon as I walked out of that office, man, I
just started balley and I hugged my coach. He was
there with me. And it's not just my coach, he's
my brother. We had been on this journey at this
point for ten years together. He's my black belt in
(24:10):
jiu jitsu and I'm his black belt in Muay tie.
So we have this beautiful teacher student relationship. And you know,
it just started crying. I'm like, okay, we're gonna fight.
We're gonna fight. And now it's less than a month out,
but I got a freaking torn hamstring backed Yeah, so
not ideal. And basically I work around the hamstring for
(24:32):
the next couple of weeks. I send everything into Bellotour.
They have to send it all into the commission in London.
And we didn't get the news that they were going
to allow me to fight until two weeks before the fight.
So two weeks before the fight that I finally know
for sure the fight was gonna happen. Wow, And I
(24:52):
didn't have like all of these things.
Speaker 2 (24:54):
What's It's hard to train like that too, because you
gotta have no right.
Speaker 3 (25:00):
It's man, it's horrible horrible to take a beat and
when you don't know if you have something because even.
Speaker 4 (25:06):
Gonna happen, Yeah, it's gonna happen.
Speaker 1 (25:08):
Yeah, And and trying to stay positive, like you're confident.
You need confidence, you know. And it was the worst
camp I've ever done in my life, one hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (25:17):
It's got to be like, I'm not doing Shark when
I'm on fight. I'm not fucking going against five guys
in fucking five minutes. This, I'm not doing this. I'm
not Yeah, I don't. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (25:27):
The internal conversation was all over the place, stuff like that,
just all of it.
Speaker 4 (25:32):
But inside of that couple of weeks from.
Speaker 1 (25:35):
Finding out to that seeing that doctor there, I did
a lot of walks, I did a lot of meditation,
and I knew that I had to do that fight.
I knew if there was any way I could do it,
I had to do it because it meant everything, you know.
It was like my legacy, you know, my my name,
for my father being his son and and him raising
(26:00):
me as a martial artist and everything that we had
been through in our journey and my team and just
all of it. I was like, if there's no other fight,
I can have I have to do this one.
Speaker 2 (26:11):
I have so you being a lot to go on
year terms instead of having it.
Speaker 1 (26:15):
Taken from you right right, And so I really honed in, deep,
deep to my sense of purpose and what that fight
meant to me. More than just being a world champion.
It was so much deeper than that. And you know,
so basically the whole team gets out there. I'm dealing
with my leg all the way until the very end.
(26:35):
But you know, I'll never forget when we were in
the warm up area backstage's getting ready to go. I
talked about this on Joe's podcast, Joe Rogan Show. When
I when I came out with all of this information.
You know, I had this book with me that I
took to all of my fights. It's a Think and
Grow Rich by Napoleon Hill. So many great pieces in
(26:57):
that book that just really changed my life when I
was younger and just keeps me focused. And I didn't
open it up the whole time during camp, even out
there in London, but I always pack it in my bag.
I just take it with me and backstage I open
it up to read a little bit before I'm really
starting to you know, get get the Blood flowing and
(27:20):
that the flap was saved in a spot of in
the book. And so where I opened the book, the
first thing I see is a highlighted section that I
had marked, and it reads, every adversity carries with it
the seed of an equivalent advantage. And right then and
there it hit me. And I was like, I remember
(27:41):
smiling and kind of getting a little little teary eye,
and I looked at my dad, I looked at my coaches,
my you know, my team, my family, and I'm just like,
I'm gonna win this fucking fight, you know. And and
I kind of smiled at them, and I was just like,
this is our night, you know. And I mean, I'm
getting good goosebumps right now. And that was it, man,
You know of the fight.
Speaker 3 (28:00):
That at that point, the fight becomes the easy part
compared to the struggle.
Speaker 1 (28:03):
You're just one hundred percent right. And my opponent had
been very vocal about how he was fighting for money
and just you know, not price, not purpose, not purpose,
and uh, and I knew right there I want this
more than he does one hundred percent. There's I wouldn't
be here, I wouldn't have made it there if I
(28:24):
didn't want it with every inch, every ounce of my being,
you know.
Speaker 4 (28:29):
So that was it, man, And sure enough the fight
went the way it did.
Speaker 2 (28:33):
Well.
Speaker 3 (28:33):
You you again, you fought that night too, like you
were relentless. You fought that night like, hey man, someone's
trying to take this from me, and I am going
to brutalize this person in front of me and make
sure there is no way I don't come out here
with my hand raised. It was clear you absolutely just
(28:53):
impose your will in every way.
Speaker 2 (28:55):
From the time the bell.
Speaker 4 (28:56):
Rang, well, I mean it had. It was a back
and forth fight.
Speaker 1 (29:00):
He had his moments, for sure, and my whole thing was,
I'm leaving everything out here, you know, I'm not every
possible amount of effort I can put. I'm gonna put
into this, into this fight in this cage. And you know,
I'd only had nine fights. He had like fifty, you know,
he had only lost like five fights. For I think
it was even less at that point. You know, I'm
(29:21):
a huge underdog. I'd never done championship rounds, you know,
going to the fourth and fifth round, you know, and
like after the second round ended, and I was like
holding him so much and using the grappling and the
wrestling my arms like the lactic acid was pumping, and
I was like, dude, I'm kind of a little tired already.
(29:42):
And we still got three more rounds, you know, And
I was winning the third round until the last couple
of minutes. I was on his back and I had
this half a second of like, I can tell I'm
starting to fall off his back, ye, and I needed
to put more energy climb back on his back and
stay on his back and hold him.
Speaker 4 (30:03):
But I was like, ah, I'm.
Speaker 1 (30:04):
A little tired, and say I have a good guard,
It's okay if I land on bottom. And that was
terrible and I accepted bottom position, and you know, he
is well well known for having incredible ground and pound,
and I kind of took him lightly in that moment.
I was like, I'm so much better on the ground.
I'll do guard. I'll be fine. And I gave him
that a little bit of life when he finally got
(30:27):
me off and he just unleashed and I got cut
and you know, definitely lost that around, got beat up.
And then in the fourth round, I couldn't see because
I'm bleeding in my eye, and so I'm like trying
to fight with one eye, and then he he poked
me in the other eye, in my good eye, and so.
Speaker 4 (30:46):
Then I'm like totally like I can't see.
Speaker 1 (30:47):
I didn't complain the ref or anything, and I'm like
this and then boom, he sticks an uppercut right in
the middle. I had no idea where it came from,
and I fell. It wasn't like it rocked me so bad,
but I just didn't know where they were coming from,
and so I just I fell it, and you know,
so then he scored a knockdown and so he won
that round. So now we're too too going into the
fifth round, and my corner is just like calmly but intensely,
(31:12):
you know, one more round.
Speaker 4 (31:15):
Everything you got, you know, this is your destiny.
Speaker 1 (31:18):
Go out there. All you need to do is get
one more takedown. And I had this surge of energy.
It was like everything that I went through in the
camp just hit me. And it was like here we are,
last five minutes, Like how bad do you want it?
Speaker 4 (31:29):
Let's go, Let's go.
Speaker 1 (31:31):
And I remember getting up and just being like.
Speaker 4 (31:34):
Like, okay, here we are.
Speaker 1 (31:37):
And I told myself I had this saying I'm wearing
it on my shirt. Right now. I've been saying it
like for a long time. I can't even I mean
even before I started MMA. Every time I'm in a
camp and I'm you know, preparing for something big. When
I do my last round of sparring training or a
conditioning circuit, whatever it is, when it comes down to
(31:59):
that last round, I used to tell myself the last
round is my best round. Last round is my best round.
I always try to finish strong, always try to finish strong.
And I was telling that to myself walking out for
that fifth and final round, and it just energized me.
And the referee brings us to the middle to shake
hands for the final round, and I remember looking right
(32:21):
into Sassy's eyes and smiling and I'm.
Speaker 4 (32:24):
Just like, you know, just ready, like okay, here we go.
Speaker 1 (32:27):
And it turned out to be my best round, My
best round of the whole fight was the last round.
Speaker 2 (32:31):
Were talking about you imposing your will.
Speaker 4 (32:33):
Yes, he didn't even touch me that round.
Speaker 1 (32:35):
I immediately pressured him, put him against the cage, took
him down, did a lot of damage that round and
completely controlled it. And that won me the fight. And
so that was I said, I was going to keep
it short and sweet. That was a long great I
love it you kid.
Speaker 4 (32:50):
That was it so again.
Speaker 3 (32:51):
Now so now here's the second part though. Okay, so
you win this title fight.
Speaker 2 (32:56):
You were again, you were you were man. You were
all world in that.
Speaker 3 (33:00):
That fight because you did go through adversity. Her round
was kind of you dominated for the first four minutes.
They sent along those lines and then got caught right,
you know, sloppy there. But that fifth round, man, it
was just like, man, every once in a while, like
only a couple of times in your life, you get
to find out who the fuck you are. A you
did for that fifth round, yes, sir, and we're like, man,
what he just did to Massasse?
Speaker 2 (33:20):
No one's beating his cat for a while. And then
after that, now I want you to take you there
because that was your last fight.
Speaker 1 (33:28):
So I came out of it and in my head
I just kind of like turned off all that stuff
I went through. And up to this point in time,
nobody knew except my coaches that were in Brazil with
me and my girlfriend is now my wife, you know,
they were the only ones that knew even about the
(33:49):
medical issue, and I just I didn't want to tell anybody,
you know, I didn't want to worry like my parents.
Speaker 4 (33:54):
My dad was in my corner.
Speaker 1 (33:55):
I didn't even tell my dad. I didn't want to really, yeah,
I didn't want him to to, you know, to pull
me back or to not you know, be confident in me.
Speaker 2 (34:05):
And it's also a celebration time. You're the middleweight champ
in the world.
Speaker 1 (34:08):
Yeah, and so you know, definitely super happy, you know,
feel very fulfilled and moving forward, you know, belt who
gives me a little break? Da da da, And they're like, okay,
we want to do the rematch. And I said, great,
let's do it. And in my head, I'm like, after that,
(34:29):
you know, if I get a good camp and the
evolution that came in my training after that fight, going
five rounds and knowing, you know, you find yourself. I mean,
it takes time. I was just then hitting my black
belt level of MMA. I felt like I graduated to
a black belt in MMA at that point, like Okay,
(34:50):
now I really am getting this.
Speaker 4 (34:52):
And so we signed a rematch.
Speaker 1 (34:54):
The fight was in the very end of June, and
then we signed the rematch to happen in Janeuary in
LA and so, you know, by the fall October November
I'm starting to get into camp again, and uh and
I'm just on fire. I'm feeling so good. I'm so
confident and there's no way he's going to make it
out five rounds this time. I'm going to finish him
(35:15):
this time. And we signed everything. I renegotiated my contract
and my life is about to get really really good
because I'm the you know, I'm the champion. Now I
can headline big cards. I want to fight, you know,
it's gonna fight at the form. I had a dream
of fighting in Madison Square Garden and Bellatore was going
there and I had all this like, man, my name
is going to be up there. I'm going to headline.
(35:36):
I'm gonna be the champ, and we're going to finally
make some money and I'm going to set up my my,
my whole life, you know, with this. This is going
to be career, retirement, everything. And so life is looking good. Well,
I'm in the in the camp for the rematch and
I get a call super random and it's a it's
(35:59):
a neurology just from Ireland and he tells me that
after the fight, they decided to make a whole board
to study my case. Look at my scans and come
up with some sort of precedent for what if this
(36:21):
happens again in the future. Because it was such a
unique situation, no one really knew what to do and
how to how to approach it. And he's like, look,
we made this board, we talked about your case, we
looked at your scans, and we all voted, and you
will not be allowed to fight here in Europe ever again.
And I'm telling you right now you need to stop fighting.
(36:43):
And I'm like, oh, okay, here we are again, you know.
And I'm in another camp already and I already had
everything set up and it's still it's like November and
some still a couple.
Speaker 4 (36:56):
Months out, so I have some time, but not that
much time.
Speaker 1 (36:59):
And so I call it Rich and I'm like, Rich,
I just got this call from with Rich show with
the BELLI right, yeah, yeah, our guy guy exactly, great guy.
Here's my my contact for everything. Him and Mike Cogan,
another great guy. And I call it Bridge and I'm like, dude,
this doctor, he just hit me with a big one.
And I'm really concerned to what California is gonna say.
(37:21):
So let's let's start the process now, because I'm not
doing a whole camp and waiting till two weeks before
the fight to know if I'm going to fight again,
And so they give me set up at UCLA.
Speaker 4 (37:32):
We book a trip.
Speaker 1 (37:33):
Immediately, I go to California, go to UCLA and and.
Speaker 4 (37:40):
See a specialist there.
Speaker 1 (37:42):
Keep in mind, the fight had already been signed and everything,
but they hadn't announced it yet. And behind the scenes,
I'm like telling people, Oh, yeah, we're gonna fight. We're
gonna fight, that the news is coming, news is coming,
news is coming, and nothing's going out because we're all
concerned about California. And I'm getting like, message, what are
you going to defend your bell? You're scared of Messa
see all this stuff. I'm like, dude, I've already signed,
(38:04):
I'm ready to go, you know. I'm I'm dealing with
all of this, trying to keep it quiet. So I
go to UCLA, see a specialist, get more scans again. Uh,
nothing had got nothing changed. There's not like anything had
grown or nothing had gotten worse. And that was after
the fight. I mean, really, my whole career, I didn't
really ever get hit in a fight until that fight,
(38:25):
and uh, you know, nothing changed. So good signs. Everything
look good. Talk to UCLA, tell them the whole thing.
They say the same thing. Man, there's no there's no
evidence and there's nothing that supports this is going to
make it worse. The extra risk is very very very
very small. We're okay with it as long as you're
(38:47):
okay with it. And we keep getting scans. We see
you again, Da da dad, And I'm like, yes, yes, yes,
they ride out of thing. We get it all to
Belletour and they sent it to the California Athletic Commission.
Now it's all up to them. Wait wait, wait, wait,
wait comes back. No. I got a call from Rich
not going to happen. He was like, look now that
(39:08):
it's official. California says no. Europe says no, we don't
know what to do. You're our champ and we don't
want to put you in freaking you know, Kansas or
Idaho or whatever. We need you to fight on big shows.
But these are going to be in states and places
that you know I mean. And even if they tried
(39:29):
to undercover slide me in somewhere else, that commission could
talk to them and say, hey, you guys, know what's
going on. You know, and so it was this whole
thing and they're like, we don't know what we're going
to do with you. And I'm in limbo for a
few weeks, and then finally I had this opportunity to
get on Joe's Show, and I'm just like, man, guys,
let me just get my story out there, because I
(39:50):
need to get off my chest. Still to this point.
All the way until like a week before I went
to do Joe Show, I hadn't told anybody. I hadn't
told even my family. And finally I tell them and
I say, hey, I'm just going to let it all
out on Joe's show so everyone can hear it all
at once and get the record straight, know what's going on.
And so basically no one was going to approve me.
(40:14):
And that was that, and so I had to relinquish
my belt. I told the whole story and got it
out there, huge weight off my shoulders. I felt so
much better, so much lighter after that, and it was
one of the toughest things I'd ever been through, ever
did in that moment.
Speaker 4 (40:31):
You know, just letting it all out on Joe's show
is very emotional for me.
Speaker 1 (40:35):
Yeah, that was that. It was just like you get
to the top of the mountain, you're so happy and
you know, and then it's over. You know. But as
hard as all that was, I'll tell you what I've
been through since, just so grateful, you know. I realized
that that was this part of my destiny, part of
my story, and I really like honed in on a
(40:57):
new purpose. I came back to to got to save
my goodbye to jujitsu and grappling, and been able to
do some big things on this side of the sport,
my other love, you.
Speaker 4 (41:07):
Know, gee and no gee, and have you won several
more world titles?
Speaker 1 (41:12):
Right?
Speaker 4 (41:13):
Not world titles.
Speaker 1 (41:14):
I did win some of the titles and won some
big matches, and I did ABCC and I was just
recently the silver medallist and the nine to nine kilogram
division and that's like our Olympics. Yeah, I was the
oldest guy to ever make it to the finals of
that division. So you know, good stuff, you know, definitely
no complaints of course that happened.
Speaker 2 (41:36):
You know.
Speaker 1 (41:37):
The fight was in nineteen and I did Joe Show
in January of twenty twenty, and then I had the
grand opening for my academy, my new academy huge, beautiful,
ten thousand square foot space. I used all my earnings
from my fights to invest in this place, and I
had to take on a pretty substantial commercial loan, you know.
(41:59):
So I went into to make this place possible. And
I did that thinking, Oh, all the money I'm gonna
make from my fights, now, I'm gonna pay this off
in less than a year, like it's gonna be no problem.
And you know, I had all these plans, but then
fighting stopped, and then I'm like, well, that's okay. Business
is going to do great. You know, the beautiful new school.
Speaker 4 (42:18):
I'm I'm world champion, mm a, you know, great everything.
Speaker 1 (42:21):
Dad. Pandemic hits two weeks after our grand opening, had
to close the doors for three months. Not near as
bad here in Oklahoma as where it was everyone. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
terrible out there, terrible, So I can't imagine that. But
it was just a whirlwind of all these things hitting
(42:42):
me like, you know, down, little up, down and even
harder again, you know, and it's just like, dude, what's
going on? But it got me to where I am today,
and my girlfriend became my wife. We have kids now.
I have two year old twins and at the end
(43:02):
of twenty two, Japan's borders opened back up and they
started having international fighters come in for fighting events there,
and I got the opportunity to come back and fight
one more time three and a half years after that
title fight, and the fact that I stayed active in
(43:24):
jiu jitsu and I didn't just stop. You know, I
could have said, Okay, good career, did my thing. Gee
noge jiu jitsu, MMA world champion, good career, I'm gonna
call it. But instead I just like, let me keep pushing,
let me go back to jiu jitsu, fight all the
new young guys I hadn't competed against yet, do all
these competitions again. Just keep pushing, keep pushing. And that
(43:47):
kept me in shape, and it kept me, It kept
me sharp. And so when Japan called and I had
the opportunity to do a fight in Japan, I was like,
I was ready and I had my MMA guys, my team.
I was still helping them. So I had still been sparring,
still been moving, and I got to fight in Japan.
That's a picture of me in the ring right after
(44:08):
it happened with our twin babies in Japan, just five
months after they were born, and I got to do
my goodbye, my go out on my terms, you know,
because the commission told me I couldn't fight anymore. Good
thing about Japan, they don't care about anything, right. I
was like, you guys need a letter something, and they're like, nah,
(44:31):
I know.
Speaker 2 (44:33):
It was great. Yeah, people, it's great. Oh yeah, it's great. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 4 (44:37):
They're like, no, you're fine, You're good. I'm like, okay, cool.
So I got to fight there.
Speaker 1 (44:43):
I thought an undefeated kid, he's like twenty five years
old eight and O.
Speaker 4 (44:47):
Submit him in the first round and that was that.
Speaker 1 (44:50):
Still retired undefeated, but didn't go the way I planned it,
but still a beautiful story nonetheless, and I still got
to make my last round the best round.
Speaker 2 (44:58):
Here's a couple of things I'll try with one I want.
Speaker 3 (45:01):
You to always remember, right, And I just went through
this with Mark Kerr, the smashing machine, right, legend of legends.
He went through a hard time and he and I
were training in Arizona and he's like, you know, I'm
really fucking struggling like I used to be Mark Kerr.
I'm like, no, motherfucker, You're always Mark Kerr. You'll never
not be if you won a title, you got suddenly
(45:23):
like people won world titles and they lose, doesn't take
away you were a world champion.
Speaker 2 (45:28):
You were one and one at one point. So for
the rest of your life, you take that.
Speaker 3 (45:31):
By the way, the funny part was is as he
said that, the kid behind the desk wherever were said,
I'm sorry, are you Mark Kerr? I'm like you say
it like man, right there, it's like godlike step like
stepped in, like I'm gonna remind you.
Speaker 2 (45:46):
Just for you to always remind yourself, okay, no matter what.
Speaker 3 (45:49):
You fucking climbed the top of the mountain. That's it, right.
And you know the other great thing about the sport.
I try and teach my guys like, fuck the winner
of the lost, don't worry about it.
Speaker 2 (46:00):
It's, man, the fight, the honor of the fight.
Speaker 3 (46:02):
If you take that ego part out of it, it
makes you a lot more dangerous than everybody who's trying
to fucking not lose, er trying only when you know,
put on that pressure.
Speaker 2 (46:10):
It's the fight itself. But the fight itself comes from
this fucking community. And you're such a big part of
this fucking community. It's the most special beautiful.
Speaker 3 (46:18):
Like my life is great because I have football and
fighting and the two best locker rooms on the planet.
You put a bunch of football players and fighters together,
you'll solve all the world's problems, you know, And you
have that, and you're such an integral part of that.
I hope you've been able to love yourself up for
this and go, oh no, I fucking was at the
pinnacle and I've reached every dream every other fighter wished
(46:39):
she could have done. And use that as your equity
for the rest of your life. That suddainly doesn't leave
when the uniform comes off, when the helmet comes off,
or when your gloves come off.
Speaker 1 (46:48):
Yeah, one hundred percent, Jay, You know the journey, The
journey is beautiful, man, And I've been so fortunate to
have this incredible martial arts journey, you know, from going
to zil as a kid, and you know, experiencing jiu
jitsu in the roots before it's become this big, you know,
(47:08):
global sport now and having the opportunity to represent myself
in the cage and express myself as a true martial artist.
You know, I've had so many losses in jiu jitsu
on those mats and so you know, I know what
it's like to have to pick yourself back up again
and stay positive.
Speaker 4 (47:27):
You know, I was never a world champion at the
lower belts.
Speaker 1 (47:30):
You know, nowadays these kids that are winning black belt
world titles, ninety nine percent of them, like they've been
world champion at blue, purple, brown, like over and over again.
There they've been phenoms. Like people expect all of this
of them. You know, I was a kid from Oklahoma
who never had a black belt. You know, it's just
me and my dad on her own. We were studying
on VHS tapes. We're having to fly all over the
(47:52):
world just to learn, just to be able to go
somewhere to ask someone our question. You know, hey, can
you answer a question? You know, and all these things
like I wasn't supposed to get to where I got
by any means, and you know, it was that unbreakable
spirit and just never stopped believing and under and how
to like you turn your adversity into the advantage like
(48:14):
gift exactly exactly, and it makes you appreciate it so
much more and then you have so much more to
offer as well, because at the end of the day,
the fighting I mean in jiu jitsu. Don't get me wrong,
there's old guye divisions, you know, until until you're you know,
until you're doster. Yeah, Master seven eight. I don't know
(48:35):
how far it goes, but I'll be in there, I
promise you, because I love it. I love it and
it's who I am. But you know, the glory days
come to an end. But then it's like what you learned,
who you became, all the lessons and the experience that
you get to share with everyone else, you know, with
those around you. You know, that.
Speaker 4 (48:57):
Becomes the new mission.
Speaker 1 (49:00):
Right It's like, okay, let me pass this on, let
me help the next generation, let me try to make
a positive impact on everybody else. That's what Last Round,
Best Round is all about for me. That's why I
put it out there to help everybody else, you know,
stay positive and never give up and learn how to
you know, just appreciate the journey and you know, take
(49:21):
all those those obstacles and just say, okay, this is
going to make my story even better and just make
you stronger, and you.
Speaker 2 (49:29):
Got to celebrate yourself forever. You know.
Speaker 3 (49:31):
I have friends like Lindsey Vonn who just keeps your
metals away. I'm like, no, put them up there because
that was my past life.
Speaker 2 (49:36):
No, it's not.
Speaker 3 (49:37):
What's behind your ribcage got you to be that, So
celebrate it forever. For you, your title belt means more
than everybody else's. So I hope you have it up
there prominently somewhere forever because it says a different story
from every other champion who's ever fought.
Speaker 2 (49:55):
I hope you can always celebrate yourself for that.
Speaker 1 (49:57):
Thank you, Jay, It means a lot to me.
Speaker 2 (49:59):
Absolutely, yeah, brother, I love you, man. I appreciate you
joining me. I was gonna ask you what your unbreakable
moment is, but you fucking you answered it.
Speaker 4 (50:06):
So I had a lot, man, I have a lot.
Speaker 1 (50:08):
Like I said, all the times I failed in jiu
jitsu and wondering if it was going to happen, and
you know, it just kept going. You know, That's what
it's all about. And uh, what I've grown to learn
is it just gets better and better. Like you know,
the best is always yet to come, right, as long
as you keep going, the best is always yet to come. People, Okay,
(50:29):
I'm not you know, fighting on a world stage at
Wimbley Arena in London, right now. But there's new meaning,
new purpose, and you know, I have my kids like
that right there, you know, with with my twins in
the cage in Japan on a come like on a
fight that shouldn't have happened. But you know, that was
something that was even sweeter even though it wasn't a
(50:50):
world title, even sweeter than winning the world title because
that is going to live in their lives forever, that moment,
like you know, their dad didn't give up and I
got that opportunity and three and a half years after
it all went down, you know, at like forty years old,
I went in that cage or in that ring and
I won, and I brought them in there, and having
(51:13):
them in my life is a big reason why I
did it, you know, because it's like I got to
show them anything is possible when you don't give up. So,
you know, like I said, it just the journey just
gets sweeter. You appreciate it more. The relationships to people
that you have around you, if you keep going, those
grow stronger.
Speaker 4 (51:33):
You appreciate those people more. Like just you know, it's beautiful.
Speaker 1 (51:37):
Man. I've had such a blessed life and I'm very
very grateful and you know, getting to talk to you
about it, like, hey, this is awesome.
Speaker 2 (51:43):
You know what I mean. Bless you came on to brother.
I really appreciate it, man.
Speaker 3 (51:46):
Yeah, I've always had a lot of love for you
to dude, and just man, I've admired your you know,
your decision always to be like.
Speaker 2 (51:53):
I'm just going to keep fucking going, and it's just
it's huge.
Speaker 3 (51:56):
A lot of people sit back and go, oh, man,
life me a shitty hand. So as a result, I'm
gonna just sit down here and sulk about my shitty hand.
Speaker 2 (52:04):
And you never did, and I'm sure you know there's
a lot of shitty moments.
Speaker 3 (52:08):
He just kept moving forward, man, And that well, like
I said, the unbreakable part is things that could have
broken us and didn't. As a result, we came through
the other side of that tunnel stronger. And that is
our fucking equity forever in life.
Speaker 2 (52:20):
Yes, that's our superpower. So I'm proud of you, brother.
I appreciate you joining me.
Speaker 1 (52:24):
Man.
Speaker 2 (52:24):
I love the dude. When you come out to l A,
We're definitely fucking breaking bread.
Speaker 1 (52:28):
Yeah, for sure, for sure, I'm looking forward to it.
And if I can put it out there, Last Round,
Best Round dot Com. There's a whole documentary that Will
Harris did about that Japan fight. He went to Japan
with us, Will Harris Anatomy of a Fighter. A beautiful,
beautiful job he did. And and stay tuned because you're
gonna hear a lot more about Last Round, Best Round
(52:49):
in the future. And and that's it. So thank you
so much.
Speaker 2 (52:53):
God can do to help promote brother. I got you,
I got right back, all right.
Speaker 1 (52:56):
I appreciate that.
Speaker 2 (52:58):
Thank you, Thank you my brother, love you body.
Speaker 1 (53:02):
Thank you.
Host
Jay Glazer
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