August 1, 2025 • 37 mins
River Phoenix’s upbringing not only shaped his worldview but also ignited his artistic passions early on, laying the groundwork for his future career in Hollywood. The 1986 film "Stand By Me” catapulted him into the spotlight and established him as a household name. In “Rising Star,” the first episode of Variety and iHeart Podcasts’ “Variety Confidential,” host Tatiana Siegel speaks with River's “Stand By Me” co-star Corey Feldman and Variety’s chief film critic Owen Gleiberman about River’s early career and rise to fame.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
This show contains mature content and adult themes.
Speaker 2 (00:03):
It may not be suitable for young audiences.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
From Variety and iHeart Podcasts, this is season two of
Variety Confidential.
Speaker 3 (00:14):
He Was.
Speaker 4 (00:17):
Supporters St. Paulish one three.
Speaker 3 (00:24):
Library Bokay.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
This season on Variety Confidential, we peel back the layers
of actor River Phoenix's meteoric rise to fame, from his
unconventional childhood to becoming the alternative poster boy of a generation.
We'll explore his powerful performances in classics like stand By
Me and My Own Private Idaho, You're.
Speaker 3 (00:48):
Never going to get out of this town now, my boy.
Speaker 1 (00:51):
Examining how his raw talent and undeniable charisma left an
indelible mark on the film industry.
Speaker 5 (00:57):
You guys were ussia dead body. A find a normal
family and a good upbringing, and I would have been
so well adjusted person.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
Depends on what you call normal. I'm Tachiana Siegel, Executive
editor of Film and Media at Variety, and I'm here
to take you through the extraordinary life of one of
Hollywood's most celebrated stars, River Phoenix. His is a name
that still resonates with cinophiles and casual moviegoers alike. Nearly
(01:30):
three decades after his untimely passing. But River's story isn't
just about the bright lights of Hollywood. It's a tale
of youthful ambition, artistic integrity, and the dark side of fame.
Exclusive interviews with Rivers co stars and friends, including Corey
Feldman and Samantha Mathis, will shed light on who River
(01:53):
really was off camera. Whether you're a longtime fan or
just discovering his war, join us as we speak with
industry insiders and Varieties experts to explore the brilliance and
complexity of River Phoenix. Let's dive into the life, legacy,
and lasting impact of an actor who burned bright and
(02:16):
left us far too soon. This is Variety Confidential, the
life and legend of River Phoenix.
Speaker 5 (02:23):
In fact, I would rather quit while I was ahead. Yeah,
there's no need overstanding. You're welcome.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
River Phoenix was born on August twenty third, nineteen seventy,
into a family that embraced an unconventional lifestyle. His parents,
Arlen and John Bottom, were deeply ameshed in counterculture of
the nineteen sixties and lived mostly on the road with
their five children, River the eldest, followed by Rain, Joaquin
(02:54):
Liberty and Summer. When he was a young boy, River's
parents became missionaries for the religious cult Children of God,
also known as the Family. John and Arland's work took
them to South America, but they eventually became disillusioned with
the group and relocated the family to Florida. There, they
(03:14):
adopted a new surname, Phoenix, a symbol of rebirth. By
all accounts, it was a nurturing, if unusual environment. River
and his siblings never had a formal education, but their parents'
bohemian lifestyle allowed the children to explore any creativity or
self expression to its fullest extent. They showed an aptitude
(03:37):
for acting in music, and at times busk to help
bring in money for the family.
Speaker 5 (03:42):
Well, in my family, throughout the years, we've been moving frequently,
whether it be for financial reasons or for different movies
that we were working on. So I've been very used
to that spontaneous, must pick it up and move on
kind of thing.
Speaker 1 (04:02):
River's brother, actor Joaquin Phoenix, recently detailed their upbringing and
sibling dynamic on comedian Theo Vaughn's podcast this past weekend
with Theo Vaughn, Why was.
Speaker 6 (04:14):
The second son uh? And uh, and my brother was
like quite a force and was definitely like I don't know,
almost like mythical or Shakespearean or you know, maybe it's
because he he died or something, but he's like, you know,
he was like the first son and he was and
he was he was incredible, and he was such a
(04:36):
force within our family. It was kind of like the
the the the guiding light in some ways. He's one
of the acted first and we used to sing on
the streets and he played guitar and kind of like
over singer. He was the lead singer and he was
the guitarist and kind of oversaw everybody. And he was
(04:57):
such a like a strong but gentle force within the family.
Speaker 1 (05:03):
This upbringing not only shaped rivers worldview, but also ignited
his artistic passions early on, laying the groundwork for his
future career in Hollywood. His breakthrough came in nineteen eighty
five with the TV movie Surviving a Family and Crisis,
which showcased his talent to a broader audience, but it
(05:23):
was nineteen eighty six's Stand By Me that catapulted him
into the spotlight, establishing him as a household name in
Variety's Oral history of the movie. Director Rob Reiner says
it was Phoenix's star power that helped the movie find distribution.
As he tells it, nearly every studio in Hollywood had
passed on the Coming of Age film when they convinced
(05:46):
New Columbia Pictures production head Guy McElwain to screen it.
But the most crucial members of the audience were mcelwain's
two daughters. About halfway through, they were in love with
River Phoenix. Bruce A. Evans, who produced and co wrote
the film, remembers in the film, fourteen year old River
is a standout as spiritual leader Chris Chambers, alongside co
(06:10):
stars Corey Feldman as hot tempered Teddy Duchamp, Will Wheaton
as sensitive Gordie la Chance, and Jerry O'Connell as wisecracking
Verne Tessio. It's been decades since, but Corey Feldman says
he still cherishes those memories on the stand by Me
set with River, whom he called one of the great
(06:30):
iconic actors of our time.
Speaker 2 (06:33):
I would say River was like the James Dean of
our generation. You know, he had all that prospect, he
had all that potential. Everybody knew that he was going
to be an Academy Award winner.
Speaker 4 (06:45):
Everybody knew that he was going to be.
Speaker 2 (06:47):
Hailed as one of the great iconic actors of our time,
and we knew it at that time.
Speaker 4 (06:51):
We knew it.
Speaker 2 (06:53):
I just assumed he would always be part of my life,
and I always assumed we'd have many more times to
work together. I figured we'd end up doing music together.
I figured we do more films together. To me, it
was a very open ended relationship that had only started
to bud. And that was that was the hardest gut
punch of the whole thing, was knowing that my friend
(07:15):
was gone and that wasn't going to happen again, and
there was no opportunity for us to ever create together
and to stand together. I mean to think about what
I've stood for in my life and the things that
he wanted to stand for or was standing for at
the time of his loss, and to think what magic
we could have stirred up together, the powerful statements, the
(07:38):
powerful moments, the things that we could have raised awareness
on if we joined forces and work together as adults,
you know, And that's the tragedy to me is just
you know, like, wow, We'll never have that chance to
see what might have become of it.
Speaker 1 (07:54):
Corey, take us back to when you were cast and
stand By Me. What do you remember from that time.
I'm filming in the summer of nineteen eighty five.
Speaker 2 (08:03):
Well, what I remember about being cast in stand By
Me was going into the audition while I was working
on the ADR for Goonies. Actually we were on the
sound stages. We did about I think it was like
sixty days worth of ADR on Goonies.
Speaker 4 (08:19):
It was a lot.
Speaker 2 (08:19):
We were there for like two months. We had our
school trailers out in the parking line, all that stuff.
So I got an audition to read for a Rob
Ryanan movie called The Body, and that's what it was
called when I went into audition for it, and I
remember it was a pretty big call. There was a
lot of kids in the room, and I remember Rob
asking me to come in two or three times to
(08:40):
try different.
Speaker 4 (08:41):
Things and all in the same day.
Speaker 2 (08:43):
But I mean like going back and forth and trying
different things, working with the character a little.
Speaker 4 (08:47):
Bit, and that was it.
Speaker 2 (08:49):
I mean, it was a pretty simple process. After I
think there was a callback. I think there was like
two calls and that was it. And then we got
the offer.
Speaker 1 (08:58):
So when you guys would see each other at casting
or whatever, were you often going up for the same roles.
Speaker 2 (09:04):
But it was movies like Explorers where you know, I
was promised a role. I originally was reading for River's role.
River got the role. Then I ended up reading for
the part that Jason Present ended up playing, which I
believe I got and was going to me, and then
I got Goonies and had to turn it down. So
there was a lot of that kind of stuff, you know,
(09:25):
And that was it was that way always with me
and River, and it was also that way with me
and Corey Haim. So a lot of people don't realize that,
and I was one of those people, by the way
that didn't realize it. But Corey would tell me, I
actually met you before Laws Boys, and I was like, how,
And he said, on the audition for Goonies, when I
went into amblin, you were actually sitting in the waiting room.
(09:46):
And when I saw that you were going in for
the same character as me, I knew that I was
in trouble because I knew that you already had a
relationship with Steven and blah blah blah. So that was
kind of one of those interesting things. So Corey was
one of them. But you know, I didn't see him
as much as he was from Canada, but River and
I saw each other on everything. And again Explorers, you know,
was another movie that he ended up getting.
Speaker 4 (10:07):
I ended up getting it too. We could have ended
up in that together.
Speaker 2 (10:10):
But then because I got the opera, like I think,
the same week as Goonies, I couldn't do it.
Speaker 4 (10:15):
Yeah, so there you go.
Speaker 1 (10:17):
Okay, what was the vibe like on set?
Speaker 4 (10:19):
Oh, it's amazing.
Speaker 2 (10:20):
I mean it was. First of all, the thing that
was great about that film was the fact that you had,
you know, four serious actors, even though we were kids,
we all took our craft seriously, and you had a
very serious.
Speaker 4 (10:33):
Director who had something to prove. You know. This was
not the Rob Reiner that we think of no of today.
Speaker 2 (10:40):
This was the guy who really had a chip on
his shoulder because people kept calling him Meatball and he
did not want to be remembered or referred to as
the meatball.
Speaker 4 (10:50):
It was like, yeah, that was cute.
Speaker 2 (10:51):
That was a sitcom I did back in the seventies
and you know, early eighties.
Speaker 4 (10:55):
But I'm done with that now. And now I'm a
director and I want.
Speaker 2 (10:58):
To be taken and seeing, and so because of that,
I think that's what kind of got me excited about
the prospect when I read the stuff that I read
from the body and said, Okay, this, this will be serious.
This is not like you know, the other stuff that
I've done before, where it's action adventure or comedy or horror.
I mean, this is like really serious stuff. So we
all got to put our serious faces on and go
(11:19):
for it. And so when we got up there, the
beautiful experience was that rob knowing that we were a
bunch of kids who did have the intention to be serious,
but at the same time probably came from a myriad
of backgrounds regarding our instincts, regarding what we were used to.
If you know, some of us were trained and had class,
some of us did not, like myself, who never went
(11:41):
to class, never had a coach, And so some of
the things that he wanted to do was kind of
broaden our horizons by introducing us to tricks and games
and things that were used in acting schools, in acting
classes and stuff that I personally had never experienced because
I'd never been to those things. And so we did
a series of things that he called traditional you know exercises,
(12:04):
which were exercises from you know, stell Adler or whatever,
where we would do things like mirroring or volume games
where we would you know, mirror each other's movements or
mirror each other's volume, where we would you know, somebody
would say something and then we would repeat it back
to them at a louder level, and then they would
repeat it back at a louder level. Things like that,
(12:26):
just working off of each other to gain each other's sensibilities,
understand each other's timing and thought process. And then we'd
play other games, like you know, kind of fun imagination
games or improvisation games, different things, just to get our
brains working and to get us communicating in a way
that felt like we've known each other for a.
Speaker 4 (12:46):
Lot longer than we had.
Speaker 2 (12:48):
And with River and I, it was really easy because
River and I had known each other for many years already.
We'd been seeing each other in different casting offices, you know,
playing football in the parking lot, link be in the
parking lot. You know, that's the kind of stuff that
you did if you got along with another kid in
the industry, because generally you'd walk into these casting offices
(13:09):
and they'd be I mean, I'm sure it's still like this,
but you know, there was fifty kids in there, and
they're all with their stage moms, and all their stage
moms have told their kids not to talk to other kids.
That's like a big thing. And for whatever reason, River
and I were both always those kids. Like we'd see
each other, hey man, how are you good? Good, what's
going on? Let's go outside and talk. Okay, when we
go outside and just start hanging, you know, and have
(13:30):
fun like kids do until it was time to get called.
And I guess, you know, even though we both did
have stage moms, for whatever reason, I guess they didn't
mind us hanging out because they knew that we were
probably the best of the best, and it was probably
a good idea for us to have a connection or whatever.
But the point is is that, you know, it wasn't
frowned upon for us to have that relationship, so we
(13:50):
kind of built.
Speaker 4 (13:51):
It, you know. And I wouldn't say we were great friends.
I would just say we were acquaintances.
Speaker 2 (13:55):
But we always kind of had a smile and a
fondness for when we saw each other and when we
realized that we were casting the movie together.
Speaker 4 (14:02):
We were both very excited about that.
Speaker 1 (14:05):
Is there an early memory from production that still stands
out to you.
Speaker 2 (14:10):
I'll never forget the plane ride over, which was one
of the scariest plane rides of my life. And I'll
never forget that because River and I were sitting next
to each other on a small single engine prop lane
and you know, it's like a puddle jumper, and we
hit some really serious turbulence on the way over, and
I'll never forget River and I sitting there fearing for
(14:30):
our lives, like scared to death, but laughing at the
same time because the plane was going like this. It
was rocking so hard that at one point it went
all the way up on its side. So we're like, whoof,
like that all the way up on its side, and
I remember almost going upside down and I'm like kind
of He's sitting next to me and I'm looking down
and I'm like, oh my god, are we going to die?
(14:50):
And we shared that experience of like a near death
experience together, and that's how we started off our journey
for a Stand by Me. So I've never told that story,
but it's an interest one and what.
Speaker 1 (15:01):
Do you remember about River as an actor?
Speaker 2 (15:04):
You know, most young actors, you look at them and
they don't respond, or if they do respond, they're just
reading words off the page, but there's no connection there.
That's the testament of a great actor, and especially at
a young age, is somebody that's not working off the
written page, but they're working off the emotion that those
words make them feel. Whether it's comedy or serious or horror,
(15:29):
it doesn't matter. It's still the same value, which is
being real in the moment and giving that real moment
to your fellow actors to get them the opportunity to
share in that real moment with you.
Speaker 4 (15:41):
So, yeah, that was the kinship.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
I believe that we had that kind of put us
above the other guys, not in the sense of actors,
just in the sense of we had that understanding.
Speaker 4 (15:52):
It was a mutual understanding.
Speaker 2 (15:54):
And then will you know, I think it was kind
of more from the other side of the training, which
was very kind of stick to the words on the page.
Speaker 4 (16:02):
You know, do what's in front of you. You know,
don't kind of do anything.
Speaker 2 (16:05):
Outside of the box unless you're told where River and
I were much more like go on the feeling go
on the feeling and then Jerry being so young, he
was just kind of like, you know, this was his
first project where him it was like the opposite side
of the spectrum where he was just like you know,
a bird being let out of the cage for the
first time and just kind of like.
Speaker 4 (16:25):
Hey, this is great, this is fun. Let's go everywhere,
you know, let's do anything. Let's yeah, this is awesome.
And he was. He brought that to his character, and
he brought that to the scenes, and all that innocence
and that sweetness that's in his character I think was
very genuine to Jerry and who he was.
Speaker 1 (16:42):
What was like the vibe like when cameras aren't rolling,
he seems like almost like summer camp, like you guys
are all the same age or were not the same
age and.
Speaker 4 (16:52):
Had to do a lot of fun.
Speaker 2 (16:53):
It was amazing until River had his family upheaved him
from the hotel and moved them all to a house
outside of town. So when we were all staying in
the same hotel, it was a blast. We were having
an amazing time. It was maybe a little bit too
much fun. But when his family, his Mam Marlene, decided
that they wanted to rent a little, you know, family
(17:15):
ranch home outside in the suburbs, which was about forty
minutes away from city.
Speaker 4 (17:21):
You know.
Speaker 2 (17:22):
Obviously I would go out there and stay with them sometimes,
or River would come stay in my hotel room with
me sometimes. But for the most part, it created the
separation between us, which was kind of depressing because we
were really excited and enjoying that camaraderie and enjoying that
kind of summer camp vibe, which of course you still
got on the set, but it was a little bit
different because you're working.
Speaker 4 (17:41):
So but we had some great times.
Speaker 2 (17:43):
I mean, that was the first nightclub I ever went
to in my life, was with River, and it was
an under eighteen, like an age fifteen to eighteen type nightclub.
And I don't even know how. I guess it was
all ages because we were not that old. We were
only thirteen. I don't know how we got into that place,
but they were letting us in. So we went to
our first night club for kids, and it was all,
(18:05):
you know, like I said, thirteen to eighteen year olds,
you know, dancing to depeche Mode and all the goth
type eighties music that was out there, and I'd come
in and River and I would have little Michael Jackson
dance offs. People don't realize this, but River could also
dance and he liked to dance like Michael also, although
it was never seen on camera, but he would do it.
(18:26):
And we would go to this nightclub called the Met
that was the name of the club. Actually just ran
into somebody at the comic con that I did last
weekend who was like, Oh, I remember you from Eugene, Oregon.
I don't know if you know this, but I went
to that nightclub with you. I said, what was it called.
They said it was the Met. I was like, that's right,
so that's what I have that information fresh on me.
(18:47):
But yeah, So we would go to that nightclub together.
You know, we famously got drunk together. I think it
was my first time being drunk, I'm not sure about his.
And then we also famously smoked weed together for the
first time, which is really weird, but that was on
set offset of the movie. We didn't do it on
set obviously while we were working, but it was through
(19:11):
people that were associated with the set, and that's how
we ended up getting the weed in the first place.
So basically one of the crew members brought us to
his room and smoked us out, And of course that
was not you know, that's typely right. We shouldn't be
doing that, but they did anyway. So but you know,
it was all in good fun. I mean, I wouldn't
(19:31):
say that they were trying to, you know, taint the
clean perception of a young adolescent. But we came to him.
It's not like he was pushing it on us. We
were saying, you know, all these kids are smoking weed
in town and they keep talking to us about it,
and we don't want to just you know, run off
with some kids. We'd rather do it with an adult
who knows what they're doing. And you know, maybe we
(19:52):
saw that you have a bong in your room. You know,
we were like hanging out with this guy on the
crew and we saw a bong in his room in
River said, you know, look he's got I was like, oh,
he's like, well, maybe we can ask him. So that's
what it was about. But anyway, we did it. Rivers
said he never felt it that day, by the way,
so I got stoned out of my mind.
Speaker 4 (20:12):
He never felt anything.
Speaker 2 (20:13):
And then I think we tried again another time, and
that time he did feel it. But and then I
remember cut to like New York when we were doing
the press tour and I was there with my dad.
Speaker 4 (20:25):
And I remember going over the River's room.
Speaker 2 (20:27):
And like I could smell weed coming all the way
down the hallway. I was like, well, I guess he
figured it out. But anyway, so.
Speaker 4 (20:34):
Yeah, that was there, you go. That was it, at the.
Speaker 2 (20:37):
End of innocence in the truest form, and that moment
of crossing from you know, puberty, you know, being kids,
being rambunctious, trying to understand the world and everything around us,
and then experimenting with these things that we, you know,
probably shouldn't have been. But I think it was pretty
much on par with what every other kid our age.
Speaker 4 (20:59):
Was doing at the time.
Speaker 2 (21:00):
I mean, I don't think we were really doing anything
that crazier out of control, and certainly we never did
hard drugs together or anything like that.
Speaker 1 (21:07):
Did he stay in touch after the film wrapped or
after the press tour.
Speaker 4 (21:11):
Yeah, we did.
Speaker 2 (21:12):
We stayed friends for many years, you know, and then
we kind of then we kind of stopped talking.
Speaker 4 (21:17):
I think probably around sixteen to eighteen.
Speaker 2 (21:21):
We didn't talk for a while, and then I saw
him when I turned eighteen at the Academy Awards, and
I remember it had been about two years and he
was there with Martha Plimpton. I was there with Drew Barrymore.
I was performing that year. He was nominated for Running
on Empty and so I remember going and visiting him,
like we would go to each other's sets, so like
we'd both be working on the Warner Brothers lot. I
(21:41):
think he was working on First No, No, No, before
before Running on Empty.
Speaker 4 (21:46):
There was that movie that he did, Jimmy Ruden. Was
it Jimmy Ruden?
Speaker 2 (21:49):
Yeah, might have been, But anyway, he was working on
a movie on the lot on the Warner Brothers lot.
I was working on I think Lost Boys, And we
kind of hooked up there and out on each other's
sets a little bit. And then the next time I
saw him after that was the Academy Awards, and it
was like, wow, look here we are. Now you're nominated.
I'm performing, Like this is kind of a big deal.
(22:11):
We've done well for ourselves.
Speaker 1 (22:14):
Okay, let's go back to that night at the Shrine
Auditorium in nineteen eighty nine for the Oscar Ceremony.
Speaker 7 (22:20):
The nominates for the best actor in the supporting role.
Speaker 3 (22:25):
Now like Dennis and Little Dog, Gentlemen, Kevin Klein in
a Fish called wand Martin Landau in Tucker the Man
and His Dreams, River Phoenix and running on empty.
Speaker 7 (22:43):
Dean Stockworld in Marriage with them All and the Oscar
goes to Kevin Klein and a Fish called wand Corey.
Speaker 1 (22:59):
What happened next?
Speaker 2 (23:00):
And then the very next contact was when I had
gotten through rehab and I was nineteen, and I had
just come out of rehab, and I was working on
a movie that I'm not hugely proud of, but it
was called Happy Campers, which was a broad kind of comedy,
camp comedy whatever.
Speaker 4 (23:20):
But anyway, point being that.
Speaker 2 (23:23):
The first a d saw how serious I was trying
to help people get sober, and she brought up to
me that River was going through some of his own
personal demons. And I don't want to get too into
the details of that, but I'll say that when I
heard that he was struggling with some of the same
things that I had just recovered from, I obviously wanted
(23:43):
to help in any way I could. So I reached
out to him a few times and we did speak,
we did connect, and The plan was that when I
got back from filming, we were going to get together.
And my plan was that I was going to get
him into twelve step recovery. And I was actually making
a plan to do that, to do like an intervention.
(24:03):
And then when I got back, I contacted him, never
reached him. His guy, his name was Sky, who was
with him actually the whole time of the filming of
the Standpy. I mean, he was his guardian, his onset guardian,
his name was. They called him Sky Phoenix, and Sky
and I are still very close friends today.
Speaker 4 (24:20):
But Sky was the one that entered the phone that
day and he.
Speaker 2 (24:23):
Said, oh, Rivers not available, he's sleeping or whatever, and
he never put him on the phone with me, and
we never reconnected. And because we never reconnected, I never
had the chance to get him into that twelve step recovery.
And it was only about maybe a couple months after
that that he that he oded. So it's a terrible
piece of my history, and it's very sad.
Speaker 4 (24:44):
You know.
Speaker 2 (24:45):
It's one of those things that you know, you ask
yourself over and over, could I have done more? You know,
I wish, I wish I would have thought more. I
wish I would have realized how serious it was and
made more of an aggressive plan to you know, make
myself present, to go, you know, pound on his door,
drag him out. Whatever I had to do, I should
have I should have done more, and I don't know
(25:05):
if I'll ever really completely forgive myself for that.
Speaker 7 (25:08):
Hmm.
Speaker 1 (25:09):
It sounds like my own private Idaho was the film
that really pushed him over the edge.
Speaker 2 (25:14):
Yep, that's what he had. That's that's what the lady,
her name was Chris Kringle. She had just worked with
him on that film, and that's why I was getting
the feedback what had happened on that set, and you
know what kind of condition he was in, and that's
why I was like, oh my god, I gotta do something.
So I did emphatically try to reach him. Several times.
We did connect, but briefly, and then by the time
(25:37):
I got home, you know, people get distracted. I got,
you know, right into a next movie. He goes into
his next you know how it is. It's just, you know,
you go your different paths and then by the time
you circle back sometimes it's too late.
Speaker 4 (25:50):
And that's what happened.
Speaker 1 (25:52):
What do you recall was your reaction when you heard
the news that he had passed away.
Speaker 2 (25:57):
Oh just awful, what loss. What a beautiful soul. I mean,
we had so much in common. That's why I respected him.
I mean not to sound self indulgent, but like, he
was a vegetarian, he loved animals, he loved humans, he
loved giving. He was a musician, he was, you know,
(26:20):
an artist. He liked to dance, he liked to sing,
he liked to quick. We made a music video together.
A lot of people don't know this, but him and
his sister Rain did some very early recordings of some
family songs, kind of like Partridge Family type stuff, and
they asked me to star in the video because he
liked the way I danced, and you know, he knew
that I was trying to get into music. He was
(26:41):
further advanced than I was, because I didn't start writing
until probably after that. I think around stand by Me
is when I started first putting pen to paper and
trying to write music.
Speaker 4 (26:51):
And it wasn't until really around Lost Boys that I.
Speaker 2 (26:54):
Put together my first single in my first video, which
was Rotten Away, which I never released even but I
was kind of working on music at that time, so
He had me probably by about a year or two,
and when he was already working on his music and
he would play it for me.
Speaker 4 (27:08):
I was like, this is great, this is great. He's like,
why do you start one of the videos. We want
to make a video and I want you to start.
I was like okay.
Speaker 2 (27:13):
So he directed the video and it was me taking
his little sister out on a date or something like that.
It was really sweet and really cute. But you know,
I show up with flowers and I knock on the
door and the little girl comes to the door and
we go up on this date holding hands.
Speaker 4 (27:29):
And it was just the sweetest, was innocent little thing.
Speaker 2 (27:33):
So yeah, I go back to those dimes, and I
go back to those memories of why we were so
connected and why we were so linked together spiritually because
we were like the same we were cut from the
same cloth, and I just had so much love and
respect and admiration for him. So when I you know,
when I turned on the news that night, and it
was Halloween night, so I think i'd.
Speaker 4 (27:53):
Been out as well, you know, and I came home and.
Speaker 2 (27:55):
I just saw it and it was just it. I
couldn't even believe it was real. You know, it was
just it was horrifying, and yeah, it's just a huge laws.
Speaker 1 (28:07):
To further discuss the cultural phenomenon that would stand By
Me were turned to Variety is chief film critic Owen Gleiberman.
Speaker 8 (28:14):
I think the movie that really put him on the
map for me was stand By Me. You know, he
had that kind of wolf cub look about him, and
he already, you know, in hindsight, had the quality that
would define him as an actor, which is that under
this cool facade, there was this very tender and sincere quality.
(28:37):
It's kind of effortless gravitas that he had. And in
that sense, you know, he was a prototype in a
way for a new generation of stars, a new paradigm
of Hollywood startup. You know, he'd started out as a
teen star doing after school specials and things like that,
and in a way that felt very ahead of the curve.
He was sort of like Harry Styles or Robert Pattinson
(29:00):
in that when he crossed over into an adult persona,
he had to sort of fight for his credibility. But
I think, you know, from stand by Me on you
really saw that he just had this quality that stood out,
this stillness about him that made you want to watch him,
where he could just effortlessly own a scene. Just about
(29:21):
the highest compliment you can give a young actor is
to say that he's a James Dean. Now, a million
young actors have been compared to James Dean, and ninety
nine percent of them do not live up to that.
But River Phoenix really was a James Dean. And you
start with that look. I mean, he was just very
(29:42):
handsome with that dark blonde hair, but there was a
soul to him. He looked like a wolf, very wild
and mysterious, and he had this quality of melancholy about
him that always came through very glamorous but also vulnerable, haunted.
But that gave him this intoxicating quality where he could
(30:03):
be doing absolutely nothing and you wanted to watch me.
And part of what was so James Dean like about
River Phoenix is that he did seem to be nursing
some buried, kind of far off ache, some kind of wound,
and you wanted to get in touch with that. You
wanted to know what it was. You kind of wanted
to take.
Speaker 4 (30:23):
Care of him.
Speaker 8 (30:25):
I think River Phoenix stood out in that movie by
seeming more like a seventies actor. I think those kids
were all pretty good in the movie, but you know,
they were kind of punchy and a little bit sticky
son of them, and he was. He was willing to
kind of be laid back and not say anything and
(30:47):
just you know, kind of command a scene through his presence.
And I think that's the quality he carried through all
his roles. He often played these kind of quiet, introspective
characters where he wasn't ruling a scene through dialogue, although
he could do that too, and there was something it
(31:09):
was more like just his presence. There was this quality
he had that drew you to it. It was very
nonverbal in a way, and I think that comes across
and stand by me, that's what makes him the most
magnetic of those four is that he's the one. He's
the one of these boys who has kind of a
(31:29):
quality of mystery about him.
Speaker 1 (31:35):
With his new phone fame, River took on ambitious roles
that further highlighted his talent. Films like The Mosquito Coast
and Running on Empty earned him critical acclaim and solidified
his status as a rise in star Let's Listen to
this nineteen eighty eight interview from Toronto's CFTO News.
Speaker 8 (31:55):
Phoenix has met with considerable success in his brief career,
but doesn't consider himself an actor as much as a comedian.
Speaker 5 (32:01):
To me, an actor is like a Shakespearean actor, and
I just feel like I can blend well and can
take on a character and somehow make it feel somewhat
organic and spontaneous.
Speaker 1 (32:20):
Yet with success came personal challenges. River struggled with the
pressures of his newfound fame, the financial responsibility of being
a breadwinner for his family, his tendency to throw his
entire self into a role, and a complex personal life
that included an on again, off again relationship with his
Mosquito Coast and running on Empty coastar Martha Plumpton. He
(32:42):
also began experimenting with drugs and alcohol during this time.
Martha recently spoke about River and their four year romance
on her friend Jesse Tyler Ferguson's Dinners on Me podcast.
Speaker 9 (32:55):
River was certainly more famous than I ever was. I mean,
he got an Oscar nomination, obviously, but I think we
were both really good at knowing that we didn't really
want that attention anyway, and so we really weren't exposed
really that much in that way, and neither of us
was terribly comfortable with that sort of thing, And it
(33:15):
was before we were even like understood really like what
that meant, you know.
Speaker 4 (33:22):
I think it.
Speaker 9 (33:24):
Got harder as we got older and River became more famous.
It got harder for him. I think, well, I know
it was harder for him, and he was not as
equipped I think as maybe some other people might be
(33:48):
to handle that stuff because he was a very at heart,
very innocent and and like a driven by love human being,
so that the contradictions of Hollywood and show business were
much more difficult for him. Yeah, and you know when
we did break up eventually, we were together for about
(34:11):
four years, and then when we did break up, we
did remain friends, and we were each other's first love.
That relationship never really goes away. You can't ever let
something like that go. It's just too important and too
like altering. I mean, it's part of it's made you
who you are, you know, especially in those really formative years.
Speaker 4 (34:32):
I mean, it's a huge part of who I am.
Speaker 9 (34:35):
So yeah, so, and of course we stayed friends, but
I think fame was really hard on River. I think
he really just didn't know what to do with all
of that kind and he wanted to do good, but
it was really it's just the contradictions of it were
too difficult.
Speaker 4 (34:54):
Yeah, it seems like he was really lucky.
Speaker 3 (34:57):
To have you.
Speaker 9 (34:58):
Well, I think he was lucky to have me and
his family, his brothers and sisters. I think, you know,
his personality or his affliction, his illness was incredibly difficult
for him to manage on his own, and he never
(35:21):
really got the help that I think he would have
done amazingly well with If he had gotten that help,
I think he would have been an incredible advocate for
sobriety and for people struggling with addiction. And unfortunately it
just got him before he had a chance to do that.
(35:41):
But yeah, I mean I miss him every single day,
every single day.
Speaker 1 (35:49):
It all came to a head on October thirty first,
nineteen ninety three, at the Viper Room in Los Angeles,
when Phoenix died of an overdose. He was twenty three
years old. That Halloween night, his girlfriend, Samantha Mathis, was
right by riverside.
Speaker 10 (36:05):
I think he was an iconic person for our generation,
just like my parents talk about they knew where they
were when John F.
Speaker 4 (36:14):
Kennedy was killed.
Speaker 10 (36:15):
Pretty Much everyone I know knows exactly where they were
when River died, and what a loss of hope that
was for our generation.
Speaker 1 (36:27):
We've only just begun to uncover the remarkable life of
River Phoenix, from his unorthodox upbringing to his rapid rise
as a Hollywood icon. In the next episode, we'll delve
deeper into the pressures that came with fame and the
artistic choices that defined his legacy, including his films Dogfight
(36:48):
and My Own Private Idaho. Join us next time for
more on Variety Confidential, the life and legend of River Phoenix.
Don't forget to subscribe wherever you listen to podcasts. Variety
Confidential is created by Dea Lawrence and Stephen Gados. Season
two is hosted by Tatiana Siegal, produced by Karen Misagucci
(37:11):
and Sydney Kramer. Executive produced by da Lawrence and Tatiana Siegal.
Written by Anna Moslin, Karen Mazagucci and Tatiana Siegal, Variety's
co editor in Chief Cynthia Littleton, and Ramin Sechuda. Variety
Content Studio Executive produced by Alex Hughes, Edited and mixed
(37:31):
by Aaron Greenawald. Please refer to sources and citations on
variety dot com
This show contains mature content and adult themes.
Speaker 2 (00:03):
It may not be suitable for young audiences.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
From Variety and iHeart Podcasts, this is season two of
Variety Confidential.
Speaker 3 (00:14):
He Was.
Speaker 4 (00:17):
Supporters St. Paulish one three.
Speaker 3 (00:24):
Library Bokay.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
This season on Variety Confidential, we peel back the layers
of actor River Phoenix's meteoric rise to fame, from his
unconventional childhood to becoming the alternative poster boy of a generation.
We'll explore his powerful performances in classics like stand By
Me and My Own Private Idaho, You're.
Speaker 3 (00:48):
Never going to get out of this town now, my boy.
Speaker 1 (00:51):
Examining how his raw talent and undeniable charisma left an
indelible mark on the film industry.
Speaker 5 (00:57):
You guys were ussia dead body. A find a normal
family and a good upbringing, and I would have been
so well adjusted person.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
Depends on what you call normal. I'm Tachiana Siegel, Executive
editor of Film and Media at Variety, and I'm here
to take you through the extraordinary life of one of
Hollywood's most celebrated stars, River Phoenix. His is a name
that still resonates with cinophiles and casual moviegoers alike. Nearly
(01:30):
three decades after his untimely passing. But River's story isn't
just about the bright lights of Hollywood. It's a tale
of youthful ambition, artistic integrity, and the dark side of fame.
Exclusive interviews with Rivers co stars and friends, including Corey
Feldman and Samantha Mathis, will shed light on who River
(01:53):
really was off camera. Whether you're a longtime fan or
just discovering his war, join us as we speak with
industry insiders and Varieties experts to explore the brilliance and
complexity of River Phoenix. Let's dive into the life, legacy,
and lasting impact of an actor who burned bright and
(02:16):
left us far too soon. This is Variety Confidential, the
life and legend of River Phoenix.
Speaker 5 (02:23):
In fact, I would rather quit while I was ahead. Yeah,
there's no need overstanding. You're welcome.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
River Phoenix was born on August twenty third, nineteen seventy,
into a family that embraced an unconventional lifestyle. His parents,
Arlen and John Bottom, were deeply ameshed in counterculture of
the nineteen sixties and lived mostly on the road with
their five children, River the eldest, followed by Rain, Joaquin
(02:54):
Liberty and Summer. When he was a young boy, River's
parents became missionaries for the religious cult Children of God,
also known as the Family. John and Arland's work took
them to South America, but they eventually became disillusioned with
the group and relocated the family to Florida. There, they
(03:14):
adopted a new surname, Phoenix, a symbol of rebirth. By
all accounts, it was a nurturing, if unusual environment. River
and his siblings never had a formal education, but their parents'
bohemian lifestyle allowed the children to explore any creativity or
self expression to its fullest extent. They showed an aptitude
(03:37):
for acting in music, and at times busk to help
bring in money for the family.
Speaker 5 (03:42):
Well, in my family, throughout the years, we've been moving frequently,
whether it be for financial reasons or for different movies
that we were working on. So I've been very used
to that spontaneous, must pick it up and move on
kind of thing.
Speaker 1 (04:02):
River's brother, actor Joaquin Phoenix, recently detailed their upbringing and
sibling dynamic on comedian Theo Vaughn's podcast this past weekend
with Theo Vaughn, Why was.
Speaker 6 (04:14):
The second son uh? And uh, and my brother was
like quite a force and was definitely like I don't know,
almost like mythical or Shakespearean or you know, maybe it's
because he he died or something, but he's like, you know,
he was like the first son and he was and
he was he was incredible, and he was such a
(04:36):
force within our family. It was kind of like the
the the the guiding light in some ways. He's one
of the acted first and we used to sing on
the streets and he played guitar and kind of like
over singer. He was the lead singer and he was
the guitarist and kind of oversaw everybody. And he was
(04:57):
such a like a strong but gentle force within the family.
Speaker 1 (05:03):
This upbringing not only shaped rivers worldview, but also ignited
his artistic passions early on, laying the groundwork for his
future career in Hollywood. His breakthrough came in nineteen eighty
five with the TV movie Surviving a Family and Crisis,
which showcased his talent to a broader audience, but it
(05:23):
was nineteen eighty six's Stand By Me that catapulted him
into the spotlight, establishing him as a household name in
Variety's Oral history of the movie. Director Rob Reiner says
it was Phoenix's star power that helped the movie find distribution.
As he tells it, nearly every studio in Hollywood had
passed on the Coming of Age film when they convinced
(05:46):
New Columbia Pictures production head Guy McElwain to screen it.
But the most crucial members of the audience were mcelwain's
two daughters. About halfway through, they were in love with
River Phoenix. Bruce A. Evans, who produced and co wrote
the film, remembers in the film, fourteen year old River
is a standout as spiritual leader Chris Chambers, alongside co
(06:10):
stars Corey Feldman as hot tempered Teddy Duchamp, Will Wheaton
as sensitive Gordie la Chance, and Jerry O'Connell as wisecracking
Verne Tessio. It's been decades since, but Corey Feldman says
he still cherishes those memories on the stand by Me
set with River, whom he called one of the great
(06:30):
iconic actors of our time.
Speaker 2 (06:33):
I would say River was like the James Dean of
our generation. You know, he had all that prospect, he
had all that potential. Everybody knew that he was going
to be an Academy Award winner.
Speaker 4 (06:45):
Everybody knew that he was going to be.
Speaker 2 (06:47):
Hailed as one of the great iconic actors of our time,
and we knew it at that time.
Speaker 4 (06:51):
We knew it.
Speaker 2 (06:53):
I just assumed he would always be part of my life,
and I always assumed we'd have many more times to
work together. I figured we'd end up doing music together.
I figured we do more films together. To me, it
was a very open ended relationship that had only started
to bud. And that was that was the hardest gut
punch of the whole thing, was knowing that my friend
(07:15):
was gone and that wasn't going to happen again, and
there was no opportunity for us to ever create together
and to stand together. I mean to think about what
I've stood for in my life and the things that
he wanted to stand for or was standing for at
the time of his loss, and to think what magic
we could have stirred up together, the powerful statements, the
(07:38):
powerful moments, the things that we could have raised awareness
on if we joined forces and work together as adults,
you know, And that's the tragedy to me is just
you know, like, wow, We'll never have that chance to
see what might have become of it.
Speaker 1 (07:54):
Corey, take us back to when you were cast and
stand By Me. What do you remember from that time.
I'm filming in the summer of nineteen eighty five.
Speaker 2 (08:03):
Well, what I remember about being cast in stand By
Me was going into the audition while I was working
on the ADR for Goonies. Actually we were on the
sound stages. We did about I think it was like
sixty days worth of ADR on Goonies.
Speaker 4 (08:19):
It was a lot.
Speaker 2 (08:19):
We were there for like two months. We had our
school trailers out in the parking line, all that stuff.
So I got an audition to read for a Rob
Ryanan movie called The Body, and that's what it was
called when I went into audition for it, and I
remember it was a pretty big call. There was a
lot of kids in the room, and I remember Rob
asking me to come in two or three times to
(08:40):
try different.
Speaker 4 (08:41):
Things and all in the same day.
Speaker 2 (08:43):
But I mean like going back and forth and trying
different things, working with the character a little.
Speaker 4 (08:47):
Bit, and that was it.
Speaker 2 (08:49):
I mean, it was a pretty simple process. After I
think there was a callback. I think there was like
two calls and that was it. And then we got
the offer.
Speaker 1 (08:58):
So when you guys would see each other at casting
or whatever, were you often going up for the same roles.
Speaker 2 (09:04):
But it was movies like Explorers where you know, I
was promised a role. I originally was reading for River's role.
River got the role. Then I ended up reading for
the part that Jason Present ended up playing, which I
believe I got and was going to me, and then
I got Goonies and had to turn it down. So
there was a lot of that kind of stuff, you know,
(09:25):
And that was it was that way always with me
and River, and it was also that way with me
and Corey Haim. So a lot of people don't realize that,
and I was one of those people, by the way
that didn't realize it. But Corey would tell me, I
actually met you before Laws Boys, and I was like, how,
And he said, on the audition for Goonies, when I
went into amblin, you were actually sitting in the waiting room.
(09:46):
And when I saw that you were going in for
the same character as me, I knew that I was
in trouble because I knew that you already had a
relationship with Steven and blah blah blah. So that was
kind of one of those interesting things. So Corey was
one of them. But you know, I didn't see him
as much as he was from Canada, but River and
I saw each other on everything. And again Explorers, you know,
was another movie that he ended up getting.
Speaker 4 (10:07):
I ended up getting it too. We could have ended
up in that together.
Speaker 2 (10:10):
But then because I got the opera, like I think,
the same week as Goonies, I couldn't do it.
Speaker 4 (10:15):
Yeah, so there you go.
Speaker 1 (10:17):
Okay, what was the vibe like on set?
Speaker 4 (10:19):
Oh, it's amazing.
Speaker 2 (10:20):
I mean it was. First of all, the thing that
was great about that film was the fact that you had,
you know, four serious actors, even though we were kids,
we all took our craft seriously, and you had a
very serious.
Speaker 4 (10:33):
Director who had something to prove. You know. This was
not the Rob Reiner that we think of no of today.
Speaker 2 (10:40):
This was the guy who really had a chip on
his shoulder because people kept calling him Meatball and he
did not want to be remembered or referred to as
the meatball.
Speaker 4 (10:50):
It was like, yeah, that was cute.
Speaker 2 (10:51):
That was a sitcom I did back in the seventies
and you know, early eighties.
Speaker 4 (10:55):
But I'm done with that now. And now I'm a
director and I want.
Speaker 2 (10:58):
To be taken and seeing, and so because of that,
I think that's what kind of got me excited about
the prospect when I read the stuff that I read
from the body and said, Okay, this, this will be serious.
This is not like you know, the other stuff that
I've done before, where it's action adventure or comedy or horror.
I mean, this is like really serious stuff. So we
all got to put our serious faces on and go
(11:19):
for it. And so when we got up there, the
beautiful experience was that rob knowing that we were a
bunch of kids who did have the intention to be serious,
but at the same time probably came from a myriad
of backgrounds regarding our instincts, regarding what we were used to.
If you know, some of us were trained and had class,
some of us did not, like myself, who never went
(11:41):
to class, never had a coach, And so some of
the things that he wanted to do was kind of
broaden our horizons by introducing us to tricks and games
and things that were used in acting schools, in acting
classes and stuff that I personally had never experienced because
I'd never been to those things. And so we did
a series of things that he called traditional you know exercises,
(12:04):
which were exercises from you know, stell Adler or whatever,
where we would do things like mirroring or volume games
where we would you know, mirror each other's movements or
mirror each other's volume, where we would you know, somebody
would say something and then we would repeat it back
to them at a louder level, and then they would
repeat it back at a louder level. Things like that,
(12:26):
just working off of each other to gain each other's sensibilities,
understand each other's timing and thought process. And then we'd
play other games, like you know, kind of fun imagination
games or improvisation games, different things, just to get our
brains working and to get us communicating in a way
that felt like we've known each other for a.
Speaker 4 (12:46):
Lot longer than we had.
Speaker 2 (12:48):
And with River and I, it was really easy because
River and I had known each other for many years already.
We'd been seeing each other in different casting offices, you know,
playing football in the parking lot, link be in the
parking lot. You know, that's the kind of stuff that
you did if you got along with another kid in
the industry, because generally you'd walk into these casting offices
(13:09):
and they'd be I mean, I'm sure it's still like this,
but you know, there was fifty kids in there, and
they're all with their stage moms, and all their stage
moms have told their kids not to talk to other kids.
That's like a big thing. And for whatever reason, River
and I were both always those kids. Like we'd see
each other, hey man, how are you good? Good, what's
going on? Let's go outside and talk. Okay, when we
go outside and just start hanging, you know, and have
(13:30):
fun like kids do until it was time to get called.
And I guess, you know, even though we both did
have stage moms, for whatever reason, I guess they didn't
mind us hanging out because they knew that we were
probably the best of the best, and it was probably
a good idea for us to have a connection or whatever.
But the point is is that, you know, it wasn't
frowned upon for us to have that relationship, so we
(13:50):
kind of built.
Speaker 4 (13:51):
It, you know. And I wouldn't say we were great friends.
I would just say we were acquaintances.
Speaker 2 (13:55):
But we always kind of had a smile and a
fondness for when we saw each other and when we
realized that we were casting the movie together.
Speaker 4 (14:02):
We were both very excited about that.
Speaker 1 (14:05):
Is there an early memory from production that still stands
out to you.
Speaker 2 (14:10):
I'll never forget the plane ride over, which was one
of the scariest plane rides of my life. And I'll
never forget that because River and I were sitting next
to each other on a small single engine prop lane
and you know, it's like a puddle jumper, and we
hit some really serious turbulence on the way over, and
I'll never forget River and I sitting there fearing for
(14:30):
our lives, like scared to death, but laughing at the
same time because the plane was going like this. It
was rocking so hard that at one point it went
all the way up on its side. So we're like, whoof,
like that all the way up on its side, and
I remember almost going upside down and I'm like kind
of He's sitting next to me and I'm looking down
and I'm like, oh my god, are we going to die?
(14:50):
And we shared that experience of like a near death
experience together, and that's how we started off our journey
for a Stand by Me. So I've never told that story,
but it's an interest one and what.
Speaker 1 (15:01):
Do you remember about River as an actor?
Speaker 2 (15:04):
You know, most young actors, you look at them and
they don't respond, or if they do respond, they're just
reading words off the page, but there's no connection there.
That's the testament of a great actor, and especially at
a young age, is somebody that's not working off the
written page, but they're working off the emotion that those
words make them feel. Whether it's comedy or serious or horror,
(15:29):
it doesn't matter. It's still the same value, which is
being real in the moment and giving that real moment
to your fellow actors to get them the opportunity to
share in that real moment with you.
Speaker 4 (15:41):
So, yeah, that was the kinship.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
I believe that we had that kind of put us
above the other guys, not in the sense of actors,
just in the sense of we had that understanding.
Speaker 4 (15:52):
It was a mutual understanding.
Speaker 2 (15:54):
And then will you know, I think it was kind
of more from the other side of the training, which
was very kind of stick to the words on the page.
Speaker 4 (16:02):
You know, do what's in front of you. You know,
don't kind of do anything.
Speaker 2 (16:05):
Outside of the box unless you're told where River and
I were much more like go on the feeling go
on the feeling and then Jerry being so young, he
was just kind of like, you know, this was his
first project where him it was like the opposite side
of the spectrum where he was just like you know,
a bird being let out of the cage for the
first time and just kind of like.
Speaker 4 (16:25):
Hey, this is great, this is fun. Let's go everywhere,
you know, let's do anything. Let's yeah, this is awesome.
And he was. He brought that to his character, and
he brought that to the scenes, and all that innocence
and that sweetness that's in his character I think was
very genuine to Jerry and who he was.
Speaker 1 (16:42):
What was like the vibe like when cameras aren't rolling,
he seems like almost like summer camp, like you guys
are all the same age or were not the same
age and.
Speaker 4 (16:52):
Had to do a lot of fun.
Speaker 2 (16:53):
It was amazing until River had his family upheaved him
from the hotel and moved them all to a house
outside of town. So when we were all staying in
the same hotel, it was a blast. We were having
an amazing time. It was maybe a little bit too
much fun. But when his family, his Mam Marlene, decided
that they wanted to rent a little, you know, family
(17:15):
ranch home outside in the suburbs, which was about forty
minutes away from city.
Speaker 4 (17:21):
You know.
Speaker 2 (17:22):
Obviously I would go out there and stay with them sometimes,
or River would come stay in my hotel room with
me sometimes. But for the most part, it created the
separation between us, which was kind of depressing because we
were really excited and enjoying that camaraderie and enjoying that
kind of summer camp vibe, which of course you still
got on the set, but it was a little bit
different because you're working.
Speaker 4 (17:41):
So but we had some great times.
Speaker 2 (17:43):
I mean, that was the first nightclub I ever went
to in my life, was with River, and it was
an under eighteen, like an age fifteen to eighteen type nightclub.
And I don't even know how. I guess it was
all ages because we were not that old. We were
only thirteen. I don't know how we got into that place,
but they were letting us in. So we went to
our first night club for kids, and it was all,
(18:05):
you know, like I said, thirteen to eighteen year olds,
you know, dancing to depeche Mode and all the goth
type eighties music that was out there, and I'd come
in and River and I would have little Michael Jackson
dance offs. People don't realize this, but River could also
dance and he liked to dance like Michael also, although
it was never seen on camera, but he would do it.
(18:26):
And we would go to this nightclub called the Met
that was the name of the club. Actually just ran
into somebody at the comic con that I did last
weekend who was like, Oh, I remember you from Eugene, Oregon.
I don't know if you know this, but I went
to that nightclub with you. I said, what was it called.
They said it was the Met. I was like, that's right,
so that's what I have that information fresh on me.
(18:47):
But yeah, So we would go to that nightclub together.
You know, we famously got drunk together. I think it
was my first time being drunk, I'm not sure about his.
And then we also famously smoked weed together for the
first time, which is really weird, but that was on
set offset of the movie. We didn't do it on
set obviously while we were working, but it was through
(19:11):
people that were associated with the set, and that's how
we ended up getting the weed in the first place.
So basically one of the crew members brought us to
his room and smoked us out, And of course that
was not you know, that's typely right. We shouldn't be
doing that, but they did anyway. So but you know,
it was all in good fun. I mean, I wouldn't
(19:31):
say that they were trying to, you know, taint the
clean perception of a young adolescent. But we came to him.
It's not like he was pushing it on us. We
were saying, you know, all these kids are smoking weed
in town and they keep talking to us about it,
and we don't want to just you know, run off
with some kids. We'd rather do it with an adult
who knows what they're doing. And you know, maybe we
(19:52):
saw that you have a bong in your room. You know,
we were like hanging out with this guy on the
crew and we saw a bong in his room in
River said, you know, look he's got I was like, oh,
he's like, well, maybe we can ask him. So that's
what it was about. But anyway, we did it. Rivers
said he never felt it that day, by the way,
so I got stoned out of my mind.
Speaker 4 (20:12):
He never felt anything.
Speaker 2 (20:13):
And then I think we tried again another time, and
that time he did feel it. But and then I
remember cut to like New York when we were doing
the press tour and I was there with my dad.
Speaker 4 (20:25):
And I remember going over the River's room.
Speaker 2 (20:27):
And like I could smell weed coming all the way
down the hallway. I was like, well, I guess he
figured it out. But anyway, so.
Speaker 4 (20:34):
Yeah, that was there, you go. That was it, at the.
Speaker 2 (20:37):
End of innocence in the truest form, and that moment
of crossing from you know, puberty, you know, being kids,
being rambunctious, trying to understand the world and everything around us,
and then experimenting with these things that we, you know,
probably shouldn't have been. But I think it was pretty
much on par with what every other kid our age.
Speaker 4 (20:59):
Was doing at the time.
Speaker 2 (21:00):
I mean, I don't think we were really doing anything
that crazier out of control, and certainly we never did
hard drugs together or anything like that.
Speaker 1 (21:07):
Did he stay in touch after the film wrapped or
after the press tour.
Speaker 4 (21:11):
Yeah, we did.
Speaker 2 (21:12):
We stayed friends for many years, you know, and then
we kind of then we kind of stopped talking.
Speaker 4 (21:17):
I think probably around sixteen to eighteen.
Speaker 2 (21:21):
We didn't talk for a while, and then I saw
him when I turned eighteen at the Academy Awards, and
I remember it had been about two years and he
was there with Martha Plimpton. I was there with Drew Barrymore.
I was performing that year. He was nominated for Running
on Empty and so I remember going and visiting him,
like we would go to each other's sets, so like
we'd both be working on the Warner Brothers lot. I
(21:41):
think he was working on First No, No, No, before
before Running on Empty.
Speaker 4 (21:46):
There was that movie that he did, Jimmy Ruden. Was
it Jimmy Ruden?
Speaker 2 (21:49):
Yeah, might have been, But anyway, he was working on
a movie on the lot on the Warner Brothers lot.
I was working on I think Lost Boys, And we
kind of hooked up there and out on each other's
sets a little bit. And then the next time I
saw him after that was the Academy Awards, and it
was like, wow, look here we are. Now you're nominated.
I'm performing, Like this is kind of a big deal.
(22:11):
We've done well for ourselves.
Speaker 1 (22:14):
Okay, let's go back to that night at the Shrine
Auditorium in nineteen eighty nine for the Oscar Ceremony.
Speaker 7 (22:20):
The nominates for the best actor in the supporting role.
Speaker 3 (22:25):
Now like Dennis and Little Dog, Gentlemen, Kevin Klein in
a Fish called wand Martin Landau in Tucker the Man
and His Dreams, River Phoenix and running on empty.
Speaker 7 (22:43):
Dean Stockworld in Marriage with them All and the Oscar
goes to Kevin Klein and a Fish called wand Corey.
Speaker 1 (22:59):
What happened next?
Speaker 2 (23:00):
And then the very next contact was when I had
gotten through rehab and I was nineteen, and I had
just come out of rehab, and I was working on
a movie that I'm not hugely proud of, but it
was called Happy Campers, which was a broad kind of comedy,
camp comedy whatever.
Speaker 4 (23:20):
But anyway, point being that.
Speaker 2 (23:23):
The first a d saw how serious I was trying
to help people get sober, and she brought up to
me that River was going through some of his own
personal demons. And I don't want to get too into
the details of that, but I'll say that when I
heard that he was struggling with some of the same
things that I had just recovered from, I obviously wanted
(23:43):
to help in any way I could. So I reached
out to him a few times and we did speak,
we did connect, and The plan was that when I
got back from filming, we were going to get together.
And my plan was that I was going to get
him into twelve step recovery. And I was actually making
a plan to do that, to do like an intervention.
(24:03):
And then when I got back, I contacted him, never
reached him. His guy, his name was Sky, who was
with him actually the whole time of the filming of
the Standpy. I mean, he was his guardian, his onset guardian,
his name was. They called him Sky Phoenix, and Sky
and I are still very close friends today.
Speaker 4 (24:20):
But Sky was the one that entered the phone that
day and he.
Speaker 2 (24:23):
Said, oh, Rivers not available, he's sleeping or whatever, and
he never put him on the phone with me, and
we never reconnected. And because we never reconnected, I never
had the chance to get him into that twelve step recovery.
And it was only about maybe a couple months after
that that he that he oded. So it's a terrible
piece of my history, and it's very sad.
Speaker 4 (24:44):
You know.
Speaker 2 (24:45):
It's one of those things that you know, you ask
yourself over and over, could I have done more? You know,
I wish, I wish I would have thought more. I
wish I would have realized how serious it was and
made more of an aggressive plan to you know, make
myself present, to go, you know, pound on his door,
drag him out. Whatever I had to do, I should
have I should have done more, and I don't know
(25:05):
if I'll ever really completely forgive myself for that.
Speaker 7 (25:08):
Hmm.
Speaker 1 (25:09):
It sounds like my own private Idaho was the film
that really pushed him over the edge.
Speaker 2 (25:14):
Yep, that's what he had. That's that's what the lady,
her name was Chris Kringle. She had just worked with
him on that film, and that's why I was getting
the feedback what had happened on that set, and you
know what kind of condition he was in, and that's
why I was like, oh my god, I gotta do something.
So I did emphatically try to reach him. Several times.
We did connect, but briefly, and then by the time
(25:37):
I got home, you know, people get distracted. I got,
you know, right into a next movie. He goes into
his next you know how it is. It's just, you know,
you go your different paths and then by the time
you circle back sometimes it's too late.
Speaker 4 (25:50):
And that's what happened.
Speaker 1 (25:52):
What do you recall was your reaction when you heard
the news that he had passed away.
Speaker 2 (25:57):
Oh just awful, what loss. What a beautiful soul. I mean,
we had so much in common. That's why I respected him.
I mean not to sound self indulgent, but like, he
was a vegetarian, he loved animals, he loved humans, he
loved giving. He was a musician, he was, you know,
(26:20):
an artist. He liked to dance, he liked to sing,
he liked to quick. We made a music video together.
A lot of people don't know this, but him and
his sister Rain did some very early recordings of some
family songs, kind of like Partridge Family type stuff, and
they asked me to star in the video because he
liked the way I danced, and you know, he knew
that I was trying to get into music. He was
(26:41):
further advanced than I was, because I didn't start writing
until probably after that. I think around stand by Me
is when I started first putting pen to paper and
trying to write music.
Speaker 4 (26:51):
And it wasn't until really around Lost Boys that I.
Speaker 2 (26:54):
Put together my first single in my first video, which
was Rotten Away, which I never released even but I
was kind of working on music at that time, so
He had me probably by about a year or two,
and when he was already working on his music and
he would play it for me.
Speaker 4 (27:08):
I was like, this is great, this is great. He's like,
why do you start one of the videos. We want
to make a video and I want you to start.
I was like okay.
Speaker 2 (27:13):
So he directed the video and it was me taking
his little sister out on a date or something like that.
It was really sweet and really cute. But you know,
I show up with flowers and I knock on the
door and the little girl comes to the door and
we go up on this date holding hands.
Speaker 4 (27:29):
And it was just the sweetest, was innocent little thing.
Speaker 2 (27:33):
So yeah, I go back to those dimes, and I
go back to those memories of why we were so
connected and why we were so linked together spiritually because
we were like the same we were cut from the
same cloth, and I just had so much love and
respect and admiration for him. So when I you know,
when I turned on the news that night, and it
was Halloween night, so I think i'd.
Speaker 4 (27:53):
Been out as well, you know, and I came home and.
Speaker 2 (27:55):
I just saw it and it was just it. I
couldn't even believe it was real. You know, it was
just it was horrifying, and yeah, it's just a huge laws.
Speaker 1 (28:07):
To further discuss the cultural phenomenon that would stand By
Me were turned to Variety is chief film critic Owen Gleiberman.
Speaker 8 (28:14):
I think the movie that really put him on the
map for me was stand By Me. You know, he
had that kind of wolf cub look about him, and
he already, you know, in hindsight, had the quality that
would define him as an actor, which is that under
this cool facade, there was this very tender and sincere quality.
(28:37):
It's kind of effortless gravitas that he had. And in
that sense, you know, he was a prototype in a
way for a new generation of stars, a new paradigm
of Hollywood startup. You know, he'd started out as a
teen star doing after school specials and things like that,
and in a way that felt very ahead of the curve.
He was sort of like Harry Styles or Robert Pattinson
(29:00):
in that when he crossed over into an adult persona,
he had to sort of fight for his credibility. But
I think, you know, from stand by Me on you
really saw that he just had this quality that stood out,
this stillness about him that made you want to watch him,
where he could just effortlessly own a scene. Just about
(29:21):
the highest compliment you can give a young actor is
to say that he's a James Dean. Now, a million
young actors have been compared to James Dean, and ninety
nine percent of them do not live up to that.
But River Phoenix really was a James Dean. And you
start with that look. I mean, he was just very
(29:42):
handsome with that dark blonde hair, but there was a
soul to him. He looked like a wolf, very wild
and mysterious, and he had this quality of melancholy about
him that always came through very glamorous but also vulnerable, haunted.
But that gave him this intoxicating quality where he could
(30:03):
be doing absolutely nothing and you wanted to watch me.
And part of what was so James Dean like about
River Phoenix is that he did seem to be nursing
some buried, kind of far off ache, some kind of wound,
and you wanted to get in touch with that. You
wanted to know what it was. You kind of wanted
to take.
Speaker 4 (30:23):
Care of him.
Speaker 8 (30:25):
I think River Phoenix stood out in that movie by
seeming more like a seventies actor. I think those kids
were all pretty good in the movie, but you know,
they were kind of punchy and a little bit sticky
son of them, and he was. He was willing to
kind of be laid back and not say anything and
(30:47):
just you know, kind of command a scene through his presence.
And I think that's the quality he carried through all
his roles. He often played these kind of quiet, introspective
characters where he wasn't ruling a scene through dialogue, although
he could do that too, and there was something it
(31:09):
was more like just his presence. There was this quality
he had that drew you to it. It was very
nonverbal in a way, and I think that comes across
and stand by me, that's what makes him the most
magnetic of those four is that he's the one. He's
the one of these boys who has kind of a
(31:29):
quality of mystery about him.
Speaker 1 (31:35):
With his new phone fame, River took on ambitious roles
that further highlighted his talent. Films like The Mosquito Coast
and Running on Empty earned him critical acclaim and solidified
his status as a rise in star Let's Listen to
this nineteen eighty eight interview from Toronto's CFTO News.
Speaker 8 (31:55):
Phoenix has met with considerable success in his brief career,
but doesn't consider himself an actor as much as a comedian.
Speaker 5 (32:01):
To me, an actor is like a Shakespearean actor, and
I just feel like I can blend well and can
take on a character and somehow make it feel somewhat
organic and spontaneous.
Speaker 1 (32:20):
Yet with success came personal challenges. River struggled with the
pressures of his newfound fame, the financial responsibility of being
a breadwinner for his family, his tendency to throw his
entire self into a role, and a complex personal life
that included an on again, off again relationship with his
Mosquito Coast and running on Empty coastar Martha Plumpton. He
(32:42):
also began experimenting with drugs and alcohol during this time.
Martha recently spoke about River and their four year romance
on her friend Jesse Tyler Ferguson's Dinners on Me podcast.
Speaker 9 (32:55):
River was certainly more famous than I ever was. I mean,
he got an Oscar nomination, obviously, but I think we
were both really good at knowing that we didn't really
want that attention anyway, and so we really weren't exposed
really that much in that way, and neither of us
was terribly comfortable with that sort of thing, And it
(33:15):
was before we were even like understood really like what
that meant, you know.
Speaker 4 (33:22):
I think it.
Speaker 9 (33:24):
Got harder as we got older and River became more famous.
It got harder for him. I think, well, I know
it was harder for him, and he was not as
equipped I think as maybe some other people might be
(33:48):
to handle that stuff because he was a very at heart,
very innocent and and like a driven by love human being,
so that the contradictions of Hollywood and show business were
much more difficult for him. Yeah, and you know when
we did break up eventually, we were together for about
(34:11):
four years, and then when we did break up, we
did remain friends, and we were each other's first love.
That relationship never really goes away. You can't ever let
something like that go. It's just too important and too
like altering. I mean, it's part of it's made you
who you are, you know, especially in those really formative years.
Speaker 4 (34:32):
I mean, it's a huge part of who I am.
Speaker 9 (34:35):
So yeah, so, and of course we stayed friends, but
I think fame was really hard on River. I think
he really just didn't know what to do with all
of that kind and he wanted to do good, but
it was really it's just the contradictions of it were
too difficult.
Speaker 4 (34:54):
Yeah, it seems like he was really lucky.
Speaker 3 (34:57):
To have you.
Speaker 9 (34:58):
Well, I think he was lucky to have me and
his family, his brothers and sisters. I think, you know,
his personality or his affliction, his illness was incredibly difficult
for him to manage on his own, and he never
(35:21):
really got the help that I think he would have
done amazingly well with If he had gotten that help,
I think he would have been an incredible advocate for
sobriety and for people struggling with addiction. And unfortunately it
just got him before he had a chance to do that.
(35:41):
But yeah, I mean I miss him every single day,
every single day.
Speaker 1 (35:49):
It all came to a head on October thirty first,
nineteen ninety three, at the Viper Room in Los Angeles,
when Phoenix died of an overdose. He was twenty three
years old. That Halloween night, his girlfriend, Samantha Mathis, was
right by riverside.
Speaker 10 (36:05):
I think he was an iconic person for our generation,
just like my parents talk about they knew where they
were when John F.
Speaker 4 (36:14):
Kennedy was killed.
Speaker 10 (36:15):
Pretty Much everyone I know knows exactly where they were
when River died, and what a loss of hope that
was for our generation.
Speaker 1 (36:27):
We've only just begun to uncover the remarkable life of
River Phoenix, from his unorthodox upbringing to his rapid rise
as a Hollywood icon. In the next episode, we'll delve
deeper into the pressures that came with fame and the
artistic choices that defined his legacy, including his films Dogfight
(36:48):
and My Own Private Idaho. Join us next time for
more on Variety Confidential, the life and legend of River Phoenix.
Don't forget to subscribe wherever you listen to podcasts. Variety
Confidential is created by Dea Lawrence and Stephen Gados. Season
two is hosted by Tatiana Siegal, produced by Karen Misagucci
(37:11):
and Sydney Kramer. Executive produced by da Lawrence and Tatiana Siegal.
Written by Anna Moslin, Karen Mazagucci and Tatiana Siegal, Variety's
co editor in Chief Cynthia Littleton, and Ramin Sechuda. Variety
Content Studio Executive produced by Alex Hughes, Edited and mixed
(37:31):
by Aaron Greenawald. Please refer to sources and citations on
variety dot com
Host
Tatiana Siegel
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