Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:09):
Hey, what's going on? Is Chris Corrino. This is the
Voice of the Nets podcast, coming to you from the road,
recording this while the Nets were in Chicago, got a
chance to catch up with Nick Claxton. We're getting up
close and personal with Nick um. It was about it
was Christmas Day last year in l a and Nick
Claxton I think got in the psyche of the NBA
(00:33):
fans around the world when he dunked on Lebron James.
It kind of all of a sudden, now people started
to have Nick Claxton on their radar, like, Wow, this
is not just some guy who was the first pick
in the second round back in two thousand and nineteen.
Who's uh behind you know, three other aging All Stars
(00:57):
Chason rings Uh. Anymore, this is a Nick Claxton. Who Wow,
we might have keep an eye on this guy. Well,
fast forward to the twenty to twenty three season and
Nick Claxton, as we record, this is ninth in the
All Star balloting for front court players in the Eastern Conference.
(01:20):
He already interjected himself into the Defensive Player of the
Year conversation by claiming that, hey, people should look for
him to win that award. This year. These are things
now that are putting Nick Claxton in the conversation amongst
the top NBA players in the league, especially on the
(01:41):
defensive end of the floor. Uh. But as you may
have followed on the social media channels on the Nets,
you see Greenville, South Carolina to Brooklyn, a documentary that
chronicles his journey, which is not a very long journey
right now. He's only barely twenty three years old. So
we thought we'd sit down with Nick, get to know
(02:04):
him a little bit personally more, maybe going a little
more in depth uh that you saw in the documentary,
and just talk about the growth, the challenges, what he's into,
all kinds of great stuff. Really my pleasure to sit
down have a conversation right here on the Voice of
the Nets with the great Nick Claxton. So we're sitting
(02:26):
down here. You just get I just got the email there.
You were nice in the UH voting for the All
Star Game. What are your your initial reaction to something
like that. I mean, that's big time. I want to
see that I'm ninth. I want to climb up my
heart on that list. Stuff. But it's definitely sirot to
see my name even on that list. I think it's
good even if it even if it doesn't work out
for you that get there this year, I feel like
(02:49):
you always have to get in the conversation for people
to kind of think of you now, oh yeah, that
guy could be an All Star. Yeah. I think that's
definitely where it starts. Just having your name kind of
trending in the right direction. And it's definitely a big
It's I'm saying that my work is it's being recognized,
(03:09):
and it just makes me want to, you know, go
even harder and produce even more out there on the
court for my team. And I know, I know you
put yourself in the conversation for Defensive Player of the
Year and I said, like, well, maybe somebody like asked
them like, are you gonna be a defensive player? Yeah?
But you know you you brought it up right, I mean,
is that is that where you see kind of your identity? Definitely,
(03:34):
And at the end of the day, you know, we
have to bring ourselves as players. Um, it's kind of
our jobs to do that out there on the court.
And when you're giving a platform that we're giving you
have to you have to do that in your game,
has to has to speak for itself. So me bringing
that up and just kind of just opening up people's
(03:54):
eyes to you know, me being a defensive player of
the year, UM defensive team. And it's definitely worked and
a lot of people are starting to take notice. You
got to back that up when you say that, right,
you got that, You've got that confidence about you. I
want to go back so that if you if people
followed them that the social media uh platforms for the nets,
(04:15):
they were seeing this new documentary, this mini documentary from
Greenville to Brooklyn. It was great because you got to
see uh, your your mom and dad, Nicki and Charles,
your your brother Chaz. Uh Greenville to Brooklyn. Is it
as different as people would think? Or there are some
similarities there? Na, it's honestly night in day. Uh. Just
(04:38):
growing up in the South in Greenville, like you said,
then going to college in Georgia. It was a big
culture shock for me. But I've definitely adjusted over these
past few years, and I really the city. I've runed
to love the city. At first, I was kind of like,
you know, it's a big city, so many different people.
I really didn't know what to do, what to get into.
But you know, over the years, UM, I really become
(05:01):
a lot more comfortable in this city. And of course
I still stick to my roots back home in Greenville. Yeah.
I mean you're about when you came to Brooklyn. Yeah,
I was tween years old. I mean that's you're you're
you're a young man, You're a college kid. Um, you
say you've adjusted. What is it about Brooklyn that you
kind of like? And what is it about Greenville that
(05:22):
you kind of miss? Um? The things I love about
Brooklyn is just the culture, the different types of people
that you run into on a day to day basis
in Brooklyn, and even just the five boroughs are all
so close, and I mean New York is just one
of one. You can really can find anything you need,
is um, at any time, any time of day. It's
(05:45):
always things are always open. It's it's really the seat
that never sleeps. And you know, one thing I really
love about Brooklyn is just the um the fashion, and
I'm really in the fashion. And it's definitely one of
the best places in the US, if not the best place,
um for shopping and things I missed about green but
just the trees, the seeniory of the space, my family, friends,
(06:06):
close friends. But you know, um my, my folks, they
could always come out to to the city and come visit.
Let's talk about your your folks for a second. Heere
because your dad played at Georgia. Um, where is there
any choice, Freddy or else where? Was Georgia the place
you were gonna go? Well? Yeah, my parents they were
hands off. I can honestly say that. Um. I took
(06:28):
my first official visits to Florida State and honestly almost
went there. But my dad was really adamant about me,
um taking off five of my official visits. And I'm
happy that he he chose to do that because when
he went through his process, he didn't use off all
of his visits. And I mean, I think that anybody
coming up through that process should do that because the
visits are free. Um, it can be kind of kind
(06:50):
of tiring, but at the end of the day, you know,
experience experience in different college atmosphere. So I think that
everybody should do that. And my heart ended up um
telling me to go to Georgia as it was family.
I mean, your your dad played there. It was a
really good player. Georgia got drafted in the NBA, spent
a little time um and and in the video Greenville,
(07:13):
South Greenville to Brooklyn. Your mom, Nikki, she's out there
talking about your guard skills. I mean, is she is?
Is she she worked in your camp too? Is there
the economy between mom and dad? I know, just my
personal level, you know, being trying to go into broadcasting
in college, I had my father telling me, you know,
(07:34):
very few people make it better, get a backup plan.
But mom was like, no, you're You're great, don't worry
about it in private. Your dad is proud of your
tells about So what was the diconomy between mom and
dad in terms of uh being an NBA player and
and pushing you to other things? Yeah, I mean I
think my my path was definitely interesting. Uh growing up,
(07:57):
I wasn't always the highly tided off star recruit, but
I just always had a a work ethic that I
saw in my parents every single day. And I kind
of used that with basketball and I never gave up.
I grew and God blessed me with height, with with
length and with the with the work ethic that I have.
(08:19):
And yeah, I mean my parents they definitely pushed me,
especially my dad just pushing me every single day. Will
be days when you know, I didn't really I wouldn't
feel like going to the gym earlier on, but he
would make sure I was, you know, getting in my
reps until it became something that I kind of became
obsessive over. And my mom she was just there. I
mean she was She would always make the sacrifices, um,
(08:40):
picking me up after work or me going and sitting
down with her her job, and it just became a
natural thing over over the years, and me just falling
in love with the game. Your dad coached you, right,
and when you're in youth leagues, I know you said
you had the hype, but you didn't always have the hype, right,
I mean you were you weren't short, but you did
go through a big growth spurt in high school with
the dad. Was that hard to um, to to just
(09:03):
get coordinated where they're where they're growing pains, what we
were going through with that. Yeah, I was always I
was always pretty coordinated, and it really take me along
to grow into my body. Like as far as like
I was never really like goofy, you know, kind of
out there on the court. But um, the growing pains
were pretty bad. I had like some pretty bad knee
issues and I kind of had to manage that. Where
(09:25):
I had had to sit out certain tournaments. I set
out a summer and where I just worked out and
the tennanightis was bad when I went through that growth
spurt around nine, Tim Cray, But um, I was able
to manage that. And UM really just um, like you
said earlier, my dad holding into my my guard skills
earlier on, and then me having that growth spurt, and
(09:48):
then I already had that fail for the game from guarden,
smaller players, from handling the ball, and I think all
of those things are what I used to my advantage today.
Your competitiveness in the video, you're talking about you and
your brother always going to add a chas he's what
(10:08):
two years ago, ch Chase he said, two years younger,
and he said, went through went through university. Um so
was there a point where like could he beat you
or was it just you just handle the moment? He
could never beat me? And then I got my older brother,
Charles and my cousins and it was just that's just
(10:29):
what we did every day. We just competed everything in
the backyard, backyard, whether it's video games, anything. And I
was always talking trash to him. I think that's where
I get that from now and now that stuff it
doesn't affect him like it's just that's that's who I
am as a person, That's who he is. We're both
ultra competitors, and that's definitely where that where that comes from.
I see the competitive nature come out in you on
(10:51):
the floor each night. Um, you're you're you're when you
were younger, you playing a program, drama rant, you're right
with your drama ran and that. Um, he wasn't very
highly touted either, right, So that's short of the I
feel like those guys have a little bit to prove
trying when you come from that just being from South Carolina,
(11:11):
it's a smaller market. Even as I, um, you know,
he kind of had a different path then us, but
just coming from South Carolina having that underdog mentality, a
lot of times people can't overlook us because we're from
South Carolina and you just adopt that that mentality. I
know I definitely have and you can see it he does,
and I'm extremely I'm happy to see what he's doing. Um,
(11:35):
we played it was my last year, a year I
think eleventh grade. We played on the same team, and
I was the one getting most of the recognition from
from schools and to see you know what he's doing now,
is it's good? Were you always uh shop blocker, defensive
minded player even when you were a young kid. Yeah,
even when I was younger, I wasn't the tallest player
(11:57):
on the court. I would always find a way to
block shots. And really where I've always hung my husband defense.
I think that comes from that definitely comes from my
dad though. He That's how he was as a player,
and then just growing up just watching basketball with him,
that's just what he was big on defense. Defense, That's
what he preached, Uh, just being disciplined on defense. And
(12:18):
then you know, you start to learn different trades, different
trades and how to have your own sauce out there defensively.
So have your own sauce defensively. I like that. What's
your when you're out there right now? I see you
you have to guard smaller guys on the premier and
the switching defense, and that's flight your guard big guys.
You gotta protect the rim um? Are there different techniques?
(12:40):
Is it? What's been the biggest adjudgment for you at
the NBA level. That's a good question. I'm the biggest
adjustment I would say has been besides me getting stronger,
I still have a ways to go. Um, guarden guys
on the perimeter hasn't really been I issue. But you know,
(13:01):
sometimes one of those bigger guys, that's when I'm I'm
I'm learning. Um, even especially this year, Markief, He's really
taking me under his wings, is teaching me different things.
And I'm a I'm a sponge. All the guys that
have come through here, Uh, I listened. I feel like
I try to take best in pieces from everybody's game
and added to my game. And I'm still learning. I
still have a way to go. But um, I definitely
(13:24):
love the spot that I'm in now and I take
on that challenge every single night. It's interesting that the
perimeter part of it would be the thing that more
comes natural to you me than it does right does
and then some of the bigger bodies. Where where the
development when you got to the next you special time
of the g league? Um, who's been your guys that
have helped you out the most? And and in what
(13:44):
ways do you think you've you know, grown from that experience.
I mean since day one, I've been with um for
rfk Ran. Yeah, I've been with him since day when
he was with me during the G League and all
a lot to him. We've been working day in, day out. Um.
Like you said, the G League stance, that's just a
(14:04):
part of the journey. You can never get to how
I get too low. I enjoyed my time and the
G League. My my first year in the league, I
was able to get some some really good reps. And
it hasn't always been easy. I've had injuries, I've had
guys come in, all Stars come in, and so I've
had to I had to get through a lot. But
that's what makes me the the player that I am today,
(14:24):
and I'm I'm thankful for the journey. I'm thankful for
for the highs the lows, and I'm looking forward to continue.
Do you feel the jump this year? I mean you
you mentioned all Stars, guys that you know we're brought
in and are not not here anymore kind of the
job was handed to you. Do you feel a confidence
level because it looks like it, you know, you just
(14:45):
look like a like a more confident player this year.
I think it just it just shows the confidence that
the organization has in me um. Giving me the starting
job this year was big for my confidence and not
not seeing anybody in front of me how has been
in the past, so just knowing like all right now,
it's it's my time and at the end of the day,
(15:08):
it's up to me to go out there and produce.
And that's what I do. I bring the best version
of myself on a night and night basis, and I'm
a lot stronger now. I feel like my my body
is ready to, you know, with standing the rigorous NBA schedule.
And that's just what I've been doing, taking the game
my game, just trying to get a little bit better
every single game. Man letting, every letting, everything else happening.
(15:30):
There was one play I remember recently, I think the
New Year's Eve game. You're in Charlotte and you're you're
you get switched out on the Terry Roach here, and
I mean that's a difficult matchup for anybody, and Terry
kind of like there's one point you I don't know
if it looked to me like you let him go
buy you so that you could block and you got them.
You blocked him, Like take me through that, Like are
(15:53):
you are you saying to yourself. I know, I I
know he's gonna try and get around me, so let
me try and block the shot. Are you are you
baiting him into at I remember this play? Um, Yeah,
he drove past me and right he's got a quick
first step. He beat me on that one. But and
I've been doing a really good job with time of
my blocks. Is just getting more comfortable. And and sometimes
(16:14):
certain plays, you know, you might give up like a
rebound to get a block. Sometimes sometimes that's how it goes.
But yeah, I remember that play. What about when you're
playing with Kevin Durant because you have such lengths there
and you guys are both in the the only I
think the only duel in the NBA in the top
ten in blocks? What's that like being out there with him?
(16:34):
Are you in tandem? Do you know that you know
one guy sets him up, leads him into you. Is
there is there short of working in tandem kind of thing?
Defensively with you guys, yeah, we're definitely in syncing. No,
I'll play I have a lot of rips with him
over these past a few years. So, um, offensively, defensively,
we're definitely in sync now. And just I'm trying to
(16:56):
get like that with a whole entire team though, UM,
just just knowing, knowing when guys make it beat when
I need to be there, um to support what guys
and I'm just trying to just get guys, you know,
not to foul. I got that back, and yeah, I mean,
I mean, um, Katie, we definitely definitely have a really
good centergy out there, and defensively, I think that I mean,
(17:18):
it's crazy to say, but I think that his game
has taken up a big jump this year. Defensively, they've
really had because he's an impact player defensively, not that
he hasn't been in the past, but it's just it's
amazing we're doing on both ends of the floor. And
when you see him, when you see him like when
he when he's diving into the stands in Atlanta, or
even last night when guys are a little SLUGGISHU we're
recording this the night after the Bulls game, you know
(17:39):
he's out there just busting it. How do you how
do your teammates, especially you're playing with Kevin Durant, Kyrie Irving,
hold you accountable and maybe the other role players and
younger guys on the team I mean, I think when
you have leaders like that, actions always speak louder than words.
So at the end of the day, words only mean
so much. I mean, like you see a guy like Katie,
(18:02):
He's going out there in a night, like you said
against Chicago, where you know a lot of people don't
have it going, and he's out there getting to it.
So if you see that coming from a star player,
making making hustle plays, that the only that that's contain
you just throwout the whole team and it makes everybody
else want to bring the best version of themselves every
single night. And you talk about that, and I think
(18:23):
of you being a leader with this team and knowing
your role defensively where we're talking about all the different
things you have to do as a young player, and
playing with those legendary players, do you feel a weight
of that, Like on the defensive end, you've got it,
you gotta switch and guard point guards, you gotta protect
the rim, you gotta get out and contest three's on guys,
(18:43):
Do you feel the weight of that? Is that something
that maybe you enjoy? Yeah? I definitely I love it,
Like that's what I want. I've been doing it since
I've been in the league, and I feel like, you know,
I'm the best study now that I've been and I
take on the challenge every single night. That's my That's
what the team needs for me to do at a
hot level for us to succeed. So, um, I like
(19:07):
the challenge. That's what I want to do. That's what
that's what my calling is for the team, and that's
what the team needs from every single night. What feels
better dunking on somebody or grabbing an allee or sending
one into the fifth row? What feels better for Nick Laxton?
(19:29):
I would have to say probably probably dunking on somebody.
That's that's that's a great feeling. But you know, as
funny as you're you're leading the league as we take
this in field goal percentage, which I mean you're you're
doing stuff that's historic. You're in the seventies every month
in field goal percentage, and a lot of people would think, well,
that's because you're saw dunks, but you've been You're finishing
(19:51):
around the rim in in wild ways to like nothing
that You've got the little hook going. Um, your your
twin staying and scoring. Is that by design? Is it? Feel?
Have you worked on that part is it. It's just
knowing that when I when I get the ball down there,
I'm gonna have to try and maneuver around people. What's
(20:11):
the thought process with the way you're finishing around the
wren this ship. I would say it's a combination of things.
I always say as a combination of strength. Definitely me
getting stronger and being able to take bumps better and
just finishing with both hands, being a lot more comfortable
doing that. And yeah, whenever I get the ball down there,
just finishing over around people. Like you said, it's not
(20:34):
all dunks. If people really analyze the games and they
can say, oh, well he just dunks everything. No, like
I'm I'm going at guys, I'm finishing around people, finishing
over people, And it's it's definitely a lot of skill
finishes and just a lot of work that I put
in over these past few years, just with touch. And
it's not you don't have you know, it's not a
face up game for you. But like a lot of
(20:56):
the game today, they want the bigs to be stretched
guys that can shoot jump shots. That's really not what
your game is. Do you think I was gonna say,
do you think You're gonna look to develop that more
because if you weren't playing with Kevin Durant Kyrie Irving,
it probably be a little more important for you to
work on that, you know, to be that guy. Yeah,
I mean, I can't play like this forever where I'm
(21:16):
just running and jumping. I won't be able. I won't
be this athletic my whole entype career. Um, this is
what the team needs from me right now, and so
I've really just honed in on that and just starting
in my role. But definitely down the road, I definitely
want to, you know, develop a jump shot UM shot
the ball in college and something I'll definitely work at
(21:38):
over over the summers and at I noticed from the
beginning of the year to to recently, the free throw
shooting routine for you has been different. You went now
to where you're much more deliberate. Um, you had a
stretch where you've made a bunch in a row, and
I'm just curious to know the switch and and and
how you came to that and what is the purpose
(22:01):
of the way you approach free throw shooting now. Yeah,
So I mean, as people know, my free through my
free throw shooting has been a journey. Um, was it
were you was? Was it always like that? Or was
it were you were good? Free to a shooter early on? Um,
so let's see high school. See I was high school.
It was it was solid, college sixty four, you know, decent,
(22:24):
that's decent. Um, first year of fifties, last year, second
year in the league, kind of up and down, and
then especially my my third year this past season. Um,
I think it's been a combination of things, just me
being in my own head and me not shooting the
ball anymore like I used to shoot. So with me
not shooting anymore, it's just everything is all dunks around
(22:48):
the room, touch and you get to the free throw
line and you gotta you gotta calm yourself now and
knock down the free throws. And this I've changed it.
I've changed it up this year and it's been it
feels pretty good. Um. I'm just like you said, I'm
a lot more focused when I go up to the line.
I'm I have a routine. I'm focusing on the routine
(23:08):
and work in progress. But it's something that I feel,
I feel good about and I'm gonna continue to work
at every single day. Um. And yeah, but you want
to be able to you want to be able to
do something that you can repeat over. Yeah, that's that's
the thing that before earlier in the season or even
last year, I was switching up the shot a lot.
So now I have a routine to where I'm just
(23:30):
focusing on I got certain queues that I'm locking in
on and locking in on that process and shooting that
same way every time. And if something is often, I
know it's often, I can tweak it and fix it
right there. It's the growth. That's how you have to
That's how you stay in the leak. That's how you
get all star boats exact. Uh, we're on the road
when we're taping this, let's talk a little bit about that.
(23:50):
Do you like the road, you like visiting different cities. Yeah,
I think it depends on what cities. Though we're in
Chicago right now. Like Chicago is cool, it's like a
like a baby New York. But you know, certain cities
are kind of tough. Um start out a lot, and
when you're in these cities or do you kind of
stay in your room. It depends, you know, it depends
on it depends on the city. Um, certain cities you
(24:13):
may do a little bit more exploring, but I definitely
I like being on the road, but it's nothing like
being at home with your own bit. At the end
of the day, you said, you're you're you're you're into fashion.
So they're playing at their different cities. Do you like
to go? There's certain places you like to visit for that.
In that regard, I haven't done that yet, but I
feel like living in New York, you don't really need
to do that as much because all of the best
(24:36):
clothes are really in New York. You can find it there.
What's the what's how would you stop me? I know
I'm a little I'm like, I'm like old man. Yeah,
like how could I how could I up my game
a little bit? Stop? I would say, whatever you feel comfortable,
and when there's some some coats some how flashy you
want to be. I kind of like to be a
(24:56):
little flashy sometimes, like with shades. But whatever you feel
comfortable and whatever you want to whatever you want to
put out there. I saw you walk into the arena
one day with like an old school briefcase, like like
you got the hard you know, rectangular briefcase. Is that
part of the fashion? Yeah? So look, it's a look
go yard bad. Yeah. I didn't really have much channing,
(25:16):
but it's just part of the Look, what do you are?
You gotta brings your you are your video game guide.
You bring that on the road with you. I used
to PlayStation. It's so heavy. So kind of just be
in a room just watching watching TV. Um read and
I try to read and just talking to friends and family.
(25:37):
Any uh, books that you could that that you've that
you've leaned on in your life that have maybe made
an impact on you. Yeah, the Alchemists, Um Curry suggested
for me to read and definitely changed my perspective on life.
And like the Four Agreements Relent List by Tim Grover. Um.
(26:00):
Tim Grover, who was Kobe Bryant's workout guy. Right Jordan, Yeah, Jordan, Chicago.
Actually yeah. Muhammad Ali's autobiography was really good. So yeah,
it's a few books that I really like and I
want to just a continuery. Alive was the guy that
kind of put stuff out there. He was gonna do it.
(26:23):
He had swagger, a lot of it. Uh. I always
end these things by Jim Balvano, the head coach in
North Carolina State. He was this Uh, he was the
guy who's a famous shot, Lorenzo Charles Dunk in the
n c A tournament and when the tourm he's running
around and h he got cancer. And he was at
(26:43):
the SPS he got the Arthur Ash Award and he
gives this, uh, he gives this great stirring speech about
never give up. And as a guy who was a
month away from passing away, and he said, to have
a full life, you thought you had to do three
things every day, laugh, cry, and think. M hm um.
(27:07):
What makes Nick Claxton laugh? What makes me laugh? Probably
just just good vibes, man, Just whether it's you know,
certain teammates are really funny. You spent a lot of
the funniest teammate, funniest teammate this year or anybody I think.
(27:30):
I think, um rfk, you got a really good personality
is pretty funny. Smiling my face, um day into that.
But Ben Ben is Ben is funny. You got a
good personality. Um. I don't know if you're a crier.
I don't know, Like if you watch a fat, sad
movie or something, if it would get bringing to do
sometimes just you want your emotions kind of like you know,
(27:51):
just stirred to where you feel him. You know, is
something that that does that for you? Uh? Death? Honestly, yeah,
when people pass But you know, like you said, it's
good to just let us let out emotions. It's not
really good to suppress everything. Yeah, it's good to feel it,
(28:15):
you know. And I mean I could watch a good
car commercial and be brought to tears. I mean, especially
when you when you become a parent, you know, you
think of stuff differently like that. Um, the think parties
to say was, you know outside the Barkley Center there's
the oculus they score, and you know that's the circular thing.
You put a message up there, and so many people
(28:37):
can pass through by coming up in the subway or
coming into the arena. If there was a message that
you can just give to people something you want people
to to think about. What do you think something would
be that you want to put up there for everybody
to say and think about. I would say just staying
in the present. Don't don't get too hot, don't get
(28:58):
too love. Life has its upsi downs, and just stay
in the present moment. Whether it's whether it's a good
day or this's a bad day, just feel it and
move on and life. Life goes on, and continue to
be thankful for everything that you have and just just
be happy because we only get in one life. Net
(29:19):
fans are thankful for Nick Claxton this year. You've been
an integral part of of the nets success and continued
good luck. Really enjoyed doing this with you. I hope
it wasn't too painful. Appreciate you. That's Nick Claxton here
on the Voice of the Nets. Thanks Nick. All right,
(29:40):
my thanks to Nick Claxton. Great getting to know Nick.
I've gotten to see him. I mean, you're seeing him
grow up before our eyes in Brooklyn and it's really
become a force. He's been so enjoyable to watch. I
hope you enjoyed getting to know Nick a little bit better.
I want to thank my crew here uh in Chicago.
Our producer of the Voice of the Nets is Tom
dow To engineer Isaac Lee. Thank you very much for listening.
(30:03):
Please subscribe and listen wherever you get your podcast. I'm
Chris Corino. This is the Voice of the Nets.