May 7, 2018 • 41 mins
Welcome to Whine Down with Jana Kramer! We get to know Jana a little better, when she shares the story of her one week marriage, and a discussion on the importance of sex in a relationship. Then she gets some words of wisdom from life coach Caroline Zwickson, and learns how to ask your partner for help.
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Speaker 1 (00:02):
Wine Down with Jane Kramer and I hear a radio podcast.
Hey guys, what's up. It's Jane Kramer and it's The
Wine Down. Oh my goodness, I'm so excited. I've been
wanting to do a podcast for years. And UM, I
think for those of you that don't know who I am, Um,
(00:24):
I get ten minutes to tell you who that is.
I think I need a little bit more than ten minutes.
But UM, to start, I'm a mom. I have a
beautiful two year old daughter. Her name is Jolie, and
she's the love of my life and she's the reason
why I do everything. Um, I'm married, and I say
(00:48):
that with caution because, um, you know, my life is
extremely public and it's been it's been a crazy journey
because I have I've I've had a couple of marriages
under my belt. Um, but I wouldn't really call the marriages.
I would call them glimpses of things because one I
met when I was nineteen and then we went to Vegas.
(01:08):
The other one I was only married to for a
week and now he's my best friend. And um, you know,
now I'm married and we've been married for it'll be
three years. In may happily a couple of months. But um,
that's besides the point and we'll talk about that later.
But um, wait a minute, did you just say you
were married to somebody for a week? Yeah? How did
(01:29):
you get divorced so fast? No? Okay, Well here's the deal.
We were. He's not my best friend, which is the
funniest part of all of it. His wife is like
truly my my best friend here in l A. Um
and I we have like weekly dinner family parties. Um,
but we were. We were dating for three years and
then he was fourteen years older than me. Um, in
(01:52):
the age wasn't an issue. But what the issue was
is we were just I was going right, he was
going left. And but as I'm such like a love
addict at the core, I just I always wanted to
please him. And um, but you know my dream I
was I was going to Nashville. He was here in
l A. And um, I was just finishing one tree hill.
(02:13):
Long story short, it was just one of those things
where I walked on the aisle and was like, I
don't want to be married to this man. Oh no, wait,
was it a full on wedding with the wedding the
wedding and everything. Yeah, it was the whole. I mean,
so what we say is we laugh and we say
we had a beautiful party. We were not married. Married
to me is like what I'm in now, Like we
are like in it, you know what I mean, Like
(02:34):
we're fighting for it. We have a child, like we're
working on our marriage. To me, that's marriage, not just
like a wedding. And so I think I've only been
like for me, I've only been married once but on
paper three. But let's go back, let's go back to
the one week marriage, but one like marriage. You when
did you decide you needed to get a divorce the
(02:56):
day I married him? The day you married him? So
you guys didn't go on the honeymoon, you didn't, Well
we went up north after because we got married up
North Michigan. Um, but I just I knew. I actually
called the wedding off two weeks before. But then I
was like, well, we have like an okay exclusive and
you know, I don't want to ruin people's plans. So
(03:17):
I was just like, you know, well maybe maybe like
maybe i'll feel something different, Like maybe I'll walk down
the aisle and I'll feel something different. But I knew
that if I stayed married him, we'd have kids and
then we'd end up divorce, and I was like, I
don't want, Like I grew up in a divorce family
and for me personally, like I just knew, like if
I knew walking down the aisles shouldn't be married to
(03:38):
this man, I should divorce him now absolutely, And it
was like the greatest thing that ever happened, because now
he's married to this amazing girl named Julie and they
have a beautiful son, and Camden and Jolie are like
besties and now we all hang out. I was just
texting with her there in Hawaii right now, and they're
coming back and then we're having dinner tomorrow night. That's
(03:59):
and he's an actor John with and Check, so he
um and he's he's like my acting coach too, so
whenever I have auditions he helps me. And yeah, did
you ever feel like you wanted to be the runaway
bride where you just didn't show up? Oh? Yeah, totally.
But I couldn't do it. I just felt so bad
for people like I wanted to, like because I wanted
to have that beautiful day. I wanted to be in
(04:19):
love with him. It's a thing I like every part
of me, like was just like because I did, I
do love like I still I love John. I think
he's a great guy. Would we have ever worked? No,
like not at all. Okay, So we're his parents, both
of his parents there? Yeah, and your parents ever? Everyone
was there, and girl, it was beau. It was a
beautiful wedding. Did your parents know? No? No? What about
(04:42):
his parents? His dad and I never really got along.
He's like real old school, like cop and I was
like this little young little like name to marry your son.
He's like, what is my He probably thought his son
was going through a midlife crisis, honestly because I was
like twenty six and he was in his forties. So
and what about the mom? Oh, she's like they're great,
(05:04):
They're awesome, and you know they still I mean I
have not seen them since the wedding. Every time I like,
I know they're in town right now. So I texted
Julie and I was like, Hey, does Jolie want to
play with Camden? But I don't think they want to
see me, so that we're not cool yet. But Julie,
John and I are great Okay, And how long has
it been? So it's been almost eight years? Wow? But
(05:27):
I mean like again, like we weren't like, yes, we
we were. We dated for three years and what was
it like then? So back and forth because he had
just gotten divorced from Christina appligate. Oh my god, he
called me Christina so many times? Do it in bed?
Not in bed? Not in bed? No? But maybe like
(05:48):
I don't, like I don't remember that, but no, he
would call me sometimes I would just be and I
think I always wanted to be better than her, like
I wanted to be like because he was so hurt
from that relationship. Did she end it with him? Yeah,
So that's tough when you were rebound for him. He
had plenty of rebounds before me. But and you was
like his first girlfriend after Christina, and you feel like
(06:11):
you two were codependent on each other. No, I he was.
He like didn't want me at all in the beginning,
but I like forced myself on him, like because we
did a movie together called prom Night, and I was like,
oh my god, that's the guy from that thing you do.
He's so hot and um, and then we hung out
and then he's just like, you're too young, and I
(06:32):
was like, no, I'm not immature, I swear, and and
then it was just one of those things where I
just I kept wanting his love and attention and affection.
And that's like what a love addict is, Okay, And
so what was the relationship? Like how much time did
you spend another like that? I mean three years? We
probably were together like a year, like two years? And
(06:54):
did you break up a lot? Yeah? We broke up
a lot because he would there really like oh him
all the time, and I beIN, please, why don't you
want to be with me? Um? He just didn't want
a girlfriend. He's like, I'm just I'm not ready. So
and I just waited and stayed and passed so many
like and every time I got in a good relationship
with someone, he'd always come back. And then I'd of
course break up with that person and date him and
(07:17):
date him. And then when he was ready to commit
to you, that was when you were like, I know,
but it was because we had different Um, we were
just so we were too different at that point. Okay,
but your best friends, but just too different so we
couldn't be married. Now I know, people are like, well,
(07:37):
you guys are best friends, like why wouldn't you guys work?
Because him and Julie work, like she can handle his stuff.
There's certain things as a wife that I could not
handle that he does. That makes sense. I understand that.
Like he's you know, he's really really really actory. And
sometimes I'm like, can you just like stop and just
(07:58):
because he needs the attention? Does he? I mean, like,
I know, I like attention. I know, I mean all
actors like attention. But it's just it's yeah, and there
is a dark side too, and you know it's it's heavy,
and it's like I like more of the light with
the heavy and sometimes like and Julie can balance it
so well, like I support it supported and I would
be like, like he he would write a script and
(08:19):
I'd be like, that's awful, and that's not a supportive wife,
you know, but I didn't. It's an honest one, yeah,
but it's not a nice one. And Julie like supports
his like thoughts and ideas well. That makes sense? And
what about now? What about? Now? What about now? Me?
Do you like still consider yourself a love addict? I
(08:41):
can I have always be a love addict. I just
I love because and you have to be careful with
that because it's like, you know, there's times when you
know my husband and I are good, and it's like
you have to really hone in on that love addiction
because you don't want to find it somewhere else. You
gotta keep finding it in the relationship, right, And do
you think about that sometimes? If you guys are right, No,
(09:05):
I think I think everyone has like healthy fantasies. Yeah,
but I would I'd probably never admit that to him,
But now that he's probably hearing this, now he knows,
he knows. No. I mean, I think it's that's a
tough question because I would be mad at him for
having those fantasies, right, So I shouldn't either. But sometimes
(09:28):
I fantasize about being divorced and having the house to myself.
And that's why my fantasy not about being with someone else.
It's about being alone, having space, space, just being like
left alone for a day a Wednesday, every Wednesday, every Wednesday.
Does he does he demand a lot? Does he know
(09:50):
my husband is he's great? I mean, obviously it's very public.
Our our our separation was extremely public. And his stuff,
which you know, well, I'll talk about later in in podcast. History,
but um, we're working on it. And that's the thing.
Like marriage is, whether there's infidelity, whether there's um issues
(10:12):
in the marriage, you always have to work on it. Yes,
I think someone that has a perfect marriage I call
BS two right away absolutely because you have to grow.
That means that you're actually not working on your marriage
then to me personally, right because you're not growing, you
have to grow together and the people that don't grow together, like,
we're both willing to work. That's the thing. I'm willing
to work. He's willing to work. That's what's making this
(10:33):
relationship not end catastrophically. Yet you go to therapy so
much therapy, but I love therapy. I think it's great.
Do you do individual and marriage individual marriage And he's
got his whole in his own thing that he goes
to as well. So it's it's both of us. You know,
you actively working in the marriage. You guys are in it.
You guys are really putting the work. It's tough. I
(10:55):
mean sometimes, like after couples therapy, it's really close to
our house, so a lot of the times I walk
home just because I just need like a minute. It's
tough because you're talking about things. It's like, yeah, I
wish it was a complete fairy tale and perfect, but
it's not. But at the end of the day, like
it could be. If you really truly work on it
and both partners are willing to work on it, then
(11:15):
you could have a beautiful relationship. I love that. So
here's the deal. I need as much help as all
of you guys do, and I'm I'm constantly on my
comments looking at what you guys want and what I
need to is. So I'm gonna have not only celebrity
moms on here. I'm gonna have life coaches. I'm going
to have sex experts. I'm gonna have a marriage therapist
(11:39):
because I know we all need some help. I know
I do. Caroline's wisen um. She is a life coach
um works with mom issues, relationship issues, or even just
life and you can find her at Caroline's Wicksen dot com. Caroline, Hi, Hi,
how are you. I'm good? How are you? I'm doing great?
Thank you? So can you tell our listeners, um, just
(12:00):
a little bit about you your background? Yeah? Absolutely so. Um,
I'm a women's someone will help and life coach. Um.
I'm really passionate about you. Know, connecting, connecting to two um.
And my background is in psychology, so I have also
have a master's in counseling psychology, and I specifically now
work with mothers to really reclaim themselves, you know, their
(12:22):
identity after becoming a mom, which so many times get
so lost. Um, and then also reclaiming your health both
part of that's amazing. And I'm here with producer Jen too,
and we were just having that conversation about how it's
that's that's what I'm personally dealing with, is how to
be able to separate being a mom and then my
(12:43):
career because I have we have a lot of guilt
with that too. So what would be like your advice
for me and mom's out there that are having that problem,
but having that guilt problem specifically guilt, but then also
so I guess two things, guilt and then also how
to how to have my things, like how to have
(13:04):
my purpose and all of this. Mm hmm yeah, So
like really like how do you reclaim yourself as a woman? UM?
So I think a lot of times, you know, like
the most common thing that I really hear from from
moms in in my work, if I don't even know
who I am anymore? Right, that real sense of loss
that like I don't even know what happened to the
(13:24):
woman who I once was. And then there's this whole
idea in our society and culture of like bouncing back
and getting that woman back and getting that life back.
And what I always tell my clients and what I've
seen a lot of time talking about, is that it's
not about um, you know, getting back what who you
once were, but really needing that person that you are now,
and really needing the woman, the mother that you've evolved into,
(13:48):
because she has changed, like she's different physically, you know,
like her value system has changed dramatically, And so really
approaching this topic with a really open mind and open
heart and really finding out who are you now that
you've undergone this massive transition? Um? I think. And then
another point to that is I think something that is
really important obviously is time. Like so many moms struggle
(14:10):
with time, and like not even moms right, like everybody
nowadays struggling with time, UM, and becoming really good at
delegating and understanding what are at the areas and subchecks
that you can actually take care of, UM, And what
do I think that you can really delegate to other people,
and how can you really structure a support system and
a tribe around you that is supporting you in you know,
(14:33):
integrating motherhood into your life. M you know what. I
love that. Here's my problem with it though, when because
I sat down with my therapist and I it's just
like I feel like I'm doing everything, and she goes, well,
start trying to ask people for help. So but when
I asked people for help, for example, like my daughter
had split up in our crib and it took me.
(14:53):
It was so hard for me to ask my nanny
to clean the sheets. But why didn't the nanny just
clean this cheats well? Because she didn't know that she
had like spit up in there. And so I had asked.
I asked, nanny, I said, and it was like I
was like, okay, I'm gonna practice like what my therapist
told me to do. So I was like, can you
please change the sheets in like the crib room, you know,
in her nursery. And I come home and she didn't
(15:14):
do it. So I'm like, this is why I don't
ask people to do something, because it doesn't get done
like I have to just I'm just gonna do it myself, right,
So that's like where it's like how do I how
do I delegate? But if I don't like the way
that it's done or if it's not done, how do
I deal with that? Well, if it's not done, then
you know, maybe we're not getting the right kind of support,
(15:35):
like you honestly like made people that you can trust
and rely on. Um, and who are you know like
also like obviously like willing to help you. UM. I
think that whole like hesitation to ask for help like
that is really unless so that we can train. I
think the more we can train ourselves to ask for help,
the easier it becomes, and the more trusting we also become.
(15:56):
As we were experiencing over time, but I asked the
person for help, and they did it, and it was
done in a way that it was accessible for me
and for everybody else and from like basically like having
positive experience, positive experience, positive experience that is current to
build your trust muscle. It's hard though, So it's really hard,
(16:16):
and it's really hard to find a team that like
really you know, puts into your life. Stuff Like a
friend of mine always as higher really slowly for anyone
who comes into your personal house. Yeah, hey, true or false.
If it ain't broke, don't fix it. M M agree.
(16:38):
I agree with that too. Why do people think that
that's true though, because it's the easy way out, you know.
But if you're really talking about creating lives that are
really fulfilling for ourselves, because a lot of people set
up for a mediocre life, right. I was texting your
coach and I was like that, she's gonna say true,
(17:00):
and I'm gonna say b as to that. You are
a true life coach. People should definitely all right, here's
another one, true or false. Um, if you can beat them,
join them. If you can't beat them, join them. She's
passed again. But here's the problem. People think that's like
(17:20):
true stuff can beat them. Yeah yeah, but then you're
just sacrificing yourself and your own values and that's not
a good way of living. She's she is. And it starts,
doesn't it, Caroline. It starts with girls when they're like
really young in their peer groups. Yeah, and boys too.
(17:40):
I mean, like develop developmentally. They go through like a
twinship face right where they are basically trying on what
it's like to be like the other people and they're
like copying everything that somebody else is doing. But I
think that's where, you know, like our parenting comes in
at some point where we also have to encourage them
to be true individuals and a lot of that happens
of role modeling. Right, how can use it to your
(18:02):
own values? So how can use it to what's really
important to you? How can you actually speak with an
authentic voice? And that's what your children will learn? Right?
Question about that with relationships? What do you what's your
advice about an argument in front of your children? Is
it something where it? Because here's here's my problem. I
don't want to be like, oh, we're just like perfect
(18:24):
and people don't argue, And it's like what is what
is the line with with that and raising you know,
showing your children certain things? Yeah, I mean, you know,
like an argument like it can be like something where
you're feeling like, Okay, we're actually coming to a solution
and we're like having a people of conversation. We just
have different opinions, but we're coming to a compromise. I
think that's great for your children to be able to watch,
(18:46):
But if it's a really heated argument, and where like
basically like the foundation of safety of the family feels
at risk to a child, I think it's left would
be taken into another room. So what's the word I
think table it or like like what's the like not
like you know what I mean? Like how do you
how do you stop something? Then like how do you
(19:07):
stop the argument? So I think you know one of
you or both ideally like you have to agree, like
if this happened. Confusually this kind of thing like it happened,
and then later on you're like, shoot, like this really
something that happened. You know. Um, then you basically say,
like the next time, I'm feeling the seats coming up again,
because usually work of us feel speech when anger rises
(19:29):
in the body. When I'm feeling the sensation in my body,
it's going to be my responsibility to say, let's stop
this conversation now, And that's resument when the kids are
in bed or when you know, when we're out of
out forever, because I want to like finish it. Also,
you're heated saying you're not really in the moment. You
are in the moment of the anger, so you're not
thinking about anything else around you. How do you how
(19:51):
do you deal with It's really hard moms wanting to
separate to there because sometimes I feel lost as not
only a mom, but as a wife too. Yeah. So
I'm like, I'm like, it's just like who Like like
you said, like who am I? Because I'm like, I'm
a I'm my wife, I'm a mom, But like what
other where's my Where's Janna? Like where did she go?
(20:12):
Because I'm just trying to please everybody in the family. Yeah,
And I mean this is again like moms tell me
I'm losing myself, and dad, it's a husband tell me,
I feel like I'm losing my wife. What happens a
lot because women have the tendency because they drive us crazy.
That's why they don't know that, you know what, pusnant
were just talking about that because he goes he's like, why, oh,
(20:35):
he made a comment about Mother's Day and it was like,
moms are magical And I go, why did you just
make that voice? And he goes, oh, sorry, I didn't
realize it was a Mother's Day ad And I'm like,
we are magical. We do everything. And he's like, you
don't do everything? And I was like, where's our daughter
going to preschool. He's like, I was like, you wouldn't
like you wouldn't think to like like, we just take
care of it. We don't ask you to help us,
(20:57):
like I mean, like we we take care of all
of it all. Who's does he know where her dentist is?
She wouldn't even know when she has to go to
the dentist. So it's like, but like, but we put
all that pressure on us. But here's the problem. And again,
like I know how you say to delegate. So I
could be like, honey, make an appointment, and I know
he would, but he wouldn't do it when I want
(21:17):
him to do it, right, it would be two days
from now, yeah, or like a month from now of course.
So it's like again, it's like that's where I feel
like we we um almost like force us, not force ourselves,
but like we're the reason why we're losing ourselves. Yeah,
and we're not delegating. Like Caroline just said, we need
to delegate. We have to well, because I think in
order to delegate effectively in hisself, that goes back to
(21:40):
what we were talking about earlier. Um, we do have
to trust the other people and we also have to
allow other people to do it their way right. So
like if I'm, for example, like I'm usually a person
who cooks dinner because I'm also want to food and
kind of like with them in our family. And if
I now told my husband to make dinner and he's
starting to make something that you make, like he's not
(22:00):
going to make the dinner that I make. But I
have to be okay with that. It's strategic incompetence, and
I just got with the expectations, like he's he's purposely
screwing up something because he's like I don't want to
have to do that, like when they go to the
grocery store and forget to buy four or five things. Yeah,
and here's the deal. I know, I'm like giving my
(22:21):
husband hard time, but he is great because he does
he does, you know, help the laundry, although he's never
he's like, these pants don't fit her anymore. I was like, yeah,
because there's six months pants, Like you know what I mean,
Like you could have put them like away, Why are
you putting those on our daughter? Like it's like, I
don't think he's ever like, you know, helped. I don't
know how those were still in her door because usually
(22:41):
I make sure that her clothes are put away that
don't fit her anymore. But somehow those got in there,
probably because he kept putting them on her like dot her.
But um, you know, I mean he does help, but
it is hard because again, like as moms like I
feel like we do put that pressure on ourselves. And
having a life coach help us, I think is would
be beneficial for me, Oh for sure. So what what
(23:04):
do you do? Like? How do you is it like
is it like a therapy session? Do I sit down
and talk to you? Is it something where you know,
is it like a weekly thing? Is it a monthly thing?
Or how does that work with a life coach? Yeah,
I mean it can look in different ways. The way
I work with my clients is UM basically how you
really greatly? Because we said is it like does it
like therapy? Um? That basically life coaching focus is much
(23:27):
more on the future and really connecting you with your
intuition and your desired outcomes going forward versus traditional therapy
really focuses more on your past and really overcoming things
that happened in your childhood or in your past that
you're you know, not able to move away from. UM
and So in coaching, I worked with my clients every
two weeks, so we speak on the phone every two
(23:49):
weeks UM, and we discussed in our lives what are
their block and then also what are we UM? What
do you want to achieve? Like what do you want
to get to UM? And then according to that we
plan very pretty strategic and set the big action stuff UM.
And then they have two weeks to implement and they
have unlimited email support. So I work with my clients
(24:09):
where you know, they can write me an email whenever
UM they need to in order to update me on
if something is working at something is not working, and
then we kind of problem solved from they're amazing. That's awesome. Well, Caroline,
thank you so much. I really appreciate Where can we
find you out? UM? iFIT it's Caroline six, the dot
coms Caroline b A r O l I N E
(24:30):
and the kicks them VS and cebra w I c
K s O N. And are you on Instagram or
need those? I'm on Instagram and my Instagram handle is
ko tick fun so c A R O V w
I c K s O N. Amazing. Well, thank you
so much. We really appreciate it. And this is definitely
something that I know that I'm going to need. So
hopefully your mama is out there got some good info too,
(24:54):
So thanks Caroline, have a great day. Thank you. Right
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(25:17):
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(25:39):
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enter Janna. Okay, um, should we talk about sex on
(26:01):
the show? I think sex? What I mean? It's curious
because I think sex and marriage is a huge issue. Absolutely.
I have found married and not having sex there is
a problem that is not being talked about. I mean
my ex we didn't even sleep in the same bedroom
for the last two and a half years. That's because
you guys didn't like each other. Yeah, yeah, because were
(26:24):
you not attracted to your husband? Were you ever? I
think so? I mean that was so long ago. We
had to have been attracted to him to get married. No,
I mean I was so young. I was so young? Really? Yeah,
well you probably yeah, I'm sure I was. There was
a there was a time. Did you ever think about so?
(26:45):
Then you how long? What was the longest you went
without sleeping with your husband? Probably about three years? Three years?
No sex? Did you master me? Can we talk about that? That?
Can talk about that much? It's too much because I
will talk about it. That's the problem. I am. So
we just go too far. What didn't you just go
(27:07):
to want to know if you guys think we're going
too far, I will stop. I will peg this right
on up. But here's the problem. If you guys want
to be open book with me, we can talk about
it all. If you want to send me in your
questions or your comments, um, you can email me at
Jane Kramer at iHeart media dot com. And if you
have any questions about sex or what you should do,
(27:28):
Like I have a friend she doesn't sleep with her husband,
and I have a hard like they have to like
schedule sex. I'm like, well that's boring. How often do
they schedule it? I think it's like every other month,
like it's second or having sex that's like what like
the therapist had recommended. So it's like and for me
(27:48):
it's like I actually want to have more sex than
a husband, which is an issue. So was it always
that way with him? With Michael? Yeah, well he has
he's got like intimacy issues, which is something that we
can talk on. Somebody like that. It's tough. Yeah, that's
like word really it's so tough. So that's something I
(28:11):
think we need a marriage counselor on the show for
that talk. I think so too, because that's that's something
that like he is working on. But it's really hard
for me because I'm like, well, it doesn't have to
be intimate. Why can't we just like have sex? But
he connects, he connects to two and you're able to
next like making love with intimacy, and I'm like, I don't.
I'm not. We don't have to make love right now.
We can just have sex like you can even yeah,
(28:36):
I mean like it's cool, but like I for some reason,
like I need that, like like I don't need the
fore play. Let's just get to it. I'm fine even
if I don't climb the hill. Yeah, yes I can.
It's still like I don't know. I sometimes I think
it's bad, but I do equate love with sex like
(28:58):
that he wants me because he's with me, right, But
that's part of the love addict. Yes, ding ding ding.
But it's like, man, I feel so rejected as a husband, right,
and that's not good. When men feel rejected, that's when
they start to look outside of the marriage. But here's here,
(29:19):
and here's the issue with me, which is what I
was like because I wanted sex. I'm like, why did
you cheat on me? Like I was willing to have
sex with you. So that's that's the part that stings
me because I'm like, I begged you for sex, right,
I wanted to have But that's a totally different issue,
I know. But that's what's like, there's that that rejection
(29:39):
piece that I have to work on. So it's like
when he doesn't want to sleep with me, because for me, personally,
i'd be happy with I'd be happy with like three
times a week, like full on three times a week,
like me actually trying like maybe like twice a week, okay.
And what about him? What do you think he wants?
I think he'd be okay with like ones or not
(30:01):
even once every other do you what do you think
people do in those situations? Like you guys have been
going to therapy, what what is the therapist saying, Well,
we haven't really gotten there because we have so many
other issues that we have to work on. I mean,
that's definitely an issue in therapy, but I think that
something we're still like working on and he's working on
because sometimes like it doesn't have to just be sex,
(30:23):
but I still want to be able to like I
want to make out, I want to do those things.
Do you people? I feel like don't make out what
does he kiss you when he sees you? Does he
is he affectionate? Y ask? But again I'm I'm more affectionate,
like again like he because he has that like intimacy issue,
Like I would be like I have way more p
(30:43):
d A. But now I've like gone back from that
because I know he doesn't like it as much. So
it's like, well, then I'm not being myself and that's
not doesn't feel good for me, and so like we're
trying to find that healthy balance. But that's the thing,
Like when I talk to my other girlfriends, it's like
I'm having sex, it's like whether you want to or not,
do you want your husband stepping out on you know,
like have sex with them whether you want it or not.
(31:05):
But then don't be a log because they're like, well,
of course I don't want to sleep with you because
you're just like laying there. But then if the person
really doesn't want to sleep with the guy, it's really
married exactly, I don't know. I mean some things, I
get it. You don't want to have sex, you're tired,
you've got baby puke all over you, Like I get that.
But then at the same time, you should. Also, you
(31:28):
have to have investment in your relationship, and part of
an investment is having sex. I think it is, But
I also have women that don't. They aren't just very
sexual and they don't they've never like masturbated before, and
I find that crazy. You have friends who have never
mastered ever, And I'm like, let me walk you into
a hustler store and buy you a rabbit, like it'll
just change your life? Is that? Like? Do you start
(31:49):
buying mom on Amazon and giving giving one in a while?
I have an old faithful let's just call her old faithful.
She's been a round. And how does your actually feel?
Like my husband? We don't really talk about that, really no,
(32:12):
because it's it's a very touchy subject in the household
because I don't want him doing that. But does he
he better not? He must, he can't, he must be
it's weird again, I can't. It's like it's a it's
a tough topic because you know it's again. Once there's
like infidelity, things just kind of go. It's there's different
(32:35):
boundaries that needs to be in place interest him, Okay,
boundaries and do you feel like you're on the other
side of that? Oh, no, No, there's still trust issues.
I think there's I am trusting him more, but I
think you always have to continue to work on the trust.
But I'm willing to talk more about sex if you
(32:57):
guys are so, if you have any questions. Jannekramer, I
heart media dot Com, Let's talk about it. What is
pan sexual? Pan Sexual is a term that a lot
of millennials are using. They're more on the spectrum of sexuality.
It does has nothing to do with gender, um race age, anything.
It's just they can fall in love with the human being,
(33:21):
so they don't even consider themselves that liquid. Isn't there
something another liquid thing? It's like, it's like fluid, fluid fluid,
I'm fluid, Like, isn't the same thing? It's pretty much
the same thing. It's like you're on a spectrum of you.
Just it doesn't matter the gender you're just if you
fall in love with Nikki, who's a girl, happens to
(33:45):
be a girl, You're in love with Nikki the human
beings you could ever fall in love with a girl.
I don't think so. I WoT love me well, I
love you like I'm gonna make you fall in love
with me and I'm getting we're gonna make out with me?
But um, I feel totally connected to you. But I
(34:05):
am so right now so so so mand um, I
I think that I you know what, I've never told
this before. Ever. There was this waitress at Friday's. Um.
(34:25):
I was in high school and I don't remember her name,
but I had the biggest crush on her. She was
like short hair lesbian. Oh wow. But she was like
cool and like confident and like sexy, and I would
like catch myself flirting with her and I was like,
am I No, I just like I've never I've never
(34:45):
forgot about her. Wow, weird, right, But I would go
for like more of the like short hair girl, so
more boyish. Yeah, like I'm obsessed with like um oh
my gosh, I just read her name. She's married to
the writer Glendalon Glennon Doyle. She's married. She's a soccer
player Abby, Abby wand box. I have a girl crush
(35:05):
on her? Did you ever have? Never? I don't think
I could actually go through with it. Yeah, So I've
never done that. I've never even kissed a girl, even
though I want to sing this song I kissed a girl. No,
but I've never kissed a girl like I mean, I've
like kissed on like but not like as in like
a lesbian way, lesbian way. He didn't make no no
(35:28):
no no. But I've I've never had that, but I've
I've never thought forgot about the Friday's girl And where
was she? Where did she? I was a waitress in
Michigan at Friday's. Wow, Yeah, that's never forgotten about her.
I've never what's her name? I don't remember. I had
(35:48):
a hard time keeping a job when I was in Michigan.
I would just go from job to job. Where did you? Oh?
I worked at Appleby's, Friday's Um American Grill. I worked
at Joe's Crabshack, Greek Island. I love Greek Island. Yeah. So, like,
you know, my boyfriend would have like a soccer game
and I didn't want to show up for work. That
(36:09):
was the problem. And I was like good. Yeah, So
apparently I am really boring because everyone's like telling me
about like they're always like, what shows do you watch?
And I'm like, well, the one show I did watch
was over Scandal, right, So I'm like, you know what
I watched? You want to hear what I watched. I
was like Puppy Dog Pals, Mickey Mouse in the Roadster Clubhouse,
(36:32):
Like that's the stuff that I watched. Transformer Like me,
Everyone's like, you don't watch Westworld or you know Handmaid's Tails,
Like I would love to, but by the time it's
eight o'clock, I want a glass of wine, I want
my bed, and I want to go to sleep. That's it, right, Yeah.
Do you know how many times I've watched Bolt? That's
actually really good. I just watched it the other day.
(36:53):
It was really cute. Just in the past three days.
Have you seen Up? Have I seen Up? It's so good.
It's so sad, though, I mean, this is like, but
I feel like we should. This is okay because you
and I are so busy and we just watch like
Up and um Tangled and all those shows. Let's challenge
each other to watch a show. So it'll be like
(37:16):
instead of a book club, it'll be a show club.
Which which show? Which show do you want to watch? Well?
I kind of want to watch Handmaids Tale. I've heard
that's really good. Okay, so let's do this because I
know it's challenging. Let's watch two a week. I feel
like that's pretty I can do that. I can do
that Tuesday and Thursday night. Sure, get on this Sunday,
(37:37):
I'll do Wednesday. I'll do Tuesday Wednesday and when we'll
talk about it and then we'll talk about it because
I feel like if I'm not getting because if not,
then I'm just gonna sit down and watch like Kardashian
reruns until I like get tired enough and fall asleep
and I'll watch, you know, season twelve begun. We need
to like, we need to be we need we need
(37:59):
to be cool moms. Okay, like we need to have
some fun for ourselves. We need to be cool moms. Um,
and you guys feel free to join us and watching
Handmaid's Tale and we can like binge talk about it
and um, yeah, we can talk all about it because
I feel like for the moms out there that are
just have pop past in their brain, we can now
(38:21):
be like, yeah, have you watched handmaid Stale? And like
you can like feel a part of the conversation. It's
a gradual bene. Okay, it's not a binge at all.
It's just reasonable binge. It's a small binge to a week.
We're going from zero to two huge. That's huge, that's
two hours. I'm gonna have so much more like knowledge
(38:42):
in life and I'm just gonna walk around being like
the Handmaids Tale and we're just no idea what it is.
It's so excited handmaidge. There's nuns in it. Oh cool
there about the nuns. Do you have a thing for nuns?
Is that your girl across a none? But oh, speaking
of your blonde girl that you loved? Um, who are
(39:05):
your girl crushes? Do you have them? Celebrity celebrity gerty
girl crush? Well, you know, Kate Hutson cut her hair.
I'm kind of digging on her now she's got cut Yeah,
Katie Perry too, I'm not into her. No, No, Kate Hudson.
Kate Hutson, she's got great style. But honestly, you know,
(39:25):
I would say Kate Hudson ill like cry style and
then um, oh man, that's kind of a tough one.
But you know whose Instagram? I look at a lot.
Who is Um Chloe Kardashian. I love Chloe. She's not
my girl crushed though, Um Drew Barrymore because she's so cute.
She has everything going on and I want to drink
(39:47):
rose with her because I just think i'd have her
on a drink that is so fun um in Sandra Bullock,
I love her, love her. She's so classy. She is
She's always kept it classy, even when she was going
through the worst time of her life. Just the one
worst time I know he was that was he did
her wrong. That was just she is great that she's
(40:08):
just pure class. Yeah, and she's a mom, and yeah,
I like her a lot. Speaking of Kate Hadson's about
to have a baby, a baby girl. Yeah, we should
have her on. I just would love to talk to
her like how she bounced because she's been married three times.
I know, well, you know, with three different kids from
three different daddies. So I'm curious all musicians like her.
(40:30):
She's got a type. She's definitely definitely got a type.
But I will, you know what. I love her mom
because when I got as soon as I started announcing
that I was getting divorced, I was like, I'm never
ever getting married again. I'm going to goldieh on it
the rest of my life. I mean, it's working for
right because they wake up every morning and they make
(40:53):
the choice to stay together. There's not a piece of paper. Yeah, well,
this is so much about it. I'm so excited. Thank
you guys so much for listening. Um, this has just
made my entire world. I hope you guys enjoy it
as much as I have. UM and Jen, you're so sweet.
Thank you for being here with me. Anything you guys
want to talk about, please let me know any advice,
what you just anything, I mean, let's talk about it all.
(41:14):
Email me at Janne Kramer at iHeartMedia dot com and
we'll be back next week and we'll wind down together
again
Wine Down with Jane Kramer and I hear a radio podcast.
Hey guys, what's up. It's Jane Kramer and it's The
Wine Down. Oh my goodness, I'm so excited. I've been
wanting to do a podcast for years. And UM, I
think for those of you that don't know who I am, Um,
(00:24):
I get ten minutes to tell you who that is.
I think I need a little bit more than ten minutes.
But UM, to start, I'm a mom. I have a
beautiful two year old daughter. Her name is Jolie, and
she's the love of my life and she's the reason
why I do everything. Um, I'm married, and I say
(00:48):
that with caution because, um, you know, my life is
extremely public and it's been it's been a crazy journey
because I have I've I've had a couple of marriages
under my belt. Um, but I wouldn't really call the marriages.
I would call them glimpses of things because one I
met when I was nineteen and then we went to Vegas.
(01:08):
The other one I was only married to for a
week and now he's my best friend. And um, you know,
now I'm married and we've been married for it'll be
three years. In may happily a couple of months. But um,
that's besides the point and we'll talk about that later.
But um, wait a minute, did you just say you
were married to somebody for a week? Yeah? How did
(01:29):
you get divorced so fast? No? Okay, Well here's the deal.
We were. He's not my best friend, which is the
funniest part of all of it. His wife is like
truly my my best friend here in l A. Um
and I we have like weekly dinner family parties. Um,
but we were. We were dating for three years and
then he was fourteen years older than me. Um, in
(01:52):
the age wasn't an issue. But what the issue was
is we were just I was going right, he was
going left. And but as I'm such like a love
addict at the core, I just I always wanted to
please him. And um, but you know my dream I
was I was going to Nashville. He was here in
l A. And um, I was just finishing one tree hill.
(02:13):
Long story short, it was just one of those things
where I walked on the aisle and was like, I
don't want to be married to this man. Oh no, wait,
was it a full on wedding with the wedding the
wedding and everything. Yeah, it was the whole. I mean,
so what we say is we laugh and we say
we had a beautiful party. We were not married. Married
to me is like what I'm in now, Like we
are like in it, you know what I mean, Like
(02:34):
we're fighting for it. We have a child, like we're
working on our marriage. To me, that's marriage, not just
like a wedding. And so I think I've only been
like for me, I've only been married once but on
paper three. But let's go back, let's go back to
the one week marriage, but one like marriage. You when
did you decide you needed to get a divorce the
(02:56):
day I married him? The day you married him? So
you guys didn't go on the honeymoon, you didn't, Well
we went up north after because we got married up
North Michigan. Um, but I just I knew. I actually
called the wedding off two weeks before. But then I
was like, well, we have like an okay exclusive and
you know, I don't want to ruin people's plans. So
(03:17):
I was just like, you know, well maybe maybe like
maybe i'll feel something different, Like maybe I'll walk down
the aisle and I'll feel something different. But I knew
that if I stayed married him, we'd have kids and
then we'd end up divorce, and I was like, I
don't want, Like I grew up in a divorce family
and for me personally, like I just knew, like if
I knew walking down the aisles shouldn't be married to
(03:38):
this man, I should divorce him now absolutely, And it
was like the greatest thing that ever happened, because now
he's married to this amazing girl named Julie and they
have a beautiful son, and Camden and Jolie are like
besties and now we all hang out. I was just
texting with her there in Hawaii right now, and they're
coming back and then we're having dinner tomorrow night. That's
(03:59):
and he's an actor John with and Check, so he
um and he's he's like my acting coach too, so
whenever I have auditions he helps me. And yeah, did
you ever feel like you wanted to be the runaway
bride where you just didn't show up? Oh? Yeah, totally.
But I couldn't do it. I just felt so bad
for people like I wanted to, like because I wanted
to have that beautiful day. I wanted to be in
(04:19):
love with him. It's a thing I like every part
of me, like was just like because I did, I
do love like I still I love John. I think
he's a great guy. Would we have ever worked? No,
like not at all. Okay, So we're his parents, both
of his parents there? Yeah, and your parents ever? Everyone
was there, and girl, it was beau. It was a
beautiful wedding. Did your parents know? No? No? What about
(04:42):
his parents? His dad and I never really got along.
He's like real old school, like cop and I was
like this little young little like name to marry your son.
He's like, what is my He probably thought his son
was going through a midlife crisis, honestly because I was
like twenty six and he was in his forties. So
and what about the mom? Oh, she's like they're great,
(05:04):
They're awesome, and you know they still I mean I
have not seen them since the wedding. Every time I like,
I know they're in town right now. So I texted
Julie and I was like, Hey, does Jolie want to
play with Camden? But I don't think they want to
see me, so that we're not cool yet. But Julie,
John and I are great Okay, And how long has
it been? So it's been almost eight years? Wow? But
(05:27):
I mean like again, like we weren't like, yes, we
we were. We dated for three years and what was
it like then? So back and forth because he had
just gotten divorced from Christina appligate. Oh my god, he
called me Christina so many times? Do it in bed?
Not in bed? Not in bed? No? But maybe like
(05:48):
I don't, like I don't remember that, but no, he
would call me sometimes I would just be and I
think I always wanted to be better than her, like
I wanted to be like because he was so hurt
from that relationship. Did she end it with him? Yeah,
So that's tough when you were rebound for him. He
had plenty of rebounds before me. But and you was
like his first girlfriend after Christina, and you feel like
(06:11):
you two were codependent on each other. No, I he was.
He like didn't want me at all in the beginning,
but I like forced myself on him, like because we
did a movie together called prom Night, and I was like,
oh my god, that's the guy from that thing you do.
He's so hot and um, and then we hung out
and then he's just like, you're too young, and I
(06:32):
was like, no, I'm not immature, I swear, and and
then it was just one of those things where I
just I kept wanting his love and attention and affection.
And that's like what a love addict is, Okay, And
so what was the relationship? Like how much time did
you spend another like that? I mean three years? We
probably were together like a year, like two years? And
(06:54):
did you break up a lot? Yeah? We broke up
a lot because he would there really like oh him
all the time, and I beIN, please, why don't you
want to be with me? Um? He just didn't want
a girlfriend. He's like, I'm just I'm not ready. So
and I just waited and stayed and passed so many
like and every time I got in a good relationship
with someone, he'd always come back. And then I'd of
course break up with that person and date him and
(07:17):
date him. And then when he was ready to commit
to you, that was when you were like, I know,
but it was because we had different Um, we were
just so we were too different at that point. Okay,
but your best friends, but just too different so we
couldn't be married. Now I know, people are like, well,
(07:37):
you guys are best friends, like why wouldn't you guys work?
Because him and Julie work, like she can handle his stuff.
There's certain things as a wife that I could not
handle that he does. That makes sense. I understand that.
Like he's you know, he's really really really actory. And
sometimes I'm like, can you just like stop and just
(07:58):
because he needs the attention? Does he? I mean, like,
I know, I like attention. I know, I mean all
actors like attention. But it's just it's yeah, and there
is a dark side too, and you know it's it's heavy,
and it's like I like more of the light with
the heavy and sometimes like and Julie can balance it
so well, like I support it supported and I would
be like, like he he would write a script and
(08:19):
I'd be like, that's awful, and that's not a supportive wife,
you know, but I didn't. It's an honest one, yeah,
but it's not a nice one. And Julie like supports
his like thoughts and ideas well. That makes sense? And
what about now? What about? Now? What about now? Me?
Do you like still consider yourself a love addict? I
(08:41):
can I have always be a love addict. I just
I love because and you have to be careful with
that because it's like, you know, there's times when you
know my husband and I are good, and it's like
you have to really hone in on that love addiction
because you don't want to find it somewhere else. You
gotta keep finding it in the relationship, right, And do
you think about that sometimes? If you guys are right, No,
(09:05):
I think I think everyone has like healthy fantasies. Yeah,
but I would I'd probably never admit that to him,
But now that he's probably hearing this, now he knows,
he knows. No. I mean, I think it's that's a
tough question because I would be mad at him for
having those fantasies, right, So I shouldn't either. But sometimes
(09:28):
I fantasize about being divorced and having the house to myself.
And that's why my fantasy not about being with someone else.
It's about being alone, having space, space, just being like
left alone for a day a Wednesday, every Wednesday, every Wednesday.
Does he does he demand a lot? Does he know
(09:50):
my husband is he's great? I mean, obviously it's very public.
Our our our separation was extremely public. And his stuff,
which you know, well, I'll talk about later in in podcast. History,
but um, we're working on it. And that's the thing.
Like marriage is, whether there's infidelity, whether there's um issues
(10:12):
in the marriage, you always have to work on it. Yes,
I think someone that has a perfect marriage I call
BS two right away absolutely because you have to grow.
That means that you're actually not working on your marriage
then to me personally, right because you're not growing, you
have to grow together and the people that don't grow together, like,
we're both willing to work. That's the thing. I'm willing
to work. He's willing to work. That's what's making this
(10:33):
relationship not end catastrophically. Yet you go to therapy so
much therapy, but I love therapy. I think it's great.
Do you do individual and marriage individual marriage And he's
got his whole in his own thing that he goes
to as well. So it's it's both of us. You know,
you actively working in the marriage. You guys are in it.
You guys are really putting the work. It's tough. I
(10:55):
mean sometimes, like after couples therapy, it's really close to
our house, so a lot of the times I walk
home just because I just need like a minute. It's
tough because you're talking about things. It's like, yeah, I
wish it was a complete fairy tale and perfect, but
it's not. But at the end of the day, like
it could be. If you really truly work on it
and both partners are willing to work on it, then
(11:15):
you could have a beautiful relationship. I love that. So
here's the deal. I need as much help as all
of you guys do, and I'm I'm constantly on my
comments looking at what you guys want and what I
need to is. So I'm gonna have not only celebrity
moms on here. I'm gonna have life coaches. I'm going
to have sex experts. I'm gonna have a marriage therapist
(11:39):
because I know we all need some help. I know
I do. Caroline's wisen um. She is a life coach
um works with mom issues, relationship issues, or even just
life and you can find her at Caroline's Wicksen dot com. Caroline, Hi, Hi,
how are you. I'm good? How are you? I'm doing great?
Thank you? So can you tell our listeners, um, just
(12:00):
a little bit about you your background? Yeah? Absolutely so. Um,
I'm a women's someone will help and life coach. Um.
I'm really passionate about you. Know, connecting, connecting to two um.
And my background is in psychology, so I have also
have a master's in counseling psychology, and I specifically now
work with mothers to really reclaim themselves, you know, their
(12:22):
identity after becoming a mom, which so many times get
so lost. Um, and then also reclaiming your health both
part of that's amazing. And I'm here with producer Jen too,
and we were just having that conversation about how it's
that's that's what I'm personally dealing with, is how to
be able to separate being a mom and then my
(12:43):
career because I have we have a lot of guilt
with that too. So what would be like your advice
for me and mom's out there that are having that problem,
but having that guilt problem specifically guilt, but then also
so I guess two things, guilt and then also how
to how to have my things, like how to have
(13:04):
my purpose and all of this. Mm hmm yeah, So
like really like how do you reclaim yourself as a woman? UM?
So I think a lot of times, you know, like
the most common thing that I really hear from from
moms in in my work, if I don't even know
who I am anymore? Right, that real sense of loss
that like I don't even know what happened to the
(13:24):
woman who I once was. And then there's this whole
idea in our society and culture of like bouncing back
and getting that woman back and getting that life back.
And what I always tell my clients and what I've
seen a lot of time talking about, is that it's
not about um, you know, getting back what who you
once were, but really needing that person that you are now,
and really needing the woman, the mother that you've evolved into,
(13:48):
because she has changed, like she's different physically, you know,
like her value system has changed dramatically, And so really
approaching this topic with a really open mind and open
heart and really finding out who are you now that
you've undergone this massive transition? Um? I think. And then
another point to that is I think something that is
really important obviously is time. Like so many moms struggle
(14:10):
with time, and like not even moms right, like everybody
nowadays struggling with time, UM, and becoming really good at
delegating and understanding what are at the areas and subchecks
that you can actually take care of, UM, And what
do I think that you can really delegate to other people,
and how can you really structure a support system and
a tribe around you that is supporting you in you know,
(14:33):
integrating motherhood into your life. M you know what. I
love that. Here's my problem with it though, when because
I sat down with my therapist and I it's just
like I feel like I'm doing everything, and she goes, well,
start trying to ask people for help. So but when
I asked people for help, for example, like my daughter
had split up in our crib and it took me.
(14:53):
It was so hard for me to ask my nanny
to clean the sheets. But why didn't the nanny just
clean this cheats well? Because she didn't know that she
had like spit up in there. And so I had asked.
I asked, nanny, I said, and it was like I
was like, okay, I'm gonna practice like what my therapist
told me to do. So I was like, can you
please change the sheets in like the crib room, you know,
in her nursery. And I come home and she didn't
(15:14):
do it. So I'm like, this is why I don't
ask people to do something, because it doesn't get done
like I have to just I'm just gonna do it myself, right,
So that's like where it's like how do I how
do I delegate? But if I don't like the way
that it's done or if it's not done, how do
I deal with that? Well, if it's not done, then
you know, maybe we're not getting the right kind of support,
(15:35):
like you honestly like made people that you can trust
and rely on. Um, and who are you know like
also like obviously like willing to help you. UM. I
think that whole like hesitation to ask for help like
that is really unless so that we can train. I
think the more we can train ourselves to ask for help,
the easier it becomes, and the more trusting we also become.
(15:56):
As we were experiencing over time, but I asked the
person for help, and they did it, and it was
done in a way that it was accessible for me
and for everybody else and from like basically like having
positive experience, positive experience, positive experience that is current to
build your trust muscle. It's hard though, So it's really hard,
(16:16):
and it's really hard to find a team that like
really you know, puts into your life. Stuff Like a
friend of mine always as higher really slowly for anyone
who comes into your personal house. Yeah, hey, true or false.
If it ain't broke, don't fix it. M M agree.
(16:38):
I agree with that too. Why do people think that
that's true though, because it's the easy way out, you know.
But if you're really talking about creating lives that are
really fulfilling for ourselves, because a lot of people set
up for a mediocre life, right. I was texting your
coach and I was like that, she's gonna say true,
(17:00):
and I'm gonna say b as to that. You are
a true life coach. People should definitely all right, here's
another one, true or false. Um, if you can beat them,
join them. If you can't beat them, join them. She's
passed again. But here's the problem. People think that's like
(17:20):
true stuff can beat them. Yeah yeah, but then you're
just sacrificing yourself and your own values and that's not
a good way of living. She's she is. And it starts,
doesn't it, Caroline. It starts with girls when they're like
really young in their peer groups. Yeah, and boys too.
(17:40):
I mean, like develop developmentally. They go through like a
twinship face right where they are basically trying on what
it's like to be like the other people and they're
like copying everything that somebody else is doing. But I
think that's where, you know, like our parenting comes in
at some point where we also have to encourage them
to be true individuals and a lot of that happens
of role modeling. Right, how can use it to your
(18:02):
own values? So how can use it to what's really
important to you? How can you actually speak with an
authentic voice? And that's what your children will learn? Right?
Question about that with relationships? What do you what's your
advice about an argument in front of your children? Is
it something where it? Because here's here's my problem. I
don't want to be like, oh, we're just like perfect
(18:24):
and people don't argue, And it's like what is what
is the line with with that and raising you know,
showing your children certain things? Yeah, I mean, you know,
like an argument like it can be like something where
you're feeling like, Okay, we're actually coming to a solution
and we're like having a people of conversation. We just
have different opinions, but we're coming to a compromise. I
think that's great for your children to be able to watch,
(18:46):
But if it's a really heated argument, and where like
basically like the foundation of safety of the family feels
at risk to a child, I think it's left would
be taken into another room. So what's the word I
think table it or like like what's the like not
like you know what I mean? Like how do you
how do you stop something? Then like how do you
(19:07):
stop the argument? So I think you know one of
you or both ideally like you have to agree, like
if this happened. Confusually this kind of thing like it happened,
and then later on you're like, shoot, like this really
something that happened. You know. Um, then you basically say,
like the next time, I'm feeling the seats coming up again,
because usually work of us feel speech when anger rises
(19:29):
in the body. When I'm feeling the sensation in my body,
it's going to be my responsibility to say, let's stop
this conversation now, And that's resument when the kids are
in bed or when you know, when we're out of
out forever, because I want to like finish it. Also,
you're heated saying you're not really in the moment. You
are in the moment of the anger, so you're not
thinking about anything else around you. How do you how
(19:51):
do you deal with It's really hard moms wanting to
separate to there because sometimes I feel lost as not
only a mom, but as a wife too. Yeah. So
I'm like, I'm like, it's just like who Like like
you said, like who am I? Because I'm like, I'm
a I'm my wife, I'm a mom, But like what
other where's my Where's Janna? Like where did she go?
(20:12):
Because I'm just trying to please everybody in the family. Yeah,
And I mean this is again like moms tell me
I'm losing myself, and dad, it's a husband tell me,
I feel like I'm losing my wife. What happens a
lot because women have the tendency because they drive us crazy.
That's why they don't know that, you know what, pusnant
were just talking about that because he goes he's like, why, oh,
(20:35):
he made a comment about Mother's Day and it was like,
moms are magical And I go, why did you just
make that voice? And he goes, oh, sorry, I didn't
realize it was a Mother's Day ad And I'm like,
we are magical. We do everything. And he's like, you
don't do everything? And I was like, where's our daughter
going to preschool. He's like, I was like, you wouldn't
like you wouldn't think to like like, we just take
care of it. We don't ask you to help us,
(20:57):
like I mean, like we we take care of all
of it all. Who's does he know where her dentist is?
She wouldn't even know when she has to go to
the dentist. So it's like, but like, but we put
all that pressure on us. But here's the problem. And again,
like I know how you say to delegate. So I
could be like, honey, make an appointment, and I know
he would, but he wouldn't do it when I want
(21:17):
him to do it, right, it would be two days
from now, yeah, or like a month from now of course.
So it's like again, it's like that's where I feel
like we we um almost like force us, not force ourselves,
but like we're the reason why we're losing ourselves. Yeah,
and we're not delegating. Like Caroline just said, we need
to delegate. We have to well, because I think in
order to delegate effectively in hisself, that goes back to
(21:40):
what we were talking about earlier. Um, we do have
to trust the other people and we also have to
allow other people to do it their way right. So
like if I'm, for example, like I'm usually a person
who cooks dinner because I'm also want to food and
kind of like with them in our family. And if
I now told my husband to make dinner and he's
starting to make something that you make, like he's not
(22:00):
going to make the dinner that I make. But I
have to be okay with that. It's strategic incompetence, and
I just got with the expectations, like he's he's purposely
screwing up something because he's like I don't want to
have to do that, like when they go to the
grocery store and forget to buy four or five things. Yeah,
and here's the deal. I know, I'm like giving my
(22:21):
husband hard time, but he is great because he does
he does, you know, help the laundry, although he's never
he's like, these pants don't fit her anymore. I was like, yeah,
because there's six months pants, Like you know what I mean,
Like you could have put them like away, Why are
you putting those on our daughter? Like it's like, I
don't think he's ever like, you know, helped. I don't
know how those were still in her door because usually
(22:41):
I make sure that her clothes are put away that
don't fit her anymore. But somehow those got in there,
probably because he kept putting them on her like dot her.
But um, you know, I mean he does help, but
it is hard because again, like as moms like I
feel like we do put that pressure on ourselves. And
having a life coach help us, I think is would
be beneficial for me, Oh for sure. So what what
(23:04):
do you do? Like? How do you is it like
is it like a therapy session? Do I sit down
and talk to you? Is it something where you know,
is it like a weekly thing? Is it a monthly thing?
Or how does that work with a life coach? Yeah,
I mean it can look in different ways. The way
I work with my clients is UM basically how you
really greatly? Because we said is it like does it
like therapy? Um? That basically life coaching focus is much
(23:27):
more on the future and really connecting you with your
intuition and your desired outcomes going forward versus traditional therapy
really focuses more on your past and really overcoming things
that happened in your childhood or in your past that
you're you know, not able to move away from. UM
and So in coaching, I worked with my clients every
two weeks, so we speak on the phone every two
(23:49):
weeks UM, and we discussed in our lives what are
their block and then also what are we UM? What
do you want to achieve? Like what do you want
to get to UM? And then according to that we
plan very pretty strategic and set the big action stuff UM.
And then they have two weeks to implement and they
have unlimited email support. So I work with my clients
(24:09):
where you know, they can write me an email whenever
UM they need to in order to update me on
if something is working at something is not working, and
then we kind of problem solved from they're amazing. That's awesome. Well, Caroline,
thank you so much. I really appreciate Where can we
find you out? UM? iFIT it's Caroline six, the dot
coms Caroline b A r O l I N E
(24:30):
and the kicks them VS and cebra w I c
K s O N. And are you on Instagram or
need those? I'm on Instagram and my Instagram handle is
ko tick fun so c A R O V w
I c K s O N. Amazing. Well, thank you
so much. We really appreciate it. And this is definitely
something that I know that I'm going to need. So
hopefully your mama is out there got some good info too,
(24:54):
So thanks Caroline, have a great day. Thank you. Right
all right, So these days you can get practically everything demand,
like our podcast, which you can listen whenever you want,
when it's convenient for you. And did you know you
can also get postage on demand. All you need is
stamps dot Com. So for me, I love stamps dot
Com because I'm also a businesswoman. I'm working on my
(25:17):
first business venture and this is something that I'm going
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And again, as a working mom, it's something that can
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(25:39):
stamps dot com is fantastic and you can use my
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Go to stamps dot com before you do anything else.
Click on the radio microphone at the top of the
homepage and type in Janna, that's stamps dot com and
enter Janna. Okay, um, should we talk about sex on
(26:01):
the show? I think sex? What I mean? It's curious
because I think sex and marriage is a huge issue. Absolutely.
I have found married and not having sex there is
a problem that is not being talked about. I mean
my ex we didn't even sleep in the same bedroom
for the last two and a half years. That's because
you guys didn't like each other. Yeah, yeah, because were
(26:24):
you not attracted to your husband? Were you ever? I
think so? I mean that was so long ago. We
had to have been attracted to him to get married. No,
I mean I was so young. I was so young? Really? Yeah,
well you probably yeah, I'm sure I was. There was
a there was a time. Did you ever think about so?
(26:45):
Then you how long? What was the longest you went
without sleeping with your husband? Probably about three years? Three years?
No sex? Did you master me? Can we talk about that? That?
Can talk about that much? It's too much because I
will talk about it. That's the problem. I am. So
we just go too far. What didn't you just go
(27:07):
to want to know if you guys think we're going
too far, I will stop. I will peg this right
on up. But here's the problem. If you guys want
to be open book with me, we can talk about
it all. If you want to send me in your
questions or your comments, um, you can email me at
Jane Kramer at iHeart media dot com. And if you
have any questions about sex or what you should do,
(27:28):
Like I have a friend she doesn't sleep with her husband,
and I have a hard like they have to like
schedule sex. I'm like, well that's boring. How often do
they schedule it? I think it's like every other month,
like it's second or having sex that's like what like
the therapist had recommended. So it's like and for me
(27:48):
it's like I actually want to have more sex than
a husband, which is an issue. So was it always
that way with him? With Michael? Yeah, well he has
he's got like intimacy issues, which is something that we
can talk on. Somebody like that. It's tough. Yeah, that's
like word really it's so tough. So that's something I
(28:11):
think we need a marriage counselor on the show for
that talk. I think so too, because that's that's something
that like he is working on. But it's really hard
for me because I'm like, well, it doesn't have to
be intimate. Why can't we just like have sex? But
he connects, he connects to two and you're able to
next like making love with intimacy, and I'm like, I don't.
I'm not. We don't have to make love right now.
We can just have sex like you can even yeah,
(28:36):
I mean like it's cool, but like I for some reason,
like I need that, like like I don't need the
fore play. Let's just get to it. I'm fine even
if I don't climb the hill. Yeah, yes I can.
It's still like I don't know. I sometimes I think
it's bad, but I do equate love with sex like
(28:58):
that he wants me because he's with me, right, But
that's part of the love addict. Yes, ding ding ding.
But it's like, man, I feel so rejected as a husband, right,
and that's not good. When men feel rejected, that's when
they start to look outside of the marriage. But here's here,
(29:19):
and here's the issue with me, which is what I
was like because I wanted sex. I'm like, why did
you cheat on me? Like I was willing to have
sex with you. So that's that's the part that stings
me because I'm like, I begged you for sex, right,
I wanted to have But that's a totally different issue,
I know. But that's what's like, there's that that rejection
(29:39):
piece that I have to work on. So it's like
when he doesn't want to sleep with me, because for me, personally,
i'd be happy with I'd be happy with like three
times a week, like full on three times a week,
like me actually trying like maybe like twice a week, okay.
And what about him? What do you think he wants?
I think he'd be okay with like ones or not
(30:01):
even once every other do you what do you think
people do in those situations? Like you guys have been
going to therapy, what what is the therapist saying, Well,
we haven't really gotten there because we have so many
other issues that we have to work on. I mean,
that's definitely an issue in therapy, but I think that
something we're still like working on and he's working on
because sometimes like it doesn't have to just be sex,
(30:23):
but I still want to be able to like I
want to make out, I want to do those things.
Do you people? I feel like don't make out what
does he kiss you when he sees you? Does he
is he affectionate? Y ask? But again I'm I'm more affectionate,
like again like he because he has that like intimacy issue,
Like I would be like I have way more p
(30:43):
d A. But now I've like gone back from that
because I know he doesn't like it as much. So
it's like, well, then I'm not being myself and that's
not doesn't feel good for me, and so like we're
trying to find that healthy balance. But that's the thing,
Like when I talk to my other girlfriends, it's like
I'm having sex, it's like whether you want to or not,
do you want your husband stepping out on you know,
like have sex with them whether you want it or not.
(31:05):
But then don't be a log because they're like, well,
of course I don't want to sleep with you because
you're just like laying there. But then if the person
really doesn't want to sleep with the guy, it's really
married exactly, I don't know. I mean some things, I
get it. You don't want to have sex, you're tired,
you've got baby puke all over you, Like I get that.
But then at the same time, you should. Also, you
(31:28):
have to have investment in your relationship, and part of
an investment is having sex. I think it is, But
I also have women that don't. They aren't just very
sexual and they don't they've never like masturbated before, and
I find that crazy. You have friends who have never
mastered ever, And I'm like, let me walk you into
a hustler store and buy you a rabbit, like it'll
just change your life? Is that? Like? Do you start
(31:49):
buying mom on Amazon and giving giving one in a while?
I have an old faithful let's just call her old faithful.
She's been a round. And how does your actually feel?
Like my husband? We don't really talk about that, really no,
(32:12):
because it's it's a very touchy subject in the household
because I don't want him doing that. But does he
he better not? He must, he can't, he must be
it's weird again, I can't. It's like it's a it's
a tough topic because you know it's again. Once there's
like infidelity, things just kind of go. It's there's different
(32:35):
boundaries that needs to be in place interest him, Okay,
boundaries and do you feel like you're on the other
side of that? Oh, no, No, there's still trust issues.
I think there's I am trusting him more, but I
think you always have to continue to work on the trust.
But I'm willing to talk more about sex if you
(32:57):
guys are so, if you have any questions. Jannekramer, I
heart media dot Com, Let's talk about it. What is
pan sexual? Pan Sexual is a term that a lot
of millennials are using. They're more on the spectrum of sexuality.
It does has nothing to do with gender, um race age, anything.
It's just they can fall in love with the human being,
(33:21):
so they don't even consider themselves that liquid. Isn't there
something another liquid thing? It's like, it's like fluid, fluid fluid,
I'm fluid, Like, isn't the same thing? It's pretty much
the same thing. It's like you're on a spectrum of you.
Just it doesn't matter the gender you're just if you
fall in love with Nikki, who's a girl, happens to
(33:45):
be a girl, You're in love with Nikki the human
beings you could ever fall in love with a girl.
I don't think so. I WoT love me well, I
love you like I'm gonna make you fall in love
with me and I'm getting we're gonna make out with me?
But um, I feel totally connected to you. But I
(34:05):
am so right now so so so mand um, I
I think that I you know what, I've never told
this before. Ever. There was this waitress at Friday's. Um.
(34:25):
I was in high school and I don't remember her name,
but I had the biggest crush on her. She was
like short hair lesbian. Oh wow. But she was like
cool and like confident and like sexy, and I would
like catch myself flirting with her and I was like,
am I No, I just like I've never I've never
(34:45):
forgot about her. Wow, weird, right, But I would go
for like more of the like short hair girl, so
more boyish. Yeah, like I'm obsessed with like um oh
my gosh, I just read her name. She's married to
the writer Glendalon Glennon Doyle. She's married. She's a soccer
player Abby, Abby wand box. I have a girl crush
(35:05):
on her? Did you ever have? Never? I don't think
I could actually go through with it. Yeah, So I've
never done that. I've never even kissed a girl, even
though I want to sing this song I kissed a girl. No,
but I've never kissed a girl like I mean, I've
like kissed on like but not like as in like
a lesbian way, lesbian way. He didn't make no no
(35:28):
no no. But I've I've never had that, but I've
I've never thought forgot about the Friday's girl And where
was she? Where did she? I was a waitress in
Michigan at Friday's. Wow, Yeah, that's never forgotten about her.
I've never what's her name? I don't remember. I had
(35:48):
a hard time keeping a job when I was in Michigan.
I would just go from job to job. Where did you? Oh?
I worked at Appleby's, Friday's Um American Grill. I worked
at Joe's Crabshack, Greek Island. I love Greek Island. Yeah. So, like,
you know, my boyfriend would have like a soccer game
and I didn't want to show up for work. That
(36:09):
was the problem. And I was like good. Yeah, So
apparently I am really boring because everyone's like telling me
about like they're always like, what shows do you watch?
And I'm like, well, the one show I did watch
was over Scandal, right, So I'm like, you know what
I watched? You want to hear what I watched. I
was like Puppy Dog Pals, Mickey Mouse in the Roadster Clubhouse,
(36:32):
Like that's the stuff that I watched. Transformer Like me,
Everyone's like, you don't watch Westworld or you know Handmaid's Tails,
Like I would love to, but by the time it's
eight o'clock, I want a glass of wine, I want
my bed, and I want to go to sleep. That's it, right, Yeah.
Do you know how many times I've watched Bolt? That's
actually really good. I just watched it the other day.
(36:53):
It was really cute. Just in the past three days.
Have you seen Up? Have I seen Up? It's so good.
It's so sad, though, I mean, this is like, but
I feel like we should. This is okay because you
and I are so busy and we just watch like
Up and um Tangled and all those shows. Let's challenge
each other to watch a show. So it'll be like
(37:16):
instead of a book club, it'll be a show club.
Which which show? Which show do you want to watch? Well?
I kind of want to watch Handmaids Tale. I've heard
that's really good. Okay, so let's do this because I
know it's challenging. Let's watch two a week. I feel
like that's pretty I can do that. I can do
that Tuesday and Thursday night. Sure, get on this Sunday,
(37:37):
I'll do Wednesday. I'll do Tuesday Wednesday and when we'll
talk about it and then we'll talk about it because
I feel like if I'm not getting because if not,
then I'm just gonna sit down and watch like Kardashian
reruns until I like get tired enough and fall asleep
and I'll watch, you know, season twelve begun. We need
to like, we need to be we need we need
(37:59):
to be cool moms. Okay, like we need to have
some fun for ourselves. We need to be cool moms. Um,
and you guys feel free to join us and watching
Handmaid's Tale and we can like binge talk about it
and um, yeah, we can talk all about it because
I feel like for the moms out there that are
just have pop past in their brain, we can now
(38:21):
be like, yeah, have you watched handmaid Stale? And like
you can like feel a part of the conversation. It's
a gradual bene. Okay, it's not a binge at all.
It's just reasonable binge. It's a small binge to a week.
We're going from zero to two huge. That's huge, that's
two hours. I'm gonna have so much more like knowledge
(38:42):
in life and I'm just gonna walk around being like
the Handmaids Tale and we're just no idea what it is.
It's so excited handmaidge. There's nuns in it. Oh cool
there about the nuns. Do you have a thing for nuns?
Is that your girl across a none? But oh, speaking
of your blonde girl that you loved? Um, who are
(39:05):
your girl crushes? Do you have them? Celebrity celebrity gerty
girl crush? Well, you know, Kate Hutson cut her hair.
I'm kind of digging on her now she's got cut Yeah,
Katie Perry too, I'm not into her. No, No, Kate Hudson.
Kate Hutson, she's got great style. But honestly, you know,
(39:25):
I would say Kate Hudson ill like cry style and
then um, oh man, that's kind of a tough one.
But you know whose Instagram? I look at a lot.
Who is Um Chloe Kardashian. I love Chloe. She's not
my girl crushed though, Um Drew Barrymore because she's so cute.
She has everything going on and I want to drink
(39:47):
rose with her because I just think i'd have her
on a drink that is so fun um in Sandra Bullock,
I love her, love her. She's so classy. She is
She's always kept it classy, even when she was going
through the worst time of her life. Just the one
worst time I know he was that was he did
her wrong. That was just she is great that she's
(40:08):
just pure class. Yeah, and she's a mom, and yeah,
I like her a lot. Speaking of Kate Hadson's about
to have a baby, a baby girl. Yeah, we should
have her on. I just would love to talk to
her like how she bounced because she's been married three times.
I know, well, you know, with three different kids from
three different daddies. So I'm curious all musicians like her.
(40:30):
She's got a type. She's definitely definitely got a type.
But I will, you know what. I love her mom
because when I got as soon as I started announcing
that I was getting divorced, I was like, I'm never
ever getting married again. I'm going to goldieh on it
the rest of my life. I mean, it's working for
right because they wake up every morning and they make
(40:53):
the choice to stay together. There's not a piece of paper. Yeah, well,
this is so much about it. I'm so excited. Thank
you guys so much for listening. Um, this has just
made my entire world. I hope you guys enjoy it
as much as I have. UM and Jen, you're so sweet.
Thank you for being here with me. Anything you guys
want to talk about, please let me know any advice,
what you just anything, I mean, let's talk about it all.
(41:14):
Email me at Janne Kramer at iHeartMedia dot com and
we'll be back next week and we'll wind down together
again
Host
Jana Kramer
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