Whine the Vine with Kaitlyn Bristowe and Jason Tartick

Jana and Mike invite Kaitlyn Bristowe and Jason Tartick into their bedroom for an intimate Whine Down! They open up about the early days of their relationship and the advice Kaitlyn gave Jason about dating another girl. 

We hear about the work they’ve done on finding emotional triggers and how to deal with conflict. 

And Mike and Jason bond over having details about their relationship come out on their podcasts!

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:01):
Wind Down with Janet Kramer and Michael Coffin. And I've
heard radio podcast, So why do you hate listening back
to your podcast? Okay? This is like anything I do,
I feel like I just choose not to Otherwise I'm
just too hard on myself. Like sometimes if it's really funny,
I'll listen to that part back, or like little clips
I'll pick out for the like Instagram story or something.

(00:23):
But to listen to the whole thing, I'll be like, oh,
why didn't I say this? Or oh why did I
say that? When I know it's a good podcast anyway,
So I just need to leave it and not be
hard on myself. Wait time out? Should we intro? Oh yeah,
I guess, or just people just hey, hang on for
the ride. Here we go name that person. It's a

(00:43):
fun game. But I think everyone knows. Um, we've got
Caitlin and Jason Um joining the Wine Down crew tonight,
so we're so excited. It's actually it is tonight. It's
Friday night, Friday night, even though you guys are hearing
this Monday morning, but still, but we got drinks in hand,
so this is the kind of vibe we have. We're
in our bed room. It's really intimate and it's I

(01:03):
feel like yeast barely said hello and they took us
right to the bedroom and oh, what's cool? What are
we doing here? Here? You go? No, but we just
we just I made Mike just start recording because we
started saying things and then it was good and I'm like, wait,
which like just stop? Do you I don't do you

(01:23):
listen to the podcast when we record. So the beginning
days I listened to it a lot because I use
that like film, like in sports, right, Like I was
trying to get better. Okay, how can I do this better?
How can I you know? And now that I always
want to keep improving, but I don't know. Recently I
haven't as much and I don't know if Caitlin is
kind of like you where I'm like, damn, I should

(01:44):
have said this one. Often I catch myself thinking that
and I'll say what I'm just thinking I should say.
I'm like, oh, yeah, good job. Like literally I'm like
say this because I forget like what I said. I'm like,
oh yeah I did say that, great, yeah yeah yeah,
I mean it probably would be good for to do that,
to listen to, you know, better yourself next time. But
I'm like, I think I'm doing okay, I criticized myself

(02:10):
too much if I do it. So like I'll read reviews,
which is like the worst thing ever to do that,
but I read them and I'm like, you're right, like
I'm being too hard on Mike. Okay, so like I'm
gonna not be as hard on Mike. And then I
say something out of being sarcastic. But then it's like, oh, no, crap,
like I forgot to edit that part out enough people
are going to think that I'm still it's always about Mike,
and Mike's always wrong and like and I'm like, shoot,

(02:31):
like yeah, it's not like how it usually is. It's
just welcome to relationships. I feel like that's just men
are so much better at um filtering and picking their battles.
They just are or I mean I think so is
that how it is on off the vine too? Yes? Yeah,
well I don't read reviews, no, No. I mean like
with when Jason comes on, like do they ever say

(02:51):
it's more on like Instagram Stories or Instagram Live, people
are like Caitlin so mean to Jason. Well and maybe
in You're the super Bowl thing, people were chirping out
about that, So like, what did happen? I was chirping
him because you were having a day. No, I wasn't
having well, I have a lot of days, but I

(03:11):
feel like it was, um, we we have like a
lot of banter where we like poke at each other
a lot, and that's kind of like our sense of
humor too. That was a beer bottle as people on
Monday morning are listening, listening, But it was more that

(03:32):
I was poking fun because you said something. You like
dropped something about a division of soccer you were in,
and I was like, oh, subtle flex or something. And
I was like, oh yeah, no, you were just anything
I said. She was just like, come over the top.
You're just having one of those days. And people are like,
take it easy. And the one thing I was I
was being facetious. I was making fun of myself. I
was playing a celebrity football game and I was like,

(03:54):
I'm a Division three former soccer player. I'm sure I'm
going to be in you know, good shape. Facetiously joke
you wrong. It's all former NFL guys, Like can I
say that? Take it out? It's my New York. It
comes out and Caitlin's like, oh, you're telling everybody played
college soccer. That's real cool. I'm like, Caitlin, I'm literally
making fun of myself here. But I didn't know that

(04:15):
because I don't know what division means and I didn't
know what you were saying. I thought you were like
pumping your own tires. Like, but I will stand up
for Caitlin though, because we are very we're very we're
from the same cloth, we're very sarcastic. We like to
give it out sometimes because of our own insecurities, like like,
I know that's on me too, and so sometimes when
I say things I don't I don't mean what I how,

(04:37):
it maybe comes out and if someone doesn't know me,
then it's like, oh, I could totally see how they
would think that sounded ugly. Or I'm picking out my
husband and that's like the farthest thing from the truth,
And like, I love my husband, I support him, and
we talk about all this together. So I feel like
that's that's frustrating sometimes when we're more kind of misunderstood.
But I'm working on it. But it's still hard because

(04:57):
I catch myself like biting you're not fine. I should
probably work on it a bit more, but no, I'm
the same way where I like, sometimes my delivery comes
out with a lot of attitude, and um, I'm very critical,
but I don't mean to be. It's just I'm like,
I'm like that with the people I love the most,
which is so silly because that's who you should like,
you know, be the easiest one. But I'm the most

(05:19):
critical with people I love. Jason, what is it for you?
I mean when when that happens, Like, do you ever
get upset? Because there's I know sometimes Mike will be like, hey,
like that. I know you were joking. We had, um,
you know, Sean and Andrew East, and we were at
dinner with them one night and I had said something
and I don't remember what it was. You might remember, Mike,
but you kind of pulled me aside and you're like, oh,

(05:39):
I said something about divorce. And he's like, I know
you were saying that jokingly. He's like, but like, can
we just not throw those comments out anymore? And I'm like,
I'm so sorry, And I kind of told him. I
was like, I I sometimes feel awkward around people. And
we're just starting to hang out again to be like
ha ha, like who knows? And and so I say
it out of uncomfortability, Yeah, to lighten the mood. So

(06:01):
that because maybe people are thinking that, but he's like
they weren't, so why do you have to say? And
so it's just one of the things where he's like,
don't like that hurt my feelings and I'm like, oh,
then I start to cry and then I feel awful
and I'm like, no, that's not what I meant. But
I mean, does that ever affect you when she does that?
So I think you you handle it really well. That's
how I handle it right, Like I take it offline.
I'm like, I don't want to have this conversation here
at bookmark it And for me, it's just explaining where

(06:23):
you're coming from. I think in any confrontation or argument,
people always want to lead with their ego. They want
to lead with with emotion, and I'm going to take
over this and I'm gonna alpha this position, whether you're
a male or female, and that leads, in my opinion,
to nothing. In my opinion, like when we have confrontation,
I wanted to be principal, and when it's principal driven,
I want to have the conversation. I'm gonna fight like
hell for it. That's how you pick and choose your battles.

(06:45):
And when it's principal like driven, I expect that it
doesn't happen again. Right, So if we can't learn from
the fight yesterday and it doesn't better shape us for tomorrow,
then why the hell are we having the fight? So
let's just get to the core of it, understand each
other's percept and will be in a better position to
like succeed as a couple. He's very good at that.
I need to learn more from Jason. Actual. Yeah, that's

(07:10):
usually how interviews go with us. I mean, he is
so well spoken and says everything, and I'm always like,
uh huhoken, I say things wrong and I asked the
weird questions and he looks at me, and I'm like,
I know, I'm an idiot. Exactly how we are. I
feel like we are like mirroring each other right now,
like I'm just in a mirror. But that's I did
work on it though. The other night, it was my

(07:31):
birthday and we did this like boat party, social distancing
boat party, and we had like a few people back
at the house after and Jason was what the kids
say lit? And he was on fire and he I'm
looking over and he's got a cigar lit in the house,

(07:53):
in my kitchen, and I had just spent this money
on a farm style sink that I was like so
proud of, and I it was just he ash in
the sink. Not only did he ash in the sink,
but he put it out in the sink when I
was like, I was like, what are you doing with
a cigar in the kitchen? And he thought he was
doing the right thing because he panicked, like, oh what

(08:14):
am I doing? And he put it out in the
sink and I was like, And usually at that point
of the night, I probably would have started an argument,
but I just took myself into my bedroom. I shut
my closet door, and I gave myself a fifteen minute
like time out, power nap, and I I just recharged
the batteries for like fifteen minutes, got back up, and

(08:34):
came back out and I let it go. That was
I think that's a great example, but also a terrible
example because we had been going after it since like
two pm. And like I called my college buddies at night,
like some of my bids are still close with the like,
we have not seen you that drunk and probably eight
nine years and when I tell you, that's how drunk
I was at the time I got back to the house.

(08:55):
You know, I would never have a lit cigar in
the house, but I was. I didn't. I didn't even
know I did. That said you were so lit because
you wouldn't of course wouldn't do that. You just weren't
thinking like you're you could tell his wheel started turning
as soon as I looked at him and was like,
what are you doing? You're like, oh, you panicked and
put it on the thing. But I think the takeaway
from that, right, the takeaway is that like can parliamentalize

(09:20):
and have conversations that are like meaningful and productive instead
of just reacting with ego intomotion because it's just in
my opinion and my experience, it leads to almost nothing good.
You call each other names and it becomes the ego.
Then you battle and then you fight for what where's
it going? And so I'm I don't really enjoy conflict.
But if we're going to have conflict, in my opinion,

(09:41):
like let's make it super super constructive, right, we just
we just had a couple of therapy session the other
day and we're talking about it. Where thinking back on
the last you know, a few months, six weeks or so,
really we've acknowledged that we've done that a lot better
like ourselves, like both of us have where it's there's

(10:01):
times where our pride or egos want to step up
and I I historically want to get defensive. I think
things personal, which I learned to get from both parents.
I had an epiphany last week. Um, and so it's
one of those things that it's always kind of been
an issue with us. But the fact that we're starting

(10:22):
to do that, we're allowing each other to have our
feelings to be like, Okay, it's yours as much as
I want to react and get on my mountain and
plant my flag and you know, and she wants to
do the same thing. We're starting to get that kind
of dance back and forth of being able to do
that and listening, like I'll say, you might have been
like over the past six weeks too. I think our

(10:44):
couple of theist therapist is actually shocked. But when you said,
and I don't mean that sarcastically, like you know, he
was just you know when we were saying, like, when
I come to you with something that maybe is triggering
to me or upsetting to me, you you're not defensive
and you listen and you empathize, and like your empathy
level has been like through the roof and like the

(11:05):
best you've ever been. So like, I see that and
acknowledge that, and I really appreciate that because it does
wonders for me when like you listen and you hear
and you don't go straight to the well, you know.
But also it's probably because you've learned to talk about
your triggers more openly and and tell him how you're feeling,
like it's it's it is. It is absolutely is a

(11:28):
combination because if she was still reacting from a hurt
place telling me these things and like just coming after me,
it would be hard for me to be like, honey,
I love you. I want to be like, yeah, that's
what is y'all's biggest confrontation, Like in the relationship waits,
how long have you guys? Wait? First off, you were

(11:50):
the bachelorette in what year? Two? Yeah? Um? From then
from that time on, when did you meet Jason? Here
was that? And that the first time you guys met? Yes,
what was the interaction when you guys met? I love

(12:11):
this story because it's adorable and so us and funny.
But I was going through the breakup like publicly. It
had already happened, but I was going through it publicly.
Actually not even publicly at the time. Um it was
about to come out to be public the breakup, and
I was in Seattle to be with a girlfriend because
she was helping me through a hard time. And I

(12:33):
was like, well, I might as well see who's in
Seattle to podcast with. And so there's a few bachelor
people there, and so I reached out to like um
who Dez and a few Bachelor people Olivia and then
Jason and he was gonna and Jason, you were on
Becca season. So I was like, oh, I'll get a

(12:54):
bachelor podcast in And Jason wasn't going to come because
he had, like I something wrong with your eye and
you're like one of those things called Actually it wasn't,
it wasn't. He was a pink eye, know it. Remember

(13:17):
when I farted on my pillows it was the sty
I think actually it was like a big it was
on my eyelid. It just like got super selected yeah,
and I was like, oh, I'm so like depressed, I
don't want to go podcast. But we both like battled
and somehow made it. And when I when he showed up,

(13:37):
I had just been face timing with my dad and sobbing,
and I was like, Oh my gosh, this is so embarrassing.
He's going to come in and like see me crying
and there's like no feelings at this point because I
didn't had never met him. And so he walked in
and he's Jason's energy is electric all the time, and
he's just like this really like you spend two minutes
around him and you're like in a better mood. And
so he came in and I was like, I'm like

(14:01):
having a really hard day and he just gave me
like a huge hug and he's like, I just came
from like a charity event where I cried and you're crying.
He goes, We'll just like have some wine. He brought
a bottle of wine and a wine opener and two
glasses back. It was, yeah, we did. I brought a
girl along with me from Bachelor World, Olivia, because she

(14:24):
was in Seattle, and I Olivia from Ben season. Yes,
when she was the big mouth. Yeah, she's so sweet.
She's the sweetest, she's so funny, and so I brought
her as a buffer because I was like, I'm in
this weird place and like I need like a sidekick.
Well it ended up being like she she didn't even
like come in on. The conversation was just like this

(14:45):
energy between Jason I that I again didn't realize until
listeners were like, whoa, you guys, your chemistry is off
the charts and like if something doesn't work out with Seawan,
you should be with Jason. And I was like, whoa.
People like don't even know that that news is about
to come out, and so um, Jason, let you tell
him on the side, like, hey, by the way, no,
I'm about to be done with or did I I

(15:08):
think I said I was. I think it was like
it was in my opinion, a lot of people have
been talking about it. And then she shows up crying
and based on what you were saying to Olivia could
over here. I'm like, Okay, something's not I don't know
what's going on, but I'm not I didn't stop on that.
I was like, I'm not asking, I don't But my
favorite part of The story is that we left the

(15:29):
podcast and I called a friend and said, oh, I
hope he's the next bachelor. And he called a friend
and said, I think I just met my future wife.
And then and then over like a couple of weeks
of talking, I was like, because, were you in the
running to be the next Bachelor? Yeah? Who ended up
being it? It was between Colton, myself, and Blake that year.
So we all went through and we were buddies, so

(15:51):
we all went through, like the blood test, the fingerprints. Oh,
they go through everything test you got it. Then they
do your fingerprints than they do They were calling people
background check from ten years ago. There was a friend
of mine I hadn't talked since college and they had
called him. He was my college roommate and they were
so they do their due diligence, and then they didn't

(16:12):
tell us. We had no idea going it. Actually, wait
a second, I'm going to call you out here because
they wait a second, because they it was the day
before Labor Day. They texted all three of us meet
Blake and Golden said we're gonna call you guys in
the next couple of hours and tell you who we picked.
And they picked Colton. So when you interviewed me was
after yes, I said you should have been the Bachelor. Sorry,

(16:35):
I was like rooting for you to be the Bachelor,
and I kept saying, and this is I wrote a
song the other day about how Jason like when I
met him, I was like, Oh, that guy's gonna be
so good for somebody, Like I can't like he's just
going to be did you. We're just not in it
at that moment, like you just my mind, not even
for a second you thought. I was like, I'm gonna
be single for another five years until I find the

(16:56):
right person. Like, there's no way I'm going to find
somebody at I am like all the things I'm looking for,
And of course at that point and in your thirties,
you kind of really start to know like who you
are and what you need and what you want. And
I was like, there's no way. I wrote it down
on paper everything I would want in a guy, and
I said, if I found somebody that was six of

(17:17):
this list, I would be lucky. And the only thing
that Jason didn't cross off on my list was I
didn't want to date somebody from the Bachelor world. Everything
else I was like, holy moly, you're literally everything that
I wrote out. It's like I did it on a
vision board and like found you immediately, like it was crazy.
So on what you just said, you didn't want to
date anyone from the Bachelor World. Does that is that

(17:39):
common from most of you a lum that come from that,
or is it also there's a mutual understanding where you
can kind of connect on that as well. I don't
know why I felt that way, and I think a
lot of people that come off the show say the
same thing, Like it's like musicians, I'm not going to
date another musician. I don't know. It's like I don't
know why, if it's an ego thing or I'm not sure,
but I just think I was a little bit jaded

(18:02):
from a relationship coming out of that show and the
like shame and negativity that surrounded that relationship that I
didn't want to go back into that. But I mean,
I can say I think that's probably more of like
a history thing because most of the guys that came
up our season we were totally up to go be
the lead or to maybe go to Paradise things like that,

(18:22):
So I think it's it's an instant thing that you
just understand because you go through this weird, kind of
life changing, super unique situation and you're dealing with producers
and all this outside noise, and it happened so quickly,
so it's an easy thing to kind of connect over.
And that's why I think a lot of the relationships
are at least sparked. So when did it happen? Who?

(18:44):
Then contacted who? So we started talking for a little
bit and she friend zoned me, but it was just
like banter. So we were like kind of chirping each other,
a little text in here and there, nothing, but I
was like, it was strictly friend zone. So then people say,
how did you break down the friend zone? So I
was like, I gotta there's a lot of like texting
and both going on. We gotta get to that. We
gotta break this down. So this girl who's kind of

(19:04):
in the media or whatever, I wanted to go on
a date. So I'm like, oh, this is great. I'm
gonna press this. I'm gonna like, you know, my bro
over here, KB, I'm gonna be like, what do you think?
Did she meet your standard? So I was like, hey,
this girl like was pursuing me, she wants to go
on a date, I'm thinking about doing it? What do
you think? And I shot him? I shot her like
a picture and and I'm like, I thought Kate went

(19:25):
honestly at this point, based on my reciprocation conversation, I
thought should be like, hell yeah, go for go have
a date, like have a go broke like slap on
the ask. And she was like, fired up, you could
do better than that. What are you gonna go on
a date with this person? You don't need to settle
for something. I was like, okay, test number one worked.

(19:47):
That's brilliant. It was brilliant and I and it was
in that moment that I was like do I have
feelings for this? That It was literally in the I'll
never forget. I was in the bath having a glass
of whiskey when you sent that to me, and I
remember being like I remember being like that like affected
me and I didn't want you to do it, and
I got really weird about it. And then I was like, oh,

(20:08):
do I feelings? I guess I do? And then now
how long have you? Hasn't dating for about a year
and a half. It's January of eighteen. January of nineteen.

(20:29):
So I was just at a little neighborhood outdoor. I
feel like we have to like asterix things when we
say it was outdoor. It was birthday, but there was um.
But I was just over there and I was talking
to my friend Pamelin and I was like, oh, yeah,
like we're podcasting. My friend Kulin Bristo was coming over
and her her boyfriend Jason, and she's like, oh, are

(20:52):
they engaged? And I was like, I don't think so.
I was like, I think I would have known that,
or I would have seen at least on Instagram. And
she's like, oh, I just read it they're getting engaged soon.
And I was like, I'll ask. Was just going to say, oh,
so we have it coming soon. We've talked about it

(21:12):
for like probably a year, which is crazy, um, because
I again I thought I was jaded. I've been engaged before.
I'm not going to do it again, like anytime soon.
And then uh, yeah, we've we've talked about it for
probably a year. Yeah. Well, the irony of it is
that the greatest what do they call it, the greatest
seasons of all times? So, Caitlin season just aired last week.

(21:34):
They had was your first time you watched, right, Yeah,
I mean I didn't watch because I was watching your
stories and it's like the first time that he's like
seeing it. Her and my mom got after it that
night and my dad was like the ultimate dad slash bro.
He's like, yeah, let's go play some cards, Like come on,
let's have a drink. So I like, I came in,

(21:56):
I'd sit down, I'd see someone I'm like, I'm not
fond of I'd walk Uh. It was. It was weird
because I think it's hard for anyone to watch that,
but you have known for so long the history of
my season that you're kind of like, why already knew
this happened? And this was five years ago, and like
it kind of probably I'm speaking for you, but like

(22:17):
it helped to know that you already knew everything that
happened anyways, and he's friends with all those people, so
it's like, honestly, to bring the conversation full circle, like
talking about ego and principal Eagle, who whoever wants to
see the person that they're in love with today with
thirty other people and witness it on TV? No one

(22:37):
and if you answer yes to that, but principle like,
if she didn't have that experience and I didn't go
on this show, we would have never met, we'd never
be here today. So you know, we weren't thrilled that
they're rearing the season, but as a result of the show,
we're here. And at the end, what were We'll come
back to what the question was. I thought you had
a ring in your pocket. Oh yes, yes, So so

(23:01):
at the end, Chris Harrison goes, now, Caitlin, you know
I'm an officiant and oh that was the Dancing with
the Stars thing? Yes, and so, which, by the way, congratulations,
cause I know how long you've wanted to do that.
I'll never forget our conversation when you went on and
you're like you need to go, and I was like,
you go enjoy it. I just because I heard that
you were like black bald from it, like they're like,

(23:21):
he'll never let you do it. There was a whole,
the whole thing. But I was just like, I mean,
you're the you're the dancer. Like I almost felt bad,
like when I was like you said that, and I
remember being like, no, this is exciting. Be happy about
it. It It was awesome and I was so glad and
happy for you wait, but then we're so then he said,
will you be on Dancing with the Stars? But were you?
Then a little slightly bummed that it wasn't no, because

(23:42):
he said, because I think I would. He said, I
have a question that's going to change your life. Change
that would? I think I'd be upset because it's like
in my back of my mind like, oh my god,
I'm over here, I have no idea what's going on? Okay,
all right, so yeah, so I'm gonna I'm gonna paint
the god text here. So her show airs. After her
show airs, they do an interview with her. Said Caitlin, like,
what do you think about all that? This was tough?

(24:03):
She gives a breakdown. Well, let's bring out where you
are today. You're here with Jason. Jason's one of you
guys are a great couple. How's everything going? They asked us,
how did you meet? We got into it. Then he
stops and we think the interview is done, and he
said Chris Harrison says, Caitlin, before we end, I have
a question that's going to change your life. Are you preparing?
He just told me he was an efficient Yeah, And

(24:25):
the fact is, none of us know about this. Caitlyn
grabs my pocket and I was working. I was working
late that day, so I had my shirt when I
was wearing, but my pants. I had work pants and
had my ear pods in there, so Caitlin's and I
was like, no, no, they're my ear pods laughing. But
I wasn't disappointed because I would have throat chopped him

(24:48):
if he proposed after that, because it just showed my
relationship with Sean, then my engagement to Nick, and then
if we went after to an interview and that's when
Jason proposed, I would have been like, no, wrong. Oh,
Like when he said, I was like, wait, yeah, he tried.
It was but but they had just showed that, so

(25:10):
I was like, that wouldn't be special to have Jason
men and and he already knew I didn't want to
do it on a TV show, so I was like,
I mean Dancing with the Stars was like the best, Like, yes,
it was, you know, I was even more t to it, right,
So they actually asked me to propose to Caitlin at
that time. So producers asked me, hey, we'll get you
Neil Lane ring, Well, we'll take care of it. So

(25:31):
I didn't tell Caitlin. I thought about it for a day.
I'm like, no, I'm not gonna, you know, nice to
the producers. They didn't push me at all. They just said, hey,
if you want to do it, go ahead. I would
have said yes and just not done it. Kept the range, yeah,
but for sure there'd be a contract. Yeah, exactly. So
I declined that they were totally cool with it, and
then like the time out. Would you have been bummed
if he did that? Though, Like, and you would have

(25:52):
I mean probably not super bummed because I can't wait
to marry him, but at the same time, I would
have been bummed that that's how it went down. Okay, sorry,
continue no. And then about a week later, I said, hey,
I want to let you know they came to me,
I made the decision. I said no. She's like, thank god,
I wouldn't want that at this time in this situation.
But I think you thought I was playing like reverse psychology, right,

(26:14):
So it was if you watched that that interview, I
was like, I like freaked out. And then he pulled
out that EarPods or air pods whatever there and I
was like, oh my gosh, and Harrison was dying laughing,
but yeah, that's fantastic To answer your question, Yes, we
will get engaged soon because I remember when I talked

(26:35):
to you, you were like, I don't want to stay
in Nashville. So has that now changed? It's changed a
little bit. Nashville's grown on me. Um. I think what's
great is we're gonna be out in l A for
a little bit, so it'll be something different. We'll get
to kind of like test the waters and hopefully. Yeah,
I mean, I think if we lived in LA would
be very short term. Where would you want to live?
Because I know you said you were in I know

(26:56):
you're from Buffalo, from Seattles where you were working, Seattle
was working. Um, I wouldn't go back to Seattle. And
so let's hash it out right now. Where do you
want to live? Yeah? I don't know. We talked about
this often, I think now about a year, but we
traveled so much so Quarantine spen the first time we've
actually spent time here. But I think Nashville is probably

(27:18):
where we'll end up. If I were to live anywhere else,
I'd say somewhere like I do, like Dallas, Texas, Austin, Texas, Denver.
But I'm sensing it. I just I don't know where
i'd want to live. Like part of me wants to
move back to Canada, but Jason is not totally on
board with that. Um. But I'm like, I'm more thinking

(27:39):
long term, like having kids and being around family. Um.
But I mean nothing wrong with I love Canada. Just yeah,
but your family is close to us in Nashville, which
is nice. But I love Nashville and I could Johnny
where we're at is very great school Well, that's another
thing we talked about, is is the next move we make.

(28:00):
We want to make sure that if we do settle
down there, that there's good schools and we've that's something
we talk about. If we stay in Nashville, We're coming
out this without a doubt. And I would say Vegas,
odds have it anything like chance we stay in So
you're here, I think, so yeah. So when this all happens,
you guys get engaged, you get married. Let's circle back
to what is the one thing you think it's going

(28:22):
to be kind of that problem area in your relationship,
because we we talk about that in a relationship, what
is what is our biggest problem? So what for you guys,
is that thing that's going to just kind of weigh
on you. I think I know, and maybe I don't
know if you have a different perspective, But for me,
I think it'll be that I like things a certain
way and I feel like even with dogs, I like

(28:43):
have this motherly instinct where I don't. I feel like
sometimes Jason can't do things right, like where I'm like,
how do you not know to do that? Like I
feel like that's going to be when we have kids
that I'm going to need to be aware of how
hard I am on you, because I'm going to think
like I have motherly instincts and I know what to do,

(29:04):
and I'm going to worry about how your is this
sound familiar? You do are cut from the same thing,
but not to fault though, because you even said like
you rely on essentially me and Caitlin like the well,
you're the managers. Yeah, we talked about that one of
the podcasts, like I'm just the house mom manager. So

(29:25):
it's like he does rely on me for knowing the
schedules and the kids in this, but he can do
it too, like he I deliver on it. And the
thing is is but he's not allowed to change it.
I'm the only the one, and that's where we're That's
where weird argue because she'd be like, why isn't James down,
like you gotta, He's gotta be down this time, it's
like a minute after I'm sorry, I'm going down, And
then and then like two days later, she's just like,

(29:48):
I'm like, I didn't have to go to bed. She's
like fifteen minutes past his bedtime. Jake, No, it's okay.
He slept a little later today and his maps staying
with mom. I'm like, what the just making the rule
that's right. So I'm like a by Caitlin's like instinct,
I'm by the book, Like you can't say one thing
and then do the other. And also you can't just
come up with these hypotheses because that's what it makes

(30:10):
sense to you when literally you can do research that
everything in the world tells you that's not the truth.
So we get into a lot of arguments of like
what is right or wrong for the dogs And I'm
more with the dogs. I'm more like I'm more like
up in the air, but like kids, I won't But like,
I think that's where we're both hard nosed with where
we believe are certain things like you'll always make you
always think you're right right, and I'll be like, well

(30:30):
that's you say that, so I think that like that,
But but we do find ways to compromise, because you
if you can't compromise, it's not gonna work. So it's
gonna be give and take and you pick and choose
your battles. That's what I've learned. At least. What's the
one thing with Caitlin that You're like, this is gonna
bother me? Yeah, I think. Let's see. I think the

(30:52):
biggest thing with Caitlin that I work on is that
I think I think I think very logically and rationally,
and I'm not extremely emotional, and it's okay to be emotional,
but I am. Also the big thing is I've always
learned to cope with things really well, so I can
something happens and I'm like, okay, I'm gonna deal with
my feelings. I'm gonna cope and I'm gonna find a

(31:13):
way to solve It's okay, a mirror literally, I'm a
little bit more emotional for sure, but okay, that's fair.
And then like I think Caitlyn, like the coping thing.
Caitlin doesn't cope very well, and that drives me before
Like it was so when I went through a really

(31:36):
rough time in my twenties, it was the first time
I went to a therapist and she talked me through
all these things and she looked at me and she goes, oh, Caitlin,
you have not been taught any coping skills. You don't
know how to cope. And I was like, whoa ding dinging.
The light went off the moment I was like, I
don't know how to cope. Um through my childhood like
and nothing against my parents. They were just trying to
do as best. But my mom always wanted to fix

(31:58):
things and make it right, and she wanted to like
make sure I was always happy, and that's obviously her
way of showing love. But I never really had to
cope with things. And so I learned in my twenties
that I'm not good at coping. And that's something that
I've really genuinely worked on from twenty seven to now.
So you can only imagine what I was like at
twenty seven, but but to now, I'm like, that's still

(32:22):
something I need to for sure work on. Is my
coping skills. Yeah, I just I'm a little dramatic. Is
that when you're dramatic too, and and when you resolve
your fights and conflicts too. I mean, are you though,
I want to talk about it or do you want
to go away? Or do you want to slam doors?
I do both. I have I mean, previous relationships to

(32:43):
this one. It's so wild how different I am because
I feel safe. I've never felt safe in a relationship
until this relationship. So I deal with conflict different and
insecurities differently because I don't question him leaving me or
like get all insecure. I'm like, I feel safe and up.
So I'm like, I deal with all of my insecurities
differently now where before I probably would have slammed doors

(33:05):
and through a fit. And I could still do that,
of course, but like again that happened since laughing. But
it's like you should like in this relationship compared to
last time, like a whole other person. Here's where I
give you a ton of credit, and this is really important.
It's like the slam doors thing will happen, like the
sudden reaction happens, and then the emotional part and then

(33:26):
the best part about you is what with time and
just dealing with it. You totally come around and you're like, Okay,
here's where I was right, and here's where I was wrong,
and here's where I think you were right, and here's
where I think you were wrong. And that's how the
relationship works at that point, because then I sit down
and say, you're right, I was wrong. I think accountability
is huge, and you have to be willing to take accountability,
and I think we do a pretty good job of that.

(33:47):
Over a year and a half. How many times do
you think I've slammed a door? Be honest, what do
you think? Oh my gosh, I thought you were really
thinking about it, because you're probably like I don't know,
maybe twice, oh yeah, like quick little bull not like

(34:12):
full arm swinging, oh like half like like oh you're
annoying me. Boom yeah, okay, god. I was like, wow,
am I that? I thought it'd got a long way.
I think you're doing great. We're doing great. I love this. Look,
don't feel bad. I shattered his phone like a few

(34:33):
months ago. So while I was taking a shower, I'm like, no,
I didn't even I mean there Sudson up and Jane
got pissed. It was pissed about something and triggered and
threw my phone in the shower floor. And I'm just like, so,
how do you react in that situation? That that one
I just kind of I wasn't in the wrong. Yeah,

(34:53):
it wasn't. It wasn't about wrong. It was about I
wasn't escalating the situation. I wasn't escalating in it. She
was spinning herself out of control, which I've been guilty
of numerous times. Um, and she did that and I
was just like, okay, well I can't do it, you know,
but that's been a long time since I've thrown something. Yeah,

(35:15):
that was a spiraler. Spiraling is hard to be hard,
Like all the therapy sessions I've been to, it's like
walk away in that time, I'm like, oh, sure, okay,
I'll just walk away while I'm in mid spiral. Like
that's not easy to do. It's ten seconds is all
you need? No, that's bs because yeah, I need like

(35:38):
and honestly, like the second I did it, I was like,
you know what I mean, Like why did I like,
like I know, And then you come down from the
it's like you're still validated, but you didn't need to
smash a phone. Yeah, you know, that's that's the and
then you feel like a crazy person and then you
have to go through that and like, but I'm validated
in like thinking this and like feeling this. It's just

(36:00):
like that was really rare for you though, what just
you spiraling like that? Oh that's been years. Like once
it happens, though, do you guys have like a grudge
phase or not? Like are you holding a grudge? How
is like the recovery work from that? I will say,
good question. It was a good one. Um. We had
an amazing spiral session the Leather Night where we came

(36:26):
when I faked out about having another kid, where we
came out of it. Yeah. Um, oh is that when
you were crying because Jason wasn't a baby and he
had that was kind of a lie, not a lie.
I mean I was crying because he wasn't a baby,
but I was also crying because like Mikel was like,
I don't want another kid. That's a tough conversation. Yeah,
and I was like, yeah, that's a hard conversation. It

(36:50):
was hard, and it was that I honest see where
you're going with this. Yeah, no, but I went crazy,
like I was just like, well, I don't know if
I can live, Like I'm like, I don't. I don't
want to resent you if we don't have another one.
And then I just I went I felt myself going crazy.

(37:11):
I felt myself going so high, out of body, out
of body, like just she was saying things that she
hasn't said for years, like to try to hurt me,
Like literally, it's been years since she said these certain
certain things because they know she knows they're hot buttons,
and you know, to your point, like pride and ego
is this is because of the last couple of months,
we've been better at this. I just kind of laid

(37:31):
on the couch and it's just like which almost annoyed
me more that he was trying, like real hard to
get him a reaction, because usually he meets meet my
reaction and we are explosive yes, and I'm like, meet
me their mother effort because I'm ready to get the
watching sports. But as as he continued to do that,

(37:54):
I just felt myself get crazier and crazier and crazier
and say things and then like I go into the
room and I just hysterically start bawling, and then I'm like,
mother effret, I have to go out there and apologize,
Like I have to go out and then be like
I felt. I was like and I went out there
and I was like, I feel crazy. Those it was
that was like my Zach Wartz, I feel crazy and

(38:15):
because it just it would become so out of body
that I just and it was it was wrong, and
I you know, we that was the first time that
we did it. We recovered good. The smash phone thing,
I think we recovered pretty well too, because again, I
just I think I'm so scared of this relationship too.
I'm scared of the bombs. Like we've we've had a

(38:36):
lot of bombs, and I'm so when I saw something
on the phone, I was like, oh my god, it's dear.
I'm such an idiot, like and I just was like,
I just went I didn't go to him first to
be like you we talked about this. I built a
story in my head. And when he was like, what,
it's nothing, and I'm like I've heard that before. I

(38:57):
was I came like and I don't believe you. And
then it was just like smashed. And then I was like,
oh god, I'm crazy, like, and then I was like,
and then I was like, I had to leave the house.
But but how incredible that you guys can like say
that you've come so far and that like bombs have happened,
but now you can like that takes a lot of
hard work and commitment to each other to get to

(39:19):
a place where you can say, like, bombs have happened,
and now like you can resolve them quicker. You can
like have more of like appreciation for each other's feelings
and all those things. Like that's huge in a marriage
and with kids, to be able to not just call
it quits or throw things away and to like work
your ass off to get to the place that you

(39:40):
are now to see the progress and think, Okay, if
we can like get this far, imagine how far we
can get in five years. And that's really important because
I mean, Jason has always been like I don't I
don't know if you've ever had like these kinds of
explosive fights and relationships, but I seem to be very like, oh,
it's annoying I have, but it's amazing, like you, and

(40:01):
that's what you need. You don't want someone else that's
the same reaction with you, And that's what didn't I
say that to you yesterday? I said, it's so wild
for me because it would be like a four day
run of happy times was like a good week for
me and other relationships, where with Jason, I'm like, I
don't think we've ever had a blowout. And again we're
only a year and a half in and like it's Jason,

(40:22):
but like we have never had a blow out. And
I'm not saying that will never happen, but like you've
taught me to to deal with conflict and to cope better,
and you're you are very logical and I'm very emotional,
but you've helped me back. But he's helping like he's
he's and you know, just like vice versa for you know,
Mike and I, it's like we're learning and we're getting
better and we're leaning into each other. And I think

(40:45):
to answer like full circle your question is like we're
just every time we're doing better and we're learning from
it and we're coming around and saying and it's I
think it's working. Yeah it is. And to what Caitlin
just said that you're learning from Jason, I think ultimately
you have done a lot of work on myself, like
with my therapist and everything like that. And but I've

(41:05):
learned more of that from Janna because even before the
last probably two months, I was spending more frequently than Joanna.
And when I spend, it's not necessarily throwing things or whatever,
but I'm heightened, my voices is raised. And then I
just keep coming after her, like we'll stop talking and

(41:25):
I'll just keep coming. She'll go to the closet, like
close the door and like maybe crying or just like
leave me alone, Leave me alone, leave me alone. I'll
just keep pepper in her, trying to do the same
thing she was doing to me the other night, just
trying to get her to meet her on my level,
and she wouldn't, you know. So it's like there has
to be given take because if it's the same person.
And for a while there she felt like the only
person that was doing the work because I was the

(41:48):
one that was spinning more often. So now it's it's
so much better because we see that back and forth.
It's like, Okay, I'm not alone in this. The other
person's meeting me there. Why do you think you did?
And more so in my situation, it's there's so much

(42:09):
shame involved with everything that I like, I want to like, uh,
stand up for and defend everything I can when like,
if I have an inch, I'll take a mile, Like
an inch of good, I'm gonna take a mile because
I've been for so long and there's so much ammunition
negative against me that when there's one thing positive or

(42:32):
it's in my mind, I minimize it because it's not
as big as what I did in the past. I
want to be you know, I just want to take
take take of any kind of positive versus all of
the negative that's stacked up against me. For you know,
there's last five years or whatever, so I think that's
that that's the biggest thing. It's just like I'm just
trying to take it so you get it and like
trying to make you understand that that's not me anymore.

(42:55):
But I can't make you understand. The only way I
can do it is by not reacting, by doing what
I did the other night, by allowing you to have
these feelings, by being empathetic. So we're starting to get there. Guys,

(43:18):
aren't relationships just something there. There are a lot of
work they really are. There's like and and I love
that you guys podcasts and you're open about it because
I think a lot of people feel shame around how
they react in relationships because we've all been like conditioned
a certain way growing up and how we see relationships
and how we react to our partners and certain things.

(43:41):
And I know for myself, just hearing other people talk
about their relationships and being open about their hard times
has helped me so much. So I love that you
guys do podcasts about being so open about it because
it probably helps so many people. And I just like
you've been so fortunate, Jason, with your family and like
certain things like he just grew up. I watch his
dad the way his dad is to his mom, and

(44:03):
I'll like start crying and like it's it's insane. I've
never seen anything like it. Like behind closed doors, he
won't even know him watching, and his dad will look
at his mom and just be like you are the
glue to this family, Like I love you so much,
and like like that's just and that's what Jason's witten is,
not that you've never gone through anything hard, but like
you know, coming from a divorce family, which I actually
think I had a healthy divorce with my parents, Like

(44:25):
it's still like weighs on people, and it's crazy how
much your conditioned as a child to how you behave
as an adult. And even if you know better, like
you said the out of body experiences, Like even when
you know better, it's like you've been conditioned your whole
life too to think and act a certain way. And
so it takes a lot of therapy and talking out
loud and connecting with other people who go through the

(44:47):
same thing to grow. So that's cool that you guys
do that. Thank you. Yeah, I think also, Okay, so
there's a lot of things there. One I think when
you have these discussions. Everyone comes from different backgrounds, different parenting,
Everyone has differ and triggers. So I think with first
of all, relationships are extremely, extremely difficult, but you really
have to understand the core of why someone is showing

(45:09):
the emotion they're showing. So many times in our relationship
I would say something to Kalin, she would break down crying,
and I'm I'm literally standing there like a ghost, like
what just happened? So instead of like yelling or getting frustrated,
I want to know, like what exactly was it that
I did? That just sparks something on your history that
created such pain that you're crying right now because this

(45:29):
reaction is not normal, right, this isn't common practice reacting
this way. Clearly there's something that happened. So something that
I always do is really trying, like when someone is triggered,
let's not let's stop right now, and like what is
the core of this, Like, let's break it down, peel
thee onion? What is it? No, I know it's easier,
it's easier said than done. But then also when you

(45:50):
talk about I think when you talk about like me
having great like parents and and and holding onto things
like I also don't think you have to know where
you came from and you have issues with your parents
and your maybe parenting was the best, which is then
as a derivative of where you stand, that's who you are.
But at some point everyone has to grow up and

(46:11):
take responsibility and take ownership and stop passing the blame
on mom or dad or grandpa and say this is
what I need to work on, and I'm gonna work
on it, and I'm holding myself accountable to it. I
think it's you can say that, but you also have
to understand and forgive yourself of where you came from. Absolutely,
And I don't think you can work on yourself until
you know yourself. And I think that's part of knowing yourself.
I think that's step one. But then it's like you've

(46:33):
really got to put in the work done to cure
that stuff. What do you want to work on, Jason?
That's a really good question. Jason's just taking us to
church right now. I'm like I'm doing I'm doing heart
hands over. His emotional intelligence and maturity is like out
of this world. It's insane, which has really helped me
but also made me feel very stupid. You know what, Yeah,

(46:57):
you know what I think I do is I think
I try. I try to be so level head and
logical that sometimes I don't explain myself because I'll constrain
my emotion because I just like I would I would
rather like deal with the solution and then then put
my emotion out there, so I kind of take the
emotion out of it. So something that I need to
do is like there are times that like I'm really

(47:20):
piste off at something Caitlyn just did. She has no idea,
and I bring her side and like like, why do
would you ever do that? Why would you ever think
that that's respectful or acceptable? And Caitlyn will be like,
what where is this coming from? Like what are you
talking about? I stop, you know, hit pause, think about it,
and I'm like, I guess I haven't really like expressed
myself at all that the X, Y, and Z really

(47:41):
does bother me. So that's something I got to work as,
like expressing myself. Yeah, Like I always try and internalize
and then react instead of just initially reacting. And I
think a hybrid of that both can help, like, you know,
for the benefit of us. You know, it's interesting you
said that way, and I wonder if it's just a
male thing or if it's certain people in general. But

(48:02):
I'm similar where some of the things that Jane might
do that frustrates me the most is because it goes
against my logic. Where literally, in my my old therapist
in l A that really was like the nucleus of
my recovery and everything. He would always call it Mike's world,
like in Mike's world, Like why are you talking about
Mike's world so much? Like it's because if it doesn't

(48:22):
make sense in Mike's world, it's basically wrong, you know.
I mean like that's how that's how my logic was,
and so I'll get so frustrated because I'd be like,
why would you do that? Like it's like I'm asking
him a question while he's making a peanut butter and
July sand much He's like, why would you ask me
this question? Can't you see him doing something right now?
I'm like, why are you geting so frustrated just asking
a question? Like but but but now it's to that example,

(48:46):
that was a fight we had in Los Angeles. Yeah,
we had an actual fight, but he got I was
literally making a sand rational awareness and I'm like, as
I'm holding laundry and a kid in this, and I'm like,
I just want to know what time we're leaving. So
this to that point this morning, right I haven't even
eaten my breakfast yet, and we're you know, you're you
guys are in a house right now. See all the

(49:07):
blue tape everywhere and like basically construction zone because we're
doing our like one year warranty thing, which side note
we preface. Before they came in, were like, I don't
mind the house. It's a mess. I feel like anytime
anyone has company over, everyone says that it's like if
anyone's house ever cleaned, because everyone always says, come on in,
but our house is a mess. Forgive us Like what right? Right? Right?

(49:30):
So uh so this morning, like, no, you didn't do
anything wrong, but it's just uh an observation of how
we were and how we are now because you asked
me questions. You're like, hey, we need I haven't even
eatn yet. Got the kids. She's seeing Jay's hey, can
you take this and eat the ladder so we can
put the tape up in the room. And I'm like,

(49:52):
I haven't eaten breakfast, and that part that now it's
a fraction of me. Back then in l A, it
was majority of me. Now it's a fraction of me.
I wanted to be like, can I freaking eat breakfast
before you start bombarding me with things to do? But
that's how Janna wakes up. She wakes up like, let's
go like how can we be productive right now? And

(50:13):
I'd like to sit down with you. My breakfast, had
my coffee, that's my thing. And but instead of like
reacting that way, I was just like okay and helped
her out and did it and then went and sat
down and ate my breakfast, and you probably avoided an argument. Yeah,
and I don't have any. The difference is letting the
feelings go or pushing them aside. Its supposed to pushing
them down, Like I'm not pushing them down where it

(50:33):
comes up sideways later or as resentment or whatever. It's
just swallow, it dissipates. I'm good. Yeah, I like the aside,
not down. Yeah. I like that. I've never heard you
say that before. I really yeah, because it's like when
you push it down, you're gonna then it's coming back up,
it's coming back out because you're gonna be like still
angry about it. But pushing aside, it's like, okay, she
just wanted to get like you know, it's like it's fine.

(50:55):
Maybe I'll bring it up to her later during our
check in if it's still with me. Do you guys
start checking every day at night? Yeah? Oh I love that.
So you just like talk about your day and you know,
so it's it's called fanos. So it's called so the
first one is feeling, So you would say like I'm feeling,
so tonight we'll be like I'm feeling tired, um excited

(51:16):
to go to Michigan. Um, I'm feeling a little triggered
because something came up earlier today. I'm feeling like whatever,
you're whatever you're feeling. And then it's affirmation. So you
would say, hey, thank you for getting that ladder for
me this morning. I know you want to eat your breakfast,
but thank you for getting that for me. Thank you,
just like thank you, thank you, thank you for what

(51:36):
you did today, thank you for helping with the kids,
thank you for letting me go for a walk, like
I really needed that, like whatever, and then needs like
I really need you. So we're coming up on an
anniversary that's kind of triggering, and it's like, hey, I
really need you to know that, like this date coming
up is hurting me, and just like love me a
little better or like hold me, acknowledge it, like whatever

(51:58):
you need. And then own is our part, Caitlin, where
we say I was a crazy person last night and
I am really sorry, So own whatever you did wrong.
And then the last part is Mike's recovery stuff. Yes,
as for sobriety, So I talked about like meetings or
sponsor stuff or anything like that. So but or you
can say, they say therapy, so like I have therapy

(52:18):
session with therapists after fourth of July. I was going
to ask you, so, oh, so what is that called again?
To spell it out for me. One more feelings, affirmations, needs,
own and then whatever you're doing to better yourself. We
just do power hours in the morning when we're like,
what do we need to do to get done today?
And then we like talk about like our schedules, but
we don't do it. We don't do chickens at the
end of the night, which I actually think would be

(52:40):
super important for us because at night we're both so
tired and we're like we put on like a Netflix
show and are on our phones, and I feel like
we don't connect enough at night at the end of
the day, which we should totally do that well. And
you know, it's something like even if you don't want
to do it every night, you can be like, hey,
do you want to check in and it's like yeah, whatever,
but then like at least it once a week. Yeah.

(53:00):
I like that because you're not holding onto any because
in our relationship we would hold onto things and then
it would come out real sideways. Do you guys work
it all together. Do you do anything kind of So
how is that? Do you guys work in the same
style or That's funny because when you were saying that,
Janet gets up and she's like ready to go and
be productive. I'm like, that's where we are not cut

(53:20):
from the same cloth. Really, You're like you have Okay,
let's just promote it first. So obviously off the vine podcast,
you've got to do um do. Yeah, the scruncheese, You've
got the spade and sparrows, wine nine to wine, nine
to wine. I mean, you have your if I'm being honest,
like I'm being honest. If I'm being honest, like you're

(53:41):
like you're killing it. So like you have your music,
you have all the stuff going on, So like, how
are you not? I'm productive? I just my mornings are
more like Mike, where I need to wake up. I
need to like have my time to wake up, and
then I need to have a coffee And Jason is
the sweetest and brings me coffee in bed all the time,
and I need to like have an hour to actually

(54:04):
just start moving in my day and then I'll be productive.
But I don't wake up like it's a struggle for
me to get out of bed. I am very lazy
in the mornings. What time do you roll out about it?
Like ten? Damn, I can't wait till you're a mom. Oh,
I'm like if I sar for nine am, I'm like, Oh,

(54:27):
Julie watked in this morning at and I wake up
at six. I wake up at six every morning kind
of for that reason. I have some things that do
but also I like that hour to kind of wake
up because I also know how Jenny is when she
first wakes up. But if I haven't eaten her had
my coffee yet, I'm still just like, hey, hold on,
but you know, yeah, Julie came in at five forty
this morning, like, hey, it's morning time. I'm up schedules working,

(54:54):
I'll put it, I get it right in the office, coffee,
Wall Street Journal, NonStop. I could I could literally I
was single, I could work twenty hours a day. Yeah.
I think that's what we've actually gotten closer during quarantine
because he has such a discipline schedule where he wakes up,
he'll go for a run or do a workout, have
his coffee, read the paper, be upstairs, and he just works, works, works,

(55:17):
and he stays up in his office that sometimes I'm like,
is he even home? I don't know, So that at
the end of the night, I'm like, it's almost like
he was gone for the whole day, and I kind
of like miss him by the end of the day,
even though you're just upstairs. Yeah, operate differently, though differently.
What are you doing right now, Jason? So, I got
a lot of stuff going. So I was a corporate
banker before, and so I started. I do investing, So
I do angel investing, investing companies. I do consulting, so

(55:40):
financial and career consulting. I just signed up two book
deal with HarperCollins. So yeah, thank you. Yeah. Does your
book come out or is it out September twenty see,
you guys can pre order right now at Jana and
Mike dot com. Yeah, getting your copy will take I
guess sometimes. Okay, okay, awesome, And like the newest most

(56:05):
exciting project going to be about SO one is going
to be all about career navigation, professional development, accelerating your career,
everything from negotiating your salary to moving up the ladder
to detouring your entire career. Entrepreneurship list goes on um yeah.
So the new like my new passion thing I started
is called Restart. And so the idea is that, like,

(56:28):
there's so many lessons that aren't taught in a classroom,
that you can't find in a textbook, that are imperative
to everything we do on a daily basis, and so
it's breaking those things down. Give me an example. He's
so good at breaking down things that in my mind,
I'm like, this is the most overwhelming complicated thing in
the world, and Jason can break things down where like

(56:48):
he makes he just simplifies everything. So you're like, oh,
like even something like student debt or like I don't
know what was the DOW. I was like, what like
stocks and stuff is I have no idea like what
to invest in or like. So I mean there's just
like I'm like thinking, how many topics. So some of
the things we do our real talk. So we talked
to prominent individuals who achieved like immaculate success and we're

(57:10):
not worried about like where are they, how they like
where they are, but how they got there. So like
we have Damon John from Shark Tanky came on, Barbara
Corker and the Bella twins Um Ryan sir hen for
a million dollar listings. So it's it's always have the
most fascinating stories, like of how they got there. But
but even on your restart page, I feel like you
break down things you do like fun quiz and like

(57:31):
certain things where like mortgage, read finances, student debt, breakdown
stuff like that. I love that. Um okay, So to
end it, I really want to know why you don't
drink water, because when we started this interview, Caitlin's like,
I don't drink water. How are you like what? It's

(57:51):
the weirdest thing I hate. I hated about myself that
I don't like water. I've never what do you drink coffee?
I'll like, I'll like drink. I'll force myself to drink
a bottle of water a day, but like that's probably
as much water as I take in as like one
bottle of water, and I course myself. I don't know

(58:11):
why I don't like it. I don't know like makes
you try putting lemon in it and hucumber. I've tried everything,
little small water. Yeah, I've tried everything. It's I don't
know why it's a it's a it's a flaw and
I'm not sure it's character defact. I'm working on it
with Angela. I'm talking I've seen her tomorrow said Hi,

(58:33):
no bad blood. Okay, everyone download if I'm being honest,
and um follow Jason and Caitlin because they're awesome. Thank
you guys so much for coming to another hour. I'll
just have to do a part to on our my podcast,
but you will be there and we can do another
part too. I love it. I love you guys. Thank you,