November 17, 2025 • 38 mins
Jasmine Crockett has been going through it. As she bravely tries to preserve the American people's rights to health insurance, food, and marriage equality, she must confront a government unwilling to come to the table with humane solutions. She talks to Ashlyn about what banding together could look like and the type of life she hopes to live after Congress. Leading with grace, humor, and fire, Jasmine Crockett shows us what it means to stay grounded while pushing for change.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hi, everyone, and welcome back to another episode of Wide
Open with Ashlyn Harris. So, my son, it, you know,
is obsessed with dinosaurs.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
So here we are.
Speaker 1 (00:11):
We're in his room and I'm like, it's so cute
and i love being a mom, so I'm not going
to hide it or take it down. We're just here
and we're I'm gonna take you on a safari during Christmas.
So this weekend, I'm really excited. Uh, Sophia has the
has been given the opportunity to uh sit down with
(00:31):
Kamala to do one of her book tours in Toronto.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
So I'm really excited.
Speaker 1 (00:38):
I know Sophia is super excited, and yeah, we're both
going to go to Toronto this weekend and get some
get some time with her and Doug and the family,
and yeah, just re energize because it's been one hell
of a year, especially the current landscape of policy. So
(01:00):
it'll be really nice to be around familiar faces. To
say the least. Sophia is very close with Kamala, and
Sophia has been campaigning and you know, being such a
servant to you know, America and politics for a very
long time, and that's like her passion is democracy and justice,
and I love supporting her and how how happy and
(01:23):
excited she gets to kind of serve her country and
in a different way than I served my country being
a professional soccer player for the US team. So Saturday night,
a bunch of us leslies, all my cute little gay girlfriends,
we had a date night and we went to Hannah
Berner's comedy show and it was so much fun. I
(01:49):
laughed my ass off. Ali opened for Hannah and her
whole like set was about lesbians, and I was fucking
cackling so hard.
Speaker 2 (02:00):
At one point she could hear.
Speaker 1 (02:03):
Me, and I was like up in a box and
she was just like making everyone gag, just gag over
her content.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
So we had a really good time, and then.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
A few of us drove upstate to have a little
gay little weekend. Especially with the ruling of the Supreme Court,
it was such a good time to just celebrate with
my queer little friends. And we watched the holiday and
we made fires and ate good food and set up
(02:34):
all the Christmas decorations. So we have I think we
have in total five or six Christmas trees. It's absolutely obnoxious.
So yeah, we set up three Christmas trees upstate and
then brought back two Christmas trees here in New York
in the city.
Speaker 2 (02:54):
So we're just gonna have a big old It's just
it's fun. We have two kids. You have to go
hard in the paint. So that's what we commit to doing.
Speaker 1 (03:04):
Oh I am absolutely a fake tree kind of bitch,
Like I don't have like my version this is yes,
I am so not high maintenance. And my version of
a Christmas tree is literally get the pre lit one,
get the one that changes like.
Speaker 2 (03:22):
Colorful, up warm, white, up this, up that, and then
I don't have to decorate it.
Speaker 1 (03:29):
I literally pop that thing up, plug it in, and
I fluff it and keep it pushing. And it drives
Sophia crazy. She's like, absolutely not. She's vientage shopping on
Etsy and god knows what else. eBay, all these all
these ornaments that are like beautiful and heavy and m
(03:50):
and I'm like, good, enjoy this for two point three seconds,
because as soon as Ocean sees that, he's gonna grab
it and check it across the fucking bedroom and the
room and everything else and roll it down the stairs.
Like it's so funny because I know exactly how my
toddlers operate, so everything is like shatter proof. We don't
(04:11):
paper cardboard ornaments like we keep it simple and basic.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
And she's like, I want my vintage glass this and that,
and I'm like, it's all gonna break. Give it one week,
one day, it's gonna break.
Speaker 1 (04:33):
Hi, everyone, welcome back to Wide Open. I'm your host,
Ashlyn Harrison. Today I'm sitting down with someone who's redefining
what it means to lead both with backbone and with heart.
Congresswoman Jasmine Crockett is here. She's a civil rights attorney
turned political powerhouse, known for speaking truth to power and
(04:54):
standing her ground with grace, humor, and more importantly fire.
What I of most about Jasmine is that her voice
comes from a real place, a place built on faith, family,
and lived experience. In this conversation, we talk about her
father's presence as a pastor has shaped her ability to
command a room, how her law degree prepared her to
(05:17):
fight for justice, and what it really takes to stay
grounded while pushing for change. We also dive into the
state of gay rights in this country, including the huge
Supreme Court win this week keeping gay marriage legal, and
of course, the weekly question does the Democratic Party have
(05:37):
a backbone. Jasmine is sharp, funny, honest, and full of
the kind of conviction this country needs.
Speaker 2 (05:44):
Right now, let's get into it.
Speaker 1 (05:46):
Congresswoman Jasmine Crocket, the oneted only, Oh my gosh.
Speaker 3 (05:52):
One of my favorite humans.
Speaker 1 (05:54):
Thank you for taking the time, because holy shit, everything's
on fire. I can't imagine, I mean, what you're doing
all around the clock at this point.
Speaker 4 (06:04):
Yeah, first of all, it's great to see you.
Speaker 5 (06:07):
I wish I was saying you in person, I know,
but I am definitely in DC ready to do my
black job.
Speaker 6 (06:15):
Yes you are, honey, And yeah, you know, I just
want to say to all your listeners that I'm sorry,
like I'm sorry that government is failing everyone.
Speaker 4 (06:27):
No matter like.
Speaker 5 (06:27):
How you affiliate yourself, there's no way to believe that
this is how government is supposed to function. And it
is my sincere hope regardless of kind of what policies
and who's getting to put what bills on the floor,
I just hope that we can get to the point
that we can actually do the very basics that government
(06:48):
is supposed to do, which is to keep the lights on, right, Like,
I just hope that we can at a very minimum
get back to basics.
Speaker 1 (06:55):
But what I love so much about you, Jasmine, is
the way you care yourself like you're so real. Like you,
there's no question why everyone says or hopes that you
are our.
Speaker 2 (07:07):
Future because you're just You're.
Speaker 1 (07:12):
The way you show up for us and the way
you serve us is something like I've never seen in
our party, which even more now than ever, where everyone's
questioning if we if we even fucking have a backbone,
like you've been that backbone for us, and you know,
as much as the last however many I'm not even
(07:32):
saying week, So I'm gonna say the last year has
been a fucking shit show. It's been a win for
us this week with the Supreme Court because a lot
of people tuning in at least my viewership or either
allies of the gay community or a part of the
gay community. And you know, we'll take the wins when
we could take the wins at this point for our community.
Speaker 2 (07:53):
So I'm curious of what you think right now.
Speaker 1 (07:56):
It you know, what was that a big you know,
can we breathe a little bit?
Speaker 4 (08:02):
Or is it just I think it was monumental?
Speaker 5 (08:05):
Okay, I had just done the black tie dinner in Dallas,
and as I was there, I was talking about here
it is that we are on the edge of our
seats wondering whether or not marriage equality will be a
thing right, And I'm like, why is it that we
(08:26):
have spent so much time going back, right, like, instead
of going forward.
Speaker 4 (08:30):
This is what we're doing.
Speaker 5 (08:32):
And the reality is that whether you know, people that
are members of the LGBTQIA community get married or not
has nothing to do with whether or not they have
food on the table. It has nothing to do with
whether or not they are able to build generational wealth.
It has nothing to do with the fact that we
are missing over a million jobs that have been lost
(08:54):
in less than a year since this man is worn
in the number of availability of jobs for the first
time in a very long time is less than what
we have as it relates to able bodied workers that
are looking for work. And so you know, like, none
of this has anything to do with anything. And I
hate that the entirety of the community has been escapegoat
(09:17):
to distract from real issues, the real governing things that
we should be focused on governing somebody's bedroom or their love.
Speaker 4 (09:29):
It's not really like I mean, it's not my priority.
It's not my business.
Speaker 6 (09:35):
It's not my.
Speaker 4 (09:35):
Priority unless it is to open up freedom. And you know,
I think that when.
Speaker 5 (09:42):
You talk about what it is to be a patriot
or an American, at the core of everything is our freedom.
Speaker 4 (09:47):
That is what separates us.
Speaker 5 (09:49):
From every other non democratic kind of nation. And so
the idea that we are now kind of wavering on
what freedom looks like, who gets freedom and that kind
of stuff, that is when we honestly should have all
band together. You know, I talk all the time about
like as say it this very callous way, but I'm
(10:11):
not being callous where I'm like, I don't really care
what you think about reproductive freedom. I don't really care
what you think about the LGBTQUIA community and the freedom's
they deserve. Like, if you consider yourself an American, if
you consider yourself to be a patriot, then the most
patriotic thing that you can do, it has nothing to
do with whether or not you agree, has to do
(10:33):
with the fact that you respect it. Right, you say, listen,
we believe in freedom. I ain't gotta like it. I
can tell you my religiousy is these I say, whatever
your thing is, right, it's not about whether or not
you approve like it, love it, or even hate it.
It's about whether or not you believe in freedom. And
so I would tell people all the time because people
(10:54):
get it real confused because I've got a district that
is heavily African American, but I live in what we
call the neighborhood in Dubtless, so I represent the Oakland
area right as well as this kind of So they're like,
wellw you deal with black preachers, And I'm like, very easily, right,
It's not about you know, what you believe, It's not
(11:17):
about any of that. It's about the fact that I
am a civil rights lawyer. I believe in the civil
rights and liberties of all people. And if I ever
get to the point that I'm like, well, I'll only
fight for the civil rights of this group and not that,
then I'm failing myself. And the best example that I
can give you of how seriously I take the work
that I've done as an attorney is even as a
(11:39):
black woman, I have represented.
Speaker 4 (11:43):
I had a defendant. There was a member of the
Rian Brotherhood.
Speaker 5 (11:47):
And when you get a quarter pointed attorney, you don't
get to say, hey, I'm racist. I can't take the
black one like you get what you get right now.
Granted I could have got off of it right and said, hey,
I feel like I can't do this, but I believe
in the Constitution.
Speaker 4 (12:04):
I believe that everyone is entitled to their due process.
Speaker 2 (12:07):
I believe that.
Speaker 5 (12:08):
If the justice system works the way that it is
supposed to work, then somebody that needs to be held
accountable will and somebody who's not supposed to be held
accountable hopefully they won't write. But I did not not
defend him to the best of my ability, to the
extent that it was one of those times that I
felt like I could show him better than I could
(12:29):
tell him, because the idea of hating somebody with my
amount of melanin just because and then ultimately kind of
the universe turning everything on its head and you're now
being represented by one of these people that you hate.
You know, it's one thing to say you're a Christian,
it's another thing to actually show it in your works.
(12:52):
I think one of the best things that I could
do to show that I believe in the Constitution, to
show that I believe in the work that I was
doing as an attorney answers show that I really am
a I am a Christian is to defend somebody that
I know hates me, who doesn't even know me. And
after it was all said and done, he was not
full of hate for me. Now, he still may have
hated black people, who knows, but he was not full
(13:13):
of hate for me directly. And I think that, you know,
that was a really important lesson. When I think about
the number of people that walk around talking about they
hate certain groups and that kind of stuff, most of
them have failed to actually interact right They somehow have
used their lack of interaction to basically justify the fact
(13:36):
that they look at us as less in human. And
I think that the real cure is not going to
be sitting on social media going back and forth with
keyboard warriors or bots or whomever. I think it's going
to be getting back to real connections and getting to
know people because again, you can show them better than
you can tell them. Instead of believing that you know,
(13:58):
these are second class citizens, whether it's because of their race,
or it's because of the country they were born in,
or because they remember the LGBCQI a community. How about
you actually just interacts because you may learn that honestly,
we're all just people. We're all just and we are
all just trying to live a spool as possible.
Speaker 2 (14:19):
Stay tuned.
Speaker 1 (14:20):
I'll be back in just a moment after this brief
message from our sponsors. I have to ask, because I'm
so curious. You're You're an incredibly smart but you're incredibly
You're an EmPATH, You're just you get it. And I
wonder where this comes from because you're so in your
(14:45):
body with who you are and how you show up,
and you're you can be in a room with you
for thirty seconds and you can feel that it's electric you.
You make people want to be better. And I'm I'm curious,
where did you find this voice and this passion and
this fearlessness when you hit the floor and you're just
(15:07):
like in your element?
Speaker 2 (15:09):
Why politics?
Speaker 3 (15:11):
Like I have so many questions.
Speaker 4 (15:14):
I ask God all the time, Why politics? Lord in Mercy?
Speaker 5 (15:19):
You know, as I've said so many times, I never
had to worry about death threats when I was representing
actual killers. It was only once I decided that I
wanted to be a representative of the people as a
whole that I ended up having to deal with death threats.
And needing security and all that kind of stuff. I
literally in jail sales with actual people that had killed people,
and I was like, I'm good, like I you know,
it is what it is. But I think that you know,
(15:42):
we all interpret our experiences through whatever lens we do, right,
and so I look at everything that I've experienced as
the things that have shaped me. And you know, one
of the things that I consistently hear as I travel
the country is that you know, I was built for
such a time as this, and it is a heavy
(16:03):
burden to have to know that we're really at a
historically low place in our country, and to really a
lot of days because I am very much human, just
want to give up.
Speaker 4 (16:18):
You know, I don't have to do it.
Speaker 5 (16:19):
You know, I get harassed and people say crazy stuff
like I'm becoming a millionaire doing this. I'm like, bro,
like the same way it is because I'm also not
gonna play with these people. You're not gonna find me
doing none of this nonsense that Trump is up to.
I already know they will put me under the jail.
Also is just wrong, you know obviously, you know, for me,
it's about you know, what is your purpose? And I
(16:42):
think that I feel so confident in the fact that
this has nothing to do with me. You know, there
are people that were born into certain political families. They
knew forever that they would be in politics. They you know,
charted their every move, what they majored in, and you
know whether or not they went to law school, whose
(17:04):
offices they worked in.
Speaker 4 (17:05):
That wasn't me.
Speaker 5 (17:06):
I never worked on the hill, I never interned on
the Hill. I never thought about the Hill whatsoever. You know,
from a state level or federal level, like, this wasn't
It wasn't anything that I aspired to. There were so
many people, because my predecessor had been in the seat
for thirty years, that had been tracking her down, trying
to get the nod like, trying to figure out what
(17:27):
is it going to take. That wasn't me, Like I like,
it was none of that. And so I have no
reason to be fearful because I am so confident that
this wasn't my plan. It was God's plan all my life.
And I think that's the only way to explain.
Speaker 6 (17:44):
You know.
Speaker 5 (17:44):
I was talking to one of my friends the other
night and I was like, you know, sometimes I just
sit back and I think about all that I've done,
and I literally have not been in Congress for a
total of three years, like crazy, not at three years yet, right,
And I was explaining that as I was on my
flight coming back to DC. I was like, yeah, there's
(18:05):
some old Republican that was on my plane. I was like,
I have no idea who it is. And it's someone
in my delegation, right, I'm like, no clue, no idea
who he was, whatsoever. But the guy that was sitting
next to me on the plane was like obviously very
into him.
Speaker 4 (18:21):
So I was like, huh, that's gonna be interesting, right,
you know, because to.
Speaker 5 (18:25):
Me, but you know whatever, and so but I thought
about that, and I was like, he's probably been in
Congress for a very long time, and I, as a
sitting member of Congress, have no idea who he is.
From the delegation of thirty eight people in Texas, I have.
Speaker 4 (18:39):
No idea who he is.
Speaker 5 (18:40):
And so I was like, you know, it's crazy because
some part of our bubble makes us believe that everybody
knows all the elected officials. They know all four hundred
and thirty five in the House, they know the hundred
on the Senate side.
Speaker 4 (18:54):
And I was like it's just fake and false.
Speaker 5 (18:58):
More importantly, the fact is that, like while he had
on a jacket, I didn't pay attention to his name,
Congress and all that kind of stuff. You know, it
was the flight attendants they knew exactly who I was.
It was other passengers they knew exactly who I was.
And to think about the fact that I'm able to
(19:19):
have such an impact in less than three years, which
is more than some people that have been here for
a very long time, it really only continues to reaffirm
that this has never been anything that I did, but
it's been the real purpose on my life. And so
I am very confident that if for some reason my
(19:41):
district said, hey, you know what, we don't like the
right way that you represent. We think we want somebody else,
I'm cool with that because I've in democracy. I believe
that people should have the voices that they feel like
are reflective of their will. And I'm completely confident that
I will have life after Congress, Like I am like planning, plotting,
(20:03):
and like excited about life after Congress because definitely the
more I do this, the more anonymous I actually.
Speaker 4 (20:12):
Want to be.
Speaker 3 (20:14):
I can imagine and went into private life.
Speaker 4 (20:16):
I get a little bit of a reprieve.
Speaker 1 (20:19):
I have to ask this question as an athlete because
when you are on the floor, it's something I've never experienced,
And like, you make politics enjoyable now for people like me.
Speaker 3 (20:33):
I say that genuinely, Like you know, I fuck with.
Speaker 1 (20:37):
You like hard and I got your back, and like
what a privilege it is to call you a friend.
And the way you show up for your people and
the people you don't even know or may not identify
with or but you support, you respect, you hear people,
you see people, and it is an absolute gift. And
I'm lucky to be a part of that small group
(21:00):
in your circle. But I have to fucking know as
an athlete, like preparation is key and everything I've ever
done representing my country, playing my role, showing up the
way I show up. How do you prepare when you
go to battle, babe?
Speaker 2 (21:16):
Like what are you doing? What are you listening to?
Speaker 1 (21:19):
Because it is like you're taking us to church in
a way I've never been. I mean, it is it
is something out of this world. I love it.
Speaker 4 (21:30):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (21:30):
Now, I think that that's such a great question, because
you know, when you talk about representing our country. You
didn't just get to wake up one day and start
kind of training, right. You have been training your whole life,
and then your training kind of hits a new level
when it's time to like, okay, we got to represent
(21:52):
the United States. I look at my life in a
very similar way. I think the skills that I was
able to use and fine tune in the courtroom really
helped me, especially as a public defender.
Speaker 4 (22:06):
As a public defender.
Speaker 5 (22:08):
It's always you know, David and Goliath, right, Like, you know,
the state has everything, and you are limited on your resources,
but you've got to make sure that you can put
put on a vigorous defense of really the underdog, right.
And I look at so many people that are in
(22:28):
the working class that are struggling right now as the underdogs,
especially right now because it seems like this administration is
picking winners and losers, and they want everyone who is
not a NEPO baby, everyone who didn't somehow manage to
get their hundreds of millions of dollars in the bank
before they made it into the White House. They basically
(22:51):
are beating up on us, right. So I look at
it like, Okay, I've been a criminal defense attorney. I've
been a public defender. I've been the underdog, and I've
had to make a way out of no way, and
I've had to come up with the creative arguments. And
people don't understand the skill set that you need as
a defense attorney is a lot different than as a prosecutor.
As a prosecutor, you got all the information for the
(23:14):
most part right. Obviously, a witness can always go left,
but you've got so much information. As a defense attorney,
you're kind of sitting there like you don't know what
that witness may say, and you've got to stay ready.
So you have to study that witness. You can't just
look at what they've given you. You got to look
beyond that. So we do deep dives into their social media.
(23:34):
Sometimes you put a PI on them. You get people
that are around them and find out kind of you
try to get into their heads to understand who they are.
So when I'm preparing for committee, I don't just look
at what the committee memo says.
Speaker 4 (23:48):
I have my team do.
Speaker 5 (23:49):
Some deeper diving outside of what's giving to me. And
then as I'm listening, which I am thankful that I'm
so low in seniority that I don't go first.
Speaker 4 (24:00):
I start to see the theme of like what it
is that they're trying to argue.
Speaker 5 (24:05):
And because I have always had to be able to
think on my feet, I'm able to adjust in real time.
And luckily my team is able to adjust in real
time too, and print things out and that kind of stuff. So,
you know, one of my more viral moments was when
they were going after President Joe Biden and they were like, oh,
he's corrupt, the Biden crime.
Speaker 4 (24:27):
Family, blah blah blah.
Speaker 5 (24:29):
And so I decided, based on some things that I
heard to talk about the documents at Mary A Lago,
And if people will remember, I held up this sheet
of paper and I talked about our national.
Speaker 4 (24:42):
Secrets and the shitter.
Speaker 6 (24:45):
And so.
Speaker 5 (24:45):
But it was a sheet of paper, and it was
a sheet of paper because I had just told myself,
I'm like, hey, go print this, do this, you know,
like I had remembered that I had seen the images
that kind of stuff. So I was texting it in
real time, and it was more so in response to
things that they were trying to say about Joe Biden
in that moment, whereas I would have had it printed
(25:08):
out on a big poster board.
Speaker 4 (25:10):
It was part of it.
Speaker 5 (25:11):
So you know, some of my most viral moments I
think have been viral because they have been authentic in
the moment and meeting the moment versus super prepared. I
don't know that I've ever really gone viral for my actual, specific,
prepared remarks. It's always been just the total preparation, including
(25:34):
me being a trial lawyer. That has led me to
be able to pivot really fast and really hanging them
up on some stuff.
Speaker 3 (25:42):
I love it. I love it.
Speaker 1 (25:46):
This is wide open and I'm your host, Ashlyn Harris.
Speaker 3 (25:49):
Thanks for listening.
Speaker 2 (25:50):
We'll be right back.
Speaker 3 (25:55):
I have to say, today's a big day for you.
I know you have very little times.
Speaker 1 (26:00):
I have to ask these eight dems who caved, who
sold sold out, and now you know, like I said earlier,
it feels like the backbone of our party is just
like what are we doing after all of this?
Speaker 3 (26:17):
So what is your thoughts?
Speaker 1 (26:18):
I mean, I know what you said, you know on
your social media, but I'm curious now walking into this dance,
like what is what does it feel like? You know,
these are supposed to be our people showing up for us,
representing us and doing the right thing. And it's been
a hard few weeks for a lot of people in
this country, and we just fucking throw the towel in
(26:40):
now now, yeah.
Speaker 4 (26:43):
I agree. My deal is Listen, if you were going cave, you.
Speaker 5 (26:46):
Should have just went ahead, caved early on and save
everybody all the drama. But to build a movement and
to get people to understand are why, I mean that
was huge because everybody talks about how Democrats are terrible messengers.
But it's like we laid out our why, but then
you folded and you didn't get the why, so were
(27:08):
you lying? Like this gets me to those voters that
look at the parties and say that they're the same.
For the longest, I could not really understand what people meant,
because you know, I don't think you'll ever find a
Democratic president that's saying, oh, I've got money to feed
people on snap and I won't, Like, I just don't.
Speaker 4 (27:27):
I don't think you'll ever find that.
Speaker 5 (27:29):
But to the extent that they can't be trusted with
their word, I get that, and I think that any
rage or disappointment that anybody feels, I think it's absolutely warranted.
I will tell you that it sucks when you're part
of like a team, right, Like you talk about representing
the United States, Like yeah, you know if you are
(27:51):
on a team, or even for those of you they've
never had to be in a team type setting, but
like you're working on a group project and it's like, well, damn.
Speaker 4 (28:00):
We over here, like we are dragging the whole light team.
Speaker 5 (28:03):
Like that's tough. Yeah, I do want people. I'm not
asking anybody to give a pass to the eight dem senators.
I am asking you to look at the numbers as
a whole. We have forty odd Democratic Senators and of those.
Speaker 4 (28:18):
Forty something eightfolded.
Speaker 5 (28:20):
As we go in and we vote, I think we're
at I don't know if we're at two twelve or
two thirteen.
Speaker 4 (28:25):
I don't know our numbers. Our numbers are all jacked
up because people keep dying and I don't know.
Speaker 5 (28:29):
But anyway, we've got over two hundred Democrats in the House,
and you know, I think it's a matter of you
when you ultimately look at how many no's we have
between the House and the Senate. I just want the
American people not to hold what those eight Senate Dems
(28:50):
did against all of us. I think that it gives
us pause to make sure that we don't just vote
for Democrats, but we take our time and we figure
out who is the right Democrat for this moment, and
that's what we need to do. I don't think we
throw in the towel because of those eight because listen.
Speaker 4 (29:10):
I'm still sitting here now. My one vote is not
half as powerful.
Speaker 5 (29:15):
As any one of their votes, because my body is
four hundred and thirty five.
Speaker 4 (29:19):
But I am fighting, and I can promise you there
are many.
Speaker 5 (29:24):
Other people that are ready and willing to get into
this fight and fight just as vigorously as I fight.
Speaker 4 (29:32):
If not harder.
Speaker 5 (29:33):
So my thing is, don't give up, but make sure
you do your research, don't mut us all together. Make
sure you're not only getting a Democrat, but you're getting
the right Democrat that part.
Speaker 1 (29:44):
And then today I can't pass over it. Clearly, kind
of news came out about the.
Speaker 2 (29:51):
Dog that has embarked, So some emails.
Speaker 1 (29:59):
Have been, yeah, coming out and I'm curious what you're
I mean, it's like, of course we're not surprised by it,
but what are your thoughts on this?
Speaker 5 (30:09):
Yeah, So, first of all, kudos to the Epstein Estate
and no kudos for the FBI director Patel, and no
kudos for the director of the DOJ Pambondi.
Speaker 4 (30:24):
No kudos. They get nothing from us.
Speaker 5 (30:26):
Yeah, they've had subpoenas for months and somehow nothing, whereas
the Epstein estate obviously understands what a subpoena is and
has decided that they're not trying to play around with
it now. Whether or not there's still so much more
to give us, who knows, but at least they are
turning over documents to the oversight Committee. Was in receipt
(30:48):
of approximately twenty thousand documents that we've now released. That's
from the Epstein estate. I just want to clarify that
this ain't coming from the people who we actually oversee
at the DJ and so there are many more communications.
These communications obviously pre date Epstein's death because he died
(31:10):
in twenty nineteen. Obviously can't be sent emails from the
other side. So these are our contemporaneous thoughts. And the
reason that I bring that up is because I want
people to understand, because you know, he about it is
a hoax, This is Latin, This was a real time.
Speaker 4 (31:26):
Yes, yes, this is not created out of thin air.
Speaker 5 (31:30):
This was at the time, right, So there were communications
about the investigations as relates to Trump, and basically Gallain,
Maxwell and Epstein are going back and forth and basically
the portion that you reference was that they were like,
no law enforcement has mentioned that Trump has said anything
(31:54):
about him, which in THINGU waits he knows something because
an email that says that Jasmine ain't saying nothing, I
mean nothing, I mean because I don't know anything to say,
there would never be an email that says that, right, yeah,
So and and it was it was in context of criminality,
So you got that one that you're referencing.
Speaker 4 (32:15):
Then you have.
Speaker 5 (32:18):
And and and there was mention of a victim being
at a home with Trump or whatever on that particular occasion.
And then there was this email. So you know, if
you've been really following like intently, then you know that
there's been a lawsuit against a gentleman an author who
(32:40):
has had been in communication with Epstein. So there's emails
between them and they are talking about basically the CNN
may ask about Trump's relationship with Epstein at one of
the forums. So this before he's elected the first time,
(33:02):
and basically it was like, you know, Epstein trying to
strategize on how to deal with this because he's like,
if Trump wins, then this is great because he'll owe
us a debt. Now, why would Trump owe a debt
if he wins? He didn't do anything wrong, right, So
(33:23):
that's what these emails were revealing in real time. These
were the thoughts that Epstein was having without any influence
of Trump and talking about say, oh, I'll let you
out of jail for free, as he's doing with Gleigh Maxwell,
Like we don't need like unfiltered raw communications in the time.
(33:45):
We know that these are the things that Trump doesn't
want out. And the final point I'll make on this
whole nonsense is that you know, we knew that the
Speaker shut the house down so that he would not
have to move forward on the release, the full release,
because now we're talking about what the doj ain't done.
Speaker 4 (34:06):
Okay.
Speaker 5 (34:07):
In addition to Treasury, like we need to get at
Treasury with these bank documents about all the money that
was going and where it was going and all this stuff.
So there's a lot of other places that we can
dig for information as well and potentially conduct a more
thorough investigation than what was conducted by the DJ at
that time, but the Speaker kept us out so that
(34:31):
we wouldn't take the vote. There's only four Republicans to
sign onto the discharge petition, and it's our understanding through
reporting that he's been leaning hard on those four Republicans
to come off the discharged petition to keep us under
the two hundred and eighteen.
Speaker 4 (34:48):
We're about to go in and repelect. Grhava will become Rep.
Speaker 5 (34:54):
Grahava in a minute, and she's going to sign the
discharge petition and if the name doesn't come off before
she signs it, that is enough. That is enough, and
we move forward. So we'll see if he's been effective today.
Speaker 3 (35:08):
Wow, well, I know we don't.
Speaker 1 (35:10):
We don't have much time on our hands right now
before you go into this, but I have to I
have to ask what are you doing to take care
of yourself? Like, what are you doing right now? I mean,
I know that your whole life is dedicated to this,
and I just what are you doing to take care
of Jasmine?
Speaker 3 (35:28):
Right now?
Speaker 5 (35:29):
I'm not doing very well, but I will tell you
that that's another reason that I won't be doing this
for forever. Yeah, at the pace that I run it's
just not healthy yet, and I think it is with
this moment requires but it's not sustainable to do this
for years and years and years.
Speaker 1 (35:50):
You know.
Speaker 5 (35:50):
I wish I had known that we were going to
be on vacation for a number of weeks almost an yeah,
because maybe I would have taken a vacation instead. I
was constantly back and forth thinking, we're about to go
back in and you know, really working and obviously working
on stuff for the elections, but I am hoping and planning,
like I'm trying to be more intentional about taking some.
Speaker 4 (36:12):
Time just to be with friends.
Speaker 5 (36:14):
Honestly, that's usually my biggest refuge is being around the
people that I know love me regardless of the headlines,
and have my back regardless of the headlines, and.
Speaker 4 (36:24):
Really do the things that you do. Ask the question, yeah,
you want to take care of yourself.
Speaker 1 (36:30):
Well, we're so grateful for you, and thank you for
rolling your sleeves up and doing the right thing for.
Speaker 3 (36:36):
All of us, and good luck today.
Speaker 1 (36:39):
You know we're always with you, and I know you're
going to always do the right thing, and that's what
separates you from a lot of other people. So you're
my favorite. Thanks for taking the time today.
Speaker 5 (36:50):
Yes, thank you, and I'll see you in persons and
dinner soon.
Speaker 1 (36:56):
Please, I need to feed your soul with my energy
to I'll be there. I can't wait. Have the best day.
I'm always thinking about you, you know that. And we'll
see you soon, all right. Thanks, Thanks Jasmine. Congress Woman
Jasmine Crockett, thank you for showing up with such honesty
(37:16):
and strength.
Speaker 3 (37:17):
What I love most about this conversation is.
Speaker 1 (37:20):
How real you are about the fight, not just in politics,
but staying true to who you are in the middle
of it. You remind us that having a backbone doesn't
mean losing compassion, and that leadership, grounded and purposed still exists.
To everyone listening, keep paying attention, keep speaking up, and
(37:41):
keep supporting the people who are doing the work with
integrity and courage. I am Ashland Harris and this is
Wide Open, where we meet people who move the world
forward just by being themselves.
Speaker 3 (37:53):
Thanks for listening. I'll see you next week.
Speaker 1 (37:56):
Wide Open with Ashland Harris is an iHeart women's sports product.
Speaker 3 (38:00):
You can find us on.
Speaker 1 (38:01):
The iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Our producers are Carmen Borca, Correo, Emily Maronoff and Lucy Jones.
Production assistants from Malia Aguidello. Our executive producers are Jesse Katz,
Jenny Kaplan and Emily Rudder. Our editors are Jenny Kaplan
(38:23):
and Emily Rudder and I'm Your Host Ashlyn Harris
Hi, everyone, and welcome back to another episode of Wide
Open with Ashlyn Harris. So, my son, it, you know,
is obsessed with dinosaurs.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
So here we are.
Speaker 1 (00:11):
We're in his room and I'm like, it's so cute
and i love being a mom, so I'm not going
to hide it or take it down. We're just here
and we're I'm gonna take you on a safari during Christmas.
So this weekend, I'm really excited. Uh, Sophia has the
has been given the opportunity to uh sit down with
(00:31):
Kamala to do one of her book tours in Toronto.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
So I'm really excited.
Speaker 1 (00:38):
I know Sophia is super excited, and yeah, we're both
going to go to Toronto this weekend and get some
get some time with her and Doug and the family,
and yeah, just re energize because it's been one hell
of a year, especially the current landscape of policy. So
(01:00):
it'll be really nice to be around familiar faces. To
say the least. Sophia is very close with Kamala, and
Sophia has been campaigning and you know, being such a
servant to you know, America and politics for a very
long time, and that's like her passion is democracy and justice,
and I love supporting her and how how happy and
(01:23):
excited she gets to kind of serve her country and
in a different way than I served my country being
a professional soccer player for the US team. So Saturday night,
a bunch of us leslies, all my cute little gay girlfriends,
we had a date night and we went to Hannah
Berner's comedy show and it was so much fun. I
(01:49):
laughed my ass off. Ali opened for Hannah and her
whole like set was about lesbians, and I was fucking
cackling so hard.
Speaker 2 (02:00):
At one point she could hear.
Speaker 1 (02:03):
Me, and I was like up in a box and
she was just like making everyone gag, just gag over
her content.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
So we had a really good time, and then.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
A few of us drove upstate to have a little
gay little weekend. Especially with the ruling of the Supreme Court,
it was such a good time to just celebrate with
my queer little friends. And we watched the holiday and
we made fires and ate good food and set up
(02:34):
all the Christmas decorations. So we have I think we
have in total five or six Christmas trees. It's absolutely obnoxious.
So yeah, we set up three Christmas trees upstate and
then brought back two Christmas trees here in New York
in the city.
Speaker 2 (02:54):
So we're just gonna have a big old It's just
it's fun. We have two kids. You have to go
hard in the paint. So that's what we commit to doing.
Speaker 1 (03:04):
Oh I am absolutely a fake tree kind of bitch,
Like I don't have like my version this is yes,
I am so not high maintenance. And my version of
a Christmas tree is literally get the pre lit one,
get the one that changes like.
Speaker 2 (03:22):
Colorful, up warm, white, up this, up that, and then
I don't have to decorate it.
Speaker 1 (03:29):
I literally pop that thing up, plug it in, and
I fluff it and keep it pushing. And it drives
Sophia crazy. She's like, absolutely not. She's vientage shopping on
Etsy and god knows what else. eBay, all these all
these ornaments that are like beautiful and heavy and m
(03:50):
and I'm like, good, enjoy this for two point three seconds,
because as soon as Ocean sees that, he's gonna grab
it and check it across the fucking bedroom and the
room and everything else and roll it down the stairs.
Like it's so funny because I know exactly how my
toddlers operate, so everything is like shatter proof. We don't
(04:11):
paper cardboard ornaments like we keep it simple and basic.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
And she's like, I want my vintage glass this and that,
and I'm like, it's all gonna break. Give it one week,
one day, it's gonna break.
Speaker 1 (04:33):
Hi, everyone, welcome back to Wide Open. I'm your host,
Ashlyn Harrison. Today I'm sitting down with someone who's redefining
what it means to lead both with backbone and with heart.
Congresswoman Jasmine Crockett is here. She's a civil rights attorney
turned political powerhouse, known for speaking truth to power and
(04:54):
standing her ground with grace, humor, and more importantly fire.
What I of most about Jasmine is that her voice
comes from a real place, a place built on faith, family,
and lived experience. In this conversation, we talk about her
father's presence as a pastor has shaped her ability to
command a room, how her law degree prepared her to
(05:17):
fight for justice, and what it really takes to stay
grounded while pushing for change. We also dive into the
state of gay rights in this country, including the huge
Supreme Court win this week keeping gay marriage legal, and
of course, the weekly question does the Democratic Party have
(05:37):
a backbone. Jasmine is sharp, funny, honest, and full of
the kind of conviction this country needs.
Speaker 2 (05:44):
Right now, let's get into it.
Speaker 1 (05:46):
Congresswoman Jasmine Crocket, the oneted only, Oh my gosh.
Speaker 3 (05:52):
One of my favorite humans.
Speaker 1 (05:54):
Thank you for taking the time, because holy shit, everything's
on fire. I can't imagine, I mean, what you're doing
all around the clock at this point.
Speaker 4 (06:04):
Yeah, first of all, it's great to see you.
Speaker 5 (06:07):
I wish I was saying you in person, I know,
but I am definitely in DC ready to do my
black job.
Speaker 6 (06:15):
Yes you are, honey, And yeah, you know, I just
want to say to all your listeners that I'm sorry,
like I'm sorry that government is failing everyone.
Speaker 4 (06:27):
No matter like.
Speaker 5 (06:27):
How you affiliate yourself, there's no way to believe that
this is how government is supposed to function. And it
is my sincere hope regardless of kind of what policies
and who's getting to put what bills on the floor,
I just hope that we can get to the point
that we can actually do the very basics that government
(06:48):
is supposed to do, which is to keep the lights on, right, Like,
I just hope that we can at a very minimum
get back to basics.
Speaker 1 (06:55):
But what I love so much about you, Jasmine, is
the way you care yourself like you're so real. Like you,
there's no question why everyone says or hopes that you
are our.
Speaker 2 (07:07):
Future because you're just You're.
Speaker 1 (07:12):
The way you show up for us and the way
you serve us is something like I've never seen in
our party, which even more now than ever, where everyone's
questioning if we if we even fucking have a backbone,
like you've been that backbone for us, and you know,
as much as the last however many I'm not even
(07:32):
saying week, So I'm gonna say the last year has
been a fucking shit show. It's been a win for
us this week with the Supreme Court because a lot
of people tuning in at least my viewership or either
allies of the gay community or a part of the
gay community. And you know, we'll take the wins when
we could take the wins at this point for our community.
Speaker 2 (07:53):
So I'm curious of what you think right now.
Speaker 1 (07:56):
It you know, what was that a big you know,
can we breathe a little bit?
Speaker 4 (08:02):
Or is it just I think it was monumental?
Speaker 5 (08:05):
Okay, I had just done the black tie dinner in Dallas,
and as I was there, I was talking about here
it is that we are on the edge of our
seats wondering whether or not marriage equality will be a
thing right, And I'm like, why is it that we
(08:26):
have spent so much time going back, right, like, instead
of going forward.
Speaker 4 (08:30):
This is what we're doing.
Speaker 5 (08:32):
And the reality is that whether you know, people that
are members of the LGBTQIA community get married or not
has nothing to do with whether or not they have
food on the table. It has nothing to do with
whether or not they are able to build generational wealth.
It has nothing to do with the fact that we
are missing over a million jobs that have been lost
(08:54):
in less than a year since this man is worn
in the number of availability of jobs for the first
time in a very long time is less than what
we have as it relates to able bodied workers that
are looking for work. And so you know, like, none
of this has anything to do with anything. And I
hate that the entirety of the community has been escapegoat
(09:17):
to distract from real issues, the real governing things that
we should be focused on governing somebody's bedroom or their love.
Speaker 4 (09:29):
It's not really like I mean, it's not my priority.
It's not my business.
Speaker 6 (09:35):
It's not my.
Speaker 4 (09:35):
Priority unless it is to open up freedom. And you know,
I think that when.
Speaker 5 (09:42):
You talk about what it is to be a patriot
or an American, at the core of everything is our freedom.
Speaker 4 (09:47):
That is what separates us.
Speaker 5 (09:49):
From every other non democratic kind of nation. And so
the idea that we are now kind of wavering on
what freedom looks like, who gets freedom and that kind
of stuff, that is when we honestly should have all
band together. You know, I talk all the time about
like as say it this very callous way, but I'm
(10:11):
not being callous where I'm like, I don't really care
what you think about reproductive freedom. I don't really care
what you think about the LGBTQUIA community and the freedom's
they deserve. Like, if you consider yourself an American, if
you consider yourself to be a patriot, then the most
patriotic thing that you can do, it has nothing to
do with whether or not you agree, has to do
(10:33):
with the fact that you respect it. Right, you say, listen,
we believe in freedom. I ain't gotta like it. I
can tell you my religiousy is these I say, whatever
your thing is, right, it's not about whether or not
you approve like it, love it, or even hate it.
It's about whether or not you believe in freedom. And
so I would tell people all the time because people
(10:54):
get it real confused because I've got a district that
is heavily African American, but I live in what we
call the neighborhood in Dubtless, so I represent the Oakland
area right as well as this kind of So they're like,
wellw you deal with black preachers, And I'm like, very easily, right,
It's not about you know, what you believe, It's not
(11:17):
about any of that. It's about the fact that I
am a civil rights lawyer. I believe in the civil
rights and liberties of all people. And if I ever
get to the point that I'm like, well, I'll only
fight for the civil rights of this group and not that,
then I'm failing myself. And the best example that I
can give you of how seriously I take the work
that I've done as an attorney is even as a
(11:39):
black woman, I have represented.
Speaker 4 (11:43):
I had a defendant. There was a member of the
Rian Brotherhood.
Speaker 5 (11:47):
And when you get a quarter pointed attorney, you don't
get to say, hey, I'm racist. I can't take the
black one like you get what you get right now.
Granted I could have got off of it right and said, hey,
I feel like I can't do this, but I believe
in the Constitution.
Speaker 4 (12:04):
I believe that everyone is entitled to their due process.
Speaker 2 (12:07):
I believe that.
Speaker 5 (12:08):
If the justice system works the way that it is
supposed to work, then somebody that needs to be held
accountable will and somebody who's not supposed to be held
accountable hopefully they won't write. But I did not not
defend him to the best of my ability, to the
extent that it was one of those times that I
felt like I could show him better than I could
(12:29):
tell him, because the idea of hating somebody with my
amount of melanin just because and then ultimately kind of
the universe turning everything on its head and you're now
being represented by one of these people that you hate.
You know, it's one thing to say you're a Christian,
it's another thing to actually show it in your works.
(12:52):
I think one of the best things that I could
do to show that I believe in the Constitution, to
show that I believe in the work that I was
doing as an attorney answers show that I really am
a I am a Christian is to defend somebody that
I know hates me, who doesn't even know me. And
after it was all said and done, he was not
full of hate for me. Now, he still may have
hated black people, who knows, but he was not full
(13:13):
of hate for me directly. And I think that, you know,
that was a really important lesson. When I think about
the number of people that walk around talking about they
hate certain groups and that kind of stuff, most of
them have failed to actually interact right They somehow have
used their lack of interaction to basically justify the fact
(13:36):
that they look at us as less in human. And
I think that the real cure is not going to
be sitting on social media going back and forth with
keyboard warriors or bots or whomever. I think it's going
to be getting back to real connections and getting to
know people because again, you can show them better than
you can tell them. Instead of believing that you know,
(13:58):
these are second class citizens, whether it's because of their race,
or it's because of the country they were born in,
or because they remember the LGBCQI a community. How about
you actually just interacts because you may learn that honestly,
we're all just people. We're all just and we are
all just trying to live a spool as possible.
Speaker 2 (14:19):
Stay tuned.
Speaker 1 (14:20):
I'll be back in just a moment after this brief
message from our sponsors. I have to ask, because I'm
so curious. You're You're an incredibly smart but you're incredibly
You're an EmPATH, You're just you get it. And I
wonder where this comes from because you're so in your
(14:45):
body with who you are and how you show up,
and you're you can be in a room with you
for thirty seconds and you can feel that it's electric you.
You make people want to be better. And I'm I'm curious,
where did you find this voice and this passion and
this fearlessness when you hit the floor and you're just
(15:07):
like in your element?
Speaker 2 (15:09):
Why politics?
Speaker 3 (15:11):
Like I have so many questions.
Speaker 4 (15:14):
I ask God all the time, Why politics? Lord in Mercy?
Speaker 5 (15:19):
You know, as I've said so many times, I never
had to worry about death threats when I was representing
actual killers. It was only once I decided that I
wanted to be a representative of the people as a
whole that I ended up having to deal with death threats.
And needing security and all that kind of stuff. I
literally in jail sales with actual people that had killed people,
and I was like, I'm good, like I you know,
it is what it is. But I think that you know,
(15:42):
we all interpret our experiences through whatever lens we do, right,
and so I look at everything that I've experienced as
the things that have shaped me. And you know, one
of the things that I consistently hear as I travel
the country is that you know, I was built for
such a time as this, and it is a heavy
(16:03):
burden to have to know that we're really at a
historically low place in our country, and to really a
lot of days because I am very much human, just
want to give up.
Speaker 4 (16:18):
You know, I don't have to do it.
Speaker 5 (16:19):
You know, I get harassed and people say crazy stuff
like I'm becoming a millionaire doing this. I'm like, bro,
like the same way it is because I'm also not
gonna play with these people. You're not gonna find me
doing none of this nonsense that Trump is up to.
I already know they will put me under the jail.
Also is just wrong, you know obviously, you know, for me,
it's about you know, what is your purpose? And I
(16:42):
think that I feel so confident in the fact that
this has nothing to do with me. You know, there
are people that were born into certain political families. They
knew forever that they would be in politics. They you know,
charted their every move, what they majored in, and you
know whether or not they went to law school, whose
(17:04):
offices they worked in.
Speaker 4 (17:05):
That wasn't me.
Speaker 5 (17:06):
I never worked on the hill, I never interned on
the Hill. I never thought about the Hill whatsoever. You know,
from a state level or federal level, like, this wasn't
It wasn't anything that I aspired to. There were so
many people, because my predecessor had been in the seat
for thirty years, that had been tracking her down, trying
to get the nod like, trying to figure out what
(17:27):
is it going to take. That wasn't me, Like I like,
it was none of that. And so I have no
reason to be fearful because I am so confident that
this wasn't my plan. It was God's plan all my life.
And I think that's the only way to explain.
Speaker 6 (17:44):
You know.
Speaker 5 (17:44):
I was talking to one of my friends the other
night and I was like, you know, sometimes I just
sit back and I think about all that I've done,
and I literally have not been in Congress for a
total of three years, like crazy, not at three years yet, right,
And I was explaining that as I was on my
flight coming back to DC. I was like, yeah, there's
(18:05):
some old Republican that was on my plane. I was like,
I have no idea who it is. And it's someone
in my delegation, right, I'm like, no clue, no idea
who he was, whatsoever. But the guy that was sitting
next to me on the plane was like obviously very
into him.
Speaker 4 (18:21):
So I was like, huh, that's gonna be interesting, right,
you know, because to.
Speaker 5 (18:25):
Me, but you know whatever, and so but I thought
about that, and I was like, he's probably been in
Congress for a very long time, and I, as a
sitting member of Congress, have no idea who he is.
From the delegation of thirty eight people in Texas, I have.
Speaker 4 (18:39):
No idea who he is.
Speaker 5 (18:40):
And so I was like, you know, it's crazy because
some part of our bubble makes us believe that everybody
knows all the elected officials. They know all four hundred
and thirty five in the House, they know the hundred
on the Senate side.
Speaker 4 (18:54):
And I was like it's just fake and false.
Speaker 5 (18:58):
More importantly, the fact is that, like while he had
on a jacket, I didn't pay attention to his name,
Congress and all that kind of stuff. You know, it
was the flight attendants they knew exactly who I was.
It was other passengers they knew exactly who I was.
And to think about the fact that I'm able to
(19:19):
have such an impact in less than three years, which
is more than some people that have been here for
a very long time, it really only continues to reaffirm
that this has never been anything that I did, but
it's been the real purpose on my life. And so
I am very confident that if for some reason my
(19:41):
district said, hey, you know what, we don't like the
right way that you represent. We think we want somebody else,
I'm cool with that because I've in democracy. I believe
that people should have the voices that they feel like
are reflective of their will. And I'm completely confident that
I will have life after Congress, Like I am like planning, plotting,
(20:03):
and like excited about life after Congress because definitely the
more I do this, the more anonymous I actually.
Speaker 4 (20:12):
Want to be.
Speaker 3 (20:14):
I can imagine and went into private life.
Speaker 4 (20:16):
I get a little bit of a reprieve.
Speaker 1 (20:19):
I have to ask this question as an athlete because
when you are on the floor, it's something I've never experienced,
And like, you make politics enjoyable now for people like me.
Speaker 3 (20:33):
I say that genuinely, Like you know, I fuck with.
Speaker 1 (20:37):
You like hard and I got your back, and like
what a privilege it is to call you a friend.
And the way you show up for your people and
the people you don't even know or may not identify
with or but you support, you respect, you hear people,
you see people, and it is an absolute gift. And
I'm lucky to be a part of that small group
(21:00):
in your circle. But I have to fucking know as
an athlete, like preparation is key and everything I've ever
done representing my country, playing my role, showing up the
way I show up. How do you prepare when you
go to battle, babe?
Speaker 2 (21:16):
Like what are you doing? What are you listening to?
Speaker 1 (21:19):
Because it is like you're taking us to church in
a way I've never been. I mean, it is it
is something out of this world. I love it.
Speaker 4 (21:30):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (21:30):
Now, I think that that's such a great question, because
you know, when you talk about representing our country. You
didn't just get to wake up one day and start
kind of training, right. You have been training your whole life,
and then your training kind of hits a new level
when it's time to like, okay, we got to represent
(21:52):
the United States. I look at my life in a
very similar way. I think the skills that I was
able to use and fine tune in the courtroom really
helped me, especially as a public defender.
Speaker 4 (22:06):
As a public defender.
Speaker 5 (22:08):
It's always you know, David and Goliath, right, Like, you know,
the state has everything, and you are limited on your resources,
but you've got to make sure that you can put
put on a vigorous defense of really the underdog, right.
And I look at so many people that are in
(22:28):
the working class that are struggling right now as the underdogs,
especially right now because it seems like this administration is
picking winners and losers, and they want everyone who is
not a NEPO baby, everyone who didn't somehow manage to
get their hundreds of millions of dollars in the bank
before they made it into the White House. They basically
(22:51):
are beating up on us, right. So I look at
it like, Okay, I've been a criminal defense attorney. I've
been a public defender. I've been the underdog, and I've
had to make a way out of no way, and
I've had to come up with the creative arguments. And
people don't understand the skill set that you need as
a defense attorney is a lot different than as a prosecutor.
As a prosecutor, you got all the information for the
(23:14):
most part right. Obviously, a witness can always go left,
but you've got so much information. As a defense attorney,
you're kind of sitting there like you don't know what
that witness may say, and you've got to stay ready.
So you have to study that witness. You can't just
look at what they've given you. You got to look
beyond that. So we do deep dives into their social media.
(23:34):
Sometimes you put a PI on them. You get people
that are around them and find out kind of you
try to get into their heads to understand who they are.
So when I'm preparing for committee, I don't just look
at what the committee memo says.
Speaker 4 (23:48):
I have my team do.
Speaker 5 (23:49):
Some deeper diving outside of what's giving to me. And
then as I'm listening, which I am thankful that I'm
so low in seniority that I don't go first.
Speaker 4 (24:00):
I start to see the theme of like what it
is that they're trying to argue.
Speaker 5 (24:05):
And because I have always had to be able to
think on my feet, I'm able to adjust in real time.
And luckily my team is able to adjust in real
time too, and print things out and that kind of stuff. So,
you know, one of my more viral moments was when
they were going after President Joe Biden and they were like, oh,
he's corrupt, the Biden crime.
Speaker 4 (24:27):
Family, blah blah blah.
Speaker 5 (24:29):
And so I decided, based on some things that I
heard to talk about the documents at Mary A Lago,
And if people will remember, I held up this sheet
of paper and I talked about our national.
Speaker 4 (24:42):
Secrets and the shitter.
Speaker 6 (24:45):
And so.
Speaker 5 (24:45):
But it was a sheet of paper, and it was
a sheet of paper because I had just told myself,
I'm like, hey, go print this, do this, you know,
like I had remembered that I had seen the images
that kind of stuff. So I was texting it in
real time, and it was more so in response to
things that they were trying to say about Joe Biden
in that moment, whereas I would have had it printed
(25:08):
out on a big poster board.
Speaker 4 (25:10):
It was part of it.
Speaker 5 (25:11):
So you know, some of my most viral moments I
think have been viral because they have been authentic in
the moment and meeting the moment versus super prepared. I
don't know that I've ever really gone viral for my actual, specific,
prepared remarks. It's always been just the total preparation, including
(25:34):
me being a trial lawyer. That has led me to
be able to pivot really fast and really hanging them
up on some stuff.
Speaker 3 (25:42):
I love it. I love it.
Speaker 1 (25:46):
This is wide open and I'm your host, Ashlyn Harris.
Speaker 3 (25:49):
Thanks for listening.
Speaker 2 (25:50):
We'll be right back.
Speaker 3 (25:55):
I have to say, today's a big day for you.
I know you have very little times.
Speaker 1 (26:00):
I have to ask these eight dems who caved, who
sold sold out, and now you know, like I said earlier,
it feels like the backbone of our party is just
like what are we doing after all of this?
Speaker 3 (26:17):
So what is your thoughts?
Speaker 1 (26:18):
I mean, I know what you said, you know on
your social media, but I'm curious now walking into this dance,
like what is what does it feel like? You know,
these are supposed to be our people showing up for us,
representing us and doing the right thing. And it's been
a hard few weeks for a lot of people in
this country, and we just fucking throw the towel in
(26:40):
now now, yeah.
Speaker 4 (26:43):
I agree. My deal is Listen, if you were going cave, you.
Speaker 5 (26:46):
Should have just went ahead, caved early on and save
everybody all the drama. But to build a movement and
to get people to understand are why, I mean that
was huge because everybody talks about how Democrats are terrible messengers.
But it's like we laid out our why, but then
you folded and you didn't get the why, so were
(27:08):
you lying? Like this gets me to those voters that
look at the parties and say that they're the same.
For the longest, I could not really understand what people meant,
because you know, I don't think you'll ever find a
Democratic president that's saying, oh, I've got money to feed
people on snap and I won't, Like, I just don't.
Speaker 4 (27:27):
I don't think you'll ever find that.
Speaker 5 (27:29):
But to the extent that they can't be trusted with
their word, I get that, and I think that any
rage or disappointment that anybody feels, I think it's absolutely warranted.
I will tell you that it sucks when you're part
of like a team, right, Like you talk about representing
the United States, Like yeah, you know if you are
(27:51):
on a team, or even for those of you they've
never had to be in a team type setting, but
like you're working on a group project and it's like, well, damn.
Speaker 4 (28:00):
We over here, like we are dragging the whole light team.
Speaker 5 (28:03):
Like that's tough. Yeah, I do want people. I'm not
asking anybody to give a pass to the eight dem senators.
I am asking you to look at the numbers as
a whole. We have forty odd Democratic Senators and of those.
Speaker 4 (28:18):
Forty something eightfolded.
Speaker 5 (28:20):
As we go in and we vote, I think we're
at I don't know if we're at two twelve or
two thirteen.
Speaker 4 (28:25):
I don't know our numbers. Our numbers are all jacked
up because people keep dying and I don't know.
Speaker 5 (28:29):
But anyway, we've got over two hundred Democrats in the House,
and you know, I think it's a matter of you
when you ultimately look at how many no's we have
between the House and the Senate. I just want the
American people not to hold what those eight Senate Dems
(28:50):
did against all of us. I think that it gives
us pause to make sure that we don't just vote
for Democrats, but we take our time and we figure
out who is the right Democrat for this moment, and
that's what we need to do. I don't think we
throw in the towel because of those eight because listen.
Speaker 4 (29:10):
I'm still sitting here now. My one vote is not
half as powerful.
Speaker 5 (29:15):
As any one of their votes, because my body is
four hundred and thirty five.
Speaker 4 (29:19):
But I am fighting, and I can promise you there
are many.
Speaker 5 (29:24):
Other people that are ready and willing to get into
this fight and fight just as vigorously as I fight.
Speaker 4 (29:32):
If not harder.
Speaker 5 (29:33):
So my thing is, don't give up, but make sure
you do your research, don't mut us all together. Make
sure you're not only getting a Democrat, but you're getting
the right Democrat that part.
Speaker 1 (29:44):
And then today I can't pass over it. Clearly, kind
of news came out about the.
Speaker 2 (29:51):
Dog that has embarked, So some emails.
Speaker 1 (29:59):
Have been, yeah, coming out and I'm curious what you're
I mean, it's like, of course we're not surprised by it,
but what are your thoughts on this?
Speaker 5 (30:09):
Yeah, So, first of all, kudos to the Epstein Estate
and no kudos for the FBI director Patel, and no
kudos for the director of the DOJ Pambondi.
Speaker 4 (30:24):
No kudos. They get nothing from us.
Speaker 5 (30:26):
Yeah, they've had subpoenas for months and somehow nothing, whereas
the Epstein estate obviously understands what a subpoena is and
has decided that they're not trying to play around with
it now. Whether or not there's still so much more
to give us, who knows, but at least they are
turning over documents to the oversight Committee. Was in receipt
(30:48):
of approximately twenty thousand documents that we've now released. That's
from the Epstein estate. I just want to clarify that
this ain't coming from the people who we actually oversee
at the DJ and so there are many more communications.
These communications obviously pre date Epstein's death because he died
(31:10):
in twenty nineteen. Obviously can't be sent emails from the
other side. So these are our contemporaneous thoughts. And the
reason that I bring that up is because I want
people to understand, because you know, he about it is
a hoax, This is Latin, This was a real time.
Speaker 4 (31:26):
Yes, yes, this is not created out of thin air.
Speaker 5 (31:30):
This was at the time, right, So there were communications
about the investigations as relates to Trump, and basically Gallain,
Maxwell and Epstein are going back and forth and basically
the portion that you reference was that they were like,
no law enforcement has mentioned that Trump has said anything
(31:54):
about him, which in THINGU waits he knows something because
an email that says that Jasmine ain't saying nothing, I
mean nothing, I mean because I don't know anything to say,
there would never be an email that says that, right, yeah,
So and and it was it was in context of criminality,
So you got that one that you're referencing.
Speaker 4 (32:15):
Then you have.
Speaker 5 (32:18):
And and and there was mention of a victim being
at a home with Trump or whatever on that particular occasion.
And then there was this email. So you know, if
you've been really following like intently, then you know that
there's been a lawsuit against a gentleman an author who
(32:40):
has had been in communication with Epstein. So there's emails
between them and they are talking about basically the CNN
may ask about Trump's relationship with Epstein at one of
the forums. So this before he's elected the first time,
(33:02):
and basically it was like, you know, Epstein trying to
strategize on how to deal with this because he's like,
if Trump wins, then this is great because he'll owe
us a debt. Now, why would Trump owe a debt
if he wins? He didn't do anything wrong, right, So
(33:23):
that's what these emails were revealing in real time. These
were the thoughts that Epstein was having without any influence
of Trump and talking about say, oh, I'll let you
out of jail for free, as he's doing with Gleigh Maxwell,
Like we don't need like unfiltered raw communications in the time.
(33:45):
We know that these are the things that Trump doesn't
want out. And the final point I'll make on this
whole nonsense is that you know, we knew that the
Speaker shut the house down so that he would not
have to move forward on the release, the full release,
because now we're talking about what the doj ain't done.
Speaker 4 (34:06):
Okay.
Speaker 5 (34:07):
In addition to Treasury, like we need to get at
Treasury with these bank documents about all the money that
was going and where it was going and all this stuff.
So there's a lot of other places that we can
dig for information as well and potentially conduct a more
thorough investigation than what was conducted by the DJ at
that time, but the Speaker kept us out so that
(34:31):
we wouldn't take the vote. There's only four Republicans to
sign onto the discharge petition, and it's our understanding through
reporting that he's been leaning hard on those four Republicans
to come off the discharged petition to keep us under
the two hundred and eighteen.
Speaker 4 (34:48):
We're about to go in and repelect. Grhava will become Rep.
Speaker 5 (34:54):
Grahava in a minute, and she's going to sign the
discharge petition and if the name doesn't come off before
she signs it, that is enough. That is enough, and
we move forward. So we'll see if he's been effective today.
Speaker 3 (35:08):
Wow, well, I know we don't.
Speaker 1 (35:10):
We don't have much time on our hands right now
before you go into this, but I have to I
have to ask what are you doing to take care
of yourself? Like, what are you doing right now? I mean,
I know that your whole life is dedicated to this,
and I just what are you doing to take care
of Jasmine?
Speaker 3 (35:28):
Right now?
Speaker 5 (35:29):
I'm not doing very well, but I will tell you
that that's another reason that I won't be doing this
for forever. Yeah, at the pace that I run it's
just not healthy yet, and I think it is with
this moment requires but it's not sustainable to do this
for years and years and years.
Speaker 1 (35:50):
You know.
Speaker 5 (35:50):
I wish I had known that we were going to
be on vacation for a number of weeks almost an yeah,
because maybe I would have taken a vacation instead. I
was constantly back and forth thinking, we're about to go
back in and you know, really working and obviously working
on stuff for the elections, but I am hoping and planning,
like I'm trying to be more intentional about taking some.
Speaker 4 (36:12):
Time just to be with friends.
Speaker 5 (36:14):
Honestly, that's usually my biggest refuge is being around the
people that I know love me regardless of the headlines,
and have my back regardless of the headlines, and.
Speaker 4 (36:24):
Really do the things that you do. Ask the question, yeah,
you want to take care of yourself.
Speaker 1 (36:30):
Well, we're so grateful for you, and thank you for
rolling your sleeves up and doing the right thing for.
Speaker 3 (36:36):
All of us, and good luck today.
Speaker 1 (36:39):
You know we're always with you, and I know you're
going to always do the right thing, and that's what
separates you from a lot of other people. So you're
my favorite. Thanks for taking the time today.
Speaker 5 (36:50):
Yes, thank you, and I'll see you in persons and
dinner soon.
Speaker 1 (36:56):
Please, I need to feed your soul with my energy
to I'll be there. I can't wait. Have the best day.
I'm always thinking about you, you know that. And we'll
see you soon, all right. Thanks, Thanks Jasmine. Congress Woman
Jasmine Crockett, thank you for showing up with such honesty
(37:16):
and strength.
Speaker 3 (37:17):
What I love most about this conversation is.
Speaker 1 (37:20):
How real you are about the fight, not just in politics,
but staying true to who you are in the middle
of it. You remind us that having a backbone doesn't
mean losing compassion, and that leadership, grounded and purposed still exists.
To everyone listening, keep paying attention, keep speaking up, and
(37:41):
keep supporting the people who are doing the work with
integrity and courage. I am Ashland Harris and this is
Wide Open, where we meet people who move the world
forward just by being themselves.
Speaker 3 (37:53):
Thanks for listening. I'll see you next week.
Speaker 1 (37:56):
Wide Open with Ashland Harris is an iHeart women's sports product.
Speaker 3 (38:00):
You can find us on.
Speaker 1 (38:01):
The iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Our producers are Carmen Borca, Correo, Emily Maronoff and Lucy Jones.
Production assistants from Malia Aguidello. Our executive producers are Jesse Katz,
Jenny Kaplan and Emily Rudder. Our editors are Jenny Kaplan
(38:23):
and Emily Rudder and I'm Your Host Ashlyn Harris
Host
Ashlyn Harris
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