Work in Progress: Mayci Neeley

"The Secret Lives of Mormon Wives" fan favorite Mayci Neeley gets brutally honest about love, loss, and survival —stories she lays bare in her new memoir "Told You So." Her journey from heartbreak and abuse to resilience and rebuilding takes on new dimension as she reflects on life lessons only learned in hindsight.

Brace for some fun shockers, too, as Mayci also spills the tea on "Mormon Wives" season 3 and reveals why she's not losing sleep over some of the show's wilder revelations.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hey, everyone, it's Sophia. Welcome to work in progress high
Whips Marties. Today we are joined by a guest who
has made some serious waves in reality TV, and I'm

(00:23):
just so excited to talk to her. Her life has
been wild and from an exterior that could look very
shiny and perfect to sharing experiences and an interior that
has been anything. But I really admire the way she's
chosen to be so upfront about her life. Today's guest

(00:44):
you might know is Macey Neely from Who is The
Secret Lives of Mormon Wives. The show has clearly taken
the world by storm, but in the beginning, in particular,
barely scratched the surface of Macy's personal story. She became
a mom at twenty, she lost her son's father in
a tragic car accident, she went back to college as
a single mother. She's given glimpses of these challenging things

(01:07):
that she's been through that eventually led to the show
she works on with her friends. But now she's telling
us everything in a memoir that honestly surprised me with
how both inspiring and darkly funny it is. She really
lifts the veil on what growing up in her culture
with strict standards, with athletic prowess, and then frankly blowing

(01:33):
it all up looked like. She talks about temptation and
an abusive relationship and dealing with pretty dark and dangerous things.
Her memoir is called That Told You So, and in it,
Macy captures the period from college to adulthood that really
shaped her and that made her into the woman we

(01:54):
met on Secret Lives. She did this with real brutal
honesty and great and humor, and I really appreciate that
she offers us a real heartfelt portrayal of a woman
who's finding her voice and binding her strengths by embracing
her scars instead of being ashamed of them. I actually
think that's a really universal thing for so many of us.

(02:17):
So let's dive in with Macy Neely. Obviously, you know,
when I sit down with somebody, they're always in the
middle of something, right, Like it's a promo thing, your

(02:37):
book is coming out, so when as a movie coming out, whatever,
it's all always so exciting. But I do think there's
a really interesting experience as a person who lives a
life in public in some way where people don't always
know about your life before. They don't always know about
your life in any real tote. It's always a cheese.

Speaker 2 (03:01):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (03:03):
So I'm really curious for you, especially as a mom,
I think a lot about the inner children that we
carry with us. Yes, And I wonder if you could
go back to before all of this and all of
the sort of ups and downs of life and hang
out with your younger self when you're you know, eight

(03:24):
or nine or ten years old. Do you feel like
you'd hang out with that little girl and be like,
oh my god, I see how she's me.

Speaker 2 (03:32):
Yeah, honestly I think I would. I feel the one
thing I feel like is a little different is like
I was a really like sensitive, like shy child. So
then part of me is like, oh, that's weird that
like I do what I do now and like the
public eye and stuff. But I will say she's still
there though, because like I still get nervous, like I
do suf on camera or whatever, and I still sometimes
but it's like, oh, like ooh, Like you get like

(03:54):
a little nervous in the beginning sometimes like not filming
for like our show, but like if it's like an
interview or something. Every once in a while, but it's like, oh,
look at the camera and say like this, and I'm like, oh,
like oh, like I get like a little nervous still,
and so I think that's where like the ener mey
comes out. But like I think, yeah, I would definitely
still recognize that child because I think deep down I

(04:15):
do have like a very soft sensitive side, and like
I just don't show it like a ton like I
think it comes out, you know when you see it
in the book and stuff, but like I sometimes mask
it because I sometimes like I used to think that
being softer sensitive was like a weakness, but it's really not.
It's like a strength, because it's like a strength for
good kind of thing, you know. So yeah, I don't know.

Speaker 1 (04:38):
Oh, I totally agree. And I think I think that's
a byproduct certainly of being not just living a life
in public, but feeling like you're always kind of on
the chopping block of public scrutiny. It does teach you
to withdraw a little bit. And I think though it's
it's good to talk about a because you're sensitivity really

(05:01):
is I think a superpower. And be I also have
to say that never goes away. The nervousness. People will say,
you know, I've been doing this for twenty years and
I'll be at something getting ready to present, you know,
an a word to someone or give a talk, and you know,
I always have that moment where I'm like, oh my god,
am I gonna have Oh my anxiety is kicking in.

(05:21):
I feel like I have to do, I have to
be do I have time to be like a panic,
and people backstage at things will go you get nervous,
and I'm like, yeah, I am nervous for every event.
I am nervous every time I have to do a
red carpet, every time I have to do an interview,
Like that doesn't go away.

Speaker 2 (05:37):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (05:38):
So I offer that only to say.

Speaker 2 (05:40):
I guess that's good to know, because I was like, yeah,
I mean like it's like you get used to things,
but you still get nervous. And I'll say this is
the It's like the dumbest example. But I was at
this like lunch for like women business owners, and they
were going around and say like what's your name, and
like what do you do? Like what's your business and
like why is Like as I was getting close to me,
I'm like, oh my gosh, Like what am I gonna say,
like I my nerves even in this small setting, I'm like,

(06:01):
why am I anxious? Like and this just cozy, small setting,
like I don't know, Like so I feel like it's
still yeah, like definitely hits me even in the small situations.
It for sure does.

Speaker 1 (06:11):
Yeah, I don't think that goes away, but I do
think if you can kind of zoom out a little
bit and say to yourself, oh, I'm just going to
carry this feeling. Yeah, it's just a thing you're carrying
instead of your whole experience, that would be my own. Yeah,
advice not to sound like I'm your mom, but you know.

Speaker 2 (06:27):
No, But I love that because I feel like it's
like we're still just like navigating everything. Like we did
our first show in Vegas like mom talk stuff and
like all of us like we like we're nervous, but
like at least we got to do it like all together.

Speaker 1 (06:39):
Wait, what was the show we did?

Speaker 2 (06:41):
Like it was so random. It was like a Vegas
kind of like variety show where we went out there.
We did like we read like confessions because I have
a page called Dinner Sunday where I like people will
write in anonymous confessions and like we'll read them. They're
usually pretty like juicy or like sometimes people just like
want advice.

Speaker 1 (06:56):
I can't believe I didn't know you did a show
in Vegas.

Speaker 2 (06:59):
Yes, like one show. We'll probably do another one. I
don't know exactly when, but like we were supposed to
do I think at least two or threes. We did one.
And yeah, it was kind of like a variety show.
We got the Chippendals there, for sure. It was fun.
It's like a mixture of like everything, like I guess
I can time and think of like the Ellen Show whatever,
like something similar to that where it's kind of like
just random. I guess, yeah, like a mixture, like we

(07:21):
played games with people and like we brought people on
stage and stuff, and then we had to contest and stuff.
It was really fun.

Speaker 1 (07:27):
Actually, that good time so great. Oll wait wait wait, wait,
wait before we get too far, because I'm like, wait,
we're already back in the present. I have young life questions.
So when we think about that. You know, sweet sensitive
little girl, I know you were a tennis player. You
got a tennis scholarship to be right, you and obviously
that's when everything really shifted in your life. When you

(07:49):
were preparing for that and growing up in sport, Like,
as a young woman, what did you think your future
would look like? Because I would imagine you didn't think
it would be this.

Speaker 2 (08:00):
No, no, no, I thought, Okay, so in my head,
I guess my life goal like growing up was like, okay,
like I'm going to get a tennis scholarship, I'm gonna
go to BYU kind of thing. It's like the Mormon
thing to do. I'm going to meet the husband, have
the kids. But I was like if I have a career,
which I wasn't planning on doing growing up because I
was just like, you know, my mom was a stay
at home mom, so it's just kind of like one
to follow those footsteps, you know. I was like, if

(08:21):
I have a career, it's going to be like I
want to be like a pro tennis player, Like it's
what I was thinking of doing. And then you know,
when I got a little bit older, I thought it'd
be fun to do like e news or like be
like a broadcaster, like a sports broadcaster. Like it was
along the lines of those if I did have a career,
but like part of me was just like I just
want to be like a stay at home mom, you know,
which is fine, you know, but like that was what
I thought I was gonna do, and so I never

(08:42):
thought i'd be sitting here doing all I'm doing for sure,
which is super exciting, but like, yeah, no, I never
pictured myself having like a career outside of being a mom. Wow.

Speaker 1 (08:51):
Yeah, So then what was your experience, Like, you know,
you go to college, you're thinking eventually you'll be a pairent.
Maybe maybe you know you'll be an athlete, and then
life shifts, You get pregnant, you go through tragedy, Like
can you walk me through kind of from the start

(09:13):
of your freshman year to everything shifting? What was that timeline?

Speaker 2 (09:17):
Like it was all like really fast, I guess. So,
like I met my abusive boyfriend when I was a
senior in high school, so like I dated him through
like my senior year of high school and through like
like the first half of my freshman year. So it's
going through that. But I did an abusive relationship that
was like very toxic, like very I just felt like
very trapped, Like I didn't like I could get out

(09:37):
until he physically left the state. And that's when I decided, like, okay,
I can, like finally pull the plug and be done.
And at this point, if you did try to retaliate,
like and try to get me in trouble whatever, I
was like, I don't even care because I'm that miserable
that if I stand this relationship, like I don't even
want to be here kind of thing.

Speaker 1 (09:52):
Oka, it was that bad, can you what do you
mean by that? Like if he tried to get you
in trouble.

Speaker 2 (09:58):
Yeah, because the BIU honor code and since I wasn't
following it, he kept blackmailing me. So he was like, hey,
well I have pictures of you drinking and I'm going
to send it to them and they're going to kick
you out. You know. It's like I was stuck because
like of that, you know, like I tried to break
up with him so many times, and I did, and
I went back partially because of like is it like
Stockholm syndrome, I can go back to your viewser and

(10:19):
like that, but also because like I was blackmailed for
a lot of the times that I like tried to
get out, So like I felt like I was stuck
until like he physically was leaving the state and I
was like, this is my shot.

Speaker 1 (10:31):
Right almost like the shift in geography gave you the
mental and emotional space you needed. Yes, I mean, what
a crazy thing like, not to be the nerdiest person
you've ever talked to. But when you consider the fact
that our because I think about all the insane that
happened to me in my early twenties, this is the
reason I'm thinking about this. One of the things I'll

(10:53):
always say when reflecting is like, well, you know, our
frontal lobes aren't even developed till we're twenty six, right.
It's sort of my gallows humor for what I went through.
But it's also so crazy to think about. You were
a literal teenage girl and you were going through all
of this, and it's like nobody, I don't know, I

(11:18):
don't think. I think now the conversations around abusive relationships
are a little more pervasive, and especially you know how
to look out for those signs of emotional abuse narcissistic abuse.
But at least when I was twenty one, nobody was
having those conversations. And I remember the aha moment of

(11:41):
sitting down with an adult who handed me a literal
pamphlet and was like, I don't remember if it was
like twelve things or fifteen things, but let's say it
was twelve. It was like, there's twelve things on this checklist,
and I can check ten out of twelve for you,
but there were only two that this adult ye old
enough to be my parent, couldn't check off for me.

(12:02):
And I was like, wait what? And it did something
for me? Seeing it and writing did something for me.
Did you have a moment like that that coincided with
the geographic distance or was it really just he got
far enough away from you that you could see it?

Speaker 2 (12:18):
What's so bizarre about you saying that? Is like, it's
pretty much the same thing that happened to me, except
for mine. I googled it, like so I was like
I didn't even know I was being abused, like it
was so bad. But I was like, this seems like
this is like weird, like something is off, Like I
because he just kept saying like manipulating me, being like, well,
you've never been a real girlfriend before, It's like you
don't know. And so I finally googled, like what are
like signs of abuse? And like I could check off

(12:40):
like pretty much every single one this list. It was
like this long list on Google, this like website, it
was like the d D hotline whatever it was, and
I was like, oh my gosh. Again, that's when it
like really hit me, like I am like being abused,
and I fel like I already kind of you know, subconscious,
so like something's not right, you know, yeah, but like
seeing it there, I'm like, Okay, I'm not crazy, Like
this is like really happening.

Speaker 1 (12:58):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (12:59):
And it's also funny too, because you talk about the brain.
I say that all the time because my dad told
me growing up, like and I was like kind of
making those decisions. He's like, well, once your brain's developed,
like come talk and like you'll understand. Yeah, you're so dumb.
And then like once I got older, I was like wait,
like I don't know. He's so right, Like.

Speaker 1 (13:15):
You're like, is this a moment where I actually admit
to my dad that he was right? Or am I
going to regret saying that?

Speaker 2 (13:21):
And I'll take it actually, And it is so true though,
because like the decisions or like things that you think
are like a good decision or like oh it's just
fun Like back then, I'm like, oh my gosh, like
the fact that I thought this was good or this
is Okay, you know, it's just crazy what you do
when you're younger compared to now.

Speaker 1 (13:37):
Girl. Same. I'm like, we have some stories we need
to tell, not on this podcast. Oh my god. Yeah,
we'll be back in just a minute. But here's a
word from our sponsors. Okay, so you have your aha
moment looking at your computer, and then what like what

(14:01):
were your steps? How did you cut it off? Go
back home? Like what did that look like for you?
And I ask only because I mean, I obviously don't
want you to have to relive a very traumatic moment.
But I think sometimes when we talk about these things,
other people that are going through it, who maybe haven't
been handed the pamphlet or looked at the website can

(14:23):
go like, oh, that's my story, or oh maybe I
could call my parents and ask to come home, or
maybe I could tell a friend, you know, like how
did you start to make sense of it?

Speaker 2 (14:33):
Yeah? So when he left, because we were in Utah
and he was from California, just like I was, and
so he went back to California. I'm still in Utah.
I have like about almost two months left of school
before this semester ends, and so I feel like, yeah,
like the the change of him leaving was very helpful
for me because he's not physically here, so I don't
have to worry about him. But I think too, like

(14:54):
even after he left, it's like you are so manipulated
and like brainwashed that I was like, I think I
texted him such a great person. Like part of it
was because I don't want to retaliate. It was like
it was two reasons. Second, I was like I started
believing it. I was like, oh my gosh, because he's
always saying like you'll never get any better than me,
no one's gonna want you, and like all these things
and like and you believe it, right, And it's like

(15:14):
when he left, it was like a full week of
like I didn't go out with friends. I stayed in
my dorm room. I was like sad, like all the
things right. And then it's like I met my son's
father right after that, so it was like back to back,
like I met guys, and I feel like I like
was able to kind of move on from that relationship
because I met someone different, but also because it was
like I just started going out having fun, like this

(15:36):
is what life is about. Like I was so I
felt like a captive, like I feel like I was
like in prison when I was like dating him, and
once he left, like I started going out with friends,
I like, wait, like this is so fun, Like this
is what I was missing. And then shortly after I
met my son's father and so we weren't in a relationship,
but we started like dating, and I was like, this
is like, ye, what it should feel like, and she'd
feel fun, like I shouldn't have to worry about like

(15:57):
what I'm wearing, and like all the different things that
I would get.

Speaker 1 (16:01):
Yes, well, that's the crazy thing when you're in a
relationship where you're getting in trouble. I remember the shift
for me of getting out of my version of this
situation and the person I eventually started dating, like we
were going out with friends and he stopped me to
be like you look so beautiful, and I caught myself

(16:24):
kind of jump because I was I was waiting for
the butt now. He looked at me and I was like,
and he goes, what, And I said, You're not going
to like tell me to change my clothes or that
I shouldn't wear outside of the house. And he goes,
why would I ever do that? I'm so proud to
go out with you exactly. And it was this shift
of like, oh, I'm not supposed to be demeaned. I'm

(16:46):
not supposed to be demeaned for the things that attracted
you to me. Now that you have me, It's like
it's such a bait and switch. It is, And I
think it's really amazing that you could even identify that
you know obviously now but at the time and realize, oh,
I deserve to feel light in the in the presence
of someone instead of scared.

Speaker 2 (17:07):
Yes, no exactly, And I was like, wait, like I
should be having fun, Like I should shouldn't feel this
like guilt even when I was doing nothing wrong, because
like I would't feel that because I would get in
trouble for like everything, like I'd be at a tennis
practice and like my laptop was as apartment and he
would go through like all my texts from before I
met him, and then he would send me screenshots and
be like fu and I'm like, this is before I

(17:28):
even knew who you were, Like just the craziest stuff
that like I can't like when I say a lot,
I'm like, was that not so obvious? But like when
you're eighteen and you're young, you're just like and you're
so manipulated, you're you just don't even know any better. Honestly.

Speaker 1 (17:42):
It also doesn't start there.

Speaker 2 (17:43):
It's no, it doesn't.

Speaker 1 (17:44):
When I've spoken to other people about this, I think
it's important to remember the dynamic is very much like
you know, the classic cartoon snowball. It starts really small,
and as it rolls down the hill, as time passes,
it gets bigger and bigger and bigger.

Speaker 2 (18:00):
Yep.

Speaker 1 (18:00):
But you're not really tracking how big this snowball is
from here to here. You only really see how giant
it is when you compare it like where it started
to where it gets. And I think people who haven't
been through it miss that it is a slow build
and by the time you can't ignore it anymore and

(18:21):
you feel like a prisoner in your own home or
in your own body or both.

Speaker 2 (18:25):
Yep.

Speaker 1 (18:26):
You can't even fathom how it got that bad yep,
because if it started there, you'd be like, you psycho,
get away from me, exactly. You bail on this like
crazy stranger. But it doesn't start there.

Speaker 2 (18:38):
And like, that's what's so smart to talk about, because
people sometimes don't understand it unless they've been through it,
because they're like, well, like, why did you just get out?
And I'm like, yeah, if you only knew, Like they
just don't understand, like it it's so obvious on the outside
looking in, but when you're in it, you don't realize
it until it's like too late, or until like it
hits you like a ton of bricks.

Speaker 1 (18:57):
It really draws a parallel for me because you've talked
on You've talked in a few interviews about how Told
You So, which, for our friends at home is the
title of the new memoir. Yep, has actually been ten
years in the making. Yes, and I think about that.
You know, it's sort of similar like Told You So
is your snowball. Yeah, it's complete, but it's ten years

(19:19):
for you to get there.

Speaker 2 (19:21):
Yep.

Speaker 1 (19:21):
So obviously we're hinging on this big life altering moment,
but your story is so much larger than that.

Speaker 2 (19:31):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (19:31):
I would imagine a lot of people assume that this
event at nineteen is where the story starts. But where
do you feel like it really begins.

Speaker 2 (19:41):
I feel like the story begins, like I mean, I
touch on my childhood a little bit in the book,
not a ton, because like I know, people want to
hear like the juicy stuff are the interesting stuff that
like really like impacted my life, you know. But I
think like I read a little bit about the childhood.
But that's where I feel like my story starts. Because
people watch the show, right the Secret Lives more wives,
and they see us and Stead, but they have no

(20:02):
idea that like my whole life was like tennis, like
ingrained in me is like tennis, Like that is like
my upbringing. I tell people, like I never got grounded
growing up, or I didn't do anything bad. I never
s I out like nothing. It was only for tennis.
Like if I played maybe like really bad or like
had a bad attitude whatever, get grounded and stuff like that.
But like I was just like a chill kid like

(20:23):
and then tennis was just like ingrained in me. And
it's like I have a very competitive nature and it
doesn't really come out like his career wise, I don't.
I'm always against like the competitive sides, like don't compete
like me, Like when you want to celebrate people's opportunities
and like know like have an abundance mindset that like whatever,
it'll all come back to you, you know, like cheer
people on so I feel like I don't like saying

(20:43):
like like oh, we're really competitive, but yeah, but not
in my career, Like that's different.

Speaker 1 (20:47):
You know.

Speaker 2 (20:47):
Yeah, I'm like, of course I want to succeed, but
it is different from sports where you feel that there's
just like the drive like that. I love the feeling
of like sweating and like going home and getting my
bed like with sore muscles, and I actually haven't had
that feeling a long time. I'm going to kind of
miss this, like it's I'm like probably so passionate about
it right now. And I actually just put a pick
a ball court in my backyard, so I gotta get

(21:08):
out there and just release some endorphins.

Speaker 1 (21:10):
But so fun.

Speaker 2 (21:11):
I thought, that's kind of where my story starts, is
like the upbringing of just like my family's a big
tennis family, and like, yeah, that's why I went to
BYU and like a full ride tennis scholarship is because
like that's what I was working for my whole life.
And that's why going through that abusive relationship was so
impactful and like everything I went through because I felt
like I was losing everything with my tennis career. It's
just a big part of my identity, like the competitive

(21:33):
side and like the athlete indeed, I guess.

Speaker 1 (21:36):
Yeah, Well, also how regimented you can be. And you know,
not for nothing. Athletes grow up being raised to be coachable,
which I think is such a skill but also can
be a hindrance in terms of a person who wants
to control you in a negative way. Yeah, Like, I

(21:58):
think a lot about it. There's I've learned because my
partner was a professional athlete, and in the time that
we've been together, I've learned so much about that, like
perform at all costs thing that athletes have, which also
actors have when you are a performance athlete or a
performance artist, and so many people's jobs and schedules ride

(22:20):
on your ability to do what you're told when you're
trying to do it. It's a gift, but it also
can really make you lose yourself, and you really can.
You can be so good at performing that you forget
to check in with how you actually feel. And I
think there's something really interesting about that. Especially it makes

(22:42):
me especially curious for you because not only did you
grow up in the in the athletic arena of performance,
but now being on your show you know, at least
when I'm on a show, I'm playing somebody else, Like
it makes me feel so uncomfortable that when I actually
go out and have to promote my work, people want
to talk to me about my life. I'm like, can't

(23:03):
we just talk about the work? Like yeah, And like
every time I've ever talked about my life, I'm like,
do I regret this? I don't like this, you know,
like really trigger it really triggers all my anxiety. So
I'm sort of fascinated for you because I've heard that,
especially in you know, the world of reality, like people
who do it obviously love it, but that it can

(23:24):
also be hard because the way the shows are produced,
everyone kind of gets given a role. Yeah, So, how
much of yourself do you feel is properly or authentically
represented on the show? Like does the show make you
feel more like you can be yourself? Or has has

(23:44):
being on a show where you get clipped and edited
made you a little more nervous to be yourself?

Speaker 2 (23:49):
Yeah? I think it goes both ways. I think I
was more of this for the first season because I
was like, I don't know how this is edited. I
don't know what it looks like. I thought that everything
we filmed was in the show, and so I get
There's some times where I'd go home at night and
I'd be like I couldn't sleep because I'm like, what
if like it looks like this or what like I'll
get like so stressed about it. And then once I
saw how much was cut out, I was like, oh,

(24:10):
like we're chilling, Like I wasn't.

Speaker 1 (24:12):
That word anymore, but oh that's nice to know.

Speaker 2 (24:15):
So like yes and know because I feel like I'm
always myself like when I film, but like obviously so
much gets cut. Then I'm like, wait, like you cut
my humor here, like the funny things like so that's
the only thing that I sometimes get annoyed about beause
like wait, like because we get crisis in the line
and be like they're all mean girls, and it's not like, well,
it's because this fun stuff gets cut, like I can't
control that edit, you know, and it does scare me, honestly,

(24:35):
like putting my life out there, I think, so I
like got a little more cautious about like what I
share on social media now because my life is getting
like more public, right and I do action value privacy,
like I'm someone who like in Utahs like a dumb comparison,
but like these houses don't come with fences. You have
to like pay for your own fences, like it's not
part of the house. And then like no one has hedges.
It's like he's like like, hey, neighbor, and I being Californic,

(24:58):
I hate that, Like I do not want to see
my neighbors. That's me where they're great. But like I
love privacy like in my own home too, and like
and it's becoming more like that in my life now
that it's more public, and so I think it's yeah,
it's feel like a hard balance. Like for the most part,
I think that's what works for me, just being myself.
And I also my parents watch the show and they're like, well,
I's like the reason why I like people like you

(25:19):
because like you just yourself, like that's who you are,
Like it's not describe you as like how you are
on the show. Like obviously there are moments that like, yeah,
maybe are edited like a different context. There's like a
couple here and there, but like, for the most part,
I feel like it's pretty true too, like who I
am that could change my perception could change. She's in
the season. You never know what's gonna happen. But yeah,
for the most part, Yeah, yeah, I am not sure

(25:41):
about now, and the beginning I was, and now it's
a little more chill.

Speaker 1 (25:45):
I'm glad. I'm glad that it feels easier.

Speaker 2 (25:48):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (25:49):
You know, you mentioned social media, and I think that's
I think it's all really related because only a fraction
of you is going to get shown to an audience
on TV, and we show such a fraction of our
lives on social media. And let's be real, most people
are sharing the great moments, you know, they're not sharing
like the worst day or when things are insane at

(26:12):
home or you know, whatever you've talked about, you know
how social media is obviously a part of your life
with the show, But I thought it was really I
just thought it was really special that in the book
you admit that there's there's been there at least was
a time when you were concealing a lot of pain

(26:32):
and struggling with depression behind this Instagram that looked so positive.
How have you Do you think that the show has
helped you navigate showing up with a little more of
the hard stuff publicly or did you have to learn
to exercise that muscle, even to prepare to be on
the show in the first place.

Speaker 2 (26:53):
Yeah, I think it was the lather of the two.
I like, that's kind of how I built my platform
before I joined mom Talk before the show was based
off of like telling parts of my story because I
never saw it before. It was like everyone online is
so perfect and these perfect families and like the cute
house and the dogs. It's like perfect, and I just
felt like this like loser, and I was like this,

(27:14):
and I like I know that, Like I like, I
can't pick this for everyone, but I was going through it.
That's how I felt. And so once I kind of
started like, oh my, well that's a little bit halfier
and I like started talking about my life online, I
was like, no, I want to share the bad stuff
because I know that other people go through it too.
And that's kind of how I actually built my whole
platform to like join mom talk was through sharing like
my story and like the very low lows and obviously

(27:35):
like the highs and stuff. And I I feel like
I'm someone who tries not to show a polished life
because it's not real, and like, so I tried to
show that like even by accident. Like I think it
was right before I gave birth, Like my whole house
was upside down because we decided we're gonna READO all
the floor ing like a week before I gave birth.
Don't ask me why, and like so like like literally

(27:56):
and so my whole couch and everything was kind of
like a pile. But you should how like you walk.
It was that messy, and I think I took a
story of my cat like sitting in the middle of that.
But I honestly didn't even realize it was that messy
because I was just living in it. And people were like,
thank you so much for showing this, and I was like, oh,
I didn't even like realize, like that was a big two,
like the amount of DMS I got that were like
so positive, like thank you for showing this, because like

(28:17):
people don't show this, and we just feel like we're
like bad moms because our houses are perfect, and I'm like, no,
like so it almost gonna be sads. So like people
like think like.

Speaker 1 (28:26):
You're like, no, you're doing great.

Speaker 2 (28:28):
Yeah, exactly, We're all trying our best, and so I
do you try to show those authentic moments, but there
are times where the show did help I guess, like
in season two, I went to my son's father's crash
site where he died and like that, Yeah, I like
I never had been before, right, and so I didn't
want to go, but like part of me knew I
needed to at some point, like to help me feel

(28:49):
and like base my trauma to like to even write
the book. And I will say that that was a
moment where like, yeah, the show did help with that
because it's like I had that extra push of them
being be like, hey, like producers, be like this would
be so impactful for your audience to see and to
help people who are going through some more things get
through this too. And I was like, oh, like you're right,
Like that was like the hardest thing you have to do,
like especially on camera. Like and I'm someone who like

(29:12):
does not like prying on camera, Like I don't know,
Like it's hard, it's vulnerable, Like I don't know.

Speaker 1 (29:17):
It's also a really interesting thing. I mean what you
point out so often, especially because of the way things
are in our world today, social media a little it.
When you're going through something, especially as a public person,
you go through it privately until the last moment. Yeah,
and you share when you like have something to share,

(29:39):
when you have thoughts like whatever, and it's it's a
pretty wild thing to process in real time with strangers. Yeah,
but I also think you know, it can lead to
it can lead to bravery, it can lead to vulnerability

(30:01):
in a way, and it can really help people, you know,
when you tell your story. It's like I built this
sort of picture perfect life for myself and then it wasn't.
And it was really hard to have to go through
that publicly. But when I was able to reflect on
it and share about it and write about it and

(30:21):
publish a piece about it, like the number of people
who said, thank you so much for sharing this, like
I feel this, I have felt this. I have been
too scared to say. I made what I thought was
the right decision and it was the wrong one for me,
And I didn't want to go through that publicly, like
I was going through it privately in my little cocoon,

(30:42):
like walking around pretending things were fine like everybody does,
wearing the wedding ring through like all the nightmare of
what's going on behind the scenes. I was so scared
for that little cocoon to break, you know, I was
so scared for everyone to know, But weirdly when everyone knew,
it made it easier.

Speaker 2 (31:00):
Yeah, because it's almost like a weight is like lift
it up your shoulder. Is there something like knowing that
it's impacting other people and helping other people because you
don't want them to know how you did it, Like
it's yeah, it's just yeah, it's a lot. Like I
feel like it makes it makes sense because sometimes when
you go through these horrible things, you're like why, Like
I don't get like why you know? And so sometimes
when I look at the bigger picture in the purpose,

(31:22):
I'm like, well, maybe this is why this had to
happen to me, Not that it makes it okay, but
then I can help so many more people if I
had to go through this one these things, maybe this
me taking this sacrifice can help so many people to
prevent it even happening to them to begin with. I
don't know, Like I don't know, Like I just try
to make sense of it sometimes and like I think
maybe I had to go through it to help other people.

Speaker 1 (31:42):
I don't know. Yeah, we'll be back in just a
minute after a few words from our favorite sponsors. When
you reflect on that now, especially you know, just having
visits the site on the last season of the show

(32:04):
you mentioned earlier, you know, we were talking about getting
out of something abusive, how hard that is. And then
you met your son's father, you said, really soon after,
and things were just starting to get serious, and you
got pregnant, and you know, they're those sorts of things
you're not planning, but they feel like probably were pretty

(32:26):
exciting when they sat in and then this car crash happens, Like,
how did you that is so much to process, the
emotional whiplash of all of those things happening in the
same year. How did you deal with that?

Speaker 2 (32:44):
I just, honestly, I don't even know if I really
did deal with it. I just like had to survive,
Like I literally just had to wake up in the
morning because that's how like severely depressed I was, especially
being pregnant, Like it was hard to like want to
do anything, like and as I had to really like,
I'm really grateful for my parents because like my mom
was the one who's like shelcome my room. But I thought,

(33:04):
obviously thought she was like so annoying, Like I'm like young,
and she's like opening my shutters, like good morning, like
we're gonna go do that, Like she was very good
at giving me out a house and like distracting me,
yes exactly, like yeah, Grass basically, so like I feel
very grateful for my parents because I'm like I don't know,
like and then obviously like my son, like that's what
kept me going and that's how my book is dedicated
to him, is because I'm like he like saved me,

(33:27):
Like I don't know if I would be here, like
it was up for him. And then also just like
the way he changed my life, Like I went from
you know, kind of just like coasting in life like
to like I obviously now I'm a mom, Like I
had to know I had to be a provider, like
I needed to really focus, and I feel like it
helped my motivation, my drive, Like I became a better

(33:47):
person a lot more empathetic and understanding of other people's struggles,
and like he changed my life like for the better.
I can't even I don't even know who I would
be if if that didn't happen. Honestly, it's crazy.

Speaker 1 (33:59):
That's so special, yeah is it?

Speaker 2 (34:02):
Is?

Speaker 1 (34:02):
It sort of surreal to look back now because clearly
such a hard time but your son was such a gift,
and you've just had another baby and you are remarried.

Speaker 2 (34:15):
You know.

Speaker 1 (34:16):
How. I know that it's a really specific experience that
you wouldn't you wouldn't wish on another person, but it
is profoundly capable of growing your heart. Yes, to lose
someone that you love and then have to figure out

(34:38):
how to how to grieve and hold space for that
person and make space for a new person and integrate
those experiences for yourself and for your new person. So
what was it like meeting Jacob? You know what do

(34:59):
you think had really made you equipped for something that,
I mean, at least from outside, seems so lovely and healthy,
and yeah, how did you let yourself lean into this
kind of love? I think?

Speaker 2 (35:12):
And I think I said this before, but it's like,
and this is the thing that people say all the time,
but it's like you accept the love that you feel
like you deserve, right, And so I feel like for me,
he was coming around in the beginning, and I kind
of just kept pushing him off after a while because
I was like, ah, like I don't know, like he
likes me too much. Like it was like almost like
he was too much of a green flag where I
was like, he's too good and it feels weird to me,

(35:33):
like to have that kind of love, and so I
pushed him off and pushed him off until I was like,
he like is by far the best person I've dated,
Like he cares so much for me, he cares for
my child, And I think like I had to really
like learn how to love myself to accept his love too,
you know, like you have to be able to love
yourself and feel like you deserve that. So it's like
maybe I was pushing him off so much because I
didn't feel like I fully deserved it. And I also

(35:55):
feel like I I mean, I also like want to date,
like I had boyfriend after boyfriend like during that time,
and so it's like I wanted to like know for
sure what I've wanted, you know, like you kind of
to make sure. I like, I don't want to make
getting mistakes again, Like I was like, I want to
have a v one and that is the one I'm
going to be with. I don't want to like change,
and so I was also like cautious, but yeah, again,
I think I had to learn how to love myself.

(36:16):
I don't think when I met him. I was heels
by any means, you know, because I needed had some
work to do, and I talk about in the book
about was like we were engaged and I was like
kind of having mental breakdowns and like what's happening. It's
because the trum was still like hitting new years later
because I rushed her under the rug, thinking like, oh,
like it's been a couple of years, like it's gone.
I'm like, and it definitely just doesn't go away. So
like went to therapy and that definitely helped and stuff

(36:38):
and like putting me in the right direction. But like
he even now, like he's just like my rock, like
my biggest supporter. Like obviously next my parents are always
like my number one fans, but like my husband is
like he makes everything go round in this world for me,
Like I don't think I could pursue this career and
all these things without his support because it's like having

(36:59):
the kids and all the things, like the to do
list is like this long. So it's like he helps
everything work right and he's just like so supportive and
it always has been and I just I couldn't be
more grateful like that it all worked out, you know.

Speaker 1 (37:12):
Yeah, I love that I think. I think when the
right love finds you, especially when you've had all sorts
of versions of the wrong one, like yeah, it doesn't
just give you love, it really does kill you.

Speaker 2 (37:25):
In a way. Yeah, no, it does for sure. And
I think that's what happened. Was like I want to
be like I didn't lead therapy because always say did,
and I still do, but like I think we all do. Yeah,
I know, I'm like this world we live in, but
like I think when you have like someone just like
love and like I also feel like positive energy, like
I like I'm a true believer and like those who

(37:45):
you surround yourself with, it's like how you're gonna be
like you need that positive energy and like I yeah,
like I feel like again like even going through what
I went through, like you didn't have like the positive
energy you're being like it will get better, like just
hold on, you know, you know, like yeah, like you
have to stay pause or else it's like it's just
the life will just strain out of you. And I
think that's like he's always just been a happy, go

(38:05):
lucky like guy, and like that's like kind of what
I need is so nice. You need a balance, you know.

Speaker 1 (38:11):
Yeah, do you think that desire to focus on the
positive even when it's hard was a motivator to share
your IVF journey because IVF is so hard, it's the
most awful thing. And I feel like, only in the
last like two or three years does anyone even really
want to talk about it out in the world.

Speaker 2 (38:34):
Yeah, I think it, Like, I feel like people don't
want to talk about it carsion too, because it's very
vulnerable and it's like hard to be like, oh, like
I'm doing this like to have a kid, and then
you get criticism because even when I was doing it,
I get people being like, well, why don't you adopt?
And I'm like, okay, hello, I'm telling you like doing this,
and now you're saying, like, do that, and I'm like,
and I don't think people realize too, it is hard
to adopt kids. Like it's not easy, like and it's

(38:55):
very expensive, and people don't realize that. They think it's like, oh,
I can just go to the store and adopt a kid.
That's not how it works, and like people were just
kind of uneducated on all, like the whole process, right,
And so I mean, I think it's hard to share,
but I again, like I built my platform off of
sharing things that are uncomfortable and like hard because I
know they can help other people. And like, and I
think it is because when you're going through IVF, it's
lonely too, Like it really is. It's hard because it's

(39:17):
like I didn't realize how much of a mental battle
it would be. I thought it'd be a physical battle.
I was like, it's gonna be so painful, and I'm
like the pain, the physical pain, I feel like compared
to the mental pain is like very different, like the hormones, right,
Like the hormones you like you're moody, you don't feel good,
like you're nauseous, Like it's even going through my last

(39:39):
because I did the IVF process, like the first half
game the eggs and stuff a couple of years, like
two and a half years ago, and like because it
took such a mental toll on me, I was like,
I'm not transferring this embryo until I'm like mentally okay.
And that took a while. So like that's why might
have a pretty big age gap again, And because I
needed time and even doing that process, like doing the
hormones to do the transfer, like I was doing it

(40:00):
while filming, and I was like, I was having migraines
from this one medication I was on and goes like lupron.
I was for five days. I was like, my head
is killing me. I don't think I've ever had a
headache this bad in my entire life. And like and
it's just kind of like, oh whatever, like that's just.

Speaker 1 (40:15):
The process, like people to deal with it.

Speaker 2 (40:17):
Yeah, And I feel like it's like if it was
men going through it, they'd be like, oh my gosh,
let's like put you in a coma for this thing always.

Speaker 1 (40:23):
Never.

Speaker 2 (40:24):
It like makes me okay, it makes me so Yeah,
Like sometimes I love my husband, but I'm like, what
do we have men for? Like I genuinely sometimes like
don't understand. I'm like, because if we have the babies
like we do all this, I'm like, you guys don't
have to don't have periods, you don't have like nothing
like anything.

Speaker 1 (40:40):
They don't have to do anything.

Speaker 2 (40:42):
It's very I'm very salty about it.

Speaker 1 (40:44):
Actually, I think you can't have been through that process
and not be a little salty about it, especially because
the medical double standard, like they don't include us in research,
they don't care about women's pain. They don't take women's
pain seriously. And then like you know, suddenly these ding
dongs who don't even have medical degrees are telling pregnant

(41:04):
women not to take thailand all. And I'm like, guess what.
Thailand all is not dangerous, but a fever could kill
your baby. No, literally, please stop telling women to tough
it out. You could literally never.

Speaker 2 (41:16):
And it's horrible too, because then it's like they say
something like that, and then you feel guilt, like wait,
I did, yeahil all, like like I'm sorry, I took
thailand all my first prenancy almost every night and like
assume me I took talent ol PM because I couldn't sleep,
so like.

Speaker 1 (41:28):
I and by the way, that's okay and my son's fine,
so perfect. Like everybody needs to take a breath and
just like leave women, not only leave women alone, like
actually offer women a little bit of support.

Speaker 2 (41:40):
Yeah, no exactly. It's honestly so crazy to me like that. Yeah,
it just looks like where is the male birth control too?
Like please be for real right now.

Speaker 1 (41:48):
Oh, they couldn't take it because it made them gnawshit, Yeah.

Speaker 2 (41:50):
There was a study right and like it made them Yeah, sick.
I'm like, oh, I feel so bad.

Speaker 1 (41:56):
Are you kidding?

Speaker 2 (41:58):
Yeah? I mean I can talk about this all day.
I cannot handle it, Like it makes me so salty,
like even being pregnant out of like marriage, right and
like getting pregnant going home. It's like no one's looking
at the man being like oh my gosh, like oh
never bad. It's like they just get off Scott Freed
and I'm over here and you're looking at you like, oh,
like what a what a hell?

Speaker 1 (42:16):
Like she's pregnant, you know, like you're like I didn't
do this to myself exactly.

Speaker 2 (42:20):
It's like the double standard there that like kills me.
It's like the hypocrisy, like I just can't handle. I'm
also like, if anyone deserves the judgment, it's them. You're
literally making a human you should be being worshiped. It's
fully inverted. It's so exactly like we can't get ourselves
pregnant over here like hello, hello, Yeah, I love it.

Speaker 1 (42:39):
See this is why the people are like she is
America's sweetheart. I'm like, yes, I'm trying. No, it's so
good though. I think it's like such a sweet thing
to see in the you know, in the overarching feedback
of the show. Yeah, and now for our sponsors, obviously,

(43:01):
the negative feedback on social media is really hard. It's
the worst. I mean, the innergy is successful. Everyone just
wants to be mean all the time. But does the
does the really positive stuff ever make you nervous because
you're like, oh, is that gonna is that gonna make
the mean people meaner? Like how do you kind of
cope with viewer opinions? It's whether they're good or bad.

Speaker 2 (43:23):
I feel like if it's really good, sometimes I'm worried.
I'm like, oh, they had this certain expectation now for me,
And if I have a bad moment, I think, like
why you were who I thought you were? So I
like that righttimes worries me a little bit because like, yeah,
I have like obviously the reputation of being very kind
at all these things, and like that's that is who
I am. But that doesn't mean that we don't have
like moment.

Speaker 1 (43:42):
I'm also human though, yeah exactly.

Speaker 2 (43:44):
And it's like I think it's because in season three
I'm like a little worried because I was pregnant, Like
I was like for sure a little bitchy, Okay, like
give me a break, and like Episode one, I like
definitely was I was like piss at Leila in it,
and I'm like, I like, I wasn't like that mean,
but like there is definitely some looks like whoa, that's
about little off brand for her, but I'm like, I
had a moment, okay. So sometimes I'm like, oh, they
get to watch that and be like, oh, like she

(44:05):
was hiding behind that, you know. I just like we're
like that. But at the same time, I don't care,
because like you can think what you want, like I
am who I am. So sometimes I go back and
forth that and being like we are they gonna think
I'm like mean because I'm not mean, like you know,
But overall, negative comments don't really affect me a ton,
Like I think if it's like it's just like not
accurate at all, then I'm like that's wrong. But like, yeah,
There's been so many times where I start writing a

(44:26):
response and I have it and then I like, yes,
I almost feels good to like write it out, even
if you don't send it, so you cite it and
then I'll like backspace and like, Okay, it's fine.

Speaker 1 (44:35):
I do it all the time. I'm like this is
everything I want to say, and then I have to yeah,
this is not worth my time, but I got I
got to get it out otherwise it's in.

Speaker 2 (44:43):
Yeah, So it's nice to do that sometimes. And my
husband's like, don't like if I ever like complain about
He's like, don't even worry about it, like, don't respond
to them, like he always gets like Madge, it is like,
don't worry about like who cares. And I'm like, Okay,
easy for you to say because.

Speaker 1 (44:55):
You're like, well it's not you that it's incoming out.

Speaker 2 (44:58):
Yeah exactly, but it's honestly good, Like he's honestly the
greatest if we balanced each other out so much where
I like, I think he's maybe a more understanding and
kind person as well. So I'm grateful for him because
I have those moments of weakness. I'm like, no, I
want to say this and you're not gonna stop me.
And then he's like, look at the bigger picture.

Speaker 1 (45:16):
Here, like maybe stop yourself exactly.

Speaker 2 (45:19):
So I feel like I've been pretty good at like
not letting it get to me. But yeah, the backspace
teck works great for me, just like writing it out.
I'm like, and then and then like just to live
it and it's great.

Speaker 1 (45:30):
What aside from you know, the the snans of pregnancy,
what what can we expect from next season? I'm like,
what what does everyone have in store?

Speaker 2 (45:42):
I would say I'm definitely, at least for me, I'm
a little bit bitchier for sure, because you know, pregnancy
hormones be raging. You probably will see me stuffing my
face all season as well.

Speaker 1 (45:51):
But good for you.

Speaker 2 (45:52):
That's like the lighthearted part of it, I would say.
I will say there's more moments where they do keep
some of them are like funny stuff in it normally
come out like I feel like there is more some
light hard moments, and I think that it needs that
because there's a lot of heavy topics in it as well.
So it's like there's heavy topics like Mikhaela talks about
her story, which is really impactful. So like hearing that
was really awesome because I like, great, like we're leaving

(46:15):
in this stuff that like matters, you know, it's not
just like the drama. It's like the real stuff, you know.
I love that. And then obviously your heal about Jesse,
like it's left in a cliffhanger, so everyone's gonna get
answers to exactly what happened, like and I mean like
you will get exactly what happened, Like everything is there.
People when the show first started, they're like they didn't
even like talk all about the swing drama, like they
tease it too much and tell it like whatever this,

(46:37):
You're gonna get all of that and more. My goodness,
and I think there is a lot of like iPhone
footage in certain parts, and like that's how you know
it's like real, because like producers weren't even there sometimes
she is going down and so you had to you
have random people filming on iPhones. Maybe we're there, So
it's like you have moments like that like that are
sometimes I'm like I can't believe that's happening. And like

(46:58):
there's been a couple of times even with this this
last season where I signed my husband, Like I went
home at night and I was like, I don't know
if I'm cut out for this, Like I don't know,
you know, because like I'm not. I have opinions, right,
but like sometimes I'm like, keep the peace. It's worth
keeping the piece just for my own personal gain to
just be peaceful. But there are times where the girls

(47:19):
are like shut the f up to each other, like pissed,
and I'm like whoa, whoa, Like this is this is
like a little bit much, you know, and that sometimes
those moments where I'm like ooh, I don't know, like
am I made for this world? There, like I'm just
in a sense of like ah, just makes me feel
sad inside, you know. Sometimes when like it's just like
the hostility, like it's not fun anymore. If it was

(47:39):
like us yelling at the men or the men yelling
at each other, I'm like, yeah, I get the popcorn,
let's go, you know, like with like our friend group,
I'm like, ooh, I don't know, I don't like this.

Speaker 1 (47:48):
It's like you're like, guys, this is actually sort of
hard for me emotionally.

Speaker 2 (47:52):
Yeah, I'm like, wait, this is yead. But then like again, luckily,
like it's not directly involving me, so I can if
I couldn't sleep at night, they'd be story. But I'm
like I'm good, So like as long as that is
working out for me, then like I can give it
because I don't want to like go to bed and
feel like anxious, so like, you know, I don't want
to have that feeling, you know, and I lovely like
right now I don't. And I did a little bit

(48:13):
sharing my story on the last season just because I'm like,
it is very vulnerable, it's scary, you know, and it's
like just stuff that you don't want to do or
you want to avoid. But again, I knew it was
more impactful to share it. So yeah, those of those
moments that are hard, but like I did it. That's
the way. I'm not doing that again. And I watched
the season. I'm like, I watched it once and I
will not be watching that again. It's just too much.

(48:36):
It's heavy for me, you know, it's like reliving it
all over againes actually seeing it, you know, so totally.
But this season I feel like, I listen my opinion
because I have seen it is probably my favorite one
so far. But who knows, Like I could do it
every season and I just wouldn't know, But I feel like,
so far it has been my favorite.

Speaker 1 (48:53):
Wat you want that to be the goal every year
you do it? Yeah, I like it more. It's it's
interesting to see how across you know, the group of
your castmates, people are branching out into all these other spaces. Yeah,
you've written your book, Jenny Whinney, are going on Janzing
with the Stars. Taylor's going to be the new Bachelorette, Like, yeah,
how does that feel? What are your expectations for the

(49:14):
things they're going out to do? Like, are you excited
for them?

Speaker 2 (49:18):
Yes? Oh my gosh, I'm so excited. I feel like
we went to Dancing with the Stars opening night and
I literally had like tears. I was like, I just
like feel like a proud mother. Like it's the weirdest say,
like seeing your friends like accomplish their goals and their dreams.
It's just like not only so powerful, but like impactful.
It's just like so special. And like I'm obviously so
excited to watch Bachelorette. I am a little worried for Taylor,

(49:39):
just because I'm like, scares me. Yeah, bring me on
to help you out, because we aren't the best at
catching the red flag, so let me help you out there.
I think that's why I learned from experiences though, And
she's obviously better now than she was in the past.
It you know, snipping out the bad ones. But no,
it's honestly just so crazy to see and it still
blows my mind. I know that, like the show has

(50:01):
been this successful because I'm like, like, and it's your
normal life. It's just what you're living. It doesn't seem,
you know, any different, Like how is this like entertaining?
You know, Like I think we were all shocked at
how well it's done, like how many opportunities we're getting
from it, Like it's actually crazy, Like it's the show
has been out for like one year and like now
we had Dancing with the Star's Bachelorette, Like I've written

(50:21):
a book, Like it's just crazy.

Speaker 1 (50:22):
You know, it's incredible.

Speaker 2 (50:24):
Yeah, very grateful.

Speaker 1 (50:25):
It's obviously so much to reflect on and you've done
so much. And I'm not going to be the person
who asks you what's next by any means, because you're
in the middle of what is now. Yeah, but when
you look sort of at the landscape of where you've
been and you know how good things feel, what what
in your life, whether it's a personal goal or a
professional goal, like what feels like your big work in progress?

Speaker 2 (50:50):
I think it's kind of discovering like what I want
to do, you know, Like I think I if you
asked me like five years ago and said as we
be on reality show. I would have thought you were lying,
Like I never in my life like wanting to do
reality TV. Yeah, it kind of just so happened that way.
So I think it's just like for me, like kind
of discovering more of like what Macie wants and who
she wants to be, Like what are my passions like now?

(51:12):
You know, because I think when you become a mommy
sometimes lose yourself and motherhood a bit. And it's like
for me, it's like the passions were tennis, right, and
then once that's over, it's like what now? And I
feel like you a lot of athletes go through like
identity crisis when they're done with their sport, because it's like, well,
what do I do now? Like what do I have
to look forward to? How do I feel that feeling
of like winning, you know, and like succeeding. And that's
one thing I that's why I do have a lot

(51:34):
of drive. It comes from the athletes side where it's
like I need to constantly be like winning or having
like wins in my life, right, And so I think
it's like I just want to kind of discover like
what I'm passionate about, Like in like a new project
that I want to do or a new business like
things like that, but also like I want to just
chill out too, and like be a mom and like
enjoy it and like soak it in and not just

(51:54):
be like working on my phone while I'm with my kids.
And I've been a lot better at that in the
last year, because the past is what I have to
work and I have to do these things. And like
I feel like now I've been very good at prioritizing,
like no, I'm not filming because i have my son's
baseball game and I'm not missing it. I'm sorry, like
it's just not happening. Like I've been very good about that,
and like good for you. You know. They've asked to
film stuff like that, like the baseball games my kids,

(52:16):
and I'm like no, like I'm trying to get my
kids out of it, and I want to just have
that and have that. I want my kids to have
a normal childhood too, you know. I don't want them
to be like, well, my mom was like working all
the time, you know. So I feel like I'm very
cautious about that. So I think I'm just navigating it
at all. So like I think be work in progress
is what it's going to be.

Speaker 1 (52:34):
I love it. I love it, I get it. I
think if you're not careful about your time, all your
time goes to work, kids, things, admins. Yeah, and then
the work keeps encroaching. And I don't know, I think
it's really important just to block time for you, time

(52:55):
to your family. Like it's it's just as worthy as anything.
And I think, at least for me, I feel like
the balance of it all is constantly and in progress
thing as well. But I can feel when I'm getting
it more right because I feel later, yeah, and that's
a hice feeling.

Speaker 2 (53:15):
Yeah, I just want to feel like that relaxed feeling
where it's like, yes, like this is what you know
because I have a baby and I'm like this is
like I truly am like this is what I was
made for. Like I have my daughter and I'm like
I just want to be a mom and I have
those moments, you know, but I want the current and
I want you know, you always want it all, Like
I think I just want to learn how to balance
that and just pursue things. And I'm also passionate, like

(53:35):
outside of like the show and like motherhood you know,
just like for me, you know, so I'm still working
on it. I guess we'll find out.

Speaker 1 (53:43):
I love that for you. Well, congratulations on everything. The
book is beautiful. Thank you so much. I can't wait
to see how it all goes this year.

Speaker 2 (53:52):
Thank you, oh