January 17, 2018 • 27 mins
Whitney Miller from Onnit has done a lot of things that would scare that crap out of most people. Getting up on stage in a bikini in front of judges, being a professional wake boarder, getting into a ring for a fight. You might not want to do any of those things but learning how to take on a challenge is this weeks mission.
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
Have you ever looked at a portrait and wondered? Who
was this person? Really, it's really a love story. Harriet
was motivated by love and he became known for his
undercover reporting. He got himself arrested. And also it's a
tremendous dress. Ll cool Jay. I'm Kim say It, director
of the National Portrait Gallery and your host on Portraits
(00:24):
find us wherever you get your podcasts alright, Episode three
of the Workout Wednesday podcast. My name is Anthony. Thank you.
If this is the third podcast you've listened to, thanks
for that. This is the first one. Thanks for joining me.
You can go back and listen to the other two.
(00:44):
This podcast is going to be a little different. So
the first one was more about your fitness, second one
was about your diet. This isn't gonna be really about either.
We'll touch on both of those subjects, but it's really
about setting up challenges for yourself and UM to kind
of go along with that theme, this week's challenge is
(01:04):
going to be to set up something down the road
that you have to tackle. The reason I have this
guest on this podcast specifically is because I feel like
she's a great example of just seeing something and jumping
right into it and putting all your effort into it
and just seeing where it goes. Someone who has been
in a lot of different arenas, if you will, and
(01:25):
just I think it's a great motivation, So let's just
jump into it. Whitney from a Fitness and the Honed Academy.
How's it going. I'm amazing, so good. How about yourself?
I'm doing well. And the reason I wanted to get
you on this podcast is because you have I feel
like in the short time that I've known you, because
we were we recorded the first workout Wednesday video what
like two and a half maybe three years ago, something
(01:46):
like that. Exactly, You've done so many different things here.
You have like backstage interviews, but you've also been a fighter,
You've been in the pageant world. You're coming out with
a docuseries. So I think all the different things you've done,
you've had to obviously stay in shape for all of them,
and I'm sure that they were all kind of different
different things to get prepared for. Right. Oh yeah, absolutely.
(02:07):
I Mean I'm just the type of person that likes
to try everything that I can't stick with one paying actually,
so I like to just bounce around. Um, but I
guess you know. I was an athlete my entire life
from the moment I was about I don't know, five
years old. I started playing soccer, and then it was gymnastics,
and then it was sailing, and it was surfing and
trap and field and soccer, and the list just goes
(02:29):
on and um So I feel like I've always kind
of had that competitive drive, which is what keeps me
in all kinds of different sports and in competitions, you know,
at that So when I started, I went into pageants,
which is a completely different set of skills and muscles
and fitness and everything that you need for fighting, which
(02:51):
is you know, how to hit somebody in the face
and how to not get hit a face. Well, how
do you can imagine? It's very different. How do you
transition from being an athlete growing up to actually getting
into the pageant world? And you were what was it
Miss Texas Two Texas? Yeah, it was Miss Texas United
States and then I was Miss United States that same year. Okay,
so how do you get into that world? So very bizarre? Actually, Um,
(03:15):
I actually did my very first pageant when I was fifteen,
and a girlfriend of mine said Hey, there was Miss
Corpus Christie, USA. Why don't you come compete? And I said, okay, whatever,
But I have to tell you I was the biggest
tomboard growing up, Like I would basically wear my brother's
clothes and play like flag football in the front yard.
(03:36):
So me going from being such an athlete and such
a tomboy to competing and pageant was not only a
shock for me, but it was a shock for my
entire you know, friend and family group. They didn't know
what the heck I was doing. Was super confused, super
confused because I was also I was competing and surfing
at the time, so I was late to rehearsals, sunburned
(03:56):
because I was I was surfing in a competition that morning,
and so it was just like, who is this insane person?
I show up and I ended up winning, and then
I didn't do anything for about six years. It was
just pageants. You know. I was more into sports at
that point. And um, I also felt like they were
trying to groom me into someone I wasn't really comfortable being.
(04:20):
I didn't really know how I was basically giving people
answers that they wanted to hear, and that wasn't the
true authentic me, so I just didn't do it anymore.
I was a professional wake surfer in college and competing
and teaching wake boarding, and then again the phone rings,
and I guess I'm like twenty two one at the time.
Another girlfriend of mine said, Hey, Miss Texas is coming up,
(04:41):
um next weekend, do you want to compete? And I
brought off the bat told her no, I thought that
was just an insane idea, and I you know, didn't
really agree with kind of how some pageants were running
the stigma around it. Long story short, I decided that
if I didn't do it, I would regret it because
I wanted I at least had to know, right, that's
my personality. So a week later, I'm with borrowed dress, shoes, everything,
(05:05):
and UM went to Miss Texas and said that I'm
going in here completely as myself with no training for
six years and going to be Whitney. And you know,
it worked out. I won Miss Texas and then went
on to Miss United States and won that It's like
the last thing people do, but when you finally realize
that you can just be yourself and you can be comfortable,
(05:26):
it's amazing how many great things happen after that moment.
And it's also just people can tell when they're not
being yourself. Like, no matter what space you put on there,
there's some sort of like I don't know if it's
you know, if you want to get into it, but
if it's energy or whatever it is, but you can
pick up when someone's not being authentic, and then when
they are being authentic, it's just like a completely different person.
(05:49):
You are automatically way more attracted to them. Yeah, there's
there's you can tell honesty, you can feel honesty. I
think one after you won Miss Texas, obviously you did
that kind of almost on a whim. You had what
a week to prepare? One week probably last of the
week I had to be in Gallaston on I guess
(06:10):
I was a Friday, and my girlfriend called me Saturday
or Sunday this week been before after you one that,
and you know you knew at that point you were
going to go for Miss USA. How do you train
for something like that? Because I think there's a stigma
around any type of beauty related thing, whether it's a
beauty pageant or covers of magazines or whatever. It's just like, oh,
(06:30):
that girl doesn't eat and that's how she stays so
thin or what like, how do you how do you
train for something like that? Yeah, you know, And I
was something that I honestly dealt with two being an
athlete my whole life, I could basically eat whatever I
wanted to eat because I was constantly training. When I
went into pageants, you know, I wasn't really competing. I
wasn't training for something to compete physically, you know. It
(06:52):
was more training mentally and how you're gonna walk and
talk and that that sort of thing. Um, So dealing
with oh my god, am I gonna be skinny enough
was an issue for me. Also the fact that I
have a very athletic body, but you see my body
compared to anybody else in the pageant world, and you're like,
that doesn't make any sense. I'm sure than all of
(07:13):
the girls. And I walk around with veins in my
arms in a six pack just because that's how my
body has been trained since I was five years old.
And so that was I dealt with, like some insecurities
around that. But that's one of the reasons why I
wanted to do it so bad, was to show you
can be yourself you can have the body that you want.
As long as your love it and as long as
you really support that, then people are going to pick
(07:35):
up on it. And so training for me was a
lot of high intensity um workouts I really liked, and
that's when I started to get connected with on it.
So I was doing battle ropes, and I was doing
kettlebells and and things like that, and then of course
tobattas on the tread meal that always I thought. I
found that always like really kicked my body into high
gear when I needed to be on stage, go into
(07:58):
that for for people who are like, oh, maybe I
want to try something this like what was your go
to kind of work out if you were getting ready
to go on stage? So I would do tobata's on
the battle ropes. Can you break down what that is
for people who are listening and may not know exactly
what that is yet? Yeah? Absolutely so, um a tobata
is basically X amount of work with X amount of rest,
(08:20):
and so I would usually do anywhere from twenty to
forty seconds of maximal effort. So if I'm on the
battle ropes, I'm just crushing the battle ropes for twenty
seconds and then you give yourself, you know, about ten
to twenty seconds of rest in between you You You can
do that for eight ten rounds. However, however, in many
rounds you want to do it. But it basically when
(08:42):
you go through that, even after you're done working out,
you continue to um burn fat even when you're not
in because your body put in so much work within that.
And it's really short. It's really short workout. You can
go in, you can bang it out, and you get
out within thirty minutes. The actual the video that we
did the first time that we linked up for workout Wednesday,
(09:02):
when I was in New York. You actually brought battle
ropes up to New York. And I can speak to
this on a personal level. It kicked my absolute s.
I mean I was doing that. You had me alternating
different ways to the battle ropes and everything. But it
is a really good workout. It is, and you can
add you don't have to just statically stand there. You
can add squats while you're alternating battle ropes. You can
do lunges, you can do jumps, the whole thing. So
(09:24):
it's a full body, just massive workout all right. Then
you transferred from doing being in the pageant life and
doing those things, and then you started fighting and kickboxing. Yeah,
the idea, how do you make that transition? First off,
how do you what is that trigger that goes off
in your head and says, I'm gonna punch some people
in the face. Me me just being insane and wanting
(09:46):
to turn everything. But I actually I started watching the
UFC and thought that, oh that was kind of cool.
And let me tell you that I have never been
in a fight in my entire life previous to this. Like,
I wasn't a fighter growing up. I didn't get in
like a street fight. I'd never had punched somebody in
the face or had been punched in the face, So
I had no clue with the hell I was doing.
(10:07):
And um, but I started watching UFC and thought it
was pretty cool, and I started doing kind of some
kickboxing because people would come through on it and fighters
would come through on and I get to watch them
train and train with them quick. And um, just for
people who are jumping into the podcast for the first time,
can you explain what it is and how what you're
involvement is there? Just so people, Yeah, heard what we're
(10:28):
talking about, huh. On it is a total human optimization
company that we have all kinds of all natural supplements
like alpha brain. People may have heard of stream text
sport things like that. And we also have a gym
here in Austin, Texas. We have Tents, Planet and Dwayne
being Mutai all here in in Austin, And it's basically
(10:49):
total human optimization. You want to eat right, you want
to live right, you want to work out with the
top trainers, you want to supplement your body with all
natural top um clinical study did um supplements, and so
it's really just it's basically a lifestyle. And the way
I actually got connected with on it was I saw
the really cool kettle bells that you guys produce and
reached out. And if you've ever seen like the zombie
(11:11):
kettle bells or the gorilla face kettle bells, that's also
on it right. And now we have like Captain America
plates that you can get. We just we have a
new Star Wars deal. Um. This is just all kinds
of Marvel we're doing, like all the different Marvel kettle bells.
It's going to be sick. It is cool because I
feel like what on It does really well is it
makes working out fun. It's not. It's not as buttoned
(11:35):
up as it sometimes there is in other places. Right, Yeah, No,
go in there and have a good time. Plus you're
slinging around monkey hid. I mean that's pretty cool. So
you're you were starting to train at on it. Yeah,
I was training at ON. I met their CEO, who
is Aubrey Marcus, who is now my fiancee. We met
when I was in Miss Texas and I was looking
for sponsors to go to Miss United States, and I
(11:57):
basically came in and asked for a sponsorship. And that
was almost six years ago now and we're now engaged.
And so during that time, I was training here and
the fighters would come through and I would start, you know,
kind of hitting mids a little bit, and I'd watch
them and be really impressed and just kind of like
inspired and realized though that there was a martial art
(12:19):
called jiu jitsu Brazilian jiu jitsu where you got to
basically fight and spar with people all out, but you're
not getting hit or kicked in the face. Um. So
I was like, cool, I'm down with that. Yeah. I
started training jiu jitsu a little bit um, and I
honestly hated it at first. I thought it sucked. I
wasn't good at it. And usually throughout my life when
I tried some sort of like athletic ability, I was
(12:42):
decently good at it and um, but this one just
took a lot of determination and concentration and at the
same time relaxing. It was very It's difficult because it's
you have to go in there and be so relaxing
me to focus on your breath, and within the same
time you're fighting somebody. So it's like, how do you
fight relax? It sounds like it contradicts each other exactly exactly.
(13:05):
So that's also what drew me to the sport. And
so I started training that and you know, I decided,
let's do this. I want to take either an m
m A fight or a kickboxing fight or whatever. My
goal is, you know, to take one m m A,
one kickboxing and one boxing, check all the boxes off,
and call it a day. So you just want to
get one of each of them and then call it
(13:26):
and then that's it. That's all you need. Yeah, I mean,
I say that now, right, but but I have we'll see,
we'll see. Because I had one boxing match this last
August and it was the hardest and the scariest thing
I've ever done, but the most rewarding and most awesome
(13:46):
thing I've ever done. Well, had it end who won.
So it was an exhibition match, so we didn't have judges,
but we did tally everything up and at the end
of it, I won every Now, you know, and this
is kind of the the theme for this Specifick podcast
is kind of challenging yourself. And with the two stories
you just gave, with your fighting story and with the
pageant world, what I think is so incredible as you
(14:08):
did two of the things that most people would think
are the scariest things you could possibly do. One is
to get in front of people and be judged on
a number of factors, but a lot of it is
your appearance and your your fitness level. And the other
thing is to go into a ring and have someone
literally attack you. Yeah, you know, I have never really
thought of it that way, but right, But but if
you really think those are probably people's biggest fears. One
(14:30):
is getting into a fight, and the other is being
judged by a group of strangers right in public speaking
and you're in a bikini exactly, And I think it's
great for this podcast because you should challenge yourself and
you don't have to go to that extreme. I'm not
telling everyone that's listening to this podcast right now to
go enter a pageant or go get punched in the face,
but go find something that you're actually scared of and
(14:52):
and do it, because you're never going to push yourself
until you actually do that. Even it doesn't even have
to be anything big. It can see something small. Go
to join a new workout class, or do a cooking class,
or learn a new language, or just something that's slightly
out of your comfort zone because you almost get momentum.
You feel inspired after doing something like that, and you're
gonna have the momentum to want to try new things constantly.
(15:17):
Now as someone who clearly is doing a lot of
different things. What is something you still want to check
off your bucket list? What's something that's still kind of
scares you or worries you, or you're uncomfortable with it.
You're like, I need to tackle that thing. Huh. It's funny.
I mean I have a lot of things I want
to tackle off my bucket list, Like I want to
chase tornadoes, I want to swim a Great White Show.
I want to do things like that. But my main thing,
(15:38):
and this has been kind of an overarching theme of
this past weekend funny you bring it up now, is
my biggest fear in life is singing. Is singing in
front of people. And but I love to sing, but
I'm absolutely terrified to do it in front of anybody.
And I had a long conversation about this yesterday about
that being I have one concrete beer that I know
(16:00):
exactly what it is, and a lot of people are
thinking like, oh, I don't know, maybe this or maybe
this or maybe this. No, this is mine, and I
know exactly how to conquer it. It's just doing it.
So so how are you? How are you going to
conquer it? So I think it's just kind of taking
the steps to do it. Sing in front of one person,
and then three people, and then fifty people. I don't know.
(16:21):
I'm just gonna have to start taking the steps to
break that fear down. Because if you have a fear,
whether you think about it or not, it really does
dictate your everyday life. You're kind of holding yourself back,
you're limiting yourself even for that, like singing probably limits
myself and my relationships. It probably limits myself um when
(16:43):
I go after things in my career, you know, like
it really does bleed over. And so finding your fear
and going for it and not you don't have to
jump in completely if you need to take smaller steps,
take take smaller steps, but no that you can eventually
get to the end of it and it's going to
just create more space in your life. And you can
only take those small steps if you take the first one,
(17:03):
and that's identifying what your fear is or what that
one obstacle you want to overcome is. And you did
that with singing, and now you just have to take
those other steps. But the first, but that first step
is figuring out what it is. And that's what everyone
should do at some point, and the goal for everyone
this week is to figure out what that is and
to sign up for something that will help you overcome
that goal, whether it's running a half marathon and finding
(17:23):
a one that takes place in six months from now
and then setting a date and going for it. You know,
you have to start somewhere, right, You gotta start somewhere,
and when you do find it out, speak it, you know,
put it into awareness. Put it out there, Tell a friend,
tell a family member, because that's also you know, step one,
because you want someone to hold you accountable and maybe
ask you about it. So if you're not telling anybody,
(17:45):
then you're you're a little bit afraid to tell that
person anyway, just in case they're going to check in
with you and you still haven't done it. You know,
it's like, soh, tell somebody, put it out there, and
once you say it out loud, then it's real. If
you're just going over things in your head, those are
just random thoughts. But if you actually go to someone
you know and love and you tell them that, that
puts it out there in the world. Now it's real. Yep. Obviously,
(18:06):
on this podcast, I love when people email questions or
tweet questions, whatever it is. And this is the one
that actually held on for two weeks because I knew
you were going to be on the podcast, and I
think you're the perfect person to answer. This is from
a woman. Obviously, what's the best way for a woman
to start lifting weights? The weight section can be a
little intimidating And that was a direct email from someone. Yeah,
it can be intimidating, right, I mean, you walk into
a room and there's seventy five different kinds of weights
(18:28):
and bands and whatever it is. I would I would
start simple, like, you don't don't think you have to
go super heavy, don't think you have to go super lightly.
Let's let's start simple. And if it's you know, if
you want to work out your arms, do flies, you know,
or do bicep curls, or if you want to do legs,
just grab some weights and do some lunges with it. Like,
(18:49):
don't go in there thinking you have to do all
of these crazy movements, because I think in the day
and age of Instagram and everything, you see people go
in there and they're just they're hanging upside down with
one way by the foot and the other one in
there at hand, you know. So just go in there
and keep it as simple as possible. And once you
start to get more comfortable, you can advance and you
(19:10):
can make things a little bit more challenging. But go
in there, keep it simple, have some fun. Are there
any resources on that on it provides, like whether it's
a YouTube channel or a website or anything that people
can kind of get acquainted with stuff. Oh yeah, we
have tons of free online content. We just go to
on it dot com um, and then we have the
on it academy and I believe that's just on it
academy dot com and there's just tons of basically anything
(19:34):
you want to know about working out, if it's mobility,
if it's stretching, if it's weightlifting, if it's barbells, anything
and I dot com Yep, that's correct, n I T
dot com. Alright, what else do you have your ow?
Another question? And I love this because you can tell
where people's priorities are. What do you do to keep
a clean diet but still party and drink alcohol on
(19:54):
the weekends that they must follow me on Instagram? You
are You and your fiance are both people who are
very fit, but you still enjoy life. You still go
out there and and drink alcohol and go to parties
on the weekends and stuff. Yeah, yeah, you know, I do.
I really actually, I mean I enjoy it. I have
a good time. I like to go party. I like
(20:14):
to hang out with friends. I like to do dinners
and drink wine and espresso martinis and whatever else. Um.
But at the same time, I like to hit the
gym hard and I like to eat my body healthy.
So I think it's, you know, a balance, Like I
like to go out and have a good time, but
then the next day, um, I'm gonna have greens juice.
I'm gonna supplement my body properly. I'm gonna have like
(20:35):
some liver detoxifying UM drink or supplements UM eat fairly
healthy because I think that's where the kind of the
people get caught up is they go out and they
get hammered, and they hung over the next day and
they just decided to order pizza or burgers, and it
kind of perpeptuates the cycle, which is okay to do
every once in a while. But I think if you
(20:55):
go out in new party, like just think about it
the next day, I go to greens juice. At least
that you can easily do that and try to eat
a little bit healthy because you're you're already breaking your
body down. Alcohol is difficult for your body to process. Um,
So just be a little bit kinder to your body
the next day, and I think you'll you'll realize one
you're going to feel better, You're not gonna feel like
crap from eating crappy food. And then to the next
(21:17):
day you're probably gonna want to eat as healthy as
you did the first day, and it kind of just
perpetuates a positive cycle. So it's really just you can
break the cycle if you're having a good time, but
just get back onto it as quickly as possible. Absolutely,
Or if you know you're about to go out and party.
I drink greens juice all the time, but if I
know I'm having a big, you know, super fun weekend
of drinking and dancing and whatever else, I'm gonna have
(21:40):
greens juices like stocked. And you mentioned taking some supplements
here and there, and obviously on it offers supplements, but
could you talk about supplements and like, is there anything
that you always take or something that you take on
a certain day or after you drink, or something that
people should probably look into adding into their weekly or
daily regimen. Yeah, I mean, um, so if we're on it, particularly,
(22:01):
something I bring with me everywhere. It's in my purse
day in, day out, and I think it helps with
drinking and just detoxifying anyway, is our gut packs and
so it's like packed with prebiotics and probiotics, um and
different kind of liber detoxifying herbs and stuff and that
really helps me. How does that help? Yeah, No, it
(22:21):
just makes me feel better. If you ever have any
like tummy aches, or you get gassy, or you're eating
crappy food, it's just it'll help you digest all of that.
And when I say like digestive enzymes, some people think,
oh great, I'm gonna have to run to the bathroom
and for the rest of the day. No, no, no,
I don't mean that all. It just helps you digest
it a little bit easier, so you're not constipated or
(22:42):
you're not you know, you don't you don't feel gassy,
you don't feel floated. Um in your gut biome is
something that's extremely important to the other functions of your body.
It almost it dictates just about everything. And they're coming
out with crazy research on that and so just having
someone pack that has basically everything you need for gut
health makes it really easy for me. Well, this is
(23:03):
officially the second podcast in a row where someone's talking
about pooping. So there's that guy that going forward, pooping
is is important. So what else do you have coming up?
I know right now you're hosting for Glory Kickboxing. I am,
And then you were talking to me earlier about your
docuseries coming out on YouTube. Yeah, So on top of
(23:25):
everything else, I want, one thing I'm actually really passionate
about is talking about love, sex, and relationships because it's,
you know, something that we all deal with. We're either
in a relationship, or we want a relationship, or we
just got out of a relationship. Just what is how
it works? And so I'm doing a docuseries on YouTube
called Love Undressed, and I'm basically going through different um
(23:47):
topics when it pertains to love, sex and relationships and
breaking them down. So, for example, the first episode is
going to be on marriage, and I'm gonna ask the question,
is marriage broken? We'll talk to different experts in the field,
you will do some interviews, you'll kind of get my
you know, thoughts on it, and also just some ways
(24:07):
that can either help your marriage or a different way
of thinking. And just like all these different perspectives pertaining
to love, sex, relationships. And when does that start airing?
When does that go live on YouTube? So that should
go live next month in February. Don't really quite know,
but I was just maybe maybe Valentine's Day, now that
I'm thinking about it, i'd be appropriate, right, I think so, so, Whitney.
(24:29):
If people want to follow you, if they want to
just ask you questions personally, where can everyone kind of
follow along and see your whole journey? Um? So you
can follow me on Instagram. I'm pretty active on there,
and it's missed tu JITs M I S S the
number two j I T S and that stands for
miss United States to jiu Jitsu. Kind of how I
got that name. I'm a completely open book. So any
(24:51):
questions on love, sex, relationships, or fitness, or fighting or pageants, anything,
I'm completely open. I try to answer as many questions
as I've possibly can well listen. Thank you so so
very much for making some time out and recording this
podcast with me. Appreciate it, and uh, good luck with everything.
Good luck with the docuseries. Yeah, thanks so much. Ahead
of blast. So, as I'm gonna do on this podcast
(25:13):
every single week is I'm going to challenge you and
myself actually the same time two do something to better yourself.
So the first week it was to drink the appropriate
amount of water, which I know personally has made me
feel a lot better. The second challenge and podcast number
two is to make sure that we're getting enough sleep,
So for me, that was gonna be six hours of sleep.
(25:34):
I wake up around four or fifteen in the morning,
so I was trying to get to bed and be
asleep by ten. I haven't always fallen asleep at that time,
but I'm at least getting myself into bed now between
ten and ten fifteen, And it's actually easier for me
to fall asleep now because I'm on kind of that schedule.
This week is gonna be a little different. It's not
something you're gonna do week over week, um, but you're
(25:55):
gonna set up a challenge for yourself. You're gonna look
out at ahead and say, Okay, do I want to
run a five k a half marathon? Do I want
to try a triathlon? Do it? It doesn't have to
be anything physical, but those are just some good examples.
Do you want to go to an open mic night?
Do you want to go take a improv class? Sign
up for something that's gonna take a little bit of courage,
(26:18):
something that you don't do already. Maybe it's three three
months down the road, maybe it's six months down the road,
but before the year's over, find something that's gonna challenge
you and make sure you tell someone, tweet it, you
can even miss email me. Whatever you want to do,
make sure you tell someone so it becomes real. I
think that's kind of the whole theme here for this
specific podcast. Again, thank you so much for hanging out
(26:40):
with me. Make sure you follow along on the podcast
at the follow butt under the subscribe button depending on
what platform you're on. It'll be posted every single Wednesday
right here in I Heart Radio. And next week I
know I'm gonna have another diet person on the podcast,
So if you've got questions, hit me up at Worst Anthony, Facebook, Twitter, Snapchat,
Instagram at Worst Anthony, and you can always email my
(27:01):
Day Friday Show at gmail dot com. Thanks for hanging
out with me for another week. Have you ever looked
at a portrait and wondered? Who was this person? Really?
It's really a love story. Harriet was motivated by love
and he became known for his undercover reporting. He got
himself arrested. And also it's a tremendous dress. Ll L
(27:24):
cool J. I'm Kim said, director of the National Portrait
Gallery and your host on Portraits find us wherever you
get your podcasts
Have you ever looked at a portrait and wondered? Who
was this person? Really, it's really a love story. Harriet
was motivated by love and he became known for his
undercover reporting. He got himself arrested. And also it's a
tremendous dress. Ll cool Jay. I'm Kim say It, director
of the National Portrait Gallery and your host on Portraits
(00:24):
find us wherever you get your podcasts alright, Episode three
of the Workout Wednesday podcast. My name is Anthony. Thank you.
If this is the third podcast you've listened to, thanks
for that. This is the first one. Thanks for joining me.
You can go back and listen to the other two.
(00:44):
This podcast is going to be a little different. So
the first one was more about your fitness, second one
was about your diet. This isn't gonna be really about either.
We'll touch on both of those subjects, but it's really
about setting up challenges for yourself and UM to kind
of go along with that theme, this week's challenge is
(01:04):
going to be to set up something down the road
that you have to tackle. The reason I have this
guest on this podcast specifically is because I feel like
she's a great example of just seeing something and jumping
right into it and putting all your effort into it
and just seeing where it goes. Someone who has been
in a lot of different arenas, if you will, and
(01:25):
just I think it's a great motivation, So let's just
jump into it. Whitney from a Fitness and the Honed Academy.
How's it going. I'm amazing, so good. How about yourself?
I'm doing well. And the reason I wanted to get
you on this podcast is because you have I feel
like in the short time that I've known you, because
we were we recorded the first workout Wednesday video what
like two and a half maybe three years ago, something
(01:46):
like that. Exactly, You've done so many different things here.
You have like backstage interviews, but you've also been a fighter,
You've been in the pageant world. You're coming out with
a docuseries. So I think all the different things you've done,
you've had to obviously stay in shape for all of them,
and I'm sure that they were all kind of different
different things to get prepared for. Right. Oh yeah, absolutely.
(02:07):
I Mean I'm just the type of person that likes
to try everything that I can't stick with one paying actually,
so I like to just bounce around. Um, but I
guess you know. I was an athlete my entire life
from the moment I was about I don't know, five
years old. I started playing soccer, and then it was gymnastics,
and then it was sailing, and it was surfing and
trap and field and soccer, and the list just goes
(02:29):
on and um So I feel like I've always kind
of had that competitive drive, which is what keeps me
in all kinds of different sports and in competitions, you know,
at that So when I started, I went into pageants,
which is a completely different set of skills and muscles
and fitness and everything that you need for fighting, which
(02:51):
is you know, how to hit somebody in the face
and how to not get hit a face. Well, how
do you can imagine? It's very different. How do you
transition from being an athlete growing up to actually getting
into the pageant world? And you were what was it
Miss Texas Two Texas? Yeah, it was Miss Texas United
States and then I was Miss United States that same year. Okay,
so how do you get into that world? So very bizarre? Actually, Um,
(03:15):
I actually did my very first pageant when I was fifteen,
and a girlfriend of mine said Hey, there was Miss
Corpus Christie, USA. Why don't you come compete? And I said, okay, whatever,
But I have to tell you I was the biggest
tomboard growing up, Like I would basically wear my brother's
clothes and play like flag football in the front yard.
(03:36):
So me going from being such an athlete and such
a tomboy to competing and pageant was not only a
shock for me, but it was a shock for my
entire you know, friend and family group. They didn't know
what the heck I was doing. Was super confused, super
confused because I was also I was competing and surfing
at the time, so I was late to rehearsals, sunburned
(03:56):
because I was I was surfing in a competition that morning,
and so it was just like, who is this insane person?
I show up and I ended up winning, and then
I didn't do anything for about six years. It was
just pageants. You know. I was more into sports at
that point. And um, I also felt like they were
trying to groom me into someone I wasn't really comfortable being.
(04:20):
I didn't really know how I was basically giving people
answers that they wanted to hear, and that wasn't the
true authentic me, so I just didn't do it anymore.
I was a professional wake surfer in college and competing
and teaching wake boarding, and then again the phone rings,
and I guess I'm like twenty two one at the time.
Another girlfriend of mine said, Hey, Miss Texas is coming up,
(04:41):
um next weekend, do you want to compete? And I
brought off the bat told her no, I thought that
was just an insane idea, and I you know, didn't
really agree with kind of how some pageants were running
the stigma around it. Long story short, I decided that
if I didn't do it, I would regret it because
I wanted I at least had to know, right, that's
my personality. So a week later, I'm with borrowed dress, shoes, everything,
(05:05):
and UM went to Miss Texas and said that I'm
going in here completely as myself with no training for
six years and going to be Whitney. And you know,
it worked out. I won Miss Texas and then went
on to Miss United States and won that It's like
the last thing people do, but when you finally realize
that you can just be yourself and you can be comfortable,
(05:26):
it's amazing how many great things happen after that moment.
And it's also just people can tell when they're not
being yourself. Like, no matter what space you put on there,
there's some sort of like I don't know if it's
you know, if you want to get into it, but
if it's energy or whatever it is, but you can
pick up when someone's not being authentic, and then when
they are being authentic, it's just like a completely different person.
(05:49):
You are automatically way more attracted to them. Yeah, there's
there's you can tell honesty, you can feel honesty. I
think one after you won Miss Texas, obviously you did
that kind of almost on a whim. You had what
a week to prepare? One week probably last of the
week I had to be in Gallaston on I guess
(06:10):
I was a Friday, and my girlfriend called me Saturday
or Sunday this week been before after you one that,
and you know you knew at that point you were
going to go for Miss USA. How do you train
for something like that? Because I think there's a stigma
around any type of beauty related thing, whether it's a
beauty pageant or covers of magazines or whatever. It's just like, oh,
(06:30):
that girl doesn't eat and that's how she stays so
thin or what like, how do you how do you
train for something like that? Yeah, you know, And I
was something that I honestly dealt with two being an
athlete my whole life, I could basically eat whatever I
wanted to eat because I was constantly training. When I
went into pageants, you know, I wasn't really competing. I
wasn't training for something to compete physically, you know. It
(06:52):
was more training mentally and how you're gonna walk and
talk and that that sort of thing. Um, So dealing
with oh my god, am I gonna be skinny enough
was an issue for me. Also the fact that I
have a very athletic body, but you see my body
compared to anybody else in the pageant world, and you're like,
that doesn't make any sense. I'm sure than all of
(07:13):
the girls. And I walk around with veins in my
arms in a six pack just because that's how my
body has been trained since I was five years old.
And so that was I dealt with, like some insecurities
around that. But that's one of the reasons why I
wanted to do it so bad, was to show you
can be yourself you can have the body that you want.
As long as your love it and as long as
you really support that, then people are going to pick
(07:35):
up on it. And so training for me was a
lot of high intensity um workouts I really liked, and
that's when I started to get connected with on it.
So I was doing battle ropes, and I was doing
kettlebells and and things like that, and then of course
tobattas on the tread meal that always I thought. I
found that always like really kicked my body into high
gear when I needed to be on stage, go into
(07:58):
that for for people who are like, oh, maybe I
want to try something this like what was your go
to kind of work out if you were getting ready
to go on stage? So I would do tobata's on
the battle ropes. Can you break down what that is
for people who are listening and may not know exactly
what that is yet? Yeah? Absolutely so, um a tobata
is basically X amount of work with X amount of rest,
(08:20):
and so I would usually do anywhere from twenty to
forty seconds of maximal effort. So if I'm on the
battle ropes, I'm just crushing the battle ropes for twenty
seconds and then you give yourself, you know, about ten
to twenty seconds of rest in between you You You can
do that for eight ten rounds. However, however, in many
rounds you want to do it. But it basically when
(08:42):
you go through that, even after you're done working out,
you continue to um burn fat even when you're not
in because your body put in so much work within that.
And it's really short. It's really short workout. You can
go in, you can bang it out, and you get
out within thirty minutes. The actual the video that we
did the first time that we linked up for workout Wednesday,
(09:02):
when I was in New York. You actually brought battle
ropes up to New York. And I can speak to
this on a personal level. It kicked my absolute s.
I mean I was doing that. You had me alternating
different ways to the battle ropes and everything. But it
is a really good workout. It is, and you can
add you don't have to just statically stand there. You
can add squats while you're alternating battle ropes. You can
do lunges, you can do jumps, the whole thing. So
(09:24):
it's a full body, just massive workout all right. Then
you transferred from doing being in the pageant life and
doing those things, and then you started fighting and kickboxing. Yeah,
the idea, how do you make that transition? First off,
how do you what is that trigger that goes off
in your head and says, I'm gonna punch some people
in the face. Me me just being insane and wanting
(09:46):
to turn everything. But I actually I started watching the
UFC and thought that, oh that was kind of cool.
And let me tell you that I have never been
in a fight in my entire life previous to this. Like,
I wasn't a fighter growing up. I didn't get in
like a street fight. I'd never had punched somebody in
the face or had been punched in the face, So
I had no clue with the hell I was doing.
(10:07):
And um, but I started watching UFC and thought it
was pretty cool, and I started doing kind of some
kickboxing because people would come through on it and fighters
would come through on and I get to watch them
train and train with them quick. And um, just for
people who are jumping into the podcast for the first time,
can you explain what it is and how what you're
involvement is there? Just so people, Yeah, heard what we're
(10:28):
talking about, huh. On it is a total human optimization
company that we have all kinds of all natural supplements
like alpha brain. People may have heard of stream text
sport things like that. And we also have a gym
here in Austin, Texas. We have Tents, Planet and Dwayne
being Mutai all here in in Austin, And it's basically
(10:49):
total human optimization. You want to eat right, you want
to live right, you want to work out with the
top trainers, you want to supplement your body with all
natural top um clinical study did um supplements, and so
it's really just it's basically a lifestyle. And the way
I actually got connected with on it was I saw
the really cool kettle bells that you guys produce and
reached out. And if you've ever seen like the zombie
(11:11):
kettle bells or the gorilla face kettle bells, that's also
on it right. And now we have like Captain America
plates that you can get. We just we have a
new Star Wars deal. Um. This is just all kinds
of Marvel we're doing, like all the different Marvel kettle bells.
It's going to be sick. It is cool because I
feel like what on It does really well is it
makes working out fun. It's not. It's not as buttoned
(11:35):
up as it sometimes there is in other places. Right, Yeah, No,
go in there and have a good time. Plus you're
slinging around monkey hid. I mean that's pretty cool. So
you're you were starting to train at on it. Yeah,
I was training at ON. I met their CEO, who
is Aubrey Marcus, who is now my fiancee. We met
when I was in Miss Texas and I was looking
for sponsors to go to Miss United States, and I
(11:57):
basically came in and asked for a sponsorship. And that
was almost six years ago now and we're now engaged.
And so during that time, I was training here and
the fighters would come through and I would start, you know,
kind of hitting mids a little bit, and I'd watch
them and be really impressed and just kind of like
inspired and realized though that there was a martial art
(12:19):
called jiu jitsu Brazilian jiu jitsu where you got to
basically fight and spar with people all out, but you're
not getting hit or kicked in the face. Um. So
I was like, cool, I'm down with that. Yeah. I
started training jiu jitsu a little bit um, and I
honestly hated it at first. I thought it sucked. I
wasn't good at it. And usually throughout my life when
I tried some sort of like athletic ability, I was
(12:42):
decently good at it and um, but this one just
took a lot of determination and concentration and at the
same time relaxing. It was very It's difficult because it's
you have to go in there and be so relaxing
me to focus on your breath, and within the same
time you're fighting somebody. So it's like, how do you
fight relax? It sounds like it contradicts each other exactly exactly.
(13:05):
So that's also what drew me to the sport. And
so I started training that and you know, I decided,
let's do this. I want to take either an m
m A fight or a kickboxing fight or whatever. My
goal is, you know, to take one m m A,
one kickboxing and one boxing, check all the boxes off,
and call it a day. So you just want to
get one of each of them and then call it
(13:26):
and then that's it. That's all you need. Yeah, I mean,
I say that now, right, but but I have we'll see,
we'll see. Because I had one boxing match this last
August and it was the hardest and the scariest thing
I've ever done, but the most rewarding and most awesome
(13:46):
thing I've ever done. Well, had it end who won.
So it was an exhibition match, so we didn't have judges,
but we did tally everything up and at the end
of it, I won every Now, you know, and this
is kind of the the theme for this Specifick podcast
is kind of challenging yourself. And with the two stories
you just gave, with your fighting story and with the
pageant world, what I think is so incredible as you
(14:08):
did two of the things that most people would think
are the scariest things you could possibly do. One is
to get in front of people and be judged on
a number of factors, but a lot of it is
your appearance and your your fitness level. And the other
thing is to go into a ring and have someone
literally attack you. Yeah, you know, I have never really
thought of it that way, but right, But but if
you really think those are probably people's biggest fears. One
(14:30):
is getting into a fight, and the other is being
judged by a group of strangers right in public speaking
and you're in a bikini exactly, And I think it's
great for this podcast because you should challenge yourself and
you don't have to go to that extreme. I'm not
telling everyone that's listening to this podcast right now to
go enter a pageant or go get punched in the face,
but go find something that you're actually scared of and
(14:52):
and do it, because you're never going to push yourself
until you actually do that. Even it doesn't even have
to be anything big. It can see something small. Go
to join a new workout class, or do a cooking class,
or learn a new language, or just something that's slightly
out of your comfort zone because you almost get momentum.
You feel inspired after doing something like that, and you're
gonna have the momentum to want to try new things constantly.
(15:17):
Now as someone who clearly is doing a lot of
different things. What is something you still want to check
off your bucket list? What's something that's still kind of
scares you or worries you, or you're uncomfortable with it.
You're like, I need to tackle that thing. Huh. It's funny.
I mean I have a lot of things I want
to tackle off my bucket list, Like I want to
chase tornadoes, I want to swim a Great White Show.
I want to do things like that. But my main thing,
(15:38):
and this has been kind of an overarching theme of
this past weekend funny you bring it up now, is
my biggest fear in life is singing. Is singing in
front of people. And but I love to sing, but
I'm absolutely terrified to do it in front of anybody.
And I had a long conversation about this yesterday about
that being I have one concrete beer that I know
(16:00):
exactly what it is, and a lot of people are
thinking like, oh, I don't know, maybe this or maybe
this or maybe this. No, this is mine, and I
know exactly how to conquer it. It's just doing it.
So so how are you? How are you going to
conquer it? So I think it's just kind of taking
the steps to do it. Sing in front of one person,
and then three people, and then fifty people. I don't know.
(16:21):
I'm just gonna have to start taking the steps to
break that fear down. Because if you have a fear,
whether you think about it or not, it really does
dictate your everyday life. You're kind of holding yourself back,
you're limiting yourself even for that, like singing probably limits
myself and my relationships. It probably limits myself um when
(16:43):
I go after things in my career, you know, like
it really does bleed over. And so finding your fear
and going for it and not you don't have to
jump in completely if you need to take smaller steps,
take take smaller steps, but no that you can eventually
get to the end of it and it's going to
just create more space in your life. And you can
only take those small steps if you take the first one,
(17:03):
and that's identifying what your fear is or what that
one obstacle you want to overcome is. And you did
that with singing, and now you just have to take
those other steps. But the first, but that first step
is figuring out what it is. And that's what everyone
should do at some point, and the goal for everyone
this week is to figure out what that is and
to sign up for something that will help you overcome
that goal, whether it's running a half marathon and finding
(17:23):
a one that takes place in six months from now
and then setting a date and going for it. You know,
you have to start somewhere, right, You gotta start somewhere,
and when you do find it out, speak it, you know,
put it into awareness. Put it out there, Tell a friend,
tell a family member, because that's also you know, step one,
because you want someone to hold you accountable and maybe
ask you about it. So if you're not telling anybody,
(17:45):
then you're you're a little bit afraid to tell that
person anyway, just in case they're going to check in
with you and you still haven't done it. You know,
it's like, soh, tell somebody, put it out there, and
once you say it out loud, then it's real. If
you're just going over things in your head, those are
just random thoughts. But if you actually go to someone
you know and love and you tell them that, that
puts it out there in the world. Now it's real. Yep. Obviously,
(18:06):
on this podcast, I love when people email questions or
tweet questions, whatever it is. And this is the one
that actually held on for two weeks because I knew
you were going to be on the podcast, and I
think you're the perfect person to answer. This is from
a woman. Obviously, what's the best way for a woman
to start lifting weights? The weight section can be a
little intimidating And that was a direct email from someone. Yeah,
it can be intimidating, right, I mean, you walk into
a room and there's seventy five different kinds of weights
(18:28):
and bands and whatever it is. I would I would
start simple, like, you don't don't think you have to
go super heavy, don't think you have to go super lightly.
Let's let's start simple. And if it's you know, if
you want to work out your arms, do flies, you know,
or do bicep curls, or if you want to do legs,
just grab some weights and do some lunges with it. Like,
(18:49):
don't go in there thinking you have to do all
of these crazy movements, because I think in the day
and age of Instagram and everything, you see people go
in there and they're just they're hanging upside down with
one way by the foot and the other one in
there at hand, you know. So just go in there
and keep it as simple as possible. And once you
start to get more comfortable, you can advance and you
(19:10):
can make things a little bit more challenging. But go
in there, keep it simple, have some fun. Are there
any resources on that on it provides, like whether it's
a YouTube channel or a website or anything that people
can kind of get acquainted with stuff. Oh yeah, we
have tons of free online content. We just go to
on it dot com um, and then we have the
on it academy and I believe that's just on it
academy dot com and there's just tons of basically anything
(19:34):
you want to know about working out, if it's mobility,
if it's stretching, if it's weightlifting, if it's barbells, anything
and I dot com Yep, that's correct, n I T
dot com. Alright, what else do you have your ow?
Another question? And I love this because you can tell
where people's priorities are. What do you do to keep
a clean diet but still party and drink alcohol on
(19:54):
the weekends that they must follow me on Instagram? You
are You and your fiance are both people who are
very fit, but you still enjoy life. You still go
out there and and drink alcohol and go to parties
on the weekends and stuff. Yeah, yeah, you know, I do.
I really actually, I mean I enjoy it. I have
a good time. I like to go party. I like
(20:14):
to hang out with friends. I like to do dinners
and drink wine and espresso martinis and whatever else. Um.
But at the same time, I like to hit the
gym hard and I like to eat my body healthy.
So I think it's, you know, a balance, Like I
like to go out and have a good time, but
then the next day, um, I'm gonna have greens juice.
I'm gonna supplement my body properly. I'm gonna have like
(20:35):
some liver detoxifying UM drink or supplements UM eat fairly
healthy because I think that's where the kind of the
people get caught up is they go out and they
get hammered, and they hung over the next day and
they just decided to order pizza or burgers, and it
kind of perpeptuates the cycle, which is okay to do
every once in a while. But I think if you
(20:55):
go out in new party, like just think about it
the next day, I go to greens juice. At least
that you can easily do that and try to eat
a little bit healthy because you're you're already breaking your
body down. Alcohol is difficult for your body to process. Um,
So just be a little bit kinder to your body
the next day, and I think you'll you'll realize one
you're going to feel better, You're not gonna feel like
crap from eating crappy food. And then to the next
(21:17):
day you're probably gonna want to eat as healthy as
you did the first day, and it kind of just
perpetuates a positive cycle. So it's really just you can
break the cycle if you're having a good time, but
just get back onto it as quickly as possible. Absolutely,
Or if you know you're about to go out and party.
I drink greens juice all the time, but if I
know I'm having a big, you know, super fun weekend
of drinking and dancing and whatever else, I'm gonna have
(21:40):
greens juices like stocked. And you mentioned taking some supplements
here and there, and obviously on it offers supplements, but
could you talk about supplements and like, is there anything
that you always take or something that you take on
a certain day or after you drink, or something that
people should probably look into adding into their weekly or
daily regimen. Yeah, I mean, um, so if we're on it, particularly,
(22:01):
something I bring with me everywhere. It's in my purse
day in, day out, and I think it helps with
drinking and just detoxifying anyway, is our gut packs and
so it's like packed with prebiotics and probiotics, um and
different kind of liber detoxifying herbs and stuff and that
really helps me. How does that help? Yeah, No, it
(22:21):
just makes me feel better. If you ever have any
like tummy aches, or you get gassy, or you're eating
crappy food, it's just it'll help you digest all of that.
And when I say like digestive enzymes, some people think,
oh great, I'm gonna have to run to the bathroom
and for the rest of the day. No, no, no,
I don't mean that all. It just helps you digest
it a little bit easier, so you're not constipated or
(22:42):
you're not you know, you don't you don't feel gassy,
you don't feel floated. Um in your gut biome is
something that's extremely important to the other functions of your body.
It almost it dictates just about everything. And they're coming
out with crazy research on that and so just having
someone pack that has basically everything you need for gut
health makes it really easy for me. Well, this is
(23:03):
officially the second podcast in a row where someone's talking
about pooping. So there's that guy that going forward, pooping
is is important. So what else do you have coming up?
I know right now you're hosting for Glory Kickboxing. I am,
And then you were talking to me earlier about your
docuseries coming out on YouTube. Yeah, So on top of
(23:25):
everything else, I want, one thing I'm actually really passionate
about is talking about love, sex, and relationships because it's,
you know, something that we all deal with. We're either
in a relationship, or we want a relationship, or we
just got out of a relationship. Just what is how
it works? And so I'm doing a docuseries on YouTube
called Love Undressed, and I'm basically going through different um
(23:47):
topics when it pertains to love, sex and relationships and
breaking them down. So, for example, the first episode is
going to be on marriage, and I'm gonna ask the question,
is marriage broken? We'll talk to different experts in the field,
you will do some interviews, you'll kind of get my
you know, thoughts on it, and also just some ways
(24:07):
that can either help your marriage or a different way
of thinking. And just like all these different perspectives pertaining
to love, sex, relationships. And when does that start airing?
When does that go live on YouTube? So that should
go live next month in February. Don't really quite know,
but I was just maybe maybe Valentine's Day, now that
I'm thinking about it, i'd be appropriate, right, I think so, so, Whitney.
(24:29):
If people want to follow you, if they want to
just ask you questions personally, where can everyone kind of
follow along and see your whole journey? Um? So you
can follow me on Instagram. I'm pretty active on there,
and it's missed tu JITs M I S S the
number two j I T S and that stands for
miss United States to jiu Jitsu. Kind of how I
got that name. I'm a completely open book. So any
(24:51):
questions on love, sex, relationships, or fitness, or fighting or pageants, anything,
I'm completely open. I try to answer as many questions
as I've possibly can well listen. Thank you so so
very much for making some time out and recording this
podcast with me. Appreciate it, and uh, good luck with everything.
Good luck with the docuseries. Yeah, thanks so much. Ahead
of blast. So, as I'm gonna do on this podcast
(25:13):
every single week is I'm going to challenge you and
myself actually the same time two do something to better yourself.
So the first week it was to drink the appropriate
amount of water, which I know personally has made me
feel a lot better. The second challenge and podcast number
two is to make sure that we're getting enough sleep,
So for me, that was gonna be six hours of sleep.
(25:34):
I wake up around four or fifteen in the morning,
so I was trying to get to bed and be
asleep by ten. I haven't always fallen asleep at that time,
but I'm at least getting myself into bed now between
ten and ten fifteen, And it's actually easier for me
to fall asleep now because I'm on kind of that schedule.
This week is gonna be a little different. It's not
something you're gonna do week over week, um, but you're
(25:55):
gonna set up a challenge for yourself. You're gonna look
out at ahead and say, Okay, do I want to
run a five k a half marathon? Do I want
to try a triathlon? Do it? It doesn't have to
be anything physical, but those are just some good examples.
Do you want to go to an open mic night?
Do you want to go take a improv class? Sign
up for something that's gonna take a little bit of courage,
(26:18):
something that you don't do already. Maybe it's three three
months down the road, maybe it's six months down the road,
but before the year's over, find something that's gonna challenge
you and make sure you tell someone, tweet it, you
can even miss email me. Whatever you want to do,
make sure you tell someone so it becomes real. I
think that's kind of the whole theme here for this
specific podcast. Again, thank you so much for hanging out
(26:40):
with me. Make sure you follow along on the podcast
at the follow butt under the subscribe button depending on
what platform you're on. It'll be posted every single Wednesday
right here in I Heart Radio. And next week I
know I'm gonna have another diet person on the podcast,
So if you've got questions, hit me up at Worst Anthony, Facebook, Twitter, Snapchat,
Instagram at Worst Anthony, and you can always email my
(27:01):
Day Friday Show at gmail dot com. Thanks for hanging
out with me for another week. Have you ever looked
at a portrait and wondered? Who was this person? Really?
It's really a love story. Harriet was motivated by love
and he became known for his undercover reporting. He got
himself arrested. And also it's a tremendous dress. Ll L
(27:24):
cool J. I'm Kim said, director of the National Portrait
Gallery and your host on Portraits find us wherever you
get your podcasts
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