March 4, 2025 • 25 mins
Is the rise of AI making you uncomfortable? Does it make you wonder about how we will evolve as a species? What the effects will be on the human psyche? Does it make you question how the value of creativity will shift and change as AI takes over?
These questions are valuable ones to ask and answer while we navigate this wild new world we’re living in.
And yet on today’s episode, I want to offer an interesting take on AI that you may not have heard elsewhere. While asking the hard questions about AI is certainly a vital part of the conversation, it’s might also be valuable to consider how AI might remind us what it means to be human in the first place.
What if AI reminds us why creativity matters so much?
What if our resistance to AI is helping us resolve our fears?
I hope you enjoy these candid and casual reflections as the widespread use of AI expands in real time.
Host: Ally Fallon // @allyfallon // allisonfallon.com
Follow Ally on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/allyfallon/
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Pick up the pieces of your life, put them back
together with the words you write. All the beauty and
peace and the magic that you'll start too fun.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
When you write your story.
Speaker 3 (00:13):
You got the.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
Words and said, don't you think it's down to let
them out and write them down on cold It's all
about and write, write your story. Write, write your story.
Speaker 3 (00:29):
Hi, and welcome back to the Write Your Story Podcast.
I'm Ali Fallon, I'm your host, and I'm here today
to talk to you about a topic that keeps coming
up again and again and again in my personal life
and all around me. And I'm sure it's coming up
for you too, and so I want to address it.
I've avoided addressing it because the part of me I'm
an enneagram for and I hate doing the popular thing.
(00:51):
But I'm gonna just get over myself for a second,
get over my false self, and my true self is
here to talk to you about the influence of AI
on creativity.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
This is a.
Speaker 3 (01:01):
Topic of conversation that has just like flooded into the
popular culture scene in the last couple of months with
the development of technology. Rightfully, so, I mean we're all
just kind of asking the questions, what is this going
to mean for us? What is it going to mean
for me as an employee, as a worker, as a
creative person, as a contributor to society. How is this
(01:21):
going to change the way that we see ourselves? How
is it going to change the way that we show up?
And I feel like the only area where I really
feel qualified to speak on this is through the lens
of creativity. I want to talk about the impact that
AI is going to have on our creativity, and in particular,
I want to talk about this because I think my
take is going to be a little bit different than
probably a lot of what you've heard. A lot of
(01:43):
what I hear out there in popular culture right now
is a very protective energy around creative work, which makes
sense and is important and is a fair perspective. I'm
not refuting that perspective. I'm not saying that it's wrong
the respective of like, hey, creative people, we work really
hard to write our books and to write our screenplays
(02:04):
and to you know, to make this creative stuff that
people get to enjoy, and art brings such life and
vitality to people's lives, and this needs to be protected.
AI can't just come in and learn from how we
do it and then do it in you know, a
fraction of the time, like a minute, little tiny fraction
of the time. Da da da da da, like put
(02:26):
together a book and then spit it out, and then
authors all lose their royalties. Like that's not fair. And
that's a lot of what I've heard, and the screenwriters
have said the same thing, you know, like like these
big companies can't cut the corner and not pay us
to write the script and just hire AI to write
the script, then what about us? These are all fair
(02:46):
concerns and complaints and an absolutely important part of the conversation.
And also since that conversation is already happening, what I
want to do is share a bit of an alternative perspective.
So yes and yes, and this that I want to
talk about today. What I want to talk about today
is the flip side of what AI can do for creativity.
(03:08):
And I'll share this just from my personal lens, of
my personal perspective. I'm by no means an expert on AI.
In fact, like technology and me are sometimes not totally friends.
I spent my whole life laughing at my mom that
she could never figure out how to work the remote
control for the TV, and now I'm the one who
can never figure out how to work remote controls for
pretty much anything, and so I'm not like a huge
techie person. I'm not informed enough to make any kind
(03:30):
of predictions about where AI is headed or where we're
going or any of that. I want to speak more
through my own personal lens, like the way that I've
been using AI for the past couple of months and
how I've seen it impact me as a creative person.
And then i want to share a conclusion that I've
come to that's not like a final, final conclusion. This
(03:50):
is the conclusion, but it's just a way to think
about our interplay with AI that might bring you a
little bit of relief and hope. So my main interaction
with AI has been through chat GPT. I would imagine
if you're not a super techy person, that's probably your
interaction with AI too. In fact, if you're not a
super techy person, you might not even be using chat GPT.
(04:11):
I am using it mostly because my husband is much
more techy than I am, and he is the one
who kind of brought my attention to the fact that
chat GPT is super helpful. Look, it can help you
write this email. It can help you, you know, come
up with ideas for your business. It can help you
make a budget, it can help you whatever. So I
was like, this is cool, this is fun. Like things
that are hard for me are very easy for chat GPT,
(04:33):
and I can just kind of type it in there
and it spits out a rough draft of something, and
it can act like scaffolding for me to get to
where I'm trying to go. One of the ways that
I use chat GPT fairly regularly is my kids, who
are three and four, started asking for these bedtime stories
where they wanted their stuffed animals to be included in
(04:54):
the bedtime story. So they wanted a story about the
two of them, and they wanted their My son has
a little puppy who he calls very creative there, and
my daughter has a unicorn that she calls Uni, again
super creative names. So they wanted a bedtime story where
Puppy and Uni were in the story. While Matt and
I were telling these stories over and over again, night
after night, and I just kind of ran out of
(05:15):
ideas for what puppy and Uni should do, and so
I asked chat GPT. I said can you tell me
a children's story appropriate for a three and four year
old that includes a brother and sister named Nella and
Charlie that are three and four and also includes their
stuffed animals, Uni and Puppy, And you know, fed the
information into chat GBT, and chat GBT literally spat out
(05:37):
these amazing fun stories for my kids that are like
a series of adventures that Nella and Charlie and Union
and Puppy go on. And the stories are called the
Adventures of Uni and Puppy, but they are a series.
I can ask for a story each night and Chattchebet
spits out the story, and it's so fun and expansive
to see how something that I was like laboring so
(05:59):
hard art over to try to think of, like what
else are Uni and Puppy going to do? And now
GPT thinks of all these fun things that they do
in Nashville together that I wouldn't have ever thought of.
And it's just been a really sweet, fun way to
interact with the kids. They love it. They think it's
so fun that they get these new stories every night.
Another way that I've used chat GPT is a prompt
that I got from my friend Koula, who was telling
(06:22):
me about how you can start this thread in chat
GPT that you call your advisory board or your board
of directors or whatever you want to call it, and
you basically select real people from real life who are
public figures of some kind or authors or whatever, who
you respect and admire, who if you had access to
every human being in the world, these are the people
that you would put on your board of directors. So
(06:43):
maybe you pick someone who's like your spirituality guide and
that's you know, for me, like Marian Williamson or Richard
Rorer or something. And then you pick someone who is
your business guide. And then you pick someone who is
your relationship guide. So you build this board of directors.
You pick real people from real life, but you don't
have to actually know them in real life, and then
you input this prompt into chat GBT and I'll read
(07:05):
you my prompt here in just a second. That creates
an opportunity for you to ask this board of directors
any question that you want and to get a response
from each of the members of the board, so you
could ask them. You know, I have this big decision
to make in my life. I was offered a job
should I take the job or should I not take
the job? Or you know, I'm in this relationship. I've
been in it for three years and I've been mostly happy,
(07:26):
but the last six months I've been very unhappy. What
would you suggest that I do? So you can ask
these questions instid of chat GBT and your board of
directors will answer for you. So basically, chat GBT goes
to source all this information from these public figures and
will tell you. You know, this person says this is the
advice that they give you, and this other person gives
you this advice. So I'll read you here in just
(07:47):
a second that prompt, so you can try this if
you want. But it's been really, really fun, Okay, So
here's the prompt. The prompt says, this thread will be
used to simulate a group chat with my personal board
of directors. It includes the following people and you list
all their names. I've chosen them for their perspectives, expertise, values,
and because I believe they will help make my life
better and provide thoughtful counsel through specific challenges. For each
(08:10):
question or challenge I present, please provide a detailed reply
from each person's perspective, use all available knowledge of their expertise,
how they think, and specific quotes or principles they are
known for. Each response should include their advice action items
based on their perspective, an explanation of why they are
suggesting this approach. So I've used this threat a bunch
(08:31):
of different times in chat GBT to just you know,
sometimes I'm asking like not fake questions, but like questions
where I kind of already know the answer, but I'm
just curious to see what each of these people would say.
And then there also have been times where I'm asking
a genuine question. It's like I don't know what to
do next with this issue, and so I'm just going
to see, like what would David White, who's one of
the people on my list, what would he say? What
(08:51):
would Mary and Williamson say? What would Richard Rohrer say?
What would Mary Oliver say? What would an LaMotte say?
You can include anybody that you want on this list,
And it's just such a fun con to get to
think that you're in a way interacting with these people.
You're not really, but you're interacting with their ideas in
a way where you wouldn't really get to do that
in real life. So if you haven't done that already,
if you haven't used chat GBT already, this could be
(09:13):
a good reason to give it a shot. At least.
The other thing I've used chat GPT for is asking
it a question about a creative project that I'm working on.
So I've asked it like, Okay, if I were going
to write a book about X subject, and I wanted
it to be like this, and I wanted it to
have this kind of element to it, but I really
wanted to take this new twist on it. You know,
what kind of outline would you give me? And I've
(09:35):
really been doing this from a place more of curiosity
than anything. I haven't been seriously outlining a book recently,
but I just was curious to see what chat gbt
would come up with. And it's really fascinating to think
that you could input your ideas into chat GBT and
chat gpt could kind of create some clarity for you,
almost do like what I do for an author, like
(09:57):
ask you more questions or create more clarity, or spit
out a rough draft of an outline that you could
then interact with. So it's not just AI doing it
for you, it's you interacting with AI and creating something
out of nothing. Again, I haven't done this seriously with
a book that I'm actually writing, but I've just played
with it a little bit because I've been very curious
(10:18):
to see what chat GBT or other AI platforms might
be capable of. So all about to say that's my
very elementary experience with chat GBT. That's just me kind
of playing and seeing what's possible. But it's brought up
(10:41):
a lot of conversations in our household with Matt and
I about what is this going to mean for creative people.
One of the things we've talked a lot about is
if AI gets involved in book writing, you know, what
is that going to do for my coaching programs, my career,
my job me as a coach. And it's kind of
(11:01):
interesting timing because I also have taken this step back
from coaching. But it has made me think about, like, Okay,
if this is my livelihood, and if there are other
people who are feeling this way, like this is my
livelihood and AI comes in and takes that over, I
can at least see why this would feel threatening to
people and threatening to creative people. And yet, as Matt
(11:22):
and I were talking about it. One of the things
that I started to realize was that my motivation for
doing creative work really isn't about the final product. And
this is probably not surprising to you. If you've been
around here a long time, if you've been listening to
this podcast, or if you've followed me on Instagram, or
you've been on my email list, it's probably not shocking
to you to hear me say that my motivation is
(11:43):
not about the finished product. To me, one of the
things that came out in my conversations with Matt around
Ai and this sort of threat of AI taking over
book writing was even if AI could write me a
New York Times best selling book in a matter of minutes,
which in a way I believe that AI could do
(12:03):
that sooner than later. If not now, even if AI
could do it, I would still want to do it.
I'm not saying I wouldn't take any help. I wouldn't.
I'm not saying I wouldn't take an assist in writing
the outline or something like that, or you know, cleaning
up a piece of writing or something. But I'm telling
you I would still want to be the one even
if AI could do it. For me if you were like, Hey,
(12:26):
here's the deal. AI can do this for you. You
just plug in your idea. It's going to write you
this book. It's going to hit the New York Times List,
it's going to make you famous. You're going to make
millions of dollars. I would still be like, I'm going
to do it. And it's not because I am a
glutton for punishment or just want things to be harder.
It makes me think about this conversation that my friend
and I had at dinner the other night when we
(12:47):
were celebrating her birthday. She was talking about how she
went to much Peach, you the Mayan ruins that are
in Peru, and she was like, oh god, it was
so annoying. It was so commercialized. It was the worst
thing ever. I expected to be the amazing spiritual experience
and it just wasn't that. And I was like, Oh, really,
tell me more about that, because I'm like, I went
to Machipichu, you know, I know it's been even more
(13:08):
commercialized over time, and I went several years ago, so
I was like, maybe it's a time difference is how
we're getting our wires cross. But I had a totally
different experience at Machipichu, and she was like, yeah, I
mean I just like I took the train up there
and I got off and it was super expensive. There
are all these people trying to make money off of you,
and I just got there and it just like didn't
have the zing that I wanted it to have. And
(13:29):
I was like, oh, I'm like, I think that the
difference is and this is no shade on her at all,
but the difference is I hiked to Machu Pichu. It
took me four days. I hiked three days in from
Portan and Talis to I can't remember the name of
the city now, and then hiked the final day the
fourth day, from the bottom of the mountain to the top.
(13:53):
It's like a several thousand foot elevation gain, and then
once you get into the park, there's even another thousand
feet that you can hike to the top of the ruin.
And I hiked every last inch of that with my
own feet, and then carried myself all the way down
with a backpack on. I left my heavy backpack at
the campsite on the night that we hiked up to Machipichu.
(14:15):
So the last day I carried a much lighter pack,
but for the rest of it, I carried a forty
pound pack on my back from Port Natalis all the
way into I don't know, I can't think of the
name of the city right now, but at the base
of the mountain of Matchipichu. So I did that forty
pounds on my pack three days in get to the base,
you know, exhausted, tired, think you can't move another muscle,
drop your bag there. We literally slept from eight pm
(14:38):
until four am. You have to if you want to
beat the buses to the top of the mountain, you
have to wake up at the crack of dawn, like
it's not even light out yet. I'm wearing a head lamp.
I'm with a couple friends hiking up to the top
of the mountain. You have to beat the buses up
there because they only let I think it's like two
hundred people in each day, and so if the buses
beat you, there's no way the hikers are going to
get in. So the hikers have to get up before
(14:59):
the buses. So we hike from like four to six thirty,
beat the buses up there. They get there at seven something,
get into the park. My friend is like, do you
want to hike to the top of the ruins? And
in my head, I'm like, there's no way my body
can do that, but yes I do because this is
my one time in my life I'm going to be
at Machu Picchu. So We're gonna hike to the freaking
top of this thing. So I hike to the top
(15:21):
with my friends see it from the top. It's the
most spectacular experience. I just feel like every neuron is firing.
I'm like, Oh, I'm in heaven. This is the most
amazing thing I've ever done in my life. I'm so
proud of myself. I'm feeling so confident. We hike down
the mountain. I was just on cloud nine. I was
like in absolute bliss for the rest of the day,
(15:41):
the rest of the week. It was the most incredible experience,
and I was like, I think that's the difference. I
think because I had to give so much in order
to get there, I think I received so much more
from the experience. And yes, there were parts of it
that were commercialized and that's annoying, but also, you know,
I carried myself up there with my own two feet,
(16:02):
and she said something that I thought was so profound.
She's like, that proves that it was always you. It
was never machu pichu. Like the elation, that feeling of euphoria.
It was always you. It was always in you. It
had nothing to do with machu pichu. It had everything
to do with you. And I was just like, Oh,
my gosh, my mind is blown. You're so right about that.
(16:24):
That view is the same view I have about book writing.
It's like someone else could do it for you, and
I listen. I was a ghostwriter for years. I was
really like, very off put by the idea of ghostwriting
when it was first introduced to me. And then I
became a ghostwriter and I was like, actually, ghostwriters are amazing.
We get to come together with these brilliant ideas. We
use our set of skills, they bring their set of skills.
(16:45):
I get to interact with these people who are so incredible,
and there is something to be said about that. It's
an amazing collaboration between a ghostwriter and an author. And
I've ghost written ten books, so no shade on ghostwriting
at all. But for the sake of the analogy, you
can either hire a ghost writer kind of outsource this thing,
(17:06):
touch it as little as possible, get someone else to
do it, and get on the New York Times list
and make a bunch of money, and that's that, And
it's not really a spiritual, creative experience. Or you can
do it your friggin self and you can walk your
own two feet up there, and you're gonna think you're
never gonna make it. It's gonna feel like you're never
gonna make it, and you're gonna be like, I couldn't
possibly take one more step, and then you do take
(17:27):
one more step, and the feeling of arriving at the
top of the ruins is just like euphoric, Like you're
just like like, how life is so amazing. I'm so incredible.
God is like, you know, just the biggest thing I
could ever understand. And I'm just here. I am what
an incredible life that I get to live. And the
(17:48):
gratitude that rushes in and the confidence is just so
all consuming. So you can do it either way. It's like, yeah,
there's the option to take the buses to the top
of the mountain, but it's not going to feel the
same when you're in the park. You know, you can
pay you can have someone drive you up there, you
can pay to get in the park, you can take
a quick look around, and you can be like, check
(18:10):
check off my bucket list Machu peach you or you know,
you can hike up from the bottom of the mountain.
And again, I'm not saying that there's anything wrong with
hiring a ghostwriter, or with using AI to to help
you write your book, or even with using AI to
write your book. A part of me feels like I
do understand the protectiveness around the craft, and we have
(18:30):
to create some restraints that help people operate with integrity
and honesty with the introduction of AI. And yet part
of me's like, yeah, great if they want to do that,
if they want to take the easy way. Whoever wants
to take the bus up to the top of Machipeachu, Like,
You're feel free, You're welcome, You're not stealing anything from me.
I'm going to hike from the bottom because I'm gonna
(18:52):
I'm in it for the spiritual experience. I'm not in
it to just simply see the thing and check it
off of my bucket list. And this is my view
of creativity that makes me unafraid of the introduction of AI,
because AI can never take that from me. AI can
never take from me. What I believe is an absolute,
(19:12):
inbuilt biological mechanism, a need for creativity, a need to
make something out of nothing, a need to connect with ourselves.
And I believe that I did that when I hiked
to the top of Machu Pichu, and I believe I
do that every single time I write a book. And
it's why I teach people to write their own books.
It's why I teach the courses that I teach, It's
(19:33):
why I've been coaching and doing this work for so long.
It's why, in some ways I've gotten somewhat fed up
with the publishing industry as a whole, because it sort
of feels like it doesn't satisfy the itch, it doesn't
scratch the itch that I have to be in touch
with my creative nature to make something out of nothing.
There's nothing wrong with it. It is not I don't
(19:53):
have to villainize it in order to say I just
am hungry for something deeper. I'm just hungry for something
to yeah, to connect with that part of myself that
wants to make something. And I wonder if the reason
that you're here is because you're hungry for that too,
And does AI take that away from us? No, I
don't think it does. I mean I think AI can
(20:14):
be a helpful tool. It can be a scaffolding. It
can prop us up in areas where like we don't
have the skills, and also we can hike to the
top of the mountain by ourselves. It's like, do you
want to hike to the mountain by yourself with your
own pack? Do you want to hire a shirpa and
have them carry your pack and you hike to the mountain.
That's one way to do it too. There's no wrong
way to do it. Do you want to ride the
(20:36):
bus to the top of the mountain and listen, there
are certain people who the only way that they would
ever get to see mu Chipichu is if they ride
the bus to the top of the mountain. So there's
nothing wrong with riding that bus at the top of
the mountain. Like, we can't judge that. It's just a
matter of asking yourself, how do I want to do this,
how do I want to live this experience? What is
my motivation for writing this book, what is my motivation
(20:58):
for making this creative project? And listen. If your motivation
is to make a bunch of money, if your motivation
is to get famous, if your motivation is to hit
the New York Times list, if your motivation is to
feel cool and good about yourself, then maybe AI is
a great way to do that because you might not
have the skills on your own to write the book
without AI. And again I'm going to reiterate, I do
(21:21):
think it's important for there to be some kind of
guardrails around, like what's allowed with AI, Like how do
we protect intellectual property with the introduction of AI. That
stuff is important and it will happen eventually. I mean,
we're kind of in the very very beginning stages of
this right now, but I do believe that these guardrails
will be introduced in the meantime. We're in the wild West.
It's like, yeah, whatever goes goes, Like whatever you want
(21:43):
to do, and so in that period of time, if
you want to leverage AI to write a book for
you so that you can, like I said, make a
bunch of money, get on the New York Times list,
do whatever you want to do that is one hundred
percent at your disposal. It's kind of freaky how much
is at your disposal. And yet, if you have that innate,
(22:03):
biological built I believe it's biological and built in, it
may not be. I only have my perspective to share from,
so I don't have the science to back that up.
I don't know if it's innate and biological. To me,
it feels like an absolute necessity that I must make
stuff that I must create. And I don't know if
everybody has that. But if you have that, if you're here,
(22:26):
you probably have it, because that's probably what has drawn
you to me. And if you do have that, then
I'll tell you that having AI write your book for
you is not going to scratch the itch. It may
check the item off your bucket list, but it's not
going to scratch that itch. And the itch will still
be there until you scratch it. And so I just
want to challenge you to think about it that way,
(22:47):
that AI is a cool tool that we can use
for all kinds of different stuff. You know, it's been
really nice to have it tell children's stories to my kids,
because by seven thirty at night, when I'm doing bedtime
and I've done so many my brain has worked so
hard all day. Sometimes it's just like, yeah, I don't
think my brain is going to come up with a
very interesting story right now, So we're going to use
chat GPT. It's gonna give us at a little alley oop.
(23:10):
Is that the right term? I shouldn't use sports analogies
when I don't know, like a little set up, a layup.
It's like a little yeah, a little setup for the spike. Again,
bad sports analogies. I don't know, but I'm picturing like
someone like setting it up for you to spike the ball. Yeah,
it's nice. It's like a little lift to help you
tell a story to your kids at night, So use
it for that. But if you have the itch to
(23:33):
make something from scratch, doing it with AI, I don't
think is going to scratch that itch. Now collaborating with
AI might scratch the itch. I think. Because it's so new,
we're all going to have to experiment with how things
feel and what works and what doesn't work. And again,
those guardrails will be introduced at some point so that
there can be some integrity around this and we can
(23:53):
know like who was this written by? Was a written
by AI? Was A written by a person? Until then,
ask yourself the question what am I here for? What
am I doing this for? What am I writing a
book for? What am I making things for? Am I
what's my motivation to create something? And if it's to
be in touch with yourself, if it's to feel that
(24:14):
feeling of euphoria like I Friakin did it, I'm at
the top of majupet you. I cannot believe myself and
to connect with that confidence and connect with that soul
and spirit in you, and to feel connected to the
greatness of all things, then yeah, AI is not going
to do that for you. If it's to hit the
New York Times list, then sure, yeah, AI might be
(24:35):
very helpful, especially in this interim before we have specific rules.
So just reflect on that, think about that a little bit,
and hopefully this brings you a little bit of lightness
to the idea of AI that we don't have to
feel quite so threatened that AI cannot compromise my innate,
biologically built in drive to create. I'll see you next
(24:58):
week on The Very Story podcast.
Pick up the pieces of your life, put them back
together with the words you write. All the beauty and
peace and the magic that you'll start too fun.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
When you write your story.
Speaker 3 (00:13):
You got the.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
Words and said, don't you think it's down to let
them out and write them down on cold It's all
about and write, write your story. Write, write your story.
Speaker 3 (00:29):
Hi, and welcome back to the Write Your Story Podcast.
I'm Ali Fallon, I'm your host, and I'm here today
to talk to you about a topic that keeps coming
up again and again and again in my personal life
and all around me. And I'm sure it's coming up
for you too, and so I want to address it.
I've avoided addressing it because the part of me I'm
an enneagram for and I hate doing the popular thing.
(00:51):
But I'm gonna just get over myself for a second,
get over my false self, and my true self is
here to talk to you about the influence of AI
on creativity.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
This is a.
Speaker 3 (01:01):
Topic of conversation that has just like flooded into the
popular culture scene in the last couple of months with
the development of technology. Rightfully, so, I mean we're all
just kind of asking the questions, what is this going
to mean for us? What is it going to mean
for me as an employee, as a worker, as a
creative person, as a contributor to society. How is this
(01:21):
going to change the way that we see ourselves? How
is it going to change the way that we show up?
And I feel like the only area where I really
feel qualified to speak on this is through the lens
of creativity. I want to talk about the impact that
AI is going to have on our creativity, and in particular,
I want to talk about this because I think my
take is going to be a little bit different than
probably a lot of what you've heard. A lot of
(01:43):
what I hear out there in popular culture right now
is a very protective energy around creative work, which makes
sense and is important and is a fair perspective. I'm
not refuting that perspective. I'm not saying that it's wrong
the respective of like, hey, creative people, we work really
hard to write our books and to write our screenplays
(02:04):
and to you know, to make this creative stuff that
people get to enjoy, and art brings such life and
vitality to people's lives, and this needs to be protected.
AI can't just come in and learn from how we
do it and then do it in you know, a
fraction of the time, like a minute, little tiny fraction
of the time. Da da da da da, like put
(02:26):
together a book and then spit it out, and then
authors all lose their royalties. Like that's not fair. And
that's a lot of what I've heard, and the screenwriters
have said the same thing, you know, like like these
big companies can't cut the corner and not pay us
to write the script and just hire AI to write
the script, then what about us? These are all fair
(02:46):
concerns and complaints and an absolutely important part of the conversation.
And also since that conversation is already happening, what I
want to do is share a bit of an alternative perspective.
So yes and yes, and this that I want to
talk about today. What I want to talk about today
is the flip side of what AI can do for creativity.
(03:08):
And I'll share this just from my personal lens, of
my personal perspective. I'm by no means an expert on AI.
In fact, like technology and me are sometimes not totally friends.
I spent my whole life laughing at my mom that
she could never figure out how to work the remote
control for the TV, and now I'm the one who
can never figure out how to work remote controls for
pretty much anything, and so I'm not like a huge
techie person. I'm not informed enough to make any kind
(03:30):
of predictions about where AI is headed or where we're
going or any of that. I want to speak more
through my own personal lens, like the way that I've
been using AI for the past couple of months and
how I've seen it impact me as a creative person.
And then i want to share a conclusion that I've
come to that's not like a final, final conclusion. This
(03:50):
is the conclusion, but it's just a way to think
about our interplay with AI that might bring you a
little bit of relief and hope. So my main interaction
with AI has been through chat GPT. I would imagine
if you're not a super techy person, that's probably your
interaction with AI too. In fact, if you're not a
super techy person, you might not even be using chat GPT.
(04:11):
I am using it mostly because my husband is much
more techy than I am, and he is the one
who kind of brought my attention to the fact that
chat GPT is super helpful. Look, it can help you
write this email. It can help you, you know, come
up with ideas for your business. It can help you
make a budget, it can help you whatever. So I
was like, this is cool, this is fun. Like things
that are hard for me are very easy for chat GPT,
(04:33):
and I can just kind of type it in there
and it spits out a rough draft of something, and
it can act like scaffolding for me to get to
where I'm trying to go. One of the ways that
I use chat GPT fairly regularly is my kids, who
are three and four, started asking for these bedtime stories
where they wanted their stuffed animals to be included in
(04:54):
the bedtime story. So they wanted a story about the
two of them, and they wanted their My son has
a little puppy who he calls very creative there, and
my daughter has a unicorn that she calls Uni, again
super creative names. So they wanted a bedtime story where
Puppy and Uni were in the story. While Matt and
I were telling these stories over and over again, night
after night, and I just kind of ran out of
(05:15):
ideas for what puppy and Uni should do, and so
I asked chat GPT. I said can you tell me
a children's story appropriate for a three and four year
old that includes a brother and sister named Nella and
Charlie that are three and four and also includes their
stuffed animals, Uni and Puppy, And you know, fed the
information into chat GBT, and chat GBT literally spat out
(05:37):
these amazing fun stories for my kids that are like
a series of adventures that Nella and Charlie and Union
and Puppy go on. And the stories are called the
Adventures of Uni and Puppy, but they are a series.
I can ask for a story each night and Chattchebet
spits out the story, and it's so fun and expansive
to see how something that I was like laboring so
(05:59):
hard art over to try to think of, like what
else are Uni and Puppy going to do? And now
GPT thinks of all these fun things that they do
in Nashville together that I wouldn't have ever thought of.
And it's just been a really sweet, fun way to
interact with the kids. They love it. They think it's
so fun that they get these new stories every night.
Another way that I've used chat GPT is a prompt
that I got from my friend Koula, who was telling
(06:22):
me about how you can start this thread in chat
GPT that you call your advisory board or your board
of directors or whatever you want to call it, and
you basically select real people from real life who are
public figures of some kind or authors or whatever, who
you respect and admire, who if you had access to
every human being in the world, these are the people
that you would put on your board of directors. So
(06:43):
maybe you pick someone who's like your spirituality guide and
that's you know, for me, like Marian Williamson or Richard
Rorer or something. And then you pick someone who is
your business guide. And then you pick someone who is
your relationship guide. So you build this board of directors.
You pick real people from real life, but you don't
have to actually know them in real life, and then
you input this prompt into chat GBT and I'll read
(07:05):
you my prompt here in just a second. That creates
an opportunity for you to ask this board of directors
any question that you want and to get a response
from each of the members of the board, so you
could ask them. You know, I have this big decision
to make in my life. I was offered a job
should I take the job or should I not take
the job? Or you know, I'm in this relationship. I've
been in it for three years and I've been mostly happy,
(07:26):
but the last six months I've been very unhappy. What
would you suggest that I do? So you can ask
these questions instid of chat GBT and your board of
directors will answer for you. So basically, chat GBT goes
to source all this information from these public figures and
will tell you. You know, this person says this is the
advice that they give you, and this other person gives
you this advice. So I'll read you here in just
(07:47):
a second that prompt, so you can try this if
you want. But it's been really, really fun, Okay, So
here's the prompt. The prompt says, this thread will be
used to simulate a group chat with my personal board
of directors. It includes the following people and you list
all their names. I've chosen them for their perspectives, expertise, values,
and because I believe they will help make my life
better and provide thoughtful counsel through specific challenges. For each
(08:10):
question or challenge I present, please provide a detailed reply
from each person's perspective, use all available knowledge of their expertise,
how they think, and specific quotes or principles they are
known for. Each response should include their advice action items
based on their perspective, an explanation of why they are
suggesting this approach. So I've used this threat a bunch
(08:31):
of different times in chat GBT to just you know,
sometimes I'm asking like not fake questions, but like questions
where I kind of already know the answer, but I'm
just curious to see what each of these people would say.
And then there also have been times where I'm asking
a genuine question. It's like I don't know what to
do next with this issue, and so I'm just going
to see, like what would David White, who's one of
the people on my list, what would he say? What
(08:51):
would Mary and Williamson say? What would Richard Rohrer say?
What would Mary Oliver say? What would an LaMotte say?
You can include anybody that you want on this list,
And it's just such a fun con to get to
think that you're in a way interacting with these people.
You're not really, but you're interacting with their ideas in
a way where you wouldn't really get to do that
in real life. So if you haven't done that already,
if you haven't used chat GBT already, this could be
(09:13):
a good reason to give it a shot. At least.
The other thing I've used chat GPT for is asking
it a question about a creative project that I'm working on.
So I've asked it like, Okay, if I were going
to write a book about X subject, and I wanted
it to be like this, and I wanted it to
have this kind of element to it, but I really
wanted to take this new twist on it. You know,
what kind of outline would you give me? And I've
(09:35):
really been doing this from a place more of curiosity
than anything. I haven't been seriously outlining a book recently,
but I just was curious to see what chat gbt
would come up with. And it's really fascinating to think
that you could input your ideas into chat GBT and
chat gpt could kind of create some clarity for you,
almost do like what I do for an author, like
(09:57):
ask you more questions or create more clarity, or spit
out a rough draft of an outline that you could
then interact with. So it's not just AI doing it
for you, it's you interacting with AI and creating something
out of nothing. Again, I haven't done this seriously with
a book that I'm actually writing, but I've just played
with it a little bit because I've been very curious
(10:18):
to see what chat GBT or other AI platforms might
be capable of. So all about to say that's my
very elementary experience with chat GBT. That's just me kind
of playing and seeing what's possible. But it's brought up
(10:41):
a lot of conversations in our household with Matt and
I about what is this going to mean for creative people.
One of the things we've talked a lot about is
if AI gets involved in book writing, you know, what
is that going to do for my coaching programs, my career,
my job me as a coach. And it's kind of
(11:01):
interesting timing because I also have taken this step back
from coaching. But it has made me think about, like, Okay,
if this is my livelihood, and if there are other
people who are feeling this way, like this is my
livelihood and AI comes in and takes that over, I
can at least see why this would feel threatening to
people and threatening to creative people. And yet, as Matt
(11:22):
and I were talking about it. One of the things
that I started to realize was that my motivation for
doing creative work really isn't about the final product. And
this is probably not surprising to you. If you've been
around here a long time, if you've been listening to
this podcast, or if you've followed me on Instagram, or
you've been on my email list, it's probably not shocking
to you to hear me say that my motivation is
(11:43):
not about the finished product. To me, one of the
things that came out in my conversations with Matt around
Ai and this sort of threat of AI taking over
book writing was even if AI could write me a
New York Times best selling book in a matter of minutes,
which in a way I believe that AI could do
(12:03):
that sooner than later. If not now, even if AI
could do it, I would still want to do it.
I'm not saying I wouldn't take any help. I wouldn't.
I'm not saying I wouldn't take an assist in writing
the outline or something like that, or you know, cleaning
up a piece of writing or something. But I'm telling
you I would still want to be the one even
if AI could do it. For me if you were like, Hey,
(12:26):
here's the deal. AI can do this for you. You
just plug in your idea. It's going to write you
this book. It's going to hit the New York Times List,
it's going to make you famous. You're going to make
millions of dollars. I would still be like, I'm going
to do it. And it's not because I am a
glutton for punishment or just want things to be harder.
It makes me think about this conversation that my friend
and I had at dinner the other night when we
(12:47):
were celebrating her birthday. She was talking about how she
went to much Peach, you the Mayan ruins that are
in Peru, and she was like, oh god, it was
so annoying. It was so commercialized. It was the worst
thing ever. I expected to be the amazing spiritual experience
and it just wasn't that. And I was like, Oh, really,
tell me more about that, because I'm like, I went
to Machipichu, you know, I know it's been even more
(13:08):
commercialized over time, and I went several years ago, so
I was like, maybe it's a time difference is how
we're getting our wires cross. But I had a totally
different experience at Machipichu, and she was like, yeah, I
mean I just like I took the train up there
and I got off and it was super expensive. There
are all these people trying to make money off of you,
and I just got there and it just like didn't
have the zing that I wanted it to have. And
(13:29):
I was like, oh, I'm like, I think that the
difference is and this is no shade on her at all,
but the difference is I hiked to Machu Pichu. It
took me four days. I hiked three days in from
Portan and Talis to I can't remember the name of
the city now, and then hiked the final day the
fourth day, from the bottom of the mountain to the top.
(13:53):
It's like a several thousand foot elevation gain, and then
once you get into the park, there's even another thousand
feet that you can hike to the top of the ruin.
And I hiked every last inch of that with my
own feet, and then carried myself all the way down
with a backpack on. I left my heavy backpack at
the campsite on the night that we hiked up to Machipichu.
(14:15):
So the last day I carried a much lighter pack,
but for the rest of it, I carried a forty
pound pack on my back from Port Natalis all the
way into I don't know, I can't think of the
name of the city right now, but at the base
of the mountain of Matchipichu. So I did that forty
pounds on my pack three days in get to the base,
you know, exhausted, tired, think you can't move another muscle,
drop your bag there. We literally slept from eight pm
(14:38):
until four am. You have to if you want to
beat the buses to the top of the mountain, you
have to wake up at the crack of dawn, like
it's not even light out yet. I'm wearing a head lamp.
I'm with a couple friends hiking up to the top
of the mountain. You have to beat the buses up
there because they only let I think it's like two
hundred people in each day, and so if the buses
beat you, there's no way the hikers are going to
get in. So the hikers have to get up before
(14:59):
the buses. So we hike from like four to six thirty,
beat the buses up there. They get there at seven something,
get into the park. My friend is like, do you
want to hike to the top of the ruins? And
in my head, I'm like, there's no way my body
can do that, but yes I do because this is
my one time in my life I'm going to be
at Machu Picchu. So We're gonna hike to the freaking
top of this thing. So I hike to the top
(15:21):
with my friends see it from the top. It's the
most spectacular experience. I just feel like every neuron is firing.
I'm like, Oh, I'm in heaven. This is the most
amazing thing I've ever done in my life. I'm so
proud of myself. I'm feeling so confident. We hike down
the mountain. I was just on cloud nine. I was
like in absolute bliss for the rest of the day,
(15:41):
the rest of the week. It was the most incredible experience,
and I was like, I think that's the difference. I
think because I had to give so much in order
to get there, I think I received so much more
from the experience. And yes, there were parts of it
that were commercialized and that's annoying, but also, you know,
I carried myself up there with my own two feet,
(16:02):
and she said something that I thought was so profound.
She's like, that proves that it was always you. It
was never machu pichu. Like the elation, that feeling of euphoria.
It was always you. It was always in you. It
had nothing to do with machu pichu. It had everything
to do with you. And I was just like, Oh,
my gosh, my mind is blown. You're so right about that.
(16:24):
That view is the same view I have about book writing.
It's like someone else could do it for you, and
I listen. I was a ghostwriter for years. I was
really like, very off put by the idea of ghostwriting
when it was first introduced to me. And then I
became a ghostwriter and I was like, actually, ghostwriters are amazing.
We get to come together with these brilliant ideas. We
use our set of skills, they bring their set of skills.
(16:45):
I get to interact with these people who are so incredible,
and there is something to be said about that. It's
an amazing collaboration between a ghostwriter and an author. And
I've ghost written ten books, so no shade on ghostwriting
at all. But for the sake of the analogy, you
can either hire a ghost writer kind of outsource this thing,
(17:06):
touch it as little as possible, get someone else to
do it, and get on the New York Times list
and make a bunch of money, and that's that, And
it's not really a spiritual, creative experience. Or you can
do it your friggin self and you can walk your
own two feet up there, and you're gonna think you're
never gonna make it. It's gonna feel like you're never
gonna make it, and you're gonna be like, I couldn't
possibly take one more step, and then you do take
(17:27):
one more step, and the feeling of arriving at the
top of the ruins is just like euphoric, Like you're
just like like, how life is so amazing. I'm so incredible.
God is like, you know, just the biggest thing I
could ever understand. And I'm just here. I am what
an incredible life that I get to live. And the
(17:48):
gratitude that rushes in and the confidence is just so
all consuming. So you can do it either way. It's like, yeah,
there's the option to take the buses to the top
of the mountain, but it's not going to feel the
same when you're in the park. You know, you can
pay you can have someone drive you up there, you
can pay to get in the park, you can take
a quick look around, and you can be like, check
(18:10):
check off my bucket list Machu peach you or you know,
you can hike up from the bottom of the mountain.
And again, I'm not saying that there's anything wrong with
hiring a ghostwriter, or with using AI to to help
you write your book, or even with using AI to
write your book. A part of me feels like I
do understand the protectiveness around the craft, and we have
(18:30):
to create some restraints that help people operate with integrity
and honesty with the introduction of AI. And yet part
of me's like, yeah, great if they want to do that,
if they want to take the easy way. Whoever wants
to take the bus up to the top of Machipeachu, Like,
You're feel free, You're welcome, You're not stealing anything from me.
I'm going to hike from the bottom because I'm gonna
(18:52):
I'm in it for the spiritual experience. I'm not in
it to just simply see the thing and check it
off of my bucket list. And this is my view
of creativity that makes me unafraid of the introduction of AI,
because AI can never take that from me. AI can
never take from me. What I believe is an absolute,
(19:12):
inbuilt biological mechanism, a need for creativity, a need to
make something out of nothing, a need to connect with ourselves.
And I believe that I did that when I hiked
to the top of Machu Pichu, and I believe I
do that every single time I write a book. And
it's why I teach people to write their own books.
It's why I teach the courses that I teach, It's
(19:33):
why I've been coaching and doing this work for so long.
It's why, in some ways I've gotten somewhat fed up
with the publishing industry as a whole, because it sort
of feels like it doesn't satisfy the itch, it doesn't
scratch the itch that I have to be in touch
with my creative nature to make something out of nothing.
There's nothing wrong with it. It is not I don't
(19:53):
have to villainize it in order to say I just
am hungry for something deeper. I'm just hungry for something
to yeah, to connect with that part of myself that
wants to make something. And I wonder if the reason
that you're here is because you're hungry for that too,
And does AI take that away from us? No, I
don't think it does. I mean I think AI can
(20:14):
be a helpful tool. It can be a scaffolding. It
can prop us up in areas where like we don't
have the skills, and also we can hike to the
top of the mountain by ourselves. It's like, do you
want to hike to the mountain by yourself with your
own pack? Do you want to hire a shirpa and
have them carry your pack and you hike to the mountain.
That's one way to do it too. There's no wrong
way to do it. Do you want to ride the
(20:36):
bus to the top of the mountain and listen, there
are certain people who the only way that they would
ever get to see mu Chipichu is if they ride
the bus to the top of the mountain. So there's
nothing wrong with riding that bus at the top of
the mountain. Like, we can't judge that. It's just a
matter of asking yourself, how do I want to do this,
how do I want to live this experience? What is
my motivation for writing this book, what is my motivation
(20:58):
for making this creative project? And listen. If your motivation
is to make a bunch of money, if your motivation
is to get famous, if your motivation is to hit
the New York Times list, if your motivation is to
feel cool and good about yourself, then maybe AI is
a great way to do that because you might not
have the skills on your own to write the book
without AI. And again I'm going to reiterate, I do
(21:21):
think it's important for there to be some kind of
guardrails around, like what's allowed with AI, Like how do
we protect intellectual property with the introduction of AI. That
stuff is important and it will happen eventually. I mean,
we're kind of in the very very beginning stages of
this right now, but I do believe that these guardrails
will be introduced in the meantime. We're in the wild West.
It's like, yeah, whatever goes goes, Like whatever you want
(21:43):
to do, and so in that period of time, if
you want to leverage AI to write a book for
you so that you can, like I said, make a
bunch of money, get on the New York Times list,
do whatever you want to do that is one hundred
percent at your disposal. It's kind of freaky how much
is at your disposal. And yet, if you have that innate,
(22:03):
biological built I believe it's biological and built in, it
may not be. I only have my perspective to share from,
so I don't have the science to back that up.
I don't know if it's innate and biological. To me,
it feels like an absolute necessity that I must make
stuff that I must create. And I don't know if
everybody has that. But if you have that, if you're here,
(22:26):
you probably have it, because that's probably what has drawn
you to me. And if you do have that, then
I'll tell you that having AI write your book for
you is not going to scratch the itch. It may
check the item off your bucket list, but it's not
going to scratch that itch. And the itch will still
be there until you scratch it. And so I just
want to challenge you to think about it that way,
(22:47):
that AI is a cool tool that we can use
for all kinds of different stuff. You know, it's been
really nice to have it tell children's stories to my kids,
because by seven thirty at night, when I'm doing bedtime
and I've done so many my brain has worked so
hard all day. Sometimes it's just like, yeah, I don't
think my brain is going to come up with a
very interesting story right now, So we're going to use
chat GPT. It's gonna give us at a little alley oop.
(23:10):
Is that the right term? I shouldn't use sports analogies
when I don't know, like a little set up, a layup.
It's like a little yeah, a little setup for the spike. Again,
bad sports analogies. I don't know, but I'm picturing like
someone like setting it up for you to spike the ball. Yeah,
it's nice. It's like a little lift to help you
tell a story to your kids at night, So use
it for that. But if you have the itch to
(23:33):
make something from scratch, doing it with AI, I don't
think is going to scratch that itch. Now collaborating with
AI might scratch the itch. I think. Because it's so new,
we're all going to have to experiment with how things
feel and what works and what doesn't work. And again,
those guardrails will be introduced at some point so that
there can be some integrity around this and we can
(23:53):
know like who was this written by? Was a written
by AI? Was A written by a person? Until then,
ask yourself the question what am I here for? What
am I doing this for? What am I writing a
book for? What am I making things for? Am I
what's my motivation to create something? And if it's to
be in touch with yourself, if it's to feel that
(24:14):
feeling of euphoria like I Friakin did it, I'm at
the top of majupet you. I cannot believe myself and
to connect with that confidence and connect with that soul
and spirit in you, and to feel connected to the
greatness of all things, then yeah, AI is not going
to do that for you. If it's to hit the
New York Times list, then sure, yeah, AI might be
(24:35):
very helpful, especially in this interim before we have specific rules.
So just reflect on that, think about that a little bit,
and hopefully this brings you a little bit of lightness
to the idea of AI that we don't have to
feel quite so threatened that AI cannot compromise my innate,
biologically built in drive to create. I'll see you next
(24:58):
week on The Very Story podcast.
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I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com