Ironheart Reactions (Episodes 1-3)

We’re here to talk about Ms. Riri, bad girl genius.  Jason and Rosie suit up to recap the first half of the new Ironheart show on Disney+. They break down their thoughts on the Hood, the heist at Heirlum, and dive into Natalie’s character and whether or not it works for them. Plus, the most important question of all; are cassette tapes back???

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Warning, today's episode contained spoilers for the first three episodes
of Ironheart on Disney Plus. Oh it was just concepts

(00:24):
and I'm Rosey Night and welcome back to Answering Vision,
the podcast.

Speaker 2 (00:27):
We dived into your favorite shows, movies, comic, hip, pop culture.

Speaker 1 (00:31):
Coming to you from our podcast, where we're bring three
episodes a week every Tuesday and Thursday, and another day
and Friday, where.

Speaker 2 (00:40):
There's another day in there. It might be Wednesday, it
might be Friday. Why that's right. End, don't forget about
news Plus. In today's episode, we're talking about Iron Hawk.
It's been a long time coming, baby, and it's finally here.
The first three episodes of Iron Hawk have arrived. They

(01:01):
are longer than we expected, each one around four eight
to fifty minutes. They are very aesthetically in the world
of the MCU. Yes, but what do we think about them? Well,
guess what we're gonna recap. We're gonna tell you who's
in them, We're gonna tell you what we think is
gonna happen. We're gonna tell you how we feel about it.
So let's get into it.

Speaker 1 (01:23):
Okay, iron Heart Episode one, let's get this out of
the way. I want to get this, just get.

Speaker 2 (01:27):
It out of the way. Let's just shut it out.

Speaker 1 (01:29):
We're bumped a little bit, a little bit, a little bit,
we're a.

Speaker 2 (01:33):
Little bit bummed.

Speaker 1 (01:34):
We wish Iron Heart was better, and there's various problems
that we're gonna talk about them. But let's first recap
this show. So we open on a selfie video uh
the uh that Reary Williams has recorded of her hanging
out with her friend Natalie talking about their aspirations and
life and stuff. And this will all be come important

(01:57):
because we're gonna find out soon enough that Natalie has
sadly passed away.

Speaker 2 (02:02):
I also need to say, yes, I did immediately have
a little, a little knee wobble, because the aesthetic of
this opening kind of flashback is a real choice and
does not immediately I think set the show up for success.
I think it looks very un emcu and very kind

(02:25):
of more like ya TV that But you know what,
after that, I feel like the show actually does start
to look really great. But yeah, that was I did
have a wobble. I did have a wobble there.

Speaker 1 (02:36):
We open up at M I T with a voiceover.
We're kind of watching realgoing about her day. She's talking
about her her research, her technology.

Speaker 2 (02:47):
She's back, living's living up. She's like it's going great.

Speaker 1 (02:51):
She's back from Wakanda after the events of Wakanda forever.
But she needs a re sources really, you know, like
now that she doesn't have a nation state's backing behind her,
she needs like real, real money to continue her work
at a Tony Stark level. Of course, she is a

(03:12):
Tony Stark fellow, so she feels the weight of that legacy,
and so she's been hustling. And part of the hustling
has been she's been like trading her independently produced technology,
including like test projects for students at other universities.

Speaker 2 (03:30):
For cash.

Speaker 1 (03:31):
And one of the things she talks about wanting to
do with her research is help first responders save lives.
But all in all, it's not going great and really
needs to extend that Tony Stark grant so she can
continued her work on Tony Stark's time.

Speaker 2 (03:49):
May he rest in peace. It's not like he doesn't
have the money. Well he's and sadly, if he was
still around, I think it would be no problemly be
more open to it than the university.

Speaker 1 (04:00):
Right, But now there's like a board that has to
like okay stuff, and it's there's a lot of red tape.
And she is a four year undergrad, so you know,
and she also doesn't want to do class work.

Speaker 2 (04:12):
That's the other thing.

Speaker 1 (04:13):
She's like, can I just can I just have the
university pay for me to just be in the research
lab and not do schoolwork? And they're like no, in fact,
you're expelled.

Speaker 2 (04:22):
So she gets yeah, because we found out that you've
been doing you know what, you've been selling it to
like every other ivy.

Speaker 1 (04:28):
League around like, which is like a real I mean,
that's a real you can't do that.

Speaker 2 (04:33):
That's look, I'm legitimate specific but like I get it. Also,
I would well, I.

Speaker 1 (04:38):
Mean like if you get caught, that's it's like, don't
get if you get Also I want to say as well,
I don't want to say that.

Speaker 2 (04:47):
It is very interesting to me. I think this sums
up a problem that the MCU has, which is like,
if you've been to Wakanda, why would you just just
stay in Wakanda? Honestly, like, rather than this version of
the MCU outside of it, it seemed like they wouldn't
they were you know, I think they weren't. Yeah, I
mean they were not seen.

Speaker 1 (05:08):
On having an American hangout, you know what I mean, Like,
I think the general AIDS is a distrust. So she
gets expelled and so re repacks up her stuff. She
basically steals her suit from the school, which comes installed
with like a m I T. Microsoft Word inspired AI

(05:30):
named Trevor, who she can barely get to set a
flight clippy, very much clippy. And then so she flies
back to Chicago. As she is flying over the city,
a we kind of quick cut to a technologically skilled

(05:51):
group of breaking artists who are currently robbing a mansion.
And this gang includes two members named Rampage uh also
named Stuart played by Eric Andre who I did not
know was in this show and who is barely in
the show. Don't blink because that's what you're gonna see
of Rampage.

Speaker 2 (06:10):
Basically, yes, and they are all of these characters in
a classic kind of Marvel TV situation. Rampage Ak Stewart
is a Marvel character. Slug is a Marvel character. We
also have the Blood Brothers, who here are reimagined as
the Blood Siblings, which I find really funny because I'm like,
just still call them the Blood Brothers. I don't think

(06:31):
they're mass but sure, but yeah, like actual lots of
Marvel deep cut character pulls it if you do want
to explore and see like who these characters were in
the comics and what it means to kind of have
them here.

Speaker 1 (06:44):
And their leader is park Robbins aka the Hood, and
we see this heist kind of go sideways because Rampage
isn't that great at his job, which is like the
tech guy, like the tech fixer guy, and the alarm
goes off and the Blood siblings getting a brawl security
and everybody asked to quickly escape. They go back like

(07:05):
you know. They meet up later under a bridge and
Parker's like, Rampage, I think we might have to fire
a rampage and as the kind of saw he does
kind of suck and just at that moment, Real's flying
over town.

Speaker 2 (07:17):
They look up to like what's that? Re really loses
control over suit.

Speaker 1 (07:21):
It crashes like pieces like file all over the place.
Re Re's walking back to her house with like the
pieces of pursuit like under her arms. She's getting roasted
by the citizenry. She meets a kid named Landon who
charges her twenty dollars to help her take her stuff home.
If you're thinking, wow, that's a lot of characters for

(07:42):
the first seven minutes of a show, I think you
kind of keyed in on one of the problems this
show has, which is in the first I mean, that's
like ten people that have been like introduced, that's not
including the Dean and then the the Dean's assistant, and
like a lot going on.

Speaker 2 (08:04):
Right away, yeah, right away. And I will say I
think that this is also one of those moments where
you are seeing the glimpses of the greatness that this
show has, because I do think that really walking through
with her busted up suit is like really funny. Ye
And I think that the way that they do the title,

(08:25):
where the title is basically made up of her like
smashing into the ground, there's a lot of comic book
fun kind of moments here, and there's also this kind
of understanding of the community, but into cutting that with
the introduction of the gang. And this will go to
my point that I think is really, in my opinion,
the issue with the show, which is the show is

(08:47):
six episodes, but it's paced like a twelve episode Netflix
ya show yea, And it has enough energy and action
for a twelve episode show. So I do think the
truncated nature of it is an issue because otherwise I
thought the actual introduction of really and also this kind
of notion of like what is it like to live
in the MCU and you're not as rich as Kate

(09:09):
Bishop Paul is really interesting and everyone is basically just
like how does this work? Like who? Well, I kind
of have a power or I have a skill, like
can I make this work? Like how does it work
for me? I think there is something there that is
so interesting to be explored, but it's very hard to
explore it with twenty characters and six episodes.

Speaker 1 (09:28):
Yeah, she re rearives home and at the front door
she hears like her mom talking with her friends about
Rere's expulsion.

Speaker 2 (09:39):
She already knows about it.

Speaker 1 (09:41):
This is because she's like been bribing a janitor to
keep her informed about stuff. We meet Rere's friend Zai Xavier,
her friend Natalie's brother.

Speaker 2 (09:50):
Who's another important character.

Speaker 1 (09:51):
Another hugely important character. This is like plus the friends
who also have like speaking roles about crystals and stuff is.

Speaker 2 (09:58):
Who by the way, one of them is he's already
like whoa like iconic voice different right now and like
voice acting and then.

Speaker 1 (10:07):
But it's like it is so many characters like right away.
So Zay gives really the perfect reason to like leave
the house and not get dragged for getting expelled from MIT.
They go to the lakefront talk about what she wants
to do next. She wants to make a better suit,
she wants to make better ai. She wants to take
stock tech to the next level. She thinks, maybe I'll

(10:28):
go to Dubai. There's a lot of money there and
I can continue my research. But you know, Chicago in
general feels too small time for her. She's thinking about leaving.
Zay takes really to see a mural of her stepdad
and Natalie that the community put up and really painful
memories for it's right next to the family garage that

(10:50):
her dad used to run, and we don't yet know
what happened to them, but it's clear it's very traumatic.
And you know, day is like, hey, whatever happened to
that old barracouda car, you know, the Barracuda.

Speaker 2 (11:03):
Like seventies like muscle car.

Speaker 1 (11:04):
What happened to that?

Speaker 2 (11:05):
She's a guy sold it.

Speaker 1 (11:07):
To get money for the suit and Zay's apologizing for
not being there that night, and then he gives her
a mixtape he made literally a cassette tape and a Walkman.
And meanwhile, as this is happening, one of Parker's gang
is watching it. This is a guy named Jonathan who's
like Parker's cousin, is kind of like his closest beste.

Speaker 2 (11:29):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (11:32):
This led me to ask whether like cassette tapes are back, Like,
are they back as a thing?

Speaker 2 (11:36):
They Okay, you put this in the group chat. Let's
have a little a sidebar quickly. I believe they are back.
I see kids wearing Walkmans they make branded Hello Kitty Walkman's.
Now those are back. They have snoopy Walkmans, and especially
like indie bands, but like actual indie bands, they all
back to making cassette tape releases. I have cassette tapes

(11:59):
from some of my friend's bands. I think that coming back,
it's never gonna be a vinyl level comeback, because vinyl
actually sounds fucking fantastic Vinyl sounds, but tapes are at
like an experiential thing. And I think as kids are
getting more and kind of tired with the digital world,
I think they like something tangible that they can touch,
and I think cassette tapes a part of that. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (12:22):
So later, re Rey is at a different like mechanics
slash scrap shop place and she's looking for scrap for
her armor to do repairs. She doesn't have the heart
to break it to the owner of the place, who
remembers her. It's like, oh my god, you're the genius
see the Tony Stark fellow, Like, what's going on now?

Speaker 2 (12:42):
You must be like rich and crazy. It must be crazy.
She can.

Speaker 1 (12:45):
She's like trying to like broach the topic of like
can I get this scrap on credit? When Jonathan comes
up and is like, I got it and he pays
for it, which can never be good. Then he hands
her very bad, very bad instantly every kind of knows
but not she doesn't listen to that.

Speaker 2 (13:03):
Gut enough for me.

Speaker 1 (13:04):
Hands her a card for Desposito's Pizza. I believe it
was where Parker's secret headquarter is. She goes to the
pizza place. It does not seem to be operational, but
there's an elevator in the back, and uh, this actually
was this whole sequence I thought was really cool. Gas starts.
She goes in she's gonna go up to like the
second floor where the car tells her to go, but

(13:26):
then gas starts filling the car, and then.

Speaker 2 (13:27):
Parker's voice comes over. He's like, this is your test.

Speaker 1 (13:30):
Can you escape this elevator in three minutes before the
gas overcomes you?

Speaker 2 (13:34):
And she does? She like she very sore coded, but
I thought very saw coded. Yeah, Also like I think
it's a good it is a good foreteller of like, Babe,
this is probably not a good idea, Like this is
a very kind of horror movie style yelling at the
TV show like if that's what you have to do,

(13:55):
it's probably gonna go badly for you. Let's be real.

Speaker 1 (13:58):
So she managed to do it, and she beats Rampage
aka Stewart's Time by a lot, so Parker is absolutely
in the clear to fire Rampage. And then Parker makes
his pitch. It's like, listen, here's what we're offering, a
place to use your gifts, your genius in a way

(14:20):
that is useful, and we're gonna be taking down It's
not He doesn't say this like in a kind of
plain way, but he kind of hints it like Okay,
we're gonna be taking down people like kind of deserve it.

Speaker 2 (14:35):
Yeah, like rich people, Yeah they.

Speaker 1 (14:37):
Can miss it and they're like, yeah, suck anyway. And
then thirdly, money, you're gonna make money. You need that money,
don't even She turns him down, but she can't leave
right away because of the elevator. So now Parker turns
up the volume on the offer. He opens up like
a box of cash, and he gives her what looks
like about ten grand yeah, in a like a wad,

(15:01):
and he's like, here you go.

Speaker 2 (15:03):
And she's like, what are you doing? What? Like, what
are we what's the job?

Speaker 1 (15:07):
Like, what are we actually gonna be doing to which
come on, obviously something.

Speaker 2 (15:12):
Not legal but like not legal, babe, legal, And.

Speaker 1 (15:14):
She says, well, I don't want to hurt people, and
he's like, well, don't worry, we're not gonna that's that's
not gonna be part of it. But it's like, obviously
gonna be very lucrative, so she can come.

Speaker 2 (15:21):
On, babe, let's be real. I'm like every time with
it's like, here's ten thousand dollars, but don't worry. You
won't have to anyone the thing that clearly most people
would do. I will say even though you know, I
think we are being honest about a feeling, I will say, also,
guess what this is the classic setup in like a

(15:42):
million different but here's the difference.

Speaker 1 (15:45):
Here's the difference. I mean, there's a reason why every
heist movie is one last job because you need that
what's the number? And I think it's not as apparent here,
but it will become.

Speaker 2 (15:57):
A lost three. Yeah, how much does the suit?

Speaker 1 (16:02):
Yes, it will become apparent over these three episodes that
you're like, well, how how many jobs are you doing?
Like is it one job to like get a start?
And is it two jobs? Like what's the number you
need to.

Speaker 2 (16:14):
Hit to be? Like?

Speaker 1 (16:16):
I'm good because if we're talking stark level, you're never
going to make billions of dollars doing this? So like,
what what what is the what is the cutoff? What
is the thing that?

Speaker 2 (16:29):
What is the goal?

Speaker 1 (16:30):
And I think that lack of a clear goal, even
though she states up at the top, oh, I want
to you know, I want to make a better suit
for first responders. I want to make better checking this it.
We never really return to that, and I find myself
missing it. That's all okay, So you're you're right like,
this is a setup that we've seen a million times before.

Speaker 2 (16:50):
She goes back home.

Speaker 1 (16:51):
Uh, she's spending all night rebuilding the suit before the
job with Parker tomorrow.

Speaker 2 (16:58):
Parker's like, we have a job tomorrow eleven am. She's
listened to his A's mix.

Speaker 1 (17:02):
She's getting emotional thinking about her dad and Natalie. It's
clear like whatever happened is truly really terrible and it's violent,
and she's shaken by this. Her mom sees her upset
and tries to help, but like rebuffs her dives back
into her work.

Speaker 2 (17:19):
Meanwhile, we kind of go to Parker.

Speaker 1 (17:23):
He's in his little bass preparing for the job by
getting tattooed, listening to Nina simone Sinnerman, which is and
the verse that they're on is all about like the
the it's talking about like the Devil, which is.

Speaker 2 (17:36):
Like enjoying the numbers. We would definitely enjoy the music
supervision on this show. The music is.

Speaker 1 (17:49):
Really really fun. Yeah, really really really good. So it's
clear that like the Mephisto hints are very very strong.
Right off jump, he goes inside like a vault that
he has and he hangs up the hood. Meanwhile, really
is like using her brain waves to create the AI

(18:11):
in the suit, and it's going to take like four
hours for her brain waves to like program the suit,
which is a very iron Man that was like og
iron Man, and there is some like that's how he
controlled the suit was And I say as.

Speaker 2 (18:25):
Well, in that way, they do lean into a lot
of stuff here that I'm assuming at some point was
going to be part of Armor Wars. Yea, is that
still happening. I don't know, because we do get this
kind of cool concept of like an AI driven suit
and does the person need to be in the suit,
which is very very coded from the old Iron Man stuff,

(18:47):
the eighties Armor war stuff, which I do think is
really cool. I will say as well, I do think
that I was kind of going back and rereading the comics,
and I do think that a lot of what they're
taking from with re Rey's stuff here is h is
from the pre eviewing stuff, you know. And I do
think that Eve is really where got her her chops

(19:11):
and her life and her life outside of this kind
of tragic backstory that Bendis had given her. And I
think that this leans heavily on the tragic bas.

Speaker 1 (19:20):
So uh when she wakes up the next morning, the
upload is finished and her AI appears and it's Natalie
what whoa, Okay, whoa.

Speaker 2 (19:33):
Let's take a quick break. Let's take a quick break,
and we'll be back to figure out how this happened.
How it happened. We're back. Episode two.

Speaker 1 (19:55):
We open on re re arguing with her Natalie AI
about whether or not she she's real.

Speaker 2 (20:00):
She's not.

Speaker 1 (20:00):
She's a hologram projected from the chest plate of her armor,
and Natalie the Natalie AI appears to be like has
all her it's her personality, it's her mannerisms.

Speaker 2 (20:12):
It's Natalie Reary is really freaked out. She doesn't want
to come. Natalie the AI is.

Speaker 1 (20:19):
Like super insistent, like I'm Natalie Reary is like, well,
I'm going to erase you and to start over because
this is super weird, and like you're not doing what
an AI should do, which is like help me. Instead
you're arguing with me about like and refusing to run
diagnostics and all this stuff. And then in the middle
of all this, she gets a text from Parker and
it's time for the first job. So that's yeah, it's

(20:43):
like a lot.

Speaker 2 (20:43):
I will say that.

Speaker 1 (20:46):
There are ethical issues here that will dive into in
a bit, But my first thought is this is forget
the tech side of it, which has issues as well
with regards to like Reary's genius, but it ethically where
now where this is weird?

Speaker 2 (21:07):
No?

Speaker 1 (21:07):
Because I feel like if if the technology exists to
bring me back after I'm dead, obviously people will do this.
That said, yes, how would I feel about it? I
feel like, ask me.

Speaker 2 (21:19):
First, you know, I agree, I would say, so this
is from the Eve comics, but obviously something that I
really like there is kind of like it's very clear
that this is an AI and that it's AI Natalie,
and it's meant to represent how Reary has you know,

(21:42):
not dealt with that trauma and she wants to have
Natalie back in her life. She still thinks about it,
but I will say in I feel like in the
show because we are seeing a real actress. Yeah, and
a real person represents which we have never seen with
AI and the MCU have always been the voiceover with

(22:03):
Javis or Tom.

Speaker 1 (22:05):
Holland's clearly simulated like not a person that ever is interested.

Speaker 2 (22:11):
This definitely raises some questions of yes, is this fair?
Like would you want to do it, Like, why is
she uh, you know, trapped in her friend's suit? And
I'm very interested with this. I feel like in the
first three episodes they are definitely hinting to me this

(22:32):
AI is like too humanly real. I feel like it
hints that there is some kind of I agree, manipulate something.

Speaker 1 (22:41):
Else, somewhat something else going on, because I mean, like,
you know, like you need money, Like here's your thing,
like you we can create AI that are completely just
like the people that they represented, so literally.

Speaker 2 (22:55):
You would never ever if you have the technology to do,
then you have to tech. It could be a black
Mirror esque like CEO billionaire, Like you could be a
billionaire ten nights. Yeah, go scan everyone's heads for ten minutes, babe.

Speaker 1 (23:10):
Go make the go to go to Silicon Valley, make
the pitch, show people the tech demo, and I guarantee
you you're.

Speaker 2 (23:17):
A billionaire overnight. Like, go get the money. I definitely agree, yea,
And I love. What I really liked about the E
version of this storyline is that we get this kind
of like horror from rear and that that's kind of
like so overwhelmed. But yeah, it's like I do feel

(23:37):
like they just move too quickly, and she just.

Speaker 1 (23:39):
Like move Okay, that's part of what yes, because the
eve part there is this she has a moment where
she has to like yeah, there's the It's so emotional
for her that she actually just turns it off and
activates it and tries to work out.

Speaker 2 (23:53):
And we do get a little mention here like should
I get a new one?

Speaker 1 (23:57):
But moreover in the E version of the story, re Rey,
who is a genius, is like, how did this happen?

Speaker 2 (24:05):
I need to figure out, like what happened here? I
understand that she.

Speaker 1 (24:09):
Needs to go to this heist job with Parker, but like, yeah,
like this is a job situation.

Speaker 2 (24:21):
I'm curious enough about like why this happened and what
this is.

Speaker 1 (24:25):
Anyway, she heads out and she finds out from Parker
as he's like doing the little spiel for the gang.

Speaker 2 (24:31):
But what this is we are raiding this.

Speaker 1 (24:37):
CEO who created this project called Tunnel, which is like
an under Chicago system of tunnels to alleviate traffics.

Speaker 2 (24:45):
It's like high tech tunnels. Maybe you drive your car
down there. Also gets on a little platform in the
very coded because that's what the boring company was supposed
to do. So we get you can tell this show
has been in the works for a long time and
that is a that's definitely a storyline from about probably
four years ago, because Ela must never made that happen.

Speaker 1 (25:05):
Guys, So they go. The Parker introduces the gang. We
meet Slug from Madapoor, who is like the hacker. We
meet extremely cool new addition to the black Pack cannon.
There is a big black Kaka cannon in Hollywood, big
fan of this edition. We meet Rob and Jerry, the
sibling cage fighters. We meet Clown, who is like the

(25:26):
explosives expert.

Speaker 2 (25:27):
We meet Parker's cousin John, who is like then.

Speaker 1 (25:30):
Doesn't do not then, Well, he's like the knife obsessive,
but he also does like all like I'll drive all whatever,
like he's like the jack of all trades and reread
obviously he's taken rampage of Spot. The job is to
disrupt and hijack the Sila Zarat, the CEO of Tunnel's
Tunnels project, which the reasoning being well, it's destroying communities

(25:52):
across Chicago, or has destroyed, and Sheila's doing this demo
and it's the perfect time to like hijacket, so arcite's
we get in the suit. We're gonna need you in
the suit tonight. She runs a diagnostic on the suit
and it's not gonna be ready, and she's thinking, Okay,
I need help with this, Like how do I I
need help getting this suit up and running? Maybe Ramcage

(26:13):
can help.

Speaker 2 (26:14):
Sorry, I gotta tell you though, this was the first
thing that took me out that are you's good? He's
he's not good exactly like you. Never He's just some
goofy guy like he why would he be able to
help you? Do you not have any other friends? Like? Please,
I know that you have another friend from m I

(26:35):
T cool cool, surey.

Speaker 1 (26:39):
Full of like geniuses, like just go back to her
and like you need the course to please. So she
ends up going to the dark web and looking at
names of like dark web geniuses who like trade in
high tech illicit technology, and she finds this guy named
Joe McGillicuddy. And meanwhile, now is like talking to her

(27:01):
and like distracting her.

Speaker 2 (27:02):
And knows weight like has.

Speaker 1 (27:06):
Way too much of Natalie's full fledged memories and understanding
about Natalie's life, like again, this AI is Natalie one
hundred percent it's her, which how did this? Like?

Speaker 2 (27:20):
I agree with you, it feels like there must be
some sort of magic. I was feeling like this is
either a hood situation or if the show is gonna
deliver on what the internet is guessing with Mephisto and
Mephisto situation. I agree now, I was feeling like a
hood type magical, some manipulation because it's too well formed.

Speaker 1 (27:42):
How would you as how would your memories? How would
her memories of a person create the person? Like wouldn't
you need the one to one person that the actual
person's memories?

Speaker 2 (27:55):
Not like in the comics, it's the idea of like
it's her perception of how Nashley would have grown up,
whereas here it's basically full Natalie. She's arguing with her.
I don't think that going into this mission with that
AI of your friend is a clever idea, A rea like,

(28:16):
that's my biggest thing? Is I by the way that
get her?

Speaker 1 (28:19):
That would have been interesting if there was some serious
dissonance between AI Natalie and real Natalie, like you look
like her, you talk like her, but there's you obviously
aren't like. But instead, like I kept on waiting for
that kind of like ominous note to sound and it
kind of never does. Yeah, but yeah, that's and then
the other thing is, isn't this gonna be like super

(28:39):
distracting and a like life or death mission.

Speaker 2 (28:41):
To that's you and also like your AI best friend
who's also dead. I feel like, again, this is something
where I do feel like if Natalie hadn't had to
have been revealed at the end of the first episode,
or she had been revealed at the end of the
first episode, but we had a couple of episodes, maybe
a bottle episode to explore that relationship, and then you know,

(29:04):
and they they don't even get into the you know,
the fun stuff that we kind of love with this,
which is just like Jarvis is an acronym, you know,
you have this Natalie is in the comics is the
neuro autonomous technical Assistant and that intelligence and it's so
good and uh yeah, I just again, I think that

(29:25):
there needed to be a little more time. We talked
about this in pre pro and I think that Joelle
put it really well, which was kind of like tell
a smaller story if you don't have the time, but
we don't know this might have began meant to have
nine twelve episodes and or style. So I, yeah, this

(29:45):
is one of the first of Reari's decisions where I'm
going to be like, babe, what you're doing. But also
she's like twenty one, so I was also making a
lot of bad choices back then. Yes, so I'm not
going to judge too hard.

Speaker 1 (29:56):
Really like uploads Natalie out of the suit into her
laptop so she can run the suit without any distractions.
Then she leaves re re rents Landon's wagon to get
the suit out to Evanston.

Speaker 2 (30:10):
On the train. Joe seems like literally a regular Joe.
It's Alden Earnreich of Solo fame. She's talking to him
about stuff.

Speaker 1 (30:18):
She gets into his house where because she helps him
with his groceries, and Joe's She's like, so, what's up.
I need a repulsor micro science y sounding thing, and
just like what about She's like, and she's like, no,
I need this science stuff or I'm gonna rat you
out to the FBI. Here's where I'm like, okay, now,

(30:38):
this is a thing that fast of all. First of all,
I don't know like comics read would not be like
I'm gonna rat to the FBI.

Speaker 2 (30:48):
I know that.

Speaker 1 (30:49):
So here's another decision of rears where I'm like, did
you really just like threaten to rat this guy out
to the like you also you just met him like
he had killed you.

Speaker 2 (30:59):
I know you're in they please, you're in his fancy
suburban house.

Speaker 1 (31:05):
Well, Joe agrees, Okay, under penalty of being snitched out,
I will drive you to my secret wear.

Speaker 2 (31:12):
Not setting up a good relationship with this person who
clearly isn't called Joe by the way, Like even from here,
I was like, Oh, I get it. I see who
he is. He loves iron Man makes.

Speaker 1 (31:22):
Said I want to say this, everybody in this show
is doing a great job act.

Speaker 2 (31:26):
They are acting their asses. I think I think this
is a really and obviously like this in itself is
kind of a problem, but ironically I think this is
like a really great role for Elden Aaron Wright and
shouldn't He's probably shouldn't be the standout, but he is
one of the standouts. But yeah, it's it's also a

(31:48):
very interesting character, as we'll get into and I actually
find the relationship between him and re Re very very
interesting because of who he is and who she is.
And yeah, we'll get into it. But also, why is
Natalie texting real time be letting that AI text you, bro?
We seen these men falling in love with chat GTP.

(32:10):
I mean in real life, do not let this guy text.
Do not let this AI text you, babe.

Speaker 1 (32:15):
I mean, that's another issue. Not to get sidetracked, but
I think all of this storyline kind of happening as
we are made aware of numerous stories and numerous publications.
Required has written a lot about this about people who
are becoming either obsessed with their AI companions, their chat GPTs, whatever,

(32:37):
or are having chat ebt as a story in the
Times about this recently amplify their existing mental health issues
to a to a scary degree because they're just constantly
with what you believe.

Speaker 2 (32:51):
Yes, you live in a yes you do. You know, Like,
it's not That's the thing is, it's not actually AI.
It's a large language model, so it's basically just learning
constantly and then wants you to use it more to
learn more, so it affirms your beliefs. It's not And
I think, like do I think that if this show
was thirteen episodes long, maybe they would be an interesting
inter interaction with that Maybe but do I think that

(33:14):
we're gonna get to find out about like why, I
don't know. I don't feel like the nat I feel
like the Natalie stuff is getting out of hand very quickly,
so too very quickly.

Speaker 1 (33:25):
So on the drive, Natalie is texting reredoun stopped and
Joe begins crying and he won't.

Speaker 2 (33:30):
They're like, She's like, why are you crying?

Speaker 1 (33:31):
And he's like again he always looks like this is
like actually a fun scene.

Speaker 2 (33:37):
And it's really good together.

Speaker 1 (33:39):
They are quite good together. The chemistry is really great,
and it's very clear that Joe has like secrets. So meanwhile,
back at the house, in like talk about talk about
the Natalie stuff spinning out of control, Natalie escapes the
laptop into the Internet basically and gets into the.

Speaker 2 (33:56):
Samy nineties like Internet horror as well many movies like Man.
She's in control of the blender. Guys, she's gonna kill
you with the blend. She's in the wires.

Speaker 1 (34:11):
So she gets into the smart picture frame, you know
the picture frames that my mom I got my mom
on for Christmas, and she liked them.

Speaker 2 (34:19):
She loved the moms love those.

Speaker 1 (34:21):
And she's running around of the picture frame AND's mom
is at first like scared, and she's like, oh, like
it's a ghost, but no, it's like Natalie's like, no,
it's me.

Speaker 2 (34:35):
And here's what's going on.

Speaker 1 (34:36):
And and then she's like immediately to your point about
like pacing and emotional arcs and like to being too compressed.
She just immediately is like, Okay, this is not weird
at all.

Speaker 2 (34:46):
In fact, it's.

Speaker 1 (34:46):
Good, am I Like, what, like, you've just immediately moved
on from how crazy this is to she immediately likes it,
so that that is weird.

Speaker 2 (34:57):
We go to the vault. Very weird, very very weird.

Speaker 1 (35:00):
We go to the vault. It's like a silo in
the middle of some farmland. They go down there and
it's like a bunch of high tech, cutting edge stuff
that he has collected.

Speaker 2 (35:08):
Weaponry. Now, that's all very iron Man coded. There's lots
of iron Man kind of stock tech down there. Why
would he care about that?

Speaker 1 (35:16):
Jason, Well, he says the bunker makes him feel closer
to his dad, And I'm like, okay, your dad is
obad state.

Speaker 2 (35:22):
I thought this.

Speaker 1 (35:24):
Spoiler rack spoiler We do get this reveal later, but
it was very clear.

Speaker 2 (35:30):
Dad is otate.

Speaker 1 (35:33):
So Joe is like, I want to help people with
tech in much the way, yeah, the way that really
wants to read. Doesn't respond to this again, this is
like a small thing, but she doesn't trust Joe clearly,
but he has something she wants. We go back to
the apartment where Mom is having a full conversation with
Natalie now like it's totally normal, and she's like, wow,

(35:55):
you just seem like the real Natalie and not acknowledging
how strange this is. Mom tells Natalie that Listen is
really stubborn and the way to help her is you
have to force your You have to force your help
on her. That's the only way she will ax self help.
And Natalie is like okay, yeah and yeah, basically.

Speaker 2 (36:16):
Gives her advice to give to an ai Mom.

Speaker 1 (36:19):
And by the way, this is kind of my If
there's an elemental issue for me with Ironheart, it's that
like re Rey is constantly having help forced on her
or being talked into it. She doesn't make a lot
of decisions on her own, it feels like, and so it.

Speaker 2 (36:38):
Feels ironically seeking out Joe as like one of the
only decisions that she makes, but everyone else is very
much like leading her down a Sutain road. Even if
you think about it with uh old the Hood Papa Robbins,
they essentially trap her in like a sow trap and
like yeahma bonta to joining and then blackmailho with So

(37:00):
there is not a lot of agency here, but in
a way I don't I kind of I don't know
if it's intentional or not, but I do kind of
like how that does also feel very realistic to when
you're that age, Like that isn't a lot of agency.
People can lead you down these roads. But it is
weird that it's like an ongoing thread where somebody even says,

(37:22):
like force help on her. It's the only way she'll
accept it, you know. It starts to be like an
excuse to just tell really where she's going.

Speaker 1 (37:31):
So At the Vault really asks Joe for his take
on now he basically describes the situation with Natalie.

Speaker 2 (37:42):
Joe's like, that can't happen. It's impossible.

Speaker 1 (37:44):
She's like, well, what if it did happen, He'd be like, well,
it be unethical. For one thing, we find out that
his like day job is like he's a tech ethicist.

Speaker 2 (37:51):
It's ethicist, Yeah, which is from the comics.

Speaker 1 (37:54):
Yeah, and so really has to basically go Joe into
helping her tweak the suit. And there's this weird note
where Joe doesn't want to touch anything. He doesn't want
to touch any of the tech that he's collected. So
Re really like forces him to like handle this piece
of like gear.

Speaker 2 (38:13):
And how does it feel. It feels cold and medally and.

Speaker 1 (38:15):
It's clear that he really is warming up to it,
and then Re shoots off and flies off to the heist.
The heist begins, and it's all basically going according to plan,
with only one obvious murder in the control room when
Jonathan Knife's a guy like throws a knife into his
chest and it's clear that that guy is dead, but
we never discuss it later and almost like maybe a.

Speaker 2 (38:38):
Good kind of like note that maybe John is a
little bit like he always not. He's I mean one
like if you're in, if your major hyperfixation is nice, yeah,
never bodes well. Like let's talk about not to chat
GTPH but yeah, oh my god, I call it the

(38:59):
wrong name every time. I'm sorry, guys, but you know what,
that's just me, that's just who I am. I'll never
remember chat GPT is the real name, sorry chat GPT,
So that guy's did that, and then the c and
then Sheila the CEO, enters the tunnel system. The Gang
is taking control of the control.

Speaker 1 (39:15):
Room of the tunnel project with Slug, you know, like
doing all the hacking stuff, and Slug gives re read
like a drive device that she needs to use to
like install on the platform that is carrying Sheila's car.
But uh, problems arise and she and re loses the

(39:40):
drive and so she has to contact the gang and
be like, Okay, new plan, here's what we're going to do.
And the plan the plan works, the tunnel system crashes
just as it's supposed to do, and then the Hood
appears in Sheila's car right next to her, like it
becomes visible, yeah, and he Basically we find out what
the what the whole gig of the gang is. It's

(40:00):
basically they're extorting these billionaires and being like, here's here's
a contract for like no show jobs for every member
of the gang where we all make I don't know
what this. What do you think the salary is on
the no show It's it's.

Speaker 2 (40:13):
Given like at least six figures a gig two fifty
h time. Yeah, and and the idea is that kind
of hilariously, I didn't really And it's everything tell that
basically they're finding leverage on these billionaires and then being like, hey,
we'll reveal this if you don't give us a job.

(40:35):
I'm like, what about we'll reveal this if you just
give us money, Like why do you have to do
the labor, like just extort them for the money?

Speaker 1 (40:42):
Well, I mean it's a I guess it's like, well no,
because it's a no show job, like like in the Mob,
where they don't have to go to work, but technically
they are.

Speaker 2 (40:51):
On the page getting paid. Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (40:53):
Now my issue with that is now, like your bank
account and everything is connected to these crimes. It feels
like just to your point, just get the cash and leave.
Let's get the cash, guys.

Speaker 2 (41:06):
So then so it seems like it's going well.

Speaker 1 (41:10):
Sheila signs the contract for the no show jobs and
a lifetime access to the tunnel, So now the gang
can use the tunnels to like go to and fro.

Speaker 2 (41:18):
And the enough to pay a troll. A security guard.

Speaker 1 (41:21):
Confronts Natalie as they've exited the tunnels in the armor,
so Rere and Natalie are in the armor and they've
exited and this security guard has a gun pulled and
the face visor is up, so like Reary is exposed
and seeing this gun causes Rere to have like, you know,

(41:43):
church post traumatic trauma like attack, and just in that moment,
Natalie also glitches, and so now Reread doesn't have control
of the suit. And then the guy shoots, but the
bullet like Bend's wanted style.

Speaker 2 (42:00):
I was gonna say immediately, I was like, oh, I
was bending a bullet.

Speaker 1 (42:05):
Okay, okay, it bends, one hits, the hits the security
guard on the shoulder.

Speaker 2 (42:12):
He goes down and it's park Parker did this somehow,
you like, with the wood's power.

Speaker 1 (42:19):
And so that's one with a bullet wound and then
one guy one hundred percent dead. But they got the money.
So the gang goes to celebrate it to hideout, and
they're like throwing cash around, which is like, where'd they
get the cash so quickly whatever. Reary is obviously concerned
because this did not go as smoothly as it seems.

Speaker 2 (42:39):
I thought they didn't have people guys like dead.

Speaker 1 (42:48):
Jonathand so the heut is way more violent she was
expecting she is. And then she's also like very curious
because like Parker has powers, like wait, what's this about? Yeah,
so she's asking clown about it. What do you know
about him? And there's a lot of rumors flying around
nobody knows for sure, like what's going on around him?
Parker comes out, he makes a speech that's very cult leader.

Speaker 2 (43:10):
Oh my god, very very cult Come on, bro, Like
I was also okay, so let's check in at this point. Yeah,
like I would say, maybe, okay, we're about to hit
like the fine the credits are about to roll on
episode two at this point, what do you believe? How
in control of the Hood is Parker? Is the Hood
real tech? Is it magic? What do you think of

(43:32):
Parker at this moment? Because this was definitely giving like
kind of almost like Mysterio two point zero vibes to
me at this point, especially with but the cult leader
speech and then obviously the fact he can bend the bullets,
and I was I was still definitely in I was
questioning at this point because we had posed the idea

(43:54):
that he was gonna maybe just be using tech and
that would be that grounded nature. But they are very
Billy leaning on the notion of magic and talking about magic.
So I'm I was definitely interested.

Speaker 1 (44:06):
Well consist point, I think considering how one to one,
a lot of the stuff is in the show thus far,
like from the comics, I think that, yeah, I think
that it is magic, and then I think, you know,
there's this there's these whisperings that are happening, and the scenes.

Speaker 2 (44:21):
Where it's just Parker and Jonathan, and yeah, it sounds
like there's kind of yes.

Speaker 1 (44:27):
So I do believe that it's magic, and I think
it's probably if it's not the Fisto, it's some sort
of other demon.

Speaker 2 (44:34):
But it's problem Yeah, Like we know that the cloak
actually connects him to Dormamu in the comics, but I
think we've done with dor Mamu, doctor Strange. I feel
like that would be a let down to a lot
of people. The cloak is also giving wonder maximum of
so I have been interested in that because it looks
like it's made out of her costume. It's that very
It's like is it leather? Is it some kind of

(44:56):
athleisure fabric? Like what's going on with the herd? But
it's definitely it's taking a toll on Parker because he's
got all the scars, yes, having to cover them up
with some like fucking prism break style tattoos like which
I guess is Jonathan doing the tattoos too.

Speaker 1 (45:16):
Yes, Jonathan is also he's again jacket again, a jack
of jacket everything.

Speaker 2 (45:22):
Who doesn't love to have a friendly tattoo artist in
that evil HQ. That's right, So.

Speaker 1 (45:29):
Everyone toasts, you know, it's a job well done, but
it's clear that Weary is like this is I have
doubts about this? Yeah, obviously you guy's dead. Anyway, they
go back home. Natalie apologizes for glitching out. She's froze
when she saw the gun and reads like, what do
you remember about like this certain night on this certain days?
She's like, I don't remember anything about it?

Speaker 2 (45:49):
What happened?

Speaker 1 (45:50):
And Natalie says also, but by the way, like Parker,
there's like a weird energy coming off of him. It's
like nothing I've ever read like since before. He's powered
in some way. Re Rey is much more focused though,
on her barely functioning AI and the fact that like
the glitch almost killed them. And then but before she

(46:12):
can really explore this, she's like, oh, I said I
would go meet Zay at this party. So she goes
to the party, and Natalie promises to stay hidden from
her brother, which is also.

Speaker 2 (46:21):
Like, bro, like your mama's already also like your mama
about how about you fix the AI of your best
friend that you have understated into this metal body and
don't go to the party deal anyway?

Speaker 1 (46:39):
Yeah, I feel like that's a genius would be like, well,
this is obviously a much more pressing and interesting problem
than like the party.

Speaker 2 (46:46):
I'm not gonna go, know the party anyway. Back at
the hideout, it's very p it's very peapaka issues like
double life. You have to go see your friends, but
really you're like, maybe you should stop the Green Goblin, bro.
So it's very classic comics.

Speaker 1 (46:59):
So Parker is hearing voices, the hood is kind of
talking to him. He's like writhing with discomfort, and his
back tattoos like obviously getting bigger, and John is worried
about him. You know what all of this is doing
to him, he basically says, And Parker's like, don't worry
about it.

Speaker 2 (47:18):
That's my business.

Speaker 1 (47:19):
Now get out of here, give me some privacy. Gets
home and her mom is like what are you gonna
tell me you resurrected Natalie?

Speaker 2 (47:28):
Mom? What do you want me to go to therapy? Don't
you tell me? Are we going to tell?

Speaker 1 (47:36):
And then she and then she says, this is actually
crazy to me. She goes, it's like you brought back
her entire soul. And then she says, can you make
one of Gary, her dad, her stepdad. Technically I'm gonna
call him dad.

Speaker 2 (47:52):
He's the dad, yeah, and he's the dad who stepped up. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (47:56):
And she's like, can you make one of Gary? And
really says no and p because she doesn't knew how
she did Nalie.

Speaker 2 (48:03):
But this is like a fact we're not now gonna
explore these questions. Is like you need to explore these
first of all proof. Can I just say, even though
it came in a very up way that could be
making bank, she just this this is but also, like, guys,

(48:24):
you both need to go to therapy and have some
deep like E D M R like former therapy, because
you should not just be thinking about how to resurrect
ai versions of your dead loved ones. That is literally
it's been done in black mirror like three or four times.
Don't do it it's gonna go badly. Also, I love

(48:45):
like I do feel from a from a creative perspective,
I feel like the way they introduce the mom is
like she's super chilling, cool and just lets ree redo
what she wants. And I feel like at some point
they must have been like, yeah, yeah, that's why she's
not bothered about Natalie. And I'm like, no, guys, has
a difference about having a mama's chill. I also get
also spelled from school. There was no suggestion chill. There

(49:07):
was like in the initial.

Speaker 1 (49:09):
Meeting of her, there was like a I forget the
line exactly, but we kind of like get got a
suggestion that she was religious. And I'll just say, like
every religious person I know, oh would respond to this
situation like it was the devil. Like they would it
would not be good. And I will say, like to
your point about the black mirror stuff and any other
AI comes to life like story that we've heard, Yeah,

(49:30):
it's more weird to me that it seems like there's
gonna be no downside, it's.

Speaker 2 (49:35):
Gonna be all fine. That seems weirder to me. I
will also say I do think because again, like reading
the comics, I think something that they missed Tia the
which I get it because I love the idea of
her having her own story, but in the comics really
is used to weird AI inhabit like that exists because

(49:58):
she is walking with an AI version of Tony Stark
who just like walks around her house and like in
her office and helps her, so she is less freaked
out by it. I think the fact that we don't
have that history here or that kind of conversation or
a stand in for that makes it seem absolutely wild
that her and her mama just like loving this guy's great.

Speaker 1 (50:19):
Immediately okay with it. We go to Evanston, where Joe
steps in his neighbor's dogs shit on his lawns.

Speaker 2 (50:27):
So he goes over and.

Speaker 1 (50:28):
He like decapitates all of his neighbor's flowers. Our first
kind of hint maybe that there's something darker about Joe.
Let's go to a break and then we'll talk about
the third episode in the tranche of three episodes.

Speaker 2 (50:40):
Yeah, and we're back.

Speaker 1 (50:56):
So the Gang is celebrating with its new founderings of
throwing all around. They're talking about their plans, like I
want to open a restaurant, rampage.

Speaker 2 (51:06):
No one knows is big clubs.

Speaker 1 (51:11):
Like Clown is like, I want to open a school
for money laundering purposes.

Speaker 2 (51:15):
The siblings want to open.

Speaker 1 (51:16):
I appreciate, and Red is of course investing in her suit,
to which again I say, like.

Speaker 2 (51:22):
What's we needed end? We need an end goal for readabies.

Speaker 1 (51:26):
That's looking pretty good, it's working, Like, so what are
we waiting working? I feel like you just need to
like just go to the car shop painting it, like
I feel like a prey, close babe. So the party
screeches to a halt when Clown comes out of Parker's room,
having picked Parker's vault and taken out the hood, and
she's got the hood on and she's like prancing around

(51:46):
and she's like.

Speaker 2 (51:47):
But it feels weird. There's something weird about it.

Speaker 1 (51:50):
They kind of talk about like trying to figure out
what's going on with the Hood and figuring out like
where Parker's powers come from.

Speaker 2 (51:55):
But then an interesting and sensible divugeon for the gag
you should be doing this, But then John shows up
and like bashes Clown's head into the table. Crazy John's
done for in my mind, And then Rey is like,
what's your problem, to which I would say, and I'm
not condoning violence, but also like, well you did just

(52:15):
break into the guy's like vaults, like safe, who's running this?

Speaker 1 (52:19):
You understand what the problem is. And so then Parker
shows up and is like everybody, everybody chill up.

Speaker 2 (52:25):
It's fine, John, it's fine.

Speaker 1 (52:27):
Clown, don't worry about it. Everybody chill Here's what're.

Speaker 2 (52:33):
The come on, guys, this is not a good situation. Again,
I think this is a pacing issue because, for example,
would have loved to see Clown pick that safe love
the idea that they would have tried. Everyone would have
tried to try on that suit, right the guy. Everyone
wants to know how it works. It's them. We know
the world that we're living in. There are superheroes, there

(52:54):
are super villains. This has power, and I think again,
like John putting his hands on a woman like that
should have expanded a conversation, and it does influence something
really does light, which I think is interesting. But yeah,
then hot Hood and Poka being like, oh, let's just
go on to our next tyst. I'm like, bro, the

(53:15):
gang is not solid, Like there is beef in the gang,
Like this is gonna end badly for someone.

Speaker 1 (53:21):
So here's the next heist. It's Heirloom, which is an
ag tech company. CEO Hunter Mason is into like making
seeds and archiving seeds and creating food that you can
grow like kind of in different places using technology. The
thing about Heirloom HQ is it has really good security

(53:43):
where it's like a magneto thing. You can't bring in
any metal or weaponry. Yeah, or the security system will
sense it in lockdown no matter where it is. So
that means no suit for re. Rea re Re talks
of the hood and here we have this conversation that
I'm like, this kind of shouldn't this shouldn't exist.

Speaker 2 (54:03):
She says, yeah, the hood. Okay, what are we doing?
Like what is this?

Speaker 1 (54:06):
We're doing crimes? I want you to know that I'm
a good person, not a criminal, and.

Speaker 2 (54:12):
We had I think also, this is like this is
where I feel like here, this could have been such
an interesting conversation to have about the notion of criminal
criminality and somebody like Tony Stark who was a literal
war criminal and had to reimagine his world, and there

(54:35):
could have been like a five minute at least a
tiny introspection on the notion of like what is crime
or how does crime pay or what like, maybe you're
looking at it the wrong way. But instead it's just
like he's just nobody. Yeah, okay, we get it broke.

(54:55):
Nobody paid attention to you until you were wearing the hood.
We've heard it before.

Speaker 1 (55:00):
From that, it's just a setup for Perker to talk
about why his background a little bit and I agree
with you like to here. I kept on waiting for
Rere to be like, no, we're not doing it this way.
Here's how we're gonna do this, like and there gonna
be fucking I on, man, I can stop you for
for them to be some power struggle in terms of

(55:22):
like how they're gonna do these heists. Like after I
saw the first one, it was so violent, Like we
can do it this way and make it less violent,
and ince.

Speaker 2 (55:29):
Is my genius scheme on how we neba huh anyone.

Speaker 1 (55:32):
Yeah, and then she just gets kind of talked into
doing it again. And it's weird to me that said,
uh really then is like how does the hood work?
Like what's going on that he just basically says, Hey,
it's magic. She's like that just means you don't know
how it works. It's like, okay, so what you're making
money out making money and that's all.

Speaker 2 (55:53):
We really need. Also, right, can I have this question
for the hood? I get it. I get that it's
like cool motif for him to be like it's magic,
But if it's really magic, he needs to stop telling
people that. I know, like, he needs to stop saying oh,
it's magic, because I'm like, guys, magic is very brah
in this world, and I feel like you're putting a

(56:13):
talk on your back. Okay, so she said, so, then, uh,
I know.

Speaker 1 (56:19):
Later Joe shows up at her house AT's house and
Mom is like, who the fuck is this guy?

Speaker 2 (56:25):
And was like, oh, we know each other from work.

Speaker 1 (56:28):
And and and my secret job.

Speaker 2 (56:32):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (56:33):
It's very weird to me that, Like Mom has like
many more questions about Joe than she has about the
Natalie Resurrection air that said, Joe is like ever since
re remade him hold that piece of equipment, He's like
bursting with ideas about like tech applications and stuff he
can do. Stuff he stores in his wall and he

(56:53):
gives her like all these blueprints and it's like, well,
now I'm gonna rat you out either you help me
with these blueprints and give me your thoughts on them,
or I watch you out to your mom and then he.

Speaker 2 (57:03):
Drops off the difference.

Speaker 1 (57:04):
Really wants to optimize the suit, but Natalie takes over
the suit for a second and starts arguing with her again.
Natalie wants Natalie just wants really to hang out with her,
which really reluctantly.

Speaker 2 (57:15):
Agrees to do. Oh and that's bread the suit. Epically,
this is breaking my heart. This kind of like inter
change between the idea of like this transactional relationship between them,
where like it has to be like y'all hang out

(57:36):
with you, but if you are grading my suit, yeah,
but I'm like, but if she is all the memories
of your friend, like, how is she experiencing this? I
don't know. Yeah, I think the Natalie stuff has really
got me hung up on a lot of like ethical
and emotional questions that I don't know if the show
was planning on. I completely agree with you.

Speaker 1 (57:55):
So they hang out by the lake and then Joe
texts again this is like these scenes are happening way
too fast, where the pacing is just like this could
be an interesting scene if you let it breathe, But
we don't have time. So Joe is like, can you
come over early? And uh, you know, really briefly is

(58:18):
kind of like wondering, like about like Natalie, why do
you have the memories of Natalie?

Speaker 2 (58:23):
And uh, but.

Speaker 1 (58:25):
They don't really explore it again and she has to
has to go to Joe's.

Speaker 2 (58:29):
Also, I'm pretty sure that when Joe shows up and
she's like, how did you find me, He's like, oh,
I just like googled your address and I'm like, remy,
take an hour and stop that because you need to
get that shit wiped off the internet. There are services
you can pay, you can get Shakeula Gorgeous hack a
slug to help you. But like, this man should not

(58:50):
just be able to find your mom's address on the Internet.
That's not gonna bode well for you in your Iron
Man era that you were going for.

Speaker 1 (58:58):
So Natalie and re Re goo to the garage to
see the garage they're talking about like the work she's
doing for Parker, and Ree says, I plan to do
a couple more jobs and then I'm out again. Just
give me a hard number, like what is the dollar
a month? Couple five?

Speaker 2 (59:15):
The garage? Just on a just on like a continuity
thing here, and this is what happened when you watch
these shows like more than once and you start to
know that she has a go at her mom and
says like, oh, you haven't been keeping the Gary's garage
up to scratch, Like it's looking fucked up. It looks
it looks great, it looks really great. It could have

(59:36):
always been her you know shop, which obviously is inevitably
gonna turn back into it. It's looking fine.

Speaker 1 (59:42):
Yeah, Okay, So they're in the garage, they're talking about stuff.
Really has a flashback to the night that her dad
and Natalie were killed.

Speaker 2 (59:52):
It was a drive by.

Speaker 1 (59:55):
Natalie talks re redowned from her panic attack, which is
just like her dad used to do. Now, I was like, well,
how do you know how to do that? Like only
my dad could do that? Again, like this lack of
curiosity about like how do you have all these like
where does all this stuff come from? Like she should
be trying to figure this out.

Speaker 2 (01:00:11):
Okay, you know, I will say we you might be
thinking like do you need two people to have been
fridged for this story? That's the part that's my other
thing is like that question when I'm gonna tell you.
I'm gonna tell you something, guys. Yeah, if you had
read if you read the original Williams Commis, you may

(01:00:32):
have forgotten about this. But they actually uh fridged another
person in her life in the original comics, Demetrius, her father,
who gets killed in a gas station robbery gone wrong
when she's five, and then she goes lives with her
I'm gonna stepdad Gary, and then Gary gets killed with Natalie.

(01:00:52):
So I'm like, please, guys, maybe like a little bit
less of this fridging. Now, look are they gonna If
they're gonna spend the time I'm in this show to
explore the notion of gun violence and how it impacts
young people, then I'm very interested, and I'm glad that
they cut the Demetrius part as far as we know,
but I don't think the show has the scope or

(01:01:14):
time to deal with this. And as she has this
panic attack, I feel like there's a great place there
where maybe you know, some her interacting with Natalie or
I don't know, But instead she's got to go home
and find out that the cops are there because there's
another plotline that is about to begin. Yeah, So you

(01:01:38):
make a good point.

Speaker 1 (01:01:38):
Which is like, I like the exploration emotionally of the
impact of this stuff. But it's also weird to me
that like Rerie kind of never says I'm having these
feelings because of this, when everything else in the show
is like it's very explained, implicitly, almost over explained.

Speaker 2 (01:01:59):
That's so really great point, also weird. I would love
for her to have this conversation, and maybe this's going
to happen in the next three episodes, but I would
love for her to have this conversation with Xavia or
with her mom, with a human being who is also
impacted by this, instead of it being channeled through the
Nathalie AI. So it's yeah, but guess what. The cops

(01:02:20):
away after her, and now we know why she got
to call Stewart aka Rampage.

Speaker 1 (01:02:25):
So she she u was the last person to call
Rampage and Rampage is now dead, and so they cops
want to talk to her about, like, what do you
know about the death of Rampage. Re redecides that, okay,
I need to I believe the gang is involved in
the death of Rampage, and also I want to know

(01:02:46):
what's going on with the Hood and the Magic powers
potentially magic powers quote air quotes magic. So I need
to steal a piece of the hood to analyze it
to figure out if he's involved and figure out what
we're up against. So the perfect time to grab a
sample is during this heirloom heist, right, But.

Speaker 2 (01:03:02):
Why not just reach out to clown who already picked
the lock and be like, hey, you want to get
back on the fact that Joe fucking smashed your interest? Interesting? Sorry?

Speaker 1 (01:03:13):
Yeah, and then we could have this power struggle again
within the gang and give her some agency. But no,
she needs to kind of get talked into doing this
Binatalie again, but she won't be able to bring the suit.
But Joe brought a schematic for a type of like
biomesh that is like it looks like a almost like
a bandage that you wear on your arm there.

Speaker 2 (01:03:32):
Like a face skin. Yeah, yeah, it's like Stark nanotech.
So then and I guess it can make a laser.
And it can make a laser, don't worry. We go
to the base where.

Speaker 1 (01:03:42):
Jonathan is doing watching Parker do hot yoga.

Speaker 2 (01:03:46):
By the way, can I just say something. I get
that he's meant to be his cousin, but these two
are playing this shits so gay for each other. I'm sorry, guys.
I know, I know I do this with every show.
I know he is meant to be his cousin, but like,
why is Nathan just watching him do hot yoga? Watch
watching him shirtless do hot yoga?

Speaker 1 (01:04:07):
Wait? Wait, doing his his back tattoo, and then as
he's doing the tattoo, being like, I'm so sorry.

Speaker 2 (01:04:15):
I'm saying there is a chemistry here. And then also
Jonathan finally saying something sensible, where he's like, guys, there's
no there's actually no leverage against this billionab got leverage
against all the rest of them, but no leverage against him,
And and park is like, don't worry about it, babe.
Just look at my rippling muscles and imagine when I'll

(01:04:37):
be wearing the sexy magic hood again. Like what do
you mean, no, don't do it? Cancel the schemes. So yeah,
Jonathan's like, let's cancel the heist. Parker's like, no.

Speaker 1 (01:04:45):
Rear goes to see Joe at his house. Joe has
a grizzly the way suh Rey leave basketball. You know what, really,
Revery and Nally.

Speaker 2 (01:04:59):
And Joe and his nasty ass, can you know what
he's motherfuckers. They are made preach on the two insane people.

Speaker 1 (01:05:08):
Honestly, cut does not even describe it. He's got a
grizzly wound that is about in which he's like put
like in a hole and he's like put stuff under
the skin into his forearm and it's really gross, and
Joe's like, can you help me with this? So Rear
then tells Joe that she's got some ideas for upgrades

(01:05:29):
for his biomesh idea. But Joe is like really concerned that, like, listen,
if you use any of my tech for whatever it
is you're doing, if it's criminal, especially, all that stuff
is easily traced to me because of whatever however, I
so you have to promise me that you're it. Whatever

(01:05:50):
you do, it can't get traced back to me. She's
like okay, and then Rear accidentally spills like a cereal
bag's like.

Speaker 2 (01:05:58):
A fucking gallons. It just full of ashes that she's
fucking around with and it just on the outside of
the back and I have to say I do like
it just says Obadiah S. So if you didn't know
Joe is Zeke Stain.

Speaker 1 (01:06:16):
Yes, Zeke Stain and that is you know, Obadiah Stain
in the bag.

Speaker 2 (01:06:21):
And again these two have like really great chemistry. I
really like this scene is so funny together.

Speaker 1 (01:06:26):
This scene is cuckoo, bananas, nonsensical, but like they're so
fun in it together it works. Yeah, so uh is like, oh,
my dad taught me how to dress wounds like this
crazy fucking.

Speaker 2 (01:06:42):
Jagged, fucking open bleeding which he put he put like
a fucking neuralink in Like this man is insane, he's
not well his dad, But I do again, this is
a thing about pacing, right. I get that they wanted
to reveal this. I get it, and I love the reveal.
It's funny, but also, like you only have six episodes,

(01:07:02):
there's something very interesting about the perceived mantle holder of
the Iron Man legacy in rearly teaming up with the
perceived like troubled legacy holder of a Badiah Stain. That's
so interesting that maybe it didn't need to be a
secret reveal, you know, maybe there's something in that about

(01:07:24):
how they relate to their father figures that we've got
more time with completely. I think it's so interesting and
I hope we do get more of it. In the
next part. But yeah, uh, do not. First of all, Zeke,
do not let this gal use it. She's obviously gonna
drop it, really don't. Just like he's so up this
man's arm, like it's looking bad.

Speaker 1 (01:07:45):
Well, as soon as he said that, I'm like one
hundred percent she is gonna drop this biometer.

Speaker 2 (01:07:49):
Drop that shares.

Speaker 1 (01:07:51):
So the gang needs to disarm and get into Heirloom.
They all, you know, put away their weapons in order
to break in, except for re Rea, of course, who's
supposed to stay in her suit and do like an Overwatch,
but it's Natalie piloting the suit and re Re secretly
swims in with her biomesh patch through a set of pipes.
Parker goes to confront the Heirloom CEO in his like

(01:08:15):
greenhouse office, which actually looks pretty cool. Really is like
under a grate in the floor.

Speaker 2 (01:08:25):
I was stressed watching this man. I'm like, you meant
to be a genius impossible, So yes, yes, it's mission
impossible levels of stressing.

Speaker 1 (01:08:36):
So like, Reary is using the laser in her biomesh
to cut a little piece of the hood off, but
it's tough because it's magic and it's leather.

Speaker 2 (01:08:44):
And that's also some kind of like Hubrin, there's some
kind of kind of gaming technique.

Speaker 1 (01:08:51):
Because remember the security system will they couldn't get possible,
will sense any weapons or technology or or metal that
it doesn't recognize and trigger, so she has to stay
below this threshold.

Speaker 2 (01:09:07):
While you very gamified. It's very funny. It's like if
you've ever tried to, like, you know, play a game
where you have to get the perfect amount to hit
in the right direction.

Speaker 1 (01:09:16):
Their guy is like, I'm not gonna be extorted, fuck you.
And meanwhile the gang is in like another greenhouse and
their clown's just like, I'm bunding this, burn this shit down.
So then clown starts a fire in the in the
green room and she's like in the greenhouse and she's
like burning all the shit because the CEO was refusing
to sign a contract. And Parker's like, well, what if

(01:09:38):
we destroy your whole company?

Speaker 2 (01:09:40):
Right seewhile I thought it was interesting, Yeah, why, Like
he literally like just offers them a check. He's like,
I know what you're doing. Just take this fucking chet
and just leave. I would have taken it. In that case, Parker,
he has the he's got you like just take the check. No,
they need the money. They need the no you know,

(01:10:02):
the no show jobs. Like sure, So the building is
locked down. That's all that mattens.

Speaker 1 (01:10:07):
Well, here's my question. So the late rereason laser gets
too hot and the alarm system senses that there's weaponry
and stuff going on. Why didn't clowns fire trigger.

Speaker 2 (01:10:18):
The I know, I couldn't. I couldn't walk that out
whether it was like because it was a huge fire.
But also it does get shut down, like I don't know,
I don't know how this place works. I didn't even
know what this man's business is. Honestly, they should have
left him alone.

Speaker 1 (01:10:35):
So the building's now locked down, and it's like filling
with more gas more like carbon DIACs are gas to
make everybody go to see Parker is hearing voices that
they are telling him to do the ceo. The CEO
pulls a pistol and now there's a fight, which is
kind of cool. Hood is disappearing and reappearing, and then
he invisible kills the CEO as re rewatches. She does

(01:11:00):
like get to cut all the way through the hood,
like she cuts like eighty percent. She yeah, and before
he disappears and so she can't get the rest of it. Meanwhile,
the rest of the gang is trapped in the labs,
only Jonathan and the Ironheart armorycking Jonathan.

Speaker 2 (01:11:16):
Jonathan fucking Jonathan.

Speaker 1 (01:11:18):
So Jonathan Hood is now taking out cars left and right,
re re orders Natalie. She's like, rescue the rest of
the crew, don't worry about me. I can get out
on my own. Natalie's like no, but then it is convinced.
So Rey is escaping through the labs. She runs into
Jonathan and Jonathan and Jonathan is like, why aren't you

(01:11:42):
in your suit? I thought you were in your suit
up there, And also like, what is that in your hand?
Is that a piece of the hood? The leather piece
of the hood.

Speaker 2 (01:11:49):
She accuses him of killing Rampage and they fight and
he's like, yeah, I did kill him. Yeah he was
that even a secret? Yeah what are you talking about?
Course I can kill the guys. This whole show.

Speaker 1 (01:12:03):
Re re loses her biomesh patch, she loses the I
think loses the piece of the hood leather doesn't.

Speaker 2 (01:12:08):
Yeah, well I don't. I don't know about that. She did,
hilariously just randomly pick it up off the side maybe
she doesn't. I'm invisible, so maybe she does have it.
But I'm going to say something, Uh, describe what you
think happened next, because I think I think it's a
more brutal read than you realize.

Speaker 1 (01:12:25):
Well, I think what happens is Okay, so the HQ
is filling with gas that's making everybody suffocate. Natalie comes in,
puts rear the armor, and she flies off, leaving Jonathan
to die, to.

Speaker 2 (01:12:41):
Die, Yes, no, no, I think you're right. I think
you're right. She kills Jonathan like they could have said.
He puts his hand out and he's like help man. Yeah,
but they're like you know about you know that.

Speaker 1 (01:12:52):
I'm like, you guys are also murdering people.

Speaker 2 (01:12:57):
But also.

Speaker 1 (01:12:59):
I think this was I think, yeah, this was a weird.
This is another weird one. It would have been cool
if like she's like, no, save Jonathan, Natalie, and Natalie
is like no.

Speaker 2 (01:13:10):
No, yeah, yea yeah, yeah yeah yeah. Also, oh, Natalie.
If Natalie has said to her like, well remember how
he like smashed clown's head against the thing and he
killed rampage, Like does he need to be saved? But
instead Reby just makes that choice. She just you know what,
I'm not gonna miss Jonathan. I don't think she made
a terrible choice. This was but you know, I will say, well,
this is really so Jonathan said not to go.

Speaker 1 (01:13:32):
It's on Parker, and I agree with you. I'm not
gonna miss Jonathan. I think Jonathan's a bad guy. I
do find it weird that the prime here's the issue.
The primary reason that Rory kills this guy is because
she doesn't want him rat turn out.

Speaker 2 (01:13:45):
Yes, so that up with all the rime, all the ratting,
too much ratting.

Speaker 1 (01:13:51):
Okay, So back home, she realizes she lost the biomesh
which will get trace back to Joe, and she has
another panic attack bark. Parker's back at the HQ, and
he's like furious that this heist has gone sideways and
that Jonathan is dead. He's screaming and whoever gave him
his magic? I trusted you and it's gone badly and

(01:14:12):
what have you done?

Speaker 2 (01:14:13):
And he sees a vision, like a magic vy brutal, scary.

Speaker 1 (01:14:18):
Brutal vision of Jonathan's suffering, suffocating to deathn't like reaching
out for who we know is like Natalie and Reary
to help him and Parker saying, why are you showing
me this? And then all of a sudden, a demonic,
very evil looking figure appears, and this is where I'm
like this, it's fucking.

Speaker 2 (01:14:36):
Naturally, everyone's gonna be so sick of it after I'm like, guys,
it's too late. I'm sorry to tell you that, but
you know what, he's here. We've been talking about it
for five years, as the world has changed unbelievably. Am
I still talking about it? Yeah? I also thought, I
really I did like the visual like fust the shadowy

(01:14:59):
figure kind of looks like re read because in the
suit to kind of tell Parker like she killed him.
And then you get yeah, And I mean, guys, you
saw the little m outlined in red. You guys assumed.
Let's see. We'll be talking about it when the next
three episodes drop. But it's looking high odds high odds

(01:15:22):
high odds that Mephisto is finally round, because.

Speaker 1 (01:15:26):
I think if you don't show him now, people are
gonna be like, don't ever do this again.

Speaker 2 (01:15:30):
Don't do it again. It's been too many times, too
many teasers, too many theories, of which I was many
to blame for.

Speaker 1 (01:15:37):
Sorry, guys, but like, but yes it is. I think
it's time.

Speaker 2 (01:15:41):
I'm ready. And that's the first three episodes of iron Heart.
You know what. I'm just so glad we did like
a big deep dive into this, so you gotta do it.
We gotta recap it, gotta talk about it, got to
talk about how it works, how it doesn't work. And
I'm excited to see the next three episodes. And I mean,
you see how slacked with people.

Speaker 1 (01:16:00):
Mephisto will I will I. We assume it's Mephisto, and
I will be there to find out, like what's going
on with that? Like, let's find out, Yeah, and what's
going on with that guy?

Speaker 2 (01:16:08):
Man? Well, that's it for this episode.

Speaker 1 (01:16:11):
Tomorrow and exhibition, we're checking in on some of the
movies we haven't had a chance to talk about so
far this year, this spring, this summer, including Final Destination, Bloodlines,
and Wes Anderson's latest infotation scheme. That's it for this episode.

Speaker 2 (01:16:25):
Thanks for listening. Bye.

Speaker 1 (01:16:32):
X ray Vision is hosted by Jason Concepcion and Rosie
Night and is a production of iHeart Podcast.

Speaker 2 (01:16:38):
Our executive producers are Joel Menique and Aaron Kaufman. Our
supervising producer is Abu safar. Our producers are Common, Laurent
Dean Jonathan and Fay Wack.

Speaker 1 (01:16:48):
Our theme song is by Brian Vasquez, with alternate theme
songs by Aaron Kaufman.

Speaker 2 (01:16:52):
Special thanks to Saul Rubin, Chris Lord, Kenny Goodman and
Heidi Our discorded moderate the