Best Of 2022

Can you believe it’s been almost a year since XOXO began? Join Jessica and Zuzanna in celebrating this wild and wonderful journey with a Best Of 2022 episode - our way of reminiscing on just a few of our fondest moments from the show.

 

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:17):
Welcome back, listeners to your one and only source into
all things gossip Girl. You know you'll love it. XO
x O. Hey Hey everyone, Happy New Year. I'm Jessica's
door and today we have an extra special episode of
XO XO just for you. It's been almost a year

(00:39):
since we kicked off this show, can you believe it,
So we thought it was time to walk back down
memory lane and relive just a few of our best moments.
We talked to some of Gossip Girl's biggest characters this
past year and have watched some pretty wild stories unfold.
And I cannot thank our guests enough for coming on
the show and share during your time with us. To

(01:01):
each and every one of you, and to all the
cast and crew who made Gossip Girl what it was,
I thank you so so much. And a special thanks
to my partner in crime, Zuzana Shatzkowski, who joined me
on this journey a couple of months ago. It's been
so great to do these re watches with you, and
I love you so much, girl, and I want to
thank you listeners for tuning in. You've been right there

(01:24):
with us for the whole crazy ride. And while x
O XO was taking a hiatus for the new year.
I hope that you all have enjoyed this wild ride
with us. And with that, we're starting the best of
episode with Gossip Girls creators Josh Swartz and Stephanie Savage,
who take us back to where it all began. Here's
Josh and Stephanie. The c W was not a thing,

(01:47):
Oh yeah, it was. It was that we were the
first show for the c W. They were a a
network that had fused together the w B and the
u p N, and the way I would call it
happening was alloy and my agents had sent me the
Gossip Girl books, which were set up at the c
W already with Don Ostruff. I immediately called Stephanie and said,

(02:11):
if you like this, let's do this together, because we
were trying to figure out what we were going to
do together after the o C ended and there was
nobody I wanted to work with more after that then
then staff, and so it was already set up in
the c W, and we were like, okay, great. We
knew what they were trying to do, We knew what
the w B was, and that was kind of the
model that they were seemed to be following. And we
were off to the races. And I remember very distinctly

(02:33):
being on the set of the o C finale and
there was like a crowd of teenagers in the street
where we were shooting the episode, and somebody was like,
what are you guys gonna do next, and said, oh,
doing this, uh this book series called Gossip Girl, and
everybody screamed. All these kids screamed. So the books already
had a big built in fan base going into it

(02:54):
that I think we were not fully aware how how
big the fan base was, how passionate. Yeah, we had
never really heard of them. And obviously you guys read
the books, had an idea of what you want to do.
Was it always going to be a TV show? For us?
It was so the other Not only did we not
know how popular the books were, no one told us
that they had tried unsuccessfully to develop the books a

(03:16):
couple of times prior to us, which may have made
us suspicious. We just went in like, you know, good thing,
good thing. You didn't know that, Yeah, very idealistic. So
I think it was. I think it was they attempted
it as a movie, I believe with Lindsay Lohan. Yeah,
Lindsay Lohan is Blair, Amy Sherman Palladino I think was
writing it, yeah, prior to us, so we were not

(03:37):
aware of any of that. Lindsay as Blair, who has Serena.
I'm not sure they got that far down the line.
Dina Lohan her mother. Okay, so you guys knew you
were going to go do that. By the way, how
did you guys originally meet to do the O C?
Are you going all the way back? We met prior

(03:58):
to the O C pilot. We met on a general
meeting and uh, out of that meeting, BOC was born.
And we just worked incredibly closely together. Stephanie was my
boss on the pilot, is what we like to say.
I guess that is the truth. That's why we truth. Um.
And I was the writer and she was the producer.
And but even though we had these different roles, we

(04:18):
just worked very seamlessly together and it was just a
real creative synergy and um, but she was Stephanie was
extremely thorough as a boss and as a producer and
with time my naps, because we're working a lot of
hours and I would be very tired and I'd be like,
please just take a nap, and she'd be like, you
have two minutes ago. No, it was like twenty minutes,
and I'd always give you like a couple of extra minutes.

(04:39):
But we did joke. My credit on the first season
of The o C was supervising producer and I literally
supervised him, is this an okay shirt to wear to networks?
Stephanie okay, thank you? Yeah she was supervising. No, yeah,
well that was part of the chart. And so very
early on though, it was like clear like, oh, you

(04:59):
are more than a producer or someone you know who
in this traditional usually producers are non writing producers on
a lot of these shows, and Stephanie was just clearly
someone who was a writer but was also at that
time acting more as a producer. So you know, first
opportunity was like you should write an episode of the show, um,
and she did and it was the Chris mcka episode,

(05:20):
and then we got to switch roles and I got
to be her boss. She did not nap. I did
not have to time any from but it was very
uncomfortable for me to have to be now the baby
writer handing my script into the show runner and like
praying that you liked it. And like that didn't get
a huge rewrite, that it wasn't a big whiff. She

(05:42):
nailed it. She sailed it as you expected. Yeah, but
I think that really formed like the basis of our
the foundation of our relationship, where we can wear different
hats with each other. We can write things together as partners.
One person can write something and the other person can
be more of a producer. We can sort of like
move back and forth pretty seamlessly, and I think that's

(06:03):
quite unusual for people. And I think most importantly, we
are okay being vulnerable with each other, which obviously if
you're going to write something or create something, there's a
lot of vulnerability required. So I always felt like I
could go to Stephanie with the most embryonic seed of
an idea or a pitch or what have you, and
there would be no judgment about what was lacking, only

(06:25):
excitement about what it could be. We were early adopters
of vulnerability exactly. Thank goodness those two got together. I
mean they literally launched the c W. That's insane, and
without the c W, I wouldn't have had the chance
to meet the wonderful people who became the Gossip Girl cast,
including one of my friends to this day, Chase Crawford.

(06:47):
Here's Chase talking about landing the role of Nate and
his relationship with another major cast member. Can you guess
who it is? Okay, So that was the first pilot season.
So then what happened? How did Gossip Girl come about?
And what's really funny, we had the same agent that
put us both on Gossip Yeah, we did. They're not
was awesome. Yeah, I loved her. I went, I ended up,

(07:09):
you know, meeting a different manager, and I segued and
so yeah, the Covenant came out to that in the
six I I segued that too, moving to I c M.
But I remember that stack of scripts. You can see
it in their office, and they back in the day
when we actually got you know, hard scripts and before
zoom and all that, um, it had Gossip Girl and
I had no. I I just saw him like, that

(07:29):
sounds ridiculous, you know what I mean? That sounds that's
what is That's not Friday Night Lights. That's ridiculous. I'm like,
surely they're not going to name it that, but they
told me they're like, these are the people that did
the O C. And I think I had gone into
actually an auditioned for Josh for like a guest star
on the o C thing, and obviously everyone I watched it.
I watched like every season of that, crying at the finale.

(07:53):
But yeah, Josh, Like when I knew Josh Sevny were
part of I'm like, yeah, this is I saw the
role they wanted to go for him, Like yeah, yeah,
this is okay, I can see this, and that process.
That was an interesting process though, Yeah, it was good.
We went into casting office and I think the director
and one of the producers was there, I can't remember.
And then they called pretty quickly We're like yeah, we like,

(08:14):
we want to go further and do potentially have a
test deal. And I didn't realize that that that me
at the time. I don't know if they really do
this anymore. You know, you have to basically go back
and read the same scenes for Josh and Stephanie and
the people you already read for, so now it's like
six people in the room, and then you gotta go
over two Warner Brothers or whatever you know at the
time CWS New and read for like the network head

(08:36):
and then you just like people sometimes oh my god,
and I remember the final one. It was like at
the top of the ABC, maybe in Berberg. I don't
know why it was there, necessarily I walked in this
big conference room and I kept me I remember thinking like,
who's gonna play Blair Waldorf because that's I admit I
made a few of those girls, you know that we're
in the running for it, and I don't know, I
just nothing struck me as like that's the girl. And

(08:59):
I remember going up top of the deal still nervous.
They let me in this massive waiting room which was
just a massive conference on the top of this thing,
and there was this one girl in this chair at
the very end, like with her back to me in
the chair and like I kind of want like HI,
introduced myself. She turns around headband on. It's late and
I'm like I instantly was like, oh, that's the girl.
Like if she can this is you can act. I'm

(09:20):
sure she can. Love that kind of had an instant
like friendship connection, you know, easy, easy to talk to
and uh. But then you had to go into this
room and it was like stadium seating, no no, no
one in the back was lit, just me and like
a spar stool and it was like, you know, and
you just see suits. Yeah, you just see like faceless people.
And it's so weird and like such a weird process.

(09:43):
So you guys listening. Once you shoot a pilot, no
one knows what the response is going to be and
if it's gonna get picked up. So it's so funny that,
like you go and put all this time, energy and
effort into something and you we have zero clue of
what's going to happen. It's wild. Yeah, you form these relationships.
It's like, can you go away for three weeks in
New York City. We're staying at like the Grammercy Park Hotel,

(10:04):
which at the time I had no idea. It's like
so so much fun and we just have a blast
and then you're like, okay, like the hope it works out.
You know, you might see in the fall. But actually
I remember the moment that Josh and Stephanie had us
up to this little production office Blake and all of
this showed up pen and everybody, and they just screened
it for us. It felt like a an whole time
TV and like in the classroom where they like will

(10:25):
you in. I remember watching it and being like, oh, Wow,
they made that from all that Crappley shot. Yeah, and
then the music. I remember like the music was so
good and I but I wasn't even fine tuned as
an actor then to know like what part of my
stuff would make it. I didn't know if it was
like going to even come together right, And obviously it's

(10:47):
it's always, you know, nerve wracking watching yourself for the
first time on something. But they remember being like, wow,
this is like they got it, like this is good,
Like I can't imagine that's not getting picked up. And
somehow I remember getting a copy of it. My parents
had the DVD and then they want they probably watched
the pilot twenty five times and they showed it to people,
to everyone. They're like, we're having a screening of gossip grond.

(11:08):
They were really they had fun. When did you and
Ed decide to live together? Because, by the way, you guys,
being roommates was one of the best things for me
of my entire experience. The roof deck, the watching football,
the making dinners like Alex Paul in between us great time.
Oh my god, that's right, we can talk about that.
That was hilarious. DJs like right next door to me

(11:30):
and Ed's building just lived there and literally next door.
She's like, come over my friend's house. He likes the
DJ at night, you know, and we'd like go over
there like two three in the morning and like party
and you know, he'd be playing music and he's like
ended up being the chain Smokers. It was great, you know,
it was amazing. He would remember, like Will started hiring
him at one of the places, but he was making
like a couple hundred bucks on like a Monday night

(11:51):
and now like has a residency and is one of
the biggest. Oh man, he's such a good dude that
you know, both are and yeah, no, I mean so
me and me and Ed, you know, and Ed coming
from London, he was he was I think he was
like the youngest as well. He was like barely eighteen
years old, right, you know. Yeah, and you know, I'm
this Texas kid lived in California. He's never lived in
the States before. And uh, I don't know, I guess

(12:12):
my I remember he was still in London after the
and it was summertime. I mean, my mom decided to
go to New York and like look at places and
we have you know, I have no idea. I mean,
I knew that New York was semi expensive, but like
it was insane. I mean it was you know. So
I looked and I was like, hey, buddy, um do
you yeah? Do you want to like? This is how

(12:33):
much I didn't believe it either. It's like, well, can
we not get like like it's full bedroom, like ten
thousand square foot you know, I'm like, no, that doesn't know,
we actually doesn't. This is gonna be a two bedroom
shoebox and uh yeah, you're sleeping in the office. And
it was a very nice place, very nice, very building,

(12:53):
extremely nice. And I mean I'm sure even now nowadays
probably even like triple whatever it was, but you know,
you had to put down like the first month's rent
a security deposit, and last months it's like a triple thing.
I had no not one check had come in from
the show me and I had to borrow money for
my dad, you know, might okay yeah, and then uh
and then I never saw it. I just sent him.
I think I sent him some photos. I take it.

(13:16):
I mean it's just like three iPhone days. I don't
even know how I like, I sent him these photos
and he's like, Okay, d never seen you, never been
there or anything. And but by the way how you
guys decorated, it was like very homey. It was very clean,
it was very fresh, and that I feel like that
was like a place where we would like get ready
and kind of pre game before we'd go to a

(13:37):
concert or a show or someone's play on the weekends
and stuff. Oh yeah, it was. It was a hub
for everything. And you know, and and and I had
experience living with roommates, you know, in college and stuff.
I'm not sure if if Ed Reardly did but hit
him getting to know me in that way, I shooting like,
I mean, you know, who knows for better for worse.

(13:57):
But we we had a we had a really really
great time, him watching like soccer, European football, me showing
him American football. And and you know, it had this
rooftop you know that rooftop situation that was like it
had like chairs, it was it was it was kind
of perfect. It had like a view. And we ended
up just going to kind of a local Irish hole

(14:19):
in the wall pub sometimes and coming back and we
called it roof deck. We we bring a couple of
bow speakers up there and I'm telling there wasn't a
better party in New York City. No, there was not.
There seriously was not a better party in New York City.
You guys, trust me. And speaking of New York, the
city was a big part of my life while filming
Gossip Girl. There's just something so magical about it. And

(14:42):
Taylor Momson agrees. Here's Taylor, I always feel like in
New York and like learning and growing as an artist
or wanting to become a better artist. Do you feel
like that New York keeps you on your toes? You know,
there's something so I don't know, there's I've been literally
around the world at this point, and there's snowhere else
like New York. It's just it has this energy to

(15:03):
it that you can't find in any other city and
hold something kind of special about even though you're surrounded
by people, you can hide in New York City, you know,
like it has it has both has all the elements
everywhere in one Like you can go You're gonna walk
one block and you're in the heart of everything walking
you know, walk a different street and by yourself yourself.

(15:25):
So it's awesome. I also don't think unless you live
there you would ever like imagine that because I remember
when I first that first season of the show, I
remember feeling like that. I was like a little lonely.
At one point, I think I was missing my family.
It was a new city. Even though everything was awesome,
the whole cast was incredible. I loved my apartment, I
loved everything, but I just remember one time, I'm like,
I feel alone right now. And this is crazy because

(15:46):
there's millions of people one block from me. There's like
cars going by every direction. But yeah, yeah, I felt
very kind of like isolated for a minute, and in
a way, it kind of felt good, you know what
I mean. Absolutely, it's I can't get enough of it.
I need in my life. Need isoltions that you know,
right and think and come down or whatever. And then
I need the excitement of the city and tour and

(16:09):
that side of life too. So it's it's I find
I find New York has the best balance of both.
You can depending on the day, you can you can
be wherever you want to be sure. So when you
first moved to New York, was it for Gossip Girl?
I know you did modeling and acting, you know, your
whole life, but was your initial move to New York

(16:29):
for Gossip Girl? Yes, um, yes, and no. When I
was when I was young, like very young, when I
was like two three, um, starting modeling and starting commercials,
we would spend summers in New York. So we get
an apartment for the summer and and that's where I
go to auditions and stuff. So I grew up in
the city, spending a lot of time there, but never
permanently lived there. And so we made the move, um

(16:50):
for Gossip Girl. Yet, right, you know, I moved on.
I was I think it was only twelve in the pilot. Okay,
that's crazy. How was that it was? It was interesting,
I mean at first, you know, I had spent so
much time my whole life kind of traveling around for
for projects, and I had never really spent a lot
of time in one school or like, you know, staying

(17:10):
I never really had a lot of friends growing up
and stuff because I was moving around so much. And
so when Gossip Girl came around, we had just settled
in my family just settled in Maryland, and I was
actually in a school for the first time. You would
like go back on breaks and stuff. For at least
the first season right the first season, I see friends
and stuff. Um, but when the show came about and
it was introduced to me into audition for it and stuff,

(17:32):
my agent actually had to fly to Maryland and try
to convince me to do this because I was really
content being in the school and having friends. For the
first week, it was a normal thing. You were like
going to dances and and having sleepovers and doing things
you do as a kid. And then it's crazy because
on the flip side, there's probably a ton of people
trying to act that would do anything to get the
opportunity to play Jenny Humphrey, although no one could have

(17:53):
played it even remotely close to how you did it,
and you I've been rewatching girl. Wow, you're else. But
let's get back to that. So you were content wanted
to stay, so they had to fly out to ask you. Yes.
My agent flew out and came to my house and
it's like, this is a really great opportunity. It's a
really cool character. It's a really cool show. You're gonna
get to live in New York City. We know you

(18:14):
love New York like it's full of fashion, which you love.
And did you think it was a cool character? I did. Um,
I hadn't read the books yet. He told me to
read the books. Um, I think I read the first one. Uh,
I don't. God's just so long, I know, girl, but
I think you're the first one. Anyway, long story short,
I ended up auditioning and we went to I went

(18:36):
to auditioned in New York. Um, took the bus to
New York and uh, very shortly after that had the part.
Like it was a very quick one to audition and
your cast and so then that was the huge shift, right,
And I will say it was the best decision I
ever made. I mean, moving to New York, my life
just opened up like and flourished in a completely new way.
Or and it probably had you grow as an artist

(18:56):
in all different ways, not just as an actor than
going into the musician that you are and be able
to be where you are now. That probably did open
the door, even though at the time you were probably
not thinking I'm gonna do the show. We didn't even
know how the show was going to be received. So
so it's just kind of one door opening another, which
is kind of what we keep talking about on some
of these episodes, which is what is like so fascinating
about life. Sometimes you get mad when you don't get

(19:18):
the audition, or if this song doesn't come out the
way you liked it, but then all of a sudden
the next song because of a heartbreak or whatever you
went through. Listen to me acting like I know how
to write a song. I don't. It's not wrong. You know,
you write a lot of bad songs before you write
good ones. You go on a lot of failed auditions
before you get the park you know, right, and and
sometimes you can be hard on yourself where you're like, oh,
you know, I wish I would have gotten that job,
or I can't believe where this person is now, And

(19:40):
then I'm like, I wouldn't be where I am if,
you know, if I didn't go to Josh's barbecue. Whatever,
So you get the audition. Also, David Rappaport, who casted
the pilot, had just told me that you were one
of the first that they cast, which I think is
awesome because with this cast and how big a show became,

(20:01):
that really speaks a testament to how amazing you are
and how much everyone believed in you to bring Jenny
Humphrey to life. Because um, when the first person is
cast on a pilot. That's a lot to go around you.
There was still a lot of girls to cast, there
was still a lot of family members around you. And
we know as actors there's a hype thing. There's like
hair color, their skin color that they all got to
like mesh well to make sure it flows and looks

(20:23):
right and people play off each other. So that's pretty
dope that you were the first one. That's totally cool.
I don't know if I even knew that I might. Um,
that's yeah, that's all I mean, that's very flattering. Thanks guys. Yeah, Taylor,
You're perfect and I love you so much. Another actor
that David, Josh and Stephanie were sure about was Ed Westwick.

(20:46):
But Ed's casting process wasn't very smooth, to say the least.
He didn't have a visa to work in the States,
and you really need that. So here's Ed to tell
us all about it. So the situation was, yes, didn't
have a visa, which obviously you have to have to
work in the States, and then I had to go
to Canada to get my visa done. An emergency like situation.

(21:08):
I was with this lawyer in Canada. I've never been
to Toronto before I just met this lawyer randomly. I
was nineteen. I was like, what is going on? This
guy in a long coat in the winter, and he said,
come with me, walked me to the front of this
line at the embassy or consulate in Toronto. But at
this point, you're just trying to get the visa to
go or is the job yours or they wanting you

(21:29):
to get the visa so you meet them. The job's
mind as long as everything goes right and I can
get to work within a few hours, which is like
the next morning, and this is for the pilot. This
is for the pilot, but I have to in order
to get in order to initiate the visa, you have
to leave the country and enter. So I had to
go to Canada to get it done and then fly

(21:51):
back and then I was starting work that next morning. Luckily,
you know, it all went through the people at the
embassy or whatever, because you know that govern agencies can
take their time to like get paperwork done. But hey,
this lawyer knew what he was doing. He said he
was one of those slick guys who knew everyone at
the embassy. It was like cruise to the front of

(22:12):
the line, and I didn't had no experience, and so
I got the I got the visa and we started
working and that was it, you know, and so whatever
happened with at this point, you knew that Chuck was
going to have an American accent, because I know there
was a conversation about maybe keeping your accent. No, that
was never really a thing me. It was like, I,
I know, I auditioned because when I when I auditioned

(22:36):
for Chase's part as well, right, but I mean I
was just kind of yeah, but it was like super
early on. It was like I walked in and they
said audition for both, and then it was it was
obviously like to be more for the Chuck role, and
and it was just it was a much more interesting role.
You know, I was having much more fun with it.
I think I had more of a character for it.
That was the part that resonated. So they were like, okay,

(22:59):
just stick with the Chuck and then they just wanted
to hear it in an English accent. And you can't
just this is the thing that people don't get is
you can't just make a character. You can't just switch
their accent. And a lot of people have had this
before where people will say, oh my god, do it
in an English accent, and it's like part of me

(23:19):
just does this because if the characters written to be
American and if there's if there's comedy, comedy is a
big thing. Everything sounds so different. As soon as it's
done in an English accent. The time, in the intonation
and everything like that, the whole performance changed, the whole
character changes. And there was an argument that, you know,
you could have pulled it off as an English accent,
but this character didn't need They didn't need that, you know,

(23:41):
he didn't need that added thing. This character he had
saved there anywhere and he was you know, he was
an aragon New York, New York type guy. So casting

(24:03):
the right actors for each role was crucial, but just
as important was the fashion on the show, especially on
Gossip Girl. It was a character we got to work
with one of the best stylists in the world, Eric Damon.
Eric talks about the magical wardrobe room and getting world
class designers involved. Here's Eric. I'll say that wardrobe room.
Walking into that wardrobe room is like so special to me,

(24:26):
like all like the vibes create the whole fantasy and
that's something This is something I learned, like working with
Patricia Field on Sex in the City was like to
create this atmosphere, in this ambience is important, you know,
to come in and have the beauty and like completely
immerse yourself in this fantasy world that we're you know,
we're creating fantasy and we're you know, we're dealing with
again a lot of like realistic logistics. But when you're

(24:49):
in there and you just want to like do your thing,
it's important to kind of walk into this fairytale world
that is the customs Shop so that you know, you
feel as an actor, you know, coming in that year
can be like Okay, I can block everything else out.
There's a lot of like crazyness outside of this room,
but right now we're just here and we're going to
create Vanessa's most incredible look to introduce finness into the world. Yeah,

(25:10):
how was um working with all the designers. I'm sure
that you had relationships with all of them anyway, just
from how talented you are and and all of your
credits and all the things, and how wonderful you are
to work with. Thank you. It was difficult in the
beginning because you know, again like designers, I don't want
to lend television back then, you know, it wasn't we
weren't established as this fashion show yet. I had some

(25:31):
relationships from sex in the City or from the editorial
world that we could pull in. And I think we
ended up season one was using a lot more like
younger designers, and like I guess we didn't you know,
c W, we didn't have a giant budget to be
buying Valentino one of the kind channel stuff that wasn't
part of it. And the more the kind of excitement
around the show as it grew, I think there was

(25:53):
more and more excitement from designers, and like I think
a big part of like the success of it was
we had the writer strike that happened, and Warner Brothers
and c W were very smart to like use that
as a marketing moment, Like we did all these great
marketing campaigns with you guys and you know, push two
kids in the show in front of the media because
it was just like void of media at the time.

(26:16):
And I think because all of a sudden, kids were
being shot by paparazzi and like some Blake is carrying
Chanel bag. It's getting idd and I think people like
there was a switch that happened between like saying what
the show looked like and the heft that it carried
in the media where all of a sudden, like when
we came back from that, there was a lot more
interest from the designers. And really it's like Chanel was

(26:39):
one of the first big houses that said yes that
they wanted to work with us, And I think once
we got Chanelle locked in, you know, and it's like
it's funny, like how pr like how these PR houses worth.
They're like every gonna be like do you have Chanelle?
Do you have fair Gumma? Do you you know, it's
just like such a game a little bit like who
do you have? And he said yes, I'm not gonna
say yes until they say yes, Like, well, if one
of you don't say yes, then you know it's not

(27:02):
going to happen. And Chanelle, you know, I think Carl
I think saw something in Blake and maybe it's been
you know, I think that was part of the excitement
around it, and Chanelle said yes, and then it was
just like the deluge we had free Reign and again,
so grateful to Chanelle and all the designers. We got
to work with so many incredible designers and have all

(27:24):
these amazing pieces like shipped right off the run way.
You know, really had um that I haven't had since then,
like I had it again on on The New Gossip Girl.
But it was a moment in time like to have
all of these incredible which also led to this success
of what we were doing with the show, because you know,
we weren't able It wasn't able to purchase that, and
we weren't able to have access to these clothes. So

(27:44):
I think, you know, the relationships we did have, and
again so grateful to all of the designers and all
the you know, design houses and PR companies that were
so excited to work with us and really helped us
make all of this vision come true. Eric also had
a few words for our next guest, the almost always
stylish Carter Basin. Here's my friend Sebastian stand I'm playing

(28:06):
Carter and the accessory he's never allowed to wear on
the Upper East Side. I didn't really think that I
was going to be coming back, you know it. Nobody
had said this was going to be a recurring character.
I think it was only gonna be one or two
episodes and then you know, they they kind of brought
him back around and that was fun and sort of
got all these intricate storylines and it's just funny how

(28:27):
I ended up with Serena. It was always this like
history with Serena and stuff. He always popped up in
the scene sort of swarm me, you know, kind of
just with another fact or you know, he's had he
had one more thing up his sleeve, and and I
was like, God, I'm just always going to be like
this nasty guy you know that just pops in there.
And but it was super fun like and it was

(28:48):
I think it was overwhelming two at times, because like
you said, we were just growing up and I think
you get a lot of young love and a lot
of things that kind of are coming act very quickly
and you're just trying to process it it and I
think it always looks you know, when we look back now,
I think we can all look back and just kind
of go like, oh, yeah, that was It was more

(29:11):
fun than we and we were thinking at the time.
But totally where people coming in right, like yeah, people
that like popped in and out, and the whole fashion
world think about that, like the fashion stuff we would
go to. I know, well that was I was always
a plus one at those things, but it wasn't really
invited directly. But but I remember being there and going like,

(29:32):
oh my god, like this is just intense. I don't
I'm just gonna look to see where the bar is.
You know, you always look very sharp and good and fit. Right,
Somebody show me a picture of me back then, like
and I remember just like doing the half shirt talk,
talking like like the one like the button, you know,
like a button down and there's one it tucked in

(29:53):
but not the other. And like I had like four
buttons on buttoned down to here and stuff. It was
just like, oh my god. I would say now though,
if Vogue or anyone did a like survey, I would say,
you're probably top five best dressed in Hollywood at this point,
and it's probably is out there. To be honest, I
don't know. I could thank my stylist. I guess in

(30:14):
Michael Fisher in a lot of ways. He's I sort
of just turning him and go like, listen, you gotta
tell me what to do. But I think in terms
of our show, the show, right, like Eric who was
our constant design I remember I tried on a suit
one time and I was like, should I get a
belt or something? And he was like, no, there was

(30:35):
belts happening on the side, and that was kind of
a thing. And I know, he started a few trends
at the time, Right, I'm not crazy that he's like
an icon and not only is he an amazing artist
in the fashion world to bring all those characters to
life in a way, like how he dressed Chuck. Chuck
walked a certain way in those suits because of how

(30:56):
you know he felt in them, you know what I mean? Well, yeah,
I think that's what happens when you as you get
older and stuff, you start to look at all these
pieces that kind of come together to make this think.
You know, when you're younger's sort of like I'm the
actor and I'm going to do my character and stuff,
but like these people supply all these other kind of
layers to create those things. But yeah, I mean he

(31:17):
Chuck Bass was a very uh he seemed to always
have all the cool lines and you know, yeah, Eric
Damon killed it with that. So you came on basically
Carter Bays and dated Serena. Did you have other love stories?
It was basically Serena. But then I don't quote me
here because it's been a while, but I do remember

(31:39):
at one point that he became a bit of a
pond in the Blair Chuck Wars right right, Yes, there
was something there like that or or I don't know,
but it was always Serena. Yeah. Yeah, so you worked
with Blake Lively, who played Serena on our show the most,
But then you really went off to work with a
wonderful group of leading ladies, Margot Robbie, you have a

(32:03):
movie coming out with the cool kidman Manelope Cruise. I mean,
those are just really beautiful, wonderful actors to work with, totally.
I mean, I yeah, I've been very lucky to be
opposite incredible partners. I think when you think of acting,
it's always sort of this partnership in this dance that
I feel like has to happen with the people you're
working with, and and it's true, I you know, I think, yeah,

(32:27):
it really did start with Lake essentially. I mean, I
think I've sort of, yeah, I've managed to kind of
work with find my way with with some of the
most strongest women out there. I honestly feel like I'm
better in the scene as a result of it. And weirdly,
I can't quite say I've had the same experience with
male like super famous actors, you know, like it's actually

(32:49):
been weirder on that and actually working with with a
strong woman because there's no bullshit. You just sort of
like have to show up and like do the work.
And I think male dynamics are are sort of funny
with each other, you know, when you have someone who's
like older or you know, a younger person coming in
and stuff like, there's always sort of an interesting tug

(33:10):
of war, which I'm like always rolling my eyes at. Right, Yeah,
I would. I would rather pick a strong female partner
in a movie or a TV show any day, Totally agree, Sab. Luckily,
Gossip Girl had so many strong leading women on it,
like our next guest, who played badass mom to the
Upper east Side. Here's my Girl, Kelly Rutherford on growing

(33:31):
up and the lessons she learned from playing Lily. Here's
Kelly were you were you Team Rufus, Team Bart or
team William. Gosh, Well, William wasn't even in there very much.
It was sort of like, you know, we didn't we
explored it but I don't think it was as sort
of explored as Bart and and Rufus, and I really
liked both because it really shows you and when Obviously,

(33:54):
what I loved about the character and what they wrote
for the adults on the show grown Ups, was your adults.
But you know what I mean grown ups is that
you know, we hadn't We didn't have it all figured
out either. We didn't always know what to do either.
And I think that was part of the beauty of
what made our storylines interesting as well, is that you know,
there's a part of all of us that would want

(34:15):
to be with Rufus and want to be with Bart
and so you know, they were such interesting characters in themselves.
So and at different times in your life, one makes
sense and maybe another one would make sense, right like
as you grow and you change. And obviously if Rufus
and I were meant to be together and we were young,
we would have been. But there are things that came along,
and I think there are always those people that you

(34:36):
you wonder, Yeah, like God, there's so much there, There's
so much. There's so much. Yeah, that we're alike and
we relate to each other, and there's so much there,
so what is it? Why can't we get it together?
And then we end up marrying someone that you would
never think that came out of nowhere. You're married, right,
and it's great, you know. So it's you realize that
that's life. And I think the older you get in

(34:58):
particular helps and our work and what we do is
that you're just you don't judge things the way you
used to. You go with the fact that things don't
always make sense, and that that doesn't make people bad people,
absolutely not. And I think you hit it right on
the nose, Like I think, somewhere in life you think
your parents should have it all figured it out or
they do, and then you get to an age where

(35:19):
I'm like, oh my gosh, my mom was still figuring
stuff out. Even though she was the best mom and awesome,
there was a lot going on to you know, my
parents got divorced when I was in high school. I
would have never known that it was as difficult as
it maybe was. Because even if it's people are ready
to be apart and get divorced and it might be
the best thing for the relationship, it's still not an
easy thing. You're wrapping up a chapter especially when there's

(35:39):
kids and stuff. So I think too, when we look
up to your parents, you guys are such legends in
our eyes, and you guys do things that we think
you have like you just got it all figured out,
and you guys wear that hat and do it so well.
And then I think as we get older and see like, oh,
they were figuring things out. But that's just what you
do for your kids. You make them think it's we're
going to be fine, because we are going to be fine. Yeah,

(36:03):
And then I think parents do their best to see
that that's possible, you know. But I always tell my kids, look,
I'm I'm open to suggestions because I think it helps
to get feedback as a parent too when they're able
to because we don't always know. We you know, we're
going based on what we knew as how it worked
with our parents and so on and so forth. So

(36:23):
but you just realized the humor in it all. You
know that it's all the family dynamics is a lot
of there there was. I was like going back and
reflecting on when Lily was with Bart you were on
the Upper East Side at a lunch with him, and
the way the music was and the way the camera
angle was coming in on you. I'm just gonna play

(36:44):
it because I really felt for your character for a
minute in this moment about kind of all the emotions
she was going through figuring out should I be with
this man? And you're just such a phenomenal actor, Like
I remember, like I kind of felt like goose bumps
for a minute, like, oh my god, she's sad? Is
she to go through with this? What is she doing?
So let me just play this for you. I'm watching

(37:05):
Lily Vanda Woodson um at a restaurant on the Upper
East Side and kind of taking in what her life's
going to be with bart Bass, and it just kind
of shows you that money and all of that can't
buy you happiness, that she's actually like, wait, this is
not what I want. Yeah, she looks sad. That was

(37:25):
a real true moment. I think people before they're going
to get married, some people do a checklist through their mind.
Do you remember that scene he got up to get
it take a business call and you're kind of just
like you can tell you you just went somewhere else,
and we're like, I don't know if I want this.
Well that's the thing though, you know, I think to
realize that no matter who you're going to marry, there's

(37:46):
going to be stuff. Right, So if you marry Rufus,
you're going to have a grand stuff and be married
bart You're gonna have this stuff. So it's like choosing
what stuff you want to deal with. And I think
that that the humanity and that is so beautiful is
when you realize, regardless of who I'm with, I'm going
to have to find my way and find my own
happiness and my own joy and and allow them to

(38:08):
really be who they are and who they're showing themselves
to be. Right. So I think that moment probably was
a lot about Okay, this is who I'm marrying, this
is what I'm this is, this is what this set
of things are going to be with this person. Absolutely
your storylines and you were on the whole time the
show was on, so you worked with everyone who did

(38:29):
you have? Um, you had good chemistry with everyone because
you're just a great actor and and it was just
well cast across the board. I was telling David Rappaport,
I mean you couldn't have gotten everyone. They did hit
and brought it and made it so colorful and so
wonderful and the chemistry with everyone because everyone had something
with someone. So I was like, it's so funny that
not everyone had chemistry reads in the very beginning, the

(38:49):
way it all went, everyone dated, everyone had some sort
of a relationship with each other. So who did you
enjoy when you look back, who did you laugh with
the most? Well? David is incredible. I mean David was
super young. I mean I remember going in and reading
in a small office in Studio City. I mean it
was like and he was so lovely. He had such

(39:10):
a wonderful way about him, and I'm sure that's part
of why he's so good at what he does. David's
the casting director for those of you that don't know,
he cast the pilot off and anyway. But in terms
of working, you know, Caroline and I still are good friends.
I mean, Matthew and I rufus still Caroline who played
my mother cc um. You know, I loved the dynamic

(39:33):
with Ed and I in terms of our our dynamic
as actors. You know obviously adore him. I know, uh,
and I like, you know, the thing is, I mean
I really enjoyed working with everyone. To be honest with
you again, thankful to Josh and Stephanie and to David
for casting every bo. I mean they literally cast my

(39:55):
mother and her birthdays one day after my mother and
my grandmother's Danish and she's from Sweden, Like you know,
the pain of cast someone more, you know, That's what
I mean. It was just there was something so aligned
about it at the time. So I enjoyed working with everyone.
I enjoyed working with Blake. I love her character and
our dynamic. I love um you are dynamic with yeah,

(40:16):
Lily and Serena was it was a really cool, beautiful
thing and you kind of watched it grow, you know,
throughout the seasons and and your wardrobes. I mean it
was beautiful and so sick, so fun. Talking about husbands,
can we get some love for Vanya. He's one of
the best and the husband of our next strong female

(40:36):
character and the heart of the show to Rhoda before
she joined XO XO. Susanna Shotskowski stopped by the podcast
to talk about swearing in Polish and how the role
of de Roda grew here. She is, Susanna, your situation
for Gossip Girl, Like it was never going to be
that De Roda was in start to finish no first, No, No,

(41:01):
it was totally unexpected. And I always tell like young
actors that you know, I always my advice is always
like you never know uh where the character ever know
where your opportunities lie. You know, you have this idea
that oh, this is gonna be the job that's it,
or this is the thing that this is gonna be
a great gig for me, this is my path, and
it's always a surprise, like it's never the one you

(41:22):
thought it was. It's always somewhere where you didn't expect
or see it. Because for me, um the Derotor role
was an audition for literally it was a possible recurring
guest star. And the breakdown said something like sixty plus
plus housekeeper. Yeah, and there were and there were no

(41:46):
and I said no lines and so I was likea
was sixty five years old and a mute, silent Yeah, yeah,
there are no lines in the There were no lines
in the first episode. And it was like, by the way,
there's so without Deronda, so there's no a girl. Basically
it was gone, I'm I'm dropping the bike dub with
the podcast, like no gossip Girl exists. Yeah. So it

(42:09):
was like they were so basically it was like a
possibly going to recur housekeeper who didn't have any lines,
and they were looking for an older woman. But the
only keyword, the only reason I even popped up, you know,
my agents even submitted me, was the Polish part. I
had just played a Polish housekeeper and the Sopranos, like
in the final season this little show no one's ever
heard of that basically television have a tiny part because

(42:30):
then like they had a really cool Polish housekeeper who
did a lot of stuff on that show, but that
wasn't me. And then in the final season when she
was gone, I played uh, the Polish housekeeper for Carmel
and Tony for like three episodes. But I said a
couple of lines to Tony which was actually really thrilling,
you know really, and I'm like, you know, and he
was really and James caandeal Pine he was really nice

(42:52):
to me and he said I had a good accent
and I was very good, and I was like so exciting,
But but it had just happened right before the gospel audition,
so we're like, well, they know you you can do
a Polish maid, and they know you're not sixty five.
And in fact like this always shocks people. But when
we started Gossipel, I was twenty eight and I love
it because when you really look you don't like very young,

(43:17):
but people in person maybe say, oh, you look younger.
But the contrast and like what they did with the character,
it just made me seem like, right, and we're in
a high school. Yeah yeah, like and you're you know,
sixteen at the time. Yeah, yeah, I supposed to be
like raising her. Yeah. And the thing is like we
always had all these lines a Deroto going to feed

(43:38):
ducks in Central Park with Blair when she was a baby,
and I was like, yes, Deronto was twelve, you know,
but anyway, literally Deronda was learning how to walk as well.
Don't worry, it's like Hollywood magic. But any anyway, so
I went in for an audition and I had there
were no lines, So what do you look like you
know the road literally yes, literally for the audition, they said,

(44:04):
you know, improvised, like you're serving breakfast to some rich kids,
and I was like okay, um and in the lobby right, Well,
that's the thing is, I was like, I gotta do
something with personality, and so like when I signed in
in the lobby and you know, the actors, I'll sign
in a sheet. And I saw that I was the
only one with a Polish name, so I was like, oh,

(44:24):
I'm probably the only like, you know, legit pole in here.
So I figured let me lean into that. So when
I did the audition, I sort of improvised and I
was like mumbling and talking to myself in Polish, like
in a sort of like, uh, you know, brilliant. I
love that, And I did it for so long, and

(44:46):
I think it was I'm pretty sure it was Mark Pisnarski,
who was like who did the pilot and had directed
the pilot, but this I wasn't in the pilot, was
in the second episode. But I remember they let me
go on and on for you're just talking to yourself.
I'm just walking around a pole us cursing and you know,
roll in my eyes, and and then I left. And
it was funny because I got the part, and I

(45:07):
didn't really think that was that. I was like, oh, okay,
I mean it's like no lines, like whatever. And my
agent said, you know, it's gonna probably be a good,
big show because it's based on a very popular book series.
And I thought another hit show. You're like, yeah, and
I didn't really know anything because I was just like
I never knew anything about anything I was, which is
also always good. I really am the same. Yeah, And

(45:30):
I've talked to I mean, I've heard I've listened to
your podcast. I'm a big fan, and I've heard a
lot of people can't talk with you about you know,
this idea that um, you know in this business, you know,
either make a pilot that will the pilot go? Who
knows will when we recast? Will it one continue? Will
the show get picked up? Like all of the variables
and uncertainty, the fact that any show ever goes at all,

(45:52):
much less that it becomes popular, much less that it continues,
much less that in that it then becomes part of
the zeitgeister in, you know, part of culture over time.
Like it's just so many phenomenal things one after the
other with the show that I didn't even know to
worry about. Like when we were talking show, I never
even occurred to me to worry that they wouldn't renew
it or you know, I was always on the ride.

(46:13):
You know, I'm just gonna talk to myself and the
most favorite pars on the show. No, But it was
like I just always was, you know. And the thing
for me is that I was always scared I would
never that they would never have me back. So it
was like in the beginning, I Is Dorota's character sort
of grew over time. I never all every single script.
I was like, I hope they didn't kill me off

(46:34):
or get rid of me. I was like, I was
like waiting for that to happen for six seasons. UM.
So I never really even felt super comfortable in it. Um.
But yeah. But the funny part was the when I
got the part. They called me and said, you know,
you got the the show, and I text message my
boyfriend at the time and I said I got Gossip
Girl and he wrote back he was like, did you

(46:54):
mean this for somebody else because he thought I met
I got Gossip Girl, Like, hey girl, I got God Yeah,
And I was like, no, no, I got the show
called Awesome Girl. And it was funny. But you know,
I showed up and my first scene was with Layton.
It was like a really cool reveal for my character
because it was like Lara's speaking kind of lamenting about

(47:18):
her day and her troubles, and it ercent looks like
she must be talking to her mother, because he would
only speak to your mother that way. And then when
they shot reverses, you see that it's the housekeeper. And
so even though the housekeeper had no lines, you could
see that like, this is in this girl's life, This
is who she has to you know this, Yeah, this

(47:38):
is her maternal figure, and like this is kind of
you know, where she is um in terms of her
relationship with her own mother. So it was automatically kind
of set up in that way, and I think, you know,
the the relationship between Laren Dorota sort of grew, sort
of it grew organically, and then we had so much
fun with it, and then all this kind of silly

(48:01):
uh stuff started getting introduced. I remember the first episode
where it was like a funny thing happened for Derona
was that Cyndi Lauper came in and and and Blair
wants to run off after Chuck or something, and then
so she ends up pushing to Rota on Cyndi Lauper
like she's like, you know, Deronte is your biggest fan.
And I had this fantastic scene with Cindy Lapper where

(48:22):
I had to like, you know, freak out over her,
and so Throta all of a sudden started having a
little you know, funny things to do, and I think
over time it started to to grow. Yeah, oh my god,
I love that love. And honestly, like when Norman Buckley
was on he was talking about yeah, yeah, where he

(48:42):
was like, you guys have to kind of lead into
this relationship because of the way Blair's relationships with her mother,
there has to be this thing. Basically, he would saying,
you guys have to explore this relationship right now. He
really was the guy. I mean he and I know
you talked about this in the podcast, but he was
the one who really re established the possibilities for Dorota

(49:05):
because he switched up this scene where Margaret. It was
written for Claire's mom, and then he made it all
of a sudden because of him and his collaboration with
the writers and producers, it became Derota scene, and it
was really what defined that role. All of a sudden,
it came from like an implied possibility to a reality
and so he opened that door and it was such

(49:27):
a huge moment. It happens sometimes as an actor where
you have uh, you know, you're sort of doing your
work over here on the side, and then you kind
of get a door that you can step through, you know,
and somebody has to open that up for you. And
it was for me and for Deronda, it was literally
just kind of my whole body right now. It was
so cool. We all loved de Rota as Bossip Girls heart,

(50:00):
but sometimes you need a villain to come in and
shake things up. That's where our next guest comes in,
because who can play a villain better than Michelle Tracked
and Burg here's Michelle. I'm playing the sexy, strong and yeah,
kind of evil Georgina Sparks. I. Yeah, I was in
l A and I had wanted to move back to
New York, but I didn't really have a reason. So
I was looking for TV shows and I was at

(50:21):
a big agency at the time, and somehow it got
to me that someone involved, either Josh or Stephanie I'm
not sure, had heard about this small guest star and
it wasn't it was an offer. I think they might
have gone to, you know, one or two people before,
which is very common. Um, but obviously it was waiting
for the perfect bitch to walk correct. Yeah, and I

(50:44):
was like, believe me, I am very comfortable with playing evil.
I do it in my life all the time. I
actually had some sort of feeling I couldn't remember. I
don't remember everyone's story of coming on because it's been
so long. But I actually this morning when I was
like thinking about talking because I was so excited and
like I actually kind of remember or somewhere in like

(51:05):
a haze in my mind, like I do think she
was just offered this, which is also like awesome as
an actor. That says a lot that they were just like, hey,
we're gonna like trust you with this role that's gonna
come and like mess up a lot of stuff on
the Upper East Side. No, it's really great. I mean
I think Josh Short Short Jephanie Savage a million times

(51:27):
over yet and I believe now that I mean, this
is what fifteen years ago? Ten I can't count anymore. Um,
what day is it? The phone call sort of went like, hey,
do you want to come on this show that people
hadn't fully fully heard of, but still because it also
stopped airing, right, it's sort of the middle because it
was the writer's straight Oh I haven't seen it. I

(51:48):
just finished this film and like Okay, well, what's the
character about. Well, we can tell you she's an evil bitch, like,
oh and okay, you had me at evil. Let me
just play this clip, bro, quick, are you drugging Serena? Ge? Oh? Boy,

(52:11):
that was quick. You can try to get later. Okay,
I'd like to propose a toast. Okay to the new
you vyd com in. You basically don't give her an
option other than to hang out with you this evening,
and then you go and you drug Serena. I remember

(52:32):
reading this in the script and being like, oh my god.
And then it just the more crazy stuff comes on
and comes on and comes on with you. I mean,
you baked being Gossip Girl. You tell Dan that he's
the father of your child. I mean, you did some
scandalous stuff. Thank you. I can't really take credit for that.
Was you know, the team of g G and they're
amazingly brilliant writers. And the directors came on like do

(52:56):
you remember Amy Heckerlan directing? Yes, so cool? Well, and
I just sort of yeah, I had always predominantly played
the good girl, and I was so over that. Oh great,
I have to smile every day and give people flowers
and chocolate. I'm like, no, let me screw something up
in here. So that was just fun. And I was

(53:16):
I think I was twenty three or twenty four, and
I was really looking for a role that brought me
over that you know, child star kind of phase. It
was that, and it was sexy, and it was strong,
and it was a woman that, maybe a little bit
too much, knew what she was doing and had every
intention of doing it. She was rather unapologetic, which I
think is very fun for an actor to play, for sure.

(53:38):
And you did it so well, Um when you were
coming to do it at this point, like you were saying,
like people knew about the show but didn't know exactly
what it was all gonna do. Did you ever have
a feeling about that like it was going to hit
the way it did, And if so, what was that
for you? Or were you just like I'm gonna go
do my job, kill it and we'll see what happens. Well,

(53:58):
you know, I had been and Buffy, and I knew
the c W machine um even though it's called something
else back then, because I don't know um and so exactly.
And I knew that they would put a juggernaut of
publicity machine behind it. That was always their formula and
they were very good at it. And I knew that
the books were popular with you know, the I don't

(54:22):
know what you call the millennials, teenage girls. I'm a
grant um. But it would just build momentum. And I
actually think the writer's strike possibly helped it to not
be canceled because more people were watching while nothing new
was being created. So I think it was just a
spiral of like wild events. Uh. I loved the writing.
I thought it was obviously sassy and and witty and

(54:44):
respected the audience and didn't you know, play down like
a you know, cheesy goofy one of the other network
shows that I'm not going to say because maybe they
want to give me a job someday. Um. And it
was great. It was fun, and I I knew about
a fashion and you know, I've always been the fashion
like obsessed girl, and just walking into Eric Damon's like

(55:07):
magical emporium for the first time that was epic, right. Yeah.
I was like, oh, oh, this is serious, and you
immediately got the sex in the city vibes because Eric
is a you know, disciple of Pat Field, so it
just all felt right and I got to I really
really really sparkly jewelry and a lot of it. You did,
you looked awesome. This next guest also played a complicated

(55:29):
character and had fun playing someone so different from who
he is in real life. Here's the super sweet Robert
John Burke on having fun with the dashing and devastating
bar Bass. I'll tell you a funny story that combines
my fire service with Gossip Girl. We had a false
alarm in a hotel. The hotel is emptying out. People
are in their pajamas. These girls are in their pajamas,

(55:51):
and I'm walking in with the hook, like the big
pole and the water can. I have all my gear on.
And as I'm walking into the hotel, this girl is
like she's too as from my face, walking past me,
and she looks at me. She goes, she goes, are
you Chuck's dad? And I looked at her so quickly.
I looked at her and I was literally a fire happening,
and that's her question, so you Chuck sand I look
at her and I go, chuckstad is dead. And I

(56:13):
keep walking and she was like she started screaming, and
she like kind of tripped and fell and her girlfriend's
caught her and she's pointing in my direction and she's
like it's and and her. I can hear the converse
the friends going, what do you mean? What are you
talking about? You know, Sharon, are you okay? Whatever? And
and so finally I saw her on the outside by
the fire truck. I came around the opposite end. She

(56:34):
could never see me again, and I left, you know
what I mean. But when she said to me, are
you Chuck's dad? Like, just like that, I said, Chuck's
dad is dead, like immediately she just freaked. Anyway, So
I always remember that one. By the way, did everyone
everyone was okay in that fire? There's no fire. It's
just a false alarm. We were just emptying out, you know.
It's like, oh, a false alarm. Okay, that is hilarious.

(56:56):
Automatic alarm. And that happens like over the years, like
you'll show up and know like, hey, you look like
the guy from Special but whatever. And so when I
first started, you're a shnook if you don't say, oh hello,
you speak to the people. And then other firefights, like dude,
we're like twenty minutes like getting back because you're like
I'm like dude, you're the one who told them that, know.
And so now if somebody says, wait, wait, is is

(57:18):
that the guy and my guys they'll say, oh, no, no,
he looks just like that guy. Yeah, no, yeah, no,
that's not him. It looks just like him. He looks
just like bar Pass but it's not him. Um. A
guy one night leaning on the side of the road,
he's like, are you Mickey from Rescuing me? And I
was like, I said, it's three thirty in the morning.
I was driving the amulance. I said, if I was

(57:39):
Mickey from Rescue, why would I be here with you?
And he goes, wow, he goes, you look just like him.
And he goes and you sound like him too. It's like,
oh god, yeah, it happens. But I'm sure you know
that is just hilarious. Are you Chuck's dad? No, Chuck's
dad is dead. And she just she just her hands

(57:59):
went up to her and started shaking, like shaking. It
was so weird. And then she was trying. The poor thing.
She was trying to explain what she had seen to
her friends, and they were just thinking, something's wrong with
this something is wrong with this girl. Yeah, And it
was really bad. I wish I could just I wish
a videotape of that that would have been. But anyway,
hilarious that is that it is funny. It's this show

(58:23):
just affected so many of the fans in such a
way like it's actually quite sweet and you know, but
that's wild. There's an alarm going off and that happened.
Oh my goodness. I think I think that like Serena
and Blair their relationship, just I think there was just
so much identification with it for two girls, girls at age. Yeah,

(58:44):
for girls at age, even irrespective of their affluence, because
the things they went through were just relevant and identifiable
at any you know, well, yeah, yeah, I I really
think that. And you wanted to know that these things
have somehow you were finding out that these things happened
with rich kids, poor kids, you know, and how they

(59:07):
navigate their world and their problems are just as real
as anybody else, a relative and real. Yeah, and it was.
There was so many things. It was like their relationship
and their competitiveness, sometimes as best friends and then having
each other's backs and betraying each other but yet still
being each other's number one fan. And then you know,

(59:28):
mixed families and divorce and death, and it was fashion
and it was all there. It was all there, and
how did they how did they get through it? And
it was usually like, well, I think that's Serena's part,
just honestly, you know what I mean. She was always
very honest, opened and forth right. She was not very

(59:48):
duplicitous a lot of the time. And if you pushed
her and like bothered her, she was going to push
back and stand up for herself. So there was a
sense of self worth. And you know, Blair was always
a little more curial and duplicity is somehow but always
wound up understanding the lesson or you know, in life.
And I I just thought, you want to talk about

(01:00:09):
two actresses, two actors? Actually I should say who stepped
into these roles? I mean glove Fit day one. Yeah,
from the pilot, Yeah, from the pilot. It's just so
it's so strange, it's beautiful to see actually, yeah, it's great. Yeah.
And and then even to like what how different the
three guys were. I mean, you take you know, Dan

(01:00:29):
to Chase, to to Chuck, Dan, Nate to Chuck. It's
this kid from Brooklyn and then you still have these
two rich kids, and you know, a lot of family
stuff going on, but there was a softness to Nate,
like internally and externally. And then there you know, them
playing best friends. I mean, they just did a great job.
And then you kind of had, you know, Jenny and
I from Brooklyn, one wanting to fit into that world

(01:00:52):
so so badly, one not wanting to and not getting it.
So there was that piece to the puzzle over here.
And then I really thought even and Kelly and I
were just talking about this last week, the dynamic of
the parents so to speak. You know, we were all
adults at that point, but I mean they're still so young.
But that the parents in the show, they really did
a good the humanity, like what they did in all

(01:01:14):
of the relationships. There were great even to the relationships
with the kids, their kids and their stepkids and each
other and their parents. Like Lily's relationship with CC is
a whole another thing. You know. CC, I think was
only in about ten episodes, and she's so memorable. She's
she makes such a presence, it's wild. I looked that
up the other day and I was like, well, she

(01:01:34):
must have been and it was I think it was
ten or something twelve. It was something shocking because it
felt like it was like a couple of seasons and
it wasn't even a full season. Yeah, you must have
done like quite a few. Yeah. I mean I was
in in and out like I was ten of thirteen
for four and a half seasons. Yeah. But I mean

(01:01:56):
some of the episodes, Robert I had come in and
you know, go hand Nate a letter and then like leave. Yeah, no,
I believe me. I used to call those the perfect crime,
you know, because I was getting paid, whether I was
there one scene or forty two scenes, to get paid
the same. So it was a trip and I'd be
liking Jamaica on the beach sometimes on my the perfect crime.

(01:02:17):
We call it rescue me. Once I had one word
and and my buddy Lenny had one word, and it's
like Dennis Leary's characters up on top of the bridge
and we're like Tommy, No. He says Tommy, and I
say no. And we did it four times and that
was it, and he looked at me said perfect crime.
See you on the next episode. I was like, dude, wild,
what would definitely be a crime is if we got

(01:02:39):
through the whole episode without hearing from our final guests,
the Queen of the Upper east Side, half of the
best relationship on television, Eleanor Waldorf. Let's end our walk
down Memory Lane with the legendary Margaret Colin. Here's Margaret,
and I just want to talk a little bit about
the relationship with Cyrus, because when when that came on,
the dynamic of you two was so lovely and great,
and he's obviously an incredible actor as well. Did you

(01:03:02):
know right away were they casting all around? I don't.
I don't really know the story with how he was cast,
do you guys know, I don't. I think it was
an offer. I think I'm sure it was an offer. Uh.
And I think once I knew that there, Cyrus was
introduced as I recall, and uh, you never got the
scripts way ahead of time, did we ladies know? So?

(01:03:23):
So then you just looked on the call sheet on
who was playing it and uh. And I had known
Wally from mutual friends and of course you know, I
have his aunt Damn and Lemon play right here. So
signed he's a player, I and a stage actor and
a film actor as well. Um, so I I knew

(01:03:44):
him socially a little bit through mutual friends, and then
we we knew it was a big site gig because
I'm five ten and he's not, and there's a big
age there's a big age difference, so we knew that
they were going for that. But both of us just
sank our feet very plant, very firmly planted on the

(01:04:05):
idea that this was mutual respect and a lot of love.
They were both financially very comfortable, but it was mutual
respect and a lot of love, and I think that's
what made the relationship work great. Right. Also, we had
a chance with that relationship to see eleanor a little
softer sometimes giddy, you know, and those were really thrilling
moments to see, uh, to see that almost girl like quality.

(01:04:27):
It was just just being in love. So that was
one of the more pure love stories. I would say
on the show. It really was, and you really felt it.
It was like when he would talk to Blair about it,
I'm like, oh my gosh, he's like madly in love
with her mother. Like it was sweet, really sweet, right,
So that and that was they wrote that, and then
Wally just you know, committed to it and that that

(01:04:50):
I was very grateful for what I wasn't so grateful
for was when they we danced at some party I
don't remember. I don't think it was my set, but
they uh okay, uh Wally and Eleanor dance which puts
his head right in my boobs and and then he
dips her. Well, I don't know, ladies, if you've been dipped,

(01:05:12):
how often you've been dipped. But when the guy is
up to your boobs, it's really hard to be dipped,
to be bent over in his arms. Right. So the
director comes up and we're approaching the scene. It's not
the first thing up in the day, and the director
comes up and she says, well, I didn't bother staging
this because you know, I knew your actors would would

(01:05:32):
know how to handle it. And I'm looking at her, going, oh,
similar to what they say with the sex scene. You guys,
go ahead. I didn't bother picking my shots. You just
do what you do. Oh I should just do what
I do. My husband will be so pleased. So so like, oh,
all of a sudden, you're abdicating your job as a director.
You don't have a shot, you don't have any idea,
So you actors can just do what you do. Wally says,

(01:05:54):
I don't dance right, and he walks away. So the
directors throws her hands up, and I'm like, oh, well,
I dance all right. So I'm like, I don't know
what we're gonna do. So they're they're humming around and
walling around, and I'm going, this is, this is hysterical.
Everybody's I called my husband. I say, how is while
I supposed to at me? My husband tells me how

(01:06:16):
to shoot it and how to do it. So I say,
while I came here, put your arms around me in
a in a in a dance position, one around my waist,
one in my hand, and then just walk about back
and forth to like this. You go and you can't
find the beat, and you won't find a beat. And
so I just say, step step, step step. So he
does that, I said, and now back me up towards

(01:06:38):
this couch. So I said, when I say, n put
your foot on the couch bench, you know, put your
bent knee on the couch. So I go, step step
step step knee. And he put his knee on the
couch and I bent myself over and over so and
then and then I stood up and so so you

(01:07:01):
have to put the camera behind the couch and Wally
and I while he has his leg has to be
out of frame, and then it just looks like I'm
he's dipping me. And then I come up and we're great.
So I teach this to Wally. I show it to
the camera department. They're like, terrific. The set people move
the couch over so that we can do this. We
practice it twice while he feels like he's king of

(01:07:23):
the world. I'm like, that's pretty good. Director says terrific.
We go and get touched up. We come back and
they have put people on the couch so there's like
four inches for Wally's foot. He's never gonna find that.
Mark and I told them, okay, great, this is how
you want it by you can find somebody to do this,
Like oh right, They go, alright, alright, I said, get

(01:07:45):
all those people off the couch, get him all off couch. Okay.
So basically, you did direct it. I did. I directed it.
You were like a savior. You came, you had the
shot mapped out. You know that's right, Mark right, happy,
happy to the rescue. Have Wally bend you over his name?

(01:08:06):
Thank you? You like I think you have comedy in
your in your blood, because there was scenes too with
even Eleanor that you made funny that necessarily it probably
wasn't that funny on the page or had someone else
kind of read it. You brought a comedy to even Eleanor.
With with some of this not so great stuff about Eleanor,
you really brought things that were We're great with her.

(01:08:29):
Thank you, honey, thank you. Yeah, you guys, you're so flattering.
I don't I don't deserve happens price, but I'm so
thank you for all the lovely things you said. And
none of it's true, but you're all a lot. You're
both delightful, and I'm so happy to re visit a
really happy time in my life and to see that
beautiful those beautiful faces, and I just enjoyed working with
you so much. To Zanni, you gotta know that it was.

(01:08:51):
We just had a really great time together. Thank you,
you really did. It will always be very dear to
my heart, and I hope it happens again for me.
I hope to get another gig and walk in and
Margaret me and be there. Um, So thank you so
much for talking to us and for being the most
fantastic Eleanor and bringing all of that. You brought so
much to that role, and you brought so much to

(01:09:13):
the show that still means a lot to a lot
of people and they're watching it. So yes, I'm sure
so many people are thrilled to hear you today and
to hear some of your behind the scenes and your
voice such a beautiful, very specific boys. But yeah, thank
you for joining us, and thank you for your stories,
and just yeah, you brought a lot of smiles to
everyone's faces on this show. I know that obviously everyone

(01:09:35):
in the Waldor family loved working with you, and anyone
I did too. I know we didn't get too very much,
so I agree with and I hope that I book
a show sometime soon and we're together. That would make
me very very happy. That was very, very very blessed.
Wasn't that great? I love going back to moments like these.

(01:09:59):
Like Margaret said, I feel so blessed and lucky to
have been able to talk to all these amazing guests
we've had on the podcast this year. They've truly made
this time special and something I'll never ever forget. I
watched this podcast grow as I watched my daughter grow
two very special things to me, and hopefully one day
she'll go back and listen to our walk down Memory

(01:10:20):
Lane and have all the fields and vibes that we've
had through this journey. And I also want to thank
Susanna again for becoming a part of this show with me,
and thank you all for listening. This show wouldn't be
what it is without you. And that's it for the
rewind until next time, Sure youre XO XO is produced

(01:10:44):
by Propagate Content and Meet Jessica's Or. Our show is
executive produced by Linkley. Our senior producers Diego Tapia. Our
producers are Hannah Harris, Emile Carr, and Christen Vermilion, and
our intern is Sammy Cats. Original music by Moxie and
lun