June 13, 2025 • 47 mins
Gregg Rosenthal is joined by Patrick Claybon and Jourdan Rodrigue of The Athletic to give you their winners and losers of minicamp season. Find out why the Bengals are losers (03:00), the Cowboys are winners (10:10), Xavier Legette is a winner (12:50), the Falcons (12:50) and Jets (20:00) are winners, Arthur Smith is a loser while Aaron Rodgers is a winner (23:00), mini camp stats are losers (28:48), the Bears are winners (36:30), and more!
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
Stop your pants.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
Welcome to NFL Daily. I'm Greg Rosenthal, and we're getting
excited for the real NFL off season to start. Jordan
Rodriguez the Athletics clearly excited. Patrick claibhan is as well.
We're gonna have to beep you out right off the top.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
Of the show at Jordan did not realize we were starting.
Speaker 3 (00:22):
We are starting.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
We couldn't get you couldn't wait any longer to start.
Speaker 4 (00:26):
What if we don't beep it? I'm I'm just throwing
that out there, Okay. I'm looking over at Eric.
Speaker 1 (00:33):
Eric having a conversation behind the glass earlier about just
the tone of voice that you use to talk about
difficult things.
Speaker 2 (00:40):
And there's no like like SCC for podcasts. I guess
the NFL. Yes, certain things are more appropriate than others.
But this is a this is all on.
Speaker 4 (00:50):
It depends on the timing of the beat because with
the S word right and the I G. Yeah, if
you beep it, it could turn into something else. WHOA Okay,
I mean you could drop it all together.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
You could.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
I am in favor of it, and I think it
fits well for the vibe of this show. Driving Mini
Camp season is all but done, guys with the break
is about to happen.
Speaker 3 (01:17):
The break is about to happen.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
Although there are a few random teams that are practicing
next week, but not many most like the Chargers for instance,
There's just a couple of rookies there. There's a couple
of voluntary ones. A lot of people are canceling their
things for next week. So about twenty eight twenty nine teams.
Their off season program is over as of Thursday. As
we are taping this, I say.
Speaker 4 (01:38):
Well, I want to run the numbers on is there
an advantage to OTA timing? I would like to and
perhaps this is a tease, I'll reveal the answer. Okay
next week, dun dun dump. Wow.
Speaker 2 (01:52):
The Lions, for instance, yeah, they've already been offering. The
Rams are going to go to Hawaii next week. Jordan
is not making that trip. It would be a big
expense for them to just.
Speaker 1 (02:02):
I will be in New York helping my sister move.
Speaker 3 (02:05):
Great job by you.
Speaker 1 (02:07):
So I mean you pick an option, you know, like
sweating in New York, putting together Ikia furniture and going
to Maui. I mean, I don't know, tough choice.
Speaker 4 (02:15):
Yeah, but when you're done there's the collective relief of
having done something good right, or.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
Or the relief that comes with laying in the sand
sipping a decree.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
You know you'd have to work there, and you know, I.
Speaker 1 (02:34):
Don't think you understand how little work is involved with
covering Rams Mini Camp.
Speaker 2 (02:39):
I can imagine, especially who we're not supposed to say that,
basically like, hey, let's let's let Pooka a Kua.
Speaker 3 (02:45):
It's so cool.
Speaker 1 (02:46):
There's going to be so many fans there that are
so excited to see him. I am sad to be
missing that.
Speaker 3 (02:51):
That is too bad.
Speaker 2 (02:52):
But we will wrap up, and I know you are
at rams OTAs this week. I don't know if the
Rams will make it into this show or not, because
we are going to tell winners and losers for Mini
Camp season, something I like to do because it's just
a fun framing device and serious football heads like Patrick
might look down on it because like, how can you
really win or lose? It's just this is a fun
(03:13):
way to wrap up and justify why we're here at
this time of season.
Speaker 4 (03:18):
I'm not serious, I'm just annoying.
Speaker 2 (03:19):
No, okay, let's start. I will throw out a winner
right off the top. I'll say Jordan Rodriege is a
winner because I feel like you have been right on
front street of this Bengals story of them not taking
care of their people, and you've just been frustrated.
Speaker 3 (03:37):
So it's just in your wheelhouse.
Speaker 2 (03:39):
Yeah, that they are now finding new ways to annoy
their players. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (03:42):
And I want to be clear because I think this
is actually a serious topic and I want to be
really clear when I'm speaking on it because I think
it's really important for not just the current conversation, but
the future of how these things are argued and then
hopefully solved. I think that, first of all, the Bengals
could have won the off season. They got their receivers done,
(04:05):
even if Trey Hendrickson was still kind of out there
hanging in the breeze, and maybe there's a resolution and
maybe it comes by training camp or maybe there's a trade.
I still would have given them more points for the
positive of the off season. And I've heard it. I've
heard Bengals fans being like, why do you hate our team?
Why do you hate the team? Like, stop talking smack
about the Bengals. And I have to say I am
(04:26):
genuinely disappointed and disturbed by the way that they have
handled this Samar Stuart situation, because the entire context of
this conversation is asking somebody to basically be the face
of a changed blueprint, to set a new precedent, to
(04:48):
take advantage of a collectively bargained already collectively bargained contract
and remove something from that player and ask him to
be the face of this precedent moving forward, which would
then affect all all other players. And I don't think
that's fair, and I think it's really a crappy thing
for a team to do when a player already has
no control over which team he arrives at via the draft.
Speaker 2 (05:10):
Yeah, and I should have set it up by saying
that Samar Stewart left Bengals mini camp on Thursday. He
has not been practicing. He's their first round pick. It's honestly,
I did find out and under understand what the difference
in the contract that they're at. It's not worth getting
into here, but it is worth listening to Shamar Stewart
talk about it earlier in the week.
Speaker 5 (05:32):
I've been doing this for most of my whole life,
and then all of a sudden it is gone over
something very simple to fix. It's kind of disappointing who
all greed trade will be right right, but technically still
one percent wrong for being on the contract. So in
my case, I'm one hundred percent right, so it should
(05:52):
be a no brainer. And in trace case, I think
it should be a no brainer too. I mean, he
led seventeen and a half sacks and two for two
years back to back. If I was a GM or
I was the owner, take all my money. But I
guess they don't offer you like that.
Speaker 1 (06:09):
Yeah, So, and I don't want to be clear too,
because I came into the room this morning like ready
to swing because I was upset about this, and I
am upset about this. I think that, first of all,
these contracts are tiered in a certain way. Now that's
pretty relatively simple. They're not perfect. I don't think anything
that has to be collectively bargained. Because a corporation on
(06:29):
one side is trying to get more and the worker
on the other side is also trying to get more,
it's always going to have to be a compromise in
certain ways. So these are tiered relatively and relatively straightforward
manner now, and they were collectively bargained. But what the
Bengals are trying to do right now is set a
new blueprint for certain removals of guarantees in the sort
(06:50):
of the back end of guarantees of the contract. And
like you said, it's murky and nuanced and there's like
a lot of legal ees involved, but at the basic
simplest way to describe this is something has already been
approved by the collective bargaining agreement that the Bengals are
now trying to change, and to do so with this
(07:13):
particular contract would then set a precedent and a blueprint
for all thirty one other teams to possibly do the
same thing, which in this league we have to assume
that they would in order to save a small percentage
of money. And instead of this being resolved when the player,
when Shamar is holding out or not practicing because it
(07:34):
would be a liability for himself if he were to
get injured in a practice before he actually signs the contract,
instead of this being resolved, it has now turned into
a very public situation where this twenty one year old
young man is basically having to be the face of
if I don't hold firm, every other first round pick
(07:55):
that comes after me could be subjected to this same removal.
Speaker 2 (08:00):
Right, that's not fair, he said the money quote from
him was, I'm not asking for nothing that's never been
done before. But in the team's case, y'all just want
to win an argument instead of winning more games, in
my opinion, which is fighting words and man, is a
tough situation for a rookie to be in.
Speaker 4 (08:17):
Yeah, they'd like to win a chance to spend less
month ultimately to compensate someone. And while he's not asking
for something that nobody else has asked before, the Bengals
in this instance are asking something of Stuart that nobody
has asked of anybody before in terms of the particular
language of this contract. And this is a CBA that
was negotiated when Shamar Stewart was seventeen years old, so
(08:40):
he never had any call on what the CEVA looked like.
And here at this point his only option is to withhold,
is to withhold his labor until this is resolved. But
this is clearly this is an overreach.
Speaker 2 (08:54):
Thing is they'll figure it out. All right, Let's do
another winner and Loser. I apologize because that was such
a bummer no to start, all right, Mark Patrick.
Speaker 1 (09:00):
Garrett, It's not a bummer. It's important, right, No.
Speaker 2 (09:03):
It absolutely is. I just feel bad because, like the
Bengals are, it is an annoying situation. It will get
straightened out. Off the top, I mean, eventually it will
get straightened out. But I also just feel like we're
at some point. Bengals fans, they know it, and they're
they're just having to sit in it right now.
Speaker 1 (09:23):
Yeah, And to be clear, none of us are trying
to pile on the Bengals, but it is an infrastructural
failure of the entire ecosystem top to bottom to put
a twenty one year old in this position of potentially
defying his union, to potentially defying all of the players
and teammates and colleagues that come after him. And where
the hell is the head coach in this? Where is
he to step in and be the coach for the player?
Speaker 2 (09:45):
Yeah, Zach Taylor has never been one that has a
ton of power compared to the rest of that organization.
Speaker 3 (09:52):
It's pretty clear, all right, Patrick.
Speaker 1 (09:53):
I don't think Greg's ever heard me yell before, and
I think he's deeply uncompaed.
Speaker 4 (09:57):
You feel like that's yelling.
Speaker 1 (09:58):
Yeah, that's my I told Eric, I was like when
I'm mad, I still smile.
Speaker 4 (10:02):
A lot, like like yelling. Is this if they're conditional,
they're not guarantees. Yeah, if there's conditions at taxes on,
why do we call them guarantees. George Pickens reg is
a winner, which also means Dak Prescott is a winner,
which also means the Cowboys are winners in this where
we see this exchange and feel like, oh, you know,
George Pickens was was mercurial and he was doing all
(10:23):
these weird things. He's at a great camp and thus far,
like Dak Prescott had twenty six throws on a mini
camp day, which signals to me that Dak is out
there and they feel comfortable with him throwing that much.
You mentioned the Schottenheimer vibes of getting promoted to actually
a place where he'll be successful as a head coach
where maybe that success didn't necessarily come as an offensive coordinator,
(10:44):
and I've bought in.
Speaker 2 (10:47):
The vibes are better. He's wearing a backward visor. That
was what really did it for me.
Speaker 1 (10:50):
I kind of love that, Like, I don't hate him
for wearing a backward visor. I just he looks Why.
Speaker 3 (10:55):
Would you hate him for wearing a backward visor.
Speaker 1 (10:57):
No, Oh my gosh. Hate is a strong word here people,
you use it. I'm just saying, like, I don't like
he pulls it off, is what I'm saying. It's like
the reverse hatfish, Like he really pulls it off. It's awesome.
Speaker 2 (11:09):
If anyone was gonna pull it off for some reason,
it is. It is shoddy. Yeah, good, good week for
the Cowboys. Just that they got Michael Parsons too. I
throw them in as a winner. That he's actually out there,
it's not a big difference to me, but it indicates
he's definitely not holding out a training camp. He did
show up to mandatory mini camp, unlike Trey Hendrickson and TG.
Speaker 3 (11:27):
Why.
Speaker 2 (11:28):
I obviously don't follow those guys for not showing up.
But he even jumps into some individual drills, which I
think was like, not the plan that said. We had
Ian rappaport on earlier this week, and he thought that's
the holdout that might go the longest, and so he'll
probably have a hold in here in Oxnard. I would
not be surprised. All right, give me a winner or
a loser.
Speaker 1 (11:46):
Yeah, kind of piggybacks off of that, and the Cowboys
kind of on the ascension in terms of vibes, and
it seems very much to be the case new offensive
coordinators who are taking over already solid offenses or offenses
who already have a franchise quarter back, King Grizzard and
the Lizard Wizard over at the Tampa Bay Buccaneers, John
Morton with the Lions, Grant Udinski with the Jaguars, Nick
(12:07):
Kaylee with the Texans, Kevin Patullo with the Eagles, and
Clayton Adams with the Cowboys. The aforementioned Cowboys. These are
all relatively inexperienced, some longtime coaches, but relatively in experienced
coordinators who are taking over teams that are very competent
right now, or at least on the offensive side.
Speaker 2 (12:25):
So they're being set up in positions to succeed. I'm
like a lot of Yeah, I would also be fired people.
Speaker 3 (12:32):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (12:32):
I could also say we could also build this into
the loser category in terms of hiring practices across the league,
but you'd have to do a quick Google search on
all of the names that I mentioned. Why what Who's
a winner? Give me a winner, A different winner, a
different winner.
Speaker 3 (12:48):
I would go.
Speaker 2 (12:48):
Xavier Lagett because he's he's in a glorilla video.
Speaker 4 (12:53):
Literally almost screw fine.
Speaker 2 (12:56):
Sorry no, I have so many too, but that was
like the biggest one. I forgot about it last week.
I was just like what I saw.
Speaker 1 (13:01):
It in the rundown. I was like, did Kreik talk
about this yet?
Speaker 2 (13:04):
It's also like not just that he is in a
glorilla video, he's in it sort of as like a
symbol of a highly attractive young man, like he is
the object in the video, so who wouldn't want to
be that as a twenty two year old.
Speaker 4 (13:22):
It reminds me of when the TikTok memes started abba
habba of Bryce Young last season, like Who's going to
beat the Chiefs? And then it was it was all
these Bryce Young memes that the same sort of energy
surrounding Xavier, Like this video has changed the social media
perspective on Xavier Laget from the guy that drops the
(13:42):
ball in which, like I know, like Packers fans will
remember the era of Davante dropping the ball and it's like, oh,
this guy he can't catch. This is bad. But I
think the vibes have shifted and now there's more collective
belief in Xavier Laget that he's like, as Glorilla said,
the type of player that Panthers fans want.
Speaker 1 (14:00):
You liked that.
Speaker 2 (14:00):
I thought about trying to pull off a joke like that,
and I called an audible halfway through. I was like,
the downside is too great?
Speaker 1 (14:08):
Probably a good call.
Speaker 4 (14:09):
You're good.
Speaker 2 (14:10):
It's definitely a trend. We got Stefan Diggs with Cardi b.
We got Sauce Gardner with Ice Spice. It's all happening
here in the NFL. We're at the center of the culture.
And you know what Glorilla reminds me of is that
she randomly was getting pitched to be on and was
expected to be on NFL Total Access about three years ago,
(14:31):
and I happened to have had a conversation with someone
about her going on to the show because they weren't
really familiar at that time and it was just when
she was just starting to pop.
Speaker 3 (14:42):
I was like, Oh, you got to do that, that's
going to be great.
Speaker 2 (14:45):
And in the end they decided they said no, they
didn't have her on because and what I really want
to say is, you got to trust my instincts on
what the kids are listening to.
Speaker 3 (14:56):
In terms of.
Speaker 2 (14:56):
Pop culture, because I was on it. I was like, no, no,
she's she's about to take off. She's popping off, and
we said, no, bad job, bad job. Give me another winner.
Speaker 4 (15:09):
That's like a sliding doors moment for NFL Total Access
may may for a rest, not okay.
Speaker 1 (15:14):
One of my winners is that the Falcons are building
their program thoroughly out with Mike Penix, that they also
have a quality backup quarterback and possible trade in Kirk Cousins,
and that Kirk Cousins came out and said that he
probably overestimated how ready he was to play after his
Achilles injury, which like all of us could have and
(15:37):
did say. But I respect the Falcons for like letting
him go on his own discovery journey and still drafting
the quarterback understanding that, hey, maybe this guy won't be
ready who we just gave a bunch of money to,
we should probably still go out and draft quarterback. I
do think we have sound of that as well.
Speaker 6 (15:51):
I think when the season ended last year, you know,
as I started them getting into working on my body
and having the time to do that, felt like I
thought I was much better than I was. And I
think you learn that as you as you improve, as
you make improvements, you realize, oh, I thought I was
already back and I'm still, you know, making a lot
of improvements.
Speaker 4 (16:11):
Heres.
Speaker 1 (16:12):
Yeah, I think Kirk is a winner of this mini camp.
I know it doesn't look like it on paper, but
I think he's a winner in terms of like he
shows up and he I think there's a lot of
hand ringing about like the vibes that would potentially be
happening in that quarterback room. To that, I say, clearly,
those people don't really know Kirk Cousins, who is not
(16:34):
the type of person to cause any sort of internal toxicity.
Rahee Morris is like praising him for being in the
front row of the meetings all the same. And they
also don't know Mike Pennix, who is one of the calmest,
most prepared and collective collected people who could be playing
quarterback for you and potentially being your franchise quarterback. I
(16:54):
honestly think this is a win win win, because the
Falcons also look really smart for having navigated this way.
Money aside, they look really smart for having this plan
in place and potentially having a trade piece later in
the season wants Kirk if something else God forbid, happens
to another quarterback and a team needs a quarterback and
comes calling for the Falcons.
Speaker 2 (17:14):
It's true, Kirk a chance, It's true, and yet the
biggest reason he's still on the Falcons is just no
other team wanted him. The reporting is just if anyone
had taken on ten million dollars of his salary and
given anything, they would have traded him. But I think
you're right in the end the way they've managed that
and the way they talked about each other, Kirk and
Michael Pennix, I think they're cool and it would be
(17:35):
great to have Kirk Cousins as your backup ultimately, because
I don't know that Michael Pennox is going to survive
the season, so Raps.
Speaker 3 (17:41):
She kind of convinced me on that one.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
Doesn't mean they wouldn't trade Kirk if they get a
decent offer in camp. But ultimately, if you're just worried
about the twenty twenty five Falcons, they're much better with
Kirk Cousins as their backup quarterback versus.
Speaker 3 (17:52):
And I don't know who is their number three right now.
Speaker 1 (17:54):
And I want to reiterate too, like he they gave
the Falcons gave Kirk every opportunity, to the point of
losing games to keep that job last year. And yes,
the injury was a factor that we now know of
per Kirk Cousins, but like they gave him every opportunity
to win that job, and Michael Pennox took over and
looked like the future. If you go back and watch
(18:16):
some of the throws that he made over that stretch,
he looked like the future of this offense. They the
conversations that I've had with people in Atlanta, he is
the future of this offense. And so, yes, it sucks,
and it sucks to watch your kind of career get
relegated to this before your eyes. And certainly the injury
is a significant factor in that. But Kirk did not
keep the job. He just didn't keep the job. I
(18:38):
think he has a self awareness of that, That's what
I'm hearing from from his comments.
Speaker 4 (18:43):
Well, I think he's always had the self awareness. I
feel like he's comfortable now, yeah, to acknowledge that that
wasn't Kirk Cousins that we saw towards the middle and
the end of his run last season, and he said
it right there, like I thought. I think he knew.
I don't think it was a surprise to Kirk and
be like, oh, well, it turns out I wasn't actually back. No,
I think he knew.
Speaker 2 (19:03):
But you have to delude yourself in great professional athletes,
they have to have a certain amount of delusion to
get to where they are.
Speaker 3 (19:10):
He's thirty six years old.
Speaker 2 (19:11):
He suffered that torn achilles much later than Aaron Rodgers did,
like in terms of the course of the season, so
it does make a lot of sense that he could
be in better shape. Their number three quarterback right now
is Easton Stick. They also have an undrafted free agent
Emery Jones, so that is a pretty big upgrade at
your backup spot in case anything happened to the man.
Speaker 1 (19:31):
Michael Pennox, the fourth quarterback Weston Stick.
Speaker 3 (19:34):
Hey, now, thanks, Patrick, come on.
Speaker 4 (19:39):
There it is.
Speaker 1 (19:41):
I'll take it.
Speaker 3 (19:42):
Who's up? Who's up? On Winters?
Speaker 4 (19:44):
I made an Easton Stick joke one time on GDL
and Scott Piola thought I was referencing a hockey stick,
so I was referencing a baseball bet. But it's a
big sporting that's company anyway. Speaking of Achilles, winner is
the fact that Aaron Glenn said Jermaine Johnson might be
able to start the twenty twenty five season, which makes
me more excited for this Jets team. Where As we've
collectively looked at it, yeah, piece by piece. As the
(20:07):
off season has gone on, there's more reasons to believe,
and I think getting Jermaine Johnson back at the edge
at some point, whether it's again it's an achilles, so
like we just discussed with Kirk Cousins, it's going to
take time to get back to the way that he
was playing before. But such a good force run and
pass off the edge, just a solid player in that position. Again,
(20:27):
the whole roster looks so much better with just a
little bit of change and a little bit of belief.
With Aaron Glenn sprinkling things.
Speaker 1 (20:35):
In, I know he's got the it factor. I've said
this before on the show. I've really liked most, if
not all, of the things the Jets have done this season.
They fall very much into my off season and mini
camp and probably training camp winners column. You've got Justin
Fields leading a total, excellent vibes, probably smash mouth offense.
I saw a highlight. I mean, I know it's this
(20:57):
time of year where we do see the highlights. I
saw a highlight of one of the past that he
made downfield at mini camp, and it drew a collective
like I think, exhale of happiness from that entire area
that where it's just felt so toxic for so long
on the field, and then stars with extensions coming due
soon are actually showing up to these practices. Aaron Glenn
(21:18):
cut swift ties with any of the negativity that lingered
in the building prior, and did so even though he
had to eat that criticism publicly from Aaron Rodgers. He
just kept going to work and going about trying to
make this football team better. I think it's a huge
credit to Aaron Glenn and the Jets. And you know,
I'm starting to buy in, guys, I am, I am starting.
Speaker 3 (21:37):
To do it.
Speaker 2 (21:38):
I've been buying in. I'm with you, Garrett. There's a
lot of like Garrett Wilson looking better than he ever has.
Speaker 3 (21:43):
I mean, he's always awesome. I love this time. I
can buy it.
Speaker 1 (21:46):
Everyone's great except the people who aren't.
Speaker 3 (21:49):
JK.
Speaker 2 (21:50):
Dobbins is a winner. I like that home for him
in Denver. Haven't done a show since he signed there.
He's going to make that team he's getting I think
two point seventy five million dollar base but guaranteed too,
so there's no chance that he's going to get cut beforehand.
I don't know if it's like a massive change in RJ.
Harvey's like fantasy stock. I saw a lot of that.
(22:11):
It's like I think RJ. Harvey is going to be
who RJ. Harvey is, and JK. Dobbins is another valuable
piece to have there and probably will have a sizable workload.
Speaker 3 (22:23):
But ultimately, I never thought RJ.
Speaker 2 (22:25):
Harvey was going to be a guy that was getting
more than twelve to fifteen touches a game. And if
he's going to be, if he's that good, he still
will even if JK.
Speaker 3 (22:33):
Dobbins is there.
Speaker 2 (22:33):
But JK Dobbins great vibes, another player who might be
even better a year further removed from his surgeries.
Speaker 3 (22:39):
But he was quite good last year.
Speaker 2 (22:41):
And I always think Sean Payton knows how to get
the most out of his running backs, really all his
skill position players strength, so he'll focus on what JK.
Speaker 3 (22:50):
Dobbins does well and I think get a lot out
of them.
Speaker 1 (22:54):
I regret to inform Arthur Smith that I have placed
him in the Mini camp and OTA's Losers column, not
because I think that about him as a person, or
his offense or his system, but because I think that
he was riding shotgun in this car being driven by
Mike Tomlin, and suddenly there's a new passenger, princess in town.
(23:16):
That person has control over the GPS and over the music,
and Art Smith is like hanging on to the bumper
on a skateboard. And this offense, the way that this
offense comes together, is one of the stories of the
off season in my opinion, because Arthur Smith is going
to have to pull from a different set of knowledge,
(23:37):
a different set of concepts than he previously has preferred
that really run heavy, you know, play action, all of
those types of things. Whereas Aaron Rodgers likes to change
the play at the line of scrimmage, he likes to
drop back, he likes to have the defense in front
of him, he likes to understand and see where all
of the little chess machinations are coming from. And I
(23:58):
think both of those things are fine. It's just melding
them together is what's going to be super interesting to me.
And I am waiting with breath that is baitis to
see what this version of the Steelers look like.
Speaker 2 (24:10):
Let's listen to Aaron Rodgers. I checked out his entire
press conference with the Steelers reporters, and I found it compelling.
Here's a little section of it.
Speaker 7 (24:19):
A lot of decisions that I've made over my career
in life from strictly the ego, even if they turn
out well or always unfulfilling, but the decisions made from
the soul are usually pretty fulfilling. So this was a
decision that was best for my soul.
Speaker 3 (24:36):
I believe him.
Speaker 2 (24:38):
I also it doesn't make me necessarily feel any better
about the Steelers because of what you said. Like, one
thing left unset about the Arthur Smith and Aaron Rodgers
offenses lately is how ineffective they've been. Like even with
Matt Lafleur as his coaching Green Bay was ineffective, certainly
was with the Jets. Arthur Smith is on a three
year losing streak essentially of ineffective offenses. And the thing
that was interesting to me listening to that clipping Rogers
(25:00):
And there was another one where they literally asked him
what would it be like to win a championship here?
And he said, oh that, you know, he said something like,
well that what would that be? Seventh you know here,
that would be that would be great. But then he
went on and said but that he essentially kind of
was like, but that's not what it's about for me.
It's about giving back to the game and just finding
joy in something that I love UH to do, which
(25:21):
is great, But I don't know. Part of me also
thinks like, once you're thinking about retirement, he just I
don't know if he's quite all in as he as
he used to be. How could you be?
Speaker 4 (25:33):
But that all that stuff is what's happened before. I
think his level of all in uh hasn't hasn't changed.
This is just a cyclical thing where he gets in
the honeymoon phase with a new team and the interviews
all sound great. He starts dropping Sun sue Es quotes
about making decisions for his soul, and then in week four,
(25:53):
you know, he'll be, you know, campaigning with RFK somewhere
right like it's it's all, it's all, We've seen it
all for It's the question of how how well is
his achilles doing, how well is he going to move
in the pocket and all the other stuff Mike Tomlin's
gonna take care of all that. Yeah, right, it's we're
gonna get.
Speaker 3 (26:11):
Okay, we're gonna negative view.
Speaker 1 (26:13):
I'm still driving.
Speaker 3 (26:14):
Okay, I got you. But the negative view, and I
watched it, I was like that it wasn't.
Speaker 2 (26:19):
Really all about wins and losses anymore for him, which
I think is a dangerous place to be in pro football.
Speaker 1 (26:24):
I will say, like, this is a multiple things are
true at the same time situation where I believe that
he believes in what he's talking about right now. I
believe the Steelers signed him with the intent of we
need to try to actually, you know, push past this
this hump that we've been in and win. They aggressively
(26:45):
pursued behind the scenes, but still aggressively pursued different quarterbacks
this off season and ultimately came to Aaron Rodgers. Gave
him the leeway and the patients to be able to
have his off season the way that he wanted to
have his off season. And at the same time, like,
Aaron Rodgers is many things right, but right now he
(27:09):
strikes me as somebody who is deeply committed to trying
to go out on a high note. Yes, whatever that
looks like whether it's I think he has to and
perhaps based on these comments, has come to terms with
the fact that it might not mean a great record,
but he wants it to feel like a high note.
(27:30):
That's what I'm getting from those comments.
Speaker 3 (27:32):
I think.
Speaker 2 (27:33):
I think that's well said and a good interpretation of everything.
And it's funny because him being in charge of the
offense or cheat that was like one of the things
he bristled at was like, well, I've always just played
within an offense.
Speaker 3 (27:44):
I'm never changing the place. And I'm like, bro, we
can see you cod.
Speaker 4 (27:47):
It's literally the reason he got hurt. It's literally the reason.
Speaker 2 (27:50):
It's also like part of the reason why he's recorded
some of the greatest seasons of all time. I can
remember so far back as like there was this little
twenty fourteen twenty fifth team lull in his career, and
the huge criticisms at the time with McCarthy was he
was so like he had lost his balance of instructure
and out of structure and he essentially was just like
(28:11):
vibing out there and not doing the places called. That
was more than a decade ago, and I think it's
only gotten stronger since. But I don't know if it's
good for my soul, but I am happy Aaron Rodgers
back in the league.
Speaker 3 (28:21):
I think it's going to make these Steelers games more important.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
Let's take a quick break and we will be back
with some more winners and losers, wrapping up Mini camp season.
Speaker 3 (28:29):
After the break.
Speaker 2 (28:39):
Back on NFL Daily, Kyle Shanahan got annoyed with the
reporters who are keeping stats in Ota.
Speaker 1 (28:47):
Yeah, I'm team Kyle Shanahan on this.
Speaker 3 (28:49):
I get it. And he's saying that.
Speaker 2 (28:53):
The keeping of the stats is not only misleading for
the people that are radiant, but it's actually impacting the
way the players play. Let's say maybe a quarterback is
trying to get more completions than he normally would because
he knows they're keeping track and negatively impacting their learning
a little uh wagging the tail thing.
Speaker 3 (29:15):
I never really don't.
Speaker 4 (29:16):
If only there was somebody to properly contextualize the things
people were seeing and you know, honestly evaluate them when else, well.
Speaker 2 (29:23):
I don't think he would have I don't think he
would approve on us going winners and losers. I guess
we'd be on the side of like Nope, Sorry, Kyle,
there are winners and losers.
Speaker 1 (29:32):
I actually in my losers column, I had the people
putting actual weight. I guess track as many stats as
you want, but in a loser's column, I had putting
actual weight on it. And I do have like a quick,
very quick anecdote on that front, if you will, guys
will indulge me, of course. I remember in twenty twenty
one when Matthew Stafford first arrived in Los Angeles, he
(29:55):
used the joint practices against the Raiders and the Cowboys
during that to basically troubleshoot the range of his receivers
and what windows within this offense. You know, receivers in
the Sean McVay system, especially at that time, they were
changing around some of the landmarks that they would ask
receivers to run to, basically the spot on the field
to which the quarterback throws the ball. Understanding that Stafford
(30:18):
was a quarterback who could freestyle a little bit more,
could be more creative with the range of what that route,
structure and spacing would look like down the field. So
he was using those practice. He threw like seven interceptions
in one practice, and I remember the collective narrative, especially
from visiting media at the time, was people losing their
GD minds over this. This is the bus trade. This
(30:42):
isn't going to work out. He's washed, He's it. Conversely,
Jalen Ramsey was playing in the star position, so the
slot their hybrid slot safety corner for the first time,
and working on a new type of match zone that
conceptually they were trying to install that offseason. Clips of
him giving up a two yard pass, videos of him
(31:03):
giving up a three yard past.
Speaker 3 (31:04):
He's cooked, he's washed.
Speaker 1 (31:06):
They're never going to be the same again. And what
did the Rams go and do that year? Win the
Super Bowl. I'm just saying this to say, like people
use these practices to try things right, to learn things. Well,
what Kyle said actual competition, Like none of this matters.
Speaker 3 (31:23):
Yet, especially now. And Kyle was like before they could
just practice. The point of practice is to practice. I agree,
I was.
Speaker 2 (31:30):
I have like losers are people putting too much into
mini camps.
Speaker 3 (31:33):
Here's how you can tell you shouldn't. I mean put
too much into them?
Speaker 2 (31:37):
Is half the teams like cancel and don't take all
the days even necessary. They cancel the last day or two,
they cancel next week if it was that important.
Speaker 3 (31:44):
They wouldn't and so they should just be you know,
it is practice.
Speaker 2 (31:47):
I think the most important things you can draw from
them are stuff that we're talking about, like depth chart,
like where the coaches are telling us stuff or injuries happen.
Unfortunately in defense of.
Speaker 4 (31:57):
The of the charters right away, Yeah, yeah, a lot
of that. A lot of folks came up in eras
where coaches were reluctant to share information. Availability was limited,
viewing opportunity was very limited, and so there's there's scraps, right,
and you have people that are trying to just claw
together every scrap that they can. It's very difficult to
(32:18):
walk around the field and just absorb vibes, right, So
it's like, oh, so and so was x of X
for x yards and x touchdowns And then you know,
you could poise that to the coach and then the
coach could properly contextualize that. But in a lot of
situations they may say something like we're all we all
could be dead on Sunday or not actually answer the
question in the first place, which push people in position
(32:39):
to chart.
Speaker 2 (32:40):
Right, that's totally true, and uh, like you're only allowed
to show up as a media during OTA is usually
once in an entire week.
Speaker 3 (32:48):
Mini camps used to be totally different.
Speaker 2 (32:50):
Not to age myself, but you used to be able
to tackle and wear pads and they did two practice.
It wasn't that lot, though, But so if we're the CBA,
they would do two practices day one like it would
be like a training camp day essentially.
Speaker 3 (33:02):
And now now it's different.
Speaker 2 (33:03):
Now they're canceling the final Saints practice to go to
five oh four f O r E, which I'm guessing
is some sort of either mini golf or top golf
copy Ane's new album.
Speaker 1 (33:18):
More information is that they don't all I'm saying more
information and trust in the reporters on the ground is good.
It's just that when you're weighing too much in this
time of year, you go down this deep dark path
and I just don't want that for people. I don't
want that for you. The fans. I love better for you.
Speaker 2 (33:34):
I love that they put the Saints having practice or
not on that that's what they say, at least on
rookie QB Hunter Deckers making a three pointer or not,
and he hit the three pointer and everyone so lucky.
It's then they get to go play golf.
Speaker 3 (33:48):
You're up.
Speaker 4 (33:49):
It's sad loser and winner. I'll combine them because it's
injury related for both of them. Will start with the
good news. Keaton Mitchell uh fully recovered and on the
way back from that ACL tear that came rookie season
which was very promising, and the Ravens go and rush
for over three thousand yards and have a great running season.
And now Keith Mitchell gets to be added back to
that finally fully healthy behind Derrick Henry. And on the downside,
(34:12):
a little bit further away in the Tri State area,
Michael Gallup having a setback, waiting for his comeback to
fully come to fruition. And so that's that sucks.
Speaker 2 (34:20):
Yeah, the worst thing to hear this time of year
are injuries. So let's just fire through a couple. Noah
Brown had what sounded like the most serious injury from
this week.
Speaker 3 (34:30):
We'll see, we don't know the results, but he was
carted off.
Speaker 2 (34:32):
Was very frustrated, I think described as a buy a
reporter of there. Ben Standig is like slamming his helmet,
kind of yelling out when they went over a bump,
which not a great sign for him. They also don't
have Terry McLaurin there, but that's not because of an injury.
That's just he's pitching out waiting for a new contract.
So that's disappointing. Also, just everyone ease off on debo
(34:53):
looking a little slow on one of those routes and
a little bigger, like they're not playing at full speed.
He's not trying to run his fastest, so let's just
calm down.
Speaker 1 (35:01):
I also guarantee you he is gonna be so hard
to tackle regardless. So like if a freight train is
coming at you, or a slightly smaller and thinner freight
train is coming at you, it's still a freight train.
Speaker 4 (35:13):
People. Has never been a small guy.
Speaker 3 (35:15):
Right he is.
Speaker 2 (35:16):
He is a big boy. But this like the route
that they had like multiple people like it was like
a drill, like like let's calm down. But in in
uh San Francisco. They have a couple of receivers that
have been out there on my radar because Ricky Pearsall
just wasn't able to stay healthy last year and he
missed most of the ots. Juwan Jennings has been out
with a calf. The Bears are missing Colston Loveland. He
(35:39):
might not be ready for training camp. So that's whenever
the second year player you hear like, well, I never
really caught up because I missed so much of the
off season. We tend to like overlook the off season
part of it, and Luthor Burdon really hasn't practiced for them.
So a lot of just like in little injuries that
will keep an eye on going.
Speaker 3 (35:55):
It's a camp. Give me something.
Speaker 1 (35:56):
You like Ricky Piersall who was literally shot. You're mentioning
that as he could not stay on the phone.
Speaker 2 (36:03):
I oh, I was not referring to that. I was
referring to the injuries that he has. Yes, so clear
toy here, he had injuries before that that he was
not on the field even before that happen, and then
when he came back, he suffered through a couple of
different separate injuries.
Speaker 3 (36:19):
But I'm glad you cleared that out.
Speaker 1 (36:21):
I have a Bear's positive that is less big picture
but more a couple of pieces that I've been reading
coming out of Bear's mini camp. It seems like they're
really focusing in on the details, to the point where
Ben Johnson is like losing his gourd at Cole Comet
for lining up a yard off in his split, which
(36:44):
is actually that's that's a thing you have to when
you have those splits the way that he likes to
run his formations, like you need to be in the
exact specific right place, like even an inch off affects
the spacing deeper down the field. So I read a
story about that, then I read a story about them
practicing a ton of situational football. So for me, the
Bears are winners because they're doing these things at a
(37:05):
high intensity, even in a low intensity time of year,
to try to reset the narrative that they just are
are messy all throughout.
Speaker 2 (37:13):
That is a little bit of a trope, but also
one that I think that's a really sic meaningful because
it's a Mi Mike Rabel. He's getting the same pop
of like, hey, they're making them redo the plays they're making.
Drake may call out a certain cadence and if anyone
jumps off side, then you got to do the thing,
whereas that would have never happened last year. But I
also do believe certain coaches pay closer attention to details
(37:37):
much more than others. You could see it when Tennis Allen,
for instance, replaced Sean Payton, like they just got sloppy
in a second.
Speaker 3 (37:43):
And that starts in the office.
Speaker 1 (37:44):
And I think that Ben Johnson, because he coached under
Dan Campbell, like has this like sort of warm fuzzy
rep by association just not the case at all. Like
he is hyper detailed, very intense. He's like not the
warm fuzzy bear hug at the podium of Dan Campbell.
He's all biting kneecaps of Dan Campbell. And he can also,
(38:07):
by the way, identify the specific location of the potel attendant.
So he is like, wow, hyper fixated and very intense.
And I think it is what the Bears need. And
that's that's my point.
Speaker 2 (38:18):
I'm going to give a winner to the Pittsburgh Steelers'
assistant coaches who are giving us hardcore depth chart updates.
Their wide receiver coach said very clearly, Calvin Austen is
our number two. Y'all don't realize he's underrated. He actually
made the case for Calvin Austin as a better blocker
than people realized, despite his one hundred and sixty two pounds.
(38:40):
I do think Calvin Austin has been a better player
in the NFL than people realized. But he said like,
that's our number two, Like, stop asking who's the number two?
Speaker 3 (38:46):
Interesting?
Speaker 2 (38:47):
And then their defensive line coach said, Derek Harmon is
our left starting defensive end. He's our you know, you
guys can stop asking that too. He's our rookie. He
is going to start. So just a little bit of like.
Speaker 3 (38:58):
Morsels of nuggets. Why information and I like it?
Speaker 4 (39:01):
Yeah, it doesn't. It's not going to make them try
less hard. It's like, oh, I can get super comfortable now,
and yeah, it's the type of thing that that is good.
It's the information that that people go to mini camp
to cover and get stuff like that. Why why keep
it behind this veil of mystery? And no coach ever
is going to be like, hey, you know, you guys
need to properly contextualize me having guys redo things, you know,
(39:24):
like that's something that they're completely okay with him, you
being like, yeah, Mike.
Speaker 1 (39:27):
Rabel, he was actually seven inches off of his spot,
not a yard.
Speaker 4 (39:31):
It went crazy today because detail wasn't specifically adhered to.
Speaker 2 (39:35):
They also, yeah, I have a boss that they clearly
like Mike Tommins like yeah, you can say whatever. There'd
be some coaches that that would probably be.
Speaker 4 (39:42):
Yeah, well no, what would be the point of not
saying it.
Speaker 1 (39:44):
Yeah, one of my winners was quarterbacks getting either engaged
or married. Okay, yeah, especially during this miniicamp time of
year to pivot slightly. Jalen and Brianna Hurts, Josh Allen
and Hailey Steinfeld, Aaron Rodgers. I don't know if he
said specifically who he had gotten married to.
Speaker 2 (40:03):
Drake May and it's Britney with an I based on
a Pat McAfee appearance from like six months ago or
three months something like that.
Speaker 3 (40:09):
Okay, that's it. That's all details.
Speaker 1 (40:12):
Drake Man and Hudson are about to get married. High
school sweethearts Jordan Love and Ronica Stone and Matthew Stafford
and the Rams renewed their vows for another year. Okay.
So I have to admit to you, guys, I only
knew like two of these. So I crowdsourced it with
my fifteen person all women's NFL reporter group chat, and
the first response I got back was everybody, they're all
(40:35):
married to the game. Shout out to Catherine Fitzgerald, the
perfect it's perfect response.
Speaker 3 (40:41):
I'm happy for all the all these young.
Speaker 1 (40:42):
Man's I love, love it's awesome.
Speaker 4 (40:45):
I have a winner in a Trope update. It comes
our courtesy of Cardinals tight end Trade McBride, who said
that the Cardinals offense was adding a lot of sauce.
Oh off season, and it's like we step away from yeah,
we're going to be more precise, We're gonna be more multiple,
working different position groups. He went ahead and said that
the offense is going to have more sauce. And I
(41:05):
like that because it's a little bit of mystery, but
we also know exactly what he means.
Speaker 2 (41:08):
I like that Marvin Harrison has added copious amounts of
tricep muscles.
Speaker 3 (41:15):
I don't know if you.
Speaker 1 (41:15):
See you're on for Trope al art, Like.
Speaker 2 (41:17):
They're like, there, it's been a whole like it's a
huge story in Arizona where it's just like he has
showed up and he's just outrageous. And then they sent
they sent like a picture out and people are just
all into Marvin Harrison's triceps. All the reporters there, it's
all happening. The triceps are taking over.
Speaker 4 (41:33):
The top result when I sarched it is is Marvin
Harrison getting too jacked.
Speaker 5 (41:39):
It.
Speaker 2 (41:40):
On the other side of the veil at this There
is such a is there's such a thing as to
people used to think CMC was two jacked. CMC, by
the way, fully healthy, practicing fully. It's rare that that
is happening. So that's just that's just a little notable.
I'll throw a winner out that bow. Melton is trying
to be like Travis Hunter and playing on both sides
of the ball. It's not a great sign for his
career as a receiver in Green Bay, where he's probably
(42:02):
fighting an uphill battle to make the team as like
a pure receiver. But he's out there straight up playing
cornerback now like his bro Max Melton on the Arizona Cardinals.
So maybe he can be some sort of hybrid special
teamer cornerback, six cornerback, sixth receiver.
Speaker 4 (42:20):
Let's go COACHLF did like clarify, he's like bo is
still a wide receiver. Okay, but it's hard not to
take negatives away from like seeing a number eighty out there,
like working on his punch, It's like, oh, no, what
are we doing?
Speaker 3 (42:35):
If it helped, yeah, if it helps you make the two.
Speaker 2 (42:36):
If you look at all the guys they've drafted and
the guys who are just bigger than him.
Speaker 3 (42:41):
He's got an uphill battle. So that's good.
Speaker 2 (42:43):
Raiders fans, I'm going to say, are losers for wanting.
Anyone that's a Raiders fan that just wants to forget
about Derek Carr's playoff throw against Jermaine Pratt, they won't
be able to because Jermaine Pratt is now a member
of the ring.
Speaker 1 (42:58):
I've started to be worried for you. What I did,
s trainer Steven, See what I did there started? You
had me the first half. I'm not gonna lie.
Speaker 4 (43:06):
It was a heat seeking missile that navigated its way
past Remaine Brett to the couch that there a car.
Speaker 2 (43:17):
I saw Bengals fan say that was one of the
best moments. I saw Bengals fan say that was one
of the best moments of their life.
Speaker 3 (43:25):
Did Jermaine Pratt intercept it?
Speaker 2 (43:26):
And it's true if you if you're thinking about the
the losing streak and the playoffs and the struggles that
they had, that kick that kick started at all. But
now when Pratt's out there, you know, good signing for
the Raiders. Get give a veteran guy a chance at
a position of of need.
Speaker 3 (43:40):
But it's just going to remind Raiders fans.
Speaker 4 (43:42):
I think it's gonna show them how far that they've come, okay,
and that this is a totally new start and there's
there's new things to celebrate and enjoy. You don't have
to necessarily cape for anybody in their massive mistakes.
Speaker 2 (43:52):
All right, we should We should get the people on
their way if we If you guys want to do
any speed round winners and losers before we say good
by to this edition of Mini Camp, you know, wrap up.
Speaker 1 (44:04):
The Panthers are a winner in my book. Getting Derek
Brown back this season is going to be huge for
their defense. Also, Trevon Morrigg sounds like he's already making
a splash in practices. Yes, it is OTAs we are
not going to put too much stock in it, but
they badly need somebody who can play that versatile safety
come into the box, help defend the run, who also
can make plays.
Speaker 3 (44:22):
On the ball.
Speaker 1 (44:22):
Their defense needs the juice and getting him into the
mix on that three year deal, but also regaining Derek Brown,
signing Bobby Brown, all of these things are good for
the Panthers.
Speaker 2 (44:32):
Tech mcmaillan out of practice and just someone to keep
an eye on coming into training camp just in case
that's serious.
Speaker 3 (44:37):
You just don't know this time of year.
Speaker 4 (44:38):
And congratulations all the folks who were agitated by Rashi
Rice's non appearance in our receiver ranking that he was
a full participant working his way back and get some
more Rashi Rice, so you can get out there and prove.
Speaker 2 (44:49):
Us roll shout out to the receiver rankings. But still
doing you know, good numbers. People are going back to that.
People getting mad. You know, I don't feel bad. I
think Recei Rice was very solidly like around thirty five.
Yeah he was not even the one of the first
guys off, but he was definitely in the top forty.
Speaker 3 (45:06):
He's got to prove it. He's got to stay on
the field quickly.
Speaker 2 (45:10):
James Cook, his financial advisor, is absolutely a winner.
Speaker 3 (45:15):
Let's listen to why James is back at practice.
Speaker 4 (45:17):
It is mandatory, but why did you decide to come?
Speaker 5 (45:22):
I like my money, Yeah, he will definitely do so
That's why I'm here.
Speaker 3 (45:28):
It is Yeah, I need that for him.
Speaker 2 (45:32):
If you're making it now too, you can invest it
in the near terma. And it also indicates to me
he's not gonna miss any of training camp, and so ultimately,
even though he probably deserves a new contract, I don't
think he's going to be holding out.
Speaker 4 (45:44):
C J.
Speaker 2 (45:44):
Stroud was back at practice, so that's good for the
Texans fans that were worried. He just said he needed
to take a little bit of a rest with his arm,
but he's back to practicing fully. And then a lot
of big Nickel love Derwin James and Nick Emon Worry
both getting that offseason, we're gonna play to the line
of scrimmage. Derwin James of course did that very much
(46:04):
effectively at the end of last season, but they're going
to try to lean into that more and it definitely
sounds like even Worry they're using essentially as a linebacker
is yes.
Speaker 1 (46:12):
You know, my theory on this is that people understand
that the quote unquote cover linebacker is still just as
important as they always have been because of the news
the modern since you know, the early mid twenty fifteens
and beyond twenty seventeen, beyond spacing and play action and
all of those types of things. So they still need
a cover player in that area. But they also understand
(46:32):
how prevalent the run game is regaining its own momentum
and its own steam, and so they still need that
downhill force to help stop the run. So I think
you're going to see more one and a half linebacker sets,
which means a actual linebacker a lah Ernest Jones, and
then Nick em and worry coming in is that hybrid
player to help with the coverage as well. So I
(46:54):
think this is going to be fun.
Speaker 2 (46:55):
Shout out to Dan Buchanan ahead of his time. It's
kind of like the only guy filling this role about
seven or eight years ago. Now there's a whole league
full of them.
Speaker 1 (47:04):
Check Thompson, Erasure But okay, I.
Speaker 2 (47:06):
Mean I feel like that's fair check Toobs, but check
Thomson to me, was just like an outside line back.
Speaker 1 (47:11):
Nicol.
Speaker 3 (47:12):
Yes, uh, great show, great week.
Speaker 2 (47:15):
We will be back next week on Monday, and you
know what, it's going to be the same.
Speaker 1 (47:21):
Trio here, maybe even in the same outfit.
Speaker 2 (47:24):
No I brought a change a change of clothes. But
we are going to be talking about the secret weapons.
Remember we did it a couple of weeks back. This
time it'll be from the National Football Conference.
Speaker 3 (47:36):
Football is taking a break.
Speaker 4 (47:37):
It's my back.
Speaker 3 (47:38):
What taking a little break?
Stop your pants.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
Welcome to NFL Daily. I'm Greg Rosenthal, and we're getting
excited for the real NFL off season to start. Jordan
Rodriguez the Athletics clearly excited. Patrick claibhan is as well.
We're gonna have to beep you out right off the top.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
Of the show at Jordan did not realize we were starting.
Speaker 3 (00:22):
We are starting.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
We couldn't get you couldn't wait any longer to start.
Speaker 4 (00:26):
What if we don't beep it? I'm I'm just throwing
that out there, Okay. I'm looking over at Eric.
Speaker 1 (00:33):
Eric having a conversation behind the glass earlier about just
the tone of voice that you use to talk about
difficult things.
Speaker 2 (00:40):
And there's no like like SCC for podcasts. I guess
the NFL. Yes, certain things are more appropriate than others.
But this is a this is all on.
Speaker 4 (00:50):
It depends on the timing of the beat because with
the S word right and the I G. Yeah, if
you beep it, it could turn into something else. WHOA Okay,
I mean you could drop it all together.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
You could.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
I am in favor of it, and I think it
fits well for the vibe of this show. Driving Mini
Camp season is all but done, guys with the break
is about to happen.
Speaker 3 (01:17):
The break is about to happen.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
Although there are a few random teams that are practicing
next week, but not many most like the Chargers for instance,
There's just a couple of rookies there. There's a couple
of voluntary ones. A lot of people are canceling their
things for next week. So about twenty eight twenty nine teams.
Their off season program is over as of Thursday. As
we are taping this, I say.
Speaker 4 (01:38):
Well, I want to run the numbers on is there
an advantage to OTA timing? I would like to and
perhaps this is a tease, I'll reveal the answer. Okay
next week, dun dun dump. Wow.
Speaker 2 (01:52):
The Lions, for instance, yeah, they've already been offering. The
Rams are going to go to Hawaii next week. Jordan
is not making that trip. It would be a big
expense for them to just.
Speaker 1 (02:02):
I will be in New York helping my sister move.
Speaker 3 (02:05):
Great job by you.
Speaker 1 (02:07):
So I mean you pick an option, you know, like
sweating in New York, putting together Ikia furniture and going
to Maui. I mean, I don't know, tough choice.
Speaker 4 (02:15):
Yeah, but when you're done there's the collective relief of
having done something good right, or.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
Or the relief that comes with laying in the sand
sipping a decree.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
You know you'd have to work there, and you know, I.
Speaker 1 (02:34):
Don't think you understand how little work is involved with
covering Rams Mini Camp.
Speaker 2 (02:39):
I can imagine, especially who we're not supposed to say that,
basically like, hey, let's let's let Pooka a Kua.
Speaker 3 (02:45):
It's so cool.
Speaker 1 (02:46):
There's going to be so many fans there that are
so excited to see him. I am sad to be
missing that.
Speaker 3 (02:51):
That is too bad.
Speaker 2 (02:52):
But we will wrap up, and I know you are
at rams OTAs this week. I don't know if the
Rams will make it into this show or not, because
we are going to tell winners and losers for Mini
Camp season, something I like to do because it's just
a fun framing device and serious football heads like Patrick
might look down on it because like, how can you
really win or lose? It's just this is a fun
(03:13):
way to wrap up and justify why we're here at
this time of season.
Speaker 4 (03:18):
I'm not serious, I'm just annoying.
Speaker 2 (03:19):
No, okay, let's start. I will throw out a winner
right off the top. I'll say Jordan Rodriege is a
winner because I feel like you have been right on
front street of this Bengals story of them not taking
care of their people, and you've just been frustrated.
Speaker 3 (03:37):
So it's just in your wheelhouse.
Speaker 2 (03:39):
Yeah, that they are now finding new ways to annoy
their players. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (03:42):
And I want to be clear because I think this
is actually a serious topic and I want to be
really clear when I'm speaking on it because I think
it's really important for not just the current conversation, but
the future of how these things are argued and then
hopefully solved. I think that, first of all, the Bengals
could have won the off season. They got their receivers done,
(04:05):
even if Trey Hendrickson was still kind of out there
hanging in the breeze, and maybe there's a resolution and
maybe it comes by training camp or maybe there's a trade.
I still would have given them more points for the
positive of the off season. And I've heard it. I've
heard Bengals fans being like, why do you hate our team?
Why do you hate the team? Like, stop talking smack
about the Bengals. And I have to say I am
(04:26):
genuinely disappointed and disturbed by the way that they have
handled this Samar Stuart situation, because the entire context of
this conversation is asking somebody to basically be the face
of a changed blueprint, to set a new precedent, to
(04:48):
take advantage of a collectively bargained already collectively bargained contract
and remove something from that player and ask him to
be the face of this precedent moving forward, which would
then affect all all other players. And I don't think
that's fair, and I think it's really a crappy thing
for a team to do when a player already has
no control over which team he arrives at via the draft.
Speaker 2 (05:10):
Yeah, and I should have set it up by saying
that Samar Stewart left Bengals mini camp on Thursday. He
has not been practicing. He's their first round pick. It's honestly,
I did find out and under understand what the difference
in the contract that they're at. It's not worth getting
into here, but it is worth listening to Shamar Stewart
talk about it earlier in the week.
Speaker 5 (05:32):
I've been doing this for most of my whole life,
and then all of a sudden it is gone over
something very simple to fix. It's kind of disappointing who
all greed trade will be right right, but technically still
one percent wrong for being on the contract. So in
my case, I'm one hundred percent right, so it should
(05:52):
be a no brainer. And in trace case, I think
it should be a no brainer too. I mean, he
led seventeen and a half sacks and two for two
years back to back. If I was a GM or
I was the owner, take all my money. But I
guess they don't offer you like that.
Speaker 1 (06:09):
Yeah, So, and I don't want to be clear too,
because I came into the room this morning like ready
to swing because I was upset about this, and I
am upset about this. I think that, first of all,
these contracts are tiered in a certain way. Now that's
pretty relatively simple. They're not perfect. I don't think anything
that has to be collectively bargained. Because a corporation on
(06:29):
one side is trying to get more and the worker
on the other side is also trying to get more,
it's always going to have to be a compromise in
certain ways. So these are tiered relatively and relatively straightforward
manner now, and they were collectively bargained. But what the
Bengals are trying to do right now is set a
new blueprint for certain removals of guarantees in the sort
(06:50):
of the back end of guarantees of the contract. And
like you said, it's murky and nuanced and there's like
a lot of legal ees involved, but at the basic
simplest way to describe this is something has already been
approved by the collective bargaining agreement that the Bengals are
now trying to change, and to do so with this
(07:13):
particular contract would then set a precedent and a blueprint
for all thirty one other teams to possibly do the
same thing, which in this league we have to assume
that they would in order to save a small percentage
of money. And instead of this being resolved when the player,
when Shamar is holding out or not practicing because it
(07:34):
would be a liability for himself if he were to
get injured in a practice before he actually signs the contract,
instead of this being resolved, it has now turned into
a very public situation where this twenty one year old
young man is basically having to be the face of
if I don't hold firm, every other first round pick
(07:55):
that comes after me could be subjected to this same removal.
Speaker 2 (08:00):
Right, that's not fair, he said the money quote from
him was, I'm not asking for nothing that's never been
done before. But in the team's case, y'all just want
to win an argument instead of winning more games, in
my opinion, which is fighting words and man, is a
tough situation for a rookie to be in.
Speaker 4 (08:17):
Yeah, they'd like to win a chance to spend less
month ultimately to compensate someone. And while he's not asking
for something that nobody else has asked before, the Bengals
in this instance are asking something of Stuart that nobody
has asked of anybody before in terms of the particular
language of this contract. And this is a CBA that
was negotiated when Shamar Stewart was seventeen years old, so
(08:40):
he never had any call on what the CEVA looked like.
And here at this point his only option is to withhold,
is to withhold his labor until this is resolved. But
this is clearly this is an overreach.
Speaker 2 (08:54):
Thing is they'll figure it out. All right, Let's do
another winner and Loser. I apologize because that was such
a bummer no to start, all right, Mark Patrick.
Speaker 1 (09:00):
Garrett, It's not a bummer. It's important, right, No.
Speaker 2 (09:03):
It absolutely is. I just feel bad because, like the
Bengals are, it is an annoying situation. It will get
straightened out. Off the top, I mean, eventually it will
get straightened out. But I also just feel like we're
at some point. Bengals fans, they know it, and they're
they're just having to sit in it right now.
Speaker 1 (09:23):
Yeah, And to be clear, none of us are trying
to pile on the Bengals, but it is an infrastructural
failure of the entire ecosystem top to bottom to put
a twenty one year old in this position of potentially
defying his union, to potentially defying all of the players
and teammates and colleagues that come after him. And where
the hell is the head coach in this? Where is
he to step in and be the coach for the player?
Speaker 2 (09:45):
Yeah, Zach Taylor has never been one that has a
ton of power compared to the rest of that organization.
Speaker 3 (09:52):
It's pretty clear, all right, Patrick.
Speaker 1 (09:53):
I don't think Greg's ever heard me yell before, and
I think he's deeply uncompaed.
Speaker 4 (09:57):
You feel like that's yelling.
Speaker 1 (09:58):
Yeah, that's my I told Eric, I was like when
I'm mad, I still smile.
Speaker 4 (10:02):
A lot, like like yelling. Is this if they're conditional,
they're not guarantees. Yeah, if there's conditions at taxes on,
why do we call them guarantees. George Pickens reg is
a winner, which also means Dak Prescott is a winner,
which also means the Cowboys are winners in this where
we see this exchange and feel like, oh, you know,
George Pickens was was mercurial and he was doing all
(10:23):
these weird things. He's at a great camp and thus far,
like Dak Prescott had twenty six throws on a mini
camp day, which signals to me that Dak is out
there and they feel comfortable with him throwing that much.
You mentioned the Schottenheimer vibes of getting promoted to actually
a place where he'll be successful as a head coach
where maybe that success didn't necessarily come as an offensive coordinator,
(10:44):
and I've bought in.
Speaker 2 (10:47):
The vibes are better. He's wearing a backward visor. That
was what really did it for me.
Speaker 1 (10:50):
I kind of love that, Like, I don't hate him
for wearing a backward visor. I just he looks Why.
Speaker 3 (10:55):
Would you hate him for wearing a backward visor.
Speaker 1 (10:57):
No, Oh my gosh. Hate is a strong word here people,
you use it. I'm just saying, like, I don't like
he pulls it off, is what I'm saying. It's like
the reverse hatfish, Like he really pulls it off. It's awesome.
Speaker 2 (11:09):
If anyone was gonna pull it off for some reason,
it is. It is shoddy. Yeah, good, good week for
the Cowboys. Just that they got Michael Parsons too. I
throw them in as a winner. That he's actually out there,
it's not a big difference to me, but it indicates
he's definitely not holding out a training camp. He did
show up to mandatory mini camp, unlike Trey Hendrickson and TG.
Speaker 3 (11:27):
Why.
Speaker 2 (11:28):
I obviously don't follow those guys for not showing up.
But he even jumps into some individual drills, which I
think was like, not the plan that said. We had
Ian rappaport on earlier this week, and he thought that's
the holdout that might go the longest, and so he'll
probably have a hold in here in Oxnard. I would
not be surprised. All right, give me a winner or
a loser.
Speaker 1 (11:46):
Yeah, kind of piggybacks off of that, and the Cowboys
kind of on the ascension in terms of vibes, and
it seems very much to be the case new offensive
coordinators who are taking over already solid offenses or offenses
who already have a franchise quarter back, King Grizzard and
the Lizard Wizard over at the Tampa Bay Buccaneers, John
Morton with the Lions, Grant Udinski with the Jaguars, Nick
(12:07):
Kaylee with the Texans, Kevin Patullo with the Eagles, and
Clayton Adams with the Cowboys. The aforementioned Cowboys. These are
all relatively inexperienced, some longtime coaches, but relatively in experienced
coordinators who are taking over teams that are very competent
right now, or at least on the offensive side.
Speaker 2 (12:25):
So they're being set up in positions to succeed. I'm
like a lot of Yeah, I would also be fired people.
Speaker 3 (12:32):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (12:32):
I could also say we could also build this into
the loser category in terms of hiring practices across the league,
but you'd have to do a quick Google search on
all of the names that I mentioned. Why what Who's
a winner? Give me a winner, A different winner, a
different winner.
Speaker 3 (12:48):
I would go.
Speaker 2 (12:48):
Xavier Lagett because he's he's in a glorilla video.
Speaker 4 (12:53):
Literally almost screw fine.
Speaker 2 (12:56):
Sorry no, I have so many too, but that was
like the biggest one. I forgot about it last week.
I was just like what I saw.
Speaker 1 (13:01):
It in the rundown. I was like, did Kreik talk
about this yet?
Speaker 2 (13:04):
It's also like not just that he is in a
glorilla video, he's in it sort of as like a
symbol of a highly attractive young man, like he is
the object in the video, so who wouldn't want to
be that as a twenty two year old.
Speaker 4 (13:22):
It reminds me of when the TikTok memes started abba
habba of Bryce Young last season, like Who's going to
beat the Chiefs? And then it was it was all
these Bryce Young memes that the same sort of energy
surrounding Xavier, Like this video has changed the social media
perspective on Xavier Laget from the guy that drops the
(13:42):
ball in which, like I know, like Packers fans will
remember the era of Davante dropping the ball and it's like, oh,
this guy he can't catch. This is bad. But I
think the vibes have shifted and now there's more collective
belief in Xavier Laget that he's like, as Glorilla said,
the type of player that Panthers fans want.
Speaker 1 (14:00):
You liked that.
Speaker 2 (14:00):
I thought about trying to pull off a joke like that,
and I called an audible halfway through. I was like,
the downside is too great?
Speaker 1 (14:08):
Probably a good call.
Speaker 4 (14:09):
You're good.
Speaker 2 (14:10):
It's definitely a trend. We got Stefan Diggs with Cardi b.
We got Sauce Gardner with Ice Spice. It's all happening
here in the NFL. We're at the center of the culture.
And you know what Glorilla reminds me of is that
she randomly was getting pitched to be on and was
expected to be on NFL Total Access about three years ago,
(14:31):
and I happened to have had a conversation with someone
about her going on to the show because they weren't
really familiar at that time and it was just when
she was just starting to pop.
Speaker 3 (14:42):
I was like, Oh, you got to do that, that's
going to be great.
Speaker 2 (14:45):
And in the end they decided they said no, they
didn't have her on because and what I really want
to say is, you got to trust my instincts on
what the kids are listening to.
Speaker 3 (14:56):
In terms of.
Speaker 2 (14:56):
Pop culture, because I was on it. I was like, no, no,
she's she's about to take off. She's popping off, and
we said, no, bad job, bad job. Give me another winner.
Speaker 4 (15:09):
That's like a sliding doors moment for NFL Total Access
may may for a rest, not okay.
Speaker 1 (15:14):
One of my winners is that the Falcons are building
their program thoroughly out with Mike Penix, that they also
have a quality backup quarterback and possible trade in Kirk Cousins,
and that Kirk Cousins came out and said that he
probably overestimated how ready he was to play after his
Achilles injury, which like all of us could have and
(15:37):
did say. But I respect the Falcons for like letting
him go on his own discovery journey and still drafting
the quarterback understanding that, hey, maybe this guy won't be
ready who we just gave a bunch of money to,
we should probably still go out and draft quarterback. I
do think we have sound of that as well.
Speaker 6 (15:51):
I think when the season ended last year, you know,
as I started them getting into working on my body
and having the time to do that, felt like I
thought I was much better than I was. And I
think you learn that as you as you improve, as
you make improvements, you realize, oh, I thought I was
already back and I'm still, you know, making a lot
of improvements.
Speaker 4 (16:11):
Heres.
Speaker 1 (16:12):
Yeah, I think Kirk is a winner of this mini camp.
I know it doesn't look like it on paper, but
I think he's a winner in terms of like he
shows up and he I think there's a lot of
hand ringing about like the vibes that would potentially be
happening in that quarterback room. To that, I say, clearly,
those people don't really know Kirk Cousins, who is not
(16:34):
the type of person to cause any sort of internal toxicity.
Rahee Morris is like praising him for being in the
front row of the meetings all the same. And they
also don't know Mike Pennix, who is one of the calmest,
most prepared and collective collected people who could be playing
quarterback for you and potentially being your franchise quarterback. I
(16:54):
honestly think this is a win win win, because the
Falcons also look really smart for having navigated this way.
Money aside, they look really smart for having this plan
in place and potentially having a trade piece later in
the season wants Kirk if something else God forbid, happens
to another quarterback and a team needs a quarterback and
comes calling for the Falcons.
Speaker 2 (17:14):
It's true, Kirk a chance, It's true, and yet the
biggest reason he's still on the Falcons is just no
other team wanted him. The reporting is just if anyone
had taken on ten million dollars of his salary and
given anything, they would have traded him. But I think
you're right in the end the way they've managed that
and the way they talked about each other, Kirk and
Michael Pennix, I think they're cool and it would be
(17:35):
great to have Kirk Cousins as your backup ultimately, because
I don't know that Michael Pennox is going to survive
the season, so Raps.
Speaker 3 (17:41):
She kind of convinced me on that one.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
Doesn't mean they wouldn't trade Kirk if they get a
decent offer in camp. But ultimately, if you're just worried
about the twenty twenty five Falcons, they're much better with
Kirk Cousins as their backup quarterback versus.
Speaker 3 (17:52):
And I don't know who is their number three right now.
Speaker 1 (17:54):
And I want to reiterate too, like he they gave
the Falcons gave Kirk every opportunity, to the point of
losing games to keep that job last year. And yes,
the injury was a factor that we now know of
per Kirk Cousins, but like they gave him every opportunity
to win that job, and Michael Pennox took over and
looked like the future. If you go back and watch
(18:16):
some of the throws that he made over that stretch,
he looked like the future of this offense. They the
conversations that I've had with people in Atlanta, he is
the future of this offense. And so, yes, it sucks,
and it sucks to watch your kind of career get
relegated to this before your eyes. And certainly the injury
is a significant factor in that. But Kirk did not
keep the job. He just didn't keep the job. I
(18:38):
think he has a self awareness of that, That's what
I'm hearing from from his comments.
Speaker 4 (18:43):
Well, I think he's always had the self awareness. I
feel like he's comfortable now, yeah, to acknowledge that that
wasn't Kirk Cousins that we saw towards the middle and
the end of his run last season, and he said
it right there, like I thought. I think he knew.
I don't think it was a surprise to Kirk and
be like, oh, well, it turns out I wasn't actually back. No,
I think he knew.
Speaker 2 (19:03):
But you have to delude yourself in great professional athletes,
they have to have a certain amount of delusion to
get to where they are.
Speaker 3 (19:10):
He's thirty six years old.
Speaker 2 (19:11):
He suffered that torn achilles much later than Aaron Rodgers did,
like in terms of the course of the season, so
it does make a lot of sense that he could
be in better shape. Their number three quarterback right now
is Easton Stick. They also have an undrafted free agent
Emery Jones, so that is a pretty big upgrade at
your backup spot in case anything happened to the man.
Speaker 1 (19:31):
Michael Pennox, the fourth quarterback Weston Stick.
Speaker 3 (19:34):
Hey, now, thanks, Patrick, come on.
Speaker 4 (19:39):
There it is.
Speaker 1 (19:41):
I'll take it.
Speaker 3 (19:42):
Who's up? Who's up? On Winters?
Speaker 4 (19:44):
I made an Easton Stick joke one time on GDL
and Scott Piola thought I was referencing a hockey stick,
so I was referencing a baseball bet. But it's a
big sporting that's company anyway. Speaking of Achilles, winner is
the fact that Aaron Glenn said Jermaine Johnson might be
able to start the twenty twenty five season, which makes
me more excited for this Jets team. Where As we've
collectively looked at it, yeah, piece by piece. As the
(20:07):
off season has gone on, there's more reasons to believe,
and I think getting Jermaine Johnson back at the edge
at some point, whether it's again it's an achilles, so
like we just discussed with Kirk Cousins, it's going to
take time to get back to the way that he
was playing before. But such a good force run and
pass off the edge, just a solid player in that position. Again,
(20:27):
the whole roster looks so much better with just a
little bit of change and a little bit of belief.
With Aaron Glenn sprinkling things.
Speaker 1 (20:35):
In, I know he's got the it factor. I've said
this before on the show. I've really liked most, if
not all, of the things the Jets have done this season.
They fall very much into my off season and mini
camp and probably training camp winners column. You've got Justin
Fields leading a total, excellent vibes, probably smash mouth offense.
I saw a highlight. I mean, I know it's this
(20:57):
time of year where we do see the highlights. I
saw a highlight of one of the past that he
made downfield at mini camp, and it drew a collective
like I think, exhale of happiness from that entire area
that where it's just felt so toxic for so long
on the field, and then stars with extensions coming due
soon are actually showing up to these practices. Aaron Glenn
(21:18):
cut swift ties with any of the negativity that lingered
in the building prior, and did so even though he
had to eat that criticism publicly from Aaron Rodgers. He
just kept going to work and going about trying to
make this football team better. I think it's a huge
credit to Aaron Glenn and the Jets. And you know,
I'm starting to buy in, guys, I am, I am starting.
Speaker 3 (21:37):
To do it.
Speaker 2 (21:38):
I've been buying in. I'm with you, Garrett. There's a
lot of like Garrett Wilson looking better than he ever has.
Speaker 3 (21:43):
I mean, he's always awesome. I love this time. I
can buy it.
Speaker 1 (21:46):
Everyone's great except the people who aren't.
Speaker 3 (21:49):
JK.
Speaker 2 (21:50):
Dobbins is a winner. I like that home for him
in Denver. Haven't done a show since he signed there.
He's going to make that team he's getting I think
two point seventy five million dollar base but guaranteed too,
so there's no chance that he's going to get cut beforehand.
I don't know if it's like a massive change in RJ.
Harvey's like fantasy stock. I saw a lot of that.
(22:11):
It's like I think RJ. Harvey is going to be
who RJ. Harvey is, and JK. Dobbins is another valuable
piece to have there and probably will have a sizable workload.
Speaker 3 (22:23):
But ultimately, I never thought RJ.
Speaker 2 (22:25):
Harvey was going to be a guy that was getting
more than twelve to fifteen touches a game. And if
he's going to be, if he's that good, he still
will even if JK.
Speaker 3 (22:33):
Dobbins is there.
Speaker 2 (22:33):
But JK Dobbins great vibes, another player who might be
even better a year further removed from his surgeries.
Speaker 3 (22:39):
But he was quite good last year.
Speaker 2 (22:41):
And I always think Sean Payton knows how to get
the most out of his running backs, really all his
skill position players strength, so he'll focus on what JK.
Speaker 3 (22:50):
Dobbins does well and I think get a lot out
of them.
Speaker 1 (22:54):
I regret to inform Arthur Smith that I have placed
him in the Mini camp and OTA's Losers column, not
because I think that about him as a person, or
his offense or his system, but because I think that
he was riding shotgun in this car being driven by
Mike Tomlin, and suddenly there's a new passenger, princess in town.
(23:16):
That person has control over the GPS and over the music,
and Art Smith is like hanging on to the bumper
on a skateboard. And this offense, the way that this
offense comes together, is one of the stories of the
off season in my opinion, because Arthur Smith is going
to have to pull from a different set of knowledge,
(23:37):
a different set of concepts than he previously has preferred
that really run heavy, you know, play action, all of
those types of things. Whereas Aaron Rodgers likes to change
the play at the line of scrimmage, he likes to
drop back, he likes to have the defense in front
of him, he likes to understand and see where all
of the little chess machinations are coming from. And I
(23:58):
think both of those things are fine. It's just melding
them together is what's going to be super interesting to me.
And I am waiting with breath that is baitis to
see what this version of the Steelers look like.
Speaker 2 (24:10):
Let's listen to Aaron Rodgers. I checked out his entire
press conference with the Steelers reporters, and I found it compelling.
Here's a little section of it.
Speaker 7 (24:19):
A lot of decisions that I've made over my career
in life from strictly the ego, even if they turn
out well or always unfulfilling, but the decisions made from
the soul are usually pretty fulfilling. So this was a
decision that was best for my soul.
Speaker 3 (24:36):
I believe him.
Speaker 2 (24:38):
I also it doesn't make me necessarily feel any better
about the Steelers because of what you said. Like, one
thing left unset about the Arthur Smith and Aaron Rodgers
offenses lately is how ineffective they've been. Like even with
Matt Lafleur as his coaching Green Bay was ineffective, certainly
was with the Jets. Arthur Smith is on a three
year losing streak essentially of ineffective offenses. And the thing
that was interesting to me listening to that clipping Rogers
(25:00):
And there was another one where they literally asked him
what would it be like to win a championship here?
And he said, oh that, you know, he said something like,
well that what would that be? Seventh you know here,
that would be that would be great. But then he
went on and said but that he essentially kind of
was like, but that's not what it's about for me.
It's about giving back to the game and just finding
joy in something that I love UH to do, which
(25:21):
is great, But I don't know. Part of me also
thinks like, once you're thinking about retirement, he just I
don't know if he's quite all in as he as
he used to be. How could you be?
Speaker 4 (25:33):
But that all that stuff is what's happened before. I
think his level of all in uh hasn't hasn't changed.
This is just a cyclical thing where he gets in
the honeymoon phase with a new team and the interviews
all sound great. He starts dropping Sun sue Es quotes
about making decisions for his soul, and then in week four,
(25:53):
you know, he'll be, you know, campaigning with RFK somewhere
right like it's it's all, it's all, We've seen it
all for It's the question of how how well is
his achilles doing, how well is he going to move
in the pocket and all the other stuff Mike Tomlin's
gonna take care of all that. Yeah, right, it's we're
gonna get.
Speaker 3 (26:11):
Okay, we're gonna negative view.
Speaker 1 (26:13):
I'm still driving.
Speaker 3 (26:14):
Okay, I got you. But the negative view, and I
watched it, I was like that it wasn't.
Speaker 2 (26:19):
Really all about wins and losses anymore for him, which
I think is a dangerous place to be in pro football.
Speaker 1 (26:24):
I will say, like, this is a multiple things are
true at the same time situation where I believe that
he believes in what he's talking about right now. I
believe the Steelers signed him with the intent of we
need to try to actually, you know, push past this
this hump that we've been in and win. They aggressively
(26:45):
pursued behind the scenes, but still aggressively pursued different quarterbacks
this off season and ultimately came to Aaron Rodgers. Gave
him the leeway and the patients to be able to
have his off season the way that he wanted to
have his off season. And at the same time, like,
Aaron Rodgers is many things right, but right now he
(27:09):
strikes me as somebody who is deeply committed to trying
to go out on a high note. Yes, whatever that
looks like whether it's I think he has to and
perhaps based on these comments, has come to terms with
the fact that it might not mean a great record,
but he wants it to feel like a high note.
(27:30):
That's what I'm getting from those comments.
Speaker 3 (27:32):
I think.
Speaker 2 (27:33):
I think that's well said and a good interpretation of everything.
And it's funny because him being in charge of the
offense or cheat that was like one of the things
he bristled at was like, well, I've always just played
within an offense.
Speaker 3 (27:44):
I'm never changing the place. And I'm like, bro, we
can see you cod.
Speaker 4 (27:47):
It's literally the reason he got hurt. It's literally the reason.
Speaker 2 (27:50):
It's also like part of the reason why he's recorded
some of the greatest seasons of all time. I can
remember so far back as like there was this little
twenty fourteen twenty fifth team lull in his career, and
the huge criticisms at the time with McCarthy was he
was so like he had lost his balance of instructure
and out of structure and he essentially was just like
(28:11):
vibing out there and not doing the places called. That
was more than a decade ago, and I think it's
only gotten stronger since. But I don't know if it's
good for my soul, but I am happy Aaron Rodgers
back in the league.
Speaker 3 (28:21):
I think it's going to make these Steelers games more important.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
Let's take a quick break and we will be back
with some more winners and losers, wrapping up Mini camp season.
Speaker 3 (28:29):
After the break.
Speaker 2 (28:39):
Back on NFL Daily, Kyle Shanahan got annoyed with the
reporters who are keeping stats in Ota.
Speaker 1 (28:47):
Yeah, I'm team Kyle Shanahan on this.
Speaker 3 (28:49):
I get it. And he's saying that.
Speaker 2 (28:53):
The keeping of the stats is not only misleading for
the people that are radiant, but it's actually impacting the
way the players play. Let's say maybe a quarterback is
trying to get more completions than he normally would because
he knows they're keeping track and negatively impacting their learning
a little uh wagging the tail thing.
Speaker 3 (29:15):
I never really don't.
Speaker 4 (29:16):
If only there was somebody to properly contextualize the things
people were seeing and you know, honestly evaluate them when else, well.
Speaker 2 (29:23):
I don't think he would have I don't think he
would approve on us going winners and losers. I guess
we'd be on the side of like Nope, Sorry, Kyle,
there are winners and losers.
Speaker 1 (29:32):
I actually in my losers column, I had the people
putting actual weight. I guess track as many stats as
you want, but in a loser's column, I had putting
actual weight on it. And I do have like a quick,
very quick anecdote on that front, if you will, guys
will indulge me, of course. I remember in twenty twenty
one when Matthew Stafford first arrived in Los Angeles, he
(29:55):
used the joint practices against the Raiders and the Cowboys
during that to basically troubleshoot the range of his receivers
and what windows within this offense. You know, receivers in
the Sean McVay system, especially at that time, they were
changing around some of the landmarks that they would ask
receivers to run to, basically the spot on the field
to which the quarterback throws the ball. Understanding that Stafford
(30:18):
was a quarterback who could freestyle a little bit more,
could be more creative with the range of what that route,
structure and spacing would look like down the field. So
he was using those practice. He threw like seven interceptions
in one practice, and I remember the collective narrative, especially
from visiting media at the time, was people losing their
GD minds over this. This is the bus trade. This
(30:42):
isn't going to work out. He's washed, He's it. Conversely,
Jalen Ramsey was playing in the star position, so the
slot their hybrid slot safety corner for the first time,
and working on a new type of match zone that
conceptually they were trying to install that offseason. Clips of
him giving up a two yard pass, videos of him
(31:03):
giving up a three yard past.
Speaker 3 (31:04):
He's cooked, he's washed.
Speaker 1 (31:06):
They're never going to be the same again. And what
did the Rams go and do that year? Win the
Super Bowl. I'm just saying this to say, like people
use these practices to try things right, to learn things. Well,
what Kyle said actual competition, Like none of this matters.
Speaker 3 (31:23):
Yet, especially now. And Kyle was like before they could
just practice. The point of practice is to practice. I agree,
I was.
Speaker 2 (31:30):
I have like losers are people putting too much into
mini camps.
Speaker 3 (31:33):
Here's how you can tell you shouldn't. I mean put
too much into them?
Speaker 2 (31:37):
Is half the teams like cancel and don't take all
the days even necessary. They cancel the last day or two,
they cancel next week if it was that important.
Speaker 3 (31:44):
They wouldn't and so they should just be you know,
it is practice.
Speaker 2 (31:47):
I think the most important things you can draw from
them are stuff that we're talking about, like depth chart,
like where the coaches are telling us stuff or injuries happen.
Unfortunately in defense of.
Speaker 4 (31:57):
The of the charters right away, Yeah, yeah, a lot
of that. A lot of folks came up in eras
where coaches were reluctant to share information. Availability was limited,
viewing opportunity was very limited, and so there's there's scraps, right,
and you have people that are trying to just claw
together every scrap that they can. It's very difficult to
(32:18):
walk around the field and just absorb vibes, right, So
it's like, oh, so and so was x of X
for x yards and x touchdowns And then you know,
you could poise that to the coach and then the
coach could properly contextualize that. But in a lot of
situations they may say something like we're all we all
could be dead on Sunday or not actually answer the
question in the first place, which push people in position
(32:39):
to chart.
Speaker 2 (32:40):
Right, that's totally true, and uh, like you're only allowed
to show up as a media during OTA is usually
once in an entire week.
Speaker 3 (32:48):
Mini camps used to be totally different.
Speaker 2 (32:50):
Not to age myself, but you used to be able
to tackle and wear pads and they did two practice.
It wasn't that lot, though, But so if we're the CBA,
they would do two practices day one like it would
be like a training camp day essentially.
Speaker 3 (33:02):
And now now it's different.
Speaker 2 (33:03):
Now they're canceling the final Saints practice to go to
five oh four f O r E, which I'm guessing
is some sort of either mini golf or top golf
copy Ane's new album.
Speaker 1 (33:18):
More information is that they don't all I'm saying more
information and trust in the reporters on the ground is good.
It's just that when you're weighing too much in this
time of year, you go down this deep dark path
and I just don't want that for people. I don't
want that for you. The fans. I love better for you.
Speaker 2 (33:34):
I love that they put the Saints having practice or
not on that that's what they say, at least on
rookie QB Hunter Deckers making a three pointer or not,
and he hit the three pointer and everyone so lucky.
It's then they get to go play golf.
Speaker 3 (33:48):
You're up.
Speaker 4 (33:49):
It's sad loser and winner. I'll combine them because it's
injury related for both of them. Will start with the
good news. Keaton Mitchell uh fully recovered and on the
way back from that ACL tear that came rookie season
which was very promising, and the Ravens go and rush
for over three thousand yards and have a great running season.
And now Keith Mitchell gets to be added back to
that finally fully healthy behind Derrick Henry. And on the downside,
(34:12):
a little bit further away in the Tri State area,
Michael Gallup having a setback, waiting for his comeback to
fully come to fruition. And so that's that sucks.
Speaker 2 (34:20):
Yeah, the worst thing to hear this time of year
are injuries. So let's just fire through a couple. Noah
Brown had what sounded like the most serious injury from
this week.
Speaker 3 (34:30):
We'll see, we don't know the results, but he was
carted off.
Speaker 2 (34:32):
Was very frustrated, I think described as a buy a
reporter of there. Ben Standig is like slamming his helmet,
kind of yelling out when they went over a bump,
which not a great sign for him. They also don't
have Terry McLaurin there, but that's not because of an injury.
That's just he's pitching out waiting for a new contract.
So that's disappointing. Also, just everyone ease off on debo
(34:53):
looking a little slow on one of those routes and
a little bigger, like they're not playing at full speed.
He's not trying to run his fastest, so let's just
calm down.
Speaker 1 (35:01):
I also guarantee you he is gonna be so hard
to tackle regardless. So like if a freight train is
coming at you, or a slightly smaller and thinner freight
train is coming at you, it's still a freight train.
Speaker 4 (35:13):
People. Has never been a small guy.
Speaker 3 (35:15):
Right he is.
Speaker 2 (35:16):
He is a big boy. But this like the route
that they had like multiple people like it was like
a drill, like like let's calm down. But in in
uh San Francisco. They have a couple of receivers that
have been out there on my radar because Ricky Pearsall
just wasn't able to stay healthy last year and he
missed most of the ots. Juwan Jennings has been out
with a calf. The Bears are missing Colston Loveland. He
(35:39):
might not be ready for training camp. So that's whenever
the second year player you hear like, well, I never
really caught up because I missed so much of the
off season. We tend to like overlook the off season
part of it, and Luthor Burdon really hasn't practiced for them.
So a lot of just like in little injuries that
will keep an eye on going.
Speaker 3 (35:55):
It's a camp. Give me something.
Speaker 1 (35:56):
You like Ricky Piersall who was literally shot. You're mentioning
that as he could not stay on the phone.
Speaker 2 (36:03):
I oh, I was not referring to that. I was
referring to the injuries that he has. Yes, so clear
toy here, he had injuries before that that he was
not on the field even before that happen, and then
when he came back, he suffered through a couple of
different separate injuries.
Speaker 3 (36:19):
But I'm glad you cleared that out.
Speaker 1 (36:21):
I have a Bear's positive that is less big picture
but more a couple of pieces that I've been reading
coming out of Bear's mini camp. It seems like they're
really focusing in on the details, to the point where
Ben Johnson is like losing his gourd at Cole Comet
for lining up a yard off in his split, which
(36:44):
is actually that's that's a thing you have to when
you have those splits the way that he likes to
run his formations, like you need to be in the
exact specific right place, like even an inch off affects
the spacing deeper down the field. So I read a
story about that, then I read a story about them
practicing a ton of situational football. So for me, the
Bears are winners because they're doing these things at a
(37:05):
high intensity, even in a low intensity time of year,
to try to reset the narrative that they just are
are messy all throughout.
Speaker 2 (37:13):
That is a little bit of a trope, but also
one that I think that's a really sic meaningful because
it's a Mi Mike Rabel. He's getting the same pop
of like, hey, they're making them redo the plays they're making.
Drake may call out a certain cadence and if anyone
jumps off side, then you got to do the thing,
whereas that would have never happened last year. But I
also do believe certain coaches pay closer attention to details
(37:37):
much more than others. You could see it when Tennis Allen,
for instance, replaced Sean Payton, like they just got sloppy
in a second.
Speaker 3 (37:43):
And that starts in the office.
Speaker 1 (37:44):
And I think that Ben Johnson, because he coached under
Dan Campbell, like has this like sort of warm fuzzy
rep by association just not the case at all. Like
he is hyper detailed, very intense. He's like not the
warm fuzzy bear hug at the podium of Dan Campbell.
He's all biting kneecaps of Dan Campbell. And he can also,
(38:07):
by the way, identify the specific location of the potel attendant.
So he is like, wow, hyper fixated and very intense.
And I think it is what the Bears need. And
that's that's my point.
Speaker 2 (38:18):
I'm going to give a winner to the Pittsburgh Steelers'
assistant coaches who are giving us hardcore depth chart updates.
Their wide receiver coach said very clearly, Calvin Austen is
our number two. Y'all don't realize he's underrated. He actually
made the case for Calvin Austin as a better blocker
than people realized, despite his one hundred and sixty two pounds.
(38:40):
I do think Calvin Austin has been a better player
in the NFL than people realized. But he said like,
that's our number two, Like, stop asking who's the number two?
Speaker 3 (38:46):
Interesting?
Speaker 2 (38:47):
And then their defensive line coach said, Derek Harmon is
our left starting defensive end. He's our you know, you
guys can stop asking that too. He's our rookie. He
is going to start. So just a little bit of like.
Speaker 3 (38:58):
Morsels of nuggets. Why information and I like it?
Speaker 4 (39:01):
Yeah, it doesn't. It's not going to make them try
less hard. It's like, oh, I can get super comfortable now,
and yeah, it's the type of thing that that is good.
It's the information that that people go to mini camp
to cover and get stuff like that. Why why keep
it behind this veil of mystery? And no coach ever
is going to be like, hey, you know, you guys
need to properly contextualize me having guys redo things, you know,
(39:24):
like that's something that they're completely okay with him, you
being like, yeah, Mike.
Speaker 1 (39:27):
Rabel, he was actually seven inches off of his spot,
not a yard.
Speaker 4 (39:31):
It went crazy today because detail wasn't specifically adhered to.
Speaker 2 (39:35):
They also, yeah, I have a boss that they clearly
like Mike Tommins like yeah, you can say whatever. There'd
be some coaches that that would probably be.
Speaker 4 (39:42):
Yeah, well no, what would be the point of not
saying it.
Speaker 1 (39:44):
Yeah, one of my winners was quarterbacks getting either engaged
or married. Okay, yeah, especially during this miniicamp time of
year to pivot slightly. Jalen and Brianna Hurts, Josh Allen
and Hailey Steinfeld, Aaron Rodgers. I don't know if he
said specifically who he had gotten married to.
Speaker 2 (40:03):
Drake May and it's Britney with an I based on
a Pat McAfee appearance from like six months ago or
three months something like that.
Speaker 3 (40:09):
Okay, that's it. That's all details.
Speaker 1 (40:12):
Drake Man and Hudson are about to get married. High
school sweethearts Jordan Love and Ronica Stone and Matthew Stafford
and the Rams renewed their vows for another year. Okay.
So I have to admit to you, guys, I only
knew like two of these. So I crowdsourced it with
my fifteen person all women's NFL reporter group chat, and
the first response I got back was everybody, they're all
(40:35):
married to the game. Shout out to Catherine Fitzgerald, the
perfect it's perfect response.
Speaker 3 (40:41):
I'm happy for all the all these young.
Speaker 1 (40:42):
Man's I love, love it's awesome.
Speaker 4 (40:45):
I have a winner in a Trope update. It comes
our courtesy of Cardinals tight end Trade McBride, who said
that the Cardinals offense was adding a lot of sauce.
Oh off season, and it's like we step away from yeah,
we're going to be more precise, We're gonna be more multiple,
working different position groups. He went ahead and said that
the offense is going to have more sauce. And I
(41:05):
like that because it's a little bit of mystery, but
we also know exactly what he means.
Speaker 2 (41:08):
I like that Marvin Harrison has added copious amounts of
tricep muscles.
Speaker 3 (41:15):
I don't know if you.
Speaker 1 (41:15):
See you're on for Trope al art, Like.
Speaker 2 (41:17):
They're like, there, it's been a whole like it's a
huge story in Arizona where it's just like he has
showed up and he's just outrageous. And then they sent
they sent like a picture out and people are just
all into Marvin Harrison's triceps. All the reporters there, it's
all happening. The triceps are taking over.
Speaker 4 (41:33):
The top result when I sarched it is is Marvin
Harrison getting too jacked.
Speaker 5 (41:39):
It.
Speaker 2 (41:40):
On the other side of the veil at this There
is such a is there's such a thing as to
people used to think CMC was two jacked. CMC, by
the way, fully healthy, practicing fully. It's rare that that
is happening. So that's just that's just a little notable.
I'll throw a winner out that bow. Melton is trying
to be like Travis Hunter and playing on both sides
of the ball. It's not a great sign for his
career as a receiver in Green Bay, where he's probably
(42:02):
fighting an uphill battle to make the team as like
a pure receiver. But he's out there straight up playing
cornerback now like his bro Max Melton on the Arizona Cardinals.
So maybe he can be some sort of hybrid special
teamer cornerback, six cornerback, sixth receiver.
Speaker 4 (42:20):
Let's go COACHLF did like clarify, he's like bo is
still a wide receiver. Okay, but it's hard not to
take negatives away from like seeing a number eighty out there,
like working on his punch, It's like, oh, no, what
are we doing?
Speaker 3 (42:35):
If it helped, yeah, if it helps you make the two.
Speaker 2 (42:36):
If you look at all the guys they've drafted and
the guys who are just bigger than him.
Speaker 3 (42:41):
He's got an uphill battle. So that's good.
Speaker 2 (42:43):
Raiders fans, I'm going to say, are losers for wanting.
Anyone that's a Raiders fan that just wants to forget
about Derek Carr's playoff throw against Jermaine Pratt, they won't
be able to because Jermaine Pratt is now a member
of the ring.
Speaker 1 (42:58):
I've started to be worried for you. What I did,
s trainer Steven, See what I did there started? You
had me the first half. I'm not gonna lie.
Speaker 4 (43:06):
It was a heat seeking missile that navigated its way
past Remaine Brett to the couch that there a car.
Speaker 2 (43:17):
I saw Bengals fan say that was one of the
best moments. I saw Bengals fan say that was one
of the best moments of their life.
Speaker 3 (43:25):
Did Jermaine Pratt intercept it?
Speaker 2 (43:26):
And it's true if you if you're thinking about the
the losing streak and the playoffs and the struggles that
they had, that kick that kick started at all. But
now when Pratt's out there, you know, good signing for
the Raiders. Get give a veteran guy a chance at
a position of of need.
Speaker 3 (43:40):
But it's just going to remind Raiders fans.
Speaker 4 (43:42):
I think it's gonna show them how far that they've come, okay,
and that this is a totally new start and there's
there's new things to celebrate and enjoy. You don't have
to necessarily cape for anybody in their massive mistakes.
Speaker 2 (43:52):
All right, we should We should get the people on
their way if we If you guys want to do
any speed round winners and losers before we say good
by to this edition of Mini Camp, you know, wrap up.
Speaker 1 (44:04):
The Panthers are a winner in my book. Getting Derek
Brown back this season is going to be huge for
their defense. Also, Trevon Morrigg sounds like he's already making
a splash in practices. Yes, it is OTAs we are
not going to put too much stock in it, but
they badly need somebody who can play that versatile safety
come into the box, help defend the run, who also
can make plays.
Speaker 3 (44:22):
On the ball.
Speaker 1 (44:22):
Their defense needs the juice and getting him into the
mix on that three year deal, but also regaining Derek Brown,
signing Bobby Brown, all of these things are good for
the Panthers.
Speaker 2 (44:32):
Tech mcmaillan out of practice and just someone to keep
an eye on coming into training camp just in case
that's serious.
Speaker 3 (44:37):
You just don't know this time of year.
Speaker 4 (44:38):
And congratulations all the folks who were agitated by Rashi
Rice's non appearance in our receiver ranking that he was
a full participant working his way back and get some
more Rashi Rice, so you can get out there and prove.
Speaker 2 (44:49):
Us roll shout out to the receiver rankings. But still
doing you know, good numbers. People are going back to that.
People getting mad. You know, I don't feel bad. I
think Recei Rice was very solidly like around thirty five.
Yeah he was not even the one of the first
guys off, but he was definitely in the top forty.
Speaker 3 (45:06):
He's got to prove it. He's got to stay on
the field quickly.
Speaker 2 (45:10):
James Cook, his financial advisor, is absolutely a winner.
Speaker 3 (45:15):
Let's listen to why James is back at practice.
Speaker 4 (45:17):
It is mandatory, but why did you decide to come?
Speaker 5 (45:22):
I like my money, Yeah, he will definitely do so
That's why I'm here.
Speaker 3 (45:28):
It is Yeah, I need that for him.
Speaker 2 (45:32):
If you're making it now too, you can invest it
in the near terma. And it also indicates to me
he's not gonna miss any of training camp, and so ultimately,
even though he probably deserves a new contract, I don't
think he's going to be holding out.
Speaker 4 (45:44):
C J.
Speaker 2 (45:44):
Stroud was back at practice, so that's good for the
Texans fans that were worried. He just said he needed
to take a little bit of a rest with his arm,
but he's back to practicing fully. And then a lot
of big Nickel love Derwin James and Nick Emon Worry
both getting that offseason, we're gonna play to the line
of scrimmage. Derwin James of course did that very much
(46:04):
effectively at the end of last season, but they're going
to try to lean into that more and it definitely
sounds like even Worry they're using essentially as a linebacker
is yes.
Speaker 1 (46:12):
You know, my theory on this is that people understand
that the quote unquote cover linebacker is still just as
important as they always have been because of the news
the modern since you know, the early mid twenty fifteens
and beyond twenty seventeen, beyond spacing and play action and
all of those types of things. So they still need
a cover player in that area. But they also understand
(46:32):
how prevalent the run game is regaining its own momentum
and its own steam, and so they still need that
downhill force to help stop the run. So I think
you're going to see more one and a half linebacker sets,
which means a actual linebacker a lah Ernest Jones, and
then Nick em and worry coming in is that hybrid
player to help with the coverage as well. So I
(46:54):
think this is going to be fun.
Speaker 2 (46:55):
Shout out to Dan Buchanan ahead of his time. It's
kind of like the only guy filling this role about
seven or eight years ago. Now there's a whole league
full of them.
Speaker 1 (47:04):
Check Thompson, Erasure But okay, I.
Speaker 2 (47:06):
Mean I feel like that's fair check Toobs, but check
Thomson to me, was just like an outside line back.
Speaker 1 (47:11):
Nicol.
Speaker 3 (47:12):
Yes, uh, great show, great week.
Speaker 2 (47:15):
We will be back next week on Monday, and you
know what, it's going to be the same.
Speaker 1 (47:21):
Trio here, maybe even in the same outfit.
Speaker 2 (47:24):
No I brought a change a change of clothes. But
we are going to be talking about the secret weapons.
Remember we did it a couple of weeks back. This
time it'll be from the National Football Conference.
Speaker 3 (47:36):
Football is taking a break.
Speaker 4 (47:37):
It's my back.
Speaker 3 (47:38):
What taking a little break?
Host
Gregg Rosenthal
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