November 7, 2025 • 37 mins
That was one of the football games of all time. The Las Vegas Raiders and the Denver Broncos combined for 17 total points as Bo Nix, Sean Payton and the Broncos faithful have to feel like they got away with murder after coming away with a win in Week 10. Gregg Rosenthal and Nick Shook have recap and analysis of the day's action, but also provide league-wide power rankings of every NFL team. HINT: NFC West teams make up two of the top three slots. Listen to the latest edition of NFL Daily to find out why!
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Ready fifty sent freedom right to the left, Knicks drops back,
throws a ball to the end zone. The pass is
taught and that is a Denver touchdown. Troy Franklin with
the catch at the gold line and he had Eric
Stokes on his back. Stokes made the tackle, but Franklin
(00:21):
had the ball and a touchdown.
Speaker 2 (00:25):
That was Dave Logan on koa. That was the only
Denver Broncos touchdown of the night. That was the last
time we saw anyone in the end zone in this game.
A ten to seven victory by the Denver Broncos over
the Las Vegas Raiders. Nick, when I asked you before
the season to do every Monday night game recap with me,
(00:47):
every Thursday night game recap with me, I never promised
that they would all be beautiful, and I submit there
will not be an uglier primetime game than this all season.
For many seasons, there there are some games that are
ugly and fun, and this one, by the end was
just ugly.
Speaker 3 (01:07):
It makes me think about that Colt's Broncos game that
was a Thursday Night or a few years.
Speaker 4 (01:10):
Ago that was also just about as ugly as this one.
Speaker 2 (01:12):
But that one had like a sense of like this is.
We're all having a good time by the end because.
Speaker 4 (01:17):
It's so bad.
Speaker 3 (01:18):
Fact that it was that bad, yeah, and this one
so much just like I know it to that point.
So my youngest sister lives with me, and she made
some incredible banana bread today, and to feel something again
before getting on the show, I just took a big
chunk of banana bread and housed it before I came
in here to do the show.
Speaker 2 (01:34):
I appreciate that. I appreciate your sister. I want some
of that banana bread. And we're still gonna break this down,
but we're also going to break down the entire league.
Where we made our first power rankings of the year,
me and you a little bit of a power poll
where we averaged our rankings together, and uh yeah, the Broncos,
(01:56):
you know, might have to move down a couple spots
despite winning tonight's game. So you know, we'll give this
game all the time it deserves, maybe a little less
than most Thursday nights, and then we'll do some of
the power rankings.
Speaker 3 (02:06):
You know.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
My takeaway here in a game that had twenty two
penalties split evenly, eleven each, fifteen punts and just incredibly
long stretches of offensive incompetency, especially you know in the
second half of this game, was that this Bronco's offense, Like,
(02:28):
I know, they won the game. When usually talked positive
about you know, we'll talk about the defense and how
good they look, that we know they're great, like their
troubles are not going away Bo Nicks through an unforgivable
interception late in this game. They never got it even
going in the fourth quarter. The reason they won is
because their defense kept setting them up with short fields.
They eventually got a little bit of a running game going,
but my god, they're passing game against the defense that
(02:51):
has struggled all season. Was kind of my biggest takeaway
because this isn't eight and two team leading the AFC
West with a chance to get the number one seed.
Speaker 3 (03:00):
Yeah, and it's another example of what this team has
been for I mean months, not month, but months at
this point. I mean, they are a team that looks
as if they are sleepwalking offensively almost every week. And
their story has been they turned on the fourth quarter
and come back and win games. And frankly, tonight was
setting up to be that. If Daniel Carlson makes the
game tying field goal, which he missed. We were going
(03:22):
to have to see them put the foot down on
the pedal again and see if they could pull another
one out of thin air instead. Luckily, because the Raiders
missed their field goal, Lebroncos simply had to salt it away.
I will give them a little bit of credit. Before
that touchdown pass that we heard to start the show, Yo,
Knicks did have a handful of really good throws where
he stepped up in the pocket, he extended to play
and you know, he's got guys ten to fifteen yards
(03:43):
downfield that he's hitting accurately. Other than that nightmare, they
didn't run the ball effectively in the first half. They
decided to commit to it in the second half and
it helped a little bit and helped them put the
game away as well.
Speaker 4 (03:53):
But it is a team that lacks and identity.
Speaker 3 (03:56):
Has talent, has an ability to move the football at times,
but lacks identities, so it takes them forever to get going,
and we were left with this same thing. You know,
I described Bonnicks recently as a firecracker quarterback because he's silent,
and it's just like lighting a pack of firecrackers. Everything's quiet,
the fuse is lit. Might hear the fuse and then
pop up up, pop up, pap pap up. That's how
he's been in almost every game tonight. He wasn't even
(04:18):
really that exceptly when they scored that touchdown.
Speaker 2 (04:20):
Yeah, that was one drive. It was late in the
second quarter. It was the best field position that they
had until the second half where they blew a couple
really short fields. But they started at their own forty
seven and they drove down and you're right, he's made
a few plays where he steps up in the pocket
and you know, sees open lanes and hits a pass,
(04:41):
but he missed so many of those tonight. And they
had a crazy amount of drives in this game, thirteen drives,
so like that game should have ended at you usually
you get about ten drives in a game, and they
had seven points at one point, and there was a
stretch where through eleven drives, which is more than a game,
you know, a normal game, where they had eight three
(05:02):
and outs out of those seven drives, and an interception
in those eight drives, another very short drive, and then
the touchdown drive that we just talked about, and then
on top of it, like if you want to extend
it out to twelve drives. It was that groaner of
an interception in the fourth quarter, so that that's a
twelve drive sequence with just total struggle fest And there
(05:26):
wasn't a lot of pressure on him. I mean there
was at times, but I looked and there wasn't much
quick pressure. Max Crosby was generally taken care of tonight
by their pass rush. So one play really stands out
to me where Kirk Kurbstreet on the broadcast is like,
you know, bo Nick's not feeling very settled in the pocket,
and I'm like, yeah, that's true. But it was a
(05:49):
three man rush against a five man protection with absolutely
no one there, and then he just like throws it
away on a third third down. That was at the
beginning of the fourth quarter. And yet I appreciated them,
if nothing else, running the clock out at the end
of the game with some good JK. Dobbins runs and
if nothing else, that got us to the end of
the game quicker.
Speaker 3 (06:09):
Yeah, there was one inexplicable miss of a running lane
by JK. Dobbins in that sequence. For you see it
on Prime vision from over the top, You're like, the
lane is there, and he just tries to swerve right
around it. Otherwise they put the gameway. But you're absolutely right.
I mean this offense had no rhythm the entire night.
This game was really won by their defense and their
defense's ability to completely eliminate brock Bowers from the equation
for the Raiders. They dedicated defensive backs to them all game.
(06:31):
There were multiple instances in which the Raiders are running
play action trying to slip Boers out into the flat.
There's two dbs right there covering him.
Speaker 4 (06:38):
Gino looks to him first, has to go somewhere else.
Speaker 3 (06:40):
So, I mean, this defense won this game they wanted
by not really blitzing that much but getting semi consistent
pressure doesn't really show up in the numbers, but shows
up visually. And it's not really like their hallmark that
they have a good defense. We know that, but when
you think about the Broncos, you don't think like great
defensive team they win with defense. You think of them
as a team that has a good defense and then
just happens to find enough success offensively. And it felt
(07:03):
like a diet version of that tonight.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
An extreme version. I would say, yeah, I'm I'm glad
you brought up something positive here. So yeah, let's give
Nick Benito his flowers, eight or nine QB pressures, six
quick pressures, two sacks. I think they'll count it officially
as one and a half. I don't believe in half sacks.
Another couple quarterback hits on the day, Zach Allen with
three quarterback hits and a sack. And the Raiders start
(07:28):
out this game with a really good touchdown drive. And
the image I remember it best is on the score
Jackson Powers Johnson, their guard, you know, blocking Nick Benito
out of the play in Ashton Genty running through a
tackle by Ufunga, and I'm thinking, okay, we're live. This
is gonna be an interesting game. And that was like
(07:49):
the last we saw anything of that, And partly because
Jackson Powers Johnson left this game, and that left their
left side which has been missing Colton Miller thin all night.
What the hell, let's listen to the one Raider touchdown
because we really aren't going to have any other highlights.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
Time out. Gino's clapping his hands on third and short
inside handoff Genty inside the five first down is go
one touchdown Raiders Genty on the inside handle a six
yard run.
Speaker 4 (08:16):
Josh's in the insode.
Speaker 2 (08:19):
Oh, Ashley Gensy started this game great and then he
ended the game with three point two yards per carry.
I was watching part of the game with more East
Jones Drew. He thinks genty misses some holes. You were
talking about not having like the greatest vision. He thinks
he missed them tonight. But after really that first drive
or two, the Broncos dominated in a way that you
just rarely see. There was a sequence, and I keep going.
(08:42):
While the Broncos were doing all those three and outs
that I just mentioned, there was an eight drive sequence
by the Raiders where they had a total of ten yards.
I mean, that's crazy. A total of ten yards, a
four play turnover on downs three and out, three and
out three end of half, three and out, one play
interception three and a block punt and then on a
(09:04):
three and out. That's that's wild. In an NFL game
that we all watched and we were paid for.
Speaker 4 (09:10):
Yeah, we were, thank you. I will say that Jackson
powers johnts like Jackson Powers.
Speaker 3 (09:15):
Johnson supposedly going to be coming in to be the center,
he loses the center job.
Speaker 4 (09:19):
He ends up being a guard.
Speaker 3 (09:20):
He is kind of in the mold of Richie and
cognitothough he's taller, but he looks like him physically, and
the way that he moves and blocks is kind of similar,
which is funny because in Cognito, you know, end of
his career, he was a Raider as well, but once
they lost him, the right side of their offensive line
was just consistently bad. You see him pulling from right
to left there on that touchdown run. After that, DJ
Glaze is getting beaten consistently in one on ones by
(09:43):
Nick Benito, the right guard that replaces Jackson powers Johnson
getting beaten consistently in one on ones to where Gino
never has any time to survey the field, and that's
before he gets banged up. This offense had no life.
We've talked all year about how Genti is consistently getting
hit behind the line of scrimmage. Watch it on Prime
Vision tonight from above, it's the same thing. He's getting
(10:03):
hit a yard half, a yard yard and a half
behind the line of scrimmage. He's got nowhere to run
This Raiders offense. If it's not dead, it's on. It's
basically on life support right now. Like they just can't
do anything.
Speaker 2 (10:14):
They're leading receiver tonight was Tyler Lockett by far five
for forty four. You know, Bowers has one good catch
where he singled up on Jaday Baron in the first half,
and in that drive I believe ended either in the
turnover on downs or one of the three punts that
the Raiders had in Broncos territory. I don't know how
(10:35):
they pulled that off. They also had the missed field
goal that you mentioned when Gino did get some passes
going in the second half their only sign of life,
and then they settle for the field goal attempt and
he missed it. And Gino is struggling in general. He
definitely missed a few throws tonight. He held onto the
ball a little bit, but he had basically no chance.
(10:55):
And the offensive line you're talking about is Dylan Forsyth
or Stone Forsythe at left tackle, is it? Dylan Putnam
at left guard, Jordan Meredith, Alex Kappa in Glaze, dj
Glaze on the right side. So that's three replacements and
then one of the starters, Glaze, just getting killed. It's
HiT's rough going for my guy. I don't think you
(11:17):
had much of a chance. But there's just there's not
much more you can say. I think about this Raiders offense,
maybe not of this game unless you have anything more
you really want to get to here.
Speaker 3 (11:29):
Typically Captain Geno for trying to cut out the injury
that he was dealing with, it was pretty clear he
was limited by it. He gets hit after scrambling. He
basically gets tripped up by Nick Benito you're gonna see
if you're watching on YouTube, and then Malcolm Roach falls
on him, and I believe that's where it happened, because
he starts grabbing his left leg and he continues to
grab his left leg. Kaylee Hartsung later reported it was
a left quad injury. So if you see the replay
(11:51):
again if you're watching on YouTube, Gino stumbles to the
ground and then Roach falls in and the replay view
from behind, which I'm not sure we're.
Speaker 4 (11:58):
Gonna get here, we don't get there.
Speaker 3 (11:59):
You can see the impact on his leg. His knee
kind of goes inward. At first I thought it might
be a knee issue, ends up being a quad. Either way,
it was a significant hurdle for him physically, and ultimately
I think it limited him in key spots, but you
got to give him credit for trying to gut it out.
Speaker 2 (12:14):
Yeah, he had a dime to Dante Thornton in the
first half which could have been caught and just completely dropped.
Probably his best throw of the night by far. He
had a touchdown taken off the board by a jack
or No, that was a Dante Thornton penalty, rather on
an offensive pass interference where I think the play call
(12:36):
would have worked it Obviously.
Speaker 3 (12:37):
I don't think that defender is going to actually come
that the ground, even if he doesn't hit him, I
don't think he gets there.
Speaker 2 (12:42):
It was absolutely the right call, don't get me wrong,
because he went out of his way to hit the guy.
Was just too easy and that took seven points off
the board too. And then he had a sequence wherever
he Moster had a blown assignment trying to protect him
against the blitz and he just starts yelling at at Moster.
There there weren't see. There was a moment where I
(13:04):
thought it was going to get to like fun ugly,
and that was the sequence where the Broncos, who are
running it down the Raiders' throats, get to third and
one and then John Payton calls a trick play. Oh
my god, and they go backward five yards.
Speaker 4 (13:18):
It was so bad.
Speaker 2 (13:20):
And then and then they come up short on the
field goal attempt after that, losing five yards on the
third to one. And then the ensuing play is you know,
Smith hitting Ash and Genty in the chest and the
ball pops up for an interception. Like it just was like, okay,
now we're having some fun. Then there's a block punt.
But it didn't even continue to be fun. It just
(13:43):
it just was ugly.
Speaker 3 (13:46):
You know that That miskick, by the way, is my
favorite example of an of a. It's the latest example
of what my favorite new trend in football is, which
is announcers being infatuated by the whole k ball juice
caball revolution and kickers can kick balls a mile now
and Will LUTs lines up for a fifty nine yarder,
no small feat and al Michaels is like he hit
these with these and warm ups.
Speaker 4 (14:07):
And LUTs comes up like eight yards short.
Speaker 3 (14:09):
I'm just like, yeah, maybe we don't think everybody can
hit sixty yarders routinely, Like let's be reminded that these
are humans.
Speaker 2 (14:16):
And it was a windy night we should point out
with some of the offensive struggles, although like inaccurate passes,
weirdly of everything didn't seem like it was the biggest
issue in general on the night. Yeah, not everyone's going
to be able to hit. Although he did bounce it
in which if you tried to do that a hundred times,
I don't know if you could, like the ball bounced
(14:38):
and went over to the crossbar.
Speaker 3 (14:39):
Maybe they should make it a Doug Flutie dropkick, remember
that back in the day.
Speaker 2 (14:42):
That that counts. Well, that's a little different. That's a
little about to bounce there. Start at the beginning. They
started this game. And it's been a really dark day
in the NFL. And like I said, we're going to
do the power rankings right after this break. But there's
no other great place to address this. But everyone listening
probably knows right now what a what a difficult day
(15:03):
this has been in the NFL. A lot of people
woke up, myself included to the news that Marshawn Neil,
and the twenty four year old defensive end of the
Dallas Cowboys, died on Wednesday night, and the Dallas Police
the Texas Department of Safety said he died of an
apparent self inflicted gunshot wound after crashing his vehicle. And
(15:28):
more reporting is out there. I'm reading the Athletic right
now and in their reporting from the police, this is
all directly from the police. You know, had a police
dispatch where his girlfriend called and and said that he
was having you know, suicidal thoughts and said that that
was going to happen. And there were text messages that
(15:49):
he sent. And there's nothing more you can do than
just send your heart to to everyone that that knows
Marshawn Neelan and and of course to his family into
the Dallas Cowboys and everyone struggling with mental illness out there.
The reporting also, you know, indicates it he had been
struggling with a history of mental illness, and it's just
(16:14):
it's just an insidious thing. It impacted my family, my
life quite a bit and distressed in peace marsha On Neiland,
twenty four years old. Will We'll be back on the
other side. Okay, it's power ranking time. We've done similar
(16:39):
ish conversations. Who's in the Super Bowl? Mix kind of
took stock of the league while we were in Ireland,
but here we are. One game passed the midway point shook,
and I think it's time to just kind of break
it down who we think are the best teams in
the entire NFL. You made it a list, I made
a list, and we combined them, and now we're going
(17:01):
to talk about it, and we broke it into four
different sections, and we'll start we'll go bottom up. Let's
start with a they gone section self explanatory. They gone
dead last Tennessee Titans. We both had that. By the way,
I should have showed you my list so you know
where we agreed. Where we did. The New Orleans Saints
(17:22):
second to last, thirty one, we both agreed on that
completely as well number thirty the Jets twenty nine Raiders
did not help themselves tonight. Sad to see the Washington
Commanders who shook absolutely buried down at twenty eight. We
got the Dolphins at twenty seven, Shooks Browns who had
a little more faith in than me up at twenty six,
(17:42):
and then the Giants at twenty five. And I broke
them into sections. But this naturally to me, are like
the teams that, if you see them on the schedule,
shook your counting on a w Why did you have
Washington that that low.
Speaker 3 (17:57):
Bit well, because they're just so banged up, Like I'm
not talking about them being healthy, and now the way
we looked at them going into the season, We're talking
about Jadon Daniels dealing with his third injury, and they
have so many losses on both sides of the ball.
This is where we are at Week ten, and I
don't expect the Washington Commanders to contend in most games
that are ahead of them, even if they have Jade
and Daniels available, just because that's how banged up they are.
(18:18):
They have lost so much and we saw exactly what
they are on Sunday night against the Seahawks.
Speaker 2 (18:24):
So yeah, you go, Gabriel Browns, Yes, you gotta below
this thing can't stop anyone on the ground.
Speaker 3 (18:32):
I can't believe I have to defend the Browns. This
is not me defending the Browns, but the Browns defense
will at least keep them in a game. Washington could
just get rolled by anybody because of all the losses
they have personnel wise.
Speaker 2 (18:43):
That's absolutely right. Although it's it's a big week for
not only draft positioning shook between the Jets and the
and the Browns, but for the power rankings, because if
they can't beat the Jets who are below them here,
you know, then you're in trouble. And it shows that
you're ranking.
Speaker 3 (19:00):
I like how you're revealing mine just without revealing yourself
at all.
Speaker 2 (19:03):
I'm trying to try to find mine.
Speaker 4 (19:05):
I am the scapegoat.
Speaker 2 (19:07):
You are the scapegoat. If Okay Giants, twenty five Browns,
you know, twenty six Dolphins. It's crazy to think that
the commanders are behind those teams, but you're absolutely right. Like,
who would I take on a neutral field right now?
Dolphins commanders. I probably would take the Dolphins out. Which
of these teams would you least want to play on
a Sunday?
Speaker 4 (19:26):
Oh, it's undoubtedly the New York Giants. Like it's even close.
Speaker 3 (19:31):
Because Jackson Dart brings an element of aggression to this offense.
Speaker 4 (19:36):
He is a playmaker.
Speaker 3 (19:37):
I know that they've they lost Camskataboo and they've lost
you know, Malik Neighbors, and he is an absolute warrior
for them, Like watching them is still fun because of him,
Like he is trying to carry this offense on their back.
And I think their defense has enough talent to cause
problems for a lesser team. So like, if the Browns
are playing the Giants, I'm taking the Giants because I
don't think the Browns can protect against that defense, and
I think Jackson Dart eventually will find a way to
(19:58):
score enough points to beat them.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
And Raiders fans out there, I had you thirtieth going
into this game, and just ahead of the Saints and
Titans twenty ninth. When you average me and check out,
it's you're looking at thirty two pretty soon. It's a
tough situation. All right, Let's go to the next segment.
The next group is called stuck in the middle. So
(20:21):
these teams have a chance to make the playoffs. Certainly
number twenty four the Cincinnati Bengals, they're right on the
edge of that. The Cowboys at twenty three, Falcons at
twenty two. Disappointing season, the Carolina Panthers little disrespected here
at twenty one, Texans at twenty, Cardinals at nineteen. Some
love for the Cardinals considering their record. Eighteen for the
(20:45):
Chicago Bears and seventeen of the Jacksonville Jaguars. So the
Bears are five and three. Shook explained to me kind
of your thought process of why they are here, and
we did not disagree much there. You had them nineteen,
I had him seventeen.
Speaker 4 (21:01):
Yeah, we're super close here.
Speaker 3 (21:03):
I think that the Bears could easily climb out of
this tier because I love the development of their offense
under Ben Johnson's direction, Like they are getting creative and
running all kinds of wacky stuff that you don't expect,
but they're also executing it. Now, Caleb is still a
bit unsteady. He doesn't like his highlight plays are really
fun to watch. But he's and he's getting more comfortable.
(21:24):
He's getting better, but he's still not at that point
where you're like, he's going to lead them to victory.
Now he's done a couple times in clutch spots. But
I have questions about their defense because they can't generate
a pass rush to save their lives. So that's why
they're kind of stuck in this tier. But I think
if their offense continues on the trajectory they're currently on,
they could climb out of it and get into the
bottom of the next tier.
Speaker 2 (21:44):
Yeah. I think part of their issue is just the
quality of their opponents. And you could say the same
thing about the Patriots, but the Patriots quarterback's playing better
and they're seven and two, so there is a little
bit of a difference there. I just want to see
more out of Spars team because I think the defense
is struggling. The passing game is up and down, Like
(22:05):
it looks better in the box score than the numbers,
but they are trending up. And it is crazy to think, like, man,
the league feels deep if the Jaguars are seventeen, yeah,
and the Panthers are twenty first, And I think the
Panthers are just an eye test thing ultimately, like, yeah,
it is the year of the running game and everything,
(22:27):
but if you can't consistently throw the ball and your
defense is not a difference maker, and I don't consider
the Panthers defense to be a difference maker. I think
that's where they get edged out a little bit compared
to teams like the Cardinals and the Texans, for instance,
to me, have a higher upside despite their record. Right now,
what was your thought process of kind of where they
are versus say, the Cardinals and the Texans specific.
Speaker 3 (22:49):
Yeah, maybe I'm one of the last believers in the Texans,
but their defense is very, very good, and it like,
you know, we talked about with the Browns. They're going
it's gonna keep them in most games, and if they
get protect CJ. Stroud, who got knocked out by a
cushion last week, then I think that they would be
a competitive team against most teams, which is why they're
ranked higher.
Speaker 4 (23:07):
And it's not to say that the Panthers aren't.
Speaker 3 (23:08):
They just upset the Packers, but we see the ceiling
on their offense, especially if their running games not working.
I think that the Panthers are on the right path
and a year from now they'll be in a better place.
You see, you know, signs of it on both sides
of the ball. It's just that, like this is the
build up to that. So that's kind of why they
are where they are. But I also when we talk
about the Jags being in this group at the top
of this group mm hm, bitter recency not biased, but
(23:31):
but recency influence with us because I could very easily
see us putting the Vikings in that spot instead of
the Jaguars, had the Vikings not just gone into Yea
beating the line they just.
Speaker 2 (23:41):
Beat the Lions. You gotta add adapt to new information, right,
and I think roster wise, they're better, right, and maybe
it is confirming my priors. I thought they would get
over eight and a half wins this year and they
still have a chance to do so. There is a
lot of talent the coaches. But yeah, you're you're hinting
at who up next, so let's just do it. The
next tier is frisky, and the Vikings are at the
(24:03):
bottom of that tier. But these are the teams that
you don't want to play them. I think it'd be
a disappointment if they don't make the playoffs. But we're
also just valuing where they are right now. Number sixteen,
the Vikings, big jump, I think from where they would
have been, Like you said, Shook last week at this time,
the Chargers are at fifteen, a little lower than I
expected they'd be in this exercise. The forty nine Ers fourteen,
(24:25):
Ravens all the way up to thirteen despite the three
and five record, but they are the Ravens. The Steelers
at twelve, Broncos at eleven, and Patriots at ten. Now
I got to say we did this assuming the Broncos
are going to win this game, like roughly where they
would be. I mean, I think just for making us
go through this should maybe we should knock them down
(24:47):
a couple of spots.
Speaker 4 (24:48):
Yes, yes, we assume they were going to win.
Speaker 3 (24:51):
We didn't assume they're gonna win in the ugliest fashion possible. Yeah,
and this is a fun kind of examination of where
we differ too, because I had the Ravens all the
way up at eleven because I just believe that if
Lamar can be Lamar, that they're going to be right
on the edge of that top ten. But yeah, the
Broncos deserves let's drop them a couple spots and.
Speaker 4 (25:08):
I'm going to bought the Ravens up. Okay, I we
should also defend this.
Speaker 2 (25:11):
So you already had them ahead of them. You had
the Ravens at eleven. I had him at fifteen. And
I guess what I would say to that, I did
have them behind the forty nine Ers and the Chargers,
and maybe I shouldn't. I'm talking about opponent I'm talking
about like consistency. Okay, the Ravens didn't look amazing beating
the Dolphins to me. I know it ended up being easy,
(25:32):
but it wasn't like a game where you look at
the numbers and everything that they were particularly dominant and
you know they beat the Bears. That was a good
effort with Tyler Huntley. I guess I just want to
see them in a game like they are this week
against a better opponent before I'm feeling like they're back back.
So I punished them a little bit for that.
Speaker 4 (25:52):
That's fair.
Speaker 3 (25:52):
We should defend where we are putting the Chargers though,
because I think this is accurate. And the reason is
is the losses in the offensive line. We know we
are bracing for offense being a challenge for them from
here on out after losing Joe Alt for the rest
of the season.
Speaker 2 (26:05):
So that and the defense hasn't been that good, right,
Like I thought the defense would be better and it's
been up and down.
Speaker 4 (26:11):
Yeah, I would agree. I would agree with that.
Speaker 2 (26:13):
Forty nine Ers though, ahead of the now that I'm
looking at it, like in my heart, forty nine ers
considering their injuries. Actually I did have them below the Chargers,
and I think you should have too, but you didn't.
You know nothing.
Speaker 3 (26:27):
And I had the forty nine Ers ahead of the
Chargers because I admire their scrappiness and their ability to
extract wins out of thin air despite all the losses
that they've had in personnel like that. I am still
mystified by how they are still competitive every week given
all the guys they don't have.
Speaker 2 (26:42):
I had the Patriots at eleven, you had them at ten.
Do you think it's fair that they are not in
our highest tier? Essentially that we're we're kind of saying
with this tier to me, you know, you're not one
of the real deal ones yet, and it's crazy to
think that about the I guess he just want I
want just a little more proof. But what do you
(27:05):
think about not putting the Patriots or the Broncos or
even the Steelers in like real deal Super Bowl contender status.
Speaker 3 (27:14):
I think that the Patriots are going to remind me
of teams that played soft schedules and got you know,
to the playoffs on the back of the soft schedule.
Not to take away anything that they've done, because Drake
may is the engine that drives that team forward and
he's playing fantastic football, but I do think that if
they end up facing higher level competition, they could get exposed,
you know, on a given Sunday or whatever. So that's
why they sit at ten. For me, the Steelers, I
(27:36):
sound like a hater. They're just very up and down.
Like the way that they dominated the Colts statistically with
turnovers and everything else was shocking. But yet they only
won that game by a touchdown, and so that kind
of points to sign to me that, like, I think
Aaron Rodgers is playing very good football for them right now.
He's got complete command of that offense when he's given
when he's empowered to run that offense. But I think
(27:57):
that there is not fraudulent in them, but just a
visible ceiling with them, which is why I have them
where they are.
Speaker 2 (28:02):
And it's funny. If we had done this segment before
Thursday Night Football, Broncos fans would have been annoyed, I
think at how low they are. And now after Thursday
Night Football, even though they got to win, I feel
like the bow Knicks nation, the bow leievers, will just
like be a little quieter.
Speaker 3 (28:20):
I got to give them a lot of credit. A
big shout out for me because I get a lot
of hate for the QB Index every week. It's part
of you know, it comes with the game. Bo Knicks
fans have not gotten in my DMS or my mentions
once and in fact, I've had a little bit of
back and forth with Broncos fans, like when I'm streaming
on Twitch or whatever, They're in agreement, like they underst
they're realists with him and they understand where he is
(28:41):
right now. So shout out to you guys for not
letting your emotions cloud your judgment.
Speaker 2 (28:46):
Shout out to the Broncos fans for the most incredible
Bronx cheer on Thursday night when their punter finally had
a good punt because he kept punting it off the
side of his foot, they were booing the hell out
of bow Nicks and the Broncos offense. They did it
going into halftime, they did it coming out of halftime
(29:08):
when they went three and out out of halftime, and
then he hit this punt which was his first decent
punt of the night, and they gave him a loud
ass Bronx cheer for a punt that was amazing.
Speaker 3 (29:18):
Just that this is coming off of the back of
him launching absolute rockets a week earlier, like to the
point where I tweeted, I was like, he has a
mortar cannon, like a mortar launcher on his leg, like that's.
Speaker 4 (29:30):
What his leg is.
Speaker 3 (29:31):
And then he goes out there to night and just
sends like ground balls out there.
Speaker 4 (29:34):
You know that punting's hard. Man football was hard.
Speaker 2 (29:36):
It is crazy that punting was like the most entertaining
thing in the game. Aj Cole the Raiders had two
punts go inside the two yard line. That's the first
time that's happened in the same game in like five years.
Not surprising there. And then he also had a block
punt that basically won the Broncos. The game set them
up on a short field goal, and that's how they
got their short field and that's how they got their
you know, winning field goal. Let's do the title contender.
(29:58):
I'm calling this the real Ones. It really shows what
a crazy year this is, because I think you could
shake up these nine teams in any direction, and I'm
not going to argue too much with it. Number nine
the Tampa Bay Buccaneers. Number eight is Green Bay lower
than I expected, And it is interesting when you force
yourself to do this exercise and you realize, like, wow,
(30:20):
the Packers down there, although I had them highering you.
Number seven, the Detroit Lions, number six, We have the
Colts five, the Buffalo Bills. The Chiefs, despite losing last week,
is actually ahead of the Bills. And that's why I
like power rankings. They shouldn't just be you know, your record,
number three, the LA Rams, number two Philadelphia Eagles, and
(30:41):
number one the Seattle Seahawks up at number one. I
was surprised, shook, we were on the same page with
the Seahawks. You had them very high. Was it number one?
I believe it was number two for you, but it
averaged out to being number one. You had the Chiefs won,
and that was the rising the Seahawks, two, Eagle three.
(31:02):
So what strikes you the most just looking at this
list of the best nine teams, and then I'll tell
you what stands out to me.
Speaker 3 (31:11):
So this season feels like we've gotten more parody in
the league than we've gotten in probably the last five
or seven years. And I think that this group really
illustrates that. Because this was the most difficult part of
this exercise for me.
Speaker 4 (31:22):
Because I'm getting at one Chiefs. Yeah, they lost the Bills.
They had a terrible game.
Speaker 3 (31:27):
That was the bills best showing in years defensively at least.
And I think that if you play that game ten times,
it might turn out differently, you know, a few different times.
Speaker 4 (31:34):
So I'm not going to put too much stock into
a regular season win over the Chiefs, I felt.
Speaker 3 (31:39):
I still feel confident as though if I had to
take any team in a neutral site or in a
playoff game Homer away, I would still say.
Speaker 4 (31:46):
Patrick Mahomes, Andy Reid the Kansas City Chiefs.
Speaker 3 (31:49):
But once we got past the Chiefs and the Seahawks,
I'm like, oh my god, Like, what do I think
about the rest of these guys? Because the Eagles have,
you know, the personnel to get it done. They had
the drama, but they're also you know, they're coming off
of two quality wins. The Rams are like lurking as
this team that people aren't paying attention to, but they're
playing phenomenal football, especially offensively. Lion's coming off of a
loss of the Vikings, but there's still the Lions. We
(32:09):
still respect them. Bills are lower for me than five.
Actually had them at six just because I still need
it proven to me, like you need the Ravens to.
Speaker 4 (32:16):
Prove it to you.
Speaker 3 (32:17):
Like I get down to like six, seven, eight nine,
and I'm like, oh God, I forgot about the Buccaneers.
Wait right, we have all these injuries on offense. Can
they still do it? The Packers. I don't believe in
them fully right now because of some of the performances
they've produced recently. And the Colts Daniel Jones scared me
back into being hesitant about them with accounting for five
of their six turnovers.
Speaker 4 (32:35):
So it's really hard to sort.
Speaker 3 (32:36):
These guys out right now, which is why the NFL
is incredibly fun to watch.
Speaker 2 (32:40):
Yeah, so, first of all, it's six NFC teams, three AFC,
So I think I shocked. Yeah, it just I think
there's more really good teams this year than most years.
I actually it is parody, but I don't think it's
mediocrity because we looked at that group from ten to
(33:01):
sixteen and those are good teams too. So the bad
teams are really bad this year for sure, but I
think there's a lot of good teams at the top.
Like all these teams, for almost all of them have
had multi year kind of build ups to this moment,
you know, like Mike McDonald, it's only a second year,
(33:22):
but man, they're so different than they were, you know,
Sean McVay, and they've been in this rebuild ish phase
for the last couple of years. They called it a
sprint rebuild that's peaking right now. The Eagles are in
the middle of their primes, the Chiefs are that are
the Chiefs obviously, and like even the Bucks, like they've
been building to this moment. So it's not like other
than the Colts, there's not like a big surprise team,
(33:44):
and there's not a team that like feels like it
came out of nowhere. And yet the Colts when and
I've talked about this this week, when you look at it,
like that team has about as much continuity and veterans
and guys who have been on that roster for four
or five years than anyone. So I just like that
we're like really familiar, you're with all these teams, and
I think they all have a shot to win the
Super Bowl. And the biggest disagreement we had here, well
(34:07):
there were a couple, but we were only three spots
apart on any team, But I had the Colts still
at four. Maybe that's too high, but I believe in
transcendent offenses, and I just think they have a chance
to be a transcendent offense. Is their offense, like the
(34:28):
does it have a chance to be the best thing
in the NFL? I think it has a chance, so
maybe I'm wrong.
Speaker 3 (34:36):
I mean, because of the continuity, that's probably the strongest
argument for them that they could have the best offense
the NFL. I mean, they've certainly put up a lot
of points, but you also have to consider opponent when
you examine some of their victories. I actually want to
step into our therapist's office real quick. I'm the therapist and
I'm also the patient here because this is a great
demonstration of the difference between you and me and my
abandonment issues. The Colts burned me once, and I'm like, nope,
(34:58):
I'm off the ship. I'm not, but you can't hurt
me twice. Colts, I'm not gonna let you hurt me again.
I'm running away from you. Whereas you are more of
an open hearted believer, like they said on the Monday
Night recap, Greg has kind eyes.
Speaker 4 (35:09):
You have a kind heart too. You're willing to let
the Colts have a bad Sunday.
Speaker 2 (35:12):
Maybe, or maybe I just stick with my priors and
I just spent the week, you know, gassing them up
before they stunk up the joint. And like a team
like the Bills are, I think they have fundamental things
that I worry about and yet man, they are a
good problem solving team like the Chiefs. So if I
had to do it again, maybe I would have flipped
it and the Bills would have been a little bit higher,
(35:33):
because like the Chiefs, they deserve the benefit of doubt
if they're going to like create solutions to the problems
that the season gives them. And you can kind of
see it the last couple of weeks. Do we know
that the Colts are going to do that? We don't
know because we haven't seen it, and we are putting
a lot of faith there in the Seahawks. I hadem one,
(35:53):
you had them two. But man, it's a beautiful thing.
And you know what, we got a game this weekend
with two of these top teams playing. That's all I
want out of each week, at least one or two
games where you know, two of these nine teams are
playing each other. And yeah, we got a nice Packers
(36:15):
Eagles game and the Patriots not too far out of
this tier. Play in the Bucks is a really good
one nine versus ten if you look at the windows,
I know we had a bad primetime game shook, but
this is sneakily one of the best weeks of the
year because we have Pats Bucks in that early window
along with Ravens Vikings, which I think is really fun.
(36:37):
That's a great game, and the primetime windows are absolutely great.
In the four to twenty five window, we have Rams
forty nine ers, which I think is good enough to
hold that window. It's like every window has has a nice,
delicious game.
Speaker 4 (36:51):
You know.
Speaker 3 (36:51):
It's like a relief, and it's also excites me when
I see a good Monday nighter, and Eagles Packers is
going to be a good Monday nighter.
Speaker 2 (36:59):
We need it. We'll be live and we appreciate everyone
who's been listening to all our recaps this season. And
that's it for this one. We will be next in
the feed. Cynthia Friedland and I we push back the
pick show a little bit this week because everything's been
a little up in the air. So we have our
picks against the spread that'll be on Friday afternoon. We
(37:21):
will see them and we can only hope to do
better at our jobs than the Raiders and the Broncos
offenses did not see it.
Speaker 3 (37:30):
Frighten
Ready fifty sent freedom right to the left, Knicks drops back,
throws a ball to the end zone. The pass is
taught and that is a Denver touchdown. Troy Franklin with
the catch at the gold line and he had Eric
Stokes on his back. Stokes made the tackle, but Franklin
(00:21):
had the ball and a touchdown.
Speaker 2 (00:25):
That was Dave Logan on koa. That was the only
Denver Broncos touchdown of the night. That was the last
time we saw anyone in the end zone in this game.
A ten to seven victory by the Denver Broncos over
the Las Vegas Raiders. Nick, when I asked you before
the season to do every Monday night game recap with me,
(00:47):
every Thursday night game recap with me, I never promised
that they would all be beautiful, and I submit there
will not be an uglier primetime game than this all season.
For many seasons, there there are some games that are
ugly and fun, and this one, by the end was
just ugly.
Speaker 3 (01:07):
It makes me think about that Colt's Broncos game that
was a Thursday Night or a few years.
Speaker 4 (01:10):
Ago that was also just about as ugly as this one.
Speaker 2 (01:12):
But that one had like a sense of like this is.
We're all having a good time by the end because.
Speaker 4 (01:17):
It's so bad.
Speaker 3 (01:18):
Fact that it was that bad, yeah, and this one
so much just like I know it to that point.
So my youngest sister lives with me, and she made
some incredible banana bread today, and to feel something again
before getting on the show, I just took a big
chunk of banana bread and housed it before I came
in here to do the show.
Speaker 2 (01:34):
I appreciate that. I appreciate your sister. I want some
of that banana bread. And we're still gonna break this down,
but we're also going to break down the entire league.
Where we made our first power rankings of the year,
me and you a little bit of a power poll
where we averaged our rankings together, and uh yeah, the Broncos,
(01:56):
you know, might have to move down a couple spots
despite winning tonight's game. So you know, we'll give this
game all the time it deserves, maybe a little less
than most Thursday nights, and then we'll do some of
the power rankings.
Speaker 3 (02:06):
You know.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
My takeaway here in a game that had twenty two
penalties split evenly, eleven each, fifteen punts and just incredibly
long stretches of offensive incompetency, especially you know in the
second half of this game, was that this Bronco's offense, Like,
(02:28):
I know, they won the game. When usually talked positive
about you know, we'll talk about the defense and how
good they look, that we know they're great, like their
troubles are not going away Bo Nicks through an unforgivable
interception late in this game. They never got it even
going in the fourth quarter. The reason they won is
because their defense kept setting them up with short fields.
They eventually got a little bit of a running game going,
but my god, they're passing game against the defense that
(02:51):
has struggled all season. Was kind of my biggest takeaway
because this isn't eight and two team leading the AFC
West with a chance to get the number one seed.
Speaker 3 (03:00):
Yeah, and it's another example of what this team has
been for I mean months, not month, but months at
this point. I mean, they are a team that looks
as if they are sleepwalking offensively almost every week. And
their story has been they turned on the fourth quarter
and come back and win games. And frankly, tonight was
setting up to be that. If Daniel Carlson makes the
game tying field goal, which he missed. We were going
(03:22):
to have to see them put the foot down on
the pedal again and see if they could pull another
one out of thin air instead. Luckily, because the Raiders
missed their field goal, Lebroncos simply had to salt it away.
I will give them a little bit of credit. Before
that touchdown pass that we heard to start the show, Yo,
Knicks did have a handful of really good throws where
he stepped up in the pocket, he extended to play
and you know, he's got guys ten to fifteen yards
(03:43):
downfield that he's hitting accurately. Other than that nightmare, they
didn't run the ball effectively in the first half. They
decided to commit to it in the second half and
it helped a little bit and helped them put the
game away as well.
Speaker 4 (03:53):
But it is a team that lacks and identity.
Speaker 3 (03:56):
Has talent, has an ability to move the football at times,
but lacks identities, so it takes them forever to get going,
and we were left with this same thing. You know,
I described Bonnicks recently as a firecracker quarterback because he's silent,
and it's just like lighting a pack of firecrackers. Everything's quiet,
the fuse is lit. Might hear the fuse and then
pop up up, pop up, pap pap up. That's how
he's been in almost every game tonight. He wasn't even
(04:18):
really that exceptly when they scored that touchdown.
Speaker 2 (04:20):
Yeah, that was one drive. It was late in the
second quarter. It was the best field position that they
had until the second half where they blew a couple
really short fields. But they started at their own forty
seven and they drove down and you're right, he's made
a few plays where he steps up in the pocket
and you know, sees open lanes and hits a pass,
(04:41):
but he missed so many of those tonight. And they
had a crazy amount of drives in this game, thirteen drives,
so like that game should have ended at you usually
you get about ten drives in a game, and they
had seven points at one point, and there was a
stretch where through eleven drives, which is more than a game,
you know, a normal game, where they had eight three
(05:02):
and outs out of those seven drives, and an interception
in those eight drives, another very short drive, and then
the touchdown drive that we just talked about, and then
on top of it, like if you want to extend
it out to twelve drives. It was that groaner of
an interception in the fourth quarter, so that that's a
twelve drive sequence with just total struggle fest And there
(05:26):
wasn't a lot of pressure on him. I mean there
was at times, but I looked and there wasn't much
quick pressure. Max Crosby was generally taken care of tonight
by their pass rush. So one play really stands out
to me where Kirk Kurbstreet on the broadcast is like,
you know, bo Nick's not feeling very settled in the pocket,
and I'm like, yeah, that's true. But it was a
(05:49):
three man rush against a five man protection with absolutely
no one there, and then he just like throws it
away on a third third down. That was at the
beginning of the fourth quarter. And yet I appreciated them,
if nothing else, running the clock out at the end
of the game with some good JK. Dobbins runs and
if nothing else, that got us to the end of
the game quicker.
Speaker 3 (06:09):
Yeah, there was one inexplicable miss of a running lane
by JK. Dobbins in that sequence. For you see it
on Prime vision from over the top, You're like, the
lane is there, and he just tries to swerve right
around it. Otherwise they put the gameway. But you're absolutely right.
I mean this offense had no rhythm the entire night.
This game was really won by their defense and their
defense's ability to completely eliminate brock Bowers from the equation
for the Raiders. They dedicated defensive backs to them all game.
(06:31):
There were multiple instances in which the Raiders are running
play action trying to slip Boers out into the flat.
There's two dbs right there covering him.
Speaker 4 (06:38):
Gino looks to him first, has to go somewhere else.
Speaker 3 (06:40):
So, I mean, this defense won this game they wanted
by not really blitzing that much but getting semi consistent
pressure doesn't really show up in the numbers, but shows
up visually. And it's not really like their hallmark that
they have a good defense. We know that, but when
you think about the Broncos, you don't think like great
defensive team they win with defense. You think of them
as a team that has a good defense and then
just happens to find enough success offensively. And it felt
(07:03):
like a diet version of that tonight.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
An extreme version. I would say, yeah, I'm I'm glad
you brought up something positive here. So yeah, let's give
Nick Benito his flowers, eight or nine QB pressures, six
quick pressures, two sacks. I think they'll count it officially
as one and a half. I don't believe in half sacks.
Another couple quarterback hits on the day, Zach Allen with
three quarterback hits and a sack. And the Raiders start
(07:28):
out this game with a really good touchdown drive. And
the image I remember it best is on the score
Jackson Powers Johnson, their guard, you know, blocking Nick Benito
out of the play in Ashton Genty running through a
tackle by Ufunga, and I'm thinking, okay, we're live. This
is gonna be an interesting game. And that was like
(07:49):
the last we saw anything of that, And partly because
Jackson Powers Johnson left this game, and that left their
left side which has been missing Colton Miller thin all night.
What the hell, let's listen to the one Raider touchdown
because we really aren't going to have any other highlights.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
Time out. Gino's clapping his hands on third and short
inside handoff Genty inside the five first down is go
one touchdown Raiders Genty on the inside handle a six
yard run.
Speaker 4 (08:16):
Josh's in the insode.
Speaker 2 (08:19):
Oh, Ashley Gensy started this game great and then he
ended the game with three point two yards per carry.
I was watching part of the game with more East
Jones Drew. He thinks genty misses some holes. You were
talking about not having like the greatest vision. He thinks
he missed them tonight. But after really that first drive
or two, the Broncos dominated in a way that you
just rarely see. There was a sequence, and I keep going.
(08:42):
While the Broncos were doing all those three and outs
that I just mentioned, there was an eight drive sequence
by the Raiders where they had a total of ten yards.
I mean, that's crazy. A total of ten yards, a
four play turnover on downs three and out, three and
out three end of half, three and out, one play
interception three and a block punt and then on a
(09:04):
three and out. That's that's wild. In an NFL game
that we all watched and we were paid for.
Speaker 4 (09:10):
Yeah, we were, thank you. I will say that Jackson
powers johnts like Jackson Powers.
Speaker 3 (09:15):
Johnson supposedly going to be coming in to be the center,
he loses the center job.
Speaker 4 (09:19):
He ends up being a guard.
Speaker 3 (09:20):
He is kind of in the mold of Richie and
cognitothough he's taller, but he looks like him physically, and
the way that he moves and blocks is kind of similar,
which is funny because in Cognito, you know, end of
his career, he was a Raider as well, but once
they lost him, the right side of their offensive line
was just consistently bad. You see him pulling from right
to left there on that touchdown run. After that, DJ
Glaze is getting beaten consistently in one on ones by
(09:43):
Nick Benito, the right guard that replaces Jackson powers Johnson
getting beaten consistently in one on ones to where Gino
never has any time to survey the field, and that's
before he gets banged up. This offense had no life.
We've talked all year about how Genti is consistently getting
hit behind the line of scrimmage. Watch it on Prime
Vision tonight from above, it's the same thing. He's getting
(10:03):
hit a yard half, a yard yard and a half
behind the line of scrimmage. He's got nowhere to run
This Raiders offense. If it's not dead, it's on. It's
basically on life support right now. Like they just can't
do anything.
Speaker 2 (10:14):
They're leading receiver tonight was Tyler Lockett by far five
for forty four. You know, Bowers has one good catch
where he singled up on Jaday Baron in the first half,
and in that drive I believe ended either in the
turnover on downs or one of the three punts that
the Raiders had in Broncos territory. I don't know how
(10:35):
they pulled that off. They also had the missed field
goal that you mentioned when Gino did get some passes
going in the second half their only sign of life,
and then they settle for the field goal attempt and
he missed it. And Gino is struggling in general. He
definitely missed a few throws tonight. He held onto the
ball a little bit, but he had basically no chance.
(10:55):
And the offensive line you're talking about is Dylan Forsyth
or Stone Forsythe at left tackle, is it? Dylan Putnam
at left guard, Jordan Meredith, Alex Kappa in Glaze, dj
Glaze on the right side. So that's three replacements and
then one of the starters, Glaze, just getting killed. It's
HiT's rough going for my guy. I don't think you
(11:17):
had much of a chance. But there's just there's not
much more you can say. I think about this Raiders offense,
maybe not of this game unless you have anything more
you really want to get to here.
Speaker 3 (11:29):
Typically Captain Geno for trying to cut out the injury
that he was dealing with, it was pretty clear he
was limited by it. He gets hit after scrambling. He
basically gets tripped up by Nick Benito you're gonna see
if you're watching on YouTube, and then Malcolm Roach falls
on him, and I believe that's where it happened, because
he starts grabbing his left leg and he continues to
grab his left leg. Kaylee Hartsung later reported it was
a left quad injury. So if you see the replay
(11:51):
again if you're watching on YouTube, Gino stumbles to the
ground and then Roach falls in and the replay view
from behind, which I'm not sure we're.
Speaker 4 (11:58):
Gonna get here, we don't get there.
Speaker 3 (11:59):
You can see the impact on his leg. His knee
kind of goes inward. At first I thought it might
be a knee issue, ends up being a quad. Either way,
it was a significant hurdle for him physically, and ultimately
I think it limited him in key spots, but you
got to give him credit for trying to gut it out.
Speaker 2 (12:14):
Yeah, he had a dime to Dante Thornton in the
first half which could have been caught and just completely dropped.
Probably his best throw of the night by far. He
had a touchdown taken off the board by a jack
or No, that was a Dante Thornton penalty, rather on
an offensive pass interference where I think the play call
(12:36):
would have worked it Obviously.
Speaker 3 (12:37):
I don't think that defender is going to actually come
that the ground, even if he doesn't hit him, I
don't think he gets there.
Speaker 2 (12:42):
It was absolutely the right call, don't get me wrong,
because he went out of his way to hit the guy.
Was just too easy and that took seven points off
the board too. And then he had a sequence wherever
he Moster had a blown assignment trying to protect him
against the blitz and he just starts yelling at at Moster.
There there weren't see. There was a moment where I
(13:04):
thought it was going to get to like fun ugly,
and that was the sequence where the Broncos, who are
running it down the Raiders' throats, get to third and
one and then John Payton calls a trick play. Oh
my god, and they go backward five yards.
Speaker 4 (13:18):
It was so bad.
Speaker 2 (13:20):
And then and then they come up short on the
field goal attempt after that, losing five yards on the
third to one. And then the ensuing play is you know,
Smith hitting Ash and Genty in the chest and the
ball pops up for an interception. Like it just was like, okay,
now we're having some fun. Then there's a block punt.
But it didn't even continue to be fun. It just
(13:43):
it just was ugly.
Speaker 3 (13:46):
You know that That miskick, by the way, is my
favorite example of an of a. It's the latest example
of what my favorite new trend in football is, which
is announcers being infatuated by the whole k ball juice
caball revolution and kickers can kick balls a mile now
and Will LUTs lines up for a fifty nine yarder,
no small feat and al Michaels is like he hit
these with these and warm ups.
Speaker 4 (14:07):
And LUTs comes up like eight yards short.
Speaker 3 (14:09):
I'm just like, yeah, maybe we don't think everybody can
hit sixty yarders routinely, Like let's be reminded that these
are humans.
Speaker 2 (14:16):
And it was a windy night we should point out
with some of the offensive struggles, although like inaccurate passes,
weirdly of everything didn't seem like it was the biggest
issue in general on the night. Yeah, not everyone's going
to be able to hit. Although he did bounce it
in which if you tried to do that a hundred times,
I don't know if you could, like the ball bounced
(14:38):
and went over to the crossbar.
Speaker 3 (14:39):
Maybe they should make it a Doug Flutie dropkick, remember
that back in the day.
Speaker 2 (14:42):
That that counts. Well, that's a little different. That's a
little about to bounce there. Start at the beginning. They
started this game. And it's been a really dark day
in the NFL. And like I said, we're going to
do the power rankings right after this break. But there's
no other great place to address this. But everyone listening
probably knows right now what a what a difficult day
(15:03):
this has been in the NFL. A lot of people
woke up, myself included to the news that Marshawn Neil,
and the twenty four year old defensive end of the
Dallas Cowboys, died on Wednesday night, and the Dallas Police
the Texas Department of Safety said he died of an
apparent self inflicted gunshot wound after crashing his vehicle. And
(15:28):
more reporting is out there. I'm reading the Athletic right
now and in their reporting from the police, this is
all directly from the police. You know, had a police
dispatch where his girlfriend called and and said that he
was having you know, suicidal thoughts and said that that
was going to happen. And there were text messages that
(15:49):
he sent. And there's nothing more you can do than
just send your heart to to everyone that that knows
Marshawn Neelan and and of course to his family into
the Dallas Cowboys and everyone struggling with mental illness out there.
The reporting also, you know, indicates it he had been
struggling with a history of mental illness, and it's just
(16:14):
it's just an insidious thing. It impacted my family, my
life quite a bit and distressed in peace marsha On Neiland,
twenty four years old. Will We'll be back on the
other side. Okay, it's power ranking time. We've done similar
(16:39):
ish conversations. Who's in the Super Bowl? Mix kind of
took stock of the league while we were in Ireland,
but here we are. One game passed the midway point shook,
and I think it's time to just kind of break
it down who we think are the best teams in
the entire NFL. You made it a list, I made
a list, and we combined them, and now we're going
(17:01):
to talk about it, and we broke it into four
different sections, and we'll start we'll go bottom up. Let's
start with a they gone section self explanatory. They gone
dead last Tennessee Titans. We both had that. By the way,
I should have showed you my list so you know
where we agreed. Where we did. The New Orleans Saints
(17:22):
second to last, thirty one, we both agreed on that
completely as well number thirty the Jets twenty nine Raiders
did not help themselves tonight. Sad to see the Washington
Commanders who shook absolutely buried down at twenty eight. We
got the Dolphins at twenty seven, Shooks Browns who had
a little more faith in than me up at twenty six,
(17:42):
and then the Giants at twenty five. And I broke
them into sections. But this naturally to me, are like
the teams that, if you see them on the schedule,
shook your counting on a w Why did you have
Washington that that low.
Speaker 3 (17:57):
Bit well, because they're just so banged up, Like I'm
not talking about them being healthy, and now the way
we looked at them going into the season, We're talking
about Jadon Daniels dealing with his third injury, and they
have so many losses on both sides of the ball.
This is where we are at Week ten, and I
don't expect the Washington Commanders to contend in most games
that are ahead of them, even if they have Jade
and Daniels available, just because that's how banged up they are.
(18:18):
They have lost so much and we saw exactly what
they are on Sunday night against the Seahawks.
Speaker 2 (18:24):
So yeah, you go, Gabriel Browns, Yes, you gotta below
this thing can't stop anyone on the ground.
Speaker 3 (18:32):
I can't believe I have to defend the Browns. This
is not me defending the Browns, but the Browns defense
will at least keep them in a game. Washington could
just get rolled by anybody because of all the losses
they have personnel wise.
Speaker 2 (18:43):
That's absolutely right. Although it's it's a big week for
not only draft positioning shook between the Jets and the
and the Browns, but for the power rankings, because if
they can't beat the Jets who are below them here,
you know, then you're in trouble. And it shows that
you're ranking.
Speaker 3 (19:00):
I like how you're revealing mine just without revealing yourself
at all.
Speaker 2 (19:03):
I'm trying to try to find mine.
Speaker 4 (19:05):
I am the scapegoat.
Speaker 2 (19:07):
You are the scapegoat. If Okay Giants, twenty five Browns,
you know, twenty six Dolphins. It's crazy to think that
the commanders are behind those teams, but you're absolutely right. Like,
who would I take on a neutral field right now?
Dolphins commanders. I probably would take the Dolphins out. Which
of these teams would you least want to play on
a Sunday?
Speaker 4 (19:26):
Oh, it's undoubtedly the New York Giants. Like it's even close.
Speaker 3 (19:31):
Because Jackson Dart brings an element of aggression to this offense.
Speaker 4 (19:36):
He is a playmaker.
Speaker 3 (19:37):
I know that they've they lost Camskataboo and they've lost
you know, Malik Neighbors, and he is an absolute warrior
for them, Like watching them is still fun because of him,
Like he is trying to carry this offense on their back.
And I think their defense has enough talent to cause
problems for a lesser team. So like, if the Browns
are playing the Giants, I'm taking the Giants because I
don't think the Browns can protect against that defense, and
I think Jackson Dart eventually will find a way to
(19:58):
score enough points to beat them.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
And Raiders fans out there, I had you thirtieth going
into this game, and just ahead of the Saints and
Titans twenty ninth. When you average me and check out,
it's you're looking at thirty two pretty soon. It's a
tough situation. All right, Let's go to the next segment.
The next group is called stuck in the middle. So
(20:21):
these teams have a chance to make the playoffs. Certainly
number twenty four the Cincinnati Bengals, they're right on the
edge of that. The Cowboys at twenty three, Falcons at
twenty two. Disappointing season, the Carolina Panthers little disrespected here
at twenty one, Texans at twenty, Cardinals at nineteen. Some
love for the Cardinals considering their record. Eighteen for the
(20:45):
Chicago Bears and seventeen of the Jacksonville Jaguars. So the
Bears are five and three. Shook explained to me kind
of your thought process of why they are here, and
we did not disagree much there. You had them nineteen,
I had him seventeen.
Speaker 4 (21:01):
Yeah, we're super close here.
Speaker 3 (21:03):
I think that the Bears could easily climb out of
this tier because I love the development of their offense
under Ben Johnson's direction, Like they are getting creative and
running all kinds of wacky stuff that you don't expect,
but they're also executing it. Now, Caleb is still a
bit unsteady. He doesn't like his highlight plays are really
fun to watch. But he's and he's getting more comfortable.
(21:24):
He's getting better, but he's still not at that point
where you're like, he's going to lead them to victory.
Now he's done a couple times in clutch spots. But
I have questions about their defense because they can't generate
a pass rush to save their lives. So that's why
they're kind of stuck in this tier. But I think
if their offense continues on the trajectory they're currently on,
they could climb out of it and get into the
bottom of the next tier.
Speaker 2 (21:44):
Yeah. I think part of their issue is just the
quality of their opponents. And you could say the same
thing about the Patriots, but the Patriots quarterback's playing better
and they're seven and two, so there is a little
bit of a difference there. I just want to see
more out of Spars team because I think the defense
is struggling. The passing game is up and down, Like
(22:05):
it looks better in the box score than the numbers,
but they are trending up. And it is crazy to think, like, man,
the league feels deep if the Jaguars are seventeen, yeah,
and the Panthers are twenty first, And I think the
Panthers are just an eye test thing ultimately, like, yeah,
it is the year of the running game and everything,
(22:27):
but if you can't consistently throw the ball and your
defense is not a difference maker, and I don't consider
the Panthers defense to be a difference maker. I think
that's where they get edged out a little bit compared
to teams like the Cardinals and the Texans, for instance,
to me, have a higher upside despite their record. Right now,
what was your thought process of kind of where they
are versus say, the Cardinals and the Texans specific.
Speaker 3 (22:49):
Yeah, maybe I'm one of the last believers in the Texans,
but their defense is very, very good, and it like,
you know, we talked about with the Browns. They're going
it's gonna keep them in most games, and if they
get protect CJ. Stroud, who got knocked out by a
cushion last week, then I think that they would be
a competitive team against most teams, which is why they're
ranked higher.
Speaker 4 (23:07):
And it's not to say that the Panthers aren't.
Speaker 3 (23:08):
They just upset the Packers, but we see the ceiling
on their offense, especially if their running games not working.
I think that the Panthers are on the right path
and a year from now they'll be in a better place.
You see, you know, signs of it on both sides
of the ball. It's just that, like this is the
build up to that. So that's kind of why they
are where they are. But I also when we talk
about the Jags being in this group at the top
of this group mm hm, bitter recency not biased, but
(23:31):
but recency influence with us because I could very easily
see us putting the Vikings in that spot instead of
the Jaguars, had the Vikings not just gone into Yea
beating the line they just.
Speaker 2 (23:41):
Beat the Lions. You gotta add adapt to new information, right,
and I think roster wise, they're better, right, and maybe
it is confirming my priors. I thought they would get
over eight and a half wins this year and they
still have a chance to do so. There is a
lot of talent the coaches. But yeah, you're you're hinting
at who up next, so let's just do it. The
next tier is frisky, and the Vikings are at the
(24:03):
bottom of that tier. But these are the teams that
you don't want to play them. I think it'd be
a disappointment if they don't make the playoffs. But we're
also just valuing where they are right now. Number sixteen,
the Vikings, big jump, I think from where they would
have been, Like you said, Shook last week at this time,
the Chargers are at fifteen, a little lower than I
expected they'd be in this exercise. The forty nine Ers fourteen,
(24:25):
Ravens all the way up to thirteen despite the three
and five record, but they are the Ravens. The Steelers
at twelve, Broncos at eleven, and Patriots at ten. Now
I got to say we did this assuming the Broncos
are going to win this game, like roughly where they
would be. I mean, I think just for making us
go through this should maybe we should knock them down
(24:47):
a couple of spots.
Speaker 4 (24:48):
Yes, yes, we assume they were going to win.
Speaker 3 (24:51):
We didn't assume they're gonna win in the ugliest fashion possible. Yeah,
and this is a fun kind of examination of where
we differ too, because I had the Ravens all the
way up at eleven because I just believe that if
Lamar can be Lamar, that they're going to be right
on the edge of that top ten. But yeah, the
Broncos deserves let's drop them a couple spots and.
Speaker 4 (25:08):
I'm going to bought the Ravens up. Okay, I we
should also defend this.
Speaker 2 (25:11):
So you already had them ahead of them. You had
the Ravens at eleven. I had him at fifteen. And
I guess what I would say to that, I did
have them behind the forty nine Ers and the Chargers,
and maybe I shouldn't. I'm talking about opponent I'm talking
about like consistency. Okay, the Ravens didn't look amazing beating
the Dolphins to me. I know it ended up being easy,
(25:32):
but it wasn't like a game where you look at
the numbers and everything that they were particularly dominant and
you know they beat the Bears. That was a good
effort with Tyler Huntley. I guess I just want to
see them in a game like they are this week
against a better opponent before I'm feeling like they're back back.
So I punished them a little bit for that.
Speaker 4 (25:52):
That's fair.
Speaker 3 (25:52):
We should defend where we are putting the Chargers though,
because I think this is accurate. And the reason is
is the losses in the offensive line. We know we
are bracing for offense being a challenge for them from
here on out after losing Joe Alt for the rest
of the season.
Speaker 2 (26:05):
So that and the defense hasn't been that good, right,
Like I thought the defense would be better and it's
been up and down.
Speaker 4 (26:11):
Yeah, I would agree. I would agree with that.
Speaker 2 (26:13):
Forty nine Ers though, ahead of the now that I'm
looking at it, like in my heart, forty nine ers
considering their injuries. Actually I did have them below the Chargers,
and I think you should have too, but you didn't.
You know nothing.
Speaker 3 (26:27):
And I had the forty nine Ers ahead of the
Chargers because I admire their scrappiness and their ability to
extract wins out of thin air despite all the losses
that they've had in personnel like that. I am still
mystified by how they are still competitive every week given
all the guys they don't have.
Speaker 2 (26:42):
I had the Patriots at eleven, you had them at ten.
Do you think it's fair that they are not in
our highest tier? Essentially that we're we're kind of saying
with this tier to me, you know, you're not one
of the real deal ones yet, and it's crazy to
think that about the I guess he just want I
want just a little more proof. But what do you
(27:05):
think about not putting the Patriots or the Broncos or
even the Steelers in like real deal Super Bowl contender status.
Speaker 3 (27:14):
I think that the Patriots are going to remind me
of teams that played soft schedules and got you know,
to the playoffs on the back of the soft schedule.
Not to take away anything that they've done, because Drake
may is the engine that drives that team forward and
he's playing fantastic football, but I do think that if
they end up facing higher level competition, they could get exposed,
you know, on a given Sunday or whatever. So that's
why they sit at ten. For me, the Steelers, I
(27:36):
sound like a hater. They're just very up and down.
Like the way that they dominated the Colts statistically with
turnovers and everything else was shocking. But yet they only
won that game by a touchdown, and so that kind
of points to sign to me that, like, I think
Aaron Rodgers is playing very good football for them right now.
He's got complete command of that offense when he's given
when he's empowered to run that offense. But I think
(27:57):
that there is not fraudulent in them, but just a
visible ceiling with them, which is why I have them
where they are.
Speaker 2 (28:02):
And it's funny. If we had done this segment before
Thursday Night Football, Broncos fans would have been annoyed, I
think at how low they are. And now after Thursday
Night Football, even though they got to win, I feel
like the bow Knicks nation, the bow leievers, will just
like be a little quieter.
Speaker 3 (28:20):
I got to give them a lot of credit. A
big shout out for me because I get a lot
of hate for the QB Index every week. It's part
of you know, it comes with the game. Bo Knicks
fans have not gotten in my DMS or my mentions
once and in fact, I've had a little bit of
back and forth with Broncos fans, like when I'm streaming
on Twitch or whatever, They're in agreement, like they underst
they're realists with him and they understand where he is
(28:41):
right now. So shout out to you guys for not
letting your emotions cloud your judgment.
Speaker 2 (28:46):
Shout out to the Broncos fans for the most incredible
Bronx cheer on Thursday night when their punter finally had
a good punt because he kept punting it off the
side of his foot, they were booing the hell out
of bow Nicks and the Broncos offense. They did it
going into halftime, they did it coming out of halftime
(29:08):
when they went three and out out of halftime, and
then he hit this punt which was his first decent
punt of the night, and they gave him a loud
ass Bronx cheer for a punt that was amazing.
Speaker 3 (29:18):
Just that this is coming off of the back of
him launching absolute rockets a week earlier, like to the
point where I tweeted, I was like, he has a
mortar cannon, like a mortar launcher on his leg, like that's.
Speaker 4 (29:30):
What his leg is.
Speaker 3 (29:31):
And then he goes out there to night and just
sends like ground balls out there.
Speaker 4 (29:34):
You know that punting's hard. Man football was hard.
Speaker 2 (29:36):
It is crazy that punting was like the most entertaining
thing in the game. Aj Cole the Raiders had two
punts go inside the two yard line. That's the first
time that's happened in the same game in like five years.
Not surprising there. And then he also had a block
punt that basically won the Broncos. The game set them
up on a short field goal, and that's how they
got their short field and that's how they got their
you know, winning field goal. Let's do the title contender.
(29:58):
I'm calling this the real Ones. It really shows what
a crazy year this is, because I think you could
shake up these nine teams in any direction, and I'm
not going to argue too much with it. Number nine
the Tampa Bay Buccaneers. Number eight is Green Bay lower
than I expected, And it is interesting when you force
yourself to do this exercise and you realize, like, wow,
(30:20):
the Packers down there, although I had them highering you.
Number seven, the Detroit Lions, number six, We have the
Colts five, the Buffalo Bills. The Chiefs, despite losing last week,
is actually ahead of the Bills. And that's why I
like power rankings. They shouldn't just be you know, your record,
number three, the LA Rams, number two Philadelphia Eagles, and
(30:41):
number one the Seattle Seahawks up at number one. I
was surprised, shook, we were on the same page with
the Seahawks. You had them very high. Was it number one?
I believe it was number two for you, but it
averaged out to being number one. You had the Chiefs won,
and that was the rising the Seahawks, two, Eagle three.
(31:02):
So what strikes you the most just looking at this
list of the best nine teams, and then I'll tell
you what stands out to me.
Speaker 3 (31:11):
So this season feels like we've gotten more parody in
the league than we've gotten in probably the last five
or seven years. And I think that this group really
illustrates that. Because this was the most difficult part of
this exercise for me.
Speaker 4 (31:22):
Because I'm getting at one Chiefs. Yeah, they lost the Bills.
They had a terrible game.
Speaker 3 (31:27):
That was the bills best showing in years defensively at least.
And I think that if you play that game ten times,
it might turn out differently, you know, a few different times.
Speaker 4 (31:34):
So I'm not going to put too much stock into
a regular season win over the Chiefs, I felt.
Speaker 3 (31:39):
I still feel confident as though if I had to
take any team in a neutral site or in a
playoff game Homer away, I would still say.
Speaker 4 (31:46):
Patrick Mahomes, Andy Reid the Kansas City Chiefs.
Speaker 3 (31:49):
But once we got past the Chiefs and the Seahawks,
I'm like, oh my god, Like, what do I think
about the rest of these guys? Because the Eagles have,
you know, the personnel to get it done. They had
the drama, but they're also you know, they're coming off
of two quality wins. The Rams are like lurking as
this team that people aren't paying attention to, but they're
playing phenomenal football, especially offensively. Lion's coming off of a
loss of the Vikings, but there's still the Lions. We
(32:09):
still respect them. Bills are lower for me than five.
Actually had them at six just because I still need
it proven to me, like you need the Ravens to.
Speaker 4 (32:16):
Prove it to you.
Speaker 3 (32:17):
Like I get down to like six, seven, eight nine,
and I'm like, oh God, I forgot about the Buccaneers.
Wait right, we have all these injuries on offense. Can
they still do it? The Packers. I don't believe in
them fully right now because of some of the performances
they've produced recently. And the Colts Daniel Jones scared me
back into being hesitant about them with accounting for five
of their six turnovers.
Speaker 4 (32:35):
So it's really hard to sort.
Speaker 3 (32:36):
These guys out right now, which is why the NFL
is incredibly fun to watch.
Speaker 2 (32:40):
Yeah, so, first of all, it's six NFC teams, three AFC,
So I think I shocked. Yeah, it just I think
there's more really good teams this year than most years.
I actually it is parody, but I don't think it's
mediocrity because we looked at that group from ten to
(33:01):
sixteen and those are good teams too. So the bad
teams are really bad this year for sure, but I
think there's a lot of good teams at the top.
Like all these teams, for almost all of them have
had multi year kind of build ups to this moment,
you know, like Mike McDonald, it's only a second year,
(33:22):
but man, they're so different than they were, you know,
Sean McVay, and they've been in this rebuild ish phase
for the last couple of years. They called it a
sprint rebuild that's peaking right now. The Eagles are in
the middle of their primes, the Chiefs are that are
the Chiefs obviously, and like even the Bucks, like they've
been building to this moment. So it's not like other
than the Colts, there's not like a big surprise team,
(33:44):
and there's not a team that like feels like it
came out of nowhere. And yet the Colts when and
I've talked about this this week, when you look at it,
like that team has about as much continuity and veterans
and guys who have been on that roster for four
or five years than anyone. So I just like that
we're like really familiar, you're with all these teams, and
I think they all have a shot to win the
Super Bowl. And the biggest disagreement we had here, well
(34:07):
there were a couple, but we were only three spots
apart on any team, But I had the Colts still
at four. Maybe that's too high, but I believe in
transcendent offenses, and I just think they have a chance
to be a transcendent offense. Is their offense, like the
(34:28):
does it have a chance to be the best thing
in the NFL? I think it has a chance, so
maybe I'm wrong.
Speaker 3 (34:36):
I mean, because of the continuity, that's probably the strongest
argument for them that they could have the best offense
the NFL. I mean, they've certainly put up a lot
of points, but you also have to consider opponent when
you examine some of their victories. I actually want to
step into our therapist's office real quick. I'm the therapist and
I'm also the patient here because this is a great
demonstration of the difference between you and me and my
abandonment issues. The Colts burned me once, and I'm like, nope,
(34:58):
I'm off the ship. I'm not, but you can't hurt
me twice. Colts, I'm not gonna let you hurt me again.
I'm running away from you. Whereas you are more of
an open hearted believer, like they said on the Monday
Night recap, Greg has kind eyes.
Speaker 4 (35:09):
You have a kind heart too. You're willing to let
the Colts have a bad Sunday.
Speaker 2 (35:12):
Maybe, or maybe I just stick with my priors and
I just spent the week, you know, gassing them up
before they stunk up the joint. And like a team
like the Bills are, I think they have fundamental things
that I worry about and yet man, they are a
good problem solving team like the Chiefs. So if I
had to do it again, maybe I would have flipped
it and the Bills would have been a little bit higher,
(35:33):
because like the Chiefs, they deserve the benefit of doubt
if they're going to like create solutions to the problems
that the season gives them. And you can kind of
see it the last couple of weeks. Do we know
that the Colts are going to do that? We don't
know because we haven't seen it, and we are putting
a lot of faith there in the Seahawks. I hadem one,
(35:53):
you had them two. But man, it's a beautiful thing.
And you know what, we got a game this weekend
with two of these top teams playing. That's all I
want out of each week, at least one or two
games where you know, two of these nine teams are
playing each other. And yeah, we got a nice Packers
(36:15):
Eagles game and the Patriots not too far out of
this tier. Play in the Bucks is a really good
one nine versus ten if you look at the windows,
I know we had a bad primetime game shook, but
this is sneakily one of the best weeks of the
year because we have Pats Bucks in that early window
along with Ravens Vikings, which I think is really fun.
(36:37):
That's a great game, and the primetime windows are absolutely great.
In the four to twenty five window, we have Rams
forty nine ers, which I think is good enough to
hold that window. It's like every window has has a nice,
delicious game.
Speaker 4 (36:51):
You know.
Speaker 3 (36:51):
It's like a relief, and it's also excites me when
I see a good Monday nighter, and Eagles Packers is
going to be a good Monday nighter.
Speaker 2 (36:59):
We need it. We'll be live and we appreciate everyone
who's been listening to all our recaps this season. And
that's it for this one. We will be next in
the feed. Cynthia Friedland and I we push back the
pick show a little bit this week because everything's been
a little up in the air. So we have our
picks against the spread that'll be on Friday afternoon. We
(37:21):
will see them and we can only hope to do
better at our jobs than the Raiders and the Broncos
offenses did not see it.
Speaker 3 (37:30):
Frighten
Host
Gregg Rosenthal
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