November 10, 2025 • 29 mins
NFL Network Insiders Tom Pelissero, Ian Rapoport, Mike Garafolo, Judy Battista, and Steve Wyche react to the Giants firing Head Coach Brian Daboll. The Insiders also discuss Joe Burrow returning to the practice field for the Bengals, preview the Week 11 matchup between the Seahawks and Rams, and remember former NFL Commissioner Paul Tagliabue.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
Happy Monday, everyone, and welcome inside with the Insiders alongside
Mike Herrat Follo, Ian Rappaport, and Judy Batiste. I am
Tom Pellisio. This is our Monday podcast edition, breaking down
all things from Sunday across the NFL. If you are
catching this on the podcast, that's a two parter.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
You can start here, start there. It doesn't really matter if.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
You're catching us on YouTube, catching us on the NFL channel,
on fast streaming platforms, wherever you are. We appreciate you
being here and we will get into injury updates. We'll
get into what we saw out of the games on Sunday,
but we are all hands on deck today for massive
news out of New York.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
Ian Rappaport, do you first have.
Speaker 1 (00:46):
The news Brian Dable out as Giants coach, a move that,
while it felt inevitable, you never know exactly how the
timing of these.
Speaker 2 (00:54):
Things are going to go.
Speaker 1 (00:56):
New York after three and a half seasons, moving on
and embarking on yet another search for a new head coach.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
Yeah, I would say a frustrating season in many respects,
not all respects, but many respects for the New York Giants.
You're right, this did feel inevitable, and the Giants have
now just made it official with a statement from John
Maratom I'll let you read that in a second, saying
Brian Dable has in fact been has in fact been
(01:24):
relieved of his duties. Once you get the sense, I'm
gonna sneeze in a second, oh there you go, I'm okay,
now sorry, Once you get the sense it's funny, once
you get the sense that it's inevitable, you should just
do it. And I think where the Giants were in
their season, once you know, it's like every time they lost,
they were gonna be the questions of all right, has
(01:44):
Brian dave all been fired?
Speaker 4 (01:45):
Now?
Speaker 3 (01:46):
Another double digit loss, another road loss where it slipped
away in a game they easily had in hand, played
a great game right up until the end. When they didn't.
It was like the death March was on. They felt
in the building, everyone outside the building knew it. Brian
Dable is a good guy and a former Coach of
the Year and what he has done with Jackson Dart
(02:08):
and this offense has been at times promising, not good enough.
And this team has talent. They should be winning and
they are not. Unfortunately, it was time and Brian Dabo
now officially fired as the Giants head coach.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
Mike that joint statement from John Marray and Steve Tish saying,
in part, we spoke this morning about the direction of
our franchise on the field, and we've decided that at
this time it is in our best interest to make
a change at the head coaching position. The past few
seasons have been nothing short of disappointing, and we have
not met our expectations for this franchise. We understand the
frustrations of our fans and we will work to deliver
(02:46):
a significantly improved product. We appreciate Coach Dable for contributions
to our organization. We wish the Dabole family all the
best in the future. Judy, this is the fourth head
coaching change that the Giants have made over the decade
since they parted ways with Tom Coughlin. Much like Ben McAdoo,
(03:07):
who of course succeeded Tom Coughlin, they Bowl won in
his first season and they went into the playoffs. I
was at that playoff game against the Vikings in Minnesota.
The Giants won that game and they advanced the divisional
round and it was the cigar chompion, everybody rallying around Dable.
You know, the entire environment seemed to have pointed in
(03:29):
a positive direction since that game. The Giants lost thirty
four out of a possible forty five games, and the
way they were losing games this season again seemed to
just point toward this has become an inevitability that they
once again will be.
Speaker 2 (03:45):
Looking for a coach. Danny Judy on Mute Judy. All right, Mike,
let's go to you. How about that?
Speaker 5 (03:59):
Listen when when John Mara spoke to the media, I
guess back in January and said that his patience was
running thin, but he was retaining Brian Dable and Joe Shane.
Speaker 4 (04:12):
I remember the way that I phrased it was we
better talk.
Speaker 5 (04:15):
About playoff positioning as we come down the stretch of
this upcoming season, rather than draft positioning.
Speaker 4 (04:22):
There's a world in which Brian Dable didn't have.
Speaker 5 (04:24):
To make the playoffs, but was still going to show
enough progress here with regard to how the team's performing
and the quarterback position to retain.
Speaker 4 (04:32):
His job for this upcoming season.
Speaker 5 (04:35):
It was, for a flicker of a moment looking like
it was going to get there. After that win against
the Eagles that I covered a couple of weeks ago,
that Thursday night game, it was like, wow, okay, all right.
Speaker 4 (04:43):
You're starting to see it.
Speaker 5 (04:44):
You're starting to see things come together in a way
that makes sense for a team that's.
Speaker 4 (04:49):
Going to compete in the future, not there now.
Speaker 5 (04:52):
And it happened quickly, and between the injury to Jackson Dart,
the another concussion check, and the way that they blew
lead in this one just completely frustrating for a lot
of folks inside that building. So there is a chance
for Mike Kafka here the interim head coach UH, to
make a statement for this team going forward, but there
(05:16):
will be a wide ranging, bigger picture search as there
always is on this one.
Speaker 6 (05:20):
UH.
Speaker 5 (05:21):
Kafka has been a head coach for the Senior Ball
and the Shne Bowl before back to back year, so
he has some head coaching experience and it's a guy
that really at times hadn't called play plays for this team,
So this is a lot on his plate at this point.
The schedule is not pretty Patriots Packers, and who's the
third team? It's another brutal one in the next three
(05:41):
before the bye week. Patriots Packer Lions.
Speaker 7 (05:43):
So the whole schedule is brutal, and.
Speaker 5 (05:49):
I said, like, you didn't look at the schedule and go, oh,
this team's winning nine games and going to the playoffs.
But you potentially looked at this team and said could
win seven games and okay, we're moving in the right direction.
Speaker 4 (05:59):
You can stick. Just didn't get there. And now the
Giants make that decision. Yeah, I want to we want
to go to Judy in a sec assuming I have
no idea.
Speaker 8 (06:06):
Can you hear me?
Speaker 3 (06:07):
We can hear yesco I want to read this first
from John Mahra in the statement that he just put
out uh on Joe Shane remaining the general manager and
leading the search for a new head coach from Mare.
We feel like Joe's assembled a good, young nucleus of
talent and we look forward to its development. Unfortunately, the
results of the past three years of not what any
of us want. It took full responsibility for that. Look
(06:29):
forward to the kind of success our fans expect. So
Joe Shane Judy will remain as GM and will lead
the search, which I would say clears up one of
the bigger questions for that moving forward.
Speaker 9 (06:41):
Sure, that is one of the big questions. I just
want to go back since Hei you couldn't hear me.
I mean, I can tell you at you know, before
the season started, during the off season, like John.
Speaker 8 (06:52):
Marra did not want to have to do this.
Speaker 9 (06:54):
He really hoped that this was going to work out,
which is why he brought them back. He had a
lot of confidence that especially with Jackson Dark coming on
with Russell Wilson, that they would get off to a
better start. But certainly when the season started so poorly,
and then when they started blowing the big leads where
they just couldn't close out games, it has felt inevitable.
Speaker 8 (07:18):
And I would agree with you what you said.
Speaker 9 (07:21):
And once you know it's inevitable, then it's better to
just get on with it and start the process.
Speaker 8 (07:26):
Although that certainly has not been the Giant's way.
Speaker 9 (07:29):
Look, the Giant's way traditionally was to have coaches for
a long time. I mean the last decade has been
very unusual for them and very uncomfortable. They do not
like to have to blow up things every few years.
They know that's not the formula. Listen, there's some talent
on the roster. This is you know, they're not the
(07:50):
Kansas City Chiefs, though, I mean, we're you know that
there's not a ton of depth on the team. They've
got some, you know, right, young hopeful stars certainly, you
know obviously Jackson Dart and Milik Neighbors and Scataboo and
you know, some of the guys on the offensive line,
but on the defensive line rather, But the offensive.
Speaker 8 (08:10):
Line is is what it is.
Speaker 9 (08:13):
They need think the roster needs to be better too,
and so I do think the it's always interesting if
you're going to keep the general manager, they must have
a lot of confidence that the general manager that Joe
can make improvements on this roster. At the same time,
they're obviously going to have another very high draft pick here.
Speaker 8 (08:31):
But you know, I'm not sure we should overstate how.
Speaker 9 (08:34):
Talented the roster is because there are still holes on
that roster other than Elik Neighbors. You know, the offensive
weapons are kind of thin in the passing game. So
this is definitely not where the Giants wanted to be.
Speaker 8 (08:49):
I'll just say that.
Speaker 2 (08:51):
Short term here.
Speaker 1 (08:52):
Mike Kafka, who has interviewed for a number of head
coaching jobs in the past, in all likelihood you would
think is not going to have Jackson Dart this week
he seperate a concussion.
Speaker 2 (09:02):
It's not a guarantee, but.
Speaker 1 (09:04):
By and large, we see more players miss at least
one game with a concussion than we even have in
years past. But one of my immediate questions, and clearly
again there's a series of steps here, we don't want
to move on too quickly because Brian Dable, who's a
good dude who we all like and have met and
spent time with, is out of a job, and that's
a crappy thing for everybody involved. But the season goes on,
(09:26):
and talking to people there today, that's what everyone was saying, like,
it's just hard. It sucks the way that you're up
in these games and then they get away from you
four times on the road, having a double digit lead
and going zero to four in those games. It's just
you never want to lose any game, but you definitely
don't want to have games fall apart like that. My
immediate questions go to number one, how exactly if it
all may Mike Kafka adjust things with the coaching staff.
(09:48):
At this point, he has not done that at all,
But Kafka taking on a head coaching job on an
inter basis. In addition to still having you would think
the offensive coordinator duties, is he still going to call
the place you would think yes, But as one of
you said, not always has been the case in the past.
The second part of this is, if it's no Jackson Dart,
are we convinced Russell Wilson Ian starts this next week
(10:12):
or do we go to if you want to try
to change the vibes, there is maybe the King of
vibes sitting there as your third string quarterback.
Speaker 3 (10:20):
I was actually gonna say that the King of Vibes
was actually what I was going to say, except probably
a little bit better. Yeah, I mean, I would say, look,
Russell Wilson has come in in relief of Jackson Dart
a couple of times and has looked truly terrible, like
really bad. Jameis Winston is going to look bad, but
he's also going to look good, and there's gonna be
(10:43):
a lot and like hard to imagine, just hard to imagine.
That the Giants move on from Brian day ball and
the first thing that interim coach Mike Kopka does is go,
We're gonna run Russell Wilson out there. I'd be surprised. Now,
we'll see we have not heard from him yet. I
have not heard any quarterback decisions yet, but I'm just
(11:03):
saying that would surprise me. And I would also say
we talk sometimes about like, oh, the interim coach is
going to have a chance. This feels more real to
me than a lot of them, Like Mike Kafka has
been a serious head coaching candidate, most recently, I believed
in Seattle, but a couple other places, Like I would
expect him to have a real shot at this thing.
Speaker 1 (11:24):
You know, they mostly with Jackson Dart, which you would
think also Mike would give him some level of leg up.
If again this thing works out and the new roles meshed,
there is something to be said for not doing what
so many other teams recent years have done, which is
blowing up the coaching staff and having a quarterback start
completely from scratching year two.
Speaker 5 (11:43):
Yeah, and by the way, they did block Mike Kafka
as an offensive coordinator candidate two years ago. The Seahawks
then had another to Seattle, right, Yeah, And the Seahawks
had another opening this year and they were told, if
you put in for him, we're going to block again.
So it wasn't technically another block, but they made it clear.
So yeah, he was thought at least that highly of
inside the building. And that's not just from Brian Dable,
(12:04):
that was from others higher up. They're now going to
have a chance to have a say here in this
coaching search. So yeah, I mean it does feel a
little bit real here. It does feel like a chance
for Kafka to show that he took that experience from
both of those stints as a coach in All Star
Games and UH and get a chance to translate it
to the field. It's a difficult balance, right if you're
(12:24):
handling the entire offense. That's why a lot of times
we see a special teams coach take over or something
like that. When I had conversations even with you guys
throughout the course of the season, we said, if the
Giants make a change, who are they turning to, Because
there's really no ready made interim guy like a Mike
McCoy on the staff here, so they go right to
Kafka as a chance for this, not just looking for
(12:45):
somebody with some stability.
Speaker 4 (12:47):
This is a okay, this is part of your interview
process here, Mike. So let's see what he can.
Speaker 1 (12:51):
Do, Mike, real quick here, since you gotta jump here
and momentarily any final thoughts beyond that, then beyond Kafka,
what exactly we know what the Giant's history is. It's
been a lot of offensive coaches in the past. It's
been quite a few of first time head coaches, though
not entirely. Kaughlin wasn't obviously, Pat Shermer wasn't. What do
(13:13):
you think ultimately they're looking for the new ket coach.
Speaker 5 (13:16):
It's got to be somebody who is a here we go,
we're in leader of men season already.
Speaker 4 (13:21):
It's got to be somebody that can command a building.
Speaker 5 (13:23):
Like they have gone with the Ben mcado with the
young offensive mind.
Speaker 4 (13:26):
They went with Pat Sherman, which of all the hires
that they've made recently, like that's the one. I just
still don't know what they saw there.
Speaker 5 (13:33):
They go with Brian Dable as kind of a mix
of both, even though he didn't have the previous head
coaching experience.
Speaker 4 (13:40):
I think, for for.
Speaker 5 (13:42):
All that we thought maybe Kauflin was an offensive mind,
Tom Coughlin was a guy that knew how to run
the building, knew how to get guys to do things.
They had to do to win football games. They've got
to go back and find somebody like that. So I
think that that'll be probably a big.
Speaker 4 (13:56):
Part of this coaching search coming up. Look, John Marra.
Speaker 5 (14:00):
An uncomfortable part of this, but John Marra has made
it clear he's dealing We haven't seen him much. He's
been dealing with some health issues, So how does that
factor and he's been diagnosed with cancer?
Speaker 4 (14:09):
Has that factor into this whole thing right here?
Speaker 5 (14:10):
This is something where that's a really personal health thing
that he's dealing with.
Speaker 4 (14:14):
You're adding this on top of that.
Speaker 5 (14:15):
So it's hard for me to kind of give a
prediction because there's so much influx inside that building. And again,
just to be clear, we wish John Mara the absolute
best in his battle against cancer.
Speaker 9 (14:25):
D Now, I do wonder if the fact that they
have had such limited success with inexperienced coaches makes them
cast a wider net and look at coaches who have
had previous experience just because the recent past has not
gone well with first time head coaches. This is a job.
(14:49):
I tweetd this and people started arguing with me, but.
Speaker 4 (14:51):
Like no.
Speaker 3 (14:55):
Read the comments.
Speaker 9 (14:56):
The New York Giants job is a plumb job, no
matter what condition they're in. Forget about the fact that
they've won two games. It's the New York Giants. It's
the New York Giants. It still means something in the
NFL world to be the head coach of the New
York Giants. They will have their pick of candidates, and
certainly the presidence of Jackson Dark only enhances that. So
(15:16):
they they can cast a wide net. They can take
the obvious, they can take their time. They've got plenty
of time now. But I do look at yes, I mean,
continuity is good, and certainly if Mike Kofka can run
off some wins here and things look good, then obviously
he has the inside track. But the idea of blowing
it up and making the quarterbacks start over, I mean,
that's working out pretty well in Chicago right now, right.
Speaker 8 (15:39):
So, I'm not sure you want to just rule that out.
Speaker 9 (15:41):
If you get the right guy, they've just got to
get the right guy. They've got to get the right guy.
They haven't been able to do it since Kafluin was here.
Speaker 4 (15:48):
I'll just throw one name out there. He's got head
coaching experience.
Speaker 5 (15:50):
He doesn't have a lot of head coaching experience, but
Antonio Pierce as a connection to that building, if he
gets an interview.
Speaker 4 (15:55):
Would not be suppressed.
Speaker 2 (15:57):
Mike, thank you.
Speaker 4 (15:58):
We'll be right back with more.
Speaker 6 (16:00):
On the inside.
Speaker 2 (16:13):
Welcome in our Steve Whites to the conversation.
Speaker 1 (16:16):
Now, a lot to discuss from the Sunday of Week
ten in the NFL.
Speaker 2 (16:21):
The first ian.
Speaker 1 (16:22):
Let's start out with an injury update from the Bengals,
a positive injury update, which there have not been many
of those. Joe Burrow are a little sooner than any
of us expected. Officially back on the practice field today.
What are we looking at in terms of not just
getting out there on a limited basis, but actually returning
to play for Joe Burrow.
Speaker 3 (16:41):
Yeah, really significant day for the Cincinnati Bengals. And we've
spent a lot of time over the last several weeks
looking at the Bengals record, looking at the calendar, looking
at Joe Burrow and being like, all right, if they're
here by here, then maybe he could maybe he could play.
And the way he was described to me was if
they are alive, he's got a shot in early to
(17:03):
mid December. Well, they're alive, maybe not as alive as
they wish they would be. But they're alive, and he
is going to practice this week. He's twenty one day
window is open. He has been cleared for limited participation
in practice. Basically, what this means is he is now
allowed to do football drills. So to do football drills,
you do them in practice. He has now cleared to
(17:24):
practice on a limited basis. I would imagine that he
is practicing with one of those steal like bottoms of
your feet, those like orthotic, you know, to protect his toe.
That's basically what you do if you come back a
little early. But he's got a shot. And I would
also say this, the Bengals are what are they three insects?
Speaker 7 (17:47):
Right?
Speaker 3 (17:47):
I think they're three in six.
Speaker 2 (17:49):
And two games out in the division.
Speaker 3 (17:51):
Right, And look, the schedule's hard, of course it's hard.
But the way it was explained to me is if
they're alive, don't be surprised you see him in December
with him practicing now, I wouldn't be surprised if we
see him no matter what, he's gonna want to play,
and if he's good enough to play, I imagine we're
going to see him. This is a big day for Cincy.
Speaker 4 (18:14):
Steve Oh my bad.
Speaker 7 (18:16):
Well, look, look, if he wants to play, he's gonna play.
But the thing is, the Bengals issues aren't a quarterback,
right the Bengals, if they want to get contention, they
got to stop some people. Joe I mean, Joe Burrow
is that guy. But I'm gonna say Joe Flacco is
playing well, probably why they're in contention now. But if
Burrow does come back, Okay, let's make it fun again,
(18:36):
Cincinnati Bengals. You know you've done the last couple of years,
and Joe Burrow has been healthy. Let's make it fun
down the stretch.
Speaker 9 (18:41):
I mean that division is totally there. They're not that
far out that obviously. The Steelers are lagging or struggling
right now. The Ravens are coming up are now. But sure,
I mean, if he gets back, if Joe Flacco can
sort of hold the Ford and the defense can hold
the Ford for a few more weeks, win some games
here there, then it's just you know, a free for
(19:04):
all coming down the final month or six weeks of
the season. They totally have a chance to sneak in,
especially as a wildcard like it's it's got to be
such a lift. Obviously, he is a great player. It's
got to be such an emotional lift for that team
to see him walk out there, like you know, it's
just it gives you hope. So I totally expect that
(19:25):
he will be back on the field. Why wouldn't he play.
He'll want to.
Speaker 3 (19:28):
Play, He'll want to play. And I would say, schedule wise,
he's not going to play this week. That's the Steelers.
He's not going to play next week probably that's the Patriots,
and then they have the Ravens on Thanksgiving.
Speaker 8 (19:43):
Oh, turn, that would be that'd be a way to return.
Speaker 1 (19:50):
That way, that would be well ahead of the timeline.
Probably the more likely is after that game, which is
only what seventeen days away from right now, you activate
him after that game, you save the rosters pot, and
he comes back in December, which was always kind of
the target.
Speaker 3 (20:06):
Everything is not as fun as my thing.
Speaker 1 (20:08):
It's not as fun, But I'm trying to also be realistic.
It's a three month he's got a three month injury
and it's been two months.
Speaker 4 (20:15):
Let's start there, right.
Speaker 1 (20:16):
It's a it's a it's a tricky thing. But again,
the fact that he's out there, this is sooner than
we thought we'd see him on the practice field. Let's
see he's after where it goes from there. Let's go
out to your backyard.
Speaker 2 (20:26):
Steve Weis. We got a showdown next week.
Speaker 1 (20:30):
It's the Seahawks against the Ram, two teams that when
you watch them, and I know, you know the Seahawks,
some weird stuff happens in that game, but I mean
they look like monsters against the Cardinals. Same thing with
the Rams, where maybe you're playing a team that's a
little bit shorthanded, but they got after him in San
francisc Let's go. I don't want to see either of
(20:51):
those teams in January, and games like this can go
a long way toward determining are you potentially as one
of the other NFC contenders going in playing a division
playoff game, even in a conference championship in La or
in Seattle.
Speaker 4 (21:05):
Yeah, look, both these teams I tweeted about this is Hagler.
Speaker 2 (21:08):
Hearns right.
Speaker 7 (21:09):
The way these teams have come out of the gate
and scored points offensively. They're not sitting back. There's no
counterpunching here. These guys are just digging in and they're
throwing blows. You saw what Seattle did to the Arizona Cardinals.
It was a damn shaman. The craziest number I saw
all weekend long. Sam Darnold nine of ten for one
hundred and sixty seven yards in the first half against Arizona.
Speaker 4 (21:29):
He finishes ten of twelve.
Speaker 7 (21:31):
He only threw two more passes in the game because
they absolutely took apart the Cardinals because that offense, that's crazy.
Speaker 4 (21:37):
It's crazy.
Speaker 7 (21:38):
And he wasn't like he came out what like they
put in a backup quarterback.
Speaker 2 (21:42):
He played.
Speaker 7 (21:42):
They just devastated Arizona and they have been playing like
this their last two games.
Speaker 4 (21:47):
They're averaging thirty seven points.
Speaker 7 (21:50):
But the Rams they're averaging thirty seven points as well
over the last three games, and Matthew Stafford's playing as
well as any won. The Rams offensive line is getting healthy,
they're running the ball, getting back Pooka to go with DeVante,
and seeing the Rams actually incorporate multiple tight ends into
their offense. Now you know Sean Sean McVay is an
(22:12):
eleven personnel guys, sometimes they'll run a lot of twelve
personnel to two tight end sets. So again the offenses
look scary, but the defenses look equally scary. We know
how good that Rams defensive front is, but the way
Leonard Williams and in Seattle, I mean they sat Jacobi
Pressett five times in the first half of that game.
Speaker 4 (22:31):
They get after it.
Speaker 7 (22:32):
So this is strength on strength and as you mentioned,
tom As, this could set up for potential home field
in the playoffs, and we know, especially if it's in Seattle,
this is a This is a significant game and possibly
determined who could win a very, very tough division.
Speaker 9 (22:51):
They look like the two best teams, well, certainly the
two best teams in the NFC. We're going to see
the Eagles tonight, but they haven't looked anywhere near this
level so far. They look like they might be the
two best teams in the NFL right now. The way
they're playing. I mean, Matthew Stafford is playing at an
insanely high level, and Seattle might be the most complete
(23:12):
team right now, the most balanced. So those games are
going to be I mean, they are clearly very important
for playoff seating, but they might tell us an awful
lot about what team we're going to be looking at
at the end of January too into February, because I've seen.
I've watched both teams the last few weeks, and I
(23:32):
have not seen a team play better.
Speaker 3 (23:35):
Jean, I'm going to let you guys finish this out
and jump off and make a call. Although I agree
with everything, everyone just.
Speaker 2 (23:45):
Here's and you go hand to your business.
Speaker 7 (23:47):
I'll tell you what, Tom, The one thing we really
didn't see incorporated with the Seahawks and they took about
Arizona was Rashisha heat He played, but we didn't see
his potential impact. This is a game where we can
see it because the Rams are really good at safety,
but their corners, you know, they're still trying to work
some things out. So I just can't wait to see
the way this plays out. The Seattle's passing game isn't
(24:09):
necessarily a quick passing game, so the Rams pass rushers
can get after him. Same with the Rams. Their passing
plays tended to take a while to develop, so these
defenses are going to have a say in this. I
am really looking. It's a Sunday night game too, I believe,
so this is this is going to be the you
know that the mid season game of the year, so
(24:31):
to speak.
Speaker 1 (24:32):
It just I keep saying it every week, but this
twenty twenty five Sea Owks team reminds me a lot
of the twenty thirteen I agree, this team can throw
the ball a lot better. You know those teams, And
somewhere Doug Baldwin's going to see this quoted and it's going.
Speaker 2 (24:45):
To text me.
Speaker 1 (24:46):
But like, they didn't have a Jackson Smith and Jigga
on that team, They didn't have a Rasid Shiheed style.
Speaker 2 (24:52):
Burner on the team.
Speaker 1 (24:53):
Cooper Cup, you know, is a dirty work type of guy,
and Sam Darnold's playing at a really high level. But
the way that that defense with a bunch of guys
who not all of them are high draft picks, not
all of them, I don't think anybody on that defense.
Maybe Leonard Williams is like a household type of name,
but they just they play so hard, fast, physical discipline.
You can see in year one they were pretty good.
(25:15):
I remember they went ten and seven, they were the
real ten win team and missed the playoffs.
Speaker 2 (25:19):
But the way that they play.
Speaker 1 (25:21):
Now and you can see Mike McDonald getting the pieces
in place to play the way that he wants to,
it's pretty impressive.
Speaker 2 (25:27):
Steve.
Speaker 1 (25:28):
I also want to ask you about sad news that
we had yesterday regarding the former NFL Commissioner Paul Tagliabu.
My time covering the NFL only marginally overlapped with Paul.
He certainly was a giant in the game. But you
covered the NFL, you know, during the certainly during the
meat of his tenure. Just tell me, you know your
(25:48):
your reaction to the news, but also what you remember
most about Paul Taglibu, the NFL commission.
Speaker 7 (25:53):
Yeah, I mean, look, it's it's the course of life.
We're seeing a lot of people, you know, run that.
We saw Lenny Wilkins, the basket Hall of Famer, also
passed yesterday. But Paul Tagliabu, you know, I had the
good fortune Paul went to the Pro Football Hall of
Fame in twenty twenty. You know, I do our Hall
of Fame coverage, but he went in twenty twenty.
Speaker 2 (26:12):
I'm sorry.
Speaker 7 (26:12):
In twenty twenty two, Art McNally, the first official, went
into the Pro Football Hall of Fame.
Speaker 4 (26:18):
And when we do the.
Speaker 7 (26:19):
Door knocks, we have a Hall of famer break the
news to the incoming in Trinee, and it was Paul Taglibu.
So I got to spend the afternoon with him. And
you know, Paul, he's really tall. I played basketball at Georgetown.
He's a lawyer, and you're just getting all this astutent knowledge,
and you know, he's telling me about some of the
tough decisions he had to go through, such as moving
the Super Bowl out of Arizona one year because it
(26:43):
refused to recognize that Martin Luther King holiday and move
it to San Diego and why that was such an
important thing to him and so many people in the league.
Speaker 4 (26:50):
But he did it right.
Speaker 7 (26:52):
He saw the potential economic loss that Arizona was going
to face by doing this, but he just thought the
standard of doing something like that was more important. And
they also made it back to Arizona on the back end.
But you just see some of the things that he did.
You know, they had He had four teams come into
the league when he was there.
Speaker 4 (27:09):
He had a lot of movement teams relocating.
Speaker 2 (27:13):
While he was there.
Speaker 9 (27:14):
You know.
Speaker 7 (27:15):
You know a lot of people say, well, he wasn't
that hard on the concussion issue, and that's something that
lingered over him. That's why he did not get into
the Hall of Fame for years, because there weren't the
studies and there wasn't the attention paid to concussions like
we have now. He's he's admitted that he didn't take it,
you know, seriously enough. But other than you know, other
than that significant issue, he's just scene as a as
(27:37):
a great leader of corraling the owners. We saw ownership
come in, people like Jerry Jones come in and get
things done. So he's he's another one of these commissions
who grew the league television rights, things like that, we
saw the World League and things like that.
Speaker 4 (27:53):
So just just a fantastic gentleman.
Speaker 7 (27:56):
Scholarly, he was a lawyer, but just someone who always
really looked out for the league itself but also for
the players because you know, is big thing that people
talk about was the labor piece with the Players Association,
the players Union that reigned during his whole tenure during
the NFL's commissioner.
Speaker 1 (28:18):
Steve, thank you very much for that perspective. We got
a lot more to come on The Insiders Part two.
If you're on the podcast, if you're on YouTube or
catching this on the NFL channel on fast streaming platforms,
just stay tuned. We will get into all the big
stuff happened in the AFC in games yesterday, including the
Dolphins running the Bills off the field. That's a really thing,
(28:40):
really a real thing that happened here. We had some
instant impact from some of the players that were traded,
including Sauce Gardner. That and a whole lot more for
Steve as well as Judy, Mike and Ian. This is
how the show goes, especially on Mondays, a lot of
stuff going on.
Speaker 2 (28:56):
I appreciate you all listening to what
Speaker 6 (29:00):
The
Happy Monday, everyone, and welcome inside with the Insiders alongside
Mike Herrat Follo, Ian Rappaport, and Judy Batiste. I am
Tom Pellisio. This is our Monday podcast edition, breaking down
all things from Sunday across the NFL. If you are
catching this on the podcast, that's a two parter.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
You can start here, start there. It doesn't really matter if.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
You're catching us on YouTube, catching us on the NFL channel,
on fast streaming platforms, wherever you are. We appreciate you
being here and we will get into injury updates. We'll
get into what we saw out of the games on Sunday,
but we are all hands on deck today for massive
news out of New York.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
Ian Rappaport, do you first have.
Speaker 1 (00:46):
The news Brian Dable out as Giants coach, a move that,
while it felt inevitable, you never know exactly how the
timing of these.
Speaker 2 (00:54):
Things are going to go.
Speaker 1 (00:56):
New York after three and a half seasons, moving on
and embarking on yet another search for a new head coach.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
Yeah, I would say a frustrating season in many respects,
not all respects, but many respects for the New York Giants.
You're right, this did feel inevitable, and the Giants have
now just made it official with a statement from John
Maratom I'll let you read that in a second, saying
Brian Dable has in fact been has in fact been
(01:24):
relieved of his duties. Once you get the sense, I'm
gonna sneeze in a second, oh there you go, I'm okay,
now sorry, Once you get the sense it's funny, once
you get the sense that it's inevitable, you should just
do it. And I think where the Giants were in
their season, once you know, it's like every time they lost,
they were gonna be the questions of all right, has
(01:44):
Brian dave all been fired?
Speaker 4 (01:45):
Now?
Speaker 3 (01:46):
Another double digit loss, another road loss where it slipped
away in a game they easily had in hand, played
a great game right up until the end. When they didn't.
It was like the death March was on. They felt
in the building, everyone outside the building knew it. Brian
Dable is a good guy and a former Coach of
the Year and what he has done with Jackson Dart
(02:08):
and this offense has been at times promising, not good enough.
And this team has talent. They should be winning and
they are not. Unfortunately, it was time and Brian Dabo
now officially fired as the Giants head coach.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
Mike that joint statement from John Marray and Steve Tish saying,
in part, we spoke this morning about the direction of
our franchise on the field, and we've decided that at
this time it is in our best interest to make
a change at the head coaching position. The past few
seasons have been nothing short of disappointing, and we have
not met our expectations for this franchise. We understand the
frustrations of our fans and we will work to deliver
(02:46):
a significantly improved product. We appreciate Coach Dable for contributions
to our organization. We wish the Dabole family all the
best in the future. Judy, this is the fourth head
coaching change that the Giants have made over the decade
since they parted ways with Tom Coughlin. Much like Ben McAdoo,
(03:07):
who of course succeeded Tom Coughlin, they Bowl won in
his first season and they went into the playoffs. I
was at that playoff game against the Vikings in Minnesota.
The Giants won that game and they advanced the divisional
round and it was the cigar chompion, everybody rallying around Dable.
You know, the entire environment seemed to have pointed in
(03:29):
a positive direction since that game. The Giants lost thirty
four out of a possible forty five games, and the
way they were losing games this season again seemed to
just point toward this has become an inevitability that they
once again will be.
Speaker 2 (03:45):
Looking for a coach. Danny Judy on Mute Judy. All right, Mike,
let's go to you. How about that?
Speaker 5 (03:59):
Listen when when John Mara spoke to the media, I
guess back in January and said that his patience was
running thin, but he was retaining Brian Dable and Joe Shane.
Speaker 4 (04:12):
I remember the way that I phrased it was we
better talk.
Speaker 5 (04:15):
About playoff positioning as we come down the stretch of
this upcoming season, rather than draft positioning.
Speaker 4 (04:22):
There's a world in which Brian Dable didn't have.
Speaker 5 (04:24):
To make the playoffs, but was still going to show
enough progress here with regard to how the team's performing
and the quarterback position to retain.
Speaker 4 (04:32):
His job for this upcoming season.
Speaker 5 (04:35):
It was, for a flicker of a moment looking like
it was going to get there. After that win against
the Eagles that I covered a couple of weeks ago,
that Thursday night game, it was like, wow, okay, all right.
Speaker 4 (04:43):
You're starting to see it.
Speaker 5 (04:44):
You're starting to see things come together in a way
that makes sense for a team that's.
Speaker 4 (04:49):
Going to compete in the future, not there now.
Speaker 5 (04:52):
And it happened quickly, and between the injury to Jackson Dart,
the another concussion check, and the way that they blew
lead in this one just completely frustrating for a lot
of folks inside that building. So there is a chance
for Mike Kafka here the interim head coach UH, to
make a statement for this team going forward, but there
(05:16):
will be a wide ranging, bigger picture search as there
always is on this one.
Speaker 6 (05:20):
UH.
Speaker 5 (05:21):
Kafka has been a head coach for the Senior Ball
and the Shne Bowl before back to back year, so
he has some head coaching experience and it's a guy
that really at times hadn't called play plays for this team,
So this is a lot on his plate at this point.
The schedule is not pretty Patriots Packers, and who's the
third team? It's another brutal one in the next three
(05:41):
before the bye week. Patriots Packer Lions.
Speaker 7 (05:43):
So the whole schedule is brutal, and.
Speaker 5 (05:49):
I said, like, you didn't look at the schedule and go, oh,
this team's winning nine games and going to the playoffs.
But you potentially looked at this team and said could
win seven games and okay, we're moving in the right direction.
Speaker 4 (05:59):
You can stick. Just didn't get there. And now the
Giants make that decision. Yeah, I want to we want
to go to Judy in a sec assuming I have
no idea.
Speaker 8 (06:06):
Can you hear me?
Speaker 3 (06:07):
We can hear yesco I want to read this first
from John Mahra in the statement that he just put
out uh on Joe Shane remaining the general manager and
leading the search for a new head coach from Mare.
We feel like Joe's assembled a good, young nucleus of
talent and we look forward to its development. Unfortunately, the
results of the past three years of not what any
of us want. It took full responsibility for that. Look
(06:29):
forward to the kind of success our fans expect. So
Joe Shane Judy will remain as GM and will lead
the search, which I would say clears up one of
the bigger questions for that moving forward.
Speaker 9 (06:41):
Sure, that is one of the big questions. I just
want to go back since Hei you couldn't hear me.
I mean, I can tell you at you know, before
the season started, during the off season, like John.
Speaker 8 (06:52):
Marra did not want to have to do this.
Speaker 9 (06:54):
He really hoped that this was going to work out,
which is why he brought them back. He had a
lot of confidence that especially with Jackson Dark coming on
with Russell Wilson, that they would get off to a
better start. But certainly when the season started so poorly,
and then when they started blowing the big leads where
they just couldn't close out games, it has felt inevitable.
Speaker 8 (07:18):
And I would agree with you what you said.
Speaker 9 (07:21):
And once you know it's inevitable, then it's better to
just get on with it and start the process.
Speaker 8 (07:26):
Although that certainly has not been the Giant's way.
Speaker 9 (07:29):
Look, the Giant's way traditionally was to have coaches for
a long time. I mean the last decade has been
very unusual for them and very uncomfortable. They do not
like to have to blow up things every few years.
They know that's not the formula. Listen, there's some talent
on the roster. This is you know, they're not the
(07:50):
Kansas City Chiefs, though, I mean, we're you know that
there's not a ton of depth on the team. They've
got some, you know, right, young hopeful stars certainly, you
know obviously Jackson Dart and Milik Neighbors and Scataboo and
you know, some of the guys on the offensive line,
but on the defensive line rather, But the offensive.
Speaker 8 (08:10):
Line is is what it is.
Speaker 9 (08:13):
They need think the roster needs to be better too,
and so I do think the it's always interesting if
you're going to keep the general manager, they must have
a lot of confidence that the general manager that Joe
can make improvements on this roster. At the same time,
they're obviously going to have another very high draft pick here.
Speaker 8 (08:31):
But you know, I'm not sure we should overstate how.
Speaker 9 (08:34):
Talented the roster is because there are still holes on
that roster other than Elik Neighbors. You know, the offensive
weapons are kind of thin in the passing game. So
this is definitely not where the Giants wanted to be.
Speaker 8 (08:49):
I'll just say that.
Speaker 2 (08:51):
Short term here.
Speaker 1 (08:52):
Mike Kafka, who has interviewed for a number of head
coaching jobs in the past, in all likelihood you would
think is not going to have Jackson Dart this week
he seperate a concussion.
Speaker 2 (09:02):
It's not a guarantee, but.
Speaker 1 (09:04):
By and large, we see more players miss at least
one game with a concussion than we even have in
years past. But one of my immediate questions, and clearly
again there's a series of steps here, we don't want
to move on too quickly because Brian Dable, who's a
good dude who we all like and have met and
spent time with, is out of a job, and that's
a crappy thing for everybody involved. But the season goes on,
(09:26):
and talking to people there today, that's what everyone was saying, like,
it's just hard. It sucks the way that you're up
in these games and then they get away from you
four times on the road, having a double digit lead
and going zero to four in those games. It's just
you never want to lose any game, but you definitely
don't want to have games fall apart like that. My
immediate questions go to number one, how exactly if it
all may Mike Kafka adjust things with the coaching staff.
(09:48):
At this point, he has not done that at all,
But Kafka taking on a head coaching job on an
inter basis. In addition to still having you would think
the offensive coordinator duties, is he still going to call
the place you would think yes, But as one of
you said, not always has been the case in the past.
The second part of this is, if it's no Jackson Dart,
are we convinced Russell Wilson Ian starts this next week
(10:12):
or do we go to if you want to try
to change the vibes, there is maybe the King of
vibes sitting there as your third string quarterback.
Speaker 3 (10:20):
I was actually gonna say that the King of Vibes
was actually what I was going to say, except probably
a little bit better. Yeah, I mean, I would say, look,
Russell Wilson has come in in relief of Jackson Dart
a couple of times and has looked truly terrible, like
really bad. Jameis Winston is going to look bad, but
he's also going to look good, and there's gonna be
(10:43):
a lot and like hard to imagine, just hard to imagine.
That the Giants move on from Brian day ball and
the first thing that interim coach Mike Kopka does is go,
We're gonna run Russell Wilson out there. I'd be surprised. Now,
we'll see we have not heard from him yet. I
have not heard any quarterback decisions yet, but I'm just
(11:03):
saying that would surprise me. And I would also say
we talk sometimes about like, oh, the interim coach is
going to have a chance. This feels more real to
me than a lot of them, Like Mike Kafka has
been a serious head coaching candidate, most recently, I believed
in Seattle, but a couple other places, Like I would
expect him to have a real shot at this thing.
Speaker 1 (11:24):
You know, they mostly with Jackson Dart, which you would
think also Mike would give him some level of leg up.
If again this thing works out and the new roles meshed,
there is something to be said for not doing what
so many other teams recent years have done, which is
blowing up the coaching staff and having a quarterback start
completely from scratching year two.
Speaker 5 (11:43):
Yeah, and by the way, they did block Mike Kafka
as an offensive coordinator candidate two years ago. The Seahawks
then had another to Seattle, right, Yeah, And the Seahawks
had another opening this year and they were told, if
you put in for him, we're going to block again.
So it wasn't technically another block, but they made it clear.
So yeah, he was thought at least that highly of
inside the building. And that's not just from Brian Dable,
(12:04):
that was from others higher up. They're now going to
have a chance to have a say here in this
coaching search. So yeah, I mean it does feel a
little bit real here. It does feel like a chance
for Kafka to show that he took that experience from
both of those stints as a coach in All Star
Games and UH and get a chance to translate it
to the field. It's a difficult balance, right if you're
(12:24):
handling the entire offense. That's why a lot of times
we see a special teams coach take over or something
like that. When I had conversations even with you guys
throughout the course of the season, we said, if the
Giants make a change, who are they turning to, Because
there's really no ready made interim guy like a Mike
McCoy on the staff here, so they go right to
Kafka as a chance for this, not just looking for
(12:45):
somebody with some stability.
Speaker 4 (12:47):
This is a okay, this is part of your interview
process here, Mike. So let's see what he can.
Speaker 1 (12:51):
Do, Mike, real quick here, since you gotta jump here
and momentarily any final thoughts beyond that, then beyond Kafka,
what exactly we know what the Giant's history is. It's
been a lot of offensive coaches in the past. It's
been quite a few of first time head coaches, though
not entirely. Kaughlin wasn't obviously, Pat Shermer wasn't. What do
(13:13):
you think ultimately they're looking for the new ket coach.
Speaker 5 (13:16):
It's got to be somebody who is a here we go,
we're in leader of men season already.
Speaker 4 (13:21):
It's got to be somebody that can command a building.
Speaker 5 (13:23):
Like they have gone with the Ben mcado with the
young offensive mind.
Speaker 4 (13:26):
They went with Pat Sherman, which of all the hires
that they've made recently, like that's the one. I just
still don't know what they saw there.
Speaker 5 (13:33):
They go with Brian Dable as kind of a mix
of both, even though he didn't have the previous head
coaching experience.
Speaker 4 (13:40):
I think, for for.
Speaker 5 (13:42):
All that we thought maybe Kauflin was an offensive mind,
Tom Coughlin was a guy that knew how to run
the building, knew how to get guys to do things.
They had to do to win football games. They've got
to go back and find somebody like that. So I
think that that'll be probably a big.
Speaker 4 (13:56):
Part of this coaching search coming up. Look, John Marra.
Speaker 5 (14:00):
An uncomfortable part of this, but John Marra has made
it clear he's dealing We haven't seen him much. He's
been dealing with some health issues, So how does that
factor and he's been diagnosed with cancer?
Speaker 4 (14:09):
Has that factor into this whole thing right here?
Speaker 5 (14:10):
This is something where that's a really personal health thing
that he's dealing with.
Speaker 4 (14:14):
You're adding this on top of that.
Speaker 5 (14:15):
So it's hard for me to kind of give a
prediction because there's so much influx inside that building. And again,
just to be clear, we wish John Mara the absolute
best in his battle against cancer.
Speaker 9 (14:25):
D Now, I do wonder if the fact that they
have had such limited success with inexperienced coaches makes them
cast a wider net and look at coaches who have
had previous experience just because the recent past has not
gone well with first time head coaches. This is a job.
(14:49):
I tweetd this and people started arguing with me, but.
Speaker 4 (14:51):
Like no.
Speaker 3 (14:55):
Read the comments.
Speaker 9 (14:56):
The New York Giants job is a plumb job, no
matter what condition they're in. Forget about the fact that
they've won two games. It's the New York Giants. It's
the New York Giants. It still means something in the
NFL world to be the head coach of the New
York Giants. They will have their pick of candidates, and
certainly the presidence of Jackson Dark only enhances that. So
(15:16):
they they can cast a wide net. They can take
the obvious, they can take their time. They've got plenty
of time now. But I do look at yes, I mean,
continuity is good, and certainly if Mike Kofka can run
off some wins here and things look good, then obviously
he has the inside track. But the idea of blowing
it up and making the quarterbacks start over, I mean,
that's working out pretty well in Chicago right now, right.
Speaker 8 (15:39):
So, I'm not sure you want to just rule that out.
Speaker 9 (15:41):
If you get the right guy, they've just got to
get the right guy. They've got to get the right guy.
They haven't been able to do it since Kafluin was here.
Speaker 4 (15:48):
I'll just throw one name out there. He's got head
coaching experience.
Speaker 5 (15:50):
He doesn't have a lot of head coaching experience, but
Antonio Pierce as a connection to that building, if he
gets an interview.
Speaker 4 (15:55):
Would not be suppressed.
Speaker 2 (15:57):
Mike, thank you.
Speaker 4 (15:58):
We'll be right back with more.
Speaker 6 (16:00):
On the inside.
Speaker 2 (16:13):
Welcome in our Steve Whites to the conversation.
Speaker 1 (16:16):
Now, a lot to discuss from the Sunday of Week
ten in the NFL.
Speaker 2 (16:21):
The first ian.
Speaker 1 (16:22):
Let's start out with an injury update from the Bengals,
a positive injury update, which there have not been many
of those. Joe Burrow are a little sooner than any
of us expected. Officially back on the practice field today.
What are we looking at in terms of not just
getting out there on a limited basis, but actually returning
to play for Joe Burrow.
Speaker 3 (16:41):
Yeah, really significant day for the Cincinnati Bengals. And we've
spent a lot of time over the last several weeks
looking at the Bengals record, looking at the calendar, looking
at Joe Burrow and being like, all right, if they're
here by here, then maybe he could maybe he could play.
And the way he was described to me was if
they are alive, he's got a shot in early to
(17:03):
mid December. Well, they're alive, maybe not as alive as
they wish they would be. But they're alive, and he
is going to practice this week. He's twenty one day
window is open. He has been cleared for limited participation
in practice. Basically, what this means is he is now
allowed to do football drills. So to do football drills,
you do them in practice. He has now cleared to
(17:24):
practice on a limited basis. I would imagine that he
is practicing with one of those steal like bottoms of
your feet, those like orthotic, you know, to protect his toe.
That's basically what you do if you come back a
little early. But he's got a shot. And I would
also say this, the Bengals are what are they three insects?
Speaker 7 (17:47):
Right?
Speaker 3 (17:47):
I think they're three in six.
Speaker 2 (17:49):
And two games out in the division.
Speaker 3 (17:51):
Right, And look, the schedule's hard, of course it's hard.
But the way it was explained to me is if
they're alive, don't be surprised you see him in December
with him practicing now, I wouldn't be surprised if we
see him no matter what, he's gonna want to play,
and if he's good enough to play, I imagine we're
going to see him. This is a big day for Cincy.
Speaker 4 (18:14):
Steve Oh my bad.
Speaker 7 (18:16):
Well, look, look, if he wants to play, he's gonna play.
But the thing is, the Bengals issues aren't a quarterback,
right the Bengals, if they want to get contention, they
got to stop some people. Joe I mean, Joe Burrow
is that guy. But I'm gonna say Joe Flacco is
playing well, probably why they're in contention now. But if
Burrow does come back, Okay, let's make it fun again,
(18:36):
Cincinnati Bengals. You know you've done the last couple of years,
and Joe Burrow has been healthy. Let's make it fun
down the stretch.
Speaker 9 (18:41):
I mean that division is totally there. They're not that
far out that obviously. The Steelers are lagging or struggling
right now. The Ravens are coming up are now. But sure,
I mean, if he gets back, if Joe Flacco can
sort of hold the Ford and the defense can hold
the Ford for a few more weeks, win some games
here there, then it's just you know, a free for
(19:04):
all coming down the final month or six weeks of
the season. They totally have a chance to sneak in,
especially as a wildcard like it's it's got to be
such a lift. Obviously, he is a great player. It's
got to be such an emotional lift for that team
to see him walk out there, like you know, it's
just it gives you hope. So I totally expect that
(19:25):
he will be back on the field. Why wouldn't he play.
He'll want to.
Speaker 3 (19:28):
Play, He'll want to play. And I would say, schedule wise,
he's not going to play this week. That's the Steelers.
He's not going to play next week probably that's the Patriots,
and then they have the Ravens on Thanksgiving.
Speaker 8 (19:43):
Oh, turn, that would be that'd be a way to return.
Speaker 1 (19:50):
That way, that would be well ahead of the timeline.
Probably the more likely is after that game, which is
only what seventeen days away from right now, you activate
him after that game, you save the rosters pot, and
he comes back in December, which was always kind of
the target.
Speaker 3 (20:06):
Everything is not as fun as my thing.
Speaker 1 (20:08):
It's not as fun, But I'm trying to also be realistic.
It's a three month he's got a three month injury
and it's been two months.
Speaker 4 (20:15):
Let's start there, right.
Speaker 1 (20:16):
It's a it's a it's a tricky thing. But again,
the fact that he's out there, this is sooner than
we thought we'd see him on the practice field. Let's
see he's after where it goes from there. Let's go
out to your backyard.
Speaker 2 (20:26):
Steve Weis. We got a showdown next week.
Speaker 1 (20:30):
It's the Seahawks against the Ram, two teams that when
you watch them, and I know, you know the Seahawks,
some weird stuff happens in that game, but I mean
they look like monsters against the Cardinals. Same thing with
the Rams, where maybe you're playing a team that's a
little bit shorthanded, but they got after him in San
francisc Let's go. I don't want to see either of
(20:51):
those teams in January, and games like this can go
a long way toward determining are you potentially as one
of the other NFC contenders going in playing a division
playoff game, even in a conference championship in La or
in Seattle.
Speaker 4 (21:05):
Yeah, look, both these teams I tweeted about this is Hagler.
Speaker 2 (21:08):
Hearns right.
Speaker 7 (21:09):
The way these teams have come out of the gate
and scored points offensively. They're not sitting back. There's no
counterpunching here. These guys are just digging in and they're
throwing blows. You saw what Seattle did to the Arizona Cardinals.
It was a damn shaman. The craziest number I saw
all weekend long. Sam Darnold nine of ten for one
hundred and sixty seven yards in the first half against Arizona.
Speaker 4 (21:29):
He finishes ten of twelve.
Speaker 7 (21:31):
He only threw two more passes in the game because
they absolutely took apart the Cardinals because that offense, that's crazy.
Speaker 4 (21:37):
It's crazy.
Speaker 7 (21:38):
And he wasn't like he came out what like they
put in a backup quarterback.
Speaker 2 (21:42):
He played.
Speaker 7 (21:42):
They just devastated Arizona and they have been playing like
this their last two games.
Speaker 4 (21:47):
They're averaging thirty seven points.
Speaker 7 (21:50):
But the Rams they're averaging thirty seven points as well
over the last three games, and Matthew Stafford's playing as
well as any won. The Rams offensive line is getting healthy,
they're running the ball, getting back Pooka to go with DeVante,
and seeing the Rams actually incorporate multiple tight ends into
their offense. Now you know Sean Sean McVay is an
(22:12):
eleven personnel guys, sometimes they'll run a lot of twelve
personnel to two tight end sets. So again the offenses
look scary, but the defenses look equally scary. We know
how good that Rams defensive front is, but the way
Leonard Williams and in Seattle, I mean they sat Jacobi
Pressett five times in the first half of that game.
Speaker 4 (22:31):
They get after it.
Speaker 7 (22:32):
So this is strength on strength and as you mentioned,
tom As, this could set up for potential home field
in the playoffs, and we know, especially if it's in Seattle,
this is a This is a significant game and possibly
determined who could win a very, very tough division.
Speaker 9 (22:51):
They look like the two best teams, well, certainly the
two best teams in the NFC. We're going to see
the Eagles tonight, but they haven't looked anywhere near this
level so far. They look like they might be the
two best teams in the NFL right now. The way
they're playing. I mean, Matthew Stafford is playing at an
insanely high level, and Seattle might be the most complete
(23:12):
team right now, the most balanced. So those games are
going to be I mean, they are clearly very important
for playoff seating, but they might tell us an awful
lot about what team we're going to be looking at
at the end of January too into February, because I've seen.
I've watched both teams the last few weeks, and I
(23:32):
have not seen a team play better.
Speaker 3 (23:35):
Jean, I'm going to let you guys finish this out
and jump off and make a call. Although I agree
with everything, everyone just.
Speaker 2 (23:45):
Here's and you go hand to your business.
Speaker 7 (23:47):
I'll tell you what, Tom, The one thing we really
didn't see incorporated with the Seahawks and they took about
Arizona was Rashisha heat He played, but we didn't see
his potential impact. This is a game where we can
see it because the Rams are really good at safety,
but their corners, you know, they're still trying to work
some things out. So I just can't wait to see
the way this plays out. The Seattle's passing game isn't
(24:09):
necessarily a quick passing game, so the Rams pass rushers
can get after him. Same with the Rams. Their passing
plays tended to take a while to develop, so these
defenses are going to have a say in this. I
am really looking. It's a Sunday night game too, I believe,
so this is this is going to be the you
know that the mid season game of the year, so
(24:31):
to speak.
Speaker 1 (24:32):
It just I keep saying it every week, but this
twenty twenty five Sea Owks team reminds me a lot
of the twenty thirteen I agree, this team can throw
the ball a lot better. You know those teams, And
somewhere Doug Baldwin's going to see this quoted and it's going.
Speaker 2 (24:45):
To text me.
Speaker 1 (24:46):
But like, they didn't have a Jackson Smith and Jigga
on that team, They didn't have a Rasid Shiheed style.
Speaker 2 (24:52):
Burner on the team.
Speaker 1 (24:53):
Cooper Cup, you know, is a dirty work type of guy,
and Sam Darnold's playing at a really high level. But
the way that that defense with a bunch of guys
who not all of them are high draft picks, not
all of them, I don't think anybody on that defense.
Maybe Leonard Williams is like a household type of name,
but they just they play so hard, fast, physical discipline.
You can see in year one they were pretty good.
(25:15):
I remember they went ten and seven, they were the
real ten win team and missed the playoffs.
Speaker 2 (25:19):
But the way that they play.
Speaker 1 (25:21):
Now and you can see Mike McDonald getting the pieces
in place to play the way that he wants to,
it's pretty impressive.
Speaker 2 (25:27):
Steve.
Speaker 1 (25:28):
I also want to ask you about sad news that
we had yesterday regarding the former NFL Commissioner Paul Tagliabu.
My time covering the NFL only marginally overlapped with Paul.
He certainly was a giant in the game. But you
covered the NFL, you know, during the certainly during the
meat of his tenure. Just tell me, you know your
(25:48):
your reaction to the news, but also what you remember
most about Paul Taglibu, the NFL commission.
Speaker 7 (25:53):
Yeah, I mean, look, it's it's the course of life.
We're seeing a lot of people, you know, run that.
We saw Lenny Wilkins, the basket Hall of Famer, also
passed yesterday. But Paul Tagliabu, you know, I had the
good fortune Paul went to the Pro Football Hall of
Fame in twenty twenty. You know, I do our Hall
of Fame coverage, but he went in twenty twenty.
Speaker 2 (26:12):
I'm sorry.
Speaker 7 (26:12):
In twenty twenty two, Art McNally, the first official, went
into the Pro Football Hall of Fame.
Speaker 4 (26:18):
And when we do the.
Speaker 7 (26:19):
Door knocks, we have a Hall of famer break the
news to the incoming in Trinee, and it was Paul Taglibu.
So I got to spend the afternoon with him. And
you know, Paul, he's really tall. I played basketball at Georgetown.
He's a lawyer, and you're just getting all this astutent knowledge,
and you know, he's telling me about some of the
tough decisions he had to go through, such as moving
the Super Bowl out of Arizona one year because it
(26:43):
refused to recognize that Martin Luther King holiday and move
it to San Diego and why that was such an
important thing to him and so many people in the league.
Speaker 4 (26:50):
But he did it right.
Speaker 7 (26:52):
He saw the potential economic loss that Arizona was going
to face by doing this, but he just thought the
standard of doing something like that was more important. And
they also made it back to Arizona on the back end.
But you just see some of the things that he did.
You know, they had He had four teams come into
the league when he was there.
Speaker 4 (27:09):
He had a lot of movement teams relocating.
Speaker 2 (27:13):
While he was there.
Speaker 9 (27:14):
You know.
Speaker 7 (27:15):
You know a lot of people say, well, he wasn't
that hard on the concussion issue, and that's something that
lingered over him. That's why he did not get into
the Hall of Fame for years, because there weren't the
studies and there wasn't the attention paid to concussions like
we have now. He's he's admitted that he didn't take it,
you know, seriously enough. But other than you know, other
than that significant issue, he's just scene as a as
(27:37):
a great leader of corraling the owners. We saw ownership
come in, people like Jerry Jones come in and get
things done. So he's he's another one of these commissions
who grew the league television rights, things like that, we
saw the World League and things like that.
Speaker 4 (27:53):
So just just a fantastic gentleman.
Speaker 7 (27:56):
Scholarly, he was a lawyer, but just someone who always
really looked out for the league itself but also for
the players because you know, is big thing that people
talk about was the labor piece with the Players Association,
the players Union that reigned during his whole tenure during
the NFL's commissioner.
Speaker 1 (28:18):
Steve, thank you very much for that perspective. We got
a lot more to come on The Insiders Part two.
If you're on the podcast, if you're on YouTube or
catching this on the NFL channel on fast streaming platforms,
just stay tuned. We will get into all the big
stuff happened in the AFC in games yesterday, including the
Dolphins running the Bills off the field. That's a really thing,
(28:40):
really a real thing that happened here. We had some
instant impact from some of the players that were traded,
including Sauce Gardner. That and a whole lot more for
Steve as well as Judy, Mike and Ian. This is
how the show goes, especially on Mondays, a lot of
stuff going on.
Speaker 2 (28:56):
I appreciate you all listening to what
Speaker 6 (29:00):
The
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Judy Battista
Tom Pelissero
Ian Rapaport
Mike Garafolo
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