August 3, 2023 • 26 mins
Mike and Wes continue to discuss the noteworthy items from training camp, including DL Devonte Wyatt's strong start (:44), the shuffling on the O-line (8:04), the visit from Peyton Manning (15:13), and the arrival of Derrick Coleman to the front office (23:05).
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hi, everybody. Welcome to another edition of Packers unscripted from
Packers dot Com. I am Mike Spofford, joined as always
by my trusted colleague Weston Hodkowitz. We're coming to you
once again from different locations at Lambeufield and West.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
That's so much different this time, Mike. You're right down
the hall from me now, right.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
But things are things are so busy and so crazy
during training camp that I can't even get in the
studio today, let alone both of us being able to
get in the studio to.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
We're gonna do it for the storage closet here soon, yeah.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
For so they'll just keep moving us around as we
get through our various episodes. But the logistics aside. Packers
are in the midst of training camp here and conducted
another full padded practice on Tuesday since we had recorded
our previous show. There'll be another practice not long after
(01:01):
we get this show recorded. One thing I wanted to
touch on here, Wes, and you wrote about it. There's
a story on packers dot com for those who want
to check it out. We talked a lot on our
last show about the one on ones, which kind of
get cranked up when the players put the pads on
and whatnot. And one guy who's really been standing out
(01:21):
in those one on one drills is the second year
defensive lineman Davante Wyatt. It looks like he is off
to a very very good start, the former first round
pick in his second season.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
Yeah, yeahs Mike. And it was really interesting talking to
him at his locker earlier this week because Pete Doherty
was actually there, and you know, we were talking about
the first rep that he took actually might have been
the second one against Josh Myers, and obviously it was
a big victory for Wyatt, but he hit him with
the spin move, and Pete Doherty asked him that. He's like,
you know, is that is that kind of like one
(01:54):
of your big moves. He's like, oh, yeah, that's my
special move, and we all kind of got a big
laugh on it because then later on in practice going
up against I believe it's Gene Delance. I want to
make sure you get that right, one of the practice
squad holdover from last year. Then he switched over and
he converted to his power and again was able to
get the offensive lineman on the ground while keeping his
(02:15):
own balance, mind you, and I think what we've seen
with Devonte White in year two is the game has
slowed down. I know that's a big cliche, but now
he's been able to do this rep after rep after rep.
They don't have Dean Lowery anymore, they don't have Jaron Reid.
When you look at that base defensive front, and specifically
(02:38):
that nickel front with him and probably Kenny Clark at
the three tech spots, this is a huge opportunity for
the young man, and I think he's really taken advantage
of it so far. Now, again, these are just practices.
We just put the pads on. But if you were
looking for the indicators that DeVante White is ready for
this opportunity, I think you're seeing them because again, played
(02:58):
I think just over two hundred snaps last year. He
only missed one game all regular season, but he just
he was averaging about ten snaps a game. But when
he started to build some momentum at the end of
the season, I think that helped his confidence. And now
he's coming back looking a lot more. I don't want
to say dominant, because again, we got to see some
we got see some joint practices, we got to see
some preseason games we got to get in the regular season.
(03:20):
But I think the Packers have to be feeling really
good right now that, Okay, we're gonna stick with him
and TJ. Slayton. We're not going to bring any other
veterans to replace Lowery and Reid. I think the Signs
have been really promising that they made the right choice.
Speaker 1 (03:31):
Yeah, I think the question the question that's still out
there with Wyatt. To me, the Packers drafted him you
as as an interior defensive lineman. You're a first round
pick when you show you can rush the passer from
that spot. The Packers didn't have any questions. I don't think.
I don't think anybody does with regard to the pass
rush is going to come. It's going to be there
(03:54):
for Wyatt from uh, you know, from that three tech
spot or wherever he may line up on the interior.
The question at this level is going to be will
he be able to will he be able to hold
up and be the type of disruptive force against the
run that he was in college? And things can be
a little bit different in the NFL. It's not as
easy as just beating your man and getting into the
(04:15):
backfield to stop the run, because if that play is
not coming at you, you know, it's really easy for
a gap or a hole to to open up and
uh and then boom, suddenly you know, a run is
out the gate. The run defense has played a little
bit a little bit differently in the NFL in that regard,
and I'm not saying that DeVante Wyatt can't do it,
but because he had such limited playing time as a rookie,
(04:39):
I think we have to see if he's going to
be able to be a run stopper down after down,
just as I think he's going to be able to
consistently put pressure on the quarterback when given those opportunities.
The comment, the quote that has that has stood out.
It's shown up in our coverage and and coverage elsewhere.
When defensive lineman Jerry Montgomery with the media during the spring,
(05:01):
I can't remember exactly if it was OTA's or mini
camp or exactly what it was, but he was talking
about Week eighteen against the Lions. Obviously that was a
disappointing loss for the Packers, but in the midst of
that game, Wyatt got a strip sack of Jared Goff
of Detroit and it was probably the biggest highlight play
of his rookie campaign, and Montgomery said when Wyatt came
(05:23):
off the field after that play, he commented like, hey, coach,
I think I'm starting to get it, you know. And yes,
it was week eighteen and everybody was hoping that maybe
it would come around a little bit sooner for Wyatt,
but there he had such a strong finish to the season,
not just with that play but over the last month
of the regular season last year, that what we're seeing
(05:44):
now at the start of training camp is not necessarily surprised.
It really looks like he is building off of what
he did last December.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
Yeah, absolutely in that That's what I kind of was
talking about. And I asked him about that, the momentum
that he kind of derived from the end of that season,
and he said there was a little bit, but he's like,
I feel much more confident now. And I think that
was the totality of his offseason. I feel like that
was everything that he put in with the reps with
Kenny Clark and you know, TJ. Slayton during the offseason program.
(06:12):
And then the other thing that's interesting too. You mentioned it,
like the Packers the run defense, that's the big thing
for them this year. Whatever you want to put it on,
whatever the issues were last season, twenty six is twenty six.
Then Green Bay knows they need to do better against that.
They can't give up five yards a clip against the
run this season, I feel like getting back to a
more traditional nose tackle and TJ. Slayton is a big
(06:34):
piece to that. You know, for years you'd see not
just Green Bay, but a lot of teams in the NFL.
As teams got faster, we saw, you know, safeties playing linebacker.
We saw three hundred and fifteen pound nose tackles. We'd
gotten kind of away from the Ryan Pickett sort of
generation of three hundred and forty pounds and just an
absolute handful for interior alignment to deal with. Slayton is
(06:57):
a little bit more out of that mold, right at
three hundred fourty pounds. With as much athleticism that he has,
He's going to be a big piece at the one tech.
But it's not just one player. It is on Wide,
it's on Clark, it's on everybody behind them to hold
up their end of the bargain. I think the Packers
are going to be able to get after the quarterback
this season. I feel pretty confident saying that with Rashaun
(07:18):
Gary coming back, Lucas Fanas is the first round pick,
the athleticism they have on the interior defensive line, and
even guys like you know, Devondre Campbell and Kuay Walker
behind that, it's about okay. Right out of the gate, Mike,
You're going to see New Orleans, You're going to see Atlanta.
There's a first round pick that Detroit drafted. You're going
to see a lot of running backs that are either
(07:39):
top of the line or considered, you know, that next
wave of elite backs, and Green Bay has to be
able to stop them.
Speaker 1 (07:45):
And you're going to see a quarterback in week one
who likes to run the ball, not just from a
scrambling standpoint, you know, busted plays, but actually designed runs,
you know, justin fields and the Chicago Bears. He likes
to play running backs sometimes as quarterback, and that's going
to be a challenge right out of the gate in
Week one at Soldier Field as well. So shifting gears
(08:06):
to the other side of the ball for a minute.
One thing that we will be watching pretty closely here
as training camp continues, starting to see some more shuffling
on the offensive line with the number one unit in
terms of where guys are lining up specifically, we've now
seen Zach Tom starting to take some snaps at center
with the number one offensive line in place of Josh Myers,
(08:28):
with Yosh Niman playing right tackle. So that's a combination
that the coaches are are going to take a look at,
and I think the best way to try to understand
what's going on here. Larry articulated it very well in
our three Things video after practice on Tuesday. I tried
to do the same thing in our Insider Inbox column
(08:49):
on Wednesday morning. If you go by what Matt Lafleur
has been saying all along that it's about getting the
best five on the field, it really looks like right
now three of those best five our David Baktiari Elton Jenkins,
and John Runyon. We haven't seen really anything but those
guys being in their traditional spots. But then it's between
(09:11):
yash Niman, Josh Myers, and Zach Tom. Two of those
three guys will be will round out the best five.
So it's three guys competing for two spots. Obviously, Meyer's
only a center. Nyman only plays tackle, Zach Tom can
play either one, so in some respects if you look
(09:34):
at it as well, if Zach Tom proves that he's
one of the best five, and I'm not saying that
that's been decided yet, but say if it evolves that way,
and Zach Tom proves that he's one of the best five,
then his position potentially could be determined by who is
the other guy who joins the best five, and then
Zach Tom just fills in the other spot. That's one
(09:54):
way that this could evolve. But it's something that we
will watch as training camp continues, as we get into
the preseason games and and where guys are taking reps,
because nothing's for certain yet, but but it certainly is
is starting to take a little bit more shape in
terms of exactly what's being looked at.
Speaker 2 (10:12):
First off, what Zach Tom is doing is just the
darnedest thing I think I've ever seen during an NFL
training camp. We've seen that, right, you know, Elton Jenkins
plays guard and tackle, and we've seen these guys. I
don't know if I've ever seen a guy in team
period switch between right tackle and center depending on which
which package is in and the look that they're getting.
Speaker 1 (10:30):
I mean, yeah, and sometimes from period to period, like
he doesn't just get to play one spot for like
a whole practice like he's he's he gets, you know,
three snaps at one spot and then he's taking three
or four snaps at the other. It is. It is
pretty amazing. And uh and you know, the not just
the physical challenge but the mental challenge in terms of
the plays and executing the responsibilities at two different spots
(10:51):
within the same practice. That that can't be easy.
Speaker 2 (10:54):
No, And it takes a smart kid to do that.
And obviously, as we've talked about numerous times now, he
has put on the weight this offseason, kind of anchored
down a little bit. He feels like that's helped him.
But because of that, it's also allowed him to have
that flexibility to challenge at multiple positions. And you know,
as much as Zach Tom I'm sure loves to be
versaal and loves to play different spots, I'm guessing his
(11:14):
goal at the end of the day. I don't think
I'm going too far dow a limb saying this is
to be a Week one starter when the Packers travel
to Soldier Field, that the interesting aspect of this though,
that I find the most funny is right off the bat,
you say, David back Terry Delton Jenkins. That goes without saying.
I love the trajectory that John Runyan has been on,
(11:36):
where you know, he was in the lineup and he
was out of the lineup, and then it was Lucas Patrick,
and then it wasn't Lucas Patrick and it's Runyon and
then the last two years, I don't even know if,
like the gathered media has even talked to the kid
that much. He just does his job. He's owned now
right guard. He started last year at left guard before
they made the flop with you know, the switch with
(11:58):
with Yash and he's just steady as they go. I mean,
I feel like John running has just been an ultimate
premium pick for the Packers coming out of that twenty draft.
But because of that, you know, in Zach Tom competing
the way he is, it creates some questions there about
if he could potentially push Fitz center too. So competition
brings out the best in everybody. Mike, you and I
(12:18):
have said that since the beginning of time, and the
Packers ultimately they're gonna need all six of those guys
this year. I doubt there's a scenario in which they
all end up healthy from week one to week thirty
eight or whatever the season runs now. So the fact
of the matter is you have to have options, and
Zach tom gives the Packers a heck of a lot
of them.
Speaker 1 (12:34):
Yeah, and what you said about Runying is spot on too,
you know. For a guy to come in as a
sixth round pick and he was an All Big Ten
tackle at Michigan, and the Packers you know, saw him
as as an interior lineman, you know, from the start,
and he's learned the guard spot. He's played both sides,
he's played on either side of the center, and suddenly
(12:57):
now he's kind of entrenched at right guard and nobody
you know, putting up a serious challenge for him at
that spot. When you can find when you can find
a reliable, like don't have to worry about it type
of player in the sixth round of the draft and
he's actually playing in the NFL at a position that
(13:18):
he didn't even play in college, that says something about
the scouting evaluation, but also says something about that player,
that individual in particular, and how he's gone about the
transition to the NFL. It's it's been pretty impressive on
Runyan's part.
Speaker 2 (13:32):
Huge value too, right, you go back, you think Olayne
Taylor getting eight years out of Green Bay after being
an undrafted free draft thirteen and again, very same credentials.
He played guard at Oklahoma State as where you know,
Runyon was playing tackle but just didn't get enough respect.
People didn't think he was athletic enough. They weren't sure
if he could do it at this level. And he
ends up being a six foot five, three hundred and
(13:53):
twenty four pound like stalwart on your offensive line for years.
And I think those are the ties. Those are the
type of guys that you can't say enough about because
you can't always be spending first round picks on interior
defense or interior offensive linemen and run And I think
kind of, I know I went off on a tangent
with your point, your original point, but I just think
(14:14):
it's very funny that that's not even been a conversation.
He's just been the guy as much as Elton Jenkins
has been the guy at left guard. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (14:21):
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Speaker 2 (14:55):
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Speaker 1 (14:59):
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Speaker 2 (15:04):
It has been fifty years of better, it's just fifty
years in change of that.
Speaker 1 (15:08):
Yeah, right, Like that's the other fifty plus years. So well,
another another topic I wanted to get to that we
had so much with regard to what was going on
at practice to to get to on our last show,
that we didn't get to the fact that at Monday's practice,
this week, Peyton Manning was in attendance the uh the
(15:31):
Hall of Fame quarterback, two time Super Bowl champion and
now very very busy with his own media production business.
And no, he was not here to talk to Jordan
Love about the Netflix Quarterback series. That was not part
of their discussion. But Jordan Love did reveal to the
media some of the stuff that they did talk about,
(15:53):
and he was really appreciative of the chance to talk
with Peyton Manning one on one, and they talked a
lot about, you know, just preparation, you know, how to
how to study film and you know, how to be
that that leader and that that main communicator on the
offense when it comes to your lineman and your receivers
and all that, and uh, you know, Jordan Love soaked
(16:15):
up everything he could from, uh, from that conversation with
Peyton Manning, and I think he, you know, he really
appreciated that opportunity.
Speaker 2 (16:22):
Yeah, a neat opportunity for a young guy that you know,
you always go back to thinking about, like when you know,
Aaron Rodgers got to Green Bay and he talked about
the influence that Joe Montana had on him and Steve
Young and those guys from the Bay Area and and
obviously quarterbacks learned from quarterbacks, right, It's the way it
all goes in our profession too. There's writers we aspired
(16:44):
to be and and and people that we enjoyed reading.
So for Love to be able to have that interaction,
I thought was really valuable. And as Matt Lafleur said,
you know, Peyton coming and saying in words to the
entire team though, those are those are the monumental kind
of things because as Jordan's talked about, and I think
we don't discuss this enough, Peyton Manning had a ton
(17:07):
of pressure on him coming into the National Football League. Now,
social media twenty five years ago isn't what it is today,
so he probably didn't have to like look at it
from every single person giving their opinion at every single second.
But the fact of the matter is he was Archie
Manning's son. He was the first overall pick and he
threw what was it, twenty nine interceptions his first year
(17:28):
in the National Football League.
Speaker 1 (17:30):
Still has the rookie record for most interceptions in one season.
Speaker 2 (17:34):
Yeah, no, rookies really gonna get that much of a
leash these days, Xeah Exactly.
Speaker 1 (17:39):
That's the thing It's kind of like what Brett Farres said.
You know, he holds the all time record for interceptions
for a career. It's like, well, you have to be
doing something right if you be allowed to throw that
many interceptions. And Peyton Manning was allowed to throw that
many as a rookie because the Colts knew what they
had and certainly it eventually came around for him.
Speaker 2 (17:57):
And the Colts weren't very good that year either, right,
and next thing you know, they turn it around and
they'd become a perennial playoff team and eventually a super
Bowl champion. But to be able to level with a
guy like Jordan Love like that, I think that's important
because it reminds you that whatever the result is today
doesn't mean that that predestines to you to what tomorrow
(18:18):
is going to be good or bad. Right, there's going
to be ebbs and flows to this game. And it's
the number one thing I talked about all off season
when we would do these podcasts, when we do unscripted,
when we talk to Larry, is that Jordan Love, that's
the biggest transition for me, That that's the biggest hurdle
I think he needs to climb is just that you're
going to play a game on Sunday. You're going to
(18:39):
break it down. You know, unless you start winning a
bunch of games, you don't have you get victory Mondays.
But you're gonna have to break it down on Monday
and you start getting ready for the new game plan
on Wednesday. That's the That's how the life of an
NFL quarterback goes. You have to have that short memory
and you have to keep building towards what's coming next.
And I feel like that is the personification of what
(19:00):
Peyton Manning did in his career. That's how you last
as long as he did in the league, in addition
to just having a you know a lot of God
given talent and ability. So I think it's exciting right now.
I think it's exciting for the Green Bay Packers when
you get that type of player in here. I mean
all our eyes immediately from the sidelines started going over there.
I started when you as soon as you notice Peyton
Manning there, it is something that's going to catch you.
(19:21):
And I'm just really happy for Peyton Manning too that
he got to chat with Red Batty, because when you
talk about legendary people in the National Football League. Peyton
Manning's up there. He's pretty good. Hall of Famer, but
Red Batty Gordon just the cut above. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (19:36):
Well, the other thing I really enjoyed was hearing Matt
Lafleur at the podium the other day reminiscing about a
very bad memory early in his coaching career when he
had just broken into the league with the Houston Texans
and they basically blew a seventeen point lead to Peyton
Manning in the last five minutes of the game. And
(19:56):
it's funny, West because I, you know, me and my
curiosity and how you know. So I went and looked
up the game and exactly like, okay, so, how did
Peyton Manning pull off this comeback? Well, one, it wasn't
It wasn't all Peyton Manning. But this is how it unfolded,
and you have to picture. Okay, if you're Matt Lafleur,
this is this is like his fourth or fifth game
(20:17):
as an NFL assistant coach, on the bottom of the
totem pole quality control level with the Houston Texans. He's
just just gotten into the league in two thousand and eight,
and he's a month into his career as an NFL coach,
and he's watching from the press box and his team
has a twenty seven to ten lead with about five
minutes to go. Huge underdogs, the Texans against the Colts,
(20:38):
and Peyton Manning drives the Colts down for a touchdown.
It's twenty seven to seventeen. Then the Texans fumble the ball,
it gets scooped up and run back seventy yards for
a touchdown, so it's twenty seven to twenty four. And
then the Texans fumble the ball again. The Colts recover,
Peyton Manning drives them down and gets the touchdown to
(20:59):
take the lead with a little bit under two minutes left.
And then the Texans get one more shot and the
quarterback throws an interception. So that's actually how that game unfolded.
So you talk about a game that is going to
make an impression on a young coach who's just broken
into the league. He's up against a you know, watching
a Hall of Fame quarterback on the other side, seeing
(21:19):
how how you absolutely have to play and execute and
do things right for sixty minutes in order to win
games in this league, and how huge a factor turnovers
can be.
Speaker 2 (21:29):
I mean it was.
Speaker 1 (21:30):
It was all laid out for Matt Lafluor right there
in that game against Peyton Manning and the Colts. And
it was fun to hear him talk about that bad memory,
but then also look up the details of exactly what unfolded,
because there's no question that that game made a big
impression on Matt Lafleur and how it's shaped him as
a head coach.
Speaker 2 (21:49):
Yeah, and people wonder why Matt always talks about turnover
margin different exactly exactly, Just look at that one first
month of the two thousand and eight season, twenty seven
to ten, with five minutes to go.
Speaker 1 (22:00):
Look what happened.
Speaker 2 (22:01):
So it'll turn, it'll turn whatever it is, a seventeen
point lead into a deficit real quick when you start
tumbling balls for touchdowns. But but hey, listen, I mean
it's cool, it's it is the neat thing about training camp.
I remember, if I can just say one last story
here before we cut out, The first time I saw
John Madden at one of our training camps. I was
still at the Press because ut of the time John
(22:22):
was a little bit older, but he was here. I
can't remember what the project was for, but you start
to see some of these people that have had such
an impact on the game of football and what the
sport that we enjoy today. And there's no like goodyear
blimp saying hey, welcome, Pete mcley just kind of show
up from time to time during camp, right yep here
there and and to me, that's that's always the most fun.
(22:44):
And yeah, a very cool memory. And I think something
that Jordan love is he ventures off as we talk
about it, into his first year as a head as
a head coach, as a quarterback, starting quarterback in the
National Football League. One of those like tiny moments that
kind of builds up to something special.
Speaker 1 (23:00):
Yeah, absolutely, and Manning did. He addressed the entire team
actually after practice on Monday, shared some words of wisdom
and everything.
Speaker 2 (23:07):
There.
Speaker 1 (23:07):
I know we do have to get going. But I
want to mention one other thing to all of our
loyal listeners readers out there. If you have not checked
out Wes's story on Derek Coleman, the deaf slash heard
of hearing Super Bowl champion from the Seattle Seahawks who
is now a member of the Packers' front office in
the player engagement area, you need to read that story.
(23:30):
It's really really well done. It's a great story by
about a great individual. I'll give you just a minute here,
Wes to talk about how that story came together and
the impression that it made on you as the writer.
Speaker 2 (23:44):
Well, it was fun, Mike, because I think you and
I we both remember Derek Coleman and the Duracell commercial
and everything he was a part of with the Seattle Seahawks,
good bad and in between, right. I mean, there was
a touchdown in twenty fourteen and that opener at you know,
Oughton Seattle that I'll never quite forget either. But that
being said, from a football perspective and what he means
to this community, I feel like it was fun being
(24:07):
a part of that. So basically, myself, Tyler Gaieski, and
Nick McGahan from our video department all went down to
Verona Area High School beautiful high school by the way, Michael,
down in your southern eastern part of the woods, southwestern
southwestern sorry.
Speaker 1 (24:22):
Near Madison I know is yeah, Verona is very close
to Madison for those who don't know.
Speaker 2 (24:27):
Terrible at geography. It was my worst subject. Sorry, But
that being said, I'm really getting off to a great
start on this promo R and I. But the fact
was is that being able to be with him in
the American Sign language. Students from Verona, Wisconsin School from
the Deaf was also there. Their faculty had came to
the event and listening to Derek's message, and it's one
thing to read stories, it's one thing to watch amazing
(24:50):
video packages that have been put together over the years,
but when you actually see the way he interacts with kids,
it was very special. And having a chance to talk
with Gray Rugemer about him and Matt Lafleur made a comment,
and then certainly some of the lives he's touched away
from football. You know, that was the coolest part of
the experience to me because you see what a certain
(25:11):
amount of celebrity can do for the good of the
world if used in channeled properly, and I feel like
Derek Coleman has really done that. Now, as you mentioned,
the assistant to Gray Rugemer in the player engagement area,
it's the perfect role for Derek. He has had such
an incredible lived experience and his ability to kind of
relay and tell players what it's like to go through things,
(25:34):
I think is really important because in a lot of
ways he had to study this book over and over
and over again to make it as long as he
did in the National Football League, And as Aaron Jones
told me during the offseason when I talked to him
about it, you know, he feels like he could be
a real special piece to what this team is building
now moving forward. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (25:51):
Absolutely, And I encourage everyone to check out that story.
It was posted on packers dot com Wednesday. Shouldn't be
too hard to find and uh and I think you'll
really enjoy it. So with that, we will call it
a wrap on this edition of Packers Unscripted. Be sure
to follow all of our coverage of training camp. We've
got it all for you on packers dot com. For Wes,
I am Mike. Thank you for tuning in everybody. We
(26:14):
will see you next time.
Hi, everybody. Welcome to another edition of Packers unscripted from
Packers dot Com. I am Mike Spofford, joined as always
by my trusted colleague Weston Hodkowitz. We're coming to you
once again from different locations at Lambeufield and West.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
That's so much different this time, Mike. You're right down
the hall from me now, right.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
But things are things are so busy and so crazy
during training camp that I can't even get in the
studio today, let alone both of us being able to
get in the studio to.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
We're gonna do it for the storage closet here soon, yeah.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
For so they'll just keep moving us around as we
get through our various episodes. But the logistics aside. Packers
are in the midst of training camp here and conducted
another full padded practice on Tuesday since we had recorded
our previous show. There'll be another practice not long after
(01:01):
we get this show recorded. One thing I wanted to
touch on here, Wes, and you wrote about it. There's
a story on packers dot com for those who want
to check it out. We talked a lot on our
last show about the one on ones, which kind of
get cranked up when the players put the pads on
and whatnot. And one guy who's really been standing out
(01:21):
in those one on one drills is the second year
defensive lineman Davante Wyatt. It looks like he is off
to a very very good start, the former first round
pick in his second season.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
Yeah, yeahs Mike. And it was really interesting talking to
him at his locker earlier this week because Pete Doherty
was actually there, and you know, we were talking about
the first rep that he took actually might have been
the second one against Josh Myers, and obviously it was
a big victory for Wyatt, but he hit him with
the spin move, and Pete Doherty asked him that. He's like,
you know, is that is that kind of like one
(01:54):
of your big moves. He's like, oh, yeah, that's my
special move, and we all kind of got a big
laugh on it because then later on in practice going
up against I believe it's Gene Delance. I want to
make sure you get that right, one of the practice
squad holdover from last year. Then he switched over and
he converted to his power and again was able to
get the offensive lineman on the ground while keeping his
(02:15):
own balance, mind you, and I think what we've seen
with Devonte White in year two is the game has
slowed down. I know that's a big cliche, but now
he's been able to do this rep after rep after rep.
They don't have Dean Lowery anymore, they don't have Jaron Reid.
When you look at that base defensive front, and specifically
(02:38):
that nickel front with him and probably Kenny Clark at
the three tech spots, this is a huge opportunity for
the young man, and I think he's really taken advantage
of it so far. Now, again, these are just practices.
We just put the pads on. But if you were
looking for the indicators that DeVante White is ready for
this opportunity, I think you're seeing them because again, played
(02:58):
I think just over two hundred snaps last year. He
only missed one game all regular season, but he just
he was averaging about ten snaps a game. But when
he started to build some momentum at the end of
the season, I think that helped his confidence. And now
he's coming back looking a lot more. I don't want
to say dominant, because again, we got to see some
we got see some joint practices, we got to see
some preseason games we got to get in the regular season.
(03:20):
But I think the Packers have to be feeling really
good right now that, Okay, we're gonna stick with him
and TJ. Slayton. We're not going to bring any other
veterans to replace Lowery and Reid. I think the Signs
have been really promising that they made the right choice.
Speaker 1 (03:31):
Yeah, I think the question the question that's still out
there with Wyatt. To me, the Packers drafted him you
as as an interior defensive lineman. You're a first round
pick when you show you can rush the passer from
that spot. The Packers didn't have any questions. I don't think.
I don't think anybody does with regard to the pass
rush is going to come. It's going to be there
(03:54):
for Wyatt from uh, you know, from that three tech
spot or wherever he may line up on the interior.
The question at this level is going to be will
he be able to will he be able to hold
up and be the type of disruptive force against the
run that he was in college? And things can be
a little bit different in the NFL. It's not as
easy as just beating your man and getting into the
(04:15):
backfield to stop the run, because if that play is
not coming at you, you know, it's really easy for
a gap or a hole to to open up and
uh and then boom, suddenly you know, a run is
out the gate. The run defense has played a little
bit a little bit differently in the NFL in that regard,
and I'm not saying that DeVante Wyatt can't do it,
but because he had such limited playing time as a rookie,
(04:39):
I think we have to see if he's going to
be able to be a run stopper down after down,
just as I think he's going to be able to
consistently put pressure on the quarterback when given those opportunities.
The comment, the quote that has that has stood out.
It's shown up in our coverage and and coverage elsewhere.
When defensive lineman Jerry Montgomery with the media during the spring,
(05:01):
I can't remember exactly if it was OTA's or mini
camp or exactly what it was, but he was talking
about Week eighteen against the Lions. Obviously that was a
disappointing loss for the Packers, but in the midst of
that game, Wyatt got a strip sack of Jared Goff
of Detroit and it was probably the biggest highlight play
of his rookie campaign, and Montgomery said when Wyatt came
(05:23):
off the field after that play, he commented like, hey, coach,
I think I'm starting to get it, you know. And yes,
it was week eighteen and everybody was hoping that maybe
it would come around a little bit sooner for Wyatt,
but there he had such a strong finish to the season,
not just with that play but over the last month
of the regular season last year, that what we're seeing
(05:44):
now at the start of training camp is not necessarily surprised.
It really looks like he is building off of what
he did last December.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
Yeah, absolutely in that That's what I kind of was
talking about. And I asked him about that, the momentum
that he kind of derived from the end of that season,
and he said there was a little bit, but he's like,
I feel much more confident now. And I think that
was the totality of his offseason. I feel like that
was everything that he put in with the reps with
Kenny Clark and you know, TJ. Slayton during the offseason program.
(06:12):
And then the other thing that's interesting too. You mentioned it,
like the Packers the run defense, that's the big thing
for them this year. Whatever you want to put it on,
whatever the issues were last season, twenty six is twenty six.
Then Green Bay knows they need to do better against that.
They can't give up five yards a clip against the
run this season, I feel like getting back to a
more traditional nose tackle and TJ. Slayton is a big
(06:34):
piece to that. You know, for years you'd see not
just Green Bay, but a lot of teams in the NFL.
As teams got faster, we saw, you know, safeties playing linebacker.
We saw three hundred and fifteen pound nose tackles. We'd
gotten kind of away from the Ryan Pickett sort of
generation of three hundred and forty pounds and just an
absolute handful for interior alignment to deal with. Slayton is
(06:57):
a little bit more out of that mold, right at
three hundred fourty pounds. With as much athleticism that he has,
He's going to be a big piece at the one tech.
But it's not just one player. It is on Wide,
it's on Clark, it's on everybody behind them to hold
up their end of the bargain. I think the Packers
are going to be able to get after the quarterback
this season. I feel pretty confident saying that with Rashaun
(07:18):
Gary coming back, Lucas Fanas is the first round pick,
the athleticism they have on the interior defensive line, and
even guys like you know, Devondre Campbell and Kuay Walker
behind that, it's about okay. Right out of the gate, Mike,
You're going to see New Orleans, You're going to see Atlanta.
There's a first round pick that Detroit drafted. You're going
to see a lot of running backs that are either
(07:39):
top of the line or considered, you know, that next
wave of elite backs, and Green Bay has to be
able to stop them.
Speaker 1 (07:45):
And you're going to see a quarterback in week one
who likes to run the ball, not just from a
scrambling standpoint, you know, busted plays, but actually designed runs,
you know, justin fields and the Chicago Bears. He likes
to play running backs sometimes as quarterback, and that's going
to be a challenge right out of the gate in
Week one at Soldier Field as well. So shifting gears
(08:06):
to the other side of the ball for a minute.
One thing that we will be watching pretty closely here
as training camp continues, starting to see some more shuffling
on the offensive line with the number one unit in
terms of where guys are lining up specifically, we've now
seen Zach Tom starting to take some snaps at center
with the number one offensive line in place of Josh Myers,
(08:28):
with Yosh Niman playing right tackle. So that's a combination
that the coaches are are going to take a look at,
and I think the best way to try to understand
what's going on here. Larry articulated it very well in
our three Things video after practice on Tuesday. I tried
to do the same thing in our Insider Inbox column
(08:49):
on Wednesday morning. If you go by what Matt Lafleur
has been saying all along that it's about getting the
best five on the field, it really looks like right
now three of those best five our David Baktiari Elton Jenkins,
and John Runyon. We haven't seen really anything but those
guys being in their traditional spots. But then it's between
(09:11):
yash Niman, Josh Myers, and Zach Tom. Two of those
three guys will be will round out the best five.
So it's three guys competing for two spots. Obviously, Meyer's
only a center. Nyman only plays tackle, Zach Tom can
play either one, so in some respects if you look
(09:34):
at it as well, if Zach Tom proves that he's
one of the best five, and I'm not saying that
that's been decided yet, but say if it evolves that way,
and Zach Tom proves that he's one of the best five,
then his position potentially could be determined by who is
the other guy who joins the best five, and then
Zach Tom just fills in the other spot. That's one
(09:54):
way that this could evolve. But it's something that we
will watch as training camp continues, as we get into
the preseason games and and where guys are taking reps,
because nothing's for certain yet, but but it certainly is
is starting to take a little bit more shape in
terms of exactly what's being looked at.
Speaker 2 (10:12):
First off, what Zach Tom is doing is just the
darnedest thing I think I've ever seen during an NFL
training camp. We've seen that, right, you know, Elton Jenkins
plays guard and tackle, and we've seen these guys. I
don't know if I've ever seen a guy in team
period switch between right tackle and center depending on which
which package is in and the look that they're getting.
Speaker 1 (10:30):
I mean, yeah, and sometimes from period to period, like
he doesn't just get to play one spot for like
a whole practice like he's he's he gets, you know,
three snaps at one spot and then he's taking three
or four snaps at the other. It is. It is
pretty amazing. And uh and you know, the not just
the physical challenge but the mental challenge in terms of
the plays and executing the responsibilities at two different spots
(10:51):
within the same practice. That that can't be easy.
Speaker 2 (10:54):
No, And it takes a smart kid to do that.
And obviously, as we've talked about numerous times now, he
has put on the weight this offseason, kind of anchored
down a little bit. He feels like that's helped him.
But because of that, it's also allowed him to have
that flexibility to challenge at multiple positions. And you know,
as much as Zach Tom I'm sure loves to be
versaal and loves to play different spots, I'm guessing his
(11:14):
goal at the end of the day. I don't think
I'm going too far dow a limb saying this is
to be a Week one starter when the Packers travel
to Soldier Field, that the interesting aspect of this though,
that I find the most funny is right off the bat,
you say, David back Terry Delton Jenkins. That goes without saying.
I love the trajectory that John Runyan has been on,
(11:36):
where you know, he was in the lineup and he
was out of the lineup, and then it was Lucas Patrick,
and then it wasn't Lucas Patrick and it's Runyon and
then the last two years, I don't even know if,
like the gathered media has even talked to the kid
that much. He just does his job. He's owned now
right guard. He started last year at left guard before
they made the flop with you know, the switch with
(11:58):
with Yash and he's just steady as they go. I mean,
I feel like John running has just been an ultimate
premium pick for the Packers coming out of that twenty draft.
But because of that, you know, in Zach Tom competing
the way he is, it creates some questions there about
if he could potentially push Fitz center too. So competition
brings out the best in everybody. Mike, you and I
(12:18):
have said that since the beginning of time, and the
Packers ultimately they're gonna need all six of those guys
this year. I doubt there's a scenario in which they
all end up healthy from week one to week thirty
eight or whatever the season runs now. So the fact
of the matter is you have to have options, and
Zach tom gives the Packers a heck of a lot
of them.
Speaker 1 (12:34):
Yeah, and what you said about Runying is spot on too,
you know. For a guy to come in as a
sixth round pick and he was an All Big Ten
tackle at Michigan, and the Packers you know, saw him
as as an interior lineman, you know, from the start,
and he's learned the guard spot. He's played both sides,
he's played on either side of the center, and suddenly
(12:57):
now he's kind of entrenched at right guard and nobody
you know, putting up a serious challenge for him at
that spot. When you can find when you can find
a reliable, like don't have to worry about it type
of player in the sixth round of the draft and
he's actually playing in the NFL at a position that
(13:18):
he didn't even play in college, that says something about
the scouting evaluation, but also says something about that player,
that individual in particular, and how he's gone about the
transition to the NFL. It's it's been pretty impressive on
Runyan's part.
Speaker 2 (13:32):
Huge value too, right, you go back, you think Olayne
Taylor getting eight years out of Green Bay after being
an undrafted free draft thirteen and again, very same credentials.
He played guard at Oklahoma State as where you know,
Runyon was playing tackle but just didn't get enough respect.
People didn't think he was athletic enough. They weren't sure
if he could do it at this level. And he
ends up being a six foot five, three hundred and
(13:53):
twenty four pound like stalwart on your offensive line for years.
And I think those are the ties. Those are the
type of guys that you can't say enough about because
you can't always be spending first round picks on interior
defense or interior offensive linemen and run And I think
kind of, I know I went off on a tangent
with your point, your original point, but I just think
(14:14):
it's very funny that that's not even been a conversation.
He's just been the guy as much as Elton Jenkins
has been the guy at left guard. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (14:21):
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on that for me quest.
Speaker 2 (14:55):
I will, But I also know enough about sales to
never deviate off the screen.
Speaker 1 (14:59):
I know it's like read read, what's read, what's in
front of you. That's a that's technically, that's how it works.
Speaker 2 (15:04):
It has been fifty years of better, it's just fifty
years in change of that.
Speaker 1 (15:08):
Yeah, right, Like that's the other fifty plus years. So well,
another another topic I wanted to get to that we
had so much with regard to what was going on
at practice to to get to on our last show,
that we didn't get to the fact that at Monday's practice,
this week, Peyton Manning was in attendance the uh the
(15:31):
Hall of Fame quarterback, two time Super Bowl champion and
now very very busy with his own media production business.
And no, he was not here to talk to Jordan
Love about the Netflix Quarterback series. That was not part
of their discussion. But Jordan Love did reveal to the
media some of the stuff that they did talk about,
(15:53):
and he was really appreciative of the chance to talk
with Peyton Manning one on one, and they talked a
lot about, you know, just preparation, you know, how to
how to study film and you know, how to be
that that leader and that that main communicator on the
offense when it comes to your lineman and your receivers
and all that, and uh, you know, Jordan Love soaked
(16:15):
up everything he could from, uh, from that conversation with
Peyton Manning, and I think he, you know, he really
appreciated that opportunity.
Speaker 2 (16:22):
Yeah, a neat opportunity for a young guy that you know,
you always go back to thinking about, like when you know,
Aaron Rodgers got to Green Bay and he talked about
the influence that Joe Montana had on him and Steve
Young and those guys from the Bay Area and and
obviously quarterbacks learned from quarterbacks, right, It's the way it
all goes in our profession too. There's writers we aspired
(16:44):
to be and and and people that we enjoyed reading.
So for Love to be able to have that interaction,
I thought was really valuable. And as Matt Lafleur said,
you know, Peyton coming and saying in words to the
entire team though, those are those are the monumental kind
of things because as Jordan's talked about, and I think
we don't discuss this enough, Peyton Manning had a ton
(17:07):
of pressure on him coming into the National Football League. Now,
social media twenty five years ago isn't what it is today,
so he probably didn't have to like look at it
from every single person giving their opinion at every single second.
But the fact of the matter is he was Archie
Manning's son. He was the first overall pick and he
threw what was it, twenty nine interceptions his first year
(17:28):
in the National Football League.
Speaker 1 (17:30):
Still has the rookie record for most interceptions in one season.
Speaker 2 (17:34):
Yeah, no, rookies really gonna get that much of a
leash these days, Xeah Exactly.
Speaker 1 (17:39):
That's the thing It's kind of like what Brett Farres said.
You know, he holds the all time record for interceptions
for a career. It's like, well, you have to be
doing something right if you be allowed to throw that
many interceptions. And Peyton Manning was allowed to throw that
many as a rookie because the Colts knew what they
had and certainly it eventually came around for him.
Speaker 2 (17:57):
And the Colts weren't very good that year either, right,
and next thing you know, they turn it around and
they'd become a perennial playoff team and eventually a super
Bowl champion. But to be able to level with a
guy like Jordan Love like that, I think that's important
because it reminds you that whatever the result is today
doesn't mean that that predestines to you to what tomorrow
(18:18):
is going to be good or bad. Right, there's going
to be ebbs and flows to this game. And it's
the number one thing I talked about all off season
when we would do these podcasts, when we do unscripted,
when we talk to Larry, is that Jordan Love, that's
the biggest transition for me, That that's the biggest hurdle
I think he needs to climb is just that you're
going to play a game on Sunday. You're going to
(18:39):
break it down. You know, unless you start winning a
bunch of games, you don't have you get victory Mondays.
But you're gonna have to break it down on Monday
and you start getting ready for the new game plan
on Wednesday. That's the That's how the life of an
NFL quarterback goes. You have to have that short memory
and you have to keep building towards what's coming next.
And I feel like that is the personification of what
(19:00):
Peyton Manning did in his career. That's how you last
as long as he did in the league, in addition
to just having a you know a lot of God
given talent and ability. So I think it's exciting right now.
I think it's exciting for the Green Bay Packers when
you get that type of player in here. I mean
all our eyes immediately from the sidelines started going over there.
I started when you as soon as you notice Peyton
Manning there, it is something that's going to catch you.
(19:21):
And I'm just really happy for Peyton Manning too that
he got to chat with Red Batty, because when you
talk about legendary people in the National Football League. Peyton
Manning's up there. He's pretty good. Hall of Famer, but
Red Batty Gordon just the cut above. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (19:36):
Well, the other thing I really enjoyed was hearing Matt
Lafleur at the podium the other day reminiscing about a
very bad memory early in his coaching career when he
had just broken into the league with the Houston Texans
and they basically blew a seventeen point lead to Peyton
Manning in the last five minutes of the game. And
(19:56):
it's funny, West because I, you know, me and my
curiosity and how you know. So I went and looked
up the game and exactly like, okay, so, how did
Peyton Manning pull off this comeback? Well, one, it wasn't
It wasn't all Peyton Manning. But this is how it unfolded,
and you have to picture. Okay, if you're Matt Lafleur,
this is this is like his fourth or fifth game
(20:17):
as an NFL assistant coach, on the bottom of the
totem pole quality control level with the Houston Texans. He's
just just gotten into the league in two thousand and eight,
and he's a month into his career as an NFL coach,
and he's watching from the press box and his team
has a twenty seven to ten lead with about five
minutes to go. Huge underdogs, the Texans against the Colts,
(20:38):
and Peyton Manning drives the Colts down for a touchdown.
It's twenty seven to seventeen. Then the Texans fumble the ball,
it gets scooped up and run back seventy yards for
a touchdown, so it's twenty seven to twenty four. And
then the Texans fumble the ball again. The Colts recover,
Peyton Manning drives them down and gets the touchdown to
(20:59):
take the lead with a little bit under two minutes left.
And then the Texans get one more shot and the
quarterback throws an interception. So that's actually how that game unfolded.
So you talk about a game that is going to
make an impression on a young coach who's just broken
into the league. He's up against a you know, watching
a Hall of Fame quarterback on the other side, seeing
(21:19):
how how you absolutely have to play and execute and
do things right for sixty minutes in order to win
games in this league, and how huge a factor turnovers
can be.
Speaker 2 (21:29):
I mean it was.
Speaker 1 (21:30):
It was all laid out for Matt Lafluor right there
in that game against Peyton Manning and the Colts. And
it was fun to hear him talk about that bad memory,
but then also look up the details of exactly what unfolded,
because there's no question that that game made a big
impression on Matt Lafleur and how it's shaped him as
a head coach.
Speaker 2 (21:49):
Yeah, and people wonder why Matt always talks about turnover
margin different exactly exactly, Just look at that one first
month of the two thousand and eight season, twenty seven
to ten, with five minutes to go.
Speaker 1 (22:00):
Look what happened.
Speaker 2 (22:01):
So it'll turn, it'll turn whatever it is, a seventeen
point lead into a deficit real quick when you start
tumbling balls for touchdowns. But but hey, listen, I mean
it's cool, it's it is the neat thing about training camp.
I remember, if I can just say one last story
here before we cut out, The first time I saw
John Madden at one of our training camps. I was
still at the Press because ut of the time John
(22:22):
was a little bit older, but he was here. I
can't remember what the project was for, but you start
to see some of these people that have had such
an impact on the game of football and what the
sport that we enjoy today. And there's no like goodyear
blimp saying hey, welcome, Pete mcley just kind of show
up from time to time during camp, right yep here
there and and to me, that's that's always the most fun.
(22:44):
And yeah, a very cool memory. And I think something
that Jordan love is he ventures off as we talk
about it, into his first year as a head as
a head coach, as a quarterback, starting quarterback in the
National Football League. One of those like tiny moments that
kind of builds up to something special.
Speaker 1 (23:00):
Yeah, absolutely, and Manning did. He addressed the entire team
actually after practice on Monday, shared some words of wisdom
and everything.
Speaker 2 (23:07):
There.
Speaker 1 (23:07):
I know we do have to get going. But I
want to mention one other thing to all of our
loyal listeners readers out there. If you have not checked
out Wes's story on Derek Coleman, the deaf slash heard
of hearing Super Bowl champion from the Seattle Seahawks who
is now a member of the Packers' front office in
the player engagement area, you need to read that story.
(23:30):
It's really really well done. It's a great story by
about a great individual. I'll give you just a minute here,
Wes to talk about how that story came together and
the impression that it made on you as the writer.
Speaker 2 (23:44):
Well, it was fun, Mike, because I think you and
I we both remember Derek Coleman and the Duracell commercial
and everything he was a part of with the Seattle Seahawks,
good bad and in between, right. I mean, there was
a touchdown in twenty fourteen and that opener at you know,
Oughton Seattle that I'll never quite forget either. But that
being said, from a football perspective and what he means
to this community, I feel like it was fun being
(24:07):
a part of that. So basically, myself, Tyler Gaieski, and
Nick McGahan from our video department all went down to
Verona Area High School beautiful high school by the way, Michael,
down in your southern eastern part of the woods, southwestern
southwestern sorry.
Speaker 1 (24:22):
Near Madison I know is yeah, Verona is very close
to Madison for those who don't know.
Speaker 2 (24:27):
Terrible at geography. It was my worst subject. Sorry, But
that being said, I'm really getting off to a great
start on this promo R and I. But the fact
was is that being able to be with him in
the American Sign language. Students from Verona, Wisconsin School from
the Deaf was also there. Their faculty had came to
the event and listening to Derek's message, and it's one
thing to read stories, it's one thing to watch amazing
(24:50):
video packages that have been put together over the years,
but when you actually see the way he interacts with kids,
it was very special. And having a chance to talk
with Gray Rugemer about him and Matt Lafleur made a comment,
and then certainly some of the lives he's touched away
from football. You know, that was the coolest part of
the experience to me because you see what a certain
(25:11):
amount of celebrity can do for the good of the
world if used in channeled properly, and I feel like
Derek Coleman has really done that. Now, as you mentioned,
the assistant to Gray Rugemer in the player engagement area,
it's the perfect role for Derek. He has had such
an incredible lived experience and his ability to kind of
relay and tell players what it's like to go through things,
(25:34):
I think is really important because in a lot of
ways he had to study this book over and over
and over again to make it as long as he
did in the National Football League, And as Aaron Jones
told me during the offseason when I talked to him
about it, you know, he feels like he could be
a real special piece to what this team is building
now moving forward. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (25:51):
Absolutely, And I encourage everyone to check out that story.
It was posted on packers dot com Wednesday. Shouldn't be
too hard to find and uh and I think you'll
really enjoy it. So with that, we will call it
a wrap on this edition of Packers Unscripted. Be sure
to follow all of our coverage of training camp. We've
got it all for you on packers dot com. For Wes,
I am Mike. Thank you for tuning in everybody. We
(26:14):
will see you next time.
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