2023 Week 13 Recap

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
They Around the NFL podcast, living in.

Speaker 2 (00:08):
From the Chris Westling podcast studio. It's Around the NFL
the Week thirteen flagship program.

Speaker 1 (00:15):
Wow.

Speaker 2 (00:16):
Dan Hans is here with Greg Rosenthal and Mark Sessler's
heroes both and this is an interesting Week thirteen. We
had six teams on Buy and Boys. I there are
many times where I miss living on the East Coast.
It's days like today where I sit down and I

(00:36):
turn on the ten am starts and up and down
the Eastern seaboard, just miserable weather messing with everyone's lives,
like destroying any semblance of having a fun day at
the stadiums. And I think, okay, it's pretty nice out here, yo,
one hundred percent.

Speaker 3 (00:50):
And I mean, you know, we got some weird weather
suspended play which happens. It seemed to happen like once
a year whenever's covering that game. Yeah, and I believe
it was you, Greg, that you're suddenly watching games an
hour and a half later than all the other early
slot games.

Speaker 4 (01:03):
And I mean the Cardinals Steelers deserve to be a
four and a half hour game.

Speaker 5 (01:07):
Ah.

Speaker 4 (01:07):
But yes, I'm always happy we're here on the West coast,
so we're not driving home either at their Sunday night
football at twelve thirty at night.

Speaker 5 (01:13):
Yeah, that's true.

Speaker 2 (01:14):
So you had, yeah, multiple games in raining or downpour conditions.
You had all the soggy fields, slippery fields, all those
black pellets everywhere, like on the cleats and on their
faces and their face mess ah.

Speaker 1 (01:26):
But and then you had all these backup quarterbacks, oh oh,
and all these guys that can't play. So you got
some things going on around the league.

Speaker 2 (01:33):
But the one thing we did have, one thing that
we knew we had in our back pocket in this
week thirteen were the Eagles and Niners.

Speaker 1 (01:41):
And here's the good thing, and we're gonna get to
the game.

Speaker 2 (01:43):
And maybe it wasn't the barn burner we were expecting,
but we learned a lot about both teams.

Speaker 1 (01:47):
And also Greggy. These guys hate each other and to
just get the feeling. It was round one to set
it up for a better one.

Speaker 6 (01:54):
Next to Philadelphia, we go first and ten Niners in
the Philly four eight party looks lap now middle throws
caught Brooke and tackled by Deebo Samuel dows not thirty.

Speaker 7 (02:06):
Twenty j turn five touchdown. He is going sack Francisco.
What an absolute peast debo Samuel oh Man, Greg Papa
and Tim Ryan with the call K and B.

Speaker 2 (02:24):
Are you know there's so many stars on the Niners
and superstars of the Niners. I have long thought debos
Samuel is one of those people that he's in my
superstar club.

Speaker 5 (02:34):
And if you look at.

Speaker 2 (02:35):
The Niners bump in the road this season, it neatly
coincides with Deebo Samuel out of the lineup. He is
such a devastating jack of all trades and we saw
it again in Philadelphia where Samuel scored three touchdowns. Who
the star of a dominant offensive performance for Kyle Shanahan's
offense and a forty two nineteen win over the Eagles.

(02:57):
That's just the second loss of the season for Philly
and that tightens up the top of the NFC picture considerably.

Speaker 5 (03:03):
Greg, the game started.

Speaker 2 (03:06):
In one place, yep, and then once San Francisco kind
of got things.

Speaker 1 (03:10):
Calmed down, the whole game change.

Speaker 8 (03:12):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (03:13):
The first quarter was completely dominated by Philadelphia. They had
seven first downs to only six plays for the forty
nine to one hundred and twenty four yards to negative six.
And then after that the forty nine Ers put together
what was really one of the best offensive performances of
the season by any team and zooming out. I think
it really brings into focus this matchup forty nine Ers

(03:36):
offense versus Eagles defense specifically, because that's where I'm concerned
about this Eagles team. Their linebackers have been poor all year,
the safeties up and down, and Shanahan just put a
big circle on those linebackers and he kept putting them
in conflict, and their tackling was poor. And it was
Kittle and it was Samuel, and it was Ayuk, and
it was Purty on some early third downs being very

(03:59):
calm and making good throws in this Eagles defense, seventheeth
and dvaa coming into today. To me, it is a
season long issue. And once again they get out gained
by ninety five plus yards. That's five straight games that
that's happened.

Speaker 3 (04:15):
That is wild, And it's like this is a matchup
situation too, because I'm with you, we're gonna see these
guys playing again and for the Niners to start well, we're.

Speaker 1 (04:25):
Gonna be repeated a confluence of these teams.

Speaker 2 (04:27):
Though, as football fans, I want to feel like we
got cheated. If these teams somehow don't meet again and
hopefully the NFC title game or at the very least
the divisional players, we gotta get these guys back.

Speaker 9 (04:36):
In the same Yeah, you throw Dallas in there too.

Speaker 3 (04:38):
I mean, I just think to start the way they started,
and you you're wondering, did the Eagles just have this
team's number? And to turn around with these long Shanahan
esque touchdown drives, six touchdowns in a row, clock chewing,
high yardage, multiplay situations where it's like every game someone

(04:58):
else steps up and plays the star for San Francisco
and this version of Deebo Samuel. When you have Trent
win Was back in the lineup, it just makes it
impossible to figure out how to defend them.

Speaker 10 (05:09):
Right.

Speaker 4 (05:09):
You mentioned it coincided with Debo being out, and that's
totally fair. But Trent Williams is the guy I feel like, Yeah,
he's a to me, a first ballot type of Hall
of Fame type guy who's still playing at a high level.
And when they got going early and they were down
six to nothing and Philadelphia went zero for two in
the red zone, settling for field goes, they did it

(05:29):
by going left it was running left behind Trent Williams,
and I also think about a play to start the
second half. They did so well going into halftime, a
four minute drive that killed the clock, didn't give Philadelphia
a chance to score coming back, and then a four
minute drive out of halftime, and there was just no
pressure on Perdy for the most part on those throws.

(05:49):
And I think of a third and seven to start
that drive coming out of halftime, which is an out
route to Ayuk to the opposite hash And you don't
think a party in terms of his arm strength or anything,
but that was a real deal pro throw. He had
a nice run in the red zone where he bounced
off the tackler. It was a great day out of
him too, Like it's pretty rare that, you know quarterback

(06:10):
hats three hundred and fourteen yards and twenty seven attempts,
four touchdowns, and he does feel like the third or
fourth person that you talk about on this team. But
it was really just personally met life for party, right,
it's perfect for everyone. Schio Capatia put that this was
the second best EPA per drive performance by any team
all year, which makes sense. They went six straight touchdowns
and then finished the game after that.

Speaker 2 (06:29):
I gotta I gotta give us a little bit of
credit because I think as a group, we were kind
of on this as a possibility with the Eagles living
dangerously these last few weeks and the Niners looking for
that revenge, playing at a high level, being in a
place where they kind of needed the win, and there
seemed like an opportunity for this Mark. I think you
locked it up. I did good job there. I almost

(06:50):
came with you. Yeah, And I would have been safe
in that spot too, And you know, so you just
gotta you gotta give the Niners a ton of credit.
And they're, like I said, a lot of bad blood
here between these two teams.

Speaker 5 (07:01):
Will get into what happened with the director of.

Speaker 2 (07:03):
Security in a little bit, but for them to put
him on them that way with the six straight scores,
and I think, you can't win a game in the
first quarter, but you can lose one. You could let
a game really sneak away. And you look at the
way the game started. Greg mentioned that Eagles went red zone,
red zone, field goal, field goal early. They also the

(07:24):
Niners first possession minus two yards, their second possession minus
four yards, and they're facing a third and three in
their third possession, and Perty connects with Kittle to move
the change. They're facing a third and one. A few
plays later, it's Purty again.

Speaker 1 (07:37):
And that's where he was so common. Yeah, just kind
of waiting for Diba to get open on a third
and one is very.

Speaker 2 (07:42):
He hit Samuel for thirteen yards and once they kind
of got the crowd a little bit taken out of
it and they got calmed down, they just started rolling.
I mean, that's the sign of a championship team, and
we're not going to go back, and Eagles fans don't
want to hear it, and the Niners fans wouldn't help
them anyway.

Speaker 1 (07:58):
I kind of think the Niners were the team led
in the NFC.

Speaker 2 (08:00):
In the way played out an NFC title game was
heartbreaking for them and their fan base. This was a
This was an announcement to the Eagles, like, this is
us at full strength, and.

Speaker 1 (08:09):
You don't want to see us in January.

Speaker 4 (08:11):
Let's see what happens, right, because the forty nine Ers
defense got more pressure on Hurts than vice versa. Now,
sometimes I feel like Hurts left the pocket when it
was clean and just held it forever and wanted to
make a play and it was back to a little
bit about what we saw from Hurts. I don't think
their offense was bad today. They finished with nineteen points,
was just disappointing, but they moved the ball. They didn't
have a ton of possessions either. He almost had three

(08:33):
hundred yards, but no running game at all. And then
Hurts just not feeling like comfortable going to his first read.
Not a lot in rhythm for them, And so give
Charvarius Warden in some of the other defensive backs credit
for that.

Speaker 3 (08:46):
Yeah, I think it's like it's so easy to, you know,
magnify the Niners offense and talk about how versatile they
are in all their stars, but it's like their defensive
front is growing more powerful, and like they gave up
two point six yards per Kerry to we an Eagles
team that you know has been hot and cold on
offense in some ways, but they were able to lean
on their ground game heavily early in the year, and today.

Speaker 1 (09:07):
They couldn't at all.

Speaker 3 (09:07):
And I think to go do this in Philadelphia, which
is one of the nastier places to play and come
out from the West Coast, it's like this is a
statement operation by the Niners, and stop telling me that
Brock Party is so far down in this MVP race.
It annoys me. It annoys me because I don't know
what else he needs to do. I don't know what
else he needs.

Speaker 2 (09:24):
Here's the thing, here's the thing that's and I'm with you, fundamentally,
I'm with you like it needs to he needs more credit. Also,
like I think Christian McCaffrey deserves real MVP, a real look.

Speaker 1 (09:37):
And this is one hundred and thirty three yards in
this game. We haven't even mentioned him.

Speaker 2 (09:39):
Yeah, it was like for him, that's a quiet but
he was. Every time they kind of needed a play,
he made a play. He had a couple of runs
where he just showed the best footwork of any running
back in the league. Just a brilliant, brilliant offense. And
you could tell when they had a nice sideline shot
of Shanahan Party, I thought I kind of bailed him
out a little bit on the play, the short touchdown
pass to get them going, and you saw you saw

(10:02):
Shannan like pump his fist on the sideline and like
they were off and running, and it was just another
show of Shanahan's might. So you know what, let's do
the do this game on the NFL Plus on Monday.

Speaker 5 (10:13):
Yeah, game of the Week.

Speaker 3 (10:14):
We've we've tilted towards you know, the closest game of
the week sometimes had This has a meaning in a
very different way.

Speaker 1 (10:20):
Now what we do game of the week if Big
Dom was not involved.

Speaker 2 (10:24):
Listen, big Dom is someone who I think we need
to have long conversations about. It was made clear to
me from John Kelly that Big Dom, the director of
security for the Eagles, is a folk hero in Philadelphia,
and apparently his skirmish with who's at Drake Greenlaw that
led to green Law suspension and the head of security

(10:44):
for the Eagles being escorted from the side to off
the sideline, Which is funny that I was a little
bit worried, I gotta be honest with you, hmmm, that
that was gonna spark some type of magical moment and
then we were gonna have to deal with Bradley Cooper
jumping up and down and lead chance and all that stuff.

Speaker 5 (11:02):
But it didn't happen that way.

Speaker 1 (11:03):
It didn't.

Speaker 3 (11:04):
And this was you know, like it's not the ira
ironic nickname where they call a large very large person
tiny like back in the thirties. Yeah, yeah, he literally
is just a giant guy and that's they call him
Big Dom and they should.

Speaker 1 (11:17):
I'm not now he's been going to become He would
have become an even bigger folk here.

Speaker 4 (11:21):
People love him. Andy Reid loved him too. He called
him my big Italian son back in the day. Like, uh,
I think that was on Chris Laws podcasts. Hey, I
saw him tweet that out and people loved him. But
Big Dom ultimately like kind of skated in terms of
the broadcast, like, like, let's calm down, Big Dom. I
get why Kyle Shanahan was pretty fired up afterwards. He

(11:44):
was slander He does not need he does not need
to be involved, and Nick Sirianni actually agreed and said,
like Dom should not have been involved there either didn't
approve of his actions and kind of baited like he
did a good job baiting Drake Ivelaw into he ejected,
but I'm not sure he needed to be ejected when
some big guy on the sideline is pointing a figure

(12:05):
in his face, like get out of there.

Speaker 1 (12:07):
You know the Eagles have problems after this game.

Speaker 2 (12:09):
I feel like Big Dom's long the list and there
it is, you're watch it on YouTube. They got to
figure out how to stop a team, an elite team
because they have not been and guess what they get that?
I think the Cowboys next week and all of a sudden, everything's.

Speaker 1 (12:20):
Up for grabs. Number one seed, spicy, It is delicious.

Speaker 2 (12:26):
All right, let's see, let's move on. Let's go to
another game. Uh, that looked like it was going to
be a blowout. That got tight to the Superdome. Two
tight end set for the Lions. Golf takes fakes, the
give goes end around. Now they flip it on the
second back coming around. That is jameson Williams.

Speaker 11 (12:45):
It's the before it's side the ten Dogs into the
end zone, touchdown Detroit Lions.

Speaker 8 (12:51):
A little razzle dazzled.

Speaker 1 (12:53):
A number nan dive into the enisode.

Speaker 8 (12:56):
The Lions extended their lead.

Speaker 2 (12:59):
You know these are the great that's Dan Miller of course,
and Lomas Brown of WXYT. These are all amazing athletes
that we watch every Sunday. But sometimes you see you
see a play and you see a player and you're like, oh,
he looks different than the other guys.

Speaker 1 (13:15):
Jameis and Williams, we see you Bud. He's through the
air there.

Speaker 2 (13:19):
Barely, but not even just the sword, just the speed
in which he cut through those twenties.

Speaker 1 (13:23):
Tell me he did not run thirty three miles per hour.

Speaker 2 (13:26):
On I swear to God if he was not, and Eric,
if there's a way to track this down, if there was,
if he is not above twenty one miles per hour,
I'm gonna be sick to my stomach for the entire
next gen industry. Rightfully, so, the Lions got that well
time TD from their first round mystery Man and another
huge performance from breakdout, breakout tight end Sam Laporta in

(13:47):
a thirty three to twenty eight win over the Saints.
Mark Detroit jumped ahead early, nearly let it slip away,
but the ability to make big plays when it mattered,
that was the difference.

Speaker 3 (13:57):
They did They obviously, I think De Troit and we've
identified that there are certain weaknesses that they carry into
their postseason journey. But at the same time, it's exciting
to see what you got from Jameis and Williams and
Sam Laporta is emerging as like a rock solid star
tight end who is a heap becoming a bigger and
bigger part of their offense. They jumped out to a

(14:19):
twenty one to nothing lead in the first seven minutes.
Derek Carr through a terrible interception on the first offensive
play of the game. Detroit popped it in a couple
of plays later. He had a rough fumble in the
fourth quarter, and that was when they were climbing back
into this game. Derek Carr got whacked at one point,
looked really banged up. Left with a shoulder injury, a
back injury. I got thrown into the concussion portal and

(14:42):
you know, at one point he's getting bid.

Speaker 5 (14:43):
I hope everyone's happy.

Speaker 9 (14:44):
Well, no, you know what you know, life once and
for all, I know portal.

Speaker 3 (14:49):
Well, it does sound dark, but like you, you like
have been defending him, and I had to say that
at one point, like with the Superdome, which was massively
filled with Lions fans, So it's like that's that's telling
me that a lot of Saints fans are about as
frustrated as possible and selling your tickets. But he's getting
booed relentlessly because it was a rough Like the way
this whole thing started, it was not a good look

(15:10):
for Derek Carr.

Speaker 4 (15:11):
Like Quin Taysom Hills on the field. They then boo
when Car comes back.

Speaker 3 (15:15):
Yeah, like Car, it was, and you just saw a
look on his face on the sideline. But at one
point he's getting lustily booed by this crowd and he'd
hit fifteen straight passes and.

Speaker 1 (15:24):
Then his interception was just a drop. It was not
on him to be fair.

Speaker 3 (15:28):
Yeah, I just think I think the problem with I
think the whole thing, with the whole whole experience here
is becoming like the whole Saints team feels like they're
floating away to me, and it starts.

Speaker 1 (15:36):
With the coach. It's the quarterback situation.

Speaker 2 (15:38):
He's like the face of it, and he's become the
main target and he absolutely has played a role in
what's happening here, Mark, and I'd love to hear more,
although I'm still trying to wrap my head around next
gen stats report here that Jamis and William reached the.

Speaker 1 (15:50):
Top speed of twenty point seven.

Speaker 4 (15:52):
Okay, here's because you only get you only get those
what you only get those top speeds if you run
for like twenty five straight yards, you know what I mean.
You no one can get it in the first fifteen yards,
you know, what I mean.

Speaker 2 (16:05):
Tell me, you can't tell me you watch that play
in real time. He's not going sixty miles an hour.
I yeah, it's it's questionable.

Speaker 4 (16:13):
And when he jumped and then the celebration like multi part.
He only has a couple plays every week, but they're
among the most exciting plays in the NFL.

Speaker 1 (16:21):
I love me some Jamis did with but.

Speaker 2 (16:23):
No, all right, let's let's watch them James and Williams
post game one way play.

Speaker 1 (16:29):
We already know what's going on. When waimore get, I
just got a giddy.

Speaker 5 (16:33):
Let's go tend down.

Speaker 12 (16:34):
Wait, wait, let's go.

Speaker 5 (16:37):
It's such a great guy.

Speaker 1 (16:39):
I gotta start start calling. I thought it was Jamo,
but I guess he's Weimo Mark.

Speaker 2 (16:44):
Let's getting back to the game, and along lines what
you're saying with carr Andy and Jameis, Winston comes in
and they have a chance to steal this game, and
then he's scattershotting the ball over the place. So just
be careful, Saints fans of who you're getting after, because
it's it's a lot of people that aren't getting jobs.

Speaker 1 (17:01):
Well they're not to some of their parts.

Speaker 3 (17:02):
And I don't think I think it's pretty clear to
most Saints fans the Jameis Winston's not going to give
you a completely different experience. I thought this game mattered
a lot for Jared Goff, who was money when it mattered.
In the final couple of minutes. It was third and eight,
They're up thirty three to twenty eight with two plus
to go, and Goff hit Sam lad Part a beautiful
throw and then on that same drive on third and

(17:22):
nine to ice this thing to not allow the Saints
back in when it was so close, hit Josh Reynolds.
And it's like this was a game where Jared Goff
returned to the player that we've seen, not you know,
critical mistakes down the stretch. And for the Lions, like
had they somehow crumbled here, we'd be asking a lot
of questions.

Speaker 1 (17:39):
Now they're nine and three for the first time in
the Super Bowl era, right, Yeah, big win on the road,
a game like I expected quite a stat nine and
three for the first time in fifty seven years. The Lions,
they're gonna.

Speaker 9 (17:52):
Have it's been the dark organizational journey for.

Speaker 4 (17:55):
They're gonna have a lot of these little numbers. And
this game kind of went like I thought, we're just
there would be messiness these two teams. The the Lions
defense is a problem enough that there's gonna be messy moments.
I was nervous, Greg, you were nervous. You jumped on
my lock. But you shouldn't have been nervous, because they
always give.

Speaker 1 (18:12):
It to give it to once, give it to us.
The vibes are right, give it to me again. I
gotta say one thing real quick.

Speaker 3 (18:21):
I thought that was gonna be a very annoying aspect today,
and you guys barely even talked about it.

Speaker 1 (18:25):
So good that you made the office more than what
were you expecting.

Speaker 3 (18:29):
Just a lot of you guys like.

Speaker 4 (18:31):
Like like, I'm not gonna honk too much about uh,
the Saints losing here, But that third and nine you
just mentioned, so that the Laporta catch before that nails.
He has a chance Laporta to set the all time
record for yardage as a rookie.

Speaker 1 (18:48):
I mean, you went nine today.

Speaker 4 (18:50):
That's that's the record, I believe for a single game
for a rookie tight end. And now he's got a
chance to break that the season record. He's got a
pretty good chance. I think he needs a couple hundred
yards to go in the last five games. He's ridiculous.
But that throw on third and nine to Reynolds, that
play call and then Gof's execution of it was as
gutsy to me as any fourth down call that Campbell's

(19:12):
made all season. That was as gutsy as going for
it on your own thirty two because the Saints had
no timeouts there. The Cowboys were in a very similar
spot actually on Thursday night when they went for that
touchdown late. A little different situation, but if all the
Lions had to do there was run the ball and
they get to punt with a minute left up a touchdown,

(19:33):
and instead they call pass on third and nine, and
I'm thinking that's one of those plays where you tell golf, like,
if it's not there, just eat it and the clock
will run and we have like a ninety five percent
chance to win. Yeah, and there's pressure early. Goff actually
takes a hit on that play. He's moving left to
get out of the way. It's like second reaction golf play,
and when he throws that ball, I'm thinking, no, no, no, no, no,

(19:54):
this is such a bad idea. And he puts a
dime on Renolds while moving left and Reynolds makes a
great catch with it too and run after the catch
to get the first out. That was it was a
really high level play by by Goff and Reynolds, and
a ton of guts by the coaching stuff, and a
lot of trust. They really do trust Jared Goff an
incredible amount in these big tits.

Speaker 3 (20:12):
And he's shown them outside of the past couple of
games where you know he deserves that trust. There was
one moment in this and it wasn't really like the
it wasn't the network's decision to do this, but how
like Kamara raised out of bounds and like ran into
the legs of like a chain gang dude.

Speaker 9 (20:29):
Yeah, and like the camera was sort of fixed, like
the camera.

Speaker 3 (20:32):
Guy was sort of fixed on the whole situation, and
it was uncomfortable to watch because it was just like
not an athlete but a like a normal man, just
like writhing on the ground in a way that like
it was worse than stuff.

Speaker 2 (20:42):
I was a catastrophic lower leg injury as a dislocated
kneecap or something.

Speaker 4 (20:47):
Jeff Duncan of The Times picky and reported that, yeah,
that he was at University Hospital in New Orleans.

Speaker 1 (20:52):
It's gonna have surgery. It was uncomfortable to watch. We
wish him well.

Speaker 3 (20:55):
It's like when we've been on the like the games
in London on the sideline, there's always this like under
belly of concern that like a football is gonna hit
me in the head, where a player is gonna smash
in me and I'll.

Speaker 9 (21:05):
Just be killed.

Speaker 2 (21:06):
Right, that would be in some ways a pathetic way
to go, but also kind of cool. I mean, we
would be They're all just specs on this universe, and
at least that would be a memorable death.

Speaker 1 (21:17):
It'd be pathetic.

Speaker 5 (21:18):
Oh has your buddy Mark doing? Oh?

Speaker 2 (21:20):
Died killed on the sideline by Derrick Henry in Week five,
like oble keg all right, Uh, let's head to Houston,
where the Texans were looking to keep their playoff push
going and the Broncos we're looking to keep a winning
streak intact.

Speaker 11 (21:37):
Third and goal from the eight, Wilson and the gun
one back p Ryan Wilson gets to snap wilsonid Chase.

Speaker 13 (21:43):
Wilson escapes the sack, throws what's out of the ends
are accepted, Yes, Texas, Yes, Houston's gonna win.

Speaker 8 (21:54):
Nine seconds to go.

Speaker 2 (21:57):
Yes, Mark Van Demir and andre Ware with a yes,
Ki l T andre Ware, that's awesome.

Speaker 5 (22:05):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (22:05):
The fun and surprising Texans season has been defined by
the play of wonder kind QB Bryce Young Thanks C. J.

Speaker 5 (22:16):
Stroud.

Speaker 2 (22:16):
On Sunday, we were reminded of the huge gains made
on the other side of the ball, Jimmy Ward's end
zone I n T save the day for the home
team and a twenty two win over the Broncos, who's
winning streak comes to an end and the Texans keep
themselves in the playoff mix. Interesting game, all right, Let's
start with the big injury news because it's it's terrible

(22:38):
because Tank Dell on the Texans from in close touchdown
run he's blocking, he gets rolled up on and he's
got a broken leg and he's out for the year
and he's going to injured reserve. And it's hard to
understate how important or overstate how important he is to
this team and what he has meant to SAYJ. Stroud

(23:00):
and what has been kind of a historic rookie season.
When you have a quarterback having a historic rookie season,
there's usually a wingman that's helping him make it happen.
And that has very much been Tank del so losing
him for the balance of the season is devastating. That said,
this is not a one trick pony act this offense.
And on the day that they lose tanked Dell for

(23:22):
the year. Nico Collins goes nine for one ninety one
and a touchdown. They still aren't getting anything from the
running game, but Stroud was able to find a way.
And most importantly, as I said at the top here,
it was the defense because you had, like I said,
you had the interception to seal it. That was one
of three picks by Russell Wilson. The other two were
by Derek Stingley, their number three overall pick two years ago,

(23:46):
and Will Anderson had two sacks and two tackles for
a loss. So you have all these guys when they
were the worst team in the league the last few years,
and they're starting to bank these high level draft picks.
It's really looking like they're hitting on these guys, and
you're seeing with Dimico Ryans leading the way, progress on
that side, and that makes Texas the Texans dangerous.

Speaker 3 (24:06):
Yeah, I think like there's a connective DNA to what
Demiico Ryans was able to do in San Francisco before
he got this job where there's player development, like Will
Anderson's growth has like he was a fascinating player today
and wreaking all sorts of havoc. Like you bring in
Jimmy Ward, who obviously you know they knew each other
from San Francisco, and he's making big plays, and like

(24:27):
Derek Stingley, it's like it's the Yes, CJ. Stroud is
the biggest story in Houston, but this defense can make
a difference too. And I kind of just like the
way this whole team building situation has gone for Texas.

Speaker 4 (24:38):
Pretty quickly, right, Jimmy Ward and Stingley. You look at
when they were in the lineup and when they weren't,
and that kind of coincides with them playing much better now.
Their offensive line has also gotten healthier, and I think
that's how too in terms of the past protection for Stroud,
but they are box office every week, that is now.

(24:58):
And they showed a graphic during game like heartbreaking losses
for the Texans that they had suffered. Their last three
losses were all heartbreaking, and I was looking at them,
I'm thinking, well, that's true, but like every time they
win it's a heartbreaking loss for the opponent. That is
now eight straight games that have been decided by one
score and I'm just eyeballing them. And I think all
of them were like the last drive, where like someone

(25:20):
has the ball and they either win the game or
they don't win the game with the ball in the
last seconds. And that's just it makes sense that they're
a young team, and I think they got to be
so excited about the Stingley Anderson combos as well, said Dan, this,
thankurt it out, Thank you Greg.

Speaker 1 (25:35):
Yeah, so you have that side of things and the reason.

Speaker 2 (25:38):
And again they just lost their most important offensive player
beside Stroud. So I'm not going to come down on
the offense too hard, but they really struggled to put
this game away third down. They were four for sixteen
in this game, and it allowed Denver to hang around
even on an imperfect day from their offense. So Russell Wilson,
we just talked about him. Greg is pumping his fist
right now because Wilson after going.

Speaker 1 (26:00):
He didn't say a word.

Speaker 2 (26:01):
No interceptions during that that's five game winning streak. He
throws three interceptions in this game, and it's kind of frustrating.
I know Denver fans are feeling it because the interception
that ends the game, he makes a really athletic play
to escape the rush and he actually he kind of
sets himself a little bit and takes an extra beat.
He probably doesn't throw that ball up for grabs because

(26:22):
he had he had some time, but I think he
was rushing after the hurry and it led to the interception,
so that those turnovers were killer. He also had a
touchdown pass and a touchdown run and did move the offense,
especially in the second half, but it wasn't enough.

Speaker 5 (26:38):
Arrow up on court Courtland Sutton by the.

Speaker 9 (26:40):
Way, Oh, I feel like every week he's doing something.

Speaker 5 (26:42):
Really and I was, I was.

Speaker 2 (26:43):
I think I had a tweet earlier today that he's
really kind of arrived.

Speaker 5 (26:47):
But he had like a twelve hundred yard season a
few years ago.

Speaker 4 (26:49):
One of West's favorite players thought he was kind of
an all Pro that was buried on a team that
it depressed his stats even though he was just incredible.

Speaker 5 (26:57):
But he's kind of back now that that version of
him his best.

Speaker 2 (27:00):
He had his ninth catchdown touchdown catch of the season,
so that was the positive. Denver and Houston still in
the playoff mix. But that was a big win for
the text loss in the injury.

Speaker 3 (27:10):
Wilson on the ground last you know, three or four
weeks has been looking a little bit more like the.

Speaker 4 (27:15):
Old Yes had a big fourth down pick up their
six and six Texans seven and five. We'll see if
that tiebreaker ends up mattering. But even just the fact
that the Texans get a game up and have a
fairly favorable schedule moving forward, as Big James Palmer pointed out,
Russell Wilson three point eight yards per attempt and play
when they weren't doing play action in you know thirteen

(27:36):
when it was And I think that points out a
little bit of what I've been just saying with Russell Wilson,
which is that like there's still like kind of a
limited offense. They can't just like drop back to pass
and win. That's not what they're doing. It's like play action.
It's like scheming up types of plays.

Speaker 2 (27:51):
So yeah, I mean he's a nobody's pounded the table
for MVP for Russe Wilson.

Speaker 1 (27:55):
No, there was like one Broncos fan, But you don't
want to be but you don't want to listen to
this closely block it was like, this is better MV.
I don't know.

Speaker 9 (28:04):
Yes, I saw one that feels slightly disconnected from reality.

Speaker 2 (28:06):
I think he's probably a big wins as a QB
stat guy, would be my guess. On that play one
last thing before we move on, we need Uh. This
happened a couple of times. H that I saw in
games I watched today. Happened in the Meadowlands too, against
the Falcons when they blew a play dead on a
strip of Trevor Simeon that would have went for a touchdown.

Speaker 12 (28:29):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (28:29):
They overturned it on review from an incomplete pass, But
if they just let the play play out, it's a
touchdown and a game icing touchdown for Atlanta. In this game,
the Texans hit some a JP ryand for no game
They took the ball away ran it in for a
tv TD, but officials ruled forward progressing stopped. A replay
showed it that that was you could very easily have
gone the other way on that.

Speaker 1 (28:51):
And it's just, you know, come on, bad officiating game whistles.

Speaker 2 (28:54):
I feel like I was watching a lot of bad
officiating in the games I watched today.

Speaker 5 (28:58):
I don't know about you.

Speaker 1 (28:59):
And the Texans.

Speaker 4 (28:59):
First touchdown was after Alex Singleton roughing, which was pretty
soft like where it was. That was a fourth down
turnover that it kept the drive going because he like
lightly pushed C J.

Speaker 1 (29:12):
Stroud.

Speaker 4 (29:12):
Although if I was Texans fans, I would love the
fact that Stroud like immediately got right back.

Speaker 1 (29:18):
In his face. And that's why I was surprised, like
Singleton just got the penalty and Stroud at all. But
it was I liked it.

Speaker 3 (29:23):
I would say, if you're an official and it's pouring
rain or it looked like it was hailing at one
point down in Tampa, like I think it'd be, you know,
I would do a lesser job.

Speaker 4 (29:32):
Not a problem at NRG Stadium if that's what it is.
It's still energy. I don't they flipped that way. So
you're saying they wouldn't try as hard if the weather
was better.

Speaker 3 (29:42):
I don't, but try as hard. It's like to go
go do anything just as good. If it's freezing rain
and you're like soaking, well, it's your job. The professional
you know what.

Speaker 1 (29:51):
If job to begin with.

Speaker 5 (29:53):
If this is open air and the rains pouring in.

Speaker 9 (29:55):
Oh, we'd be professional.

Speaker 2 (29:56):
But this is what we just stays at a level
absolutely of greatness. All right, let's take a break and
we will march on.

Speaker 13 (30:09):
Right.

Speaker 2 (30:10):
Welcome back to Around the NFL the Flagship Program, Week thirteen.
It's time now for the Sunday Drive presented by the
first ever Toyota Grand Highlander.

Speaker 1 (30:21):
It is Nick Shook time. So let's head to Nashville.
Two thirty four to go in overtime, second down and
goal at the four Hanks. You out of the guns,
shotgun snap looks to is right, Indians close, Michael Pittman
looks down.

Speaker 8 (30:36):
Touchdown. Michael Pittman ball game?

Speaker 1 (30:39):
Why gee?

Speaker 11 (30:41):
Why Michael Pittman into the inZone from Carnivent.

Speaker 1 (30:45):
You and the cool Quinn thirty one.

Speaker 8 (30:47):
C bang in Nashville. Yes, sir, how the Bungos are out?

Speaker 2 (30:54):
Matt Taylor and Rick Van Turry with the call w
f N I Gardner means you threw a four yard
touchdown pass to Michael Pittman with two thirty one to
play in overtime, allowing the Colts to escape Nashville with
a thirty one to twenty eight win over the Titans.
That's four straight wins for the Colts to keep them

(31:14):
in the playoff race in the AFC. The Colts had
needed that touchdown because Nick Folk booted a forty six
yarder earlier in ot But they would not be denied.

Speaker 1 (31:25):
Another man who will never be denied in all things,
but especially in the gym.

Speaker 2 (31:31):
The pipe pipe, pipe, pipe pipe.

Speaker 1 (31:37):
Game turned on that block punt, didn't it. Yeah, a
little bit. I got the Colts back to the game.

Speaker 14 (31:42):
Titans were got out too an early lead, kind of
had a little bit of control of the game. Colts
couldn't do all that much offensively. You get the block pun,
everything swings. Suddenly the Colts are stringing together good drive,
They take the lead, they get it to overtime, Titans
fight back.

Speaker 1 (31:54):
This game had everything.

Speaker 14 (31:56):
This game had pretty much every element you'll expect from
an NFL game. There was all kinds of wackiness. You
had two former backups now starters playing pretty good football.
A classic meeting between the Colts and Titans. This used
to decide the division. It's not going to decide the
division this year, but it was worthy of that type
those types of steaks and Colts.

Speaker 5 (32:17):
Come away a winner.

Speaker 14 (32:18):
And I don't know if if you know, but just
just so you're certain in case the radio call didn't
get it through to your head.

Speaker 9 (32:22):
Yeah, he got it, He's got it, he got it.

Speaker 5 (32:25):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (32:25):
Yeah, you can watch games all season and not I
would imagine we won't see any other game where a
punt is blocked twice in a row by the same team,
which knocks out the punter and then brings a Nick
Folk to punt who, by the way, punted. Fine, sure,
let's just save a roster spot and have no as
the holder. Yeah he didn't, which that may have cost

(32:47):
them because they missed the extra point with Tannehill the laces.
It's like, okay, can we calm down to the laces
and hit an extra point?

Speaker 1 (32:54):
What do I know?

Speaker 5 (32:54):
You're out of your element.

Speaker 4 (32:56):
And then, more importantly, I mean the same game that
we have two straight block punts, we have a pick two,
which is one of my favorite things. If this game
did not involve the Colts Titans, it would absolutely be
our game of the week. Maybe we should rethink it.
I'm just saying there said there was a.

Speaker 1 (33:13):
Lone going on tangle. Yeah, go ahead, shooky, Yeah, they
kind of are.

Speaker 14 (33:18):
I mean Gardner minshe had a strong day. You know,
he didn't make any mistakes. He had a beautiful touchdown
pass to Alec Pierce, who I think is kind of
coming on as of late. He's a guy who I've
kind of liked, and and you look at the receiving
corps and you think, well, they don't have all that
much talent. But if a guy like Piers can produce
like he did today, then suddenly it'll be much better
and be more than just Michael Pittman, who also had
a strong day. But it's you know, it's a cold

(33:38):
team that's hanging around guys. I mean, we know who
the Titans are. They went through a stretch last couple
of weeks where they couldn't move the ball at all,
and it was nice to see Will Levis get some
time to throw. And because Derek Henry found some success
in the ground before he exited with an injury, you know,
Levis was able to operate the offense and you kind
of see what Greg was all high on Levis for
like a month ago or however long ago. It was like,
it's there, it is there. I totally see it. But

(33:59):
once Henry leaves, that offense kind of shrinks, gives the
Colts an opening. And again, like I said, the Colts
are hanging around. They're seven and five. They're probably the
ugliest seven and five team in the league right now
outside of the Pittsburgh Steelers. But then again, you have
to take them seriously from here on out, especially when
they find ways to win this game, because for a
while there it looked like they were going to drop
one to a division rival.

Speaker 3 (34:16):
And they're not going away if they play like this
and if they're coached like this, because they've got the
Bengals Joe Burrow free Bengals next week, a Steelers team
that's going to be playing with their backup quarterback, a
Falcons team that's beatable, the Raiders who are beatable.

Speaker 1 (34:30):
And then that final game with the Texans. So it's
like we.

Speaker 3 (34:33):
Talked a lot about the Colts last week, and I
hear it like they're not always exciting to watch. But
I do think that change psyching is a difference making
type of coach. And I look at the overall jobb
he's done this year, I'm really impressed. And you get
this version of Gardner minsh, You're not the one that's
throwing three interceptions and you can win.

Speaker 4 (34:49):
Right That was his best throw of the game in overtime.
And I want to give them credit because they're just clutched.
They always find a way here. And then I look
and like the offense I think had a total of
fourteen yards on their last five possessions of the in
the fourth quarter, So their offense did not was not
clutch in the fourth quarter, but their defense made just
enough place to get him to overtime.

Speaker 1 (35:10):
And then Minshew makes the play, and it's just like
and that the culture now three and zero.

Speaker 2 (35:14):
When min Chew does not throw an interception, which you
know he does do that a lot, so but when
he plays the clean version of a Minshee game, it's
just like the Coult server a reminder, and I hope
teams are learning from this in this very sloppy quarterback
season twenty twenty three.

Speaker 1 (35:30):
Your season doesn't have to be over because your starting
quarterback got hurt. It doesn't have to be right.

Speaker 2 (35:35):
For many teams, it is because they don't prioritize or
invest in the position beyond the starter. And Minshew was
out there for anybody, and the Colts said, Okay, we
like having that guy behind our rookie. And when the
rookie disappears at the end of September, they were still
okay because the rookie was still figuring things out, so
it wasn't even like you were going from up here
to down here. And Minshew somehow has to find a

(35:57):
balance like he came in playing. I mean he's a
lower level, he's a high backup, you know, lower rung starter,
but that's enough in a division like this, and a
team like you're saying credit to Stichen and the whole operation.
They've been able to win a lot of these like
coin flip games, and they're in the mix as a result.

Speaker 3 (36:13):
I mean, if you can have a fringe starter as
your backup, you're in a different place than teams that
you know, with a lack of creativity stick someone behind
your starter, like in Cincinnati and if anything happened to
Josh Allen in Buffalo, where it's like your season is
lost if you sticking a guy who's just a ham
and egger.

Speaker 1 (36:28):
Yeah, but I think it also is kind of.

Speaker 14 (36:32):
They're indicative of how strong your coaching staff is because
we've seen this happen over the last few years, and
you've seen it in this season, where you know, a
team like San Francisco in previous years had to go
through a number of different quarterbacks and yet found a
way to still be kind of competitive. Or this year
with the Colts, and how Shane Stikeen's doing such a
great job. He'd be a Coach of the Year candidate
if Demico Ryans didn't exist, I think, or you look

(36:53):
at all and they've had to go through all these
things with their quarterback situation, and Kevin Sevanci has been
up and down in that department, but yet they've stayed
a flow. It really is the silver lining of a
messy quarterback season is you get a better evaluation of
how strong coaching staff is and how well they're equipped
to handle adversity. And and you know that sometimes that.

Speaker 4 (37:11):
He is a candidate, they invite three coaches to the
NFL honors.

Speaker 1 (37:16):
He certainly got. He certainly got a chance. Don't invite
two coaches who aren't gonna win. I don't know how
that works. Maybe they don't, but they definitely you don't
invite multiple coaches, then you.

Speaker 2 (37:29):
Then you got to give you the idea of Manu
Chaange Stegonds, like I could be Coach of the Year
if only Demiko Ryans didn't exist. It's like Josh Malwitz
on Dateline the same record.

Speaker 1 (37:44):
They got the same record, and one's coaching with with Minschew.

Speaker 4 (37:47):
So, uh, you might have a point, but it's one
of those seas insinuating murder. Yeah, everything goes right for
them that you get two block punts. Jeffrey Simmons leaves
with an injury and Derek Henry leaves with an injury
in the same game.

Speaker 2 (37:59):
Henry went over one hundred with two scores. Hopefully he's
going to be okay, shookie, Thank you buddy. Easy one week. Hey,
no more buys in a couple of weeks. So we're
gonna need you down the stretch.

Speaker 9 (38:09):
I'll be getting my back ready to carry the load
or you.

Speaker 5 (38:13):
Don't skip back there.

Speaker 8 (38:14):
No, I don't.

Speaker 1 (38:15):
I definitely don't, Shooky.

Speaker 5 (38:17):
Thank you buddy.

Speaker 1 (38:18):
And that was the Sunday Drive presented by Toyota Let's
Go Places. Learn more at toyota dot com. Slash Grand Highlander.

Speaker 2 (38:25):
I think we had a good Thursday show, guys. I
keep looking at some of the results and it's syncing
up with our commentary going into these games. We looked
at this Dolphins Commanders game and said, you know what,
these fish, it's been a while since. They gave us
some explosive fun and it was explosive. Well, it's explosive

(38:45):
fun for the Dolphins and explosive something else for the
Commanders and their fans.

Speaker 5 (38:51):
Let's head to landovers.

Speaker 13 (38:54):
Kill e motion goes to the right looking for him
keep down the field.

Speaker 8 (39:00):
What a movement by a heel to kicks that football.

Speaker 2 (39:04):
He was turned inside Joe the bolls it, throw it
to the outside and he weeded his way back. Another
bomb to its Hill touchdown Jimmy Cefalo.

Speaker 1 (39:15):
WBGG with it called.

Speaker 2 (39:17):
Tyreek Hill had two more touchdowns in five catches for
a buck fifty seven that was basically in a half
a word, and he and the Miami Dolphins absolutely hammet
the Washington Commanders forty five point fifteen to remain comfortably
atop the AFC East and they're nine to three for
the first time since two thousand and one. How about that, Greggie,

(39:41):
This was it? This was that a dominant Miami offense.
And of course if they're having a dominant day, Tyreek
Hill is all over it.

Speaker 1 (39:46):
Yeah, I want it to be dazzled. I said it.

Speaker 4 (39:48):
It's been a while since we had one of those
two games and we got it, and yes, Tyreek Hill
is ridiculous, and that is such a great adjustment on
the ball there where maybe they weren't on the same
page exactly, and he gets the long touchdown. But Tua
creates math problems with these receivers. Those two long touchdowns
that he threw were in getting rid of the ball

(40:10):
in two point one to three seconds, in two point
twenty five seconds, which is so fast, and yet the
ball is fifty yards.

Speaker 1 (40:16):
Down the field and Hill is catching up to it.
So it's timing, it's footwork.

Speaker 4 (40:20):
I think Tua's really improved at resetting and making the
first pass rush or miss missed. That wasn't maybe the
case on those touchdowns, but there were many plays today
where Washington actually did get pressure quickly and he just
does a little shoulder shake or he moves to the
side and then he resets. It's very Tom Brady is
just in terms of the pocket presence of just quickly

(40:41):
moving and then making a nice throw. So I'm I'm
all aboard the Tyreek Hill is the MVP right now.
I've been saying that for a while. He's at ninety
three for one, one twelve, but this was absolutely also
a great TUA performance and it was nice to see.

Speaker 1 (40:57):
We needed that.

Speaker 3 (40:57):
I mean, Tyreek Hill is just doing this every week.
Part of it is the opponent. Washington has given up
one hundred and five points in three games, and well,
I think Sam Howell has been.

Speaker 1 (41:08):
A visually intriguing player to watch.

Speaker 3 (41:11):
Everything is falling apart and it's it's clear, you know
the coach is going to be gone, the GM is
going to be gone. I think Howell deserves a chance
to stay as your future starter. I think he's shown
a lot, but he also, like is not protected well,
walks into a lot of his own sacks. And when
you get the version of them throwing a pick six today,
lighting now, I think it's a good sign that without
Jill Phillips, the Dolphins like defense played another good game.

Speaker 4 (41:34):
They got so much pressure on how this. I thought
Howell played well in this game, which will sound crazy
because he had one hundred and twenty seven yards in
an interception. The interception to me is not on the quarterback.
It was a great read by Andrew van Ginkle, like
a play that they through film study. He just read
it and picked it off. Van Ginkel had a sack,
a pick six and almost blocked a pun and then yeah,

(41:57):
Seeler and ogbad getting pressure. They were all over how
who had a couple of rushing touchdowns. And he only
took three sacks in this game. This is one of
those where he could have taken about eight sacks in
this game.

Speaker 5 (42:06):
You can't give somebody a staff for almost doing something.

Speaker 2 (42:08):
I'm just saying he was amongst after stats.

Speaker 1 (42:12):
I just made like vig Gego is everywhere.

Speaker 4 (42:14):
And there was a moment like right after a pick
six and a sack that he then almost blocked the button.

Speaker 2 (42:18):
I was just like, nice, was great. You know, I think, uh,
we now have Ron Rivera. He has now graduated, uh
to the uh Frank Reich dead man walking club.

Speaker 1 (42:30):
It's no longer a matter of if, It's a matter
of when.

Speaker 2 (42:33):
And there is certainly a case to be made here
and everyone out there wants Eric Pienemy to get a
shot as a head coach with his resume to give
the enemy, you know, four or five weeks.

Speaker 3 (42:46):
I couldn't agree more. I don't think you let you.
I don't think you just let him gocuse. I think
he's been he's been a big shot.

Speaker 2 (42:52):
See what happens with the team, see how they play
with him, and see how the offense operates with him
kind of having more responsibility. Now I might look smart
if this happens on like tomorrow, would not shock me.
But they also just let go of the defensive coordinator
and that was kind of the blood letting that I
thought would take Rivera to the finish line.

Speaker 1 (43:09):
And yet games like these make you think, like what
is the point, Like they're also going to they're entering
their bye week too, so.

Speaker 5 (43:15):
Another reason why it could happen.

Speaker 1 (43:17):
Okay, it could.

Speaker 4 (43:18):
And there was like a moment where Bienemy was kind
of like barking at Howell on the side. I just
don't know, Like it's not a good position for Bienemy
to be in either. I don't think it helps anyone.
But yeah, Rivera's defense. The Dolphins only had nine drives.

Speaker 1 (43:33):
In this game and they put up forty five points,
So it was rather that was rather a need and
a chain came back scored a couple of times. They
you know, that was a kind of get right game.
That was a nice adjust I.

Speaker 2 (43:44):
Had not thought of it in roughly twenty five years.
But on NFL Primetime on ESPN. Back in the nineties,
Eric Benemy was a running back. Oh yeah, and Chris
Berman would call him sleeping.

Speaker 5 (43:55):
With the enemy.

Speaker 1 (43:56):
Oh yeah, the Julia Roberts vehicle on one of his
best Yeah, maller and technicical. Now sleeping at the enemy
is that's a classic sleeping with the enemy.

Speaker 5 (44:09):
Good stuff. All right, here we go.

Speaker 2 (44:11):
We move forward because that's the only thing we can
do across the sidewalk.

Speaker 1 (44:16):
Mark Sessler was not in attendance, and maybe that was
a good thing.

Speaker 15 (44:20):
So has seven seconds to work with as they set
up from the thirty second and one from the pocket,
he deals.

Speaker 2 (44:27):
Down the scene, hits pot, broke it field holcoh oh,
that was pretty Pooka.

Speaker 11 (44:33):
To the crib, just touchdown.

Speaker 1 (44:35):
Alan.

Speaker 5 (44:40):
To the crib.

Speaker 1 (44:43):
You know, we love our guy, Davey Long with the call,
great guy, great announcer. Oh yeah.

Speaker 2 (44:50):
Matthew Stafford threw three touchdown passes and that guy pooking
Akoua the first ever Rams rookie wide receiver across one
thousand yards in the season.

Speaker 1 (45:01):
It's December third, how about that?

Speaker 2 (45:03):
Wow, the Rams keep winning. That's three in a row,
sneaky three game winning streak. Thirty six nineteen over the
Browns at so far mark that final score is misleading
because we were sitting next to each other. The Browns have
a chance to tie this game, I believe in the
fourth quarter.

Speaker 5 (45:21):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (45:21):
And then what midway through down one right, Yeah, and
you're one of the most reliable kickers in the league,
misses an extra point and things go south from there
and Dustin Hopkins, Dustin Hopkins, I think this this feels
like a lot of Browns games. We're gonna get down
the stretch because you got you had Joe Flacco. And
I'll say one story for Cleveland is that I would
not have been as surprise if we got a version

(45:42):
of Joe Flacco that literally was a statue, couldn't move
and any fumbles today, no, no fumbles through the ball.

Speaker 2 (45:49):
He had a stone age pony. He can do something.
He also looked to me refreshed.

Speaker 3 (45:54):
I mean, I'm not saying he's gonna he's he's not
going to like like confuse anyone on the ground, but
he didn't look like he looked to me last year
with the Jets. I thought he threw the ball outside
of you know, the one interception that was so costly,
like threw the ball really well at times, and like
you kind of it's like, oh, well, if you had
this version of of a quarterback play like during this,
Like you know, they've been on four of them and

(46:15):
it's been real up and down. Maybe they win some
of these close games, but I like this is an
example of like Omari Cooper goes out with an injury,
they've got very little else happening, you know, through the air,
and like they're they're a patchwork ground game without Nick
Chubb and so it's like they're the amount of mistakes
they can make in a Ford is so narrow unless

(46:36):
their defense has one of those games from Miles Garrett
has three sacks and you're turning the ball over, you know,
take generating takeaways, and they weren't doing that today.

Speaker 1 (46:44):
And it's a it's a couple of weeks in.

Speaker 3 (46:45):
A row where it's kind of just like concerned about
the overall journey of this Browns team. R I feel like
other AFC teams at the bottom of that, like wild
Card Grid are starting to heat up, like Cleveland's going
in the other direction, and I don't really think you
can rely on Joe Flacco and left of this offense
to save you.

Speaker 4 (47:01):
Well, yeah, midway through the fourth quarter, which is crazy
looking at the final score. The brown score touchdown, they
missed the extra point, but then they get a quick
punt from the Rams and Joe Flacco actually has the
ball with six point fifty one to go down one point.
And at that point there were a lot of tweets
and I was half watching this game too.

Speaker 1 (47:22):
There's a lot of drops.

Speaker 4 (47:23):
I thought Flacco was playing great, like Tony Grose's saying,
this is the best game any quarterbacks played for the
Browns this season. And then Flacco just forced one. He
took a shot that he shouldn't have taken. John Johnson
intercepts it, returns it, and suddenly the Rams are rolling.
But you can tell me more, Mark that I was
surprised to see the Rams rack up four hundred yards

(47:43):
almost in this game. And I think Stafford played well
and Pukinoku is great and they get the running game
going late. But if you had just said, Okay, this
is an average defense, they're playing like they looked like
an average defense based on the stats.

Speaker 1 (47:55):
Did they look like that?

Speaker 3 (47:56):
Yes, yeah, because it wasn't the way that the Rams.
The Rams did it a lot through the air. I mean,
Nakua fried them. They don't have Denzel Award and that's
two weeks in a row. Yeah, they really miss him.
I think that if you look at Jim Schwartz's defense
is historically like they've shined when he's had like that
shutdown corner and they're picking on other cornerbacks in this game.

(48:16):
And like Nikua had one hundred plus yard because of
that play right there, but he hit one hundred plus
yards in the first quarter and then like what he
looks like he had a nasty injury.

Speaker 1 (48:25):
It was a rib injury, but came back in.

Speaker 3 (48:27):
So it's like, this is a gritty young guy who
like when you don't get big numbers from Cooper Cup
Stafford Kaleen on him, and it's like they found different
ways to beat a pretty banged up Browns defense.

Speaker 2 (48:36):
Browns didn't force a turnover, the Browns didn't have a sack.
A lot of talk about the Browns is a historic
defense that's kind of out the window now. They've been
normal for a few weeks now. And I don't know
if Males Garrett's healthy or not, but you know that's
now a very quiet game and a big spot. And
on the other side of the ball. You know Joe Flacco.

(48:57):
You know he's six foot six and he's got the howitzer.
Even on the Jets last year, if you protected him,
he made some plays like he could so if they
can block for him. He cannot play behind a bad
offensive line at this stage of his career.

Speaker 1 (49:08):
But did they block for him. I'm sure he could
keep this offense moving.

Speaker 2 (49:10):
But the defense has to rediscover that spark or yeah,
they're going to fade out of this very quickly.

Speaker 5 (49:15):
The Ramps are interesting.

Speaker 2 (49:16):
This is their first greg three game winning streak since
their Super Bowl season.

Speaker 4 (49:20):
Wow, and they're limiting teams. I think this is four
street they've held opponents under twenty one points. The defense,
which is so undermanned, gets better and better. Kobe Turner,
a rookie, had a really nice game. But I think
this was a reminder. Flaco's old, for sure, thirty eight
years old, but it's easy to forget Matthew Stafford's thirty five,

(49:40):
and he is just next freaking level. There was a
play they hit a couple big plays to DeMarcus Robinson
in the second half, and there was one where Kyron
Williams is coming out of the back we field on
a wheel route, and Stafford turns his whole soulder and
Williams is open, turns his whole soulder to kind of
look at him, doesn't even do a pumping, but just

(50:02):
moves his feet and his shoulders to look at Kyrien.
Williams gets the safety to bite and then just throws
a total dime behind the safety on that touchdown to Niakua.
That was an audible at the line of scrimmage. Sean
McVay did not call that play, and so awesome. Stafford's
operating at a really, really high level, and that's why
they're six and six. He still is the biggest reason
to me that they're six and six.

Speaker 3 (50:23):
You know what, Lebron James and Kareem Abdul Jabarbara booth
at this game?

Speaker 1 (50:28):
Who at the football game?

Speaker 4 (50:30):
The two highest scoring players in the history of basket.

Speaker 1 (50:34):
But they're basketball players. I don't know, why would they
be at the I don't know. It made no sense
to me from that angle that they're not the same sport.
Doesn't it seem like we should have heard something by now?

Speaker 5 (50:47):
What I mean, how much more time do I have
to buy for you, Bud.

Speaker 1 (50:51):
I don't know why this is the most completely different
in basketball now. I don't know why this is the
drop for of all the drops that have gotten the
most used. There was something highly comical about like flying
up the rappaport connection, like ian was your supposed to
from basketball?

Speaker 5 (51:08):
See, yeah, that one.

Speaker 3 (51:10):
Right, an NFL insider saying that, So you know I'm
getting but I agree.

Speaker 2 (51:14):
I think we all agree with you. So that's why
I was surprised they were even at the football game.

Speaker 9 (51:17):
Yeah, I mean I it is illogical, all right.

Speaker 2 (51:20):
Speaking of ill logical, the Jets for the past twelve years,
oh fifty twelve to the medal.

Speaker 10 (51:26):
Ends Boyle from under center here on second at nine,
play fake to Dalvin Cook. Boyle wants to hang one
up fort Garrett Wilson.

Speaker 8 (51:34):
And it's picked.

Speaker 10 (51:35):
Jesse Bates has got another one fifth interception of the
year for Jesse Bates, and like last week, he read
it from center field.

Speaker 1 (51:48):
In Atlanta.

Speaker 10 (51:49):
Celebrates the pick by Baits with twenty six seconds.

Speaker 5 (51:52):
To go into third.

Speaker 2 (51:54):
Yes, that right there might be the final throw of
Tim Boyle's NFL career. Yes, another benefactor of the Aaron
Rodgers Scholarship fund bit the dust on Sunday, be fuddled
by the Falcons defense and an ugly thirteen to eight
win for the NFC South leaders. Desmond Ritter back in
the lineup for the second game. He threw a twenty
yard touchdown pass to Mikole Pruitt in the second quarter.

Speaker 5 (52:17):
That was the only touchdown in the game, and that was.

Speaker 2 (52:19):
The only thing that you would really need to beat
the Jets, who cannot score touchdowns. So the Falcons they
keep their spot top the NFC South. However, man, if
you want to talk yourself into the Falcons, go do
it until you're blue in the face. And I'm not
going to take anything away from him. They won this game,

(52:41):
but I just I still don't see it with this team,
and they could not get the running game going. They
really won because how inept the other side of the
ball is here.

Speaker 1 (52:48):
They're a tough watch.

Speaker 3 (52:49):
And I'm looking at this drive chart that the Jets
had six drives that win for less than six yards,
I mean, and they seem to look at like it
every week.

Speaker 9 (52:56):
And I guess i'd ask you this.

Speaker 3 (52:58):
Like, do you see the team con you mean to
splinter and fracture or was this a little bit better?

Speaker 2 (53:03):
That's almost too exciting a faith for the Jets at
this point, they just stink.

Speaker 5 (53:06):
They're a bad team.

Speaker 2 (53:08):
They are now on their third quarterback Trevor Simmons came
in after that boil throw and was equally ineffective. It
was so and credit the Falcons defense, Okay, you got it,
because you know, you gotta win games in the league.
And when the Jets took the field for their last possession,
they are down. What are they down? They're down five

(53:29):
points and they have the ball with less than two
minutes to play. They don't have any timeouts, but they
have the ball and they just have to go down
the field and score a touchdown.

Speaker 5 (53:37):
There was no one watching this game.

Speaker 2 (53:39):
There was no one at Metlive Stadium that thought the
Jets had any chance to go down the field. They
had one completion on the drive to get near I
think the forty yard line, and then they just marched
backwards and didn't even come close. So the Falcons, you know,
as frustrating and up and down as their offense has
been this season, and again you would have liked to
see their running game, you know, do better in this game.

(54:02):
Their defense has been at times pretty good this year,
and against a bad offense like the Jets and weather
like this, it was miserable at the metal ends. They
took advantage of their setup.

Speaker 4 (54:12):
Yeah, I think this is sometimes I think the narrative's
been played up too much that the Jets defense is
just holding on, holding on, holding on some of those
games that they haven't been, you know, pristine this game.
You give up one hundred and ninety four yards, you
give up three yards per play, You hold the Falcons
running attack, which was outstanding last week, to ninety yards.
You keep giving your offense a chance after chance after chance.

(54:36):
The Jets offense had seven possessions in the second half.
They did everything humanly possible. This was kind of the
stereotypical Jets game that we've been talking about all years,
and now they have the fewest touchdowns of any team
through twelve games in thirty years. And I saw this
stat from whoa from it was? I think it was

(54:56):
on true media. I forget who tweeted out. I apologize,
but two of the top five worst games of off
target throws from quarterback, so they measure how many throws
did you have in the game that gave your receiver
no chance to even make the catch. Tim Boyle in
this game was I think third worst all season, and

(55:17):
Trevor Simeon was fifth worst.

Speaker 1 (55:18):
So it was like they.

Speaker 4 (55:19):
Can't find they can't find a quarterback who could just
throw the ball. And I know there was bad weather,
but it's like Ritter wasn't on that list.

Speaker 2 (55:25):
As I will do on these Sundays this season, because
this has been, honestly, and there have been so many
but in a lot of ways, the most frustrating worst
Jets season ever because of the Rogers side of things,
and maybe if there's any positive to this, this almost
certainly should take Aaron Rodgers out of play trying to
force his way back on the field because they are
essentially eliminated at this point four and eight. I heard

(55:48):
there were Zach Wilson apologists in my mentions being like, oh,
and you wanted and you wanted Zack Wilson out of lineup.

Speaker 5 (55:54):
Well, yeah, it didn't work, but it.

Speaker 2 (55:56):
Was always a hail Mary to see if one of
these guys could provide a spark.

Speaker 1 (56:00):
Neither could, and now you have Bob Sala, who.

Speaker 2 (56:02):
Has completely been stripped of any dignity up on the
press on the day of saying, oh, you know, you
might be turning to another quarterback next week. And again,
it didn't have to be over after Week one. Maybe
the Super Bowl dreams had to be over, but you
could have still been competitive this year if you went
out and got a real quarterback. You didn't, and like
I said, you get what you deserve. So another gruesome

(56:25):
Sunday at the Metal Lands. And the thing I worry
about spinning forward now is, and I've seen it before,
they got some really talented it's a top heavy roster
for the Jets, but a lot of talented young guys
that are living through a gruesome season after a horrible
ending to last season, and it's just bad energy and
bad vibes, and that leads to negative talk and guys

(56:47):
maybe not.

Speaker 5 (56:48):
Wanted to be in the building anymore.

Speaker 2 (56:49):
And they're seeing what's going on elsewhere in the league
where people are having fun and winning games.

Speaker 5 (56:54):
It's gotten to that place for the Jets.

Speaker 2 (56:57):
So I don't know how much else needs to be
said about this game. The Falcons took care of business,
but I wasn't overly impressed by them. It was like
a mediocre team against a team that is completely imploded
and the mediocre team came out ahead.

Speaker 3 (57:10):
Yeah, I feel really ultimately incorrect about what I thought
the Falcons would be. And they're just the middle of
the road team and a terrible division. They're gonna get
an extra game in January that I don't need to watch.

Speaker 4 (57:21):
But maybe maybe there's there's six and sent that they're
in that world, there's six and six, so that gives
them a one game lead over the Saints and the Bucks.
Hopefully it's only one NFC South team to sneak in,
although if the you know, the Falcons are at six
and six, they were one of four teams we just
mentioned the Rams that are at six and six.

Speaker 1 (57:38):
It might turn into five. It's a six and sick
God help us, and they.

Speaker 9 (57:41):
Get two teams from that Southern Probably won't happen.

Speaker 1 (57:44):
Probably won't happen. A. J.

Speaker 4 (57:46):
Terrell got hurt in this game, by the way, their
best defensive day after losing Grady Jarrett.

Speaker 1 (57:52):
You know they need him back, all right, let's see,
let's see.

Speaker 5 (57:58):
Let us move to you're dying with anticipation Arch.

Speaker 2 (58:05):
Let's move to Pittsburgh, where the Steelers are looking to
continue their quest twelve and five.

Speaker 15 (58:12):
They're down on a yard on the nine. Three tight
ends Murray under center, Connor behind him, one receiver to
the right. They hand it off Connor.

Speaker 3 (58:22):
To the left.

Speaker 15 (58:22):
First down, Connor dies for the end zone touchdown. James
Connor with two scores and the welcome back party in Pittsburgh.

Speaker 5 (58:32):
All the Carls just.

Speaker 8 (58:34):
Broke out the black and blue brigade.

Speaker 13 (58:37):
Baby light up and suck the beating heart leaf.

Speaker 8 (58:43):
Speaking of your opponents.

Speaker 1 (58:46):
Whoa put that to clip it?

Speaker 2 (58:52):
And I know, Eric, you know when we're saying this,
do we have a folder of the top calls of
the year. I have a folder because because once again
Ron wolf Lee is announcing this is my competition to lose.
I like that, he clarified, metaphorically, speaking right. James Connor,
the former Steeler, ran for a buck five and two touchdowns,

(59:16):
including the game Icer and the Cardinals beat the Steelers
twenty four to ten at the field formerly known as Hines.
It's their first win in Pittsburgh since the Summer of Love, Mark, which.

Speaker 9 (59:29):
Was nineteen sixty nine. Well, it depends who you are, but.

Speaker 2 (59:31):
Yeah, that's correct, and Gregy, I mean, oh soon, come
on now, Steelers.

Speaker 5 (59:39):
We can't.

Speaker 1 (59:39):
We can't. It can't be December and we're losing games
to the tanking card.

Speaker 4 (59:43):
We can't this for a game that was delayed by
lightning multiple times in Pittsburgh in December, come back to us,
mother Nature.

Speaker 2 (59:54):
It's a high desert team flying across the country. They're
just looking to get this game over.

Speaker 4 (59:59):
With right, And at one point was twenty four to three.
It was highly entertaining and surprising. Sometimes you watch a
game and you're just not expecting it to go a
certain way, and late in the second quarter of this game,
it was going how we expected that the Steelers had
out gained the Cardinals at that point one sixty one

(01:00:19):
to thirty six, and then a two play sequence on
the goal line changed everything. Kenny Pickett scrambled trying to
score at the four, he got to the one yard line,
he hurt his ankle. We're now hearing again that it's
a significant injury according to Jerry Dulac, and that he
just said not good and that'll miss some time, extended time.

(01:00:40):
So if it's an ankle injury too.

Speaker 1 (01:00:42):
He's ducked serious and you just get hurt every few.

Speaker 4 (01:00:45):
Weeks and he takes a lot of big hits, so
that sounds like a multiple week injury. In comes Trubisky.
He hands it off to Nase Harris. It's three to
three at the time, even though the Steelers have totally dominated,
they hand it to Harris.

Speaker 1 (01:00:58):
He gets stoned at the one.

Speaker 4 (01:01:00):
Well, at least he got the Steelers defense backed up
or playing against the Cardinals, who have ever done anything
backed up. Kyler Murray leads one of the most epic
drives of the year, fifteen plays, ninety ninety yards for
a touchdown, and you know what, Kyler Murray played fantastic
the rest of the game. So did James Connor, and
they kind of dominated the second half of this game.

(01:01:23):
Trey McBride went wild the second year, tight and eight
for eighty.

Speaker 1 (01:01:27):
Nine in a touchdown.

Speaker 4 (01:01:28):
He dominated that that ninety nine yard drive and I
was just floored by how much this game changed in
that sequence.

Speaker 3 (01:01:35):
That fifteen play touchdown drive was Arizona's longest march since
twenty fifteen.

Speaker 4 (01:01:40):
That you know what else is it's the longest march
in NFL history. I mean yards wides, you can't can't
top it. It's tied a bit.

Speaker 9 (01:01:47):
And on top it can't beat it. I have a
weird stat from this game.

Speaker 5 (01:01:50):
Weirder than what Greg just said. I guess that was weird.

Speaker 9 (01:01:52):
I think it's I'd say it's less trenches.

Speaker 5 (01:01:55):
Okay.

Speaker 3 (01:01:56):
Kyler Murray at five to ten in a quarter inches
to rondeel Moore, who's five to seven.

Speaker 1 (01:02:02):
Their touchdown combination.

Speaker 3 (01:02:03):
Is the shortest duo to connect for a touchdown since
Pard Pierce, who was five foot five, threw a touchdown
to Dutch s Tournament was five foot eight on the
nineteen twenty Decatur Staley's I think it was football.

Speaker 1 (01:02:18):
Wow, it's a different sport, Gunners. That's pretty good. Although
they dead that came from Adam Harstadt and that was
fa That was one of my favorite plays and throws
of the week, and they actually called it back because
of a holding call.

Speaker 4 (01:02:32):
But he has thrown touchdowns to rondel Moore in the past,
I believe, so that would still be a true statement unless.

Speaker 3 (01:02:40):
One of them was much taller when that happened.

Speaker 1 (01:02:43):
But yeah, that was Kyler.

Speaker 4 (01:02:44):
You look at the box score and you see one
hundred and forty five yards on twenty three attempts at
a touchdown, you think, okay, it was good game, nothing crazy,
but he had two of the best throws I saw
a week. One was would have been a sixty yard
play to Moore who dropped it, and the other was
like a forty yard touchdown to More where Moore made
a great play. It was a great throw on the
run and it ends up getting called back. And it
was very confusing because they never showed flag on the

(01:03:06):
on the broadcast got suddenly they just are lining up again.

Speaker 9 (01:03:11):
But wow, they brought us asleep at the wheel.

Speaker 1 (01:03:13):
Little James Connor revenge game in Pittsburgh, it was fun.

Speaker 2 (01:03:16):
How about Mike Tomlin, who's got to be I mean,
we know our boy Mike t the Aviators. He had
to be furious with his Steelers laying an egg against
the Cards.

Speaker 5 (01:03:25):
Let's listen, you know that was a horrible day at
the office. We didn't do much right in that game,
to be quite honest with you.

Speaker 13 (01:03:33):
So we got to own that obviously, starting first and
foremost with me.

Speaker 5 (01:03:38):
Just losing football.

Speaker 1 (01:03:41):
A lot of it was like bad snaps called it JV.
He said it was a JV. Performed had a lot
of bad penalties.

Speaker 4 (01:03:47):
Team, Yeah, they had a lot of big penalties. Nine
for seventy seven, and they're usually one of the least
penalty teams. They had like three different bad snaps, so
you'll see in the box score that Trubisky and Picket
both had fumbles, but those were the bad stumps. They
lost one, so they set up a short field. Like
the Cardinals, touchdowns were often other than the ninety nine
yard one. We're on short fields, and yeah, it was

(01:04:09):
just sloppy. Trubisky wasn't great, but he took a couple
of shots. He wasn't He wasn't a disaster. It was
just they got down fast in a hurry, and JJ
Watt went out with an injury. He did say after
the game, JJ Watt did our TJ Watt sorry, that
he's fine and he'll be playing on Thursday.

Speaker 5 (01:04:24):
Yeah, that says.

Speaker 2 (01:04:25):
I didn't want to be that guy because you guys
are excited about it, but I just couldn't get on
board with this Pittsburgh offense turning the corner talk this
week and then this game happens and I have to
watch it. But it's just like, even when they were
putting up more yards, they still weren't scoring points.

Speaker 1 (01:04:40):
And once again, they can't. You can't score.

Speaker 4 (01:04:43):
Well, I think it was a reminder their running game
was working great until the moment they got stuffed on
the goal line. But when you suddenly get down two
touchdowns like that kind of went out the window.

Speaker 3 (01:04:53):
Well that's so called explosion happened against the Bengals team
with zero offense.

Speaker 9 (01:04:57):
Right now in the defense thought and.

Speaker 4 (01:05:00):
It included again sixteen points, as Dan pointed out, normal
and uh yeah, this guy, this guy McBride who again
for the seventeen people like myself who watched all or
Nothing and Trey McBride was featuring out hard knocks in
the very likable guy who had very little role last year.
I think he is their leading receiver for the season

(01:05:22):
now Dan, which maybe is not a great thing, but
he's on pace for over eight hundred yards. That's pretty
big time for a tight end.

Speaker 1 (01:05:28):
Let's big weapons in the off season. It's hands Mark.

Speaker 5 (01:05:31):
We got to to get twelve and five.

Speaker 2 (01:05:33):
Now, we got to be Patriots at Indy verse Sincy,
at Seahawks, at Ravens, need them all.

Speaker 1 (01:05:38):
Yeah, it's not gonna happen in the Cardinals. It's not happening.
Thank you Cardinals for winning this game and helping out
the tankathon exploits of the Patriots. Here, let's take a
break and then we'll hit those patriots.

Speaker 5 (01:05:51):
Good leading.

Speaker 1 (01:06:00):
Think we got something here that's think Welcome back to
Around the NFL, the flagship show.

Speaker 5 (01:06:05):
Hey, I was thinking.

Speaker 2 (01:06:08):
I was thinking because I came into the studio before
we started recording, came in a little hot, came in thinking,
you know, how if the NFL ever like invested in
some type of promotional campaign for our show.

Speaker 5 (01:06:22):
Hasn't really happened yet, but doesn't mean.

Speaker 1 (01:06:24):
It can't happen.

Speaker 2 (01:06:25):
You know, they started to flex our financial might what
fifteen billion dollar company? Yeah, all of a sudden they
start running ads on Sunday for Around.

Speaker 1 (01:06:32):
The That would be fun.

Speaker 2 (01:06:33):
Yeah, I'm sure they'll get to that soon. So I
just had an idea that popped into my head. Exterior.
Two dads at a playground in a park, Okay, okay,
And then so dad one's like, oh man, it's so
hard to keep up with everything going on in this world,
especially in the NFL, you know, because my wife is dead.
And then the other guy comes in and their kids

(01:06:55):
are playing in the background, and he's like, well, I
got something for you. Other guy's like oh, a new wife.
He's like, no, I have the Around the NFL podcast,
And then the guy with the dead wife goes, I
don't need another show all about x'es and o's of
the game.

Speaker 5 (01:07:12):
And then the other guy.

Speaker 2 (01:07:14):
Goes, Nah, these shows a little more than just about
the x'es and o's.

Speaker 5 (01:07:21):
End of commercial.

Speaker 4 (01:07:24):
I think it also could you could have different versions
where like it's all the same except his last line
is different, and it's like, actually, these guys have a
lot of fun too.

Speaker 1 (01:07:36):
That's good, you know what I mean. And so that's
that you're building and building different variations, and it's unclear
how the wife perished.

Speaker 2 (01:07:43):
Well, I was gonna say, you could have a last
shot of him being like, well, off to the cemetery.

Speaker 1 (01:07:47):
I mean, that seems like a downer. Seems like a downer.

Speaker 9 (01:07:52):
I think our show would mask over a lost line.

Speaker 1 (01:07:54):
Here's the thing, it's like.

Speaker 5 (01:07:55):
That would be that would get people talking.

Speaker 1 (01:07:58):
Yeah, yeah, they take they take their jobs really seriously,
but they don't take themselves too seriously.

Speaker 2 (01:08:04):
Oh yeah, these guys love ball, but it's not just
about the ball.

Speaker 3 (01:08:09):
They have fun, very organic conversation. It's like yours. It's
like you're friends with them. These are like the three
buddies in the bar, especially if you're from northern Scotland.

Speaker 1 (01:08:21):
There's Scotland coming up again on the show Great Country
that anyone's listening from the ad department?

Speaker 3 (01:08:27):
Just why have they never why have they never invested
even a penny on our shows before?

Speaker 2 (01:08:35):
I've never heard anything anything from the third floor. Maybe
that's for the best.

Speaker 1 (01:08:41):
All right, let's head to Foxborough where the bizarre misery continued.
For Greg's patriots Herbert to throw.

Speaker 12 (01:08:51):
As a man, it's the game, Alex Erickson.

Speaker 1 (01:08:58):
When the game demanded, excel.

Speaker 12 (01:09:01):
Etta, do not shrink when the lights are the brightest.
He puts the ball in his most valuable weapons hands
and justin Herbert delivers the victory.

Speaker 1 (01:09:16):
Put that on the list.

Speaker 5 (01:09:17):
That's pretty good.

Speaker 2 (01:09:17):
You gotta know money like you got a chance to
work with money for a few years of powering. The
man's got a keen sense of humor and a dry wit.
You could you could hear the sarcasm pulsing through that call.
And again, also, if you're gonna put any other guy
from San Diego too, If you're gonna put you're gonna
take money out of seal beach where he's doing his

(01:09:39):
surfing at six am, and you're gonna put him on
a plane and send him to New England in December
for this nothing burger of a game. At least get
a w Chargers and they do as Cameron Dicker made
two thirty eight yard field goals Hunter JK. Scott, Oh,
he's been in the Pats inside the twenty all day,
seven times in the in the and rain, and Herbert

(01:10:03):
picked up that late completion. Mark Sessler six nothing the final, WHOA.

Speaker 1 (01:10:09):
This was the worst football game I've ever watched?

Speaker 5 (01:10:13):
Is it?

Speaker 1 (01:10:13):
Wow?

Speaker 5 (01:10:14):
Six nothing?

Speaker 1 (01:10:15):
Two field goals, two short field goals.

Speaker 3 (01:10:17):
Yeah, that's I'd say from a distance, I'd kind of
be into that kind of a game because it stands
out is something very usual dog type of game.

Speaker 1 (01:10:24):
You're right unwatchable.

Speaker 3 (01:10:26):
How so, Bailey Zappi is in there, Yon Uh is
a worse than Mac Jones. I think it's hard to
detect who is worse because there's also nothing around them.

Speaker 10 (01:10:36):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (01:10:36):
They lost Formandri Stevenson with an ankleer injury pretty early
in this and that's really all they seem to have.
I thought Zappi's day was characterized by a pretty great
deep shot in the third quarter the trailing six nothing
horrible drop by Tykwon Thornton. It's like they just can't
get anything done. The Patriots defense looked good because that's

(01:10:58):
the Chargers. The Chargers are spiralingly a little on offense.
They cannot run the ball, they have no balance the Patriots.
This is a This is a wacky stat They are
the first team to lose three straight games despite allowing
ten or fewer points in those three games since go
back to nineteen thirty eight to the Chicago Cardinals. Every
other team this year that has allowed fewer than ten

(01:11:20):
ten or fewer points is fifty three and zero. That
this offense is so bad. Three yeah, this offense is
so bad. They're so unwatchable. And yet I kind of think,
I mean, I guess we don't know where anyone where
Belichick will be after all that. It's like what they
did last year by or last week by you know,
I think overtly missing that final field goal and try

(01:11:41):
to miss I don't know, I you.

Speaker 1 (01:11:43):
Know, weren't playing for the win. That remains like the
jury is out.

Speaker 3 (01:11:47):
In my opinion on that, that was drastic. I mean,
it's kind of working out perfectly. They're so bad that
they're probably gonna guess get snagged the number one number.

Speaker 2 (01:11:56):
And I'll take it a step further. Everyone's connecting Belichick
to the Chargers. I don't know whether there's actual logic
to it, Well, there's logic but actual smoke to it,
or if there's.

Speaker 5 (01:12:05):
Fire to it or what.

Speaker 2 (01:12:06):
But not only did you lose again, and it's it's
remarkable how badly this season has gone. I never thought
it could get this bad for Bill belichicking doing because no,
and I'm not I don't even want to go down
the road of like if he's really the greatest coach
of all time, how could this be happening, because there's
a lot of things going on here. But like you know,
he also made the Chargers look bad again in its

(01:12:29):
own way, So it's another nail and the coffin of
Brandon Stalley despite getting the win in a way, so
the conspiracy theories continue.

Speaker 1 (01:12:35):
Yeah, I went to Renferral, like wo Staley's defense just
pitched the shutout.

Speaker 3 (01:12:39):
No, so that's a thing like that is it's not
all negative because I like I'm losing hope in their offense.

Speaker 9 (01:12:44):
Quentin Johnson another terrible drop today.

Speaker 1 (01:12:46):
Oh that was awful.

Speaker 3 (01:12:47):
I mean, if it's happening every week, so I don't
know if it's there's no new story there.

Speaker 1 (01:12:50):
But Khalil Mack had two more secks. He has fifty.
He leads the NFL with fifty.

Speaker 2 (01:12:55):
When I saw that on Twitter, I was thinking to myself, Okay,
we know he had that insane when he had seven,
So that's always gonna juice it. But he has a
chance to challenge for the all time sack record Khalil Mack,
he's twenty three, Yeah, that could happen. He certainly could
challenge for a twenty sex season, which only about what
twenty guys or whatever.

Speaker 4 (01:13:15):
All he's got to do is play Zappi and Indan
O'Connell every week and he'll he'll get it done because Zappy,
the little I watched, was just holding onto the ball
forever on some of those plays. But this still fifteen sacks, No, Still,
he has been third. He's been fantastic this year. That
the thing that gets me, and it happened these last
two weeks with this team is Belichick has spent more

(01:13:36):
money and more time and he's so worried about the details,
and he invests in all these special teams only players,
and their special teams are terrible, their bottom five and
Dvoa their kicker who they drafted and got rid of
focus terrible. And then every other time I was I
looked at this game, you got Bryce Behringer, who's one
of the worst punters in the league. Bryce Behringer, who's

(01:13:57):
another rookie punter who they also drafted. The drafted a punter,
and the kickers, and like the difference in punting in
this game and the kicker, like, it's just if you've
lost that with Belichick. I know the defense has been
playing well, and yeah they have been. Uh it's still
not good.

Speaker 5 (01:14:13):
But we could save this conversation.

Speaker 1 (01:14:16):
But how is it?

Speaker 2 (01:14:19):
How is Bill Belichick presiding over something this truly dreadful?
How has this happened? How could it happen?

Speaker 4 (01:14:25):
Well, it's been in the same place, and he has
no checks on his power. And the few people that
maybe not had checks on his power, but would you know,
answer to him or like have some power in the organization.

Speaker 1 (01:14:41):
They're all they're all long gone. Nick Casserio, he's long gone,
Like they're all Tom Brady's long gone of course as well,
that's for a long time. Yes, let's hear from Bill Belichick.

Speaker 2 (01:14:50):
Awkward press conferences are the norm, and now you know
he's forced to answer these questions about his own job security.

Speaker 1 (01:14:57):
Bill, do you want to stay here and keep coaching
the Patriots?

Speaker 5 (01:15:00):
I look forward to this weekend right for a Steelers
read that.

Speaker 2 (01:15:05):
You know that's kind of a Bill answer, But it
all feels like the beginning.

Speaker 5 (01:15:10):
Of the end.

Speaker 3 (01:15:10):
You and I are getting Steelers Patriots on Thursday nights in.

Speaker 2 (01:15:14):
Oh yeah, a little trubisky zapp dog. How about this?
The world is getting Jets Patriots in week eighteen. It's
not like many people watch at the Earth like ready
to eviscerate everything that lives upon it.

Speaker 1 (01:15:31):
I take the medior.

Speaker 4 (01:15:33):
By the way, the Chargers in the AFC at five
and seven are two games back of a playoff spot.
You can't totally ax them out. But if they were
in the NFC, it'd say they'd have a chance. In
the AFC, two games back with five games to play
and a lot of teams to hop is a lot.

Speaker 5 (01:15:49):
But can't do that.

Speaker 1 (01:15:50):
They have to just win out essentially and go there,
which they will not be doing they will not be
doing that. Most likely.

Speaker 3 (01:15:56):
We're in that of the year where we have these
conversations and you're just waiting for the slow crawl of
time to remove these teams permanently and mathematically.

Speaker 2 (01:16:04):
All right, let's head to Tampa where the Panthers and
Bucks did battle in the downpour.

Speaker 11 (01:16:12):
The snap of Goodwin bell Hide dropping to throw Bryce
Young flushed out of the pocket, flushed down the holds
the ball upfield. It is in a sap that packed
pop with the forty three yard line and John magnificent
Antwuan wentfield want he was up. The whole hung theel
was an inn second shaster down to the sideline and
Young those a pick and the Bucks.

Speaker 1 (01:16:33):
Happened the Great Jean decker Hoff with a call.

Speaker 5 (01:16:39):
Yes, Antoine Winfield.

Speaker 2 (01:16:42):
When it looked as if the Panthers could somehow find
a way, Bryce Young threw it up for grabs. Winfield
came away from the ball with the ball through the
from the sideline, steps from the sideline, and the Buccaneers
escape with a twenty one to eighteen.

Speaker 5 (01:16:57):
Win over the Mori Bun.

Speaker 2 (01:17:00):
The Carolina Panthers, playing their first game without Frank Reich.

Speaker 5 (01:17:06):
So what to take away from this game.

Speaker 1 (01:17:09):
First of all, let's let's look on Mike Evans.

Speaker 2 (01:17:12):
Just when this game appeared to be slipping away from
the Bucks and Baker was having a miserable game, he
was averaging like four yards. In attempt, he hits Evans
over the middle. Evans goes down the sideline like a
house on fire. He dives toward the pylon. They mark
him down at the one, as the officials often were today,

(01:17:33):
they were wrong. He actually cleared the pylon and upon review,
he gets credited with the touchdown as he deserves seventy
five yards. Changed the game, got everybody back in line,
and gave Baker a stat line that you wouldn't be
afraid to show to your family. Evans finished with seven
for one sixty two. He is now over one thousand yards.

(01:17:56):
He has now gone over one thousand yards for ten
concent executive seasons. Jerry Rice has the record of eleven
straight seasons. Wild and It's funny. I think it was
Nick Westling who texted me at the beginning of the
year and says, like Mike Evans doesn't get enough respect.
He should be in the Superstar club. Look what this

(01:18:17):
guy's done. And the interesting thing about Evans' career is
he's gone over one thousands. I just said, every single
year for a decade. He has ten touchdowns this year,
doesn't matter who the quarterback is. And he had that
golden period with Brady, but he's also played with a
lot of ham and Eggers, Mark and Baker is you know,
kind of on the upper scale of that type of

(01:18:38):
group of quarterback. He is just an incredible player. So
I don't know if he's a superstar, but I think
he's a Hall of Famer right.

Speaker 3 (01:18:44):
Because, I mean, you know, literally, Jerry Rice is one
of the greatest players of all time.

Speaker 9 (01:18:49):
But Jerry Rice had great quarterback play.

Speaker 1 (01:18:50):
Around him, and he didn't do it to art the career.

Speaker 4 (01:18:52):
This is a record in terms of starting his career that,
like Evans, is just way ahead of anyone else.

Speaker 3 (01:18:58):
I think one thing about Evans this year's simply because
I remember they were just an unwatchable mess on offense
for much of last season and it was like tons
Tom Brady and Tom Brady and Evans were not on
the same page. When Baker's been good, I mean, Baker
and Evans have had a pretty good connection from wire
to wire this season, and it's just another example of
like Evans adjusting to whatever's around him and being that consistent.

Speaker 4 (01:19:20):
Right, and he could he I think he only topped
fourteen hundred yards once. He had a fifteen hundred yard
season in twenty eighteen. I mean, he's got a chance
to even get there this year. He's in a contracts
on pace for about fourteen hundred yards. Yeah, he's in
a contract year. Between him and Winfield, they actually have
two teams, two guys that have a chance.

Speaker 1 (01:19:38):
Evans probably isn't gonna.

Speaker 4 (01:19:39):
Make All Pro because the receivers so tough to make that,
but I think Winfield has a chance. I really have
just been so impressed by Winfield each and every week.
He had a sack, two tackles for the lost three
passes defense, He had the interception eight times. I just
haven't seen a more impactful safety. So that's been a weekly.

Speaker 1 (01:19:55):
Thing with him.

Speaker 2 (01:19:55):
He is Evans, and we'll move off Evans, but he
is an interesting player, and he's kind of the fascinating
greg when you get to your free agency one oh one. Yeah,
I think age thirty one season, one of the most
consistent players in the history of the sport, Like, what
kind of market would he have Anyway?

Speaker 5 (01:20:10):
The Bucks in the NFC South, which is bad.

Speaker 2 (01:20:13):
As we've stated, that was only the second win for
Tampa Bay in the last eight games, but now that
they are in a tie for second place in the division,
so they are in the mix. And it wasn't always
pretty in this game, but they got the job done
on the other side of the ball. No Basachia bump
here for the Panthers, who were competitive in the rainy conditions,

(01:20:35):
but they're still just you're not seeing anything with this offense.
Chuba Hubbard did some things, got in the end zone
twice for him, but I just just don't see it.
I have this theory that I'm working on. I'm work
shopping that Bryce Young is getting one in shorter every
week now, so now he's about five or six at
the top many more weeks. The pocket feels impossibly muddy
around him. And there was one play in this game

(01:20:58):
where the rush was coming, he kind of just turned
and threw it behind him and it bounced that a
bounds for a fumble and earths like there was another
play it was a big I believe it was a
third down where it was very clear he had to
check out of a play and he doesn't, and they
run right into a big loss where they're showing a
blitz and he just doesn't see it. So whoever it
is that's tasked with kind of getting him on the

(01:21:19):
right track, he just has They have a lot of work.

Speaker 3 (01:21:21):
Well, it's a lost year and it's like it's gonna
be an off season of a billion storylines about how
now he feels comfortable and it's it's a new start.

Speaker 9 (01:21:27):
I mean, it's it's been a rough spot.

Speaker 3 (01:21:29):
But like I thought that final, that fourth down game ender,
like he had a chance to if he were little,
if he were reacting more quickly to hit Adam Feeling
it was like it shouldn't have happened the way it happened.

Speaker 1 (01:21:40):
Like it was just anothers right, somebody's just.

Speaker 3 (01:21:42):
Sort of like not really, there's not a part of
it where you see. It's crazy to me that he
outdueled if that's how you want to put it.

Speaker 5 (01:21:48):
C J.

Speaker 3 (01:21:48):
Stroud in the one time they met, like it was
like the most atypical.

Speaker 5 (01:21:51):
Game duel that strong.

Speaker 1 (01:21:52):
You know, to go and have won that game.

Speaker 9 (01:21:54):
It feels like four years ago.

Speaker 1 (01:21:55):
It's out played slightly. I would I would say best game.
I think usually out duled is like two y athletes
playing on a high fifty the other.

Speaker 4 (01:22:04):
I could be wrong. I don't think the Panthers scored
a touchdown in that game. I believe they won with
five field goals. But I was getting a lot of
texts that you mentioned they didn't get the Bassachia bump.
But according to our friend Spice Rack, the fired coach
principal at least in terms of the desert is nine
and oh since September twenty O.

Speaker 1 (01:22:22):
I can't I can't fact check.

Speaker 4 (01:22:23):
This mean he's including, he's including college, but Carolina kept
it closer than expected.

Speaker 1 (01:22:29):
It is my point here, you.

Speaker 2 (01:22:30):
Don't get credit for the bassac bump when you lose. Now,
this isn't We're not all in the desert. Okay, Now
that's for teams that win after the firing.

Speaker 4 (01:22:38):
I do want to use his comparison ails who win,
because he was going nuts because he wanted the Panthers
to do better and win this game, and at one
point the fire, he was on fire, comparing Young to
Bryce Young in terms of his body language, saying it
was identical Bryce Young to Achilles Smith was his comparisons,
but he wants to be anywhere by here. I will

(01:23:01):
just push back just just a little slightly, which is
just it reminds me a little bit, maybe because they're
all number one picks. Alex Smith's rookie season was the
worst top pick or really rookie pick I've ever seen,
and he bounced back pretty quick to be okay.

Speaker 1 (01:23:17):
And Eli and Jared Goff were close.

Speaker 4 (01:23:19):
So all those guys were in a similar situation where
they they showed almost no bright spots their entire rookie season.

Speaker 1 (01:23:25):
So it's it's happened before.

Speaker 3 (01:23:26):
There's something else here though, Like, yeah, you're right, and
it's like there needs to be patients. But I really
watch Bryce Young and feel like, to your point, Dan,
like he plays small, and it's like, I don't know
if he's not Eli Manning, you.

Speaker 1 (01:23:39):
Know, his prototypical perfect quarterback type build.

Speaker 2 (01:23:42):
Right, Like he is small. It is he plays small.
He's small, and he's getting sacked. They're on pace to
Carolina line is not helping him. He's on pace to
be sacked sixty six times, which is almost the team record.
So that's a recipe for disaster as well. Oh Man
they are hot on our tails. Greg in the in

(01:24:03):
the pits competition, they are right behind us now two games.

Speaker 1 (01:24:07):
You should have seen a face when when you said
us just now, He's like, what is this narrative?

Speaker 5 (01:24:12):
Dan, You're wrong right now? Greg? And what is our record? Greg? Eleven?

Speaker 1 (01:24:15):
And what are you talking? I'm eleven in one. You're
one to o jumping on with me. Actually you're not
because the one week I got wrong. Now the three
of us all did it together. Well, there's a lot
of different standings of play.

Speaker 2 (01:24:27):
So I'm one and one when we picked, I'm talking one,
and since I just got on the train, I'm one
and one overall. After they blew up the entire operation,
after the horrible Joe Burray injury designation UH fiasco. And
then if you want to look at the the broader,
I think I'm I don't want to eleven.

Speaker 9 (01:24:48):
I don't want to look at the broader like I
think this is a this is a farce.

Speaker 2 (01:24:51):
You want to join the Rosenthal train because it was
a it was a little bit of a bumpy ride today,
but weed on the champagne and eating Caveo.

Speaker 3 (01:24:58):
I locked up the Niners with confidence and never for
a second had any concern about that.

Speaker 5 (01:25:03):
Affair us job, that was a good luck get it.
We all got done. Yeah, right across the board.

Speaker 3 (01:25:07):
I'll travel my own path though, You're a brave man.
Me makes second to last place.

Speaker 5 (01:25:13):
So it's just me. It's Greg in the motorcycle and
me in the sidecar.

Speaker 1 (01:25:17):
This is one of the most bizarre podcast strategies you
ever had. Storyline Right Sunday Night Football.

Speaker 13 (01:25:25):
Three receivers right, shootable life, snapped to my homes looking,
steps up, scrambling left, still looking still waiting, fires it
into the end zone, broken up, incomplete and.

Speaker 1 (01:25:38):
Dagger your dagger. The game is over.

Speaker 13 (01:25:42):
The Packers have defeated the Chiefs twenty seven to nineteen.

Speaker 1 (01:25:47):
I what a moment for this young team.

Speaker 2 (01:25:50):
Wayne Laravie with the call for Packers Radio, and yes,
it is a big moment for the green Bay Packers,
a team on the rise now uh six and after
a twenty seven to nineteen win over the mighty chief
Well are the Chiefs mighty? I'm not sure about that anymore,
but a big win for the Packers coming off obviously

(01:26:10):
a huge Thanksgiving win over the Lions, and all of
a sudden green Bay looks like a team that makes
some real noise in a wide open NFC. And boys, look,
we got to start unfortunately, and we're gonna We're gonna
give the Packers their flowers, but we got to talk
about what everybody's gonna be talking about, which is an
absolute meltdown by the officiating crew in the final minute

(01:26:34):
and a half of this game.

Speaker 5 (01:26:35):
I'm actually looking at it right now.

Speaker 2 (01:26:37):
Boys, there were you can make the case that they
blew five calls in the final sixty five seconds of
the game. Patrick Mahomes scrambles out of bounds at the
CAC forty for ten yards. They penalize Owen's on green
Bay for unnecessary roughness. Bogus call, not the right call,

(01:26:57):
not even.

Speaker 4 (01:26:57):
A question, and was an emphasis on the by the
rules committee in the offseason to not let quarterbacks bait
defenders into those costs.

Speaker 2 (01:27:06):
And they still Terry McCauley comes in for NBC says, hey,
this is the wrong call.

Speaker 5 (01:27:10):
This is that you cannot throw a flag here.

Speaker 2 (01:27:12):
The very next play, Patrick Mahomes to Rashid Rice for
ten yards, he's down by contact. They rule it a
fumble that gets overt turned on review. But that even
has a butterfly effect by missing that call and ruling
rice up when the pall comes out. That leads to
the Pachenko fight Isaya Pachenko fight where he takes a

(01:27:33):
swing and he gets suspended. That's a missed call, overturned
on review.

Speaker 3 (01:27:38):
And that took about twenty seven minutes, it felt like
for them to sort.

Speaker 5 (01:27:41):
All that out.

Speaker 2 (01:27:42):
Then you have Patrick Mahomes dropping back to pass and
he unfurls a deep ball to Marquez Valdez Scantling a
clear pass interference once again, no doubt about it. They
do not throw the flag again. They bring in McCauley
and McCall. He says, yeah, that is obvious past interference.

(01:28:05):
It should also be said that mvs also made a
catch on the play prior to that, where he had
his forward momentum had stopped and he's moving backwards as
he's pushed out of bounds, but the side jes rules
that he was able to stop the clock.

Speaker 5 (01:28:19):
That's a blown call. And then finally, and I know.

Speaker 2 (01:28:21):
This one is gonna be one, especially Packer fans are
gonna say, shut up, Dan, but a hail mary throw
and it's not really even a hail mary guys.

Speaker 5 (01:28:29):
It was from the thirty three yard line.

Speaker 2 (01:28:31):
Yeah, Travis Kelcey gets a two handed shove in the
back as the balls approaching the end zone, taking him
out of the play. And yes, Greg, you can say
on that play, nobody throws the flag there but one.

Speaker 1 (01:28:45):
He took the essentially the guy most capable of making
that play out of the play with a two handed
shove and two men.

Speaker 5 (01:28:53):
I know, makeup calls exist.

Speaker 1 (01:28:54):
If there's a way to make up for the MVS
blown call, maybe you throw the flag there. But they didn't.
And the packers of the Bend.

Speaker 4 (01:29:00):
Well, they're all they're all humans, And I don't know
who made them non call.

Speaker 1 (01:29:03):
That's the problem. We got to get some AI refs
in here.

Speaker 4 (01:29:06):
I don't know who made the non call on the
pass interference to uh vow the scantling should have been
a pass interference. It was Corey Valentine that was in coverage.
That to me in the moment felt like a makeup call,
makeup non call essentially from the Mahomes because that happened
right after the Mahomes which they blew that call.

Speaker 1 (01:29:28):
It was brutal.

Speaker 4 (01:29:28):
I don't know if they somehow knew that they brewed
that call, but they were suddenly in the crosshairs.

Speaker 1 (01:29:33):
It like they helped the Chiefs get to that point.

Speaker 4 (01:29:36):
And then right after that was the throw down the field,
and that was the one of all of these that
was truly egregious.

Speaker 1 (01:29:45):
And probably changed the game. I think it's worth going, Yes.

Speaker 5 (01:29:48):
It's first and ten at the sixth Greg.

Speaker 1 (01:29:50):
Okay, first goal, okay.

Speaker 4 (01:29:51):
And they struggled twice in the red zone tonight, and
they had to hit a two point conversion and there's overtime,
so it changed how the whole rest of the game
would have gone by just worth noting, like, you don't
know that the result of the game is right, it's.

Speaker 3 (01:30:04):
Still brutal, right, It's like we were saying, you know
before we recorded, like it wasn't like any one of
these calls is going to stir up like the competition
committee to look at things differently. The combination of all
of them, though, suggested officiating gaggle of officials who seemed completely.

Speaker 9 (01:30:20):
Out of control.

Speaker 3 (01:30:21):
There was just an air of like the game was
melting down and it's like who's in charge here?

Speaker 1 (01:30:26):
And why is this taking so long?

Speaker 3 (01:30:28):
It's like none of it was so overly complex that
it should have looked the way it did to us.

Speaker 9 (01:30:33):
And when you got McCauley, I thought he did a
good job.

Speaker 3 (01:30:35):
He came on three or four times and forcedly said wrong,
wrong call, And like, I guess for me the whole thing.
They are human, but the concept of a makeup call
is not how things should be done. Like it's like,
if you made one mistake, you don't then allow yourselves
to visibly make another right. So without telling us what's
going on and just you just look, it looked like
they were falling further and further from an element of control.

Speaker 2 (01:30:57):
I think that MVS no call given the stakes is
one of the worst non calls I've seen period. That
was one of the worst blown DEPI calls you could
possibly see. And the fact that it was dead center
in the middle of the field, no question about it.

Speaker 5 (01:31:12):
It can't happen.

Speaker 2 (01:31:13):
And you know what I mentioned it earlier in this episode,
I guess I had my eyes, Like on a typical Sunday,
we're gonna have our eyes individually on about five games
pretty closely almost every game I watched today, there were
really bad mistakes being made by the officiating and I
hate talking about this because obviously you want to focus
on what Jordan Love.

Speaker 1 (01:31:33):
And the packagers are doing about look at it to it.

Speaker 2 (01:31:35):
We have to talk about it, and I know on
Park Avenue that they're going to be talking about a
first thing Monday morning because it's affecting the quality of
the product.

Speaker 4 (01:31:43):
It's just rare that there's two calls in that spot
Patrick Mahomes in Lamboat Sunday Night football, the biggest stage.
We have a really unique entertaining game, and that you
have two calls and I'm separating the Mahomes hit out
of bounds in the first pass in the past interference

(01:32:03):
non call as just clearly wrong.

Speaker 1 (01:32:06):
No one's gonna argue that we will see the pool reports.

Speaker 4 (01:32:10):
They might be out by the time we finished talking
these ten minutes. They will have to just admit we
missed those calls. They were absolutely crystal clear, and that
it's pretty unique. I can't remember any game in this
sort of spotlight where there's a cavalcat of calls like
this all in a row.

Speaker 1 (01:32:26):
It was a pretty it was a pretty unique circumstance.
The problem is they could admit after what we all
see with our own eyes, I'm just guessing the night man.
They try not to, but those two would be tough too.

Speaker 3 (01:32:35):
It was just the lack of I wouldn't say the
words accountability, but it's just like when this happens to
a team and you get totally hosed on an island
game on national television in a circus of officiating.

Speaker 9 (01:32:45):
All just leaves you with is the loss.

Speaker 1 (01:32:48):
Let's talk about the backers, and they deserve to lose too,
by the way, Jeeves.

Speaker 5 (01:32:53):
I don't like that.

Speaker 1 (01:32:55):
I just mean teams frits out, players fritz out, coaches
fritz out, and sometimes to your point, I think mark
officials often fritz out too.

Speaker 5 (01:33:05):
Yeah, but that I can't live with that.

Speaker 2 (01:33:06):
Yeah, you know that's as a fan like, I want
the officials to do their job and stay out of
the way, and we're just never going to know, really
how that game really should have turned out because the officials.

Speaker 1 (01:33:16):
Ye.

Speaker 4 (01:33:16):
All I mean is they were in that position where
they had no timeouts, they had to drive the length
of the field in one oh nine for a touchdown
and a two point to tie.

Speaker 1 (01:33:26):
So they had put themselves in that position.

Speaker 2 (01:33:28):
They certainly did, and the reason they did is because, yeah,
for the most part, Packers outplayed the Chiefs in this game,
and you're seeing it in Matt Lafour by the way,
the bearded boy himself sixteen and oh in December games. Wow,
the Packers who were left for dead, I think they
said on the game telecast, And it checks out because
it felt that way once went forty days the season

(01:33:48):
without winning a football game, and now they you can
make the case that outside of the Niners, they're the
hottest team in the NFC. So they're very interesting, Mark
from that perspective. And the thing I'll say about Jordan
Love in this one, Mark, and I'm curious what your
thoughts are. It's not just the stats that look great
right now, it's how confident he's playing, and how you
could tell he's in control of everything he sees. And

(01:34:11):
for a guy that's as young as he is, as
inexperienced as he is, and as loss as it seemed
to he was like a month or so ago, it's
pretty remarkable to turn around.

Speaker 3 (01:34:20):
It's I think one thing that's wonderful about kind of
covering the whole league versus just your team is that
you start to see operations just grow up right before
your eyes and it's Jordan Love and it's like the
offense around him. And I thought tonight there were four
or five throws, well, I can think of one to
Christian Watson where it's like he is just throwing with

(01:34:43):
intense like confidence and putting in like into tight windows.
And there's a couple you know, there were a couple drops,
but he put the ball right on the money. And
I just think on top of that, like the way
he's seen the field, the way he uses his legs
and moments, the fact that he's pairing well in a
Matt Lafleor offense, and Matt Lafleur two weeks in a row,
because what Thanksgiving feels like about seven eros ago, two

(01:35:07):
great Matt Lafleur coached games. I think that like this
isn't working well because they're kind of all growing up together.

Speaker 4 (01:35:14):
Yeah, I said, when they were at their nadir, I
brought up how in the off season we said we're
gonna learn a lot about Matt Lafleur, and I ended
it with some smug little thing of like they are
right now like one of the worst offenses in the league. Okay,
right now, we're gonna learn a lot about Matt Lafleur
this season, he has taken a young quarterback, and I

(01:35:37):
think Love deserves the most credit. But I think with
the weapons around him and the amount of play action
he really there I hit on, you know, Russell Wilson
really relying on play action for that's not necessarily a
bad thing. I mean Ryan Tannel did it for years,
A lot of teams do it. He is relying on
play action as much as any quarterback in the league,
and it is hitting guys are open. And then when
he is doing that backpedal and he has to do

(01:35:59):
something special like that rain Bo shot to Romeo Dobbs,
which looked like a bad idea, And I don't know
how it fell down in there, like there's it still was.
He still got it exactly triangle in there, He got
exactly where it wanted to go.

Speaker 1 (01:36:15):
And I think you're right.

Speaker 4 (01:36:17):
He's playing with such incredible confidence that when he's doing
these back pedals and making these crazy throats like I'm
almost surprised when he's not hitting him. These are all
like chunk plays too, so like rookies Malik Heath and
is that even a person Dontavian Wicks and just all
these guys like fifteen to twenty five yard chunk plays.

Speaker 1 (01:36:35):
It's pretty awesome. And it's gotten this bad for the
Chiefs with their offense. If Patrick Mahomes is not handing
the ball off, for getting the hand the ball in
the hands of Jaco who's a very good running back,
or getting it to Travis Kelce who's not you know,
dominating at the same clip as past years, or Rashi Rice,
who's a consistent guy for them.

Speaker 5 (01:36:56):
Now it's bad news.

Speaker 1 (01:36:58):
But limited consistently good, but limited.

Speaker 5 (01:37:00):
Within the realm.

Speaker 2 (01:37:01):
Like today he had eight for sixty four on nine targets,
Like at least he's a guy that he's not a
liability everyone else that he's trying to get involved, whether
it's mvs who yes, got jobbed, but let's face it
probably would have dropped it anyway, Richie James Clyde, Edwards,
Lair sky Moore that route he ran on the Mahomes interception.
I mean you just like, who do you trust Caadarius Tony,

(01:37:24):
who's like not even on the roster anymore at this point.
They they have work to do in the offseason to
fix it. And again, like every time you think maybe
they're coming out of it. There's another one of these
games that tell you no, there's just there's just a
limit to this offense.

Speaker 5 (01:37:38):
And it's kind of a stunning subplot of this season.

Speaker 3 (01:37:40):
They're really frustrating when they get into certain situations where
in the past you could simply trust or you'd be
a fool not to trust Mahomes to bail you out
and to have some targets that would help you too.
But it's like we're running out of time here. I
like with the chiefs'll just we'll see where we are
on the playoffs. But you asked if they were mighty still,
and I think it's a fair question because you can't
just rely on Andy Reid, the mind of Andy Reid

(01:38:03):
and the brilliance of Patrick Mahomes to rescue an offense
that it's missing pieces and has been all year.

Speaker 4 (01:38:08):
So they finished the game so ugly, and that's what
we remember three and out than the interception, which was
going to be a tough pass, but more really did
a terrible.

Speaker 5 (01:38:19):
Job and it wasn't even greater.

Speaker 4 (01:38:21):
And agree, yeah, he killed them by changing by slowing
down on the route, and Keishak Nixon made a really
nice interception too, that you don't see guys make a
nice play like that, and then the way that game ended,
I should know that. I mean, each of these teams
only had seven drives. That is an exceptionally low number
for both teams to have in an NFL game. So
to me, this was sort of like an old Chiefs

(01:38:43):
game where it was like, oh man, our defense thinks tonight,
we need Patrick Mahomes to answer every single drive. We
just haven't seen the Chiefs defense give up points like that.
Twenty seven points and seven drives is terrible. The Chiefs
even nineteen points and seven drives is pretty great. That
points per drive, that would just barely like lead the
league in points per drive, nineteen points and seven drives.

(01:39:05):
Like it just was so limited here, but the Packers
were scoring almost every single time. And the Chiefs, you know,
are is there defense going to stay out this level
the whole season outstanding?

Speaker 1 (01:39:17):
We've seen a little leakage lately.

Speaker 4 (01:39:19):
They've had some injuries at linebacker, Nick Bolton and Drew
Treankoler out, so that that's part of it.

Speaker 1 (01:39:23):
Brian Cook got carted out of this game.

Speaker 4 (01:39:25):
They're starting safety, so that side of the ball might
be creating a little issue too.

Speaker 2 (01:39:30):
Here's the final stat Okay, it's from Tony Holzman Escarano.
He is the NFL idiot, senior researcher Kansas City, and
I know points per drive.

Speaker 5 (01:39:42):
I understand it.

Speaker 1 (01:39:43):
I'm saying they were pretty they were Okay tonight they
were pretty good. I know it doesn't feel that way anywhere.

Speaker 5 (01:39:48):
It is.

Speaker 2 (01:39:48):
The Chiefs have scored fewer than twenty points in six
games this season. The Chiefs had six such games and
Patrick Mahomes's first five seasons as a starter combined.

Speaker 9 (01:39:59):
Yeah, and it looks that way.

Speaker 4 (01:40:01):
Eight in that fourth loss is big. They're now behind
three teams in.

Speaker 1 (01:40:05):
The AFC who have three losses Ravens, Jags we'll see
on Monday night, and and the Dolphins and the Packers.
Here at six and six.

Speaker 4 (01:40:12):
You look at their schedule and all the projection models
now have the Packers business as the favorite, as like
a decent size over fifty percent chance to make the play.

Speaker 3 (01:40:23):
You even think ru will be potentially in three weeks
they're six and six. They play the Giants, the Bucks
and the Panthers before finishing with the Vikings, and anything less.

Speaker 2 (01:40:31):
Than two dubs there is the disaster. All right, the
disaster this NFC, they'll be fine matter they could probably
all right. Uh, Tomorrow, Monday, we got a doubleheader, we
got the NFL plus Game of the Week. We'll be
breaking down the niners dominant effort against the Eagles, and
then Monday night football and news recap. I'm sure there

(01:40:53):
will be maybe some follow up to everything we just
talked about here coming out of Lamba.

Speaker 5 (01:40:58):
Until then, you know what you got to do.

Speaker 8 (01:41:04):
He the call.

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Gregg Rosenthal

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