November 14, 2023 • 46 mins
In a virtual room full of heroes - Dan Hanzus and Gregg Rosenthall recap the Week 10 Monday Night Football matchup between the Broncos and the Bills. The heroes start out by talking about the Broncos (01:48) followed by the play of the Bills (11:00). After the break, the heroes get you caught up on news from around the league including Matthew Stafford's chances at playing this weekend (26:12), CeeDee Lamb making a big-time claim (31:55), and another chapter in Frank Reich's tough time in Carolina (37:25).
Note: time codes approximate.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
Twelve play the drive, Wilson cats rid of it for
the touchdown.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
To Javonte Williams.
Speaker 1 (00:12):
What a job by Russell Wilson under heavy pressure from
Tyrel Dodson and just got it over him for the
three yard touchdown. And they have a second in goal.
As Letitious Murray is in the backfield next to Allen,
they fake it to him looking for Kincaid. Alan's gonna
take it touchdown Buffalo.
Speaker 3 (00:35):
Good snap, good.
Speaker 1 (00:36):
Hold, kick perfect, and the Broncos have come to Buffalo
and they're gonna leave with a win twenty four twenty two.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
To get to four and five.
Speaker 3 (00:54):
Luck be a Lutz tonight, Will Lutz. He gets a
do over after he pushed one wide right from forty one,
seemingly giving the Buffalo Bills a narrow victory at home.
But after the Bills get called for twelve men on
the field, lets gets that do over and pipes it
from thirty six. The difference in a twenty four to
(01:15):
twenty two Bronco's victory over a Bills team that cannot
get out of its own way Right now, I am
Dan hansis joined by Greg Rosenthal from the Chris Westling
podcast studio and some really almost nightclub like lighting behind you.
(01:38):
Check this one out on YouTube. Greg. We're gonna get
to the Bills, because I think the Bills are the
bigger story in terms of their struggles and what was
expected of them and what we've seen now for a
couple of months. But let's start with the Broncos, a
team that is now four and five. We talked about
it on the Sunday Flagship Show how there is a
(02:00):
huge middle class in the AFC of teams that have
four or five losses and now all of a sudden,
and probably the Broncos left for dead at zero to
three after giving up a seventy burger are one of
those teams after a really truly impressive and unlikely victory.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
I mean, insane would be another word. This was I
think the craziest game of the year, like just just
the dumbest, Like.
Speaker 3 (02:26):
I think you had the second the second time was
right there.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
Yeah, Yeah, you sent the word absurd in a text.
Maybe that's the best one. I just think it's I
can't think of a primetime game this year that was
this insane. We almost have to go through it all
because I'm with you on the Broncos are back in
it in a way, and they've shown they're not the Patriots.
They're not one of the worst teams in the league.
(02:49):
They're going to be in every game if you give
them a chance. Their defense is just good enough to
force four turnovers, but not good enough to stop the
Bills from going down the field a couple times in
the fourth, and their offense is just good enough to
avoid mistakes and make a couple big drives late in
the game, but not good enough to take advantage of
incredible field position and all these opportunities. They had to
(03:12):
have a bigger lead. So they are that team in
the middle. But I kind of want to start with
the ending sequence because I've never seen anything quite like it.
Sean Payton, choosing on a third down with under thirty
seconds to go, instead of like throwing an incomplete.
Speaker 3 (03:31):
Pass, decides to.
Speaker 2 (03:33):
Kneel on the ball because he doesn't want to give
the Bills like fifteen seconds and look, I know AFC
Championship fifteen seconds. Things can happen. But he could have
just called for an incompletion from Russell Wilson. You could
have taken some time off the clock too, go back
for a while and throw a ball over someone's head
on the sidelight. Instead, he has so much confidence in
(03:54):
the kicking crew to run out onto the field in
that situation where the clock doesn't and go kick the
game winning field goal. He decides the kneil and he
feels that confidence because they did it at the end
of the first half and they did a beautiful job
of it, and he kneels the ball, they run out
and he pushes the kick in all the insanity, and
they lose the game if the Bills hadn't completely botched
(04:17):
it and sent twelve men on the field, like the
whole playoff race is different because the Bills sent twelve
men on the field in that situation.
Speaker 3 (04:25):
Yeah, that was my thought that Sean Peyton a little
high on his own supply and how perfectly they executed
it at the end of the second quarter. But in
this case, and let's rushed it because it wasn't as
if you know, there were two one second on the
clock and he had to get the snap off. They
(04:45):
had time for him to settle. But he rushed it
clearly and pushed it right and to get that second chance.
And yet as absurd as that is, and you saw
Josh Allen's face on the sideline after it all played out.
I didn't come out of that thinking, oh man, did
the Bills get screwed here?
Speaker 4 (05:04):
Like?
Speaker 3 (05:05):
Did they? What an unlucky way for a game to end.
They really had no business winning that game. In my opinion,
Denver gave them so many opportunities. The fact that they
missed one extra point they botched impossibly, the hold on
the score in the fourth quarter, that of course leaves
the door open for Buffalo to take the lead. And
(05:27):
then the Bills they just got to get a stop then.
And this is the difference, I think, and we're going
to hear from our producer Eric Roberts, a lifelong Bills fan,
and a bit like the difference between this team and
past years. And they are, you know, at five hundred
or lower for the first time since twenty eighteen after tonight.
(05:47):
It's just like, where's the killer instinct? Where is that
we are? We're a top team and we kind of
played with fire tonight, but we stole one by getting
that late touchdown and then we get the stop. They
can't get the stop. They let the ball get to midfield,
and I thought it was you know when they bring
the house there on second down near midfield. It worked
(06:10):
like Gangbusters, and they take down Wilson and they have
to burn dead rest burn its last time out, calling
the same kind of general scheme or play again. There
was to me needlessly risky at that point. And all
Wilson had to do, and I shouldn't say all he
had to do because that's a difficult play to get
(06:30):
off with that amount of pressure is once he saw
it was the same exact type of blitz coming his way,
get the ball up. Basically throw an armpunt up there,
and you underthrow Jerry Judy and they call toront Johnson
with a DPI and it's pretty much good night, nurse.
So Buffalo just did not execute in the game's most
important moments there, and that's been a recurring theme all season.
Speaker 2 (06:54):
Right, these two teams looked like five and five teams
in a four and five team because anytime Russell Wilson
would make a few plays, he had, you know, that
touchdown throw to Courtland Sutton, which reminded me of the
two point conversion from the NFC Championship game back in
twenty fifteen, and Sutton makes a great play and Wilson's
(07:14):
avoiding mistakes and even on that last drive it was
just like a bunch of dumb baff passes. But he
made the right decisions. He knew when to run like
he was solid. Right when you think, wow, he's really
turned in the corner, he took one of those old
Russell Wilson sacks and that was that play. Troy Aikman
was so frustrated because that was a situation in the
game where they were already in field goal range. It
was a second and four on the thirty nine for
(07:36):
the Bills. All you have to do there is get
a few more yards and not take a sack. They
show zero blitz before the snap. I figured they're faking it.
They're not going to go Greg Williams on us and
go cover zero, you know, at the very end of
the game. And they do it, and it's so well
executed that they all get in so quickly, and yet
Russell Wilson, unlike you know, I think a lot of
(07:57):
veteran quarterbacks would have gotten rid of the ball there
and he just he takes a sack, which is brutal,
and for them to run it again was like, man,
this is not Leslie Fraser. Sean McDermott runs a much
riskier defense, and it was it was just dumb and
Russell Wilson, I'm sure would love to have that throwback.
I know he is happy he got bailed out by
Toron Johnson, but yeah, he threw that ball up in
(08:19):
a windy night and he underthrew him by twenty twenty yards.
That should have been a touchdown.
Speaker 3 (08:24):
All right, take it easy, Greg, Can we because I
know you're always coming after Wilson? Can we be.
Speaker 2 (08:30):
Saying that wasn't They got the penalty because it was
such a bad throw. But underthrown deep balls is will
get you a DPI And that's that's kind of why
no one runs those those play calls anymore. And they
get it, and there were more. There was more good
than bad from Russell Wilson. And it just goes to
show that there was nothing in this Bills team that
was consistent tonight. Right when one part of the team
(08:52):
like James Cook or the running game was getting going,
they would do something bad like fumble it. Once Josh
Allen made a couple of nice throws, he would turn
the ball over. The defense was completely dominant in the
third quarter that the offense was, you know, keep spinning
down their leg and the Broncos keep getting the ball
out across the fifty and the Bills defense stopped them
for eight yards and four drives and forced the turnover.
(09:14):
Yet you said it when it came down to it
in the fourth quarter, when when the Bills actually get
a lead, they give up two straight long drives. They
can't stop Devonte Williams, and then they couldn't stop that
last drive either. So it's like everything they don't know,
Like they try to put their finger into one problem
and another problem pops.
Speaker 3 (09:32):
Up, and I know you're loath to do this, so
I'm going to do it. I think Russell Wilson might
not be a star quarterback in the way he was
in Seattle, but he has had a far better season
in year two in Denver with Sean Payton. And I
think you saw that again today because he was not
overly flashy. But I thought he played a very good
(09:54):
game overall, and he made throws. He was under pressure
a lot. He did he had some acrobatic kind of
flips when he was about to get taken out to
keep the chains moving. I thought, in general, that Wilson
has been a real bright spot for them, especially you
have to like the bigger picture of he was the
(10:16):
most high profile quarterback in terms of a trade acquisition
since Peyton Manning and he ends up having the bust
of all bus seasons. So to come out of the
ruins of last year and be a guy that now
goes from that situation to a quarterback that's going to
head into post Thanksgiving games with his team relevant. I
(10:37):
thought he played well today and I think that play
again on the third and long near midfield after he
takes the sack. Yeah, he underthrew Judy, but it was
like he got that ball out of there and through
that big looping rainbow, and you're right, it is this
slam dunk play of all slam dunk plays right now,
it seems is underthrow a receiver and you're gonna get Pi,
(10:58):
and it was Pi. So man, I just it's it's crazy.
And the Buffalo side of this is this is the
first time now where you could you're gonna look at
the Bills and forget about are they a real AFC powerhouse?
Like are they going to the playoffs? And they are
losers of three of four they're five and five. As
(11:19):
I said, this is the first time they've been at
five hundred or below in five years. And their upcoming
schedule is home against the Jets on Sunday, a Jets
team that always gives them fits, at Philly, at CAC
versus Dallas, at Chargers, lay up against New England, and
then at Miami. And I mean that I would have
(11:43):
to say if you ask me now that this is
not a playoff team, and if this is not a
playoff team, this could there could be big changes in Buffalo.
So they are very much now at a crossroads moment.
And I don't think anyone predicted that in mid November
this would be a team that is on the rank
of seeing their season fall apart. They are one of
the biggest disappointments in football, bar.
Speaker 2 (12:04):
None, no question. I think that's all well said. I
agree with it all. You couldn't lose. That's why you
couldn't lose this game, in particular, partly because you have
an at Philly, you have an at Kansas City, you
have Dallas, you have an at Miami. You got to
win a couple of those games there to possibly get
to ten and seven, and you can't have any more
(12:26):
slip ups in a game you're favored in, and hell,
like at Chargers, they're barely favored in that at this
point you still saw like why they're they're better than
the Broncos. I mean, I mean they are, They're just
not enough better to have Josh Allen just drop a
ball at one point, and he had, he had one
(12:47):
bad interception, and people are gonna remember this game as
some sort of like catastrophic Josh Allen game, and it wasn't.
It was him playing well but having just two like
terrible moments. And then it's team also having terrible moments.
James Cook fumbling the very first play of the game,
gave Davis dropping a pass that turns in to an interception.
(13:11):
So it's Josh Allen, but it's everything you said. Russell
Wilson was under pressure, like at points in that little
spot in the third quarter where I thought he ran
into some sex and took some sex. But I don't know.
I haven't seen enough out of this Bill's pass rush
in general consistently like they're not a difference making group
really anywhere, And it is shocking to me it is
(13:32):
really going to test their metal I Am not going
to give up on them. I'm always that guy in
this podcast. Maybe it's because my favorite team of all
time is the two thousand and one Patriots, and they
were five and five after ten games. And we've seen
great teams that have great quarterbacks really look bad at
certain points late in the season, like the Ravens when
they lost, you know, two games in a row by
thirty points in mid December and then won the Super
(13:54):
Bowl like it does happen, and if it was ever
going to happen, like a team led by Josh Allen
could do it. But they're not. I'm starting to feel
like I'm gonna take the l because they are tenth
in the AFC right now, Dan, I mean, they've got
like teams to catch up on. Now. There's a bunch
of teams that have four losses, a bunch of teams
that have five losses. Almost the entire conference does eight
(14:15):
teams has four or five losses. So if they could
start winning games, they'd be fine. But you look at
that schedule, it'stard.
Speaker 3 (14:20):
To they're not going anywhere. This team's not good enough,
and they're telling us we've seen enough of a sample
size where I really do think this is a yeah,
an average team, like a nine win team maybe, and
maybe that's enough to get in. Maybe it's not. And
the difference and it's you know, you know this, Like
even I enjoyed I was living in Boston at the time,
(14:40):
and I enjoyed that two thousand and one Patriots team
and that crazy playoff run because they were an underdog
team and nothing was expected of them. I think this
Bills team has crumbled under the weight of expectations and
a growing sense of pressure that they should have been
over the hump already by now. And then there was
this idea that this is the year, this is the
(15:00):
year it's finally gonna happen. Like Eric Roberts, you had
a good line before we started. You said, there's not
been a good watch all season, with maybe the exception
of the Dolphins game. Even the games they win, it's
always a struggle. In fact, the only game they've won
in the past month was that Bucks game where they
were looking like they had figured some things out and
then all of a sudden needed a Chris Godwin not
(15:22):
to see hal Mary falling right into his hands to
escape with that game.
Speaker 5 (15:26):
Yeah, every game feels it's pulling teeth, like nothing seems
that the bolts aren't tight enough. I mean even today
at first, you know, the handoff to Cook, it just
Josh kind of just dropped it out of his chest,
you know. Then Joe Buck Troy aikmanner like, hey man,
they want the coin toss. They want to set the
(15:47):
tone like the Bengals did against them last week. First
play the game, James Cook fumble like, it's just there's something, man,
There's just something. I don't know what it is. And
Ken Dorsey might be the scapegoat. I don't know if
Sean mcdermot's gonna be the guy, because you know, I
don't know's it's.
Speaker 4 (16:02):
It's pulling teeth with this team right now.
Speaker 5 (16:04):
Even the wins outside of maybe yeah, like you said,
the Dolphins game is good. They kind of slacked the
Raiders back a couple of weeks ago. But it's there's
something's wrong, man, I don't know what it is. Stefan
Diggs usually gets his today, maybe like three or four catches.
Speaker 4 (16:20):
It's tough.
Speaker 3 (16:21):
I have no confidence in my team the Jets because
of the offense, but that Sala has he has a
beat on that bills offense that's already vulnerable. That game,
that game could be a real slog like this as well,
Like I would not be surprised if that is a
game they're struggling to take care of business and like
they are in a lot of trouble. Yeah.
Speaker 5 (16:40):
No, you mentioned the schedule coming up, and we talked
a little bit before we started recording, and you go
into you see the schedule, You're like, okay, You're you're
looking it up, like, hey, here comes the murders row.
Like you said, you got Philly, you got Casey, you
got Dallas, you got the Chargers. I was gonna I'm
going to that game hopefully hmm. It might be a
bad night for me. But it's like you're going in
that stretch and yeah, like you said, the Jets always
(17:01):
give him trouble. I mean that first game of the season,
weird little outlier. They still lost. But you're kind of
hoping you're not five and five going into this kind
of murderer's row of your wake or your schedule where
you got to maybe now you're trying to steal games
where you meet. You're hoping you have like a little cushion, mean,
you lose one here, or you're on the road in Philly,
or you're on the road in case. You're not trying
(17:22):
to steal games against these teams. It's I don't know, man,
I don't I don't like. I don't like speaking in
a hyperbole. But yeah, like I said, I don't know playoffs.
Something's not right, man, something's not right. And I love
Josh Allen. I'm definitely a Josh Allen apologist. He does
a lot for the team. He tried, he wins games
for us, but do something's tough, man.
Speaker 3 (17:41):
He's not having a great year and he's been tough.
He's been this team four more turnovers today. I mean this,
And you know a lot of these games are at home.
Like it's just like they're a hard team to figure out.
And you know, to swing back to Denver, Greg like,
you know, let's look at their schedule now, because they're
a team that figure things out. And I'm giving credit
(18:02):
to Russell Wilson. I'm gonna let's give credit. You gotta
give some to Peyton too, because he got this team
off the mat where it could have been a total
house fire there. But I will say this, I don't
I'm not in a place where I'm gonna think Denver
is about to make a run. Here. They have Sunday
night football against the Vikings, then they're home against Cleveland,
(18:22):
at Houston, at Chargers, at Detroit. I don't see more
than two wins there. So I don't want to take
anything away from what they did tonight, But I didn't
see anything about like a team that's about to make
noise in the conference either.
Speaker 2 (18:35):
You know, they had that Dolphins game, but basically they've
been in every game this season no matter who they play.
Good teams are bad teams. It's like, come down to
the end. They feel like that team. I think John
Payton's a good game day coach. He's a good game planner.
Sometimes you see their first down offense, you think they're
I think they're playing on some level not to lose,
(18:55):
which is not the worst way to play if you're
good at doing that. Like the two thousand and one
Patriots very much played not to lose. And you look
at Russell Wilson's stats tonight and it's very typical of
a season. He threw the ball twenty nine times for
one hundred and ninety three yards, two touchdowns, no interceptions.
He didn't have anything that was even close to an interception.
He had a couple bad throws, took a couple bad sacks.
(19:18):
Most of his night was looking for his first lead.
Sometimes hit it had like one or two nice throws.
For the most part, it was like find your checkdown,
get six yards. His instincts have been better. He's in
an offense that makes sense, and their running game is
pretty good. You can win games that way if your
defense is decent and creating turnovers like they are. They
(19:39):
feel like they're gonna win as many games as they lose,
and they'll get to the end of the season and
they'll be eight and nine or something like that. I
don't feel much different about them than I did at
one in five. I really don't, other than the defense
now is fine. Like you look at the bit like
tonight they gave up seven point three yards per play,
Like when the Bills got that ballack, did you have
(20:01):
any doubt in your mind that they were going down
to score a touchdown to go up one? Because I didn't,
And I was just thinking when they got inside the
ten so quickly, I almost thought, oh they got they
almost got here too quickly. You know, because now you
can't burn the clock anymore. They were running the ball
so well. I thought, like I thought the Bills, the
Broncos defense was going to like stand up in that moment.
(20:23):
But I do give Peyton credit. There's something about him
that's canny, and I think he coaches up the right things,
get rid, gets rid of the right players, and they've
got players off the street playing pretty well for them.
Speaker 3 (20:37):
Yeah, this game I thought was I thought once they
botched that extra point and they let the Bills go
right down the field, I thought that was it, twenty
two to twenty one. So they deserve credit. They found
away one more time down the field, and their season has,
you know, a nice night for the fan base, and
they're relevant for at least another week or two.
Speaker 2 (20:59):
I do want to hit one last thing on the Bills,
because I think what you said about that Patriots seemed
not having expectations versus this Bills team is so right.
And it's what I believe our friend Damashek would call
the curse is supposed to and the worst place to
be when you're supposed to be good is that you
(21:19):
didn't actually win anything in the first place, because you're
getting You're getting banged on both ends. They got that close,
they got thirteen seconds away. I think they would have
won the Super Bowl that year if they had won
that game. Personally, who knows. But see, you have the
pain of losing it. That's not keeping you together, and
you have all these expectations, and I do really think
(21:41):
that you see it across the board, and this is
going to test Allen and McDermott specifically and Digs more,
you know, in the rest of their leaders more than
any situation possibly could. I thought we would learn a
lot about them in the second half of this game,
even being down seven going into halftime, and maybe they
(22:02):
are just kind of showing us who they are. That's
too much, it's too much for them.
Speaker 5 (22:08):
I hate to be I hate to be that guy. Yes,
but I'm at the point where it's like, what the
hell is wrong? As a fan, like something's up and
I'm watching.
Speaker 2 (22:16):
I mean, the fans are tight, the fans are like
you could they start booing, like the feel good story
the builder back is so over.
Speaker 5 (22:23):
It's so gone, and it's like it's at the point
where what the f is happening?
Speaker 4 (22:27):
What's going on here? You know? And you know, you
got the Stephan Dick's stuff every season.
Speaker 5 (22:32):
You know, it's like Sean mcdermy, oh, there's something up,
and then Digg's all, we're good, Josh and all were good,
and he's saying, you know, what's all you guys are
making a story out of nothing. And I've watched shows
that have pointed out like a couple of these pre
game tunnel speeches from from John Josh Allen are like,
leave it here, you know, don't whatever is there, leave
(22:53):
it here nothing, you know, play for each other, and
it's like it's reading between lines because it's we're grasping
a straw.
Speaker 4 (22:59):
It's here as fans.
Speaker 5 (23:00):
It's like, what is wrong And a lot of like somebody,
a couple of people point out, like what are these
pre tunnel speeches with Josh allensain whatever you got going
on out there, leave it at the door.
Speaker 4 (23:09):
We're here for each other, and it's just I don't know.
Speaker 5 (23:11):
I'm I'm I'm I'm really here as a fan, dude.
Speaker 3 (23:16):
Like I what you said is very true, Greg about
the curse is supposed to be And I know exactly
where you are, Eric, and I apologize that sometimes I
go back here but it's it's a sport that I understand,
and there are parallels that what the Bill, where the
Bills are at right now is as a Yankee fan,
where I was five years ago when they were the
(23:37):
baby Bombers and Aaron Judge came up and they nearly
they took the Astros to seven games. It was when
the Astros cheated and the Astros win that World Series.
And then this window was opened up, and this idea like,
this is their window that's going to be the next
big run. And then they fell short, and then they
fell short, and then they fell short, and then quietly
the roster was starting to have cracks and decay as
(23:59):
well well. And then by about five years into this
quote unquote window, not only do you realize you still
haven't won anything yet. Wait, we're not as good as
we were when this window first opened up. And I
think that's now this like cold reality. I'm a Bill
and need to do work.
Speaker 4 (24:16):
Man.
Speaker 5 (24:16):
I'm on both sides of that, Dan, I got both.
I got the football and the baseball. So they beat
us when they beat you guys. Now, I watching I'm
watching Corey seeger Win MVPs for the Rangers.
Speaker 3 (24:26):
Well, there you go, Alicia got you have, you have
your Rangers.
Speaker 4 (24:29):
That's tough, man. I can't win anywhere.
Speaker 3 (24:31):
So, oh you're a Dodgers fan. That's right. I'm sorry, buddy,
Jesus Christ.
Speaker 4 (24:35):
I'm a big loser.
Speaker 3 (24:37):
Hey, hang in there, buddy, you're still very handsome and
you got two thumbs mostly. All right, let's take a
break and then uh we'll do some news. All right,
we are back. It's a therapy session on a Monday
night as Western New York and and Erica Roberts's corner
of Los Angeles is just under siege as the Bills.
(25:00):
The Bills start to fade away. I don't know. I'm
still kind of in shock that they did not find
a way in this game. But let's see what else
is going on in the NFL right now. Let's start
here in Los Angeles, where Matthew Stafford is ready to
return to action. He's expected to play in Week eleven,
with the recently signed Carson Wentz likely backing him up.
(25:23):
That's kind of just a funny tandem for some reason,
Stafford and Wentz. Here is Rams head coach Sean McVay
on the QB situation.
Speaker 6 (25:31):
Now, Matthews should be ready to go. He was out
there taking part an individual today. It's making great progress,
and so we're operating with the anticipation and expectation that
he is going to be.
Speaker 2 (25:41):
Good to go.
Speaker 6 (25:42):
It'll be pushing through, but we expect him to be
to be able to start and play and do his
thing and lead the way.
Speaker 1 (25:48):
This week.
Speaker 3 (25:49):
What is that? I don't know. I got to get
Jordan Rodrigue back on the horn. Now what do we
have going on? There's a huge sign in Sean mcvay's
office in the colors and font of the rams that
reads in all caps, urgent enjoyment. What is that? Can
we get a screen grab of that?
Speaker 2 (26:11):
That's what led to him becoming a data week ago.
A little exurgent enjoyment.
Speaker 3 (26:18):
That's what I think of same.
Speaker 2 (26:24):
You know, I'm gonna enjoy seeing Matthew Stafford back. I
wanted to get this into the show. Is it is
newsworthy because they're they're more or less out of the
race unless they can go on a surprising run. They
got the Seahawks and the Cardinals the next two weeks,
two teams they generally play well against, including Week one
when they they trounced the Seahawks, so you never know.
(26:45):
They're not a crazy team to go on a little
run here, But we never hit Carson Wentz signing with
this team, and it is it is something crazy that
the two guys I was thinking of West because team.
Those were the two biggest stories in the NFL. If
you go back to our podcast the twenty seventeen season,
(27:07):
I bet we spent more time talking about Sean McVay
in his first season as coach and the revolutionary way
he was calling the plays into golf, you know, with
the before the fifteen seconds kind of telling him what
to do right before that. And Wes we were fascinated
by They were a fascinating team. And also Carson Wentz
in his second year, not coming out of nowhere, but
(27:28):
having an MVP campaign run that no one really saw
coming before that. That injury cut it short. And here
we are six years later, and if they had just
had Carson Wentz, you know, on their roster a few
weeks ago and maybe an offseason to get him ready,
I think they had maybe beat the Packers, had a
much better chance.
Speaker 3 (27:45):
Man Wentz has been kind of trash for a couple
of years.
Speaker 2 (27:49):
I'm just saying, if they had any normal backup quarterback,
they could have beat the Packers. But it's just crazy
that they're all together. And I'm still glad that Carson
Wentz is not played this week, that we're getting Mattie staff.
Speaker 3 (28:02):
Yeah, but it does feel because Stafford is you know,
he battles the injury bug at the stage of his career.
I do believe we should be in line for a
couple of late December, perhaps early January. Carson Wentz starts
here in Los Angeles, so plenty of tickets at SOFI Stadium.
Let's get in there and check them out and have
some urgent enjoyment of our own. What is that.
Speaker 2 (28:28):
That must have been there all year? I would not
I don't want Carson went I want to go to
that Thursday night game against the Saints. So I do
not want Carson Wentz. But I'm telling you, I like
the these teams need to be criticized like a little
bit more for how they've handled these backup quarterback situations.
The fact that the Rams just decided, you know, they
got into the middle of the season and they sold
(28:49):
the rest of their team down the river.
Speaker 3 (28:52):
Get to start right don't get me started on that
that situation.
Speaker 2 (28:56):
Just like you totally could have just had a normal
backup quarterback for like a million dollars in it would
have been fine, Like Carson Wentz would have been fine
this whole time.
Speaker 3 (29:05):
Doesn't Urgent Enjoyment sound like a collective soul album that
came out in twenty seventeen and nobody even knew it existed.
Speaker 2 (29:13):
Maybe Soul Asylum.
Speaker 3 (29:15):
Maybe maybe it's weird. It's weird how you stress those words,
Soul Asylum.
Speaker 2 (29:20):
Sol Asylum. Just saw Dave Perner on stage at the
Liz Fair, Eggs Al and Guyville show.
Speaker 3 (29:27):
How about that she brought out Perner? Wow, that's interesting.
Bob and I watch went to a Soul Asylum concert
about seven years ago at the at the Troubadour, and
I kept on looking around to see if maybe win
On a Ryder would be there. Perner's ex how Dave Perner,
the man literally looked and almost certainly smelled like a
(29:50):
homeless person was locking down nineteen ninety two win on
a Ryder at all time? Zeus her favorite. I'll never
I'll never quite have a handle on that one, all right.
In other news, the Saints are dealing with quote unquote
fairly significant injuries to both wide receiver Michael Thomas and
(30:11):
cornerback Marshaun Lattimore. These are this according to Pro Football Talk,
these are injuries that are not expected to end the
seasons of the respective players, but it's going to cost
them potentially multiple weeks. A better news for Derek Carr.
He avoided a serious right shoulder injury that was confirmed
by Dennis Allen on Monday. He said the shoulder checked
(30:34):
out fine. They have a bye this week, so the
car is a tough son of a gun. I would
imagine you're going to see him out there when they
come back for their Week twelve matchup with the Falcons,
but don't expect to see Latimore and Thomas.
Speaker 2 (30:49):
The Saints fans were enjoying the Jamis experience more than
I expected, considering it ended with two interceptions, and they
seem about done with Carr. I don't necessarily think Cars
a problem. He's not necessarily the solution there either, But
Dennis Allen did make it clear Derek Carr is absolutely
or starting quarterback. He will absolutely be starting, and losing
(31:11):
Lattimore is big. This has been one of the healthiest
teams in the league. It's one of the reasons why
I think Dennis Allen has kind of avoided national attention
for the poor job he's doing because they have the
easiest schedule in the league. Literally the rest of the way,
it's the thirty second hardest schedule. It is the easiest
schedule the rest of the way. They've had a pretty
easy schedule to begin with. I don't think they're a
(31:32):
well coached team, and there's just there's something there. They
got to be careful or else things could get sideways.
Speaker 3 (31:41):
They also, by the way, added Jason Pierre Paul, the
veteran pass rusher, to their building, so we'll see if
he gets any level of run in their defense. We've
talked about what my words specifically meant for CD Lamb
and his twenty twenty three outlook. He was having a
(32:03):
productive but not flashy season for the Cowboys, but in
the last three weeks he's been completely unstoppable. He's had
three straight games of at least one hundred and fifty yards,
eleven for one point fifty and two touches in a
wipeout of the Giants on Sunday, and he is feeling
himself right now. He told the Cowboys website in an
(32:24):
article posted Monday, that quote, I'm the top receiver in
this game. There's no question about it. If there is,
i'll see you again next week. And I don't know
if I agree with that, because I think Justin Jefferson
is the best. But I have always thought Ceedee Lamb
had the potential to be this level of a game breaker,
and he's on my short list. I would probably put
(32:46):
him in my top three, if not top five, wide receivers,
and he is certainly showing that right now. And Greg,
for a guy that primarily, as you pointed out a
couple days ago, plays the slot, it's kind of unusual
to have somebody that's like electric at this level of
playing the way he does.
Speaker 2 (33:03):
Yeah, because he could do it all. He can make
those tough contested catches, he can just cream people after
the catch, and he can't play outside and make he
can run all the routes. It's crazy because I wanted
to throw this out there just because you're mister ced Lamb,
but also because like, all right, let's at least think
about this, like where he would stand Justin Jefferson's hurt
(33:26):
if Justin Jefferson's healthy. Yes, but I'm going to say,
like right now, this season, so Justin Jefferson's kind of
taking himself out of the mix. So's DeVante Adams because
the team he's on, and who knows, maybe he's getting
a little older. So I do the math and it's
kind of like Tyreek Hill I think for this season
would maybe have the belt. AJ Brown would be right there,
(33:50):
and Ceedee Lamb would would probably be next. And if
I was starting the team, just like for the next
five years, out of those three, I don't know, take
Ceedee Lamb like just because he feels a little more
scheme independent that you could put him in any situation.
AJ Brown is an absolute dog. So for this season
I'm given I'm giving Ceedee Lamb the bronze. But the
(34:11):
fact that that's even true, I had to think about it.
I was like, that's that's pretty impressive.
Speaker 3 (34:14):
I think DeVante is trapped in a terrible situation. I
still think he's probably at the top or near the
top of his powers. Jefferson is my number one. Yeah,
I'd probably slot him in maybe right there at three,
with Tyreek behind him, and then I'd put either Jamar
Chase or Stefan Diggs at five, that would be those
would be my top five. And you know cheese, I
(34:36):
mean Cooper Cup That's what I mean. I mean, that's
it's hard. But he's a little bit older.
Speaker 2 (34:41):
I think CD you just watch him. I just think
he hasn't been thought of as that talented because it's
been a slow building. Like he is that talented. He
you can make arguments for any of those guys, but
he's right there in terms of his skill set. He's awesome.
Speaker 3 (34:55):
And if you want an idea of his skill set, yeah,
watch that. There's really no reason otherwise to watch that
Cowboys Giants game because it was as basically varsity v JV.
But he had two touchdowns, one on a design running
play where he just beat everybody the edge and scored easily,
had the touchdown, and just like with him lately on
(35:16):
this run he's on. It's just a collection of thirty
four yard receptions like that just are setting up that
team for success. The Patriots, moving on, do not have
a wide receiver that we could add to that conversation,
and really have not since Randy Moss.
Speaker 2 (35:33):
Well, you don't like Pop Douglas I think he had
like seventy five yards.
Speaker 3 (35:38):
They took a chance on Jack Jones in the draft
a couple of years ago, a high level impact player
for college that had in college, who had some off
the field issues. He's turned out to be. It appears
a bit of a knucklehead as a professional as well.
And mix that with all the dysfunction and the Patriots
these days, and this was not a marriage made to last.
(36:01):
And he is indeed waived by the Patriots. He played
just ten snaps in their loss to the Cults, and
his snaps had been declining week by week by week
with various drama around him, and it's just yet another
story of darkness in a fairly bleak season in New England.
Speaker 2 (36:22):
Yeah, he played so well to start last season. I'm
trying to look at the PFF numbers. He looked like
an absolute steal that they might be building their team around.
For a little while. He was ranked, according to PFF
as a top twenty cornerback in their grades for people
that had at least four hundred snaps. He was sixteenth,
(36:43):
And I could buy that because he couldn't really tackle,
but he covered so well, and it's just emblematic of
what's going on with this season. Jac Jackson was left home.
Trent Brown missed practice last week. He was injured, but
there was also a personal matter, which was also the
way that they described j. C. Jackson and Jack Jones
were having issues. So considering Trent Brown's history, and he's
(37:04):
a good player, he's one of the better left tackles
in the league, I think still when he's on the field,
that's got my attention. There's just like a lot going
on here, like of what happens to bad teams and
bad organizations, and then now it's just the Patriots that's
that bad organization.
Speaker 3 (37:20):
It's crazy, Yeah, it's it's it really is. And finally
the Panthers and I just feel for Frank Reich. I mean,
is there a guy that you know he just needs
to be released from a very dark situation. And I
think he'll be a happier person for it come January,
because it's all it all seems to be coming to
a head for the Panthers.
Speaker 2 (37:41):
A one and done.
Speaker 3 (37:43):
I don't know. I guess, yeah, I guess maybe you
think he gets two years, but this has been bad.
But there's also when you do things like give up
play calling duties to your offensive coordinator Thomas Brown, I
believe three weeks ago. And then you know, after they
got there their win over the Texans. We played it
on the show, the emotional speech he gave and gave
(38:06):
the game ball to Brown. But the offense is Createred
has actually been worse with Brown calling plays, and now
there is open discussion and Reich acknowledge to the team's
website that he's just really quote thinking the whole thing
through about taking back play calling. This kind of I'm
sniffing this one out a little bit, Greg that Brown
(38:28):
is struggling with the job and there's some grumbles maybe
in the locker room about the job he's doing, and
Reich is might it might be less about him deciding
that he needs to step in for Brown and the
team is unhappy with the direction. That's just a theory
of mine. But him taking back over his play caller
just as another sign that they don't know what they're
(38:51):
doing or what they're trying to do or and I
would imagine ownership doesn't love the look either.
Speaker 2 (38:58):
It's all felt like madlane potentially from ownership, because that's
been consistent with this ownership group and to put a
better spin on it. It might be the idea that
you need to make Bryce Young look better over the
next eight games, or you know, that's it. And if
(39:18):
I'm going to go down and I'm Frank Reich and
this is my last bite at the Apple, I'm going
to go down doing it my way, calling my plays,
doing whatever I can, and not handing it off because
I don't I might not have much time here when
they're doing split screens, Dan, I saw this one in
Carolina of Bryce Young's first nine games and Jimmy Classon's
(39:40):
first nine games, and they're like, can you choose which
one is which?
Speaker 3 (39:43):
Oh?
Speaker 2 (39:43):
No, ab Test, They're basically the same. And it's like, Okay,
I've been the one saying Bryce Young's a little better
than people have been given them credit for. In the
last two games, he's taken big steps back, and that's worrisome.
And that's why. Look, a guy like Frank Raik wants
at least takes some control.
Speaker 3 (40:01):
And it's you know, and I've always kind of pushed
back when you've and this has typically been privately, but
you've always been like, man, I missed that. Jerry Richardson
and I'm always like, why would you say that, Greg,
But I think what you're saying is is that the
new ownership, it just feels like things haven't gotten better,
and the meddling of an owner is never something that
typically leads to success. So yeah, I'm gonna I'm gonna
(40:24):
give you the w on that one.
Speaker 2 (40:26):
Not what I said, never said that. You can go
back and listen to our Jerry Richardson conversations. Actually have
no idea what we said back then, what we were
allowed to say.
Speaker 3 (40:36):
But you've softened on the old man.
Speaker 2 (40:38):
And not a man that left in a blaze of glory,
but did always have that bragging right that I believe
he was and I guess still is the only former
player ever to own an NFL team, So that's that's something.
Speaker 3 (40:53):
Also, I think the only former NFL player to turn
into an owner and then have his statue melted down.
Speaker 2 (41:00):
That's right. They took down the statue and they had
to they.
Speaker 3 (41:05):
Had to turn his statue into liquid magma.
Speaker 2 (41:09):
There's a good job. It's a good job taking down
that statue. Lot of stats.
Speaker 3 (41:12):
Well that's what you said initially, but you know now
you're like, put the statue back up. He has a
place in history.
Speaker 2 (41:18):
Believe me, there were there were like some I believe
within a strange corner of Panthers Phantom. But we're really
down a weird ride here.
Speaker 3 (41:27):
That was like a kind of a crusade you've been
on in general, like put back all the statues into
the South, put them all back. Great, Calm down, you've
done it.
Speaker 2 (41:39):
You've made me feel uncomfortable with your untruth.
Speaker 3 (41:42):
How much further can I take this? Before Greg says, hey,
can we take that out of the show. I think
there's one more joke that, like the third the rule
of three is here that that Eric is scrubbing. But
I don't want Eric to scrub because Eric is scrubbing
the filth of the twenty twenty three bills off himself
right now.
Speaker 2 (42:02):
Yeah, I mean it's tough. We're tough on We're tough
on you, Eric, you know, in a way that we
probably wouldn't with with our own teams.
Speaker 5 (42:10):
In such a I got a pretty good loofah in
the in the tub, so I can I can handle it?
Speaker 3 (42:16):
You know what, Eric lights some candles, get the bubble
bath out and just sink into it. And because you
deserve it, and get a glass of pino grigio.
Speaker 5 (42:26):
I always kind of joke in these primetime games, like
Buffalo going to Buffalo, Like as a kid growing up,
it's like they went all those years without a primetime game,
and like one of my first like memories is the
lateral pass and Tennessee was there. Oh yeah, you know,
And and then they had the Monday Night game against
Tony Romo.
Speaker 4 (42:46):
He threw like five picks. They still lost.
Speaker 5 (42:50):
I was out of Nathan Peterman game where he threw
five interceptions.
Speaker 4 (42:54):
It's just, you know, it comes down with those things.
Speaker 5 (42:56):
It's just like you get hard and you get a
callous when it comes to Bills and just watching them.
But these primetime games, they just always kind of the
way they.
Speaker 2 (43:07):
Need to get them out of primetime. They've been living
in primetime. They just did the tour, They did TNF,
SNF and Monday Night Football in a row, and they
need a break. I think everyone needs a break from
the Bills. They need a break from themselves.
Speaker 3 (43:20):
They need to go play some quiet, you know, one
PM window games and just get there.
Speaker 4 (43:25):
I think your next couple.
Speaker 5 (43:26):
I think the next couple because I watched most of
them with my family before I come in and work
and do the stuff for ATM. You know, the ten
am Pacific time games, so I get a nice little
like window watch with my mom comeing to work.
Speaker 4 (43:37):
I think the next couple are one pm Pacific time.
Speaker 2 (43:40):
They're all yeah, they are all four to twenty five
national games. And this is the curse of being good.
You don't get to have a buried game until you
play the Patriots.
Speaker 5 (43:50):
Randy's my neighbors, so he was over here watching with me,
and I kind of ran through like a QB a
QB rundown. What I've remember the like the chat was
a chat tool EJ Manual, JP loss min Era.
Speaker 4 (44:03):
You know, it's just like.
Speaker 3 (44:04):
There were years where you were playing sixteen one pm
Sunday Windows.
Speaker 4 (44:09):
Yeah, man, nobody you'd lose. You'd lose, and nobody would
Nobody would know today when Josh through the interception, actually,
when James Cook had that weird fumble that bounced backed
into his hand, somehow miraculously.
Speaker 2 (44:23):
He dribbled it down the floor. I mean he ran
incredibly except for the two times he fumbled.
Speaker 5 (44:29):
Yeah, no, And that's what that was. One things like
why are we throwing the ball like James Cook. Outside
of you know, the dumb fumble and the fumble he
got back into his his belly somehow maracuously. He was
actually doing pretty well. But you know, it's like throughout
the course of this game, I would look down on
my phone, it's like twenty four text messages, group messages,
just ripping me apart, and it's like, guys, this is.
Speaker 4 (44:49):
Not new to me at all in any way in any.
Speaker 5 (44:51):
Capacity, Like this is buffalo, Like we find ways to
you know, my dad lived through the four Super Bowls.
I was a wee l at that time, so thankfully
I don't have to do that stuff. But I was
talking to mom tonight We're watching this game right here
on my couch, and like she's like, yeah, we stopped
doing super parties after the second one. It's it's just like,
(45:11):
you know, it's gonna happen.
Speaker 4 (45:13):
I don't know. It's being a cute though.
Speaker 2 (45:15):
That Randy was over on the couch.
Speaker 3 (45:17):
I love well. I was going to say, I think
that might be the thing that you know is barrier
that listeners will be tickled by that that Eric and
Big Funk, they they are neighbors. In addition to those colleagues.
Speaker 5 (45:30):
He's probably like, I can see his front door from
right where I'm sitting, and it's probably about you know what,
was I like maybe twenty five twenty five yards from
my window to his front door. So we're homies.
Speaker 3 (45:40):
This movie. This movie might be kind of before your time,
but I'm getting vibes of office space where Peter Gibbons
had his neighbor Lawrence, and they could just hear each
other through the walls. Yeah, and you know there was
a there's just a connection that comes to you through that. Yeah.
Speaker 5 (45:58):
Well we worked we worked together in morning radio for
the NFL. Yeah, he actually moved to the NFL before me,
kind of hooked me up in the NFL job interview section.
Speaker 4 (46:08):
So, yeah, we have a history. He's my friend.
Speaker 3 (46:12):
Good. That's nice. See it's a family show around Yeah, definitely.
So even when things are going bad for our football teams,
there's a lot to be thankful for. And thank you
to everyone for listening to the Monday edition of Around
the NFL. We'll be back and by the way, we
did our game rewatch on the NFL plus the Texans
(46:35):
thrilling win their latest thrilling win, this time over the Bengals,
so check that out and then we'll be back with
Connie Fox and Mark Sessler on Wednesday, Heat the Call
Twelve play the drive, Wilson cats rid of it for
the touchdown.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
To Javonte Williams.
Speaker 1 (00:12):
What a job by Russell Wilson under heavy pressure from
Tyrel Dodson and just got it over him for the
three yard touchdown. And they have a second in goal.
As Letitious Murray is in the backfield next to Allen,
they fake it to him looking for Kincaid. Alan's gonna
take it touchdown Buffalo.
Speaker 3 (00:35):
Good snap, good.
Speaker 1 (00:36):
Hold, kick perfect, and the Broncos have come to Buffalo
and they're gonna leave with a win twenty four twenty two.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
To get to four and five.
Speaker 3 (00:54):
Luck be a Lutz tonight, Will Lutz. He gets a
do over after he pushed one wide right from forty one,
seemingly giving the Buffalo Bills a narrow victory at home.
But after the Bills get called for twelve men on
the field, lets gets that do over and pipes it
from thirty six. The difference in a twenty four to
(01:15):
twenty two Bronco's victory over a Bills team that cannot
get out of its own way Right now, I am
Dan hansis joined by Greg Rosenthal from the Chris Westling
podcast studio and some really almost nightclub like lighting behind you.
(01:38):
Check this one out on YouTube. Greg. We're gonna get
to the Bills, because I think the Bills are the
bigger story in terms of their struggles and what was
expected of them and what we've seen now for a
couple of months. But let's start with the Broncos, a
team that is now four and five. We talked about
it on the Sunday Flagship Show how there is a
(02:00):
huge middle class in the AFC of teams that have
four or five losses and now all of a sudden,
and probably the Broncos left for dead at zero to
three after giving up a seventy burger are one of
those teams after a really truly impressive and unlikely victory.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
I mean, insane would be another word. This was I
think the craziest game of the year, like just just
the dumbest, Like.
Speaker 3 (02:26):
I think you had the second the second time was
right there.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
Yeah, Yeah, you sent the word absurd in a text.
Maybe that's the best one. I just think it's I
can't think of a primetime game this year that was
this insane. We almost have to go through it all
because I'm with you on the Broncos are back in
it in a way, and they've shown they're not the Patriots.
They're not one of the worst teams in the league.
(02:49):
They're going to be in every game if you give
them a chance. Their defense is just good enough to
force four turnovers, but not good enough to stop the
Bills from going down the field a couple times in
the fourth, and their offense is just good enough to
avoid mistakes and make a couple big drives late in
the game, but not good enough to take advantage of
incredible field position and all these opportunities. They had to
(03:12):
have a bigger lead. So they are that team in
the middle. But I kind of want to start with
the ending sequence because I've never seen anything quite like it.
Sean Payton, choosing on a third down with under thirty
seconds to go, instead of like throwing an incomplete.
Speaker 3 (03:31):
Pass, decides to.
Speaker 2 (03:33):
Kneel on the ball because he doesn't want to give
the Bills like fifteen seconds and look, I know AFC
Championship fifteen seconds. Things can happen. But he could have
just called for an incompletion from Russell Wilson. You could
have taken some time off the clock too, go back
for a while and throw a ball over someone's head
on the sidelight. Instead, he has so much confidence in
(03:54):
the kicking crew to run out onto the field in
that situation where the clock doesn't and go kick the
game winning field goal. He decides the kneil and he
feels that confidence because they did it at the end
of the first half and they did a beautiful job
of it, and he kneels the ball, they run out
and he pushes the kick in all the insanity, and
they lose the game if the Bills hadn't completely botched
(04:17):
it and sent twelve men on the field, like the
whole playoff race is different because the Bills sent twelve
men on the field in that situation.
Speaker 3 (04:25):
Yeah, that was my thought that Sean Peyton a little
high on his own supply and how perfectly they executed
it at the end of the second quarter. But in
this case, and let's rushed it because it wasn't as
if you know, there were two one second on the
clock and he had to get the snap off. They
(04:45):
had time for him to settle. But he rushed it
clearly and pushed it right and to get that second chance.
And yet as absurd as that is, and you saw
Josh Allen's face on the sideline after it all played out.
I didn't come out of that thinking, oh man, did
the Bills get screwed here?
Speaker 4 (05:04):
Like?
Speaker 3 (05:05):
Did they? What an unlucky way for a game to end.
They really had no business winning that game. In my opinion,
Denver gave them so many opportunities. The fact that they
missed one extra point they botched impossibly, the hold on
the score in the fourth quarter, that of course leaves
the door open for Buffalo to take the lead. And
(05:27):
then the Bills they just got to get a stop then.
And this is the difference, I think, and we're going
to hear from our producer Eric Roberts, a lifelong Bills fan,
and a bit like the difference between this team and
past years. And they are, you know, at five hundred
or lower for the first time since twenty eighteen after tonight.
(05:47):
It's just like, where's the killer instinct? Where is that
we are? We're a top team and we kind of
played with fire tonight, but we stole one by getting
that late touchdown and then we get the stop. They
can't get the stop. They let the ball get to midfield,
and I thought it was you know when they bring
the house there on second down near midfield. It worked
(06:10):
like Gangbusters, and they take down Wilson and they have
to burn dead rest burn its last time out, calling
the same kind of general scheme or play again. There
was to me needlessly risky at that point. And all
Wilson had to do, and I shouldn't say all he
had to do because that's a difficult play to get
(06:30):
off with that amount of pressure is once he saw
it was the same exact type of blitz coming his way,
get the ball up. Basically throw an armpunt up there,
and you underthrow Jerry Judy and they call toront Johnson
with a DPI and it's pretty much good night, nurse.
So Buffalo just did not execute in the game's most
important moments there, and that's been a recurring theme all season.
Speaker 2 (06:54):
Right, these two teams looked like five and five teams
in a four and five team because anytime Russell Wilson
would make a few plays, he had, you know, that
touchdown throw to Courtland Sutton, which reminded me of the
two point conversion from the NFC Championship game back in
twenty fifteen, and Sutton makes a great play and Wilson's
(07:14):
avoiding mistakes and even on that last drive it was
just like a bunch of dumb baff passes. But he
made the right decisions. He knew when to run like
he was solid. Right when you think, wow, he's really
turned in the corner, he took one of those old
Russell Wilson sacks and that was that play. Troy Aikman
was so frustrated because that was a situation in the
game where they were already in field goal range. It
was a second and four on the thirty nine for
(07:36):
the Bills. All you have to do there is get
a few more yards and not take a sack. They
show zero blitz before the snap. I figured they're faking it.
They're not going to go Greg Williams on us and
go cover zero, you know, at the very end of
the game. And they do it, and it's so well
executed that they all get in so quickly, and yet
Russell Wilson, unlike you know, I think a lot of
(07:57):
veteran quarterbacks would have gotten rid of the ball there
and he just he takes a sack, which is brutal,
and for them to run it again was like, man,
this is not Leslie Fraser. Sean McDermott runs a much
riskier defense, and it was it was just dumb and
Russell Wilson, I'm sure would love to have that throwback.
I know he is happy he got bailed out by
Toron Johnson, but yeah, he threw that ball up in
(08:19):
a windy night and he underthrew him by twenty twenty yards.
That should have been a touchdown.
Speaker 3 (08:24):
All right, take it easy, Greg, Can we because I
know you're always coming after Wilson? Can we be.
Speaker 2 (08:30):
Saying that wasn't They got the penalty because it was
such a bad throw. But underthrown deep balls is will
get you a DPI And that's that's kind of why
no one runs those those play calls anymore. And they
get it, and there were more. There was more good
than bad from Russell Wilson. And it just goes to
show that there was nothing in this Bills team that
was consistent tonight. Right when one part of the team
(08:52):
like James Cook or the running game was getting going,
they would do something bad like fumble it. Once Josh
Allen made a couple of nice throws, he would turn
the ball over. The defense was completely dominant in the
third quarter that the offense was, you know, keep spinning
down their leg and the Broncos keep getting the ball
out across the fifty and the Bills defense stopped them
for eight yards and four drives and forced the turnover.
(09:14):
Yet you said it when it came down to it
in the fourth quarter, when when the Bills actually get
a lead, they give up two straight long drives. They
can't stop Devonte Williams, and then they couldn't stop that
last drive either. So it's like everything they don't know,
Like they try to put their finger into one problem
and another problem pops.
Speaker 3 (09:32):
Up, and I know you're loath to do this, so
I'm going to do it. I think Russell Wilson might
not be a star quarterback in the way he was
in Seattle, but he has had a far better season
in year two in Denver with Sean Payton. And I
think you saw that again today because he was not
overly flashy. But I thought he played a very good
(09:54):
game overall, and he made throws. He was under pressure
a lot. He did he had some acrobatic kind of
flips when he was about to get taken out to
keep the chains moving. I thought, in general, that Wilson
has been a real bright spot for them, especially you
have to like the bigger picture of he was the
(10:16):
most high profile quarterback in terms of a trade acquisition
since Peyton Manning and he ends up having the bust
of all bus seasons. So to come out of the
ruins of last year and be a guy that now
goes from that situation to a quarterback that's going to
head into post Thanksgiving games with his team relevant. I
(10:37):
thought he played well today and I think that play
again on the third and long near midfield after he
takes the sack. Yeah, he underthrew Judy, but it was
like he got that ball out of there and through
that big looping rainbow, and you're right, it is this
slam dunk play of all slam dunk plays right now,
it seems is underthrow a receiver and you're gonna get Pi,
(10:58):
and it was Pi. So man, I just it's it's crazy.
And the Buffalo side of this is this is the
first time now where you could you're gonna look at
the Bills and forget about are they a real AFC powerhouse?
Like are they going to the playoffs? And they are
losers of three of four they're five and five. As
(11:19):
I said, this is the first time they've been at
five hundred or below in five years. And their upcoming
schedule is home against the Jets on Sunday, a Jets
team that always gives them fits, at Philly, at CAC
versus Dallas, at Chargers, lay up against New England, and
then at Miami. And I mean that I would have
(11:43):
to say if you ask me now that this is
not a playoff team, and if this is not a
playoff team, this could there could be big changes in Buffalo.
So they are very much now at a crossroads moment.
And I don't think anyone predicted that in mid November
this would be a team that is on the rank
of seeing their season fall apart. They are one of
the biggest disappointments in football, bar.
Speaker 2 (12:04):
None, no question. I think that's all well said. I
agree with it all. You couldn't lose. That's why you
couldn't lose this game, in particular, partly because you have
an at Philly, you have an at Kansas City, you
have Dallas, you have an at Miami. You got to
win a couple of those games there to possibly get
to ten and seven, and you can't have any more
(12:26):
slip ups in a game you're favored in, and hell,
like at Chargers, they're barely favored in that at this
point you still saw like why they're they're better than
the Broncos. I mean, I mean they are, They're just
not enough better to have Josh Allen just drop a
ball at one point, and he had, he had one
(12:47):
bad interception, and people are gonna remember this game as
some sort of like catastrophic Josh Allen game, and it wasn't.
It was him playing well but having just two like
terrible moments. And then it's team also having terrible moments.
James Cook fumbling the very first play of the game,
gave Davis dropping a pass that turns in to an interception.
(13:11):
So it's Josh Allen, but it's everything you said. Russell
Wilson was under pressure, like at points in that little
spot in the third quarter where I thought he ran
into some sex and took some sex. But I don't know.
I haven't seen enough out of this Bill's pass rush
in general consistently like they're not a difference making group
really anywhere, And it is shocking to me it is
(13:32):
really going to test their metal I Am not going
to give up on them. I'm always that guy in
this podcast. Maybe it's because my favorite team of all
time is the two thousand and one Patriots, and they
were five and five after ten games. And we've seen
great teams that have great quarterbacks really look bad at
certain points late in the season, like the Ravens when
they lost, you know, two games in a row by
thirty points in mid December and then won the Super
(13:54):
Bowl like it does happen, and if it was ever
going to happen, like a team led by Josh Allen
could do it. But they're not. I'm starting to feel
like I'm gonna take the l because they are tenth
in the AFC right now, Dan, I mean, they've got
like teams to catch up on. Now. There's a bunch
of teams that have four losses, a bunch of teams
that have five losses. Almost the entire conference does eight
(14:15):
teams has four or five losses. So if they could
start winning games, they'd be fine. But you look at
that schedule, it'stard.
Speaker 3 (14:20):
To they're not going anywhere. This team's not good enough,
and they're telling us we've seen enough of a sample
size where I really do think this is a yeah,
an average team, like a nine win team maybe, and
maybe that's enough to get in. Maybe it's not. And
the difference and it's you know, you know this, Like
even I enjoyed I was living in Boston at the time,
(14:40):
and I enjoyed that two thousand and one Patriots team
and that crazy playoff run because they were an underdog
team and nothing was expected of them. I think this
Bills team has crumbled under the weight of expectations and
a growing sense of pressure that they should have been
over the hump already by now. And then there was
this idea that this is the year, this is the
(15:00):
year it's finally gonna happen. Like Eric Roberts, you had
a good line before we started. You said, there's not
been a good watch all season, with maybe the exception
of the Dolphins game. Even the games they win, it's
always a struggle. In fact, the only game they've won
in the past month was that Bucks game where they
were looking like they had figured some things out and
then all of a sudden needed a Chris Godwin not
(15:22):
to see hal Mary falling right into his hands to
escape with that game.
Speaker 5 (15:26):
Yeah, every game feels it's pulling teeth, like nothing seems
that the bolts aren't tight enough. I mean even today
at first, you know, the handoff to Cook, it just
Josh kind of just dropped it out of his chest,
you know. Then Joe Buck Troy aikmanner like, hey man,
they want the coin toss. They want to set the
(15:47):
tone like the Bengals did against them last week. First
play the game, James Cook fumble like, it's just there's something, man,
There's just something. I don't know what it is. And
Ken Dorsey might be the scapegoat. I don't know if
Sean mcdermot's gonna be the guy, because you know, I
don't know's it's.
Speaker 4 (16:02):
It's pulling teeth with this team right now.
Speaker 5 (16:04):
Even the wins outside of maybe yeah, like you said,
the Dolphins game is good. They kind of slacked the
Raiders back a couple of weeks ago. But it's there's
something's wrong, man, I don't know what it is. Stefan
Diggs usually gets his today, maybe like three or four catches.
Speaker 4 (16:20):
It's tough.
Speaker 3 (16:21):
I have no confidence in my team the Jets because
of the offense, but that Sala has he has a
beat on that bills offense that's already vulnerable. That game,
that game could be a real slog like this as well,
Like I would not be surprised if that is a
game they're struggling to take care of business and like
they are in a lot of trouble. Yeah.
Speaker 5 (16:40):
No, you mentioned the schedule coming up, and we talked
a little bit before we started recording, and you go
into you see the schedule, You're like, okay, You're you're
looking it up, like, hey, here comes the murders row.
Like you said, you got Philly, you got Casey, you
got Dallas, you got the Chargers. I was gonna I'm
going to that game hopefully hmm. It might be a
bad night for me. But it's like you're going in
that stretch and yeah, like you said, the Jets always
(17:01):
give him trouble. I mean that first game of the season,
weird little outlier. They still lost. But you're kind of
hoping you're not five and five going into this kind
of murderer's row of your wake or your schedule where
you got to maybe now you're trying to steal games
where you meet. You're hoping you have like a little cushion, mean,
you lose one here, or you're on the road in Philly,
or you're on the road in case. You're not trying
(17:22):
to steal games against these teams. It's I don't know, man,
I don't I don't like. I don't like speaking in
a hyperbole. But yeah, like I said, I don't know playoffs.
Something's not right, man, something's not right. And I love
Josh Allen. I'm definitely a Josh Allen apologist. He does
a lot for the team. He tried, he wins games
for us, but do something's tough, man.
Speaker 3 (17:41):
He's not having a great year and he's been tough.
He's been this team four more turnovers today. I mean this,
And you know a lot of these games are at home.
Like it's just like they're a hard team to figure out.
And you know, to swing back to Denver, Greg like,
you know, let's look at their schedule now, because they're
a team that figure things out. And I'm giving credit
(18:02):
to Russell Wilson. I'm gonna let's give credit. You gotta
give some to Peyton too, because he got this team
off the mat where it could have been a total
house fire there. But I will say this, I don't
I'm not in a place where I'm gonna think Denver
is about to make a run. Here. They have Sunday
night football against the Vikings, then they're home against Cleveland,
(18:22):
at Houston, at Chargers, at Detroit. I don't see more
than two wins there. So I don't want to take
anything away from what they did tonight, But I didn't
see anything about like a team that's about to make
noise in the conference either.
Speaker 2 (18:35):
You know, they had that Dolphins game, but basically they've
been in every game this season no matter who they play.
Good teams are bad teams. It's like, come down to
the end. They feel like that team. I think John
Payton's a good game day coach. He's a good game planner.
Sometimes you see their first down offense, you think they're
I think they're playing on some level not to lose,
(18:55):
which is not the worst way to play if you're
good at doing that. Like the two thousand and one
Patriots very much played not to lose. And you look
at Russell Wilson's stats tonight and it's very typical of
a season. He threw the ball twenty nine times for
one hundred and ninety three yards, two touchdowns, no interceptions.
He didn't have anything that was even close to an interception.
He had a couple bad throws, took a couple bad sacks.
(19:18):
Most of his night was looking for his first lead.
Sometimes hit it had like one or two nice throws.
For the most part, it was like find your checkdown,
get six yards. His instincts have been better. He's in
an offense that makes sense, and their running game is
pretty good. You can win games that way if your
defense is decent and creating turnovers like they are. They
(19:39):
feel like they're gonna win as many games as they lose,
and they'll get to the end of the season and
they'll be eight and nine or something like that. I
don't feel much different about them than I did at
one in five. I really don't, other than the defense
now is fine. Like you look at the bit like
tonight they gave up seven point three yards per play,
Like when the Bills got that ballack, did you have
(20:01):
any doubt in your mind that they were going down
to score a touchdown to go up one? Because I didn't,
And I was just thinking when they got inside the
ten so quickly, I almost thought, oh they got they
almost got here too quickly. You know, because now you
can't burn the clock anymore. They were running the ball
so well. I thought, like I thought the Bills, the
Broncos defense was going to like stand up in that moment.
(20:23):
But I do give Peyton credit. There's something about him
that's canny, and I think he coaches up the right things,
get rid, gets rid of the right players, and they've
got players off the street playing pretty well for them.
Speaker 3 (20:37):
Yeah, this game I thought was I thought once they
botched that extra point and they let the Bills go
right down the field, I thought that was it, twenty
two to twenty one. So they deserve credit. They found
away one more time down the field, and their season has,
you know, a nice night for the fan base, and
they're relevant for at least another week or two.
Speaker 2 (20:59):
I do want to hit one last thing on the Bills,
because I think what you said about that Patriots seemed
not having expectations versus this Bills team is so right.
And it's what I believe our friend Damashek would call
the curse is supposed to and the worst place to
be when you're supposed to be good is that you
(21:19):
didn't actually win anything in the first place, because you're
getting You're getting banged on both ends. They got that close,
they got thirteen seconds away. I think they would have
won the Super Bowl that year if they had won
that game. Personally, who knows. But see, you have the
pain of losing it. That's not keeping you together, and
you have all these expectations, and I do really think
(21:41):
that you see it across the board, and this is
going to test Allen and McDermott specifically and Digs more,
you know, in the rest of their leaders more than
any situation possibly could. I thought we would learn a
lot about them in the second half of this game,
even being down seven going into halftime, and maybe they
(22:02):
are just kind of showing us who they are. That's
too much, it's too much for them.
Speaker 5 (22:08):
I hate to be I hate to be that guy. Yes,
but I'm at the point where it's like, what the
hell is wrong? As a fan, like something's up and
I'm watching.
Speaker 2 (22:16):
I mean, the fans are tight, the fans are like
you could they start booing, like the feel good story
the builder back is so over.
Speaker 5 (22:23):
It's so gone, and it's like it's at the point
where what the f is happening?
Speaker 4 (22:27):
What's going on here? You know? And you know, you
got the Stephan Dick's stuff every season.
Speaker 5 (22:32):
You know, it's like Sean mcdermy, oh, there's something up,
and then Digg's all, we're good, Josh and all were good,
and he's saying, you know, what's all you guys are
making a story out of nothing. And I've watched shows
that have pointed out like a couple of these pre
game tunnel speeches from from John Josh Allen are like,
leave it here, you know, don't whatever is there, leave
(22:53):
it here nothing, you know, play for each other, and
it's like it's reading between lines because it's we're grasping
a straw.
Speaker 4 (22:59):
It's here as fans.
Speaker 5 (23:00):
It's like, what is wrong And a lot of like somebody,
a couple of people point out, like what are these
pre tunnel speeches with Josh allensain whatever you got going
on out there, leave it at the door.
Speaker 4 (23:09):
We're here for each other, and it's just I don't know.
Speaker 5 (23:11):
I'm I'm I'm I'm really here as a fan, dude.
Speaker 3 (23:16):
Like I what you said is very true, Greg about
the curse is supposed to be And I know exactly
where you are, Eric, and I apologize that sometimes I
go back here but it's it's a sport that I understand,
and there are parallels that what the Bill, where the
Bills are at right now is as a Yankee fan,
where I was five years ago when they were the
(23:37):
baby Bombers and Aaron Judge came up and they nearly
they took the Astros to seven games. It was when
the Astros cheated and the Astros win that World Series.
And then this window was opened up, and this idea like,
this is their window that's going to be the next
big run. And then they fell short, and then they
fell short, and then they fell short, and then quietly
the roster was starting to have cracks and decay as
(23:59):
well well. And then by about five years into this
quote unquote window, not only do you realize you still
haven't won anything yet. Wait, we're not as good as
we were when this window first opened up. And I
think that's now this like cold reality. I'm a Bill
and need to do work.
Speaker 4 (24:16):
Man.
Speaker 5 (24:16):
I'm on both sides of that, Dan, I got both.
I got the football and the baseball. So they beat
us when they beat you guys. Now, I watching I'm
watching Corey seeger Win MVPs for the Rangers.
Speaker 3 (24:26):
Well, there you go, Alicia got you have, you have
your Rangers.
Speaker 4 (24:29):
That's tough, man. I can't win anywhere.
Speaker 3 (24:31):
So, oh you're a Dodgers fan. That's right. I'm sorry, buddy,
Jesus Christ.
Speaker 4 (24:35):
I'm a big loser.
Speaker 3 (24:37):
Hey, hang in there, buddy, you're still very handsome and
you got two thumbs mostly. All right, let's take a
break and then uh we'll do some news. All right,
we are back. It's a therapy session on a Monday
night as Western New York and and Erica Roberts's corner
of Los Angeles is just under siege as the Bills.
(25:00):
The Bills start to fade away. I don't know. I'm
still kind of in shock that they did not find
a way in this game. But let's see what else
is going on in the NFL right now. Let's start
here in Los Angeles, where Matthew Stafford is ready to
return to action. He's expected to play in Week eleven,
with the recently signed Carson Wentz likely backing him up.
(25:23):
That's kind of just a funny tandem for some reason,
Stafford and Wentz. Here is Rams head coach Sean McVay
on the QB situation.
Speaker 6 (25:31):
Now, Matthews should be ready to go. He was out
there taking part an individual today. It's making great progress,
and so we're operating with the anticipation and expectation that
he is going to be.
Speaker 2 (25:41):
Good to go.
Speaker 6 (25:42):
It'll be pushing through, but we expect him to be
to be able to start and play and do his
thing and lead the way.
Speaker 1 (25:48):
This week.
Speaker 3 (25:49):
What is that? I don't know. I got to get
Jordan Rodrigue back on the horn. Now what do we
have going on? There's a huge sign in Sean mcvay's
office in the colors and font of the rams that
reads in all caps, urgent enjoyment. What is that? Can
we get a screen grab of that?
Speaker 2 (26:11):
That's what led to him becoming a data week ago.
A little exurgent enjoyment.
Speaker 3 (26:18):
That's what I think of same.
Speaker 2 (26:24):
You know, I'm gonna enjoy seeing Matthew Stafford back. I
wanted to get this into the show. Is it is
newsworthy because they're they're more or less out of the
race unless they can go on a surprising run. They
got the Seahawks and the Cardinals the next two weeks,
two teams they generally play well against, including Week one
when they they trounced the Seahawks, so you never know.
(26:45):
They're not a crazy team to go on a little
run here, But we never hit Carson Wentz signing with
this team, and it is it is something crazy that
the two guys I was thinking of West because team.
Those were the two biggest stories in the NFL. If
you go back to our podcast the twenty seventeen season,
(27:07):
I bet we spent more time talking about Sean McVay
in his first season as coach and the revolutionary way
he was calling the plays into golf, you know, with
the before the fifteen seconds kind of telling him what
to do right before that. And Wes we were fascinated
by They were a fascinating team. And also Carson Wentz
in his second year, not coming out of nowhere, but
(27:28):
having an MVP campaign run that no one really saw
coming before that. That injury cut it short. And here
we are six years later, and if they had just
had Carson Wentz, you know, on their roster a few
weeks ago and maybe an offseason to get him ready,
I think they had maybe beat the Packers, had a
much better chance.
Speaker 3 (27:45):
Man Wentz has been kind of trash for a couple
of years.
Speaker 2 (27:49):
I'm just saying, if they had any normal backup quarterback,
they could have beat the Packers. But it's just crazy
that they're all together. And I'm still glad that Carson
Wentz is not played this week, that we're getting Mattie staff.
Speaker 3 (28:02):
Yeah, but it does feel because Stafford is you know,
he battles the injury bug at the stage of his career.
I do believe we should be in line for a
couple of late December, perhaps early January. Carson Wentz starts
here in Los Angeles, so plenty of tickets at SOFI Stadium.
Let's get in there and check them out and have
some urgent enjoyment of our own. What is that.
Speaker 2 (28:28):
That must have been there all year? I would not
I don't want Carson went I want to go to
that Thursday night game against the Saints. So I do
not want Carson Wentz. But I'm telling you, I like
the these teams need to be criticized like a little
bit more for how they've handled these backup quarterback situations.
The fact that the Rams just decided, you know, they
got into the middle of the season and they sold
(28:49):
the rest of their team down the river.
Speaker 3 (28:52):
Get to start right don't get me started on that
that situation.
Speaker 2 (28:56):
Just like you totally could have just had a normal
backup quarterback for like a million dollars in it would
have been fine, Like Carson Wentz would have been fine
this whole time.
Speaker 3 (29:05):
Doesn't Urgent Enjoyment sound like a collective soul album that
came out in twenty seventeen and nobody even knew it existed.
Speaker 2 (29:13):
Maybe Soul Asylum.
Speaker 3 (29:15):
Maybe maybe it's weird. It's weird how you stress those words,
Soul Asylum.
Speaker 2 (29:20):
Sol Asylum. Just saw Dave Perner on stage at the
Liz Fair, Eggs Al and Guyville show.
Speaker 3 (29:27):
How about that she brought out Perner? Wow, that's interesting.
Bob and I watch went to a Soul Asylum concert
about seven years ago at the at the Troubadour, and
I kept on looking around to see if maybe win
On a Ryder would be there. Perner's ex how Dave Perner,
the man literally looked and almost certainly smelled like a
(29:50):
homeless person was locking down nineteen ninety two win on
a Ryder at all time? Zeus her favorite. I'll never
I'll never quite have a handle on that one, all right.
In other news, the Saints are dealing with quote unquote
fairly significant injuries to both wide receiver Michael Thomas and
(30:11):
cornerback Marshaun Lattimore. These are this according to Pro Football Talk,
these are injuries that are not expected to end the
seasons of the respective players, but it's going to cost
them potentially multiple weeks. A better news for Derek Carr.
He avoided a serious right shoulder injury that was confirmed
by Dennis Allen on Monday. He said the shoulder checked
(30:34):
out fine. They have a bye this week, so the
car is a tough son of a gun. I would
imagine you're going to see him out there when they
come back for their Week twelve matchup with the Falcons,
but don't expect to see Latimore and Thomas.
Speaker 2 (30:49):
The Saints fans were enjoying the Jamis experience more than
I expected, considering it ended with two interceptions, and they
seem about done with Carr. I don't necessarily think Cars
a problem. He's not necessarily the solution there either, But
Dennis Allen did make it clear Derek Carr is absolutely
or starting quarterback. He will absolutely be starting, and losing
(31:11):
Lattimore is big. This has been one of the healthiest
teams in the league. It's one of the reasons why
I think Dennis Allen has kind of avoided national attention
for the poor job he's doing because they have the
easiest schedule in the league. Literally the rest of the way,
it's the thirty second hardest schedule. It is the easiest
schedule the rest of the way. They've had a pretty
easy schedule to begin with. I don't think they're a
(31:32):
well coached team, and there's just there's something there. They
got to be careful or else things could get sideways.
Speaker 3 (31:41):
They also, by the way, added Jason Pierre Paul, the
veteran pass rusher, to their building, so we'll see if
he gets any level of run in their defense. We've
talked about what my words specifically meant for CD Lamb
and his twenty twenty three outlook. He was having a
(32:03):
productive but not flashy season for the Cowboys, but in
the last three weeks he's been completely unstoppable. He's had
three straight games of at least one hundred and fifty yards,
eleven for one point fifty and two touches in a
wipeout of the Giants on Sunday, and he is feeling
himself right now. He told the Cowboys website in an
(32:24):
article posted Monday, that quote, I'm the top receiver in
this game. There's no question about it. If there is,
i'll see you again next week. And I don't know
if I agree with that, because I think Justin Jefferson
is the best. But I have always thought Ceedee Lamb
had the potential to be this level of a game breaker,
and he's on my short list. I would probably put
(32:46):
him in my top three, if not top five, wide receivers,
and he is certainly showing that right now. And Greg,
for a guy that primarily, as you pointed out a
couple days ago, plays the slot, it's kind of unusual
to have somebody that's like electric at this level of
playing the way he does.
Speaker 2 (33:03):
Yeah, because he could do it all. He can make
those tough contested catches, he can just cream people after
the catch, and he can't play outside and make he
can run all the routes. It's crazy because I wanted
to throw this out there just because you're mister ced Lamb,
but also because like, all right, let's at least think
about this, like where he would stand Justin Jefferson's hurt
(33:26):
if Justin Jefferson's healthy. Yes, but I'm going to say,
like right now, this season, so Justin Jefferson's kind of
taking himself out of the mix. So's DeVante Adams because
the team he's on, and who knows, maybe he's getting
a little older. So I do the math and it's
kind of like Tyreek Hill I think for this season
would maybe have the belt. AJ Brown would be right there,
(33:50):
and Ceedee Lamb would would probably be next. And if
I was starting the team, just like for the next
five years, out of those three, I don't know, take
Ceedee Lamb like just because he feels a little more
scheme independent that you could put him in any situation.
AJ Brown is an absolute dog. So for this season
I'm given I'm giving Ceedee Lamb the bronze. But the
(34:11):
fact that that's even true, I had to think about it.
I was like, that's that's pretty impressive.
Speaker 3 (34:14):
I think DeVante is trapped in a terrible situation. I
still think he's probably at the top or near the
top of his powers. Jefferson is my number one. Yeah,
I'd probably slot him in maybe right there at three,
with Tyreek behind him, and then I'd put either Jamar
Chase or Stefan Diggs at five, that would be those
would be my top five. And you know cheese, I
(34:36):
mean Cooper Cup That's what I mean. I mean, that's
it's hard. But he's a little bit older.
Speaker 2 (34:41):
I think CD you just watch him. I just think
he hasn't been thought of as that talented because it's
been a slow building. Like he is that talented. He
you can make arguments for any of those guys, but
he's right there in terms of his skill set. He's awesome.
Speaker 3 (34:55):
And if you want an idea of his skill set, yeah,
watch that. There's really no reason otherwise to watch that
Cowboys Giants game because it was as basically varsity v JV.
But he had two touchdowns, one on a design running
play where he just beat everybody the edge and scored easily,
had the touchdown, and just like with him lately on
(35:16):
this run he's on. It's just a collection of thirty
four yard receptions like that just are setting up that
team for success. The Patriots, moving on, do not have
a wide receiver that we could add to that conversation,
and really have not since Randy Moss.
Speaker 2 (35:33):
Well, you don't like Pop Douglas I think he had
like seventy five yards.
Speaker 3 (35:38):
They took a chance on Jack Jones in the draft
a couple of years ago, a high level impact player
for college that had in college, who had some off
the field issues. He's turned out to be. It appears
a bit of a knucklehead as a professional as well.
And mix that with all the dysfunction and the Patriots
these days, and this was not a marriage made to last.
(36:01):
And he is indeed waived by the Patriots. He played
just ten snaps in their loss to the Cults, and
his snaps had been declining week by week by week
with various drama around him, and it's just yet another
story of darkness in a fairly bleak season in New England.
Speaker 2 (36:22):
Yeah, he played so well to start last season. I'm
trying to look at the PFF numbers. He looked like
an absolute steal that they might be building their team around.
For a little while. He was ranked, according to PFF
as a top twenty cornerback in their grades for people
that had at least four hundred snaps. He was sixteenth,
(36:43):
And I could buy that because he couldn't really tackle,
but he covered so well, and it's just emblematic of
what's going on with this season. Jac Jackson was left home.
Trent Brown missed practice last week. He was injured, but
there was also a personal matter, which was also the
way that they described j. C. Jackson and Jack Jones
were having issues. So considering Trent Brown's history, and he's
(37:04):
a good player, he's one of the better left tackles
in the league, I think still when he's on the field,
that's got my attention. There's just like a lot going
on here, like of what happens to bad teams and
bad organizations, and then now it's just the Patriots that's
that bad organization.
Speaker 3 (37:20):
It's crazy, Yeah, it's it's it really is. And finally
the Panthers and I just feel for Frank Reich. I mean,
is there a guy that you know he just needs
to be released from a very dark situation. And I
think he'll be a happier person for it come January,
because it's all it all seems to be coming to
a head for the Panthers.
Speaker 2 (37:41):
A one and done.
Speaker 3 (37:43):
I don't know. I guess, yeah, I guess maybe you
think he gets two years, but this has been bad.
But there's also when you do things like give up
play calling duties to your offensive coordinator Thomas Brown, I
believe three weeks ago. And then you know, after they
got there their win over the Texans. We played it
on the show, the emotional speech he gave and gave
(38:06):
the game ball to Brown. But the offense is Createred
has actually been worse with Brown calling plays, and now
there is open discussion and Reich acknowledge to the team's
website that he's just really quote thinking the whole thing
through about taking back play calling. This kind of I'm
sniffing this one out a little bit, Greg that Brown
(38:28):
is struggling with the job and there's some grumbles maybe
in the locker room about the job he's doing, and
Reich is might it might be less about him deciding
that he needs to step in for Brown and the
team is unhappy with the direction. That's just a theory
of mine. But him taking back over his play caller
just as another sign that they don't know what they're
(38:51):
doing or what they're trying to do or and I
would imagine ownership doesn't love the look either.
Speaker 2 (38:58):
It's all felt like madlane potentially from ownership, because that's
been consistent with this ownership group and to put a
better spin on it. It might be the idea that
you need to make Bryce Young look better over the
next eight games, or you know, that's it. And if
(39:18):
I'm going to go down and I'm Frank Reich and
this is my last bite at the Apple, I'm going
to go down doing it my way, calling my plays,
doing whatever I can, and not handing it off because
I don't I might not have much time here when
they're doing split screens, Dan, I saw this one in
Carolina of Bryce Young's first nine games and Jimmy Classon's
(39:40):
first nine games, and they're like, can you choose which
one is which?
Speaker 3 (39:43):
Oh?
Speaker 2 (39:43):
No, ab Test, They're basically the same. And it's like, Okay,
I've been the one saying Bryce Young's a little better
than people have been given them credit for. In the
last two games, he's taken big steps back, and that's worrisome.
And that's why. Look, a guy like Frank Raik wants
at least takes some control.
Speaker 3 (40:01):
And it's you know, and I've always kind of pushed
back when you've and this has typically been privately, but
you've always been like, man, I missed that. Jerry Richardson
and I'm always like, why would you say that, Greg,
But I think what you're saying is is that the
new ownership, it just feels like things haven't gotten better,
and the meddling of an owner is never something that
typically leads to success. So yeah, I'm gonna I'm gonna
(40:24):
give you the w on that one.
Speaker 2 (40:26):
Not what I said, never said that. You can go
back and listen to our Jerry Richardson conversations. Actually have
no idea what we said back then, what we were
allowed to say.
Speaker 3 (40:36):
But you've softened on the old man.
Speaker 2 (40:38):
And not a man that left in a blaze of glory,
but did always have that bragging right that I believe
he was and I guess still is the only former
player ever to own an NFL team, So that's that's something.
Speaker 3 (40:53):
Also, I think the only former NFL player to turn
into an owner and then have his statue melted down.
Speaker 2 (41:00):
That's right. They took down the statue and they had
to they.
Speaker 3 (41:05):
Had to turn his statue into liquid magma.
Speaker 2 (41:09):
There's a good job. It's a good job taking down
that statue. Lot of stats.
Speaker 3 (41:12):
Well that's what you said initially, but you know now
you're like, put the statue back up. He has a
place in history.
Speaker 2 (41:18):
Believe me, there were there were like some I believe
within a strange corner of Panthers Phantom. But we're really
down a weird ride here.
Speaker 3 (41:27):
That was like a kind of a crusade you've been
on in general, like put back all the statues into
the South, put them all back. Great, Calm down, you've
done it.
Speaker 2 (41:39):
You've made me feel uncomfortable with your untruth.
Speaker 3 (41:42):
How much further can I take this? Before Greg says, hey,
can we take that out of the show. I think
there's one more joke that, like the third the rule
of three is here that that Eric is scrubbing. But
I don't want Eric to scrub because Eric is scrubbing
the filth of the twenty twenty three bills off himself
right now.
Speaker 2 (42:02):
Yeah, I mean it's tough. We're tough on We're tough
on you, Eric, you know, in a way that we
probably wouldn't with with our own teams.
Speaker 5 (42:10):
In such a I got a pretty good loofah in
the in the tub, so I can I can handle it?
Speaker 3 (42:16):
You know what, Eric lights some candles, get the bubble
bath out and just sink into it. And because you
deserve it, and get a glass of pino grigio.
Speaker 5 (42:26):
I always kind of joke in these primetime games, like
Buffalo going to Buffalo, Like as a kid growing up,
it's like they went all those years without a primetime game,
and like one of my first like memories is the
lateral pass and Tennessee was there. Oh yeah, you know,
And and then they had the Monday Night game against
Tony Romo.
Speaker 4 (42:46):
He threw like five picks. They still lost.
Speaker 5 (42:50):
I was out of Nathan Peterman game where he threw
five interceptions.
Speaker 4 (42:54):
It's just, you know, it comes down with those things.
Speaker 5 (42:56):
It's just like you get hard and you get a
callous when it comes to Bills and just watching them.
But these primetime games, they just always kind of the
way they.
Speaker 2 (43:07):
Need to get them out of primetime. They've been living
in primetime. They just did the tour, They did TNF,
SNF and Monday Night Football in a row, and they
need a break. I think everyone needs a break from
the Bills. They need a break from themselves.
Speaker 3 (43:20):
They need to go play some quiet, you know, one
PM window games and just get there.
Speaker 4 (43:25):
I think your next couple.
Speaker 5 (43:26):
I think the next couple because I watched most of
them with my family before I come in and work
and do the stuff for ATM. You know, the ten
am Pacific time games, so I get a nice little
like window watch with my mom comeing to work.
Speaker 4 (43:37):
I think the next couple are one pm Pacific time.
Speaker 2 (43:40):
They're all yeah, they are all four to twenty five
national games. And this is the curse of being good.
You don't get to have a buried game until you
play the Patriots.
Speaker 5 (43:50):
Randy's my neighbors, so he was over here watching with me,
and I kind of ran through like a QB a
QB rundown. What I've remember the like the chat was
a chat tool EJ Manual, JP loss min Era.
Speaker 4 (44:03):
You know, it's just like.
Speaker 3 (44:04):
There were years where you were playing sixteen one pm
Sunday Windows.
Speaker 4 (44:09):
Yeah, man, nobody you'd lose. You'd lose, and nobody would
Nobody would know today when Josh through the interception, actually,
when James Cook had that weird fumble that bounced backed
into his hand, somehow miraculously.
Speaker 2 (44:23):
He dribbled it down the floor. I mean he ran
incredibly except for the two times he fumbled.
Speaker 5 (44:29):
Yeah, no, And that's what that was. One things like
why are we throwing the ball like James Cook. Outside
of you know, the dumb fumble and the fumble he
got back into his his belly somehow maracuously. He was
actually doing pretty well. But you know, it's like throughout
the course of this game, I would look down on
my phone, it's like twenty four text messages, group messages,
just ripping me apart, and it's like, guys, this is.
Speaker 4 (44:49):
Not new to me at all in any way in any.
Speaker 5 (44:51):
Capacity, Like this is buffalo, Like we find ways to
you know, my dad lived through the four Super Bowls.
I was a wee l at that time, so thankfully
I don't have to do that stuff. But I was
talking to mom tonight We're watching this game right here
on my couch, and like she's like, yeah, we stopped
doing super parties after the second one. It's it's just like,
(45:11):
you know, it's gonna happen.
Speaker 4 (45:13):
I don't know. It's being a cute though.
Speaker 2 (45:15):
That Randy was over on the couch.
Speaker 3 (45:17):
I love well. I was going to say, I think
that might be the thing that you know is barrier
that listeners will be tickled by that that Eric and
Big Funk, they they are neighbors. In addition to those colleagues.
Speaker 5 (45:30):
He's probably like, I can see his front door from
right where I'm sitting, and it's probably about you know what,
was I like maybe twenty five twenty five yards from
my window to his front door. So we're homies.
Speaker 3 (45:40):
This movie. This movie might be kind of before your time,
but I'm getting vibes of office space where Peter Gibbons
had his neighbor Lawrence, and they could just hear each
other through the walls. Yeah, and you know there was
a there's just a connection that comes to you through that. Yeah.
Speaker 5 (45:58):
Well we worked we worked together in morning radio for
the NFL. Yeah, he actually moved to the NFL before me,
kind of hooked me up in the NFL job interview section.
Speaker 4 (46:08):
So, yeah, we have a history. He's my friend.
Speaker 3 (46:12):
Good. That's nice. See it's a family show around Yeah, definitely.
So even when things are going bad for our football teams,
there's a lot to be thankful for. And thank you
to everyone for listening to the Monday edition of Around
the NFL. We'll be back and by the way, we
did our game rewatch on the NFL plus the Texans
(46:35):
thrilling win their latest thrilling win, this time over the Bengals,
so check that out and then we'll be back with
Connie Fox and Mark Sessler on Wednesday, Heat the Call
Host
Gregg Rosenthal
Popular Podcasts
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.
Therapy Gecko
An unlicensed lizard psychologist travels the universe talking to strangers about absolutely nothing. TO CALL THE GECKO: follow me on https://www.twitch.tv/lyleforever to get a notification for when I am taking calls. I am usually live Mondays, Wednesdays, and Fridays but lately a lot of other times too. I am a gecko.