November 17, 2023 • 19 mins
In a studio full of heroes - Gregg Rosenthal and Patrick Claybon react to the news that Joe Burrow will miss the remainder of the 2023 season due to a torn ligament in his right wrist.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:09):
Welcome to another edition of the Around the NFL Emergency Podcast.
Here in the Chris Westling podcast studio, I'm with my
friend a hero, Patrick Claybonn, and uh, we're usually here
on Fridays to tape game deviut a fun show. Yeah,
Unfortunately we're in the podcast studio for an unfun reason.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
I wish we weren't the exact opposite of an of
a fun Friday, because right when I got in, I'm
looking up and I'm seeing Taylor on On with the end,
and it's like, oh, what's what's the breaking Burrow's done
for the year. And I was, you know, considering the
way that he reacted after the ball left his hand,
and and like you could see, he was an obvious pain.
(00:52):
He was kind of dejected for the remainder of the game.
It's like, well, this is going to be significant, but
to have to have no Joe Burrow for the rest
of it, Like, the league is better when not just
Joe's playing, but just when we're talking to Joe, when
we're hearing Joe's thoughts about football, even the way he
handled his season ending Now news conference just highlighted how
(01:13):
great it is, how great of a communicator and a
person a football player he is, and it's just it sucks.
Speaker 3 (01:18):
It sucks.
Speaker 1 (01:19):
I was talking about it with Emmica, my wife, because
I was just leaving the house when this popped, and
we were saying the same sort of thing that you do.
Speaker 4 (01:27):
Forget that this whole league, this studio, this.
Speaker 1 (01:30):
Building, everything, like a lot of it is on the
backs of like ten quarterback and like if you whittle
a town, it's like six or seven, Like they do
really matter that much. They add so much to what
we do on a week to week basis, and it's
such a bummer. And maybe I'm just an optimist for
some reason, it didn't occur to me that he would
be out for the season. It's the same thing last
(01:51):
night when Dan broke the news to me mid podcast
and Mark Andrews out for the season. I was like, Oh,
I just I never think worst case scenarios, like that'll
be a high ankle, or that'll be something. And this
is rough because like most teams, the Bengals don't really
have a backup plan. We can get into that, but
I think we'll just start more on just the big
picture Bengals of it all. They're five and five this season,
(02:14):
they're zero and three to the division. They're one to
five in the conference. They had some issues that I
talked about with Dan last night. We don't defensively offensive
line in terms of their pass protection.
Speaker 4 (02:24):
We don't need to go too deep into it.
Speaker 1 (02:26):
It's hard to imagine them winning enough games to make
the playoffs this year. They play the Steelers, Jaguars, Colts, Vikings, Steelers, Chiefs, Browns,
All those teams are in the playoff race. I guess
I'm more interested looking at this team right now and
that like, can they be competitive in those games? Can
they win some of those games? Even if it's not
(02:48):
going anywhere? They now matter because they're improving all these
potential playoff teams as schedule. The Steelers are kind of
lucky here because they missed Joe Burrow to Times.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
Yeah, and ultimately because we saw and Trey Hendrickson really
gutted it out last night. He did come up with
a sack, but he was clearly playing hurt. And we
saw them go through that stretch right whereas Arizona, Seattle
and then San Francisco and lose defense played spectacularly, and
I guess that's something else we need to look ahead
to with regards to twenty twenty four, is if lou
(03:21):
Ana Roumo is not the head coach somewhere, because clearly,
like losing safeties that played ninety nine and ninety eight
percent of the snaps last year has an impact, Right,
you're you're not.
Speaker 1 (03:33):
Just sometimes the offseason narrative. Yah, yeah, it's true. I
thought it was overblown. Actually, I was like, they'll probably
be fine, and last night was a big change. Actually
they bench Nick Scotten from Yeah for the first time
in that game, and they're.
Speaker 2 (03:44):
Still kind of trying to ultimately figure things out there.
But it's so much easier to go in. And obviously
it is even dumb to say when oh, yeah, we
got Joe and Jamar and t and everything's, you know,
worst case scenario, we end up in a shootout and
it's it's not looking good like the rest of the way,
(04:04):
Like even even after because of the Colts and the Vikings,
it's like, where's the where's the spot, Like, where's where's
win six coming?
Speaker 1 (04:14):
I think they can be competitive and and I don't
want to get into a whole Zach Taylor thing. Me
and Dan have gone back and forth about him quite
a bit, and I do with my Bengals fans a
lot of them or are on my side that like, look,
if if you have a quality coach, you can maybe
survive the loss of even a franchise quarterback. We're seeing
what the Vikings are doing, for instance, right now, and
just that they would be competitive in these games. The
(04:35):
Steelers aren't some world beaters the Colts. We know what
the Vikings are dealing with that maybe they can pick
like a coach and a defense and all that talent
you said that's still there on offense can maybe pick
off a couple of these games, but it's gonna be tough.
Jake Browning played fairly well, I thought last night. You know,
we checked the PFF grades right before we started. He
(04:57):
got a sixty eight. That's pretty good, and that passed
the eye test that he didn't do too many things wrong.
He made a couple accurate throws, he kind of went
through his reads, and I was like, Okay, that was
better than the version I saw in the preseason when
he had one of the worst training camp battles. Because
they played the whole preseason because Burrow is hurt, and
I watched most of it for some reason, and him
(05:19):
and Simeon couldn't It couldn't have been worse, And I
don't know. It got very frustrated with these teams who
don't invest in backup quarterbacks and just weirdly don't seem
to take that position that seriously. Our friend Chase Daniel
was honking about it on Twitter, and I agree with him,
Like Teddy was just sitting out there for a while,
(05:40):
like these teams that have championship aspirations. I guess you're
not winning the championship with Teddy, but you can't tell
me that a playoff run wouldn't be a lot more
entertaining and be worth it for the fans paying money,
and be worth it for T Higgins and Tyler Boyd
in a contract. Y're like, like, the next seven weeks matters,
even if you're not gonna win a super Bowl, And
they got super cheap this offseason and a couple of
(06:02):
teams did that, and I just don't get it.
Speaker 3 (06:03):
It doesn't make any sense.
Speaker 2 (06:04):
I mean, the best possible explanation a few years ago was, well,
we don't want somebody to come in and the quarterback
lose the locker. The Carson Wentz backup situation, and it's
like you're worried about somebody's feelings. Like, if the feelings
are that much of a concern, maybe the quarterback's not
very good.
Speaker 4 (06:20):
Right, No one's worried about Joe Burrow's feelings. He can
handle it.
Speaker 3 (06:22):
Yeah, Joe will be fine. You've got to you gotta
invest at the position.
Speaker 2 (06:27):
And maybe this changes things for twenty twenty four, but
everybody's stuck now, Like Tommy DeVito is going to be
playing for the rest of the season because like there's
there's just no other than pulling somebody off the street.
Speaker 1 (06:40):
Well, Joe Flacco did work out for the Browns, right.
You know what's funny is I was thinking, like, is
are we in a world where the Bengals are like, damn,
they got to Flacco first, or there there's actually like
a betting war.
Speaker 3 (06:53):
Yeah, Joe Flacco sweepstakes.
Speaker 4 (06:55):
I mean maybe why not or Matt Ryan or someone.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
I mean part of it is there's just not enough
you know, proven quarterbacks in the NFL. But I just
think it's an under I don't know, underpaid position. It's
kind of crazy to me because like Jamis was available
for cheap. Andy Dalton was available for cheap, Baker was
available for cheap. Any of these championship level teams or
(07:20):
even playoff level teams could have just invested the five
six million dollars that it costs, and it's so worth
it because it's a weird sport where one position so
far outweighs every other position that it's like driving your
car without insurance. It just doesn't make any sense because yeah,
like Tom Brady could stay healthy for his entire career
(07:41):
except for that one year with Matt Castle, and yet
I was always supporting Bill Belichick taking Ryan Mallet and
Kevin O'Connell and Jacoby Brissett and Jimmy Garoppolo. He just
kept doing it like over and over because it totally
makes sense. That position so much more important. Why not
spend a second or a third on that instead of
spending the money on some cornerback that you're gonna cut.
Speaker 4 (08:02):
If you're Bill Belichick in year two.
Speaker 2 (08:04):
I just had a second theory. What if they don't
want to answer the questions about the backup?
Speaker 4 (08:08):
Is that's I think that's part of it.
Speaker 2 (08:09):
A two game skid, and then it's like, let's put
in Bailey's appy and like it literally never works, but
people are going to continue to ask.
Speaker 1 (08:16):
I think that's part of it. In Belichick was one
person that didn't care, but I just maybe.
Speaker 3 (08:20):
That's maybe that's why you put him in the final drive.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
My larger point was just like it, it doesn't make
any sense that that's not treated financially and draft pick
wise as important as you're starting off ball linebacker or
even your third edge rusher, whatever money you're picking, or just.
Speaker 2 (08:39):
Or just not unspent money, or just money that's there
that's available to spent, and right they just don't spend it.
Speaker 1 (08:45):
That That's just sort of a frustration I've long had,
and it's funny with this team in particular because I
listened to Paul Daner his podcast with the Athletic and
I read his stuff there and this was like story
number two behind the safeties all off season was why
don't why are backups so bad? Why aren't we investing
in backups? So it is a case of first guessing,
(09:07):
not second guessing.
Speaker 3 (09:09):
Greg, Where do you get all the time for all
these podcasts?
Speaker 1 (09:12):
You listen on one point five speed, you do a
lot of stuff around the house, You pick and choose
but I've sort of added the team podcast. It's it's good,
all right? What else should we talk about the Bengals?
They're done for the season. Let's look at the division.
I guess quickly the Steelers are just right in.
Speaker 3 (09:32):
A way of the zombie Steelers, right.
Speaker 4 (09:34):
I wouldn't call it.
Speaker 1 (09:35):
Luck because I think they've won these games and that
they have a good coaching staff that's figured out a
way to do it, and they've gotten a little luck
along the way.
Speaker 4 (09:42):
But it is crazy.
Speaker 1 (09:43):
They've been out gained every game in their six and
three and now in the last week they've seen both
Deshaun Watson and Joe Burrow leave the division. The Ravens
are a couple of games ahead, but they're in a
weird spot where they're eight and three and the Steelers
are six and three.
Speaker 4 (09:57):
That bothers me.
Speaker 1 (09:58):
I know it's only for four days, but like, what
are we doing here sport that there's an eight and
three and a six and three?
Speaker 4 (10:03):
It's that that bothers me.
Speaker 1 (10:04):
Do you think the Steelers now like they got two
games against the Browns, Like, do you think they were
a playoff team?
Speaker 3 (10:09):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (10:10):
I think the Steelers, Like why why wouldn't they be
other than the fact that the numbers that you mentioned,
I mean, you could also make the case that, like
Lamar and the Ravens were the best seven and three
team of all time before last night. Are considering the
way that things have gone statistically for them, it's so
hard to continue to win in the way that they have.
But while they keep doing it, Like who's to say,
(10:32):
because we looked back at last year's vikings and it's like, oh,
that was a fraud. Well, like here comes Kevin O'Connell again, right,
and so like I know it's cliche and it's like
wins and losses are all the matters, but like they
keep doing it, and they keep doing it in weird fashion.
Speaker 1 (10:48):
I keep I kept believing at some point they're actually
gonna play better. You know, the offense looked a whole
lot better. They actually are already since the buy. Kenny
Pickett hasn't been he's just kind of been like a
below average quarterback, but he's been a below average quarterback
that's not going to crush your team. And their offense
has been average to better than average because the running
(11:09):
games getting going. So I think they're gonna play better.
This is a big game this weekend. I'm actually picking
the Browns to win this game. A little tease for
NFL game debut. People should check that out. We're on
reruns throughout the weekend. Even if you don't hear this
right away, but I think we're five pm Pacific on Fridays.
We're on Sunday mornings before game day. Yeah, Saturdays, it's there.
Speaker 4 (11:29):
We'll do the picks.
Speaker 1 (11:30):
I think the brown like, the Browns are winners here too,
because they don't have that Bengals game coming up or
anything like that, or they do they finish the season
with the Bengals, so like that, there's a difference between
these two teams. The Bengals do not have a difference
making difference right now. You can say that they can
play better because of the personnel they have, but the
(11:50):
Browns of the best defense in the league.
Speaker 4 (11:52):
The Bengals are just there.
Speaker 3 (11:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (11:56):
It's depressing, man.
Speaker 1 (11:58):
It's like I think about the big picture of it
all too and we will wrap up soon.
Speaker 4 (12:02):
We got to get going.
Speaker 1 (12:04):
But I think back to that play in the Super Bowl,
the penalty on Logan Wilson, and then certainly what happened
with the last drive against the Rams. It's just so
hard to get back to that point, and that was
a coin flip game. I believe those two teams whereas
even a super Bowl as you'll see, and you feel
like you have all the time in the world. And
(12:25):
they're going to be very good, I think throughout the
Joe Burrow era, but this offseason they're going to be
a very different team in twenty twenty four than they
were in twenty twenty three. Here are some free agents
that the Bengals have. DJ Reider, their best interior defensive tackle.
What a great free agent signing right there with Trey Hendrickson.
Does he get another contract with the team. He's getting
(12:45):
a little older. Tyler Boyd is a free agent. T
Higgins is a freight free agent. That was part of
what made them special, these receivers all together. Jonah Williams,
who's played a ton of snaps for them and it
has been fine this year at right tackle, is.
Speaker 4 (12:59):
A free agent.
Speaker 1 (13:00):
Shaudobi a woozy who hasn't maybe played up to his
previous level coming off a series serious injury.
Speaker 4 (13:05):
He's a free agent.
Speaker 1 (13:06):
Those are as core of five, you know, starters as
you could find from this three year run. So it
just I just kind of wanted to circle how it's difficult.
You need a lot of things to go your way.
And Burrows had bad injury luck, the Bengals have had
some in general. And they're going to count on Duke
Tobin and partly Zach Taylor to come up with like
(13:27):
a new version of this Bengals team because they're not
going to be the same.
Speaker 2 (13:29):
And people may be tired of us talking about it,
but I always have to go back to it that
it's really hard to win that one game, right, It's
really hard. A lot of stuff has to happen, and
then you lose that game or you come up short
before that game, you never get a chance to play
in it. And we and we make the case about
the quality of people's entire careers based on the outcome
of that in a story.
Speaker 1 (13:46):
Or even last year, they were so close to being
in that game again, you kind of forget about that
as a heartbreaking loss, that Chiefs loss.
Speaker 4 (13:54):
They could have.
Speaker 1 (13:54):
Very easily been back in that Super Bowl and won it.
And there was nothing separating those two teams to me
really either. Just that day the Chiefs were three points better.
Speaker 2 (14:03):
Yeah, and then so like I'm looking at that list
of free agents and maybe it's Tyler Boyd, and Tyler
Boyd is the odd man out and he's somewhere else
and he's no longer around the Boyd Chase Higgins receiving
group with Burrow like it deserves to be remembered. And
because you know, because you know that there was an
incompletion to samaj pron you know, because there was a
(14:28):
hedge on on Aaron Donald, it didn't quite get there.
Like we have to say that this was group was
a failure, but we aren't a failure.
Speaker 4 (14:35):
We don't.
Speaker 3 (14:36):
Yeah, yeah, to hell with that.
Speaker 4 (14:38):
There weren't our own podcasts.
Speaker 1 (14:40):
We're the around the NFL podcast We are the thought
leaders Patrick.
Speaker 4 (14:44):
We don't have to say it.
Speaker 1 (14:48):
And but I might as well make predictions here reader
chance to come back Boyd, he's probably gone a Woozy,
probably gone T franchise tag if I had to guess,
but no guarantee. He's and Joan and Williams probably guns
or maybe actually they're the team that that does pay him.
So I think there's gonna be a lot of changing.
And you just feel you said it really well at
the top. You feel for Burrow personally. He's had a
(15:11):
few injuries now, He's had the a c L had
a knee sprain I believe late.
Speaker 4 (15:18):
In the twenty twenty one season.
Speaker 1 (15:22):
Nothing that that kept him out a long time until
this calf injury which bothered him. So he's just he's
just had bad breaks and you feel for him, you
feel for the whole organization and and even the smallest
bit for us because.
Speaker 4 (15:35):
We're gonna have like Jake Browning in primetime.
Speaker 3 (15:37):
And it's gonna be annoying.
Speaker 1 (15:40):
U let's wrap the show with more bad news, uh
Ian Rappaport as we are taping, this reported just kind
of the extent of the Mark Andrews injury, and uh,
I believe it's a fractured fibula along with the knee
or the let's see what it is, sorry cracked fibula
(16:02):
and the ankle ligament injuries. That it makes sense that
that he's out for the season, but that still is
disappointing because that's a really serious injury. When it's both
of those combined, like the broken in a situation like this,
you almost root for a broken leg because that's a
cleaner recovery and that's something he could be back working
(16:23):
pretty early in the offseason. But it makes sense that
they so quickly ruled him out for the year because
that that is a long time recovery, so he wish
wished the best for him too.
Speaker 3 (16:31):
Yeah, and possibly multiple surgeries.
Speaker 2 (16:33):
And you could see it in Lamar's reaction both on
the field and after the and after the game that
this will significantly impact the chances for Baltimore m because
there's plenty of times where Mark is the one, well.
Speaker 4 (16:46):
He's the most important one.
Speaker 3 (16:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:48):
I've been waiting for their passing attack to just be
a little more consistent, a little more on the same page.
I think we're seeing that with Odell and Bateman, who
were kind of the we know what we're getting out
as z A Flowers, I think the way they use
him makes sense. But those two guys, it's been better
and they still have more than enough I believe to
(17:09):
go on a Super Bowl run. But that is still
a major loss, and the AFC just feels different. The
Bills are no lock to make the playoffs, the Bengals
are no locked to make the playoffs. The Browns are
now playing with the backup, and it absolutely leaves more
room for Miami and a surprise team somewhere that we're
(17:31):
not even thinking about, whether it's the Chargers or the
Colts or heck, the Las Vegas Raiders. I'm not going
that far. I'm just saying it does open it. It
opens it up a little where if you look at
the who's going to make it as the seventh seed
and the sixth seed. Before I would have said, well,
you at least got to get to ten wins and
you might be looking at tie breakers there, and now
(17:52):
it's like, okay, ten wins maybe feels a little safer,
Maybe you don't need the type of who knows, maybe
nine to eight gets involved here because all these teams
are closer than they are apart, and with.
Speaker 3 (18:02):
So many common schedules.
Speaker 1 (18:03):
I think nine and eighttimly right, and like I feel
more confident today. Jacksonville and Houston both get in, for instance,
just because I actually thought they probably were good enough
to do so already, and now it's like you just
look at the picture, everything changes with the quarterback. It
is a bummer, but I'm glad, you know, we do
this game debut together, so that we were here to
(18:24):
be able to do this today and it didn't wait
till the Sunday.
Speaker 4 (18:27):
Yeah recap show.
Speaker 2 (18:28):
Yeah, let's let's do an emergency pod when something awesome
happens next time.
Speaker 4 (18:32):
That would that would be fun.
Speaker 1 (18:34):
Until then, we will be back on Sunday, we hope,
and we plan for Mark Sssler to be back there.
Get better, buddy, and until then, for Patrick Claibond
Speaker 4 (18:48):
Keep it ta
Welcome to another edition of the Around the NFL Emergency Podcast.
Here in the Chris Westling podcast studio, I'm with my
friend a hero, Patrick Claybonn, and uh, we're usually here
on Fridays to tape game deviut a fun show. Yeah,
Unfortunately we're in the podcast studio for an unfun reason.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
I wish we weren't the exact opposite of an of
a fun Friday, because right when I got in, I'm
looking up and I'm seeing Taylor on On with the end,
and it's like, oh, what's what's the breaking Burrow's done
for the year. And I was, you know, considering the
way that he reacted after the ball left his hand,
and and like you could see, he was an obvious pain.
(00:52):
He was kind of dejected for the remainder of the game.
It's like, well, this is going to be significant, but
to have to have no Joe Burrow for the rest
of it, Like, the league is better when not just
Joe's playing, but just when we're talking to Joe, when
we're hearing Joe's thoughts about football, even the way he
handled his season ending Now news conference just highlighted how
(01:13):
great it is, how great of a communicator and a
person a football player he is, and it's just it sucks.
Speaker 3 (01:18):
It sucks.
Speaker 1 (01:19):
I was talking about it with Emmica, my wife, because
I was just leaving the house when this popped, and
we were saying the same sort of thing that you do.
Speaker 4 (01:27):
Forget that this whole league, this studio, this.
Speaker 1 (01:30):
Building, everything, like a lot of it is on the
backs of like ten quarterback and like if you whittle
a town, it's like six or seven, Like they do
really matter that much. They add so much to what
we do on a week to week basis, and it's
such a bummer. And maybe I'm just an optimist for
some reason, it didn't occur to me that he would
be out for the season. It's the same thing last
(01:51):
night when Dan broke the news to me mid podcast
and Mark Andrews out for the season. I was like, Oh,
I just I never think worst case scenarios, like that'll
be a high ankle, or that'll be something. And this
is rough because like most teams, the Bengals don't really
have a backup plan. We can get into that, but
I think we'll just start more on just the big
picture Bengals of it all. They're five and five this season,
(02:14):
they're zero and three to the division. They're one to
five in the conference. They had some issues that I
talked about with Dan last night. We don't defensively offensive
line in terms of their pass protection.
Speaker 4 (02:24):
We don't need to go too deep into it.
Speaker 1 (02:26):
It's hard to imagine them winning enough games to make
the playoffs this year. They play the Steelers, Jaguars, Colts, Vikings, Steelers, Chiefs, Browns,
All those teams are in the playoff race. I guess
I'm more interested looking at this team right now and
that like, can they be competitive in those games? Can
they win some of those games? Even if it's not
(02:48):
going anywhere? They now matter because they're improving all these
potential playoff teams as schedule. The Steelers are kind of
lucky here because they missed Joe Burrow to Times.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
Yeah, and ultimately because we saw and Trey Hendrickson really
gutted it out last night. He did come up with
a sack, but he was clearly playing hurt. And we
saw them go through that stretch right whereas Arizona, Seattle
and then San Francisco and lose defense played spectacularly, and
I guess that's something else we need to look ahead
to with regards to twenty twenty four, is if lou
(03:21):
Ana Roumo is not the head coach somewhere, because clearly,
like losing safeties that played ninety nine and ninety eight
percent of the snaps last year has an impact, Right,
you're you're not.
Speaker 1 (03:33):
Just sometimes the offseason narrative. Yah, yeah, it's true. I
thought it was overblown. Actually, I was like, they'll probably
be fine, and last night was a big change. Actually
they bench Nick Scotten from Yeah for the first time
in that game, and they're.
Speaker 2 (03:44):
Still kind of trying to ultimately figure things out there.
But it's so much easier to go in. And obviously
it is even dumb to say when oh, yeah, we
got Joe and Jamar and t and everything's, you know,
worst case scenario, we end up in a shootout and
it's it's not looking good like the rest of the way,
(04:04):
Like even even after because of the Colts and the Vikings,
it's like, where's the where's the spot, Like, where's where's
win six coming?
Speaker 1 (04:14):
I think they can be competitive and and I don't
want to get into a whole Zach Taylor thing. Me
and Dan have gone back and forth about him quite
a bit, and I do with my Bengals fans a
lot of them or are on my side that like, look,
if if you have a quality coach, you can maybe
survive the loss of even a franchise quarterback. We're seeing
what the Vikings are doing, for instance, right now, and
just that they would be competitive in these games. The
(04:35):
Steelers aren't some world beaters the Colts. We know what
the Vikings are dealing with that maybe they can pick
like a coach and a defense and all that talent
you said that's still there on offense can maybe pick
off a couple of these games, but it's gonna be tough.
Jake Browning played fairly well, I thought last night. You know,
we checked the PFF grades right before we started. He
(04:57):
got a sixty eight. That's pretty good, and that passed
the eye test that he didn't do too many things wrong.
He made a couple accurate throws, he kind of went
through his reads, and I was like, Okay, that was
better than the version I saw in the preseason when
he had one of the worst training camp battles. Because
they played the whole preseason because Burrow is hurt, and
I watched most of it for some reason, and him
(05:19):
and Simeon couldn't It couldn't have been worse, And I
don't know. It got very frustrated with these teams who
don't invest in backup quarterbacks and just weirdly don't seem
to take that position that seriously. Our friend Chase Daniel
was honking about it on Twitter, and I agree with him,
Like Teddy was just sitting out there for a while,
(05:40):
like these teams that have championship aspirations. I guess you're
not winning the championship with Teddy, but you can't tell
me that a playoff run wouldn't be a lot more
entertaining and be worth it for the fans paying money,
and be worth it for T Higgins and Tyler Boyd
in a contract. Y're like, like, the next seven weeks matters,
even if you're not gonna win a super Bowl, And
they got super cheap this offseason and a couple of
(06:02):
teams did that, and I just don't get it.
Speaker 3 (06:03):
It doesn't make any sense.
Speaker 2 (06:04):
I mean, the best possible explanation a few years ago was, well,
we don't want somebody to come in and the quarterback
lose the locker. The Carson Wentz backup situation, and it's
like you're worried about somebody's feelings. Like, if the feelings
are that much of a concern, maybe the quarterback's not
very good.
Speaker 4 (06:20):
Right, No one's worried about Joe Burrow's feelings. He can
handle it.
Speaker 3 (06:22):
Yeah, Joe will be fine. You've got to you gotta
invest at the position.
Speaker 2 (06:27):
And maybe this changes things for twenty twenty four, but
everybody's stuck now, Like Tommy DeVito is going to be
playing for the rest of the season because like there's
there's just no other than pulling somebody off the street.
Speaker 1 (06:40):
Well, Joe Flacco did work out for the Browns, right.
You know what's funny is I was thinking, like, is
are we in a world where the Bengals are like, damn,
they got to Flacco first, or there there's actually like
a betting war.
Speaker 3 (06:53):
Yeah, Joe Flacco sweepstakes.
Speaker 4 (06:55):
I mean maybe why not or Matt Ryan or someone.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
I mean part of it is there's just not enough
you know, proven quarterbacks in the NFL. But I just
think it's an under I don't know, underpaid position. It's
kind of crazy to me because like Jamis was available
for cheap. Andy Dalton was available for cheap, Baker was
available for cheap. Any of these championship level teams or
(07:20):
even playoff level teams could have just invested the five
six million dollars that it costs, and it's so worth
it because it's a weird sport where one position so
far outweighs every other position that it's like driving your
car without insurance. It just doesn't make any sense because yeah,
like Tom Brady could stay healthy for his entire career
(07:41):
except for that one year with Matt Castle, and yet
I was always supporting Bill Belichick taking Ryan Mallet and
Kevin O'Connell and Jacoby Brissett and Jimmy Garoppolo. He just
kept doing it like over and over because it totally
makes sense. That position so much more important. Why not
spend a second or a third on that instead of
spending the money on some cornerback that you're gonna cut.
Speaker 4 (08:02):
If you're Bill Belichick in year two.
Speaker 2 (08:04):
I just had a second theory. What if they don't
want to answer the questions about the backup?
Speaker 4 (08:08):
Is that's I think that's part of it.
Speaker 2 (08:09):
A two game skid, and then it's like, let's put
in Bailey's appy and like it literally never works, but
people are going to continue to ask.
Speaker 1 (08:16):
I think that's part of it. In Belichick was one
person that didn't care, but I just maybe.
Speaker 3 (08:20):
That's maybe that's why you put him in the final drive.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
My larger point was just like it, it doesn't make
any sense that that's not treated financially and draft pick
wise as important as you're starting off ball linebacker or
even your third edge rusher, whatever money you're picking, or just.
Speaker 2 (08:39):
Or just not unspent money, or just money that's there
that's available to spent, and right they just don't spend it.
Speaker 1 (08:45):
That That's just sort of a frustration I've long had,
and it's funny with this team in particular because I
listened to Paul Daner his podcast with the Athletic and
I read his stuff there and this was like story
number two behind the safeties all off season was why
don't why are backups so bad? Why aren't we investing
in backups? So it is a case of first guessing,
(09:07):
not second guessing.
Speaker 3 (09:09):
Greg, Where do you get all the time for all
these podcasts?
Speaker 1 (09:12):
You listen on one point five speed, you do a
lot of stuff around the house, You pick and choose
but I've sort of added the team podcast. It's it's good,
all right? What else should we talk about the Bengals?
They're done for the season. Let's look at the division.
I guess quickly the Steelers are just right in.
Speaker 3 (09:32):
A way of the zombie Steelers, right.
Speaker 4 (09:34):
I wouldn't call it.
Speaker 1 (09:35):
Luck because I think they've won these games and that
they have a good coaching staff that's figured out a
way to do it, and they've gotten a little luck
along the way.
Speaker 4 (09:42):
But it is crazy.
Speaker 1 (09:43):
They've been out gained every game in their six and
three and now in the last week they've seen both
Deshaun Watson and Joe Burrow leave the division. The Ravens
are a couple of games ahead, but they're in a
weird spot where they're eight and three and the Steelers
are six and three.
Speaker 4 (09:57):
That bothers me.
Speaker 1 (09:58):
I know it's only for four days, but like, what
are we doing here sport that there's an eight and
three and a six and three?
Speaker 4 (10:03):
It's that that bothers me.
Speaker 1 (10:04):
Do you think the Steelers now like they got two
games against the Browns, Like, do you think they were
a playoff team?
Speaker 3 (10:09):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (10:10):
I think the Steelers, Like why why wouldn't they be
other than the fact that the numbers that you mentioned,
I mean, you could also make the case that, like
Lamar and the Ravens were the best seven and three
team of all time before last night. Are considering the
way that things have gone statistically for them, it's so
hard to continue to win in the way that they have.
But while they keep doing it, Like who's to say,
(10:32):
because we looked back at last year's vikings and it's like, oh,
that was a fraud. Well, like here comes Kevin O'Connell again, right,
and so like I know it's cliche and it's like
wins and losses are all the matters, but like they
keep doing it, and they keep doing it in weird fashion.
Speaker 1 (10:48):
I keep I kept believing at some point they're actually
gonna play better. You know, the offense looked a whole
lot better. They actually are already since the buy. Kenny
Pickett hasn't been he's just kind of been like a
below average quarterback, but he's been a below average quarterback
that's not going to crush your team. And their offense
has been average to better than average because the running
(11:09):
games getting going. So I think they're gonna play better.
This is a big game this weekend. I'm actually picking
the Browns to win this game. A little tease for
NFL game debut. People should check that out. We're on
reruns throughout the weekend. Even if you don't hear this
right away, but I think we're five pm Pacific on Fridays.
We're on Sunday mornings before game day. Yeah, Saturdays, it's there.
Speaker 4 (11:29):
We'll do the picks.
Speaker 1 (11:30):
I think the brown like, the Browns are winners here too,
because they don't have that Bengals game coming up or
anything like that, or they do they finish the season
with the Bengals, so like that, there's a difference between
these two teams. The Bengals do not have a difference
making difference right now. You can say that they can
play better because of the personnel they have, but the
(11:50):
Browns of the best defense in the league.
Speaker 4 (11:52):
The Bengals are just there.
Speaker 3 (11:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (11:56):
It's depressing, man.
Speaker 1 (11:58):
It's like I think about the big picture of it
all too and we will wrap up soon.
Speaker 4 (12:02):
We got to get going.
Speaker 1 (12:04):
But I think back to that play in the Super Bowl,
the penalty on Logan Wilson, and then certainly what happened
with the last drive against the Rams. It's just so
hard to get back to that point, and that was
a coin flip game. I believe those two teams whereas
even a super Bowl as you'll see, and you feel
like you have all the time in the world. And
(12:25):
they're going to be very good, I think throughout the
Joe Burrow era, but this offseason they're going to be
a very different team in twenty twenty four than they
were in twenty twenty three. Here are some free agents
that the Bengals have. DJ Reider, their best interior defensive tackle.
What a great free agent signing right there with Trey Hendrickson.
Does he get another contract with the team. He's getting
(12:45):
a little older. Tyler Boyd is a free agent. T
Higgins is a freight free agent. That was part of
what made them special, these receivers all together. Jonah Williams,
who's played a ton of snaps for them and it
has been fine this year at right tackle, is.
Speaker 4 (12:59):
A free agent.
Speaker 1 (13:00):
Shaudobi a woozy who hasn't maybe played up to his
previous level coming off a series serious injury.
Speaker 4 (13:05):
He's a free agent.
Speaker 1 (13:06):
Those are as core of five, you know, starters as
you could find from this three year run. So it
just I just kind of wanted to circle how it's difficult.
You need a lot of things to go your way.
And Burrows had bad injury luck, the Bengals have had
some in general. And they're going to count on Duke
Tobin and partly Zach Taylor to come up with like
(13:27):
a new version of this Bengals team because they're not
going to be the same.
Speaker 2 (13:29):
And people may be tired of us talking about it,
but I always have to go back to it that
it's really hard to win that one game, right, It's
really hard. A lot of stuff has to happen, and
then you lose that game or you come up short
before that game, you never get a chance to play
in it. And we and we make the case about
the quality of people's entire careers based on the outcome
of that in a story.
Speaker 1 (13:46):
Or even last year, they were so close to being
in that game again, you kind of forget about that
as a heartbreaking loss, that Chiefs loss.
Speaker 4 (13:54):
They could have.
Speaker 1 (13:54):
Very easily been back in that Super Bowl and won it.
And there was nothing separating those two teams to me
really either. Just that day the Chiefs were three points better.
Speaker 2 (14:03):
Yeah, and then so like I'm looking at that list
of free agents and maybe it's Tyler Boyd, and Tyler
Boyd is the odd man out and he's somewhere else
and he's no longer around the Boyd Chase Higgins receiving
group with Burrow like it deserves to be remembered. And
because you know, because you know that there was an
incompletion to samaj pron you know, because there was a
(14:28):
hedge on on Aaron Donald, it didn't quite get there.
Like we have to say that this was group was
a failure, but we aren't a failure.
Speaker 4 (14:35):
We don't.
Speaker 3 (14:36):
Yeah, yeah, to hell with that.
Speaker 4 (14:38):
There weren't our own podcasts.
Speaker 1 (14:40):
We're the around the NFL podcast We are the thought
leaders Patrick.
Speaker 4 (14:44):
We don't have to say it.
Speaker 1 (14:48):
And but I might as well make predictions here reader
chance to come back Boyd, he's probably gone a Woozy,
probably gone T franchise tag if I had to guess,
but no guarantee. He's and Joan and Williams probably guns
or maybe actually they're the team that that does pay him.
So I think there's gonna be a lot of changing.
And you just feel you said it really well at
the top. You feel for Burrow personally. He's had a
(15:11):
few injuries now, He's had the a c L had
a knee sprain I believe late.
Speaker 4 (15:18):
In the twenty twenty one season.
Speaker 1 (15:22):
Nothing that that kept him out a long time until
this calf injury which bothered him. So he's just he's
just had bad breaks and you feel for him, you
feel for the whole organization and and even the smallest
bit for us because.
Speaker 4 (15:35):
We're gonna have like Jake Browning in primetime.
Speaker 3 (15:37):
And it's gonna be annoying.
Speaker 1 (15:40):
U let's wrap the show with more bad news, uh
Ian Rappaport as we are taping, this reported just kind
of the extent of the Mark Andrews injury, and uh,
I believe it's a fractured fibula along with the knee
or the let's see what it is, sorry cracked fibula
(16:02):
and the ankle ligament injuries. That it makes sense that
that he's out for the season, but that still is
disappointing because that's a really serious injury. When it's both
of those combined, like the broken in a situation like this,
you almost root for a broken leg because that's a
cleaner recovery and that's something he could be back working
(16:23):
pretty early in the offseason. But it makes sense that
they so quickly ruled him out for the year because
that that is a long time recovery, so he wish
wished the best for him too.
Speaker 3 (16:31):
Yeah, and possibly multiple surgeries.
Speaker 2 (16:33):
And you could see it in Lamar's reaction both on
the field and after the and after the game that
this will significantly impact the chances for Baltimore m because
there's plenty of times where Mark is the one, well.
Speaker 4 (16:46):
He's the most important one.
Speaker 3 (16:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:48):
I've been waiting for their passing attack to just be
a little more consistent, a little more on the same page.
I think we're seeing that with Odell and Bateman, who
were kind of the we know what we're getting out
as z A Flowers, I think the way they use
him makes sense. But those two guys, it's been better
and they still have more than enough I believe to
(17:09):
go on a Super Bowl run. But that is still
a major loss, and the AFC just feels different. The
Bills are no lock to make the playoffs, the Bengals
are no locked to make the playoffs. The Browns are
now playing with the backup, and it absolutely leaves more
room for Miami and a surprise team somewhere that we're
(17:31):
not even thinking about, whether it's the Chargers or the
Colts or heck, the Las Vegas Raiders. I'm not going
that far. I'm just saying it does open it. It
opens it up a little where if you look at
the who's going to make it as the seventh seed
and the sixth seed. Before I would have said, well,
you at least got to get to ten wins and
you might be looking at tie breakers there, and now
(17:52):
it's like, okay, ten wins maybe feels a little safer,
Maybe you don't need the type of who knows, maybe
nine to eight gets involved here because all these teams
are closer than they are apart, and with.
Speaker 3 (18:02):
So many common schedules.
Speaker 1 (18:03):
I think nine and eighttimly right, and like I feel
more confident today. Jacksonville and Houston both get in, for instance,
just because I actually thought they probably were good enough
to do so already, and now it's like you just
look at the picture, everything changes with the quarterback. It
is a bummer, but I'm glad, you know, we do
this game debut together, so that we were here to
(18:24):
be able to do this today and it didn't wait
till the Sunday.
Speaker 4 (18:27):
Yeah recap show.
Speaker 2 (18:28):
Yeah, let's let's do an emergency pod when something awesome
happens next time.
Speaker 4 (18:32):
That would that would be fun.
Speaker 1 (18:34):
Until then, we will be back on Sunday, we hope,
and we plan for Mark Sssler to be back there.
Get better, buddy, and until then, for Patrick Claibond
Speaker 4 (18:48):
Keep it ta
Host
Gregg Rosenthal
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