June 25, 2023 • 23 mins
Jules Long Beach invited us to meet a group of drag queens and their LGBTQ+ friends during their weekly dinner party. The Monday night gathering has been a ritual for more than 15 years. No subject was off-limits and some of the answers may surprise you.
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Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
Recently, the most controversial topic youwould never believe at our chosen family table
was definitely pronouns. What do youthink? Yeah? Yeah, did you
discuss and how did it result?One of our friends was like, hey,
my company wants me to put pronounson my name tag and I'm not
gonna do that. And I lookedat him dead in the face that I
(00:20):
said, what, like really,like of all people, like, why
do you care? And he's like, well, I mean I don't need
to put my pronouns on there.I'm like, well, we're dealing with
a member of the LGBTQ community.What is the disconnect here? And he
is a little bit older, ifif, if we don't get it,
(00:42):
And for me it was a momentof like, let's all talk about this
because if we don't get it inour house at our table, if we
don't understand the pronouns situation, thenof course who does And it's a learning
moment for me. It's it waswhen that happened. You know, I've
never about my pronouns. I spendhalf my life as a woman. I
(01:03):
spend half my life as a man. My public figure is a drag queen.
I use she her pronouns. ButI've never had to qualify that before
recently, what a couple of yearsago, you know, I've never had
to answer that question. And sotalk to one of our friends who was
like, I'm not putting them onit, and I really had to be
(01:23):
like, what is it to you? And the core of that discussion was
what are you losing by putting onyour pronouns? You know, were you
born a male, you'll live asa mail you want to be referred to
as he him? Why is thattaking anything away from you from putting that
on a name tag? Why isthat a hang up? So the question
(01:45):
to the table then about the pronounsconversation, What were your thoughts about that?
Well? I think it boils downto just basic human decency and respect.
You know, you don't want someonemisaddressing you, don't misaddress someone else,
(02:06):
and you know you there can bethe initial mistake in communication like oh,
you know, someone says mystery andsay oh, it's actually missus.
Cool, then move on like there'sno reason to get hung up on what
someone addresses them by, you know, unless they're claiming to be a doctor
and they're not a doctor. Otherwise, leave it alone, Leave it alone.
(02:27):
Just have some basic human respect anddecency for people, and if they
want to be addressed as such,addressed them as such. But it's also
understanding what each person wants to beaddressed as because growing up it was gayer
straight right now, don't don't confusegender with h you know, the sexual
it's sexually with gender, absolutely not. But it's still part of identity,
(02:51):
right, It's still part of identity, and it is still part of what
we experienced. You know, growingup, that was part of identity,
whether you were straight or you weregay, and now there's LGBTQ plus,
right, so there's all kinds ofdifferent types of identity. So you can't
and also you can't always assume speakingfor myself, not you, not you
personally communications communica say oh actually Igo by this right then? Cool?
(03:16):
Except that keep it moving absolutely,you know. But I think that's where
the confusion, I think gets thatthat creates a conversation because you know,
speaking of an older person who isin his fifties, who is like,
why do I need to do this? Because he didn't have to do that.
It's not about to honeymoon. No, No, I'm not talking about
me. I don't know, Yeah, I mean that for everyone, like,
(03:37):
like everyone's so like that's a bigproblem in this world right now.
Everyone so like self evolved, selfcentric, self absorbed. Uh, you
know, we could go on,like narcissism is a big problem right now.
Um, So it's not about you, it's about the other person and
you you respecting and spreading joy,right, So you know, I mean
(03:58):
if we're if we're wanting to getreligious, that's what it's all about,
right, It's it's it's spreading thatjoy, being that positive light for everybody
else, you know. So that'swhat I mean, right, And there's
also two can I there's also twosides to that. There's the person that
is looking for this this identity,right and this is what we're identifying ourselves
(04:19):
as. And there's also the aperson that is learning about this identity.
Right. And what I think alot of us have experienced in the last
couple of years me personally, issomeone's going to walk through the door and
you say you refer to them ashe, and now they're offended, and
it creates this kind of you know, uncomfortable situation. But they walk in,
(04:41):
they look masculine, right, Soyou're just going to assume that they're
he, and it's still a learningexperience, I think for everybody because until
you say that I identify as somethingelse, you don't know. So I
think it works on both sides ofthe coin, because you as a person
that needs to feel more valid byidentifying this this way, and also the
other person that's seen you from thephysical essence coming through that through that door,
(05:05):
you know, where they're a male, female, whatever else. So
now there's so many other identities.There's they, there's him, there's she,
There's so many different ones. SoI think people need to be a
little bit more mindful of Hi,I want to be identified as this.
So do you think it's incumbent uponthat person to make that pronouncement as soon
(05:27):
as they walk into a room.No. I think it's a little bit
of both both sides of the coin. People to be mindful and not assume
that this is their identity, andalso the person that's coming in through the
door that wants to be identified acertain way to be able to voice that
because I think you touched on something. I think part of the frustration is
that people are afraid of offending andthey don't want to step over that line,
(05:48):
so they opt either not saying anythingor they just step all over themselves.
But or they don't feel confident enoughto just say, you know,
I might look like a woman,but I don't identify as a woman.
You know, Like when you introduceyourself to somebody, you say what your
pronouns are, and then it kindof gives them the okay to say there.
(06:11):
So like if you're not sure,then I would just introduce myself.
My pronouns are a him, andthen let them introduce themselves. So walk
me through that. So, ifwe're meeting for the first time, what's
my what's my open pronouns are?He am okay, nice to meet you
with yours? What are my pronouns? Or what are my name your name
pronouns? So am I am?I obligated to give you my pronouns even
though I may not subscribe to that. No, I don't think so my
(06:35):
conversation starts up an invitation. Iguess you could. I was just saying,
like the older gays a lot oftimes, like in the nineties two
thousands, like the gay guys allused to refer to each other as girl,
Hey girl, you know what Imean. And now it's like,
we don't do that anymore. Solike their generation took the power out of
(06:57):
the pronouns and used them interchangeably,so it wasn't like an issue, and
now this generation wants to put allthe power back into the pronouns. So
it's things are changing and evolving thepronoun situation. Though I also feel it's
it's an issue within the gay communityor the lgbt QIA plus community. Mainstream
America is not concerned. I don'tthink they're concerned about this. I really
(07:23):
don't. But it's such a thingwithin our community that we want to be
referred to as you know, thepronoun that you choose. I don't think
my job does not have pronouns onour email signatures, but in the job
I do, lots of companies thatI deal with do have it, and
that's fine. You know, ifit's your choice to do that, go
(07:46):
ahead. I don't feel that everybodyshould be doing it if they don't want
to. Like, my name isa female name, you know, if
it's if it's a I disagree withthat completely, do you yes? And
this is kind of the point wehad the other night when we had a
conversation about do I put my pronounson my name tag? I disagree with
(08:07):
it, because the more of usthat put our pronouns out there, the
more people feel free to use theirpronouns. I just wondered what your thoughts
are with the school curriculum mission andpeople fighting about books and the types of
teachers and the types of curricula.I mean, I just wonder if they're
what your thoughts are on that isthis mister Melvoine versus missus Goldberg, that
(08:33):
whole Wendy. I think it wasschool board. The recent ones are like
Glendale School District where they got violentin the valley right near my house.
Satical Elementary School Elementary to Maciela justfired a superintendent. So when you see
those kinds of things happening, whatare your initial reactions? Okay, I
(08:56):
am a child. I grew upin the eighties, I graduated school in
the nineties. I was not toldanything about gay people growing up. I
am gay because that's how I wasborn. And these people that are protesting
in the curriculum in schools, it'sshowing the children that are gay that they
(09:18):
have a voice. And they havemeaning in life. I didn't have that
growing up. So when I wascoming into high school and getting bullied and
getting notes left on my car andyou know, threatening things, it wasn't
because I was learning from books inschool. So these parents that are worried
about these kids that are learning aboutyou know, they're not even learning anything
about being gay. They're learning aboutOh, there's different types of families.
(09:41):
Billy over here has a mom anda dad, and Jenny over here has
two moms or two dads, orI was a child of a single parent.
I absolutely agree. You won't learnabout gay anywhere. First in the
church, growing up Southern Baptist inSouth Carolina, I knew very very early
on that the sometime was wrong,something was very wrong or different different.
(10:07):
Yeah, absolutely, thank you,thank you, thank you. See that's
the self hate you get from thatkind of environment. That's a case in
point right there. Uh yeah,So they're teaching you that the world is
(10:28):
a wide spot. There are lotsof different people people. Yeah, I
grew up I learned that. Iwas very sure it was born and it
wasn't mid eighties two and there wereno gay kids around in school or nobody
safe enough to go out. Therewere, but yeah, my biology teacher
I remember, refused to teach Darwin'stheory of evolution because we needed to teach
(10:50):
christ And a kid did wear likea rainbow shirt one time, and I
think it said it'll only be kinkythe first time, which probably was an
appropriate price. He made him liketurn it inside out and like, you
know, so there were no gaykids that I knew of growing up in
high school at all. So therewas bullying and stuff, but we once
again to her point, like weweren't talking about anything gay, but there
(11:15):
it just makes you feel repressed andnot feel accepted. Or that's where you
have all like suicides and things thathappen because you're saving these kids by letting
them feel that, Okay, there'sother people like you, and you're valid
and you are different, but that'sokay, you know. Like that I
think is the message they're trying toteach in school, but and trying to
get rid of teachers that are gayor can't have like a picture of their
(11:39):
husband, you know, or whatever, like you're taking rights away. Why
can't a straight teacher have her husbandnext to her? But you know,
I definitely did not know any otherI didn't know any other gay people that
at least that I knew that theywere gay until I was twenty one.
(12:00):
Probably so Yeah. I also grewup in a very conservative Evangelical Christian community,
went to I was homeschooled, wentto Baptists, didn't really pay off.
I think the problem is religion.I'm going to say it. I
(12:20):
mean I was not raised religious.Um, I'm Jewish, and it was
not for me to be about Mitzvahed. I told my mom, I don't
want to be about Mitzvahed. Ido not believe in religion period, because
I think that within all different religions, if you want to have your beliefs,
(12:41):
I respect that you have your beliefs. But I think that the religious
beliefs are the problems that are inour community. It's where extremities are bred.
It's where people with extreme views getthose views from. Well. They
think more their religion is old history. Have died in the name of God
or religion than anything else than anythingelse throughout all the time. People's beliefs
(13:07):
are what have caused murderer's peoplen diereligion. They didn't die. It's not
like they fell over a religious rocketdie, you know, like they were
murdered in the name of God.You know, so counterpoint there. We
I grew up extremely religious. Inever had a television the home. I'd
never gone to a movie theater untilthe age of eighteen and out of the
(13:31):
house. And there was zero influencein my life about queer gay LGBTQ until
I heard it from the pulpit aboutyou're going to help. That's the only
time I ever heard it. However, when I came out of that environment
and I found gay churches, soI found queer communities that celebrate Christ in
(13:58):
a loving, compassionate way, thatuse the same Bible that you went to
as well, Sam, we wereat the same church. The right message
can't be done. I'm just saying, the main cause of murder throughout the
entire human civilization has been God.That was my whole point. But there
is there is a huge segment offabulous churches who are open and accepting and
(14:24):
welcoming. And you can use thatsame Bible to demonize groups, and you
can use the same Bible to lovegroups. You know, Christ is love.
I could quote you every chapter inverse with a Growing up with a
minister, father, and an extremereligion. However, it's all interpretation,
and so your interpretation that day,that year, that decade is how you
(14:50):
choose to spin it. So somepeople use religion to demonize marginalized groups,
and some people use it for theirown purposes. Don't think religion overall is
the problem. I think fear isthe problem, and fear comes from a
lack of knowledge or ignorance. Andwhen you know people in the LGBTQ community,
(15:11):
you erase the fear and it's somethingthat you know and embrace. Anyone
here have children, Yeah, soI am a very I'm a very lucky
co parent. My sister and Iraise a twelve year old child who is
(15:33):
absolutely fabulous, and she's in apublic school, an amazing public school with
very active parental participation, sometimes tooactive for my tastes, too early in
the morning. However, my opinionon school. You know, you go
(15:54):
into the library. All of thesebooks are done by professional librarians. There
is no librarian in an elementary schoolis putting a book in that is crazy,
extreme or offensive to the world.You know. The talking points is
they're putting porn in our school libraries, which is patently false. There might
(16:18):
be a book on sexual health oreducation somewhere in the higher grades available if
the child wants to check that bookout. But if you open your phone,
and every kid has a phone,you can pull up straight up porn
(16:38):
and guess what your school library doesnot have that. I think it's a
fake point. Yeah. One ofthe books they have a problem with is
a one sentence book. There's likeone sentence that pretty much just says it's
okay to have two dads, it'sokay to have two modems. And there's
a whole community losing their minds overit, absolutely losing their minds over a
(16:59):
one sentence book that just says it'sokay to have two dads too, lovel
If we're going if we're going tobanned books, it is a very slippery
soap. So if we're going tostart banning books, we're gonna follow history.
And every time of civilization bands knowledgeor books, it always goes wrong,
and so people are fighting a losingbattle and that's their last straw to
(17:23):
hold on too. And I findit hilarious that in this day and age,
when people don't even read books,that's what you're choosing to ban because
you just gave your child a smartphone. They can find out whatever they want
whenever they want, anytime they want, they can watch a video. You
banning a book that was approved bya librarian who is passionate about childhood education
(17:48):
and cares for your child because youwere at work and don't want to be
bothered is completely hypocritical. You saidit perfect You said it perfectly. So
my final question the next presidential election. Do you think that's going to set
(18:11):
the tone in the pace for yourcommunity. I do not agree that a
presidential election sets the pace for theLGBTQ community. I think that it creates
fear, anxiety, self loathing,and upset to have extreme Republicans dictate what
(18:34):
they feel the LGBTQ community should bedemonized of for the purposes of this election.
When it survey after survey shows themajority of Americans don't care. They're
using it as a wedge issue andthey're going to use it in this next
election as well. I think thecommunity needs to wake up. And I
(18:56):
mean I've voted every every elections sinceI was eighteen and I was able to
vote. I think that the communityat large does not vote. They feel
it their vote doesn't matter. I'mnot going to vote period. A conversation
with somebody in our community. There'splenty of people that I've spoken to.
They're like, my vote's not goingto mean anything. It's not going to
make a difference. But it's like, what's the big deal, Like you,
(19:19):
this is your right as an Americanwhen you turn eighteen, you're allowed
to vote. And well, wedon't also put enough emphasis on that in
high school, get the same importanceof voting. And you know, like
government econ in high school is ajoke. Let's be real. It's all
the easy a for for most highschool students. It's usually it is well,
(19:41):
I will tell you in most publiceducation, it's performed by a coach
who doesn't care. He's not therefor that. That's not the topic.
This is a southern South Carolina.Well South Carolina puts their coaches in.
Is that what you're saying. It'snot what happens to this. This is
(20:02):
like a stereotype. This is thisthing. This is very common because the
government econ is an easy a everybodyusually a code. We need to we
need to wake up as a communityin large and and get out there and
vote. You know, even ifyou feel like it's not going to make
a difference, it's going to makea difference if enough of you are not
(20:23):
voting, Okay enough, if yougo out and vote, Hey, you
know what, these numbers are goingto go up. It's not that hard.
And that's absolutely true. That's foryour life, that's your livelihood.
You know, you have a voice. Use it. And then if you
don't use it and you lose,well, you know what, guess what,
you didn't vote, So you can'tcomplain if you don't vote, You're
(20:45):
you're forfeiting. You're like, peopleare making decisions for your life, and
if you don't vote, you're justgiving them that power to do that,
like nearly really free will. Soelection, who's going to be sitting there?
See just evolving you much? Yes? Oh completely? I don't want
another Trump is going to be onhouse arrest and still be running. I'm
(21:10):
like, is this happening in ourcountry? Yes? And yeah for my
president, but I'd even be allowedto run is just insane. So what
are they what are they showing?What are they showing? What are they
showing the masses of people that arealready in that frame of mind, ethics
and moral matter, right, it'sscary to think that if if Trump does
(21:33):
get the nomination and he wins theelection and we have to go back again
for another four years of the Trumpera, it's going to be even worse.
It's going to be even worse becausethey're going to look back at the
last four years of Biden and say, ZEE told you so, America went
to garbage. I'm not going touse the word, but the global scale,
we're going to look like a trashcan. Okay, I don't I
(21:56):
don't know you're going to bleep itout, but I had to bleep that.
But like, if Trump gets inagain, you know, it's a
scary thought because he riles up thepeople that are so filled with hate.
And it's not just for our community. They're hatred of anyone that's not white,
heterosexual, straight, the same thingChristian mail, you know, and
(22:19):
that's that's not America. We're luckyto live in socale where there's everything.
But I mean, I grew uphere. But if I had come from
another state that was not like southernCalifornia, Like, it's a scary thought.
I don't know if I would havesurvived, you know. Here in
California, I was Yeah, Ihad my bullying and all that shit,
(22:40):
but I survived, and I meta community of people, you know,
in a small southern state that mightnot have happened. And that's the Trump
groups. Yes they're here in socale, but they're not as big as they
are in other states. And Ifeel that if he wins again, he's
going to rile up more people andget more hatred going, and it's going
to turn into you Nazi Germany.Let's be real. Well. On that
(23:03):
note, I can't thank you allenough for allowing us to come into your
Monday ritual. Appreciate it very much, and thank you for your thoughts and
your candidate conversations. Thank you.So he said, She Said? They
Said is a production of the KFINews Department for iHeartMedia, Los Angeles and
(23:23):
is produced by Steve Gregory and JacobGonzalez. The associate producer is Nick Paliocchini
and the field engineer is Tony Sarantino.
Recently, the most controversial topic youwould never believe at our chosen family table
was definitely pronouns. What do youthink? Yeah? Yeah, did you
discuss and how did it result?One of our friends was like, hey,
my company wants me to put pronounson my name tag and I'm not
gonna do that. And I lookedat him dead in the face that I
(00:20):
said, what, like really,like of all people, like, why
do you care? And he's like, well, I mean I don't need
to put my pronouns on there.I'm like, well, we're dealing with
a member of the LGBTQ community.What is the disconnect here? And he
is a little bit older, ifif, if we don't get it,
(00:42):
And for me it was a momentof like, let's all talk about this
because if we don't get it inour house at our table, if we
don't understand the pronouns situation, thenof course who does And it's a learning
moment for me. It's it waswhen that happened. You know, I've
never about my pronouns. I spendhalf my life as a woman. I
(01:03):
spend half my life as a man. My public figure is a drag queen.
I use she her pronouns. ButI've never had to qualify that before
recently, what a couple of yearsago, you know, I've never had
to answer that question. And sotalk to one of our friends who was
like, I'm not putting them onit, and I really had to be
(01:23):
like, what is it to you? And the core of that discussion was
what are you losing by putting onyour pronouns? You know, were you
born a male, you'll live asa mail you want to be referred to
as he him? Why is thattaking anything away from you from putting that
on a name tag? Why isthat a hang up? So the question
(01:45):
to the table then about the pronounsconversation, What were your thoughts about that?
Well? I think it boils downto just basic human decency and respect.
You know, you don't want someonemisaddressing you, don't misaddress someone else,
(02:06):
and you know you there can bethe initial mistake in communication like oh,
you know, someone says mystery andsay oh, it's actually missus.
Cool, then move on like there'sno reason to get hung up on what
someone addresses them by, you know, unless they're claiming to be a doctor
and they're not a doctor. Otherwise, leave it alone, Leave it alone.
(02:27):
Just have some basic human respect anddecency for people, and if they
want to be addressed as such,addressed them as such. But it's also
understanding what each person wants to beaddressed as because growing up it was gayer
straight right now, don't don't confusegender with h you know, the sexual
it's sexually with gender, absolutely not. But it's still part of identity,
(02:51):
right, It's still part of identity, and it is still part of what
we experienced. You know, growingup, that was part of identity,
whether you were straight or you weregay, and now there's LGBTQ plus,
right, so there's all kinds ofdifferent types of identity. So you can't
and also you can't always assume speakingfor myself, not you, not you
personally communications communica say oh actually Igo by this right then? Cool?
(03:16):
Except that keep it moving absolutely,you know. But I think that's where
the confusion, I think gets thatthat creates a conversation because you know,
speaking of an older person who isin his fifties, who is like,
why do I need to do this? Because he didn't have to do that.
It's not about to honeymoon. No, No, I'm not talking about
me. I don't know, Yeah, I mean that for everyone, like,
(03:37):
like everyone's so like that's a bigproblem in this world right now.
Everyone so like self evolved, selfcentric, self absorbed. Uh, you
know, we could go on,like narcissism is a big problem right now.
Um, So it's not about you, it's about the other person and
you you respecting and spreading joy,right, So you know, I mean
(03:58):
if we're if we're wanting to getreligious, that's what it's all about,
right, It's it's it's spreading thatjoy, being that positive light for everybody
else, you know. So that'swhat I mean, right, And there's
also two can I there's also twosides to that. There's the person that
is looking for this this identity,right and this is what we're identifying ourselves
(04:19):
as. And there's also the aperson that is learning about this identity.
Right. And what I think alot of us have experienced in the last
couple of years me personally, issomeone's going to walk through the door and
you say you refer to them ashe, and now they're offended, and
it creates this kind of you know, uncomfortable situation. But they walk in,
(04:41):
they look masculine, right, Soyou're just going to assume that they're
he, and it's still a learningexperience, I think for everybody because until
you say that I identify as somethingelse, you don't know. So I
think it works on both sides ofthe coin, because you as a person
that needs to feel more valid byidentifying this this way, and also the
other person that's seen you from thephysical essence coming through that through that door,
(05:05):
you know, where they're a male, female, whatever else. So
now there's so many other identities.There's they, there's him, there's she,
There's so many different ones. SoI think people need to be a
little bit more mindful of Hi,I want to be identified as this.
So do you think it's incumbent uponthat person to make that pronouncement as soon
(05:27):
as they walk into a room.No. I think it's a little bit
of both both sides of the coin. People to be mindful and not assume
that this is their identity, andalso the person that's coming in through the
door that wants to be identified acertain way to be able to voice that
because I think you touched on something. I think part of the frustration is
that people are afraid of offending andthey don't want to step over that line,
(05:48):
so they opt either not saying anythingor they just step all over themselves.
But or they don't feel confident enoughto just say, you know,
I might look like a woman,but I don't identify as a woman.
You know, Like when you introduceyourself to somebody, you say what your
pronouns are, and then it kindof gives them the okay to say there.
(06:11):
So like if you're not sure,then I would just introduce myself.
My pronouns are a him, andthen let them introduce themselves. So walk
me through that. So, ifwe're meeting for the first time, what's
my what's my open pronouns are?He am okay, nice to meet you
with yours? What are my pronouns? Or what are my name your name
pronouns? So am I am?I obligated to give you my pronouns even
though I may not subscribe to that. No, I don't think so my
(06:35):
conversation starts up an invitation. Iguess you could. I was just saying,
like the older gays a lot oftimes, like in the nineties two
thousands, like the gay guys allused to refer to each other as girl,
Hey girl, you know what Imean. And now it's like,
we don't do that anymore. Solike their generation took the power out of
(06:57):
the pronouns and used them interchangeably,so it wasn't like an issue, and
now this generation wants to put allthe power back into the pronouns. So
it's things are changing and evolving thepronoun situation. Though I also feel it's
it's an issue within the gay communityor the lgbt QIA plus community. Mainstream
America is not concerned. I don'tthink they're concerned about this. I really
(07:23):
don't. But it's such a thingwithin our community that we want to be
referred to as you know, thepronoun that you choose. I don't think
my job does not have pronouns onour email signatures, but in the job
I do, lots of companies thatI deal with do have it, and
that's fine. You know, ifit's your choice to do that, go
(07:46):
ahead. I don't feel that everybodyshould be doing it if they don't want
to. Like, my name isa female name, you know, if
it's if it's a I disagree withthat completely, do you yes? And
this is kind of the point wehad the other night when we had a
conversation about do I put my pronounson my name tag? I disagree with
(08:07):
it, because the more of usthat put our pronouns out there, the
more people feel free to use theirpronouns. I just wondered what your thoughts
are with the school curriculum mission andpeople fighting about books and the types of
teachers and the types of curricula.I mean, I just wonder if they're
what your thoughts are on that isthis mister Melvoine versus missus Goldberg, that
(08:33):
whole Wendy. I think it wasschool board. The recent ones are like
Glendale School District where they got violentin the valley right near my house.
Satical Elementary School Elementary to Maciela justfired a superintendent. So when you see
those kinds of things happening, whatare your initial reactions? Okay, I
(08:56):
am a child. I grew upin the eighties, I graduated school in
the nineties. I was not toldanything about gay people growing up. I
am gay because that's how I wasborn. And these people that are protesting
in the curriculum in schools, it'sshowing the children that are gay that they
(09:18):
have a voice. And they havemeaning in life. I didn't have that
growing up. So when I wascoming into high school and getting bullied and
getting notes left on my car andyou know, threatening things, it wasn't
because I was learning from books inschool. So these parents that are worried
about these kids that are learning aboutyou know, they're not even learning anything
about being gay. They're learning aboutOh, there's different types of families.
(09:41):
Billy over here has a mom anda dad, and Jenny over here has
two moms or two dads, orI was a child of a single parent.
I absolutely agree. You won't learnabout gay anywhere. First in the
church, growing up Southern Baptist inSouth Carolina, I knew very very early
on that the sometime was wrong,something was very wrong or different different.
(10:07):
Yeah, absolutely, thank you,thank you, thank you. See that's
the self hate you get from thatkind of environment. That's a case in
point right there. Uh yeah,So they're teaching you that the world is
(10:28):
a wide spot. There are lotsof different people people. Yeah, I
grew up I learned that. Iwas very sure it was born and it
wasn't mid eighties two and there wereno gay kids around in school or nobody
safe enough to go out. Therewere, but yeah, my biology teacher
I remember, refused to teach Darwin'stheory of evolution because we needed to teach
(10:50):
christ And a kid did wear likea rainbow shirt one time, and I
think it said it'll only be kinkythe first time, which probably was an
appropriate price. He made him liketurn it inside out and like, you
know, so there were no gaykids that I knew of growing up in
high school at all. So therewas bullying and stuff, but we once
again to her point, like weweren't talking about anything gay, but there
(11:15):
it just makes you feel repressed andnot feel accepted. Or that's where you
have all like suicides and things thathappen because you're saving these kids by letting
them feel that, Okay, there'sother people like you, and you're valid
and you are different, but that'sokay, you know. Like that I
think is the message they're trying toteach in school, but and trying to
get rid of teachers that are gayor can't have like a picture of their
(11:39):
husband, you know, or whatever, like you're taking rights away. Why
can't a straight teacher have her husbandnext to her? But you know,
I definitely did not know any otherI didn't know any other gay people that
at least that I knew that theywere gay until I was twenty one.
(12:00):
Probably so Yeah. I also grewup in a very conservative Evangelical Christian community,
went to I was homeschooled, wentto Baptists, didn't really pay off.
I think the problem is religion.I'm going to say it. I
(12:20):
mean I was not raised religious.Um, I'm Jewish, and it was
not for me to be about Mitzvahed. I told my mom, I don't
want to be about Mitzvahed. Ido not believe in religion period, because
I think that within all different religions, if you want to have your beliefs,
(12:41):
I respect that you have your beliefs. But I think that the religious
beliefs are the problems that are inour community. It's where extremities are bred.
It's where people with extreme views getthose views from. Well. They
think more their religion is old history. Have died in the name of God
or religion than anything else than anythingelse throughout all the time. People's beliefs
(13:07):
are what have caused murderer's peoplen diereligion. They didn't die. It's not
like they fell over a religious rocketdie, you know, like they were
murdered in the name of God.You know, so counterpoint there. We
I grew up extremely religious. Inever had a television the home. I'd
never gone to a movie theater untilthe age of eighteen and out of the
(13:31):
house. And there was zero influencein my life about queer gay LGBTQ until
I heard it from the pulpit aboutyou're going to help. That's the only
time I ever heard it. However, when I came out of that environment
and I found gay churches, soI found queer communities that celebrate Christ in
(13:58):
a loving, compassionate way, thatuse the same Bible that you went to
as well, Sam, we wereat the same church. The right message
can't be done. I'm just saying, the main cause of murder throughout the
entire human civilization has been God.That was my whole point. But there
is there is a huge segment offabulous churches who are open and accepting and
(14:24):
welcoming. And you can use thatsame Bible to demonize groups, and you
can use the same Bible to lovegroups. You know, Christ is love.
I could quote you every chapter inverse with a Growing up with a
minister, father, and an extremereligion. However, it's all interpretation,
and so your interpretation that day,that year, that decade is how you
(14:50):
choose to spin it. So somepeople use religion to demonize marginalized groups,
and some people use it for theirown purposes. Don't think religion overall is
the problem. I think fear isthe problem, and fear comes from a
lack of knowledge or ignorance. Andwhen you know people in the LGBTQ community,
(15:11):
you erase the fear and it's somethingthat you know and embrace. Anyone
here have children, Yeah, soI am a very I'm a very lucky
co parent. My sister and Iraise a twelve year old child who is
(15:33):
absolutely fabulous, and she's in apublic school, an amazing public school with
very active parental participation, sometimes tooactive for my tastes, too early in
the morning. However, my opinionon school. You know, you go
(15:54):
into the library. All of thesebooks are done by professional librarians. There
is no librarian in an elementary schoolis putting a book in that is crazy,
extreme or offensive to the world.You know. The talking points is
they're putting porn in our school libraries, which is patently false. There might
(16:18):
be a book on sexual health oreducation somewhere in the higher grades available if
the child wants to check that bookout. But if you open your phone,
and every kid has a phone,you can pull up straight up porn
(16:38):
and guess what your school library doesnot have that. I think it's a
fake point. Yeah. One ofthe books they have a problem with is
a one sentence book. There's likeone sentence that pretty much just says it's
okay to have two dads, it'sokay to have two modems. And there's
a whole community losing their minds overit, absolutely losing their minds over a
(16:59):
one sentence book that just says it'sokay to have two dads too, lovel
If we're going if we're going tobanned books, it is a very slippery
soap. So if we're going tostart banning books, we're gonna follow history.
And every time of civilization bands knowledgeor books, it always goes wrong,
and so people are fighting a losingbattle and that's their last straw to
(17:23):
hold on too. And I findit hilarious that in this day and age,
when people don't even read books,that's what you're choosing to ban because
you just gave your child a smartphone. They can find out whatever they want
whenever they want, anytime they want, they can watch a video. You
banning a book that was approved bya librarian who is passionate about childhood education
(17:48):
and cares for your child because youwere at work and don't want to be
bothered is completely hypocritical. You saidit perfect You said it perfectly. So
my final question the next presidential election. Do you think that's going to set
(18:11):
the tone in the pace for yourcommunity. I do not agree that a
presidential election sets the pace for theLGBTQ community. I think that it creates
fear, anxiety, self loathing,and upset to have extreme Republicans dictate what
(18:34):
they feel the LGBTQ community should bedemonized of for the purposes of this election.
When it survey after survey shows themajority of Americans don't care. They're
using it as a wedge issue andthey're going to use it in this next
election as well. I think thecommunity needs to wake up. And I
(18:56):
mean I've voted every every elections sinceI was eighteen and I was able to
vote. I think that the communityat large does not vote. They feel
it their vote doesn't matter. I'mnot going to vote period. A conversation
with somebody in our community. There'splenty of people that I've spoken to.
They're like, my vote's not goingto mean anything. It's not going to
make a difference. But it's like, what's the big deal, Like you,
(19:19):
this is your right as an Americanwhen you turn eighteen, you're allowed
to vote. And well, wedon't also put enough emphasis on that in
high school, get the same importanceof voting. And you know, like
government econ in high school is ajoke. Let's be real. It's all
the easy a for for most highschool students. It's usually it is well,
(19:41):
I will tell you in most publiceducation, it's performed by a coach
who doesn't care. He's not therefor that. That's not the topic.
This is a southern South Carolina.Well South Carolina puts their coaches in.
Is that what you're saying. It'snot what happens to this. This is
(20:02):
like a stereotype. This is thisthing. This is very common because the
government econ is an easy a everybodyusually a code. We need to we
need to wake up as a communityin large and and get out there and
vote. You know, even ifyou feel like it's not going to make
a difference, it's going to makea difference if enough of you are not
(20:23):
voting, Okay enough, if yougo out and vote, Hey, you
know what, these numbers are goingto go up. It's not that hard.
And that's absolutely true. That's foryour life, that's your livelihood.
You know, you have a voice. Use it. And then if you
don't use it and you lose,well, you know what, guess what,
you didn't vote, So you can'tcomplain if you don't vote, You're
(20:45):
you're forfeiting. You're like, peopleare making decisions for your life, and
if you don't vote, you're justgiving them that power to do that,
like nearly really free will. Soelection, who's going to be sitting there?
See just evolving you much? Yes? Oh completely? I don't want
another Trump is going to be onhouse arrest and still be running. I'm
(21:10):
like, is this happening in ourcountry? Yes? And yeah for my
president, but I'd even be allowedto run is just insane. So what
are they what are they showing?What are they showing? What are they
showing the masses of people that arealready in that frame of mind, ethics
and moral matter, right, it'sscary to think that if if Trump does
(21:33):
get the nomination and he wins theelection and we have to go back again
for another four years of the Trumpera, it's going to be even worse.
It's going to be even worse becausethey're going to look back at the
last four years of Biden and say, ZEE told you so, America went
to garbage. I'm not going touse the word, but the global scale,
we're going to look like a trashcan. Okay, I don't I
(21:56):
don't know you're going to bleep itout, but I had to bleep that.
But like, if Trump gets inagain, you know, it's a
scary thought because he riles up thepeople that are so filled with hate.
And it's not just for our community. They're hatred of anyone that's not white,
heterosexual, straight, the same thingChristian mail, you know, and
(22:19):
that's that's not America. We're luckyto live in socale where there's everything.
But I mean, I grew uphere. But if I had come from
another state that was not like southernCalifornia, Like, it's a scary thought.
I don't know if I would havesurvived, you know. Here in
California, I was Yeah, Ihad my bullying and all that shit,
(22:40):
but I survived, and I meta community of people, you know,
in a small southern state that mightnot have happened. And that's the Trump
groups. Yes they're here in socale, but they're not as big as they
are in other states. And Ifeel that if he wins again, he's
going to rile up more people andget more hatred going, and it's going
to turn into you Nazi Germany.Let's be real. Well. On that
(23:03):
note, I can't thank you allenough for allowing us to come into your
Monday ritual. Appreciate it very much, and thank you for your thoughts and
your candidate conversations. Thank you.So he said, She Said? They
Said is a production of the KFINews Department for iHeartMedia, Los Angeles and
(23:23):
is produced by Steve Gregory and JacobGonzalez. The associate producer is Nick Paliocchini
and the field engineer is Tony Sarantino.
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