March 17, 2023 • 25 mins
Hailey Bieber was caught doing the glazed donut lip trend and Allure Magazine credited HER with the trend. Is this a case of appropriation? When does it go to Rachel Dolezal levels of too far?
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Speaker 1 (00:04):
I'm a honey German. My parents are Dominican. I was
born and raised in New York City. I love sneakers
and I'm a body positive advocate. I'm Carolina Bermudez, but
I was born and raised in Ohio. I'm a wife,
a mama, and a worker being. This is life in Spanglish, Carolina. Yes, baby,
I have been on fire TikTok. All of a sudden,
(00:28):
I'm seeing things that are quote unquote trends. I'm like,
this isn't not a trend. Oh? Is this the article
that you sent me? Yep? Okay, so this is all
over TikTok, which, by the way, you know that I
am not all over TikTok. So you have to like
tell me more about this because I have an opinion
about the culture vultures that everybody's talking about. So let's
talk about Hayley Beaver, right, brownie glazed lips? Right? Oh
(00:52):
the don't what was she doing that? But that everybody
was saying those are like chola lips or something. Yes, exactly.
It's like, Okay, all of a sudden, everybody's going crazy
new trend, new trend, new trend. I'm like, bitch, this
is not a new trend, like when we're talking you know,
darker lip right. And by the way, I'm saying that
affectionately only because my experience was that my family, a
lot of them grew up in San Francisco, so you know,
(01:14):
gang banging and all of that. That was like really
prominent in the eighties and the nineties in San Francisco,
and so they would always say, like my would say,
you know, you know, like that's yeah, no, And even
here in New York it was a thing back in
the nineties. We would use brown eyeliner as a lip line, right,
like that was a thing that belonged to us. You know,
(01:36):
black and brown women have been doing this for years.
Oh so then Haley Beavers doing this now and people
are saying, that's what the that's where I'm and they're
saying it together. She like she created that. Oh no,
get out of here. Yeah exactly. Now everybody's going crazy,
you know, Cosmo, it's like, get Haley Beavers, you know,
brownie glazed the lips, like the fucker. We have been
(01:56):
doing this as latinas forever. But that brought me to
the whole you know, cultural vulture. Yes, you know, and
you know, just appropriation. This happened a while back when
Gwen Stefani. I think she was talking about her time
when she had Remember she had the hero Juku girls. Yes,
when she had her one album that came out and
they went everywhere with it. They were like her minions,
(02:17):
but they weren't allowed to talk. Okay, that's why I
said the word mini. They'll use like a million people
behind her. But yeah, and then she recently, and this
is months ago, she said that she is part Japanese,
which I think really offended an upset And are you serious?
I think that yeah, well, okay, yes, so maybe she's transcultural.
I don't know. But my whole thing's like, I have
(02:41):
a real issue with this only because are we not
allowing people to appreciate other cultures because we are so
ready to attack them for trying to take what's ours?
Or is it that we've been gate keeping things for
so long? Because like this even happened with a hair product.
I think the main problem we have is when things
(03:02):
that are created by us and that belonged to us
is taken, let's say, by a celebrity, and then they're
attributed for creating something that you know, what's part of
is part of our culture for decades. That's where I
have the problem, Like, don't say Hayley Beaver started this
trend with these lips when she obviously took it from
a whole subculture. Well, I think that's her responsibility though
(03:26):
to say, like, oh, I was inspired by whoever she
got it from whatever, you know, even if it was
like an editorial thing, or if it was an old
picture of j exactly. It could be Jenny Riba, you
know when she first started, could be anywhere. But a
lot of people aren't into giving credit. A lot of
people are into stealing stealing it, And that's where I
(03:47):
feel like there's a big issue. I feel. I think
that with anything anymore, you have to credit everybody. I
can't even post a picture of a celebrity on my
Instagram without having to credit Getty Images. Oh yeah, our
image or whoever the photographers are. Because you're afraid of
getting suited. Everybody wants to sue everybody. Well that that's
a big fact. That is a big, big fact, Like
(04:08):
everybody wants to get paid. But you know, I don't
know when it comes to beauty and trends, like Latina
as we started, so much stuff, so many things. You know,
When Raquel Welch passed away, I was just a floored
because I remember thinking to myself, like, I grew up
and by the way, Raquel Welch was Latina, but she
(04:29):
didn't really embrace that until later on in her career,
which a lot of people talked about. She was always
looked at as like a sex bombshell, like sexy woman,
Yeah exactly, And so I looked back on her and
I was like, what a classic beauty, And I thought
that there were so many beautiful things about her. There
are so many beautiful, wonderful things about us as Latinas.
And I'm not talking about just the ones that are
(04:50):
made for TV or the movies, you know. I think
that just like if you look at your theas or
your cousins, they're gorgeous in their own right, and we
all have our own thing. My concern is, for example,
I love hip hop, I love rap music. I grew
up in a small town in Ohio where you were
(05:10):
either white or you were black, and I went more
toward my African American friends. I mean, yes, I had
my white friends too, but because of the exposure to
the music and what I learned from them, I grew
up appreciating it. Now I have two little white children
who love to reference Biggie or to POC or jay Z,
(05:35):
and I don't want them to be accused of cultural
appropriation or being culture vultures because they truly enjoy that
because they've been raised with it. Do you see what
I'm saying. So that's where I feel like there's a
fine line here. There definitely is, especially with music. I
don't think loving hip hop makes you a culture vulture.
You know, we have people like let's say Jack Harlowe.
(05:57):
He's a dope as rapper. He's a white man, he
is a dopest rap, but he's a spit of Nobody
can deny him that he is part of the culture. Right,
But but why does he get a pass? And why
does Eminem get a pass? And why did Justin Timberlake
get a pass? And what do they call it? Like
Blue Eyed Soul? Right, Robin Thick got a pass. So
these are all just things that I think about because,
like whether it's beauty, trends, music, film, I think that
(06:22):
we're really walking a fine line of not being able
to appreciate and learn about other cultures. Honey, there's a
picture of me on my dining room set as a
six year old little girl. My mom and dad came
back from San Francisco. They went to Chinatown. They bought
me a little dress. My mom had my hair in
(06:43):
Little Transas, you know, and they and they basically dressed
me in this, you know, beautiful outfit that was. I
don't know if it was China. I don't want to
say I was China. My assumption is Chinese. Okay. I
worry about a picture like that because people will, oh,
my gosh, like if you shared that right now, it
was just like I would be open for targeting. It
(07:06):
was like, you really think it's okay for you to
share this exactly. But meanwhile, my parents love Chinatown in
San Francisco. They wanted to bring me back a cosita,
that's what they used to call it, like a little gift.
And now I look at that, and the weird part
is that with everything, you have to think about, how
is this going to come up, how's it gonna be received,
how's it gonna be received by everybody? And so that's
(07:28):
where it got me thinking, like, here's a white woman
Gwen Stefani, highly successful music television married to a country star.
No no, no no. She comes out and says that like
she appreciated the Japanese culture, but then she qualified it
by saying, oh, well, I'm part Japanese. Like I almost
feel like she was pressured to say something I would
(07:48):
never I would never and she like, Hilaria, Oh my gosh. Okay.
That's another That's that's hard. That is a difficult discussion
for me, because I feel like Ilaia Baldwin has a
genuine appreciation for the Spanish culture, and I think she
got carried away, very very carried away. You can't, yo,
(08:10):
you can't just you can't just make believe you're something
Like you can appreciate something, but you can't just be
like okay, and from now on, I'm gonna make believe
right there, case in point, that is what cultural appropriation is, right,
And so that's where we're explaining it to people, and
we're saying, like, there are even people who say you're
not Latina enough to claim Look at what the criticism
(08:33):
that Jlo has gotten throughout her career because she can't
speak Spanish. I saw a meme and it was just
like Jlo smiling. While she doesn't understand anything bad, Bunny
is saying, I'm like, yo, yah, people are horrible when
they were Yes, she probably didn't, but it's okay, you know,
But that's what I'm saying. It's exactly like, let her
be who she is. Is who she is. She was
(08:55):
raised in the Bronx in New York. She's a She's
a motherfucking bodiquo. That's it, whether you like it or not.
And she can claim it, you know. But like, that's
where I'm very conflicted with this topic, because there are
certain places and certain things that I want to see
and that I want to enjoy in my life. For example,
we have a I have a very dear friend who
(09:17):
recently went to Morocco, And did you go to Morocco?
I have not, but I need to. She said it
was a life changing trip for her. Okay. In her
picture she's wearing um and I don't know what to
call them, not a job because it was just basically
a scarf over her yeah, like a scarf over her head.
And I said, I was like, oh my gosh, you
(09:37):
look gorgeous. You know what she said to me, She goes,
I loved how I felt I was wearing a klf tan,
I was wearing a beautiful veil on my head. She goes,
I wouldn't dare do that in New York because people
would accuse me of, you know, stealing somebody else's culture.
And I thought about it. I'm like, but like, what
is wrong with you loving that and loving the way
(09:58):
that you feel in that. I almost feel like it's
an honor. I do see both sides, and I'm playing
Devil's advocate right now simply for the discussion. It is beautiful.
But when I see photos like that, because I do
have friends and that travel, I kind of like feel away.
One of my brothers went to Dubai and then he
(10:19):
like dressed up like I guess someone from Dubai, and
I just found it strange. I'm like, why are you
wearing that right now? And then he like posed with
somebody with similar clothes, and I don't know, to me
it was just not cultural appropriation, but he found it
like amusing, and to me it was offensive. Oh okay,
So then like maybe it is the attitude in which
you're because like clearly you don't want to ridicule another culture,
(10:43):
Like it was just the whole thinking this is so
cool for Instagram flexing, for the grant, it was just
kind of like weird, it's so different, right, but like,
but for example, when my friend brought this up, I
said to her, I was like, you need to rock
because she said, she's like, I got the most beautiful
calf dancer and she must have looked absolutely at least stunning.
If it's okay, let's say you're going to a temple.
It is required, it's required to you. You are paying homage,
(11:06):
you are respecting the culture, the tradition, You're going by
the norms that it are required from you. Then why
can't I bring that back to the United States? If
I'm going to a temple and where did you go?
You went to Thailand and you loved it. Yeah, I
went to Thailand. I loved it. And you had to
cover yourself up. Yeah you had to take off your shoes.
Of course. If you were feeling yourself and you loved
(11:27):
it and you came back to New York, why why
should you not be allowed to wear that? I think
I don't know, it's like a maybe it's a transparency
thing because I don't know why my mind keeps going
back to the number one stunna when it comes to
the cultural appropriation. Rachel Dola's all, Oh geez, I thought
you were talking about big timers. I was like, the
(11:48):
number one stunna up, No girl, I wouldn't been bringing
it back, not no baby. But Rachel Dola's out, which
remind everybody about who she is because some people may
not remember her, you will once she starts to Yeah,
Rachel Dola's all. You know, she was the president of
the naacp up in Spokane, and she was a white
(12:08):
woman who considered herself I guess trans um transracial, that's
what that's the word that she used, that transracial. Yeah,
and she lived her life as a black woman and
she still continues to do so, you know, if you
want to learn more about her, she has a great
Netflix documentary. And it's weird because I was always like,
(12:29):
oh my gosh, she's horrible. She's a horrible person who
makes believe they're a black woman and who takes jobs
away from from a you know, another black woman when
they're you know, secret. I mean, so I was just
kind of and then but wait, wait, wait, I don't
want you to lose you, but can I please say something. Yeah,
you are lying and you are the head of the NAP.
(12:50):
Have a huge problem with that is next level. I
have a huge problem with that. That is next level.
Like deceitfulness not okay under any circumstances, like loving a culture,
loving a tradition, perfectly fine. And you know what's crazy
about Rachel Dolas all that she was doing amazing things
(13:13):
for the black community. She was doing things that I
wasn't doing and maybe my black friends weren't doing. But
the deceit of passing yourself off as a different race,
that's where the problems lies. Whole other like cant of worms.
Because also that's psychological, im and I'm no psychiatrist. Definitely,
(13:33):
she's definitely it's it's it's something in her head. There
has to be some type of a personality disorder or
something or you know what I mean. I don't know
what it is. That's why I said I'm not a
clinical dollar. She says that she's always felt you know,
her parents, she's white parents, and they adopted black children,
and then she started helping raise the black children, and
she said she started becoming more knowledgeable and educated in
(13:58):
black culture. Okay, but you can still be in own person.
We literally just talked about this, right. I wasn't raised
with black brothers and sisters, but I had very dear
black friends. But I still remained who I am, And
I think that's the beauty of it, right, Like, I
think that that's where, well, like, look, we even get
down to look at the Kardashians, how vilified they have
(14:21):
been by women who wear braids. I have to be honest,
I've always had princes. When I was a little girl,
my mom used to always put braids in my hair,
and they might be different types of braids. But why
is it okay for some people to do it? Is
because there are Armenian they shouldn't be allowed to do it.
(14:42):
That is where I feel like we are really crossing
this literal definition of what a culture vulture really is.
I guess if you steal, if you pick and then
you pass off as your own, that's what I equate
with being a culture vulture. Stealing, not paying homage, not acknowledging,
(15:03):
not saying I got this from this culture or from
this lifestyle. I think that's what the problem comes in
for me. Right, It's not even the usage of it,
of the music of the fashion because you can't control
like hip hop is. It's not music, it's the culture.
And if you're part of the culture, whether you're Asian,
whether you're Latino, whether you're white, if you're part of
the culture, hip hop comes with fashion, it comes with music,
(15:26):
it comes with terms, it comes with hairstyles, it comes
with jewelry. Like you can't say okay because you're part
of the hip hop culture, but you can't wear the
hair or you're part of the hip hop culture where
you can't dress like it. That's my issue. That's a
problem for me, especially when it's a whole culture, like
let's say hip hop. It encompasses everything, and I don't
think you can Did you watch that movie, um Lauren London?
(15:49):
And oh is this the one where everyone? No? I
didn't see it, but I heard the reaction where a
lot of people were very upset because allegedly they did
not kiss in the movie. Is that why everybody was
upset about? Then? The kiss was cgi or whatever. I
don't understand, but the movie was a lot about that.
What was it? I Love you something? Yeah, what was
the name of it? You people? Oh? You people? Yeah,
(16:11):
it's a good movie and you know, it kind of
like touches on that because he's a Jewish guy. Yeah,
but he loves hip hop. Yeah, he loves them music.
He sounds like somebody I know, he loves a clothing
my husband. But then her family was rejecting him because
they felt like he was just cultural appropriation. Right, She
loved him, it was normal for her. She just saw
(16:31):
him as her equal. But it's crazy that in twenty
twenty three were still making movies like this. But it's
tough happening. It touched on it, and her father just
couldn't wrap his head around like, oh, you like this music,
or you wear those sneakers or this is how you
really dressed. Well, that's where I feel like it's an
honor or. It's it's paying homage. As you said, Where
you know I think that we are failing is the acknowledgement.
(16:52):
It's it's taking people's stories and claiming them as our own.
You know, we've spoken about this many many times. There
needs to be more stories of our stories from our
own people being told to the movie studios, to the
record labels like you know, that's the reason why I
feel like, you know, and I bring up bad Bunny
only because of his authenticity to who he is and
(17:15):
how he represents for us as Latinos, you know. And
I think that is so incredibly important because he has
broken so many boundaries and people wanted to put him
in a box, and he said, I'm not going to
sit in your box. I'm gonna do whatever the funk
I want. And now look at him, you know what
I mean. So I feel like there is a lot
to be explored with this conversation. I'm just more upset
(17:35):
than in twenty twenty three, where we should all be
accepting and receiving and understanding and hearing people's stories, that
we're shutting people down or we're not willing to educate,
you know, we're canceling all of these people where it's
like you can even look at somebody like Pimpule Pimple.
The majority of his first hits, we're all samples of
(17:58):
songs that our parents used to dance in the living room. Honestly,
like you know, if you think back to like and
I'm they're escaping me, right, mommy, mommy. But these are
all songs that he took to honor our culture. Yeah,
if you're if you're fourth, right and you and you say,
I honor this culture. I live by this code, like
(18:20):
this is the music I grew up with. I don't
believe in shutting people out of a culture based on
skin tone, especially hip hop. Like I live hip hop,
that's my thing. You know what I'm saying, Latinos, we
grew up on it, we helped build it, and that
you cannot deny and you can't take away from us.
But I do know that. You know, let's say, when
a white person is really really into the culture and
(18:43):
let's say adopts lingo or a wave of dressing, sometimes
some people might frown on it and be like, what
are you doing? You're not one of us. I see it,
and I just think it's wrong if there's a respect
and there's a love for the music, for the culture,
for the artistry, for the fashion. You know, I understand
the gate keep thing, and we should we should. You know,
a whole episode on the gate Keeping because I had
(19:05):
no idea how serious this was, where people were going
and buying the specific hair oil in bulk because they
didn't want other people together, they didn't want to run
out yeah much talk yes or something? What was it?
I think that's one of them, and then they sold it.
You know what's crazy, Carolina, because then they sold it
to like company, big corporation, and everybody went and bought
the oil because they like the white people gonna mess
(19:27):
up the formulation. Yes, exactly, but that's what I'm saying.
It's like, but why can't we all appreciate and and
and that's the whole point. It's like, when you build
an industry or when you build a company, the goal,
in my opinion, and I don't know anything because I
don't have a company, The goal of my opinion is
to make it so big that you sell it, ye,
so that somebody else can then take it, and then
(19:48):
you can go back and invest in other things and
you know, help other small business and seedings and things
like that. So I don't necessarily think it's a bad
thing that they sold their company. But what I do
think is important is that they preserve the natural recipe arry,
because I don't want you selling me a product for
black and Latina hair, which is no longer the formulation
(20:11):
that started out. The product this yere is Caribbean. Yeah,
it's hot in this student right now, and I'm stressed
the fun out because I'm like, I know, the nape
of my neck has got but you know what, we
don't get I honestly, at this point, there's nothing I
(20:32):
can do about it. But there's there's a guy who
has actually made a career out of this, and I'm
gonna bring him. Have you watched Dave? Have you watched
a Little Dickie's show? You know a Little Dickie. So
for those of you guys who don't know a Little Dickie,
he's a rapper, but he um he had one of
his songs, I woke up in Chris Brown's body like
he t But he is widely recepted by the hip
(20:54):
hop community, Okay, and he has now branched off and
he has a TV show where he talks about all
of these things, being a white rapper in hip hop,
in the industry. It's on I think it's on whom.
Why do I know this because my husband, Mark Grossman
loves to watch it, you know. And so that's the thing.
It's like, we went to we had the privilege and
(21:17):
the honor of going to Lincoln Center for Biggie's I
saw I was hating. I'm not even gonna lie to
you us say what the fuck? It was so special,
and I know how much Mark loves Biggie nas Like
he was these guys are his guys, right, he's a
long Island MSG. We're about to wed On. We did that.
(21:40):
We did that one night on leave Madison Square Garden. Baby,
I know what he likes. And so that's we were
at this concert and it was very beautiful because they
had them the orchestra doing all of Biggie's It was
so special. Mark was reciting every word, but he wasn't
saying it out loud. He was you know when somebody's
like reciting his word. Yeah, you can see him. The
(22:01):
people behind us were in awe of him. They were like, yo,
you are coming to the cookout. They're like, we love you.
They because they saw the genuine appreciation that he has.
But you know what's great, it's like he shouldn't in
any way shape or for him feel like he can't
spit a bit. That's what I said to him, Why
(22:22):
are you mouthing it? Everybody's here, everybody's like, obviously fan,
you're an og fan, Like you know what, he's lyricous
and we don't say that, and obviously, but I said
I'm most like, why are you being so and he's like,
you know, I don't know. He's shy too. Yeah, I know.
It's I know, it's like it's like a perception thing,
like Okay, I don't want people to be like, oh why.
But the energy in that space was one that was
(22:43):
just so amazing that I thought, and I love that.
And I looked back at them and I said, you
guys just made his night. I was like, thank you
so much because they saw it like we were both there,
we were in it, we were loving every second of it.
And so I just think that maybe maybe if things
like this get under your skin, if things like this
bother you, because like the Hailey Bieber thing, I didn't
(23:03):
understand it at first, and then I was like, oh,
so she has a makeup line out. Now she's trying
to say that she and from what I was reading,
people were saying that she was trying to claim it
as a lure. Magazine is like, oh the new trend.
This is not a new trend, right, this was ours
from the nineties to two thousand. Meganasasiquas, everybody did it right,
(23:28):
pay homage and say where it came from. I think
it's the whole trying to erase the origin of something
that really bothers the creators. Boom. That is it. That's
the message. And you know what, we can we can't
go anywhere else after that because that is the truth. Honey.
That was amazing, seriously, and that's how we're going to
(23:48):
get a better understanding of things. If you give the
credit where it to due, then we can grow with it.
That's it. You can use it. But listen, you better
say when you know when you put photo credit Getty, Yeah,
you better put credit Boom what she said. Damn girl,
you are spinning today. This is amazing. The whole biggie
(24:09):
thing got me height. No want to split them all.
I know. I love it. Well, we're here for it,
and you know what, I would totally love to see
you do it. You guys. Hit us up on Instagram,
make sure you give us a follow at li Spanglish,
and don't forget to like and subscribe. For sure, hit
us up wherever you consume your podcast. Subscribe, hit us
five stars and drop the comments the reviews. I love
(24:30):
reading the reviews. I remember, like three seasons ago, we
used to have old comments behind us. We need to
bring that back because the comments were just super dope.
Definitely and follow us both on a gram you can
find us. Oh yes, I'm at the real Carolina. I
am Honey German. That's the actual name. My other name
got lost. I know we've both been like, I'm still
morning that ship, but look for us, we both got
(24:51):
like just totally twisted on social media. But no, we're
here and we are here to stay, and guys, thank
you so so much. We'll be back next week with
another episode. Oka Lifense Banglish is a production of Lipensepanglish
Productions in partnership with Iheart's Mikuntura podcast network.
I'm a honey German. My parents are Dominican. I was
born and raised in New York City. I love sneakers
and I'm a body positive advocate. I'm Carolina Bermudez, but
I was born and raised in Ohio. I'm a wife,
a mama, and a worker being. This is life in Spanglish, Carolina. Yes, baby,
I have been on fire TikTok. All of a sudden,
(00:28):
I'm seeing things that are quote unquote trends. I'm like,
this isn't not a trend. Oh? Is this the article
that you sent me? Yep? Okay, so this is all
over TikTok, which, by the way, you know that I
am not all over TikTok. So you have to like
tell me more about this because I have an opinion
about the culture vultures that everybody's talking about. So let's
talk about Hayley Beaver, right, brownie glazed lips? Right? Oh
(00:52):
the don't what was she doing that? But that everybody
was saying those are like chola lips or something. Yes, exactly.
It's like, Okay, all of a sudden, everybody's going crazy
new trend, new trend, new trend. I'm like, bitch, this
is not a new trend, like when we're talking you know,
darker lip right. And by the way, I'm saying that
affectionately only because my experience was that my family, a
lot of them grew up in San Francisco, so you know,
(01:14):
gang banging and all of that. That was like really
prominent in the eighties and the nineties in San Francisco,
and so they would always say, like my would say,
you know, you know, like that's yeah, no, And even
here in New York it was a thing back in
the nineties. We would use brown eyeliner as a lip line, right,
like that was a thing that belonged to us. You know,
(01:36):
black and brown women have been doing this for years.
Oh so then Haley Beavers doing this now and people
are saying, that's what the that's where I'm and they're
saying it together. She like she created that. Oh no,
get out of here. Yeah exactly. Now everybody's going crazy,
you know, Cosmo, it's like, get Haley Beavers, you know,
brownie glazed the lips, like the fucker. We have been
(01:56):
doing this as latinas forever. But that brought me to
the whole you know, cultural vulture. Yes, you know, and
you know, just appropriation. This happened a while back when
Gwen Stefani. I think she was talking about her time
when she had Remember she had the hero Juku girls. Yes,
when she had her one album that came out and
they went everywhere with it. They were like her minions,
(02:17):
but they weren't allowed to talk. Okay, that's why I
said the word mini. They'll use like a million people
behind her. But yeah, and then she recently, and this
is months ago, she said that she is part Japanese,
which I think really offended an upset And are you serious?
I think that yeah, well, okay, yes, so maybe she's transcultural.
I don't know. But my whole thing's like, I have
(02:41):
a real issue with this only because are we not
allowing people to appreciate other cultures because we are so
ready to attack them for trying to take what's ours?
Or is it that we've been gate keeping things for
so long? Because like this even happened with a hair product.
I think the main problem we have is when things
(03:02):
that are created by us and that belonged to us
is taken, let's say, by a celebrity, and then they're
attributed for creating something that you know, what's part of
is part of our culture for decades. That's where I
have the problem, Like, don't say Hayley Beaver started this
trend with these lips when she obviously took it from
a whole subculture. Well, I think that's her responsibility though
(03:26):
to say, like, oh, I was inspired by whoever she
got it from whatever, you know, even if it was
like an editorial thing, or if it was an old
picture of j exactly. It could be Jenny Riba, you
know when she first started, could be anywhere. But a
lot of people aren't into giving credit. A lot of
people are into stealing stealing it, And that's where I
(03:47):
feel like there's a big issue. I feel. I think
that with anything anymore, you have to credit everybody. I
can't even post a picture of a celebrity on my
Instagram without having to credit Getty Images. Oh yeah, our
image or whoever the photographers are. Because you're afraid of
getting suited. Everybody wants to sue everybody. Well that that's
a big fact. That is a big, big fact, Like
(04:08):
everybody wants to get paid. But you know, I don't
know when it comes to beauty and trends, like Latina
as we started, so much stuff, so many things. You know,
When Raquel Welch passed away, I was just a floored
because I remember thinking to myself, like, I grew up
and by the way, Raquel Welch was Latina, but she
(04:29):
didn't really embrace that until later on in her career,
which a lot of people talked about. She was always
looked at as like a sex bombshell, like sexy woman,
Yeah exactly, And so I looked back on her and
I was like, what a classic beauty, And I thought
that there were so many beautiful things about her. There
are so many beautiful, wonderful things about us as Latinas.
And I'm not talking about just the ones that are
(04:50):
made for TV or the movies, you know. I think
that just like if you look at your theas or
your cousins, they're gorgeous in their own right, and we
all have our own thing. My concern is, for example,
I love hip hop, I love rap music. I grew
up in a small town in Ohio where you were
(05:10):
either white or you were black, and I went more
toward my African American friends. I mean, yes, I had
my white friends too, but because of the exposure to
the music and what I learned from them, I grew
up appreciating it. Now I have two little white children
who love to reference Biggie or to POC or jay Z,
(05:35):
and I don't want them to be accused of cultural
appropriation or being culture vultures because they truly enjoy that
because they've been raised with it. Do you see what
I'm saying. So that's where I feel like there's a
fine line here. There definitely is, especially with music. I
don't think loving hip hop makes you a culture vulture.
You know, we have people like let's say Jack Harlowe.
(05:57):
He's a dope as rapper. He's a white man, he
is a dopest rap, but he's a spit of Nobody
can deny him that he is part of the culture. Right,
But but why does he get a pass? And why
does Eminem get a pass? And why did Justin Timberlake
get a pass? And what do they call it? Like
Blue Eyed Soul? Right, Robin Thick got a pass. So
these are all just things that I think about because,
like whether it's beauty, trends, music, film, I think that
(06:22):
we're really walking a fine line of not being able
to appreciate and learn about other cultures. Honey, there's a
picture of me on my dining room set as a
six year old little girl. My mom and dad came
back from San Francisco. They went to Chinatown. They bought
me a little dress. My mom had my hair in
(06:43):
Little Transas, you know, and they and they basically dressed
me in this, you know, beautiful outfit that was. I
don't know if it was China. I don't want to
say I was China. My assumption is Chinese. Okay. I
worry about a picture like that because people will, oh,
my gosh, like if you shared that right now, it
was just like I would be open for targeting. It
(07:06):
was like, you really think it's okay for you to
share this exactly. But meanwhile, my parents love Chinatown in
San Francisco. They wanted to bring me back a cosita,
that's what they used to call it, like a little gift.
And now I look at that, and the weird part
is that with everything, you have to think about, how
is this going to come up, how's it gonna be received,
how's it gonna be received by everybody? And so that's
(07:28):
where it got me thinking, like, here's a white woman
Gwen Stefani, highly successful music television married to a country star.
No no, no no. She comes out and says that like
she appreciated the Japanese culture, but then she qualified it
by saying, oh, well, I'm part Japanese. Like I almost
feel like she was pressured to say something I would
(07:48):
never I would never and she like, Hilaria, Oh my gosh. Okay.
That's another That's that's hard. That is a difficult discussion
for me, because I feel like Ilaia Baldwin has a
genuine appreciation for the Spanish culture, and I think she
got carried away, very very carried away. You can't, yo,
(08:10):
you can't just you can't just make believe you're something
Like you can appreciate something, but you can't just be
like okay, and from now on, I'm gonna make believe
right there, case in point, that is what cultural appropriation is, right,
And so that's where we're explaining it to people, and
we're saying, like, there are even people who say you're
not Latina enough to claim Look at what the criticism
(08:33):
that Jlo has gotten throughout her career because she can't
speak Spanish. I saw a meme and it was just
like Jlo smiling. While she doesn't understand anything bad, Bunny
is saying, I'm like, yo, yah, people are horrible when
they were Yes, she probably didn't, but it's okay, you know,
But that's what I'm saying. It's exactly like, let her
be who she is. Is who she is. She was
(08:55):
raised in the Bronx in New York. She's a She's
a motherfucking bodiquo. That's it, whether you like it or not.
And she can claim it, you know. But like, that's
where I'm very conflicted with this topic, because there are
certain places and certain things that I want to see
and that I want to enjoy in my life. For example,
we have a I have a very dear friend who
(09:17):
recently went to Morocco, And did you go to Morocco?
I have not, but I need to. She said it
was a life changing trip for her. Okay. In her
picture she's wearing um and I don't know what to
call them, not a job because it was just basically
a scarf over her yeah, like a scarf over her head.
And I said, I was like, oh my gosh, you
(09:37):
look gorgeous. You know what she said to me, She goes,
I loved how I felt I was wearing a klf tan,
I was wearing a beautiful veil on my head. She goes,
I wouldn't dare do that in New York because people
would accuse me of, you know, stealing somebody else's culture.
And I thought about it. I'm like, but like, what
is wrong with you loving that and loving the way
(09:58):
that you feel in that. I almost feel like it's
an honor. I do see both sides, and I'm playing
Devil's advocate right now simply for the discussion. It is beautiful.
But when I see photos like that, because I do
have friends and that travel, I kind of like feel away.
One of my brothers went to Dubai and then he
(10:19):
like dressed up like I guess someone from Dubai, and
I just found it strange. I'm like, why are you
wearing that right now? And then he like posed with
somebody with similar clothes, and I don't know, to me
it was just not cultural appropriation, but he found it
like amusing, and to me it was offensive. Oh okay,
So then like maybe it is the attitude in which
you're because like clearly you don't want to ridicule another culture,
(10:43):
Like it was just the whole thinking this is so
cool for Instagram flexing, for the grant, it was just
kind of like weird, it's so different, right, but like,
but for example, when my friend brought this up, I
said to her, I was like, you need to rock
because she said, she's like, I got the most beautiful
calf dancer and she must have looked absolutely at least stunning.
If it's okay, let's say you're going to a temple.
It is required, it's required to you. You are paying homage,
(11:06):
you are respecting the culture, the tradition, You're going by
the norms that it are required from you. Then why
can't I bring that back to the United States? If
I'm going to a temple and where did you go?
You went to Thailand and you loved it. Yeah, I
went to Thailand. I loved it. And you had to
cover yourself up. Yeah you had to take off your shoes.
Of course. If you were feeling yourself and you loved
(11:27):
it and you came back to New York, why why
should you not be allowed to wear that? I think
I don't know, it's like a maybe it's a transparency
thing because I don't know why my mind keeps going
back to the number one stunna when it comes to
the cultural appropriation. Rachel Dola's all, Oh geez, I thought
you were talking about big timers. I was like, the
(11:48):
number one stunna up, No girl, I wouldn't been bringing
it back, not no baby. But Rachel Dola's out, which
remind everybody about who she is because some people may
not remember her, you will once she starts to Yeah,
Rachel Dola's all. You know, she was the president of
the naacp up in Spokane, and she was a white
(12:08):
woman who considered herself I guess trans um transracial, that's
what that's the word that she used, that transracial. Yeah,
and she lived her life as a black woman and
she still continues to do so, you know, if you
want to learn more about her, she has a great
Netflix documentary. And it's weird because I was always like,
(12:29):
oh my gosh, she's horrible. She's a horrible person who
makes believe they're a black woman and who takes jobs
away from from a you know, another black woman when
they're you know, secret. I mean, so I was just
kind of and then but wait, wait, wait, I don't
want you to lose you, but can I please say something. Yeah,
you are lying and you are the head of the NAP.
(12:50):
Have a huge problem with that is next level. I
have a huge problem with that. That is next level.
Like deceitfulness not okay under any circumstances, like loving a culture,
loving a tradition, perfectly fine. And you know what's crazy
about Rachel Dolas all that she was doing amazing things
(13:13):
for the black community. She was doing things that I
wasn't doing and maybe my black friends weren't doing. But
the deceit of passing yourself off as a different race,
that's where the problems lies. Whole other like cant of worms.
Because also that's psychological, im and I'm no psychiatrist. Definitely,
(13:33):
she's definitely it's it's it's something in her head. There
has to be some type of a personality disorder or
something or you know what I mean. I don't know
what it is. That's why I said I'm not a
clinical dollar. She says that she's always felt you know,
her parents, she's white parents, and they adopted black children,
and then she started helping raise the black children, and
she said she started becoming more knowledgeable and educated in
(13:58):
black culture. Okay, but you can still be in own person.
We literally just talked about this, right. I wasn't raised
with black brothers and sisters, but I had very dear
black friends. But I still remained who I am, And
I think that's the beauty of it, right, Like, I
think that that's where, well, like, look, we even get
down to look at the Kardashians, how vilified they have
(14:21):
been by women who wear braids. I have to be honest,
I've always had princes. When I was a little girl,
my mom used to always put braids in my hair,
and they might be different types of braids. But why
is it okay for some people to do it? Is
because there are Armenian they shouldn't be allowed to do it.
(14:42):
That is where I feel like we are really crossing
this literal definition of what a culture vulture really is.
I guess if you steal, if you pick and then
you pass off as your own, that's what I equate
with being a culture vulture. Stealing, not paying homage, not acknowledging,
(15:03):
not saying I got this from this culture or from
this lifestyle. I think that's what the problem comes in
for me. Right, It's not even the usage of it,
of the music of the fashion because you can't control
like hip hop is. It's not music, it's the culture.
And if you're part of the culture, whether you're Asian,
whether you're Latino, whether you're white, if you're part of
the culture, hip hop comes with fashion, it comes with music,
(15:26):
it comes with terms, it comes with hairstyles, it comes
with jewelry. Like you can't say okay because you're part
of the hip hop culture, but you can't wear the
hair or you're part of the hip hop culture where
you can't dress like it. That's my issue. That's a
problem for me, especially when it's a whole culture, like
let's say hip hop. It encompasses everything, and I don't
think you can Did you watch that movie, um Lauren London?
(15:49):
And oh is this the one where everyone? No? I
didn't see it, but I heard the reaction where a
lot of people were very upset because allegedly they did
not kiss in the movie. Is that why everybody was
upset about? Then? The kiss was cgi or whatever. I
don't understand, but the movie was a lot about that.
What was it? I Love you something? Yeah, what was
the name of it? You people? Oh? You people? Yeah,
(16:11):
it's a good movie and you know, it kind of
like touches on that because he's a Jewish guy. Yeah,
but he loves hip hop. Yeah, he loves them music.
He sounds like somebody I know, he loves a clothing
my husband. But then her family was rejecting him because
they felt like he was just cultural appropriation. Right, She
loved him, it was normal for her. She just saw
(16:31):
him as her equal. But it's crazy that in twenty
twenty three were still making movies like this. But it's
tough happening. It touched on it, and her father just
couldn't wrap his head around like, oh, you like this music,
or you wear those sneakers or this is how you
really dressed. Well, that's where I feel like it's an
honor or. It's it's paying homage. As you said, Where
you know I think that we are failing is the acknowledgement.
(16:52):
It's it's taking people's stories and claiming them as our own.
You know, we've spoken about this many many times. There
needs to be more stories of our stories from our
own people being told to the movie studios, to the
record labels like you know, that's the reason why I
feel like, you know, and I bring up bad Bunny
only because of his authenticity to who he is and
(17:15):
how he represents for us as Latinos, you know. And
I think that is so incredibly important because he has
broken so many boundaries and people wanted to put him
in a box, and he said, I'm not going to
sit in your box. I'm gonna do whatever the funk
I want. And now look at him, you know what
I mean. So I feel like there is a lot
to be explored with this conversation. I'm just more upset
(17:35):
than in twenty twenty three, where we should all be
accepting and receiving and understanding and hearing people's stories, that
we're shutting people down or we're not willing to educate,
you know, we're canceling all of these people where it's
like you can even look at somebody like Pimpule Pimple.
The majority of his first hits, we're all samples of
(17:58):
songs that our parents used to dance in the living room. Honestly,
like you know, if you think back to like and
I'm they're escaping me, right, mommy, mommy. But these are
all songs that he took to honor our culture. Yeah,
if you're if you're fourth, right and you and you say,
I honor this culture. I live by this code, like
(18:20):
this is the music I grew up with. I don't
believe in shutting people out of a culture based on
skin tone, especially hip hop. Like I live hip hop,
that's my thing. You know what I'm saying, Latinos, we
grew up on it, we helped build it, and that
you cannot deny and you can't take away from us.
But I do know that. You know, let's say, when
a white person is really really into the culture and
(18:43):
let's say adopts lingo or a wave of dressing, sometimes
some people might frown on it and be like, what
are you doing? You're not one of us. I see it,
and I just think it's wrong if there's a respect
and there's a love for the music, for the culture,
for the artistry, for the fashion. You know, I understand
the gate keep thing, and we should we should. You know,
a whole episode on the gate Keeping because I had
(19:05):
no idea how serious this was, where people were going
and buying the specific hair oil in bulk because they
didn't want other people together, they didn't want to run
out yeah much talk yes or something? What was it?
I think that's one of them, and then they sold it.
You know what's crazy, Carolina, because then they sold it
to like company, big corporation, and everybody went and bought
the oil because they like the white people gonna mess
(19:27):
up the formulation. Yes, exactly, but that's what I'm saying.
It's like, but why can't we all appreciate and and
and that's the whole point. It's like, when you build
an industry or when you build a company, the goal,
in my opinion, and I don't know anything because I
don't have a company, The goal of my opinion is
to make it so big that you sell it, ye,
so that somebody else can then take it, and then
(19:48):
you can go back and invest in other things and
you know, help other small business and seedings and things
like that. So I don't necessarily think it's a bad
thing that they sold their company. But what I do
think is important is that they preserve the natural recipe arry,
because I don't want you selling me a product for
black and Latina hair, which is no longer the formulation
(20:11):
that started out. The product this yere is Caribbean. Yeah,
it's hot in this student right now, and I'm stressed
the fun out because I'm like, I know, the nape
of my neck has got but you know what, we
don't get I honestly, at this point, there's nothing I
(20:32):
can do about it. But there's there's a guy who
has actually made a career out of this, and I'm
gonna bring him. Have you watched Dave? Have you watched
a Little Dickie's show? You know a Little Dickie. So
for those of you guys who don't know a Little Dickie,
he's a rapper, but he um he had one of
his songs, I woke up in Chris Brown's body like
he t But he is widely recepted by the hip
(20:54):
hop community, Okay, and he has now branched off and
he has a TV show where he talks about all
of these things, being a white rapper in hip hop,
in the industry. It's on I think it's on whom.
Why do I know this because my husband, Mark Grossman
loves to watch it, you know. And so that's the thing.
It's like, we went to we had the privilege and
(21:17):
the honor of going to Lincoln Center for Biggie's I
saw I was hating. I'm not even gonna lie to
you us say what the fuck? It was so special,
and I know how much Mark loves Biggie nas Like
he was these guys are his guys, right, he's a
long Island MSG. We're about to wed On. We did that.
(21:40):
We did that one night on leave Madison Square Garden. Baby,
I know what he likes. And so that's we were
at this concert and it was very beautiful because they
had them the orchestra doing all of Biggie's It was
so special. Mark was reciting every word, but he wasn't
saying it out loud. He was you know when somebody's
like reciting his word. Yeah, you can see him. The
(22:01):
people behind us were in awe of him. They were like, yo,
you are coming to the cookout. They're like, we love you.
They because they saw the genuine appreciation that he has.
But you know what's great, it's like he shouldn't in
any way shape or for him feel like he can't
spit a bit. That's what I said to him, Why
(22:22):
are you mouthing it? Everybody's here, everybody's like, obviously fan,
you're an og fan, Like you know what, he's lyricous
and we don't say that, and obviously, but I said
I'm most like, why are you being so and he's like,
you know, I don't know. He's shy too. Yeah, I know.
It's I know, it's like it's like a perception thing,
like Okay, I don't want people to be like, oh why.
But the energy in that space was one that was
(22:43):
just so amazing that I thought, and I love that.
And I looked back at them and I said, you
guys just made his night. I was like, thank you
so much because they saw it like we were both there,
we were in it, we were loving every second of it.
And so I just think that maybe maybe if things
like this get under your skin, if things like this
bother you, because like the Hailey Bieber thing, I didn't
(23:03):
understand it at first, and then I was like, oh,
so she has a makeup line out. Now she's trying
to say that she and from what I was reading,
people were saying that she was trying to claim it
as a lure. Magazine is like, oh the new trend.
This is not a new trend, right, this was ours
from the nineties to two thousand. Meganasasiquas, everybody did it right,
(23:28):
pay homage and say where it came from. I think
it's the whole trying to erase the origin of something
that really bothers the creators. Boom. That is it. That's
the message. And you know what, we can we can't
go anywhere else after that because that is the truth. Honey.
That was amazing, seriously, and that's how we're going to
(23:48):
get a better understanding of things. If you give the
credit where it to due, then we can grow with it.
That's it. You can use it. But listen, you better
say when you know when you put photo credit Getty, Yeah,
you better put credit Boom what she said. Damn girl,
you are spinning today. This is amazing. The whole biggie
(24:09):
thing got me height. No want to split them all.
I know. I love it. Well, we're here for it,
and you know what, I would totally love to see
you do it. You guys. Hit us up on Instagram,
make sure you give us a follow at li Spanglish,
and don't forget to like and subscribe. For sure, hit
us up wherever you consume your podcast. Subscribe, hit us
five stars and drop the comments the reviews. I love
(24:30):
reading the reviews. I remember, like three seasons ago, we
used to have old comments behind us. We need to
bring that back because the comments were just super dope.
Definitely and follow us both on a gram you can
find us. Oh yes, I'm at the real Carolina. I
am Honey German. That's the actual name. My other name
got lost. I know we've both been like, I'm still
morning that ship, but look for us, we both got
(24:51):
like just totally twisted on social media. But no, we're
here and we are here to stay, and guys, thank
you so so much. We'll be back next week with
another episode. Oka Lifense Banglish is a production of Lipensepanglish
Productions in partnership with Iheart's Mikuntura podcast network.
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