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November 16, 2025 30 mins
There are some credits available for health insurance on the marketplace.  Oregon Senator Ron Wyden says the fight for more health insurance credits isn't over.  The holidays are a time to talk with older adults about what's next.  The effort to send the Oregon Transportation Law to voters.
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Episode Transcript

Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
Welcome to Local Voices. I'm brad Ford. This week it's
open enrollment on the marketplace and there are still some
credits to lower costs. Oregon Senitor Ron Wyden says the
fight is not over for enhanced healthcare credits. The holidays
can be a time to talk with older family members
about what's next, and an efforts under way to send
the Oregon Transportation Law to voters. Open enrollment is underway

(00:27):
on the federal marketplace. That's where people who don't qualify
for the Oregon Health Plan and don't get insurance for
an employer can go to get health insurance coverage. The
reason Democrats wouldn't pass the government funding bill was because
it didn't extend enhanced benefits those were added during the pandemic.
Amy Covid with the Oregon Health Insurance Marketplace joins us
on Local Voices. Amy, are there credits people can get

(00:49):
to help buy health insurance.

Speaker 2 (00:51):
That's a great question, Brod, and I know there's been
a lot of confusion swirling this year with everything going
around in the news. Premium tax credits are still available
if you go through the marketplace. What is not available
currently are the enhanced premium tax credits which were available
starting in twenty twenty one. So the amount of savings
that people are receiving is going to be a little

(01:13):
bit lower than they've seen in the last few years.

Speaker 1 (01:16):
I don't know if you have this number or not,
but what are the average amounts of credits people received
this current year?

Speaker 2 (01:23):
For this current year, for twenty twenty five, the average
amount of premium tax credits folks received was about five
hundred and thirty one dollars per month.

Speaker 1 (01:32):
How many people receive credits this year?

Speaker 2 (01:34):
Yeah, so for the current plan year that we're in
right now, for twenty twenty five, when folks went through
open enrollment last year, we found that about eighty percent
of enrollees that applied for financial help got financial health.

Speaker 1 (01:47):
Is it possible to tell this early on if there's
been a decrease in people signing up for insurance? I
know they have until a date in January in order
to do it.

Speaker 2 (01:56):
Yeah, Open enrollment ends January fifteenth, twenty twenty six, so
we've still got quite a bit of time. I would
say it is very difficult to say for sure what
the enrollment trend looks like right now. First of all,
we don't have access to the data right away to
be able to see those trends. But also people do

(02:17):
tend to wait a little bit into open enrollment, and
I think this year more than ever, with the just
everything up in the air with the enhanced premium tax credits,
I think that people might be waiting a little bit
longer than normal.

Speaker 1 (02:29):
What happens if the credits are approved during or after
open enrollment, and that would be the enhanced credits.

Speaker 2 (02:37):
Yeah, So if someone has enrolled through the marketplace and
the enhanced premium tax credits are approved to be extended
in some way, shape or form, the marketplace would I
would presume that they would go back in and just
make the calculation to adjust so that folks would be
able to receive the most amount of savings that are

(02:58):
available to them now. If someone had chosen not to
enroll through the marketplace, then they would not be able
to necessarily go back to the marketplace to enroll. So
it's really important that folks consider in rolling through the marketplace,
even if their savings available right now is a little
bit lower than what they were able to get in

(03:19):
the past, because if those savings are extended in the future,
then they would be able to take advantage of those
savings going forward.

Speaker 1 (03:27):
Are there certain qualifications people need to meet in order
to get the enhanced credits?

Speaker 2 (03:32):
So the enhanced credits actually expanded eligibility to more people
under the Affordable Care Acts, Folks are eligible for premium
tax credits if you are not eligible for a public
program like Oregon Health Plan or Medicare or with Premium
Free Part A, if you meet eligibility for income requirements,

(03:54):
so that means that your income is less than four
hundred percent of the federal poverty level, if you are
not offered affordable coverage through your job, and if you
enrolled through coverage through the marketplace. The enhanced premium tax
credits are available to people regardless of income status, so
even if you're above four hundred percent of the federal

(04:15):
poverty level. So it actually expanded assistance to more people for.

Speaker 1 (04:20):
People who haven't gone through the marketplace before to get insurance.
What do you want them to know?

Speaker 2 (04:27):
Well, there's two things that I definitely encourage folks to
check out. First of all, on our website, we have
a window shopping tool. It's really easy to use and
it'll give you a really good idea of what plans
are available in your area and how much savings might
be available to you. And the second thing that I
would recommend is really meeting with an expert that is

(04:47):
available to you. And I would recommend that for new
folks that are new to the marketplace and also folks
who have been, you know, maybe enrolled through the marketplace
for a while. Especially this year with things changing so much,
it's a really great idea to meet with an expert.
They're really well versed in the plans and the networks
available in your particular area, and they're also really on

(05:10):
top of all of the changes happening, so they'll be
able to let you know what options are available to
you and help guide you. And you can find someone
available on our website Oregon healthcare.

Speaker 1 (05:20):
Dot com terrific. What are the dates again for open enrollment?

Speaker 2 (05:25):
That's important to know. So open enrollment started November first
and ends January fifteenth. However, I do want to call
out that if you enroll by December fifteenth, then your
coverage will start on January first.

Speaker 1 (05:37):
What else is important for our listeners to know.

Speaker 2 (05:40):
Take a look at the options that are available, because
Oregon's a little bit more unique than a lot of
other states in the country, and so the national narrative
I think that's going around is scaring people a little
bit more. Our health insurance premiums did not raise as
much as they did in some others the country. They

(06:01):
raised about the same amount they do each year, So
we're not looking at as big of changes as some
areas of the country. So definitely take a look at
the window shopping tool. Don't go based off of what
you're hearing in the news. Definitely look at your specific situation,
and like I said, talk to an expert to make

(06:21):
sure that you're really getting the best information for your
specific situation.

Speaker 1 (06:25):
That's Amy Covid with the Oregon Health Insurance marketplace open
enrollments currently underway. Go to healthcare dot Oregon dot gov
to find out more and whether you might qualify for
credits that would make health insurance less expensive. The government
shutdown ended this week when eight Senate Democrats sided with
Republicans to pass a temporary funding bill. Oregon Senators Ron

(06:49):
Wyden and Jeff Merkley voted against it. Ron Wyden says
Oregonians need help paying for healthcare insurance.

Speaker 3 (06:55):
I'm going to pull out all the stops to get
relieved for Oregonians. I'm going to be seeing folks saw
over the next few days who have five hundred percent
increases in their premiums. And you know, my red line
has been clear from the very beginning. I wanted to
work in a bipartisan way. I wanted the Trump administration
and Republicans in Congress to work with us. And what

(07:17):
my red line has always been is I'm not going
to support a bill that fails to lower health costs
for Oregonians because with all these premium hikes, people aren't
going to be able to pay groceries, they are going
to be able to pay the rent, they aren't going
to be able to afford kids for love, shoes for
their kids. And you know, this is not anything that
is really to me an abstract, you know issue. This

(07:40):
is something families have to have in order to be
able to make do and get ahead and have a
good life.

Speaker 1 (07:47):
Now, there's also talk about another reconciliation bill this session.
What are you hearing about that.

Speaker 3 (07:52):
I've heard that a couple of times. I mean, we
saw what happened with the first reconciliation bill was a
gigantic gift to the billionaires, and Medicaid got savage for it.
So put me down, as you know, waiting to see
the news. But I've introduced the Billionaires Income Tax, which
says that the billionaires should actually have to pay some taxes.
Firefighters and nurses and teachers pay taxes every paycheck. A

(08:12):
billionaire if they don't want to pay any taxes for
a long time, it just takes three words by borrow
and die. If they do those three things, they can
get out of paying taxes. That's what my Billionaire's Income
Tax with twenty three senators is designed to stop.

Speaker 1 (08:26):
Now on your bipartisan bill to end President Trump's tariffs,
what's the update there.

Speaker 3 (08:31):
Well, we're really pleased that we won the floor vote
in the United States Senate. This is my proposal to
end Trump's across the board tariffs. These tariffs are poisoned
for Oregon because one out of four jobs in our
state depends on international trade. The trade jobs often pay
better than do the non trade jobs. So pull out
all the stops to kill this. And we won a

(08:53):
big vote here about a week or so ago, fifty
one to forty seven in the Senate. I got Mitch
McConnell's vote. You don't see that too often, and we're
just going to keep pushing. I also thought the Supreme
Court hearing went very well for our side, and the
justices in the oral argument seem to be pretty skeptical
of the Trump people who kept saying that this is

(09:14):
a national security issue, which I think is a wrong,
wrongly or argued point.

Speaker 1 (09:18):
As well, if it were to pass the House as well,
won't the President just veto it.

Speaker 3 (09:26):
The President is going to keep trying and trying and
trying some more all through his presidency, There's no question
about that. But I think we've managed to make the
case that a tariff is attacks that was something he
never would tell the facts about. And I think we're
doing well. But your point is well taken. I think

(09:46):
that he'll keep trying again and again and again, but
so will our group of very dedicated people. And we
got a bunch of Republicans on my vote fifty one
forty seven. Oregon wins something I worked on for a
long time. I'm the lead sponsor.

Speaker 1 (10:01):
That's another Ron Wyden discussing several issues he's working on
for Oregon. Family spend time together during the holidays, and
that can also be an opportunity to talk with older
family members about what's next. Doctor Marion Howard joins us
on Local Voices. Doctor Howard is a Jerry Attrition with
kinds of preminente Northwest. Doctor Howard, one of the more

(10:23):
difficult discussions is about when to stop driving. What's your
advice on how to monitor an older adults ability to
drive safely?

Speaker 4 (10:31):
Yeah, I think when you're noticing a concern, So some
of the things that would maybe alert you would be
things like, you know, new damage to the car, or
them reporting an accident, maybe worsening vision issues or getting lost,
or maybe just even saying, hey, I don't drive to

(10:53):
you know, metro Portland anymore or something like that because
I don't like to go new places. So some of
those types of things might just like let you explore
a little more about the why of why they may
not want to be driving in those situations any longer.
And I think that that's kind of an opening then

(11:13):
to talking about how they feel about their driving safety
or if you've driven with them and notice safety concerns,
that's obviously also another way for us to notice an issue.
But I think It's a very touchy subject and can
be very sensitive.

Speaker 1 (11:31):
Giving up your driving is a difficult thing to do.
Most people want to live in their homes as long
as they can. What should we think about it when
it comes time to consider assisted living?

Speaker 4 (11:41):
We all, I think, would rather not have to go
to an institution. So I think thinking well in advance
of actual physical debility is a good idea to say,
is my current home someplace that I could live in place?
Is it something that's adaptable for physical impairment for example?

(12:03):
But sometimes there's no other choice. Sometimes people are needing
more care around the clock, more physical assistance than is
realistic in the home, and talking about the loss of
our independence in a in it, you know, living in
a in an assistant living, you know, there are a

(12:24):
lot of things to consider that are are difficult, Like,
you know, does the person have pets? That's a big one,
A big reason that people don't want to move, you know,
just the idea of not being in your own environment.
We can't force people generally. We have to usually respect autonomy, right,

(12:45):
There's no such thing as institutionalizing people against their will.
So we need buy in and in order to do that,
I think bringing people along in a way that shows
them that this is in their best interest, and that
takes time. Sometimes it doesn't happen until something critical happens,

(13:05):
but ideally we can get there well before that.

Speaker 1 (13:09):
Now, different assisted living facilities operate in different ways, they
have different levels of care. Talk a little bit about
what to look for there.

Speaker 4 (13:20):
Some places will have all the way through, you know,
a memory care or you know, start off with more
independent apartments where you just kind of have your own
totally independent apartment living than option to go to assisted living,
which then has several levels of assistance within it, depending

(13:42):
on how much physical help or medication assistance you may need,
and then onto again kind of more of a memory
care level, which in Oregon I find, you know, memory
care can often be pretty much nursing home level of care.
Rarely do people go to true nursing home unless there's

(14:05):
truly very very advanced physical needs for the most part,
and I think it depends on obviously so many factors
what type of place you would look for. Touring and
getting a sense of the place, seeing the staffing. I
think is especially important is their high staff turnover to

(14:27):
the staff and residents seem to get along. It's I
think that's really a key in many places to being
able to understand how well run a place is is
are they able to retain their staff?

Speaker 1 (14:42):
You know, it is a complex subject that takes time
to understand. Do you have advice on how people can
learn more about what to ask and what to look
for when considering assisted living facilities?

Speaker 4 (14:52):
Yeah, I think if it were me shopping for an
assistant living with my family member, I I would again
look at how the staff are interacting, see how they
seem like they feel the staffing is, because that's really
they're going to interact a lot with staffing. You know,
how is the place run? You know, people often care

(15:14):
a lot about the food. You know, you're paying a
lot of money to live in a place and if
you don't even like eating there, and that's a big
part of you know, the budget that you're putting towards that.

Speaker 1 (15:25):
Let's go on to advanced directives. Those are including living
wills and end of life planning, all important to discuss
before it comes to that point. But that's really tough
to talk about end of life decisions, end of life situations.
How do you start that conversation?

Speaker 4 (15:42):
Yeah, I like to encourage people to talk about it
when not much else is going on in their lives.
I tend to bring it up during, you know, a
routine physical exam in my own practice, just to say, hey,
when you're well and we've just talked about your proactive
of health, let's talk about advanced directives, because when nothing

(16:04):
serious is happening, you didn't just you know, come out
of the hospital. Although that's also a perfect time if
we haven't already talked about it, I think, you know,
we do want to ideally have a conversation when it's
not so charged with imminent medical issues going on, and
ideally with all the interested parties in the same room

(16:27):
would be wonderful. So in an advanced directive, for example,
you're trying to get at least hopefully two people who
could be making medical decisions if you weren't able to
so a spouse or two children, and having them all
on the same page where maybe you're all together and
hearing the same thing at the same time, can be

(16:50):
a perfect way to do that. And then you can
even complete the paperwork, which makes it even more efficient,
so it doesn't take a lawyer or anything to do
an advance directive. So I personally like to encourage people
to do it at a holiday, you know, everybody's together.
You don't have to do it around the actual dinner table,
but you know, when everybody's together at some point, try
to try to have a conversation and see if you can,

(17:14):
you know, get it down in writing and get that
out of the way so that everyone can have that
peace of mind that it's already you know, one more
thing that we know. We don't need to worry about any.

Speaker 1 (17:26):
Emergency, absolutely, and the important thing is talking about it
early so that you're not talking about it when it's imminent.
Cognitive or physical limitations are also tough to discuss. What
should people consider, Yeah.

Speaker 4 (17:41):
I think there's a lot of fear or you know,
on the part of the person that maybe developing fears
about cognition or physical frailty, that they're going to be
losing independence or losing their ability to be a contributing
member of a family. Like in the sense that we

(18:03):
often want to feel like we're useful in life, and
I think as much as we can letting people continue
to be independent and continuing to do all of their
you know, the things that they can to support to
be useful, because I if we think that we're helping
people sometimes by doing things for them, and I think

(18:25):
that that often leaves people feeling that they are you know,
invalids or give kind of faltering then in their sense
of self. And that's to say that I think that
we can encourage people that it's not the end of

(18:45):
their their well being or their quality of life to
be developing cognitive impairment or physical disability, and that as
we destigmatize it and talk about it, that can help
them to be more willing to accept the help or
workups medical workups that we're recommending as well. And again,

(19:10):
can't reiterate it often enough that talking about it helps.
So rather than feeling like it's a shameful secret or
that you know, oh dad's repeating himself, you know, we
can be open and not feel embarrassed or shame about it.

(19:31):
I think if we can take this kind of different tact,
that this is sometimes a natural thing that happens, and
that we can still have a long and quality life
even as we're developing some of these issues.

Speaker 1 (19:47):
People want to stand their homes as long as they can,
but safety certainly is an issue there. What are some
strategies for supporting seniors independence while making sure they're safe.

Speaker 4 (19:58):
Yeah, I'd like people to approached their care providers or
their primary care doctors to make sure that we are
diagnosing and supporting their medical issues and cognitive issues, and
then potentially directing to appropriate resources like social work who
can get them community connections. There are many, you know,

(20:21):
ways that people get support in the home, whether it's
through self pay or sometimes if people qualify for Medicaid
or other services that are going to go be provided
for them by social safety net types of things or
community programs. There are many things out there, but without

(20:47):
kind of being in the know and being directed, it's
hard to even be aware of some of that. I
think that kind of the primary care is often a
portal for some of that knowledge. Not that the physicians
them selves are aware of it, but we are able
to often direct people to the right resources.

Speaker 1 (21:06):
Doctor Howard, anything else you'd like to add.

Speaker 4 (21:08):
I'd like to just encourage everyone during the upcoming holiday
season to consider seeing our loved ones and having these conversations,
whether it seems like something is changing in our loved
ones or not having a conversation about an advanced directive

(21:29):
is always worthwhile if we are.

Speaker 5 (21:32):
Seeing changes, you know, having a a open and beginning
maybe conversation about some of the things that we're seeing
can just pay off down the line by being prepared
and being supportive.

Speaker 4 (21:47):
So I just want to thank you for giving me
the opportunity to talk with everybody about that.

Speaker 1 (21:53):
Doctor Howard, thanks for joining us on local Voices. That
is Kaiser Prevalente Northwest geriatrician doctor Mary Brian Howard discussing
how to use holiday gatherings as a way to discuss
future planning with older relatives. Oregon Governor Teita Kotech signed
the transportation bill this week, more than a month after
it was passed by the legislature. Legally, she can wait

(22:14):
until now, but it also takes time away from opponents
who want to send it to voters. State Senate Minority
Leader Republican Bruce Starr joins us on Local Voices, but
it is what are your thoughts on the delay by
the governor.

Speaker 6 (22:26):
Well, I think it's disrespectful to Oregon voters to shorten
the window that is available to them under the constitution
on a referendum. You know, clearly she would prefer that
the voter's not way in. She doesn't want to give
Oregon voters the opportunity. So she delayed and delayed and delayed,

(22:47):
and here we are. So she had until Wednesday, So
theoretically she did it two days, you know, two days earlier.
But at the end of the day, she made it
more difficult for Oregonians to have their voice heard on
as issue.

Speaker 1 (23:01):
Would this have happened if the bill had bipartisan support
moving through the legislature through the special session.

Speaker 6 (23:07):
No, no, it wouldn't. That's historically transportation policy, transportation bills
like this have been bipartisan. They've been negotiations, there's collaboration,
you know, there's compromise. Not everybody gets what they want,
and yet we come together to address issues that are
that are that have to be addressed. And that process

(23:31):
did not occur. It didn't occur at the at the
end of the regular legislator session when the when the
supermajority tried to move a massive bill through that that failed,
and then the governor took the ball by the horns
and and crafted this plan. And when she called me
to say, hey, I'm going to call a special session,

(23:52):
will you show up, I mean, her question to me
is will you show up? Will you? Will you come
to the building when we when I call the session,
and I said, quote, sure, Yeah. She didn't call me
up and say what do I need to do to
get Republican support. So that's that's the reality that we're
faced with right now. And if we had had a collaborative,
bipartisan process, I don't believe we would be in the

(24:15):
process of taking a bill to the voters.

Speaker 1 (24:19):
Yeah, talk to us about the effort to send the
measure to voters next November. What now to gather seventy
eight thousand signatures?

Speaker 6 (24:28):
Yeah, so a little over seventy eight thousand signatures required.
Our goal is to get over one hundred thousand, so
that we have a margin a cushion there. We've got
over four thousand volunteers that have signed up and raised
their hand and said hey, I'm interested in signing or
carrying a petition. We've had, you know, that kind of response.

(24:51):
It's not surprising to me when you look at the
engagement that occurred both during the end of the regular
session in in July or June, and then you look
at the engagement that occurred in the special session from
Oregonians from all over the state opposed to this plan.
That Oregonians are really chomping at the bit to get

(25:14):
those petitions out and get them signed. We've got pulling
out at the demonstrates at p eighty six percent of
Oregonians wants to have the opportunity to vote on it.
We have pulling out at the demonstrates. Oregonians were very
much opposed to the governor's plan, you know, but we
it is it's tough. I mean, there's I'm not gonna
I'm not going to tuggercoat the fact that we've got

(25:35):
a very limited amount of time to gather a lot
of signatures, you know, and that's that's clearly because the
governor held the bill.

Speaker 1 (25:44):
If people want to find a location where the signatures
are being gathered, is there a is there a website?
Is there a way that people can find that.

Speaker 6 (25:53):
Stop the Gas Tax dot com? Is the website Stop
the Gas Tax dot com? And there's an opportunity to
engage with the campaign there, and you know, we will
on the twenty second. There's going to be a statewide
effort and those locations all over the state of Oregon
will be will be shouted from the mountaintops. Oregonians will

(26:16):
have ample opportunity to find places to sign these petitions.
I personally intend to go door to door in my
legislative district to talk to my constituents and get my
constituents too to sign this petition. I'm encouraging all of
my colleagues on the Republican side of the Aisle to
do that, and our Republican candidates that are running for

(26:38):
you know, state House and state Senate, use this as
an opportunity to go and have a conversation with Oregonians
because we know that Oregonians are opposed to this bill,
and we want to give Oregonians the opportunity to vote
on it.

Speaker 1 (26:53):
And so explain what happens if you get enough signatures
and they're verified and this will go on the ballot.
What happens to the law.

Speaker 6 (27:00):
So the parts of it that we are referring, we're
not referring the entire measure it would it's I don't know,
fifty or sixty pages. So we're only referring for the taxes,
the gas tax increase, the title and registration fee increases,
and the payroll tax increase. So for four parts of
the bill, basically four sections of the bill we're actually referring.

(27:23):
So when we qualify, when we have the Secretary of
State says, yep, you've got the signatures. Those taxes are
put on hold. They they're not enacted, they do not
go into law, and they're just basically put in a
in a hiatus until on November general election of next year,

(27:45):
when you know the measure that is on the ballot
and Oregonians will get to vote. So that's what happens.
Those taxes are not levied on Oregonians. They're not you know,
nobody's paying more the gas prompt, nobody's paying more when
you're reads through your vehicle, and nobody's paying more in
that payroll tax.

Speaker 1 (28:06):
I know during the summer, the governor was saying that
there would be layoffs if this didn't pass. If that happens,
what happens to odon.

Speaker 6 (28:18):
So that you raise a very good point. So the
Republicans would would suggest that the Governor's who was any
Oregonions a false choice and it's really going to be
up to her at that moment in time, though the
legislature will be in session in February, so and the
Secretary of State has until till January twenty ninth to

(28:39):
verify the signature, so basically a month to verify the signature.
So if the Secretary of State takes that long, it's
in theory we won't know for sure until the end
of the month, and then you know, the Legislature will
be back in the building in February, So it's up
to the governor. The governor can follow through with their
threats to lay off employees and cause pain and harm

(29:00):
to our economy, or she can come to the legislature
and hopefully Republicans and say, hey, we've got a problem.
Let's figure out how we solve this. And you know,
the alternative is to provide the Department of Transportation flexibility
within its budget so they can move money from places
that are less important to places that are more important

(29:22):
and fund you know, making sure that our roads are
cleared in the winter time so that our economy isn't
isn't harmed or hampered.

Speaker 1 (29:31):
That state sent up minority later, Republican Bruce Starr discussing
the transportation bill signed by the governor this week and
a signature gathering effort that's now under way to send
the issue to voters in November twenty twenty six. If
it passes, then it would pause the new taxes and
fees and let voters decide. Thanks for listening to Local Voices,
I'm brad Board. You can hear past episodes on the

(29:53):
iHeartRadio app under the podcast tab. Local Voices is a
public affairs presentation from iHeartRadio
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Ruthie's Table 4

Ruthie's Table 4

For more than 30 years The River Cafe in London, has been the home-from-home of artists, architects, designers, actors, collectors, writers, activists, and politicians. Michael Caine, Glenn Close, JJ Abrams, Steve McQueen, Victoria and David Beckham, and Lily Allen, are just some of the people who love to call The River Cafe home. On River Cafe Table 4, Rogers sits down with her customers—who have become friends—to talk about food memories. Table 4 explores how food impacts every aspect of our lives. “Foods is politics, food is cultural, food is how you express love, food is about your heritage, it defines who you and who you want to be,” says Rogers. Each week, Rogers invites her guest to reminisce about family suppers and first dates, what they cook, how they eat when performing, the restaurants they choose, and what food they seek when they need comfort. And to punctuate each episode of Table 4, guests such as Ralph Fiennes, Emily Blunt, and Alfonso Cuarón, read their favourite recipe from one of the best-selling River Cafe cookbooks. Table 4 itself, is situated near The River Cafe’s open kitchen, close to the bright pink wood-fired oven and next to the glossy yellow pass, where Ruthie oversees the restaurant. You are invited to take a seat at this intimate table and join the conversation. For more information, recipes, and ingredients, go to https://shoptherivercafe.co.uk/ Web: https://rivercafe.co.uk/ Instagram: www.instagram.com/therivercafelondon/ Facebook: https://en-gb.facebook.com/therivercafelondon/ For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iheartradio app, apple podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.com

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