Ep. 89: Thunder Punch Back Against Pacers, Tie Series 1-1. Takeaways, Concerns, and More - 06/09/25

Sean Barnard and Sam Oshtry discuss Game 2 of the #NBAFinals, as the #Thunder even up the series against the #Pacers with a resounding win.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Two NBA Finals games are in the book.

Speaker 2 (00:02):
In the series, we'll head back to Indiana with this
series split one one. I'm pretty expected somewhat blowout for
the Oklahoma City Thunder. Pretty much controlled that game from
start to finishing. After and absolutely thrilling Game one. I
think this was a bit of the boring concern that
we had going into this NBA Finals, But nonetheless, basketball
is basketball. We're gonna break things down. Oh for you
guys right here on Picks and Roll, my name is

(00:24):
Sean Bnard here with Sam Austria. As always Sam Howie.
Feeling after the Game two. I don't want to call
it a slumberfest. We're gonna get excited about this game.
But what was your first opening takeaway from last night?

Speaker 3 (00:35):
We have a Finals which is great. Like I was
going to this series pretty much expecting that this was
gonna be a blowout. This was I had in five games.
I'm not completely convinced it won't end in five games yet,
but I had it going five games. And it's because
of the talent, disparity and just everything. The Thunder do
so much better than the Pacers. And then you have

(00:56):
Game one happen and you're like, all right, we have
a series, and I kind of expected.

Speaker 4 (00:59):
The Thunder come out and roll last night, but I
wasn't gonna.

Speaker 3 (01:02):
Bet it because I can never really bet against the
Spacers team. And even when the Thunder go up twenty,
it's not like a I can tune out of this
game now, because you can't with the Pacers because we
know what they're capable of with their comebacks. So we
got a finals now, and we'll kind of talk about
why this series is won one and how the Thunder
we're able to win game two.

Speaker 2 (01:21):
Yeah, one hundred percent there, And I do think both
these teams have sort of won the game by their
blueprint and buy that. With the Pacers, I mean, they
just hang around and hang around and give themselves a
chance and go out and steal it. And that's what
they did in game one. If the game was forty
seven minutes long, we'd be talking about a two to
oho Thunder victory right now.

Speaker 1 (01:38):
But they play forty eight for a reason.

Speaker 2 (01:40):
And then in game two, a really kind of convincing
down at victory that has come to be expected from
this Oklahoma City Thunder team. Defensively, you felt the intensity
that you could feel the foot was on the gas
for a little bit longer and a little bit firmer
throughout this entire matchup there in game two, But ultimately
it is one one.

Speaker 1 (01:56):
It is the first of four.

Speaker 2 (01:58):
So I throw it to you, Sam, who's in a
better spot with this being a one to one series?
Which of these teams should feel better about how the
first two games went.

Speaker 3 (02:06):
The Pacers, of course, should be happy that they're they're
going back to Indiana one to one like that is
a complete win. Splitting those two games, No, Klama City
is a complete, complete win. The reason why the Thunder
should still feel really good and should still feel better
is because they know they're the better team and they
completely have outpit played the Pacers for like whatever forty

(02:27):
eight I can't through the mental math right now, whatever
forty eight plus forty eighties ninety six I guess, so
I guess ninety five of the ninety six minutes they
pretty much completely outplayed the Pacers, And so that's why
they should feel good about themselves. Was what you saw
yesterday in that game too, was kind of what we
thought coming into the series, where the Thunder were just
the remarkably better team and they didn't dominate the possession

(02:49):
battle like the Indiana's turnovers were way down.

Speaker 4 (02:52):
But the difference between that fluci game one win with.

Speaker 3 (02:54):
The Pacers first through other series is when you go
back to that nixt series and you go back to
the Cleveland series, the Pacers were or had a case
as the better team or even at the very worst,
were even teams against the Knicks and the Calves and
all and the Bucks and all those other teams that
they that they played. So when they had those fluky
game one wins, like when you go back to that

(03:15):
fluky game one win against the Knicks, that was so
bad and devastating for the Knicks because those teams were
even at best. So it's gonna be so difficult for
the Knicks to come back from that game and and
have an opportunity to win four of their next six games,
which is what the Knicks would have had to do.
It's different with a thunder because yes, that was a

(03:36):
fluky game one win and it's another improbable comeback. And
the Tyre Saliban is on an absurd clutch run of
just making the most insane clutch shots going back to
the regular season, where he's hit thirteen was last fifteen shots,
go ahead or game tying shots in the last two minutes
of the fourth quarter or overtime. So it's a remarkable
clutch run. And it's a fluky win where they just

(03:56):
defy all win probability charts and all lives about who
should win basketball games with teams are up a certain amount,
but the Thunder of the remarkably better team, and that
that's without question. So the Thunder can still feel good
about coming back in the series when they're down one
zero after a flukey win because they know the better
team and that's what they showed yesterday. So I'm still

(04:16):
saying the Thunder or in a better spot.

Speaker 1 (04:19):
Yeah, I think that's all very well said.

Speaker 2 (04:20):
But ultimately, like if I'm going to judge who accomplished
the most in these first two games, it's still the
answer is the Indiana Pacers to me, just from the
fact that the result is the result.

Speaker 1 (04:29):
You got the split there.

Speaker 2 (04:30):
But those first two games certainly didn't increase my optimism
that the Pacers will be winning this series. I continue
to root for this Pacers team. I think they're fun
to watch. I love the way that they don't quit.
But there is a very clear gap in talent here,
and I also think there is some things to critique
from the Oklahoma City Thunder coaching perspective here that we
kind of saw the youth show up, I think for
the first time, making what I believe was a premature

(04:52):
adjustment in taking Heart and Stee out of the starting lineup,
which by the way, they stuck with last night, and
even that didn't fully harm them, Like they really got
some success with having Casey Willis in the starting lineup
generating turnovers. The Pacers also deserve credit for limiting the
impact off those turnovers that yes, they turned it over
twenty five times, but they only made or got eleven
points generated off that in Game one there there was

(05:13):
some really impressive transition defense, but it did feel to
me like the Thunder out smarted themselves a bit, particularly
in Game one he went with a no center lineup
for a stretch there. Chad Holmgren was obviously struggling a
major deal. We got aj Mitchell minutes in games one
of the of the NBA Finals here, Like I just
felt like they got a bit too cute with it,

(05:33):
and last night was the true put the foot on
the gas and that's what we expect there.

Speaker 3 (05:37):
So just to your point about those adjustments from Oklahoma City,
you're one hundred percent right, Like the Thunders coaching staff
is maybe as good as it gets in the league. Yeah,
it was just going away from their identity and a
bad decision. So I don't really care about not starting Asaiahnstein.

Speaker 4 (05:51):
That's fine.

Speaker 3 (05:52):
I don't really mind them going somewhat small, but to
play lineups which you never did all season, haven't throughout
the playoffs without a center, and that's you closed with.

Speaker 4 (06:00):
You closed with chet.

Speaker 3 (06:01):
Holmgren and Isaiah Hearnstein on the bench, and you match
the Pacers. You should make the Pacers match you. You're
the better team, You're the team that won sixty eight games,
you're the team with a historically great net rating, and
you dominate possession battles, one of the best defenses we've
ever seen.

Speaker 4 (06:16):
You don't go small in those situations.

Speaker 3 (06:18):
So I don't mind them benching Isaiah Hartenstein in terms
of taking them out of the starting lineup. But what
you saw in the adjustment in game two was they
never played a lineup without either Chet Holmgren or Isaia
Hartenstein on the floor, and in game one they got
out rebounded by I believe it was seventeen. It was
fifty six to thirty nine. Was they got out rebounded.
In game two, they won the rebounding battle. That's always

(06:40):
been a concern with the Thunder when they play small,
is the rebounding.

Speaker 4 (06:43):
They were really bad last year.

Speaker 3 (06:45):
God get Isaiah Hartenstein to help with that, help with
their defensive course. And what you saw in that game too,
was they went with their double big lineup for the
first time all series. It was only five minutes, but
those guys were great defensively together in those five minutes.
And there was even a moment like you put Heart
and Stein as a screener, he gets the ball in
the short role. We know how great of a playmaker
Isaiah Hartenstein is in the short role. Chet Holmkin's in

(07:07):
the dunker spike. There was a lob up to Chet Holgren.
Like those two guys developed chemistry throughout the year. Those
two bigs work really well together with both good passing bigs,
good finishing bigs. We know Chet can be a perimeter player,
he can shoot. I really like when they're on the
floor together. It was only five minutes yesterday, I would
like to see more of that. But the point was
that he never that the Thunder never went small. They

(07:27):
always had one center on the floor. So yeah, I
thought that was a mistake in game one. Evidently they
thought it was a mistake too, and they acknowledged their
own self mistakes. And then in game two they'd never
played a lot up without a set on the floor,
So that was a great adjustment from Okc's perspective.

Speaker 2 (07:42):
Yeah, one hundred percent. And it was nice to see
Chet Hongren shake off some struggles. He played very poorly
in game one and was off to a slow start
again last night, but did get things together, ultimately finishing
with fifteen points and six rebounds. And I thought you
really felt his presence out there. So I always started
to get concerned that the lights might have gotten a
little bit too bright for Chet. It was nice to
see him settle in and be a key part of
this team. Now, we've talked plenty about kind of the

(08:04):
depth of both these teams, the Oklahoma City Thunders specifically here,
but to bring it over to the Indiana Pacers, we
do have to look right at the head of the
snake when talking about where things went south. A little
bit yesterday, tyrese Haliburton your favorite player here, Sam. He's
gotten plenty of flowers throughout these playoff runs, and deservedly
so that he is mister clutch. He has a ton
of big shots here. But I think what is different

(08:24):
about Haliburton compared to these top end stars that he's
kind of clawing his way into conversation with is they
don't have the dips in the way that he does. Now,
his peer stats last night look better than his game
ultimately was that he finished with seventeen points six as says,
three rebounds there, had two steals and two blocks, but
seven of thirteen from the field, and it's one of
those games where you did not feel his impact out

(08:45):
there for the vast majorities, certainly the first two and
a half three quarters there.

Speaker 1 (08:49):
What do you make of Haliburton's performance last night?

Speaker 3 (08:53):
Tyreu's Haliburn conversation has been one of the more nauseating
conversations regarding an individual player throughout these last two months
and this entire playoff roun. I mean, the swings and
I get it we're in the media. I get the
conversations we have to have every day, but the swings
on him from maybe he's the best player in the league,
you would think, but by how some people were talking
it's player, superstar, this and that from to what you

(09:18):
see with some of these performances like Game five against
the Knicks and of course last night. And it's ironic
because he was a guy recently in a press conference
who said, you know, there's a lot of box score
watchers out there who don't really understand his impact on
the game. But if you actually look at the box
score yesterday, you would think he had a decent game.
But the box score in this case doesn't help him,

(09:39):
or it does help him, but if you actually watch
the game, it hurts him because what you still in
the first three quarters is he only had five points.
He had twelve of those seventeen points in the fourth
quarter when the game was pretty much already had to read.
It was mostly around a fifteen to twenty point game
that entire time, and of course the Pacers can come
back from that, as we've seen, but it was the
Thunderhead come plea control of that game. No top ten

(10:03):
player or superstar or player who's even on top of
that magnitude has performances whereas, like you said, his presence
isn't felt where he's not even looking at the basket
to score.

Speaker 4 (10:13):
And the thunder defense deserve a lot of credit.

Speaker 3 (10:15):
I mean the ball pressure, their pickup point on him,
and their ball pressure is phenomenal when he gets in
the lane, how they swarm and collapse, and their health
defenders are always on the right right spot. They rotate
and recover incredibly well. So they were swarming him, and
that's what I kind of expected why I thought Tyree
s Aliburn would have a bad series coming in because
of this thunder defense and how they help on drives.

(10:37):
Now they prevent guards from getting into the lane because
of their aggressive ball pressure and because of their health
defense and how they collapse on drives, And that's what
you saw yesterday. But what you also saw was how
passive he was. Great players. We're talking about superstar level players,
which I've heard this, I think on the shy Roun
on ESPN. I've seen Tyree Saliburn the word superstar like

(10:58):
ten times during this playoff run. Superstar players, which is
a dumb conversation because obviously not that.

Speaker 4 (11:04):
But superstar players.

Speaker 3 (11:06):
You feel their presence every single night it doesn't matter.
Anthony Edwards can have a six for twenty four shooting game.
Those twenty four shots are going up, Like you know,
Anthony Edwards is out there making stuff happen.

Speaker 4 (11:18):
Even if he's not playing well, they're shooting well.

Speaker 3 (11:20):
You will always you can have a bad performance, but
you can't you can't let go of the rope. You
can't like not maintain an aggressive nature offensively. And I
get he's him. Being aggressive doesn't mean scoring the ball
all the time. It means kicking. But he was passive yesterday.
He was not aggressive, and that's not what you see
from superstars. Superstars do not have five points through three quarters,

(11:42):
like it's just not not top ten players, none of that.
So yeah, Tyres Aliburn is on an absurd clutch run.
He is a great, great player, he really is, and
what he's done this year to carry this Pacers team
is remarkable. He should have won Eastern Conference Finals MVP.
It was a travesty he didn't because he is the
best player on the Pacers and he was the best
player in that next series. And this clutch run that
I talked about earlier is remark we've never seen anything

(12:05):
like this in NBA history, we really have thirteen. He's
made thirteen of his last fifteen shots with to go
ahead or game time shots in the final two minutes.
That is unheard of. Like, that's like good clutch numbers.
When people were like Kobe Bryant's a great clutch player.
His clutch efficiency numbers are awful. He just all constantly
met the moment on big shots. But for Tyre's Halliburn,

(12:29):
it's like, yeah, that's great, He's done that at a
really high level. I still am not buying that he
is like this top ten player because top ten players
don't have performances like they had last night.

Speaker 2 (12:39):
So if we're gonna be super strict with the superstar label,
I will note that Anthony Edwards was held to thirteen
field goal attempts twice in the same series against this
thunder team. Here, I'm not here to argue that Tyreuse
Halburn is in that top here of elite conversation. I
think it is we can all kind of come to
the conclusion that he's a guy that has made the
most of this moment, that is a very good basketball player.

(13:01):
I think comfortably I would put him as a top
top fifteen NBA player.

Speaker 1 (13:06):
Do you think that is fair?

Speaker 4 (13:07):
Probably?

Speaker 3 (13:08):
I mean I have to go through the entire list,
probably top fifteen to top twenty.

Speaker 1 (13:13):
Yeah, I think that fair.

Speaker 2 (13:15):
This is kind of the closest comp that I've I
was really thinking through and doing this as like a
thought exercise, trying to get to it. I think Jimmy
Butler is the closest thing I can get to. Is
like where he is from a range perspective, because Jimmy
Butler is a guy that when he has his heights,
that he will put a team on his back, carried play,
carry a roster through a playoff series, certainly a guy
who likes that clutch time shot. But there's also a

(13:37):
lot of games that I've watched Jimmy Butler where he
doesn't look that interested in playing basketball, where he'll go
through the motions, particularly in the regular season. There Halburton
is a different flavor of that for sure, that he's
got more energy, he's got more juice, and is obviously
stylistically very different as a basketball player. But do you
think that is fair from a range perspective or where
he stands up around the league.

Speaker 4 (13:57):
I don't love it.

Speaker 3 (13:58):
I don't love it because look, Jimmy Butler right now
is not Jimmy Butler as prime. I mean, Jimmy Butler
passes his prime. When Jimmy Butler's in his prime. He
always met the moment like he rarely had playoff duds.
We know he was a different player in the rege
season and playoffs. Don't think you could say that about Haliburn.
Like Haliburton was great to close this regular season. He
didn't start the year great, but he was great in

(14:20):
the last three months or so in the regular season
and he made an All NBA team.

Speaker 4 (14:23):
Because of that.

Speaker 3 (14:25):
With Jimmy Butler, it's like he doesn't try as I
don't know if try as hard, but he's not the
same players in the regular season, but he elevates his
performance in the playoff. What we see him Tyres Haliburn
is he elevates his performance in the clutch and the
final few minutes of games. That's been remarkable from him.
But you've still seen playoff duds like he had a
game I talked about Game five against the n next
very struggle. He had four points in a game against

(14:46):
the Cavs. So Jimmy Butler never had those playoff duds
in his prime.

Speaker 4 (14:51):
Yeah sure.

Speaker 3 (14:51):
Now when he's without Steph Curry's passed his prime, he
can't be a one a guy. But Jimmy Butler I
knew was going to have a great game every single
night in the playoffs during his prime, during when he
carried the Heat to the finals. Both those times, you
can count on Jimmy Beller every single night, you know,
at least once a series and maybe more. Tyre's Halliburn
is going to have a dot of a game. He's
gonna have a game where he just looks passive, where

(15:13):
yet the defense is is is putting a lot of
ball pressure on him and swarming his drives, and then
he becomes passive because of that, Like great players will
continue to stay aggressive despite that. I thought the Pacers
did a good job of kind of putting him off
the ball and running running him through some off ball
actions which got him involved more, maybe getting getting him
ahead of steam Downhill. I thought the Patriers did a

(15:35):
good job adjusting to that. But still Tyrus Alburn is
the point guard, Like he's the guy you want. You
want him to have the ball more than ever, So
I don't love the comparison but I'll also get like,
I get your point. All your points are certainly valid
on it.

Speaker 2 (15:48):
Yeah, I honestly I would argue back that I think
we do see those with Jimmy where we do see
the duds on occasion where and what jimmy My takeaway
is hill which with this does not apply to Haliburn.
Jimmy will throw the talent for certain games that when
when the job is done, where they'll take a one hour,
serious lead, and then that team's obviously bringing their best
punch back. I've seen Jimmy Butler in the second quarter

(16:09):
seemingly have that realization of Yep, tonight's not the night,
let's pack it up, get ready for Game three.

Speaker 1 (16:13):
That is not something that applies to Alburn.

Speaker 2 (16:15):
I also think just pure talent wise, I would argue
tell that Halliburton is a more talented.

Speaker 1 (16:19):
Basketball player just purely on skill.

Speaker 2 (16:21):
Obviously, Jimmy does more defensively, and they both have very
different strengths and weaknesses. But I don't know, I think
that the tyrese Haliburton the conversation has swung too.

Speaker 1 (16:29):
Far in both directions for sure.

Speaker 3 (16:31):
There, Yeah, because it's that's what happens when you have
a playoff run like like the pass are On, which
is a pretty improbable run. But it's like, I just
when you and it's I don't want to hold hold
him to the standard. But that's what people are saying,
is that superstar, top ten player, So what if you're
going to claim that I have to hold him to
this standard and he hasn't met that standard time and

(16:52):
time again. Yeah, he has in the clutch certain moments.
He didn't play good in Game one, like he didn't
play well in Game one. He struggled in Game one
for the similar reasons we talked to because of the
stuff Oklahoma City was doing defensively. But it doesn't really
matter what he did in game one because he had
the remarkable game winner, which is all that matters. But
he didn't play well in Game one either, So yeah,
I'm just it's just when you have when you're holding

(17:14):
him to the standard of like top ten player, superstar,
which he isn't, and he shouldn't be held to that standard.
He's a great player, who's the best player on a
team that is in the NBA Finals right now, and
he is the Pacers engine. Like everything the Pacers do
offensively with their pace and everything. It's because of who
he is as a player. But I can't hold him
to the standard of like Steph Curry's or Anthony Edwards
or some of these guys.

Speaker 4 (17:35):
Who are who are really true superstars.

Speaker 3 (17:38):
And it's not fair to him necessarily, but when the
conversation becomes that ridiculous, oh, top ten player in the league,
you have to hold him to that standard.

Speaker 1 (17:46):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (17:47):
No, I get your point there, and that's that's very
fair as well.

Speaker 1 (17:50):
So we've talked plenty about Halliburton here.

Speaker 2 (17:52):
If we're looking ahead to how this Pacers team can
find a way to win this series or at least
win the next game here, does it purely fall on
the shoulders of Tyree's Haliburton has to be better? Or
what other adjustments are you looking for from this Pacers team.

Speaker 3 (18:04):
Yeah, so I thought the Pacers did a much better
job in game two of not turning it over like
I obviously that was it was remarkable they twenty four
turnovers in game one and somehow still won the game.
But that was because the PACER's transition defense was so good.
I mean, even all of those turnovers did a great
job of getting back on defense and preventing the Thunder
to get transition opportunities and points off of turnovers, which

(18:27):
the Thunder have done so well on all year. I
mean they led the entire NBA in points off turnovers
because they forced more turnovers than any other team. The
Pacers transitions of defense was great in game one Game two,
they did a great job of elimiting those turnovers.

Speaker 4 (18:41):
And I thought the recipe.

Speaker 3 (18:42):
I thought the recipe was there where It's like, if
you limit those turnovers, you're not going to give the
Pacers or excuse me, the Thunder fast break opportunities, and
the Thunder didn't have that many fast break opportunities. I
think a big reason of what the Pacers need to
do is you have to put more pressure on Shit.
And she had a really good Game one, but not
a great Game one. He was brilliant in Game two,

(19:03):
I mean, getting to every spot he wanted to, getting
off the ball more and letting the ball come back
to him. There was so many possessions in game one
where they didn't really it was they like Shay had
the ball and those possessions ended without him even passing it.
Once he passed the ball up more, getting off the ball,
let the ball come back to him. Let the Thunder
run a ton of actions confuse the Pacers defense, and

(19:24):
I thought the Thunder did that really well in game two.
What the Pacers need to do is they need to
send everything at Shay and just make a Jalen Williams
and chet Holmgrin beat. You're right that chet Holmgren was
better in game two, especially early. He was more aggressive,
he looked more comfortable. Jalen Williams was still pretty efficient
in game two, or excuse me, inefficient inefficient in game two.

(19:45):
The Thunder so deep, which is why they're so impossible
to beat, is because you have a guy like Aaron
Wiggins come out and finally have a great performance from him,
guy who really fell out of the rotation against the
late in that series. Against the Timberwolves, you have Lou
Dord hit five threes in game one. So there's so
many different guys that can step up, but you have
to make the secondary scorers beat you. Like Shay cannot
be going for thirty plus, he can't be shooting as

(20:05):
much as he has been the last two games, and
that part of that is you have to just send
everything at them, like their nail help has been really
good the Pacers, but I would do more than just
have heavy nail help. I would send double, constant doubles
at him. I would be blitzing all of his ball screens,
get the ball out of Shay's hands, and force the
Thunders others to beat you.

Speaker 2 (20:25):
Yeah, And it's interesting because the Pacers have sort of
approach things through throughout this entire playoff run with the
exact opposite mentality that they can kind of let the
star get there is to an extent, as long as
you're not allowing it to collapse your.

Speaker 1 (20:37):
Entire defense when you are sending multiple bodies.

Speaker 2 (20:39):
Look at Jalen Brunson and how many impressive scoring outputs
that he had with the intention of we're going to
keep leaving on in one on one coverage, so it
isn't creating collapsing the defense, kicking to others and start
of keeping things to unwind. Donovan Mitchell the same story
in the Cavaliers series, where he put up these heroic
individual stat lines, but it didn't really translate from a
team perspective. And I do think that they're following a

(21:00):
somewhat similar blueprint with how they're electing to guard Shay Here.

Speaker 1 (21:03):
Yeah, I agree, there was nice to see the guys
step up.

Speaker 2 (21:06):
Caruso as well have an awesome performance off the bench,
and they do have just so many of these guys
that can get hot on any given night. But it's
I do think like Shay's in particular Game one. I
know he had thirty eight points, but thirty shot attempts
is a lot, and it didn't feel like they were
the natural shot attempts like it did felt like he
was chasing the moment in a way that I thought.

Speaker 1 (21:25):
He just played more free basketball in Game two. So
that is what a.

Speaker 3 (21:29):
Big indicator of that is three assists in game one
versus eight assist in game two. Yeah, three assists is
way below his season average. He's a guy that gets
underratedly good passer and then racks up assists.

Speaker 4 (21:40):
So three assists is just proof that.

Speaker 3 (21:42):
He was I don't want to say selfish necessarily, but
it was just a lot of one on one not
passing and getting off the ball, which he did much
better of in Game two.

Speaker 2 (21:51):
Yeah, And I do think some of that, like was
by design from a Pacers' perspective, and that's the way
that they were playing. They would rather live with those
mid range tough shots that Shaye likes to get to
comparison to open threes kicked out of the perimeter, that
there was not a lot of you know, collapsing the
way the Thunder do so effectively every time Halliburton attacks
the basket and there are five bodies in the.

Speaker 1 (22:09):
Paint prevading them.

Speaker 2 (22:10):
The Thunder really have or the Pacers haven't really done
a lot of that when guarding Shay. So it will
be interesting to see how that plays out there from
the Thunder perspective. Is it just fully on the Jaylen
Williams and Chet Holmgren as you just mentioned, Are there
any other guys or X factors or thing that you're
looking to make sure they can take a full just
you know, stranglehold of this series.

Speaker 3 (22:30):
Well, I think that that's their advantage, which I mentioned earlier,
is their depth, Like they have so many different guys
where if Chet and Jalen struggled like they were, like again,
they should have won Game one, right, they didn't play
well by any means, I didn't the Thunder, but they
all still should have won Game one and that and
that was a bad Jaylen Williams game. Inefficient from him,
a really bad check game, didn't feel his presence, and
some bad coaching decisions too, But Ludord.

Speaker 4 (22:52):
Also had five to three.

Speaker 3 (22:53):
So you're always always gonna have another guy step up
for this Thunder team because they're so deep. It was
Aaron Wiggins night in Game two, and and he's a
guy I would rely on even more moving forward. It's
gonna it could be in Isaiah Joe Knight later in
this series. Alex Crusoe is always locked in defensively, and
we know what he brings from a roleplayerspective, but he
could have a game where he knocks down four threes
and as twenty four points.

Speaker 4 (23:15):
Like it's going to be a different guy every night.

Speaker 3 (23:17):
And that's why this Thunder team is so unbeatable because yeah,
they have the MVP of the league, but even when
their secondary scorers aren't producing, they're so deep in so
many different options. So that's what it is for me
and the Thunder need to do a better job of
converting their turnovers, yeah into points, like that's what that
we're best at all year, and they did a really
poor job of it. In credit to Indiana's transition defense,

(23:40):
but they did a really poor job of it in
game in Game one, when they had twenty four turnovers
and not a whole lot of points off turnovers, they
didn't turn the Pacers over as much, but they also
didn't capitalize on those transition opportunities. So like that, that's
what the Thunder need to do. Is like their half
court ofference has been good, but there's also been times
where it's stalled out, especially in that fourth quarter of
Game one the Thunder score. So the Thunder a great offense,

(24:03):
and there were better defense, but they're great offense because
of their defense, because of how well they force turnovers
and they get leakouts and get easy baskets and straangeestion.
So moving forward in the series, they're going to have
to do a better job of converting turnovers into ports.

Speaker 1 (24:20):
Yeah, now you're one hundred percent right about that.

Speaker 2 (24:21):
The only pushback that I would have is I do
think that is far more over a credit to the
way Indiana has managed to slow them down than what
Oklahoma three is doing in particular. But you're right, that
is the blueprint and something that they've been very reliant
on for production overall. The last guy that I really
wanted to primarily dive in in here is Pascal Siaka.

Speaker 4 (24:38):
Now.

Speaker 2 (24:38):
I undered this series with a little bit of belief
that this might be the real X factor from a
Pacers perspective, but I did not have a lot of
optimism for Haliburton being capable of breaking free having these
massive scoring games against the defense that you're gonna have
to face. The lou Dorts, the Alex Cruz Is, the
Jalen Williams. You can go down the list of all
these bodies that the Thunder can throw his direction. Sam

(24:59):
really hasn't played in the as much of an attack
mode as I would like to be in the case.
I know that he had nineteen points in Game one
last night, he finished was fourteen there, five of twelve
from the field, four of eight from three. It just
hasn't felt like he's risen to the moment and taking
things on as much as I would want, because when
I look at this from a matchup perspective, I don't
see anyone on this Thunder team that can match up

(25:20):
with him in the same way that is the case
for the Halliburtons and Nemhartz and Naysmith, as they have
so much dominant guard defense there Siakam taking on chet
Holgen or Isaiah Hartenstein, or if he is getting a
Jaln Williams matchup, whatever the case may be. I kind
of like the chances a little bit better there.

Speaker 1 (25:36):
So what have you.

Speaker 2 (25:37):
Thought from Pascal Siakam's perspective through these first two games?
And do you think I'm crazy to think he could
have that much of an impact.

Speaker 4 (25:43):
I thought he was gonna have a huge series too.

Speaker 3 (25:44):
Part of what was I thought Tyris Salivan's gonna struggle
a lot, so I thought they would, especially with the
ball pressure, so I thought they would put him off
the ball more and run more actions through Siakam. And
you saw a little bit more of that yesterday in
game two. But he hasn't really been that a great
which is kind of surprising. Like he was a bit
like I don't think he should have won Eastern Conmens
Finals MVP, but his aggressiveness against the Knicks was huge,

(26:08):
Like he was a huge part of why they won
that series. And there were nights where he was the
best player on the Pacers flour and he was just
remained aggressive and was dominating those matchups. Like Jayalen Williams
is a great defender, and Yeaham has the size advantage,
but like just Jiling Willim's base and his center of
gravity of how he guards Siakam, it's like he's really
hard to move. So Jayla Williams has success when he's

(26:29):
on him, but when it's chet Holmer Heartstein, like those
guys can't guard Siakam on the perimeter. So I think
number one, it's on the Pacers to to get him
more easy touches and easy looks. But it's also on
Siakam to remain more aggressive too, Like he can't there
can't be stints where he's not on the floor, especially
in the no Tyre's Haliburn minutes, Like the Pacers get
killed when Tyr's Haliburn is on the bench, but they

(26:51):
also keep Siakam on the floor, So like that's Siakam's
time to be the guy, Like they run everything through
him and he needs to be more aggressive. The Pacers
need to get finding ways to get easier touches. But yeah,
Siakam's scoring less than twenty or averaging less than twenty
in this series, the Pacers have no chance. They need
him to be a guy that's scoring at least twenty
four night.

Speaker 2 (27:10):
Yeah, and I think that fully falls on him, that
he needs to look himself in the mirror. That I
got to play an attack mode a little bit more
than has been the case there, but.

Speaker 1 (27:18):
Ultimately a lot more to get into.

Speaker 2 (27:19):
We will be live for game three on Wednesday, so
make sure we stay tuned in for that. We got
a ton of exciting stuff browing from a bet perspective.
We got the Wheel of Doom, we got the Box
of Bad Beats, we got plenty of fun stuff, a
super special guest, Yes, working on a potential super special guests,
so it would be uh, well, I'll be very excited
if we get to announce that there, But so make

(27:40):
sure you're tuned in live any other thoughts on Wednesdays, Sin, It's.

Speaker 3 (27:43):
Gonna be a time everyone's gonna want to tune in.
It's gonna be a time. I don't even know what
to expect, honestly, but going in nervous and excited and
hopefully hopefully we get a good guest there, which I
think everyone will know the name.

Speaker 2 (27:56):
Yeah, and I have two articles of clothing that I'm
praying get here in time I've won that's currently projected
to arrive at nine pm on Wednesday, So I'm hoping
that can get bumped up a little bit sooner.

Speaker 3 (28:06):
Than the articles of clothing. Can I get a hint? Uh, Indiana,
give me a hint.

Speaker 1 (28:11):
I'll say Indiana based articles of clothes.

Speaker 4 (28:13):
Well, you're an Indiana guy. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (28:15):
I don't have any allegiances to either of these teams,
so it's like, I don't even know what I'm gonna bet.

Speaker 4 (28:20):
I have to see.

Speaker 2 (28:21):
Yeah, you've been, if anything, a Pacers hater, I would say, yeah.

Speaker 3 (28:25):
I mean I've come around on them for good reason,
like they're in the finals. I've admitted I've been very
wrong about them. I've picked against them literally every single
series going back to even the Bucks, which is embarrassing
at this point, but it's true. So yeah, I mean
I would probably be on the Thunder to stay on Brands.

Speaker 1 (28:39):
Yeah, that is fair. But we'll see.

Speaker 2 (28:41):
I haven't even looked at what the line is for
Game three yet, so we'll be very interesting to see that.
I would assume the Thunder are still favors you. You
want to check on that as I start to swing
things here.

Speaker 4 (28:49):
Yeah, I'm gonna check on it right now.

Speaker 3 (28:51):
I'm gonna guess Thunder minus eight, maybe six seven seven?

Speaker 4 (28:58):
Thunder minus seven is my official guess you got an official.

Speaker 1 (29:00):
Guests, I'm go Thunder minus five. This, This is.

Speaker 4 (29:05):
Bingo Thunder minus five on that.

Speaker 1 (29:07):
Look at that?

Speaker 2 (29:08):
Yeah, this, I figured this would be the game that
they the Pacers would get the most respect from the book.
From a book's perspective, here is like, if they're gonna
win another, it's probably gonna be game three.

Speaker 1 (29:16):
Certainly games I would thought that.

Speaker 3 (29:18):
If it was two oh Thunder, because we've seen the
Thunder take their front off the gas when they've been up.

Speaker 4 (29:22):
To two oh before.

Speaker 3 (29:24):
But because it's one one going back to Indiana and
the Thunder, we're just eleven point favorites, like being home
court advantage, which I don't think matters that much. Is
this six point swing that's kind of surprising to me.
I'm definitely gonna be on the Thunder. I'll promise you
that right now.

Speaker 2 (29:38):
All right, well, we'll be going head to head for that,
So make sure you guys are tuned in to see
us yelling, getting rowdy, to transition a little bit out
of this NBA Finals game and kind of talk a
little bit around the league stuff a little bit of
a wide question. I want to start off with you,
is there one team in the NBA that you think
is the most interesting storyline this offseason that what they
do could have domino effects around the league, A team

(30:00):
that is holding the cards in the way from a
league perspective, or can really change the outlook of their
franchise his particular offseason. Is there a team that jumps
out to you with those sort of qualifications.

Speaker 3 (30:10):
It's it's the Bucks and it's because they have the
biggest domino of the off season. Sure, and that's giannis
Ante di Compo. Like I think a lot of teams
their entire officeason plan of their planned A, plan B,
plan C.

Speaker 4 (30:23):
A lot of it changes.

Speaker 3 (30:25):
People who have Plan A for pursuing giannis Ante do Compo,
their plans change if he doesn't become available. And it's
not just that like when the if a trade goes
down with him, it is going to be a massive
three team trade, a lot of moving parts. And what
you saw with like Damian Liveler trade a couple of
years ago is Drew Holliday was involved in that trade
and he went to Portland and then he was rerouted

(30:47):
to Boston and Boston ends up winning a championship in large.

Speaker 4 (30:50):
Part because of the addition of Drew Holiday.

Speaker 3 (30:52):
So like, it's not just Giannis, it's when whether it's
the Houston Rockets or the Knicks, which I don't think
is gonna happen, but potentially Nicks or like the Spurs
or whoever, whoever it could be that will pursue and
ultimately get Yannis. It's gonna be a lot of moving
parts in some type of three team dale deal to
make the salary caps and salary match matches work. So

(31:14):
there's gonna be other players involved in that deal that
will be rerouted to other players.

Speaker 4 (31:18):
So he's the biggest dominant.

Speaker 3 (31:20):
Then there's a lot like there's a lot of teams
that Giannis might be option a, Like a team like
the Rockets, Giannis might be option A. Okay, maybe it
doesn't become available. Ever the Bucks say we're keeping him,
he decides to stay. Maybe Kevin Durant becomes available, But
you're not pursuing Kevin and Durant because Giannest obviously hit
the blue chip guy and in this in this offseason storyline,

(31:40):
but you don't want Kevin Durant as a good plan
b He certainly, if you've opportuned to get Yannis, you're
not gonna go for Kevin Durant first. So it's all
up to Yannis and what happens, which is I kind
of expect a trade to be done or at least
pretty close to done by the NBA Draft because then
a lot of other teams can kind of start with
their offseason plan of how we're gonna approach, Like if

(32:00):
the Knicks don't get ultimately don't get Yanis, and I
don't think they will. I don't think any big move
will be coming. It's how do we build around the margins,
how do we work out this Bridge's extension. It's all
this other stuff. So Yannis is the ultimate domino to
fall of this offseason. So the Bucks hold all the cards,
and it's really not even the Bucks. It's more so
Yanis and what he decides to do. And there's been

(32:21):
some conflicting reports recently. Certain people are saying that there's
a possibility that he might actually decide to stay. And
I think if there's any player in the league who
would stay in this situation, it's probably honest because he's
a very loyal guy. He genuinely loves Milwaukee and is
grateful for his time there and him drafting them, and
then everything they've done for his family when he came

(32:41):
over from Greece. So I think there's a lot of
loyalty there. But I don't think anyone will blame him
for saying there's no contention to competing for a championship
with this organization, not next year, not for the next
few years. So I would like to go win a ring.
This is the second chapter, second half of my career,
and I'd like to be moved elsewhere. Will blame him
for that. I think that's what he should do. But

(33:03):
if he ultimately decides that's not as important as being
loyal to Milwaukee, then he might step Yeah, and I think.

Speaker 2 (33:09):
We romanticize this concept of guys staying with one team forever,
retiring at the same franchise that drafted you, which, don't
get me wrong, when it all works out according to.

Speaker 1 (33:17):
Plan is a beautiful thing. It is cool when things
play out that way.

Speaker 2 (33:20):
But in this specific situation, I think like the writing
is very clearly on the wall that Giannis has accomplished
everything he could accomplish in Milwaukee.

Speaker 1 (33:28):
He gave it all to that franchise.

Speaker 2 (33:30):
He won a championship there, became an MVP caliber player,
and I don't think there should be any hurt feelings
for both sides if they call it the end of
the road here from a pure franchise perspective, that probably
the best things for the interest of the Bucks is
to make a massive trade where you are getting picks
and young players and starting the reset. Here there is
not this like and I guess the only pushback that

(33:51):
you can point out is how weak the East is
and that if you have Giannis you have a chance.
And but I just don't see any direction. The Damian
Loward Achilles injury to me sealed the fate there. I
do hope ultimately that he has shipped somewhere else and
that we see another era of Gianni's basketball. My answer
for what the most interesting team is sort of tied
to the same conversation.

Speaker 1 (34:11):
But I think the San Antonio.

Speaker 2 (34:12):
Spurs are the most interesting team of this offseason, and
the reason I say that is they hold a lot
of the cards here for what they want to do. Obviously,
the second pick in the draft has been widely projected
to be Dylan Harper, with the full expectation here, but
they also could certainly get in the business of making
a big ticket trade if they want to that. They
obviously have se find Castle rookie the year last year,

(34:32):
Victor Woman Yama, who's ready to compete right now, a
ton of tradable contracts and intriguing young players, the likes
of Devin Bissell, Keldon Johnson, Harrison Barnes having that contract
to be stacked and added to the mix there. So
the Spurs I very clearly feel if they want to
take this next step and make this swing and kind
of grow into the contending conversation, which they sort of

(34:53):
revealed their hand this past year by trading for Daron Fox,
that they do intend to kind of make that kind
of lief.

Speaker 1 (34:58):
They can do. So.

Speaker 2 (34:59):
So if I could pick a preferred destination for Giannis,
it would be San Antonio. I've seen nothing credible that
seems to indicate that that would happen, but I continue
to keep my eyes out on that.

Speaker 3 (35:09):
Yeah, So if it's not Jannis, I certainly I could
see that happening too, And and Deren Fox might actually
be in that deal.

Speaker 4 (35:16):
But if he's not like Deer Fat Deer.

Speaker 3 (35:18):
And Fox, Giannis Vikdawmen Yama that's unbelievable defensively and not
a lot of shooting on the floor, and Steven Stefan
cast will probably be in that deal. I mean, they
certainly have the pieces where if they're interested that the
Bucks will listen to them intently because of how much
they have to offer in terms of picks and young assets.
It's really them in the Rockets that could probably put

(35:39):
the best deal on the table. But if it's not
Yannis to the Spurs, Like, is there another move that
you could see them doing that would make them the
most interesting team?

Speaker 4 (35:47):
Like, what, what's what's planned b for them? If it's
not Yannis.

Speaker 2 (35:51):
Yeah, I've seen a couple of the reports of durant
potential interest there.

Speaker 4 (35:54):
I don't love at all.

Speaker 1 (35:56):
Yeah, I don't love it. I probably wouldn't swing that.

Speaker 2 (35:58):
I would for Yiannis because I, like you said, he's
the blue chip guy and I really think that you
can build an identity that could work in the West
where you have this just lockdown defense, like good luck
scoring on a team with Giannis and Wemby on the
floor and the only real concern with giannest like you
mentioned the lack of shooting that he needs space to drive,
but Wemby can be completely comfortable being a floor spacer
and himself there. So I really see a world where

(36:20):
this could work. And my only like cautionary tale because
I had a little bit of this conversation with Mark
Kenry Junior on Saturday.

Speaker 1 (36:26):
The Spurs are very.

Speaker 2 (36:27):
Clearly kind of assumed to be taking the long view here,
though when you add Dylan Harper, you have this young
core with Harper, with Castle, with wenm mian Yama, and
obviously there are other young pieces as well. You don't
have to rush things. You can be a bit more selective.
But my cautionary tale is Victor Remanyama looks unbelievable.

Speaker 1 (36:44):
He's twenty one years old.

Speaker 2 (36:45):
We also know there isn't the strongest track record for
how long you have with players of this size, and
Webby frankly a more unique combination of.

Speaker 1 (36:52):
That than ever before.

Speaker 2 (36:53):
So while there's I'm not worried about it from Wemby's perspective,
and like the way that he takes his stretching seriously,
the way that he hasn't really had these notable injuries
outside of obviously the blood cloud issue. Which is in
a little bit of a category in its own right there,
Like I just would say the way that he's arrived
and is ready to compete right now, take advantage of
every year that you can get. So if the right

(37:15):
opportunity knocks you answer that door there.

Speaker 3 (37:18):
Yeah, I mean they would be malpracticed to rush the
timeline because you're concerned of potential wemby injuries, Like there's
for sure, there's there's nothing to indicate, Yes, the body
looks like this body could break, it's made out of glass,
but there's nothing actually substantial to indicate that, oh, this
guy's injury prone. He said, some injuries, but really the

(37:39):
big ones of course, like you said, the blood clout,
which isn't an actual injury.

Speaker 4 (37:42):
That's that's a health thing.

Speaker 3 (37:44):
So so I would never and I don't think the
Spurs will because they're obviously a very smart, well run
organization take that approach of we have to move up
this timeline like they have a young core.

Speaker 4 (37:54):
I think you moved that for a.

Speaker 3 (37:56):
Guy like Giannis, I mean it's a top three player
in the league. We know his impact on win. For
a guy like Kevin Durant, you absolutely don't that would
be just dumb, frankly, if you're going to for a
really talented player but a guy who doesn't impact winning
on that level, and you'd have to give up probably
the number two pick and other guys like you have
a great young core with Wemby, with if Dylan Harper

(38:16):
comes through, Stefan Castle, all these different guys, and now
you have Darren Fox in the next who's more of
a veteran. And Darren Fox is an imperfect player. He's
not not a great shooter at all, but I do
think he fits well with Wemby and I think they
those two guys could have a great season next year together.
So I'm not really I wouldn't. I would take the
long term approach with it from the Spurs perspective, especially

(38:38):
because Wemby is also on a decent contract right now,
like like number one pick, so it.

Speaker 1 (38:44):
Makes all NBA this season and then's getting plaid.

Speaker 4 (38:46):
That's what I'm saying.

Speaker 3 (38:47):
It's like it's like right now, but it won't be
for long. It won't be for long, so so I
don't know why you would just bring in a bunch
of guys who are really expensive, like maybe a Kevin Durant,
some veteran guys who are really expensive. When you're gonna
have to pay when be a ton later down, Like
you're gonna have to pay Wenby a ton pretty soon.
But you're gonna have all these like Dylan Harper will
be on a decent contract for a few years. Defon Castle,

(39:08):
all these different guys like your your luxury tax or
excuse me, your your salary cap works right now because
of the young pieces and you have such a talented
core where it's like you bring Dylan Harper in next
year bearing some health situations, and we know.

Speaker 4 (39:21):
How good the West is. This is a definitely should
be a playoff team.

Speaker 3 (39:24):
That's the expectation if we all think Wenby is as
good as he is, which I think all of us
believe that he's a top ten player in the league
right now. So this should be a playoff team next year.
There's no reason to rush it and rush this process
when you have such a great young core. So the
Spurs could make a lot of noise with with yan
It and with making a Giannis moove. Other than that,

(39:44):
it's kind of to me like stam Pat build around
the margin, similar to the Knicks.

Speaker 2 (39:49):
Yeah, I guess the more I reflect on this, this
is a little bit more of a Yannis or Nothing
sort of perspective here, and I just would take that
swing if you can get like a legitimate chance at
it that I do think that there's something too, having
a couple of years where it's Giannis and Wemby, and
it would be kind of cool to see that, like
follow the Spurs the Lords. Obviously there's been kind of
the double big man in guys passing the torch for
franchise history there, from Tim Duncans to David Robinson. You

(40:11):
can go down the list, So that would be pretty
cool to me if that's how things work out. But
we will see. So I mentioned Dylan Harper there at
number two. It is pretty widely just at this point
understood the draft's gonna start with that Sixers pick with
the third pick.

Speaker 1 (40:25):
Cooper Flag will go to the Mavericks for the first pick.

Speaker 2 (40:27):
The San Antonio Spurs or whoever is selecting second, will
draft Dylan Harper with that second pick here, and then
the Sixers will be on the clock at three. So
you and I have not seen eye to eye on
the draft conversation here. You still are standing firm that
if you're on the clock right now, who's your who
would your selection be for the Sixers?

Speaker 3 (40:45):
If this seasons, Sixers keep the pick. It's still VG
edge Combe. And the more I think about it, the
more I really do believe it'll be VG edge Comb
and not as Bailey. It's just it's a Devil Morley
type player and he's going to help this team win
that he just is. We've talked that with Aast Bailey.
Ace Bailey is a project. He is incredibly inefficient, his
shot selection, just his decision making. It's just a project.

(41:09):
I'm not saying he's not going to be a great
player in the NBA, but it's a project and I
would never trust that guy in a playoff rotation. And
the window for the Sixers, Yeah, it's also for the future,
but there's a win now window for the Sixers if
which is the biggest if in all of basketball, If
Joel Embiid can stay healthy and you want a win
now player that would be part of a playoff rotation,
I think VG Edgecombe is that guy. As a defender,

(41:31):
He's phenomenal as an off ball mover, cutter. He the
athletic specimen that he is everything vg Edgecomb showed last year.
I think he's the guy where it's going to be
a win now move. But I will say, and I'd
be interested to hear your perspective on this. I've been
hearing more reports out there that the pick could be traded. Look,

(41:52):
I can't listen. I don't live really listen to any
reports this time of year. It's just with a draft
and free agency and who's interested in who? It's all
bs most of it, like for people listening out there,
like Legion Legion Hoops has become an awful account.

Speaker 4 (42:05):
It used to be a great account when it was
coming up. It's just become an awful account.

Speaker 3 (42:09):
Excuse me, where they're giving credibility and credence to like, oh,
this person is in this that we're hearing this, and
it's like per per who. It's some random account no
one's ever heard of. And these people are constantly wrong
because teams play them like fiddles and that and look
at that, Like if you're in the reporting game, that's
there's something wrong with that. Necessarily, Like you has to

(42:29):
be an insider, you need to have you need to
have connections with teams and if they tell you something,
you're gonna put it out because they want you to.
But most reporters are played like fiddles by teams and
they're used as complete leverage tools. And that's where a
lot of what what these reports are is they're complete
leverage tools by teams. So maybe that's what the Sixers
are doing here. But it does feel like some from

(42:51):
some more credible people that it's a real possibility the
Sixers trade the pick, but I don't really see other
than it's a trade down situation where they can get
a player they really like. I don't see the trade possibilities.

Speaker 1 (43:01):
Yeah, for starters.

Speaker 2 (43:02):
The ones that really frustrate me from the aggregation standpoint
is like an anonymous Western Conference executive. Yeah, it's like,
what are we doing here? Give me something a little
bit more hard hitting than that. But it is absolutely
smoke screen season across the NBA that there seems to
be a different report for the same teams. And every
single day I've seen some Trey Johnson love from the
Sixers perspective, which has been interested to me.

Speaker 4 (43:25):
That's just nonsense, that's just nonsense.

Speaker 3 (43:27):
And they never they could not get a Gord that's
the same prototype as a Max Scene, that Cane guy.
It's just how many of those guys can you stack up?

Speaker 2 (43:36):
But you're all in on the VJ Edge Cup experience.
I guess he's a defense first guy, but he's still
six foot five.

Speaker 1 (43:41):
And in that same guard rotation.

Speaker 3 (43:42):
But he's not a lead like he's not a lead
ball handler, like he doesn't need the ball in his hands.

Speaker 4 (43:46):
He's a great off ball cutter. He can be a three.

Speaker 3 (43:48):
I know he's not the tallest guy, but he can
be a he can be a three and D guy
like he'll play off the ball. He's more he played
more of a spot up role, like he's not a
guy who's a lead ball handler.

Speaker 4 (43:57):
And the way Trey Johnson.

Speaker 2 (43:58):
Is VJ also not a guy that is in NBA
caliber dribbler at this point in the game that I
would say.

Speaker 4 (44:03):
Yeah, what's what I'm saying.

Speaker 3 (44:04):
He plays off the ball like he's the three and
D guy like that that's what they needed for when
now guys, you need those guys on the team. So
I don't want him to be the lead ball handler.
That that would be mixing up with what you have
with MAXI and McCain and even even Quentin Grimes who
showed lead ball handling abilities.

Speaker 2 (44:20):
So I still stand ten toes down that Ace Bailey
would be my selection to the third pick. And the
reason that I think that Darryl Moury, we will see
what he ends up doing, but I still see like
a very reasonable world in which he does make that
selection is Darryl Mory likes to take the stupid superstar
swings man and if everything clicks for Ace Bailey, the
ceiling is higher than VJ.

Speaker 1 (44:38):
Edgecomb there.

Speaker 2 (44:39):
That's something that I do think well Morey will buy
into and like when having this whole conversation, I think
you make this selection pretty much independent of this Sixers team.
Is there an argument that fit is better for Ace
in general anyway?

Speaker 1 (44:51):
For sure?

Speaker 2 (44:52):
But I think the concept is and what this principle
needs to be recognized by Sixers fans everywhere. Whoever the
selection is made at the third pick will not make
or break this Sixers team's championship chances. That is dependent
on the health of Joel Embiid. That is dependent on
the bounce back season from Paul George from Tyrese Maxi
progressing from that rookie season from Jard McCain being real there.

(45:12):
Those are things that will swing the actual outlook of
the team. This is going to be a pick that
all of these guys in consideration here are not remotely
close to finished products. And while they will each have roles,
any one of these guys will have some sort of role.
I don't think it's anything that really changes things with
the team. And I do think that you're making this
selection with the future in mind, of that next generation
with MAXI with McCain, and I think Ace Bailey fits

(45:34):
that exact talk.

Speaker 3 (45:35):
Let me push back on your assertion that del moriy
is like the superstars swing guy, like he loves stick superstars.
He's done that with proven superstars throughout his career, Like
he's never done that in the draft because he's never
really picked.

Speaker 1 (45:48):
He's never drafted this high.

Speaker 3 (45:50):
Yeah exactly, Yeah, but so like he's done that with
proven superstars, where yeah, he wants to pile up those
superstars and we've seen that. But all those guys that
he's acquired through free agency, whether it's going back obviously
with Harden, but going back when Harden was there an
MVP caliber level, he got Russell Westbrook and then and
he got Chris Paul, and we know what the sections
we've done and got Paul George. All those guys are
proven stores. It's different in the draft where it's like, yeah,

(46:12):
this guy's ceiling is probably higher than BG Edgecum and
he could be a store, but he's not some You're
not taking a swing on a guy who's some certain
store that has proven himself in the league. So I
don't buy that from the Darren Mory perspective. And the
other thing from Daryl Mory is I am not convinced
this guy will will will be around to see a
rebuild post in the post MBAT era. And I think

(46:34):
the Sixers are decently set up. And I actually want
to do this with you. Zach Loow did on his
podcast of the Top Teams if you were if you
were going to be a present basket operations for one
team drafting those top teams in the East, and he
did it with someone on his podcast, and that person
said the Sixers were the last team he would select
in all the East to oversee right now, which I

(46:55):
think I'm completely with you. That's ridiculous because I think,
and well, we should do the draft maybe maybe next week,
but the Sixers are decently.

Speaker 4 (47:03):
Set up in the post Nbat era.

Speaker 3 (47:04):
Like I get all the mb criticisms, those are all valid,
but they're actually pretty decently set up in the post
m beat era with Maxie McCain, whoever they draft number three,
all these guys, and you could get off of a
Paul George contract if you really had to. If mb
somehow career or somehow comes to a halt next year,
you can get off that contract. So my point is

(47:26):
that I don't think there are more is going to
be here to oversee, even though they're decently set up.
He's not going to be here to oversee a retool
effort where this team's a middle of the pack team
going back chasing championship contention. Whether it's the Sixers letting
him go, whether him trying to look at his next
opportunity where he can actually win a championship. He's not
going to be here for the post MBAT era. So
I don't think he really cares what Ace Bailey is
in seven years or six six years.

Speaker 4 (47:48):
And you're right that the sixer whoever they draft won't
make or breakthrough. She's the next year.

Speaker 3 (47:55):
But if this is if MBAT is healthy again, biggest
live in basketball. But if em Beat healthy, that that
could have an impact who this player is. Like, if
you're talking about we see how important depth has been
throughout this playoff run.

Speaker 4 (48:09):
Like even thinking about Christian Braun during the Nuggets run, he.

Speaker 3 (48:12):
Had really impactful minutes in the finals and throughout that
playoff run for the Nuggets as a rookie. So if
you can build depth of guy who can be a
legitimate playoff rotation player, I think VG Edge comes a
better chance of being that next year and probably the
year after than Acet Bailey. Then that's the guy I'm
going He's not gonna make or break the season. All
comes down to and Beats health. But if then beat
is healthy, that he could be impactful in a playoff rotation.

Speaker 2 (48:34):
Christian Brown also entered the league after three years at
Kansas at twenty two years old. Versus all these guys
that we're mentioned right now, from Trey to VJ to
Ace or we're talking eighteen nineteen years old.

Speaker 3 (48:44):
I know, I'm just saying more win now, guys. I
get that, and he was a champion of Kansas, but
it's more win now, guys, who could who could impact
your rotation as a rookie in a PLOO in the playoffs.

Speaker 4 (48:56):
Like that's the point I think.

Speaker 2 (48:59):
I still think, like, look to keep it on Ace
here him in a more minimize minimized role. It can
do all these things, like if he's just a three
and D guy that is playing some really high level
of defense. And I will also stand on the point,
I do think there's a somewhat likely world that Ace
Bailey becomes the better NBA defender out of him and
VJ Here.

Speaker 4 (49:19):
Like maybe, but I just VJ Edge comes.

Speaker 3 (49:23):
Athleticism is off the charts, and like athleticism is like
one of like it's a lot of effort thing and
focus and IQ. But like athleticism is one of the
biggest things athleticism strength when I'm just looking at an
individual defender, and so yeah, maybe AAST Bailey can become
But when you're looking at their tape in college, there's
no way you're saying Abill is a better defender than
vg Edge.

Speaker 2 (49:41):
Come right now, I don't. I don't think it's that
far off. Like I VJ is the better defender currently
for sure. I'm not gonna get in there. But I
don't think that there's an insane gap between them, like
some of the rim protection stuff that ACE has, and
really the critique of Aces, there will be the moments
where the motor dies a little bit, where he can
get caught sleeping off ball, and like that's of the
critique here, but you also see flashes where that dude

(50:02):
absolutely locks up and him as a week side rim protector,
I love him being bigger in size, like the VJ.
Don't don't take it too deep of a dive into
the VJ post defense tape because that that's where it
gets ugly.

Speaker 1 (50:13):
A little bit, and I get like, that's not gonna
be his primary role.

Speaker 2 (50:16):
But I do see a world when, like projecting these
guys forward, where there are gonna be teams from a
playoff perspective circling that guy, saying let's get him in
a one on one spot, getting him get him in
the post.

Speaker 3 (50:25):
Now they're not circling VG edge comb. When you have
Maxie and mchann on the floor, those guys are being
targeted more than anybody. And that's why I think you
could pair well with I think he could pair well
with one of them on the floor because both those
guys are and Maxi's improved defensively, both those guys are
defensive liabilities and will be max Maxi was targeted. He
was targeted against the Knicks a lot every time down

(50:46):
almost Brunson was targeting against the next couple of years
ago in that playoff series. And he's improved, but he's
still guy that you're gonna target just because it was
his height. And that's why Brunt's the big reason why
Brunton is targeted two defensively. So I think pairing one
of those guys with veg Edge comb a. Yeah, his
post defense is probably really bad, but as an on
BALLD defender, I think he could pair well with the

(51:06):
Maxi or McCain to it.

Speaker 2 (51:08):
Yeah, I mean last last year, I will stend I
will defend Tyres Max.

Speaker 1 (51:13):
He was at least a league average defender last year.
I think it notch better than that. I think he.

Speaker 3 (51:17):
Improved, but it's all it's also like it was such
a wash of a season. But I do think he
improved defensively for sure, he definitely should should flashes.

Speaker 4 (51:25):
Of improvement there.

Speaker 3 (51:25):
It's different when you get to the playoffs though, it
just is like like even Tyres Helbern I think has
improved a lot as a defender. You're still targeting him
constantly in the playoffs because he's the weakest link on
that floor, and that's why the thunder is so great.
It's like Shay is probably the weakest defender, but he's
he I think it's been great defensively this series, but
he's also way above a league average defender.

Speaker 1 (51:44):
Definitely.

Speaker 2 (51:45):
Yeah, No, McCain, very legitimate concern is there. Well, we'll
see how that that shakes out. But I again, very
small sample sized rookie year. Guys will get better and
still very young, so I'm not like hitting the complete
panic button that he can't get there. But McCain is
certainly when we're heavy this whole conversation the biggest week
link to discuss.

Speaker 1 (52:02):
Now to shift it back to draft talk overall.

Speaker 2 (52:05):
I know you mentioned before we hopped on here you've
been starting to dive in the weeds look at some
names deeper down on this draft list.

Speaker 1 (52:11):
Is there any guys.

Speaker 2 (52:12):
That you want to stamp as your guys per se,
or guys that are jumping out to you that you
believe are gonna be steals in this draft, maybe the
later first round, even from the Sixers perspective, you can
swing if there's a trade down situation. Guys like that
that jump out to you, any names like that that
pop right to your head.

Speaker 4 (52:29):
Well, Derek Queen will always be my guy.

Speaker 3 (52:30):
I'll be going to bat for Derek Queen and he
will be a phenomenal NBA player. And Kevin Willard said
it during the season. He was like, if this guy
was a white European, he would be the number one
pick in the draft.

Speaker 1 (52:41):
Yeah, I've heard that.

Speaker 2 (52:42):
By the way, Can I ask when the last white
European was drafted first overall?

Speaker 4 (52:47):
I have no idea was Dirk first overall? He was not.

Speaker 2 (52:51):
I did look this up at the time too, it
was what's his name? It didn't turn out that good either,
Like early two thousands, you can Drake Kerlinka was the
last white European to be drafted first overall in.

Speaker 4 (53:03):
A decent career, nothing special, but decent.

Speaker 1 (53:07):
By point being for that quote here, I just don't
think that's true.

Speaker 3 (53:10):
Yeah, I mean I think it's it's slight hyperbole, but
but the sentiment is true where it's like he would
be a more respective prospect if he was a white
European just because because we've seen the skill set translate
like everyone's looking for the next Nicole Jokic, everyone's looking
for Alpur and Sengoon type, like all these guys, big
men who who maybe aren't super athletic but can impact

(53:30):
the game, uh with their touch, with with with their passing,
their vision, all that stuff. So so I think it's
the sentiment that counts, which is true. Yeah, he wouldn't
be the one pick, especially in the draft with Cooper Flag,
but it's the sentiment that he would be a more
respected prospect, with which I do agree with. And look,
I love Derek Queen, so will be my guy. And
we'll get into more of that because he's going to
be a top He's gonna be a top seven ish

(53:53):
pick and be shocking if the Wizards. It'd be shocking
if the Wizards, with everything he was in their back
backyard last year, I would be shocked if the Wizards
passed on him.

Speaker 4 (54:01):
But while we'll see what happens there. There's there's some
other guys like Jace Richardson.

Speaker 3 (54:06):
I know that's Mark Henry's guy, so I'm not gonna
steal from him, but I've completely come around on Jace Richardson.
I think his ceiling or excuse me, I think his
floor is a really solid role player and I don't
know if his ceiling's way that much higher. But he's
one of the most efficient pick and role playmakers in
the league last year, excuse me, in the country last year,
and just what he is as a connector, as a
pastor really smart player. Is obviously small, but I think

(54:29):
he's gonna have like a Derek White prototype, Like he's
gonna be a really good role player in the league.

Speaker 4 (54:33):
So I would draft.

Speaker 3 (54:34):
Him, not not that high, but he's a guy I'm
really coming in around. I don't have any like my
guys just yet. The draft class at like beyond the
top isn't like I don't really love like Egor. We
talked about Egor Denham, you and me talked about before
we got before we got on air today.

Speaker 4 (54:54):
Like he I love watching him.

Speaker 3 (54:56):
He's a six' nine point guard who has an incredible,
handling the, skills amazing, footwork great pace plays with acceleration.
Deceleration he is all the tools that you would want
in the, prospect except for the fact.

Speaker 4 (55:10):
He's a shooting.

Speaker 1 (55:11):
Touch to, MYSELF i would, say.

Speaker 3 (55:12):
Yeah, honestly, yes he is an awful shooter just and
it's weird because, like Like i'm got some shooting mechanic,
expert but his form looks decent to, me like it
doesn't look.

Speaker 4 (55:23):
Bad and one THING i like.

Speaker 3 (55:25):
Throughout the year is he remained confident in his shot
through throughout throughout the season and really never lost confidence
in a shot despite shooting awful percentages like less than
thirty percent from three and and a lot of things
you hear from scouts sometimes are if you could have
a bad year or two shooting college from, three but
if you're a good free throw, shooter that means like

(55:45):
mechanics are there and they'll. Translate he was a bad
free throw shooter. Too he shot sixty nine percent from
the free throw. Line so it's like it's. WEIRD i
don't really understand. It but if he can develop a,
shot and this is my, point it's like his ceiling
is a super st like a legitimate superstore in THE,
nba if he can develop a.

Speaker 4 (56:04):
Shot but, really this.

Speaker 3 (56:06):
After this season at B, yu there's no reason and
this year overseas even he didn' shoot the ball particularly
well but better than he did at B, yu there's
no reason to believe that he's he's going to going
to be ever developed into a good, shooter and then
the question is like what's his?

Speaker 4 (56:19):
Ceiling like a Front Franz wagner.

Speaker 3 (56:21):
Type where it's like he's a really good player and
he still impacts the, game and But Franz wagner is
an awful. Shooter so it's LIKE i like him as a,
PROSPECT i really like watching him, play but the shooting
concern is obviously a series.

Speaker 4 (56:34):
Concern, yeah he's definitely.

Speaker 2 (56:35):
INTERESTING i don't even think he gets quite To france.
Level would be my honest guest With eagor. Here I'm
i'm not sipping the kool aid for what he can,
be but we'll see helped. Me definitely a guy that's
going to take some, work but could get there if
he puts the pieces together. Completely there's a lot of
fun names in this, draft and we can dive deeper
into him as once we get past the. Finals from
the sixers perspective, here that thirty fifth pick a ton

(56:58):
of fun guys to target as. Well will be interesting
to see what they what they do and move. Around
SO i guess to bring it back to the sixty,
conversation your feel is that they're trading down at this
point in the.

Speaker 4 (57:07):
Game, NO i.

Speaker 3 (57:08):
DON'T i feel isn't, that BUT i have heard. Credit
but it does seem like there are credible reports out
there that they they're really exploring the, possibility not not
the B s reports that we talked, about like legitimate
reports from from real PEOPLE i. Trust right, now if
like you had to, say what are they gonna do
the drafts, Tomorrow LIKE i would say the DRAFTING vg
edge come with the third, pick BUT i do think
all options on the, table Including Ace, bailey including trading,

(57:30):
down and and, they're like you said, earlier the draft
starts with them and every Every i'm sure teams are
calling them seeing what they're trying to, do and they
might be sending some smoke screen signals out, there but
the draft starts with them at. Three so what would
if you had to say the draft is, tomorrow what
would you say they're?

Speaker 2 (57:46):
DOING i think they will certainly explore every option to trade,
down BUT i think like it's kind of gonna be
PRETTY nba wide viewed that like there isn't that much
the gap between like the third and eighth player in this,
draft and like to actually get what's worth moving down.

Speaker 1 (58:01):
For i'm a little bit skeptical that package comes.

Speaker 2 (58:04):
Together you can make the case like a team like
The nets makes a lot of sense for me if
they want to get up there and take that swing
The jazz who still could use like a swing for
a top end one a. Guy if one of these
teams falls in love With, ace so you can move
drop down a couple. Picks i'm totally game with. That
it is important to me that they walk away like
they clear top kind of top, selection top, ten top
fifteen guy to add to this youthful. Core SO i

(58:26):
think they'll try to move, Down but my honest guess
would be that they stay right there at.

Speaker 1 (58:29):
Three AND i won't.

Speaker 2 (58:30):
Lie there's a part of me that kind of believes
they might take The Trey johnson.

Speaker 4 (58:33):
Swing really you're buying into? THAT i.

Speaker 2 (58:37):
WAS i read a shout To adam Ronson The Philly,
voice who wrote up a mock draft yesterday that they
kind of did like just a case for each, guy
and it goes back, to, LIKE i think it's true
that principle that There i'm alway's gonna want to take
the superstar. SWING i think that that's gonna be something
that he can't ignore or you, like when you're picking this,
high that's the direction you gotta. GO i Mean Trey,

(58:57):
johnson While i'm not that high on, Him LIKE i
would not.

Speaker 1 (59:00):
Take trey personally.

Speaker 2 (59:02):
Whatsoever, HERE i think the defensive concerns are even greater
than anything we've acknowledged with some of the other. GUYS
i don't see anywhere where he's a neutral or positive.
Defender his playmaking, FEEL i don't think he's there. Yet
he did some powdy stuff on the, court but he
led THE sec in scoring with nineteen point or nineteen
point three points per. Game thirty nine percent shooter from
three Broke Kevin durant's scoring records At, texas which does

(59:23):
not happen by accident, there And i'd like the shots very.
Repeatable he can play on or off. Ball there's things
you can certainly like. There SO i have a little
bit this, Week i've kind of had a little bit
of that.

Speaker 4 (59:33):
Feeling, YEAH i just do you do you subscribe to
my theory at? All THAT.

Speaker 3 (59:39):
A i think he's only really taking the superstar swing
with proven, stars LIKE i don't buy that he would
do that with the. Draft he's done that with proven
stores who have proven themselves in the, league and b
THAT i don't believe he will be here to usher
in the post and Beat. Era SO i don't think
he's thinking about it from that. Way do you subscribe to?
That do you believe in that at?

Speaker 2 (59:58):
ALL i think that there is more truth to like
him making this selection from a long, term long term
stance like kind of gives him a bit more job
security that you can make the case to ownership That
i've laid out this blueprint for life Post Joel. Embi
that sets us up if this PLAN a does not.
Work SO i think that he can be.

Speaker 4 (01:00:16):
If he wants to.

Speaker 3 (01:00:16):
BE i don't think it's going to be all like
an ownership gets rid of. HIM i think he might
also want to get out of.

Speaker 2 (01:00:20):
It oh, interesting, INTERESTING i mean all, Right So i'll
say this on like the SUPER.

Speaker 3 (01:00:25):
I, mean he wanted to get out out of The
houston situation once The James harden stuff fell, up fell
off and they were entering a, rebuild even though he'd
probably rather be back In houston these days than he
would be In, philly but he wanted to get out
when when they were going to retool, mode if you
want to call it.

Speaker 2 (01:00:40):
That, YEAH i, Mean darryl is very much on the
record about the importance of stars and how it is
these top, fifteen top twenty guys that dictate what you're
sealing as a.

Speaker 1 (01:00:50):
TEAM i don't.

Speaker 4 (01:00:50):
Think The pacers. Did he watched The pacers. Run.

Speaker 2 (01:00:53):
Well i'm not SAYING i don't see quite eye to
eye on, him but he will certainly repeat this phrase
or some very of, that and whenever you give a
microphone or ask him that particular question, HERE i don't
think he's gonna view this draft through a different lens of.
That but if you can have a chance to add
like a guy that could be a legitimate, Star darrell's
gonna be willing to take that.

Speaker 1 (01:01:11):
Swing it's sort of HOW i feel like.

Speaker 2 (01:01:12):
It SO i get your point about like the win
now piece and things like, that BUT i think more
he's gonna really identify this is, like when these guys
growing to be their full, players who is going to
be the best, Player who is going to be the
guy that we believe could be a face of the
franchise type?

Speaker 1 (01:01:27):
Dude AND i think that's how he's going to operate
and make them the.

Speaker 4 (01:01:29):
Decision, yeah it's it's it's a.

Speaker 3 (01:01:33):
PREDICAMENT i think he's weighing it, too, right like like
do you do you want a guy who could potentially
have a super high ceiling and be a superstar for
you in the POST nb there or do you want
to try to maximize this? Window and it's really, interesting
LIKE i don't know exactly what he believes byd the.
Scenes of course he's saying the right things when he
speaks to the media about mb that he's on the right,
track he's gonna come, back he's going to be at

(01:01:55):
THIS mvp, Level but, like there's no way he can
even fully believe that he's a rational.

Speaker 4 (01:02:01):
PERSON i think so.

Speaker 2 (01:02:03):
Even say like there's you, know he's done, Fine but
there's nothing that he could say that like changes my
mindset or my opinion one way or.

Speaker 1 (01:02:10):
Another it just is what it.

Speaker 4 (01:02:11):
Is, No, yeah but, yeah one hundred.

Speaker 3 (01:02:13):
Percent But i'm saying like from even what he, Believes
like what does he, Believe like does he believe THAT
mbat is going to come back and be uh and
be like AN mvp level player and not get? Hurt
and if he, does then that might influence his, pick
and if he's hedging against that and SAYING i actually
don't believe he will ever be at that level, again
even though we never say that, publicly that that will
influence his pick in a different. Direction SO i think

(01:02:34):
that's really telling of how he what he actually how he.

Speaker 4 (01:02:38):
Actually views THE mb, situation which we don't know.

Speaker 2 (01:02:40):
Exactly the only other thing THAT i meant to bring
up the first time here is when you think back
to the biggest swing That Daryl mary's ever take with
the one that like sort of we think of when
we think Of Darrel, maury it was that first trade
For James. Harden that was a big swing for a
guy with not a lot of sample size and not
a lot of data. Here at that, Point James harden
was a Six man of The, year was like the

(01:03:01):
very clear third piece on That thunder, team And morey
took that massive swing to make him the face of the.
Franchise that sort of feels like a more comparable situation than,
This AND i get hard and obviously was playing at
THE nba level and slightly different with, that BUT i
think we can call that like a big swing without
him being a proven.

Speaker 3 (01:03:17):
Star, yes but the difference is That rocket situation was completely.
Different they needed that on the roster BECAUSE i don't
remember that roster. Exactly was that tw, THIRTEEN i don't
remember that roster, exactly but i'd Be i'd be pretty
confidence saying they didn't have any stars on that team.

Speaker 4 (01:03:31):
Already, yeah The sixers already.

Speaker 3 (01:03:33):
Have and of course it's hard to have this conversation
because we don't know WHAT mbt, is but they already
have Two All stars on the team and potentially even
a third If Paul george can ever get back to
what he was even two or three seasons, ago which
is unlikely. Too and then you have another budding star
With jerry. McKean so like That rocket situation was there
was no stars on the, team you have stars on
the team, now so you don't need to go swing

(01:03:55):
for the fence for a.

Speaker 2 (01:03:56):
Star if you Knew Joel embiid is not coming, back
that that he's never gonna be physically what he.

Speaker 4 (01:04:02):
Was he's never gonna play a game, again never gonna.

Speaker 2 (01:04:04):
Well yeah we'll, go we'll walk all the way. There
he's never gonna play a game. Again does that change
the way you make this? Pick, yeah so then you're
more willing to take the The Ace bailey swinger the Trade.

Speaker 4 (01:04:14):
Johnson i'll be more willing to take THE A bailey.

Speaker 1 (01:04:16):
Swing, Interesting, Okay and AGAIN i.

Speaker 3 (01:04:18):
Don't THINK A bailey is ever gonna be like that,
guy BUT i do understand that that you'd Be i'd
be more willing to take the SWING a because he
is stealing is higher than anyone behind him Except Ry
queen and. B you, like you have those those prospects
in place where if you miss on this, pick you

(01:04:39):
still Have, maxi you still have. McCain, uh you still
have guys who or can be center pieces of the.
Franchise And maxie is based off the extension that that
they get granted, him which was a which was a
ton of. Money so you can even like swing and
miss on this, pick which is like you take big
swings knowing you may be able to afford to. Miss

(01:05:00):
AND i think they could know that they could afford
to miss because Ast billy is a, huge huge Swing
AND i don't THINK A bill is gonna be a bad,
player BUT i don't Think East billy is ever going
to be like we're throwing out the word like potential
like superstar star LIKE i don't ever see As bailey at.

Speaker 1 (01:05:15):
That do you think you get end up better Than Tyrese?

Speaker 4 (01:05:18):
Haliburn DO i think he'll ever be better Than Tyres?

Speaker 3 (01:05:20):
Alburn, Yes Tyres alburn just brought a team to THE Nba,
finals As bailey will as the best player on TEAM.

Speaker 4 (01:05:25):
A bailey will never do that in his. CAREER i
can promise you that probably.

Speaker 2 (01:05:29):
Proven Superstar Tyres haliburn from how we do that FOR
i don't. Know i'll give as a fair, chance but
ultimately a lot more to break down any would be.

Speaker 4 (01:05:38):
Your coach before we end, it BECAUSE i know we're going.
Long who would be your?

Speaker 3 (01:05:41):
Coach if you if if someone had to ask, you
have to give one?

Speaker 4 (01:05:45):
Answer who will be the next next head? Coach who will?

Speaker 2 (01:05:48):
Be, Yeah Johnny bryant is WHO i think it's gonna
end up. Being i've seen a lot too much smoke
with it from mixed people THAT i kind of, respect
and that was the hot name from the. BEGINNING i
get there trying to get sexy with The Jason kidd,
additions try And trade Or eric s Bolsh drive's scene
floated out. There the reality IS i think they take
a little bit of the safe. Approach give a guy an,
opportunity And Johnny bryant will be the.

Speaker 3 (01:06:08):
Dude, YEAH i DON'T i don't disagree with. THAT i
think He's he's a, real genuine. POSSIBILITY i think The
Jason kids stuff is, very very real. THOUGH i think
The knicks will and are pursuing, Him AND i don't
know how The MAVs are you that because of course
he's under. CONTRACT i could guarantee You Jason kidd would
rather because if you had to give him playing sit right,
now he, said rather be with the next, organization The MAVs.

Speaker 1 (01:06:28):
ORGANIZATION i tend to disagree with. That he Got Cooper
flagg walking into your organization right?

Speaker 4 (01:06:33):
Now, yes or do you know who his? Bosses?

Speaker 3 (01:06:36):
Yeah also the worst executive in the ENTIRE. Nba he
is the dumbest person in the ENTIRE.

Speaker 4 (01:06:41):
Nba.

Speaker 3 (01:06:42):
YEAH i, mean there's there's no. DEBATING i know he
had some good moves two years ago WITH. Pj washington
and And derek and And Daniel gaffer bringing those guys.

Speaker 4 (01:06:49):
In he just Traded, Luka doncic And Jason.

Speaker 3 (01:06:52):
Kidd has made it pretty clear subtly not explicitly but
subtly that he did not was not on board with.

Speaker 4 (01:06:58):
That it was not even.

Speaker 3 (01:06:59):
Consultant he works for the dumbest man in The TYRIE.
Mba he Has Cooper flagg coming in and then he's.

Speaker 4 (01:07:04):
Gonna be a.

Speaker 3 (01:07:05):
Superstar that man probably wants to go Coach New york
and he obviously has a prior relationship With Jalen. Brunson
i'd be shocked if right now he'd a blank slate
and wouldn't pick The knicks over the, maps the.

Speaker 2 (01:07:16):
Boss and the ownership in THE, gm the front office.
Situation you can make that case. There but just looking
at That mavericks, team like if You're Jason, KIDD i
would have a hard time walking away From think if
if that team gets one hundred percent right there With Anthony,
davis With Kyrie, irving who should return at some point
in the mid, Season Cooper flag is LIKE i would
If i'm any sort of head, Coach i'm itching to
get a chance to Coach Cooper, flagg AND i would

(01:07:39):
have a hard time passing that up from his.

Speaker 3 (01:07:40):
Pear The Cooper flag thing is, real but the problem
is That kyrie probably will never return to the same level,
player And Anthony davis is also another injury prone.

Speaker 4 (01:07:49):
Guy, like it's not the right roster For Cooper.

Speaker 3 (01:07:51):
Flag it is maybe for the next year or, Two
like he doesn't have to be the, guy WHICH i
think will be good for him playing off And Anthony
davis playing more of the, four WHICH i think will
be will be good. Form but it's also like a
bunch of guys who are trying to win right, now and.
Rookies even a guy is, TALENTED i think will immediately
come in and be a great.

Speaker 4 (01:08:08):
Player they don't win right. Now, ever really he as
the second or.

Speaker 3 (01:08:13):
Third best, player SO i don't think it's it's just
the right like roster long term, form and they could obviously,
replenish but it seems like they're in this window where
it's like they want to win, now And Nico harrison
obviously wants to win now because he has to because
his future is on the, Line but it doesn't feel
like the right roster for. That SO i think long,
Term i'd love to go to S Cooper, flag BUT
i don't love THIS mav situation in the immediate.

Speaker 1 (01:08:36):
Future, hey defense wins, Championships sam astri if.

Speaker 4 (01:08:39):
You the, brilliant the Brilliant Nico. Harrison what a smart.

Speaker 1 (01:08:42):
Guy that's what we've been.

Speaker 2 (01:08:44):
Told so it's still insane that they got bailed out
by getting the one. Pick in, general unbelievable that the
basketball gods allowed that to. Happen, then for whatever that.

Speaker 3 (01:08:51):
Makes you think there aren't any basketball, gods because that's.

Speaker 4 (01:08:53):
Inconceivable, yeah, no it certainly feels that.

Speaker 2 (01:08:57):
Way But, sam any final thoughts in the, draft THE nba,
playoffs or anything else before we sign off, HERE.

Speaker 4 (01:09:01):
I don't think.

Speaker 3 (01:09:02):
SO i think if you had to before the, SERIES
i said thunder and, Five i'll still keep with thunder and.
FIVE i think thunder and six is more likely right,
now But i'd still keep with thunder and.

Speaker 2 (01:09:13):
FIVE i went with thunder and, six And i'm gonna
keep it there as. Well for, NOW i will be
rooting on My Indiana pacers For game. Three make sure
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(01:09:34):
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