March 25, 2022 • 56 mins
Leah and Demetri are joined by journalist, actress, author and model Lisa Guerrero to get the insider details from behind the 'Secrets of Playboy'. Not only is Lisa armed with first hand knowledge as host of the upcoming additional episodes of the A&E series that feature conversations with women who have never spoken up before, but she was also "invited" into the Playboy world as a young up-and-comer in the industry.
All that plus the Hot Topics: A recent disappearance labeled "suspicious in nature"...a mysterious illness on the set of a famous TV show and the details of a Hollywood celebrity's death that remains "undetermined."
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Crime. Hello everyone, and welcome to another episode of Real
Time Crime. I'm your host, Leah Lamar, and I have
with me our incredible friend who is sometimes Dmitri, but
(00:23):
now oftentimes Dmitri. Dmitri. It's a good thing I didn't
take sometimes to meet you on Instagram because now that
you'd be like, go get oftentimes Dmitri. Well, I mean
I don't see you running to your phone to change
your handles. Yeah, so no more promotions for you, Dmitri.
Or that's the last one. I'm still at Dmitri Pappis.
That's all al right, whatever you can tell him. In
my dad's office today, I'm in Florida, lucky me, and
(00:46):
I see you are in your own office. That's right,
because you're a dad, that's right. I work from all
this is where I am, so I spend the day here,
and you know I I always talk into a microphone,
but it just happens to be convenient when we're on
the podcast. I never noticed this before, but it does
seem like the artwork behind you as a bar code.
Uh maybe I see. I can tell you in Florida
(01:08):
because you have the vertical lines, the blinds, all the
vertical blinds. They're killing me. I hate the vertical blinds. Okay, well,
today we're going to be discussing a bunch of hot
topics as usual. There is a search for an eighteen
year old woman who disappeared suspiciously in Nevada. We will
be covering a mystery illness that hit the set of
(01:28):
n C I S and we'll be covering circling back.
I should say to Moses J. Mosley's autopsy results. And
then we have a very special guest with us today,
Lisa Guero, who is the host of Secrets of Playboy
on A and E, which would be airing on Monday.
And I'm very excited about this episode today. But first
(01:48):
I'd like to apologize to everyone that I'm wearing my
visial line. I don't think it's it's invisible the video.
Nobody can you hear it? This is most people are listening, Dmitri.
I'm not sure if realized that. No. I thought you
were drunk. You thought I was drunk. No, Oh, I
didn't really think you were drunk. I don't hear anything.
I don't hear a difference. You don't hear This is
(02:10):
coming from a career mumbler. So what's the difference, king
of mumbling mumbled looking? All right, let's just get into
this because I'm mentally ill today. Okay, So our first
hot topic for today is Nevada authorities are searching for
an eighteen year old woman whose disappearance they say is
suspicious in nature. I mean, I have to say, any
(02:31):
disappearance is usually suspicious in nature. So I'm not really
sure what that headlines about, but I think that's being polite.
I think that I think this is definitely suspicious. Right,
So what they're saying is she did not intentionally run away.
Something happened. Okay. So Naomi has been missing for more
than a week. She's eighteen, and she lives in Nevada.
(02:52):
She was last seen in her car in the parking
lot of a Walmart, and she parked her car on
five am and was active on social media between five
oh nine and five three am. And Detective Eric whose
Marris with the Lion County Sheriff's Office, during a Tuesday
news conference, declared that this was correct and so apparently
(03:14):
she was waiting to take the shuttle to work from Walmart.
That's the important thing because if you say she was
in her car at five am in a Walmart parking lot.
You think, well, who knows what, but that she was
catching a shuttle from there to go to work. I've
never seen that early in the morning. So already, I mean,
I find this unbelievable. Okay, So at five twenty four,
(03:35):
a surveillance video shows a man wearing a gray hooded sweatshirt,
dark pants or jeans, and dark tennis shoes approaching her vehicle.
At five, her vehicle was seen leaving the parking lot
with the man driving. Okay, so this is very quick turnaround.
So she was on social from five oh nine to
five twenty three. At five twenty four, he pops up
(03:55):
on surveillance at five they're already out of the parking
lot and he was drying her car and he's driving
her car. Okay, and um On March fift her vehicle
is recovered near the Walmart and it's currently being processed.
Authorities are asking for the public's help in locating the
dark newer Chevrolet. Um, well, is that is that his
(04:21):
car that they're looking for? I don't know that. Well, no, no,
I thought that that was her car. Yeah, yeah, her car.
So they found her car. But my question is one
I don't know. If you watch the footage they post
the footage from the surveillance camera, it doesn't show anything.
(04:42):
It doesn't show him getting into her car, just shows
the back of his head, So you just see a
hood up. You basically don't see a person at all.
You can't tell anything about him maybe his height maybe,
and you don't seem getting into the car, and you
don't see the car leaving, So it's not really showing
us all the information because part of me is like, well,
she's sitting me in the diver seat and she scooted over.
(05:02):
Was she sitting in the passenger seat waiting for this person?
My assumption is that he approached with a weapon and
said I am like basically cardjactor. But the question is, so,
why why is that footage trunk heated like SEC just
just runs constantly. Well, we can ask the same same
thing about the hotel Sixel, well except that you already
chalked up to the elevator game, but this had no elevator. Um.
(05:24):
But the other question is so I wonder if she
As with most of these stories, I have a ton
of questions. Was she there every day? At five am
to catch that struggle to work. I imagine it had
to be some sort of routine. So perhaps someone had
known this and kind of it wasn't like some random thing,
maybe slightly premeditated. Is it someone she knew? Was she
(05:46):
involved in something that we're uncertain about or don't know
about where we but there are millions you know? Was
it someone that she met online? We just don't know.
It could have just been a random person who held
her up and took her car. Yeah, and you can,
obviously you look into the stuff that the family says,
and obviously it's heartbreaking. Her mother said, please save my
(06:07):
daughter and bring her home. Um anything, anything, little tiny
bit of information, please call, Like that's that's heartbreaking in itself,
but it gives you a little bit into you know,
your first thing is okay, five o'clock parking a lot
of a Walmart. There's who knows what this girl is.
But when you get glimpses of of the family's reaction,
and obviously they're not always genuine, but you you can
(06:30):
filter through what you think that leads you to believe
that she came from a good home. She you know,
she had a family, and that she was going to
work like. That's why I say suspicious in nature is
being generous. I think it is definitely suspicious, definitely suspicious.
Do you think she can still be found? God? I
hope so. Um. You know, I think I'm tainted from
seeing all these stories through through overtime where you see
(06:53):
so many were it's either not solved there a doesn't
end well as opposed to the amount that you see
the ends in a happy ending. Uh. Yeah, I really
hope that she she can be and I think without
any further leads, I could go either way. I hope
that that is the case. I hope that she is
just somewhere and that she can if she is being
held captive, she can be. Uh she sneak gets out
(07:16):
or gets found or something. And that's why I think
it's important. That's kind of what we do here is
you bring some of these stories to light. Check it out,
Go check the footage, especially if you're in that area,
if you're in Nevada and stuff like that, or wherever
he said there was by I eight. So they think
maybe he took the car on aight. But you know
that that's the way these things get solved is when
everybody is aware of them. So we don't talk about
(07:37):
these things just for you know, not amusements, not the
right word, but but hopefully you know. I mean. The
other thing is, you know, oftentimes we don't circle back
on missing persons. And and I'm not just talking about
the podcast. I'm talking about the media because if the
story isn't interesting enough, where the trail is lost, people
often lose steam on it. Because well that was the
(07:58):
thing with the Gabby Petito thing. Every was like, why
are we still talking about this? What about all these
other cases? Right? But even to us remember the soccer
mom story, what happened to her? We don't know. We
still don't know. And actually, after watching this um Russell
Crowe movie last night but the next three days with
(08:19):
him and Elizabeth Banks oh Man, well but basically they
do escape the country. I won't give you a spoiler,
but it's about people breaking out of jail and attempting
to escape the country and become unknown. And so it's
like that, I just always look at stories like that
and thinks we don't know what's happening in someone's life.
(08:42):
And I like how I said, I always just look
at stories like that. I look at movies, I look
at anything that's not real and related to real life,
and you just never know what's going on in someone's life.
We have no idea what she was going through, but
I hope she's okay, and we will try to follow
up on the story if the media of us too. Yeah, yeah,
I think we should. Obviously we have the stories that
(09:04):
we do. We'll try and be better about, you know,
circling back on some of these, especially hopefully if there's
happy endings. Yeah. I mean sometimes, you know, you think,
how big is this circle? By the time we circle back,
it's an oval? Okay, So let's move into our next story.
It's a little more lighthearted. I would say. There's a
(09:26):
mystery illness spreading on the set of n C I
s no one died. This is why I feel like
I can make fun of it a little bit. But
apparently people are getting sick on set and vomiting. This
is to me, this is a non story. I've been
on plenty of sets like working. It's like you eat
enough craft service, you're literally I'm sorry, this is obviously
(09:49):
food poisoning. No one died, everyone vomited. Eighteen people fell sick,
it's like, yeah, maybe don't eat the sushi that's been
sitting out at Crafty all day. Is it's so hard
to not do that. I'm s sorry, but you know,
everyone's fine. Everyone had mild symptoms. I just think that
this is again people wanting to think that there's going
to be another sort of pandemic. Now the news is
(10:10):
just so insane. This is suspicious in nature, nothing more. Yeah,
and moving right along, we are going to circle back.
This one is not a noble but actually it is
once you hear the rest of the story. But Moses J.
Mosley Is autopsy reveals why his manner of death remains undetermined.
This story is again suspicious af right. Yeah, And for
(10:33):
those that don't remember he was, he's an actor on
the Walking Day right, who they thought committed suicide. But
now they have decided that it is undetermined, despite the
cause of death being confirmed as gunshot to the head.
So he was thirty one, and he was young and healthy,
and I guess no plans of suicide that he told anyone,
(10:58):
And so people are thing that they're not sure. My people,
I mean the people in charge, the coroner who took
the autopsy. So basically what they set Aside from his
fatal injury, he was in good health and tested negative
for drugs and alcohol. So they're saying that there is
a possibility that it was an accidental gunshot to the head.
(11:23):
This to me seems like a reach, like they don't
want to say he committed suicide, and I know a
lot of people don't want that to be said if
that is the case, whether it be family members or friends.
And I'm not saying I don't know obviously what this is, um,
but as sad as that is, I think we have
a responsibility UM to admit that people um sometimes I'm
(11:45):
not speaking of Moses per se, but people have um,
they have you know, mental health issues, and I think
it's something we're someone who has them is trying to
you know, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, of course, yea, yeah,
it's true. It's like the more we pretend that that's
(12:07):
not okay, the best thing you can do for any
situation is to talk about it and make people realize
that they're not alone, They're not the only ones feeling something.
So if this is just and again I don't know,
but if this is just to cover up, like well,
we don't want to say that he did this, then
it's a huge disservice. I agree. I also think, how
do you accidentally shoot yourself in the head. It's like,
(12:28):
I really I cannot figure that out. It doesn't make
any sense. I mean, he wasn't in a party playing
Russian Roulette with people, right, So if you're sitting there
and playing with if you're sitting there playing with a gun,
then I think that you know, there's there's probably some
issues to discuss, uh then and there, I mean, none
of this changes the fact that unfortunately he has obviously
(12:49):
he was killed. Um so it's really just a matter
of I don't know. I'm partially irritated by the story
because it's like we thought one thing and now it's
like remains undetermined. So what does that mean? What's the
point of coming out and saying that. Is it because
we're covering something up? Is it because we just don't
want to say something, or you know, I don't know,
(13:10):
We're just we're just not us. I mean, the news
cycle is bringing this story back up with now no
new information, even less information than we had before. So
what's the point what's happening here? That's what aggravates me.
I don't know, and I think I also, I feel
like I have less information than even less information. I'm
my my brain is bockled by this. Is that good
(13:31):
that we have people tuning in the podcast to help
them have less information than they had before. Well, hey, again,
you're not alone. The same thing is happening to us.
It feels like every time I talked to my psychiactor,
she's just like, I don't know why things are not
working out the way I thought they would for you.
I'm like, yeah, me neither. So you have less information
than even I do. This is good. This is really
(13:53):
getting paid to figure it out. Oh lord, well, Dmitri,
I think it's time to cut to a quick break
before we bring our lovely guest Lisa Guerro in for today.
And you guys are in for a real treat, if
I do say so myself. Yeah, we're gonna be talking
about the secrets of Playboy and you want to talk
about crimes in plain site. When you think something's one
(14:13):
thing and find out that it's been something else for years,
that's what we're gonna get into. Yeah, crime and plain Site.
No one asked me to ever live in the Playboy
mansion because I'm not hot enough, guys will be right back.
(14:38):
So today we have with us the amazing Lisa Guerrero.
She's one of America's most watched and most popular broadcasters,
investigative journalists, and former sports reporters. She's blazed a trail
for women in television as the chief investigative correspondent for
America's number one syndicated news magazine, Inside Edition. Five million
(14:59):
people a night watch Lisa Chase Bad Guys on TV,
and another ten million subscribers watch her stories on YouTube.
Her career on camera spans four decades, and the lessons
she's learned overcoming incredible challenges are the basis for her
inspirational memoir Warrior, My Path to Being Brave, which is
now being developed into a TV series, How Absolutely Incredible Now.
(15:23):
Lisa's also hosting a few episodes of the documentary event
Secrets of Playboy, which explores the hidden truths behind the
fable and philosophy of the Playboy Empire through a modern
day lens. The series delves into the complex world Hugh
Hefner created and examines its far reaching consequences on our
culture's view of power and sexuality. The show is on
(15:45):
A and E and the two new hour long episodes
will begin airing on March twenty, and they won't be
documentary style like the current ten episode series has been formatted. Instead,
they're going to present new convers stations hosted by none
other than former Playboy cover model and investigative journalist who's
(16:06):
here with us today, the amazing Lisa Guerrero. I gotta
tell you, Lisa, well done. Well, it's it's it's because
you have so many credentials and so much stuff to
talk about. Because normally I'll take like a sip of
coffee while he is reading this. I think I finished
my whole mug full of coffee because you had so
much interesting stuff to go through. I was gonna say,
(16:28):
this is the first time I've ever done the podcast
with my Invisilne in so the fact that I didn't
list constantly is really a feat um. So thank you
guys for putting up with that. Well, it's invisilene is
the correct term because I can't see it. Good job.
Thank you in Visiline and Lisa. What were you about
to say? I was gonna say, when people read my
bio and they go wow, You've done so many things.
(16:50):
All I think about is like, I'm old. When you're
fifty seven, you have a long bio. You better have
a long bio at MYSA your seven. I am every
single day of it. You guys, every day not a chance.
You look younger than me and I'm seventeen. That's that's
that's the that's the real time crime for today is
how much older we look than you. Yeah, this is
(17:13):
the you half learned me. Okay. So Lisa, by the way,
you gordeous, I need to know all your beauty secrets
be Latina. Oh my god, So I have to go
back in time before I was born and choose a
different set of parents. That's yeah. Yeah, well well yeah,
I like to add on that. In that department, I
(17:33):
had a Latina mom and she was pretty outstanding looking.
So I got really lucky with that. Oh my gosh. Okay,
so there's so much to talk about here. But okay,
so most people know you as a sports reporter for
Monday Night Football to your investigative work on Inside Edition.
How did you get involved with secrets of Playboy? Well,
(17:54):
you know, interestingly, they came to me because they knew
that I had a background uh with the Playboy organization.
When I was nineteen twenty and twenty one years old,
I had signed with Playboy Model Agency, which was actually
an agency that handled not just playmates, but also swimwear models,
lingerie fitness models. I had been doing swimwear modeling since
(18:17):
I was sixteen, and I was doing you know, Nautilus
and Gold Gym and a lot of body conscious campaigns
as a model. So they signed me as a fitness
model and we were encouraged to go to the Playboy
mansion for movie night. And I was really, can't see this.
(18:38):
She just did air quotes for encouraged Yes, yes, air
quotes um, and so we were kind of pressured to
go to the Playboy mansion. I was really vulnerable and
really naive back then. I didn't drink alcohol, I certainly
didn't do drugs, and I chose not to pose for
Playboy although they asked me to, and I was I
(19:00):
was really um kind of freaked out when I went
to the mansion because I saw all of these older
men chasing around these younger women. I saw a lot
of of course, alcohol and drug use, and I figured
out pretty quickly that the reason that I should go
is that they had a free buffet laid out, and
as a struggling young model and actress, I would take
(19:21):
empty tupperware in a bag, and when everybody would go
into the movie for the screening, for the movie screening,
I would sneak out and fill up these tupperware with
free food and then leave the mansion before the old
then came out to try to hit on you. That's
worth the trip right there, you at. It totally was,
(19:41):
and and that's kind of you know, I think Playboy
for for feeding me during those lean years. Um. But
I remember at one point being approached by Hugh Hefner,
and at this point I'm probably twenty, and he came
in for a kiss at the mansion down he was
at the time, no, he was three, and exactly give him,
(20:03):
give him a break. Um. He kind of came in
for the kiss, like an open mouth kiss, and I
turned my head and so he kissed me on the cheek,
but it was like slobber like a dog. And I
really decided that I didn't want to go back to
the mansion. So I probably went a handful of times.
Uh figured out it wasn't my my thing, and I
(20:25):
moved on with my career, and thankfully I didn't pose
as a centerfold back then, although I did do the
Lingerie magazine because I was dressed in something, but I
wasn't nude, so I, um, you know, I went on
with my career, became a sportscaster, became an actor that
every year they would come back to me and they
would offer me the opportunity to be a centerfold. And
then later when my career blossomed and I became a
(20:47):
national sportscaster, they started asking me to do the cover
as a celebrity cover. And finally, twenty years later, when
I was forty, I agreed to do a celebrity cover
for Boy And at that point, you know, I was
in control of the shoot. I was forty. I got
to choose the photographer, choose the location, choose the pictures. Well,
(21:08):
you were a celebrity already, not somebody looking that they
could correct manipulate you. Right, No, exactly, and so I
had control. I was a grown woman, and I found
it empowering to do that shoot. Um and I looked
back on that also as an opportunity to bridge my
career between sportscasting and Inside Edition Inside Edition did a
(21:29):
story about me appearing on the cover of Playboy at
forty and two weeks later, they offered me a two
year deal to be a West Coast correspondent for the show.
That was in two thousand and six, and since then,
I've been promoted and now I do the investigations for
the show. So I'm living this kind of dream job
in part thanks to Playboy, because I took a huge
(21:50):
risk of doing that cover. And I used to look
back on my Playboy experiences kind of with a laugh
and a wink and saying, you know, nothing bad happened
to me. I as them they didn't use me. But
now that I've seen Secrets of Playboy, and I watched
those first ten episodes with all of these women coming
forward recounting their traumatic experiences, I realized that I dodged
(22:13):
a bullet and that could have been me. Those women
could have been me. I was nineteen the first time
I met the Playboy organization, and I thank god I
have a great relationship with my dad and a strong
family unit. But you know, a lot of these women didn't,
and so they were vulnerable. And I think Hugh Hefner
and the organization preyed upon vulnerable young women, and um,
(22:37):
that's what made me want to get involved with the
series is as an investigator, as a journalist, I wanted
to tell the stories of these women. I wanted to
ask them questions about it. But I also believed them
because I was there and I remember a lot of
these incidents happening around me and knowing that there was
a darkness there that made me uncomfortable. Um. So we
(23:00):
fast forward to today and the first ten episodes you know,
have aired, and what Amy wanted to do is continue
the conversation with two more episodes in studio with a
host me that gets to ask these women questions. So
we're interviewing some women that you've already seen in the
documentary series and new women that weren't a part of
the original documentary series that are now coming forward to
(23:23):
tell their traumatic experiences to us for the first time. Well,
that's the brilliance of your position is that you're an
invest in the game of the journalist and you have
firsthand experience from that world. It's like, I mean, I
think they had to obviously they brought you on because
if your talent is that but I think it would
have been a huge missed opportunity to not have you
(23:44):
be part of that. You're the perfect person for it,
and I'm sure a lot of the girls trust you
as well. Thank you, And I think that did really
help with that trust factor because, as you probably know,
when a lot of these women came forward, they were
criticized not just by viewers or you know, mainstream readers
of the magazine, but they were criticized by women within
(24:05):
the Playboy sisterhood and that was extremely painful for them,
and they knew it was going to happen. And this
is what makes them really brave, is that these women
knew that they were going to get pushed back on this,
that they would get trolled on social media, that they
would be ousted from their Playboy sisterhood, but they did
it anyway because they to happen to the next generation
(24:27):
of young women. There's no Hugh Hefner anymore, but there
are still men like that in the world, but Hugh
types live on right, and there's no there's no there's
no way that everyone's experience was the same. So of
course they would get pushed back from people who had
who maybe gotten more from it, or who were treated
differently or or whatever, didn't have a problem with what
was going on. So yeah, so even more so, it
was brave of them to do that. Um, it's funny. Yeah,
(24:50):
I just want to stop for a second because you
make such a great point here. Um, one of the
reasons everybody quiet. I made a good point mark the calendars. Um,
what what you're saying is important because, look, the women,
the women knew that they were going to receive pushback.
So as a host and as somebody that had been there,
it was important for me to be able to point
(25:12):
out to the viewer to say, look, I don't have
an ax to grind. This didn't happen to me. I
was not a victim of a rape or or a
drugging or an abduction. But what I can tell you
is that just because it didn't happen to me doesn't
mean that it didn't happen to these women. You know,
it's it's really hard for for people to kind of
(25:33):
get their head around that concept somehow, but it's it's
not too easy to imagine that just because one person is, uh,
you know, a predator, that doesn't mean they're a predator
to every single woman they come across they can't, but
they pick people to groom that are specifically vulnerable to attack.
So that's why, because I don't have an extra grind,
(25:55):
I think I was the right person to ask these
questions and to help the audience kind of have this
conversation about it. Well, so in the latest episode of
Secrets of Playboy, it was allegedly very scathing against you,
and like you said, some people had really negative experiences
with him, and not everyone did. What were some of
(26:16):
your other personal interactions with him, like and what else
did you witness firsthand? So when I was at the
Mansion Um again one, I immediately there is a sense
of inequity in terms of the age differences between the
men and the women. You know, I I I realized,
(26:37):
and I think a lot of young women, probably you know,
at that age range really think of guys over thirty
even as old, you know, when you're I remember being
nineteen and twenty and you know, going to clubs with
a fake I D and seeing a thirty year old
at a bar and thinking, oh, gross, he's old. He's
he's got to be at least thirty, he's probably divorced.
And so meanwhile I'm looking for a guy who's forty five,
(26:59):
and I'm like, he's at his prime. Yeah, exactly. But
when you're young, you don't look at it like if
you have a normal you know, pretty much of a
normal family unit, where you're kind of, um, haven't been
abused or haven't been traumatized. I think most young women
at that age would see men in their fifties and
sixties and not necessarily be attracted to them. But those
(27:20):
men were there, and it wasn't just this is a
big part of this story, right. It wasn't just Hugh Hefner.
He had a whole circle of men around him that
were exhibiting the same kind of behavior. And so the
first thing I noticed was how uncomfortable I was with
that and how um, you know, they kept saying the
(27:41):
same thing, Oh, I'm sure you want to be an actress.
I'm a producer, I can help you. You know, I'm
a director, I'm a star, And there there was just
a real sense of Okay, there is some kind of
trade going on here, and it was It was gross
to me, It made me uncome trible. But at the
same time I also understood that I was there because
(28:03):
my agency wanted me to be there, and then I
was there later to get free food. So you know,
everybody was participating in some way in this kind of
um you know, I guess exchange in some way. People
were there for business, people were there to help their career,
people were there to find a young woman. It was
really interesting. That's the scary part about that situation, is
(28:25):
that type of stuff. We've heard stories about that in
Hollywood for forever. I'm a director, I'm a producer. I
can help your career. I guess you want to be
an actress. This this has happened to me a million
times as But now you're in a position in an
atmosphere where it's completely sexualized, and you're not on a
set where they're like trying to sneak it in here.
That is what they're doing at the mansion, Like, that's
(28:46):
why those guys are there. They're not there looking for
somebody to start in their movie. Right there there to
get what they want, and so it's almost like it's
almost like just walking right into a trap and and
knowing it is, but it's normalized. Well, that's that is
exactly right, and that that is why these stories about
Carissa and Christina Shannon, which are the twins from the
(29:09):
final series of The Girls next Door. Um, that's who
we're talking about on the first one of these two
specials who went on Monday Night is behind the scenes
of The Girls next Door and the twins come forward
for the first time. They were nineteen when they first
got to the mansion and became his girlfriends. He was
eighty three, and they watched that show, The Girls next
(29:31):
Door as teenagers, and they thought it was a sitcom.
They didn't think it was real. So when they were
asked to be the girlfriends and they were asked to
be to live at the mansion, they didn't realize what
they were getting into. They were vulnerable, they were young,
They came from a very tough background, and what they
found themselves in was much more than they could process
(29:53):
or handle at that age. And they have some really
traumatic experiences that they're telling me about on Monday Night. Um,
and it's it's they've never talked about this before, but
it's it's an example of these really young women being
targeted by this older man and his organization. Do you
think anyone was actually attracted to Hugh. I think when
(30:15):
he was younger and as I was watching, you know,
that's a really great question, I think because as I
was watching the early episodes when he was younger, he
was very handsome, he was powerful. You know, he came
across as a feminist, and some people still believe and
in some ways. I think one of the things he
talked about was women taking ownership of their sexuality and
(30:36):
and you know free, you know, freedom of of your
your sexuality, your body, um. Feminism, um. As we kind
of thought of feminism in the seventies. Part of that
was being comfortable with your nudity, not having to wear
braws right and and and having sex with who you
wanted to when he wanted to, being able to get
a pill, the pill, being able to to have an
(30:59):
abortion if you wanted too. So those are things that
early on Hugh Hefner was a champion of so I
can see how earlier he was attractive to some some women.
And when you look at Sondra Theodore, who's one of
the women we talked to in the second of my episodes,
which is a week from Monday, she was very young,
but he was in his fifties when they were dating,
(31:20):
and and he was still handsome, and he was, you know,
a powerful man, a wealthy man. He lived in a mansion,
and I can see how a young woman might get
swept away at that point. Now, as he got older,
it's inconceivable to me to be attracted to somebody, you
know that that became the man, that that he looks
(31:42):
like he was towards the end um and that that's
really troubling, isn't it It is? And also speaking of
the youth that was in the house, is it true
that it was commonplace that girls who were seventeen would
take photos for Centerfold and then once they turned eighteen,
they would publish the magazine. Yeah. So, Susie Craibacker, who
(32:02):
used to go by the name Susie Scott, was a playmate,
and we talked to Susie in the second of these
two episodes, the special So a Week from Monday. Susie
talks about um, you know, the fact that she was
actually underage when she shot her first Centerfold and they
waited until she turned eighteen to publish them. Yeah. So
(32:23):
so there there there were instances that some of these
women talk about throughout the the documentary series, and then
the twins themselves of course they you know, they were
nineteen when they came to be on the show, but
they were taking suggestive photos, you know, a couple of
years earlier, and in fact they were submitted to be
(32:46):
on the show before they were, you know, of age.
The problem is that that he you know, obviously you
mentioned that he was into certain things that were that
were on the right track when he was younger. But
but the problem is the part of the manipulation is
that he really for all the other publications that did
(33:06):
similar things, Playboy was always equated with class. It was
the bow tie, it was this, and it was and
you really got a feeling, Oh, he's taking care of
these people. This is this is what's going on. This
is a class adventure. He's not doing the hustler, he's
not doing the the penthouse. You know, this is this
is he's taking care of these girls. And everybody just
kind of feeling that. So I can understand that these
(33:27):
girls went there thinking one thing, and then all of
a sudden, you're in this if I may it's Spider's web,
and you're like, huh, yeah, well, you know that's that's
that's really the case. And again, the docuseries talks about
the brand and how the brand was different than Penthouse
or Hustler or these other more risque or much more
(33:49):
explicit magazines. And so there was this image that that
the women that were on the cover and that we're, um,
you know, in the centerfolds, were the girl next door.
We're all American girls and we're you know, we're sweet,
and you know, they even equate them. There's a Playboy
manifesto that's spoken about in these specials where they equate
(34:11):
the playmate to a bunny. That she should be fresh
and she should smell freshly washed, and she should appear
to be innocent. And so there, there is definitely there.
There was for many years this image of the playmates
and how they should be the girls next door. I
would never be able to be a playmate. They'd seen
me as a caveman. They'd take one sniff and they'd
(34:34):
be like, has this woman showered in a week? Uh?
In the in the bowels of a comedy club. Um? Wow?
So I mean I have I have one million questions,
but you know it feels very Weinstein and Epstein adjacent. Yes,
I hate that I just named off Jews. I'm like,
(34:55):
as one Um, but you know, it's like, this stuff
happens not just in Hollywood, and I think sometimes people
forget that, right, Um. But also I just want to
ask you. I don't know if you ever witnessed this,
but I did hear a conspiracy theory here we go,
(35:17):
you know what? That used to be funny, but nowadays
the conspiracy there is hit more times than not. I
think so, right, but that there was a whole tunnel
system underneath the Playboy mansion where they would sneak underage
girls to other people's mansions. Well, the what's really interesting
about that question is that there is an episode about
(35:40):
these mini mansions. So Hugh Hefner had a group of
friends that had mansion systems of their own, and so
there have been rumors for a long time that, you
know that these women that would be picked up at
the mansion maybe would end up with one of the
friends at another mini mansion in the Hollywood Hills. I
(36:00):
have heard about the tunnels as well, So, UM, I
guess I would. Nothing would surprise me at this point, nothing, right, Well,
did you ever see Epstein there? I didn't know, And
again I was so young that I don't know if
I would even recognize him. Um, yeah, I wouldn't have
remembered that, right, right, right. You know, it's so interesting
(36:22):
thinking about all the different types of predators who have
come forward, and of course with the case of Epstein,
he had a right hand man or in this case,
a right hand woman, Galaine Maxwell. Did you feel like
there was that type of figure at the Playboy house?
There were so Madeline who was one of the photographers.
Of course Mary who was the house mother, UM and
(36:44):
his his assistant. I guess you would call call her
and she was in The Secret she was in The
Girl's next Door as well. She's featured prominently in those shows.
Um and he had different women that were within the
organization that worked in publicity. I'm at a lot of
the women. When I did both modeling, the modeling agency
was run by a woman, and UM, when I did
(37:07):
the cover the you know, a lot of the people
that I talked to within the organization that I did
the deal with to do the cover, we're women. So
there were a lot of women within the organization that
we're dealing directly with playmates or covers or the bunnies,
the Bunny system. You know, there were bunny mothers um so,
so yeah they were. There were multiple women um involved
(37:29):
in the organization at different levels. It's because as gross
as these guys in these situations are, they're not They're grows,
they're not morons. They know that they need this bridge.
Right If a woman sees another woman and so okay
we stick together, I know we're okay. So they think, okay,
that I'm safe here, that this isn't what I think
(37:51):
it might be, or or at least removes it a
few levels. And it's the same thing with obviously, I
don't know if you know anybody, I'm not asking you
to name anybody, but a lot of people I think
these situations are always like, oh, there's this rich dude
and he's got his buddies with him. But there are
famous people that partake of this stuff, as we've heard
rumors from the Epstein things and stuff like that, or
more so. And and part of that is also you know,
(38:12):
you walk into a party and you think, oh, I'm
cool because this person is here, so it's safe here.
But it's just another thing to lure you in and
make you feel like, okay, this is okay, and once
you're in far enough that's really interesting. Yeah, that is
the beauty of the mansion. And going to the mansion,
going to all those parties is because there were celebrities
there and it was considered a cool thing to do
(38:32):
and you were considered like a I guess an insider,
hit person or celebrity if you're going to the mansion
and so um, so there is that lure and then
you let your guard down, and in some cases, some
of these women report being drugged. Um, you know, there's
a lot of drinking going on, and you know, and
suddenly some of these young, vulnerable women are targeted. And
(38:55):
what I love about the Secrets of Playboy is that
they are naming names and they are talking about, you know,
the people that we're helping to prop up um, you know,
Hugh Hefner and the entire organization and and the show
just blows my mind because there were so many details
and so many stories that kind of corroborated each other. Fascinating.
(39:17):
Do you think anyone will go to jail after this errors?
I don't know. You know, that would require a couple
of things. You know, people would need to come forward
and um, in some cases, maybe a file a report.
Some of these these alleged crimes took place many years ago.
Of course, Hugh Heffner's dad, And you know, one of
(39:39):
the the episodes talks about the fact that Um, according
to people that worked for Playboy, both the l a
p D and Beverly Hills Police Department officers worked part
time as security at the mansion, and so there was
a connection there. So this is like, that's fascinating. It's yeah,
it's really vast eating. I encourage it. If you haven't
(40:01):
seen the show yet, you can download. You can binge
all ten episodes before Monday when we do the the
after specials, because I think, you know, it's some of
these stories are so detailed and interesting, and like I said,
a lot of these women and men that worked for
him were naming names UM and talking about these these
really troubling aspects of the organization. It's funny, because it's
(40:27):
not funny at all. Um. I remember there was one
Super Bowl where I went to a very famous director's
house and you know what, I'm not on the documentary,
so I'm not naming names, but you know, I was
there and there were a lot of girls there, so
I felt safe, and yet I was still drugged and
(40:48):
I don't even drink alcohol. They put J H B
in the water. Wow, And suddenly I couldn't pick my
head up and I was like what. I don't know
what's going on. And then my friend was like, we
should go, and I was like what she said, sometimes
they put g in the water so people have more fun.
(41:10):
And I was like, first of all, the fact that
you know that and we're still here and came in
the first place. I'm not friends with that person anymore.
Nice of them to tell you to leave, but never
been drugged in the first place. Um, And and you know,
not to make this about me, but to make this
about me, I don't know Lisa, you don't know me,
but this is what I do. There is this one
(41:31):
time on a TV set. I was shooting a show
and the lead actor, who's again very famous you know him, UM,
had his body double not naming names, not on the documentary,
but you can watch the show on Monday. Any so, UM,
he had his body double follow me to my trailer
and give me a card with his personal cell phone
(41:53):
and he said, UM, he really wants to help you.
Can you send him a body shot and text I
met this number and because I was just so cute
and look, I was never gonna do anything, right, So
I text him and he goes, hey, this is my
personal cell phone number. Don't give this to anyone. And
I said okay, and then he said, you know, um,
I can help send me over your body shot and
(42:14):
head shot and and you know, Lisa, as an actress,
no one's asking you for body shots, no one's asking
for bikini photos. You want to see your real like
your actual work, right right right right, and then and
then he and then he said, um, why don't you
come to my hotel? And he's staying at the Mandarin
And I never responded. I love the fact that he
(42:37):
said this body double like that guy was like, I
think I'm only your body double in the shot, like
doing your work. Yeah, he also sent me his number.
He's like, if you can send it to me to
why you know, why not you should have had your
body double Sanday for him. Yeah. At this point, it's
like if I send a photo of any Jewish woman,
they're like, that's leoh right, Um, so you said you
(43:00):
said you said that, you know, obviously you were you
were smart enough because you came from a good family.
And said, I mean, you must look at this, look
back at this now and and be like, thank God
that I have the family that I like. You just
want to go home and hug everybody and just be
like I was in that. I was basically on the doorstep,
maybe even in the front door of all of that.
But because of who I am, I realized, and I
(43:22):
turned around and got out. And it wasn't because I
was smarter than them. Let's let's be really clear. It
was just literally that I had a really good dad
and had a very stable home life, and you know,
I was was young and dumb ones too, and I
was vulnerable. And not that they were dumb either, um,
(43:42):
but they I think, you know, the people that that
kind of went down that path were targeted. And when
you are targeted and you are away from home. A
lot of them were from different states and even different countries, um,
somewhere from Canada. They they felt, um like this was
a place to live because you know, the mansion provided
(44:03):
them a place to live, not only a place to live,
a mansion in Beverly Hills, a mansion in Beverly Hills
and a huge potential career. And so I could definitely
see how that could happen too. It could have happened,
like I always said, could have happened to me. It
could have been me. So that that gives me a
lot of empathy when I hear the stories, and it
also makes me very willing to believe them because I
(44:27):
saw this kind of thing happening. Did they ever ask
you to live in the house? No, No they didn't.
They didn't. They asked me to pose for the magazine,
and I said, now they asked. You know, I was
invited to all the parties, and I stopped going after
a little while because I was uncomfortable after the the
Hugh Hefner kiss. How many pers Yeah, how many seafood towers?
(44:50):
Would you say? We're present? Lots of seafood towers, Oh
my gosh. And remember this was the this is then
the eighties, Yeah, late eighties. Oh you know, I'm sure
there were all that that kind of eighties swank food there.
I was. I was very easily impressed because I grew
up on you know, pizza hut and Twinkies, So I'm
(45:10):
still impressed by a sea food tower. That's true. I
could just see it. They're like, would you like to
live here? Would you like to stay over tonight? And
you're like, Guys, I'm gonna be honest with you, I'm
just here for the buffet. I would be I'd be like, yeah,
I'd love to live here. How much stage time can
I get for comedy? Yeah, for comedy. I'm I'm not
a stripper. I'm an emotional stripper. There's a difference. Yeah,
(45:34):
but I'll tell you a joke for a dollar. Um um.
That's the thing. And to what you said, Lisa, No,
it's not that, like it should not be inferred that
these people were You don't have to be stupid or like.
That's what they do. They find people, they find the
right targets for this, and like we said before, they
(45:55):
build those bridges of quote unquote trust. So people think, Okay,
I'm saying, so, it's not you don't have to be
stupid to fall for something like this because they're not
idiots and they know what they're doing. Sadly, they know
what they're doing and they're they're using that to their advantage.
Part of the interesting, uh aspect for me of interviewing
these women is to find out why they did this,
(46:17):
you know, to ask them directly and to ask those
follow up questions that people have Since the series debuted,
a lot of people said on social media, what they
should have known what they were getting into? How would
they not know? You know, they got what they wanted.
They were a star on a reality show where they
got a you know, a centrifold. But but it's really
important to let them answer those questions and let them
(46:39):
describe how they arrived to the mansion to begin with
and what that experience is. You know, what that experience
was to them. And I think that it's it's it's
worthy of our time to at least give them the
respect and dignity to listen to their stories and then
we can process it, believe it if we want. I
believe the women, and I think that most of the
viewers that have watched the episodes believe the women as well.
(47:01):
And this is just something I've been thinking about. Did
you notice any sort of common theme with religion or
lack there other than the house? Oh gosh, um, are
you talking about the women's stories, like where they came from? Well? Yeah,
if just anyone was, you know, going to church on
Sunday's or didn't hold a special service in the yard
(47:23):
every Sunday. You know, you did not know there was
you know, when when I was there. Of course, I
was just there for the screening nights, so I didn't
see anything like that. But but one interesting aspect that
you're kind of touching on is that some of the
women came from very religious backgrounds originally and again, fascinating
part of the story. How did you get from there
to hear? You know? And that's again, uh, something that
(47:47):
I think it's important for us to listen to those stories.
It's relatable, more relatable than you would think. Yeah. I mean,
I can just imagine women in Easter bunny costumes right
to your point of having a strong dad and and
you know, people are it's just this goes out to
everybody and it's like and it's not a p s A.
But I guess it is. It's what I what I
(48:07):
do because I have four kids and three of them
are girls and they're young. But what it is is,
you know, I remember when my first daughter was born,
somebody came out, you know, somebody nice. It wasn't anything weird,
but somebody was like, oh and they brought a president, Like, oh,
can I have a hug, and I was like, no,
I was like, we're not gonna She's not gonna do that.
She's not going to think that she has to give
you a hug because she got a present, so right
off the bat. And when I'm with my kids, I'm
(48:29):
never like, oh, you want dessert, okay, can here give me?
Kids Like, it's none of that ship. It's you get
what you get and you that you deserve and there's
never a trade off for it. And I think no,
I was gonna interrupt you rudely because again, you're making
so many great points Lean and Dmitri, so many great points,
but we're recording this are this This notion of you know,
(48:52):
of women being vulnerable if they don't have a great
relationship with their father is just I mean, it's a
universe truth. And I'm sorry, but it's so important for
dad's to be um cognizant of how important it is,
because you are you are a role model for your daughter,
and you are setting the table for every single relationship
(49:14):
she has moving forward in her life. And if she
views you as something that she can trust, who is loyal,
who supports her, who um who encourages her to get
an education, to be strong, to have her own opinions.
Then those are the kinds of men she's going to
to look for someday. So my daughters will grow up
and be like, yeah, this guy is not sarcastic enough. Yeah,
(49:35):
this explains a lot about like an idiot. Dmitri, your
daughter is gonna end up marrying a comedian. I'm so sorry. No, No,
that's part of the stuff I'm instilling. I'm like, remember,
just because they're funny doesn't mean you have to kiss him.
I learned that the hard way. They have to too.
This is what I keep telling the men who meet
me and like, just because I'm funny, it doesn't mean
(49:56):
you have to kiss me. Um wow. Okay, well, Lisa,
thank you so much for joining us today. And you know,
before we go, if you have any final thoughts or
anything you want people to know about the book, the series, anything,
we'd love to hear it. I just you know, I
really encourage people, like I said, to to download it
(50:17):
and to stream or or however you're going to watch
your your your shows, please watch the previous time episodes
and then you know, jump in on on Monday night,
because um, I think it's important again to to be
open minded when we hear these stories. And it's not
just these stories that we're hearing on secrets of Playboy,
(50:37):
it's all women's stories that you know, these women being
courageous enough to come forward. Now it's important for us
to at least be open minded enough to watch these stories,
to listen to what they have to say and to
process it. And UM, kudos to the women that came forward.
They are my heroes. Mm hmm. I love your story
and I love I love that they're making a TV
(50:59):
series out of your story, so I would look forward
to seeing that. Thank you, I'll be back. We'll talk
about that next. Can't wait. Lisa, thank you so much
for joining us and still waiting on your beauty secrets.
If that means I have to take a time machine
and choose different parents, I will. Um, thank you so
much for joining us. And can you tell people where
(51:19):
they can find you on the internet? Yes, UM, you
can find I'm a Twitter girl, that's my jams, so
you can go to at the number four Lisa Guerrero
g u E R R E r oh. I'm also
on Instagram and um all the places as well as
Lisa Guerrero dot Com. Amazing. Thank you so much for
(51:39):
joining us on Real Time Crime, and we're going to
be tuning in Monday night. We're so excited. Thanks Leah,
Thanks Dmitri, thank you. Yeah. Oh boy, all right, she
(52:02):
was fantastic. Not only was she fantastic, but she made
me feel very insecure about my wardrobe, hair and makeup
choices for today and lighting. So we we both took
a job to the face. When she's like, yeah, no,
I'm fifty seven, I'm like, it's like, what, Yeah, you
look twenty one. I mean, she's stunning, and she's obviously
highly intelligent and professional, and I'm very excited to watch
(52:24):
her host these episodes. I can't wait to watch. Yeah. No,
it's interesting, it's gonna be interesting. And and I haven't
seen um you know, I haven't seen. I'm gonna catch
up with the ones I haven't seen and before um
she hosts those things starting on Monday night, so just
to be caught up, Like she's got a lot of
TV to watch. No, no, it's not that I haven't
seen any of the time. It's just that I haven't
seen all time. But it's you know, it's well, you
(52:47):
have to understand. This is something that I can't just
you know, pop on secrets of Playboy in the middle
of the day or at dinner time because I have
kids around, so I have to watch this, you know, right,
and and they can watch it and not have to
give you a right that's right. Nobody has to give
me a hug. I think everybody knows that, you know what.
It's so interesting when you said that, it really triggered
(53:08):
me because because I think that a lot of society
is very transactional, and you're teaching your daughters not to
be transactual It's like, if I give you this, you
get that, and it's not based on any sort of
reward system or yeah you didn't. You're not making love
a business. Yeah. And by the way, I'm teaching my
(53:31):
son that as well. For for two sides of it,
because one, we shouldn't act like like boys are never
the victim of something like that. They are. But the
other thing is, I don't you know, I think he's
he's got an advantage because he has three sisters. Um
that he's going to understand, you know, how women feel
and how they think and how they should be treated.
But um, I think that's important for him to see
(53:52):
as well. But why do I feel like you have
twenty five children? I do? I have kids? Yeah, has
been busy times. Oh boy, all right to me, Tri,
Where can everyone find you on the internet? Everyone? Unfortunately,
much to your dismay, I'm simply at at Dmitri Pappis
on Instagram, um, and that's the best. And I'm at
(54:15):
Leo Lamar l e H L A M A R
R on all the things except TikTok, where I'm Leo
Lamar with five hours because don't ask me. Don't ask
me why. I don't know. We'll circle back on it
and maybe we'll go back on it. I mean, I
don't know if I'll ever find the answer. No, But
you know what, now that you've spelled it out, that
makes a good point. D E M E T R
I P A P P A Y S. And I'll
(54:36):
say that because I keep getting invoices for in my
email from some gym in Florida, and it's like, Hey,
I'm like, oh, look, I got this this drink at
the bar at the gym today. And I don't live
in Florida. I don't go to the gym, and I
don't care you guys. I'm Jim Shakes from the gym.
But so the point is, you know, it's it's when
you spell something wrong, you go down a whole of
the rabbit hole. So that guy is not gonna pay
(54:58):
his dues because they keep coming to me. Wow, Well,
now that guy is gonna get fat and it's your fault.
What do you gonna do? Well, he's in Florida, so
he's probably already fat. Allegedly. Thank you. Yes, if you
want to call in and leave a voicemail, please do.
If it's about a crime you think we should look into.
If it's about an update from an old case that
we for some reason don't have, let us know. We
(55:20):
like shining light on weird mysteries that I have been
unsolved and completing the circle and closing it up, whether
it's a circle or noval. I really want to stop
with this whole circle analogy because it's not really doing
anything for anyone. I think it will end when the
podcast ends. We won't carry into the next one. And
if you want to just leave a voicemail and tell
Leah she's doing great, and then I should shut up.
Then you know, I go for it. I can take
(55:40):
that too, Yeah, and you can do that at eight
six s crime. That's eight six six to any one,
crame eight six six to annyone crime eight six six
two and two seven four six three. That's the first
time you had to dance by yourself, and now you
could have danced. I could have, but I'm not going to.
Dimitri As is like, everyone's watching. Alright, Stay safe, y'all.
(56:05):
We'll see you next week, Love you, bye bye. It's
real time crop, it's real time gra I mean, is
it actually real time crime or solving anything or is
that just the thing we say. It's a thing we say,
got it? Okay, See you next week for more real
time crime, only on iHeart Radio.
Crime. Hello everyone, and welcome to another episode of Real
Time Crime. I'm your host, Leah Lamar, and I have
with me our incredible friend who is sometimes Dmitri, but
(00:23):
now oftentimes Dmitri. Dmitri. It's a good thing I didn't
take sometimes to meet you on Instagram because now that
you'd be like, go get oftentimes Dmitri. Well, I mean
I don't see you running to your phone to change
your handles. Yeah, so no more promotions for you, Dmitri.
Or that's the last one. I'm still at Dmitri Pappis.
That's all al right, whatever you can tell him. In
my dad's office today, I'm in Florida, lucky me, and
(00:46):
I see you are in your own office. That's right,
because you're a dad, that's right. I work from all
this is where I am, so I spend the day here,
and you know I I always talk into a microphone,
but it just happens to be convenient when we're on
the podcast. I never noticed this before, but it does
seem like the artwork behind you as a bar code.
Uh maybe I see. I can tell you in Florida
(01:08):
because you have the vertical lines, the blinds, all the
vertical blinds. They're killing me. I hate the vertical blinds. Okay, well,
today we're going to be discussing a bunch of hot
topics as usual. There is a search for an eighteen
year old woman who disappeared suspiciously in Nevada. We will
be covering a mystery illness that hit the set of
(01:28):
n C I S and we'll be covering circling back.
I should say to Moses J. Mosley's autopsy results. And
then we have a very special guest with us today,
Lisa Guero, who is the host of Secrets of Playboy
on A and E, which would be airing on Monday.
And I'm very excited about this episode today. But first
(01:48):
I'd like to apologize to everyone that I'm wearing my
visial line. I don't think it's it's invisible the video.
Nobody can you hear it? This is most people are listening, Dmitri.
I'm not sure if realized that. No. I thought you
were drunk. You thought I was drunk. No, Oh, I
didn't really think you were drunk. I don't hear anything.
I don't hear a difference. You don't hear This is
(02:10):
coming from a career mumbler. So what's the difference, king
of mumbling mumbled looking? All right, let's just get into
this because I'm mentally ill today. Okay, So our first
hot topic for today is Nevada authorities are searching for
an eighteen year old woman whose disappearance they say is
suspicious in nature. I mean, I have to say, any
(02:31):
disappearance is usually suspicious in nature. So I'm not really
sure what that headlines about, but I think that's being polite.
I think that I think this is definitely suspicious. Right,
So what they're saying is she did not intentionally run away.
Something happened. Okay. So Naomi has been missing for more
than a week. She's eighteen, and she lives in Nevada.
(02:52):
She was last seen in her car in the parking
lot of a Walmart, and she parked her car on
five am and was active on social media between five
oh nine and five three am. And Detective Eric whose
Marris with the Lion County Sheriff's Office, during a Tuesday
news conference, declared that this was correct and so apparently
(03:14):
she was waiting to take the shuttle to work from Walmart.
That's the important thing because if you say she was
in her car at five am in a Walmart parking lot.
You think, well, who knows what, but that she was
catching a shuttle from there to go to work. I've
never seen that early in the morning. So already, I mean,
I find this unbelievable. Okay, So at five twenty four,
(03:35):
a surveillance video shows a man wearing a gray hooded sweatshirt,
dark pants or jeans, and dark tennis shoes approaching her vehicle.
At five, her vehicle was seen leaving the parking lot
with the man driving. Okay, so this is very quick turnaround.
So she was on social from five oh nine to
five twenty three. At five twenty four, he pops up
(03:55):
on surveillance at five they're already out of the parking
lot and he was drying her car and he's driving
her car. Okay, and um On March fift her vehicle
is recovered near the Walmart and it's currently being processed.
Authorities are asking for the public's help in locating the
dark newer Chevrolet. Um, well, is that is that his
(04:21):
car that they're looking for? I don't know that. Well, no, no,
I thought that that was her car. Yeah, yeah, her car.
So they found her car. But my question is one
I don't know. If you watch the footage they post
the footage from the surveillance camera, it doesn't show anything.
(04:42):
It doesn't show him getting into her car, just shows
the back of his head, So you just see a
hood up. You basically don't see a person at all.
You can't tell anything about him maybe his height maybe,
and you don't seem getting into the car, and you
don't see the car leaving, So it's not really showing
us all the information because part of me is like, well,
she's sitting me in the diver seat and she scooted over.
(05:02):
Was she sitting in the passenger seat waiting for this person?
My assumption is that he approached with a weapon and
said I am like basically cardjactor. But the question is, so,
why why is that footage trunk heated like SEC just
just runs constantly. Well, we can ask the same same
thing about the hotel Sixel, well except that you already
chalked up to the elevator game, but this had no elevator. Um.
(05:24):
But the other question is so I wonder if she
As with most of these stories, I have a ton
of questions. Was she there every day? At five am
to catch that struggle to work. I imagine it had
to be some sort of routine. So perhaps someone had
known this and kind of it wasn't like some random thing,
maybe slightly premeditated. Is it someone she knew? Was she
(05:46):
involved in something that we're uncertain about or don't know
about where we but there are millions you know? Was
it someone that she met online? We just don't know.
It could have just been a random person who held
her up and took her car. Yeah, and you can,
obviously you look into the stuff that the family says,
and obviously it's heartbreaking. Her mother said, please save my
(06:07):
daughter and bring her home. Um anything, anything, little tiny
bit of information, please call, Like that's that's heartbreaking in itself,
but it gives you a little bit into you know,
your first thing is okay, five o'clock parking a lot
of a Walmart. There's who knows what this girl is.
But when you get glimpses of of the family's reaction,
and obviously they're not always genuine, but you you can
(06:30):
filter through what you think that leads you to believe
that she came from a good home. She you know,
she had a family, and that she was going to
work like. That's why I say suspicious in nature is
being generous. I think it is definitely suspicious, definitely suspicious.
Do you think she can still be found? God? I
hope so. Um. You know, I think I'm tainted from
seeing all these stories through through overtime where you see
(06:53):
so many were it's either not solved there a doesn't
end well as opposed to the amount that you see
the ends in a happy ending. Uh. Yeah, I really
hope that she she can be and I think without
any further leads, I could go either way. I hope
that that is the case. I hope that she is
just somewhere and that she can if she is being
held captive, she can be. Uh she sneak gets out
(07:16):
or gets found or something. And that's why I think
it's important. That's kind of what we do here is
you bring some of these stories to light. Check it out,
Go check the footage, especially if you're in that area,
if you're in Nevada and stuff like that, or wherever
he said there was by I eight. So they think
maybe he took the car on aight. But you know
that that's the way these things get solved is when
everybody is aware of them. So we don't talk about
(07:37):
these things just for you know, not amusements, not the
right word, but but hopefully you know. I mean. The
other thing is, you know, oftentimes we don't circle back
on missing persons. And and I'm not just talking about
the podcast. I'm talking about the media because if the
story isn't interesting enough, where the trail is lost, people
often lose steam on it. Because well that was the
(07:58):
thing with the Gabby Petito thing. Every was like, why
are we still talking about this? What about all these
other cases? Right? But even to us remember the soccer
mom story, what happened to her? We don't know. We
still don't know. And actually, after watching this um Russell
Crowe movie last night but the next three days with
(08:19):
him and Elizabeth Banks oh Man, well but basically they
do escape the country. I won't give you a spoiler,
but it's about people breaking out of jail and attempting
to escape the country and become unknown. And so it's
like that, I just always look at stories like that
and thinks we don't know what's happening in someone's life.
(08:42):
And I like how I said, I always just look
at stories like that. I look at movies, I look
at anything that's not real and related to real life,
and you just never know what's going on in someone's life.
We have no idea what she was going through, but
I hope she's okay, and we will try to follow
up on the story if the media of us too. Yeah, yeah,
I think we should. Obviously we have the stories that
(09:04):
we do. We'll try and be better about, you know,
circling back on some of these, especially hopefully if there's
happy endings. Yeah. I mean sometimes, you know, you think,
how big is this circle? By the time we circle back,
it's an oval? Okay, So let's move into our next story.
It's a little more lighthearted. I would say. There's a
(09:26):
mystery illness spreading on the set of n C I
s no one died. This is why I feel like
I can make fun of it a little bit. But
apparently people are getting sick on set and vomiting. This
is to me, this is a non story. I've been
on plenty of sets like working. It's like you eat
enough craft service, you're literally I'm sorry, this is obviously
(09:49):
food poisoning. No one died, everyone vomited. Eighteen people fell sick,
it's like, yeah, maybe don't eat the sushi that's been
sitting out at Crafty all day. Is it's so hard
to not do that. I'm s sorry, but you know,
everyone's fine. Everyone had mild symptoms. I just think that
this is again people wanting to think that there's going
to be another sort of pandemic. Now the news is
(10:10):
just so insane. This is suspicious in nature, nothing more. Yeah,
and moving right along, we are going to circle back.
This one is not a noble but actually it is
once you hear the rest of the story. But Moses J.
Mosley Is autopsy reveals why his manner of death remains undetermined.
This story is again suspicious af right. Yeah, And for
(10:33):
those that don't remember he was, he's an actor on
the Walking Day right, who they thought committed suicide. But
now they have decided that it is undetermined, despite the
cause of death being confirmed as gunshot to the head.
So he was thirty one, and he was young and healthy,
and I guess no plans of suicide that he told anyone,
(10:58):
And so people are thing that they're not sure. My people,
I mean the people in charge, the coroner who took
the autopsy. So basically what they set Aside from his
fatal injury, he was in good health and tested negative
for drugs and alcohol. So they're saying that there is
a possibility that it was an accidental gunshot to the head.
(11:23):
This to me seems like a reach, like they don't
want to say he committed suicide, and I know a
lot of people don't want that to be said if
that is the case, whether it be family members or friends.
And I'm not saying I don't know obviously what this is, um,
but as sad as that is, I think we have
a responsibility UM to admit that people um sometimes I'm
(11:45):
not speaking of Moses per se, but people have um,
they have you know, mental health issues, and I think
it's something we're someone who has them is trying to
you know, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, of course, yea, yeah,
it's true. It's like the more we pretend that that's
(12:07):
not okay, the best thing you can do for any
situation is to talk about it and make people realize
that they're not alone, They're not the only ones feeling something.
So if this is just and again I don't know,
but if this is just to cover up, like well,
we don't want to say that he did this, then
it's a huge disservice. I agree. I also think, how
do you accidentally shoot yourself in the head. It's like,
(12:28):
I really I cannot figure that out. It doesn't make
any sense. I mean, he wasn't in a party playing
Russian Roulette with people, right, So if you're sitting there
and playing with if you're sitting there playing with a gun,
then I think that you know, there's there's probably some
issues to discuss, uh then and there, I mean, none
of this changes the fact that unfortunately he has obviously
(12:49):
he was killed. Um so it's really just a matter
of I don't know. I'm partially irritated by the story
because it's like we thought one thing and now it's
like remains undetermined. So what does that mean? What's the
point of coming out and saying that. Is it because
we're covering something up? Is it because we just don't
want to say something, or you know, I don't know,
(13:10):
We're just we're just not us. I mean, the news
cycle is bringing this story back up with now no
new information, even less information than we had before. So
what's the point what's happening here? That's what aggravates me.
I don't know, and I think I also, I feel
like I have less information than even less information. I'm
my my brain is bockled by this. Is that good
(13:31):
that we have people tuning in the podcast to help
them have less information than they had before. Well, hey, again,
you're not alone. The same thing is happening to us.
It feels like every time I talked to my psychiactor,
she's just like, I don't know why things are not
working out the way I thought they would for you.
I'm like, yeah, me neither. So you have less information
than even I do. This is good. This is really
(13:53):
getting paid to figure it out. Oh lord, well, Dmitri,
I think it's time to cut to a quick break
before we bring our lovely guest Lisa Guerro in for today.
And you guys are in for a real treat, if
I do say so myself. Yeah, we're gonna be talking
about the secrets of Playboy and you want to talk
about crimes in plain site. When you think something's one
(14:13):
thing and find out that it's been something else for years,
that's what we're gonna get into. Yeah, crime and plain Site.
No one asked me to ever live in the Playboy
mansion because I'm not hot enough, guys will be right back.
(14:38):
So today we have with us the amazing Lisa Guerrero.
She's one of America's most watched and most popular broadcasters,
investigative journalists, and former sports reporters. She's blazed a trail
for women in television as the chief investigative correspondent for
America's number one syndicated news magazine, Inside Edition. Five million
(14:59):
people a night watch Lisa Chase Bad Guys on TV,
and another ten million subscribers watch her stories on YouTube.
Her career on camera spans four decades, and the lessons
she's learned overcoming incredible challenges are the basis for her
inspirational memoir Warrior, My Path to Being Brave, which is
now being developed into a TV series, How Absolutely Incredible Now.
(15:23):
Lisa's also hosting a few episodes of the documentary event
Secrets of Playboy, which explores the hidden truths behind the
fable and philosophy of the Playboy Empire through a modern
day lens. The series delves into the complex world Hugh
Hefner created and examines its far reaching consequences on our
culture's view of power and sexuality. The show is on
(15:45):
A and E and the two new hour long episodes
will begin airing on March twenty, and they won't be
documentary style like the current ten episode series has been formatted. Instead,
they're going to present new convers stations hosted by none
other than former Playboy cover model and investigative journalist who's
(16:06):
here with us today, the amazing Lisa Guerrero. I gotta
tell you, Lisa, well done. Well, it's it's it's because
you have so many credentials and so much stuff to
talk about. Because normally I'll take like a sip of
coffee while he is reading this. I think I finished
my whole mug full of coffee because you had so
much interesting stuff to go through. I was gonna say,
(16:28):
this is the first time I've ever done the podcast
with my Invisilne in so the fact that I didn't
list constantly is really a feat um. So thank you
guys for putting up with that. Well, it's invisilene is
the correct term because I can't see it. Good job.
Thank you in Visiline and Lisa. What were you about
to say? I was gonna say, when people read my
bio and they go wow, You've done so many things.
(16:50):
All I think about is like, I'm old. When you're
fifty seven, you have a long bio. You better have
a long bio at MYSA your seven. I am every
single day of it. You guys, every day not a chance.
You look younger than me and I'm seventeen. That's that's
that's the that's the real time crime for today is
how much older we look than you. Yeah, this is
(17:13):
the you half learned me. Okay. So Lisa, by the way,
you gordeous, I need to know all your beauty secrets
be Latina. Oh my god, So I have to go
back in time before I was born and choose a
different set of parents. That's yeah. Yeah, well well yeah,
I like to add on that. In that department, I
(17:33):
had a Latina mom and she was pretty outstanding looking.
So I got really lucky with that. Oh my gosh. Okay,
so there's so much to talk about here. But okay,
so most people know you as a sports reporter for
Monday Night Football to your investigative work on Inside Edition.
How did you get involved with secrets of Playboy? Well,
(17:54):
you know, interestingly, they came to me because they knew
that I had a background uh with the Playboy organization.
When I was nineteen twenty and twenty one years old,
I had signed with Playboy Model Agency, which was actually
an agency that handled not just playmates, but also swimwear models,
lingerie fitness models. I had been doing swimwear modeling since
(18:17):
I was sixteen, and I was doing you know, Nautilus
and Gold Gym and a lot of body conscious campaigns
as a model. So they signed me as a fitness
model and we were encouraged to go to the Playboy
mansion for movie night. And I was really, can't see this.
(18:38):
She just did air quotes for encouraged Yes, yes, air
quotes um, and so we were kind of pressured to
go to the Playboy mansion. I was really vulnerable and
really naive back then. I didn't drink alcohol, I certainly
didn't do drugs, and I chose not to pose for
Playboy although they asked me to, and I was I
(19:00):
was really um kind of freaked out when I went
to the mansion because I saw all of these older
men chasing around these younger women. I saw a lot
of of course, alcohol and drug use, and I figured
out pretty quickly that the reason that I should go
is that they had a free buffet laid out, and
as a struggling young model and actress, I would take
(19:21):
empty tupperware in a bag, and when everybody would go
into the movie for the screening, for the movie screening,
I would sneak out and fill up these tupperware with
free food and then leave the mansion before the old
then came out to try to hit on you. That's
worth the trip right there, you at. It totally was,
(19:41):
and and that's kind of you know, I think Playboy
for for feeding me during those lean years. Um. But
I remember at one point being approached by Hugh Hefner,
and at this point I'm probably twenty, and he came
in for a kiss at the mansion down he was
at the time, no, he was three, and exactly give him,
(20:03):
give him a break. Um. He kind of came in
for the kiss, like an open mouth kiss, and I
turned my head and so he kissed me on the cheek,
but it was like slobber like a dog. And I
really decided that I didn't want to go back to
the mansion. So I probably went a handful of times.
Uh figured out it wasn't my my thing, and I
(20:25):
moved on with my career, and thankfully I didn't pose
as a centerfold back then, although I did do the
Lingerie magazine because I was dressed in something, but I
wasn't nude, so I, um, you know, I went on
with my career, became a sportscaster, became an actor that
every year they would come back to me and they
would offer me the opportunity to be a centerfold. And
then later when my career blossomed and I became a
(20:47):
national sportscaster, they started asking me to do the cover
as a celebrity cover. And finally, twenty years later, when
I was forty, I agreed to do a celebrity cover
for Boy And at that point, you know, I was
in control of the shoot. I was forty. I got
to choose the photographer, choose the location, choose the pictures. Well,
(21:08):
you were a celebrity already, not somebody looking that they
could correct manipulate you. Right, No, exactly, and so I
had control. I was a grown woman, and I found
it empowering to do that shoot. Um and I looked
back on that also as an opportunity to bridge my
career between sportscasting and Inside Edition Inside Edition did a
(21:29):
story about me appearing on the cover of Playboy at
forty and two weeks later, they offered me a two
year deal to be a West Coast correspondent for the show.
That was in two thousand and six, and since then,
I've been promoted and now I do the investigations for
the show. So I'm living this kind of dream job
in part thanks to Playboy, because I took a huge
(21:50):
risk of doing that cover. And I used to look
back on my Playboy experiences kind of with a laugh
and a wink and saying, you know, nothing bad happened
to me. I as them they didn't use me. But
now that I've seen Secrets of Playboy, and I watched
those first ten episodes with all of these women coming
forward recounting their traumatic experiences, I realized that I dodged
(22:13):
a bullet and that could have been me. Those women
could have been me. I was nineteen the first time
I met the Playboy organization, and I thank god I
have a great relationship with my dad and a strong
family unit. But you know, a lot of these women didn't,
and so they were vulnerable. And I think Hugh Hefner
and the organization preyed upon vulnerable young women, and um,
(22:37):
that's what made me want to get involved with the
series is as an investigator, as a journalist, I wanted
to tell the stories of these women. I wanted to
ask them questions about it. But I also believed them
because I was there and I remember a lot of
these incidents happening around me and knowing that there was
a darkness there that made me uncomfortable. Um. So we
(23:00):
fast forward to today and the first ten episodes you know,
have aired, and what Amy wanted to do is continue
the conversation with two more episodes in studio with a
host me that gets to ask these women questions. So
we're interviewing some women that you've already seen in the
documentary series and new women that weren't a part of
the original documentary series that are now coming forward to
(23:23):
tell their traumatic experiences to us for the first time. Well,
that's the brilliance of your position is that you're an
invest in the game of the journalist and you have
firsthand experience from that world. It's like, I mean, I
think they had to obviously they brought you on because
if your talent is that but I think it would
have been a huge missed opportunity to not have you
(23:44):
be part of that. You're the perfect person for it,
and I'm sure a lot of the girls trust you
as well. Thank you, And I think that did really
help with that trust factor because, as you probably know,
when a lot of these women came forward, they were
criticized not just by viewers or you know, mainstream readers
of the magazine, but they were criticized by women within
(24:05):
the Playboy sisterhood and that was extremely painful for them,
and they knew it was going to happen. And this
is what makes them really brave, is that these women
knew that they were going to get pushed back on this,
that they would get trolled on social media, that they
would be ousted from their Playboy sisterhood, but they did
it anyway because they to happen to the next generation
(24:27):
of young women. There's no Hugh Hefner anymore, but there
are still men like that in the world, but Hugh
types live on right, and there's no there's no there's
no way that everyone's experience was the same. So of
course they would get pushed back from people who had
who maybe gotten more from it, or who were treated
differently or or whatever, didn't have a problem with what
was going on. So yeah, so even more so, it
was brave of them to do that. Um, it's funny. Yeah,
(24:50):
I just want to stop for a second because you
make such a great point here. Um, one of the
reasons everybody quiet. I made a good point mark the calendars. Um,
what what you're saying is important because, look, the women,
the women knew that they were going to receive pushback.
So as a host and as somebody that had been there,
it was important for me to be able to point
(25:12):
out to the viewer to say, look, I don't have
an ax to grind. This didn't happen to me. I
was not a victim of a rape or or a
drugging or an abduction. But what I can tell you
is that just because it didn't happen to me doesn't
mean that it didn't happen to these women. You know,
it's it's really hard for for people to kind of
(25:33):
get their head around that concept somehow, but it's it's
not too easy to imagine that just because one person is, uh,
you know, a predator, that doesn't mean they're a predator
to every single woman they come across they can't, but
they pick people to groom that are specifically vulnerable to attack.
So that's why, because I don't have an extra grind,
(25:55):
I think I was the right person to ask these
questions and to help the audience kind of have this
conversation about it. Well, so in the latest episode of
Secrets of Playboy, it was allegedly very scathing against you,
and like you said, some people had really negative experiences
with him, and not everyone did. What were some of
(26:16):
your other personal interactions with him, like and what else
did you witness firsthand? So when I was at the
Mansion Um again one, I immediately there is a sense
of inequity in terms of the age differences between the
men and the women. You know, I I I realized,
(26:37):
and I think a lot of young women, probably you know,
at that age range really think of guys over thirty
even as old, you know, when you're I remember being
nineteen and twenty and you know, going to clubs with
a fake I D and seeing a thirty year old
at a bar and thinking, oh, gross, he's old. He's
he's got to be at least thirty, he's probably divorced.
And so meanwhile I'm looking for a guy who's forty five,
(26:59):
and I'm like, he's at his prime. Yeah, exactly. But
when you're young, you don't look at it like if
you have a normal you know, pretty much of a
normal family unit, where you're kind of, um, haven't been
abused or haven't been traumatized. I think most young women
at that age would see men in their fifties and
sixties and not necessarily be attracted to them. But those
(27:20):
men were there, and it wasn't just this is a
big part of this story, right. It wasn't just Hugh Hefner.
He had a whole circle of men around him that
were exhibiting the same kind of behavior. And so the
first thing I noticed was how uncomfortable I was with
that and how um, you know, they kept saying the
(27:41):
same thing, Oh, I'm sure you want to be an actress.
I'm a producer, I can help you. You know, I'm
a director, I'm a star, And there there was just
a real sense of Okay, there is some kind of
trade going on here, and it was It was gross
to me, It made me uncome trible. But at the
same time I also understood that I was there because
(28:03):
my agency wanted me to be there, and then I
was there later to get free food. So you know,
everybody was participating in some way in this kind of
um you know, I guess exchange in some way. People
were there for business, people were there to help their career,
people were there to find a young woman. It was
really interesting. That's the scary part about that situation, is
(28:25):
that type of stuff. We've heard stories about that in
Hollywood for forever. I'm a director, I'm a producer. I
can help your career. I guess you want to be
an actress. This this has happened to me a million
times as But now you're in a position in an
atmosphere where it's completely sexualized, and you're not on a
set where they're like trying to sneak it in here.
That is what they're doing at the mansion, Like, that's
(28:46):
why those guys are there. They're not there looking for
somebody to start in their movie. Right there there to
get what they want, and so it's almost like it's
almost like just walking right into a trap and and
knowing it is, but it's normalized. Well, that's that is
exactly right, and that that is why these stories about
Carissa and Christina Shannon, which are the twins from the
(29:09):
final series of The Girls next Door. Um, that's who
we're talking about on the first one of these two
specials who went on Monday Night is behind the scenes
of The Girls next Door and the twins come forward
for the first time. They were nineteen when they first
got to the mansion and became his girlfriends. He was
eighty three, and they watched that show, The Girls next
(29:31):
Door as teenagers, and they thought it was a sitcom.
They didn't think it was real. So when they were
asked to be the girlfriends and they were asked to
be to live at the mansion, they didn't realize what
they were getting into. They were vulnerable, they were young,
They came from a very tough background, and what they
found themselves in was much more than they could process
(29:53):
or handle at that age. And they have some really
traumatic experiences that they're telling me about on Monday Night. Um,
and it's it's they've never talked about this before, but
it's it's an example of these really young women being
targeted by this older man and his organization. Do you
think anyone was actually attracted to Hugh. I think when
(30:15):
he was younger and as I was watching, you know,
that's a really great question, I think because as I
was watching the early episodes when he was younger, he
was very handsome, he was powerful. You know, he came
across as a feminist, and some people still believe and
in some ways. I think one of the things he
talked about was women taking ownership of their sexuality and
(30:36):
and you know free, you know, freedom of of your
your sexuality, your body, um. Feminism, um. As we kind
of thought of feminism in the seventies. Part of that
was being comfortable with your nudity, not having to wear
braws right and and and having sex with who you
wanted to when he wanted to, being able to get
a pill, the pill, being able to to have an
(30:59):
abortion if you wanted too. So those are things that
early on Hugh Hefner was a champion of so I
can see how earlier he was attractive to some some women.
And when you look at Sondra Theodore, who's one of
the women we talked to in the second of my episodes,
which is a week from Monday, she was very young,
but he was in his fifties when they were dating,
(31:20):
and and he was still handsome, and he was, you know,
a powerful man, a wealthy man. He lived in a mansion,
and I can see how a young woman might get
swept away at that point. Now, as he got older,
it's inconceivable to me to be attracted to somebody, you
know that that became the man, that that he looks
(31:42):
like he was towards the end um and that that's
really troubling, isn't it It is? And also speaking of
the youth that was in the house, is it true
that it was commonplace that girls who were seventeen would
take photos for Centerfold and then once they turned eighteen,
they would publish the magazine. Yeah. So, Susie Craibacker, who
(32:02):
used to go by the name Susie Scott, was a playmate,
and we talked to Susie in the second of these
two episodes, the special So a Week from Monday. Susie
talks about um, you know, the fact that she was
actually underage when she shot her first Centerfold and they
waited until she turned eighteen to publish them. Yeah. So
(32:23):
so there there there were instances that some of these
women talk about throughout the the documentary series, and then
the twins themselves of course they you know, they were
nineteen when they came to be on the show, but
they were taking suggestive photos, you know, a couple of
years earlier, and in fact they were submitted to be
(32:46):
on the show before they were, you know, of age.
The problem is that that he you know, obviously you
mentioned that he was into certain things that were that
were on the right track when he was younger. But
but the problem is the part of the manipulation is
that he really for all the other publications that did
(33:06):
similar things, Playboy was always equated with class. It was
the bow tie, it was this, and it was and
you really got a feeling, Oh, he's taking care of
these people. This is this is what's going on. This
is a class adventure. He's not doing the hustler, he's
not doing the the penthouse. You know, this is this
is he's taking care of these girls. And everybody just
kind of feeling that. So I can understand that these
(33:27):
girls went there thinking one thing, and then all of
a sudden, you're in this if I may it's Spider's web,
and you're like, huh, yeah, well, you know that's that's
that's really the case. And again, the docuseries talks about
the brand and how the brand was different than Penthouse
or Hustler or these other more risque or much more
(33:49):
explicit magazines. And so there was this image that that
the women that were on the cover and that we're, um,
you know, in the centerfolds, were the girl next door.
We're all American girls and we're you know, we're sweet,
and you know, they even equate them. There's a Playboy
manifesto that's spoken about in these specials where they equate
(34:11):
the playmate to a bunny. That she should be fresh
and she should smell freshly washed, and she should appear
to be innocent. And so there, there is definitely there.
There was for many years this image of the playmates
and how they should be the girls next door. I
would never be able to be a playmate. They'd seen
me as a caveman. They'd take one sniff and they'd
(34:34):
be like, has this woman showered in a week? Uh?
In the in the bowels of a comedy club. Um? Wow?
So I mean I have I have one million questions,
but you know it feels very Weinstein and Epstein adjacent. Yes,
I hate that I just named off Jews. I'm like,
(34:55):
as one Um, but you know, it's like, this stuff
happens not just in Hollywood, and I think sometimes people
forget that, right, Um. But also I just want to
ask you. I don't know if you ever witnessed this,
but I did hear a conspiracy theory here we go,
(35:17):
you know what? That used to be funny, but nowadays
the conspiracy there is hit more times than not. I
think so, right, but that there was a whole tunnel
system underneath the Playboy mansion where they would sneak underage
girls to other people's mansions. Well, the what's really interesting
about that question is that there is an episode about
(35:40):
these mini mansions. So Hugh Hefner had a group of
friends that had mansion systems of their own, and so
there have been rumors for a long time that, you
know that these women that would be picked up at
the mansion maybe would end up with one of the
friends at another mini mansion in the Hollywood Hills. I
(36:00):
have heard about the tunnels as well, So, UM, I
guess I would. Nothing would surprise me at this point, nothing, right, Well,
did you ever see Epstein there? I didn't know, And
again I was so young that I don't know if
I would even recognize him. Um, yeah, I wouldn't have
remembered that, right, right, right. You know, it's so interesting
(36:22):
thinking about all the different types of predators who have
come forward, and of course with the case of Epstein,
he had a right hand man or in this case,
a right hand woman, Galaine Maxwell. Did you feel like
there was that type of figure at the Playboy house?
There were so Madeline who was one of the photographers.
Of course Mary who was the house mother, UM and
(36:44):
his his assistant. I guess you would call call her
and she was in The Secret she was in The
Girl's next Door as well. She's featured prominently in those shows.
Um and he had different women that were within the
organization that worked in publicity. I'm at a lot of
the women. When I did both modeling, the modeling agency
was run by a woman, and UM, when I did
(37:07):
the cover the you know, a lot of the people
that I talked to within the organization that I did
the deal with to do the cover, we're women. So
there were a lot of women within the organization that
we're dealing directly with playmates or covers or the bunnies,
the Bunny system. You know, there were bunny mothers um so,
so yeah they were. There were multiple women um involved
(37:29):
in the organization at different levels. It's because as gross
as these guys in these situations are, they're not They're grows,
they're not morons. They know that they need this bridge.
Right If a woman sees another woman and so okay
we stick together, I know we're okay. So they think, okay,
that I'm safe here, that this isn't what I think
(37:51):
it might be, or or at least removes it a
few levels. And it's the same thing with obviously, I
don't know if you know anybody, I'm not asking you
to name anybody, but a lot of people I think
these situations are always like, oh, there's this rich dude
and he's got his buddies with him. But there are
famous people that partake of this stuff, as we've heard
rumors from the Epstein things and stuff like that, or
more so. And and part of that is also you know,
(38:12):
you walk into a party and you think, oh, I'm
cool because this person is here, so it's safe here.
But it's just another thing to lure you in and
make you feel like, okay, this is okay, and once
you're in far enough that's really interesting. Yeah, that is
the beauty of the mansion. And going to the mansion,
going to all those parties is because there were celebrities
there and it was considered a cool thing to do
(38:32):
and you were considered like a I guess an insider,
hit person or celebrity if you're going to the mansion
and so um, so there is that lure and then
you let your guard down, and in some cases, some
of these women report being drugged. Um, you know, there's
a lot of drinking going on, and you know, and
suddenly some of these young, vulnerable women are targeted. And
(38:55):
what I love about the Secrets of Playboy is that
they are naming names and they are talking about, you know,
the people that we're helping to prop up um, you know,
Hugh Hefner and the entire organization and and the show
just blows my mind because there were so many details
and so many stories that kind of corroborated each other. Fascinating.
(39:17):
Do you think anyone will go to jail after this errors?
I don't know. You know, that would require a couple
of things. You know, people would need to come forward
and um, in some cases, maybe a file a report.
Some of these these alleged crimes took place many years ago.
Of course, Hugh Heffner's dad, And you know, one of
(39:39):
the the episodes talks about the fact that Um, according
to people that worked for Playboy, both the l a
p D and Beverly Hills Police Department officers worked part
time as security at the mansion, and so there was
a connection there. So this is like, that's fascinating. It's yeah,
it's really vast eating. I encourage it. If you haven't
(40:01):
seen the show yet, you can download. You can binge
all ten episodes before Monday when we do the the
after specials, because I think, you know, it's some of
these stories are so detailed and interesting, and like I said,
a lot of these women and men that worked for
him were naming names UM and talking about these these
really troubling aspects of the organization. It's funny, because it's
(40:27):
not funny at all. Um. I remember there was one
Super Bowl where I went to a very famous director's
house and you know what, I'm not on the documentary,
so I'm not naming names, but you know, I was
there and there were a lot of girls there, so
I felt safe, and yet I was still drugged and
(40:48):
I don't even drink alcohol. They put J H B
in the water. Wow, And suddenly I couldn't pick my
head up and I was like what. I don't know
what's going on. And then my friend was like, we
should go, and I was like what she said, sometimes
they put g in the water so people have more fun.
(41:10):
And I was like, first of all, the fact that
you know that and we're still here and came in
the first place. I'm not friends with that person anymore.
Nice of them to tell you to leave, but never
been drugged in the first place. Um, And and you know,
not to make this about me, but to make this
about me, I don't know Lisa, you don't know me,
but this is what I do. There is this one
(41:31):
time on a TV set. I was shooting a show
and the lead actor, who's again very famous you know him, UM,
had his body double not naming names, not on the documentary,
but you can watch the show on Monday. Any so, UM,
he had his body double follow me to my trailer
and give me a card with his personal cell phone
(41:53):
and he said, UM, he really wants to help you.
Can you send him a body shot and text I
met this number and because I was just so cute
and look, I was never gonna do anything, right, So
I text him and he goes, hey, this is my
personal cell phone number. Don't give this to anyone. And
I said okay, and then he said, you know, um,
I can help send me over your body shot and
(42:14):
head shot and and you know, Lisa, as an actress,
no one's asking you for body shots, no one's asking
for bikini photos. You want to see your real like
your actual work, right right right right, and then and
then he and then he said, um, why don't you
come to my hotel? And he's staying at the Mandarin
And I never responded. I love the fact that he
(42:37):
said this body double like that guy was like, I
think I'm only your body double in the shot, like
doing your work. Yeah, he also sent me his number.
He's like, if you can send it to me to
why you know, why not you should have had your
body double Sanday for him. Yeah. At this point, it's
like if I send a photo of any Jewish woman,
they're like, that's leoh right, Um, so you said you
(43:00):
said you said that, you know, obviously you were you
were smart enough because you came from a good family.
And said, I mean, you must look at this, look
back at this now and and be like, thank God
that I have the family that I like. You just
want to go home and hug everybody and just be
like I was in that. I was basically on the doorstep,
maybe even in the front door of all of that.
But because of who I am, I realized, and I
(43:22):
turned around and got out. And it wasn't because I
was smarter than them. Let's let's be really clear. It
was just literally that I had a really good dad
and had a very stable home life, and you know,
I was was young and dumb ones too, and I
was vulnerable. And not that they were dumb either, um,
(43:42):
but they I think, you know, the people that that
kind of went down that path were targeted. And when
you are targeted and you are away from home. A
lot of them were from different states and even different countries, um,
somewhere from Canada. They they felt, um like this was
a place to live because you know, the mansion provided
(44:03):
them a place to live, not only a place to live,
a mansion in Beverly Hills, a mansion in Beverly Hills
and a huge potential career. And so I could definitely
see how that could happen too. It could have happened,
like I always said, could have happened to me. It
could have been me. So that that gives me a
lot of empathy when I hear the stories, and it
also makes me very willing to believe them because I
(44:27):
saw this kind of thing happening. Did they ever ask
you to live in the house? No, No they didn't.
They didn't. They asked me to pose for the magazine,
and I said, now they asked. You know, I was
invited to all the parties, and I stopped going after
a little while because I was uncomfortable after the the
Hugh Hefner kiss. How many pers Yeah, how many seafood towers?
(44:50):
Would you say? We're present? Lots of seafood towers, Oh
my gosh. And remember this was the this is then
the eighties, Yeah, late eighties. Oh you know, I'm sure
there were all that that kind of eighties swank food there.
I was. I was very easily impressed because I grew
up on you know, pizza hut and Twinkies, So I'm
(45:10):
still impressed by a sea food tower. That's true. I
could just see it. They're like, would you like to
live here? Would you like to stay over tonight? And
you're like, Guys, I'm gonna be honest with you, I'm
just here for the buffet. I would be I'd be like, yeah,
I'd love to live here. How much stage time can
I get for comedy? Yeah, for comedy. I'm I'm not
a stripper. I'm an emotional stripper. There's a difference. Yeah,
(45:34):
but I'll tell you a joke for a dollar. Um um.
That's the thing. And to what you said, Lisa, No,
it's not that, like it should not be inferred that
these people were You don't have to be stupid or like.
That's what they do. They find people, they find the
right targets for this, and like we said before, they
(45:55):
build those bridges of quote unquote trust. So people think, Okay,
I'm saying, so, it's not you don't have to be
stupid to fall for something like this because they're not
idiots and they know what they're doing. Sadly, they know
what they're doing and they're they're using that to their advantage.
Part of the interesting, uh aspect for me of interviewing
these women is to find out why they did this,
(46:17):
you know, to ask them directly and to ask those
follow up questions that people have Since the series debuted,
a lot of people said on social media, what they
should have known what they were getting into? How would
they not know? You know, they got what they wanted.
They were a star on a reality show where they
got a you know, a centrifold. But but it's really
important to let them answer those questions and let them
(46:39):
describe how they arrived to the mansion to begin with
and what that experience is. You know, what that experience
was to them. And I think that it's it's it's
worthy of our time to at least give them the
respect and dignity to listen to their stories and then
we can process it, believe it if we want. I
believe the women, and I think that most of the
viewers that have watched the episodes believe the women as well.
(47:01):
And this is just something I've been thinking about. Did
you notice any sort of common theme with religion or
lack there other than the house? Oh gosh, um, are
you talking about the women's stories, like where they came from? Well? Yeah,
if just anyone was, you know, going to church on
Sunday's or didn't hold a special service in the yard
(47:23):
every Sunday. You know, you did not know there was
you know, when when I was there. Of course, I
was just there for the screening nights, so I didn't
see anything like that. But but one interesting aspect that
you're kind of touching on is that some of the
women came from very religious backgrounds originally and again, fascinating
part of the story. How did you get from there
to hear? You know? And that's again, uh, something that
(47:47):
I think it's important for us to listen to those stories.
It's relatable, more relatable than you would think. Yeah. I mean,
I can just imagine women in Easter bunny costumes right
to your point of having a strong dad and and
you know, people are it's just this goes out to
everybody and it's like and it's not a p s A.
But I guess it is. It's what I what I
(48:07):
do because I have four kids and three of them
are girls and they're young. But what it is is,
you know, I remember when my first daughter was born,
somebody came out, you know, somebody nice. It wasn't anything weird,
but somebody was like, oh and they brought a president, Like, oh,
can I have a hug, and I was like, no,
I was like, we're not gonna She's not gonna do that.
She's not going to think that she has to give
you a hug because she got a present, so right
off the bat. And when I'm with my kids, I'm
(48:29):
never like, oh, you want dessert, okay, can here give me?
Kids Like, it's none of that ship. It's you get
what you get and you that you deserve and there's
never a trade off for it. And I think no,
I was gonna interrupt you rudely because again, you're making
so many great points Lean and Dmitri, so many great points,
but we're recording this are this This notion of you know,
(48:52):
of women being vulnerable if they don't have a great
relationship with their father is just I mean, it's a
universe truth. And I'm sorry, but it's so important for
dad's to be um cognizant of how important it is,
because you are you are a role model for your daughter,
and you are setting the table for every single relationship
(49:14):
she has moving forward in her life. And if she
views you as something that she can trust, who is loyal,
who supports her, who um who encourages her to get
an education, to be strong, to have her own opinions.
Then those are the kinds of men she's going to
to look for someday. So my daughters will grow up
and be like, yeah, this guy is not sarcastic enough. Yeah,
(49:35):
this explains a lot about like an idiot. Dmitri, your
daughter is gonna end up marrying a comedian. I'm so sorry. No, No,
that's part of the stuff I'm instilling. I'm like, remember,
just because they're funny doesn't mean you have to kiss him.
I learned that the hard way. They have to too.
This is what I keep telling the men who meet
me and like, just because I'm funny, it doesn't mean
(49:56):
you have to kiss me. Um wow. Okay, well, Lisa,
thank you so much for joining us today. And you know,
before we go, if you have any final thoughts or
anything you want people to know about the book, the series, anything,
we'd love to hear it. I just you know, I
really encourage people, like I said, to to download it
(50:17):
and to stream or or however you're going to watch
your your your shows, please watch the previous time episodes
and then you know, jump in on on Monday night,
because um, I think it's important again to to be
open minded when we hear these stories. And it's not
just these stories that we're hearing on secrets of Playboy,
(50:37):
it's all women's stories that you know, these women being
courageous enough to come forward. Now it's important for us
to at least be open minded enough to watch these stories,
to listen to what they have to say and to
process it. And UM, kudos to the women that came forward.
They are my heroes. Mm hmm. I love your story
and I love I love that they're making a TV
(50:59):
series out of your story, so I would look forward
to seeing that. Thank you, I'll be back. We'll talk
about that next. Can't wait. Lisa, thank you so much
for joining us and still waiting on your beauty secrets.
If that means I have to take a time machine
and choose different parents, I will. Um, thank you so
much for joining us. And can you tell people where
(51:19):
they can find you on the internet? Yes, UM, you
can find I'm a Twitter girl, that's my jams, so
you can go to at the number four Lisa Guerrero
g u E R R E r oh. I'm also
on Instagram and um all the places as well as
Lisa Guerrero dot Com. Amazing. Thank you so much for
(51:39):
joining us on Real Time Crime, and we're going to
be tuning in Monday night. We're so excited. Thanks Leah,
Thanks Dmitri, thank you. Yeah. Oh boy, all right, she
(52:02):
was fantastic. Not only was she fantastic, but she made
me feel very insecure about my wardrobe, hair and makeup
choices for today and lighting. So we we both took
a job to the face. When she's like, yeah, no,
I'm fifty seven, I'm like, it's like, what, Yeah, you
look twenty one. I mean, she's stunning, and she's obviously
highly intelligent and professional, and I'm very excited to watch
(52:24):
her host these episodes. I can't wait to watch. Yeah. No,
it's interesting, it's gonna be interesting. And and I haven't
seen um you know, I haven't seen. I'm gonna catch
up with the ones I haven't seen and before um
she hosts those things starting on Monday night, so just
to be caught up, Like she's got a lot of
TV to watch. No, no, it's not that I haven't
seen any of the time. It's just that I haven't
seen all time. But it's you know, it's well, you
(52:47):
have to understand. This is something that I can't just
you know, pop on secrets of Playboy in the middle
of the day or at dinner time because I have
kids around, so I have to watch this, you know, right,
and and they can watch it and not have to
give you a right that's right. Nobody has to give
me a hug. I think everybody knows that, you know what.
It's so interesting when you said that, it really triggered
(53:08):
me because because I think that a lot of society
is very transactional, and you're teaching your daughters not to
be transactual It's like, if I give you this, you
get that, and it's not based on any sort of
reward system or yeah you didn't. You're not making love
a business. Yeah. And by the way, I'm teaching my
(53:31):
son that as well. For for two sides of it,
because one, we shouldn't act like like boys are never
the victim of something like that. They are. But the
other thing is, I don't you know, I think he's
he's got an advantage because he has three sisters. Um
that he's going to understand, you know, how women feel
and how they think and how they should be treated.
But um, I think that's important for him to see
(53:52):
as well. But why do I feel like you have
twenty five children? I do? I have kids? Yeah, has
been busy times. Oh boy, all right to me, Tri,
Where can everyone find you on the internet? Everyone? Unfortunately,
much to your dismay, I'm simply at at Dmitri Pappis
on Instagram, um, and that's the best. And I'm at
(54:15):
Leo Lamar l e H L A M A R
R on all the things except TikTok, where I'm Leo
Lamar with five hours because don't ask me. Don't ask
me why. I don't know. We'll circle back on it
and maybe we'll go back on it. I mean, I
don't know if I'll ever find the answer. No, But
you know what, now that you've spelled it out, that
makes a good point. D E M E T R
I P A P P A Y S. And I'll
(54:36):
say that because I keep getting invoices for in my
email from some gym in Florida, and it's like, Hey,
I'm like, oh, look, I got this this drink at
the bar at the gym today. And I don't live
in Florida. I don't go to the gym, and I
don't care you guys. I'm Jim Shakes from the gym.
But so the point is, you know, it's it's when
you spell something wrong, you go down a whole of
the rabbit hole. So that guy is not gonna pay
(54:58):
his dues because they keep coming to me. Wow, Well,
now that guy is gonna get fat and it's your fault.
What do you gonna do? Well, he's in Florida, so
he's probably already fat. Allegedly. Thank you. Yes, if you
want to call in and leave a voicemail, please do.
If it's about a crime you think we should look into.
If it's about an update from an old case that
we for some reason don't have, let us know. We
(55:20):
like shining light on weird mysteries that I have been
unsolved and completing the circle and closing it up, whether
it's a circle or noval. I really want to stop
with this whole circle analogy because it's not really doing
anything for anyone. I think it will end when the
podcast ends. We won't carry into the next one. And
if you want to just leave a voicemail and tell
Leah she's doing great, and then I should shut up.
Then you know, I go for it. I can take
(55:40):
that too, Yeah, and you can do that at eight
six s crime. That's eight six six to any one,
crame eight six six to annyone crime eight six six
two and two seven four six three. That's the first
time you had to dance by yourself, and now you
could have danced. I could have, but I'm not going to.
Dimitri As is like, everyone's watching. Alright, Stay safe, y'all.
(56:05):
We'll see you next week, Love you, bye bye. It's
real time crop, it's real time gra I mean, is
it actually real time crime or solving anything or is
that just the thing we say. It's a thing we say,
got it? Okay, See you next week for more real
time crime, only on iHeart Radio.
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