November 4, 2025 • 32 mins
In an in-state rivalry matchup, the Rockets shot the ball poorly at home amid a rare off night for Kevin Durant. Yet, thanks to huge games by Alperen Sengun and Amen Thompson, Houston survived it versus the short-handed Dallas Mavericks (2-5).
For Monday’s ClutchFans Live postgame show, Dave Hardisty and Ben DuBose recap what we learned at Toyota Center, as well as many of the key takeaways moving forward. The Rockets (4-2) have now won four straight games, overall.
The episode can be viewed in video form here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xmrO20T6uBM
For Monday’s ClutchFans Live postgame show, Dave Hardisty and Ben DuBose recap what we learned at Toyota Center, as well as many of the key takeaways moving forward. The Rockets (4-2) have now won four straight games, overall.
The episode can be viewed in video form here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xmrO20T6uBM
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Welcome into the podcast. Everybody. Rockets get their fourth straight win,
beat the Mavericks at home in Houston one ten to
one oh two, a game that was not pretty, as
Emo O Dooka said, we were in the mud tonight,
very reminiscent of the Detroit game where the Rockets did lose.
But the good news is they don't lose this one
(00:24):
tonight pull it out. This was a depleted mav squad.
You could also look at the Rockets without obviously Fred
and without DFS and of course without your Barti Smith
junior tonight, who set out probably for one game just
to rest an injury. Rockets been just you were at
the game. You know, we were texting back and forth,
sweating it out. You know, this was kind of some
(00:47):
scary moments. But they pull out the w.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
Look, I choose to think that it's offsetting one of
those two losses in the first week of the year,
because let's be clear, they didn't deserve to win tonight.
They shot below thirty percent on three. The phrase I
used several times throughout the game was regression to the mean.
I don't think they're as bad of a shooting team
as they were a year ago by any stretch. But
the numbers they put up through five games, the Kevin
(01:11):
Durant effect, I mean that has helped them some. But
are they going to shoot forty five percent on threes
all year if Steven Adams is going to be a
lights out free throw shooter. Like, no, some of this
was just getting off to a hot start through the
first five games of the season and it came crashing
back down to earth tonight.
Speaker 3 (01:28):
And you know, to their credit, they.
Speaker 2 (01:30):
Did score twenty one points in the final seven minutes
of the game, so when it was winning time, it
was a little bit of a struggle on defense. Offensively,
they did execute, but for the game as a whole,
twenty five percent on free throws just are twenty five
percent on threes. Excuse me, nine to thirty six, sixty
five percent on free throws thirteen of twenty those gaudy
numbers to start the year. It feels like those or no,
(01:51):
I'm looking at the Dallas box, so almost identical. But
Houston was eight of twenty nine from three, so twenty
seven point six percent and twenty to thirty from the
free throw line. Apologies for getting those flipped, but the
bottom line is This was a bad game from three,
It was a bad game from the free throw line.
The defense was hit or miss, and yet you found
a way to win even when it wasn't going your way,
(02:14):
even without Jabari Smith Junior.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
Now the MAVs.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
Didn't have Anthony Davis, Kyrie Irvings out like this is
nowhere near a full strength team. This is not a
win that you feel good about. And I doubt the
Rockets are going to be the number one offense in
the NBA after tonight. But all in all, look, if
someone had offered you two weeks ago tonight, if someone
had gone to you and said, hey, would you take
a four and two start through the first six games,
(02:38):
two and one at home, two and one on the road,
your splits are going to be roughly, you know, top
three or four on offense, top ten to twelve on defense,
no major injuries other than the two you already knew
you had, being Fred VanVleet and Tory Anthony Smith. I
think everybody would have taken it, knowing the upheaval in
the offseason, knowing the pieces that you were trying to integrate,
(03:00):
knowing that you weren't fully healthy out of the shoot
like it's a weird path how they got here. But
I think in the NBA over eighty two games, there's
gonna be lots of peaks and valleys and so all
in all, four and two through six games, four game
winning streak, it's not a pretty one. You needed a
little bit of luck from a Dallas team that missed
some threes that they probably should have made and didn't
(03:22):
have Anthony Davis due to the calf strain. But in
my opinion, it sort of offsets the fact that you
probably deserve to win one of the Okacio Detroit games
and you didn't, and now you're four and two and
you're probably where you should be.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
Yeah, this is a really good rocket team. They did
they didn't play up to their capabilities tonight. You start,
you nailed it starting out with the three point shooting. Yeah,
it's definitely somewhere in between. They were gonna regress to
the meme, but through three quarters they were five of
twenty five. Tonight, it was just it was just flat
out nasty. They were very very fortunate. I mean part
of this is defense, of course, but very fortunate. The
(03:53):
MAVs themselves nine of thirty six twenty five percent from
three point range. Rockets lose this game if they give
that up. Of course they went in a blowout if
they're knocking down their threes on their own. You know,
Katie was the guy who set the tone in the
last game. Absolutely was awesome, super efficient tonight, really struggled
with his shot but did end up hitting and I'll
play these here up back to back triples you know
(04:16):
in the fourth quarter that were really big. You can
see them here that got him going. You know a
lot of these guys, Shangoon ended up having an efficient
night twenty six points, eleven boards, ten to twenty shooting,
and I'll play another clip as well where he hit
a big shot with one thirty five left to go.
But I thought there was just like that, that mixed
bag with all these guys, like they all had pros
(04:38):
and cons tonight, you know, Shane Gun in particular or
something we probably want to talk about on the side,
but you know, he had a good offensive game. But
really from the get go, they were targeting him tonight.
I don't want to say hunting him or whatever, but
just they when they would get switches, they would attacks,
particularly particularly PJ. Washington and in a way, their defense
was kind of missing Jabari just to sort of that
(04:59):
week's rim protection. Yeah, yeah, not that he's you know,
this elite shot blocker, even though that four block game
the other day would tell otherwise. But he you know,
he was definitely missing there, I think in that in
that part. And so they were they were kind of
attacking Shannggon and he did you know, he held up
at times, but a lot of times the rim protection
just wasn't there, and that was, you know, kind of
(05:22):
an issue. But of course, like I said, he had
the big play which I could play here that put
the Rockets up three, and in essence was the difference
of the game. The Rockets up one here with with
like I said, one thirty five to go spins past Gafford,
which he's done many times on Daniel Gafford, and it
was a great play by Shanggun Shanguon. So you know,
that was kind of the give and take with him.
(05:43):
But you know, I just want to chalk the game
up or you know, just push it off to the
side as in like it was ugly, but they get
the w Now they go on to Memphis before you know,
setting the stage for San Antonio yeah.
Speaker 2 (05:54):
I think the reality is you weren't as good as
you look Saturday night, when you shot like sixty five
percent from three and were otherworldly from an efficiency perspective,
and you're not as bad as you look tonight. It's
probably a balance of the two, and you were due
for a little bit of a regression to the main game,
and thankfully this one came in a win. There's a
comment from the chat that I want to point out,
I don't understand why e May plays zone so much
(06:17):
when Dallas was carving us up. I think, I mean
it goes back into the whole conundrum with this team,
which is that Steven Adams is objectively one of its
best players. He is very impactful, but the double big
can be very hit or miss in terms of its
implications for the team as a whole. And I thought
in this game there were moments where it worked. The
(06:38):
rebounding advantage, especially in the third quarters the Rockets built
a little bit of a buffer was very useful. But
then in the fourth quarter I felt like this could
have been put away earlier. But the Rockets playing with
the zone, and it's not always the double big, but
oftentimes it's the double big that leads to that zone.
It led to Dallas getting a couple of threes that
(06:58):
allowed them to maintain contact.
Speaker 3 (07:00):
And it's sort of a double edged sword.
Speaker 2 (07:02):
If you're playing a lesser opponent, Yes, in theory, you
get enough rebounds that you want to eventually just sort
of bully them the way you did against the Raptors
the other night.
Speaker 3 (07:11):
But if you're giving up.
Speaker 2 (07:12):
Threes, that's also the ticket to letting an outmanned opponent
hang around. And I think that's sort of what happened
in this one. And so that's sort of the give
and take. And honestly, it's gonna be something that Email
is going to have to feel out because there truly
wasn't that much double big until the last what four
to six weeks off the season, I feel like really
the last three or four and then the playoffs.
Speaker 1 (07:33):
This team actually.
Speaker 2 (07:34):
Yeah, I mean, but that was one like in February,
and then they didn't even start doing it regularly until
like mid March. So in terms of how it's going
to work, when teams can scout it and draw up
exactly how they want to attack it, and you know,
say what you will about the Warriors, they're a very
good team, but they're not the most athletic across the board.
(07:57):
I think some of these teams that have more athletes
a little more quickness. Mike can test you in ways
that even in the playoffs, the Warriors couldn't. And someone
else pointed out in the chat, it's tougher to run
the zone without Jabari.
Speaker 3 (08:10):
That's also true.
Speaker 2 (08:10):
You lose Jabari as you know, the rem protector who
can slide over from the weak side, and you also
lose his length in the zone. So without Jabbari you
missed him on multiple levels tonight. But yeah, I just
thought that was sort of the give and take. Like
Alfred Shongoon had a very good game offensively, especially down
the stretch when they needed him to be great.
Speaker 3 (08:30):
But honestly, the bar was very.
Speaker 2 (08:32):
High because you know Shinoon, and honestly, the double big
was targeted on the defensive end, and that's a big
part of how the MAVs sort of stayed in striking
distance for a lot of this game. So give and take,
and fortunately, you know the one thing you can ask
even if it's a bad night, you just need to
find a way to make the plays when it mattered
most and That's what Shingoon did tonight. And you know,
(08:52):
I think going forward, a big question for this team
it's going to be how they handle situations late in
the half court when opposing defenses want to take Kevin
Durant out of this game. Because one thing I thought
was very noteworthy tonight, even on a night when Kevin
had almost nothing going in through the first three quarters,
he even had a wide open three, no one within
(09:13):
like ten or fifteen feet of him in the third
that he missed very unkad like it happens to everybody
over eighty two games.
Speaker 3 (09:20):
But then as soon as he made those two.
Speaker 2 (09:21):
Threes, about midway through the fourth quarter, you saw Dallas
started sending a second defender, and anytime Katie got the ball,
they were not going to let him beat them.
Speaker 3 (09:31):
So there's more you can do off ball.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
Maybe you can send it them around some screens, but
I also think you've got to get more comfortable initiating
offense through those other four players, and sometimes you can
use Katie to draw that second defender and then quickly
attack four on three like we saw this early in
the James Hard and Russell Westbrook here where James was
coming off the unguardable tour and he would draw the
(09:54):
second defender so easily. And it took the Rockets half
a season to figure out and also shipping out out
Clint Capella for Robert Comington how exactly they wanted to
attack the backside in those scenarios.
Speaker 3 (10:05):
Well, the good news now, like you do.
Speaker 2 (10:07):
Have some of the same limitations and that you know,
Shangoon and a men. There are some shooting questions, but
you also have more than one playmaker. Like you look
at that twenty twenty team, one of the problems was that,
you know, outside of Harden, there was Russ who was
already on his decline, and not much else in terms
of how you could create with that closing line up tonight,
you have both Shangoon and the men. The question is
(10:28):
how you can get them both going in the same actions,
so the defense has more to account for.
Speaker 3 (10:33):
We saw that.
Speaker 2 (10:34):
You know, there was one possession where Shangoon fed a
cutting Amen and ra because actually got a little bit lucky.
I thought the pass was tipped, but you know, Amen
got it and did to his credit finish. So they're
working on it, but it's going to take some time,
and I think that's the big thing, and it goes
back to what we saw that opening week when you know,
Katie had huge numbers against the Pistons.
Speaker 3 (10:53):
He had a big first three quarters.
Speaker 2 (10:55):
In Oklahoma City, and then we saw late in those
games they made it or that the opposing defense that
is that they're not going to allow Kevin Durant to
beat them. So what do the Rockets turn to in
the half court? I thought it was better tonight. Again,
the overall numbers don't lie. The final seven minutes they had,
you know, twenty one points, so you can't complain about that,
(11:16):
But at the end of the day, like that's how
they're going to be tested. There were some rocky moments.
To their credit, they adjusted and you know, I'll give
Shindun his followers for that. Like it wasn't a perfect
game by any stretch. The free throws are also something
that you know, hopefully he's closer to the eighty percent
that he was almost at entering this game, as opposed
to below seventy percent the last two years. So even
(11:37):
on a night when Shangoon was struggling, he found a
way to put it together late. That's a good sign.
He needs to continue doing it. Because I think what
we saw tonight was that Kevin Durant shows you anything.
Opposing defenses are not going to let him beat you
down the stretch of a game, or not let him
beat them, and so it's up to the other Rockets
to make those plays.
Speaker 1 (11:52):
Yeah, and in fairness, Katie has been amazing. I know
we were joking around about this when people thought we
were hating on Katie. Nothing could be for from the truth,
guy is shootings just under sixty nine percent true shooting
coming into his game, he has been unbelievable. The reason
the Rockets through five games going into this game, I
don't know if they will be after tonight, but going
coming into this game, they were the number one offense,
(12:15):
number one three point shooting. That's because of KD. I mean,
Katie is you know, first and foremost. He's been amazing.
And you know, just tonight, like you said, just had
an off night. Tarry Easton has been really good. I
don't have the numbers in front of me with up
with tonight's updated stuff, but three for five from three tonight.
He's had several games now where he's hitting multiple threes.
(12:36):
He looks comfortable shooting that I would never have called
him a good three point shooter before. I call him
like solid average, whatever you want to call it. You know,
his strength is that elite defense and just sort of
chaos that he brings. But he's been good there as well.
You know, a man had a man had just hit
some really crazy plays tonight. If you guys had did
(12:57):
not see this clip, I gotta play it for you
because there was a basically off of his own free
throw tonight. Uh. He grabs the offensive rebound, dump, dumps it,
kicks it to Shenggoon Shangun, throws it back to him,
and throws down a reverse aliyup dunk. It's basically gone viral.
It's it's just insane. And of course he also had
(13:21):
the you know, I'll play here for you as well,
the block on Cooper flag to basically seal it rockets
up six. Here they go the other way and basically,
you know, put this thing away. So, you know, a
man he had a like that, like as you mentioned,
like that fast break drive late. We're really I think
there's a little over two minutes left. Really needed to
finish that layup and do it. It was going a
(13:43):
little bit too fast. But he had another play where
he drove to the basket just bowled his way there.
You can see the vision with a men as a
point guard. I know there's been criticism of him, you know,
the ball handling and stuff of that nature. I mean,
he who cares. I think that's gonna get better. He's
he's so effective, so athletic. You know, he's not a
perfect point guard. Don't get me wrong. I don't know
(14:04):
if he's like, you know, anything in any means a
traditional point guard, but like, he's a guy you want
to put the ball in his hands to make some
things happen here there. And I thought tonight he did
a really excellent job. He was eight of twelve for
twenty points in the first half alone.
Speaker 2 (14:19):
I thought it was noteworthy that Jason Kidd said pregame
a reporter asked him about a men's defense because a
men was going to get the assignment on Cooper flag,
and Kid went out of his way to compliment his offense,
not just in terms of the off ball actions that
people became accustomed to seeing him do the last couple
of years, but he referenced the ball handling, the driving, pressuring,
(14:40):
the rim and what that does for the defense, and
I think that's so important when we talk about this
Rockets team and doing what they need to do down
the stretch of the game. I sort of think, you know,
we'll see if the Rockets acknowledged this after the game.
But I wonder if a man was dealing with some
cramping again. He took a hard fall in the third
quarter and left the game for about five or six minutes,
(15:02):
came back, and just by the eye test, he didn't
looked quite as explosive to me, and so I wonder
if he didn't have quite the juice that he had
in the first half of that game. Obviously had enough
to stay in the game and was impactful, but I
don't know if he was quite as explosive. Maybe that
contributes to him going for layups instead of dunks. I
noticed on a couple of his fast freight sequences in
the second half, So hopefully he's good to go.
Speaker 1 (15:24):
And I think what maybe we were talking about it
in real time at the time. I think what kind
of tipped us off was Shangun was kind of getting
targeted a little bit defensively, but they were still doing fine.
But then he turned it over on that one drive attempt,
he may basically pulled them out of the game like
it was. It looked at normal, just took Shangun out
of the game and then quickly put Shangun back to
take a man out, which made us think maybe, as
(15:46):
you said, he.
Speaker 2 (15:47):
Came yeah, because the men before got rejected at the
rim and it was one of those where he got
met hard. There was some contact, and he stayed down
for about you know, thirty to forty five seconds and
a trainer didn't come out. It looked to me like
maybe he was, you know, just catching his breath, but
there seemed to be some level of impact there. And
the fact that he actually left the game for five
or six minutes even when he was playing so well, Yeah,
(16:10):
it made me wonder. I'll be curious to see if
they acknowledge it in the next day or two. Obviously,
it wasn't like it was in Oklahoma City where it
was something that would keep him out of the game.
Speaker 3 (16:19):
But I do think that.
Speaker 2 (16:22):
Leaning into that ball handling and driving ability to get
back to what Jason Kidd was saying pregame is really
important because when we're talking about Kevin Durant, I mean
the big difference between the current Rockets and last year's Rockets.
Even on a night that Kevin struggled to shoot, his
impact was still there because he makes opposing defense his
(16:44):
account for him at every level. You know, the version
of the Rockets from a year ago with Jalen Green,
he wasn't a bad player, but he was a predictable player.
And so even though he put up low twenties in
points per game and he bumped the efficiency to at
least of respectable level, it was basically threes and rim attacks.
Speaker 3 (17:03):
That's all it was.
Speaker 2 (17:04):
There was zero mid range game, and so it was
very easy for defenses to scheme and try to stop
him as one of the top two options alongside all
Permsion Goon on the scouting report. Well, now that you've
replaced Jalen Green with Kevin Durant, opposing defenses have to
account for him. Basically anywhere from zero to thirty feet,
(17:24):
he will rise and fire. He's got the mid range game,
one of the best in NBA history. Now he's a
better shooter. He's also taller, he has gifts, but beyond that,
he's just he has a much more diverse toolbox. He's
a higher IQ guy, which some of that comes with experience.
Katie's thirty seven. He uses that to his advantage, and
so I give that background to say it makes the
(17:45):
game a lot easier for his teammates. So if you're
a men Thompson, especially if it's high leverage possessions and Katie,
no matter how he's shooting, is gonna draw that type
of attention from opposing defenses no matter where he is,
than if you're ready to go, you can probably find
a driving lane. And the same can be said for
all Per and Shinoon and so teams aren't gonna want
(18:07):
to let Kevin Durant beat them. But the good news
is that no matter how Kevin plays, even if the
ball isn't going in the bucket on a given night,
that's going to give his teammates opportunities. And honestly, Dave,
like I felt like on a different night, the Rockets
could have won this game by twenty plus, and maybe
they should have because you know, they were favored by
twelve and the MAVs were missing a lot of guys
with injury. So that's not saying that that, oh, this
(18:28):
is a wonderful performance, but I thought they were getting
good looks throughout the game, they just weren't making them.
Like they had plenty of good opportunities, the shots just
weren't going in. And finally down the stretch of the game,
they did twenty one points in the final seven minutes.
So that's how I'm sort of looking at it is
that they continue to get good looks. They trusted the process. Defensively,
(18:49):
you know, it sort of fits with the season as
a whole. Like, offensively, tonight was an outlier shooting night,
it happens. But defensively, look, there's still a much better
offensive team than they have been a defensive team. That's
what they're trying to figure out, and so offensively they
figured it out. Defensively, sort of give a ton of
credit to Joshua Koge by the way, who left with
you know, a knee injury, came back, gutted it out,
had a couple of huge rebounds and loose balls if
(19:11):
he secured down the stretch of the game. But I
just think this was a game where offensively almost everything
went wrong. But Kevin Durant has so much gravity and
there's so much combined playmaking potential between the big three
of KD shingoon and a men that give it forty
eight minutes and you'll probably be able to figure it out.
And Dallas, for all their weaknesses, like they are a
(19:31):
top ten defense, Like they're missing a lot of playmaking
on offense, but defensively, like they're still respectable. They're well coached,
they play hard, and the Rockets still found ways when
it mattered most to make plays offensively. And so that's
why I think in the big picture, unless you see
like a sustained bad shooting stretch and we're not nearly
there yet, I'm not as worried about that. Defensively, I think,
(19:51):
you know, that's the big question. It's just, you know,
in a perfect role, you'd bully the hell out of
every team the way you did Toronto and out rebound
them sixty four to twenty nine. But if you get
up a lot of threes and you let teams hang around,
what's the balance there? To me, that's the big question
with this team.
Speaker 1 (20:06):
Yeah, I want to give a shout out as well.
It's going to be a nightly shout out, I'm sure
to Steven Adams because this guy, I mean, nine boards tonight,
twenty something minutes. It's not anything abnormal for him. But
I was just watching this game and it has to
be demoralizing to you know, be a mass fan or
any other fan of whoever the Rockets are playing to
(20:27):
work so hard in that half court defense to stop
you know something, Katie Shangoon, Amen Jabari, to get that
miss and income Steven Adams. If he doesn't get the board,
he draws a foul on somebody that is because they're
just trying to keep him off the boards. It's crazy
the impact that he has. I just want to give
(20:48):
him that shout out. And also Shangun, we were talking
about the defense. That's you know, one thing, but he
is he has been so good really for his career,
but especially this year at finding cutters and finding that
that uh, you know, a man or Tari in that
dunker spot if if the double comes to Shangoon he
reads things really well, and so you know, I got
(21:11):
to give a shout out to him. I think when
he finished with six assists tonight, but it felt like
more to be. To be totally honest with you, I
want you set the stage fourhere. I want to talk
about just briefly. We're not gonna hammer read Shepherd tonight,
but we got to talk about him because he did
play real minutes tonight, I mean down the stretch, and
that might have been because of what you said about
Kogi A Kogi, and I believe it was the fourth,
might have been late third, But he hurts some sug
(21:34):
gets hurt. It looks like it's his knee on a drive.
Comes out of the game. I believe that's why Reid
was playing at that point in time. I mean reads
in the rotation. But you know, in a really close
game in the fourth, I wasn't sure.
Speaker 3 (21:46):
We'd see him, and we saw.
Speaker 2 (21:48):
He may wiggle a little bit by playing the Aaron
Holiday card that he had not in the first five games.
Speaker 1 (21:53):
Correct, and that seemed to be a little bit of
an admission. But you know, with I don't remember how
much time was left, but he put the rockets up
nine with this nice kind of coming off the left wing,
driving kind of floater off the off the glass. Put
the rockets up nine. You're like, great, and then he
made some really bad blunders and just like that, rockets
(22:14):
were only up by two. He comes out of the
game of Kogi's Okay, we hope a Kogy's okay, or
or if emails like I don't care if you're okay,
get in there. We need trouble. We have we're in trouble.
But basically, you know, Reid is just a work in progress.
Uh he you know, had a couple of nice plays.
He knocked down a three and had that one shot,
but really some bad turnovers, some bad plays, and well
(22:38):
he couldn't be trusted down the stretch.
Speaker 3 (22:40):
And he was one of four from three. And I
think there's a link between.
Speaker 2 (22:44):
The excessive risk he takes on defense and whether the
threes are going in because I think he's a guy
who knows he needs to hit some home runs to
offset the the issues that he's going to have with
this lack of size, lack of experience, the shoes, with
physicality that he often has. I mean, other teams hunt him.
It is what it is. You just hope that he
(23:06):
offsets it in other areas. And if he's making threes,
I think he tends to play. This is just by
the eye test, but to me, it seems like he
plays a little more composed, like he knows he's still
providing value, but when he's missing threes, it feels like
he gets even more handsy and at times a little
bit reckless with the risk he takes defensively and then
(23:27):
offensively some of the you know, wild mid range shots
or running hooks, whatever you want to call them, that
he takes like it just feels like he knows at
this point in his career he needs to get some
home runs, and the simplest way for him to get
home runs just make threes.
Speaker 3 (23:42):
And he did the other night in.
Speaker 2 (23:43):
Boston and for the season overall, small sample, but his
overall clip is still good from three, So hopefully he
just continues to trust that and it evens out. But tonight,
when the threes aren't going in, then it just feels
like he then tries to do a little bit too
much defensively and it just sort of spirals. And Yeah,
I wonder if a kogie doesn't get hurt, does Reid
(24:04):
play it all in the second halfort does he play
more than like two or three minutes? Like I'm sure
he would have gotten a cameo, but I don't think
you would have seen him all that much. One other point,
guard rant, I want to get to before we close
out the show date. Yeah, and I hope after tonight's game,
people will take a deep breath. It feels like every game,
(24:26):
one way or the other, has been this constant Fred
van Fleet referendum, because I think just the shock value
that happening right before training camp, there was this overreaction
nationally thinking that without Fred the season.
Speaker 3 (24:37):
Would say the Rocket season, that they.
Speaker 2 (24:39):
Couldn't overcome it. And then as soon as you know,
the last three games the Rockets win big. They have
number offense in the league. I've seen on social media
a little bit of been, you know, an overcorrection. The
other way, it's people saying, oh, he has Fred too
much of a ball stopper. Does this show that he's
not as good or not as important as we thought? No,
I mean you can also look at tonight the Rockets
(25:00):
definitely could have used another shooter. I just think comparing
last year's team to this year's team is very dangerous,
especially for a point guard that handles the ball a
decent bit like Fred or anyone else for that matter,
because last year's team. Look, it comes down to the
modern NBA advantage generators. Like one reason why I don't
get too bogged down in the who's the point guard discussions? Look,
(25:22):
at the end of the game, you want to get
the ball in the half court to your best playmakers,
and tonight the Rockets were running a point center and
it worked to close out that game. This is not
the nineteen nineties NBA where you have John Stockton like
point guards running, you know, pick and roll. We have
long passed that point. So for me, it's all about context.
And last year's team, you know, the two advantage generators
(25:45):
were Jalen Green and all for Echan Goon. Well, as
we mentioned earlier, Jalen Green was very limited. He was
a little more predictable, and so there were a lot
of possessions where Fred got the ball laid in the
shot clock and yeah, it was an inefficient shot, but
he just sort of had to put it up because
what the hell else was he gonna do. It's the
clock's running down, and he's got the ball in his
hands because he's the point guard, he's primary ball handler.
(26:05):
And so we'd have to bail them out this year
because you have so many more advantage generators, most notably
Kevin Durant, but I think all prim Shingoon's gotten a
little bit better overall from threes and from the freezer line,
which makes teams on paper a little more reluctant to
foul him. Perhaps, like those two have gotten better, Javari
(26:26):
Smith is better at attacking closeouts. I know he wasn't
there tonight, but on the balance, he's been there. The
handles look better, Tari's look good from three. So I
think overall you have a much more dynamic offense. The
most important piece of that is the attention that Kevin
Durant draws. And so because of that, because you are,
you are generating advantages much earlier in the shot clock
(26:47):
and much more easily. You also have Aman Thompson getting
more comfortable as a ball handler and pushing the pace,
so you have more possessions where you can run offense
before the opposing defense is entirely set. And so because
of that, the role of a point guard in this offense,
or whatever the guard is, whatever you want to call it,
be it Aaron Holliday or Reach Shepherd. Right now, Fred
(27:09):
van Fleet, whenever he comes back this season or next,
like those guys are getting much better, a much better
quality of looks now than they did last season. So
the people that are sort of tripping on Fred and
using this hot start offensively as a referendum on him,
just as it was, you know, overcooked this idea that
the Rockets were doomed without Fred. I also think it's
(27:31):
overcooked that, Oh well, this proves you don't need Fred
because of how well you're executing offensively now. No, I
think they're executing better offensively now just because you're not
getting into very many terrible situations period, because you have
enough advantage generators that you're just in a much better
spot overall.
Speaker 1 (27:46):
Yeah, I think that's right. And obviously I subscribe to theory, like, Yo,
you know, Fred's the one guy you can't lose, and
he is very valuable, don't get me wrong, But I
think you know, you've been on top of this early on,
and I think you were right. I think they're going
to fill this in different ways, and the results were
still very early in the season. Obviously, tonight's going to
bring the Rockets down, but the results are there. It
(28:07):
was very weird to see Eric Pinkas, and I don't
mean in any way to single him out, but he
writes for Bleacher Report talking about a trade to save
the kd Era in Houston when we're five games in
and the Rockets have the number one offense in the league. Again,
it's early, but you know, and it's a proposal to
get Derek White, which is you know, Fred Reed Shepherd
(28:28):
and two basically Rockets picks unprotected, I assume, which is very,
very very expensive, even though we know the Rockets do
love Derek White and he doesn't have to save the Rockets.
He's in the point guard. He's a versatile player in
a variety of ways you could use. But you know,
the Rockets feel like, yeah, they lost something with Fred,
but right now they're filling it. And this is what
(28:51):
I will say. Ben said this to me as soon
as the Fred news broke is let's see because you know,
this is going to put a man into a situation
where he's going to grow rap and Reed Shepherd as well.
I think a men's really thriving reads just I think
just a little bit behind, but you can see the
potential with him as well. So yeah, I'm looking forward
(29:11):
to this. By the way, the Sanatorio game, which we've
all been looking forward to, Dylan Harper is going to
miss that game. He's out weeks now with calf injury.
We're not crying. The Rockets have plenty of injuries on
their own. I'm just pointing that out that we won't
see them at full strength necessarily either. This is a
rookie we're talking about, but he's been very, very good.
That's coming up. We do have a Memphis game between
(29:33):
now and then, and there's a bunch of drama going
on with them with John Morant and everything. But I'm
just going to keep mentioning this until that game happens. Ben,
I am really looking forward to that San Antonio game.
I would love to see the Rockets win that game,
just to get this rivalry cranked up another notch.
Speaker 2 (29:48):
And to put a bow on the fredman Fleet discussion.
Where the Rockets miss fredvan Fleet the most is actually
on defense, where he's so steady, he's so high IQ,
he's such a good communicator, and I think that's the
overall biggest challenge for this team.
Speaker 3 (30:02):
Even with all their.
Speaker 2 (30:04):
Issues tonight, let's close by looking at the bigger picture.
They still put up one hundred and ten points and
when it mattered most, they scored twenty one points in
the final seven minutes of that game, and they made
plays down the stretch. They're big guns, most notably KD
and Shingoon the top two. They delivered when you needed
them to down the stretch of that game. So it
(30:24):
wasn't pretty. But even on a night when so many
things went wrong, they were still good enough offensively that
I think they beat a lot of teams. It's defensively
where that's going to be the challenge. And you know,
we talked about running zone, especially without Jabbari, the double bigs,
the threes the MAVs hit that kept the minute, and honestly,
the Maps didn't hit that many threes. If the MAVs
(30:46):
have a good shooting night, maybe we're having a little
bit of a different conversation because the Rockets.
Speaker 3 (30:50):
Lose the game.
Speaker 2 (30:51):
But that's where the challenge is going to be, replacing
Fred leading into the double big, more teams trying to
challenge all for in Shogoon. That's gonna be like the
big in terms of do the Rockets actually have a
chance to win a championship this year?
Speaker 3 (31:05):
To me, that's going to be the big question. The
offense is going to be fine.
Speaker 2 (31:08):
Are they literally the best in the league the way
they were at least rated before tonight. I don't know
about that, but they're really really good, and Kevin Durant's
gonna assuming health assure that they're fine there. It's the
defensive end to the court where for multiple reasons, that's
where I think the big test is going to be.
Speaker 3 (31:24):
It hasn't been terrible so far. I think they're still
in the.
Speaker 2 (31:26):
Top half of the league, so it's not a disaster
by any means, but you know, definitely some questions that
you know, I just want to see him in bigger games.
You mentioned Santonio on Sunday, Milwaukee on Sunday. Those are
two road games on the road, you know, big time
frontcourt players and Winby and Giannis. Let's see how they
feel like defensively again, not like not raising any alarm bells,
(31:47):
nothing crazy, no Cybern emojis, but you know, mix mixed
bag and you know, all in all, four and two
is probably where they should be.
Speaker 3 (31:54):
And you know that's where for.
Speaker 2 (31:56):
Me, I come out of it feeling pretty satisfied, Like
I don't know if the necessarily deserve to win, but
they didn't deserve to be zero and two either, and
so all in all, it comes out of Wash four
and two it's probably where they should be, and it's
a good spot to be in before this road strip
and before the schedule starts to get a little bit
more difficult.
Speaker 1 (32:11):
Absolutely is Memphis Wednesday. Yes, okay, we'll be back on Wednesday.
That's been Domos been always a pleasure man. This is
always fun to do this. We will be back for
Wednesday night's game against the Grizzlies, and then, like I said,
after that, the Spurs are on deck. So appreciate everybody
supporting Clutch fans and all the videos we've been doing.
Thank you guys, and have a great night.
Welcome into the podcast. Everybody. Rockets get their fourth straight win,
beat the Mavericks at home in Houston one ten to
one oh two, a game that was not pretty, as
Emo O Dooka said, we were in the mud tonight,
very reminiscent of the Detroit game where the Rockets did lose.
But the good news is they don't lose this one
(00:24):
tonight pull it out. This was a depleted mav squad.
You could also look at the Rockets without obviously Fred
and without DFS and of course without your Barti Smith
junior tonight, who set out probably for one game just
to rest an injury. Rockets been just you were at
the game. You know, we were texting back and forth,
sweating it out. You know, this was kind of some
(00:47):
scary moments. But they pull out the w.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
Look, I choose to think that it's offsetting one of
those two losses in the first week of the year,
because let's be clear, they didn't deserve to win tonight.
They shot below thirty percent on three. The phrase I
used several times throughout the game was regression to the mean.
I don't think they're as bad of a shooting team
as they were a year ago by any stretch. But
the numbers they put up through five games, the Kevin
(01:11):
Durant effect, I mean that has helped them some. But
are they going to shoot forty five percent on threes
all year if Steven Adams is going to be a
lights out free throw shooter. Like, no, some of this
was just getting off to a hot start through the
first five games of the season and it came crashing
back down to earth tonight.
Speaker 3 (01:28):
And you know, to their credit, they.
Speaker 2 (01:30):
Did score twenty one points in the final seven minutes
of the game, so when it was winning time, it
was a little bit of a struggle on defense. Offensively,
they did execute, but for the game as a whole,
twenty five percent on free throws just are twenty five
percent on threes. Excuse me, nine to thirty six, sixty
five percent on free throws thirteen of twenty those gaudy
numbers to start the year. It feels like those or no,
(01:51):
I'm looking at the Dallas box, so almost identical. But
Houston was eight of twenty nine from three, so twenty
seven point six percent and twenty to thirty from the
free throw line. Apologies for getting those flipped, but the
bottom line is This was a bad game from three,
It was a bad game from the free throw line.
The defense was hit or miss, and yet you found
a way to win even when it wasn't going your way,
(02:14):
even without Jabari Smith Junior.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
Now the MAVs.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
Didn't have Anthony Davis, Kyrie Irvings out like this is
nowhere near a full strength team. This is not a
win that you feel good about. And I doubt the
Rockets are going to be the number one offense in
the NBA after tonight. But all in all, look, if
someone had offered you two weeks ago tonight, if someone
had gone to you and said, hey, would you take
a four and two start through the first six games,
(02:38):
two and one at home, two and one on the road,
your splits are going to be roughly, you know, top
three or four on offense, top ten to twelve on defense,
no major injuries other than the two you already knew
you had, being Fred VanVleet and Tory Anthony Smith. I
think everybody would have taken it, knowing the upheaval in
the offseason, knowing the pieces that you were trying to integrate,
(03:00):
knowing that you weren't fully healthy out of the shoot
like it's a weird path how they got here. But
I think in the NBA over eighty two games, there's
gonna be lots of peaks and valleys and so all
in all, four and two through six games, four game
winning streak, it's not a pretty one. You needed a
little bit of luck from a Dallas team that missed
some threes that they probably should have made and didn't
(03:22):
have Anthony Davis due to the calf strain. But in
my opinion, it sort of offsets the fact that you
probably deserve to win one of the Okacio Detroit games
and you didn't, and now you're four and two and
you're probably where you should be.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
Yeah, this is a really good rocket team. They did
they didn't play up to their capabilities tonight. You start,
you nailed it starting out with the three point shooting. Yeah,
it's definitely somewhere in between. They were gonna regress to
the meme, but through three quarters they were five of
twenty five. Tonight, it was just it was just flat
out nasty. They were very very fortunate. I mean part
of this is defense, of course, but very fortunate. The
(03:53):
MAVs themselves nine of thirty six twenty five percent from
three point range. Rockets lose this game if they give
that up. Of course they went in a blowout if
they're knocking down their threes on their own. You know,
Katie was the guy who set the tone in the
last game. Absolutely was awesome, super efficient tonight, really struggled
with his shot but did end up hitting and I'll
play these here up back to back triples you know
(04:16):
in the fourth quarter that were really big. You can
see them here that got him going. You know a
lot of these guys, Shangoon ended up having an efficient
night twenty six points, eleven boards, ten to twenty shooting,
and I'll play another clip as well where he hit
a big shot with one thirty five left to go.
But I thought there was just like that, that mixed
bag with all these guys, like they all had pros
(04:38):
and cons tonight, you know, Shane Gun in particular or
something we probably want to talk about on the side,
but you know, he had a good offensive game. But
really from the get go, they were targeting him tonight.
I don't want to say hunting him or whatever, but
just they when they would get switches, they would attacks,
particularly particularly PJ. Washington and in a way, their defense
was kind of missing Jabari just to sort of that
(04:59):
week's rim protection. Yeah, yeah, not that he's you know,
this elite shot blocker, even though that four block game
the other day would tell otherwise. But he you know,
he was definitely missing there, I think in that in
that part. And so they were they were kind of
attacking Shannggon and he did you know, he held up
at times, but a lot of times the rim protection
just wasn't there, and that was, you know, kind of
(05:22):
an issue. But of course, like I said, he had
the big play which I could play here that put
the Rockets up three, and in essence was the difference
of the game. The Rockets up one here with with
like I said, one thirty five to go spins past Gafford,
which he's done many times on Daniel Gafford, and it
was a great play by Shanggun Shanguon. So you know,
that was kind of the give and take with him.
(05:43):
But you know, I just want to chalk the game
up or you know, just push it off to the
side as in like it was ugly, but they get
the w Now they go on to Memphis before you know,
setting the stage for San Antonio yeah.
Speaker 2 (05:54):
I think the reality is you weren't as good as
you look Saturday night, when you shot like sixty five
percent from three and were otherworldly from an efficiency perspective,
and you're not as bad as you look tonight. It's
probably a balance of the two, and you were due
for a little bit of a regression to the main game,
and thankfully this one came in a win. There's a
comment from the chat that I want to point out,
I don't understand why e May plays zone so much
(06:17):
when Dallas was carving us up. I think, I mean
it goes back into the whole conundrum with this team,
which is that Steven Adams is objectively one of its
best players. He is very impactful, but the double big
can be very hit or miss in terms of its
implications for the team as a whole. And I thought
in this game there were moments where it worked. The
(06:38):
rebounding advantage, especially in the third quarters the Rockets built
a little bit of a buffer was very useful. But
then in the fourth quarter I felt like this could
have been put away earlier. But the Rockets playing with
the zone, and it's not always the double big, but
oftentimes it's the double big that leads to that zone.
It led to Dallas getting a couple of threes that
(06:58):
allowed them to maintain contact.
Speaker 3 (07:00):
And it's sort of a double edged sword.
Speaker 2 (07:02):
If you're playing a lesser opponent, Yes, in theory, you
get enough rebounds that you want to eventually just sort
of bully them the way you did against the Raptors
the other night.
Speaker 3 (07:11):
But if you're giving up.
Speaker 2 (07:12):
Threes, that's also the ticket to letting an outmanned opponent
hang around. And I think that's sort of what happened
in this one. And so that's sort of the give
and take. And honestly, it's gonna be something that Email
is going to have to feel out because there truly
wasn't that much double big until the last what four
to six weeks off the season, I feel like really
the last three or four and then the playoffs.
Speaker 1 (07:33):
This team actually.
Speaker 2 (07:34):
Yeah, I mean, but that was one like in February,
and then they didn't even start doing it regularly until
like mid March. So in terms of how it's going
to work, when teams can scout it and draw up
exactly how they want to attack it, and you know,
say what you will about the Warriors, they're a very
good team, but they're not the most athletic across the board.
(07:57):
I think some of these teams that have more athletes
a little more quickness. Mike can test you in ways
that even in the playoffs, the Warriors couldn't. And someone
else pointed out in the chat, it's tougher to run
the zone without Jabari.
Speaker 3 (08:10):
That's also true.
Speaker 2 (08:10):
You lose Jabari as you know, the rem protector who
can slide over from the weak side, and you also
lose his length in the zone. So without Jabbari you
missed him on multiple levels tonight. But yeah, I just
thought that was sort of the give and take. Like
Alfred Shongoon had a very good game offensively, especially down
the stretch when they needed him to be great.
Speaker 3 (08:30):
But honestly, the bar was very.
Speaker 2 (08:32):
High because you know Shinoon, and honestly, the double big
was targeted on the defensive end, and that's a big
part of how the MAVs sort of stayed in striking
distance for a lot of this game. So give and take,
and fortunately, you know the one thing you can ask
even if it's a bad night, you just need to
find a way to make the plays when it mattered
most and That's what Shingoon did tonight. And you know,
(08:52):
I think going forward, a big question for this team
it's going to be how they handle situations late in
the half court when opposing defenses want to take Kevin
Durant out of this game. Because one thing I thought
was very noteworthy tonight, even on a night when Kevin
had almost nothing going in through the first three quarters,
he even had a wide open three, no one within
(09:13):
like ten or fifteen feet of him in the third
that he missed very unkad like it happens to everybody
over eighty two games.
Speaker 3 (09:20):
But then as soon as he made those two.
Speaker 2 (09:21):
Threes, about midway through the fourth quarter, you saw Dallas
started sending a second defender, and anytime Katie got the ball,
they were not going to let him beat them.
Speaker 3 (09:31):
So there's more you can do off ball.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
Maybe you can send it them around some screens, but
I also think you've got to get more comfortable initiating
offense through those other four players, and sometimes you can
use Katie to draw that second defender and then quickly
attack four on three like we saw this early in
the James Hard and Russell Westbrook here where James was
coming off the unguardable tour and he would draw the
(09:54):
second defender so easily. And it took the Rockets half
a season to figure out and also shipping out out
Clint Capella for Robert Comington how exactly they wanted to
attack the backside in those scenarios.
Speaker 3 (10:05):
Well, the good news now, like you do.
Speaker 2 (10:07):
Have some of the same limitations and that you know,
Shangoon and a men. There are some shooting questions, but
you also have more than one playmaker. Like you look
at that twenty twenty team, one of the problems was that,
you know, outside of Harden, there was Russ who was
already on his decline, and not much else in terms
of how you could create with that closing line up tonight,
you have both Shangoon and the men. The question is
(10:28):
how you can get them both going in the same actions,
so the defense has more to account for.
Speaker 3 (10:33):
We saw that.
Speaker 2 (10:34):
You know, there was one possession where Shangoon fed a
cutting Amen and ra because actually got a little bit lucky.
I thought the pass was tipped, but you know, Amen
got it and did to his credit finish. So they're
working on it, but it's going to take some time,
and I think that's the big thing, and it goes
back to what we saw that opening week when you know,
Katie had huge numbers against the Pistons.
Speaker 3 (10:53):
He had a big first three quarters.
Speaker 2 (10:55):
In Oklahoma City, and then we saw late in those
games they made it or that the opposing defense that
is that they're not going to allow Kevin Durant to
beat them. So what do the Rockets turn to in
the half court? I thought it was better tonight. Again,
the overall numbers don't lie. The final seven minutes they had,
you know, twenty one points, so you can't complain about that,
(11:16):
But at the end of the day, like that's how
they're going to be tested. There were some rocky moments.
To their credit, they adjusted and you know, I'll give
Shindun his followers for that. Like it wasn't a perfect
game by any stretch. The free throws are also something
that you know, hopefully he's closer to the eighty percent
that he was almost at entering this game, as opposed
to below seventy percent the last two years. So even
(11:37):
on a night when Shangoon was struggling, he found a
way to put it together late. That's a good sign.
He needs to continue doing it. Because I think what
we saw tonight was that Kevin Durant shows you anything.
Opposing defenses are not going to let him beat you
down the stretch of a game, or not let him
beat them, and so it's up to the other Rockets
to make those plays.
Speaker 1 (11:52):
Yeah, and in fairness, Katie has been amazing. I know
we were joking around about this when people thought we
were hating on Katie. Nothing could be for from the truth,
guy is shootings just under sixty nine percent true shooting
coming into his game, he has been unbelievable. The reason
the Rockets through five games going into this game, I
don't know if they will be after tonight, but going
coming into this game, they were the number one offense,
(12:15):
number one three point shooting. That's because of KD. I mean,
Katie is you know, first and foremost. He's been amazing.
And you know, just tonight, like you said, just had
an off night. Tarry Easton has been really good. I
don't have the numbers in front of me with up
with tonight's updated stuff, but three for five from three tonight.
He's had several games now where he's hitting multiple threes.
(12:36):
He looks comfortable shooting that I would never have called
him a good three point shooter before. I call him
like solid average, whatever you want to call it. You know,
his strength is that elite defense and just sort of
chaos that he brings. But he's been good there as well.
You know, a man had a man had just hit
some really crazy plays tonight. If you guys had did
(12:57):
not see this clip, I gotta play it for you
because there was a basically off of his own free
throw tonight. Uh. He grabs the offensive rebound, dump, dumps it,
kicks it to Shenggoon Shangun, throws it back to him,
and throws down a reverse aliyup dunk. It's basically gone viral.
It's it's just insane. And of course he also had
(13:21):
the you know, I'll play here for you as well,
the block on Cooper flag to basically seal it rockets
up six. Here they go the other way and basically,
you know, put this thing away. So, you know, a
man he had a like that, like as you mentioned,
like that fast break drive late. We're really I think
there's a little over two minutes left. Really needed to
finish that layup and do it. It was going a
(13:43):
little bit too fast. But he had another play where
he drove to the basket just bowled his way there.
You can see the vision with a men as a
point guard. I know there's been criticism of him, you know,
the ball handling and stuff of that nature. I mean,
he who cares. I think that's gonna get better. He's
he's so effective, so athletic. You know, he's not a
perfect point guard. Don't get me wrong. I don't know
(14:04):
if he's like, you know, anything in any means a
traditional point guard, but like, he's a guy you want
to put the ball in his hands to make some
things happen here there. And I thought tonight he did
a really excellent job. He was eight of twelve for
twenty points in the first half alone.
Speaker 2 (14:19):
I thought it was noteworthy that Jason Kidd said pregame
a reporter asked him about a men's defense because a
men was going to get the assignment on Cooper flag,
and Kid went out of his way to compliment his offense,
not just in terms of the off ball actions that
people became accustomed to seeing him do the last couple
of years, but he referenced the ball handling, the driving, pressuring,
(14:40):
the rim and what that does for the defense, and
I think that's so important when we talk about this
Rockets team and doing what they need to do down
the stretch of the game. I sort of think, you know,
we'll see if the Rockets acknowledged this after the game.
But I wonder if a man was dealing with some
cramping again. He took a hard fall in the third
quarter and left the game for about five or six minutes,
(15:02):
came back, and just by the eye test, he didn't
looked quite as explosive to me, and so I wonder
if he didn't have quite the juice that he had
in the first half of that game. Obviously had enough
to stay in the game and was impactful, but I
don't know if he was quite as explosive. Maybe that
contributes to him going for layups instead of dunks. I
noticed on a couple of his fast freight sequences in
the second half, So hopefully he's good to go.
Speaker 1 (15:24):
And I think what maybe we were talking about it
in real time at the time. I think what kind
of tipped us off was Shangun was kind of getting
targeted a little bit defensively, but they were still doing fine.
But then he turned it over on that one drive attempt,
he may basically pulled them out of the game like
it was. It looked at normal, just took Shangun out
of the game and then quickly put Shangun back to
take a man out, which made us think maybe, as
(15:46):
you said, he.
Speaker 2 (15:47):
Came yeah, because the men before got rejected at the
rim and it was one of those where he got
met hard. There was some contact, and he stayed down
for about you know, thirty to forty five seconds and
a trainer didn't come out. It looked to me like
maybe he was, you know, just catching his breath, but
there seemed to be some level of impact there. And
the fact that he actually left the game for five
or six minutes even when he was playing so well, Yeah,
(16:10):
it made me wonder. I'll be curious to see if
they acknowledge it in the next day or two. Obviously,
it wasn't like it was in Oklahoma City where it
was something that would keep him out of the game.
Speaker 3 (16:19):
But I do think that.
Speaker 2 (16:22):
Leaning into that ball handling and driving ability to get
back to what Jason Kidd was saying pregame is really
important because when we're talking about Kevin Durant, I mean
the big difference between the current Rockets and last year's Rockets.
Even on a night that Kevin struggled to shoot, his
impact was still there because he makes opposing defense his
(16:44):
account for him at every level. You know, the version
of the Rockets from a year ago with Jalen Green,
he wasn't a bad player, but he was a predictable player.
And so even though he put up low twenties in
points per game and he bumped the efficiency to at
least of respectable level, it was basically threes and rim attacks.
Speaker 3 (17:03):
That's all it was.
Speaker 2 (17:04):
There was zero mid range game, and so it was
very easy for defenses to scheme and try to stop
him as one of the top two options alongside all
Permsion Goon on the scouting report. Well, now that you've
replaced Jalen Green with Kevin Durant, opposing defenses have to
account for him. Basically anywhere from zero to thirty feet,
(17:24):
he will rise and fire. He's got the mid range game,
one of the best in NBA history. Now he's a
better shooter. He's also taller, he has gifts, but beyond that,
he's just he has a much more diverse toolbox. He's
a higher IQ guy, which some of that comes with experience.
Katie's thirty seven. He uses that to his advantage, and
so I give that background to say it makes the
(17:45):
game a lot easier for his teammates. So if you're
a men Thompson, especially if it's high leverage possessions and Katie,
no matter how he's shooting, is gonna draw that type
of attention from opposing defenses no matter where he is,
than if you're ready to go, you can probably find
a driving lane. And the same can be said for
all Per and Shinoon and so teams aren't gonna want
(18:07):
to let Kevin Durant beat them. But the good news
is that no matter how Kevin plays, even if the
ball isn't going in the bucket on a given night,
that's going to give his teammates opportunities. And honestly, Dave,
like I felt like on a different night, the Rockets
could have won this game by twenty plus, and maybe
they should have because you know, they were favored by
twelve and the MAVs were missing a lot of guys
with injury. So that's not saying that that, oh, this
(18:28):
is a wonderful performance, but I thought they were getting
good looks throughout the game, they just weren't making them.
Like they had plenty of good opportunities, the shots just
weren't going in. And finally down the stretch of the game,
they did twenty one points in the final seven minutes.
So that's how I'm sort of looking at it is
that they continue to get good looks. They trusted the process. Defensively,
(18:49):
you know, it sort of fits with the season as
a whole. Like, offensively, tonight was an outlier shooting night,
it happens. But defensively, look, there's still a much better
offensive team than they have been a defensive team. That's
what they're trying to figure out, and so offensively they
figured it out. Defensively, sort of give a ton of
credit to Joshua Koge by the way, who left with
you know, a knee injury, came back, gutted it out,
had a couple of huge rebounds and loose balls if
(19:11):
he secured down the stretch of the game. But I
just think this was a game where offensively almost everything
went wrong. But Kevin Durant has so much gravity and
there's so much combined playmaking potential between the big three
of KD shingoon and a men that give it forty
eight minutes and you'll probably be able to figure it out.
And Dallas, for all their weaknesses, like they are a
(19:31):
top ten defense, Like they're missing a lot of playmaking
on offense, but defensively, like they're still respectable. They're well coached,
they play hard, and the Rockets still found ways when
it mattered most to make plays offensively. And so that's
why I think in the big picture, unless you see
like a sustained bad shooting stretch and we're not nearly
there yet, I'm not as worried about that. Defensively, I think,
(19:51):
you know, that's the big question. It's just, you know,
in a perfect role, you'd bully the hell out of
every team the way you did Toronto and out rebound
them sixty four to twenty nine. But if you get
up a lot of threes and you let teams hang around,
what's the balance there? To me, that's the big question
with this team.
Speaker 1 (20:06):
Yeah, I want to give a shout out as well.
It's going to be a nightly shout out, I'm sure
to Steven Adams because this guy, I mean, nine boards tonight,
twenty something minutes. It's not anything abnormal for him. But
I was just watching this game and it has to
be demoralizing to you know, be a mass fan or
any other fan of whoever the Rockets are playing to
(20:27):
work so hard in that half court defense to stop
you know something, Katie Shangoon, Amen Jabari, to get that
miss and income Steven Adams. If he doesn't get the board,
he draws a foul on somebody that is because they're
just trying to keep him off the boards. It's crazy
the impact that he has. I just want to give
(20:48):
him that shout out. And also Shangun, we were talking
about the defense. That's you know, one thing, but he
is he has been so good really for his career,
but especially this year at finding cutters and finding that
that uh, you know, a man or Tari in that
dunker spot if if the double comes to Shangoon he
reads things really well, and so you know, I got
(21:11):
to give a shout out to him. I think when
he finished with six assists tonight, but it felt like
more to be. To be totally honest with you, I
want you set the stage fourhere. I want to talk
about just briefly. We're not gonna hammer read Shepherd tonight,
but we got to talk about him because he did
play real minutes tonight, I mean down the stretch, and
that might have been because of what you said about
Kogi A Kogi, and I believe it was the fourth,
might have been late third, But he hurts some sug
(21:34):
gets hurt. It looks like it's his knee on a drive.
Comes out of the game. I believe that's why Reid
was playing at that point in time. I mean reads
in the rotation. But you know, in a really close
game in the fourth, I wasn't sure.
Speaker 3 (21:46):
We'd see him, and we saw.
Speaker 2 (21:48):
He may wiggle a little bit by playing the Aaron
Holiday card that he had not in the first five games.
Speaker 1 (21:53):
Correct, and that seemed to be a little bit of
an admission. But you know, with I don't remember how
much time was left, but he put the rockets up
nine with this nice kind of coming off the left wing,
driving kind of floater off the off the glass. Put
the rockets up nine. You're like, great, and then he
made some really bad blunders and just like that, rockets
(22:14):
were only up by two. He comes out of the
game of Kogi's Okay, we hope a Kogy's okay, or
or if emails like I don't care if you're okay,
get in there. We need trouble. We have we're in trouble.
But basically, you know, Reid is just a work in progress.
Uh he you know, had a couple of nice plays.
He knocked down a three and had that one shot,
but really some bad turnovers, some bad plays, and well
(22:38):
he couldn't be trusted down the stretch.
Speaker 3 (22:40):
And he was one of four from three. And I
think there's a link between.
Speaker 2 (22:44):
The excessive risk he takes on defense and whether the
threes are going in because I think he's a guy
who knows he needs to hit some home runs to
offset the the issues that he's going to have with
this lack of size, lack of experience, the shoes, with
physicality that he often has. I mean, other teams hunt him.
It is what it is. You just hope that he
(23:06):
offsets it in other areas. And if he's making threes,
I think he tends to play. This is just by
the eye test, but to me, it seems like he
plays a little more composed, like he knows he's still
providing value, but when he's missing threes, it feels like
he gets even more handsy and at times a little
bit reckless with the risk he takes defensively and then
(23:27):
offensively some of the you know, wild mid range shots
or running hooks, whatever you want to call them, that
he takes like it just feels like he knows at
this point in his career he needs to get some
home runs, and the simplest way for him to get
home runs just make threes.
Speaker 3 (23:42):
And he did the other night in.
Speaker 2 (23:43):
Boston and for the season overall, small sample, but his
overall clip is still good from three, So hopefully he
just continues to trust that and it evens out. But tonight,
when the threes aren't going in, then it just feels
like he then tries to do a little bit too
much defensively and it just sort of spirals. And Yeah,
I wonder if a kogie doesn't get hurt, does Reid
(24:04):
play it all in the second halfort does he play
more than like two or three minutes? Like I'm sure
he would have gotten a cameo, but I don't think
you would have seen him all that much. One other point,
guard rant, I want to get to before we close
out the show date. Yeah, and I hope after tonight's game,
people will take a deep breath. It feels like every game,
(24:26):
one way or the other, has been this constant Fred
van Fleet referendum, because I think just the shock value
that happening right before training camp, there was this overreaction
nationally thinking that without Fred the season.
Speaker 3 (24:37):
Would say the Rocket season, that they.
Speaker 2 (24:39):
Couldn't overcome it. And then as soon as you know,
the last three games the Rockets win big. They have
number offense in the league. I've seen on social media
a little bit of been, you know, an overcorrection. The
other way, it's people saying, oh, he has Fred too
much of a ball stopper. Does this show that he's
not as good or not as important as we thought? No,
I mean you can also look at tonight the Rockets
(25:00):
definitely could have used another shooter. I just think comparing
last year's team to this year's team is very dangerous,
especially for a point guard that handles the ball a
decent bit like Fred or anyone else for that matter,
because last year's team. Look, it comes down to the
modern NBA advantage generators. Like one reason why I don't
get too bogged down in the who's the point guard discussions? Look,
(25:22):
at the end of the game, you want to get
the ball in the half court to your best playmakers,
and tonight the Rockets were running a point center and
it worked to close out that game. This is not
the nineteen nineties NBA where you have John Stockton like
point guards running, you know, pick and roll. We have
long passed that point. So for me, it's all about context.
And last year's team, you know, the two advantage generators
(25:45):
were Jalen Green and all for Echan Goon. Well, as
we mentioned earlier, Jalen Green was very limited. He was
a little more predictable, and so there were a lot
of possessions where Fred got the ball laid in the
shot clock and yeah, it was an inefficient shot, but
he just sort of had to put it up because
what the hell else was he gonna do. It's the
clock's running down, and he's got the ball in his
hands because he's the point guard, he's primary ball handler.
(26:05):
And so we'd have to bail them out this year
because you have so many more advantage generators, most notably
Kevin Durant, but I think all prim Shingoon's gotten a
little bit better overall from threes and from the freezer line,
which makes teams on paper a little more reluctant to
foul him. Perhaps, like those two have gotten better, Javari
(26:26):
Smith is better at attacking closeouts. I know he wasn't
there tonight, but on the balance, he's been there. The
handles look better, Tari's look good from three. So I
think overall you have a much more dynamic offense. The
most important piece of that is the attention that Kevin
Durant draws. And so because of that, because you are,
you are generating advantages much earlier in the shot clock
(26:47):
and much more easily. You also have Aman Thompson getting
more comfortable as a ball handler and pushing the pace,
so you have more possessions where you can run offense
before the opposing defense is entirely set. And so because
of that, the role of a point guard in this offense,
or whatever the guard is, whatever you want to call it,
be it Aaron Holliday or Reach Shepherd. Right now, Fred
(27:09):
van Fleet, whenever he comes back this season or next,
like those guys are getting much better, a much better
quality of looks now than they did last season. So
the people that are sort of tripping on Fred and
using this hot start offensively as a referendum on him,
just as it was, you know, overcooked this idea that
the Rockets were doomed without Fred. I also think it's
(27:31):
overcooked that, Oh well, this proves you don't need Fred
because of how well you're executing offensively now. No, I
think they're executing better offensively now just because you're not
getting into very many terrible situations period, because you have
enough advantage generators that you're just in a much better
spot overall.
Speaker 1 (27:46):
Yeah, I think that's right. And obviously I subscribe to theory, like, Yo,
you know, Fred's the one guy you can't lose, and
he is very valuable, don't get me wrong, But I
think you know, you've been on top of this early on,
and I think you were right. I think they're going
to fill this in different ways, and the results were
still very early in the season. Obviously, tonight's going to
bring the Rockets down, but the results are there. It
(28:07):
was very weird to see Eric Pinkas, and I don't
mean in any way to single him out, but he
writes for Bleacher Report talking about a trade to save
the kd Era in Houston when we're five games in
and the Rockets have the number one offense in the league. Again,
it's early, but you know, and it's a proposal to
get Derek White, which is you know, Fred Reed Shepherd
(28:28):
and two basically Rockets picks unprotected, I assume, which is very,
very very expensive, even though we know the Rockets do
love Derek White and he doesn't have to save the Rockets.
He's in the point guard. He's a versatile player in
a variety of ways you could use. But you know,
the Rockets feel like, yeah, they lost something with Fred,
but right now they're filling it. And this is what
(28:51):
I will say. Ben said this to me as soon
as the Fred news broke is let's see because you know,
this is going to put a man into a situation
where he's going to grow rap and Reed Shepherd as well.
I think a men's really thriving reads just I think
just a little bit behind, but you can see the
potential with him as well. So yeah, I'm looking forward
(29:11):
to this. By the way, the Sanatorio game, which we've
all been looking forward to, Dylan Harper is going to
miss that game. He's out weeks now with calf injury.
We're not crying. The Rockets have plenty of injuries on
their own. I'm just pointing that out that we won't
see them at full strength necessarily either. This is a
rookie we're talking about, but he's been very, very good.
That's coming up. We do have a Memphis game between
(29:33):
now and then, and there's a bunch of drama going
on with them with John Morant and everything. But I'm
just going to keep mentioning this until that game happens. Ben,
I am really looking forward to that San Antonio game.
I would love to see the Rockets win that game,
just to get this rivalry cranked up another notch.
Speaker 2 (29:48):
And to put a bow on the fredman Fleet discussion.
Where the Rockets miss fredvan Fleet the most is actually
on defense, where he's so steady, he's so high IQ,
he's such a good communicator, and I think that's the
overall biggest challenge for this team.
Speaker 3 (30:02):
Even with all their.
Speaker 2 (30:04):
Issues tonight, let's close by looking at the bigger picture.
They still put up one hundred and ten points and
when it mattered most, they scored twenty one points in
the final seven minutes of that game, and they made
plays down the stretch. They're big guns, most notably KD
and Shingoon the top two. They delivered when you needed
them to down the stretch of that game. So it
(30:24):
wasn't pretty. But even on a night when so many
things went wrong, they were still good enough offensively that
I think they beat a lot of teams. It's defensively
where that's going to be the challenge. And you know,
we talked about running zone, especially without Jabbari, the double bigs,
the threes the MAVs hit that kept the minute, and honestly,
the Maps didn't hit that many threes. If the MAVs
(30:46):
have a good shooting night, maybe we're having a little
bit of a different conversation because the Rockets.
Speaker 3 (30:50):
Lose the game.
Speaker 2 (30:51):
But that's where the challenge is going to be, replacing
Fred leading into the double big, more teams trying to
challenge all for in Shogoon. That's gonna be like the
big in terms of do the Rockets actually have a
chance to win a championship this year?
Speaker 3 (31:05):
To me, that's going to be the big question. The
offense is going to be fine.
Speaker 2 (31:08):
Are they literally the best in the league the way
they were at least rated before tonight. I don't know
about that, but they're really really good, and Kevin Durant's
gonna assuming health assure that they're fine there. It's the
defensive end to the court where for multiple reasons, that's
where I think the big test is going to be.
Speaker 3 (31:24):
It hasn't been terrible so far. I think they're still
in the.
Speaker 2 (31:26):
Top half of the league, so it's not a disaster
by any means, but you know, definitely some questions that
you know, I just want to see him in bigger games.
You mentioned Santonio on Sunday, Milwaukee on Sunday. Those are
two road games on the road, you know, big time
frontcourt players and Winby and Giannis. Let's see how they
feel like defensively again, not like not raising any alarm bells,
(31:47):
nothing crazy, no Cybern emojis, but you know, mix mixed
bag and you know, all in all, four and two
is probably where they should be.
Speaker 3 (31:54):
And you know that's where for.
Speaker 2 (31:56):
Me, I come out of it feeling pretty satisfied, Like
I don't know if the necessarily deserve to win, but
they didn't deserve to be zero and two either, and
so all in all, it comes out of Wash four
and two it's probably where they should be, and it's
a good spot to be in before this road strip
and before the schedule starts to get a little bit
more difficult.
Speaker 1 (32:11):
Absolutely is Memphis Wednesday. Yes, okay, we'll be back on Wednesday.
That's been Domos been always a pleasure man. This is
always fun to do this. We will be back for
Wednesday night's game against the Grizzlies, and then, like I said,
after that, the Spurs are on deck. So appreciate everybody
supporting Clutch fans and all the videos we've been doing.
Thank you guys, and have a great night.
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