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August 28, 2023 • 35 mins
Now we get to the nitty gritty......here's more of our conversation with Darden Smith. Check out his music and art at dardensmith.com. You will become a fan!
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(00:00):
Hey, it's Bond Thicket. We'reon our way to the legendary Broken Spoke.
Come on, let's get out ofthe truck and head inside. Rockets.
Damn, you're proud of it,you dream. Come on, let's

(00:20):
go inside, getting ready for anothertale from the Broken Spoke. It's Bond
Thicket. Hope you're enjoining our conversationwith Darden Smith. Monty and I had
such a great time talking with Darden. Let's get back to the interview,
but let's jump back a few sentenceswhen Darden talks about changing his worth ethic
in the studio. When you're makinga list of who you want to work
with, start with your dream list. Start with the dream list, work

(00:44):
your way down, but call thoseguys first. They might say, yes,
right, I like that worth ethic. Now you mentioned the name somebody
who I've been crazy about, RodneyKrawl, and he's Rodney has set right
here and we've did a podcast beforeMonty joined, but right here at this
very table. Yeah, he said, how did you meet Rodney? I
had the same agent and we hadthe same and he was on CBS and

(01:07):
so yeah, this was this wasthe Diamonds and what was so first I
hoped for Roseanne, so I wentout and did a Roseanne tour R King's
record shop. I hoped up fournumber one old US tour that was with
the trio Right Boy Trio, andthen I got after that. I might

(01:32):
have met Rodney somewhere in there,but then I did, like I got
offered three or four dates. Iremember we played La Samua, Capistrano and
Boston in New York. There wereweeks apart. We had to fly that,
so I lost a fortune, butit was worth it. So that's
when I met Rodney. I usedto hang with. He wrote the forward,

(01:56):
wrote, for your your agent couldn'tfind any gigs between California. He's
been on the day you got RodneyCrown. You hear what happened to Jimmy
Hoffa. He signed with Halsey.No, so I you know, like
Monty was involved in, you know, Big Round. I never sold that

(02:19):
many records. I never had thishuge record selling thing. Just wasn't the
destiny. I had even the recordLittle Victories, So Loving Arms was top
ten. It was a top tenrecord, you know, and on AC
radio. And the video was justlike VH one top ten video. But
but it was that second single.In the pop world, you gotta have

(02:42):
that second single to get up there, you gotta. It's a it's a
strategy thing. And right, it'sa second single which was called Little Victories.
It was climbing the charts and doingpretty well. Uh. The label
Chaos had spent a million dollars,a million dollars, this is nineteen ninety
four promoting the cool running soundtrack,right, remember yeah, remember that.

(03:07):
So Toots and the Mat from Tootsand the Maytolls, He's done a cover
of I can see clearly now,and it was the Chaos had done that.
It was Chaos Columbia. Uh.Donnie Einner, who was the head
of Columbia Records in New York,realized that Toots was not on Columbia.
He was on a different label.I think he was on Arista or something
like that. So he finally,you spend a million dollars promoting an act

(03:30):
that is not on Columbia. Heshut the label down right as my record
was climbing. The boy So literallyI was on the road with Stevie Nicks
and the label got shut down andI felt the wind come out of my
Everything thing just went. You couldtell like one day to the next,

(03:51):
nobody showed up at the shows.You know, no my people that had
labeled people. There was no phonecalls returned. It was like a night
and day thing. And literally youcould feel the air come out of the
tires. And so the single juststopped and just began to because nobody's prods
pot. Yeah, if nobody's promotingit, it does it doesn't happen.

(04:12):
I've I've watched guys. I've watchedradio promotion guys walk into stations with stacks
of CDs. You know, it'sa CD time, walking with stacks of
CDs, and the guy looks athim and he just pushes the top three
CDs across and goes, those arethe ones. Those are the ones.
Those are the ones four through ten. You're not going to get played.

(04:35):
I've watched it happen, right,I've I've seen it happen too. It's
all I'm gonna say. Yeah,it's a shame. It all just went
stopped, and so that whole thing, the little victories thing kind of just
crunched. I had a I hada tour in Europe that was doing really
well because the tickets were selling.The whole thing got called off. The

(04:58):
whole thing, My whole career juststopped. They got dropped. But also,
you know, and it was fine. The the ecosystem of a record,
the life of just one of analbum and and an artist and the
band and their relationship with the labeland the book and agent. A hit
record is a miracle. So manythings have to because as a recording artist,

(05:20):
I've never had a hit record.I've had records that done pretty well,
but then you know, you getdropped and stuff. But as a
songwriter, I've been blessed to writesome big hits and everything has to go
right. It is a yeah,it is a miracle. It's a miracle
doctor doing it, really is.And I don't care who it is.
It could be on George Strait,it could be on the big Stevie Nicks.

(05:43):
A hit record, particularly a firsthit record, is a little bit
of a miracle, and people rarelyunderstand that, well, why didn't that
happen? Well, actually it's notwhy didn't that happen? It's how did
the few that happen happen? Becausethey're all little miracles. But here's the
thing, man, It's like,you know, people love to complain about
record labels, especially artists they loveto wine. I mean, you know

(06:04):
Monty doesn't. I don't. Youknow, Columbia Records spent so much money
promoting me and at the time,and that was thirty years ago. The
reason we're sitting at this table rightnow, it's because Columbia Records spent all
that money promoting me. It's notbecause it's because I because they spent I

(06:29):
have. You know, it's likeI still I think I still make a
living. It gave me this foundationto build on. It's up to me
after that. You know, asa friend of mine in Columbia who I'm
still close with, actually said tome one time on a plane, He
goes, here's the deal, man, you need to make sure you have
a career in spite of us.Amen. When your record label says that

(06:50):
to you, what they're saying toyou is this will all go away.
It sounds like a friend of minenamed Mark Genie might say, yeah.
Yeah. It's like it's like,hey man, you need to have a
We're behind you one hundred percent.Yeah, and it's gonna end. So
at that point, but until thattime, check books open. Man,
check book is opake advantage of Johnd Rocket. John Dan told me one
time right after the Wagoneers can't signright, it might have been my first

(07:14):
solo deal with our CA. Buthe and I were just we're having stumbled
in the lunch together and he said, man, well, people don't get
this is so ingenious. He goesall it means and having a record deal,
all it means is they they've letyou in the casino, and how
many people hit in the casino?Just go right there, That's all it
is. Radney Foster describes it asit's you've been You're the horse that has

(07:40):
been allowed to come into the stableof horses, and they're gonna feed all
the horses. One of those horsesis gonna win. Get the feed as
long as you can. Yeah,and then see what happens, because it's
like and it's cool. It's likethen it's up to you, you know.
But it's it was an interesting andit's also you know because that where
I've never understood and really in fortyyears knowing him, never know Darden bitch

(08:03):
about labels. That's not he whathe and I do. And the whole
thing is we're in show business everysingle day is some manner of a dream
I had since I was a kid. I mean, really, my fucking
shittiest day in show business. It'sjust I'm in show business. You know.
It's like I've never once had torun alongside a tank and I'm you

(08:24):
know, everybody else that gets tosee the world like me and Darden have
usually are carrying a gun. Idon't have to do it. It could
if you want it. Well,yeah sometimes I had. Don't recommend it,
but that's another podcast, right,But no, but it's just it's
it's a it's it's a privilege toget to entertain people, to get to

(08:46):
move people through music, and Iyou know, and also because uh,
Dardan's had this extraordinary music career ofcourse, and and it's so cool because
for me anyway, because uh we'vebeen we've been brothers for years and I
love this man very dearly. Butit's also so cool when a cat has
been making records this long since youwere in your twenties, right, yeah,

(09:07):
twenties. Yeah. And what Ifeel is his greatest artistic achievement is
your latest project. That's what Iwant to get into the who say that?
Man? That's pretty cool. Bookmusic art. When we say artists,
and really it's taken the entire turnto artist. Literally Western Skies.

(09:31):
Go out and get that. Nowpeople can get the record, the book,
original art. You can find itall. Just go to my website.
It's all kind of and it's stunning. I mean, it's like what
I will never forget when I didn'trealize that role Hernandez had taken on the
role of your grandmother. I wasreading his review of Western Skies. It

(09:52):
was just and every I agree withevery word. It was just it's a
it is a triumph for and thisis and this is so tell me about
thirty years ago when you made WesternSkies. Oh no, no, that's
your latest project. Dad, Sothat's my seventeenth album. Well, who's
counting? Are but it's your bestone. I think it's a I think

(10:13):
there's I think it's the most cohesiveone since the Little Victories. Actually it's
a new chapter, you know.Yeah. And it also I found it
listenable. It was yeah, yeah, it's fantastic, and well explain it's
a highly listenable record, or justsomebody goes, hey, man, I
heard your record, that's all thisthanks. Yeah, But anyway, so

(10:39):
please describe it like it's multi media. Yeah, but what does it comprised?
What? What's guys Western skies?Uh. It came about so during
the during the pandemic, all thatwas happening, and and I was doing
these drives out to Arizona during thein the middle of it all I had
to go out to do because atthe time I was still doing this work
with songwriting with soldiers where I wasdriving to driving Arizona to do work where

(11:05):
I was writing songs with veterans andthe fantastic. In the middle of that,
I and I had after my lastrecord had come out, I kind
of thought that was it. Ithought like, okay, that was my
fifteenth record. You know, it'slike I just don't know that I need
to make another record. I've kindof done it, you know. It's
like it's I'm kind of it's kindof bored. Actually, I get bored
super fast, and so I waskind of bored with the whole thing,

(11:28):
like touring and all that stuff.It was just like, Okay, I've
done it. You know, it'sokay, Okay. I kind of just
said, here's what Darden told me. I was at a songwriting with soldiers
retreat with him. He'd invite meto go write with these veterans, very
very noble cause and you were lovingit so much. Look, and we
were talking about your latest record,and uh, and and you just said,
he goes, and you said,I don't mean this negatively, he

(11:52):
goes. I think I've said it. Yeah, I kind of think I've
kind of done it. And andsongwriting with Soldiers that was, Uh.
I just just discovered this really greatway to like I call it, like,
I don't really play music now.I use music. I want to
use music in the world. Playingmusic is awesome. But I through songwriting

(12:13):
with Holders and other work that i'ddone, I discovered that songwriting is a
is like a vehicle for change andstory and all this stuff and it so
it had changed my viewpoint about whymake a record when I've got this other
thing, which is like just incrediblyrich and as a you know, I

(12:33):
was in my late fifties at thetime, it's like, okay, man,
it's like it's what's next, What'snext. I don't want to do
the same thing over and over again. So anyway, that puts us back
into Western sky. So I wasdoing these drives on the second, and
I had no intention of making arecord. I was writing songs, but
I found a Polaroid camera in mygarage, in that box that we moved

(12:56):
from house to house. But thenwe open up in that box and I
found this camera and I went,oh, my god, I haven't seen
this camera in twenty years. Whatever. I got some film, got some
black and white film, and Ijust went out. I was like,
I'm just gonna do take some pictureson these drives. So I was driving
through West Texas, through the transpecos, you know, Marfat all that stuff,
and I started loving these pictures andI got way into taking these pictures.

(13:20):
I'm not a photographer, but Iliked to take pictures. And I
was writing songs and I was writingessays based on things that I was seeing
it so poetry, essay thing.I thought they were three different bodies of
work, just stuff. And whendid the painting start. Oh, I
started painting like I started drawing andpainting like thirty years ago. No,
but I mean in regards to thisthat's sort of. I was just organic.

(13:43):
I was sketching and drawing and itwas all at the same time.
But I didn't see it together.And then at some point I went,
I should make some demos, andso I went to Sonic Ranch, which
is out in Tornillo, which isjust east of Ville Passo, right on
the border. And I was justmaking these demos, you know, three
days out there because I didn't literallyit was a pandemic. I didn't have

(14:03):
to be anywhere. I had agig in twenty twenty five, you know,
it's like nothing, and so Ijust said, I'll just do it.
And so I'm recording these songs andI'm literally still on the second day,
I'm standing out in the you know, the sun's going down. I'm
just kind of hanging out outside thestudio. And I realized what I've done.
What this is is a book withan album attached, as supposed to

(14:28):
an album with a book attached,which is a totally different way of thinking
about what I do and what thebook the book is is these photographs,
these polaroid photographs, and the songlyrics and then these essays put together,
and and so that led me.Then I had Then I had a an

(14:50):
envelope, you could say, toput all these things in. I went,
oh, great, now i knowwhat I'm doing. I remember walking
back into the studio. I wasrecording with his kid. He'd never recorded
a songwriter. He just Steve waslike he used to punk bands, and
I'm want I go. Mar He'stwenty four and I'm like, Mario,
I got it. I know whatthis is. Now, let's go.
And uh So then it was like, Okay, how do I make a

(15:11):
thing that's not just just a recordthat comes out because I've I've done It's
like, there's nothing wrong with doingit. It's just I've done it a
lot, you know. And it'slike, okay, well, I want
to have some fun. I wantto be interested. I want to be
super interested in doing it. Andif I'm not, if I'm not super
interested, now i'd really rather notdo it. And you know, it's

(15:33):
just like yourself what you're doing.And also I think there's a point it's
like and once again, it's notlike, you know, everybody's got a
different attitude. I just feel likethere's a lot of songwriter records now,
like do we need another one?I'm not sure? Man, So do
something at least that it lights youup. If it lights you up,

(15:56):
it might light somebody else up.And so that led to me, uh
they're doing this putting this book together. Got Rodney Krow to write the forward,
which once again it was like,who's gonna write my forward? The
last book I put out, Igot Warren Zanes, who wrote the great
Tom Petty biography. Yeah, Ijust went god to be awesome to get
Warren Zanes to do it. Icould call him. He goes, yeah,

(16:18):
sure, I knew Warren. Youknow, I'd done some gigs with
the Del Fuegos, and but thisone I went gotten in Rodney KROWLL if
I could just get Rodney to writethe forward. I called him up and
he goes, yeah, I'd agreat. I mean, it's like just
to just ask and uh. Butthen then I went out and made a
bunch of videos, filmed a bunchof footage in West Texas, turned that
into and then the social Spoken wordalbum that's based on the essays. I

(16:42):
scored all the essays, wrote themand recorded and then made a whole video
suite around that, did a bunchof paintings, and the paintings are gorge
Thank you the entire project and thenthose are Yeah, it's like the project
that could that never ends, butalmost it's almost in a lot of ways.

(17:02):
Artistically speaking, it's it is sucha leap. It's almost like a
damn debut in a way. Yeah, it feels like it. Uh in
that it's like people go, ohmy god, it's like new. It's
not really new for me because I'vebeen doing this stuff a long time,
but it was private, like I'vebeen drawing. I started drawing when I
was thirty I was making a record, or before I was like twenty nine,

(17:26):
I was making a record with PeteAnderson Trouble No More in La and
I was just yeah, yeah,but and then so I drew when I
was a kid, and then Istopped drawing when I was ten because people
tease me about my drawings. Iwas I was left handed and have dysgraphia,
which means you can't like, ifI draw a picture of a face,

(17:47):
it's like mister potato Head on acid, because I can't at that time.
It's it's changed, but at thetime I couldn't get the ears in
the eyes and the nose and themouth in the right spot. So kids
in my class would tease me aboutdrawing, so I quit drawing. I
love to draw. When I wasa kid, I loved it, but
I quit. Then when I wasthirty, I was in the studio and
I was doodling and I drew atree and it was like, oh my

(18:11):
god, and I covered it upafraid somebody would see it. You weren't
happy with it. I loved it, but it was like I was.
I didn't want to be teased.Business. Yeah. Well, I was
also in the studio with Pete Anderson, who just nothing but cut you down
anyway. So I got notebooks andI realized the power of a notebooks.
You close the notebook, nobody cansee it. So I'd been drawn in

(18:34):
notebooks since I was thirty, onthe road sketching, and I've got notebooks
and notebooks and i've been Finally,in twenty eighteen, I had my first
show stuff and I was like,oh wow, I can do this.
And people aren't laughing at my stuff, they're actually buying my stuff. So
that just kind of set me offonto this other track, which to me,

(18:56):
it's not the so the visual artand all this other stuff, it's
still saw. I had this greatsort of awareness about it. Money.
It takes you, it takes youinto it. Though still songs to me
like a draw. When I draw, or when I'm painting, or when
I'm doing whatever it's I approach itlike a song. It's got to sing.
It's gotta have a lyrical lyricism toit. That's not it's not really

(19:18):
it's just got it. Either groovesor it doesn't. Well. But also
I think because of the essays,particularly that I enjoyed so much, there's
the the magic thing whatever, whatever, whatever it is, that spiritual thing
is is all over Western skies verymuch. You know, there is not
a single album cut on the Westernsky well. And also when you say

(19:41):
the spiritual thing, that's the spiritualthing. It's all inside of that stuff.
It's a spiritual record, That's whatI mean. And and and when
when an artist is hitting on allceliners now you know, obviously I don't
mean religious records. I just meanthat the spirituality of I mean, you
wouldn't talk about there are a fewspiritual works in the history of man stronger
than That's all right, mama.You know. So it's like when when

(20:03):
everything comes together and it is justas an instrument of God, that is
all over Western skies and and andyou should be proud of it. But
whether or not you are cats thatthat know you and dig you and and
have known you and dug you fora while. We're all very proud of
you for that process. It wasit was cool. And the thing was

(20:25):
that, you know, realizing thatjust where I am in the sort of
the ecosystem of music, like likein the Grant the market per se Yon
City, man, like they didn'treally care. I got great reviews,
but more people are starting to doit. Man, people do yeah,
And it's like, but it's notlike it Western Skies, Like I didn't
have any radio hits in the videowhatever. It's like, it's cool,

(20:51):
but as far as pushing my thingforwards, and that thing is broad now
it's both the visual arts working ona one man sort of show around Western
Skuys. All these things are likepushed forward and so that that is like,
to me exciting because that keeps I'myou know, I'm turning sixty of

(21:12):
sixty one actually, but so lookingdown the road to seventy and eighty,
like what am I gonna be doing? Then? So Western Skuys was this
vehicle to kind of like reset theyou know, clean the carburetor. It
was so coolest because you you've maderecords. We've all done projects where even

(21:33):
though they might have been from along time ago, it's the project is
a permanent is like you make itso like Little Victories as a permanent is
is. Yeah, you know that'sinteresting. Yeah, And I think Western
Skies it's so exciting and inspiring tosee you at sixty fix and to turn
sixty one to have your latest project. Obviously Western Skies is going to continue

(21:56):
to be an is for you.That's cool. You know, I heard
this podcast at ours. It isawesome. No, I have heard your
podcast, but I heard this otherone and h it's uh. It was
Julia Dreyfuss, you know, Julie. And she's interviewing Carol Burnett. Carol
Burnett is ninety and she goes,what are you doing? She goes,
oh, well, you know we'retalking about at that. She goes,

(22:18):
oh, and I'm writing a filmtreatment on this thing, right. Louis
Drivers goes what goes Oh, yeah, I just wrote a film triatment.
I think it's very good. Sopeople are very interested. She's ninety,
right, she's still working. Sheand but she said also, she goes,
if people want what I'm doing,great, if they don't want,
great, I'm ninety. I mean, you know, it's just so cool.
Stan Laurel stay passed, stay workinglike Oliver Hardy I think passed in

(22:42):
fifty six. I think Stan Laurelpassed in seventy one. Till the day
he died, he was still writingLaurel and Hardy bits. Yeah right,
Yeah. I just think that's justwhat you do, man. I think
it's a really interesting and so findinga way to keep working but not doing
the same thing, like I justI have a lot. I mean what
Monte he's done with with The DangerousFew is like it's taking this song form

(23:04):
that he knows and moving into anew genre which is still Monty thank you.
Yeah, that's like that's the samething. So you don't want to
make you don't want to go makeyour tenth record again, but it's getting
more intimate, you know, whichis great. But you push yourself as
an artist, your audience will followbecause if you're if you're digging it,

(23:25):
they will dig it. Yeah,and there's new audience that will come to
you. And I just feel like, yeah, no, it's true.
And I look around and and thesongwriter singer songwriter world. I have this
guy he used to be my manager. Great guys, really pretty influential and
why I'm so still working. Hesaid, we don't need another Uh,

(23:48):
you know it sounds we don't needanother white guy with his guitar. Just
another white guy with a guitar.Yes, say something, he goes,
there's like a lot of them,So get busy, like, do something
original. That's what we need.That can look like anything, but just
another guy coming out singing songs.It sounds just like everybody else's records.

(24:11):
It's kind of been done, man, and I don't want to be that.
And you know, also realizing thatI come from Texas, I come
from folk music, you know,Texas folk songwriting is kind of even though
I can, you know, youcan put different grooves behind it, you
can do the thing. At theend of the day, I write folk

(24:34):
songs. I write country song countryish pop things, but at the core,
underneath all that, they're folk songs. And embracing that and seeing,
Okay, what can I do?That's like taking that because it doesn't matter
how I try to change it,still what I am. It's like Monty
can do all he wants to,He's still Monty. You know, it's

(24:55):
like and that it's kind of coolbecause you realize, oh, that's the
richness, you know, somebody who'sdone this amazing sort of sort of return
to what they do. There's twopeople I think in this scene, the
Austin scene, that I think aretaking the form that they grew up with

(25:17):
and moving it forward. It's RayWiley Hubbard and James mcmurchery. Yeah,
exactly. They are on fire.And if and if any two cats could
stand to make the same record overand over again and make everybody happy,
it's those two. And they neverhave it and he never has they within
the form. I mean, I'veloved I'd love mcmurcury stuff because what he

(25:40):
does, he's he has this thingand he kind of owns it and the
song thing. Nobody does what Mercarydoes. Nobody sees the world the way
he does. He's taken. Butthey don't all sound the same, right,
It's like it's a new thing.And Ray Wiley it's like, oh
my god, he's he wrote RedneckMother for sex, you know, and
but also he's writing spiritual songs.These are those are spiritual songs. Those

(26:02):
are blues songs, and if youknow Ray, it's almost like a returning
to his childhood of the music andtheir spirituality that's in there. To me,
that's like super exciting. Here's thesetwo guys who could float, and
there's a lot of floating that goeson. And then when writers and artists
get into their fifties, because they'repaid well maybe or they're recognizes one thing

(26:26):
or not, and so they're afraidto change and it's easy and it's easy
for me. Yeah, fuck that, man, I want to I want
to surprise myself. That's the wholething. It's like Western Sky's surprised you
right head to it. Total Yeah, dangerous few record. If you'd have
told me that ten years ago andhe gone, well, that's dumb.
Why would I make it? Whywould I start writing jazz? I don't

(26:48):
do that. Really, it's gonnabe the best record of your career.
You know those songs. We wrotea bunch of songs. You know,
we right about now, but wedon't. It was that whole time that
we were working with Kevin and stWhen I got to you introduced me to
the magic of the of the majorseventh, of the major seventh. You
know. But so Monty and Iwrote a bunch of songs before Really Dangerous
Future. Yeah, yeah, butwe were writing because I love that genre,

(27:11):
and you were spending time in Paristoo. I was in Paris a
lot. Yeah, the relationship withthe woman in Paris. I was in
Paris a lot. I've always beena fan of that sort of genre of
song, and I was studying itat the time, just like in my
own minds, going back and studyingjazz songs, classic well, the classic
sort of American American songbook. Iwas studying it, like, how does

(27:33):
it work? Those are brilliant songs. I didn't grow up with that.
How does it work? Monty andI got together and started writing all these
songs in that genre, and itwas so fun because here's these two guys
that come from this other thing andwe're seeing, we're realizing that what we
have is applicable over here, andit's it's it's it's great, it's fun.

(27:55):
There's you know. And one ofthose songs, this song, it's
a walt it's called right About Now. It's one of the recorded it Darden
hadn't recorded it. It's one ofthe strongest songs I've ever been a part
of. And when that song findsits home, we're gonna go. Oh,
that's why it's it's it's a reallystrong deal. How long How long
ago did you guys rank? Tenyears ago? Eight years ago? Well,
no, it would be more likeI was in that apartment. It

(28:18):
was probably twelve or from fifteen yearsago. You know what, I still
playing, dude. I played thismorning. I'll wake up and play guitar
every morning. And I played rightabout now because I realized, oh yeah,
Montes Major seventh Major seventh, fourseventh. So it's it's really really
cool, and it just it justsounds like one of those things you've heard.

(28:40):
I'll see you Friday, Mike.It's just amazing. Yeah. Anyway,
I really enjoyed learning more about yourfriendship. And I'm really we're not
friends. Yeah the way you mentionedthat we're in showbiz. Yeah, this
is the show. I appreciate justbeing a fly on the wall for this
thing. That's just good. Well, you know, it's it's really cool.

(29:00):
I couldn't even remember his name.I Dartney, Okay, Ray Benson
just called me Darvon, and like, you know, it's like I love
Ray, I have a picture ofRay that is in my studio. Jeff

(29:22):
Wilson took it. It's in mystudio. It's like I keep a picture
of I have a hero wall inmy studio and Ray Benson is on my
hero wall. It should be becausehe's like everything. It's just like he
is a mate. I love runninginto him. He signed me, he
produced my first record. I wantedto kill him at one point. Everybody
does, but he does. Andat the same time, I just realized

(29:44):
that my whole thing got started becauseof Ray. I quote Ray all the
time. My favorite Ray Benson quote. Some gigs you love, some gigs
you finish. Yeah, and it'sjust like, but it's great. I
have enjoyed this again. I wantto tell people encourage them to visit your

(30:07):
website because that's what got me hooked. Looking at the polaroid photos and they're
reading the essays. The picture ofyou as a kid in New York City,
the picture of you with Paul Williams, which that's You're coming back for
another episode of the podcast show.The whole show is is songwriting with soldiers.
I mean that changes lives, youknow, we gotta have We'll have

(30:30):
parton back yeah, man, Yeah, yeah, yeah, Well I hope
y'all are still around anyway. Wellwe do too, do yeah, because
Bob you're great, But the wholebehind it, ye, Marty over here,
I'm not so sure about. I'mnot sure about Marty either. Man.
Like Paul Williams. For everybody outthere who's not aware of Paul Williams,

(30:52):
come on, how can they notbe aware of Paul Williams. He
wrote Rainbow Connection, he wrote TheCarpet, write all those songs anyway,
He hits, So I met PaulWilliams at a dinner in LA and he
you know, I'm sitting next tohim and it's like, oh my god,
it's Paul Williams. We started talking. I said, what are you

(31:14):
doing now? He goes, well, I just started writing songs again.
I haven't written, I really writtensongs in ten years. I was running
up, you know, helping peopleget sober and everything, and I just
started writing. He goes, It'scrazy. I'm writing for these puppets.
Puppets. He goes, yeah,yeah, yeah, I just wrote a
song. I'm doing the Muppets movie. It's like wow, So he'd just
written those songs, and uh,I go Wow, that's amazing. We're
talking. He goes, yeah,I'm having a blast. It's just so

(31:36):
fun, and I'm like joking,and I just go, well, we
should write a song sometime, andhe goes, I'd love that. What
are you doing tomorrow? And Iwent nothing, I don't know Paul Williams,
because I was thinking, I'm canceling. Yeah, and I canceled,
and I canceled the writing a poetbecause with whom would you have an a
poem? And you go, dude, I got a bump you for Paul

(31:57):
Williams. And what are they gonnasay? Yeah? Right, man.
So anyway, I go to meetPaul. He goes, great, let's
do it. So I go tothe Warner Chapel office in LA and I'm
like, I have no idea it. I've got an idea to what it
could write about, but I haveno idea what's gonna happen. Go ahead,
Paul and I start writing this song. It's terrible, Like the song

(32:21):
is awful and we both know it. But you're writing with Paul Paul Williams,
and I'm just digging it, youknow, having fun. And at
a certain point we were in themiddle of riding the bridge, and both
of us go, let's just finish. We gotta finish this thing. Okay,
we both know it stinks, butwe gotta finish it. We're in
the middle of the of the bridgeand Paul's laying down on a couch,

(32:43):
which he does a lot when hewrites, and he dances when he writes,
because he doesn't play, really,he just dances. He jumps up
and he goes, I love writingsongs, don't you. And I was
like, I want to be thatguy. I want to be Paul Williams
doing all he's done, written forall he's written, to be writing a

(33:05):
song with me that he knows isbad. And he jumps up and goes,
I love writing songs like that's thefire mansion. Pursue that and pursue
that fire, and everything else willor will not happen, But meanwhile you
have that fire. And I sawPaul four month four months ago, I

(33:28):
saw him in New York. Iwas in the ASCAP office. He says,
Man, he still remains. Hegoes, got his songs terrible,
he goes, But what a funday, right, what a fun days?
Like you look at what's the nameof that movie guys, damn it,
uh, the Mexican Julia Roberts,Brad Pitt, James Gondolphini, terrible

(33:51):
ter you know, can't miss watchthis, you know. Buddy Holly's produced
by Owen Bradley. The only unlistenablemusic of Buddy Holly's care. Sometimes it's
just it's yeah, these great talentsof people and it has nothing to with
their talent. It just doesn't work. But you got to do it,
man, you have to do it. Thank you again for for for showing

(34:12):
up on time and coming. Youknow, it's great. It's great because
it's a podcast. Nobody cares becausewe're working on their time. That's why
you're not in radio. Alright,alright, prompt promise me, Promise me

(34:36):
that you're gonna come back again.I will, I will really really.
Yeah, it's just Bob and it'snot me. Monty Okay more Tales and
the Broken Spoke very soon. Talesfrom the Broken Spoke is recorded live at
The Broken Spoke in Austin, Texas, hosted by Country Radio Hall of Fame
broadcaster Bob Picket and Monty Warden,recorded mixed down and produced by micro Veram
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