Mavericks win NBA Draft Lottery, Kendall Rogers talks Texas Baseball, and Pete Rose's ban lifted with Gene Watson

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
My name is Craig Way. Thanks so much for joining
us for the program this afternoon. We have a busy
lineup today, Like coming up in a few minutes, we're
going to talk college baseball, both in the SEC and
the national scene with Kendall Rogers from D one baseball
dot com and get his thoughts on the long Horns

(00:20):
on the SEC, the upcoming selections that will take place,
all of those things we've got that obviously we have inconceivable.
Later on this hour, three o'clock hour, we'll visit with
Toby Rowland, play by play voice of the Oklahoma Sooners,
and get his thoughts on this Oklahoma team that will
host Texas Thursday, Friday and Saturday to conclude the regular

(00:41):
season in the Southeastern Conference and for both teams. And
in the four o'clock hour, we'll talk Major League Baseball.
Jean Watson from the Chicago White Sox front office joins
say is, we do have a busy lineup, however, however,
as we introduce you to the producer of the program,
Cameron D.

Speaker 2 (01:00):
Parker.

Speaker 1 (01:01):
The D on the birth certificate stands for Dallas as
in being named for his dad's favorite pro football team,
which has become his favorite pro football team, though he refuses.

Speaker 2 (01:10):
To watch them right now.

Speaker 1 (01:11):
But it doesn't stand for D for Dallas Cowboys today.
Now it stands for D for something else that we
all learned yesterday evening when they were revealing the winner
of the NBA Draft lottery.

Speaker 3 (01:28):
The fourth pick in the NBA Draft goes to the
Charlotte Hornets, picking third will be the Philadelphia seventy six ers.

(01:48):
The second pick will be made by the.

Speaker 2 (01:51):
San Antonio Spurs.

Speaker 3 (01:52):
And that means that the number one pick in the
twenty twenty five NBA Draft goes to the Dallas Mavericks.

Speaker 1 (02:01):
How about that, For the first time ever, the Dallas
Mavericks win the NBA Draft lottery. What were those odds?
One point eight percent? So the D has to stand
for Dallas in terms of the Mavericks date. Even though
you're an Oklahoma City thunder fan, it stands where it's rigged.

Speaker 4 (02:20):
Everything's Red Craig collusion, collusion, Nico Harrison traded Luka Doncics
the Lakers so he could get Cooper flag.

Speaker 1 (02:32):
It's all rigged, that's the response of some. It is
some folks are saying that it was rigged. Some folks
have taken his to such measures as going all the
way back, not not way back in the eighties when
they started a draft lige. But they were pointing out
like when the Hornets traded Chris Paul to the Clippers

(02:54):
and then New Orleans got the number one pick and
then and it just followed several times, so saying that
it was rigged, and it was all this sort of stuff.

Speaker 2 (03:02):
It's funny. I got a text from a Spurs fan yesterday.

Speaker 1 (03:05):
It was asking about rigged and I said, really, you
who got David Robinson, Tim Duncan and Wimby and you're
complaining about rigged? And he laughed about it. And Houston,
of course back to back number ones with a kiem
Olaje run and Ralph Sampson that happened. And of course

(03:25):
the Knicks. It was forty years ago to the day
yesterday that the Knicks got Patrick Ewing and everybody was
screaming about the you know, about the possibility of it
being rigged or whatever. So the Dallas Mavericks have the
number one pick. Most draft pundits and we'll go through

(03:47):
some of this, but most folks seem to think that
that they're going to take Cooper Flag from dude. I
hope they do as a Mavericks fan. Now, every conspiracy
theory is flying now, not just about the whole thing
about whether it was rigged or not or whatever.

Speaker 2 (04:06):
There's there, you know.

Speaker 1 (04:07):
I think what was a get up on the ESPN
where Jay Williams was saying that they should trade the
pick to the Bucks and get Giannis and some other
picks and all this other kind of stuff. There was
a report I saw today from an NBA beat reporter
on social media saying that Cooper Flag's agents are already

(04:28):
pressuring the Mavericks to trade the pick to San Antonio
otherwise under the threat that he could return to his
to Duke for his sophomore year and they get nothing
out of it if that were to happen. So the
rumors are going to be flying for some time on this.
And then I have my own conspiracy theory that that

(04:50):
Nico Harrison is simply just going to trade. They will
draft Cooper Flag and then they'll trade him to the
Spurs for forty year old Chris Paul.

Speaker 2 (04:57):
You know.

Speaker 1 (04:57):
That's that's that's my own that's my own conspiracy theory
that Nico will find a way to mess this up
in that respect, Dati hell actually make the choice and
then trade him, you know, for a forty year old
injury prone guard.

Speaker 2 (05:11):
So who knows, who knows? I know this.

Speaker 1 (05:15):
There's a lot of Mavericks fans very excited. There are
other Mavericks fans who said, you haven't won me back.
I'm out regardless because of what Nico did in trading Luca.
And then there's others who say, I'm in if they
can win with this deal, if they just you know,
if they make it, you know, if they make it work,
and all that other kind of stuff. So it brings
about a a plethora of conversations about what they might

(05:39):
do with the number one overall selection.

Speaker 4 (05:42):
Well, here's one thing, they would not have this pick.
They did not trade Luka Dancins, So got of, you know,
kind of take that in mind. What happens here now,
it'd be interesting if Dallas decides to trade this pick,
and we haven't heard anything from Niko Harrison, we probably
won't know about how they feel about trading pick or not,
but they do end up with Giannis Holy cal Craig.

(06:04):
I mean, how are we going to explain this to
our children in you know, twenty years from now, like
the twenty twenty five season was absolutely ludicrous, going back
to Luca being traded to the Mavericks having a one
point eight percent chance of winning the lottery, to winning
the lottery landing Cooper Flag. I think most people will
agree Nicole Harrison doesn't deserve the number one pick. Sorry,

(06:28):
it just dropped into I know he's built, he built
a pretty good roster, but he still treated Luca Dontres
And yeah, I know Lakers flamed out in the first
round the NBA playoffs and Luca looked pretty bad. But
also he traded for an injury prone player with an
injury prone point guard, and even with Cooper Flag, I mean,
it doesn't make the Mavericks contenders now. Of course, we

(06:49):
don't know what Cooper Flag will be like in five
ten years. Maybe he's the best player of the NBA
and Mavericks and Spurs are going back and forth competing
for an NBA championship. A lot to digest incredible theater
last night, And does anyone have anybody or any friends
who don't believe it's rigged? Because I'm in a group
chat with some NBA fans, they all think it's ricked.

Speaker 2 (07:09):
I don't believe it's ricked. I don't.

Speaker 1 (07:10):
You know what, well, I understand that because the odds
wouldn't be there. But think about it. Think about it's
the lottery, Okay, yeah. Think about the people who win
the lottery, the Texas Lotto, you know, the Mega Millions
or the lot of Texas jackpot. What were the odds
of them winning and they won? These were actually better
odds for that. Not only that, we've seen enough teams

(07:33):
over the years in the history of the draft lottery, uh,
you know, win it with way outside the odds. And
if you say that for the Mavericks, you know, I
would say the odds actually caught up for Dallas to
where they finally got it because not only had they

(07:55):
never won the lottery, they in the past they had
never landed above where their lottery slot was projected to be,
and three times they landed below it, so they were due.
Basically is the way this thing worked out. This is
why David Stern installed the NBA lottery. So teams that

(08:21):
tank on purpose they have the worst record don't get
immediately rewarded with the best player in the draft That's
why the lottery is instituted, because you want to have
the possibility of a team that did not just say, hey,
we're going to intentionally lose so we get the best player,
end up getting the best player.

Speaker 2 (08:40):
That's why it's the draft lottery.

Speaker 4 (08:42):
Yeah, and so usually, Craig, I mean this, this happens
more times than not. Think about the year, was it
Minyama to the Spurs?

Speaker 2 (08:51):
Right?

Speaker 4 (08:52):
You know Hornets had had the highest sods to win
the lottery? That that's correct. Guess what they didn't your
second they got Brandon Miller and the Spurs got Webin Yama.
That's just one of a very very few and varning between.
Do we have the worst team in the NBA get
rewarded with the first overall pick? And that's by design.

(09:12):
So I don't know why people are so upset, like, oh,
the you know, Washington or New Orleans.

Speaker 2 (09:16):
They deserve it. They deserved it. No, they didn't. They suck.

Speaker 4 (09:18):
They're misrun, mismanaged, they've signed bad players to bad contracts.

Speaker 2 (09:23):
They can't win. They don't deserve Cooper Flag.

Speaker 4 (09:26):
I'm not saying Nico Harrison and the Mavericks do, but
just because you can't fill the basketball team correctly doesn't
mean you should automatically be rewarded with the best basketball
player on the planet.

Speaker 2 (09:34):
There was a draft.

Speaker 1 (09:35):
There was way too much conspiracy about the number one
pick and tanking games like the Rockets have been were
accused of of being able to get those number one
picks back in the eighties. That's why the lottery was
installed in the first place. All right, well, we'll talk
more about it, and if you like to awigh in
with your own thoughts or questions on our text line,

(09:57):
you can do that. Text the word Texas followed by
your comment to eight one, five three zero up. Next,
we'll shift to college baseball. We'll visit with Kendall Rogers
from D one baseball dot Com. I'm thirteen under the zone,
so if we're talking about legendary Texans, it brings us
right to our hotline visits with a legend and how

(10:19):
he covers college baseball.

Speaker 2 (10:20):
It's Kenda Rogers at D one baseball dot Com. How
you doing today, Kendall, I'm doing awesome.

Speaker 5 (10:25):
I'm a you know, I don't know about a legend,
but I am a former Lufkin panther. Yeah see, I
know you pretty much know every mascot in Texas high
school football, so I forgot to add that in there.

Speaker 2 (10:36):
Did you play for the pack? I did not. Oh, okay,
it was not that good. I get it, I get it.

Speaker 1 (10:44):
But it's great to have in East Texas legend there
from Lufkin joining us before we get to talking about
Texas because people around here you know how it is,
and they get all unflamed and excited and everything before
we get to that.

Speaker 2 (10:56):
I'm curious to get your thoughts on.

Speaker 1 (11:00):
Is this and only years you've covered not only college
baseball in the SEC, but even nationally, is this Has
this season been as ever changing and unpredictable in terms
of say the upper crust of it as you can
remember in quite some time.

Speaker 2 (11:19):
It really is.

Speaker 5 (11:20):
I was just talking to something about this yesterday on
a radio show, and I think if you go back,
and maybe time will tell a different story. But I
think if you go back to last season. Let's just
go back to the College World Series last year and
the two teams left standing at the end, Tennessee and
A and M. Those two teams, I mean, if you
look at just how they were at the end of
the season, they were both insanely good, and they were

(11:43):
both insanely talented. I think if you look around college
baseball right now, you know the you know, top to bottom,
there's a lot of teams who had question marks. So
let's just look at this week's top twenty five at
the top real quick. I mean LSU really like Kate Anderson,
Anthony Jinsen. But you know, came the bullpen hold up
in the post in Florida state has had bullpen issues,
you know Texas. I feel like the Horns will get

(12:04):
over kind of this. Yeah, I wouldn't even call it
a slot, but this little bump in the road. But again,
you know, you lost Jared Spencer. It's like Max Blue
is probably gonna come back in the next week or so.
But mean, but again, like how was he going to be,
you know, after being out for a month, month or
two months with a thumb injury.

Speaker 2 (12:20):
You just never know.

Speaker 5 (12:21):
So I just take this year more than maybe the
last couple of seasons. This National Championship pitchers wide open.
Like there's just not a team that you look at
as a slam dump club, even Arkansas, a team that
you know, looked like the twenty seven Yankees against Texas
a couple of weeks ago. I mean, at one point
they had lost three out of four series in uh,
you know, four out of five. So you just never know.

(12:42):
This year in college baseball, I think a lot has
to do with you know, nil movement and things like that.

Speaker 1 (12:48):
Yeah, all right, So so here's an almost unthinkable proposition.
But I put it to you now, not so much
based on the tournament projections you have the regional projection today,
but on your rankings. And I know that the committee
have used things in their own prism, but it would
have been I think inconceivable to consider any one other

(13:13):
than an SEC regular season champion to be the number
one overall seed in the region. Given the cannibalization that's
going on, given the rise of Florida State and even
North Carolina and my goodness, Oregon and even Oregon State,
is it possible you feel that school outside the SEC
still has a shot to be the number one overall seed.

Speaker 5 (13:37):
I think Florida State would probably be the only team
that would fit that criteria. I think they would have
to win the North Carolina series this weekend and probably
do some pretty big things in the conference tournament.

Speaker 2 (13:46):
If Florida State did that.

Speaker 5 (13:47):
I mean, they could potentially be the number one overall
national seed, But right now I think it's either Texas LSU.

Speaker 2 (13:54):
In maybe Arkansas.

Speaker 5 (13:55):
The Hogs get on a run and win that Tennessee
series this weekend and also do pretty well on Hoover,
So I would be very surprised if it's a non
SEC team.

Speaker 2 (14:02):
If it is, Florida State would probably be the pick.

Speaker 1 (14:05):
All right, now, let me ask you some questions from
what would be the difficult side of their respective fan basis.
Let me start with Tennessee, since they've been struggling with
like your projections, they have them as a two seed
in Morgantown, and can they change that with a successful
weekend in Fayetteville? Does it also take some work in Hoover?

(14:26):
Where do you see the Balls right now?

Speaker 2 (14:28):
Yeah?

Speaker 5 (14:29):
I mean the problem with Tennessee is that the Balls
lose the series this weekend in Fayetteville. They will have
lost six other last seven series. And I think we
would all agree if you look at the eyeball tests
with Tennessee, you're like, this is a really good team.
The problem is that if you're looking at this through
the the prism of resumes, I mean, how are you

(14:50):
going to give a top sixteen host to a team
that will have finished their season if they lost that
series having lost six out of their last seven weekends, which,
by the way, three of those series at home. I
just don't see how you're a top sixteen seed even
if the eyeball test is there. So, uh, you know,
if Tennessee doesn't host, somebody's going to get a really
really angry Valls team that has the potential to win

(15:12):
a national championship.

Speaker 1 (15:13):
I'm glad you brought up the thing about home and
I'm curious to get your thoughts on this. I completely
understand the perspective of fans around the SEC who look
at Texans and say, hey, look, they're only really tough
series on the road as Arkansas. They got swept there,
so uh, you know, the the all their their their home.
Upon those weeks of Auburn and Georgia and the series

(15:35):
win over Lsue, those were all at home. My question
is this, how much do you think the committee gives
weight too? Uh that whether you're winning on the road
and RPI we know is waited that way, but also
what does it say about a team And you just
brought up Tennessee as an example that can't defend its
home field and struggles to win series at home. I mean,

(15:55):
I guess there's two ways of looking at that.

Speaker 2 (15:59):
They're absolutely is here.

Speaker 5 (16:00):
Here is my issue with that whole argument that you
know that Texas and accomplishments are diminished because if they
they played some of these games at home. Is when
Texas went in the SEC, and I mean you could
probably argue a little bit of the same thing in football.
A lot of people said, well, you know, Texas was
in the Big twelve in baseball, the SEC is a
different animal. They're gonna get you know, I wouldn't say
people thought they were gonna get their happy in, but

(16:21):
SEC fans thought, oh, they're they're in for a root awakening,
like they're at best gonna finish seven at thre eight
from the conference.

Speaker 2 (16:27):
So on one hand, it's either you think.

Speaker 5 (16:30):
This league was way better than you know what Texas
fans thought it was, or you know, or you look
at the you know, the games at home and go, well,
they don't mean as much. So I look at it
as I mean, you know, the core fan and the
SEC thought they weren't gonna be able to compete with
these teams. So I actually give them a ton of
credit because you know, when people kind of you know,

(16:53):
diminished there what they thought they would do. In year one,
they you know, they lose that first game LSU against
k Anderson. They bounced back and when both those games,
I thought the Georgia series, I mean I was at
the Georgia Series. I didn't think there was a chance
really in any of those games that I thought Texas,
you know, was you know, gonna lose. You look at

(17:13):
the you know, the Auburn series. I thought Texas played
really well in they dominated that series.

Speaker 2 (17:17):
So I don't know how you.

Speaker 5 (17:19):
Can go from from hey, they're gonna struggle in this
league too well. Actually, actually we want you to beat LSU,
Georgia and Auburn on the road or it doesn't really count,
like you can't have it both ways.

Speaker 6 (17:31):
Yeah, which, by the way, Tennessee, Yeah, would you know
argue those teams are pretty good at home too.

Speaker 5 (17:37):
They lost series to Kentucky A and m UH and
this past week in Auburn all at home, or two
weeks ago, Getst. Auburn and then Vanderbilt this past weekend.
They've lost actually four of those six series were at home.

Speaker 1 (17:50):
Yeah, and and that Texas Road Series win in Lexington
probably is aging a little better since Kentucky Wonville and
just got through sweeping Oklahoma last weekend.

Speaker 2 (18:01):
Exactly. I just don't I don't buy that.

Speaker 5 (18:03):
I mean I get it that on paper, people would go, oh, well,
they have the better the better team to home. But
I mean at the end of the day, I mean,
a win is a win in this conference. It's hard
to beat LSU, Georgia, Auburn all at home. And by
the way, I mean, I know A and M has
struggled in the last week. I mean they took it.
They swept an A and M team that had you know,

(18:26):
Boxville and had beaten Arkansas on the road, by the way,
and also had just gotten through beating LSU to home.
So I mean you got to give them credit for
that one too.

Speaker 2 (18:37):
Yeah, yeah, exactly.

Speaker 1 (18:38):
Visiting with Kendall Rogers from D one Baseball, Okay, since
you brought up Texas A and M, I know there's
a lot of angst obviously because after the LSU series,
I think folks thought, okay, they came off the Texas series.

Speaker 2 (18:49):
They took two or three from LSU. They're back on track.

Speaker 1 (18:51):
I remember someone asked you on back what what did
you think it would take for them getting in, and
you said probably thirteen conference wins. What that would mean
now is they'd have to sweep the series in Georgia
to get to that. Do you still feel that way?
I know you've got them in your first four out
in the projections. Where do they stand in your mind
right now?

Speaker 5 (19:09):
I really think A and M has to win the
Georgia series and probably win a couple of games in Hoover.
I just think that that Missouri series really set them back.
I mean that, I have to admit we talked about
this as a staffs. That's probably the most shocking weekend
series that I can remember in the last three or
four years in college baseball. I mean, this is being
a little dramatic, but I mean it almost reminds me

(19:31):
a little bit of when you know, when the Hermann
coachman hit that home run to beat Rice when he
was at Texas Southern back in that regional few years ago.
That's how shocking thiss was. I actually saw a tweet
the other day that had you put one hundred dollars
on Missouri on Friday and rolled those winnings to the
next day. To the next day, you would have won
sixty eight thousand dollars. That's how big of an underdog

(19:51):
Missouri was in all three of those games. So I
just think they set themselves back so much twenty four
spot dropping the RPI. You know, the Hampshire will spinning
a little bit. I think you have to win the
series at Georgia, and I think you need to win
a couple of games in Hoover.

Speaker 2 (20:07):
And by the way, you know, for any bands who think.

Speaker 5 (20:09):
Well, that's not going to happen, I mean this team
has beaten good teams on the road before. And also,
let's not forget last year Georgia played Florida, who, by
the way, they had to win that series and get
an NCAA tournament. What did Florida do. They went to
Georgia and honestly kind of with them all weekend. They
get into the tournament and they end up in Omaha.
So potentially, you know, history repeats itself.

Speaker 1 (20:31):
Let me ask you, you brought up Georgia, you brought
up Auburn. I want to get your thoughts on Georgia Vanderbilt,
Auburn and even Alabama, which you have as a regional
host now coming off the series win. How about your
thoughts on That's what I was talking about about this cannibalization.
How and I think Jim Schlastnig will put it best.
A couple of weeks ago you said the SEC will
take care of itself, meaning you'll hurt yourself or you'll

(20:53):
help yourself based on what you're doing in the league.

Speaker 2 (20:56):
There's no doubt.

Speaker 5 (20:56):
I mean, we were talking about this as the staff
as we did our projections and just trying to parts
these top SEC teams. And here's why this is very difficult. Uh,
and I don't know how the committee does it. We're
actually gonna talk to j Rts and Committee chairman later
today on a podcast just about you know, how do
you parse these SEC teams? But here's an example. Uh,
you know, Georgia was swept by Vanderbilt. Georgia swept Auburn,

(21:19):
Auburn took a series from Vanderbilt, Arkansas swept Vandy, but
then you know, lost the series to Georgia.

Speaker 2 (21:27):
So it's just like.

Speaker 5 (21:29):
Like, how do how do you split hairs between those
teams who have very comparable league records.

Speaker 2 (21:36):
And comparable RPIs and they all beat each other.

Speaker 5 (21:39):
It's really one of those situations where I think it
comes down to the eyeball test, and I think of
all those teams in that in that mix. You probably
agree with me here, but I think of all teams
in that mix outside of LSU Texas, I'm the most
bullish in Arkansas. I think when Arkansas plays its best baseball,
it is a better team than Auburn, Georgia and Vanderbilt.

Speaker 2 (21:58):
I agree. I agree with that all right.

Speaker 1 (22:00):
Now, let me get your thoughts on some mid majors
because I know there's a lot of fans in these
parts at the sun Belt. Can they get three in
with it with the Coast to win, Southern Miss and Troy?

Speaker 2 (22:13):
Or is Troy falling off enough? Where do you see
the sun Belt right now?

Speaker 1 (22:16):
Does only the tournament champion get in and or his
coast to win?

Speaker 2 (22:20):
Regardless? Yeah, Coastal is in great shape.

Speaker 5 (22:23):
Actually, Coastalkfeld like, if they, you know, win this weekend
and roll through the Sun Belt tournament, I think they
could end up being the final national seed. I love
the fact that Kevin Snall and You're one scheduled incredibly well,
non conference. If you're a mid major like that, you've
got to schedule. Well he did that through twenty three
and four in the league. They swept the season series
with Clemson. Granted it was midweek. Southern Miss has Troy

(22:45):
this weekend, you know, Southern Miss winners of twelve straight.
Just kind of looking into the postseason, remember the name JV. Middleton.
He's gonna end up being a first round pick. He's
had an incredible year as their Friday night guy. He
is very tough to beat. But then Troy, you know,
the RPI. I still feel pretty good about them getting
in the tournament at thirty seven to sixteen. Troy, by
the way, they can't seem to win a Sunday game,

(23:07):
but they still have not lost a series. At one point,
I think, you know, until the Arkansas series, them in
Texas were the only two teams that had not lost
a series all year. Obviously Troy still just that one
team now, But again, I think you get rewarded if
you can go through the whole season and not lose
a single series. So right now, I think this is
a three big league. And remember this was a league

(23:28):
last year that you know, got five bids. But they
were very deep last year, just not in the.

Speaker 2 (23:34):
Cards this year.

Speaker 5 (23:34):
You know, Louisiana a team that Texas fans saw in
College station last year just twenty five and twenty seven,
and their fourth place in the Sun Belt this year,
so tough.

Speaker 1 (23:44):
You're in SBC in the Southland, you have UTRGV at
the top of your last four ends. So are you
saying they're in even if they don't win the Southland tournament?
Say a Southeastern Louisiana wins it, or a McNeese wins it,
even a Northwestern state, you do you have the Vcaros
in the field or does it depend on you know,

(24:04):
when they go out in that unique conference tournament format
they have in the Southland.

Speaker 6 (24:08):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (24:09):
Absolutely.

Speaker 5 (24:09):
It is really unique in a sense they have like
two split tournaments and then they play a series. I
do think they need to get to that championship series
to get in. I think if they do not, it's
gonna be it's a touch sell. I mean, I have
a lot of respect for Dereck Mattlock. Again, if you're
going to be a mini major, you have to go
out and schedule. You know, was it two weeks ago
they went on the road to love it and played
a two game midweek series.

Speaker 2 (24:30):
I give him a lot of credit for doing.

Speaker 5 (24:31):
That, even if Tech isn't that great like late in
the season, playing a two game road series like that
where you're driving to Lubbock from the Rio Grand Valley,
I mean, that's a g really road trip. So I
actually would love to see them get in. I think
they're a really good club. But again, as Southland team
with a fringy RPI, you know, if they get knocked
out of their side of the bracket in that tournament

(24:52):
this weekend and do not make the championship series, it's
a very difficult sell for me in my opinion.

Speaker 1 (24:57):
Okay, all right, Big twelve and jumping back into majors
off of mid majors. Now, that's kind of been confetti
during the course of this year with Virginia West Virginia
top until they dropped the series over the weekend. In
arizona's been up and down in Arizona State has kind
of popped up, and Kansas is great and falling, and
TCU's at its moments.

Speaker 2 (25:15):
How do you see the Big twelve right now?

Speaker 5 (25:18):
Yeah, I mean the Big twelve right now is pretty set.
I mean, you got West Virginia, Arizona State, Kansas TCU.
By the way, Dan Fistrail, the former dbut assistant's done
an awesome job at KU.

Speaker 2 (25:27):
They've got thirty nine wins.

Speaker 5 (25:29):
TCU, Arizona, Kansas State all looked to be in really
good shape. Cincinnati's kind of that one team I think
going into the weekend they need to take care of business.
They're game over five hundred in the league. They're twenty
nine to twenty two overall, and Jordan Bischel's done an
awesome job. But you just don't want to go in
the conference tournament with a losing league record or a
five hundred league record. You want to you want to
improve that a little bit. The team that I'm really
fascinated to see over the next you know, not only

(25:52):
this weekend, but also in the conference tournament's Oklahoma State. Yeah,
there are another one of those teams that is supremely talented.
Nola Schubern does in company. Yet they're twenty four and
twenty two, they're just five hundred in the league. They
don't have a very good RPI. So you know, if
Voclahoma State goes on a run in that conference tournament,
who wins it. I think it knocks someone like a

(26:12):
Cincinnati or potentially even in Kansas State out of the tournament.

Speaker 1 (26:14):
Okay, all right, and then the last thing I want
to ask you speaking to curiosities. I have a close
friend who is a graduate of Oregon State University and
in what a unique situation And some might use different
terminology with regard to them, you know, a team without
a conference, but the way that they've been able to

(26:36):
schedule and going on the road and winning at Iowa,
you have them right now as a as a regional host.

Speaker 5 (26:44):
Absolutely, and they could actually still be a top eight.
You know, the quad one record still a little problematic
for them. But I love the fact that even in
a year where I mean they've been basically had what
four months to put together a schedule. You know, they
played twenty roads at Oregon State this year, which is
actually a pretty big deal. I mean, that's a great
home atmosphere, so to go on the road for twenty games.

(27:07):
They're thirteen and seven, the RPS sitting at six their
non conference RPI four through non commerce. To schedule twenty nine,
I mean, that's a heck of a job at Mitch
Cannon to put together that schedule, and again they are a.

Speaker 2 (27:18):
Club that can definitely get to Omaha.

Speaker 5 (27:20):
I mean, I've our Kett, who's a premier draft prospects,
one of the best players in the country up the middle.
It's short if you look at the Alpha, Gavin Turley's
a premier player, Dax Whitney a freshman writing for them,
one of the best freshman arms in the country along
with Atalantis.

Speaker 2 (27:34):
You know, that's a really good baseball team.

Speaker 1 (27:36):
And would it be safe to say that the committee,
which always has that sense of irony, and we all
talked about I think everybody on the earth saw coming
to Texas was going to be sent to the college station
last year. You just know they've already done it in softball,
where you could see Oregon State hosting with a former
Pac twelve now Big ten team being sent to core Vallas.

Speaker 2 (27:56):
You've got Southern California in that category. Yeah.

Speaker 5 (27:59):
Absolutely, And I mean a couple of weeks ago, you know,
when Oregon hadn't gotten on the hot streak, you know,
we actually had the Ducks go into Corvallis. So the
Committee loves a storyline, I mean you can bet. I mean,
we didn't have it this week because they weren't in
the field. But you can bet if A and M
finds a way to get in the tournament, we'll probably
get to selection Monday and go, oh shocking that they're
in the regional across from Texas.

Speaker 2 (28:22):
Funny.

Speaker 1 (28:23):
Yeah, Kenna Rodgers does fabulous working in the staff at
D one Baseball, and you can go to D one
baseball dot com for your own subscription as well. Hey, Ken,
it's always great to see you. I know I'll see
you down the postseason.

Speaker 5 (28:34):
We'll see in regionals more likely. I plan on being
in Austin for that one. It should be nice and
fun and scorching hot, of course.

Speaker 1 (28:40):
Yeah, of course, it wouldn't be June in Austin without it, right. Yeah,
that's back to everybody says Texas baseball is getting back
to where it should be. That includes the weather. I
guess all right, all right, I appreciate it.

Speaker 2 (28:53):
All right.

Speaker 1 (28:53):
That's Kendall Rogers h D one baseball dot Com. We
have Inconceivable coming up next year on thirteen under the Zone,
second hour of the program. Here on thirteen hunder the
Zone first hour, rather busy and we talk college baseball,
the national scene as well as Texas and the SEC
with Kendall Rodgers at D one baseball dot com. If
you miss that conversation, you can certainly catch it on

(29:15):
our podcast page at AM thirteen hundred.

Speaker 6 (29:18):
The zone.

Speaker 1 (29:19):
Glad to be able to avail that to you is well,
we're going to talk to more college baseball, specifically Oklahoma
in a few minutes with Toby Rowland play by play
voice of the Sooners. The Long Runs conclude the regular
season this Thursday, Friday and Saturday in Norman at el
Dale Mitchell Ballpark there on the OU campus. In fact, tomorrow,

(29:42):
Keith Morland and I will be driving up to Norman,
so we'll be navigating I thirty five.

Speaker 2 (29:50):
Cameron D.

Speaker 1 (29:50):
Parker, who's the producer of this program, will be your
host tomorrow, and we'll check in somewhere with you at
some point. I'm gonna guess that when you connect with
us tomorrow, we may be somewhere between Gainesville, Texas and Ardmore, Oklahoma,
somewhere there on I thirty five. Maybe they'reabouts closer to

(30:13):
one or the other something like that. That's unless Keith
wants to stop at Windstar or something, you know, along
the way. Probably won't happen. We'll head up on that.
So Cameron will be your host tomorrow on the program.

Speaker 2 (30:25):
Thursday. We have Zimbel hours on Thursday. Do we that
we have no, Oh, it'll.

Speaker 1 (30:29):
Be oh, it's you, okay, all right, all right, I
couldn't remember for sure on that, And I'll check in
with you Thursday.

Speaker 2 (30:33):
Friday.

Speaker 1 (30:34):
I will be hosting for you and taking you up
until three fifteen.

Speaker 5 (30:41):
Uh.

Speaker 1 (30:42):
And so we'll bring you the program from Norman on
Friday and we'll take hip to three fifteen, at which
time we turned the program over to Andrew Haynes because
it's no longer the program at that point. Is Texas
Saftball in the NCAA Tournament in the Austin Regional. Texas
against East in Illinois, three fifteen pre games start time

(31:03):
in the three thirty first pitch here on thirteen under
the zone. Texas Saftball in the NCAA Tournament, hosting in
the Austin Regional. So just so you'll know, that's that's
the plan going on for the rest of this week. Now,
we did touch it all on it in the first hour,
and it's worth touching on again. This deal about the
Mavericks winning the NBA Draft lottery last night, and most

(31:28):
folks figure Cooper Flag will be the choice there. Our
fearless leader, our programming director, Brian Erickson, sent us a
link to a story from the USA today. I examined
a lot of different things and the headline is NBA
fans call lottery rigged after Mavericks get number one pick
and win Cooper Flag sweepstakes. This is why it's not rigged.

Speaker 2 (31:52):
You know.

Speaker 1 (31:52):
The NBA has been using this lottery format to determine
the draft order since it was installed in nineteen eighty
five when the Knicks got Patrick arqueing and everybody said
it was rigged. They said that when David Stern reached
over into the envelopes to pull out the number one,
supposedly that the conspiracies that the envelope with the Knicks
was frozen, so he would grab the cold one and

(32:16):
and and pull it out there or something that was.
That was the big I remember back in the day
when that happened. And ahead of the lottery six years ago,
the format was changed to the odds system in the
hopes it would discourage tanking, but the lottery did have

(32:36):
many non competitive teams that chose to load and manage
their way through the season. Of course, the Hawks won
last year, will pick at number one to pick at
number one, so uh. After after the Mavericks thing came up,
Lebron James just tweeted out a bunch of laugh emojis

(32:59):
on that RG three who I just saw last Saturday
night in Wacob.

Speaker 2 (33:05):
Always invites on his ex space.

Speaker 1 (33:10):
His Twitter says, Dear NBA fans, this is a safe space.
Is the NBA Draft lottery rigged? Why or why not?
Dallas Mavericks made the worst traded NBA history, sending Luka
Doncic to the Lakers and then got rewarded with the
number one pick in the draft lottery to potentially draft
Cooper Flag. What well, first of all the words and
then got rewarded would seem to give the indication that

(33:33):
you think it's rigged. The two are completely separate things.
But anyway, a Twitter site called NBA University has a
photo of Adam Silver holding a phone to his face
with a quotation trade Luca to our biggest market and
will get you Flag. And then somebody else had tweeted

(33:53):
out and this is why, and it says the NBA
is never beating the rigged allegations.

Speaker 2 (33:57):
I think it's just the opposite.

Speaker 1 (33:59):
This is why it's not rich, because so many different
teams with long odds have won it.

Speaker 2 (34:05):
It's a lottery.

Speaker 1 (34:08):
So the Mavericks or the Magic in nineteen ninety three,
the Calves in twenty fourteen, the Bulls in two thousand
and eight, the Mavericks and the Cavaliers again in twenty eleven,
and the Orlando Magic had the longest odget one point
five percent back in nineteen eighty three. So yeah, but

(34:32):
you know, it makes for interesting conversation. Folks are going
to say that's the deal, that it's been rigged or something,
and I would only add this if that's true. If
it was rigged, then the Mavericks will do something nice
to happen with everything that's happened, not just this year,
over the years. If you look at the Mavericks in
the draft life, you'd think that one time, one time,

(34:56):
if not win it, they might be higher up in
the pecking ordar It's never happened. Ever, They've always been
at what their lottery spot would be or below it.
They've never been higher, and they certainly have never been
number one, So that's why I don't think it's Rick.
But I understand. I understand the folks grumble and complaining,

(35:18):
saying it doesn't pass the smell test and all the
other kinds of it doesn't matter.

Speaker 3 (35:23):
Uh.

Speaker 1 (35:23):
The question is what will the Mavericks do with the pick?
And there's a lot of speculation on that as well.
All right up next back to college baseball. We'll talk
about Oklahoma and this Sooner Longhorn matchup this weekend in
Norman with oh you play by play voice.

Speaker 2 (35:36):
Toby Roland when we continue on thirteen under the zone.

Speaker 1 (35:39):
One of my good friends is is the play by
play voice of the Oklahoma Centers. Always enjoy visiting Toby Roland,
who joins us on the hotline right now.

Speaker 2 (35:47):
How you doing, Trow? I'm good? That was interesting? Yeah,
what did though? What did do? Was not expecting that?

Speaker 1 (35:55):
But don't hit it, Okay, maybe you have TJ. I'm
back with that on Thursday when I joined you instead
of Texas fight or something and get people driving off
the road before we talk about the series. I got
off the phone earlier today with someone who is preparing
to broadcast the SEC tournament on the SEC tournament now,

(36:18):
and both of us, by the way, you and I
know had a good time when we got to do
basketball games at the tournament.

Speaker 2 (36:23):
Wasn't that a fun deal getting to do that was? Yeah,
it's a really cool thing the SEC does.

Speaker 1 (36:28):
Yeah, and so they do have their regular crew that
does the baseball tournament. But my point was, he asked me,
and I was prepared to ask you this question anyway,
He asked me what I thought this first year of
transition from the Big twelve into the SEC. How you know,
what was my take on it overall for Texas? And

(36:51):
I know we have an opportunity to examine it differently
in the way things have gone. But the long warns,
of course, are kind of have hit this ump in
the road and they're stumbling a little bit heading into
Norman and and Oklahoma. Things going well, and they hit
a bump in the road last week at Kentucky, which
is a tough place to play. Texas one two out
of three there, but it was a grind all the
way through.

Speaker 2 (37:12):
So I put the.

Speaker 1 (37:14):
Question to you, and if if we set aside the
injuries which have hit both teams, if we set those aside,
how would you characterize the transition into the SEC, uh
from the Big Twelve, and it can go you know,
across sports, not just baseball, but but obviously including in

(37:35):
that way. How did you answer that question, I said,
answer that well, I said, in some ways.

Speaker 2 (37:44):
I don't.

Speaker 1 (37:44):
I don't mean this to sound, you know whatever, jocular
or not or not complementary. But I said, in some
ways it was quote unquote not all that. And what
I meant by that was not that the SEC wasn't good,
because it is.

Speaker 2 (37:59):
But you know this, and I know this.

Speaker 1 (38:03):
That both the both Texas and Oklahoma had real grinders
in other sports in the Big Twelve. You know, both
had their high moments, uh you know, and as soon
as had a ton of high moments in football, and
the Longhorns managed to get you know, the last laugh
for them at least as a team, Texas exiting the

(38:24):
Big Twelve by winning the championship in football.

Speaker 2 (38:26):
But there were there.

Speaker 1 (38:28):
It was a grind in a lot of moment and
it was a grind in the SEC, I said, I expected.
I guess what I discovered was that the week by
week grind might have taken its toll a little more.
And that and that goes for baseball as well. Certainly
I saw it in basketball, and it might have been
and it might have been for baseball as well, so

(38:49):
that that's kind of how I answered it.

Speaker 6 (38:51):
Yeah, I agree completely. I think that the talent level
on the field just actually how good the teams are
you're playing. I was underwhelmed in football compared to what
I thought.

Speaker 2 (39:07):
You know that what it's been valleyhood to be right.

Speaker 6 (39:11):
I have been underwhelmed in baseball compared to how it's
ally hoot and made to be.

Speaker 2 (39:17):
And it was better in basketball than I anticipated. That's
just like the talent on the field.

Speaker 6 (39:23):
I think that maybe there is an underestimation out there
about how good some of the opponents have been in
the Big Twelve in recent years, like TCU and Oklahoma
State and Texas Tech and each of us, and there's
been some other teams that have popped up, you know,
there's like a popcorn like Baylor will have a team,

(39:44):
or West Virginia will have a team or whatever, Kansas State.
Those have been really really good teams and you know,
not that they aren't in the SEC, but it's not
that much different from what we've been facing the weekend
and week out and even if you say, well, well
there's no break in the SEC.

Speaker 2 (40:03):
I mean, I don't know.

Speaker 6 (40:04):
We went to Missouri for a weekend and that felt
like a break to me, like that team wasn't very good.

Speaker 2 (40:09):
At all in baseball this year. The difference for me, sure,
they're they're better.

Speaker 6 (40:14):
They have better players in the SEC across the board
than in the Big Twelve. But it's not as massive
of a difference that as what it's made out to be.
The big difference for me is the the environments, like
the fans, the stadiums, the passion. That's the massive difference

(40:35):
between the two leagues to me, in especially in football
and baseball, and it and it makes a difference, you know.

Speaker 2 (40:43):
I think it helps and hurts. You know. It's a harder.

Speaker 6 (40:46):
It's harder to go into a great baseball environment and
win a game. It also makes your team more excited
to play because you're going into a great environment rather
than Oakland Ballpark in Kansas and there's four people in
the standards where the kiss making yourself right, I think
we're probably in lockstep. There's been part of it that
I've been like, this isn't that big of a deal.

(41:07):
You guys have made too big of a deal out
of this sec We see great teams all the time,
but when you factor in the stadiums and the environments
and the fan passion and everything, that's that's the real
difference maker for me.

Speaker 1 (41:18):
Yeah, I'm curious since we're following up on that theme. Uh,
you went to Georgia for baseball.

Speaker 6 (41:24):
By the way, we can never let this interview get
out to the rest of the set or they'll be
very mad at us.

Speaker 2 (41:33):
You went to Georgia. Uh for a series. Texas did not. Uh.

Speaker 1 (41:38):
Texas went to Mississippi State, and that was that was
something special with duty noble, even though long we're sweat
the series. Uh, there, I could see what folks were
talking about there. Bo teams went to Missouri. Both teams
went to Kentucky. Even the Kentucky kind of saw the
spirit and I like that ballpark, you know. But those
aren't the ballet who teams Georgia is, I guess, But

(42:01):
the ones that are, you know, Arkansas Obviously, Arkansas is
going to be like that all year round, and they're
always gonna be like that against Texas when Texas goes
in there. But Texas did not go to Tennessee, did
not go to Vanderbilt, did not go to Old Miss,
although they've been there in the Super Regional just as
just as Oklahoma has been as well. So it's it
was kind of a mixed bag, I thought. In a

(42:22):
lot of the places, Hey, and then of course came
to Austin, Auburn came to Austin.

Speaker 2 (42:25):
Georgia came to Austin.

Speaker 1 (42:26):
So it was it was kind of a mixed bag.
We know what it's going to be. The atmosphere is
going to be like at Dale Mitchell this weekend. We
know what it's going to be like because it's it's
Red River Rivalry week.

Speaker 2 (42:37):
Right. Did we lose Toby? All right, we'll try to
We'll try to see if we can get him back.
Maybe it left him speechles.

Speaker 1 (42:49):
No, he made a really good point about that and
a lot of that, and and I guess what we
were saying is is that it's it wasn't downgrading the SEC.
It was just saying that in a lot of the
places and a lot of with a lot of the
teams that both Texas and Oklahoma had played in some

(43:15):
prior seasons, you ran across some really good teams and
you have only to look at the SEC standings to
see that kind of cannibalization that were going on. Like
Texas leeds the conference at twenty and seven, and Arkansas
is eighteen and nine and LSU is seventeen and ten.
But you go below that and you have three teams

(43:36):
at sixteen eleven Georgia, Auburn, and Vanderbilt. You have two
teams at fifteen and twelve in Alabama and Tennessee. You
have one at fourteen and thirteen in Old miss. You
have three at thirteen and fourteen, including the Senters along
with Florida Kentucky in Florida was not playing like a
thirteen and fourteen conference team in Austin last weekend. So,

(43:56):
and as Toby rejoins, us, I get to your point, Toby,
I think that we saw talented teams. Environments were different,
but we know the environment and Norman is going to
be different this week and because it is, after all,
Red River Rivalry week.

Speaker 2 (44:11):
Correct, that's right. I think Sankie pulled the plug on us.

Speaker 6 (44:15):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, must have heard it down playing We
were downplaying the conference a little bit.

Speaker 2 (44:19):
So apologies to the commissioner.

Speaker 6 (44:22):
No, it'll be a fun environment you know, we got
the as you guys do, the NCAA Softball regional going
on in town this year and Red River Baseball, so
that little stretch of Imhoff there is going to be hopping,
for sure.

Speaker 2 (44:36):
But it's exciting. I think that.

Speaker 6 (44:38):
Obviously, both teams have a lot to play for us
the final week of the regular season, and anytime these
two teams get together, it's a big deal. And you
guys are trying to clinch the regular season and Oklahoma's.

Speaker 2 (44:49):
Trying to just gear. I think they're probably in the field,
but you want to make sure.

Speaker 6 (44:53):
Of that, and maybe if you got hot here you
could still work your way into a host although I
think that's pretty far fetched after what happened in Lexington.

Speaker 2 (45:01):
But it's going to be fun the suit.

Speaker 6 (45:03):
Neither team is really I'm coming in playing great, so
I think they both would like to find a little traction,
a little momentum before we.

Speaker 2 (45:12):
Head to Hoover, so that that all allowed a little extra
spice to it.

Speaker 1 (45:16):
When you were in Athens, did you run into Keith
Morland who was working the telecast on Friday and side
I did, Okay, yeah, and he'll be up here with me.

Speaker 2 (45:24):
He it is his.

Speaker 1 (45:26):
It is his assertion that the best starting pitcher in
the SEC.

Speaker 2 (45:35):
Is not Kate Anderson at LSU.

Speaker 1 (45:38):
It is not Zach Root at Arkansas, although he looked
the part against Texas, and so did Anderson for that matter,
It's not those two, he says, at least in terms
of major league prospect. He says the best starting coaching
he said it coming back from there is Kyson Witherspoon.
And I know we took the loss last week against Kansas,
I mean, excuse me against Kentucky, but.

Speaker 2 (45:59):
He's a that's just been wiped out for you this year,
hadn't he. Yeah, he's been great.

Speaker 6 (46:04):
I think the other guy in that debate is Liam
Doyle maybe Tennessee, who's had a great year. But it'll
be interesting to see where the vote comes down an
SEC Pitcher of the Year.

Speaker 2 (46:14):
Kyson is tremendous. He's had a tremendous year.

Speaker 6 (46:17):
He had a good year last year and he was
by the end of the season that the ACE and
an effective ACE on this team. He and his brother
Malachi both were a part of Team USA this summer
and we're vallelyhood coming into the year and have lived
up to it. Especially Kyson. I'll talk about Malachi in
a second, but he's got a really good fastball ninety

(46:41):
five to ninety seven.

Speaker 2 (46:42):
He has a really good slider.

Speaker 6 (46:45):
He has worked on his curve to where it's become
an effective pitch as well. The thing about Kyson is
his control is elite, and I'm not just talking about
not walking guys. Like his ability to put the ball
the pitch where he wants in the strike zone is
or just off the strike zone, whatever the case may be,
is next level. You know, I think there's a really

(47:08):
good debate in my fourteen years to say he's the
best pitcher I've seen in an Oklahoma uniform. And Kate
Horton got his major league debut this week for the Mets.

Speaker 2 (47:17):
Yeah, so.

Speaker 6 (47:20):
You know, Jonathan Gray is he's injured, but he's a
part of the Rangers rotation. He was outstanding. So Kyson
Witherspoon has been fantastic. The other two guys have kind
of taken turns being good and not being great, and
Malachi certainly is one of those. He will be the
Saturday starter this week, the Game three starter this year,

(47:43):
and he has virtually the exact same stuff that Kyson has.
I think he might not have the command but Kyson has.
But I do think he's also at a disadvantage by
going second.

Speaker 2 (47:55):
The twins. They're identical twins.

Speaker 6 (47:58):
And when you see a guy for seven innings or
more and then you see the same guy for another five, six,
seven innings, you have a better feel. You know, it
doesn't matter if you're facing Nolan Ryan, You've just seen
it already.

Speaker 2 (48:14):
So I think that works against Malachi.

Speaker 6 (48:16):
A little bit in that visually, pitch wise, everything is
identical that is coming at you. He might actually have
a little more projectable stuff than Kays and his fastball
is a tick hotter.

Speaker 2 (48:28):
His his breaking ball breaks a tick more.

Speaker 6 (48:31):
So we'll see they need him to be a little
more consistent, you know, in the postseason, certainly if they're
going to.

Speaker 2 (48:38):
Be able to make a run into Omaha.

Speaker 1 (48:41):
I'm also fascinated by the contrast in offense on this
because because if we're being completely honest, you know, Skip
Johnson's who's a very good friend of mine as well
as he I've told this story about you about how
his son went my daughter to prom.

Speaker 2 (49:02):
They did.

Speaker 1 (49:02):
They went with a group, but they were kind of together. Uh,
it's when they went to when they went to Prom.
But so I've known Skip obviously for years and everything,
and uh, and I think he's one of the greatest
pitching coaches who's ever lived, and and and yet the
era is five to two two and it's five three

(49:23):
four in conference. Yet the hitting is three oh six
overall and three fourteen in conference. You can transt that
to Texas whose ERA is three five three overall and
three eighty six in SEC play, but yet hitting only
two seventy seven overall and only two forty five in
conference play. It's an it's an interesting contrast. I think

(49:45):
between these two.

Speaker 6 (49:46):
These two we've flopped roles this year, and it's really
upside down from what we expected this Oklahoma team to
be coming into the year. We expected pitching to carry
the day, and in some regards they have. Certainly when
Kyson's been on the mound, you know, Kyson's been great,
and Dylan Crooks the closer, has been great. There has
been some weekends, some you know, game two in Game

(50:08):
three starts that have gotten a little sideways. There's been
a little middle releaf that's gotten a little sideways. That
has led to that er bubbling up. But the bats
have been better than anticipated. Frankly, I mean, I think
coming into the year, as much as they lost in
the position group players, we were worried about them scoring
runs this year, and now lately it hasn't been great.

(50:30):
I think we're going on seven straight games now with
five runs or less. So they had an injury, a
big injury. Dayton Tocke broke his ankle at Georgia. He's there,
you know, first baseman that provides a little bit of
power for him. That's hurt him. Sam Christensen missed some games.
But they've had a little bit more pop than we thought,
not a ton, but more than we thought. And they

(50:52):
have certainly up and down the lineup hit for better
average than we thought.

Speaker 1 (50:56):
Well, so it's been a pleasant surprise. And we knew
Eastern Carmichael is going to be really good this year.
I mean, we've we've seen in the last couple of years,
and so we knew he was. He's one of those
guys I would say. It's kind of like Ryland Galvan
for the log Worns. You know, in the program so
long and you're a leader as much as you are
a producer, right.

Speaker 6 (51:14):
Yeah, you are and he's lineage, you know, he's he's
his dad played here, his brother pitched here. The Carmichael
family is a part of OU baseball. I'll tell you
where Easton has really improved this year is defensively. He's
always been able to swing the bat and he's a
tremendous athlete for anybody, much less for a catcher, but
his defensive skills were maybe a little bit of a detriment.

Speaker 2 (51:37):
He worked his tail off this summer.

Speaker 6 (51:39):
He was the MVP of the Cape Cod League All
Star Game, and he came back this year significantly improved defensively.
And then the backup catcher Scott Muddler, missed about a
month with an injury and forced him to play every
day and that helped him as well. So his defensive
skills have really taken a massive step forward this year.

Speaker 1 (52:00):
All right, I'll finish with this question. Uh, this is
the first time a Texas team will stay in a
hotel that isn't either of one or one of two.
It's he it's you know, in the past, it's always
been either the Embassy Suite to Norman or downtown in

(52:20):
Augie used to like to do it. But even David
Pierce did as well, staying at the Scurven in Oklahoma City.
So they're staying at this place called The Noun, the
right by campus corner where apparently the football worker.

Speaker 2 (52:32):
Nice place.

Speaker 6 (52:35):
I love the fact that you're having me on your
radio show to see if your room is going to
meet your expectations.

Speaker 2 (52:40):
I'm just curious to Norman, but it's very nice.

Speaker 6 (52:45):
The Noun is a brand new hotel built on campus corner,
so you're going to have all of those restaurants right
there within walking distance, and it's it's fantastic.

Speaker 2 (52:57):
Everybody that stayed there raves. So you're right on campus.

Speaker 6 (53:01):
Now you'll be on the other side of the campus,
so it's not like you can walk to the baseball
stadium right but you're right on campus and you're gonna
have a ton of restaurants right there within walking distance
around you. So I think you'll enjoy it more than
the other two places. Not that the Embassy Suites isn't fine.
It is, but you're not having to go all the
way downtown to the Scurven after the game and everything.

Speaker 2 (53:21):
You're just going to be right there at it.

Speaker 1 (53:23):
Yeah, the commute was a bit much I like the
scurven when when we were having the big twelve tournament
in Oklahoma City.

Speaker 2 (53:29):
That was haunted. You know that, right? Yeah? Yeah, you know.

Speaker 1 (53:33):
There's a great story that Bill Schoning, you just retired
doing the Spurs play by play, tells about how they
used to tell rookies when they were playing the Thunder
and they would set it up to where the rookie
would kind of overhear the conversation that they weren't directly
talking to him, so that the rookies like, what are
you talking about? And and and whatever floor? I mean,

(53:56):
the legend is it's the tenth floor, right that the
ghost haunted's at the tenth.

Speaker 2 (54:00):
I can't remember for sure, I think.

Speaker 1 (54:01):
So yeah, yeah, whatever floor the rookies room was on.
They would tell them all, yeah, you know, and then
she goes up and down the hall looking for her lover.
But but that's you're not on the you're not on
the sixth floor.

Speaker 2 (54:13):
Yeah I am.

Speaker 1 (54:13):
And they would do that just to throp, So there
was it was a great bit great they used to do. Yeah, yeah,
no doubt about it.

Speaker 2 (54:20):
We know the noun is not haunted. So I think
you're good and been around long enough to get haunted.

Speaker 6 (54:24):
I can't promise you Barry Switzer won't come over and
just kind of wonder the halls.

Speaker 2 (54:27):
You know what.

Speaker 1 (54:28):
I went with our mutual friend David Garrett over to
what is it the deli nearby? Yeah, Midway, Yeah, Midway Deli,
went in there and had lunch with him. But he
just walked in one day. We're like, hey, you set
out and had lunch.

Speaker 2 (54:40):
Lunch every day he's there.

Speaker 1 (54:42):
Okay, Hey, I appreciate the time. I look forward to
visiit with you up there, and we'll see when we.

Speaker 2 (54:46):
Get up there. You're the man. Thanks Greig, Save Travels.
Thanks Toby. All right, that is Toby rowlingd play by
play voice of the Oaklaima Centers. It is true story.

Speaker 1 (54:55):
David Garrett and uh who has helped us out on
some broadcast and that was the engineer prior to CAM
on Road broadcast for Long Worn men's basketball. We were
in town to play to play Oklahoma and this was
one of those times staying at you know, at the
MC sweets are Norman and David said, anto a place

(55:17):
where you can go to lunch, and we go to
Midway Deli and sure enough we're just sitting there were
just ordering and here comes Barry Switzer in there. Coach
Switzer comes in there, Hey, coach, Hey, what do you say, David?
What do you got? And he said, you know Craig Oh,
I know who Craig Way is. Yeah, I remember it
was great set down at it at once with him or.

Speaker 2 (55:33):
Something like that. So you knows, maybe we'll cross pass again.

Speaker 1 (55:36):
All Right, We're going to go back to some other
college baseball notes, but up next, let's.

Speaker 2 (55:43):
Talk some NBA when we continue on thirteen under the zone.

Speaker 1 (55:45):
Okay, I want to get to the NBA's there's some
news that has come down about Major League Baseball and
I'm going to get to that in the four o'clock
hour and inclusive of our conversation, which being watching, because
I want to get his take on it as well.
But it could change some things in a major way

(56:08):
with regard to eligibility for the Hall of Fame. And
I'll leave it at that for the moment, but I'll
come back to it when we get to the four out.
I want to I want to get to NBA and
i'd like to get your thoughts Cameron Parker on you know,
we talked about the Mavericks winning a draft lottery that
that that was a major development last night. The other

(56:33):
major development was the New York Knicks, who were down
eleven at the half, come all the way back and
pull away to beat the Boston Celtics and win at
Madison Square Garden last night. They were down eleven at
the half and uh they end up pulling away UH

(56:55):
to win one twenty one thirteen. At one point in
the fourth quarter, I heard when they went up I
think it was seven.

Speaker 2 (57:03):
When he went up seven.

Speaker 1 (57:05):
I heard Mike Breen say, this is the largest margin
of lead they've had in this entire series.

Speaker 2 (57:10):
And you think about that.

Speaker 1 (57:10):
It's a team that was up two games to one
and and so they win by eight, uh, and they
now lead three games to one. I think the bigger issue,
obviously is Jason Tatum, and we haven't have you've seen
I haven't seen an update on his condition today.

Speaker 2 (57:26):
Nothing's come out. He's doing an MRI the day.

Speaker 4 (57:28):
My guess is it's something torn and it's something bad. Yeah,
that's that's going to keep him out for most of
next season. So you're really expecting it to be here?

Speaker 2 (57:38):
Yeah? I think so. Wow. Well, first of all, I'm wrong.

Speaker 1 (57:42):
Well, first of all, in the immediacy, that's that's like
the Golden State Minnesota series, right, I mean, they're they're
done without him, and I know they have more weapons
than the Warriors do, but the Warriors not having Steph
Curry was on full disiplin last night. Minnesota won the
game one seventeen to one to ten, and after they

(58:04):
had a fifteen oh run early in the third quarter,
it was about seven and a half minutes to go
in the third quarter, the game was tied at sixty
eight and the Timberwolves had a seventeen oh run.

Speaker 2 (58:14):
I think we're a fifteen oh run and that was it.

Speaker 1 (58:17):
And the Wars made a late push in the final
seconds to bull within seven. But really once they got
it up to seventeen, it really won that close. So
now the Timberwolves are up three to one and they're
going home where I think they'll finish off the Warriors.
The Knicks were back to Boston where they won two games.
But if the Celtics don't have Jason Tatum, and even

(58:37):
if it isn't you know, crippling all the way into
next year, it's probably enough to keep them out of
the rest of this series. I would say that the
Celtics are probably doomed on that it would take a
lot just to win Game five at home, let alone
try to win back at the guard in Game six.

Speaker 4 (58:53):
Agreed, And the biggest thing we've seen so far in
this series, Craig, you mentioned the leads. Austin led by
twenty in both games Games one and two. Probably Game
three as well, since they won that and up at
halftime again over New York. But one thing has been
common in these three comeback victories for the next is

(59:13):
when it gets down the clutch time, which is the
last five minutes of a game, and I think it's
the NBA defines it within five points or less. Right,
the next have been a better team. They have executed better,
They played their defensively, they look like a cohesive unit.
The Boston Celtics at times look like they have no

(59:35):
idea what they are doing offensively. Next have played the
most clutch time games in the playoffs so far, six
and two record. They have a one to fourteen offensive
rating and an eighty eight point two defensive rating. That's
absolutely absurd. Boston Celtics one in four in clutch games
in the playoffs a seventy four point three offensive rating.
Craig a team that won the NBA Championship this last season.

(59:59):
The team has been known for having so much depth
and three point shooting, as a seventy four offensive rating
and their defensive rating one ten point eight. So it's
you know, it's a little bit simple. Once once the
Celtics and Knicks getting clutch time, the Knicks have been
a better team. And credit Jalen Brunson. He's been absolutely

(01:00:20):
ridiculous in clutch time. Thirty nine points last night, fourteen
to twenty five, hit, twelve assists, five rebounds. No matter
what Boston put him in, put him in in the
first game and the second game. In Game four last night,
they just could not figure out ways to stop Jalen
Brunson in clutch time. I mean, he just hits three
pointer after three pointer. Jalen Brown on him, I don't care.
I'm gonna step back and you're not gonna block this shot.

(01:00:42):
And on the other end, where's Jalen Brown in the
clutch time? Offensively, he had hit sixteen points at halftime,
Craig ended up with twenty. Yeah, ended up with twenty points.
That was the guy who won the NBA Finals MVP
this past season, he's been gone. And also you know
if you're Boston, because you know, yesterday we talked about
you know, Cleveland, Okay see going into the offseason. You know,

(01:01:04):
if okay se had lost to Denver in Game four,
you know a lot of questions now according to the summer,
and for Cleveland, now if they lose tonight, lose the series,
a lot of questions going into the summer. For Boston,
I mean, you where do you go from from here?
Getting embarrassed in the second round after having home court advantage,
after being the defending champion. One thing is that Chris

(01:01:24):
Stops is definitely not one hundred percent. You know, he's
been dealing with that you know, virus throughout the season.
Of course he's always been banged up, had been out
really the count on him. But you know, I was
listening to the ESPN radio broadcast on the way home
from the show yesterday with with PJ. Carlissimo, and he
was like, Christops, he just doesn't look right. He's not
contesting at the rim. He looks slow, he looks fatigue,

(01:01:45):
he looks weak. So not having Christops this series at
one hundred percent has been killer for Boston, but at
the same time they have not delivered in clutch time.

Speaker 2 (01:01:54):
Jillen Brunson in the Knicks half.

Speaker 1 (01:01:56):
Yeah, I mean the other guys for the Celtics, Al
Horford five points in thirty eight minutes last night you mentioned,
you mentioned Jalen Brown, he had twenty points, but like
you said, he was seven or sixteen from the floor,
two of eight from three and it wasn't it wasn't enough.
Derek White twenty three minutes and or twenty three points,

(01:02:17):
but a lot of this after they got down there
in the fourth and Drew Holliday has not been a
factor at all, and then and then for the Niggs,
it was just it was amazing the.

Speaker 2 (01:02:30):
Contributions they got.

Speaker 1 (01:02:31):
First and foremost absolutely with what they got from from
Jalen Brunson last night. That was that was obvious. And
then in addition to that he was able to get
his teammates involved and get them into where they really

(01:02:53):
contributed a great amount. Michale Bridges had had in forty
four minutes, scored twenty three points and seven rebounds. How
about o g An Andobi He hit some big shots
for them down the stretch in the fourth round, and
he played forty minutes. And even those two guys were
able to do stuff when Karl Anthony Towns was defended,

(01:03:15):
but he had twenty three. So the Knicks look really
in command of this thing. And of course folks who
weren't crazy in New York right now over this just
losing their minds over this the possibility because if they
do win, and if Indiana does take out Cleveland, which
they could very well do tonight, the Knicks will have

(01:03:36):
home court advantage in the Eastern Conference Finals, which, by
the way, didn't mean that much until last night. They
hadn't been doing that well at home. They've been doing
great on the road. But you'd much rather have it
than not. And you know, all the betting odds all
of a sudden flipped and started changing in the next favor,
at least in the Eastern Conference.

Speaker 4 (01:03:55):
And we're headed towards one of the funnest basketball all
rivalies in the nineties, returning possibly in the Eastern Conference finals.
Craig the Pacers in the Knicks, Reggie Miller for Spike
Lee now a little different, Tyres Haliburton.

Speaker 2 (01:04:12):
Spike Lee is still there.

Speaker 1 (01:04:13):
Spike and Reggie would be working the Eastern Conference Finals.
So that's going to be exciting stuff. Greig, I'm I'm
pumped for that series as well. And you know, again
we we's always talked about it. The Garden the next
one and one of the best, you know, NBA basketball cities.
You know, they haven't had a lot of success, you know,

(01:04:33):
since they lost in the NBA Finals to to the
San Antonio Spurs the next year, Allison was the last
time they got to a conference finals. Think about that.
They haven't been in a conference finals in twenty five years.

Speaker 2 (01:04:46):
I was two years old. Three years old.

Speaker 1 (01:04:48):
Yeah, that's how long it's been since the Knicks have
been in a conference finals. It's good for basketball, excited
for I was twelve the last time they won an
NBA championship. It was twelve, and I'm ring for the
Lakers as a Laker fan, as a Wilt Chamberlain Jerry
West fan. All Right, we'll be back to wrap up
Power number two. I'm thirteen hundred, the third and final

(01:05:08):
hour of the program. Here on thirteen hunder the Zone,
Craig Way alongside the producer Cameron Parker.

Speaker 2 (01:05:12):
Glad to have you with us here.

Speaker 1 (01:05:14):
Up until five o'clock tomorrow on the program.

Speaker 2 (01:05:18):
I'll check in with.

Speaker 1 (01:05:19):
Cam as I make my way north alongside Keith Morland,
will drive up to Norman, Oklahoma. The team has a
practice late tomorrow afternoon into early tomorrow evening. We'll be
there and kind of getting our equipment set up and
things like that while the team is practicing. And then
after that, of course, they have Thursday night where they

(01:05:43):
play at six point thirty against the Oklahomas Sooners. You
can hear that on one of three point one FM
beginning at six fifteen, and also you connect to it
through the iHeartRadio app.

Speaker 2 (01:05:55):
And then on Friday, same time, same place.

Speaker 1 (01:05:59):
On one of three point ONEFM, six fifteen, pre game
start time, six thirty, first pitch again, you can listen
to the iHeartRadio app. And then Saturday we'll be on
AM thirteen hundred ZO right here on this signal one
forty five pregame start time, two o'clock, first pitch for
the regular season finale. Then it's on the Hoover, Alabama
next week for the SEC tournament and then of course

(01:06:20):
the regionals that happen.

Speaker 2 (01:06:21):
So we'll be doing that tomorrow.

Speaker 1 (01:06:23):
I'll check in with Cam tomorrow and Thursday, and then
I'll be able to bring you the program on Friday
from Norman up until three fifteen when we send it
to Macombs Field to Andrew Haynes for pregame for Long
Worn Softball in the regional as Texas will host Eastern Illinois.
That's a three fifteen pregame start time and a three

(01:06:44):
thirty first pitch.

Speaker 2 (01:06:46):
So there you are with that.

Speaker 1 (01:06:47):
Okay, we'll talk some more college baseball a little bit
later on this hour. I want to get to one
topic here before we have a break, and then visit
with Gene Watson.

Speaker 2 (01:07:00):
Major League Baseball.

Speaker 1 (01:07:02):
Word has come down today from the Major League Baseball Office,
from the Commissioner's office, from Rob Manfred's office, that well,
I can tell it. I can tell it to you
this way. There's a letter and from MLB dot com.

(01:07:26):
The letter was concerned a policy decision regarding the status
of individuals who have passed away while on the permanently
ineligible list, and the issue has never really been formally
addressed by Major League Baseball, but an application filed by

(01:07:49):
the family of Pete Rose has made an incumbent upon
the office of the Commissioner to reach a policy decision
on this unprecedented issue in the modern era. This is
from a release from MLB dot com. As mister Rose
is the first person banned after the tenure of Commissioner
Keennessall mountain landis to die while still on the ineligible list,

(01:08:12):
So Commissioner Manford is concluded that MLB's policy shall be
that permanent ineligibility ends upon the passing of the disciplined individual.
In short, he Rose is eligible now for the Hall
of Fame as his shoeless Joe Jackson and others. So

(01:08:37):
the athletic als are reporting said Major League Baseball removed
Pete Rose and other deceased players from the permanently ineligible
list today. It says an extraordinary twist to a saga
that's gone on for more than three decades. The decision,
announced by Commissioner Rob Manfred in a letter to the
Rose families attorney Jeffrey Lenkoff, makes him now the all

(01:08:58):
time hitter in baseball for election to the Hall of Fame.
He died from a heart condition last September at age
eighty three. He was placed on MLB's permanently ineligible list
in nineteen eighty nine for gambling on his team Cincinnati
Reads while he managed them. He had a record still
as a record may always be the record four two

(01:09:20):
hundred and fifty six career hits has never been considered
for the Hall of Fame because of a nineteen ninety
one rule change that barred players on the ineligible list
from election. So here's the statement that Rob Manfred made
in the letter to Lenkov, the Rose family attorney.

Speaker 2 (01:09:41):
Here's the quote.

Speaker 1 (01:09:43):
In my view, a determination must be made regarding hal
The phrase permanently ineligible should be interpreted in light of
the policies, the purposes and policies behind Rule twenty one,
which are two one protect the game from individuals who
pose a risk to the end integrity of the sport
by prohibiting the participation of such individuals, and two create

(01:10:05):
a de turrent effect that reduces the likelihood of future
violations by others. In my view, once an individual has
passed away, the purposes of Rule twenty one have been served. Obviously,
a person no longer with us cannot represent a threat
to the integrity of the game. Moreover, it's hard to
conceive of a penalty that has more deterrent effect than

(01:10:26):
one that lasts a lifetime with no reprieve. Therefore, I've
concluded that permanent ineligibility ends upon the passing of the
discipline individual, and mister Rose will be removed from the
permanently ineligible list. So this ruling also applies to sixteen
other deceased individuals, including Shoeless Joe Jackson. And so that's

(01:10:53):
where that's where it is. So with now you would
imagine open the door for him to be posthumously inducted
in the Baseball Hall of Fame. And I would say
shoeless Joe Jackson as well. I think both have the
Hall of Fame credentials. The other ones, you'd have to

(01:11:17):
examine the numbers very very carefully. The others impacted included
Eddie Seacott. It was a great picture for the White Sox. Now,
these are all members of the Black Sox, the Chicago
White Sox from nineteen nineteen, who were an overwhelming favorite

(01:11:37):
to beat the Cincinnati Reds in the World Series.

Speaker 2 (01:11:40):
They lost.

Speaker 1 (01:11:41):
Back in those days, the World Series champion was decided
by winning five games. It was the best of nine,
and the Reds won the series five games to three.
And there was all kinds of rumor and whisper about
it anyway that they had done this because of two
great pitchers for the White Sox, Eddie Scott and Lefty Williams.

(01:12:03):
But there were other players, great infielders like Chick Gandal,
Swede Reisberg, and Joe Jackson in the outfield, Buck Weaver,
the third baseman. You know those guys. All of those
guys were on the band list. Fred McMullen was Happy Felch,
Joe Gedeon, Jean Paulette, Benny kauf Lee McGee, Phil Douglas

(01:12:24):
Coasey Dolan, Jimmy O'Connell, and William Coxon and Pete Rose.
So all of those, all of those guys were on
the permanently ineligible list. And that was always the debate,
how far do you go with permanently ineligible, permanently till
the end of time or permanently until that person passes
because it was never really called permanently ineligible. That's the

(01:12:48):
terminologe for baseball. We always referred to it as a
lifetime band. It was a lifetime ban. Well, his life
has ended now. People who listen to me do the
show for decades here in the Boston area, you know,
going back, you know, into the late nineties, understood where
when Bill Schuding and I did the show, we were

(01:13:08):
on opposite sides of this issue. Bill believed that Pete
Rose deserved to be in the Hall of Fame.

Speaker 2 (01:13:12):
I did not.

Speaker 1 (01:13:13):
And the reason why I didn't was because of the
things that I had heard that he did bet on
his own team while he was managing, and even if
he was betting on them to win, it was brought
up that it could influence decision making that still affecting
the fabric of the game in order to win or

(01:13:35):
win by a certain.

Speaker 2 (01:13:35):
Amount or whatever.

Speaker 1 (01:13:37):
So but I also always felt that a lifetime band
was just that for the lifetime, and I think it
applied to Shulis Joe Jackson. You know, by the way,
in the nineteen nineteen World Series, if you didn't know Shuelich,
Joe Jackson hit three seventy five. It wasn't like he
was walking up there and looking at three pitches and
walking back to the dugout. It wasn't like he was
dropping fly balls. He played well, but but you know,

(01:14:01):
he was illiterate and kind of signed to the next
with what.

Speaker 2 (01:14:03):
He did, and.

Speaker 1 (01:14:06):
There was a lot of discussion about whether he took
the money or took it and gave it back, whatever.
But Kennesaw mount Landis the commissioner, said anyone who had
knowledge of it and didn't come forward was just as guilty.
He got a lifetime ban. I would imagine that Pete
Rose and Julis Joe Jackson will be in the Hall

(01:14:27):
of Fame next uh, well, the next July, when the
next when the next election comes around, I believe they'll
be on that And I don't have a problem with that.
Now once they've passed, Now that they've been removed from
the permanently ineligible list, a lifetime ban has just been

(01:14:48):
just that they've served their time.

Speaker 2 (01:14:50):
Their life on this planet has ended. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:14:53):
I know some people will look at it forlornly and
think that it's a shame that that had happened, But
that's the way the structure was set up. Manford is
able to say, still, if you're on the permanently ineligible list,
you're there until you're gone.

Speaker 2 (01:15:06):
That's where it is.

Speaker 1 (01:15:07):
But for the sixteen individuals who passed away, they're now off.

Speaker 2 (01:15:12):
The permanently ineligible list. All right.

Speaker 1 (01:15:15):
Up next, we visit with Gene Watson to talk about
this and other Major League Baseball.

Speaker 2 (01:15:19):
Topics when we continue on thirteen under the Zone.

Speaker 1 (01:15:21):
Probably the two biggest George Strait fans I know on
the planet are Ty Harrington and Gene Watson, and they're
huge fans. And one of them is joining us on
the hotline right now. That would be Gene Watson from
the Chicago White Tux Front offs. Am I right about
your affinity for the king?

Speaker 6 (01:15:39):
Oh?

Speaker 2 (01:15:40):
My gosh, you know.

Speaker 7 (01:15:41):
The first time I ever met George Strait was in
nineteen ninety two. They were filming Pure Country in Full Earth,
which Melanie, my wife, is actually an extra in oh
in one of the state scenes. But so they would
film during the day, they would come to the games
at night, and then the Ace and the Hole being

(01:16:02):
a MacArthur and the ace in the hole.

Speaker 2 (01:16:04):
We'd go out to the cages and I.

Speaker 7 (01:16:06):
Would throw them batting practice with coolers full of Budweise,
which tell about three am, and then have to be
a work at seven in the morning. So that was
a that was a ten day run that I thought
I was going to die in.

Speaker 2 (01:16:17):
But uh memory.

Speaker 1 (01:16:18):
Nonetheless, I started to say, carries a lifetime of memories. Right, Yeah, okay,
let's cut right to the chase in here.

Speaker 2 (01:16:25):
Speaking of the word lifetime.

Speaker 1 (01:16:26):
This came down just a little while ago from the
Commissioner's office based on that that decision on the ineligibility
status UH the permanently ineligible list, and and he has
taking it taken it to UH interpret as permanently ineligible.
The ban is lifted once you pass away, which of

(01:16:47):
course would apply directly to Pete Rose, Shoelister Jackson. Sixteen
total in all UH former players who were on that
permanently ineligible list.

Speaker 2 (01:16:57):
Now, not that many on that list would.

Speaker 1 (01:17:01):
Actually be Hall of Famers, Shoeless Joe Jackson, Pete Rose
obviously would be.

Speaker 2 (01:17:05):
How about your thoughts on the commissions announcement today. I
think it's big.

Speaker 7 (01:17:10):
I think it's not really unexpected when you think about
everything that went into putting them on the suspended list,
the reasons why, and then with obviously both of them
being passed now it's just a different time, Craig, that
you know, major League Baseball has a strong relationship with
gambling now. I think when you look back at Shoeless

(01:17:33):
Joe's case, I don't know that he ever should have
been on it other than guilty by association with the
rest of the team. Right he hit three seventy five
in the World Series that year. There was never any
evidence of him taking a dime of money. I think
that was more guilty by association and just punishing the
whole group With Pete, I mean, it was never as

(01:17:53):
a player.

Speaker 2 (01:17:54):
It was a manager.

Speaker 7 (01:17:56):
He's our you know, record holder in hits games, play
all of those things.

Speaker 2 (01:18:01):
And you know, I think that what you do by.

Speaker 7 (01:18:04):
Waiting until he's deceased is you take away all the
drama of the actual ceremony. And you know, the Hall
of Fame is such a prideful community, and I'm very
close with a lot of Hall of famers and they
take great pride in that ceremony. And so rather than
having the disruption of Pete coming in and players boycotting

(01:18:27):
the event, and you know, does he turn it into
a kind of a side show with events around it,
I think you eliminate all that. Now he has a
chance to have his day go on the Hall of
Fame rightfully so, and everything moves forward.

Speaker 1 (01:18:43):
Yeah, And I think probably there's no doubt that in
what in July of twenty six, I guess we would
see both Pete Rose and Chulisjo Jackson inducted posthumously in
the Hall. And you think at that point folks will
have moved on. Because I just said this on the Urgino.

(01:19:04):
I was always on of the belief that when he
was on the permanently ineligible list, Pete Rose, I'm talking
about that because of his actions and what he signed
in the confession and originally said he never bet, never, ever, ever,
ever bet. I mean he told that to every set

(01:19:25):
of teammates he was with. I mean he told that
to Keith Morlan when they were playing on the Phillies.

Speaker 2 (01:19:29):
I never did it. I never did it. And then
he came back later and signed to think.

Speaker 1 (01:19:32):
Yeah yeah, yeah I did, and had the book and
all that sort of stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:19:35):
But and so I always.

Speaker 1 (01:19:37):
Felt that the lifetime ban was appropriate. But I am
of the belief that lifetime ban is just that. And
now that he has passed, and I think you make
a good point that probably wouldn't be a big circus
around it, no matter who is representing him or shoeless
Joe Jackson next year or if it happens in twenty

(01:19:58):
twenty six.

Speaker 7 (01:20:00):
Yeah, Craig and I'll take it one step further, and
I said this earlier today, Like my kids know who
Shoeless Joe Jackson is.

Speaker 2 (01:20:09):
He played in the you.

Speaker 7 (01:20:10):
Know, the nineteens and you know, nineteen nineteen and beyond.
I mean they shouldn't know who Shoeless Joe Jackson is.
They just the generations have passed. And I believe this
with you know, the great debate on Roger Clemens and
Barry Bonds and Rafael Palmyrow and and all the players
that are going to be left out due to performance enhancements.

(01:20:32):
You know, they shouldn't be famous or infamous sixty seventy.

Speaker 2 (01:20:37):
Eighty years down the road.

Speaker 7 (01:20:40):
Our fan base shouldn't know who these guys are because
of something that they did that carries their legacy.

Speaker 2 (01:20:47):
Put them in the Hall of Fame.

Speaker 7 (01:20:49):
But note the time, note everything about that player, and
let the fans decide the asterisks, let the fans decide
if they rightfully belong, because I can prompt was you
uh not? Every not Every player in the Hall of
Fame was an angel, a perfect angel, And every every decade,
every generation has had their vices and things that that

(01:21:11):
drew the players back on and off the field.

Speaker 2 (01:21:13):
And I just think by keeping.

Speaker 7 (01:21:15):
The best players out for particular reasons, we're not doing
a service, uh to the to the hall and just
put the players in the best players on the field,
but document all the things that the controversies that surrounded
those players at that time.

Speaker 1 (01:21:30):
Would you be okay if they had a quote unquote
wing or whatever and say, this is from the steroid
era and these players had these numbers. But also whether
it was the mental report or congressional testimony or whatever
it was, we're found to have have been steroid users
with is that what you're talking about?

Speaker 7 (01:21:48):
But in the I just think I really don't. I
think you just put them in. You know, your history
is your history, good or bad?

Speaker 2 (01:21:56):
At your history?

Speaker 7 (01:21:56):
And I just think you put them in and you
note the speculation, you note the what was proven to be,
but in between the white lines, these were the best
players of our time and then everything centered around that.
You just document it and put it into the plaque.

Speaker 1 (01:22:13):
Okay, all right, talking baseball here with Geene Watson, let's
jump to the current place in time. You are intricately
involved with what's going to happen internationally with baseball, with
the Olympics, I know you're you've always been around the
World Baseball Classic as well. It was announced today Paul
Skeens is going to pitch for Team USA next year

(01:22:33):
in the World Baseball Classic. Aaron Judges said he's going
to be in it. Mark de Rosa is going to
manage it as well. Of course, they lost to Japan
and the championship in twenty twenty three. What's your take
on where the US is in terms of their philosophy
as well as their implementation here for the for the WBC.

Speaker 7 (01:22:54):
Well, it's a wonderful event. I've covered every one of them.
I was a part of the selection for the first one,
and then Major League Baseball kind of took it over
from there. The USA committee kind of stepped back and
we handled the Olympics now for the most part.

Speaker 2 (01:23:08):
But this is a players.

Speaker 7 (01:23:10):
Event, and the minute that you have you know, Mark,
Mike Trout involved, Mike's gonna have five or six guys
that he wants to play, and those five or six
guys are going to go I'll play if we can
get this guy on board. And it's very organic in
the way they build out that roster. Major League Baseball
really has very little to do with it, the players

(01:23:31):
kind of decide who they want to have on the team,
and getting Paul Schemes on that roster is just huge
because I mean, truthfully, Japan is so extremely talented and
they take so much pride in the event, and to
be able to put a roster together they could eventually
beat them in the finals would be amazing.

Speaker 2 (01:23:50):
And you know, I know we did it a few
years ago.

Speaker 7 (01:23:53):
I was at the game in San Diego when we
did it, And to be able to compete against that
talented team from Japan would be great again.

Speaker 1 (01:24:00):
He Yeah, Schemes of course, had that incredible start last year.
This year he's three and four and a two six
three ERA. That tells you all you need to know
about the struggles the Pirates have had.

Speaker 2 (01:24:13):
Swinging in the bats.

Speaker 1 (01:24:14):
He's three and four with a two six three R
and fifty four and two thirds sittings. That tells you
about when your offense isn't able to give you enough support.

Speaker 7 (01:24:24):
Well, the other thing is, you know, with this, you're
gonna have the World Baseball Classic in twenty six and
we've got the Olympics to make them twenty eight. And
there's a big push right now to see if we
could get the major league players involved, because all the
other countries shut down for the event, in Major League
Baseball does not, so we we go to our non

(01:24:45):
forty man roster players for that event, which is a
huge competitive advantage for the other countries. And we always,
you know, even in the qualifiers, we end up winning
silver or bronze most years.

Speaker 2 (01:24:56):
We won the bronze this past winter.

Speaker 7 (01:24:58):
And so to be able to if it can come
to fruition and you can get those major league players
involved in the Olympics, it would be an absolute huge
win for the USA Baseball.

Speaker 1 (01:25:08):
And would you say, Gino that that that the major
league players who hail from nations outside the US are
more given over to playing for their home countries than
the ones who are inside the US. In other words,
I guess what I'm asking is, are we going to
see a double A or a triple A pitcher trying
to pitch to show Aotani in the Olympics.

Speaker 7 (01:25:30):
One hundred one hundred percent there's a possibility of that.
And you almost have more withdrawal from those types of
players to their countries than you do the American players
because we've.

Speaker 2 (01:25:41):
Been non forty man for a few years now.

Speaker 7 (01:25:43):
So you're trying to get you know, we're trying to
get this dream team of you know, say the futures game.
You're trying to get that kind of a caliber player
to all come together. And you know, like our last
you know, qualifier that we just had, you know, we
had four or five players from one an organization that
we just couldn't get involved because they didn't want to

(01:26:03):
draw back from their minor league teams for that long
period of time.

Speaker 2 (01:26:07):
And so it's a very slippery slope.

Speaker 7 (01:26:10):
It's one that would would have a lot more answers
defined if you could let major league players play in
the Olympics.

Speaker 1 (01:26:18):
Well, and and and here's my point on that. And
and people will know me and heard his program. You
know me as well as anybody know how how much
of a Dodger fan is. But I'm going to tell
you this, I'm a USA guy first. And if and
if Shoe a Otani is leaving the Dodgers for two
weeks to go play for Japan's Olympic team, and La

(01:26:38):
de la Cruz is leaving the Reds, and you've got
other players from the Latin American countries or wherever who
are going to play for their nations, and you're looking
at depleted MLB rosters are having to go on without them.

Speaker 2 (01:26:50):
It doesn't make sense to me. I think.

Speaker 7 (01:26:54):
I think the concept would be one the biggest hurdle
and and separate from the World Baseball Class. The biggest
hurdle is going to be insurancing. Insurancing all of those players.
Bobby Witt, Junior Shohl Tony. It's a little bit different
when it's a non major league baseball event. The World
Baseball Classic is a major league event. Secondly, I think

(01:27:14):
they would try to work out some It could be
a great opportunity to try the two half seasons and
have a break around the All Star break, where you
have the Olympics being played around the All Star break,
and you cut the major league season in the two halves,
which a lot of people are proponents for because, for instance,

(01:27:35):
I'll just say from the Chicago White Sox standpoint, we
had a terrible twenty five, We're having a terrible twenty
a terrible twenty four. We've gotten off to a really
bad start in twenty five. But the backside of twenty
six is when you can start to see it turn
for US as an organization. So if you were to
cut it into two halves, now you've got that young

(01:27:56):
team that's kind of up and coming and building. Now
you take the second half of the twenty six season
and they may be competing for a wild card. So
there are a lot of people that are four trying
the two haves. An Olympic summer might be the perfect
time to try something like that.

Speaker 2 (01:28:10):
Out.

Speaker 1 (01:28:11):
Totally agree with you, and why not follow the NHL
model because they do it. Yeah, I'll close with this.
I'm gonna give you a chance to tell folks a
little bit about this. So in your travels, you you
zigzag across the country, you're doing a lot of that,
but you're going back to Kansas City, you know, this

(01:28:32):
weekend for it's this weekend for a pretty special event.

Speaker 2 (01:28:35):
Yep.

Speaker 7 (01:28:36):
Yes, we've got the ten year anniversary of the World
Championship team.

Speaker 3 (01:28:40):
Uh.

Speaker 7 (01:28:40):
I'm actually going to help Melanie get her pair of
shoes right now for the gala. Very important, Yeah, the
most important thing, trust me. But no, we're really excited.
It's been it's been great, you know, just talking you know, Drew,
Butara who caught the last out of that World Series
is now our catching coach in Chicago. I'm sitting in
Seattle Friday night. Doug Henry, who is our bullpen coach,

(01:29:03):
was in Seattle. He's flying in for it, and there's
just a lot of great energy and we're really super
excited to bring this team back together again. And you
know where you really take a lot of pride in
it is when you look at the teams that have
won since we won. It's been Boston, it's been the
Dodgers twice, it's been the Astros twice, it's been the Cubs,

(01:29:23):
it's been Atlanta. All large market teams, and that fourteen
and fifteen teams, the back to back World Series teams
will forever be special in the history of the game
in baseball, and certainly special to the group that put
it all together. And we're really looking forward to getting
together this weekend and celebrated it.

Speaker 1 (01:29:40):
Every time I see a major league team do a
ring ceremony and a guy from another team but was
part of that World championship team comes comes there and
is given his ring, I always think that's a really
cool deal. Jack Flaarity, now back with the Tigers, came
in and they were playing the Dodgers, and they worked
it out on the Tiger's gonna be there, and he

(01:30:01):
got his ring, and then fans gave him applause. I
think that's his something about the connectivity in the brotherhood
of the game, doesn't it.

Speaker 7 (01:30:09):
One of the greatest joys I've ever been given in
this game. Craig was in twenty fourteen. After we lost
to the Giants that next April and May, my main
responsibility was to travel into minor league cities. Guys that
were a part of our forty man roster. They may

(01:30:29):
have played one game in the in the in the
in the in the season for our major league team.
I went to Vegas and and and and got the
whole Vegas team in the in a casino and gave
us a player his ring. I got to go to
Arlington and give Carlos Paguero his ring with all of

(01:30:49):
his teammates. Truly, we flew to Seattle and gave Rowl'donez
his ring. I mean, truly, one of the greatest joys
I've ever had in this game was to be able
to have that assignment and to see people have no
idea how incredibly hard it is to play one day
at the major league level, and to see these guys
that were now back in the minor leagues received their

(01:31:11):
American League Championship rings was one of the greatest joys
I've ever been a part of.

Speaker 1 (01:31:15):
Well, let me just add to that those who worked
without with completely throughout the Royal system, which I thought
was a great and classy move on their part, and
probably other teams do it as well, but for them
to award everybody throughout the entire organization a ring. And
I'm speaking of my oldest son because Andy Way was
a videographer for the Omaha Storm Chasers in twenty fourteen

(01:31:41):
and twenty fifteen and he has rings from that American
League Championship season and from the World Series and a
World Championship ring. And everybody got it trickled all the
way down through the minor leagues. And I'm sure the
Royals aren't the only one, but that's still a very
classic move I think by baseball organizations to do that
and to reward everyone who is part of the organization.

Speaker 7 (01:32:03):
I just don't think you can sell a vision of
a culture in which you have a class system. And
hey man, I started on the tarp crew, moved into
the groundskeeper, moved into the clubhouse, moved into the ticket office.
And it doesn't mean that my investment in the organization
was any less than anybody else in the organization. And

(01:32:25):
so I think that you have to see everybody in
the organization. If you want a great culture, you have
to see everybody in the organization as truly important. And
especially when you have great success, you've got to let
them know how much you appreciate the work that they
put into achieving great success.

Speaker 2 (01:32:44):
No doubt about it.

Speaker 1 (01:32:45):
Hey, Gene, I appreciate the time to pay careful attention
to getting those proper shoes picked out. Have a great
weekend there in Kansas City, and we'll visit next week.

Speaker 2 (01:32:55):
All right, Greig, thanks so much.

Speaker 1 (01:32:56):
All Right, that is Deean Watson from the Chicago White
Sox in front office again. A ten year or unifhile
it's been in a decade, ten years since the Royals
won that World Series. All right, we're gonna jump back
to college baseball coming up next when we continue on
thirteen under the zone

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