January 25, 2021 • 22 mins
Kobe Bryant, his daughter, and 7 others take a private helicopter from Orange County to the Mamba Sports Academy in Thousand Oaks, CA. This episode breaks down the conversation between air traffic controllers and pilot Ara Zobayan.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:16):
I'm Steve Gregory in Los Angeles and this is the
death and life of Kobe Bryant. Sunday, January, Kobe Bryant,
his thirteen year old daughter Gianna, her two friends, and
four others board a private helicopter in Orange County. The
(00:38):
group is headed to a youth basketball tournament at Mamba
Sports Academy in Thousand Oaks, a little over seventy miles away,
just northwest of Los Angeles. Gianna and her two team
meets were about to play in the tournament. Bryant was
the head coach of Gianna's basketball team, the Mamba's. Bryant's wife, Vanessa,
was already at the sports Academy. It was widely known
that Bryant used a private helicopter to travel to Actus
(01:00):
two games and other events. He also once said using
a helicopter kept him fresh and ready for games. The
Mamba Sports Academy was a frequent destination for Bryant and
his daughter. The pilot, are A Zabayan, has flown that
route many times before, and logs show the aircraft had
flown the route about two dozen times over a two
year period. Zabayan had flown other celebrities and v i
(01:22):
P s through the helicopter's owner. Island Express. Conditions for
the normally routine flight changed when foggy conditions set in.
Zabayan was flying a Sikorski S seventy six B, a
common choice for corporate in v I P travel. Zabayan's
aircraft was not equipped with tas it stands for Terrain
Avoidance and Warning System, but it was not a required
(01:43):
piece of equipment, so Zabayan had to rely on his
own line of sight to pilot the helicopter. Jim Lan's
a former helicopter news reporter and pilot and was part
of the Cafie news coverage the morning of the crash.
Tim helps us to cipher the radio traffic number two
and going straight hold Class Charlie Airspace and an aircraft
(02:05):
going around. So what has happened is that he is
transitioning up to five freeway when he reached the about
the l A Zoo and that's the border for the
Burbank airspace. And because uh he the weather was so bad,
he said it was the towers reporting i f R,
which is instrument flight rules, which means visibility and ceiling
is pretty low. So the pilot at that point just
(02:28):
requested a special v FAR transition through his airspace. And
that's a normal procedure that pilots can do when the
airport is below what they called basic could be a far.
Yeah you're are you following? Okay? What that is? He
said to him? He says, I see you on a
twelve hunter code in the transponder. If you have one
to zero zero in your transponder, that means I am
(02:51):
a v FAR aircraft and I'm not talking to anybody.
And at that point, so what the air air traffic
controller in San Diego a scene as a what they
call it the a f our target. He could see
what the altitude speed is of that aircraft. Two echo
actory some time passes, then to echo Actually you're still
(03:12):
too little level for fly following at this time radio
silence two echo actors ocount. A lot has been said
about the actions of the pilot are Zobaian Should he
have waited for the fog to clear? Shouldn't the helicopter
(03:33):
have been equipped with the tause avoidance system. We may
never know the answers to these questions, but we wanted
to get a breakdown of the radio transmissions that day
between the Bayan and air traffic controllers. Tim Lends a
former news helicopter reporter and pilot. He used to work
for one of the big TV news stations here in
Los Angeles. He's best known for his live coverage of
car chases and other breaking news. So I asked him
(03:56):
to listen to the entire transmission that was released and
give us his play by plane. This is the beginning
of the air traffic control chatter that morning to actually
Burbran couberminco to the three D one Enterberbank class Charlie
trip terias and farm stay attentions five tiers Town, the
one on one West Touth School November two and going
(04:16):
straight hold out type Burbank class Charlie Airspace. I have
an aircraft going around okay, so what has happened is
that he has transitioning got the five freeway when he
reached the about the L A zoo and that's the
border for the Burbank airspace and the ATEN says Charlie
air space. The air spaces are are designated by its letters,
(04:36):
so you know, be being around large around l A X.
Charlie is for the smaller UH commuter airports like Burbank,
So Class Charlie air space is the area that the
tower controls. So and because uh he the weather was
so bad, he said it was the towers reporting i
f R, which is instruments like rules, which means visibility
(04:57):
and ceiling is pretty low. So the pilot at that
point just requested a special v FAR transition through his airspace.
And that's a normal procedure that pilots can do when
the airport is below what they called basic could be
a far. So that because when you heard the controller
come back and say, remain clear of Class Trailie airspace.
(05:17):
I'll get back to you. I have a goal around,
which means an aircraft just tried to land but had
to go around because he didn't have the runway in
sight or he who was outside of his speed and
altitude restriction or parameters to have to go around, and
then apparently had another aircraft coming in nine miles out
from there. So the rule is on special v FR
(05:40):
you're only allowed to have one aircraft in the airspace
at any one time operating. So he had to keep
the helicopter out of the airspace until that airplane or
the two airplanes that were in the airspace or coming
into the airspace to get those on the ground first,
and then they were going to let him through. But
that that happens if you have a busy airport and
you're coming through and you try to slide through on
(06:00):
a special v f R, they're gonna hold you to
make sure everybody else is on the ground first and
then let you through. Vember two ecolect ray and for
your planning purposes, you can expect to transition to the
north side of the airport. I just spoke with Van
Eyes on the line and they've got multiple I part
depart just coming off of from A one six, So
you can expect to follow the find northing cross that way. Yeah.
(06:22):
So because what was happening, they had a lot of
instrument flight traffic coming into both the airports, and to
try to help him get through, they were just telling
him though, for planning purposes, because he was actually asking
to go west or north one oh one, which would
pass to the south of Burbank into the south of
Van Eyes. They were warning him, what, you're gonna need
to go up the five freeway to the one eight
(06:42):
team and go around the north side of the airports
because Dan Eyes had I fr traffic or instrument traffic
taking off to the south off their runways. They wanted
to keep the conflicts down at that point, so they
were just getting the heads up. So they're working with
him giving them information how to get through there. So
that's up. All that is all normal up to this point.
Straight for your transitioning Camerio. Did you just want to
(07:05):
follow the one team that I would look for up
then I to catch the one O one two question Rogers.
He offered him to take the one eighteen through the
Santa Susana pass UH because there's a couple of passes
to get out of valley to the west because you
have some high mountains there between the one on one
and the one eight team, So there's one pass that
(07:27):
goes to one E Santa Susana and then the one
on one is the one that he wanted because where
he was trying to go is right off the one
on one. He he had filed from my understand to
Camario Airport, or he was saying he was going to
Camarrio Port, but actually he was going to a parking
lot there in UH. I believe either Agora or Calabasas
(07:49):
near the Mamba Academy, so he wasn't gonna try to
go to the airport. He was gonna land off site
as we call it. So at that point he said
he had liked to, you know, dropped down of the
south and pick up that one on one and go
through uh Calabasas and Abura Hills there matu Coo X
ray continue following the five northwestbound to join the one
(08:09):
eight team and then Van Eidel work you through freighter
services terminated from Aintance Squawk contact Van I Helicopters one zero.
He just gave him his route of flight that he
wanted him to take and controllers trying to make sure
that he keeps him out of a way of any
of his aircraft. And then he also had already more
(08:31):
likely been talking on the two way with Van Eiserport
telling him this guy is coming and here's what I
told him to do. And so now Danna I was
going to be looking for him coming down westbound one
team from the five instead of coming up to one
oh one. So it helps out. The towers work with
each other trying to alert each other at the air traffic.
So they gave him a route to follow the five
(08:53):
Freeway north to the west one team and then check
in with Van Eys and they'll carib you when they
take you on. So you'll hear it later on in
the recording when he checks in the van Eyes and
I kind of too echo extra with you for the
especially be a part transition. We are kind of a
fourteen hundreds helicopter seven to echo actually van I tower
(09:16):
wind calm visibility two and one half feeling one thousand,
one hundred fordecast and I bought some three zero one
six cleared into van I've class Delta northeast of Vanis
along the one eighteen freeway west down. Advice when you're
in DFR conditions or when you're clear of the Vanis
Class Delta transition at or blow two thousand, five hundred
(09:38):
committee to echo X ray prise is to be a
fart condition. Uh that I would stay of the one
eighteen because he has fourteen hundreds and we have LEGO
two or three wives help and can actually thank you.
And whence you clear Vani delta, did you want to
talk to so call from question. What she just told
(09:58):
him was she had radar identified him, said that he
was radar contact. Then he gave her or gave him
the weather at Danai's airports, which was two and a
half miles visibility eleven feet overcast and the altender for
the airports. Right now, he's up over the one eighteen,
and she then says continue west one until in d
(10:21):
FR conditions, which means visual flight rule conditions. And once
he he said he didn't, he replied back at the end,
I am in d FR and continuing on. So what
he was doing was going up, going west on THEE
and when clear, he'll report or he should for report
clear the Van I, the Van I class Delta air space,
(10:44):
so you have Charlie air space and for Burbank and
then Delta and Van I. He's going to work his
way along one eighteen and then skirt around the DNA
i's air space towards the one oh one, which is
all perfectly good. Quick Actually he starts going and so
to be a south quest close to one one, he
was asking if he was okay for him to turn
(11:05):
south towards the one on one because more likely he
still was in her airspace, and so he was just
requesting to make that left hand turn from the one
and follow over to the southwest to get down to
the one on one. Approved, and are you transitioning in
b a far condition? And what dollars the five months
(11:26):
tootric thank you contacts? So now one three or four
point two for flight following, So right there she okay,
controller from the Nays Airport then approved his request to
turn southbound towards the one on one for you as
she asked if he was in visual flight rules. He
replied back, yes, I'm in visual flight rules at fift
(11:47):
hundred and she said approved as requested, and then asked
for him to contact the so Cal Traken, which is
a so call uh radar system that is covers the
area here, to contact them so that they could get
him into ray our contact and follow him to his destination.
And I dent is a term that and that's and
(12:10):
let's explain what SOCALF trackon or the SoCal SoCal radar control.
They cover all of southern California and they are based
out in San Diego, and each controller has a little
piece of the pie up a different sectors throughout southern California.
So you're talking to a greadar controller down San Diego
at this point and he just checked in with him, uh,
(12:31):
you know echo X ray request, you know, and then
when he came to heard the controller cup on echo
X ray ident. That means press a button on your transponder,
which is a device in the in the aircraft that
will send a signal to the radar and then make
you on the radar scope kind of light up. They
call it a flash to where he can see that
(12:51):
that dot is the guy he's talking to. So you're
on a transponder on an aircraft, basically gives you a
four digit code that they can assign to you and
then I can you know, know that that not that
they're looking at as you and then ah, what they
call an information tag will beyond that and the information
tag will move across their screen so they know who
they're talking to. So he's just trying to verify radar
(13:13):
contact with him at this point coming up. The flight
continues and seems pretty routine until two echo actors ocount
radio silence. The death and life of Kobe Bryant continues
after this. Former TV News chopper reporter and pilot Tim
(13:47):
Lynn has been analyzing the radio chatter between pilot our
z a buy in and the air traffic controllers from
San Diego Van Nye and Burbank. Actually, yeah, you're one,
are you request folling? Okay? What that is? He said
to him? He says, I see you on a twelve
hunter code in a transponder. If you have one to
zero zero in your transponder, that means I am a
(14:11):
v FAR aircraft and I'm not talking to anybody. And
at that point, so what the air airtraffic control or
in San Diego scene is a what they call a
B FAR target. He can see, uh, what the altitude
speed is of that aircraft. And now you know, I
can't be for sure since she talked to Van Eyes.
Van Eyes more likely already put it what they call
(14:32):
a tag on him, so they kind of had an idea.
With the N number or the registration number. The aircraft
is probably in there as well, since he had already
talked to an air traffic controller at Van Eys tower,
So that that whole thing right there is going, Hey,
you're not on a code, You're you're just squawking B far,
which means twelve. What is your intention? You know? Do
(14:53):
you want me to do? You want flight following, which
means I can follow you on the radar and give
you advisories of eric haft around you. That's what flight
following us. Also, it keeps you in contact with each
radar sector as you move through your route of flight
in case something goes wrong or then mostly it's used
for traffic avoidance, do incollectory? What are you the intention?
(15:16):
Where are you going? What are you doing? You know?
So he had so now he can formulate a plan
with with this this aircraft and what he wants to
do with him in his air space to eco Actorly,
you're still too low level for flight following at this time.
Two in collector and dontcount. You know, the radar coverage
(15:43):
is only as good as where the radar towers are.
And you have a lot of hills that are you
have the Santa Monica Mountains you have And I'm not
sure exactly which radar site they're working off it because
there are several races radar sites through southern California and
to the base and that they used. And whatever one
he was on, he couldn't see the target he was
(16:05):
getting intermitted because he had the the tag. At one
point where he says, I see his squawking, so he
had him for a little bit. Then all of a
sudden he got behind the mountain there, got too low
for the radar suite, so he dropped off. So right
there he was, had him on radar and had him
on the radio, so he can talk to him on
the radio, no problem. But his target kep dropping off
(16:28):
radar and then you heard him say, asked him that
respond and he didn't respond. So at that point he
was either a low radar coverage and more likely not
listening to the radio or not hearing the radio. Since
that's the last part of the chatter, is there a
presumption that that could have been at the point of impact?
Uh no, Uh, you gets presumption maybe, But from what
(16:52):
information I'm hearing is that he apparently had asked for
a VFR climb at one point. I've never heard a
rate our radio transmission of that, but that he had
asked for a climb. Yeah, but like I said, I
haven't heard it. But that's usually what you hear at
the end of the end of the situation like this
is they'll have you on radar, then you'll drop off radar,
(17:14):
and then they try to reach you on the rate
on the radio, and if you don't answer on the radio,
it's usually what happens at the end. So h as
far as in the track, he had already made that
turn up the one on one or not at this point,
I'm not really sure, but he could have still been
south the valley circle their ball and on the one
on one at this point, but there apparently was one
(17:35):
other radar radio transmission asking for a climb. Now, Tim
you've flown that route before, you flown the area before,
have you had any problems with the radio transmissions there? Well,
normally I don't speak with us, the SoCal tray Coon people,
because I'm norm sho low and I'm out of their
airspace and I really don't need their help going through there. Um,
(17:59):
you know, anytime do that as when you're crossing long
along desolate areas, you want somebody you just to keep
an eye on you heading out through Gallop Valley, I'll
do that, or if I'm head out through pomp Strings,
But and no local flights like that, you're not required.
Once I clear Vana air space, I'm on my own.
I don't need to talk to anybody and Conna Tim
Lynn retraces the route that r Zabayan took that morning.
(18:20):
As the death and life of Klobe Bryant continues, former
TV News chopper reporter and pilot Tim Lynn is giving
us an insider's perspective on the unique language and conversations
(18:42):
between pilot our Zabaian and their traffic controllers. Tim talks
about retracing the path that Zibayan took that morning by
flying the route himself. Yeah, I've flowed do that one
on one pass multiple times, and even after this crash,
I went back through there and I and I heard
his last reported out to four ft fifteen hundred feet,
(19:04):
and I even tried to fly through their fifteen hundred
feet just to see what it would be like. And
it was a way uncomfortable for me to go through
there at that altitude. Uh, you know, even even in
the daylight with you know, perfect visibility. You know, I
had hills on either side of me going up the
going up to one on one, and that was a
lot lower than I really would want to be, uh
(19:26):
to you know, to navigate through there. So yeah, you know,
I'd just been curious, curious helicopter pilot and listening to
the transmissions into different analysis that came out since the crash,
and I just wanted to see what it would look like.
They tried to grow up there, and you know, it
was lower than I'd want to be going through that pass.
And then add to that fog. Oh yeah, there's no way.
(19:48):
I mean, I have I have minimums uh. And the
first flying when I was doing the news, you know,
going through the New Hall Pass. If if I can
get tot, I wouldn't go because I knew the fires
for twenty seat and if the visibility was lowered them
what I know, I could keep contact with the ground,
they wouldn't do it. But because you never know what's
on the other side. Because if you get in the past,
(20:10):
so you have low visibility, you run into a cloud.
You you can't turn left or right because there's hills
on the other side of you. And the only thing
you can do is just you know, full full power,
full back on the stick and start climbing straight out
and climb up through the clouds and pop out on
top and and uh beg for forgiveness at that point,
(20:31):
ask for help to get back down. But you know,
you try to keep yourself out of a situation like that.
It's called inadvertent i AMC or instrument meroological conditions is
what they talk about, and there's a lot of training
that goes on to warn pilots about that, to train
pilots not to get into that situation. As a flight
instructure myself for both air plane and helicopter, our recurrent
(20:54):
training that we're required to do every two years, they
focus on that quite a bit, and they focus on
other things that have they've had problems with over the
last two years. But it always is what they call
interverton i AMC or where airplane drivers, you know, take
off with a hunter Hamburger on a Saturday afternoon and
when they get to their destination, they fly into a
cloud just trying to get there. And that's one of
(21:16):
the things that really causes a lot of accidents in
the general agation world, is that pushing it into bad weather.
But this pilot, very season that had a lot of
flight hours, a lot of experience in that aircraft, and
he had been that roof many times before, so he
was figuring he could get on through it. And you know,
(21:38):
your luck as only as long as your luck goes,
and some days you run out of left coming up
in episode two. Helicopter crashed into a mountain. We heard it,
and now I'm looking at the flame. Some hikers in
the Lost Hills Mountains area of Calabasas had no idea
what they just witnessed. The Life of Kobe Bryant is
(22:01):
a production of kf I News at I Heart Media,
Los Angeles for the I Heart Podcast network. H
I'm Steve Gregory in Los Angeles and this is the
death and life of Kobe Bryant. Sunday, January, Kobe Bryant,
his thirteen year old daughter Gianna, her two friends, and
four others board a private helicopter in Orange County. The
(00:38):
group is headed to a youth basketball tournament at Mamba
Sports Academy in Thousand Oaks, a little over seventy miles away,
just northwest of Los Angeles. Gianna and her two team
meets were about to play in the tournament. Bryant was
the head coach of Gianna's basketball team, the Mamba's. Bryant's wife, Vanessa,
was already at the sports Academy. It was widely known
that Bryant used a private helicopter to travel to Actus
(01:00):
two games and other events. He also once said using
a helicopter kept him fresh and ready for games. The
Mamba Sports Academy was a frequent destination for Bryant and
his daughter. The pilot, are A Zabayan, has flown that
route many times before, and logs show the aircraft had
flown the route about two dozen times over a two
year period. Zabayan had flown other celebrities and v i
(01:22):
P s through the helicopter's owner. Island Express. Conditions for
the normally routine flight changed when foggy conditions set in.
Zabayan was flying a Sikorski S seventy six B, a
common choice for corporate in v I P travel. Zabayan's
aircraft was not equipped with tas it stands for Terrain
Avoidance and Warning System, but it was not a required
(01:43):
piece of equipment, so Zabayan had to rely on his
own line of sight to pilot the helicopter. Jim Lan's
a former helicopter news reporter and pilot and was part
of the Cafie news coverage the morning of the crash.
Tim helps us to cipher the radio traffic number two
and going straight hold Class Charlie Airspace and an aircraft
(02:05):
going around. So what has happened is that he is
transitioning up to five freeway when he reached the about
the l A Zoo and that's the border for the
Burbank airspace. And because uh he the weather was so bad,
he said it was the towers reporting i f R,
which is instrument flight rules, which means visibility and ceiling
is pretty low. So the pilot at that point just
(02:28):
requested a special v FAR transition through his airspace. And
that's a normal procedure that pilots can do when the
airport is below what they called basic could be a far.
Yeah you're are you following? Okay? What that is? He
said to him? He says, I see you on a
twelve hunter code in the transponder. If you have one
to zero zero in your transponder, that means I am
(02:51):
a v FAR aircraft and I'm not talking to anybody.
And at that point, so what the air air traffic
controller in San Diego a scene as a what they
call it the a f our target. He could see
what the altitude speed is of that aircraft. Two echo
actory some time passes, then to echo Actually you're still
(03:12):
too little level for fly following at this time radio
silence two echo actors ocount. A lot has been said
about the actions of the pilot are Zobaian Should he
have waited for the fog to clear? Shouldn't the helicopter
(03:33):
have been equipped with the tause avoidance system. We may
never know the answers to these questions, but we wanted
to get a breakdown of the radio transmissions that day
between the Bayan and air traffic controllers. Tim Lends a
former news helicopter reporter and pilot. He used to work
for one of the big TV news stations here in
Los Angeles. He's best known for his live coverage of
car chases and other breaking news. So I asked him
(03:56):
to listen to the entire transmission that was released and
give us his play by plane. This is the beginning
of the air traffic control chatter that morning to actually
Burbran couberminco to the three D one Enterberbank class Charlie
trip terias and farm stay attentions five tiers Town, the
one on one West Touth School November two and going
(04:16):
straight hold out type Burbank class Charlie Airspace. I have
an aircraft going around okay, so what has happened is
that he has transitioning got the five freeway when he
reached the about the L A zoo and that's the
border for the Burbank airspace and the ATEN says Charlie
air space. The air spaces are are designated by its letters,
(04:36):
so you know, be being around large around l A X.
Charlie is for the smaller UH commuter airports like Burbank,
So Class Charlie air space is the area that the
tower controls. So and because uh he the weather was
so bad, he said it was the towers reporting i
f R, which is instruments like rules, which means visibility
(04:57):
and ceiling is pretty low. So the pilot at that
point just requested a special v FAR transition through his airspace.
And that's a normal procedure that pilots can do when
the airport is below what they called basic could be
a far. So that because when you heard the controller
come back and say, remain clear of Class Trailie airspace.
(05:17):
I'll get back to you. I have a goal around,
which means an aircraft just tried to land but had
to go around because he didn't have the runway in
sight or he who was outside of his speed and
altitude restriction or parameters to have to go around, and
then apparently had another aircraft coming in nine miles out
from there. So the rule is on special v FR
(05:40):
you're only allowed to have one aircraft in the airspace
at any one time operating. So he had to keep
the helicopter out of the airspace until that airplane or
the two airplanes that were in the airspace or coming
into the airspace to get those on the ground first,
and then they were going to let him through. But
that that happens if you have a busy airport and
you're coming through and you try to slide through on
(06:00):
a special v f R, they're gonna hold you to
make sure everybody else is on the ground first and
then let you through. Vember two ecolect ray and for
your planning purposes, you can expect to transition to the
north side of the airport. I just spoke with Van
Eyes on the line and they've got multiple I part
depart just coming off of from A one six, So
you can expect to follow the find northing cross that way. Yeah.
(06:22):
So because what was happening, they had a lot of
instrument flight traffic coming into both the airports, and to
try to help him get through, they were just telling
him though, for planning purposes, because he was actually asking
to go west or north one oh one, which would
pass to the south of Burbank into the south of
Van Eyes. They were warning him, what, you're gonna need
to go up the five freeway to the one eight
(06:42):
team and go around the north side of the airports
because Dan Eyes had I fr traffic or instrument traffic
taking off to the south off their runways. They wanted
to keep the conflicts down at that point, so they
were just getting the heads up. So they're working with
him giving them information how to get through there. So
that's up. All that is all normal up to this point.
Straight for your transitioning Camerio. Did you just want to
(07:05):
follow the one team that I would look for up
then I to catch the one O one two question Rogers.
He offered him to take the one eighteen through the
Santa Susana pass UH because there's a couple of passes
to get out of valley to the west because you
have some high mountains there between the one on one
and the one eight team, So there's one pass that
(07:27):
goes to one E Santa Susana and then the one
on one is the one that he wanted because where
he was trying to go is right off the one
on one. He he had filed from my understand to
Camario Airport, or he was saying he was going to
Camarrio Port, but actually he was going to a parking
lot there in UH. I believe either Agora or Calabasas
(07:49):
near the Mamba Academy, so he wasn't gonna try to
go to the airport. He was gonna land off site
as we call it. So at that point he said
he had liked to, you know, dropped down of the
south and pick up that one on one and go
through uh Calabasas and Abura Hills there matu Coo X
ray continue following the five northwestbound to join the one
(08:09):
eight team and then Van Eidel work you through freighter
services terminated from Aintance Squawk contact Van I Helicopters one zero.
He just gave him his route of flight that he
wanted him to take and controllers trying to make sure
that he keeps him out of a way of any
of his aircraft. And then he also had already more
(08:31):
likely been talking on the two way with Van Eiserport
telling him this guy is coming and here's what I
told him to do. And so now Danna I was
going to be looking for him coming down westbound one
team from the five instead of coming up to one
oh one. So it helps out. The towers work with
each other trying to alert each other at the air traffic.
So they gave him a route to follow the five
(08:53):
Freeway north to the west one team and then check
in with Van Eys and they'll carib you when they
take you on. So you'll hear it later on in
the recording when he checks in the van Eyes and
I kind of too echo extra with you for the
especially be a part transition. We are kind of a
fourteen hundreds helicopter seven to echo actually van I tower
(09:16):
wind calm visibility two and one half feeling one thousand,
one hundred fordecast and I bought some three zero one
six cleared into van I've class Delta northeast of Vanis
along the one eighteen freeway west down. Advice when you're
in DFR conditions or when you're clear of the Vanis
Class Delta transition at or blow two thousand, five hundred
(09:38):
committee to echo X ray prise is to be a
fart condition. Uh that I would stay of the one
eighteen because he has fourteen hundreds and we have LEGO
two or three wives help and can actually thank you.
And whence you clear Vani delta, did you want to
talk to so call from question. What she just told
(09:58):
him was she had radar identified him, said that he
was radar contact. Then he gave her or gave him
the weather at Danai's airports, which was two and a
half miles visibility eleven feet overcast and the altender for
the airports. Right now, he's up over the one eighteen,
and she then says continue west one until in d
(10:21):
FR conditions, which means visual flight rule conditions. And once
he he said he didn't, he replied back at the end,
I am in d FR and continuing on. So what
he was doing was going up, going west on THEE
and when clear, he'll report or he should for report
clear the Van I, the Van I class Delta air space,
(10:44):
so you have Charlie air space and for Burbank and
then Delta and Van I. He's going to work his
way along one eighteen and then skirt around the DNA
i's air space towards the one oh one, which is
all perfectly good. Quick Actually he starts going and so
to be a south quest close to one one, he
was asking if he was okay for him to turn
(11:05):
south towards the one on one because more likely he
still was in her airspace, and so he was just
requesting to make that left hand turn from the one
and follow over to the southwest to get down to
the one on one. Approved, and are you transitioning in
b a far condition? And what dollars the five months
(11:26):
tootric thank you contacts? So now one three or four
point two for flight following, So right there she okay,
controller from the Nays Airport then approved his request to
turn southbound towards the one on one for you as
she asked if he was in visual flight rules. He
replied back, yes, I'm in visual flight rules at fift
(11:47):
hundred and she said approved as requested, and then asked
for him to contact the so Cal Traken, which is
a so call uh radar system that is covers the
area here, to contact them so that they could get
him into ray our contact and follow him to his destination.
And I dent is a term that and that's and
(12:10):
let's explain what SOCALF trackon or the SoCal SoCal radar control.
They cover all of southern California and they are based
out in San Diego, and each controller has a little
piece of the pie up a different sectors throughout southern California.
So you're talking to a greadar controller down San Diego
at this point and he just checked in with him, uh,
(12:31):
you know echo X ray request, you know, and then
when he came to heard the controller cup on echo
X ray ident. That means press a button on your transponder,
which is a device in the in the aircraft that
will send a signal to the radar and then make
you on the radar scope kind of light up. They
call it a flash to where he can see that
(12:51):
that dot is the guy he's talking to. So you're
on a transponder on an aircraft, basically gives you a
four digit code that they can assign to you and
then I can you know, know that that not that
they're looking at as you and then ah, what they
call an information tag will beyond that and the information
tag will move across their screen so they know who
they're talking to. So he's just trying to verify radar
(13:13):
contact with him at this point coming up. The flight
continues and seems pretty routine until two echo actors ocount
radio silence. The death and life of Kobe Bryant continues
after this. Former TV News chopper reporter and pilot Tim
(13:47):
Lynn has been analyzing the radio chatter between pilot our
z a buy in and the air traffic controllers from
San Diego Van Nye and Burbank. Actually, yeah, you're one,
are you request folling? Okay? What that is? He said
to him? He says, I see you on a twelve
hunter code in a transponder. If you have one to
zero zero in your transponder, that means I am a
(14:11):
v FAR aircraft and I'm not talking to anybody. And
at that point, so what the air airtraffic control or
in San Diego scene is a what they call a
B FAR target. He can see, uh, what the altitude
speed is of that aircraft. And now you know, I
can't be for sure since she talked to Van Eyes.
Van Eyes more likely already put it what they call
(14:32):
a tag on him, so they kind of had an idea.
With the N number or the registration number. The aircraft
is probably in there as well, since he had already
talked to an air traffic controller at Van Eys tower,
So that that whole thing right there is going, Hey,
you're not on a code, You're you're just squawking B far,
which means twelve. What is your intention? You know? Do
(14:53):
you want me to do? You want flight following, which
means I can follow you on the radar and give
you advisories of eric haft around you. That's what flight
following us. Also, it keeps you in contact with each
radar sector as you move through your route of flight
in case something goes wrong or then mostly it's used
for traffic avoidance, do incollectory? What are you the intention?
(15:16):
Where are you going? What are you doing? You know?
So he had so now he can formulate a plan
with with this this aircraft and what he wants to
do with him in his air space to eco Actorly,
you're still too low level for flight following at this time.
Two in collector and dontcount. You know, the radar coverage
(15:43):
is only as good as where the radar towers are.
And you have a lot of hills that are you
have the Santa Monica Mountains you have And I'm not
sure exactly which radar site they're working off it because
there are several races radar sites through southern California and
to the base and that they used. And whatever one
he was on, he couldn't see the target he was
(16:05):
getting intermitted because he had the the tag. At one
point where he says, I see his squawking, so he
had him for a little bit. Then all of a
sudden he got behind the mountain there, got too low
for the radar suite, so he dropped off. So right
there he was, had him on radar and had him
on the radio, so he can talk to him on
the radio, no problem. But his target kep dropping off
(16:28):
radar and then you heard him say, asked him that
respond and he didn't respond. So at that point he
was either a low radar coverage and more likely not
listening to the radio or not hearing the radio. Since
that's the last part of the chatter, is there a
presumption that that could have been at the point of impact?
Uh no, Uh, you gets presumption maybe, But from what
(16:52):
information I'm hearing is that he apparently had asked for
a VFR climb at one point. I've never heard a
rate our radio transmission of that, but that he had
asked for a climb. Yeah, but like I said, I
haven't heard it. But that's usually what you hear at
the end of the end of the situation like this
is they'll have you on radar, then you'll drop off radar,
(17:14):
and then they try to reach you on the rate
on the radio, and if you don't answer on the radio,
it's usually what happens at the end. So h as
far as in the track, he had already made that
turn up the one on one or not at this point,
I'm not really sure, but he could have still been
south the valley circle their ball and on the one
on one at this point, but there apparently was one
(17:35):
other radar radio transmission asking for a climb. Now, Tim
you've flown that route before, you flown the area before,
have you had any problems with the radio transmissions there? Well,
normally I don't speak with us, the SoCal tray Coon people,
because I'm norm sho low and I'm out of their
airspace and I really don't need their help going through there. Um,
(17:59):
you know, anytime do that as when you're crossing long
along desolate areas, you want somebody you just to keep
an eye on you heading out through Gallop Valley, I'll
do that, or if I'm head out through pomp Strings,
But and no local flights like that, you're not required.
Once I clear Vana air space, I'm on my own.
I don't need to talk to anybody and Conna Tim
Lynn retraces the route that r Zabayan took that morning.
(18:20):
As the death and life of Klobe Bryant continues, former
TV News chopper reporter and pilot Tim Lynn is giving
us an insider's perspective on the unique language and conversations
(18:42):
between pilot our Zabaian and their traffic controllers. Tim talks
about retracing the path that Zibayan took that morning by
flying the route himself. Yeah, I've flowed do that one
on one pass multiple times, and even after this crash,
I went back through there and I and I heard
his last reported out to four ft fifteen hundred feet,
(19:04):
and I even tried to fly through their fifteen hundred
feet just to see what it would be like. And
it was a way uncomfortable for me to go through
there at that altitude. Uh, you know, even even in
the daylight with you know, perfect visibility. You know, I
had hills on either side of me going up the
going up to one on one, and that was a
lot lower than I really would want to be, uh
(19:26):
to you know, to navigate through there. So yeah, you know,
I'd just been curious, curious helicopter pilot and listening to
the transmissions into different analysis that came out since the crash,
and I just wanted to see what it would look like.
They tried to grow up there, and you know, it
was lower than I'd want to be going through that pass.
And then add to that fog. Oh yeah, there's no way.
(19:48):
I mean, I have I have minimums uh. And the
first flying when I was doing the news, you know,
going through the New Hall Pass. If if I can
get tot, I wouldn't go because I knew the fires
for twenty seat and if the visibility was lowered them
what I know, I could keep contact with the ground,
they wouldn't do it. But because you never know what's
on the other side. Because if you get in the past,
(20:10):
so you have low visibility, you run into a cloud.
You you can't turn left or right because there's hills
on the other side of you. And the only thing
you can do is just you know, full full power,
full back on the stick and start climbing straight out
and climb up through the clouds and pop out on
top and and uh beg for forgiveness at that point,
(20:31):
ask for help to get back down. But you know,
you try to keep yourself out of a situation like that.
It's called inadvertent i AMC or instrument meroological conditions is
what they talk about, and there's a lot of training
that goes on to warn pilots about that, to train
pilots not to get into that situation. As a flight
instructure myself for both air plane and helicopter, our recurrent
(20:54):
training that we're required to do every two years, they
focus on that quite a bit, and they focus on
other things that have they've had problems with over the
last two years. But it always is what they call
interverton i AMC or where airplane drivers, you know, take
off with a hunter Hamburger on a Saturday afternoon and
when they get to their destination, they fly into a
cloud just trying to get there. And that's one of
(21:16):
the things that really causes a lot of accidents in
the general agation world, is that pushing it into bad weather.
But this pilot, very season that had a lot of
flight hours, a lot of experience in that aircraft, and
he had been that roof many times before, so he
was figuring he could get on through it. And you know,
(21:38):
your luck as only as long as your luck goes,
and some days you run out of left coming up
in episode two. Helicopter crashed into a mountain. We heard it,
and now I'm looking at the flame. Some hikers in
the Lost Hills Mountains area of Calabasas had no idea
what they just witnessed. The Life of Kobe Bryant is
(22:01):
a production of kf I News at I Heart Media,
Los Angeles for the I Heart Podcast network. H
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